December 10, 2025 • 47 mins
Are politics turning people on more than we realize?
Today on Talk Sex with Annette, we’re diving into a surprising and fast-growing fantasy showing up in bedrooms, dating apps, and long-term relationships: the political humiliation kink — when opposing beliefs become part of a consensual power-play dynamic.
In this episode, I sit down with acclaimed psychosexual therapist and sex educator Gigi Engle to unpack why this trend is rising right now, how emotional tension becomes erotic tension, and how couples can explore fantasy safely without crossing real-life boundaries.
We break down:
✨ Why political tension can create unexpected attraction
✨ The psychology behind power-play role dynamics
✨ How to talk about fantasies with a partner (without chaos!)
✨ What to avoid if you and your partner truly disagree politically
✨ Signs this fantasy is playful — and signs it’s NOT
You can find Gigi here: https://www.missgigiengle.com/
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
SPEAKER_00 (01:29):
Do the sex.
SPEAKER_01 (01:33):
Today's Talk Sex with a Net topic is the rise of
political humiliation kink whenideology becomes foreplay.
What if the thing that istearing our country apart is
also turning people on?
Because the truth is, more andmore couples are whispering
things like, tell me you're mynaughty little conservative
(01:54):
slut, or admit you like beingcorrupted by a liberal in bed.
And suddenly the politicalhumiliation kink is no longer on
the fringe anymore.
It is everywhere.
Today we are diving into a kinksitting right at the
intersection of cultural shame,rebellion, and erotic role play,
the political humiliation kink.
(02:15):
Why does this work?
Why now?
And how do you explore itwithout turning your bedroom
into a political battlefield?
To help us unpack all of this, Iam joined by someone whose
expertise in kinks and sexualliberation makes her the perfect
guide.
Gigi Ingle is an accreditedcertified sex and relationship
psychotherapist, award-winningauthor, and internationally
(02:39):
recognized sex educator.
She is an associate clinician atTherapy Yard, working
extensively with LGBTQIA clientsand kinky folks, and people in
open and or polyamorousrelationships.
She's also the author ofKinkurious and All the Fucking
Mistakes and 2025's nominationfor Sexologist of the Year.
(03:01):
Now, before we dive in, I wantto remind you that I'm over on
OnlyFans, and there I'm sharingmy sex and intimacy how-tos,
demos, and audio guidedself-pleasure meditations, and
also offering an opportunity foryou to ask me your one-off
questions there.
You can find me there with myhandle at TalkSex within it.
You can find me on Substackdoing a whole lot of the same
with the handle at TalkSexwithin it.
(03:22):
You can also scroll down to theshow notes below, and you're
going to find the linkseverywhere you want to find me
there.
And I can't wait to see you.
But for now, Gigi, can you tellmy listeners more about you?
SPEAKER_00 (03:35):
Sure.
So, you know, I think your introwas pretty extensive there, but
I am a psychosexual andrelationship therapist.
I'm based in London, where I'velived for five years, and I work
with kinky clients and the LGBTQcommunity pretty exclusively.
And I just wrote a new bookthat's a guide for beginners to
explore their more taboo desiresin a really trauma-informed and
(03:58):
fun, hands-on kind of way.
So I think it's reallyaccessible for anybody who's
interested in exploring kink ofthe whole spectrum of it really
goes into depth.
And I am also a writer for allyour favorite magazines, such as
Cosmo and Women's Health, whereyou can find me talking about
kinks and fetishes in a nuancedand journalist-focused lens.
SPEAKER_01 (04:20):
So perfect guide for this topic.
And you want to stay to the endbecause, of course, right now,
politics, well, they're not justa hot topic.
They are infiltrating, ofcourse, all areas of our lives.
If you're finding this kinkshowing up in the bedroom or in
your dating life, this is goingto help you direct it and play
with it in a way that doesn'tdestroy a potential relationship
(04:42):
or your current relationship andhopefully can lead to a fun,
kinky turned on time.
So by the end, we're going togive you, as usual, our
takeaways so that you can startengaging in this kink should you
want to, starting tonight.
So let's talk about politics andsex, I guess, in a popsic way.
Cheers.
Cheers.
(05:02):
Gigi, when we say politicalhumiliation kink, what exactly
are we talking about?
SPEAKER_00 (05:08):
It's a pretty big term, but really what we're
looking at is people who areessentially role-playing
different conservative orliberal ideologies for the most
part.
So one partner might be theconservative party, the other
partner might be the liberalparty.
And they're basically usingthese opposing views as a part
(05:29):
of their dominant and submissivedynamic.
So somebody might be, forexample, you might be a more
dominant female partner and youare wearing your leather corset
and spanking your partner,telling them they're a dirty
little conservative pig orsomething along those lines.
So really bringing some of thevery charged feelings we have
(05:54):
about politics into a safe andcontained kinky space.
SPEAKER_01 (06:00):
In this dynamic, are people pretending to be in those
roles or are they actually ofthat political mindset?
Or it can be a mix of both?
SPEAKER_00 (06:13):
I would say probably a mix of both.
I would say most likely it'sgoing to be people who are
role-playing the roles, butthere's definitely people who
are in mixed political, I havemixed political ideologies in
their relationships, and theymay choose to use their
differing role these differingideologies in a safe way where
they can kind of play with themin a way that isn't so charged
(06:37):
as it might be if you're sittingat the dinner table and having
an argument about politics.
It's kind of a way to bring someof that into a safer space
that's kinkier rather thanemotionally charged.
SPEAKER_01 (06:50):
Maybe it's a little bit of a way to work out their
frustrations with each other,keep the relationship alive.
Why says kink rising right nowin this particular political
climate?
SPEAKER_00 (07:02):
I think it's pretty obvious that we are pretty much
more divided than we ever havebeen in the political landscape
we have in the United States.
And the more partisan thesepartisan parties become, and the
more intense we becomepassionate about our ideologies,
the and the wider the gap iscoming between them, it makes
(07:23):
sense that as this shit ishappening and as we are moving
in this sort of polar oppositeeffect, that this would start to
become more and more relevantand salient.
And when it comes to sexualityand exploration, when something
like politics is so imbued ineverything that we see and
(07:44):
experience in our day-to-daylife, it makes sense that it
there might be some overlap withsexuality.
SPEAKER_01 (07:50):
Well, so that leads me to ask, what makes political
tension such fertile ground forerotic charge?
SPEAKER_00 (07:59):
I think that what makes it so appealing for people
is that there are a lot ofemotions that come up with the
way we feel about politics.
Really can you can feel reallypassionate about something,
really angry about certainthings.
And often when we feel that way,we can experience arousal from
(08:20):
that.
And so sometimes it can be partof really part of the arousal
process.
And when we're talking abouthumiliation, Kink, when we're
talking about politicsparticularly, there can be, I
think, a real, a real eroticspark in being able to humiliate
somebody in a safe andconsensual way that both people
are agreeing to when you feel sopassionately that they're wrong.
SPEAKER_01 (08:43):
Is this a newer phenomenon or has the political
humiliation always existed?
Because honestly, I haven'treally heard about it until
recently.
SPEAKER_00 (08:55):
I think it's been around as long as politics have
been around.
I there's not unsurprisingly nota ton of data on this.
It's not like people are goingout and studying this
particularly, but I think it'sbeen around for a long time.
Like before recently, when it'ssort of become more of this
Democrat versus Republicandynamic that we're seeing, I
definitely had seen where peoplewere really sexually attracted
(09:16):
to dictators.
So they would have a partner whowas role-playing as, say, like
Vladimir Putin.
And that was part of their kindof kink role play, which, you
know, it wouldn't be me, butlike, you know, I see the appeal
of like this sort of bad guywho's in power and like he's
submitting to you as thedominatrix.
So I think it's it's the ideathat politics has played a role
(09:36):
in sex, I think, has been aroundfor a very long time.
But I do think that thisparticular brand of it is
becoming very popular nowadaysand much more trendy.
SPEAKER_01 (09:45):
You know, what it brings to mind instantly for me
is a Game of Thrones, Daenerys,and oh, what was the name of her
husband?
Listeners, I hope you guys know,but her husband who she sold to
that Jason Momoa plays, was thiswas considered one of the most
erotic dynamics, right?
(10:07):
And it was very much that twodifferent ideologies and and
then her power as a sub to liketransform him.
It sounds like a lot of thatmight come into play.
Also, the idea of comingtogether with someone who has
different ideologies that maybethrough seduction you can move
in a direction.
SPEAKER_00 (10:26):
Yeah, that's a really good point.
I definitely think there's anelement of that where it's kind
of like, I'm gonna be like thisthe sexy liberal person who you
can't resist and I'm gonna getyou to change your mind.
Like that, I think is definitelya big pull of it as well.
SPEAKER_01 (10:39):
Part of it, yeah.
So do people raised in rigidmoral or political systems erod
of eroticized rebellion orcorruption at maybe let's say a
higher level than maybe someonewho wasn't?
And might they perhaps be morelikely to engage in this kind of
dynamic?
SPEAKER_00 (11:57):
I think it's kind of hard to say such a subjective
people have such subjectiveexperiences.
I could definitely see how thatcould happen for sure.
Because when you grow up withreally rigid ideologies, and if
you, for instance, as anexample, like if you grew up in
a really conservative householdand you are now a really
conservative household withreally conservative parents, and
you are now living this life ofperhaps you're queer and you're
(12:18):
living more in your authenticspace, like the idea of
political fraught emotionalityis probably something that's
very front and center in yourpsyche.
So that could definitely play arole in how a kink like this
could develop.
SPEAKER_01 (12:30):
So we've primarily talked about this as a kink
that's gonna show up in thebedroom.
What about before we even get tothe bedroom?
And we're in the d dating world.
(13:41):
I've noticed back when I wassingle myself that I've uh there
were times I felt like I wascatniped to the conservative
guy, right?
And I've talked to many singlesdating who are like, oh, you
know, I don't women, liberalwomen who are like, man, I don't
know why, but I'm so attractedto like these idiot conservative
(14:04):
men, you know, sexually and andso on and so forth.
Does kink when it's notsomething you know that you're
experiencing show up in yourdating life and who you pursue?
And is that problematic, or canit just be converted into
something positive?
SPEAKER_00 (14:24):
I think when people are attracted to people with
very different politicalbeliefs, it's not so much that
it's because they have thedifferent political beliefs,
it's more that they might beattracted to a certain type of
person, somebody who comes froma certain background or looks a
specific way.
And then it sort of has thatkind of overlap, especially if
we're talking about heterosexualdynamics, because the stats
(14:48):
themselves just show that, youknow, it's women who are mostly
liberal and men who are mostlyconservative.
And so I think a lot ofheterosexual women will find
themselves unbeknownst to thembeing attracted to conservatives
just by the statistics alone.
And it there's nothing wrongwith wanting to pursue a
relationship with somebody whohas different political
ideologies than you do, as longas it's not something you find
(15:10):
completely morally reprehensibleand it goes against all of your
beliefs.
And it's also possible to have arelationship with somebody like
that that is purely a kinkdynamic.
For instance, you could have apartner you play with who's just
a kink partner or a sexualpartner, and there's somebody
who you can engage with thiskind of kink with within that
kind of structured dynamicwithout having to have the
(15:33):
intensity of having an actualrelationship with somebody whose
political ideology goes againsteverything you believe in.
SPEAKER_01 (15:38):
This is an interesting little take on this
kink.
Is it more prevalent than in theheterosexual dynamic than in the
LGBTQ queer dynamic?
SPEAKER_00 (15:52):
I would definitely say that's very highly likely
because there you're not goingto find a lot of conservative
queer people.
Like there are some, but thatthe percentage of uh queer per
queer people being conservativeis quite low because
conservative politics is notparticularly in favor of LGBTQ
(16:14):
rights.
So I think that juststatistically, it would have to
be accurate.
SPEAKER_01 (16:19):
Right.
I can't and and remember in anyof my dynamics with any of my
female partners, that coming up.
However, I think without namingit, I've definitely experienced
some of this political kinkbeing acted out, but not
consciously.
Right.
So that brings me to how ifpeople aren't aware of this
(16:42):
kink, but yet it's playing outin their dating life, it's
playing out in their bedroomlife, can it be destructive to
their dynamic if not properlyaddressed or played out with
what I would consider considersort of your standard BDSM or
kink playbook rules?
SPEAKER_00 (17:03):
Yeah, absolutely.
I mean, the three main tenantsof my book are consent,
communication, and aftercare.
So if you're not reallyexplicitly naming what it is
that you're doing and you're nottalking about it, you're not
having safe words, you're notacknowledging the play that
you're engaging with, it canhave the potential to have a
bleedover effect into the restof your relationship.
And it doesn't stay inside ofthe safe container that you
(17:23):
build in a kink dynamic.
So it is really important thatwe're having these
conversations, even if it'suncomfortable.
But sometimes naming theelephant in the room is a really
big pillar in building trust andsafe relationships with people.
SPEAKER_01 (17:35):
So you're going to have to address what you're
doing.
Which I think can be shame, feelshameful to some people.
And why would it feel shamefulto some people if suddenly they
recognize, oh, I'm doing thisthing that now has the name
political humiliation king?
SPEAKER_00 (17:54):
Yeah.
I mean, I think people are warywhen they about addressing it if
they are having this play out intheir life and they haven't
named it, because it might bethe way that you had said
earlier, where it's like workingout some of the aggression they
might have towards the partnerfor having political ideas that
they're very against.
And so it's kind of anopportunity for them to sort of
work some of that out in thebedroom, so to speak.
(18:16):
But the problem is that it stopsbeing, I don't know that it's so
much kink in that instance as itis actual aggression if you're
not actually discussing it andand figuring out the roles
because consent is such a hugepart of making this play
ethical.
SPEAKER_01 (18:31):
Correct.
And if you don't understand whatyou're doing in the bedroom,
then you aren't creatingboundaries around when it goes
too far for one person, right?
So maybe now moving to how thismight be showing up in your
relationship.
Perhaps you're listening to thisand you're thinking, we did kind
of talk about politics while wewere having sex the other night.
(18:53):
Because I think this can show upin what people might consider
very vanilla sexual encounters.
And for people who mightconsider themselves very
vanilla, you know.
I know that if I think back onmy experience, I've had moments
where I was sleeping withsomeone or dating with someone,
and they've made some littlecomment, like, oh, you like
(19:15):
being dominated by conservativeor whatever.
And I thought, that's a weirdthing to say, but oh no, I
didn't know, or whatever it was.
So one of the ways that this isgoing to show up, I imagine,
first in a relationship where ithasn't been acknowledged and
it's not been named norboundaries made is through
(19:37):
language.
So I'm curious about howpolitical language norm, which
is normally weaponized, thinkabout snowflake, you know,
that's snowflakes have reallybecome a weapon verbally in in
the political landscape.
But how how does that languagebecome erotic in kink contexts?
SPEAKER_00 (19:58):
Yeah, it's in humiliation kinks, you're going
to see a lot of and kink ingeneral, there's going to be a
lot of language that outside ofthe kink container, not going to
be okay.
People want to be called dirtylittle sluts and bitches, and
you know, they use the F word,gay guys will use the F word
with each other, like that, youknow, that kind of thing.
And like in the side of that,inside of that container, and if
(20:19):
you guys have agreed on thatlanguage, totally fine.
So you use the same kind ofpolitical language that's used
to demean somebody in a socialcontext, like calling me, oh,
you're being such a snowflake,but in the bedroom, it's used to
be like, it now has this eroticcharge.
And now has this erotic power,where you're using it purposely
in a sexual and arousing contextto degrade the other person in a
(20:42):
way that's consensual.
So you're not attacking theircharacter.
It's part of a role-play scene.
And so you can get that kind oferotic charge out of it and have
that be really sexy, but it'scontained and it's safe, and you
know that it's not thenbasically just being horrible.
SPEAKER_01 (21:02):
Right.
Like even something as simple assaying in the middle of
intimacy, oh, you like beingdominated by a conservative man.
Like in the middle of intimacy,if we haven't talked about it,
that's then the person who is isnot conservative is going to be
like, I actually don't likethat.
Or what does it mean that I'meven with you right now?
(21:22):
And it pulls them out of theerotic landscape and into the
battlefield, right?
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (21:30):
It's like that you're playing, you're playing
at kink without using the curwithout using the language and
the skills of kink.
It's like that, because it's notkink if you're just saying that
without somebody's consent andthey don't like it.
Like that's not hot.
(22:40):
Right.
Right.
SPEAKER_01 (22:41):
So would you say that this kink typically starts
with a verbal, verbal exchange.
It's more verbal play.
SPEAKER_00 (22:51):
Yeah, I would say that's probably the safest place
to start and the very much themost accessible way to start.
Because you kind of need a lotof what's going on with politics
when we discuss politics ingeneral, right?
Is that we are discussing it.
It is a verbal-based discussionyou're having about politics in
general.
So it makes sense that whenyou're creating the kink
dynamic, it would start withthat kind of heated, debate-like
(23:12):
language.
And then you can move into usingother things like paddles and
want to tie somebody up.
You could add all that stuff in,but starting with like the
language you're going to use andgetting very clear on the
boundaries of what's okay andwhat's not okay.
Like for instance, you might beokay with Snowflake, but you
might not be okay with somethingelse.
And so you kind of have to getclear about what's going to be
okay and what's not, with kindof the understanding that if
you're just starting to startingout, you might not know
(23:35):
something is going to reallyupset you until it's said.
And then that's why we have safewords, which are non-sexual
words used to stop the play.
You'd have that said ahead oftime.
And that way, if the person sayssomething that you didn't
realize was going to hit you inthe wrong way, you can stop and
be like, oh, wait, I actuallydon't like that.
Let's not use that one.
And it creates a dynamic whereeverybody feels because the
whole point of kink is likeyou're not actually fighting,
(23:57):
you're not actually humiliatingsomebody.
It's part of the erotic play.
And so when you have it in thatsafe container, it's just a lot
safer to explore that way.
SPEAKER_01 (24:05):
But for people who are listening to this who aren't
kinky or really hint aware, likefor the most part, you're like,
I'm mostly vanilla.
Hearing the word humiliation incontext of eroticism and sexual
interaction might sound likeLike, why would you why would
(25:21):
you want someone to humiliateyou?
Might sound awful.
I think a lot of people sort offlinch at that.
Can you talk a little bit aboutwhy humiliation can be erotic in
the bedroom setting withoutbeing harmful?
SPEAKER_00 (25:37):
Sure.
So erot erotic humiliation, likewhen everybody is consulting
consenting and enjoyingthemselves for it.
It's like the reason people havesuch a get such a kick out of
humiliation in the bedroom.
And even if you're the mosthumiliation, I understand,
loaded word.
But I think people also have tothink about just their regular
sexual dynamics.
There's very often somebody whois doing the leading and
(25:59):
somebody who is doing most ofthe following.
So you kind of already have onepartner who's being a little
more dominant, one partner who'sbeing a little more submissive.
And you know, maybe your partnercalls you like a little slut or
something.
And in that context of vanillasex, you're like, oh, that's not
humiliation.
That they're just calling me aslut because I have a dirty girl
in bed.
But like actually, that is kindof a a little bit of a
humiliation kink because thething is, it's like being, it's
(26:20):
about being dominated, it'sabout consensual power exchange.
And for a lot of people, there'ssuch a close connection with the
feelings of humiliation anderoticism.
They just are really closelyconnected in our brain and in
our nervous system response.
So that's why some people getlike a really strong erotic
charge out of it.
But if the word humiliation isgoing to stop you from wanting
(26:41):
to engage with any kind of likeplay that is in this sort of dot
DS dynamic where you're sayingquote unquote meaner things to
each other, you don't have tocall it humiliation.
It can just be like political,political politics kink or like
role play politics kink orwhatever you want to call it.
The humiliation aspect isn'tnecessary.
SPEAKER_01 (27:02):
Yeah, as as you're talking, I was thinking about
how this dynamic, thisparticular kink has played out
across time.
Lots of people like to in roleplay, right?
Like to roleplay the king or theconqueror, taking the princess
or the peasant.
That is sort of an origin storyof the political kink, right?
(27:26):
But it's in a dynamic that seemsso far from us until now.
So it has been around for a longtime.
And if you're a kinkster who hasalready been doing role play,
you've probably been engaging insome type of this dynamic,
depending on what you're into.
SPEAKER_00 (27:45):
Yeah, it's it's a lot of the appeal is kind of
being so irresistible to theother person that despite you
being so different, they can'tresist you because you're so
seductive or you're so alluring.
And that's part of it as well.
Like with this kind of you don'tnecessarily need the humiliation
aspect of it so much as much asit is like our ideologies are so
different that you but you youcan't resist me because I'm such
(28:07):
a seductress, that kind ofthing.
SPEAKER_01 (28:09):
It's the forbidden fruit as well.
A little bit of the forbiddenfruit that comes into it.
So what are some signs that acouple should not engage in this
king in the bedroom?
SPEAKER_00 (28:27):
I would say if you are brand new to kink, this
might be a difficult one to takeon right away, but and I would
probably start with somethingmore like sensation play and you
know, stuff that's a little moreeasy and basic and a little less
intense with the emotions.
I would also be really carefulif you and your partner really
(28:51):
have true IRL opposing politicalideologies.
Like it it might be, it mightnot go the sexy way you think it
is if you truly believe thatyour partner has these like
really upsetting and problematicbeliefs, and vice versa.
And trying to bring that intothe bedroom might it might be
(29:13):
great, or it might not be.
So I would say it's gonna take alot of negotiation beforehand.
And also if your relationship isin a really rocky place, which a
lot of relationships these dayswhere we have opposing political
ideologies are, due to howpolarized everything has become.
Starting kink in a really rockyplace can be sort of dangerous
territory.
What you kind of want to dofirst is go to therapy and try
(29:36):
to get your relationship back ontrack and in solid footing
before you start introducingkind of all this outside play
into it because kink is notgoing to fix the underlying
issues that are plaguing yourrelationship.
SPEAKER_01 (29:48):
Right.
So if you recognize that this isa turn-on for you, I can see two
different scenarios.
You recognize that it's aturn-on with for you with your
current partner, either becausethey have a different ideology
just enough that it's kind ofcome up in your conversations
(30:10):
and you've noticed that it'spart of what attracts you, or
you engaged in some debate withthem and gotten turned on.
Or you're currently with apartner of the same political
ideology, and you find yourselffantasizing about other people
or partners, a potential affairwith or encounter with someone
(30:33):
of a different ideology.
So in this case, let's say witha partner who's of the same
ideology of you of yours.
So two conservative people,we'll say two conservative
people.
And one of you is like, oh, Inoticed that I get turned on by
this idea, or I'm starting tofantasize about being with
someone who's liberal.
(30:54):
How do you bring that to yourpartner and say, can we play
with this without it likegetting real weird real quick?
SPEAKER_00 (31:03):
Uh well, first you want to have the timing tone and
turf is what I call it withconversations, where you are
making sure the timing of theconversation is not during sex
and not in a really emotionallycharged environment like the
bedroom.
So you want to sit down and havea conversation in like a safe
space, like your living room.
Maybe you guys are having dinnertogether, whatever it is, and
you need to get consent for thatconversation.
(31:25):
So you can say something like,you know, our sex life means a
lot to me.
It's really important to me.
I would really like toexperiment with some more
things.
I've specifically been thinking,and I know this might sound a
little odd, so bear with me.
I've had this strange likefantasy about being with
somebody who's liberal and Idon't know what it is about it,
(31:46):
but it just like turns me on,probably because it's so taboo
and like it's not somebody Iwould ever actually want to be
with, but like something aboutthat gets me going.
Is that a role-play scenarioyou'd be open to trying?
And it's really important thatwhen partners are coming to this
conversation, they're coming toit very empathetically towards
(32:07):
each other rather than seeinganything as being like an attack
on them.
So they immediately becomedefensive, because that can
often happen when we're talkingabout sex.
We were never really taught howto talk about sex.
We're taught how to be, youknow, good friends, good
siblings, all that, but we'renever taught how to be good
partners and lovers.
So it's kind of an uncomfortableconversation for people to have
(32:28):
to begin with.
So you have to be willing togive your partner a really
generous interpretation thatthey're coming to you, not to
say that your sex life is notgood, but because they have this
curiosity and they genuinelywant to like play and expand
with you.
And I think that that's kind ofwhere you start with it.
And I think it can be reallyhelpful to start looking at
some, once you've had some ofthese conversations, if they're
open to it, looking at some ofthe erotic material that's
(32:51):
online.
Like be it like stories thatcenter on this, like erotic
stories.
There's definitely some greatOnlyFans content and porn
content that sort of centers onthis, just so you can kind of
get sort of get an idea ofwhat's going on with all of
that.
I think shared media withpartners can be such a bonding
experience.
I know it's a controversialtopic for some couples, but it
can be great for people who areopen to that.
(33:12):
And yeah, just sort of startingto get curious about it.
Like that's where, that's whereI would begin.
SPEAKER_01 (33:17):
Yeah, I think shared media, if both partners feel
comfortable with it, is such agreat way to educate and share
ideas and fantasies.
Because then it also takeshaving to explain it in depth
with your own words.
It takes not off the table, butit takes the pressure off of
(33:38):
that.
unknown (33:38):
Absolutely.
SPEAKER_00 (33:39):
Like, hey, watch this.
How do you feel?
I just think it's reallyimportant that couples are
coming to this with an open mindand are willing to be a little
bit more curious with eachother.
unknown (33:49):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (33:51):
Absolutely.
And I think because I'm moreliberal and with liberalism,
oftentimes uh sex positive tendsto go more hand in hand.
I'm also queer.
Again, I think uh sex positivityand kink is a little bit more uh
(34:11):
accepted in the LGBTQ communityand in more liberal communities,
right?
It's something that's talkedabout a lot.
This conversation might beeasier, it might make more
sense.
But if you are someone who leansconservative or even religiously
(34:31):
conservative, but you haveliberal ideals, having this
conversation could be very hard.
It would oh, I would think itwould be harder.
And perhaps one of the easierways to introduce it is to talk
about, hey, like even like somelight role play, and then you
can slip in those role dynamics,right?
(34:52):
Like, hey, how about doing alittle role play?
And you can be like, oh yeah,the professor student is fun,
but what about conservativeliberal play?
SPEAKER_00 (35:00):
Yeah.
I mean, I think it's definitelyharder if you're conservative,
especially with all this so manypeople, so many conservatives
also are Christians and very thebig population evangelical
Christians.
So not exactly the most sexpositive folk, but I do think
that it's still, I mean, datashows that conservative states
are just as just as kinky intheir fantasies and their erotic
(35:20):
material as everywhere else.
They're just not really talkingabout it.
So I can understand how that'ssort of a difficult topic when
you don't have the language andwhen it is so taboo in the
culture that you've grown up in.
But like you said, it is easy tonot easy, but it's a kind of a
good gateway to kind of use theword, you know, role play rather
than saying, I I don't know if Iif I would go right for want to
(35:41):
do political humiliation, King.
That might just be a bit much.
You know, it's it language isimportant and you want to be as
gentle as possible.
SPEAKER_01 (35:49):
Do you think there's a a spike in one side or the
other an interest in politicalhumiliation?
SPEAKER_00 (35:55):
I definitely do not have a solid answer on that one
because we just don't have thenumbers for it.
I think that people who wherepolitics has been more rigid in
their lives and their upbringingare going to be more likely to
have this, whether that'sliberal or conservative.
I think in conservative statesin general and in conservative
communities in general, you'llsee a lot more intense kinks
(36:20):
being searched for in like pornhub and those sorts of erotic
spaces, because it's not thatthey are more kinky.
It's just that they are, theyhave these like niche interests
that they're not able to talkabout or express.
So that's why they're lookingfor it more in a in an erotic
material space.
But I think the more charged andthe more passionate you feel
(36:43):
about politics, the more itmight turn you on.
I could see how it withconservative ideology, because
there's so much more sexpositivity with liberals and
they kind of you kind of havethis ex you kind of have so many
so many more options forfetishes and kinks that are
available to you because of thecommunity.
If you're in conservativepolitics and so much of your
(37:04):
life is built around church andfootball and family, it might be
that politics is really whereyou're getting your erotic
charge because it's one of theonly kinds of kinks you have
access to.
SPEAKER_01 (37:19):
I'm speaking only from personal experience.
I haven't heard this come frommy more liberal acquaintances as
much as I've definitely heard,especially more conservative men
talk about being turned on bymore liberal women.
And in that, I think you'reright, that there is the aspect
of more sex positivity, moreopenness, women being more open
(37:42):
to exploratory and adventurousintimacy, right?
Being open to trying new things.
We don't necessarily see kinksas this bad thing.
We don't necessarily freak outif you're like, hey, how do you
feel about a trees or exploringwith other people?
For more liberal people, it'smaybe I'm open to that or not
(38:05):
into that, but maybe not theshame piece doesn't come into it
as much.
unknown (38:09):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (38:09):
I mean, I think for a lot of liberal, a lot of
conservative men, they're theyare attracted to sort of going
outside of the king space for asecond here, but they are
attracted to liberal womensexually because they are
attracted to the the vibe of aliberal woman who is sort of
sexually adventurous, is muchmore open about her sexuality,
more more comfortable in thatspace.
And so that I could understanddefinitely understand the sexual
(38:31):
appeal of that.
Like, oh, I I want to take awayyour bodily autonomy, but you're
really hot.
Thank you, sir.
But no, thank you.
That's so tempting.
SPEAKER_01 (38:40):
So bizarre to me, but you want to you wanna stop
me from being able to give youthis thing I can give you
because I have the right to bewho I am.
Anyways, what a conundrum foryou.
Exhausting.
It's exhausting.
All right, so now we've offeredsome ways for, especially in a
(39:03):
conservative on-conservativerelationship, to introduce this
topic to your partner and embarkon it should they be open to it.
Now it's much easier if you arein a dynamic where it's either
conservative and liberal liberalmarriage or partnership or two
(39:24):
liberals, right?
Because or more liberal people.
And look, it's a spectrum, let'sbe honest.
Political views are a spectrum,but I'm giving more extremes
because that gives you plenty oftools for conversations.
Are there any complications youcan see coming in to play
between, let's say, two moreliberal individuals in a
(39:46):
relationship, or a liberal and aconservative?
SPEAKER_00 (39:49):
Oh, like if they're if it's mixed political
ideology?
If you actually do have mixedpolitical ideology, you can play
with this kink, but it needs tobe done with a lot of care
because at that point, thethings you're saying to the
other person are quite likelythings you mean.
And that can have a lot befraught with a lot more
emotionality.
(40:09):
Like, for instance, in theclassic humiliation dom sub
instance, we're taking politicsout of it for a second.
You're humiliating your sub andspanking him and telling him
he's the bad boy and pegging himand all these sorts of things.
But you don't actually believehe's a filthy little pig, or
like think like you don'tactually believe these things
about him as a person.
This is part of your like kinkdynamic, and it's and you
(40:30):
believe it in the moment in thein your little container, but
like it doesn't, it's not thatdeep.
Whereas if you are actually in amixed pol political household,
bringing the kink in has thepotential to it could go a
little sour if somebody startssaying things that they they
really mean in a meaner way.
(40:52):
I would just I would beconcerned about how that might
play out.
It's not it's not impossible,but it it's it would be a tough
one.
SPEAKER_01 (41:01):
So to avoid that dynamic could you in advance
talk about here's a politicaltopic or an angle that we need
to stay away from in the bedroombecause either it's gonna spark
something aggressively angry inme, or because I think that when
(41:22):
we talk about this topic, youreally dislike me.
SPEAKER_00 (41:25):
Yeah, of course.
That that's pretty much that'show you do it, right?
It's about if you are in a solidrelationship with somebody who
has opposing politicalideologies to you, and you're
able to have these conversationsand talk about what is and what
is not on the table and bereally clear about the
boundaries, the subjects you cantalk about.
Like, for instance, it's likemaybe we're not gonna bring up
abortion during that kink scene.
(41:45):
Like, that's not gonna besomething we're gonna say.
We're not talking about takingaway my rights to have a to my
bodily autonomy, or we're notgonna talk about LGBTQ rights.
Don't like, don't say it.
And we're not gonna do thatbecause that's where that's
gonna get me riled up.
And so everybody has their ownboundaries around things that
they feel particularlypassionate about or particularly
angry about.
(42:07):
And we need to be really mindfulof that and need to be really
clear that just because you areengaging in this kink dynamic
with a partner does not give youfree reign to say anything you
want.
It has to be really wellnegotiated beforehand.
And that's how we keep everybodysafe.
SPEAKER_01 (42:22):
Great.
So, guys, we've given you introconversations to have with this
kink.
We've explained that you need tocreate boundaries ahead of time,
have the conversation, safewords.
What do you say?
You know, when you want it tostop, when you're like, this is
going off the rails and I'm nowangry and not turned on.
(42:44):
But can we give them some tools?
Like, okay, now you know you'vegot this kink, you want to
engage in it, you know howyou're gonna, you know, bring up
the conversation and negotiate.
What are some ways in which youcan engage with it?
Like what things can you talkabout?
And then where can you go fromthere?
SPEAKER_00 (43:02):
I think that you guys should talk about exactly
first of all, both of you needto talk about what it is exactly
about this that turns you on.
Like, what is the exact dynamic?
Like, is your partner pretendingto be Megan Kelly?
And like is a very like speci Iknow, ew, but is it like oops,
sorry guys, not to kink shame,but for real.
Your partner's being Megan Kellyand is like, you know, dom like
you're you're you're nowdominating her because she's
(43:25):
Megan Kelly and you're like, Igot you.
And that's the dynamic you'resetting up.
Is that like specifically whatyou want?
You kind of need to figure outexactly what it is.
Are you playing specific roles?
Are you just a sort of are youguys just liberal and cons and
conservative?
Like, is that the vibe or it'sare you someone specific?
Are there outfits involved?
Is there particular kinds ofplay that you want to have?
Do you want to do spanking?
(43:46):
Is there gonna be bondage?
Is there other stuff that youwant to have be a part of that?
I would start with justintroducing the role play
dynamics before you actually gointo more like bondage and
spanking and stuff because youkind of want to see how this
plays out.
And you want to get really clearabout what that's gonna look
like for both of you.
And I think you also have to bereally understanding with each
other that like neither of youreally knows what you're doing
(44:06):
yet.
And it might be weird and itmight be uncomfortable and
awkward the first few times youeven do it because you're just
figuring it out.
So you guys have to give eachother space and empathy for
laughter and feelinguncomfortable and awkward
because it's gonna take somepractice.
So give yourself grace.
SPEAKER_01 (44:22):
That's great.
So you can either role play asyourselves or you can pick
characters.
I mean, there's a lot of greatstuff you could do to JD Vance.
He's written his own role inthis dynamic.
SPEAKER_00 (44:38):
Yeah, you could be JD Vance and they could be the
coach.
Exactly.
SPEAKER_01 (44:43):
And they say romance instead.
You know somebody has engaged inthis, right?
Like you know, this is a scenethat's already been played out
across the US.
There's no doubt.
No doubt in my mind.
Here's the last question.
Because guys, you look, we'vegiven it to you.
You know now what you're gonnado or not do with this.
(45:05):
But I am curious if you have anystats or thoughts on this.
How many affairs do you thinktake place because someone gets
so turned on by engaging withsomeone else of The opposite
ideology that that's that theyseek out a a side piece or an
(45:29):
experience that is with acharged hot person of the
opposite political affiliation.
SPEAKER_00 (45:37):
I think if this is a kink that you have, or it's
something you might not know youhave, but you you do, that that
would be a huge draw.
Cause it's some the whole thing,one of the things that really
gets people going sexually is isthe, like you said, the
forbidden fruit and the tabooand doing something that you
know would be very would belooked down with this
(45:58):
displeasure from your socialgroup.
And so it feels really dirty, itfeels really wrong.
And so that really already givesit such an electric charge.
And so I wouldn't be surprisedif a lot of affairs began this
way.
SPEAKER_01 (46:14):
No, it wouldn't shock me either.
I recently did an interview justabout Grinder and how, you know,
the who knows apparently it'snot a complete myth, but you
always hear about when theRepublican Convention comes
together, grind going down.
Apparently, it actually hashappened once or twice.
(46:36):
But it would make sense to methat this would be something
that can be such a fantasy, sucha draw that it might lead to
affairs.
So for people wanting to avoid adesire pulling a partner away,
learn how to act like a liberalwoman.
SPEAKER_00 (46:56):
But there we go.
That was the message all along.
You're welcome.
All along.
SPEAKER_01 (47:01):
Absolutely.
No.
It's really important that wetake care of our sex life in the
bedroom.
And there are all kinds offantasies that we want to play
out.
But it's really important toadmit to yourself and to know
what kind of kink, what kind offantasy you're playing into, and
make sure your partner's onboard.
And I think Gigi, you did areally good job of breaking this
(47:22):
down.
This is not something that I'veseen in a lot of mainstream
media.
It's something that I thinkpeople are afraid to talk about
at this time, especially inAmerican history.
But I also think it's superimportant, right?
Keep us all emotionally healthy,especially in our relationships.
So thank you so much.
Can you tell my listeners wherethey can find out more about you
(47:44):
and connect with you outside ofthis episode?
SPEAKER_00 (47:47):
Sure.
You can find me on my website,missgigiangle.com.
I'm also Gigi Angle onInstagram.
I have a newsletter on Substackcalled the G Spot.
And my new book, Kink Curious,is available for pre-order in
the US and the UK at all yourlocal retailers.
SPEAKER_01 (48:03):
Thank you so much.
Hey guys, go out there and getkinky.
You know, flog your conservativepartner, but only with consent.
All right.
You've got a go bag of tricksfor this kink.
You can be more self aware now.
Thank you so much, Gigi, forjoining me and helping explain
this to me and my listeners.
(48:26):
And to my listeners, until nexttime, Lou.
I'll see you in the locker room.
Cheers.
Do the sex.
SPEAKER_01 (01:33):
Today's Talk Sex with a Net topic is the rise of
political humiliation kink whenideology becomes foreplay.
What if the thing that istearing our country apart is
also turning people on?
Because the truth is, more andmore couples are whispering
things like, tell me you're mynaughty little conservative
(01:54):
slut, or admit you like beingcorrupted by a liberal in bed.
And suddenly the politicalhumiliation kink is no longer on
the fringe anymore.
It is everywhere.
Today we are diving into a kinksitting right at the
intersection of cultural shame,rebellion, and erotic role play,
the political humiliation kink.
(02:15):
Why does this work?
Why now?
And how do you explore itwithout turning your bedroom
into a political battlefield?
To help us unpack all of this, Iam joined by someone whose
expertise in kinks and sexualliberation makes her the perfect
guide.
Gigi Ingle is an accreditedcertified sex and relationship
psychotherapist, award-winningauthor, and internationally
(02:39):
recognized sex educator.
She is an associate clinician atTherapy Yard, working
extensively with LGBTQIA clientsand kinky folks, and people in
open and or polyamorousrelationships.
She's also the author ofKinkurious and All the Fucking
Mistakes and 2025's nominationfor Sexologist of the Year.
(03:01):
Now, before we dive in, I wantto remind you that I'm over on
OnlyFans, and there I'm sharingmy sex and intimacy how-tos,
demos, and audio guidedself-pleasure meditations, and
also offering an opportunity foryou to ask me your one-off
questions there.
You can find me there with myhandle at TalkSex within it.
You can find me on Substackdoing a whole lot of the same
with the handle at TalkSexwithin it.
(03:22):
You can also scroll down to theshow notes below, and you're
going to find the linkseverywhere you want to find me
there.
And I can't wait to see you.
But for now, Gigi, can you tellmy listeners more about you?
SPEAKER_00 (03:35):
Sure.
So, you know, I think your introwas pretty extensive there, but
I am a psychosexual andrelationship therapist.
I'm based in London, where I'velived for five years, and I work
with kinky clients and the LGBTQcommunity pretty exclusively.
And I just wrote a new bookthat's a guide for beginners to
explore their more taboo desiresin a really trauma-informed and
(03:58):
fun, hands-on kind of way.
So I think it's reallyaccessible for anybody who's
interested in exploring kink ofthe whole spectrum of it really
goes into depth.
And I am also a writer for allyour favorite magazines, such as
Cosmo and Women's Health, whereyou can find me talking about
kinks and fetishes in a nuancedand journalist-focused lens.
SPEAKER_01 (04:20):
So perfect guide for this topic.
And you want to stay to the endbecause, of course, right now,
politics, well, they're not justa hot topic.
They are infiltrating, ofcourse, all areas of our lives.
If you're finding this kinkshowing up in the bedroom or in
your dating life, this is goingto help you direct it and play
with it in a way that doesn'tdestroy a potential relationship
(04:42):
or your current relationship andhopefully can lead to a fun,
kinky turned on time.
So by the end, we're going togive you, as usual, our
takeaways so that you can startengaging in this kink should you
want to, starting tonight.
So let's talk about politics andsex, I guess, in a popsic way.
Cheers.
Cheers.
(05:02):
Gigi, when we say politicalhumiliation kink, what exactly
are we talking about?
SPEAKER_00 (05:08):
It's a pretty big term, but really what we're
looking at is people who areessentially role-playing
different conservative orliberal ideologies for the most
part.
So one partner might be theconservative party, the other
partner might be the liberalparty.
And they're basically usingthese opposing views as a part
(05:29):
of their dominant and submissivedynamic.
So somebody might be, forexample, you might be a more
dominant female partner and youare wearing your leather corset
and spanking your partner,telling them they're a dirty
little conservative pig orsomething along those lines.
So really bringing some of thevery charged feelings we have
(05:54):
about politics into a safe andcontained kinky space.
SPEAKER_01 (06:00):
In this dynamic, are people pretending to be in those
roles or are they actually ofthat political mindset?
Or it can be a mix of both?
SPEAKER_00 (06:13):
I would say probably a mix of both.
I would say most likely it'sgoing to be people who are
role-playing the roles, butthere's definitely people who
are in mixed political, I havemixed political ideologies in
their relationships, and theymay choose to use their
differing role these differingideologies in a safe way where
they can kind of play with themin a way that isn't so charged
(06:37):
as it might be if you're sittingat the dinner table and having
an argument about politics.
It's kind of a way to bring someof that into a safer space
that's kinkier rather thanemotionally charged.
SPEAKER_01 (06:50):
Maybe it's a little bit of a way to work out their
frustrations with each other,keep the relationship alive.
Why says kink rising right nowin this particular political
climate?
SPEAKER_00 (07:02):
I think it's pretty obvious that we are pretty much
more divided than we ever havebeen in the political landscape
we have in the United States.
And the more partisan thesepartisan parties become, and the
more intense we becomepassionate about our ideologies,
the and the wider the gap iscoming between them, it makes
(07:23):
sense that as this shit ishappening and as we are moving
in this sort of polar oppositeeffect, that this would start to
become more and more relevantand salient.
And when it comes to sexualityand exploration, when something
like politics is so imbued ineverything that we see and
(07:44):
experience in our day-to-daylife, it makes sense that it
there might be some overlap withsexuality.
SPEAKER_01 (07:50):
Well, so that leads me to ask, what makes political
tension such fertile ground forerotic charge?
SPEAKER_00 (07:59):
I think that what makes it so appealing for people
is that there are a lot ofemotions that come up with the
way we feel about politics.
Really can you can feel reallypassionate about something,
really angry about certainthings.
And often when we feel that way,we can experience arousal from
(08:20):
that.
And so sometimes it can be partof really part of the arousal
process.
And when we're talking abouthumiliation, Kink, when we're
talking about politicsparticularly, there can be, I
think, a real, a real eroticspark in being able to humiliate
somebody in a safe andconsensual way that both people
are agreeing to when you feel sopassionately that they're wrong.
SPEAKER_01 (08:43):
Is this a newer phenomenon or has the political
humiliation always existed?
Because honestly, I haven'treally heard about it until
recently.
SPEAKER_00 (08:55):
I think it's been around as long as politics have
been around.
I there's not unsurprisingly nota ton of data on this.
It's not like people are goingout and studying this
particularly, but I think it'sbeen around for a long time.
Like before recently, when it'ssort of become more of this
Democrat versus Republicandynamic that we're seeing, I
definitely had seen where peoplewere really sexually attracted
(09:16):
to dictators.
So they would have a partner whowas role-playing as, say, like
Vladimir Putin.
And that was part of their kindof kink role play, which, you
know, it wouldn't be me, butlike, you know, I see the appeal
of like this sort of bad guywho's in power and like he's
submitting to you as thedominatrix.
So I think it's it's the ideathat politics has played a role
(09:36):
in sex, I think, has been aroundfor a very long time.
But I do think that thisparticular brand of it is
becoming very popular nowadaysand much more trendy.
SPEAKER_01 (09:45):
You know, what it brings to mind instantly for me
is a Game of Thrones, Daenerys,and oh, what was the name of her
husband?
Listeners, I hope you guys know,but her husband who she sold to
that Jason Momoa plays, was thiswas considered one of the most
erotic dynamics, right?
(10:07):
And it was very much that twodifferent ideologies and and
then her power as a sub to liketransform him.
It sounds like a lot of thatmight come into play.
Also, the idea of comingtogether with someone who has
different ideologies that maybethrough seduction you can move
in a direction.
SPEAKER_00 (10:26):
Yeah, that's a really good point.
I definitely think there's anelement of that where it's kind
of like, I'm gonna be like thisthe sexy liberal person who you
can't resist and I'm gonna getyou to change your mind.
Like that, I think is definitelya big pull of it as well.
SPEAKER_01 (10:39):
Part of it, yeah.
So do people raised in rigidmoral or political systems erod
of eroticized rebellion orcorruption at maybe let's say a
higher level than maybe someonewho wasn't?
And might they perhaps be morelikely to engage in this kind of
dynamic?
SPEAKER_00 (11:57):
I think it's kind of hard to say such a subjective
people have such subjectiveexperiences.
I could definitely see how thatcould happen for sure.
Because when you grow up withreally rigid ideologies, and if
you, for instance, as anexample, like if you grew up in
a really conservative householdand you are now a really
conservative household withreally conservative parents, and
you are now living this life ofperhaps you're queer and you're
(12:18):
living more in your authenticspace, like the idea of
political fraught emotionalityis probably something that's
very front and center in yourpsyche.
So that could definitely play arole in how a kink like this
could develop.
SPEAKER_01 (12:30):
So we've primarily talked about this as a kink
that's gonna show up in thebedroom.
What about before we even get tothe bedroom?
And we're in the d dating world.
(13:41):
I've noticed back when I wassingle myself that I've uh there
were times I felt like I wascatniped to the conservative
guy, right?
And I've talked to many singlesdating who are like, oh, you
know, I don't women, liberalwomen who are like, man, I don't
know why, but I'm so attractedto like these idiot conservative
(14:04):
men, you know, sexually and andso on and so forth.
Does kink when it's notsomething you know that you're
experiencing show up in yourdating life and who you pursue?
And is that problematic, or canit just be converted into
something positive?
SPEAKER_00 (14:24):
I think when people are attracted to people with
very different politicalbeliefs, it's not so much that
it's because they have thedifferent political beliefs,
it's more that they might beattracted to a certain type of
person, somebody who comes froma certain background or looks a
specific way.
And then it sort of has thatkind of overlap, especially if
we're talking about heterosexualdynamics, because the stats
(14:48):
themselves just show that, youknow, it's women who are mostly
liberal and men who are mostlyconservative.
And so I think a lot ofheterosexual women will find
themselves unbeknownst to thembeing attracted to conservatives
just by the statistics alone.
And it there's nothing wrongwith wanting to pursue a
relationship with somebody whohas different political
ideologies than you do, as longas it's not something you find
(15:10):
completely morally reprehensibleand it goes against all of your
beliefs.
And it's also possible to have arelationship with somebody like
that that is purely a kinkdynamic.
For instance, you could have apartner you play with who's just
a kink partner or a sexualpartner, and there's somebody
who you can engage with thiskind of kink with within that
kind of structured dynamicwithout having to have the
(15:33):
intensity of having an actualrelationship with somebody whose
political ideology goes againsteverything you believe in.
SPEAKER_01 (15:38):
This is an interesting little take on this
kink.
Is it more prevalent than in theheterosexual dynamic than in the
LGBTQ queer dynamic?
SPEAKER_00 (15:52):
I would definitely say that's very highly likely
because there you're not goingto find a lot of conservative
queer people.
Like there are some, but thatthe percentage of uh queer per
queer people being conservativeis quite low because
conservative politics is notparticularly in favor of LGBTQ
(16:14):
rights.
So I think that juststatistically, it would have to
be accurate.
SPEAKER_01 (16:19):
Right.
I can't and and remember in anyof my dynamics with any of my
female partners, that coming up.
However, I think without namingit, I've definitely experienced
some of this political kinkbeing acted out, but not
consciously.
Right.
So that brings me to how ifpeople aren't aware of this
(16:42):
kink, but yet it's playing outin their dating life, it's
playing out in their bedroomlife, can it be destructive to
their dynamic if not properlyaddressed or played out with
what I would consider considersort of your standard BDSM or
kink playbook rules?
SPEAKER_00 (17:03):
Yeah, absolutely.
I mean, the three main tenantsof my book are consent,
communication, and aftercare.
So if you're not reallyexplicitly naming what it is
that you're doing and you're nottalking about it, you're not
having safe words, you're notacknowledging the play that
you're engaging with, it canhave the potential to have a
bleedover effect into the restof your relationship.
And it doesn't stay inside ofthe safe container that you
(17:23):
build in a kink dynamic.
So it is really important thatwe're having these
conversations, even if it'suncomfortable.
But sometimes naming theelephant in the room is a really
big pillar in building trust andsafe relationships with people.
SPEAKER_01 (17:35):
So you're going to have to address what you're
doing.
Which I think can be shame, feelshameful to some people.
And why would it feel shamefulto some people if suddenly they
recognize, oh, I'm doing thisthing that now has the name
political humiliation king?
SPEAKER_00 (17:54):
Yeah.
I mean, I think people are warywhen they about addressing it if
they are having this play out intheir life and they haven't
named it, because it might bethe way that you had said
earlier, where it's like workingout some of the aggression they
might have towards the partnerfor having political ideas that
they're very against.
And so it's kind of anopportunity for them to sort of
work some of that out in thebedroom, so to speak.
(18:16):
But the problem is that it stopsbeing, I don't know that it's so
much kink in that instance as itis actual aggression if you're
not actually discussing it andand figuring out the roles
because consent is such a hugepart of making this play
ethical.
SPEAKER_01 (18:31):
Correct.
And if you don't understand whatyou're doing in the bedroom,
then you aren't creatingboundaries around when it goes
too far for one person, right?
So maybe now moving to how thismight be showing up in your
relationship.
Perhaps you're listening to thisand you're thinking, we did kind
of talk about politics while wewere having sex the other night.
(18:53):
Because I think this can show upin what people might consider
very vanilla sexual encounters.
And for people who mightconsider themselves very
vanilla, you know.
I know that if I think back onmy experience, I've had moments
where I was sleeping withsomeone or dating with someone,
and they've made some littlecomment, like, oh, you like
(19:15):
being dominated by conservativeor whatever.
And I thought, that's a weirdthing to say, but oh no, I
didn't know, or whatever it was.
So one of the ways that this isgoing to show up, I imagine,
first in a relationship where ithasn't been acknowledged and
it's not been named norboundaries made is through
(19:37):
language.
So I'm curious about howpolitical language norm, which
is normally weaponized, thinkabout snowflake, you know,
that's snowflakes have reallybecome a weapon verbally in in
the political landscape.
But how how does that languagebecome erotic in kink contexts?
SPEAKER_00 (19:58):
Yeah, it's in humiliation kinks, you're going
to see a lot of and kink ingeneral, there's going to be a
lot of language that outside ofthe kink container, not going to
be okay.
People want to be called dirtylittle sluts and bitches, and
you know, they use the F word,gay guys will use the F word
with each other, like that, youknow, that kind of thing.
And like in the side of that,inside of that container, and if
(20:19):
you guys have agreed on thatlanguage, totally fine.
So you use the same kind ofpolitical language that's used
to demean somebody in a socialcontext, like calling me, oh,
you're being such a snowflake,but in the bedroom, it's used to
be like, it now has this eroticcharge.
And now has this erotic power,where you're using it purposely
in a sexual and arousing contextto degrade the other person in a
(20:42):
way that's consensual.
So you're not attacking theircharacter.
It's part of a role-play scene.
And so you can get that kind oferotic charge out of it and have
that be really sexy, but it'scontained and it's safe, and you
know that it's not thenbasically just being horrible.
SPEAKER_01 (21:02):
Right.
Like even something as simple assaying in the middle of
intimacy, oh, you like beingdominated by a conservative man.
Like in the middle of intimacy,if we haven't talked about it,
that's then the person who is isnot conservative is going to be
like, I actually don't likethat.
Or what does it mean that I'meven with you right now?
(21:22):
And it pulls them out of theerotic landscape and into the
battlefield, right?
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (21:30):
It's like that you're playing, you're playing
at kink without using the curwithout using the language and
the skills of kink.
It's like that, because it's notkink if you're just saying that
without somebody's consent andthey don't like it.
Like that's not hot.
(22:40):
Right.
Right.
SPEAKER_01 (22:41):
So would you say that this kink typically starts
with a verbal, verbal exchange.
It's more verbal play.
SPEAKER_00 (22:51):
Yeah, I would say that's probably the safest place
to start and the very much themost accessible way to start.
Because you kind of need a lotof what's going on with politics
when we discuss politics ingeneral, right?
Is that we are discussing it.
It is a verbal-based discussionyou're having about politics in
general.
So it makes sense that whenyou're creating the kink
dynamic, it would start withthat kind of heated, debate-like
(23:12):
language.
And then you can move into usingother things like paddles and
want to tie somebody up.
You could add all that stuff in,but starting with like the
language you're going to use andgetting very clear on the
boundaries of what's okay andwhat's not okay.
Like for instance, you might beokay with Snowflake, but you
might not be okay with somethingelse.
And so you kind of have to getclear about what's going to be
okay and what's not, with kindof the understanding that if
you're just starting to startingout, you might not know
(23:35):
something is going to reallyupset you until it's said.
And then that's why we have safewords, which are non-sexual
words used to stop the play.
You'd have that said ahead oftime.
And that way, if the person sayssomething that you didn't
realize was going to hit you inthe wrong way, you can stop and
be like, oh, wait, I actuallydon't like that.
Let's not use that one.
And it creates a dynamic whereeverybody feels because the
whole point of kink is likeyou're not actually fighting,
(23:57):
you're not actually humiliatingsomebody.
It's part of the erotic play.
And so when you have it in thatsafe container, it's just a lot
safer to explore that way.
SPEAKER_01 (24:05):
But for people who are listening to this who aren't
kinky or really hint aware, likefor the most part, you're like,
I'm mostly vanilla.
Hearing the word humiliation incontext of eroticism and sexual
interaction might sound likeLike, why would you why would
(25:21):
you want someone to humiliateyou?
Might sound awful.
I think a lot of people sort offlinch at that.
Can you talk a little bit aboutwhy humiliation can be erotic in
the bedroom setting withoutbeing harmful?
SPEAKER_00 (25:37):
Sure.
So erot erotic humiliation, likewhen everybody is consulting
consenting and enjoyingthemselves for it.
It's like the reason people havesuch a get such a kick out of
humiliation in the bedroom.
And even if you're the mosthumiliation, I understand,
loaded word.
But I think people also have tothink about just their regular
sexual dynamics.
There's very often somebody whois doing the leading and
(25:59):
somebody who is doing most ofthe following.
So you kind of already have onepartner who's being a little
more dominant, one partner who'sbeing a little more submissive.
And you know, maybe your partnercalls you like a little slut or
something.
And in that context of vanillasex, you're like, oh, that's not
humiliation.
That they're just calling me aslut because I have a dirty girl
in bed.
But like actually, that is kindof a a little bit of a
humiliation kink because thething is, it's like being, it's
(26:20):
about being dominated, it'sabout consensual power exchange.
And for a lot of people, there'ssuch a close connection with the
feelings of humiliation anderoticism.
They just are really closelyconnected in our brain and in
our nervous system response.
So that's why some people getlike a really strong erotic
charge out of it.
But if the word humiliation isgoing to stop you from wanting
(26:41):
to engage with any kind of likeplay that is in this sort of dot
DS dynamic where you're sayingquote unquote meaner things to
each other, you don't have tocall it humiliation.
It can just be like political,political politics kink or like
role play politics kink orwhatever you want to call it.
The humiliation aspect isn'tnecessary.
SPEAKER_01 (27:02):
Yeah, as as you're talking, I was thinking about
how this dynamic, thisparticular kink has played out
across time.
Lots of people like to in roleplay, right?
Like to roleplay the king or theconqueror, taking the princess
or the peasant.
That is sort of an origin storyof the political kink, right?
(27:26):
But it's in a dynamic that seemsso far from us until now.
So it has been around for a longtime.
And if you're a kinkster who hasalready been doing role play,
you've probably been engaging insome type of this dynamic,
depending on what you're into.
SPEAKER_00 (27:45):
Yeah, it's it's a lot of the appeal is kind of
being so irresistible to theother person that despite you
being so different, they can'tresist you because you're so
seductive or you're so alluring.
And that's part of it as well.
Like with this kind of you don'tnecessarily need the humiliation
aspect of it so much as much asit is like our ideologies are so
different that you but you youcan't resist me because I'm such
(28:07):
a seductress, that kind ofthing.
SPEAKER_01 (28:09):
It's the forbidden fruit as well.
A little bit of the forbiddenfruit that comes into it.
So what are some signs that acouple should not engage in this
king in the bedroom?
SPEAKER_00 (28:27):
I would say if you are brand new to kink, this
might be a difficult one to takeon right away, but and I would
probably start with somethingmore like sensation play and you
know, stuff that's a little moreeasy and basic and a little less
intense with the emotions.
I would also be really carefulif you and your partner really
(28:51):
have true IRL opposing politicalideologies.
Like it it might be, it mightnot go the sexy way you think it
is if you truly believe thatyour partner has these like
really upsetting and problematicbeliefs, and vice versa.
And trying to bring that intothe bedroom might it might be
(29:13):
great, or it might not be.
So I would say it's gonna take alot of negotiation beforehand.
And also if your relationship isin a really rocky place, which a
lot of relationships these dayswhere we have opposing political
ideologies are, due to howpolarized everything has become.
Starting kink in a really rockyplace can be sort of dangerous
territory.
What you kind of want to dofirst is go to therapy and try
(29:36):
to get your relationship back ontrack and in solid footing
before you start introducingkind of all this outside play
into it because kink is notgoing to fix the underlying
issues that are plaguing yourrelationship.
SPEAKER_01 (29:48):
Right.
So if you recognize that this isa turn-on for you, I can see two
different scenarios.
You recognize that it's aturn-on with for you with your
current partner, either becausethey have a different ideology
just enough that it's kind ofcome up in your conversations
(30:10):
and you've noticed that it'spart of what attracts you, or
you engaged in some debate withthem and gotten turned on.
Or you're currently with apartner of the same political
ideology, and you find yourselffantasizing about other people
or partners, a potential affairwith or encounter with someone
(30:33):
of a different ideology.
So in this case, let's say witha partner who's of the same
ideology of you of yours.
So two conservative people,we'll say two conservative
people.
And one of you is like, oh, Inoticed that I get turned on by
this idea, or I'm starting tofantasize about being with
someone who's liberal.
(30:54):
How do you bring that to yourpartner and say, can we play
with this without it likegetting real weird real quick?
SPEAKER_00 (31:03):
Uh well, first you want to have the timing tone and
turf is what I call it withconversations, where you are
making sure the timing of theconversation is not during sex
and not in a really emotionallycharged environment like the
bedroom.
So you want to sit down and havea conversation in like a safe
space, like your living room.
Maybe you guys are having dinnertogether, whatever it is, and
you need to get consent for thatconversation.
(31:25):
So you can say something like,you know, our sex life means a
lot to me.
It's really important to me.
I would really like toexperiment with some more
things.
I've specifically been thinking,and I know this might sound a
little odd, so bear with me.
I've had this strange likefantasy about being with
somebody who's liberal and Idon't know what it is about it,
(31:46):
but it just like turns me on,probably because it's so taboo
and like it's not somebody Iwould ever actually want to be
with, but like something aboutthat gets me going.
Is that a role-play scenarioyou'd be open to trying?
And it's really important thatwhen partners are coming to this
conversation, they're coming toit very empathetically towards
(32:07):
each other rather than seeinganything as being like an attack
on them.
So they immediately becomedefensive, because that can
often happen when we're talkingabout sex.
We were never really taught howto talk about sex.
We're taught how to be, youknow, good friends, good
siblings, all that, but we'renever taught how to be good
partners and lovers.
So it's kind of an uncomfortableconversation for people to have
(32:28):
to begin with.
So you have to be willing togive your partner a really
generous interpretation thatthey're coming to you, not to
say that your sex life is notgood, but because they have this
curiosity and they genuinelywant to like play and expand
with you.
And I think that that's kind ofwhere you start with it.
And I think it can be reallyhelpful to start looking at
some, once you've had some ofthese conversations, if they're
open to it, looking at some ofthe erotic material that's
(32:51):
online.
Like be it like stories thatcenter on this, like erotic
stories.
There's definitely some greatOnlyFans content and porn
content that sort of centers onthis, just so you can kind of
get sort of get an idea ofwhat's going on with all of
that.
I think shared media withpartners can be such a bonding
experience.
I know it's a controversialtopic for some couples, but it
can be great for people who areopen to that.
(33:12):
And yeah, just sort of startingto get curious about it.
Like that's where, that's whereI would begin.
SPEAKER_01 (33:17):
Yeah, I think shared media, if both partners feel
comfortable with it, is such agreat way to educate and share
ideas and fantasies.
Because then it also takeshaving to explain it in depth
with your own words.
It takes not off the table, butit takes the pressure off of
(33:38):
that.
unknown (33:38):
Absolutely.
SPEAKER_00 (33:39):
Like, hey, watch this.
How do you feel?
I just think it's reallyimportant that couples are
coming to this with an open mindand are willing to be a little
bit more curious with eachother.
unknown (33:49):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (33:51):
Absolutely.
And I think because I'm moreliberal and with liberalism,
oftentimes uh sex positive tendsto go more hand in hand.
I'm also queer.
Again, I think uh sex positivityand kink is a little bit more uh
(34:11):
accepted in the LGBTQ communityand in more liberal communities,
right?
It's something that's talkedabout a lot.
This conversation might beeasier, it might make more
sense.
But if you are someone who leansconservative or even religiously
(34:31):
conservative, but you haveliberal ideals, having this
conversation could be very hard.
It would oh, I would think itwould be harder.
And perhaps one of the easierways to introduce it is to talk
about, hey, like even like somelight role play, and then you
can slip in those role dynamics,right?
(34:52):
Like, hey, how about doing alittle role play?
And you can be like, oh yeah,the professor student is fun,
but what about conservativeliberal play?
SPEAKER_00 (35:00):
Yeah.
I mean, I think it's definitelyharder if you're conservative,
especially with all this so manypeople, so many conservatives
also are Christians and very thebig population evangelical
Christians.
So not exactly the most sexpositive folk, but I do think
that it's still, I mean, datashows that conservative states
are just as just as kinky intheir fantasies and their erotic
(35:20):
material as everywhere else.
They're just not really talkingabout it.
So I can understand how that'ssort of a difficult topic when
you don't have the language andwhen it is so taboo in the
culture that you've grown up in.
But like you said, it is easy tonot easy, but it's a kind of a
good gateway to kind of use theword, you know, role play rather
than saying, I I don't know if Iif I would go right for want to
(35:41):
do political humiliation, King.
That might just be a bit much.
You know, it's it language isimportant and you want to be as
gentle as possible.
SPEAKER_01 (35:49):
Do you think there's a a spike in one side or the
other an interest in politicalhumiliation?
SPEAKER_00 (35:55):
I definitely do not have a solid answer on that one
because we just don't have thenumbers for it.
I think that people who wherepolitics has been more rigid in
their lives and their upbringingare going to be more likely to
have this, whether that'sliberal or conservative.
I think in conservative statesin general and in conservative
communities in general, you'llsee a lot more intense kinks
(36:20):
being searched for in like pornhub and those sorts of erotic
spaces, because it's not thatthey are more kinky.
It's just that they are, theyhave these like niche interests
that they're not able to talkabout or express.
So that's why they're lookingfor it more in a in an erotic
material space.
But I think the more charged andthe more passionate you feel
(36:43):
about politics, the more itmight turn you on.
I could see how it withconservative ideology, because
there's so much more sexpositivity with liberals and
they kind of you kind of havethis ex you kind of have so many
so many more options forfetishes and kinks that are
available to you because of thecommunity.
If you're in conservativepolitics and so much of your
(37:04):
life is built around church andfootball and family, it might be
that politics is really whereyou're getting your erotic
charge because it's one of theonly kinds of kinks you have
access to.
SPEAKER_01 (37:19):
I'm speaking only from personal experience.
I haven't heard this come frommy more liberal acquaintances as
much as I've definitely heard,especially more conservative men
talk about being turned on bymore liberal women.
And in that, I think you'reright, that there is the aspect
of more sex positivity, moreopenness, women being more open
(37:42):
to exploratory and adventurousintimacy, right?
Being open to trying new things.
We don't necessarily see kinksas this bad thing.
We don't necessarily freak outif you're like, hey, how do you
feel about a trees or exploringwith other people?
For more liberal people, it'smaybe I'm open to that or not
(38:05):
into that, but maybe not theshame piece doesn't come into it
as much.
unknown (38:09):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (38:09):
I mean, I think for a lot of liberal, a lot of
conservative men, they're theyare attracted to sort of going
outside of the king space for asecond here, but they are
attracted to liberal womensexually because they are
attracted to the the vibe of aliberal woman who is sort of
sexually adventurous, is muchmore open about her sexuality,
more more comfortable in thatspace.
And so that I could understanddefinitely understand the sexual
(38:31):
appeal of that.
Like, oh, I I want to take awayyour bodily autonomy, but you're
really hot.
Thank you, sir.
But no, thank you.
That's so tempting.
SPEAKER_01 (38:40):
So bizarre to me, but you want to you wanna stop
me from being able to give youthis thing I can give you
because I have the right to bewho I am.
Anyways, what a conundrum foryou.
Exhausting.
It's exhausting.
All right, so now we've offeredsome ways for, especially in a
(39:03):
conservative on-conservativerelationship, to introduce this
topic to your partner and embarkon it should they be open to it.
Now it's much easier if you arein a dynamic where it's either
conservative and liberal liberalmarriage or partnership or two
(39:24):
liberals, right?
Because or more liberal people.
And look, it's a spectrum, let'sbe honest.
Political views are a spectrum,but I'm giving more extremes
because that gives you plenty oftools for conversations.
Are there any complications youcan see coming in to play
between, let's say, two moreliberal individuals in a
(39:46):
relationship, or a liberal and aconservative?
SPEAKER_00 (39:49):
Oh, like if they're if it's mixed political
ideology?
If you actually do have mixedpolitical ideology, you can play
with this kink, but it needs tobe done with a lot of care
because at that point, thethings you're saying to the
other person are quite likelythings you mean.
And that can have a lot befraught with a lot more
emotionality.
(40:09):
Like, for instance, in theclassic humiliation dom sub
instance, we're taking politicsout of it for a second.
You're humiliating your sub andspanking him and telling him
he's the bad boy and pegging himand all these sorts of things.
But you don't actually believehe's a filthy little pig, or
like think like you don'tactually believe these things
about him as a person.
This is part of your like kinkdynamic, and it's and you
(40:30):
believe it in the moment in thein your little container, but
like it doesn't, it's not thatdeep.
Whereas if you are actually in amixed pol political household,
bringing the kink in has thepotential to it could go a
little sour if somebody startssaying things that they they
really mean in a meaner way.
(40:52):
I would just I would beconcerned about how that might
play out.
It's not it's not impossible,but it it's it would be a tough
one.
SPEAKER_01 (41:01):
So to avoid that dynamic could you in advance
talk about here's a politicaltopic or an angle that we need
to stay away from in the bedroombecause either it's gonna spark
something aggressively angry inme, or because I think that when
(41:22):
we talk about this topic, youreally dislike me.
SPEAKER_00 (41:25):
Yeah, of course.
That that's pretty much that'show you do it, right?
It's about if you are in a solidrelationship with somebody who
has opposing politicalideologies to you, and you're
able to have these conversationsand talk about what is and what
is not on the table and bereally clear about the
boundaries, the subjects you cantalk about.
Like, for instance, it's likemaybe we're not gonna bring up
abortion during that kink scene.
(41:45):
Like, that's not gonna besomething we're gonna say.
We're not talking about takingaway my rights to have a to my
bodily autonomy, or we're notgonna talk about LGBTQ rights.
Don't like, don't say it.
And we're not gonna do thatbecause that's where that's
gonna get me riled up.
And so everybody has their ownboundaries around things that
they feel particularlypassionate about or particularly
angry about.
(42:07):
And we need to be really mindfulof that and need to be really
clear that just because you areengaging in this kink dynamic
with a partner does not give youfree reign to say anything you
want.
It has to be really wellnegotiated beforehand.
And that's how we keep everybodysafe.
SPEAKER_01 (42:22):
Great.
So, guys, we've given you introconversations to have with this
kink.
We've explained that you need tocreate boundaries ahead of time,
have the conversation, safewords.
What do you say?
You know, when you want it tostop, when you're like, this is
going off the rails and I'm nowangry and not turned on.
(42:44):
But can we give them some tools?
Like, okay, now you know you'vegot this kink, you want to
engage in it, you know howyou're gonna, you know, bring up
the conversation and negotiate.
What are some ways in which youcan engage with it?
Like what things can you talkabout?
And then where can you go fromthere?
SPEAKER_00 (43:02):
I think that you guys should talk about exactly
first of all, both of you needto talk about what it is exactly
about this that turns you on.
Like, what is the exact dynamic?
Like, is your partner pretendingto be Megan Kelly?
And like is a very like speci Iknow, ew, but is it like oops,
sorry guys, not to kink shame,but for real.
Your partner's being Megan Kellyand is like, you know, dom like
you're you're you're nowdominating her because she's
(43:25):
Megan Kelly and you're like, Igot you.
And that's the dynamic you'resetting up.
Is that like specifically whatyou want?
You kind of need to figure outexactly what it is.
Are you playing specific roles?
Are you just a sort of are youguys just liberal and cons and
conservative?
Like, is that the vibe or it'sare you someone specific?
Are there outfits involved?
Is there particular kinds ofplay that you want to have?
Do you want to do spanking?
(43:46):
Is there gonna be bondage?
Is there other stuff that youwant to have be a part of that?
I would start with justintroducing the role play
dynamics before you actually gointo more like bondage and
spanking and stuff because youkind of want to see how this
plays out.
And you want to get really clearabout what that's gonna look
like for both of you.
And I think you also have to bereally understanding with each
other that like neither of youreally knows what you're doing
(44:06):
yet.
And it might be weird and itmight be uncomfortable and
awkward the first few times youeven do it because you're just
figuring it out.
So you guys have to give eachother space and empathy for
laughter and feelinguncomfortable and awkward
because it's gonna take somepractice.
So give yourself grace.
SPEAKER_01 (44:22):
That's great.
So you can either role play asyourselves or you can pick
characters.
I mean, there's a lot of greatstuff you could do to JD Vance.
He's written his own role inthis dynamic.
SPEAKER_00 (44:38):
Yeah, you could be JD Vance and they could be the
coach.
Exactly.
SPEAKER_01 (44:43):
And they say romance instead.
You know somebody has engaged inthis, right?
Like you know, this is a scenethat's already been played out
across the US.
There's no doubt.
No doubt in my mind.
Here's the last question.
Because guys, you look, we'vegiven it to you.
You know now what you're gonnado or not do with this.
(45:05):
But I am curious if you have anystats or thoughts on this.
How many affairs do you thinktake place because someone gets
so turned on by engaging withsomeone else of The opposite
ideology that that's that theyseek out a a side piece or an
(45:29):
experience that is with acharged hot person of the
opposite political affiliation.
SPEAKER_00 (45:37):
I think if this is a kink that you have, or it's
something you might not know youhave, but you you do, that that
would be a huge draw.
Cause it's some the whole thing,one of the things that really
gets people going sexually is isthe, like you said, the
forbidden fruit and the tabooand doing something that you
know would be very would belooked down with this
(45:58):
displeasure from your socialgroup.
And so it feels really dirty, itfeels really wrong.
And so that really already givesit such an electric charge.
And so I wouldn't be surprisedif a lot of affairs began this
way.
SPEAKER_01 (46:14):
No, it wouldn't shock me either.
I recently did an interview justabout Grinder and how, you know,
the who knows apparently it'snot a complete myth, but you
always hear about when theRepublican Convention comes
together, grind going down.
Apparently, it actually hashappened once or twice.
(46:36):
But it would make sense to methat this would be something
that can be such a fantasy, sucha draw that it might lead to
affairs.
So for people wanting to avoid adesire pulling a partner away,
learn how to act like a liberalwoman.
SPEAKER_00 (46:56):
But there we go.
That was the message all along.
You're welcome.
All along.
SPEAKER_01 (47:01):
Absolutely.
No.
It's really important that wetake care of our sex life in the
bedroom.
And there are all kinds offantasies that we want to play
out.
But it's really important toadmit to yourself and to know
what kind of kink, what kind offantasy you're playing into, and
make sure your partner's onboard.
And I think Gigi, you did areally good job of breaking this
(47:22):
down.
This is not something that I'veseen in a lot of mainstream
media.
It's something that I thinkpeople are afraid to talk about
at this time, especially inAmerican history.
But I also think it's superimportant, right?
Keep us all emotionally healthy,especially in our relationships.
So thank you so much.
Can you tell my listeners wherethey can find out more about you
(47:44):
and connect with you outside ofthis episode?
SPEAKER_00 (47:47):
Sure.
You can find me on my website,missgigiangle.com.
I'm also Gigi Angle onInstagram.
I have a newsletter on Substackcalled the G Spot.
And my new book, Kink Curious,is available for pre-order in
the US and the UK at all yourlocal retailers.
SPEAKER_01 (48:03):
Thank you so much.
Hey guys, go out there and getkinky.
You know, flog your conservativepartner, but only with consent.
All right.
You've got a go bag of tricksfor this kink.
You can be more self aware now.
Thank you so much, Gigi, forjoining me and helping explain
this to me and my listeners.
(48:26):
And to my listeners, until nexttime, Lou.
I'll see you in the locker room.
Cheers.
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