October 15, 2025 • 16 mins
In this episode of the 4PM Podcast, host Mounir Ajam explores the evolving role of the Chief Project Officer (CPO) and why organizations should consider adding this position to the C-suite. Drawing from insights in his upcoming book Successful Transformation, Mounir unpacks the responsibilities of a CPO, how this role aligns strategy with execution, and why it is still rare in today’s corporate world.
You’ll learn:
- The criteria for when an organization needs a CPO.
- The key responsibilities and impact of the role.
- Why the CPO is different from (yet complementary to) the COO, CSO, or CDO.
- The challenges and misconceptions organizations face about project leadership.
If your organization delivers value through projects, this episode will help you understand how a CPO can transform governance, alignment, and long-term success.
Explore more project management insights at www.urukpm.com
Connect with Uruk Project Management:
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#UrukPM #ProjectManagement #Podcast
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:02):
Welcome to the 4 pm podcast, where ideas take shape
and strategies find purpose.
I am Mounir Ajam, founder andCEO of Rook Project Management,
and I have a deep-seated passionfor project management and
community development, growingon decades of global experience
(00:24):
across diverse industries androles.
I am here to guide you throughthe transformative power of the
4PMs project program, productand portfolio management, and
our focus on business-integratedproject management.
Let's explore how integrationunlocks unparalleled value for
you and your organization.
Good day, welcome back to the4PM Podcast.
(00:59):
I am Munir Ajam, your host, andI'm delighted you're here with
me today.
In this episode, we'll diveinto an important leadership
role in organization the ChiefProject Officer, cpo.
This topic is also a chapter inour upcoming book, successful
Transformation.
To set the stage, I'd like toshare a quote from Tom Peters An
organization is people leadersserving people, frontline team
(01:24):
serving people, customers,communities.
In today's conversation, we'llunpack what the CPO role is all
about, why organizations shouldconsider it and how it can
transform the way value isdelivered.
Introduction I start thisepisode with a reminder
(02:07):
Everything I propose here or inmy upcoming book, successful
Transformation, must besubjected to the organizational
culture and context.
The ideas and the possibilitiesof implementing them depend on
the organization's projectmanagement maturity, along with
its size and the level of itsproject expenditures.
Accordingly, some parts of thistransformation initiative can
be readily accepted, whileothers might need time and
higher maturity to implement.
Even if the organization is notready to establish a project
(02:30):
management division, pmd, itshould consider the chief
project officer CPO role.
Alternative titles includechief project management officer
or vice president projectmanagement.
Let us use CPO.
The role of the CPO isunfamiliar and is a new concept.
(02:51):
In this episode, I will addressthe following point do
organizations need a CPO?
What is the role of the CPO?
What is the current state ofpractice?
Question and concern Part onedo organizations need a CPO?
(03:14):
Our view, a related question iswhat criteria would be used to
decide if the organization canbenefit from this role.
There are many factors toconsider.
However, I use the followingguidelines to answer this
question.
If the organization is largeenough to have divisions and
(03:37):
chiefs for HR, it, finance, etc.
And the various divisions doprojects regularly and the
organization delivers valuethrough projects, then a project
management division or at leasta PMO and a CPO would benefit
the organization.
Another related question shouldwe use quantitative criteria to
(04:02):
decide?
For example, should we use thenumber of projects and their
value, complexity and importance?
An organization can try usingquantitative criteria.
However, we still do not haveenough data or case studies to
guide us on quantitativecriteria.
Therefore, I prefer a differentapproach.
(04:23):
If the organizationconsistently delivers success
without a PMD or or PMOS, thenwe all know the definition of
insanity.
In that case, the organizationmust shift paradigms.
(04:54):
Association for projectmanagement View.
The association for projectmanagement, apm, held a
roundtable discussion on theneed for a chief project officer
CPO role in the C-suite and itsbenefits to project delivery
across industry sectors.
The roundtable included projectand business experts, such as
(05:18):
Professor Adam Boddison, chiefexecutive at APM, and other
business and project managementleaders.
Apm documented the discussion'sresult via a white paper, which
explored why businesses appointa CPO to their executive board
and the problem it will solve,such as managing risk and
(05:40):
governanceance.
Association for ProjectManagement 2022.
I reference this paper,including a link in the
bibliography of my book, andpart two the role of the CPO.
(06:03):
So what is the role of CPO?
Reinhard Wenger of theInternational Project Management
Association published anarticle about this in 2017.
Since we share similar views,here is a summary of that
article Wagner 2017.
Wagner 2017.
(06:31):
The chief project officer CPOrole is crucial for
project-oriented orproject-based organizations that
deliver value through project.
It focuses on aligning projectmanagement with the overall
strategy and improvingperformance.
Role and responsibilities theCPO is responsible for
establishing governance system,directing project activities,
(06:53):
leading project managers andsupporting other board members
in project-related tasks.
Governance and strategyAlignment the CPO develops a
project management strategy thataligns with the organization's
overall strategy and integratesgovernance across projects,
(07:13):
programs and portfolios.
Directing project activitiesthe CPO initiates, selects and
prioritizes projects, ensuresalignment with strategy and
conducts performance reviewsbased on KPIS leadership and
organizational support.
The CPO leads project managers,supports other board members
(07:37):
and project sponsorship, andparticipates in strategic change
activities requiring competencein transformation and change.
We must stress that the aboveare the areas led by the CPO,
conducted with the support ofthe project management division
and in collaboration with otherexecutives and divisions.
(07:59):
Further, the CPO is the projectmanagement function and
division leader.
Accordingly, the role of theCPO and the mandate of the PMD
must be aligned.
Part 3.
(08:20):
The current state.
The current state.
In response to a point on theLinkedIn thread, I wanted to
find the percentage oforganization with a CPO or
equivalent title.
So I did unscientific research,but it is still a valuable
indicator and used LinkedInsales navigator, I found the
following.
(08:40):
The search was worldwide.
I found about 1.5 KCPOs, 120KCMOs, 320 KCTOs, 490 KCFOs and
500 KCOOs.
The CEO's numbers were in themillions.
They would not be valuable forcomparison since many small
(09:03):
companies could use the CEOtitle even if they do not have
the other officer.
However, comparing the numberof CPOs versus COOs, the result
is 0.3%.
That is all.
These results clearly show thatthis role is still rare.
However, we are not surprised.
(09:24):
The premise for this series ofbooks and what we covered in
them is that project managementis still not formally accepted
and recognized as a coreorganizational function.
Organizations will not see aneed for a CPO if they do not
acknowledge project managementas a core function.
(09:44):
Part four questions andconcerns.
The following are questions andconcerns specific to this role.
Does the CPO role not lead tooverlaps in the C-suite?
At the C-suite, would the chiefproject officer CPO not overlap
with the chief strategy officerCSO, the chief operating
(10:07):
officer COO or other executives?
Is it not possible to duplicateeffort?
This should not be the case.
With proper planning andgovernance when establishing the
project management division,management can ensure adequate
delineation of responsibilities.
For example, when formulatingthe strategy, the CSO would lead
(10:32):
the effort supported by the CPOand the other executives.
Once approved, the CPOtranslates the formulated
strategy for execution throughprojects and programs in
collaboration with the otherexecutives.
Further, the CPO has insightinto capacity, competencies,
(10:53):
feasibility, etc.
To help refine the strategywith the CSO.
Therefore, this would be apartnership.
This would be a partnership.
This concept is like the CFO'sresponsibility for the
organization's finances, incollaboration with the other
executives.
The same is true for the otherfunctions and executives.
(11:17):
How about delegating the role ofthe CPO?
The chief project officer roleis essential, yet it is still
not recognized enough.
As a result, delegating thisrole to existing C-suite
individuals as champions is afrequent practice.
The challenge is that theseother C-suite executives might
(11:40):
not have enough projectmanagement expertise.
As a result, they might hireconsultants or a PMO director.
They might lack a fundamentalunderstanding of a proper CPO
role and objective.
This practice is like themindset that anyone can run a
project to.
Therefore, any executive cansponsor the project management
(12:04):
function.
Project management function theCPO must be a dedicated role
equal to other C-suite roles andmust lead the project
management division and function.
Is the role of a CPO not thesame as that of a COO.
Some practitioners have alsosuggested that the CPO role is
(12:24):
the same as the chief operatingofficer, coo.
In some contexts this might betrue.
However, in most cases thereare two distinct roles, each
with a mandate.
Then there must be someoverlaps.
I answered this point inresponse to the earlier question
.
Is the role of a CPO not thesame as that of a CDO?
(12:48):
Some organizations medical,hospitality, etc.
Might have facilities divisions.
Therefore, they might have achief development officer role.
Real estate developmentcompanies might have a similar
role.
Is this not the same thing asbeing a CPO?
Not really.
(13:08):
A CDO focuses on facilitiesprojects, expansion, acquisition
, maintenance, etc.
However, the role of a CPO isbroader and covers all aspects
of project management in theorganization, including project
and marketing, hr, it andfinance.
Therefore, if a CDO role exists, it could become a director
(13:33):
level instead of a chief officer.
However, in some contexts,having both roles, working as
partners, is possible.
Would you equate a CPO with thehead of an EPMO who report
directly to the CEO?
This question came from anonline colleague, kyron D
Bondale III.
(13:53):
It is possible if an EPMOEnterprise Project Management
Office is the only thing thatexists.
However, I see the CPO as thehead of the PM function, which
has a broader role than the EPMOdirector.
(14:16):
It is essential to reflect onthe transformative journey we
have proposed.
The insights and strategiesdiscussed here are not
theoretical concepts.
They are practical toolsdesigned to drive real change
within your organization.
Embracing these principles willenable you to build a
(14:37):
sustainable and effectiveproject management function,
ensuring that your organizationis well equipped to navigate
complexities.
Remember, transformation is nota one-time event, but an
ongoing process that requirescommitment, adaptability and
continuous improvement.
(14:58):
By fostering a culture ofchange and leveraging the power
of project and programmanagement, you can achieve
remarkable outcomes and deliverexceptional value to your
stakeholders.
Accordingly, organizationsdelivering value through project
must start the transformationjourney with a respected project
(15:21):
management leader as a chiefproject officer.
As a chief project officer, ifthis episode resonated with you,
I encourage you to subscribe,share it with your teams and
explore more at urukpmcom.
You can also connect with medirectly on LinkedIn.
(15:44):
This is Munir Ajam for the 4PMPodcast.
Until next time, keep learning,keep leading and always deliver
with purpose.
Welcome to the 4 pm podcast, where ideas take shape
and strategies find purpose.
I am Mounir Ajam, founder andCEO of Rook Project Management,
and I have a deep-seated passionfor project management and
community development, growingon decades of global experience
(00:24):
across diverse industries androles.
I am here to guide you throughthe transformative power of the
4PMs project program, productand portfolio management, and
our focus on business-integratedproject management.
Let's explore how integrationunlocks unparalleled value for
you and your organization.
Good day, welcome back to the4PM Podcast.
(00:59):
I am Munir Ajam, your host, andI'm delighted you're here with
me today.
In this episode, we'll diveinto an important leadership
role in organization the ChiefProject Officer, cpo.
This topic is also a chapter inour upcoming book, successful
Transformation.
To set the stage, I'd like toshare a quote from Tom Peters An
organization is people leadersserving people, frontline team
(01:24):
serving people, customers,communities.
In today's conversation, we'llunpack what the CPO role is all
about, why organizations shouldconsider it and how it can
transform the way value isdelivered.
Introduction I start thisepisode with a reminder
(02:07):
Everything I propose here or inmy upcoming book, successful
Transformation, must besubjected to the organizational
culture and context.
The ideas and the possibilitiesof implementing them depend on
the organization's projectmanagement maturity, along with
its size and the level of itsproject expenditures.
Accordingly, some parts of thistransformation initiative can
be readily accepted, whileothers might need time and
higher maturity to implement.
Even if the organization is notready to establish a project
(02:30):
management division, pmd, itshould consider the chief
project officer CPO role.
Alternative titles includechief project management officer
or vice president projectmanagement.
Let us use CPO.
The role of the CPO isunfamiliar and is a new concept.
(02:51):
In this episode, I will addressthe following point do
organizations need a CPO?
What is the role of the CPO?
What is the current state ofpractice?
Question and concern Part onedo organizations need a CPO?
(03:14):
Our view, a related question iswhat criteria would be used to
decide if the organization canbenefit from this role.
There are many factors toconsider.
However, I use the followingguidelines to answer this
question.
If the organization is largeenough to have divisions and
(03:37):
chiefs for HR, it, finance, etc.
And the various divisions doprojects regularly and the
organization delivers valuethrough projects, then a project
management division or at leasta PMO and a CPO would benefit
the organization.
Another related question shouldwe use quantitative criteria to
(04:02):
decide?
For example, should we use thenumber of projects and their
value, complexity and importance?
An organization can try usingquantitative criteria.
However, we still do not haveenough data or case studies to
guide us on quantitativecriteria.
Therefore, I prefer a differentapproach.
(04:23):
If the organizationconsistently delivers success
without a PMD or or PMOS, thenwe all know the definition of
insanity.
In that case, the organizationmust shift paradigms.
(04:54):
Association for projectmanagement View.
The association for projectmanagement, apm, held a
roundtable discussion on theneed for a chief project officer
CPO role in the C-suite and itsbenefits to project delivery
across industry sectors.
The roundtable included projectand business experts, such as
(05:18):
Professor Adam Boddison, chiefexecutive at APM, and other
business and project managementleaders.
Apm documented the discussion'sresult via a white paper, which
explored why businesses appointa CPO to their executive board
and the problem it will solve,such as managing risk and
(05:40):
governanceance.
Association for ProjectManagement 2022.
I reference this paper,including a link in the
bibliography of my book, andpart two the role of the CPO.
(06:03):
So what is the role of CPO?
Reinhard Wenger of theInternational Project Management
Association published anarticle about this in 2017.
Since we share similar views,here is a summary of that
article Wagner 2017.
Wagner 2017.
(06:31):
The chief project officer CPOrole is crucial for
project-oriented orproject-based organizations that
deliver value through project.
It focuses on aligning projectmanagement with the overall
strategy and improvingperformance.
Role and responsibilities theCPO is responsible for
establishing governance system,directing project activities,
(06:53):
leading project managers andsupporting other board members
in project-related tasks.
Governance and strategyAlignment the CPO develops a
project management strategy thataligns with the organization's
overall strategy and integratesgovernance across projects,
(07:13):
programs and portfolios.
Directing project activitiesthe CPO initiates, selects and
prioritizes projects, ensuresalignment with strategy and
conducts performance reviewsbased on KPIS leadership and
organizational support.
The CPO leads project managers,supports other board members
(07:37):
and project sponsorship, andparticipates in strategic change
activities requiring competencein transformation and change.
We must stress that the aboveare the areas led by the CPO,
conducted with the support ofthe project management division
and in collaboration with otherexecutives and divisions.
(07:59):
Further, the CPO is the projectmanagement function and
division leader.
Accordingly, the role of theCPO and the mandate of the PMD
must be aligned.
Part 3.
(08:20):
The current state.
The current state.
In response to a point on theLinkedIn thread, I wanted to
find the percentage oforganization with a CPO or
equivalent title.
So I did unscientific research,but it is still a valuable
indicator and used LinkedInsales navigator, I found the
following.
(08:40):
The search was worldwide.
I found about 1.5 KCPOs, 120KCMOs, 320 KCTOs, 490 KCFOs and
500 KCOOs.
The CEO's numbers were in themillions.
They would not be valuable forcomparison since many small
(09:03):
companies could use the CEOtitle even if they do not have
the other officer.
However, comparing the numberof CPOs versus COOs, the result
is 0.3%.
That is all.
These results clearly show thatthis role is still rare.
However, we are not surprised.
(09:24):
The premise for this series ofbooks and what we covered in
them is that project managementis still not formally accepted
and recognized as a coreorganizational function.
Organizations will not see aneed for a CPO if they do not
acknowledge project managementas a core function.
(09:44):
Part four questions andconcerns.
The following are questions andconcerns specific to this role.
Does the CPO role not lead tooverlaps in the C-suite?
At the C-suite, would the chiefproject officer CPO not overlap
with the chief strategy officerCSO, the chief operating
(10:07):
officer COO or other executives?
Is it not possible to duplicateeffort?
This should not be the case.
With proper planning andgovernance when establishing the
project management division,management can ensure adequate
delineation of responsibilities.
For example, when formulatingthe strategy, the CSO would lead
(10:32):
the effort supported by the CPOand the other executives.
Once approved, the CPOtranslates the formulated
strategy for execution throughprojects and programs in
collaboration with the otherexecutives.
Further, the CPO has insightinto capacity, competencies,
(10:53):
feasibility, etc.
To help refine the strategywith the CSO.
Therefore, this would be apartnership.
This would be a partnership.
This concept is like the CFO'sresponsibility for the
organization's finances, incollaboration with the other
executives.
The same is true for the otherfunctions and executives.
(11:17):
How about delegating the role ofthe CPO?
The chief project officer roleis essential, yet it is still
not recognized enough.
As a result, delegating thisrole to existing C-suite
individuals as champions is afrequent practice.
The challenge is that theseother C-suite executives might
(11:40):
not have enough projectmanagement expertise.
As a result, they might hireconsultants or a PMO director.
They might lack a fundamentalunderstanding of a proper CPO
role and objective.
This practice is like themindset that anyone can run a
project to.
Therefore, any executive cansponsor the project management
(12:04):
function.
Project management function theCPO must be a dedicated role
equal to other C-suite roles andmust lead the project
management division and function.
Is the role of a CPO not thesame as that of a COO.
Some practitioners have alsosuggested that the CPO role is
(12:24):
the same as the chief operatingofficer, coo.
In some contexts this might betrue.
However, in most cases thereare two distinct roles, each
with a mandate.
Then there must be someoverlaps.
I answered this point inresponse to the earlier question
.
Is the role of a CPO not thesame as that of a CDO?
(12:48):
Some organizations medical,hospitality, etc.
Might have facilities divisions.
Therefore, they might have achief development officer role.
Real estate developmentcompanies might have a similar
role.
Is this not the same thing asbeing a CPO?
Not really.
(13:08):
A CDO focuses on facilitiesprojects, expansion, acquisition
, maintenance, etc.
However, the role of a CPO isbroader and covers all aspects
of project management in theorganization, including project
and marketing, hr, it andfinance.
Therefore, if a CDO role exists, it could become a director
(13:33):
level instead of a chief officer.
However, in some contexts,having both roles, working as
partners, is possible.
Would you equate a CPO with thehead of an EPMO who report
directly to the CEO?
This question came from anonline colleague, kyron D
Bondale III.
(13:53):
It is possible if an EPMOEnterprise Project Management
Office is the only thing thatexists.
However, I see the CPO as thehead of the PM function, which
has a broader role than the EPMOdirector.
(14:16):
It is essential to reflect onthe transformative journey we
have proposed.
The insights and strategiesdiscussed here are not
theoretical concepts.
They are practical toolsdesigned to drive real change
within your organization.
Embracing these principles willenable you to build a
(14:37):
sustainable and effectiveproject management function,
ensuring that your organizationis well equipped to navigate
complexities.
Remember, transformation is nota one-time event, but an
ongoing process that requirescommitment, adaptability and
continuous improvement.
(14:58):
By fostering a culture ofchange and leveraging the power
of project and programmanagement, you can achieve
remarkable outcomes and deliverexceptional value to your
stakeholders.
Accordingly, organizationsdelivering value through project
must start the transformationjourney with a respected project
(15:21):
management leader as a chiefproject officer.
As a chief project officer, ifthis episode resonated with you,
I encourage you to subscribe,share it with your teams and
explore more at urukpmcom.
You can also connect with medirectly on LinkedIn.
(15:44):
This is Munir Ajam for the 4PMPodcast.
Until next time, keep learning,keep leading and always deliver
with purpose.
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