November 21, 2023 • 19 mins
Matt Williamson and Tom Opferman break down the Bengals and Steelers matchup this coming Sunday
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
We got some work to do.
Speaker 2 (00:01):
This is the Advanced Scout with Tom Opperman and Mack
Williamsit Steelers taking on the Bengals for the first time
in the twenty twenty three season in Cincinnati this coming Sunday.
But before we get to the Bengals, Matt, the big
news today, as we're recording on a Tuesday, is the
dismissal of Matt Canada as the Steelers offensive coordinator, something
that you and I have never seen in our lifetime
(00:22):
because it ain't happened since nineteen forty one when they
fired a coach or coordinator in the middle of a season.
So it's fair to say everybody is kind of shocked
by this move that it was made, but not shocked
that the move had to be made.
Speaker 3 (00:35):
No, and.
Speaker 1 (00:37):
A lot to unpeel here, And to be honest, it's
not as interesting of a conversation as people want it
to be in that from where I sit in terms
of analyzing it, because I don't think any of us
know what the ramifications are going to be. Is the
offense going to look totally different than it did before?
I can tell you the answers, No, Yeah, how much different?
Speaker 3 (00:57):
Can it look?
Speaker 1 (00:57):
Right? I mean, they're not going to go back to
day one a mini camp and reinstall everything Wednesday and
Thursday this week, and you know, in a totally different
verbiage and all that. Sure there'll be different plays sequencing,
maybe there's more play action, you know, things of that nature.
But I don't think it's going to be drastically different.
But I also think it had to be done. You
know that. I think that you can't. It's it sends
(01:20):
the wrong message if you say we can tolerate how
the offense has looked really just the passing game though.
I mean, it's the passing game that's broke.
Speaker 3 (01:27):
I don't want to.
Speaker 2 (01:28):
You know, some people have said, oh, they did this
because they were starting to lose the locker room. I
don't buy that at all either, But I will say,
if you allow that to continue like this, that is
how you do end up losing locker rooms. These players
are smart. They know what gets the job done and
what doesn't. They could smell that something wasn't going right.
Speaker 1 (01:43):
Now right, and the fact I think that your point
that so many players chirped up and this past week
in intolerab something like going on that maybe ownership and
the head coach said, well, I don't want to do
this to get out of hand. Let's let's move on.
Speaker 3 (01:59):
Eddie Faulkner will take over as OC.
Speaker 2 (02:01):
Mike Sullivan takes over the play calling duties for the
first time in Cincinnati on Sunday. Bengals two game losing
streak out for they lost to the Ravens on Thursday night.
They're three and two at home this year, and all
five of the Bengals losses this season have been against
AFC opponents. They're zero to three in the division and
have a minus twenty four point differential. This is such
a weird advanced scout for us to do, though, Matt.
Speaker 3 (02:22):
Because really everything you talk.
Speaker 2 (02:24):
About with the Bengals has to be taken with a
grain of salt because of Joe Burrow being out.
Speaker 1 (02:28):
Yeah, I mean all their offensive stuff, who knows. I mean,
it's even more difficult than the press, you know. I mean,
the Browns had a new quarterback too, but he still
had a better idea of how they would play football
and that type of thing. So we'll do it, do
our best. But you don't know exactly what you're gonna see.
But I know I'd rather not see Burrow.
Speaker 2 (02:48):
I amen to that. I'm not trying to say that
Watson and Burrow are comparable right now, but the Browns
are much more insulated to handle losing their starting quarterback.
The Bengals are all about Joe braw all.
Speaker 1 (02:58):
About Joe Burrow. Yes, and I think he's the face
of the franchise, all those things I mean. And you
could even see when he was injured last week, the
whole demeanor of the team.
Speaker 3 (03:08):
Show the shoulders, yeah right down, yeah.
Speaker 1 (03:11):
And everybody was dragging and you understand why these are
human beings. But the Bengals, I think their season is shot.
Speaker 2 (03:18):
Yeah, just probably just a weird lost season in the
midst of a run of Super Bowl window that they'll
have as long as Burrow return Southy. Every team remaining
on the Bengals schedule is currently at five hundred or better.
So great time for you to lose your franchise quarterback.
Speaker 1 (03:30):
Yah, it's gonna be tough.
Speaker 3 (03:31):
It's gonna be tough for the season.
Speaker 2 (03:34):
Serious history between these two teams. It began in nineteen
seventy and Pittsburgh leads all time sixty eight to thirty nine.
Two of those games occurred in the postseason twenty six
and twenty sixteen. The Steelers won both of those matchups.
Cincinnati has won four of the last five meetings, including
most recently Week eleven of last year. Before that, Pittsburgh
was on a eleven game winning streak in this rivalry.
(03:54):
Cincinnati has won just thirteen of the forty eight games
between these division ribbles that have been played in the
two thousand and Mike Tomlin is twenty four and eleven
against Cincinnati, including one playoff win in twenty sixteen. Dating
back to twenty fourteen, the Steelers are eight and two
in Cincinnati. Love firing up the escaloser, but those two
losses have come in the last three games, including the
(04:14):
most recent meeting in the Cincinnati.
Speaker 1 (04:16):
Last Yeah, and so Steelers have been the better organization,
the better franchise for you know, the start to finish
of this run story. But the Bengals are I almost
said it a high point. Big picture, the Borough euro
is one of the best, the best they've been without question.
Speaker 2 (04:33):
Let's start by looking at the Bengals defense and in
turn some of the Steelers offense that has a bit
of a new look to it this week. Total defense
their thirtieth in the NFL, they allowed three hundred and
eighty six yards per game six point one yards per
play allowed is better than only the Denver Broncos. The
Bengals defense has gave up six point eight yards per
play last week against Cincinnati, and they've been dead last
(04:55):
in the league in the past three games, given up
six point one yards per play for twenty seventh in
past defense. They're thirty first against the run, only better
than again the Denver Broncos in that category, giving up
one hundred and thirty eight yards per game, twenty first
in points per game at twenty two point six allowed.
They do have eighteen takeaways, though, and their twelve interceptions
are second most in the NFL. Two point six sacks
per game also puts them at seventeenth in the league.
(05:17):
It's a very unimpressive defense except for that takeaway factor.
Speaker 1 (05:21):
Yeah, and what's funny is their turnover ratio is almost
identical to the Steelers. I mean from offense, defense, fumble recoveries,
you know, interceptions thrown. It's almost dead even so we'll
recordings on Tuesday as usual, but I feel like I'm
very behind on why is the Bengals defense such a disaster.
Speaker 3 (05:43):
That's so bad.
Speaker 1 (05:44):
Yeah, I mean it's not like, oh, here's five really
bad injuries or I think their defensive coordinators one of
the best in the league. And sure they haven't been helped,
especially early in the season with the offense complementing them,
but they shouldn't be at the bottom of the league.
I mean, total opposite of what they played last week
in Cleveland.
Speaker 2 (06:03):
I mean they didn't have much changeover except for in
the secondary these Jesse Bates and Von Bell. But Matt
We're gonna get to him. Sink tax Hill has been
a revelation. He's been great. Yeah, there's a great replacement there.
And I mean, you can tell me more if I'm
wrong here, but I don't think Nick Scott's been terrible
the free agency to fill and it's not like he's
their their big black hole back there. So those two
guys leave and they've replaced them pretty well. You really
(06:24):
can't find a reason why they're struggling so much.
Speaker 1 (06:26):
No, on paper, it's it's hard and frankly, to be honest,
when I get home tonight, that's what I'm gonna spend
much of the night.
Speaker 3 (06:32):
Why do the Bengals stink at these Yeah.
Speaker 1 (06:34):
Why is this defense not adding up for personnel and
coaching versus the numbers? I mean, what am I missing here?
Speaker 2 (06:41):
And they got names too. I mean I don't think
that any of these guys are superstars. But I mean
Trey Hendrickson's known around the league. He's got nine and
a half sacks. He's a guy that's just taken off
ever since signing with the Bengals from New Orleans. No
one else on the roster has more than four sacks.
Sam Hubbard's four sacks, though, did come with him missing
two games, and Hubbard's really the second fiddle to Trey Henderson.
He's dinged up though, not sure if you'll see him
(07:03):
on the game Sunday. But guys like DJ Reader and
BJ Hill in the middle too, they're solid. That front
four is really strong for Cincinnati.
Speaker 1 (07:11):
They're big and physical, and their linebackers are good players
as well off the ball. I mean, they're not devoid
in the secondary like they're the guy. The twelve or
thirteen guys that play consistently are good football players, and
they're well coached, and they've used first round picks the
last couple of years on defense as well, So it's
not quite adding up to me.
Speaker 2 (07:33):
You mentioned Logan Wilson, or excuse me, you mentioned their
linebackers off ball. Logan Wilson is the one that really
jumps out to me. That dude's an animal. He's all
over the place. He stuffs the statue. He's got interceptions,
he's got sacks, he's got tackles for loss. He's good
in coverage, he's good in run support. And he's a
nasty linebacker too.
Speaker 1 (07:49):
He is border.
Speaker 2 (07:50):
I mean people who talk about the hip drop tackle
and stuff like that. He was throwing those around a
little bit on Thursday night against the Ravens. People speculating
maybe that's why Andrews is out for the year now.
Speaker 3 (07:58):
Right, But hey, it's not.
Speaker 2 (08:00):
They're legal exactly, and it's his job to do that
to these superstars on the other side of the ball,
and he ain't afraid to do that. He's a linebacker
that I honestly personally really love watching play.
Speaker 3 (08:09):
Yeah, he's great and underrated, to be honest.
Speaker 1 (08:11):
Absolutely. There was years there that they were looking for
the face of the defense, and I think they found
it with this guy. And Pratt's a really nice compliment
to him as well. Yea. They both cover a lot
of ground. One of the better linebacker duo is in
the league, and I don't think their thought of that
way enough.
Speaker 2 (08:25):
We mentioned the takeaways, the twelve interceptions that the Bengals have.
Logan Wilson has a couple of those, Cameron Taylor britt
leads the way with four and four Bengals have two
or more picks on the season. Those two, Jermaine Pratt
has a couple of picks, and Dax Hill has a
couple picks as well. And we talked about Dax Hill
first round pick in twenty twenty two.
Speaker 3 (08:44):
They had Jesse Bates and Von Bell, but the writing
was on the wall.
Speaker 2 (08:46):
Then you're going to have to shed some of this
cap defensively if you want to sign some of these
offensive players. That's exactly what happened. Those safeties were the
first casualties. But you got a guy in Dax Hill
that you've just thushered in now and I don't think
you've missed a beat.
Speaker 1 (09:00):
They planned well for this. I adored him coming out
of Michigan. He can play the slot, he's a great tester,
he's long. I think he's got a chance to be
a real star and this has been the first year
that he's taken over and second season. I mean, but
he's he's a really good player.
Speaker 2 (09:15):
Now before we get to the Bengals offense, there was
a disaster stat in your stat pick pack that I
had to I said, pick because it's a Picket stat.
Speaker 1 (09:22):
There's some nice ones in there.
Speaker 3 (09:24):
This was the worst one, actually of all time. Try
to think of it.
Speaker 2 (09:28):
Yes, picking now is the lowest touchdown rate in league history.
In all the quarterbacks that have attempted at least five
hundred passes, Picket is the only one with a touchdown
rate under two percent. His sits at one point nine
four percent. That is putting numbers to the claim that he.
Speaker 3 (09:44):
Might be one of the worst quarterbacks you've ever seen play.
Speaker 1 (09:46):
I mean in terms of throwing touchdowns.
Speaker 3 (09:48):
He's last a pretty important part of the job of
the Yeah, that's.
Speaker 1 (09:51):
A big deal here, And I'm not going to blame
Mac Canada a hundred percent for that either, you know,
I mean, I don't know that all of a sudden
things are just going to be way way better. One
thing about the Canada thing that want meant to mention
open to open the show, though, is far and away.
The Steelers have faced the hardest slate of defenses of
all thirty two teams to PA. Yeah. I mean they
(10:13):
wrote a DVA article about it today about since they've
been charting DVA since nineteen eighty, this has been the
hardest slate of defenses that any team has faced. It's
the third hardest, you know, since through ten games or what. Wow.
So I'm hoping, but frankly, it gets much easier for
(10:33):
this point.
Speaker 2 (10:34):
I was just going to say, can we have a
little fools gold scenario here where we're like, oh, we've
made the change at the coordinator position, and look what happened.
Speaker 3 (10:40):
But it's really the Bengals, the Cardinals, and the Patriots exactly.
Speaker 1 (10:43):
See. I think that I hope that there's not a misconception.
And I'm not defending the.
Speaker 3 (10:47):
No, no, no, Candid did a great job. He's just bad luck.
He got to score on those defenses too.
Speaker 1 (10:52):
They played Cleveland twice, they played the Niners, and they
played the Ravens. I mean they're the top four. I
mean that's four of your ten games right there. So
it's it was going to get better no matter what, folks,
is my point. So if it didn't then, Wow, that
would have been massive problem.
Speaker 2 (11:07):
Things can only get worse for the Bengals offensively with
the injury to Joe Burrow. They came into this week
averaging four point eight yards per play. That's better than
only six offenses. They were struggling at the beginning of
the year though, so these numbers are skewed even in
that it's.
Speaker 1 (11:20):
Really hard to evaluate their offense.
Speaker 2 (11:22):
Yeah, the twenty fourth and total offense two hundred ninety
eight yards per game, eighteenth and passing offense at two seventeen.
They don't run the ball at all, thirtieth and rushing
eighty yards per game their twentieth and scoring at twenty
points per game. They had eight giveaways, which is tied
with Pittsforck for the fewest.
Speaker 3 (11:35):
So they protect the ball.
Speaker 2 (11:37):
Two point seven sacks allowed per game is twenty second
in the NFL. So trouble protecting Burrow and now Browning
moving forward. Yeah, it's so weird to like go by
the numbers because they started so slow, then.
Speaker 3 (11:50):
They had this middle of the hal then they had
this middle of the season.
Speaker 2 (11:52):
Stretch where they looked like the Bengals again, and now
he's hurt and it's all gone poof.
Speaker 3 (11:57):
Kind of a very hard team to judge now moving forward.
Speaker 1 (12:00):
I don't know what's going on with Higgins's injury for
this game too.
Speaker 3 (12:02):
It's questionable.
Speaker 1 (12:03):
Yeah, I mean he's very important, of course. I think
Mixing's on the back nine of his career. They've invested
a lot in the offensive line, and I don't think
it's fixed, but it's below average, not terrible. But I
don't really know how to evaluate their offense. I mean,
Jamar Chase is a superstar. I mean he could run
free and any quarterback could hit him wide open. But
(12:25):
they're not going to be close to the team that
you're used to seeing now.
Speaker 2 (12:28):
Only Washington is throwing a ball at a higher percentage
of the time than the Bengals.
Speaker 3 (12:31):
Makes sense that changes.
Speaker 2 (12:33):
I was just going to ask you, Yeah, I think
they try. They don't run the ball though, like they
can't run the ball with Mixing this year. Do they
try to just go ultra conservative kind of look like
the Cleveland Browns did against the Steelers with Jake Browning,
Or do you just say we're not developing Brownie for
the future, we don't need a high draft pick. Really,
just let the kid drive the Ferrari and if he
crashes it into the wall, who cares? Next year we
(12:54):
just start all over with Burrow again.
Speaker 1 (12:55):
Probably it's probably more of the latter, and he probably
does crashed the Ferrari.
Speaker 3 (13:01):
He's gonna crash it.
Speaker 1 (13:02):
Yeah, he's gonna crash the Ferrari. And your point to
start the podcast was great that the Browns, whether Watson's
better than Borrow or not, and Burrow is the better, yes,
are way better insulated to handle this because their old
line's going to run the football. They're built to run
the football, and they have a great defense. We just
talked about the Bengals d not being able to carry
their weight there.
Speaker 2 (13:22):
Drake Browning completed eight to fourteen passes for sixty eight
yards and a touchdown when he replaced Joe Burrow last
week against the Baltimore Ravens. He had and he had
one other passing attempt in his NFL career. But like
the game, I don't want to say was out of
hand when Burrow got hurt, but it was basically over
from that. There's nothing Browning cold like. That's not terrible
(13:43):
for Browning to have to come in. He through a touchdown.
He completed some passes sixty eight yards, he ran for
I think.
Speaker 1 (13:48):
Forty more yards as we did.
Speaker 3 (13:50):
This is nothing he could do. The whole team was
just defeated at that point exactly. So again we'll see
if that they shed that before this week.
Speaker 1 (13:56):
Yeah, and hey, desperate team, desperate time, and they have
a whole week to prepare. And these are all proud
and very talented players that the Steelers are gonna line up,
and I'm sure they're not walking around the facility going, oh,
we're not evenna show up for this one and we
don't care. But yeah, I mean, like, I don't know
what their strategy can be.
Speaker 2 (14:13):
They win the game, they tie the Steelers record, and
they move up in the wild card standing like they're
not out of it yet. No, I can't imagine that
they're just gonna wave the white flag at least these
first couple games out of the gate without Burrow.
Speaker 1 (14:24):
And maybe they do crazy stuff and the Browns and
some of the two end to rounds and flee flickers
and reverses and fake punts and surprise on sides and
throw everything at the wall in a desperate fashion. Maybe
that's what you see. But they're in trouble.
Speaker 2 (14:38):
Chase leads the receiving core with eight hundred and thirty
three yards. He averages eighty three point three receiving yards
per game, boyd to second with four hundred and thirty nine,
a forty three point nine per game average, and Higgins
third at three hundred and twenty eight, only averaging forty
six point nine per game. For Higgins, his totally yards
is down because he's been dealing with injuries all year.
But even when he's been in there, it's the Higgins
(14:59):
and Burrow connection had to been working great this year.
Speaker 1 (15:01):
No, it hasn't, and he started with He's had two
injuries he's been playing through and Burrow wasn't great when
he was at his best and kind of a lost year.
As you mentioned, you know.
Speaker 3 (15:13):
They don't really have a tight end.
Speaker 2 (15:15):
No one on the roster has more than one hundred
and seventy five receiving yards this season. I mean they
obviously have tight ends. I should say they don't have
a pass catching threat at tight end. Four Bengals tight
ends have played between one hundred and fifteen and two
hundred and sixty six snaps this season, with t Higgins
in active. Last week, Trent Erwin slid in played fifty
eight of if possible, sixty one snaps against the Ravens.
And how oft this of the Bengals twenty three hundred
(15:36):
and seventy seven total receiving yards, just five hundred and
fifty five has come from the running back and tight
end positions.
Speaker 3 (15:42):
So they're not.
Speaker 2 (15:43):
Using and that's something that I think the past couple
of years the Bengals have had.
Speaker 3 (15:46):
You know, pieces there's an Okay receiver.
Speaker 2 (15:49):
And Ryan too, so who's not there anymore. I just
remember he would do a lot out of the backfield
in the passing game. Is a good safety valve for Burrow. So,
like you said, tread On Mixon's tire might be gone
and Travion Williams just they don't really use them at all.
Speaker 1 (16:02):
No, So obviously they're structured for Boyd Higgins and Chase
to get a lot of passes from tou Row. And
they're about the heaviest right at the top of the
league of eleven personnel teams in the league. You know,
they live in three receivers, one tight end in a
back do they try something totally different and start putting
more tight ends on the field, you know, I mean, yeah,
(16:25):
I don't know their formula.
Speaker 3 (16:28):
That's what I'm so interested in this because are now right?
Speaker 2 (16:30):
Is to see again, like we said, is he just
plug in Browning and let him go and see what
happens with the way we like to play or do
we adjust completely and you know, just dumb everything down.
Speaker 1 (16:39):
And I'm sure the Steelers defensive coaches are having the
same conversation, which.
Speaker 3 (16:43):
What are they gonna do?
Speaker 1 (16:43):
Yeah, makes them hard to prepare for. But of course
you'd much rather play Browning.
Speaker 2 (16:48):
I mean obviously, you know, Mixing does lead the way
with six hundred and five rushing yards on the ground.
Burrow's the second leading rusher with eighty eight yards. We
mentioned Travon Williams, who barely plays the fifty nine total
rushing yards this season. Mix And has found the end
zone in four straight games. He only scored a touchdown
just once in his first six games, so he's getting
hot as far as touchdowns are concerned. And they did
rush as a team for one hundred and thirty six
(17:08):
yards last week, and Browning did tap in forty yards
of his own. I think that's going to be a
weapon that he uses a lot too. It's just even
in the situations where he probably should stay in the
pocket and maybe a player will pop open downfield. I
bet he takes off in runs if his first riad
isn't there, probably, and how can you blame that?
Speaker 1 (17:26):
Yeah, exactly, And that's an efficient way to pick up five, six,
seven yards. You know, I'd like to see Kenny do
more of it, and he has. On a little bit
more related.
Speaker 2 (17:33):
The starting offensive line for the Bengals, we mentioned they
give about two point seven sacks per game and they
don't run the ball particularly well. Orlando Brown, Joan Williams,
Alex Kappa, Cordell Wohlson, and Ted Carris make up the
starting five and that unit has missed a total of
seventeen of a possible six hundred and forty snaps between
them all year, and those were all missed by Orlando Brown. So,
of anything, you can at least say they're consistent, and
(17:54):
like the Steelers, I was just gonna say that, it
reminds me of a little bit of that luck that
you got on.
Speaker 1 (18:01):
So, yeah, they've invested a lot neo line and they're
staying healthy, but it's not one of the best lines
in the League.
Speaker 2 (18:06):
Key matchups to keep an eye on before we wrap up,
the first one being Bengals wide receiver Jamar Chase for
Steelers cornerback Joey Porter Junior. I want to see this
one on one matchup. This is the best receiver and
no offense the DeAndre Hopkins currently. This is the best
receiver that JPJ is going to be going up against
this year. But I mean the wind is taken out
of the sales a little bit because of who's throwing
the football.
Speaker 1 (18:25):
For sure, and who's to say how the Steelers handle it.
I've been kind of thinking that if Higgins does play,
maybe Porter locks on Higgins and then you double Chase.
If Higgins doesn't play, would he follow Chase? I mean,
Chase is better than these other guys or.
Speaker 3 (18:42):
He saw a lot of following last week at Cooper.
Speaker 1 (18:44):
Correct Absolutely and he fared pretty well. But Cooper's a
challenge as well, so that's a tough one too.
Speaker 2 (18:51):
And Steelers left tackle Dan Moore on the offensive side
of things, He's got a tough matchup against Trey Hendrickson.
Henderson had a sack last week. His total was now
nine and a half on the year. He since joining
the Bengals from the Warrens and twenty twenty one has
thirty one and a half sacks in forty one games
with Cincinnati. He has been an incredible free agent signing.
Speaker 1 (19:09):
Absolutely. I mean he's a really good player. And I
thought Moore had a really tough week in Cleveland. I
mean a lot of it was Garrett, which is a
tough a challenge you're gonna get. But Hendrickson's a step
below that, but he's not too far.
Speaker 2 (19:23):
Steelers and Bengals in Cincinnati. Kickoff is at one PM
as the Steelers try to write the ship and get
to seven and four. For Matt Williamson on Tom Opperman,
Thanks has always forgiving us a listen, enjoy Thanksgiving and
we'll talk to you next week on the Advance Scout
We got some work to do.
Speaker 2 (00:01):
This is the Advanced Scout with Tom Opperman and Mack
Williamsit Steelers taking on the Bengals for the first time
in the twenty twenty three season in Cincinnati this coming Sunday.
But before we get to the Bengals, Matt, the big
news today, as we're recording on a Tuesday, is the
dismissal of Matt Canada as the Steelers offensive coordinator, something
that you and I have never seen in our lifetime
(00:22):
because it ain't happened since nineteen forty one when they
fired a coach or coordinator in the middle of a season.
So it's fair to say everybody is kind of shocked
by this move that it was made, but not shocked
that the move had to be made.
Speaker 3 (00:35):
No, and.
Speaker 1 (00:37):
A lot to unpeel here, And to be honest, it's
not as interesting of a conversation as people want it
to be in that from where I sit in terms
of analyzing it, because I don't think any of us
know what the ramifications are going to be. Is the
offense going to look totally different than it did before?
I can tell you the answers, No, Yeah, how much different?
Speaker 3 (00:57):
Can it look?
Speaker 1 (00:57):
Right? I mean, they're not going to go back to
day one a mini camp and reinstall everything Wednesday and
Thursday this week, and you know, in a totally different
verbiage and all that. Sure there'll be different plays sequencing,
maybe there's more play action, you know, things of that nature.
But I don't think it's going to be drastically different.
But I also think it had to be done. You
know that. I think that you can't. It's it sends
(01:20):
the wrong message if you say we can tolerate how
the offense has looked really just the passing game though.
I mean, it's the passing game that's broke.
Speaker 3 (01:27):
I don't want to.
Speaker 2 (01:28):
You know, some people have said, oh, they did this
because they were starting to lose the locker room. I
don't buy that at all either, But I will say,
if you allow that to continue like this, that is
how you do end up losing locker rooms. These players
are smart. They know what gets the job done and
what doesn't. They could smell that something wasn't going right.
Speaker 1 (01:43):
Now right, and the fact I think that your point
that so many players chirped up and this past week
in intolerab something like going on that maybe ownership and
the head coach said, well, I don't want to do
this to get out of hand. Let's let's move on.
Speaker 3 (01:59):
Eddie Faulkner will take over as OC.
Speaker 2 (02:01):
Mike Sullivan takes over the play calling duties for the
first time in Cincinnati on Sunday. Bengals two game losing
streak out for they lost to the Ravens on Thursday night.
They're three and two at home this year, and all
five of the Bengals losses this season have been against
AFC opponents. They're zero to three in the division and
have a minus twenty four point differential. This is such
a weird advanced scout for us to do, though, Matt.
Speaker 3 (02:22):
Because really everything you talk.
Speaker 2 (02:24):
About with the Bengals has to be taken with a
grain of salt because of Joe Burrow being out.
Speaker 1 (02:28):
Yeah, I mean all their offensive stuff, who knows. I mean,
it's even more difficult than the press, you know. I mean,
the Browns had a new quarterback too, but he still
had a better idea of how they would play football
and that type of thing. So we'll do it, do
our best. But you don't know exactly what you're gonna see.
But I know I'd rather not see Burrow.
Speaker 2 (02:48):
I amen to that. I'm not trying to say that
Watson and Burrow are comparable right now, but the Browns
are much more insulated to handle losing their starting quarterback.
The Bengals are all about Joe braw all.
Speaker 1 (02:58):
About Joe Burrow. Yes, and I think he's the face
of the franchise, all those things I mean. And you
could even see when he was injured last week, the
whole demeanor of the team.
Speaker 3 (03:08):
Show the shoulders, yeah right down, yeah.
Speaker 1 (03:11):
And everybody was dragging and you understand why these are
human beings. But the Bengals, I think their season is shot.
Speaker 2 (03:18):
Yeah, just probably just a weird lost season in the
midst of a run of Super Bowl window that they'll
have as long as Burrow return Southy. Every team remaining
on the Bengals schedule is currently at five hundred or better.
So great time for you to lose your franchise quarterback.
Speaker 1 (03:30):
Yah, it's gonna be tough.
Speaker 3 (03:31):
It's gonna be tough for the season.
Speaker 2 (03:34):
Serious history between these two teams. It began in nineteen
seventy and Pittsburgh leads all time sixty eight to thirty nine.
Two of those games occurred in the postseason twenty six
and twenty sixteen. The Steelers won both of those matchups.
Cincinnati has won four of the last five meetings, including
most recently Week eleven of last year. Before that, Pittsburgh
was on a eleven game winning streak in this rivalry.
(03:54):
Cincinnati has won just thirteen of the forty eight games
between these division ribbles that have been played in the
two thousand and Mike Tomlin is twenty four and eleven
against Cincinnati, including one playoff win in twenty sixteen. Dating
back to twenty fourteen, the Steelers are eight and two
in Cincinnati. Love firing up the escaloser, but those two
losses have come in the last three games, including the
(04:14):
most recent meeting in the Cincinnati.
Speaker 1 (04:16):
Last Yeah, and so Steelers have been the better organization,
the better franchise for you know, the start to finish
of this run story. But the Bengals are I almost
said it a high point. Big picture, the Borough euro
is one of the best, the best they've been without question.
Speaker 2 (04:33):
Let's start by looking at the Bengals defense and in
turn some of the Steelers offense that has a bit
of a new look to it this week. Total defense
their thirtieth in the NFL, they allowed three hundred and
eighty six yards per game six point one yards per
play allowed is better than only the Denver Broncos. The
Bengals defense has gave up six point eight yards per
play last week against Cincinnati, and they've been dead last
(04:55):
in the league in the past three games, given up
six point one yards per play for twenty seventh in
past defense. They're thirty first against the run, only better
than again the Denver Broncos in that category, giving up
one hundred and thirty eight yards per game, twenty first
in points per game at twenty two point six allowed.
They do have eighteen takeaways, though, and their twelve interceptions
are second most in the NFL. Two point six sacks
per game also puts them at seventeenth in the league.
(05:17):
It's a very unimpressive defense except for that takeaway factor.
Speaker 1 (05:21):
Yeah, and what's funny is their turnover ratio is almost
identical to the Steelers. I mean from offense, defense, fumble recoveries,
you know, interceptions thrown. It's almost dead even so we'll
recordings on Tuesday as usual, but I feel like I'm
very behind on why is the Bengals defense such a disaster.
Speaker 3 (05:43):
That's so bad.
Speaker 1 (05:44):
Yeah, I mean it's not like, oh, here's five really
bad injuries or I think their defensive coordinators one of
the best in the league. And sure they haven't been helped,
especially early in the season with the offense complementing them,
but they shouldn't be at the bottom of the league.
I mean, total opposite of what they played last week
in Cleveland.
Speaker 2 (06:03):
I mean they didn't have much changeover except for in
the secondary these Jesse Bates and Von Bell. But Matt
We're gonna get to him. Sink tax Hill has been
a revelation. He's been great. Yeah, there's a great replacement there.
And I mean, you can tell me more if I'm
wrong here, but I don't think Nick Scott's been terrible
the free agency to fill and it's not like he's
their their big black hole back there. So those two
guys leave and they've replaced them pretty well. You really
(06:24):
can't find a reason why they're struggling so much.
Speaker 1 (06:26):
No, on paper, it's it's hard and frankly, to be honest,
when I get home tonight, that's what I'm gonna spend
much of the night.
Speaker 3 (06:32):
Why do the Bengals stink at these Yeah.
Speaker 1 (06:34):
Why is this defense not adding up for personnel and
coaching versus the numbers? I mean, what am I missing here?
Speaker 2 (06:41):
And they got names too. I mean I don't think
that any of these guys are superstars. But I mean
Trey Hendrickson's known around the league. He's got nine and
a half sacks. He's a guy that's just taken off
ever since signing with the Bengals from New Orleans. No
one else on the roster has more than four sacks.
Sam Hubbard's four sacks, though, did come with him missing
two games, and Hubbard's really the second fiddle to Trey Henderson.
He's dinged up though, not sure if you'll see him
(07:03):
on the game Sunday. But guys like DJ Reader and
BJ Hill in the middle too, they're solid. That front
four is really strong for Cincinnati.
Speaker 1 (07:11):
They're big and physical, and their linebackers are good players
as well off the ball. I mean, they're not devoid
in the secondary like they're the guy. The twelve or
thirteen guys that play consistently are good football players, and
they're well coached, and they've used first round picks the
last couple of years on defense as well, So it's
not quite adding up to me.
Speaker 2 (07:33):
You mentioned Logan Wilson, or excuse me, you mentioned their
linebackers off ball. Logan Wilson is the one that really
jumps out to me. That dude's an animal. He's all
over the place. He stuffs the statue. He's got interceptions,
he's got sacks, he's got tackles for loss. He's good
in coverage, he's good in run support. And he's a
nasty linebacker too.
Speaker 1 (07:49):
He is border.
Speaker 2 (07:50):
I mean people who talk about the hip drop tackle
and stuff like that. He was throwing those around a
little bit on Thursday night against the Ravens. People speculating
maybe that's why Andrews is out for the year now.
Speaker 3 (07:58):
Right, But hey, it's not.
Speaker 2 (08:00):
They're legal exactly, and it's his job to do that
to these superstars on the other side of the ball,
and he ain't afraid to do that. He's a linebacker
that I honestly personally really love watching play.
Speaker 3 (08:09):
Yeah, he's great and underrated, to be honest.
Speaker 1 (08:11):
Absolutely. There was years there that they were looking for
the face of the defense, and I think they found
it with this guy. And Pratt's a really nice compliment
to him as well. Yea. They both cover a lot
of ground. One of the better linebacker duo is in
the league, and I don't think their thought of that
way enough.
Speaker 2 (08:25):
We mentioned the takeaways, the twelve interceptions that the Bengals have.
Logan Wilson has a couple of those, Cameron Taylor britt
leads the way with four and four Bengals have two
or more picks on the season. Those two, Jermaine Pratt
has a couple of picks, and Dax Hill has a
couple picks as well. And we talked about Dax Hill
first round pick in twenty twenty two.
Speaker 3 (08:44):
They had Jesse Bates and Von Bell, but the writing
was on the wall.
Speaker 2 (08:46):
Then you're going to have to shed some of this
cap defensively if you want to sign some of these
offensive players. That's exactly what happened. Those safeties were the
first casualties. But you got a guy in Dax Hill
that you've just thushered in now and I don't think
you've missed a beat.
Speaker 1 (09:00):
They planned well for this. I adored him coming out
of Michigan. He can play the slot, he's a great tester,
he's long. I think he's got a chance to be
a real star and this has been the first year
that he's taken over and second season. I mean, but
he's he's a really good player.
Speaker 2 (09:15):
Now before we get to the Bengals offense, there was
a disaster stat in your stat pick pack that I
had to I said, pick because it's a Picket stat.
Speaker 1 (09:22):
There's some nice ones in there.
Speaker 3 (09:24):
This was the worst one, actually of all time. Try
to think of it.
Speaker 2 (09:28):
Yes, picking now is the lowest touchdown rate in league history.
In all the quarterbacks that have attempted at least five
hundred passes, Picket is the only one with a touchdown
rate under two percent. His sits at one point nine
four percent. That is putting numbers to the claim that he.
Speaker 3 (09:44):
Might be one of the worst quarterbacks you've ever seen play.
Speaker 1 (09:46):
I mean in terms of throwing touchdowns.
Speaker 3 (09:48):
He's last a pretty important part of the job of
the Yeah, that's.
Speaker 1 (09:51):
A big deal here, And I'm not going to blame
Mac Canada a hundred percent for that either, you know,
I mean, I don't know that all of a sudden
things are just going to be way way better. One
thing about the Canada thing that want meant to mention
open to open the show, though, is far and away.
The Steelers have faced the hardest slate of defenses of
all thirty two teams to PA. Yeah. I mean they
(10:13):
wrote a DVA article about it today about since they've
been charting DVA since nineteen eighty, this has been the
hardest slate of defenses that any team has faced. It's
the third hardest, you know, since through ten games or what. Wow.
So I'm hoping, but frankly, it gets much easier for
(10:33):
this point.
Speaker 2 (10:34):
I was just going to say, can we have a
little fools gold scenario here where we're like, oh, we've
made the change at the coordinator position, and look what happened.
Speaker 3 (10:40):
But it's really the Bengals, the Cardinals, and the Patriots exactly.
Speaker 1 (10:43):
See. I think that I hope that there's not a misconception.
And I'm not defending the.
Speaker 3 (10:47):
No, no, no, Candid did a great job. He's just bad luck.
He got to score on those defenses too.
Speaker 1 (10:52):
They played Cleveland twice, they played the Niners, and they
played the Ravens. I mean they're the top four. I
mean that's four of your ten games right there. So
it's it was going to get better no matter what, folks,
is my point. So if it didn't then, Wow, that
would have been massive problem.
Speaker 2 (11:07):
Things can only get worse for the Bengals offensively with
the injury to Joe Burrow. They came into this week
averaging four point eight yards per play. That's better than
only six offenses. They were struggling at the beginning of
the year though, so these numbers are skewed even in
that it's.
Speaker 1 (11:20):
Really hard to evaluate their offense.
Speaker 2 (11:22):
Yeah, the twenty fourth and total offense two hundred ninety
eight yards per game, eighteenth and passing offense at two seventeen.
They don't run the ball at all, thirtieth and rushing
eighty yards per game their twentieth and scoring at twenty
points per game. They had eight giveaways, which is tied
with Pittsforck for the fewest.
Speaker 3 (11:35):
So they protect the ball.
Speaker 2 (11:37):
Two point seven sacks allowed per game is twenty second
in the NFL. So trouble protecting Burrow and now Browning
moving forward. Yeah, it's so weird to like go by
the numbers because they started so slow, then.
Speaker 3 (11:50):
They had this middle of the hal then they had
this middle of the season.
Speaker 2 (11:52):
Stretch where they looked like the Bengals again, and now
he's hurt and it's all gone poof.
Speaker 3 (11:57):
Kind of a very hard team to judge now moving forward.
Speaker 1 (12:00):
I don't know what's going on with Higgins's injury for
this game too.
Speaker 3 (12:02):
It's questionable.
Speaker 1 (12:03):
Yeah, I mean he's very important, of course. I think
Mixing's on the back nine of his career. They've invested
a lot in the offensive line, and I don't think
it's fixed, but it's below average, not terrible. But I
don't really know how to evaluate their offense. I mean,
Jamar Chase is a superstar. I mean he could run
free and any quarterback could hit him wide open. But
(12:25):
they're not going to be close to the team that
you're used to seeing now.
Speaker 2 (12:28):
Only Washington is throwing a ball at a higher percentage
of the time than the Bengals.
Speaker 3 (12:31):
Makes sense that changes.
Speaker 2 (12:33):
I was just going to ask you, Yeah, I think
they try. They don't run the ball though, like they
can't run the ball with Mixing this year. Do they
try to just go ultra conservative kind of look like
the Cleveland Browns did against the Steelers with Jake Browning,
Or do you just say we're not developing Brownie for
the future, we don't need a high draft pick. Really,
just let the kid drive the Ferrari and if he
crashes it into the wall, who cares? Next year we
(12:54):
just start all over with Burrow again.
Speaker 1 (12:55):
Probably it's probably more of the latter, and he probably
does crashed the Ferrari.
Speaker 3 (13:01):
He's gonna crash it.
Speaker 1 (13:02):
Yeah, he's gonna crash the Ferrari. And your point to
start the podcast was great that the Browns, whether Watson's
better than Borrow or not, and Burrow is the better, yes,
are way better insulated to handle this because their old
line's going to run the football. They're built to run
the football, and they have a great defense. We just
talked about the Bengals d not being able to carry
their weight there.
Speaker 2 (13:22):
Drake Browning completed eight to fourteen passes for sixty eight
yards and a touchdown when he replaced Joe Burrow last
week against the Baltimore Ravens. He had and he had
one other passing attempt in his NFL career. But like
the game, I don't want to say was out of
hand when Burrow got hurt, but it was basically over
from that. There's nothing Browning cold like. That's not terrible
(13:43):
for Browning to have to come in. He through a touchdown.
He completed some passes sixty eight yards, he ran for
I think.
Speaker 1 (13:48):
Forty more yards as we did.
Speaker 3 (13:50):
This is nothing he could do. The whole team was
just defeated at that point exactly. So again we'll see
if that they shed that before this week.
Speaker 1 (13:56):
Yeah, and hey, desperate team, desperate time, and they have
a whole week to prepare. And these are all proud
and very talented players that the Steelers are gonna line up,
and I'm sure they're not walking around the facility going, oh,
we're not evenna show up for this one and we
don't care. But yeah, I mean, like, I don't know
what their strategy can be.
Speaker 2 (14:13):
They win the game, they tie the Steelers record, and
they move up in the wild card standing like they're
not out of it yet. No, I can't imagine that
they're just gonna wave the white flag at least these
first couple games out of the gate without Burrow.
Speaker 1 (14:24):
And maybe they do crazy stuff and the Browns and
some of the two end to rounds and flee flickers
and reverses and fake punts and surprise on sides and
throw everything at the wall in a desperate fashion. Maybe
that's what you see. But they're in trouble.
Speaker 2 (14:38):
Chase leads the receiving core with eight hundred and thirty
three yards. He averages eighty three point three receiving yards
per game, boyd to second with four hundred and thirty nine,
a forty three point nine per game average, and Higgins
third at three hundred and twenty eight, only averaging forty
six point nine per game. For Higgins, his totally yards
is down because he's been dealing with injuries all year.
But even when he's been in there, it's the Higgins
(14:59):
and Burrow connection had to been working great this year.
Speaker 1 (15:01):
No, it hasn't, and he started with He's had two
injuries he's been playing through and Burrow wasn't great when
he was at his best and kind of a lost year.
As you mentioned, you know.
Speaker 3 (15:13):
They don't really have a tight end.
Speaker 2 (15:15):
No one on the roster has more than one hundred
and seventy five receiving yards this season. I mean they
obviously have tight ends. I should say they don't have
a pass catching threat at tight end. Four Bengals tight
ends have played between one hundred and fifteen and two
hundred and sixty six snaps this season, with t Higgins
in active. Last week, Trent Erwin slid in played fifty
eight of if possible, sixty one snaps against the Ravens.
And how oft this of the Bengals twenty three hundred
(15:36):
and seventy seven total receiving yards, just five hundred and
fifty five has come from the running back and tight
end positions.
Speaker 3 (15:42):
So they're not.
Speaker 2 (15:43):
Using and that's something that I think the past couple
of years the Bengals have had.
Speaker 3 (15:46):
You know, pieces there's an Okay receiver.
Speaker 2 (15:49):
And Ryan too, so who's not there anymore. I just
remember he would do a lot out of the backfield
in the passing game. Is a good safety valve for Burrow. So,
like you said, tread On Mixon's tire might be gone
and Travion Williams just they don't really use them at all.
Speaker 1 (16:02):
No, So obviously they're structured for Boyd Higgins and Chase
to get a lot of passes from tou Row. And
they're about the heaviest right at the top of the
league of eleven personnel teams in the league. You know,
they live in three receivers, one tight end in a
back do they try something totally different and start putting
more tight ends on the field, you know, I mean, yeah,
(16:25):
I don't know their formula.
Speaker 3 (16:28):
That's what I'm so interested in this because are now right?
Speaker 2 (16:30):
Is to see again, like we said, is he just
plug in Browning and let him go and see what
happens with the way we like to play or do
we adjust completely and you know, just dumb everything down.
Speaker 1 (16:39):
And I'm sure the Steelers defensive coaches are having the
same conversation, which.
Speaker 3 (16:43):
What are they gonna do?
Speaker 1 (16:43):
Yeah, makes them hard to prepare for. But of course
you'd much rather play Browning.
Speaker 2 (16:48):
I mean obviously, you know, Mixing does lead the way
with six hundred and five rushing yards on the ground.
Burrow's the second leading rusher with eighty eight yards. We
mentioned Travon Williams, who barely plays the fifty nine total
rushing yards this season. Mix And has found the end
zone in four straight games. He only scored a touchdown
just once in his first six games, so he's getting
hot as far as touchdowns are concerned. And they did
rush as a team for one hundred and thirty six
(17:08):
yards last week, and Browning did tap in forty yards
of his own. I think that's going to be a
weapon that he uses a lot too. It's just even
in the situations where he probably should stay in the
pocket and maybe a player will pop open downfield. I
bet he takes off in runs if his first riad
isn't there, probably, and how can you blame that?
Speaker 1 (17:26):
Yeah, exactly, And that's an efficient way to pick up five, six,
seven yards. You know, I'd like to see Kenny do
more of it, and he has. On a little bit
more related.
Speaker 2 (17:33):
The starting offensive line for the Bengals, we mentioned they
give about two point seven sacks per game and they
don't run the ball particularly well. Orlando Brown, Joan Williams,
Alex Kappa, Cordell Wohlson, and Ted Carris make up the
starting five and that unit has missed a total of
seventeen of a possible six hundred and forty snaps between
them all year, and those were all missed by Orlando Brown. So,
of anything, you can at least say they're consistent, and
(17:54):
like the Steelers, I was just gonna say that, it
reminds me of a little bit of that luck that
you got on.
Speaker 1 (18:01):
So, yeah, they've invested a lot neo line and they're
staying healthy, but it's not one of the best lines
in the League.
Speaker 2 (18:06):
Key matchups to keep an eye on before we wrap up,
the first one being Bengals wide receiver Jamar Chase for
Steelers cornerback Joey Porter Junior. I want to see this
one on one matchup. This is the best receiver and
no offense the DeAndre Hopkins currently. This is the best
receiver that JPJ is going to be going up against
this year. But I mean the wind is taken out
of the sales a little bit because of who's throwing
the football.
Speaker 1 (18:25):
For sure, and who's to say how the Steelers handle it.
I've been kind of thinking that if Higgins does play,
maybe Porter locks on Higgins and then you double Chase.
If Higgins doesn't play, would he follow Chase? I mean,
Chase is better than these other guys or.
Speaker 3 (18:42):
He saw a lot of following last week at Cooper.
Speaker 1 (18:44):
Correct Absolutely and he fared pretty well. But Cooper's a
challenge as well, so that's a tough one too.
Speaker 2 (18:51):
And Steelers left tackle Dan Moore on the offensive side
of things, He's got a tough matchup against Trey Hendrickson.
Henderson had a sack last week. His total was now
nine and a half on the year. He since joining
the Bengals from the Warrens and twenty twenty one has
thirty one and a half sacks in forty one games
with Cincinnati. He has been an incredible free agent signing.
Speaker 1 (19:09):
Absolutely. I mean he's a really good player. And I
thought Moore had a really tough week in Cleveland. I
mean a lot of it was Garrett, which is a
tough a challenge you're gonna get. But Hendrickson's a step
below that, but he's not too far.
Speaker 2 (19:23):
Steelers and Bengals in Cincinnati. Kickoff is at one PM
as the Steelers try to write the ship and get
to seven and four. For Matt Williamson on Tom Opperman,
Thanks has always forgiving us a listen, enjoy Thanksgiving and
we'll talk to you next week on the Advance Scout
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