July 1, 2025 • 37 mins
In this episode of the Tech on Toast Podcast, Chris chats with Rob Bowie, co-founder of Marker, the UK’s first standardised sustainability rating for hospitality. Rob shares the journey behind launching Marka with co-founder Chiara, and how their gamified platform is helping restaurants, pubs and cafés take tangible steps toward sustainability—without the overwhelm.💡 What’s inside: • Why Marka is like a “food hygiene rating for sustainability” • How gamification and AI help operators drive real impact • The commercial value of shouting about your sustainability wins • How Marka's rating system works (and what it really takes to get ‘Outstanding’) • The challenges (and wins) of scaling a purpose-led business from NewcastleWe cover the shifting consumer mindset, the reluctance from operators to be first movers, and why sustainability needs to be team-led—not dumped on one overworked person.🍻 Expect plenty of laughs, a few digs at food hygiene ratings, a surprising Hard Rock Café chat, and serious insight into how sustainability can be a differentiator rather than a tick-box.👣 Start your journey at wearemarka.co.uk
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:02):
Hello and welcome to the Tech and Toast Podcast.
My name is Chris Fletcher and this is season 12.
Tech and Toast Podcast is serving up fresh chats with the
sharpest minds in hostility and tech.
If you're looking to level up your up, streamline your
service, or just sprinkle a little tech magic into your
business, you've come to the right place.
And guess what? Our partners like Speed are back
this season to look after us. They're the Epossom payments
platform helping over 165,000 businesses.
(00:26):
Businesses such as Big Mama, Mildred Mallow, and Kubit House,
they'll help you you scale it. You guessed it, the speed of
light. See what I did there?
With real time insights, faster transactions, and slick
integrations with people like OpenTable, 0 News, and many
more, Lightspeeds Unified Platform is built to boost your
performance and turn your tablesquicker than you can say flat
white extra hot. So if you need fast funding,
(00:48):
check out Lightspeed Capital. No hidden fees, no interest
charges, just smart support whenyou need it.
If you're curious about all of this, just head over to
lightspeed.co.uk/tech on Toast and book yourself a free demo.
You won't regret it. Now, enough of that.
Ready for the next episode? Let's go.
(01:09):
Welcome to next episode of Tech on Toast podcast.
Today we're delighted to be joined by Robert.
Is it Bowie or Bowie? It's it's Bowie.
You're just trying to be cool. I'm not trying to be cool,
that's just objectively my name.That is my name Chris Robert
Bowie who's Co founder of something very interesting
called market Robert how are you?
I'm. Very well.
Thank you. Can we call you Rob, Robert, Bob
I? Can go for a Rob or a Robert.
(01:31):
Probably not a Bob or a Bobby. I have to point out that Robert
is from the northeast, if you hadn't picked up from his accent
already, and he's got a mission to make.
Let's tell everybody who you support, even though you're from
Newcastle. Yes, I am a Sunderland fan.
It's just like sacrilegious. Yeah, it's sacrilegious to my
own health to be. Quite dangerous, right?
Well, potentially, yeah. Just don't tell anyone.
We're in the playoffs this season, so I don't know, it
(01:52):
might bring me. But you've been in the playoffs
for like 6 months and you've kind of given up.
That's my impression. We have lost the last five
games, but it doesn't bode well.So who have?
You got in the playoffs. We've got we've got Coventry
here. We haven't won against since
2006. Well, I hate Frank Lampard, I'll
say that in the podcast, so goodluck.
Even better. So Rob, before we get into this,
(02:13):
tell us a little bit about you and how you've got to this point
in your world. So I'm Rob, I'm the Co founder
of a business called Marker and marker is EU KS first
standardized sustainability rating for hospitality.
I love this. Yes, that's a lot of words and a
lot of jargon I know, but it stands.
Essentially what that means is we provide a rating for
customers that standardized across bars, pubs, restaurants,
(02:33):
etcetera of places to eat and drink that are sustainable.
So what we do is we gamify the process of becoming sustainable.
So let's say you're a pub and you have no idea where to start.
We gamify that process, involve all your team members, and then
the output is like a really tangible sort of customer symbol
of sustain. So is it like, can I compare it
to like, you know, when I do my food hygiene audit?
(02:54):
Exactly the same. Yeah.
OK. Because because that actually
was the only thing that ever, I mean, I grew up when that was
invented and it actually stuck. So I think you're on the right
track. Well.
It's an interesting one with food hygiene rating because when
that came out, there was actually quite a lot of
skepticism of like, it's something we even need, like,
why are we doing this? But now obviously if you saw
(03:14):
somewhere without a food hygienerating, you'd be a little bit
like. Well, what I'll tell you now is
that my son is 18, and he's verydiscerning now about where he
eats stuff. And we went to a Chinese take
away last Friday and we walked up and he went whoa, whoa, whoa,
whoa, whoa. As I want to go. 3 star Dad no
and I was like Shay, it's fine it's the same place we're all
still here we've been going it 20 years he said but dad you
know what 3 because now he worksin a restaurant he understands
(03:36):
and he said you know what 3 means that they could fail on I
was like I do actually I spent my career and he said so why you
still eating It was like I'm lazy get in there but it's true
right and I think that the new generation I think particularly
in the field you're talking about I think care more right
Maybe I'm wrong but I think theydo I'm it's remiss of us not to
mention Chiara by the way, because Robert has stolen the
(03:57):
whole show because. Actually in theme with the food
hygiene rate and she had food poisoning.
So you can't be here. So Chiara is the other Co
founder is that? Correct.
Yes, Chiara is YEAH operational queen of the business and Co
founder. And the Geordie as well.
Or not. No, she's from Herefordshire.
Oh, she's the posh one. Yeah, very soon.
Very cool. And yeah, she's not well.
So Kiara, best wishes from us. Hope you get better on with the
(04:18):
show. So yeah, tell us a little bit
about so where have you been up to?
What have you been doing before you built Marker?
Cool. So it was the kind of back story
to what to to where Mark startedwas I'm kind of going to go full
circle here. That's why you do that.
So straight out of uni I was kind of like, I didn't
particularly want to go into a job.
It was 1 where my background's in sustainability.
(04:38):
So I've got my degree in sustainability.
So I was kind of looking in the field out there to be like,
what's the most impactful way tostart a business, influence
people. We had a couple of iterations
and try different things. And then it happened to be the
scenario where Chiara moved up to Newcastle from her corporate
job in London. She burnt out in that and we
kind of knew to the front through like a mutual friend.
(04:59):
So, so we met up and kind of like I was doing something
initially in the music industry,so it was kind of sustainable
events around music and such like that ended up being
something that kind of didn't look like it was going to scale.
So we kind of met and we were like, we'll just do a business
together. So that's kind of how it
started. And it's it's sort of snowballed
from there. So yeah.
(05:20):
I love it and it is and and Kiera, I'm guessing because
you're both your skill set is not opposite.
But do you find are you because we have a lot of Co founders and
founders come on and is it is itworking well?
Because I always think when you have two people together.
It works very. Well, a really long way of
asking that question. Do you like her?
It was quite, it was quite a long one.
Yeah. I think she's acceptable.
Yeah, I can. I can do business with her.
No. Yeah, she's very nice.
(05:41):
I think it's a really weird one because it's both both me and
Chiara, only children. So we've kind of like assumed
this role where suddenly we've got a sibling.
But like we've it like like I'veassumed like sort of inherited A
sibling at 24. It's really, really bizarre.
So we kind of have this like bickering relationship where
everything will disagree on, butthat's kind of good for the
process of helping the business because it's usually the answers
(06:03):
usually like somewhere in the middle, right?
So we kind of converge. And why hospitality?
A couple of reasons, one which kind of shocks us.
There's pitifully little sort ofoptions for sustainability and
hospitality like there, there really is not much out there.
And the other one is everyone eats and drinks right.
Like if you are picking a marketto influence as many people as
(06:24):
possible, there isn't many better than hospitality because
regardless of race, gender, sortof income, whatever you are
consuming from a popular restaurant.
So it's. AI think the SRA.
Do you know the SRA? If you heard of this the SRA you
probably might know them. Actually without work in the.
Industry Sustainable Restaurant Organ association.
OK. But yeah, so the SRA are
probably, I'm probably doing some people disservice here are
(06:46):
the ones that I think have been around the longest in terms of.
In that. Field, but again, without being
rude, I don't know how much impact they're having, if any.
We had them at Carluccios when Iwas there and we used to.
We did this one napkin thing andeveryone was only allowed to use
one napkin, but every time I went to a bloody restaurant they
were using 5 or 6 per person. Yeah, I think, I think a
problem, the problem with a lot of these things is the
accountability isn't there, right.
(07:07):
So as much as I'm not. Down I'm telling my waiters to.
Yeah, and I'm not out in the like the intentions good, right.
But the practicality of actuallyimplementing something like
that, it's realistically, if anyone, I mean, I've worked in
pubs for a long time and I'm obviously you've done a huge
amount of hospitality as well. Like things being said are well
and good, but realistically do that happen?
No, that's why you have a lot ofthis.
(07:29):
I mean, I'm getting into it too quickly here, but you know, like
on a menu where you mentioned the plug sockets in here, right?
Yeah. Powered by, was it powered by
Wind? Powered by Wind Ng.
Yeah, which is questionable because all the electricity on
the grid comes from the exact same player, so you can't really
say it that, but. But that's what I'm saying about
because we have a lot of menus now that will say sustainable,
you know, and they'll have even like carbon footprint scores or
(07:50):
next to dishes. And I'm yeah, I'm not sure how
much. Whilst it's great to know, how
much impact is it having? I don't know but.
What does it mean? Right.
Like if we're. Going to solve a problem, how do
we do it? See a number on a menu and like
what does that mean to any consumer?
Literally means nothing. Right.
And if I like fish and chips andit's a high carbon foot, I'm
probably going to fish. And that sounds really bad.
Well, yeah, because it's like any staff without context are
(08:13):
completely useless. I could throw all the stats at
you right now and it's I. Was hoping you were going, yeah.
I don't actually don't. I should have some more stats to
be an option now. I should have like a list of
little. So tell us a bit about because
I've got here, we've got thinking about it's a 3 tiered
system, is it? It is a three tiered system.
So as the food rating is 5. Whatever it.
(08:35):
Is yeah, not stars. Is it stars?
Yeah, it's like little forks, isn't it?
Is it? Is that?
Right. I think a fork, I'm thinking
Hard Rock. A fork is like the the emblem,
but I think it's 5. Come on, have you got a camera
on you? No.
So nobody saw what you just did?No, no, no.
I was throwing the hard. Rock, I said.
I did some sort of like, cool rock symbol.
Yeah, well, you made you look really trendy.
But I worked for Hard Rock for like 8 years and that was our.
(08:57):
Our motto? Yeah, that was our thing.
Well, the Hard Rock in Newcastle's just closed so that.
Was there even one in Newcastle?Yeah, well, exactly.
Wow. That's probably why it's closed.
Yeah, it shouldn't have opened it when they opened in like the
non tourist locations. No offense.
No Newcastle. It didn't really work.
Yeah, Edinburgh survived. Yeah, Manchester.
Well, the one in Newcastle opened on like a bizarre place
down by the river that not even people from Newcastle kind of go
(09:18):
to. And it was just like, I'm not
really sure why it's here. It was a very interesting.
My favorite bit is that every Hard Rock that opens, they have
their T-shirt, right. Hard Rock Cardiff, Hard Rock,
whatever. Yeah, so Hard Rock Newcastle.
Just I would have loved what themerch was because they have to
do. They do a bunch of personalized
merch for the city, so it would have been interesting to see the
take up. But you guys love work.
You love shouting about where you're from.
Yeah, no. Anyway, right.
(09:39):
And how do you measure? Because the big question going
to ask this, right? So how do I get to the point of
having good, excellent, outstanding, cool?
And what happens if I'm not good?
Cool. So a couple of things I'll just
sort of run back on that question.
Food hygiene rate and the reasonwe kind of look there out there
at like established standards ofrating systems and obviously
there's an absolute wealth out there, right?
The five star sort of rating is obviously well established.
(10:01):
You go and Google things about 5stars, for example, food hygiene
rating that is out of Five Forksor whatever it is.
We kind of wanted to move away from that because we felt that
that was certainly that was kindof oversaturated, like you see
that everywhere. So we wanted to have something
that was a little bit more distinctive in the market.
So we kind of turned our heads more to the sort of Michelin
star rating out of the three Michelin stars, right.
(10:22):
And I'm kind of positioned sustainability or something
that's a real asset for a business that.
More valuable. Yeah, yeah.
This is something of high value.So the way it works basically is
we gamify that process. So if you imagine like one of
those big cabbage chocolate barsyou get for Christmas.
I'm starving here. Go on I.
Know, sorry, cabbage chocolate. So we basically take all the
(10:42):
elements of sustainability imagine sustainability is the
chocolate bar and then we break it down into little chunks and
little tasks So businesses go through and complete those tasks
Each one of those tasks award the number of stars depending on
how difficult it is So basicallythey go through complete tasks
and stars and then the stars go towards the rating So 40 stars
is good, 60 stars is excellent and 80 stars is outstanding So
(11:03):
like it's completely standardized across everyone we
work with. But what's really cool the
answers of all those tasks go into like an advanced language
lot model that we've built and it basically outputs a real time
sustainability summary of everyone we work with.
So if you see like an excellent marker rating, for example in
the pub and you kind of like hell does a marker rating mean
like you can scan the code and literally say everything they
(11:27):
are doing be sustainable. That's very unbelievable.
It's really. Well, you would say that, but
yeah, but. I'm biased.
No, but that's very cool. And and how I mean I'm not
sticking to questions. How is that being received then?
So because is there a big education piece to be done here
as well as the actual product? Yeah, it's a yeah in terms of
receiver, really. Well, like it's a frustrating
(11:49):
one for us because almost the feedback we get is too good.
Like the feedback doesn't necessarily correlate with the
uptake. So for example, we walk into a
business and like the managers love it, the staff love it, the
owners. Like this is amazing.
I'd love to do this, but I thinkwe're kind of in that catch 22
of 'cause they don't see other people in the sector doing it.
They're kind of like, I wait forsomeone else to do it first.
Yeah, you need a big. Big Brother, don't you?
(12:11):
Yeah, 100%. Yeah.
Yeah, so. What's stopping a Wagamama
doing? I mean, they'd be perfect.
Right. They're nothing.
I think they take all this. No, nothing.
I mean like like tech wise we could already do like if like
2000 hospitality businesses cameto us and said, can we like get
on this and like start this process?
We would be like that's not a problem.
Like we can do that. That's very cool.
And and what's the and, and the,the, because I think
(12:33):
sustainability is quite an interesting subject because as
you just alluded to there, everybody wants to do it.
Of course, every or everybody, sorry, everybody thinks it
should be done. Yeah, what is sustainable?
But done stage it should be moresustainable.
Right. Yeah.
Everybody, I think everybody nowunderstands that that's
something that is going to help,you know, apart from Donald
Trump. I think the planet will be, you
(12:54):
know, better off for doing better things.
But where do you think the blockage is?
Do you think it is around people's education around
understanding what the benefits are or do you think it's?
To value. Do you?
Think it's low down on their list of things to do because
they've got no chef or no it's. It's, it's literally, it's,
well, this is something we kind of open.
We open our own a lot. But yeah, I'm pretty sure it's
(13:15):
not a value thing. So I don't think hospitality
business has quite yet realized the value of what this has with
consumers. Like the, the hospitality market
is obviously so extremely competitive and there's so
little you can do now to differentiate yourself from your
competition, right? One of the things that you can
do is be sustainable. Like it is a limited list now,
but like being sustainable do itdoes attract a different set of
(13:36):
customers. Because they're doing B Corp,
right? So a lot of these guys, a lot of
the bigger brand like Pizza Pilgrims just became B Corp.
I know Patty and Scott's think of B Corp.
So a lot of these guys are and Idon't think it's easy to obtain,
but they obviously see the valuein that. 100%, yeah.
And that I mean especially from like a corporate basis that's
extremely attractive, right. But I think what we see is
especially small hospitality chains and like SMA's and and
(13:58):
people across the sector, they struggle to connect That sort of
step into sustainability, isn't it, with an increase in
footfall, even though the data suggests that would happen and
other sectors like retail, that does happen in hospitality, I
think because there's not been any first movers yet, it's kind
of like there's a reluctance to do it.
And they want the ROI tomorrow as well, right?
So. Yeah, yeah, it's an instant
(14:19):
return thing where you're like, this is you can't just step into
something like sustainability and just click your fingers and
it's done. Like it's a long journey and,
and it touches all aspects of your business.
Like it is going to talk, touch your supply chains.
It is going to touch the way youtrain your staff, like the way
you operate your venue in terms of policies.
It's going to change. But actually the the weird thing
is once you've kind of got that foundation in place, it becomes
(14:41):
quite easy. After that.
It's almost those first steps orthe most difficult one, and then
you start to reap the benefits and it becomes much easier.
It's a bit like having an, an addiction.
So like that, that, that, that admittance of it's the opposite
to addiction. They don't want to, they don't
want to be addicted to it. It's the opposite of addiction.
They like, they know that they need it.
Yeah, No, I think because I think we had a, a company called
(15:02):
Zedible. Have you heard of them?
I haven't, I don't, I don't think they're around anymore,
unfortunately. But they did a carbon footprint
model where they could measure the output on recipes and all
that kind of stuff. Yeah.
And, and they were brilliant. Two boys who owned their own
restaurant chain who were doing it as like a side gig.
And then we're hoping that wouldbe their thing.
And I don't think it turned out in the end, but same thing,
(15:22):
right? Because they they were just
coming up against this. We don't, we don't get it.
We don't know why it's important.
You're slightly different because you're registering,
you're giving them a certification, right?
Yeah. Which I think is smart because
it's not only education, it's also about saying this is our
standard. This is what we, you know, we're
five star rated food hygiene andwe're outstanding rated with
marker. Yeah, it's, it's, it's a
(15:42):
strange, it's a strange catch 22we find ourselves in because I
was actually, we were talking toto a guy called Neil from, you
know, Mission Mars. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Who won't like Rudy's pizza? Yeah, we talked to Neil, who
manages their sustainability andwe had a really interesting
conversation with him where he basically sort of tabled the
notion that, well, they're doingall these things for
sustainability behind the scenes, but customers don't
(16:05):
care, right? So what's the point of talking
about it? But the position we're in is
those hospitality businesses, a lot of them think customers
don't care or actually doesn't make a difference to those
footfalls statistics, right? Even though obviously corporate
wise they might be going to be caught and such.
But actually, when that catch 22off, customers don't have
anything to pick from, like theycan't pick from nothing.
So once those options are provided, they'll start to pick
(16:27):
and then businesses will see thebenefit.
But without seeing that evidence, businesses don't want
to step into it. It's very interesting.
This round Robin of like yet oneof his needs to move first and
then everyone will be able to move as.
Well, I think if you ask marketing, they would disagree
with him. I think marketing would say yes,
this group of people really care.
But but you know what this is? This is the thing as well, where
we often find. For example, I've actually got
(16:49):
written down a point here sayingit's often businesses that will
have, let's say, two people thatare responsible for
sustainability. No one else in the business
knows what the hell they're doing.
Like it's this thing where it touches every element of the
business, right? And it changes the whole
operational practices of like supply chains and stuff, whereas
most people don't know what's going on.
So we've got this kind of dividewhere these people who are
(17:09):
operating sustainability are kind of in like a different
universe to the rest of the people in the business they're.
Like tech? Yeah.
It's just so bizarre, like we, we, there's a, there's AI won't
mention the name, but there's a quite a popular bar in Newcastle
that has someone who manages their sustainability and nobody
else in the business knows what the hell they're doing.
Like Willy Wonka. Nobody ever.
It's. So strange.
(17:30):
It's so strange, yeah. But I say, what are some of the,
I suppose, blind spots or what are some of the hidden
hospitality in sustainability when you're looking at things,
what are some people doing well that you can share and what are
things that people aren't doing that they could do well in?
Well, I think that's. The weirdest question ever.
Yeah, I'm trying to. Yeah, you just.
(17:52):
Unfolding that, I think I'll give you a second.
Yeah. So it's an interesting 1.
I think what we would say is from our experience, most venues
are doing way more than they think.
I think there's this almost thisstigma around of they don't
quite understand what sustainability is for that
venue, which means they're kind of scared of it, when in
reality, they're doing a lot more than they already realized.
And we kind of just need to consolidate that into one place
(18:13):
and strategize it a bit and go, what are we doing here?
How do we step forward with this?
Because at the minute it's so discombobulated.
But yeah, I mean, like, like basic things, like a lot of
venues now have like water reduction targets.
Like they make sure they have policies to turn lights off.
Like they have policies of social inclusion, they have
policies of diversity, They havepolicies of cultural sort of
(18:36):
outreach. Like they're doing things that
are good. It's just so disjointed.
They don't even know where they stand.
So kind of part of what we do iswe actually go into businesses
and say you need a place where this is all organized, not just
one person in the business. Let's get everyone involved in
the team, educate everyone. This can be sort of process
that's not tedious and horrible.Like you can't enjoy it, I
(18:56):
promise. And then, yeah.
And then we can reap the market and benefits as well because
obviously we know as a hospitality business, that's
what you want. Yeah.
And I totally agree with what you're saying about the
differentiator. I'd, I think that that marketing
teams, brand teams, operators, even now scratching around
trying to find ways to kind of fight for that pound because
it's difficult, right? Because there's, it's, as you
(19:17):
said, super competitive, gettingharder because the costs are
going up and up and up. But yeah, I, I think you're
definitely in the right place. And, and have you seen it?
I mean, it's hard because you'requite new.
Have you seen any kind of wins? Because I imagine it takes time,
right? I don't think you can just
switch it on to the get what they get.
They get some in the window or how does it?
How does it? Display, so it's basically a
(19:39):
full ecosystem of marketing. So the process goes they sign up
they Add all the venues they want to do so we do it per venue
so it's not organizational, which means we can have a little
bit more sort of a macro focus They do a per venue at their
staff in the venue. So essentially it spreads it
across the organization and then?
(20:00):
Essentially it syncs as they getthe market rating, All the AI
summaries sync and the rating syncs.
So that goes in our app, which is like the equivalent of like a
TripAdvisor. So you're in Waterloo, you want
to find a sustainable pub. You can go on there, find
sustainable restaurants, filter by pubs, cafes, etcetera.
So your marketplace as well? Yeah, 100%, yeah.
So on that, that that's also on our website.
So basically you can go on thereand see everything they're doing
(20:21):
to be sustainable, description of the, the, the restaurant,
etcetera, photos and then see the market rating as well.
And then there's other side. So for example, like we have
premade marketing assets, so they can click into the
marketing hub on our portal and they can download premade assets
which are like real time synced with all that information that
they've done to be sustainable. For example, if they want to
(20:43):
display like information in the toilets of how they save water,
they could have a custom airportjust like a click of a button
and just put it on the wall. So it's about creating that
whole ecosystem of marketing around sustainability.
So we not only take people on the journey, we actually tell
them like this will gain you more customers, you need to
shout about it. We will tell you how to do that,
I think. I think that's some of the
(21:03):
commercial respect of it that people are not fearful of, but
are wary of that they, they wonder if doing this is going to
obviously they're doing the right thing.
But you know, caveated with thatquite quickly these days is, are
we making some more money as well?
So, and quite rightly, you are bright.
But as you said, the whole thinghas to type together, right?
Your social media presence, everything around it should be
(21:24):
pushing the fat. But this is what we do everyday
for you guys to make sure that we're doing the right thing for
everybody else. And I think getting that message
out, it's almost pointless doingunless you're going to do that,
right? Yeah, I, I totally agree.
It's a, it's a strange one actually, because we've had,
we've had people who are and businesses we've stepped in who
are already quite committed to sustainability and they've
(21:44):
almost. They haven't necessarily gone
and shouted about it then. No, But yeah, well, this is the
thing actually. A lot of people kind of table
the notion. And I don't know if this is a
particular British thing, but they don't want to shout about
it because they feel like they feel like they're almost, they
shouldn't have to shout about doing the right thing, right?
But actually what we say is that's completely wrong because
you have the power as a hospitality business, as you
know of you bring people in the doors of of all different,
(22:08):
different sort of sects of society.
You can educate, you can do different things, you can help
make this change outside of yourvenue.
And we always say we don't want to make like 10% of businesses
100% better. We want to make 100% of
businesses 1020% better and get everyone on the ladder and get
everyone up together. Because when we we do have an
ecosystem where let's say you can go out in London and you can
(22:29):
walk down, I don't know, the berms, ABA Mile.
And you can see 10 different market rate venues and exactly
why each one sustainable. The first one or two might not
make a difference. You might say sustainability
rating, but when you've been to the 8th and 9th pub and you've
seen that everywhere, there's noway that doesn't make a
difference to the way consumers see things.
Yeah. So it's about creating that sort
of universe of sustainability, the sustainability universe.
(22:54):
I'll clip that one for you universes and and it must be it
can't be easy, right? Because you're not you're not an
old man like me. So being Howard Skarish, she's
simply she's. 24 as well. Yeah, you're both quite young
and the challenges, we just talked very briefly before we
started recording about the challenges of running your own
business. You're having to cope with that
plus you're having to educate into a well, it's unfortunate
(23:15):
I'm saying new sector, but it's not new, is it?
But it, but it is in terms of its adoption, Yeah, hospitality,
yeah. So, yeah, because we're useless.
But how is that for you? Because that, that because
you're you've got the business side of it, you've got the
product side of it. Have you found that a challenge?
Oh yeah, it's extremely difficult, Yeah, extremely
difficult. I always say like it's one of
(23:35):
those where I'm all I got torn between like a rock and a hard
place of we absolutely love whatwe do and our product is fun,
comes across thank you. But it's very difficult.
And I think the, the resilience that's needed with the
hospitality sector and I'm sure all hospitality businesses know
this internally as well is a lot, right?
Like there's a lot of resiliencerequired to plot on because
(23:57):
things just don't go or plan a lot of the time.
And that's within businesses themselves and the educational
process we have to go on to actually communicate these
things to those businesses. For example, I mean, if you
worked in a professional sector,you'd expect a reply to an
e-mail, right? We understand a lot of our
clients are so busy, it takes us3 or 4 emails to get reply,
right? So just basic things like that.
(24:18):
I think we're kind of a bit of adiscovery journey for us kind of
and a bit of like. I think.
Realism so. Yeah, I don't know if it's
they're being spammed by a million tech providers.
I'm sure they are. I'm sure they are.
No, no, no. It's the same thing, right?
And but I also agree with you about their time port, always
have been, always will be. And I don't even know if emails
the right way to like we so a lot of our customers now we just
(24:39):
get them on WhatsApp and like itsounds like we're going the
other way around, but like because we just can't get hold
of them. But when you phone them, there's
no, they don't mind or WhatsApp,they don't, they won't reply if
they don't want to, right? Definitely.
But I think it's just e-mail. It's so clogged up with.
Quite lucky in Newcastle becausewe can kind of plodge through
the door places and barge away and usually get pretty friendly
conversations. Yeah, because I think, well, and
(25:01):
I think that people appreciate it's hospitality, right?
Yeah, it's emotive business. People want to meet you face to
face. And if you can do that,
fantastic. Obviously if you're trying to
scale something, you're going tostruggle to be everywhere unless
they unless you create some moreof you.
I do. Try.
It yeah, I know. I bet, I bet.
And I think some of the challenges what you taught how
to run a business. Do you know what you're doing or
do you just learn on the hot? Well, I think we've kind of
(25:21):
learned along the way. Kiara's degree is in music and
business, actually, oddly enough.
But yeah. Sings while you do.
Your She doesn't, actually, she's not.
You know what's bizarre? She's not particularly musical
at all. She can play the drums a bit,
but it's kind of. More, well, not production or
management. Yeah, like me.
Well, I think more music in thatlike business in the music
world, sort of sort of thing. I don't know if she was.
(25:43):
Talking about, Kiara said there's an answer on the
postcard. I know I should ring.
So and I'm as you go forward then do you see the product
evolve? It obviously is going to evolve.
You're going to reiterate, but do you see that?
Is that just going to be you tooor do you plan to?
No. No, no, it's already, I mean
it's already built to scale. So we've we've kind of already
(26:03):
built all the framework there toscale staff members and scale
other things and scale our operations.
So in terms of that challenge, that won't be particularly
difficult. I think our frustration at the
minute is the limiting factor for us isn't all capabilities in
the business. It's not necessarily
financially. It's not our tech platforms or
systems or ability to scale. It's actually just education in
the sector. Like the process that takes the
(26:24):
long list is kind of convincing people that this is worthwhile.
And without those first moves, it's difficult, right?
So for example, we just, we signed Full Circle Brewery, Hill
Brewery up in Newcastle the other day.
And they got it straight away because they have this notion of
sustainability. They do it already.
They understand what it means for their customers.
And straight away it's like, yeah, I get that.
(26:46):
I totally understand it. That's an amazing idea, but we
take that to a smaller pub or even like let's say a pub chain
that's 1520, ten years. It's not there yet.
And like even though there's people from sort of like a
fundamental basis, no, it's goodthey struggle and make that line
connection between good and value like is this value for my
(27:07):
business 100? Percent.
I think almost immediately when you're talking to them, they're
thinking in their head, I'm going to get this over the line.
Yeah. How can I?
Because that's the way I have conversation with people.
I'm constantly thinking, can I reason with you to make you
understand that this is a good, good idea and that you're going
to pay? For 100%, you know what one of
the most common questions we getasked is?
Will we be at good? Will be what?
Sorry. Will will we be a good
(27:28):
sustainability? That's all.
The first question is, will we be a good sustainability?
So. What happens if you don't get
good? Nothing.
OK. You just essentially, So what we
do is we show venues is pending their rating on our website.
So they'll still go on there andgo on our app and they basically
have a year to get their first rating.
And then after that they'll kindof be removed off the, the, the
(27:49):
app and they the, the website. But yeah, I mean, we, we give,
we give businesses a lot of leeway and it's broken down in a
way where they can really split the load of this.
Like there isn't anything comparable in terms of work
rate. But yeah, it's it's interesting
though. I bet, I bet it's difficult.
And the actual I was just reading this one here.
Where's that my question going so I'll edit this bit out.
(28:14):
He was talking about pre approved sustainability.
Sustained sustainable suppliers,yes.
How does that work? OK.
So it's a similar process. And so it's a similar process
where we can we kind of understand that like this whole
notion of sustainability to businesses in terms of looking
for supplies is a little bit murky as well.
Like what does sustainability even mean?
(28:35):
Yeah. So we kind of, we, what we do is
we have a similar process for suppliers where they kind of go
through a gamified process and have to do certain things and
tasks and evidence stuff to us. And we basically off that we
kind of say like, look, this is someone that we know it's OK to
work with. They're on our website, we say
exactly why they're sustainable,etcetera.
So we can create that kind of network where we can go not only
(28:55):
can we go sort of connect a venue with a supplier, but
hopefully we can kind of go through supplies to venues as
well. So we have that sort of web, the
web of sustainability. That makes perfect sense.
And how and how big can it get? Because you're essentially
starting where the food ain't. She started with their racing.
And most people, I'm sure, like you said, probably shun them.
(29:15):
Shun them at the start going, ohGod, who cares?
Who cares if you're a one star or a five star?
But how so in an ideal, not an ideal world, in this world, how,
how big do you think you can get?
I mean, there's, there's no reason why it can't become a
global standard in terms of sustainability in hospitality.
There's no, there's no, there's no limitations on all ability to
go and do that. It's basically how willing the
(29:36):
sector is to do that or how muchthe sector wants it.
But in terms of like our ambitions, we want to be at
least minimum sort of the nationwide standard for
sustainability and hospitality. Because you're you're because
market should become part of thelanguage, right?
Yeah, which which I think is really smart when you're
building new products, right. If you can make your product
part of people's day-to-day language, then it becomes a much
(29:57):
more easy to sell on through other people because you'll get
operators saying to you, have you got?
Money, we always say, right. The thing we want the most from
what we're building is we do notwant this to be one of those
training exercises that's handeddown That's a crap video that
you watch that you go, I don't want it.
We want we want this to be something that hospitality
(30:18):
business course. Look, this is so easy, This is
so engaging. This is the output of this is so
good. Let's do it.
Let's leave into it. We want to do this.
It doesn't need to be something that's top down and litigious
and boring. Like we can make it something
that's like a bit exciting, likeinvolve all the team members in
the business, make like make make it feel like everyone's
kind of putting a bit of effort towards this.
And if we can get in that place where we have that feeling in
(30:41):
hospitality, right? Like these are teams of people
that are enthusiastic about the job.
They work extremely hard, like obviously extremely social.
Like we can step on the back of that and like make a real change
nationwide. It just requires first move as
it requires people to sort of take that first step and go,
this is what we need to do now. I.
Think you need to talk well talkafterwards brands, a couple of
(31:01):
brands that I would think that would just make sense to do.
And if you, if I'm an operator and I'm sitting here listening,
thinking, OK, quite like him, he's got good energy, he's
talking a good game. And but they don't know where to
start because I think that's often these things.
They're looking around the table.
If they haven't got someone in charge of sustainability, which
a lot of them won't write because they probably put tech
(31:21):
or accounts or whatever else before that.
So they're looking around and say everything.
Who's going to look after this and how easy it is it to do or
how easy it to get started how they do?
It is that with us, yeah. Yeah.
So it's, I mean, it's, it's as simple as this as with us where
we've actually, we actually understand that that's a
problem, right. The biggest, the biggest point
of entry to this is people kind of not knowing where to start.
It's as simple as going on the market website, click and sign
(31:44):
up, create a new account and there is a full tutorial that
guides you through everything how we use the platform.
The job officials all right, Whodoes it?
Exactly. Yeah.
And I think that's the thing. A lot of people don't understand
where this lies, but. Is it marketing?
Is it operations? Controversially, you know, I
think it's all of them. So I think the notion of going
into sustainability, what we we often find is the problem is, as
(32:05):
I was saying before, it's kind of hot spotted on one person in
the business who does everything.
Whereas like would you consider yourselves, well, maybe you
would Chris, but I don't know, but would you consider yourself
like, like an expert on like operations, an expert on like
people management, an expert on like you wouldn't, right.
I know what I know, right? I know you know, obviously I've
got knowledge around others, butyou, I know what I've brought up
in operations. And most people wouldn't, right?
(32:27):
Obviously be naive to assume that it did.
Sustainability covers all aspects of a business, like it's
social things, it's cultural things, it's environmental
things. We cannot expect one person to
do everything. We need basically someone to
take a lead, whether that's operational.
But the way marker works is theycan divide that up across venues
and divide that up across teams.They can kind of create that
structure of sustainability that's managed in the business.
(32:48):
Where we go, this isn't one person.
Let's hold multiple people accountable, spread the load,
educate multiple people and it kind of gets the ball rolling in
a way where we go that's. Like a development developmental
tool as well, right individuals you want to move on, take a bit
of responsibility, run a project100% of it might be I was
sitting with Sasha today from bills and we were she were heads
up there IT for them for the tech for them and there we would
(33:08):
talk about the same thing for her.
How do you, how you, you know, take these projects on without
getting overloaded? And that's how you do it.
You spread the load, right, makesure people get involved and get
them to help. It's fantastic what happens in
five years. So I invite you about, let's not
say 55 is a long time, let's saya year.
If I bring you back here in a year, where do you think we're
at? Well, we've changed a lot in a
year. I mean, we were just literally
(33:31):
started trading I think April last year, so basically a year
ago. So I'm hoping we'll have signed
a couple of chains by then. Fingers crossed.
Yeah. I think we, I want to help with
that actually, because I think, I think you can, Yeah.
And I. Think I've no doubt that we can,
yeah. I mean your, your your
confidence isn't the. Issue it's it's difficult.
It's difficult for us to get in the room with those people at
(33:52):
all the time. Yeah, well, it's for anyone,
right? Whether you're paused or whether
you're you. Wearing like the the the deep,
the deep cold N so we have to often.
Are there many central, most head offices are down there,
right? Or Greg's?
Greg's based is the head officer.
Greg's in Newcastle. Greg's is in Newcastle of.
Course it is. That's very cool.
Are you incorrect? He's getting Craig's.
No, but no. But hopefully we do have
(34:13):
connections to Greg's. Actually.
Greg's are good for sustainability, you know.
Yeah, I would imagine, but. And I think, I think for me the
whole when I when I first saw itright when you when you guys
popped up. You thought Greg's?
No, don't talk like I'm starving.
I'm literally starving and I walk past the Greg's.
I'm kicking myself. So I thought, should I nip in
and get something? You know what?
Sorry, I'm going on a tangent here.
You know what's really interesting?
No coming, coming to coming to to London and and we find
(34:36):
ourselves down every maybe two weeks or so.
I think it basically the inverseswitch between the South and the
north is we have the same amountof sort of like square mile per
square mile number of Greg's to what you used to have Prem
Andre. So it kind of like it's like as
you go further north, like the percentage suddenly changes.
I'd be interested to see like a chart of like how many like
(34:57):
prets change slowly and a bit like.
A bit like gales as well, right?You haven't got a gales up.
We've got gales in Newcastle. No, it's about 6 lbs for a
croissant. We don't have gales in
Newcastle. I actually, I met, I met the
person who who founded Gales theother day and he's really nice
actually. Found out the day.
Well, I think Emma King, who's the CMO?
Hawksmoor. It was also one of the original
(35:18):
founders of Gales and I knew that she was involved at start.
Anyway, I'm digressing. Yeah, obviously our job is to
help you, so I'll, we'll have a chat afterwards and we'll see
what we can do. We'll get get young Abby to go
and get her sustainability. Shoes on so she can help such a
gentleman Chris if. People want to get in touch with
you and find out more about market and actually how.
(35:38):
Just get them started. Yeah.
Maybe you should do a little webinar.
Actually, we'll do a little webinar together where we can
physically show the products. I think it always helps, right?
So people can just see, look, this is how simple it is.
Yeah, maybe tech on toast can become a can we can, can it?
Can it be a, does it have to be a physical hostile business?
Your eyes are saying yes. Physical hospitality.
Well it can't be me. I basically tech on toast.
Can't become sustainable. It could be a sustainable
(36:00):
supplier. Well, maybe we should do that
and then we can start the ball rolling and then share with
people. But how do people get in touch
and they want to have a chat? So, so simple.
I mean, there's a contact buttonon our website.
So our website is we are marker and marker spelled MARKA.
So if you just Google, we are marker contact form in there.
Or you can literally click sign up and just sign up.
It takes 3 or 4 minutes. Go through the tutorial, get
(36:23):
started. I mean, it's crazy easy.
Like crazy. Crazy easy.
That's coming from a macam. Anyway, lovely look.
Thank you very much mate. It's.
Coming your Geordie. Accent.
No, I didn't even attempt it. I know you did.
I can do it. Yeah, but I I won't.
Macam. You told me not to do it.
You said it was offensive. It's not offensive.
It's just embarrassing. Not very good.
(36:44):
Which is offensive. Anyway, he's come all the way
down. Where are you heading Back to
today? Coming to Newcastle tonight.
Yeah, Castle tonight and then. Sorry, very bad.
I mean, I'm a Scouser, but I've lost it.
I think you have lost it. Is there any time?
I don't think there is. Any no, no, I think there might
be a little bit. I think because I've been in
Wales 15 years, right? That is South Wales has affected
(37:05):
me. If it's in North Wales, just be
talking through my nose. I've got I.
Think I think you've got a little bit of a Welsh, Welsh
trang as well, Like really, really slight.
My kids speak all speak Welsh. They're all really, they're all
Welsh school, yes, they're all. I've got a clue what they're
talking about, but I'm sure. That's quite dangerous, that
isn't it. Yeah, the less they talk to me,
the better, mate, to be honest, it's much easier.
But look, that was the second test podcast.
Everyone that was Marco. Check him out.
(37:26):
We are Mark is We are marker.com.
Dot co.uk. We are market.co.uk.
Get yourselves on the sustainability journey, people.
Stop messing about. This is a commercial tool as
well as doing the right thing. So yeah, reach out to Rob or our
food poisoned friend Kiara. Is it Kiara?
If I get that right, yeah. I'll change, I'll change her
listing on our website to the food poisoned friend.
(37:48):
Be in line with it. Yeah, yeah.
So I'm sure it should be better by the time we all listen to
this. Let's hope so.
But that's it. Thank you very much, my friend.
Have a safe journey home. Say bye.
Bye. Bye everyone.
There you go.
Hello and welcome to the Tech and Toast Podcast.
My name is Chris Fletcher and this is season 12.
Tech and Toast Podcast is serving up fresh chats with the
sharpest minds in hostility and tech.
If you're looking to level up your up, streamline your
service, or just sprinkle a little tech magic into your
business, you've come to the right place.
And guess what? Our partners like Speed are back
this season to look after us. They're the Epossom payments
platform helping over 165,000 businesses.
(00:26):
Businesses such as Big Mama, Mildred Mallow, and Kubit House,
they'll help you you scale it. You guessed it, the speed of
light. See what I did there?
With real time insights, faster transactions, and slick
integrations with people like OpenTable, 0 News, and many
more, Lightspeeds Unified Platform is built to boost your
performance and turn your tablesquicker than you can say flat
white extra hot. So if you need fast funding,
(00:48):
check out Lightspeed Capital. No hidden fees, no interest
charges, just smart support whenyou need it.
If you're curious about all of this, just head over to
lightspeed.co.uk/tech on Toast and book yourself a free demo.
You won't regret it. Now, enough of that.
Ready for the next episode? Let's go.
(01:09):
Welcome to next episode of Tech on Toast podcast.
Today we're delighted to be joined by Robert.
Is it Bowie or Bowie? It's it's Bowie.
You're just trying to be cool. I'm not trying to be cool,
that's just objectively my name.That is my name Chris Robert
Bowie who's Co founder of something very interesting
called market Robert how are you?
I'm. Very well.
Thank you. Can we call you Rob, Robert, Bob
I? Can go for a Rob or a Robert.
(01:31):
Probably not a Bob or a Bobby. I have to point out that Robert
is from the northeast, if you hadn't picked up from his accent
already, and he's got a mission to make.
Let's tell everybody who you support, even though you're from
Newcastle. Yes, I am a Sunderland fan.
It's just like sacrilegious. Yeah, it's sacrilegious to my
own health to be. Quite dangerous, right?
Well, potentially, yeah. Just don't tell anyone.
We're in the playoffs this season, so I don't know, it
(01:52):
might bring me. But you've been in the playoffs
for like 6 months and you've kind of given up.
That's my impression. We have lost the last five
games, but it doesn't bode well.So who have?
You got in the playoffs. We've got we've got Coventry
here. We haven't won against since
2006. Well, I hate Frank Lampard, I'll
say that in the podcast, so goodluck.
Even better. So Rob, before we get into this,
(02:13):
tell us a little bit about you and how you've got to this point
in your world. So I'm Rob, I'm the Co founder
of a business called Marker and marker is EU KS first
standardized sustainability rating for hospitality.
I love this. Yes, that's a lot of words and a
lot of jargon I know, but it stands.
Essentially what that means is we provide a rating for
customers that standardized across bars, pubs, restaurants,
(02:33):
etcetera of places to eat and drink that are sustainable.
So what we do is we gamify the process of becoming sustainable.
So let's say you're a pub and you have no idea where to start.
We gamify that process, involve all your team members, and then
the output is like a really tangible sort of customer symbol
of sustain. So is it like, can I compare it
to like, you know, when I do my food hygiene audit?
(02:54):
Exactly the same. Yeah.
OK. Because because that actually
was the only thing that ever, I mean, I grew up when that was
invented and it actually stuck. So I think you're on the right
track. Well.
It's an interesting one with food hygiene rating because when
that came out, there was actually quite a lot of
skepticism of like, it's something we even need, like,
why are we doing this? But now obviously if you saw
(03:14):
somewhere without a food hygienerating, you'd be a little bit
like. Well, what I'll tell you now is
that my son is 18, and he's verydiscerning now about where he
eats stuff. And we went to a Chinese take
away last Friday and we walked up and he went whoa, whoa, whoa,
whoa, whoa. As I want to go. 3 star Dad no
and I was like Shay, it's fine it's the same place we're all
still here we've been going it 20 years he said but dad you
know what 3 because now he worksin a restaurant he understands
(03:36):
and he said you know what 3 means that they could fail on I
was like I do actually I spent my career and he said so why you
still eating It was like I'm lazy get in there but it's true
right and I think that the new generation I think particularly
in the field you're talking about I think care more right
Maybe I'm wrong but I think theydo I'm it's remiss of us not to
mention Chiara by the way, because Robert has stolen the
(03:57):
whole show because. Actually in theme with the food
hygiene rate and she had food poisoning.
So you can't be here. So Chiara is the other Co
founder is that? Correct.
Yes, Chiara is YEAH operational queen of the business and Co
founder. And the Geordie as well.
Or not. No, she's from Herefordshire.
Oh, she's the posh one. Yeah, very soon.
Very cool. And yeah, she's not well.
So Kiara, best wishes from us. Hope you get better on with the
(04:18):
show. So yeah, tell us a little bit
about so where have you been up to?
What have you been doing before you built Marker?
Cool. So it was the kind of back story
to what to to where Mark startedwas I'm kind of going to go full
circle here. That's why you do that.
So straight out of uni I was kind of like, I didn't
particularly want to go into a job.
It was 1 where my background's in sustainability.
(04:38):
So I've got my degree in sustainability.
So I was kind of looking in the field out there to be like,
what's the most impactful way tostart a business, influence
people. We had a couple of iterations
and try different things. And then it happened to be the
scenario where Chiara moved up to Newcastle from her corporate
job in London. She burnt out in that and we
kind of knew to the front through like a mutual friend.
(04:59):
So, so we met up and kind of like I was doing something
initially in the music industry,so it was kind of sustainable
events around music and such like that ended up being
something that kind of didn't look like it was going to scale.
So we kind of met and we were like, we'll just do a business
together. So that's kind of how it
started. And it's it's sort of snowballed
from there. So yeah.
(05:20):
I love it and it is and and Kiera, I'm guessing because
you're both your skill set is not opposite.
But do you find are you because we have a lot of Co founders and
founders come on and is it is itworking well?
Because I always think when you have two people together.
It works very. Well, a really long way of
asking that question. Do you like her?
It was quite, it was quite a long one.
Yeah. I think she's acceptable.
Yeah, I can. I can do business with her.
No. Yeah, she's very nice.
(05:41):
I think it's a really weird one because it's both both me and
Chiara, only children. So we've kind of like assumed
this role where suddenly we've got a sibling.
But like we've it like like I'veassumed like sort of inherited A
sibling at 24. It's really, really bizarre.
So we kind of have this like bickering relationship where
everything will disagree on, butthat's kind of good for the
process of helping the business because it's usually the answers
(06:03):
usually like somewhere in the middle, right?
So we kind of converge. And why hospitality?
A couple of reasons, one which kind of shocks us.
There's pitifully little sort ofoptions for sustainability and
hospitality like there, there really is not much out there.
And the other one is everyone eats and drinks right.
Like if you are picking a marketto influence as many people as
(06:24):
possible, there isn't many better than hospitality because
regardless of race, gender, sortof income, whatever you are
consuming from a popular restaurant.
So it's. AI think the SRA.
Do you know the SRA? If you heard of this the SRA you
probably might know them. Actually without work in the.
Industry Sustainable Restaurant Organ association.
OK. But yeah, so the SRA are
probably, I'm probably doing some people disservice here are
(06:46):
the ones that I think have been around the longest in terms of.
In that. Field, but again, without being
rude, I don't know how much impact they're having, if any.
We had them at Carluccios when Iwas there and we used to.
We did this one napkin thing andeveryone was only allowed to use
one napkin, but every time I went to a bloody restaurant they
were using 5 or 6 per person. Yeah, I think, I think a
problem, the problem with a lot of these things is the
accountability isn't there, right.
(07:07):
So as much as I'm not. Down I'm telling my waiters to.
Yeah, and I'm not out in the like the intentions good, right.
But the practicality of actuallyimplementing something like
that, it's realistically, if anyone, I mean, I've worked in
pubs for a long time and I'm obviously you've done a huge
amount of hospitality as well. Like things being said are well
and good, but realistically do that happen?
No, that's why you have a lot ofthis.
(07:29):
I mean, I'm getting into it too quickly here, but you know, like
on a menu where you mentioned the plug sockets in here, right?
Yeah. Powered by, was it powered by
Wind? Powered by Wind Ng.
Yeah, which is questionable because all the electricity on
the grid comes from the exact same player, so you can't really
say it that, but. But that's what I'm saying about
because we have a lot of menus now that will say sustainable,
you know, and they'll have even like carbon footprint scores or
(07:50):
next to dishes. And I'm yeah, I'm not sure how
much. Whilst it's great to know, how
much impact is it having? I don't know but.
What does it mean? Right.
Like if we're. Going to solve a problem, how do
we do it? See a number on a menu and like
what does that mean to any consumer?
Literally means nothing. Right.
And if I like fish and chips andit's a high carbon foot, I'm
probably going to fish. And that sounds really bad.
Well, yeah, because it's like any staff without context are
(08:13):
completely useless. I could throw all the stats at
you right now and it's I. Was hoping you were going, yeah.
I don't actually don't. I should have some more stats to
be an option now. I should have like a list of
little. So tell us a bit about because
I've got here, we've got thinking about it's a 3 tiered
system, is it? It is a three tiered system.
So as the food rating is 5. Whatever it.
(08:35):
Is yeah, not stars. Is it stars?
Yeah, it's like little forks, isn't it?
Is it? Is that?
Right. I think a fork, I'm thinking
Hard Rock. A fork is like the the emblem,
but I think it's 5. Come on, have you got a camera
on you? No.
So nobody saw what you just did?No, no, no.
I was throwing the hard. Rock, I said.
I did some sort of like, cool rock symbol.
Yeah, well, you made you look really trendy.
But I worked for Hard Rock for like 8 years and that was our.
(08:57):
Our motto? Yeah, that was our thing.
Well, the Hard Rock in Newcastle's just closed so that.
Was there even one in Newcastle?Yeah, well, exactly.
Wow. That's probably why it's closed.
Yeah, it shouldn't have opened it when they opened in like the
non tourist locations. No offense.
No Newcastle. It didn't really work.
Yeah, Edinburgh survived. Yeah, Manchester.
Well, the one in Newcastle opened on like a bizarre place
down by the river that not even people from Newcastle kind of go
(09:18):
to. And it was just like, I'm not
really sure why it's here. It was a very interesting.
My favorite bit is that every Hard Rock that opens, they have
their T-shirt, right. Hard Rock Cardiff, Hard Rock,
whatever. Yeah, so Hard Rock Newcastle.
Just I would have loved what themerch was because they have to
do. They do a bunch of personalized
merch for the city, so it would have been interesting to see the
take up. But you guys love work.
You love shouting about where you're from.
Yeah, no. Anyway, right.
(09:39):
And how do you measure? Because the big question going
to ask this, right? So how do I get to the point of
having good, excellent, outstanding, cool?
And what happens if I'm not good?
Cool. So a couple of things I'll just
sort of run back on that question.
Food hygiene rate and the reasonwe kind of look there out there
at like established standards ofrating systems and obviously
there's an absolute wealth out there, right?
The five star sort of rating is obviously well established.
(10:01):
You go and Google things about 5stars, for example, food hygiene
rating that is out of Five Forksor whatever it is.
We kind of wanted to move away from that because we felt that
that was certainly that was kindof oversaturated, like you see
that everywhere. So we wanted to have something
that was a little bit more distinctive in the market.
So we kind of turned our heads more to the sort of Michelin
star rating out of the three Michelin stars, right.
(10:22):
And I'm kind of positioned sustainability or something
that's a real asset for a business that.
More valuable. Yeah, yeah.
This is something of high value.So the way it works basically is
we gamify that process. So if you imagine like one of
those big cabbage chocolate barsyou get for Christmas.
I'm starving here. Go on I.
Know, sorry, cabbage chocolate. So we basically take all the
(10:42):
elements of sustainability imagine sustainability is the
chocolate bar and then we break it down into little chunks and
little tasks So businesses go through and complete those tasks
Each one of those tasks award the number of stars depending on
how difficult it is So basicallythey go through complete tasks
and stars and then the stars go towards the rating So 40 stars
is good, 60 stars is excellent and 80 stars is outstanding So
(11:03):
like it's completely standardized across everyone we
work with. But what's really cool the
answers of all those tasks go into like an advanced language
lot model that we've built and it basically outputs a real time
sustainability summary of everyone we work with.
So if you see like an excellent marker rating, for example in
the pub and you kind of like hell does a marker rating mean
like you can scan the code and literally say everything they
(11:27):
are doing be sustainable. That's very unbelievable.
It's really. Well, you would say that, but
yeah, but. I'm biased.
No, but that's very cool. And and how I mean I'm not
sticking to questions. How is that being received then?
So because is there a big education piece to be done here
as well as the actual product? Yeah, it's a yeah in terms of
receiver, really. Well, like it's a frustrating
(11:49):
one for us because almost the feedback we get is too good.
Like the feedback doesn't necessarily correlate with the
uptake. So for example, we walk into a
business and like the managers love it, the staff love it, the
owners. Like this is amazing.
I'd love to do this, but I thinkwe're kind of in that catch 22
of 'cause they don't see other people in the sector doing it.
They're kind of like, I wait forsomeone else to do it first.
Yeah, you need a big. Big Brother, don't you?
(12:11):
Yeah, 100%. Yeah.
Yeah, so. What's stopping a Wagamama
doing? I mean, they'd be perfect.
Right. They're nothing.
I think they take all this. No, nothing.
I mean like like tech wise we could already do like if like
2000 hospitality businesses cameto us and said, can we like get
on this and like start this process?
We would be like that's not a problem.
Like we can do that. That's very cool.
And and what's the and, and the,the, because I think
(12:33):
sustainability is quite an interesting subject because as
you just alluded to there, everybody wants to do it.
Of course, every or everybody, sorry, everybody thinks it
should be done. Yeah, what is sustainable?
But done stage it should be moresustainable.
Right. Yeah.
Everybody, I think everybody nowunderstands that that's
something that is going to help,you know, apart from Donald
Trump. I think the planet will be, you
(12:54):
know, better off for doing better things.
But where do you think the blockage is?
Do you think it is around people's education around
understanding what the benefits are or do you think it's?
To value. Do you?
Think it's low down on their list of things to do because
they've got no chef or no it's. It's, it's literally, it's,
well, this is something we kind of open.
We open our own a lot. But yeah, I'm pretty sure it's
(13:15):
not a value thing. So I don't think hospitality
business has quite yet realized the value of what this has with
consumers. Like the, the hospitality market
is obviously so extremely competitive and there's so
little you can do now to differentiate yourself from your
competition, right? One of the things that you can
do is be sustainable. Like it is a limited list now,
but like being sustainable do itdoes attract a different set of
(13:36):
customers. Because they're doing B Corp,
right? So a lot of these guys, a lot of
the bigger brand like Pizza Pilgrims just became B Corp.
I know Patty and Scott's think of B Corp.
So a lot of these guys are and Idon't think it's easy to obtain,
but they obviously see the valuein that. 100%, yeah.
And that I mean especially from like a corporate basis that's
extremely attractive, right. But I think what we see is
especially small hospitality chains and like SMA's and and
(13:58):
people across the sector, they struggle to connect That sort of
step into sustainability, isn't it, with an increase in
footfall, even though the data suggests that would happen and
other sectors like retail, that does happen in hospitality, I
think because there's not been any first movers yet, it's kind
of like there's a reluctance to do it.
And they want the ROI tomorrow as well, right?
So. Yeah, yeah, it's an instant
(14:19):
return thing where you're like, this is you can't just step into
something like sustainability and just click your fingers and
it's done. Like it's a long journey and,
and it touches all aspects of your business.
Like it is going to talk, touch your supply chains.
It is going to touch the way youtrain your staff, like the way
you operate your venue in terms of policies.
It's going to change. But actually the the weird thing
is once you've kind of got that foundation in place, it becomes
(14:41):
quite easy. After that.
It's almost those first steps orthe most difficult one, and then
you start to reap the benefits and it becomes much easier.
It's a bit like having an, an addiction.
So like that, that, that, that admittance of it's the opposite
to addiction. They don't want to, they don't
want to be addicted to it. It's the opposite of addiction.
They like, they know that they need it.
Yeah, No, I think because I think we had a, a company called
(15:02):
Zedible. Have you heard of them?
I haven't, I don't, I don't think they're around anymore,
unfortunately. But they did a carbon footprint
model where they could measure the output on recipes and all
that kind of stuff. Yeah.
And, and they were brilliant. Two boys who owned their own
restaurant chain who were doing it as like a side gig.
And then we're hoping that wouldbe their thing.
And I don't think it turned out in the end, but same thing,
(15:22):
right? Because they they were just
coming up against this. We don't, we don't get it.
We don't know why it's important.
You're slightly different because you're registering,
you're giving them a certification, right?
Yeah. Which I think is smart because
it's not only education, it's also about saying this is our
standard. This is what we, you know, we're
five star rated food hygiene andwe're outstanding rated with
marker. Yeah, it's, it's, it's a
(15:42):
strange, it's a strange catch 22we find ourselves in because I
was actually, we were talking toto a guy called Neil from, you
know, Mission Mars. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Who won't like Rudy's pizza? Yeah, we talked to Neil, who
manages their sustainability andwe had a really interesting
conversation with him where he basically sort of tabled the
notion that, well, they're doingall these things for
sustainability behind the scenes, but customers don't
(16:05):
care, right? So what's the point of talking
about it? But the position we're in is
those hospitality businesses, a lot of them think customers
don't care or actually doesn't make a difference to those
footfalls statistics, right? Even though obviously corporate
wise they might be going to be caught and such.
But actually, when that catch 22off, customers don't have
anything to pick from, like theycan't pick from nothing.
So once those options are provided, they'll start to pick
(16:27):
and then businesses will see thebenefit.
But without seeing that evidence, businesses don't want
to step into it. It's very interesting.
This round Robin of like yet oneof his needs to move first and
then everyone will be able to move as.
Well, I think if you ask marketing, they would disagree
with him. I think marketing would say yes,
this group of people really care.
But but you know what this is? This is the thing as well, where
we often find. For example, I've actually got
(16:49):
written down a point here sayingit's often businesses that will
have, let's say, two people thatare responsible for
sustainability. No one else in the business
knows what the hell they're doing.
Like it's this thing where it touches every element of the
business, right? And it changes the whole
operational practices of like supply chains and stuff, whereas
most people don't know what's going on.
So we've got this kind of dividewhere these people who are
(17:09):
operating sustainability are kind of in like a different
universe to the rest of the people in the business they're.
Like tech? Yeah.
It's just so bizarre, like we, we, there's a, there's AI won't
mention the name, but there's a quite a popular bar in Newcastle
that has someone who manages their sustainability and nobody
else in the business knows what the hell they're doing.
Like Willy Wonka. Nobody ever.
It's. So strange.
(17:30):
It's so strange, yeah. But I say, what are some of the,
I suppose, blind spots or what are some of the hidden
hospitality in sustainability when you're looking at things,
what are some people doing well that you can share and what are
things that people aren't doing that they could do well in?
Well, I think that's. The weirdest question ever.
Yeah, I'm trying to. Yeah, you just.
(17:52):
Unfolding that, I think I'll give you a second.
Yeah. So it's an interesting 1.
I think what we would say is from our experience, most venues
are doing way more than they think.
I think there's this almost thisstigma around of they don't
quite understand what sustainability is for that
venue, which means they're kind of scared of it, when in
reality, they're doing a lot more than they already realized.
And we kind of just need to consolidate that into one place
(18:13):
and strategize it a bit and go, what are we doing here?
How do we step forward with this?
Because at the minute it's so discombobulated.
But yeah, I mean, like, like basic things, like a lot of
venues now have like water reduction targets.
Like they make sure they have policies to turn lights off.
Like they have policies of social inclusion, they have
policies of diversity, They havepolicies of cultural sort of
(18:36):
outreach. Like they're doing things that
are good. It's just so disjointed.
They don't even know where they stand.
So kind of part of what we do iswe actually go into businesses
and say you need a place where this is all organized, not just
one person in the business. Let's get everyone involved in
the team, educate everyone. This can be sort of process
that's not tedious and horrible.Like you can't enjoy it, I
(18:56):
promise. And then, yeah.
And then we can reap the market and benefits as well because
obviously we know as a hospitality business, that's
what you want. Yeah.
And I totally agree with what you're saying about the
differentiator. I'd, I think that that marketing
teams, brand teams, operators, even now scratching around
trying to find ways to kind of fight for that pound because
it's difficult, right? Because there's, it's, as you
(19:17):
said, super competitive, gettingharder because the costs are
going up and up and up. But yeah, I, I think you're
definitely in the right place. And, and have you seen it?
I mean, it's hard because you'requite new.
Have you seen any kind of wins? Because I imagine it takes time,
right? I don't think you can just
switch it on to the get what they get.
They get some in the window or how does it?
How does it? Display, so it's basically a
(19:39):
full ecosystem of marketing. So the process goes they sign up
they Add all the venues they want to do so we do it per venue
so it's not organizational, which means we can have a little
bit more sort of a macro focus They do a per venue at their
staff in the venue. So essentially it spreads it
across the organization and then?
(20:00):
Essentially it syncs as they getthe market rating, All the AI
summaries sync and the rating syncs.
So that goes in our app, which is like the equivalent of like a
TripAdvisor. So you're in Waterloo, you want
to find a sustainable pub. You can go on there, find
sustainable restaurants, filter by pubs, cafes, etcetera.
So your marketplace as well? Yeah, 100%, yeah.
So on that, that that's also on our website.
So basically you can go on thereand see everything they're doing
(20:21):
to be sustainable, description of the, the, the restaurant,
etcetera, photos and then see the market rating as well.
And then there's other side. So for example, like we have
premade marketing assets, so they can click into the
marketing hub on our portal and they can download premade assets
which are like real time synced with all that information that
they've done to be sustainable. For example, if they want to
(20:43):
display like information in the toilets of how they save water,
they could have a custom airportjust like a click of a button
and just put it on the wall. So it's about creating that
whole ecosystem of marketing around sustainability.
So we not only take people on the journey, we actually tell
them like this will gain you more customers, you need to
shout about it. We will tell you how to do that,
I think. I think that's some of the
(21:03):
commercial respect of it that people are not fearful of, but
are wary of that they, they wonder if doing this is going to
obviously they're doing the right thing.
But you know, caveated with thatquite quickly these days is, are
we making some more money as well?
So, and quite rightly, you are bright.
But as you said, the whole thinghas to type together, right?
Your social media presence, everything around it should be
(21:24):
pushing the fat. But this is what we do everyday
for you guys to make sure that we're doing the right thing for
everybody else. And I think getting that message
out, it's almost pointless doingunless you're going to do that,
right? Yeah, I, I totally agree.
It's a, it's a strange one actually, because we've had,
we've had people who are and businesses we've stepped in who
are already quite committed to sustainability and they've
(21:44):
almost. They haven't necessarily gone
and shouted about it then. No, But yeah, well, this is the
thing actually. A lot of people kind of table
the notion. And I don't know if this is a
particular British thing, but they don't want to shout about
it because they feel like they feel like they're almost, they
shouldn't have to shout about doing the right thing, right?
But actually what we say is that's completely wrong because
you have the power as a hospitality business, as you
know of you bring people in the doors of of all different,
(22:08):
different sort of sects of society.
You can educate, you can do different things, you can help
make this change outside of yourvenue.
And we always say we don't want to make like 10% of businesses
100% better. We want to make 100% of
businesses 1020% better and get everyone on the ladder and get
everyone up together. Because when we we do have an
ecosystem where let's say you can go out in London and you can
(22:29):
walk down, I don't know, the berms, ABA Mile.
And you can see 10 different market rate venues and exactly
why each one sustainable. The first one or two might not
make a difference. You might say sustainability
rating, but when you've been to the 8th and 9th pub and you've
seen that everywhere, there's noway that doesn't make a
difference to the way consumers see things.
Yeah. So it's about creating that sort
of universe of sustainability, the sustainability universe.
(22:54):
I'll clip that one for you universes and and it must be it
can't be easy, right? Because you're not you're not an
old man like me. So being Howard Skarish, she's
simply she's. 24 as well. Yeah, you're both quite young
and the challenges, we just talked very briefly before we
started recording about the challenges of running your own
business. You're having to cope with that
plus you're having to educate into a well, it's unfortunate
(23:15):
I'm saying new sector, but it's not new, is it?
But it, but it is in terms of its adoption, Yeah, hospitality,
yeah. So, yeah, because we're useless.
But how is that for you? Because that, that because
you're you've got the business side of it, you've got the
product side of it. Have you found that a challenge?
Oh yeah, it's extremely difficult, Yeah, extremely
difficult. I always say like it's one of
(23:35):
those where I'm all I got torn between like a rock and a hard
place of we absolutely love whatwe do and our product is fun,
comes across thank you. But it's very difficult.
And I think the, the resilience that's needed with the
hospitality sector and I'm sure all hospitality businesses know
this internally as well is a lot, right?
Like there's a lot of resiliencerequired to plot on because
(23:57):
things just don't go or plan a lot of the time.
And that's within businesses themselves and the educational
process we have to go on to actually communicate these
things to those businesses. For example, I mean, if you
worked in a professional sector,you'd expect a reply to an
e-mail, right? We understand a lot of our
clients are so busy, it takes us3 or 4 emails to get reply,
right? So just basic things like that.
(24:18):
I think we're kind of a bit of adiscovery journey for us kind of
and a bit of like. I think.
Realism so. Yeah, I don't know if it's
they're being spammed by a million tech providers.
I'm sure they are. I'm sure they are.
No, no, no. It's the same thing, right?
And but I also agree with you about their time port, always
have been, always will be. And I don't even know if emails
the right way to like we so a lot of our customers now we just
(24:39):
get them on WhatsApp and like itsounds like we're going the
other way around, but like because we just can't get hold
of them. But when you phone them, there's
no, they don't mind or WhatsApp,they don't, they won't reply if
they don't want to, right? Definitely.
But I think it's just e-mail. It's so clogged up with.
Quite lucky in Newcastle becausewe can kind of plodge through
the door places and barge away and usually get pretty friendly
conversations. Yeah, because I think, well, and
(25:01):
I think that people appreciate it's hospitality, right?
Yeah, it's emotive business. People want to meet you face to
face. And if you can do that,
fantastic. Obviously if you're trying to
scale something, you're going tostruggle to be everywhere unless
they unless you create some moreof you.
I do. Try.
It yeah, I know. I bet, I bet.
And I think some of the challenges what you taught how
to run a business. Do you know what you're doing or
do you just learn on the hot? Well, I think we've kind of
(25:21):
learned along the way. Kiara's degree is in music and
business, actually, oddly enough.
But yeah. Sings while you do.
Your She doesn't, actually, she's not.
You know what's bizarre? She's not particularly musical
at all. She can play the drums a bit,
but it's kind of. More, well, not production or
management. Yeah, like me.
Well, I think more music in thatlike business in the music
world, sort of sort of thing. I don't know if she was.
(25:43):
Talking about, Kiara said there's an answer on the
postcard. I know I should ring.
So and I'm as you go forward then do you see the product
evolve? It obviously is going to evolve.
You're going to reiterate, but do you see that?
Is that just going to be you tooor do you plan to?
No. No, no, it's already, I mean
it's already built to scale. So we've we've kind of already
(26:03):
built all the framework there toscale staff members and scale
other things and scale our operations.
So in terms of that challenge, that won't be particularly
difficult. I think our frustration at the
minute is the limiting factor for us isn't all capabilities in
the business. It's not necessarily
financially. It's not our tech platforms or
systems or ability to scale. It's actually just education in
the sector. Like the process that takes the
(26:24):
long list is kind of convincing people that this is worthwhile.
And without those first moves, it's difficult, right?
So for example, we just, we signed Full Circle Brewery, Hill
Brewery up in Newcastle the other day.
And they got it straight away because they have this notion of
sustainability. They do it already.
They understand what it means for their customers.
And straight away it's like, yeah, I get that.
(26:46):
I totally understand it. That's an amazing idea, but we
take that to a smaller pub or even like let's say a pub chain
that's 1520, ten years. It's not there yet.
And like even though there's people from sort of like a
fundamental basis, no, it's goodthey struggle and make that line
connection between good and value like is this value for my
(27:07):
business 100? Percent.
I think almost immediately when you're talking to them, they're
thinking in their head, I'm going to get this over the line.
Yeah. How can I?
Because that's the way I have conversation with people.
I'm constantly thinking, can I reason with you to make you
understand that this is a good, good idea and that you're going
to pay? For 100%, you know what one of
the most common questions we getasked is?
Will we be at good? Will be what?
Sorry. Will will we be a good
(27:28):
sustainability? That's all.
The first question is, will we be a good sustainability?
So. What happens if you don't get
good? Nothing.
OK. You just essentially, So what we
do is we show venues is pending their rating on our website.
So they'll still go on there andgo on our app and they basically
have a year to get their first rating.
And then after that they'll kindof be removed off the, the, the
(27:49):
app and they the, the website. But yeah, I mean, we, we give,
we give businesses a lot of leeway and it's broken down in a
way where they can really split the load of this.
Like there isn't anything comparable in terms of work
rate. But yeah, it's it's interesting
though. I bet, I bet it's difficult.
And the actual I was just reading this one here.
Where's that my question going so I'll edit this bit out.
(28:14):
He was talking about pre approved sustainability.
Sustained sustainable suppliers,yes.
How does that work? OK.
So it's a similar process. And so it's a similar process
where we can we kind of understand that like this whole
notion of sustainability to businesses in terms of looking
for supplies is a little bit murky as well.
Like what does sustainability even mean?
(28:35):
Yeah. So we kind of, we, what we do is
we have a similar process for suppliers where they kind of go
through a gamified process and have to do certain things and
tasks and evidence stuff to us. And we basically off that we
kind of say like, look, this is someone that we know it's OK to
work with. They're on our website, we say
exactly why they're sustainable,etcetera.
So we can create that kind of network where we can go not only
(28:55):
can we go sort of connect a venue with a supplier, but
hopefully we can kind of go through supplies to venues as
well. So we have that sort of web, the
web of sustainability. That makes perfect sense.
And how and how big can it get? Because you're essentially
starting where the food ain't. She started with their racing.
And most people, I'm sure, like you said, probably shun them.
(29:15):
Shun them at the start going, ohGod, who cares?
Who cares if you're a one star or a five star?
But how so in an ideal, not an ideal world, in this world, how,
how big do you think you can get?
I mean, there's, there's no reason why it can't become a
global standard in terms of sustainability in hospitality.
There's no, there's no, there's no limitations on all ability to
go and do that. It's basically how willing the
(29:36):
sector is to do that or how muchthe sector wants it.
But in terms of like our ambitions, we want to be at
least minimum sort of the nationwide standard for
sustainability and hospitality. Because you're you're because
market should become part of thelanguage, right?
Yeah, which which I think is really smart when you're
building new products, right. If you can make your product
part of people's day-to-day language, then it becomes a much
(29:57):
more easy to sell on through other people because you'll get
operators saying to you, have you got?
Money, we always say, right. The thing we want the most from
what we're building is we do notwant this to be one of those
training exercises that's handeddown That's a crap video that
you watch that you go, I don't want it.
We want we want this to be something that hospitality
(30:18):
business course. Look, this is so easy, This is
so engaging. This is the output of this is so
good. Let's do it.
Let's leave into it. We want to do this.
It doesn't need to be something that's top down and litigious
and boring. Like we can make it something
that's like a bit exciting, likeinvolve all the team members in
the business, make like make make it feel like everyone's
kind of putting a bit of effort towards this.
And if we can get in that place where we have that feeling in
(30:41):
hospitality, right? Like these are teams of people
that are enthusiastic about the job.
They work extremely hard, like obviously extremely social.
Like we can step on the back of that and like make a real change
nationwide. It just requires first move as
it requires people to sort of take that first step and go,
this is what we need to do now. I.
Think you need to talk well talkafterwards brands, a couple of
(31:01):
brands that I would think that would just make sense to do.
And if you, if I'm an operator and I'm sitting here listening,
thinking, OK, quite like him, he's got good energy, he's
talking a good game. And but they don't know where to
start because I think that's often these things.
They're looking around the table.
If they haven't got someone in charge of sustainability, which
a lot of them won't write because they probably put tech
(31:21):
or accounts or whatever else before that.
So they're looking around and say everything.
Who's going to look after this and how easy it is it to do or
how easy it to get started how they do?
It is that with us, yeah. Yeah.
So it's, I mean, it's, it's as simple as this as with us where
we've actually, we actually understand that that's a
problem, right. The biggest, the biggest point
of entry to this is people kind of not knowing where to start.
It's as simple as going on the market website, click and sign
(31:44):
up, create a new account and there is a full tutorial that
guides you through everything how we use the platform.
The job officials all right, Whodoes it?
Exactly. Yeah.
And I think that's the thing. A lot of people don't understand
where this lies, but. Is it marketing?
Is it operations? Controversially, you know, I
think it's all of them. So I think the notion of going
into sustainability, what we we often find is the problem is, as
(32:05):
I was saying before, it's kind of hot spotted on one person in
the business who does everything.
Whereas like would you consider yourselves, well, maybe you
would Chris, but I don't know, but would you consider yourself
like, like an expert on like operations, an expert on like
people management, an expert on like you wouldn't, right.
I know what I know, right? I know you know, obviously I've
got knowledge around others, butyou, I know what I've brought up
in operations. And most people wouldn't, right?
(32:27):
Obviously be naive to assume that it did.
Sustainability covers all aspects of a business, like it's
social things, it's cultural things, it's environmental
things. We cannot expect one person to
do everything. We need basically someone to
take a lead, whether that's operational.
But the way marker works is theycan divide that up across venues
and divide that up across teams.They can kind of create that
structure of sustainability that's managed in the business.
(32:48):
Where we go, this isn't one person.
Let's hold multiple people accountable, spread the load,
educate multiple people and it kind of gets the ball rolling in
a way where we go that's. Like a development developmental
tool as well, right individuals you want to move on, take a bit
of responsibility, run a project100% of it might be I was
sitting with Sasha today from bills and we were she were heads
up there IT for them for the tech for them and there we would
(33:08):
talk about the same thing for her.
How do you, how you, you know, take these projects on without
getting overloaded? And that's how you do it.
You spread the load, right, makesure people get involved and get
them to help. It's fantastic what happens in
five years. So I invite you about, let's not
say 55 is a long time, let's saya year.
If I bring you back here in a year, where do you think we're
at? Well, we've changed a lot in a
year. I mean, we were just literally
(33:31):
started trading I think April last year, so basically a year
ago. So I'm hoping we'll have signed
a couple of chains by then. Fingers crossed.
Yeah. I think we, I want to help with
that actually, because I think, I think you can, Yeah.
And I. Think I've no doubt that we can,
yeah. I mean your, your your
confidence isn't the. Issue it's it's difficult.
It's difficult for us to get in the room with those people at
(33:52):
all the time. Yeah, well, it's for anyone,
right? Whether you're paused or whether
you're you. Wearing like the the the deep,
the deep cold N so we have to often.
Are there many central, most head offices are down there,
right? Or Greg's?
Greg's based is the head officer.
Greg's in Newcastle. Greg's is in Newcastle of.
Course it is. That's very cool.
Are you incorrect? He's getting Craig's.
No, but no. But hopefully we do have
(34:13):
connections to Greg's. Actually.
Greg's are good for sustainability, you know.
Yeah, I would imagine, but. And I think, I think for me the
whole when I when I first saw itright when you when you guys
popped up. You thought Greg's?
No, don't talk like I'm starving.
I'm literally starving and I walk past the Greg's.
I'm kicking myself. So I thought, should I nip in
and get something? You know what?
Sorry, I'm going on a tangent here.
You know what's really interesting?
No coming, coming to coming to to London and and we find
(34:36):
ourselves down every maybe two weeks or so.
I think it basically the inverseswitch between the South and the
north is we have the same amountof sort of like square mile per
square mile number of Greg's to what you used to have Prem
Andre. So it kind of like it's like as
you go further north, like the percentage suddenly changes.
I'd be interested to see like a chart of like how many like
(34:57):
prets change slowly and a bit like.
A bit like gales as well, right?You haven't got a gales up.
We've got gales in Newcastle. No, it's about 6 lbs for a
croissant. We don't have gales in
Newcastle. I actually, I met, I met the
person who who founded Gales theother day and he's really nice
actually. Found out the day.
Well, I think Emma King, who's the CMO?
Hawksmoor. It was also one of the original
(35:18):
founders of Gales and I knew that she was involved at start.
Anyway, I'm digressing. Yeah, obviously our job is to
help you, so I'll, we'll have a chat afterwards and we'll see
what we can do. We'll get get young Abby to go
and get her sustainability. Shoes on so she can help such a
gentleman Chris if. People want to get in touch with
you and find out more about market and actually how.
(35:38):
Just get them started. Yeah.
Maybe you should do a little webinar.
Actually, we'll do a little webinar together where we can
physically show the products. I think it always helps, right?
So people can just see, look, this is how simple it is.
Yeah, maybe tech on toast can become a can we can, can it?
Can it be a, does it have to be a physical hostile business?
Your eyes are saying yes. Physical hospitality.
Well it can't be me. I basically tech on toast.
Can't become sustainable. It could be a sustainable
(36:00):
supplier. Well, maybe we should do that
and then we can start the ball rolling and then share with
people. But how do people get in touch
and they want to have a chat? So, so simple.
I mean, there's a contact buttonon our website.
So our website is we are marker and marker spelled MARKA.
So if you just Google, we are marker contact form in there.
Or you can literally click sign up and just sign up.
It takes 3 or 4 minutes. Go through the tutorial, get
(36:23):
started. I mean, it's crazy easy.
Like crazy. Crazy easy.
That's coming from a macam. Anyway, lovely look.
Thank you very much mate. It's.
Coming your Geordie. Accent.
No, I didn't even attempt it. I know you did.
I can do it. Yeah, but I I won't.
Macam. You told me not to do it.
You said it was offensive. It's not offensive.
It's just embarrassing. Not very good.
(36:44):
Which is offensive. Anyway, he's come all the way
down. Where are you heading Back to
today? Coming to Newcastle tonight.
Yeah, Castle tonight and then. Sorry, very bad.
I mean, I'm a Scouser, but I've lost it.
I think you have lost it. Is there any time?
I don't think there is. Any no, no, I think there might
be a little bit. I think because I've been in
Wales 15 years, right? That is South Wales has affected
(37:05):
me. If it's in North Wales, just be
talking through my nose. I've got I.
Think I think you've got a little bit of a Welsh, Welsh
trang as well, Like really, really slight.
My kids speak all speak Welsh. They're all really, they're all
Welsh school, yes, they're all. I've got a clue what they're
talking about, but I'm sure. That's quite dangerous, that
isn't it. Yeah, the less they talk to me,
the better, mate, to be honest, it's much easier.
But look, that was the second test podcast.
Everyone that was Marco. Check him out.
(37:26):
We are Mark is We are marker.com.
Dot co.uk. We are market.co.uk.
Get yourselves on the sustainability journey, people.
Stop messing about. This is a commercial tool as
well as doing the right thing. So yeah, reach out to Rob or our
food poisoned friend Kiara. Is it Kiara?
If I get that right, yeah. I'll change, I'll change her
listing on our website to the food poisoned friend.
(37:48):
Be in line with it. Yeah, yeah.
So I'm sure it should be better by the time we all listen to
this. Let's hope so.
But that's it. Thank you very much, my friend.
Have a safe journey home. Say bye.
Bye. Bye everyone.
There you go.
Popular Podcasts
Stuff You Should Know
If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.
Dateline NBC
Current and classic episodes, featuring compelling true-crime mysteries, powerful documentaries and in-depth investigations. Follow now to get the latest episodes of Dateline NBC completely free, or subscribe to Dateline Premium for ad-free listening and exclusive bonus content: DatelinePremium.com
New Heights with Jason & Travis Kelce
Football’s funniest family duo — Jason Kelce of the Philadelphia Eagles and Travis Kelce of the Kansas City Chiefs — team up to provide next-level access to life in the league as it unfolds. The two brothers and Super Bowl champions drop weekly insights about the weekly slate of games and share their INSIDE perspectives on trending NFL news and sports headlines. They also endlessly rag on each other as brothers do, chat the latest in pop culture and welcome some very popular and well-known friends to chat with them. Check out new episodes every Wednesday. Follow New Heights on the Wondery App, YouTube or wherever you get your podcasts. You can listen to new episodes early and ad-free, and get exclusive content on Wondery+. Join Wondery+ in the Wondery App, Apple Podcasts or Spotify. And join our new membership for a unique fan experience by going to the New Heights YouTube channel now!