November 5, 2025 • 31 mins
Ever feel like you’re doing everything right but still running on empty?
In this episode, I sit down with transformational coach and author Dr. Deonne Johnson to talk about what happens when you’ve hit emotional burnout and how to find your spark again. We dig into her powerful “Bloomprint” framework, what it really means to take off the Wonder Woman cape, and how to reconnect with yourself (and your relationships) after exhaustion, disappointment, or loss. You’ll walk away with practical steps to feel grounded, re-energized, and inspired again—from the inside out.
You might want to listen if:
• You’re feeling emotionally drained or disconnected in your relationships
• You’ve been over-functioning, people-pleasing, or carrying the emotional load
• You’re craving structure and calm after a season of chaos
• You want to learn how to create space for yourself without guilt
• You’re ready to swap burnout for balance and start feeling inspired again
About Our Guest:
Dr. Deonne Johnson is a transformational coach, speaker, and author of From Tired to Inspired: A Soulful Guide to Reclaim Your Energy, Joy, and Purpose. She helps women move from burnout to inspired living through her membership, workshops and transformational retreats. Known for her warmth, wisdom, and heart-centered approach, Dr. Deonne guides others to reconnect with themselves, their purpose, and what truly matters.
Grab your Copy of From Tired to Inspired
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DISCLAIMER: Speak Honest podcast content is informational, not professional or medical advice. Jenn is an ICF relationship coach, not a licensed therapist. Consult health professionals for specific concerns. Client opinions do not reflect Speak Honest’s stance. We aim for accuracy but are not liable for errors or outcomes from ...
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
SPEAKER_00 (00:02):
Hello, everyone, and welcome back to another episode
of Speak Honest.
I'm Jen Noble, your go-torelationship coach.
And on today's episode, I am soexcited to have a special guest
on with us.
This is Dr.
Dion Johnson, someone I considernot only a colleague, but a good
friend of mine.
She is a transformational coach,speaker, and author of the most
(00:23):
fabulous book called From Tiredto No, let me do that again.
Sorry.
And she is the author of themost wonderful book called From
Spy.
Oh my God, this is gonna happentoday.
I've had a long day, Dion.
And she is the author of themost fabulous book, From Tired
to Inspired, a soulful guide toreclaim your energy, joy, and
(00:47):
purpose.
Dr.
Dion helps women move fromburnout to inspired living
through her membership programs,her workshops, and her
transformational retreats.
She is known for her warmth, herwisdom, and her heart-centered
approach.
She guides women to reconnectwith themselves, their purpose,
and what truly matters.
(01:07):
And I am so honored today tohave Dr.
Dion on the show with us today.
Dr.
Dion, tell us a little bit moreabout yourself.
(01:27):
Yes, that's right.
We're both authors with LuckyBook Publishing.
As very many people know, I'vehad a lot of people on the show
lately with Lucky BookPublishing.
These are all just becoming mybesties.
That's why I have to have themall on.
In fact, Dion and I will both beat the LA event in November that
I have been talking about for solong.
I cannot wait to see you inperson and just give you the
biggest, tightest hug of alltime.
(01:48):
And you and I haveconversations, you know, on the
side all the time.
So I thought, what a perfectopportunity to get you to come
on the show, come on here andtalk to women.
Because something it is that youdeal with a lot is burnout,
right?
Tell me a little bit about yourown story with that.
(04:10):
Okay, great.
So I had to go look that upbecause I was like, what the
hell is instructional design?
What is this?
Can you actually just explain itto us a little bit about what it
is that that is?
(04:32):
So tell us a little bit aboutit.
(05:44):
Listen, I'm a structure girly atheart.
I need structure, I need ideas,and the thing is a scaffolding
that'll make total sense to allof the ladies, at least in my
membership program, because Isay that all the time.
My 12-step program in order tobecome secure and learn how to
confidently communicate, is allbased on a 12-step scaffolding
section.
And so when I open up your bookand I'm looking through it, I'm
(06:07):
reading it, I was like, oh mygosh, this is so easy to
understand.
This isn't, this isn't all overthe place.
And like, oh, um, listen, I getit.
I have ADHD.
I'm all over the place.
This is why I like structure.
But other books I read sometimesare they're just all over the
place and I don't know where tostart, where to begin, or
nothing draws me into know howto keep going.
But your book, it's so specialin that way where you're very
(06:28):
intentional.
You're very intentional abouthere's this chapter and here's
why.
And yeah, one of the reallycoolest things about your book
is the bullet journal.
I mean, it's so much more thanjust a book, it's essentially a
journal you can use after eachchapter or each section to go
through and be able to write or,like you said, draw or just
doodle your thoughts becauseit's so important.
(06:50):
Ladies, if you are listeningright now, come back to me real
quick because our written word,our written ideas, our hand to
our mind to hand to paperconnection is actually
incredibly important for ourneuroplasticity.
It teaches our brain and ourbody things that typing
unfortunately doesn't do.
(07:10):
Don't get me wrong, I'm stilldown for like a notes app in my
phone that I keep my journal inand things like that.
But this is so, so special.
So talk me through a little bitwhy did you want to add the
bullet journals to your book?
No way, that's fantastic.
Oh my goodness.
(07:31):
For anyone listening, she isjust opening up her bullet
journal, and it is beautiful.
Look at you.
(09:07):
And this is coming from likeyour 83-year-old self.
Like your 83-year-old self isasking you, it's saying, Dear
Dion, that's beautiful becausethere's so many times,
oftentimes, like with the work Ido with my clients where we go
back in time, right?
You know me, I work withattachment styles, and we'll
talk on that in just a second.
But we go back in time, we healour inner child or our inner
teenager, even our inner20-something-year-old girl, you
(09:29):
know, that's out there clubbingall the time or whatnot, or
maybe she wanted to and shedidn't get a chance to.
And we talk to her as our like40-year-old self.
So what a beautiful opportunitywe can have to jump forward and
do it in the other direction andhave our 80-year-old self
looking back on us and say, Hey,dear one, you know, this is
like, what would I like you toknow?
(09:51):
Or, hey, how, you know, this iswhat we need to be doing today
to get where you where you wantto go.
And I think that's beautiful.
(11:04):
Wait, are you sitting heretelling me menopause is a
blessing?
Because I am gonna struggle tohave to understand that, but I
think you might be right.
This is mind blowing right now.
It is, it's like it's like ourgift, isn't it?
As women going into our prime.
I'm I know right now I'mparamenopausal.
I know so many of my listenersare, and I know there's women in
my program that have completelybeen through menopause and
(11:26):
they've gone on to the otherside.
And it is, it's it's a bitchright now, sometimes.
Yeah, and it's difficult andit's hard, but also you're
right.
Otherwise, what's thealternative?
We would be getting pregnant,and some mammals do get pregnant
all the way up until the timethey're done.
And yet we get this gift to tokind of come back to ourselves
(11:47):
as this quote unquotemiddle-aged woman figuring out
ourselves, but it's thisbeautiful opportunity in our
lives to to make ourselves in away where we get to be in
alignment with what we've alwayswanted to be, right?
And I know one of the thingsthat you talk a lot about is
reconnecting with yourself, isbeing able to slow down and
(12:08):
really get to that place whereyou are inspired.
And so let's say there's a womanout there right now and she's
perimenopausal, she's 45 yearsold, she's listening, and she's
like, I am just fucking done.
There's just I have too much onmy plate, my kids are like just
destroying the house, my husbandisn't helping, my job is a mess.
(12:29):
Like, how does she come back toherself?
(13:10):
Yeah, grab your book, open itup, let's see.
Okay, so let me can you explainit for everyone listening?
Okay.
(15:16):
No, it's not, but let's put thatmuch effort that we're giving to
some making someone else money,and let's put that effort into
ourselves for our fulfillment,our satisfaction, our longevity
of our own life.
You're absolutely correct.
In fact, the very first step ofmy module system with my ladies
is we go through, and I have theeight areas of life, very
similar.
And this exactly, I tell this topeople all the time, y'all, we
(15:39):
are not creating anything new.
We have not reinvented anywheel.
We are just taking the knowledgethat is already out there.
We are on the shoulders ofbeautiful, great people that
have done the research beforeus, and we are putting it in
words where we understand it,especially us women, especially
a lot of stuff out there iswritten by men and they don't
quite understand what it is thatwe're going through.
(16:00):
So we have beautiful flowers,you know, we have what great
words to help understand for uslike legacy, impact.
Those words are so emotional.
So they're so important to us.
And so, yeah, I go through and Ihave the lady say, like, we just
need to do an audit.
We just need to be able to seeour lives and see, but so many
(16:21):
people, it's actually a lotharder than they realize to sit
down and be like, oh shit, wait,I don't feel like I am leaving
an impact or legacy.
And then what do I do with thatbig emotion?
And so I get it, it's difficult,it's hard, but at the same time,
it's so necessary.
So listen to Dr.
Dion and this, you know, grabher book.
If what I do isn't resonating,go to Dr.
(16:42):
Dion, what she's doing.
If what Dr.
Dion is doing isn't resonating,go find someone else.
But live your life in a waywhere you're gonna fulfill
yourself and be satisfied.
As I don't believe in the wordhappy, that's my big thing.
So I always have these otherwords.
I want us to all do that.
So, with all of that said, Iwant to transition slightly,
just looking at everything we'retalking about, and I want to
(17:04):
talk about relationships.
You mentioned before that yourrelationship, one of the things
that was the cause of yourburnout back, what was it, 13
years ago now or something likethat?
Um, tell tell me where you aretoday with all of that.
Mm-hmm.
(19:06):
Yep.
(19:40):
Let's see, let's let let's step,let's uh like uh can we stop
down into this a little bit?
Would that be okay?
Yeah, okay, great.
Because this is actually such agood point.
First off, I'm very impressedthat as an avoidantly attached
man, he was the one to tell youabout attachment styles.
Gosh, is that rare?
It's usually the otherdirection.
(20:01):
The anxious person wants to tellthe avoidant, look, this is what
you are, see why you're theproblem.
So that was just really likeshocking to me that he did that.
So I was like, that's cool.
I love hearing differentexperiences because people
always come to me like, is thispossible?
Always.
Everything's possible.
We're humans, we're not, youknow, code.
We're not just gonna like be oneway all the time.
And then yeah, when you're inthat space and you guys are
(20:22):
getting counseling and you'retalking about all this, and he's
not able, it's sounding like I'mhearing, he's not able to step
up into the leadership role.
Is that right?
Yeah, and this is why not onlyare anxiously attached people
attracted to avoidantly attachedpeople because they kind of
(20:43):
reinforce this wound and thisbelief that I'm not good enough
and you know, I need to earn myworth and all these things on
the opposite direction.
See how good anxiously attachedpeople are for avoidantly
attached people.
And right now, let's even justtalk about it in terms of men
and women.
Again, spectrum everywhere, butresearch does dictate that
anxiously attached individualstypically predominantly tend to
(21:05):
be women and avoidantly attachedtend to be men.
We don't know why this is.
Personally speaking, myprofessional personal opinion,
it's not biological, it's justhow we're raised in a society
for emotions and all that stuff.
But you see in this moment, hekind of like needed you to be
that person, to stay on him, toplan things, to do this kind of
stuff.
That's why he's attracted toyou.
(21:26):
But at the same time, oh, it'stoo much for him, or you're too
clingy, or you're too needy, oryou expect too much out of him.
And it's like, yes, of courseyou do.
You want a relationship.
But I bring that up so women canhear themselves in the story to
say, look how good you were forhim.
And at the same time, yeah,unfortunately, sometimes we even
when we're healing, we cannotalways level up the other
(21:50):
person, even though we level up.
So, what was that like for youbecoming secure and learning?
Oh, we're just not compatible.
(22:42):
She's good because it's so true.
Oftentimes we want to save them,don't we?
But that's not our job,unfortunately.
It's not our responsibility, andwe need to let them figure their
shit out.
We need to let them, like yousaid, hit rock bottom.
And also, it's really hard.
Let's just be very honest aboutthat.
(23:05):
It's hard to watch them.
(23:35):
Exactly.
I would say it's in like anattached way, because yeah, you
know, healthy, unhealthy comeswith a lot of like connotations,
but there's absolutely anattachment wound there of
saying, Oh, if he needs me, thenhe won't leave me, then I'm
needed, I'm important, I'mwanted, yeah, all of these
things.
And that's those wounds oftencome up in anxiously attached
(23:56):
women.
It's where we feel like we needto be everything for everyone.
I you talk about this in yourbook, like you said, the Wonder
Woman Cape.
We have to be all the things allthe time.
And it's like, no, we shouldn'thave to.
We should be able to be in arelationship where we can be
imperfect.
We should not have to carry theweight of the emotional load of
(24:18):
this relationship.
And that means sometimes themost secure thing I think you
did was probably walking awayfrom that relationship.
That's the hardest part.
That's secure because peoplesay, I'm I'm healing, I'm
becoming more secure.
But now I kind of see all of hisissues.
Wait a second, I feel like I'mI'm worse, I feel like I'm
avoidant now, I feel like I'mcreating problems, and I'm like,
no, sweetheart, there wasalready problems there.
(24:40):
Yeah.
(25:05):
Yeah.
Yeah, and what's often happensin that relationship, and and
maybe you can speak on this alittle bit, is we stay in these
relationships because we think,oh, if I am good enough, he'll
change.
If I love him enough, if I workhard enough, if I say the right
(25:28):
thing, if I just get us theright counselor, he'll change.
And then I will get that life Iwant when I'm eighty-three.
And instead, that holds us back,doesn't it?
Yeah.
(26:20):
This could be a a partner, ahusband, a boyfriend.
It could also be a familymember, a friend.
We're not creating them as avillain.
We're not putting them down.
We're not, you know, listen, Ilove a good trash talk session
with the girls and a glass ofwine.
We can always have that.
But generally speaking, we comeback to this moment of it's just
(26:40):
we're not right for each otherright now.
Like he wants somethingdifferent, and you want
something different.
And neither of you are right orwrong.
You're just not compatible rightnow.
And you can feel that in thelove that you speak of towards
him, even now, the healthy spacethat you're in, of saying you're
just lovingly letting him go.
And that's that's hard, but it'salso freeing.
(27:01):
Can you just talk me throughwhat that feels like in your
body, being able to truly speakfrom that place in your heart?
Yay! Listen, I am friends withall of my exes.
So people know that all thetime.
So, like, because that's it.
It's about just loving them.
(27:22):
And it it takes a weight off ofyour body.
So when we talk aboutreconnecting with ourselves,
when we talk about living inalignment with our values, do
you want to be the type ofperson that's talking shit about
somebody else?
You know, oh, he did this andhe's a douchebag, and you know,
he's a dickhead and he's thisand he's that.
Or do we want to be the type ofpeople that are coming at it
from a place of love and saying,like, okay, he just needs to go
(27:43):
figure himself out?
And that's that's where I wantto get us with.
So that is so beautiful.
Thank you so much for sharingthat as well.
I know with attachment styles,it is what I do.
Uh I wrote my own book, right,with Lucky Book Publishing,
Dance of Attachment.
And you can grab both mine andDr.
Dion's book on Amazon at anytime and just go in there, type
in our names, type in our booktitles, and you guys can get
them.
I'll also make sure I have themin the show notes.
(28:05):
As we're wrapping up here today,Dr.
Dion, is there one last thingyou would love my listeners to
know?
Talk me through it.
(30:53):
That's so beautiful.
And this is not something youhave to actually say to them.
They don't need to hear it, dothey?
No, this is just for ourselves.
Can we do that real quicktogether?
What were they again?
It was I'm sorry.
Um, it's supposed thank you.
I'm sorry.
Please forgive me.
I love you.
All right.
(31:13):
So if anyone, let's let's wrapup this way.
Everyone listening, I just wantyou to kind of take a moment,
whatever it is you're doing,whether you're driving, whether
you're falling asleep at night,whether you're doing the dishes,
whether you're walking your dog,you're hanging out with your
kids, wherever it is you listento this podcast.
I just want you to take amoment, maybe put a hand on your
heart if that feels good to you.
Think of somebody who kind ofmakes your body feel a little
(31:35):
bit icky when you think aboutthem, makes you feel just like,
oh, I just, oh, I don't want todo this prayer for them.
That's the exact person we'regoing to do this prayer for.
And we're just going to hold ourheart.
And Dr.
Dion, can you just say the fourwords again, please?
(32:02):
So powerful.
And thank you so much for comingon the show today, Dr.
Dion.
And I will speak with you nexttime.
Take care.
Hello, everyone, and welcome back to another episode
of Speak Honest.
I'm Jen Noble, your go-torelationship coach.
And on today's episode, I am soexcited to have a special guest
on with us.
This is Dr.
Dion Johnson, someone I considernot only a colleague, but a good
friend of mine.
She is a transformational coach,speaker, and author of the most
(00:23):
fabulous book called From Tiredto No, let me do that again.
Sorry.
And she is the author of themost wonderful book called From
Spy.
Oh my God, this is gonna happentoday.
I've had a long day, Dion.
And she is the author of themost fabulous book, From Tired
to Inspired, a soulful guide toreclaim your energy, joy, and
(00:47):
purpose.
Dr.
Dion helps women move fromburnout to inspired living
through her membership programs,her workshops, and her
transformational retreats.
She is known for her warmth, herwisdom, and her heart-centered
approach.
She guides women to reconnectwith themselves, their purpose,
and what truly matters.
(01:07):
And I am so honored today tohave Dr.
Dion on the show with us today.
Dr.
Dion, tell us a little bit moreabout yourself.
(01:27):
Yes, that's right.
We're both authors with LuckyBook Publishing.
As very many people know, I'vehad a lot of people on the show
lately with Lucky BookPublishing.
These are all just becoming mybesties.
That's why I have to have themall on.
In fact, Dion and I will both beat the LA event in November that
I have been talking about for solong.
I cannot wait to see you inperson and just give you the
biggest, tightest hug of alltime.
(01:48):
And you and I haveconversations, you know, on the
side all the time.
So I thought, what a perfectopportunity to get you to come
on the show, come on here andtalk to women.
Because something it is that youdeal with a lot is burnout,
right?
Tell me a little bit about yourown story with that.
(04:10):
Okay, great.
So I had to go look that upbecause I was like, what the
hell is instructional design?
What is this?
Can you actually just explain itto us a little bit about what it
is that that is?
(04:32):
So tell us a little bit aboutit.
(05:44):
Listen, I'm a structure girly atheart.
I need structure, I need ideas,and the thing is a scaffolding
that'll make total sense to allof the ladies, at least in my
membership program, because Isay that all the time.
My 12-step program in order tobecome secure and learn how to
confidently communicate, is allbased on a 12-step scaffolding
section.
And so when I open up your bookand I'm looking through it, I'm
(06:07):
reading it, I was like, oh mygosh, this is so easy to
understand.
This isn't, this isn't all overthe place.
And like, oh, um, listen, I getit.
I have ADHD.
I'm all over the place.
This is why I like structure.
But other books I read sometimesare they're just all over the
place and I don't know where tostart, where to begin, or
nothing draws me into know howto keep going.
But your book, it's so specialin that way where you're very
(06:28):
intentional.
You're very intentional abouthere's this chapter and here's
why.
And yeah, one of the reallycoolest things about your book
is the bullet journal.
I mean, it's so much more thanjust a book, it's essentially a
journal you can use after eachchapter or each section to go
through and be able to write or,like you said, draw or just
doodle your thoughts becauseit's so important.
(06:50):
Ladies, if you are listeningright now, come back to me real
quick because our written word,our written ideas, our hand to
our mind to hand to paperconnection is actually
incredibly important for ourneuroplasticity.
It teaches our brain and ourbody things that typing
unfortunately doesn't do.
(07:10):
Don't get me wrong, I'm stilldown for like a notes app in my
phone that I keep my journal inand things like that.
But this is so, so special.
So talk me through a little bitwhy did you want to add the
bullet journals to your book?
No way, that's fantastic.
Oh my goodness.
(07:31):
For anyone listening, she isjust opening up her bullet
journal, and it is beautiful.
Look at you.
(09:07):
And this is coming from likeyour 83-year-old self.
Like your 83-year-old self isasking you, it's saying, Dear
Dion, that's beautiful becausethere's so many times,
oftentimes, like with the work Ido with my clients where we go
back in time, right?
You know me, I work withattachment styles, and we'll
talk on that in just a second.
But we go back in time, we healour inner child or our inner
teenager, even our inner20-something-year-old girl, you
(09:29):
know, that's out there clubbingall the time or whatnot, or
maybe she wanted to and shedidn't get a chance to.
And we talk to her as our like40-year-old self.
So what a beautiful opportunitywe can have to jump forward and
do it in the other direction andhave our 80-year-old self
looking back on us and say, Hey,dear one, you know, this is
like, what would I like you toknow?
(09:51):
Or, hey, how, you know, this iswhat we need to be doing today
to get where you where you wantto go.
And I think that's beautiful.
(11:04):
Wait, are you sitting heretelling me menopause is a
blessing?
Because I am gonna struggle tohave to understand that, but I
think you might be right.
This is mind blowing right now.
It is, it's like it's like ourgift, isn't it?
As women going into our prime.
I'm I know right now I'mparamenopausal.
I know so many of my listenersare, and I know there's women in
my program that have completelybeen through menopause and
(11:26):
they've gone on to the otherside.
And it is, it's it's a bitchright now, sometimes.
Yeah, and it's difficult andit's hard, but also you're
right.
Otherwise, what's thealternative?
We would be getting pregnant,and some mammals do get pregnant
all the way up until the timethey're done.
And yet we get this gift to tokind of come back to ourselves
(11:47):
as this quote unquotemiddle-aged woman figuring out
ourselves, but it's thisbeautiful opportunity in our
lives to to make ourselves in away where we get to be in
alignment with what we've alwayswanted to be, right?
And I know one of the thingsthat you talk a lot about is
reconnecting with yourself, isbeing able to slow down and
(12:08):
really get to that place whereyou are inspired.
And so let's say there's a womanout there right now and she's
perimenopausal, she's 45 yearsold, she's listening, and she's
like, I am just fucking done.
There's just I have too much onmy plate, my kids are like just
destroying the house, my husbandisn't helping, my job is a mess.
(12:29):
Like, how does she come back toherself?
(13:10):
Yeah, grab your book, open itup, let's see.
Okay, so let me can you explainit for everyone listening?
Okay.
(15:16):
No, it's not, but let's put thatmuch effort that we're giving to
some making someone else money,and let's put that effort into
ourselves for our fulfillment,our satisfaction, our longevity
of our own life.
You're absolutely correct.
In fact, the very first step ofmy module system with my ladies
is we go through, and I have theeight areas of life, very
similar.
And this exactly, I tell this topeople all the time, y'all, we
(15:39):
are not creating anything new.
We have not reinvented anywheel.
We are just taking the knowledgethat is already out there.
We are on the shoulders ofbeautiful, great people that
have done the research beforeus, and we are putting it in
words where we understand it,especially us women, especially
a lot of stuff out there iswritten by men and they don't
quite understand what it is thatwe're going through.
(16:00):
So we have beautiful flowers,you know, we have what great
words to help understand for uslike legacy, impact.
Those words are so emotional.
So they're so important to us.
And so, yeah, I go through and Ihave the lady say, like, we just
need to do an audit.
We just need to be able to seeour lives and see, but so many
(16:21):
people, it's actually a lotharder than they realize to sit
down and be like, oh shit, wait,I don't feel like I am leaving
an impact or legacy.
And then what do I do with thatbig emotion?
And so I get it, it's difficult,it's hard, but at the same time,
it's so necessary.
So listen to Dr.
Dion and this, you know, grabher book.
If what I do isn't resonating,go to Dr.
(16:42):
Dion, what she's doing.
If what Dr.
Dion is doing isn't resonating,go find someone else.
But live your life in a waywhere you're gonna fulfill
yourself and be satisfied.
As I don't believe in the wordhappy, that's my big thing.
So I always have these otherwords.
I want us to all do that.
So, with all of that said, Iwant to transition slightly,
just looking at everything we'retalking about, and I want to
(17:04):
talk about relationships.
You mentioned before that yourrelationship, one of the things
that was the cause of yourburnout back, what was it, 13
years ago now or something likethat?
Um, tell tell me where you aretoday with all of that.
Mm-hmm.
(19:06):
Yep.
(19:40):
Let's see, let's let let's step,let's uh like uh can we stop
down into this a little bit?
Would that be okay?
Yeah, okay, great.
Because this is actually such agood point.
First off, I'm very impressedthat as an avoidantly attached
man, he was the one to tell youabout attachment styles.
Gosh, is that rare?
It's usually the otherdirection.
(20:01):
The anxious person wants to tellthe avoidant, look, this is what
you are, see why you're theproblem.
So that was just really likeshocking to me that he did that.
So I was like, that's cool.
I love hearing differentexperiences because people
always come to me like, is thispossible?
Always.
Everything's possible.
We're humans, we're not, youknow, code.
We're not just gonna like be oneway all the time.
And then yeah, when you're inthat space and you guys are
(20:22):
getting counseling and you'retalking about all this, and he's
not able, it's sounding like I'mhearing, he's not able to step
up into the leadership role.
Is that right?
Yeah, and this is why not onlyare anxiously attached people
attracted to avoidantly attachedpeople because they kind of
(20:43):
reinforce this wound and thisbelief that I'm not good enough
and you know, I need to earn myworth and all these things on
the opposite direction.
See how good anxiously attachedpeople are for avoidantly
attached people.
And right now, let's even justtalk about it in terms of men
and women.
Again, spectrum everywhere, butresearch does dictate that
anxiously attached individualstypically predominantly tend to
(21:05):
be women and avoidantly attachedtend to be men.
We don't know why this is.
Personally speaking, myprofessional personal opinion,
it's not biological, it's justhow we're raised in a society
for emotions and all that stuff.
But you see in this moment, hekind of like needed you to be
that person, to stay on him, toplan things, to do this kind of
stuff.
That's why he's attracted toyou.
(21:26):
But at the same time, oh, it'stoo much for him, or you're too
clingy, or you're too needy, oryou expect too much out of him.
And it's like, yes, of courseyou do.
You want a relationship.
But I bring that up so women canhear themselves in the story to
say, look how good you were forhim.
And at the same time, yeah,unfortunately, sometimes we even
when we're healing, we cannotalways level up the other
(21:50):
person, even though we level up.
So, what was that like for youbecoming secure and learning?
Oh, we're just not compatible.
(22:42):
She's good because it's so true.
Oftentimes we want to save them,don't we?
But that's not our job,unfortunately.
It's not our responsibility, andwe need to let them figure their
shit out.
We need to let them, like yousaid, hit rock bottom.
And also, it's really hard.
Let's just be very honest aboutthat.
(23:05):
It's hard to watch them.
(23:35):
Exactly.
I would say it's in like anattached way, because yeah, you
know, healthy, unhealthy comeswith a lot of like connotations,
but there's absolutely anattachment wound there of
saying, Oh, if he needs me, thenhe won't leave me, then I'm
needed, I'm important, I'mwanted, yeah, all of these
things.
And that's those wounds oftencome up in anxiously attached
(23:56):
women.
It's where we feel like we needto be everything for everyone.
I you talk about this in yourbook, like you said, the Wonder
Woman Cape.
We have to be all the things allthe time.
And it's like, no, we shouldn'thave to.
We should be able to be in arelationship where we can be
imperfect.
We should not have to carry theweight of the emotional load of
(24:18):
this relationship.
And that means sometimes themost secure thing I think you
did was probably walking awayfrom that relationship.
That's the hardest part.
That's secure because peoplesay, I'm I'm healing, I'm
becoming more secure.
But now I kind of see all of hisissues.
Wait a second, I feel like I'mI'm worse, I feel like I'm
avoidant now, I feel like I'mcreating problems, and I'm like,
no, sweetheart, there wasalready problems there.
(24:40):
Yeah.
(25:05):
Yeah.
Yeah, and what's often happensin that relationship, and and
maybe you can speak on this alittle bit, is we stay in these
relationships because we think,oh, if I am good enough, he'll
change.
If I love him enough, if I workhard enough, if I say the right
(25:28):
thing, if I just get us theright counselor, he'll change.
And then I will get that life Iwant when I'm eighty-three.
And instead, that holds us back,doesn't it?
Yeah.
(26:20):
This could be a a partner, ahusband, a boyfriend.
It could also be a familymember, a friend.
We're not creating them as avillain.
We're not putting them down.
We're not, you know, listen, Ilove a good trash talk session
with the girls and a glass ofwine.
We can always have that.
But generally speaking, we comeback to this moment of it's just
(26:40):
we're not right for each otherright now.
Like he wants somethingdifferent, and you want
something different.
And neither of you are right orwrong.
You're just not compatible rightnow.
And you can feel that in thelove that you speak of towards
him, even now, the healthy spacethat you're in, of saying you're
just lovingly letting him go.
And that's that's hard, but it'salso freeing.
(27:01):
Can you just talk me throughwhat that feels like in your
body, being able to truly speakfrom that place in your heart?
Yay! Listen, I am friends withall of my exes.
So people know that all thetime.
So, like, because that's it.
It's about just loving them.
(27:22):
And it it takes a weight off ofyour body.
So when we talk aboutreconnecting with ourselves,
when we talk about living inalignment with our values, do
you want to be the type ofperson that's talking shit about
somebody else?
You know, oh, he did this andhe's a douchebag, and you know,
he's a dickhead and he's thisand he's that.
Or do we want to be the type ofpeople that are coming at it
from a place of love and saying,like, okay, he just needs to go
(27:43):
figure himself out?
And that's that's where I wantto get us with.
So that is so beautiful.
Thank you so much for sharingthat as well.
I know with attachment styles,it is what I do.
Uh I wrote my own book, right,with Lucky Book Publishing,
Dance of Attachment.
And you can grab both mine andDr.
Dion's book on Amazon at anytime and just go in there, type
in our names, type in our booktitles, and you guys can get
them.
I'll also make sure I have themin the show notes.
(28:05):
As we're wrapping up here today,Dr.
Dion, is there one last thingyou would love my listeners to
know?
Talk me through it.
(30:53):
That's so beautiful.
And this is not something youhave to actually say to them.
They don't need to hear it, dothey?
No, this is just for ourselves.
Can we do that real quicktogether?
What were they again?
It was I'm sorry.
Um, it's supposed thank you.
I'm sorry.
Please forgive me.
I love you.
All right.
(31:13):
So if anyone, let's let's wrapup this way.
Everyone listening, I just wantyou to kind of take a moment,
whatever it is you're doing,whether you're driving, whether
you're falling asleep at night,whether you're doing the dishes,
whether you're walking your dog,you're hanging out with your
kids, wherever it is you listento this podcast.
I just want you to take amoment, maybe put a hand on your
heart if that feels good to you.
Think of somebody who kind ofmakes your body feel a little
(31:35):
bit icky when you think aboutthem, makes you feel just like,
oh, I just, oh, I don't want todo this prayer for them.
That's the exact person we'regoing to do this prayer for.
And we're just going to hold ourheart.
And Dr.
Dion, can you just say the fourwords again, please?
(32:02):
So powerful.
And thank you so much for comingon the show today, Dr.
Dion.
And I will speak with you nexttime.
Take care.
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