January 9, 2024 • 20 mins
We're continuing our conversation on assessment with multi-age teacher, Tammy Clingenpeel. We talk about making "just in time" accommodations, how to differentiate assessment within a fixed curriciulum, and how Tammy's teaching has changed over time. This episode is a thoughtful reflection from a thoughtful teacher. We know you'll love it.
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Episode Transcript
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Ashley O'Neil (00:01):
Okay, now we're recording so welcome to teach,
wonder. Welcome to teach wonderpodcast hosted by Ashley O'Neal,
and Julie Cunningham.
(00:26):
You ever get into a classroomand just like the vibe you walk
in, and it's somehow bothenergetic and calm, where kids
are active and talking, but alsofocused and working, I asked our
next guest on this podcast totalk assessment because of that
vibe. I'm always in awe ofteachers that create an
environment where multiplethings are happening, and
students are all busy doingtheir own thing, but it's also
(00:47):
somehow on task. It's such ahard balance to get right. Our
guests Tammy teaches in a multiage classroom. So juggling
different content and ages andability levels has become a
dance that she practices a lot.
And I wanted to talk to herabout assessment because while
she's definitely not alone, inthe challenge of assessing
students with a wide set ofskills and goals and unified
approach, I had a chance to seeit in action and feel the vibe
(01:09):
and I was struck. We've beenhaving discussions about
assessment in our last fewepisodes. And this one addresses
assessment and gets it aquestion I wrestled with a lot
when I was teaching. When doeslearning end? And when does
assessment begin? I knowformative assessments imply that
you check in on learning alongthe way, the idea of summative
kind of implies that thelearning has ended and you're
(01:29):
like, here you go prove whatyou've got. But then I think
about children and what we knowabout development. And just
because a skill isn't masteredby the end of the spelling week,
or the history chapter, or eventhe marking period, it doesn't
mean that that window isactually shot for that kid. So
is there a place to do just intime learning with the students
within the context of a setcurriculum? To honor what is
that a student's learning cankeep happening even after my
(01:51):
curriculum calendar says it'stime to move on. Here's Tammy.
Tammy Clingenpeel (01:57):
My name is Tammy Clingenpeel. And I started
teaching a long time ago. Myfirst teaching job was
kindergarten. And I reallyenjoyed it. And then from
kindergarten, I went into firstgrade. And then I took a break
(02:18):
and was substitute teaching forabout oh, I don't know, seven,
eight years. And then I wentback into teaching. And I
started teaching a third andfourth grade combination class
at the school I'm teaching itnow. And then I went from third
and fourth grade to I believe itwas just fourth grade. And then
(02:43):
from fourth grade, I went tofifth and fifth and sixth grade.
And then from fifth and sixthgrade I went to believe it or
not, they put me in preschoolslash High School slash
assistant principal. And thenfrom there, I went to fourth,
(03:06):
fifth and sixth grade for 11years. And then from fourth,
fifth and sixth grade the last.
This is my third year just doingfifth and sixth grade. So quite
a variety.
Ashley O'Neil (03:18):
So like all of the grades really just like
preschool all the way throughthe dasher Foundation put in.
Yes, yes. What do you l ikewhere you're teaching now this
grade level?
Unknown (03:29):
Yes,
Ashley O'Neil (03:30):
I do. Yeah, it seems I liked the younger
students when I was a first likefirst teaching like that first
grade was great for me. And Ifeel like as I've gotten a
little bit older, I have a newappreciation or more of an
appreciation for the upperelementary students that fifth
and sixth grade than I ever usedto. So they're they're kind of
fun secretly, yes,
Tammy Clingenpeel (03:51):
I find benefits from all of the ages.
But I find this age is you cando a lot more.
Ashley O'Neil (04:00):
Sure. So obviously, there's been some
changes to your teachingpractices over time, just
because you're in differentgrade levels. But what are some
changes that you've made to yourpractices over time?
Tammy Clingenpeel (04:13):
I've, I've always done a lot of hands on.
But I've become a lot more handson activities, and a lot more
science and STEM activityrelated. And a lot more user
(04:35):
imagination type activitiestrying to get that implemented.
Ashley O'Neil (04:39):
And where do you where do you think that comes
from? Tammy?
I think it comes from learning.Ithink partly is because I
started getting frustrated andbored. I literally was going to
leave teaching about eight yearsago because I was still just
(05:00):
kind of like over it. And I. Andthen I joined the Civil Air
Patrol and started getting thestem kits, and kind of found a
new way to approach somelearning and having some fun,
and still implementing all thelearning practices. And I think
that's what changed it. And thenI got involved with CMU and the
(05:23):
makerspace, and inventionconvention and other things. And
I've just learned a lot more tobring things into the classroom.
So I think the hands on hasreally changed, and allowing
students a little more freedomas well.
Yeah, that makes sense. So withthat in mind, do you teach all
(05:45):
grades I break? Is that correct?
Do you teach all grades? So whatare some ways that you assess
your students?
Tammy Clingenpeel (05:52):
I do typical test and quizzes. Just because
that is the curriculum that wefollow. But along with that we I
do group projects I do. We dooral presentations, we do
memorization, so they're doing.
They memorize historicaldocuments, and then they'll
(06:16):
present them to the classorally. They do. Oh, let me see.
I'm trying to think sometimeswe'll just have a powwow. And
then the kids can do thesepresentations on their own, how
are you going to present thisinformation, and then they'll go
ahead and go and do that, I willoften give them criteria that
(06:37):
they have to meet. And thenthere'll be evaluated on that
criteria. Sometimes there'll bea rubric that they have to
follow. So kind of what you'relooking at. Yeah,
Ashley O'Neil (06:51):
that's totally what I'm looking at. I think it
sounds to me like, you do a lotof mix and matching. So what
content you're trying to assessdrives how you choose to assess
them. Does that feel accurate?
Yes, yes. And so from that, andsome of it is also driven by the
(07:13):
curriculum that you have at yourschool, right? So chapter tests
in the curriculum or whatnot,you're going to get better? Do
you feel like you learndifferent things from the
different types of assessmentsor like, like, how do you view
them? And let me give you anexample. So when I was teaching
fourth grade, we did likereading assessments that were
(07:34):
really tight. And what I mean bytight is, you would assess their
words permanent to read timethem and see how quick they
were. And then we had thesereally specific questions that
we asked because we were lookingfor, did they catch the
character? Did they understandthe main idea? Did they compare
contrast rates or reallyspecific focus types of
assessments. And that would bevery different information from
(07:56):
a timed multiplication test,which would tell me very
different information from apresentation when it was a much
more complex project for thestudents. And for me, so I could
learn about their speakingskills, I could learn about
group project skills, I couldlearn about their research
skills, right. So I learnedreally different things from my
(08:18):
students. Do you find that whenyou assess as well?
Unknown (08:23):
Yes, a lot of times, when I am testing with standard
regular tests for thecurriculum, the quizzes tend to
have more of a focus on thecontent that we've just covered.
Whereas if we're doing a test,the test is more over like an
entire chapter. Sometimes ourcurriculum will do a test over
(08:46):
like five chapters. And I'mlike, seriously, these kids are
in fifth and sixth grade, dothey really need to be tested on
such a broad span ofinformation. So what I'll do is
I'll kind of make like achallenge of it. And I'll say,
Alright, I'm going to let youpick groups and work on this I
get, you're going to use yourbook, you get to use your
(09:09):
history notes that we'vecreated. And you get to work
together and complete this as atask. Because I think then
they're one learning how to usetheir notes, and their book to
find information, and to talkand to work as a team. And
sometimes when you have thesmarter kids, they'll often want
(09:32):
to just blurt all the answers.
And so I stress to them. Youneed to Yes, work with your
partner, but you can't give themall the answers. And you can't
even just show them where theanswers are in their notes. You
can hint that it might be onthis page or stuff like that, so
that they're learning and alsoteaching other students how to
(09:52):
find the information as well.
Because not only do I havedifferent grade levels, but then
you all also have differentlearning levels as well in your
grade, because in my grade withfifth and sixth grade, I have
some students who are probably asecond grade reading level. And
then I have some kids that arehigh school reading level. And
(10:15):
so to have them do the sametest, you can't evaluate the
same way. And so if I have themwork together as a team,
sometimes, then they're learningfrom each other, not just me.
Ashley O'Neil (10:28):
Now, that makes a ton of sense. And I think you're
right that I mean, any group,you're going to have disparity
or the difference in abilitylevel. But not only that, but
yours is explicit, you know,you've got fifth and sixth
graders, and you've gotdifferent sets of standards. So
if they're reading the samebook, you might be focusing on
different things for your fifthgraders a little bit versus what
(10:50):
you're doing with your sixthgraders.
Tammy Clingenpeel (10:52):
Right
Ashley O'Neil (10:52):
Yeah, that makes sense. Um, I'm sure I can hear
challenges. If I was in yourclassroom, and I was teaching, I
can hear challenges that I wouldhave. But what are some
challenges that you have when itcomes to assessing your
students?
Unknown (11:06):
Um, I think the hardest thing that I have when I'm
assessing the students is thetrying to find the
differentiated testing for thestudents. Because sometimes you
get so involved in what is beingexpected of you as a teacher,
(11:26):
from the curriculum. And thenfor the report, report cards,
and then for the parents to see,or for the administration to
see. And yet I want the studentto be successful as well. And so
learning how, as a teacher tostep back and say, this student
can show me what he knowswithout having to do 100% of
(11:49):
this work, but maybe just 50% Ormaybe even just 40%. And picking
and choosing and making sure thework that they're doing is still
the content that needs to beevaluated, but just not as much,
and still making that child feelhis worth as well. Yeah,
Ashley O'Neil (12:11):
I mean, that that makes a ton of sense. And that
is you're right. They don't makeassessments that are multipacks,
for you to pick for yourclassroom. And so it's like you
have to do, you have done a lotof the work of knowing your
students individually. And sodoes that sometimes look like
each kid may get the similarlooking paper, but what they do
(12:32):
on that paper is all different.
Tammy Clingenpeel (12:34):
Correct?
Like, for example, on a languagescience assignment we just did
the other day, one of mystudents, I could tell, first
and foremost, it wasoverwhelming. So right away, I
eliminated half of it. Hestarted working and he was still
a little overwhelmed, you couldsee that look in his face. So I
said to him, I said, all right.
(12:58):
Let me see your paper. And thenI circled the ones that I
thought were the most important.
This type of sentence you needto know. So I'm going to have
him do this, this, this andthis. So I eliminated another
25%. And said, I want to seeyour what you can do with this.
And so then he was able tocomplete the task. And yet his
paper was the same exact papers,everybody else's. It's just I
(13:22):
had circled what he needed todo. And, and I always stress in
my class, we don't make fun ofpeople because they have
different learning papers ordifferent learning assignments.
Because everybody has differentthings that they're strong at.
Some people are strong at math,some are strong in language.
(13:43):
Some are good in reading, someare good at singing, some are
good at sports, but we're allgood at something. And we can
all be of use when it comes tocertain things in life. And one
more in the classroom, thosedifferent things will be brought
out in different ways. And sowe're just
Ashley O'Neil (14:03):
Yeah, I feel like I got to see that play out in
your classroom. When I've beenthere. I was there feel like you
were wrapping up maybe religionand math. And there were some it
was like a transition timehappening. And it seemed very
much like Well, first of all,you make use of your board a
little bit where what studentsare working on is kind of coded
up on the board next to theirname, right? It's like a whole
group, transparent way to keeptrack of who needs to work on
(14:26):
what assignment that's been outin the classroom. And you were
kind of bumping around to eachgroup. And I could hear you
making like on the spotaccommodations or changes to
students assignments. I rememberyou had a student kind of
verbally tell you the problemand then you wrote it down for
them on the test. And so you hadthat one on one moment and you
(14:46):
heard probably more informationfrom listening to them explain
the math problem. Then you hadthey just kind of muddled
through on their own. Right. Andit very much felt like there was
a culture in your classroom ofeverybody gets what they need.
You'd, that's not going to bethe same. We're all doing our
own, like, path. And it feltsupportive. So that's, that's
(15:07):
kudos to you. Because it's ahard, that's a hard culture and
to kind of set up in aclassroom, it is,
Tammy Clingenpeel (15:12):
it's been very challenging for me to step
back and accept that, forexample, with math last year, I
have one student, if I just gavethem the test to do it, they
would go and they would do theirtask. But then it would be like
75%, wrong. But then I startedsaying, Okay, I would like you
to go and do this one problem ata time and come see me. And then
(15:34):
the, the task was then gettingdone, where 75% of the test was
correct. You know, or, Hey, howabout we use graph paper so that
we do one number per box, and wehave everything lined up? And
then we'll check it like this.
And so I'm just having to learnhow to make accommodations for
each student, and yet stillcontinue with the content
(15:58):
content? And I don't knowmeeting everybody's needs. It's,
it's become quite a challenge,you know?
Ashley O'Neil (16:07):
Yeah. I imagine now, your report cards, what are
your report cards look like forschool? Because those aren't
your like those come from yourschool, there's got to be some
uniformity there. Right?
Tammy Clingenpeel (16:18):
Right, my report cards are done there via
the computer. So they're justgenerated with each subject, and
then their grade through theoffice. So I put all my grades
online, and then the officepulls them.
Ashley O'Neil (16:30):
And it's the parents then see like A, B or
like a 1234.
Unknown (16:35):
They see the the percentage grade, and then the
percentage grade key is at thebottom. Okay?
Ashley O'Neil (16:44):
And can parents communicate with you? During the
semester, like Johnny's so far,like currently getting with a C
in our class and math? Yes, Iget that.
Unknown (16:56):
I sent home a report every Sunday, I make sure all
grades for the week have beenentered into the computer. And
then I send an email with eachgrade subject. Each subject
great
Ashley O'Neil (17:10):
to each parent.
Okay, so they can see thatthat's alright, so my question
for you is, what advice wouldyou give a pre service teacher,
so someone pre service or likeyoung new, who's feeling
overwhelmed by assessment, andlearning with their students?
No.
Unknown (17:31):
Take it slow. Don't try to be that person who can do it
all in the first year ofteaching. I mean, I've been
teaching at this school for just29 years. And it's taking me a
long time, and I'm stilllearning, you know, I still go
to my daughter, who is beenteaching for like, less than 10
(17:51):
years, and I go to her for helpstill, with the new things that
are happening, you know, I was,I finished college a long time
ago, there are new changes outthere, things that are
happening. And so take it slow,and get to know your students
before you try to do too manychanges at once. You know, go
with what you know, and thenslowly make these changes. And I
(18:14):
think the biggest key is gettingto know your students and where
they are, and how to help them.
You know, and don't be afraid toask for help. You know, we've
had teachers before who wereafraid to ask for help, and then
they fall into trouble. You needto ask for help, because
otherwise, your students in thelong run are going to suffer.
(18:37):
And that's the problem rightthere because we're there to
help them. And sometimes that'shard to ask for help. But I've
learned one, you need to ask forhelp. Because if you're not
getting the help you need, youcan't help the students with
what they need. I think that'sthe biggest thing.
Ashley O'Neil (19:00):
Oh, that's perfect. Amy, thank you. I think
one of the things I like aboutI, I haven't been in the
classroom in a bit. But when Iwas in the classroom, how you
approach assessment reminds meof how I did it in my own
classroom, which is like, whenis there really a summative
assessment, right? Like when isthere really like teachers fully
hands off and this isn't amoment to learn. And I feel like
(19:22):
you you continually approachyour assessments as I want to
bring out the best in my studentand if that means taking a
minute to clarify and doing alittle accommodating learning
here to bring out the best inthem. I'm going to do that. And
I think that that's just such agreat way to approach things. So
thank you. Well, thank you. Thishas been another episode of
(19:45):
teach wonder if you found valuein what you heard today. We'd
love it if you share thisepisode with a friend or
colleague. You can find more outabout our center by visiting
cms.edu/timid or by checking usout on social media where you
can find us at see IC h c e s efull episodes with transcripts
are available on our websitethanks for listening
Okay, now we're recording so welcome to teach,
wonder. Welcome to teach wonderpodcast hosted by Ashley O'Neal,
and Julie Cunningham.
(00:26):
You ever get into a classroomand just like the vibe you walk
in, and it's somehow bothenergetic and calm, where kids
are active and talking, but alsofocused and working, I asked our
next guest on this podcast totalk assessment because of that
vibe. I'm always in awe ofteachers that create an
environment where multiplethings are happening, and
students are all busy doingtheir own thing, but it's also
(00:47):
somehow on task. It's such ahard balance to get right. Our
guests Tammy teaches in a multiage classroom. So juggling
different content and ages andability levels has become a
dance that she practices a lot.
And I wanted to talk to herabout assessment because while
she's definitely not alone, inthe challenge of assessing
students with a wide set ofskills and goals and unified
approach, I had a chance to seeit in action and feel the vibe
(01:09):
and I was struck. We've beenhaving discussions about
assessment in our last fewepisodes. And this one addresses
assessment and gets it aquestion I wrestled with a lot
when I was teaching. When doeslearning end? And when does
assessment begin? I knowformative assessments imply that
you check in on learning alongthe way, the idea of summative
kind of implies that thelearning has ended and you're
(01:29):
like, here you go prove whatyou've got. But then I think
about children and what we knowabout development. And just
because a skill isn't masteredby the end of the spelling week,
or the history chapter, or eventhe marking period, it doesn't
mean that that window isactually shot for that kid. So
is there a place to do just intime learning with the students
within the context of a setcurriculum? To honor what is
that a student's learning cankeep happening even after my
(01:51):
curriculum calendar says it'stime to move on. Here's Tammy.
Tammy Clingenpeel (01:57):
My name is Tammy Clingenpeel. And I started
teaching a long time ago. Myfirst teaching job was
kindergarten. And I reallyenjoyed it. And then from
kindergarten, I went into firstgrade. And then I took a break
(02:18):
and was substitute teaching forabout oh, I don't know, seven,
eight years. And then I wentback into teaching. And I
started teaching a third andfourth grade combination class
at the school I'm teaching itnow. And then I went from third
and fourth grade to I believe itwas just fourth grade. And then
(02:43):
from fourth grade, I went tofifth and fifth and sixth grade.
And then from fifth and sixthgrade I went to believe it or
not, they put me in preschoolslash High School slash
assistant principal. And thenfrom there, I went to fourth,
(03:06):
fifth and sixth grade for 11years. And then from fourth,
fifth and sixth grade the last.
This is my third year just doingfifth and sixth grade. So quite
a variety.
Ashley O'Neil (03:18):
So like all of the grades really just like
preschool all the way throughthe dasher Foundation put in.
Yes, yes. What do you l ikewhere you're teaching now this
grade level?
Unknown (03:29):
Yes,
Ashley O'Neil (03:30):
I do. Yeah, it seems I liked the younger
students when I was a first likefirst teaching like that first
grade was great for me. And Ifeel like as I've gotten a
little bit older, I have a newappreciation or more of an
appreciation for the upperelementary students that fifth
and sixth grade than I ever usedto. So they're they're kind of
fun secretly, yes,
Tammy Clingenpeel (03:51):
I find benefits from all of the ages.
But I find this age is you cando a lot more.
Ashley O'Neil (04:00):
Sure. So obviously, there's been some
changes to your teachingpractices over time, just
because you're in differentgrade levels. But what are some
changes that you've made to yourpractices over time?
Tammy Clingenpeel (04:13):
I've, I've always done a lot of hands on.
But I've become a lot more handson activities, and a lot more
science and STEM activityrelated. And a lot more user
(04:35):
imagination type activitiestrying to get that implemented.
Ashley O'Neil (04:39):
And where do you where do you think that comes
from? Tammy?
I think it comes from learning.Ithink partly is because I
started getting frustrated andbored. I literally was going to
leave teaching about eight yearsago because I was still just
(05:00):
kind of like over it. And I. Andthen I joined the Civil Air
Patrol and started getting thestem kits, and kind of found a
new way to approach somelearning and having some fun,
and still implementing all thelearning practices. And I think
that's what changed it. And thenI got involved with CMU and the
(05:23):
makerspace, and inventionconvention and other things. And
I've just learned a lot more tobring things into the classroom.
So I think the hands on hasreally changed, and allowing
students a little more freedomas well.
Yeah, that makes sense. So withthat in mind, do you teach all
(05:45):
grades I break? Is that correct?
Do you teach all grades? So whatare some ways that you assess
your students?
Tammy Clingenpeel (05:52):
I do typical test and quizzes. Just because
that is the curriculum that wefollow. But along with that we I
do group projects I do. We dooral presentations, we do
memorization, so they're doing.
They memorize historicaldocuments, and then they'll
(06:16):
present them to the classorally. They do. Oh, let me see.
I'm trying to think sometimeswe'll just have a powwow. And
then the kids can do thesepresentations on their own, how
are you going to present thisinformation, and then they'll go
ahead and go and do that, I willoften give them criteria that
(06:37):
they have to meet. And thenthere'll be evaluated on that
criteria. Sometimes there'll bea rubric that they have to
follow. So kind of what you'relooking at. Yeah,
Ashley O'Neil (06:51):
that's totally what I'm looking at. I think it
sounds to me like, you do a lotof mix and matching. So what
content you're trying to assessdrives how you choose to assess
them. Does that feel accurate?
Yes, yes. And so from that, andsome of it is also driven by the
(07:13):
curriculum that you have at yourschool, right? So chapter tests
in the curriculum or whatnot,you're going to get better? Do
you feel like you learndifferent things from the
different types of assessmentsor like, like, how do you view
them? And let me give you anexample. So when I was teaching
fourth grade, we did likereading assessments that were
(07:34):
really tight. And what I mean bytight is, you would assess their
words permanent to read timethem and see how quick they
were. And then we had thesereally specific questions that
we asked because we were lookingfor, did they catch the
character? Did they understandthe main idea? Did they compare
contrast rates or reallyspecific focus types of
assessments. And that would bevery different information from
(07:56):
a timed multiplication test,which would tell me very
different information from apresentation when it was a much
more complex project for thestudents. And for me, so I could
learn about their speakingskills, I could learn about
group project skills, I couldlearn about their research
skills, right. So I learnedreally different things from my
(08:18):
students. Do you find that whenyou assess as well?
Unknown (08:23):
Yes, a lot of times, when I am testing with standard
regular tests for thecurriculum, the quizzes tend to
have more of a focus on thecontent that we've just covered.
Whereas if we're doing a test,the test is more over like an
entire chapter. Sometimes ourcurriculum will do a test over
(08:46):
like five chapters. And I'mlike, seriously, these kids are
in fifth and sixth grade, dothey really need to be tested on
such a broad span ofinformation. So what I'll do is
I'll kind of make like achallenge of it. And I'll say,
Alright, I'm going to let youpick groups and work on this I
get, you're going to use yourbook, you get to use your
(09:09):
history notes that we'vecreated. And you get to work
together and complete this as atask. Because I think then
they're one learning how to usetheir notes, and their book to
find information, and to talkand to work as a team. And
sometimes when you have thesmarter kids, they'll often want
(09:32):
to just blurt all the answers.
And so I stress to them. Youneed to Yes, work with your
partner, but you can't give themall the answers. And you can't
even just show them where theanswers are in their notes. You
can hint that it might be onthis page or stuff like that, so
that they're learning and alsoteaching other students how to
(09:52):
find the information as well.
Because not only do I havedifferent grade levels, but then
you all also have differentlearning levels as well in your
grade, because in my grade withfifth and sixth grade, I have
some students who are probably asecond grade reading level. And
then I have some kids that arehigh school reading level. And
(10:15):
so to have them do the sametest, you can't evaluate the
same way. And so if I have themwork together as a team,
sometimes, then they're learningfrom each other, not just me.
Ashley O'Neil (10:28):
Now, that makes a ton of sense. And I think you're
right that I mean, any group,you're going to have disparity
or the difference in abilitylevel. But not only that, but
yours is explicit, you know,you've got fifth and sixth
graders, and you've gotdifferent sets of standards. So
if they're reading the samebook, you might be focusing on
different things for your fifthgraders a little bit versus what
(10:50):
you're doing with your sixthgraders.
Tammy Clingenpeel (10:52):
Right
Ashley O'Neil (10:52):
Yeah, that makes sense. Um, I'm sure I can hear
challenges. If I was in yourclassroom, and I was teaching, I
can hear challenges that I wouldhave. But what are some
challenges that you have when itcomes to assessing your
students?
Unknown (11:06):
Um, I think the hardest thing that I have when I'm
assessing the students is thetrying to find the
differentiated testing for thestudents. Because sometimes you
get so involved in what is beingexpected of you as a teacher,
(11:26):
from the curriculum. And thenfor the report, report cards,
and then for the parents to see,or for the administration to
see. And yet I want the studentto be successful as well. And so
learning how, as a teacher tostep back and say, this student
can show me what he knowswithout having to do 100% of
(11:49):
this work, but maybe just 50% Ormaybe even just 40%. And picking
and choosing and making sure thework that they're doing is still
the content that needs to beevaluated, but just not as much,
and still making that child feelhis worth as well. Yeah,
Ashley O'Neil (12:11):
I mean, that that makes a ton of sense. And that
is you're right. They don't makeassessments that are multipacks,
for you to pick for yourclassroom. And so it's like you
have to do, you have done a lotof the work of knowing your
students individually. And sodoes that sometimes look like
each kid may get the similarlooking paper, but what they do
(12:32):
on that paper is all different.
Tammy Clingenpeel (12:34):
Correct?
Like, for example, on a languagescience assignment we just did
the other day, one of mystudents, I could tell, first
and foremost, it wasoverwhelming. So right away, I
eliminated half of it. Hestarted working and he was still
a little overwhelmed, you couldsee that look in his face. So I
said to him, I said, all right.
(12:58):
Let me see your paper. And thenI circled the ones that I
thought were the most important.
This type of sentence you needto know. So I'm going to have
him do this, this, this andthis. So I eliminated another
25%. And said, I want to seeyour what you can do with this.
And so then he was able tocomplete the task. And yet his
paper was the same exact papers,everybody else's. It's just I
(13:22):
had circled what he needed todo. And, and I always stress in
my class, we don't make fun ofpeople because they have
different learning papers ordifferent learning assignments.
Because everybody has differentthings that they're strong at.
Some people are strong at math,some are strong in language.
(13:43):
Some are good in reading, someare good at singing, some are
good at sports, but we're allgood at something. And we can
all be of use when it comes tocertain things in life. And one
more in the classroom, thosedifferent things will be brought
out in different ways. And sowe're just
Ashley O'Neil (14:03):
Yeah, I feel like I got to see that play out in
your classroom. When I've beenthere. I was there feel like you
were wrapping up maybe religionand math. And there were some it
was like a transition timehappening. And it seemed very
much like Well, first of all,you make use of your board a
little bit where what studentsare working on is kind of coded
up on the board next to theirname, right? It's like a whole
group, transparent way to keeptrack of who needs to work on
(14:26):
what assignment that's been outin the classroom. And you were
kind of bumping around to eachgroup. And I could hear you
making like on the spotaccommodations or changes to
students assignments. I rememberyou had a student kind of
verbally tell you the problemand then you wrote it down for
them on the test. And so you hadthat one on one moment and you
(14:46):
heard probably more informationfrom listening to them explain
the math problem. Then you hadthey just kind of muddled
through on their own. Right. Andit very much felt like there was
a culture in your classroom ofeverybody gets what they need.
You'd, that's not going to bethe same. We're all doing our
own, like, path. And it feltsupportive. So that's, that's
(15:07):
kudos to you. Because it's ahard, that's a hard culture and
to kind of set up in aclassroom, it is,
Tammy Clingenpeel (15:12):
it's been very challenging for me to step
back and accept that, forexample, with math last year, I
have one student, if I just gavethem the test to do it, they
would go and they would do theirtask. But then it would be like
75%, wrong. But then I startedsaying, Okay, I would like you
to go and do this one problem ata time and come see me. And then
(15:34):
the, the task was then gettingdone, where 75% of the test was
correct. You know, or, Hey, howabout we use graph paper so that
we do one number per box, and wehave everything lined up? And
then we'll check it like this.
And so I'm just having to learnhow to make accommodations for
each student, and yet stillcontinue with the content
(15:58):
content? And I don't knowmeeting everybody's needs. It's,
it's become quite a challenge,you know?
Ashley O'Neil (16:07):
Yeah. I imagine now, your report cards, what are
your report cards look like forschool? Because those aren't
your like those come from yourschool, there's got to be some
uniformity there. Right?
Tammy Clingenpeel (16:18):
Right, my report cards are done there via
the computer. So they're justgenerated with each subject, and
then their grade through theoffice. So I put all my grades
online, and then the officepulls them.
Ashley O'Neil (16:30):
And it's the parents then see like A, B or
like a 1234.
Unknown (16:35):
They see the the percentage grade, and then the
percentage grade key is at thebottom. Okay?
Ashley O'Neil (16:44):
And can parents communicate with you? During the
semester, like Johnny's so far,like currently getting with a C
in our class and math? Yes, Iget that.
Unknown (16:56):
I sent home a report every Sunday, I make sure all
grades for the week have beenentered into the computer. And
then I send an email with eachgrade subject. Each subject
great
Ashley O'Neil (17:10):
to each parent.
Okay, so they can see thatthat's alright, so my question
for you is, what advice wouldyou give a pre service teacher,
so someone pre service or likeyoung new, who's feeling
overwhelmed by assessment, andlearning with their students?
No.
Unknown (17:31):
Take it slow. Don't try to be that person who can do it
all in the first year ofteaching. I mean, I've been
teaching at this school for just29 years. And it's taking me a
long time, and I'm stilllearning, you know, I still go
to my daughter, who is beenteaching for like, less than 10
(17:51):
years, and I go to her for helpstill, with the new things that
are happening, you know, I was,I finished college a long time
ago, there are new changes outthere, things that are
happening. And so take it slow,and get to know your students
before you try to do too manychanges at once. You know, go
with what you know, and thenslowly make these changes. And I
(18:14):
think the biggest key is gettingto know your students and where
they are, and how to help them.
You know, and don't be afraid toask for help. You know, we've
had teachers before who wereafraid to ask for help, and then
they fall into trouble. You needto ask for help, because
otherwise, your students in thelong run are going to suffer.
(18:37):
And that's the problem rightthere because we're there to
help them. And sometimes that'shard to ask for help. But I've
learned one, you need to ask forhelp. Because if you're not
getting the help you need, youcan't help the students with
what they need. I think that'sthe biggest thing.
Ashley O'Neil (19:00):
Oh, that's perfect. Amy, thank you. I think
one of the things I like aboutI, I haven't been in the
classroom in a bit. But when Iwas in the classroom, how you
approach assessment reminds meof how I did it in my own
classroom, which is like, whenis there really a summative
assessment, right? Like when isthere really like teachers fully
hands off and this isn't amoment to learn. And I feel like
(19:22):
you you continually approachyour assessments as I want to
bring out the best in my studentand if that means taking a
minute to clarify and doing alittle accommodating learning
here to bring out the best inthem. I'm going to do that. And
I think that that's just such agreat way to approach things. So
thank you. Well, thank you. Thishas been another episode of
(19:45):
teach wonder if you found valuein what you heard today. We'd
love it if you share thisepisode with a friend or
colleague. You can find more outabout our center by visiting
cms.edu/timid or by checking usout on social media where you
can find us at see IC h c e s efull episodes with transcripts
are available on our websitethanks for listening
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