September 24, 2025 • 47 mins
In this intimate sister episode of The BASIC Show, host Viktorija Pashuta sits down with Anna Pashuta, Doctor of Pharmacy, to unpack one of today’s most urgent issues: the epidemic of loneliness. From the science of depression to the philosophy of life purpose, Anna reveals how personal responsibility, curiosity, and true connection can transform the way we live.
What you’ll hear in this episode:
- 💫 Why depression and loneliness can be reframed as “selfish” states of mind
- 🧠 The science: loneliness raises dementia risk by 50%
- 🎯 How real connection comes from synchronization (shared emotion + joy)
- 📈 Practical strategies for building meaningful rituals & stronger bonds
- 🌍 Why social media acts like “clean heroin” and drains real fulfillment
- 🧰 How finding—or even borrowing—a life purpose brings resilience and direction
- 🎶 Anna’s personal story: creating a tango dance group during COVID as a cure for isolation
This episode blends psychology, philosophy, and real-world wisdom—a must-listen for anyone battling loneliness, redefining purpose, or craving deeper connection in today’s distracted world.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
SPEAKER_00 (00:00):
Depression is very selfish.
It's selfish because you areonly focusing on yourself.
Loneliness increases chances ofdementia 50%.
You feel like you're too lazy todress up, to go out.
People who would give up, theywould just die faster.
My favorite is, like, oh, goodfor you.
(00:20):
Like, oh, this is so distancing.
Good for you.
Yeah, I don't know.
He's like, go to hell.
Why am I living?
Your body will respond to yourpsychological thoughts of there
is no purpose.
This is heroin for us, right?
This is clean heroin.
You get addicted.
I don't know if it's
SPEAKER_01 (00:38):
fear of abandonment.
I don't know if it's fear oflike, you know, dying alone.
(01:01):
All right, all right.
Hello, beautiful people.
Welcome to The Basic Show.
Today we have a surprise episodeand I'm beyond excited because
today, drums, I have my sisteras my special guest on The Basic
Show, Anna Pashuta.
Hello.
(01:22):
Thank you so much for theinvitation.
Welcome, welcome.
So Anna is, just to give youguys a little bit of the
background, she is the doctor ofpharmacy so she's coming from a
little bit different world fromthe Hollywood and beauty and
fashion and we talk every singleday on the phone and then we
discuss all kinds of subjectsand I thought you know what we
(01:42):
should get on the basic show weshould talk about pressing
topics that people don't reallywell they talk about them but
not from the perspective that wehave in mind so I thought today
we can touch upon a few topicsmaybe a few serious topics we
will dive a little bit deeperwe'll see how it goes and I hope
you guys enjoying this timemaybe you just driving maybe you
(02:03):
are working out maybe you'rejust cleaning up the house but I
hope you just get comfortableand dive in into this episode so
we're gonna take first a sip ofso you would never say that okay
freshly brewed latte that willset us to the proper mood
because we're always cheerscheers and is it normal like my
(02:24):
heart is beating
SPEAKER_00 (02:25):
why your heart is beating I don't know it's just
the beginning it's fine girllet's take a sip of the nice
beautiful latte
SPEAKER_01 (02:31):
Okay.
SPEAKER_00 (02:32):
Cheers.
SPEAKER_01 (02:34):
From our golden cups, those who can see us.
Is it
SPEAKER_00 (02:37):
good?
Yep.
It's the middle of the
SPEAKER_01 (02:39):
day in
SPEAKER_00 (02:40):
LA.
Did it hit the right spot?
Yep.
Yep.
Yep.
Okay.
SPEAKER_01 (02:43):
I'm good now.
Okay.
So now, after we took a sip oflatte, we're going to talk about
different topics.
But before this episode, we kindof, we were driving on the way
to the studio in Los Angeles andwe were like, okay, what should
we talk about?
There's so many different thingsthat we we wanna touch upon.
And then one of the, personallyfor me, the most pressing topic
(03:07):
was the epidemic of lonelinessnowadays.
And I think this topic is aserious topic and I think it
touches different people, peoplewho are single, people who are
in relationship, people who aresuccessful, people who are not
as successful.
So I think this pressing issuecomes across the border.
So I wanna talk to you and seeyour opinion of this.
(03:30):
So what do you think?
I think so many people arelonely.
SPEAKER_00 (03:35):
Why so many people are lonely, okay.
I think the, so I'm judgingobviously from myself first, but
main first reason to me is thatmodern young people or people
our age, they are extremelybusy.
So people are extremely busy,people are very ambitious, we
have a lot of opportunity to dowhatever we want, and
(03:57):
everybody's definitely takingadvantage of that.
people are very busy.
So you're driving to work,you're working all the time,
you're having side hustles, andyou are exhausted at the end of
the day.
You didn't eat properly, youdidn't sleep properly, and the
last thing you want to do is tobe a pleasant company for
somebody.
I think this is the main reason.
(04:18):
And another thing that I see isthat to be social, you have to
have a sense of curiosity.
If you're not curious aboutunknown if you're not curious
about other people if you don'tfind different personalities
interesting something to exploreit's you're not gonna find joy
(04:41):
in socializing but hold on Ialso have
SPEAKER_01 (04:44):
people who are successful who have free time so
they do have free time yet theystill I don't know if they are
lazy or you know everything isat the tip of their fingers
especially with the you knowwith the dating apps it's like
okay you have your free time butyou feel like you're too lazy to
dress up to go out and plus toget the confidence to socialize
(05:04):
because that's kind of puttingan effort right to go to put
yourself out there and socializeI don't think it's just because
we're so busy I think we do havefree time though you know
SPEAKER_00 (05:13):
I'm yet to meet people with a lot of free time
but loneliness like you knowwhat is it do you just cure it
by going out having a coffeewith somebody is it about just
chatting you go you chat with aperson you are social and that's
it so loneliness is somethingthat accumulates chronically.
(05:33):
It takes years to reach thelevel of finding yourself in a
situation where you didn't getjoy from socializing.
And it's not just chatting.
I think, to me, a kind of curefor loneliness is not being
necessarily amongst people andjust talking and putting stuff
out there or doing one-timeevents like, oh, let's go play
(05:55):
volleyball or let's go to aparty, let's go to somebody's
dinner.
And I think I just lost my trainof thought.
No, no, no.
It's good because I
SPEAKER_01 (06:04):
remember you went to some of the social events to
socialize specifically withpeople and they went to the
beach and remember they're doingthose paintings.
And I remember what you saidthat it was a distraction.
Like some people, they usecertain activities to distract
themselves, yet still
SPEAKER_00 (06:21):
they feel lonely.
Yeah, okay.
Now it brings me back to mytrain of thought that it's about
synchronizing with other people.
And what that means is can otherpeople experience the same
emotions that you do in a givenmoment.
So the very simple way to put itis why is it so fun to watch
movie together with otherpeople?
SPEAKER_02 (06:38):
So
SPEAKER_00 (06:39):
you're watching the same thing, you technically
should be laughing at the sametime with everybody, you should
be scared at the same time witheverybody around you.
So that synchronization, it doessomething to us, it does
something to our brain.
And that is kind of difficult toachieve.
And especially when you go toone time events, you're going to
a party that your friendorganized and it's dinner with
(06:59):
other people.
You don't know anybody, how canyou you possibly reach that
level of same experience in thesame emotion when you just met
somebody?
It happens.
It's very special.
Like, you know, sharing a joke,everybody's laughing.
So it's very special.
So that's the thing, thesocialization that we actually
need.
And it takes, for most people,with most people, it takes time.
(07:20):
So you have to, I believe, see aperson several times to figure
out if they are your person, ifyou can synchronize on the same
thing.
So if you're going to playvolleyball together, do you
actually enjoy it to do otherpeople enjoy it exactly the same
way when you share that emotionI think that is what true
socialization is it's notnecessarily just chatting or
(07:40):
being around people and toinvest that time that's
difficult and a lot of peopledon't know what they like to do
with their free time we don'treally put much thought into it
we go to universities we try toget a career that we you know
this is what we're going to dofor the eight hours that we work
but we rarely plan what is itthat we do after because we
(08:01):
react to what is happening tous.
We need to drive, we need tocook, we need to eat, we need to
take care of children, whatever,parents.
People don't spend necessarytime to plan what they want to
do.
And if in childhood you didn'testablish your hobbies, you
didn't figure out who you are,right?
What brings you joy?
It's a little bit difficult.
(08:22):
And so people find themselves ina situation where they just
don't really have the energy orcapacity to go out.
And I think people who trulyenjoyed I think not everybody
were lucky enough to findthemselves in a situation where
they had pure joy in a group ofpeople where they shared same
(08:43):
emotion.
I think it's rare, not everybodyhas experienced that.
And like, to me, it's one of myfavorite times for me was during
COVID where I had my group offriends would go, we used to go
dancing before COVID and thenCOVID hit, we couldn't dance
anymore.
because obviously it's verysocial.
No dancing, tango.
(09:03):
Dancing tango, yeah.
Argentine tango.
And yeah, we couldn't go to thedancing studio anymore.
And then I had this thought oflike, well, how do we figure out
the problems?
How do we solve the problems?
Is there other solutions?
What can we do?
So I reached out to my friendand she wasn't my friend just
(09:25):
yet.
So I reached out to anotherperson with who I had great
energy, Sally.
Shout out to Sally.
Shout out to Sally.
Yes.
And I reached out to her and Iwas like, oh, I don't know.
It's a kind of a touchy subject.
Like, are you comfortablemeeting in person?
And like, maybe like dance,maybe, I don't know.
And she was like, hell yes.
(09:45):
So I was like, oh, okay.
And then we found a couple ofmore people because we need
couples.
We need men and women together.
We hit up a couple of otherpeople.
And then the next problem was,oh, where do we go?
Do we find a studio?
Because all the studios are shutoff.
So Sally's like, well, I have aliving room and a garage, let's
go there.
So we all went there and wemoved the furniture around, it
(10:07):
was crazy, but we found a spaceand we created our thing.
And we started meeting everyweek and it's like, no matter
what's going on with everybody'sweek, we just meet up on Friday
and just like all the worriesare gone.
We're just dancing and we'rehaving fun.
And we were and we still are allvery different people with their
different careers, goals andlife views, but yet this brought
(10:30):
us together.
And I think this was such a bigjoy because we were truly able
to do something that we alllove.
Like we connected for that hobbytogether.
And of course it became, youknow, friendship.
We would talk about our, I don'tknow, worries, whatever happened
at work.
But it took time and it was alot of joy.
(10:51):
And when COVID finished,everything opened up.
It was a little bit moredifficult to meet.
But to me, I always go back tothat time, how this was a true
socialization that is justfeeding my soul in a positive
way even today.
And of course, I have plans torecreate it when life gets in
the way, but this is what I'mtalking about.
So you just give chance topeople that you don't know.
SPEAKER_01 (11:15):
Yeah, but not everybody has these ideas,
right?
For example, me, I live faraway, right?
I live in a suburban area.
And for me, it's hard to figureout what I like.
Okay, I like table tennis,right?
I like ping pong.
I do like volleyball.
But to actually plan and findpeople as a similar minded
people, right?
And organize.
And like you said, beconsistent.
(11:35):
Like you guys are meeting once aweek, right?
To be consistent, that takesdetermination.
And I feel maybe the attentionspan on a span on the, in the
modern culture is that we wanteverything fast.
We want the high dopamine fast.
And then we get into that, youknow, stagnation mode.
And again, we like injectourselves with something
exciting.
And then again, there's astagnation mode.
(11:56):
So how do you actually, a, Iguess, right.
Find yourself, find what youlike and then be consistent and
find the ways, okay, how to bemore social in real life, not
online, right?
So I have a question to you.
I
SPEAKER_00 (12:10):
have this bonus because I can ask you questions.
Yeah.
So like, do you think this issueof loneliness, is it a personal
issue?
So is it an issue of anindividual or is it an issue of
the society, right?
So is it a selfish thing?
Okay, I can
SPEAKER_01 (12:27):
clarify that.
I think there is a differencebetween alone and and being
lonely.
For example, I am extremelyhappy to be by myself, right?
Have my own time.
I do painting.
I do reading.
I, you know, watch TV show.
I, you know, take a hike.
I go to the beach.
I write, right?
But then in those times, I don'tfeel lonely.
(12:49):
I feel lonely.
I think loneliness meaninghaving a companionship,
companionship of the person whoshares the same interest, who
you have chemistry with, right?
Who you enjoy spending time withand I think that's the problem
because there's so many thingswhich you can do this Burning
Man you know there's this musicfestivals there's restaurants
there's bars people go out yetmany many people do find
(13:13):
themselves lonely and like Isaid before not just by
themselves but in a relationshipright I've seen people who've
been married for many years andthey still say you know what I
feel lonely and I also had timesin my life when I was in a
long-term relationship and Ifelt lonely you know even though
I had that person And I feel,why do you, why did I feel that
(13:34):
way?
Why did I stay?
But I guess the question, whydid I stay in that lonely
relationship, even though didn'tbring me happiness?
I don't know if it's fear ofabandonment.
I don't know if it's fear oflike, you know, dying alone or,
you know, just, just being boredto death.
But I feel this is, this is anissue I see across different
(13:56):
audiences and I'm trying tounderstand why.
And you asked me the question,you know, and I think maybe
because we have so much choiceonline right you feel like you
can substitute friendship youfeel like especially in dating
worlds let's say if we talkabout a relationship right you
have one person you havechemistry but then tomorrow
you're gonna see a betterlooking person the next day you
(14:17):
can see a funnier person andpeople don't stay consistent and
they keep jumping and hoppingfrom one person to another to
another to another chasing thatfeeling right the imaginary
feeling that they're trying tofeed that they never You'll
never get it.
And those people, actually a lotof people in my environment,
they stay lonely and single foryears.
SPEAKER_00 (14:37):
So what I hear in your response is that possible
solution to loneliness from whatyou're saying is a partner,
right?
The life companion.
SPEAKER_02 (14:48):
And
SPEAKER_00 (14:49):
I think it is extremely important to have a
partner, but I think yourpartner will never substitute
your social circle.
So it's one of the...
different aspects in life.
Because your romantic partner,person you spend your life with,
obviously there's a lot more toit than just socializing with
(15:10):
them, right?
You're building life together,you're going through all the
struggles together.
In addition to all the romanticand social aspects, there's also
the routine and just, you know,paying bills, organizing who is
getting groceries today.
All of these aspects to justgoing through life, right?
The very practical aspect oflife and very fun and beautiful
aspect of life together.
(15:30):
But social with other people issomething else.
And it does something verydifferent to your brain, I
believe.
SPEAKER_01 (15:37):
You know, bingo, because a lot of couples, many
couples that I know, they losethemselves being stuck within
their relationship.
They do everything together.
They go to the gym together.
They have breakfast together.
They go out together.
They travel together.
And sometimes this kind of closerelationship might be
suffocating throughout time.
It's great.
You have a partner who you canshare everything.
(15:59):
But also I feel it could take atoll in a relationship because
like you said you don't haveyour circle of friends that you
can socialize outside of yourrelationship so I think it's
very important to have your ownfriends and your own hobbies
apart from your partner right soyou do and plus you have
something to talk about rightwhen you have the dinner
together right you can share heylike I went out and play golf
(16:20):
with my friends and this andthis happened hey like you know
went out and met such and suchperson you share and you
communicate because if you doeverything together you kind of
like stuck in the same storiesyou get bored with each other,
right?
And you kind of lose your owninterest, your own self, right?
In this relationship.
SPEAKER_00 (16:36):
You know, I think a very important aspect is
personal responsibility that isvery uncomfortable for a lot of
people.
A lot of people have neverencountered this feeling of
personal responsibility.
And I think this personalresponsibility has a big aspect
of being proactive in things.
(16:57):
So instead of waiting for acrisis to occur you're
proactive, you take ownership,you say, this is my
responsibility.
Obviously, a lot of aspects ofour life require personal
responsibility, but obviouslysocial aspect is very, very
important.
What do you mean socialresponsibility?
Personal responsibility, right?
So, and I think it kind ofbrings me back to my question to
(17:19):
you about whether loneliness issomething that is selfish or
loneliness, you know, issomething that we collectively
are suffering together and it'sbetween all of us.
And my thought is that this ispart of the problem that we take
loneliness as the selfishproblem same as depression
depression is very selfish it'sselfish because you are only
(17:43):
focusing on yourself you arestuck with your own thoughts
right it's very self-centeredand once you lock in your own
bubble and this is whereloneliness puts you in your own
bubble and then it leads todepression you're in your own
bubble and It's very hard to seeany other perspective, very hard
to, there's nobody arguing withyou whether you're having a good
(18:06):
day or not, it's just you andyou can spiral into something
very negative.
So I think we have to reframeloneliness as instead of being
very selfish, and in the UnitedStates, we love being selfish,
right?
It's me time, it's loveyourself.
Self-care.
All of that, self-care, right?
It's all selfish, selfish,selfish.
(18:26):
And at the point, you're sofocused on yourself that you
completely lost track that thereis other people and that they
are extremely important for yourown survival, right?
Like loneliness increaseschances of dementia 50%, right?
That is great.
So dementia, obviously, diseaseof the brain.
And we don't know how to preventit.
(18:48):
We don't know kind of what'scausing it.
We have a glimpse, right?
We're studying.
There's medications to slow itdown.
But loneliness increasesdementia chance 50%.
You know what?
SPEAKER_01 (18:58):
I remember.
Sorry to interrupt you, but I Iremember before I forget, one of
the times, actually good advice,going back to depression that
you gave me actually some timeago and shifted my perspective
on things.
When I was depressed, youactually told me, oh, it's
actually selfish to bedepressed.
You said, try to think how youcan help somebody else and you
can help another person.
(19:20):
Yeah, that's what I'm trying toget to.
Right, right.
And that actually takes you outof that bubble of being selfish
and thinking about somebodyelse.
So by taking care of somebodyelse, by thinking about somebody
else's problem, you get yourselfout of that mode and you realize
you know what things are not asbad as it seemed because you
keep brewing keep thinking youkeep like overthinking within
within your brain right creatingthose freaking I don't know what
(19:42):
are those chemicals I don't knowwhatever there's a lot of
chemicals yeah there's a lot ofthere's a big soup in the brain
yeah whatever the soup thesolanca in the freaking brain
right it creates those chemicalsthat you cannot think about
anything else and once you toldme that I realized you know what
if I tomorrow wake up in themorning with a positive mindset
and thinking okay how can I helpsomebody else with an advice
(20:04):
maybe I can you know ask ifanybody needs my help with
anything and that actuallyhelped me to get over my
depression I don't know if itwas depression maybe it was like
a well
SPEAKER_00 (20:11):
everybody goes through depressive like days in
their life like you feel lowsometimes sometimes one and
other times but yeah that isexactly my point that loneliness
people recognize it I'm lonelyI'm crying in my room if I I
think quite a few adults havethis realization that if I sleep
(20:32):
in the shower today and I'm justincapacitated and the phone is
far away, who's going to comeand save me, right?
And people keep brewing on that.
And so to me, it's like, okay,you have identified the problem.
What are you going to do aboutit?
And the tricky kind of thingabout this is that this is not
something you can solve withinone minute.
This is not something you can,let me go out clubbing, if
(20:54):
anybody's even using that word,right?
Let me go out to a party,whatever, to an outing or some
yoga session and that's gonnasolve the issue no solving
loneliness takes effort andtakes time because yep because
and I think maybe you hate itbecause like I said at the
(21:16):
beginning maybe you have neverexperienced the true joy of
connecting with people and youdid I
SPEAKER_01 (21:23):
did
SPEAKER_00 (21:23):
so I think if you experience that joy that's the
true dopamine that you wouldtruly try to chase after what
was your Well,
SPEAKER_01 (21:31):
the thing is, I'm trying to get back to loneliness
in a relationship, right?
(22:00):
for behaving that way, right?
But what I'm trying to say isthat we're all experiencing
loneliness and we're allstruggling with it, yet we don't
know what to do, right?
Like you...
I know what to do.
You know what to do?
What do we do?
I thought you would never share
SPEAKER_00 (22:15):
this special secret.
No, but like I said, so...
Okay, let's do one step, one,two, three.
Step one, two, three.
Okay, so first of all, FYI,everything is connected in life,
right?
So once you start living life ina...
And productive, I don't at allmean like, oh, you have
accomplished a lot of tasks.
Productive, I mean creative.
(22:37):
When you produce things, whenyou create moments, right?
When you create relationships,when you start living life like
this, and when you create healthand wellness and prosperity and
whatever, it affects all aspectsof your life, right?
So to socialize.
back to personal responsibility,right?
(22:59):
So it is your personalresponsibility.
And the trick is that alsonobody's going to hold you
accountable.
It's personal.
Nobody knows about itsexistence.
It's within you.
Nobody's going to hold itagainst you if you're not
personally responsible, exceptit will show in your life that,
okay, you're this kind of personwho didn't take any
responsibility in their life,right?
(23:19):
So it starts with personalresponsibility.
You have to remember yourfriend's birthdays, right?
If If there are people who arespecial in your life, you've got
to remember their special day.
And it might be even theirwedding day or when their child
was born.
Little things like this.
And if you remember what you'regoing to do about it, the
easiest, cheapest thing is youreach out to a person, then you
(23:42):
call them.
Well, calling is super extra,but it's amazing, right?
If you can call a person andsay, hey, happy birthday, how
are you doing?
What are you doing today?
You have created, this was avery productive use of your
time.
You have created a littlerapport with the person, right?
And it's about giving, giving alot, giving more with your
family, right?
(24:02):
Everybody has decided we'regoing to have Thanksgiving as a
family, as a family holiday.
What are you going to do aboutit?
This is your chance to get yourfamily together and establish
relationships with your family,right?
And then it's yourresponsibility to provide people
good time if you want to createvalue in their life.
(24:25):
Are you an interesting person totalk to and how do you become
interesting goes back tocuriosity are you curious about
things if you're curious aboutone thing start digging into
that it will bring you joy andthen you share this with other
people and being curious aboutother people being curious about
people who are notconventionally interesting
beautiful or important we're inLA right everything is about
(24:49):
looks well let's talk
SPEAKER_01 (24:52):
about that by the way people can't see but I have
goosebumps I don't know aboutyou guys but I I freaking love
you you're like I'm literallylistening to you I have
goosebumps
SPEAKER_00 (25:00):
preach
SPEAKER_01 (25:01):
okay so we talk about LA
SPEAKER_00 (25:03):
everything is about the looks everything is about
the looks LA right so what myobservations is that a lot of
the time and I see I get myobservations about LA on the
contrast because when you're inthis matrix right and we're
going to define matrix as havingthe conventional world that you
are used to and everything isfamiliar everything is normal So
(25:26):
other people define for youpretty much what normal is.
If everybody's wearing shorts,it's normal to wear shorts,
right?
So we create this matrix andnobody questions like, oh, maybe
we can wear other things, right?
So when I get out of the matrixand this is traveling outside of
the United States or talking topeople who haven't been living
here for a while, it's kind ofreally disrupts the whole system
(25:50):
in the brain of how peoplecommunicate, how people listen,
how people respond to to thelittle pain that you throw in
there, right?
And then they also havecomedians who talk about their
horrible childhood experiencesand we're all just like laughing
and it's fun.
But when you slow down and youthink about it, wow, people are
(26:10):
going through a lot of roughstuff and I'm sure everybody is,
right?
And I feel like here customaryto just like laugh it off or not
even share.
I don't know, it's kind ofcliche that people talk about
more personal stuff outside ofthe United States, But it
doesn't even have to be personalto talk about your problems with
other people.
Talking about your problems withyour friends shouldn't be
(26:31):
anything revolutionary.
But even talking about, oh, I'mthinking about these business
ideas or I was at work and thisthing made me think about this.
When you share something likethis with other people, first of
all, not many people do becausethe response usually isn't like,
oh, we're synchronized and I'veexperienced this wonder or fun
or anger, whatever happened toyou at work.
(26:54):
It's usually very staticpre-made responses.
And you can really sense thiswhen you talk to people who are,
for whom English is the secondlanguage, who do not use
response of, oh my God, this isamazing.
Or, oh, my favorite is, oh, goodfor you.
(27:14):
Like, oh, this is so distancing.
Good for you.
Yeah, I don't know.
It's like, go to hell.
Maybe somebody will explain thisbetter to you.
But for me, when somebody saysgood for you, it means like, you
exist separately, completelyseparately.
for me.
You have your joys and yoursadness.
It doesn't affect me at all.
I'm just the observer and it'sgood for you.
Do you think
SPEAKER_01 (27:33):
the lack of compassion and our inability to
feel and our inability to reallyexperience empathy and actually
remember me and you talked aboutempathy before and you told me
like, oh, I mean, not in a badway, but like, oh, you actually
don't have empathy.
Like I don't empathize peopletoo much because I feel like I'm
constantly brewing with my ownproblems, with my own projects.
(27:56):
And sometimes I overlook thingsthat I have to be more
attentive, have to be moreengaging, have to be more
present, right?
In the conversation.
And especially for my industry,right?
If I work on set, on photoshoots, you know, I direct music
videos.
Sometimes, most of the time, Isee people being in a social
environment, being all the timeon the phone, right?
(28:16):
And I'm thinking, okay, you areout.
You are in social environment.
Talk to people, right?
Ask them questions.
It's the curiosity aspect.
It's the curiosity, right?
And many people are closed down,right?
and I see, oh my God, likeeverybody, especially if you go
to the gym, everybody's on thephone.
Let's say if this handsome guyin one corner is single and
there's a beautiful girl inanother corner in the gym,
right?
And I'm thinking, oh my God,they could be like a perfect
(28:36):
couple, yet I look at both ofthem and both of them on the
phone.
And I'm thinking, this is aperfect time for you to just
exchange eye contact.
Ask, hey, like, you know, whatis your workout?
Like, how are you doing?
Possibly exchanging the numbers,right?
But they don't even get to thatpoint because they're so not
present and absent from the reallife.
And
SPEAKER_00 (28:55):
going back- this scary thought that so obviously
we have a lot of adults now whohave grown up with phones and
what phones and social media doto us I have a separate thought
about it I don't know that it isaffecting our social life in the
way that everybody portrays it Ithink the most common belief is
(29:21):
that because you're on socialmedia that somehow takes away
from your actual social life.
I think they're completelydifferent things.
They're completely differentthings.
I think it's social media.
Maybe it's called social mediajust because it has to do with
people.
It has nothing to do withsocialization.
It's to do with people, right?
(29:41):
It's escapism, right?
Yes, it's that you escape.
To me, this is purely just avery quick dopamine because
people didn't get enoughdopamine throughout the day.
Obviously, dopamine, right?
It's the good feeling that youget from doing things.
And it's dangerous to be exposedto quick dopamine all the time
(30:04):
because you just want more, butyou never get satisfied.
It doesn't get you anywhere,right?
So to me, it's like you had ahard day at work, you had
stress, you hadmiscommunications, you have
responsibilities, stuff likethis, and you're just tired.
And your response into that, wedidn't create what else there is
to do in life in your free timewhen you're at home.
You take your phone, it givesyou a little bit of that rise in
(30:26):
dopamine.
And you have, while you'relooking at the phone, you have
this sense of, oh, I'm resting,I'm having fun.
But when you turn off the phone,nothing has been achieved.
You didn't prepare a meal.
You didn't paint a painting.
You didn't establish aconnection with a friend.
Nothing was achieved, right?
But to me, that has nothing todo with being social.
(30:49):
And socializing is somethingelse.
I'm sorry, I forgot.
How did we start?
No, well, the
SPEAKER_01 (30:53):
thing is I'm listening to you, but there's
more.
many people like myself whounfortunately work from phone,
right?
One thing is like,
SPEAKER_00 (31:01):
okay.
No, personal responsibility.
Personal responsibility.
You work from home.
You work from home.
You work on your phone.
And everybody at this day andage understands what phone is.
Like, there is no...
It's a black hole.
...line about it.
This is heroin for us, right?
This is clean heroin.
(31:21):
You get addicted.
And when I pick up my phone andI...
I have a feeling, or just alittle bit, or just a little bit
more.
And you get tremendous amount ofknowledge.
And the fact that you're gettingthat knowledge.
Useless
SPEAKER_01 (31:33):
knowledge.
SPEAKER_00 (31:34):
Sometimes, right?
Depends what your feed is.
Sometimes there's great things,but in order to actually
internalize knowledge, you haveto listen to it, you have to
think about it, you have topractice it, right?
And you have to practice it inreal life, then it becomes your
knowledge.
When you just listen to itwithout internalizing, right?
Without wrapping your mindaround it without making it your
(31:56):
own part of your own thoughtprocess it's useless so we get
that joy that there's so much todo in the world there's all
these great knowledge there'sall these great speakers or
funny people right we get joybut when you shut it off you
have created nothing in yourlife this is very scary and i
know we're talking about a lot alot of topics i know i want to
SPEAKER_01 (32:16):
expand on all of them but let's go back to the
loneliness i know let's go backto the loneliness
SPEAKER_00 (32:20):
right loneliness in the relationship i think i
didn't address that yes and soit's again to me very
straightforward comes topersonal responsibility of when
you are with your partner it'svery easy to get consumed
because I think there's only somuch strength in a day you have
to complete your work and thencomplete your chores and the
only other person who is rightthere is your partner so you do
(32:42):
easy things together but againall these you know this is the
easy things like all thesebirthdays and holidays they
don't happen every day so Ithink it's fun to plan something
for people in advance so youknow you're going to socialize
with other people later butlet's talk
SPEAKER_01 (32:55):
about the people who don't have the partner, right?
I'm talking about the people whochronically been single and
lonely for many years or foryears, right?
So talk about, let's talk aboutthose people who, and I'm not
talking about exceptions of therules.
I'm talking about successfulpeople.
I'm talking about people who areestablished.
(33:15):
I'm talking about interestingpeople, smart people.
I'm talking about like theoutcasts, right?
I'm talking, and I have bothfriends, female and male
friends, extremely successful,very intelligent, Yet, I feel
and then I shared with them thatand I see from their lifestyle
that they are lonely.
And going back to what we talkedbefore, I'm trying to understand
(33:36):
and discuss and maybe share someideas.
Okay, what do we do to feel lesslonely?
And I know one of the thingsmore of in depth things that we
touched upon is not planning,not organizing, but what you
mentioned earlier is to figuringout your life purpose,
SPEAKER_00 (33:54):
right?
Yes, okay, life purpose.
purpose, yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (33:56):
Do you want to expand on that?
Let's talk about life purpose,how it connects to your
lifestyle, making choices, andbeing or not being lonely.
SPEAKER_00 (34:07):
So it's obviously the biggest question or one of
the biggest questions on theplanet.
What is the purpose of life?
Everybody's trying to figureout.
Well, not everybody.
Some people who are interestedtry to figure out.
Philosophers are talking aboutit.
That's why the subject is fun.
But to me, it's It doesn't haveto be so global, dramatic,
(34:28):
right?
There is a purpose of life to befigured out as a philosophical
topic.
But then there's also kind of agoal for your personal life.
What is the purpose of yourlife?
And I think a lot of, there'smisconception that it has to be
something dramatic, right?
And there has to be calling inyour life what your purpose of
life is.
(34:48):
And I think that if you areafter 30 and you don't have a
purpose of life, you better pickone that is random.
Let me tell you what I mean.
You pick up a random purpose oflife that is grand, that is big.
And to me, to me, this is verystraightforward, very obvious
(35:11):
how, and I should encourage alot of people to adopt this
purpose of life is helpingothers.
Okay, so your purpose of helpingothers, once you establish, and
of course, you can pick manyother different purposes in
life, right?
And guess what?
You can change your purpose inlife as you grow older.
It's not a contract you sign andyou have to stick with it.
(35:32):
But understanding what you'reliving for gives you a lot of
direction.
It gives you a lot of directionin your relationships, gives you
a lot of direction in how youspend your free time, what kind
of job you do.
And that is very helpful.
There's too many choices, toomuch noise in modern life.
So if you have one thingstraight, and even if it's for
the next five years, you havethis goal, purpose in life, not
(35:53):
goal, purpose in life, I thinkit will be helpful you will be
really really helpful for youand that around that purpose you
will form your social andromantic interactions so if you
have a big purpose in life Ithink it's you will be kind of
understanding that you need agood strong friend circle family
(36:15):
circle strong partner next toyou and that means that when you
are thinking about dating rightyou're not going to be dating
you know just to hang out.
You will be dating with theperson who will help you achieve
your life purpose and who willbe happy for you to have that
life purpose who will besupporting your life purpose
(36:38):
while pursuing their own.
Yeah,
SPEAKER_01 (36:40):
but look, many people say my purpose in life is
to travel.
My purpose in life is enjoying
SPEAKER_00 (36:46):
the moment.
You cannot choose purpose inlife something that you can get
out of the way within a year.
You can travel for a year, youcan visit most Most of the
countries in the world, ifyou're a good planner, you can
visit all the 192 countries inthe world and get it over with.
That is not purpose, that isgoals.
(37:08):
Goals is great, but purpose issomething more deeper, something
spiritual.
It's one of those things that Ialso believe strongly affect
your health.
How?
Okay, so prisoners, so peoplewho are in prison, in prison
pretty much for life likeimagine yourself in that
situation you're in prison forlife you cannot choose a job you
(37:35):
cannot choose to slip in youcannot choose to wake up early
you cannot choose to change youcannot choose to be a slob you
cannot choose anything there isno choices there is no
perspectives it's very difficultto internalize that that causes
a lot of health decay becauseyour body right why am your body
(37:56):
will respond to yourpsychological thoughts of there
is no purpose in living.
However, when you take some, Iread the book, I think it's
called Say Yes to Life.
It was a very small book.
It was given to me by our dadwhen I was going through some
rough times in life.
And it was written by apsychologist who found himself
(38:20):
in a concentration camp and howit was extremely difficult to
find purpose in life.
and do there for anything.
So you don't eat if you don'tthink you're gonna live
tomorrow.
You don't move around if youdon't think you're gonna live
tomorrow.
You don't talk to your friend orperson next to you if there is
no point in tomorrow.
And so he was describing how byhaving the purpose in life, how
(38:44):
he made his purpose, right?
He's gonna see his family, he'sgonna see his children, how that
would get him through camp andhe survived it, right?
To write the book and then hewould continue teaching in
universities And he saw thatpeople who would give up, they
would just die faster.
So there is, and I'm sure thereis other research that I cannot
(39:04):
quote right now, but I'm sure itexists, how this purpose in life
gets you moving, gets you beingproductive.
And again, in a creative way,you take care of your body, you
take care of others, you producethings in life, you produce
value to others.
And back to the lonelinessthing, that if you take it as a
selfish thing, you're sit withit at home and you think how
(39:26):
lonely you are and the questionalways is to you what kind of
value do you provide to otherpeople and value is not
necessarily that oh I'm thisgood looking person and we're
good looking people we can hangout together value okay this is
how I see it but value right canbe something more like how many
(39:49):
people can say I have a personwho's got my back if my
apartment burned down car burneddown
SPEAKER_01 (39:54):
you know I can share something with you I did an
experiment I deactivated myInstagram for a week and I was
wondering who will reach out tome and see if I'm okay I'm not
gonna name it but there was onlytwo people two people from my
circle reached out to me andasked if I'm okay I was okay but
I was just doing like a test andI realized it doesn't mean how
(40:15):
many followers you have itdoesn't mean how many comments
you have all of that doesn'teven matter right the real life
right now right here the processpresent matters the most.
Forget about the past.
Forget about the future.
This is the moment where we livein.
And going back to your thought,right, to the loneliness and to
(40:36):
being responsible and to havingthe life purpose.
it feels like, in my case, youmight take a lifetime to find
your life purpose, right?
It's like, okay, so, I mean,I've been thinking
SPEAKER_00 (40:48):
about it.
Like, what is your, how do you?
I think a passive approach.
Like, I'm gonna be waiting, I'mgonna be waiting my whole life,
and has it been described, thatrevolutionary moment where you
were waiting on your sofa verypatiently, and then your purpose
in life appeared, and thenyou're like, from now on, I have
a better life because I havethat purpose.
(41:10):
It never happens like this.
I think purpose in life, peopleencounter it through the
experiences.
It means they have to be outthere, they have to be doing
things, they have to beparticipating in things that
make them uncomfortable, right?
I know it's hard, right?
But we can talk about how to doit.
It's all in your power.
It's your personalresponsibility.
(41:30):
But if you're like, oh, let mego volunteer at the pet shelter
and you see the pets and youencounter that and then you're
like, oh...
I think this is what I reallyfeel valuable doing this.
So I think maybe this is mypurpose in life, right?
And I want to help pets.
I want to advocate for differentlaws.
(41:52):
I want to help every single dogor cat, whatever.
You encounter that purpose inlife.
And it means that you have to bedoing a lot of things.
It means that you have torealize your personal
responsibility to live afulfilling life.
And living a fulfilling life iswhen you're actually doing
things and not, yeah, on thephone, scrolling, blah, But I
understand people get tired.
(42:13):
But it means you have to thinkwhat is it that you like to do?
How do you bring value?
And you're creative.
You're curious.
You go and you do that.
And through going through allthese experiences, you will
encounter your purpose of life.
But if you don't have a purposeof life, there is plenty of
purposes of life to borrow fromother people.
And I think people's life wouldchange dramatically if they
(42:33):
adopt somebody else's purpose inlife and they try to pursue that
direction.
So how you live your life howyou kind of encourage other
people to live their lives,align with that direction, will
give you a sense of purpose.
And I think it's gonna be veryhelpful.
And then with time, maybe you'llencounter a different purpose in
life, right?
That you actually, you know,that you're like, oh, this is
(42:56):
that moment, shebang.
Now I know my purpose in life.
But in the meantime, there's somuch work to be done in the
world.
Oh my God, people need to startdoing things, right?
People need to go out there,figure out and try.
And bring your friends whileyou're doing something cool.
And this is how you establishthat connection.
This is what cures yourloneliness.
(43:16):
This is when you become valuablefor other people.
And again, it's not materialthing.
It's not a vanity thing.
It's not Instagram thing.
Where somebody with peopledepend on you for, you know, I
don't know, maybe it'sdirection.
Like, oh, what are we doingtoday?
Or what, of course, I love thevolunteering thing, which can
also be tricky because I thinkthere's a lot of useless things.
(43:38):
But volunteering is great.
If you're doing the kind ofvolunteering, bring your friends
along.
And yeah, you're passionate, Ithink it shows, and you're
actually doing something.
You're producing something.
I don't think I
SPEAKER_01 (43:53):
can add anything more to this.
SPEAKER_00 (43:57):
But let's see, going back to what is it that I do,
like step one, right?
To wrap it up, right?
To wrap it up, yeah.
Let's summarize,
SPEAKER_01 (44:05):
because I know there's so much still to dig in.
SPEAKER_00 (44:08):
Yeah, exactly.
It's one of those topics.
So I think step one in anyendeavor is research.
I think you would agree becauseI know for your work, you do
tons of research.
I know you're the queen ofresearch.
You have to learn, figure out,read different perspectives.
And this one is research of justlike, I don't know how other
people's brains work, right?
They just know mine.
(44:28):
But what is it that like sparkssomething?
Oh, that was interesting thoughtin your brain throughout the
day.
Like what was that, right?
You saw something, whatever,grocery store at work and
something sparked some kind ofan emotion.
Go into that and startresearching.
Are there more events like, Idon't know, you're passionate
about food, you're passionateabout ballet, whatever.
Something sparked your interest,start pursuing that and then
(44:51):
think like how can you add morevalue to it, right?
So first I think it's researchand then I think another thing
to do is to support people whoare already doing something,
right?
Because if you reverse and youthink if I would be creating
something and I have this, Idon't know, weird passion, I'm
trying to save all the dollarsright and somebody else you know
(45:15):
their thing aligns with yoursyou see they're trying to do
something and maybe it's alittle strange or funny
unconventional it's like whatare you doing just support all
the you know interesting peopleall the weird people right so I
think that's another thing and Idon't know you want to add the
third one for me no I must I'mwaiting for the third one I know
(45:35):
okay well let me think about thethird one and I think maybe the
third one it would be to breakout of the speech patterns,
right?
So speech patterns, hi, how areyou?
I'm good.
Oh my God, this is amazing.
This is great.
Like, can we break out of that?
And can you like respond to aperson with something more
substantial?
Let's ban
SPEAKER_01 (45:54):
the words like iconic.
SPEAKER_00 (45:57):
Yeah.
Amazing.
Like put things throughyourself, maybe, right?
And respond with your emotionsand add to what they're saying.
That creates socialization.
Am I saying this word correctly?
Socialization, yeah, that'sright.
Well, I think this is This is a
SPEAKER_01 (46:11):
good start.
I think we touched the tip ofthe iceberg.
And I know, guys, this is alittle preview of our phone
conversations that last liketwo, three hours while I'm
driving from work, while she'sdriving from work.
And we have these conversationsand topics that help me a lot in
my life.
And that's how we communicatewith Anna.
(46:33):
By the way, I call her Malaya.
I think I called you one time.
We just call each other Malayabecause I'm...
we're gonna keep the secret whyone day we'll tell okay one day
we'll tell but we call eachother malaya um so we have these
conversations every day so youguys had a little exclusive
sneak preview um into ourconversation so thank you um
(46:55):
anna for being on the basic showthank you for sharing your input
and um i hope and i know i seeyou in the next episode next
week okay see you in the nextepisode thank you so much bye
bye
SPEAKER_00 (47:10):
so
SPEAKER_02 (47:11):
you
Depression is very selfish.
It's selfish because you areonly focusing on yourself.
Loneliness increases chances ofdementia 50%.
You feel like you're too lazy todress up, to go out.
People who would give up, theywould just die faster.
My favorite is, like, oh, goodfor you.
(00:20):
Like, oh, this is so distancing.
Good for you.
Yeah, I don't know.
He's like, go to hell.
Why am I living?
Your body will respond to yourpsychological thoughts of there
is no purpose.
This is heroin for us, right?
This is clean heroin.
You get addicted.
I don't know if it's
SPEAKER_01 (00:38):
fear of abandonment.
I don't know if it's fear oflike, you know, dying alone.
(01:01):
All right, all right.
Hello, beautiful people.
Welcome to The Basic Show.
Today we have a surprise episodeand I'm beyond excited because
today, drums, I have my sisteras my special guest on The Basic
Show, Anna Pashuta.
Hello.
(01:22):
Thank you so much for theinvitation.
Welcome, welcome.
So Anna is, just to give youguys a little bit of the
background, she is the doctor ofpharmacy so she's coming from a
little bit different world fromthe Hollywood and beauty and
fashion and we talk every singleday on the phone and then we
discuss all kinds of subjectsand I thought you know what we
(01:42):
should get on the basic show weshould talk about pressing
topics that people don't reallywell they talk about them but
not from the perspective that wehave in mind so I thought today
we can touch upon a few topicsmaybe a few serious topics we
will dive a little bit deeperwe'll see how it goes and I hope
you guys enjoying this timemaybe you just driving maybe you
(02:03):
are working out maybe you'rejust cleaning up the house but I
hope you just get comfortableand dive in into this episode so
we're gonna take first a sip ofso you would never say that okay
freshly brewed latte that willset us to the proper mood
because we're always cheerscheers and is it normal like my
(02:24):
heart is beating
SPEAKER_00 (02:25):
why your heart is beating I don't know it's just
the beginning it's fine girllet's take a sip of the nice
beautiful latte
SPEAKER_01 (02:31):
Okay.
SPEAKER_00 (02:32):
Cheers.
SPEAKER_01 (02:34):
From our golden cups, those who can see us.
Is it
SPEAKER_00 (02:37):
good?
Yep.
It's the middle of the
SPEAKER_01 (02:39):
day in
SPEAKER_00 (02:40):
LA.
Did it hit the right spot?
Yep.
Yep.
Yep.
Okay.
SPEAKER_01 (02:43):
I'm good now.
Okay.
So now, after we took a sip oflatte, we're going to talk about
different topics.
But before this episode, we kindof, we were driving on the way
to the studio in Los Angeles andwe were like, okay, what should
we talk about?
There's so many different thingsthat we we wanna touch upon.
And then one of the, personallyfor me, the most pressing topic
(03:07):
was the epidemic of lonelinessnowadays.
And I think this topic is aserious topic and I think it
touches different people, peoplewho are single, people who are
in relationship, people who aresuccessful, people who are not
as successful.
So I think this pressing issuecomes across the border.
So I wanna talk to you and seeyour opinion of this.
(03:30):
So what do you think?
I think so many people arelonely.
SPEAKER_00 (03:35):
Why so many people are lonely, okay.
I think the, so I'm judgingobviously from myself first, but
main first reason to me is thatmodern young people or people
our age, they are extremelybusy.
So people are extremely busy,people are very ambitious, we
have a lot of opportunity to dowhatever we want, and
(03:57):
everybody's definitely takingadvantage of that.
people are very busy.
So you're driving to work,you're working all the time,
you're having side hustles, andyou are exhausted at the end of
the day.
You didn't eat properly, youdidn't sleep properly, and the
last thing you want to do is tobe a pleasant company for
somebody.
I think this is the main reason.
(04:18):
And another thing that I see isthat to be social, you have to
have a sense of curiosity.
If you're not curious aboutunknown if you're not curious
about other people if you don'tfind different personalities
interesting something to exploreit's you're not gonna find joy
(04:41):
in socializing but hold on Ialso have
SPEAKER_01 (04:44):
people who are successful who have free time so
they do have free time yet theystill I don't know if they are
lazy or you know everything isat the tip of their fingers
especially with the you knowwith the dating apps it's like
okay you have your free time butyou feel like you're too lazy to
dress up to go out and plus toget the confidence to socialize
(05:04):
because that's kind of puttingan effort right to go to put
yourself out there and socializeI don't think it's just because
we're so busy I think we do havefree time though you know
SPEAKER_00 (05:13):
I'm yet to meet people with a lot of free time
but loneliness like you knowwhat is it do you just cure it
by going out having a coffeewith somebody is it about just
chatting you go you chat with aperson you are social and that's
it so loneliness is somethingthat accumulates chronically.
(05:33):
It takes years to reach thelevel of finding yourself in a
situation where you didn't getjoy from socializing.
And it's not just chatting.
I think, to me, a kind of curefor loneliness is not being
necessarily amongst people andjust talking and putting stuff
out there or doing one-timeevents like, oh, let's go play
(05:55):
volleyball or let's go to aparty, let's go to somebody's
dinner.
And I think I just lost my trainof thought.
No, no, no.
It's good because I
SPEAKER_01 (06:04):
remember you went to some of the social events to
socialize specifically withpeople and they went to the
beach and remember they're doingthose paintings.
And I remember what you saidthat it was a distraction.
Like some people, they usecertain activities to distract
themselves, yet still
SPEAKER_00 (06:21):
they feel lonely.
Yeah, okay.
Now it brings me back to mytrain of thought that it's about
synchronizing with other people.
And what that means is can otherpeople experience the same
emotions that you do in a givenmoment.
So the very simple way to put itis why is it so fun to watch
movie together with otherpeople?
SPEAKER_02 (06:38):
So
SPEAKER_00 (06:39):
you're watching the same thing, you technically
should be laughing at the sametime with everybody, you should
be scared at the same time witheverybody around you.
So that synchronization, it doessomething to us, it does
something to our brain.
And that is kind of difficult toachieve.
And especially when you go toone time events, you're going to
a party that your friendorganized and it's dinner with
(06:59):
other people.
You don't know anybody, how canyou you possibly reach that
level of same experience in thesame emotion when you just met
somebody?
It happens.
It's very special.
Like, you know, sharing a joke,everybody's laughing.
So it's very special.
So that's the thing, thesocialization that we actually
need.
And it takes, for most people,with most people, it takes time.
(07:20):
So you have to, I believe, see aperson several times to figure
out if they are your person, ifyou can synchronize on the same
thing.
So if you're going to playvolleyball together, do you
actually enjoy it to do otherpeople enjoy it exactly the same
way when you share that emotionI think that is what true
socialization is it's notnecessarily just chatting or
(07:40):
being around people and toinvest that time that's
difficult and a lot of peopledon't know what they like to do
with their free time we don'treally put much thought into it
we go to universities we try toget a career that we you know
this is what we're going to dofor the eight hours that we work
but we rarely plan what is itthat we do after because we
(08:01):
react to what is happening tous.
We need to drive, we need tocook, we need to eat, we need to
take care of children, whatever,parents.
People don't spend necessarytime to plan what they want to
do.
And if in childhood you didn'testablish your hobbies, you
didn't figure out who you are,right?
What brings you joy?
It's a little bit difficult.
(08:22):
And so people find themselves ina situation where they just
don't really have the energy orcapacity to go out.
And I think people who trulyenjoyed I think not everybody
were lucky enough to findthemselves in a situation where
they had pure joy in a group ofpeople where they shared same
(08:43):
emotion.
I think it's rare, not everybodyhas experienced that.
And like, to me, it's one of myfavorite times for me was during
COVID where I had my group offriends would go, we used to go
dancing before COVID and thenCOVID hit, we couldn't dance
anymore.
because obviously it's verysocial.
No dancing, tango.
(09:03):
Dancing tango, yeah.
Argentine tango.
And yeah, we couldn't go to thedancing studio anymore.
And then I had this thought oflike, well, how do we figure out
the problems?
How do we solve the problems?
Is there other solutions?
What can we do?
So I reached out to my friendand she wasn't my friend just
(09:25):
yet.
So I reached out to anotherperson with who I had great
energy, Sally.
Shout out to Sally.
Shout out to Sally.
Yes.
And I reached out to her and Iwas like, oh, I don't know.
It's a kind of a touchy subject.
Like, are you comfortablemeeting in person?
And like, maybe like dance,maybe, I don't know.
And she was like, hell yes.
(09:45):
So I was like, oh, okay.
And then we found a couple ofmore people because we need
couples.
We need men and women together.
We hit up a couple of otherpeople.
And then the next problem was,oh, where do we go?
Do we find a studio?
Because all the studios are shutoff.
So Sally's like, well, I have aliving room and a garage, let's
go there.
So we all went there and wemoved the furniture around, it
(10:07):
was crazy, but we found a spaceand we created our thing.
And we started meeting everyweek and it's like, no matter
what's going on with everybody'sweek, we just meet up on Friday
and just like all the worriesare gone.
We're just dancing and we'rehaving fun.
And we were and we still are allvery different people with their
different careers, goals andlife views, but yet this brought
(10:30):
us together.
And I think this was such a bigjoy because we were truly able
to do something that we alllove.
Like we connected for that hobbytogether.
And of course it became, youknow, friendship.
We would talk about our, I don'tknow, worries, whatever happened
at work.
But it took time and it was alot of joy.
(10:51):
And when COVID finished,everything opened up.
It was a little bit moredifficult to meet.
But to me, I always go back tothat time, how this was a true
socialization that is justfeeding my soul in a positive
way even today.
And of course, I have plans torecreate it when life gets in
the way, but this is what I'mtalking about.
So you just give chance topeople that you don't know.
SPEAKER_01 (11:15):
Yeah, but not everybody has these ideas,
right?
For example, me, I live faraway, right?
I live in a suburban area.
And for me, it's hard to figureout what I like.
Okay, I like table tennis,right?
I like ping pong.
I do like volleyball.
But to actually plan and findpeople as a similar minded
people, right?
And organize.
And like you said, beconsistent.
(11:35):
Like you guys are meeting once aweek, right?
To be consistent, that takesdetermination.
And I feel maybe the attentionspan on a span on the, in the
modern culture is that we wanteverything fast.
We want the high dopamine fast.
And then we get into that, youknow, stagnation mode.
And again, we like injectourselves with something
exciting.
And then again, there's astagnation mode.
(11:56):
So how do you actually, a, Iguess, right.
Find yourself, find what youlike and then be consistent and
find the ways, okay, how to bemore social in real life, not
online, right?
So I have a question to you.
I
SPEAKER_00 (12:10):
have this bonus because I can ask you questions.
Yeah.
So like, do you think this issueof loneliness, is it a personal
issue?
So is it an issue of anindividual or is it an issue of
the society, right?
So is it a selfish thing?
Okay, I can
SPEAKER_01 (12:27):
clarify that.
I think there is a differencebetween alone and and being
lonely.
For example, I am extremelyhappy to be by myself, right?
Have my own time.
I do painting.
I do reading.
I, you know, watch TV show.
I, you know, take a hike.
I go to the beach.
I write, right?
But then in those times, I don'tfeel lonely.
(12:49):
I feel lonely.
I think loneliness meaninghaving a companionship,
companionship of the person whoshares the same interest, who
you have chemistry with, right?
Who you enjoy spending time withand I think that's the problem
because there's so many thingswhich you can do this Burning
Man you know there's this musicfestivals there's restaurants
there's bars people go out yetmany many people do find
(13:13):
themselves lonely and like Isaid before not just by
themselves but in a relationshipright I've seen people who've
been married for many years andthey still say you know what I
feel lonely and I also had timesin my life when I was in a
long-term relationship and Ifelt lonely you know even though
I had that person And I feel,why do you, why did I feel that
(13:34):
way?
Why did I stay?
But I guess the question, whydid I stay in that lonely
relationship, even though didn'tbring me happiness?
I don't know if it's fear ofabandonment.
I don't know if it's fear oflike, you know, dying alone or,
you know, just, just being boredto death.
But I feel this is, this is anissue I see across different
(13:56):
audiences and I'm trying tounderstand why.
And you asked me the question,you know, and I think maybe
because we have so much choiceonline right you feel like you
can substitute friendship youfeel like especially in dating
worlds let's say if we talkabout a relationship right you
have one person you havechemistry but then tomorrow
you're gonna see a betterlooking person the next day you
(14:17):
can see a funnier person andpeople don't stay consistent and
they keep jumping and hoppingfrom one person to another to
another to another chasing thatfeeling right the imaginary
feeling that they're trying tofeed that they never You'll
never get it.
And those people, actually a lotof people in my environment,
they stay lonely and single foryears.
SPEAKER_00 (14:37):
So what I hear in your response is that possible
solution to loneliness from whatyou're saying is a partner,
right?
The life companion.
SPEAKER_02 (14:48):
And
SPEAKER_00 (14:49):
I think it is extremely important to have a
partner, but I think yourpartner will never substitute
your social circle.
So it's one of the...
different aspects in life.
Because your romantic partner,person you spend your life with,
obviously there's a lot more toit than just socializing with
(15:10):
them, right?
You're building life together,you're going through all the
struggles together.
In addition to all the romanticand social aspects, there's also
the routine and just, you know,paying bills, organizing who is
getting groceries today.
All of these aspects to justgoing through life, right?
The very practical aspect oflife and very fun and beautiful
aspect of life together.
(15:30):
But social with other people issomething else.
And it does something verydifferent to your brain, I
believe.
SPEAKER_01 (15:37):
You know, bingo, because a lot of couples, many
couples that I know, they losethemselves being stuck within
their relationship.
They do everything together.
They go to the gym together.
They have breakfast together.
They go out together.
They travel together.
And sometimes this kind of closerelationship might be
suffocating throughout time.
It's great.
You have a partner who you canshare everything.
(15:59):
But also I feel it could take atoll in a relationship because
like you said you don't haveyour circle of friends that you
can socialize outside of yourrelationship so I think it's
very important to have your ownfriends and your own hobbies
apart from your partner right soyou do and plus you have
something to talk about rightwhen you have the dinner
together right you can share heylike I went out and play golf
(16:20):
with my friends and this andthis happened hey like you know
went out and met such and suchperson you share and you
communicate because if you doeverything together you kind of
like stuck in the same storiesyou get bored with each other,
right?
And you kind of lose your owninterest, your own self, right?
In this relationship.
SPEAKER_00 (16:36):
You know, I think a very important aspect is
personal responsibility that isvery uncomfortable for a lot of
people.
A lot of people have neverencountered this feeling of
personal responsibility.
And I think this personalresponsibility has a big aspect
of being proactive in things.
(16:57):
So instead of waiting for acrisis to occur you're
proactive, you take ownership,you say, this is my
responsibility.
Obviously, a lot of aspects ofour life require personal
responsibility, but obviouslysocial aspect is very, very
important.
What do you mean socialresponsibility?
Personal responsibility, right?
So, and I think it kind ofbrings me back to my question to
(17:19):
you about whether loneliness issomething that is selfish or
loneliness, you know, issomething that we collectively
are suffering together and it'sbetween all of us.
And my thought is that this ispart of the problem that we take
loneliness as the selfishproblem same as depression
depression is very selfish it'sselfish because you are only
(17:43):
focusing on yourself you arestuck with your own thoughts
right it's very self-centeredand once you lock in your own
bubble and this is whereloneliness puts you in your own
bubble and then it leads todepression you're in your own
bubble and It's very hard to seeany other perspective, very hard
to, there's nobody arguing withyou whether you're having a good
(18:06):
day or not, it's just you andyou can spiral into something
very negative.
So I think we have to reframeloneliness as instead of being
very selfish, and in the UnitedStates, we love being selfish,
right?
It's me time, it's loveyourself.
Self-care.
All of that, self-care, right?
It's all selfish, selfish,selfish.
(18:26):
And at the point, you're sofocused on yourself that you
completely lost track that thereis other people and that they
are extremely important for yourown survival, right?
Like loneliness increaseschances of dementia 50%, right?
That is great.
So dementia, obviously, diseaseof the brain.
And we don't know how to preventit.
(18:48):
We don't know kind of what'scausing it.
We have a glimpse, right?
We're studying.
There's medications to slow itdown.
But loneliness increasesdementia chance 50%.
You know what?
SPEAKER_01 (18:58):
I remember.
Sorry to interrupt you, but I Iremember before I forget, one of
the times, actually good advice,going back to depression that
you gave me actually some timeago and shifted my perspective
on things.
When I was depressed, youactually told me, oh, it's
actually selfish to bedepressed.
You said, try to think how youcan help somebody else and you
can help another person.
(19:20):
Yeah, that's what I'm trying toget to.
Right, right.
And that actually takes you outof that bubble of being selfish
and thinking about somebodyelse.
So by taking care of somebodyelse, by thinking about somebody
else's problem, you get yourselfout of that mode and you realize
you know what things are not asbad as it seemed because you
keep brewing keep thinking youkeep like overthinking within
within your brain right creatingthose freaking I don't know what
(19:42):
are those chemicals I don't knowwhatever there's a lot of
chemicals yeah there's a lot ofthere's a big soup in the brain
yeah whatever the soup thesolanca in the freaking brain
right it creates those chemicalsthat you cannot think about
anything else and once you toldme that I realized you know what
if I tomorrow wake up in themorning with a positive mindset
and thinking okay how can I helpsomebody else with an advice
(20:04):
maybe I can you know ask ifanybody needs my help with
anything and that actuallyhelped me to get over my
depression I don't know if itwas depression maybe it was like
a well
SPEAKER_00 (20:11):
everybody goes through depressive like days in
their life like you feel lowsometimes sometimes one and
other times but yeah that isexactly my point that loneliness
people recognize it I'm lonelyI'm crying in my room if I I
think quite a few adults havethis realization that if I sleep
(20:32):
in the shower today and I'm justincapacitated and the phone is
far away, who's going to comeand save me, right?
And people keep brewing on that.
And so to me, it's like, okay,you have identified the problem.
What are you going to do aboutit?
And the tricky kind of thingabout this is that this is not
something you can solve withinone minute.
This is not something you can,let me go out clubbing, if
(20:54):
anybody's even using that word,right?
Let me go out to a party,whatever, to an outing or some
yoga session and that's gonnasolve the issue no solving
loneliness takes effort andtakes time because yep because
and I think maybe you hate itbecause like I said at the
(21:16):
beginning maybe you have neverexperienced the true joy of
connecting with people and youdid I
SPEAKER_01 (21:23):
did
SPEAKER_00 (21:23):
so I think if you experience that joy that's the
true dopamine that you wouldtruly try to chase after what
was your Well,
SPEAKER_01 (21:31):
the thing is, I'm trying to get back to loneliness
in a relationship, right?
(22:00):
for behaving that way, right?
But what I'm trying to say isthat we're all experiencing
loneliness and we're allstruggling with it, yet we don't
know what to do, right?
Like you...
I know what to do.
You know what to do?
What do we do?
I thought you would never share
SPEAKER_00 (22:15):
this special secret.
No, but like I said, so...
Okay, let's do one step, one,two, three.
Step one, two, three.
Okay, so first of all, FYI,everything is connected in life,
right?
So once you start living life ina...
And productive, I don't at allmean like, oh, you have
accomplished a lot of tasks.
Productive, I mean creative.
(22:37):
When you produce things, whenyou create moments, right?
When you create relationships,when you start living life like
this, and when you create healthand wellness and prosperity and
whatever, it affects all aspectsof your life, right?
So to socialize.
back to personal responsibility,right?
(22:59):
So it is your personalresponsibility.
And the trick is that alsonobody's going to hold you
accountable.
It's personal.
Nobody knows about itsexistence.
It's within you.
Nobody's going to hold itagainst you if you're not
personally responsible, exceptit will show in your life that,
okay, you're this kind of personwho didn't take any
responsibility in their life,right?
(23:19):
So it starts with personalresponsibility.
You have to remember yourfriend's birthdays, right?
If If there are people who arespecial in your life, you've got
to remember their special day.
And it might be even theirwedding day or when their child
was born.
Little things like this.
And if you remember what you'regoing to do about it, the
easiest, cheapest thing is youreach out to a person, then you
(23:42):
call them.
Well, calling is super extra,but it's amazing, right?
If you can call a person andsay, hey, happy birthday, how
are you doing?
What are you doing today?
You have created, this was avery productive use of your
time.
You have created a littlerapport with the person, right?
And it's about giving, giving alot, giving more with your
family, right?
(24:02):
Everybody has decided we'regoing to have Thanksgiving as a
family, as a family holiday.
What are you going to do aboutit?
This is your chance to get yourfamily together and establish
relationships with your family,right?
And then it's yourresponsibility to provide people
good time if you want to createvalue in their life.
(24:25):
Are you an interesting person totalk to and how do you become
interesting goes back tocuriosity are you curious about
things if you're curious aboutone thing start digging into
that it will bring you joy andthen you share this with other
people and being curious aboutother people being curious about
people who are notconventionally interesting
beautiful or important we're inLA right everything is about
(24:49):
looks well let's talk
SPEAKER_01 (24:52):
about that by the way people can't see but I have
goosebumps I don't know aboutyou guys but I I freaking love
you you're like I'm literallylistening to you I have
goosebumps
SPEAKER_00 (25:00):
preach
SPEAKER_01 (25:01):
okay so we talk about LA
SPEAKER_00 (25:03):
everything is about the looks everything is about
the looks LA right so what myobservations is that a lot of
the time and I see I get myobservations about LA on the
contrast because when you're inthis matrix right and we're
going to define matrix as havingthe conventional world that you
are used to and everything isfamiliar everything is normal So
(25:26):
other people define for youpretty much what normal is.
If everybody's wearing shorts,it's normal to wear shorts,
right?
So we create this matrix andnobody questions like, oh, maybe
we can wear other things, right?
So when I get out of the matrixand this is traveling outside of
the United States or talking topeople who haven't been living
here for a while, it's kind ofreally disrupts the whole system
(25:50):
in the brain of how peoplecommunicate, how people listen,
how people respond to to thelittle pain that you throw in
there, right?
And then they also havecomedians who talk about their
horrible childhood experiencesand we're all just like laughing
and it's fun.
But when you slow down and youthink about it, wow, people are
(26:10):
going through a lot of roughstuff and I'm sure everybody is,
right?
And I feel like here customaryto just like laugh it off or not
even share.
I don't know, it's kind ofcliche that people talk about
more personal stuff outside ofthe United States, But it
doesn't even have to be personalto talk about your problems with
other people.
Talking about your problems withyour friends shouldn't be
(26:31):
anything revolutionary.
But even talking about, oh, I'mthinking about these business
ideas or I was at work and thisthing made me think about this.
When you share something likethis with other people, first of
all, not many people do becausethe response usually isn't like,
oh, we're synchronized and I'veexperienced this wonder or fun
or anger, whatever happened toyou at work.
(26:54):
It's usually very staticpre-made responses.
And you can really sense thiswhen you talk to people who are,
for whom English is the secondlanguage, who do not use
response of, oh my God, this isamazing.
Or, oh, my favorite is, oh, goodfor you.
(27:14):
Like, oh, this is so distancing.
Good for you.
Yeah, I don't know.
It's like, go to hell.
Maybe somebody will explain thisbetter to you.
But for me, when somebody saysgood for you, it means like, you
exist separately, completelyseparately.
for me.
You have your joys and yoursadness.
It doesn't affect me at all.
I'm just the observer and it'sgood for you.
Do you think
SPEAKER_01 (27:33):
the lack of compassion and our inability to
feel and our inability to reallyexperience empathy and actually
remember me and you talked aboutempathy before and you told me
like, oh, I mean, not in a badway, but like, oh, you actually
don't have empathy.
Like I don't empathize peopletoo much because I feel like I'm
constantly brewing with my ownproblems, with my own projects.
(27:56):
And sometimes I overlook thingsthat I have to be more
attentive, have to be moreengaging, have to be more
present, right?
In the conversation.
And especially for my industry,right?
If I work on set, on photoshoots, you know, I direct music
videos.
Sometimes, most of the time, Isee people being in a social
environment, being all the timeon the phone, right?
(28:16):
And I'm thinking, okay, you areout.
You are in social environment.
Talk to people, right?
Ask them questions.
It's the curiosity aspect.
It's the curiosity, right?
And many people are closed down,right?
and I see, oh my God, likeeverybody, especially if you go
to the gym, everybody's on thephone.
Let's say if this handsome guyin one corner is single and
there's a beautiful girl inanother corner in the gym,
right?
And I'm thinking, oh my God,they could be like a perfect
(28:36):
couple, yet I look at both ofthem and both of them on the
phone.
And I'm thinking, this is aperfect time for you to just
exchange eye contact.
Ask, hey, like, you know, whatis your workout?
Like, how are you doing?
Possibly exchanging the numbers,right?
But they don't even get to thatpoint because they're so not
present and absent from the reallife.
And
SPEAKER_00 (28:55):
going back- this scary thought that so obviously
we have a lot of adults now whohave grown up with phones and
what phones and social media doto us I have a separate thought
about it I don't know that it isaffecting our social life in the
way that everybody portrays it Ithink the most common belief is
(29:21):
that because you're on socialmedia that somehow takes away
from your actual social life.
I think they're completelydifferent things.
They're completely differentthings.
I think it's social media.
Maybe it's called social mediajust because it has to do with
people.
It has nothing to do withsocialization.
It's to do with people, right?
(29:41):
It's escapism, right?
Yes, it's that you escape.
To me, this is purely just avery quick dopamine because
people didn't get enoughdopamine throughout the day.
Obviously, dopamine, right?
It's the good feeling that youget from doing things.
And it's dangerous to be exposedto quick dopamine all the time
(30:04):
because you just want more, butyou never get satisfied.
It doesn't get you anywhere,right?
So to me, it's like you had ahard day at work, you had
stress, you hadmiscommunications, you have
responsibilities, stuff likethis, and you're just tired.
And your response into that, wedidn't create what else there is
to do in life in your free timewhen you're at home.
You take your phone, it givesyou a little bit of that rise in
(30:26):
dopamine.
And you have, while you'relooking at the phone, you have
this sense of, oh, I'm resting,I'm having fun.
But when you turn off the phone,nothing has been achieved.
You didn't prepare a meal.
You didn't paint a painting.
You didn't establish aconnection with a friend.
Nothing was achieved, right?
But to me, that has nothing todo with being social.
(30:49):
And socializing is somethingelse.
I'm sorry, I forgot.
How did we start?
No, well, the
SPEAKER_01 (30:53):
thing is I'm listening to you, but there's
more.
many people like myself whounfortunately work from phone,
right?
One thing is like,
SPEAKER_00 (31:01):
okay.
No, personal responsibility.
Personal responsibility.
You work from home.
You work from home.
You work on your phone.
And everybody at this day andage understands what phone is.
Like, there is no...
It's a black hole.
...line about it.
This is heroin for us, right?
This is clean heroin.
(31:21):
You get addicted.
And when I pick up my phone andI...
I have a feeling, or just alittle bit, or just a little bit
more.
And you get tremendous amount ofknowledge.
And the fact that you're gettingthat knowledge.
Useless
SPEAKER_01 (31:33):
knowledge.
SPEAKER_00 (31:34):
Sometimes, right?
Depends what your feed is.
Sometimes there's great things,but in order to actually
internalize knowledge, you haveto listen to it, you have to
think about it, you have topractice it, right?
And you have to practice it inreal life, then it becomes your
knowledge.
When you just listen to itwithout internalizing, right?
Without wrapping your mindaround it without making it your
(31:56):
own part of your own thoughtprocess it's useless so we get
that joy that there's so much todo in the world there's all
these great knowledge there'sall these great speakers or
funny people right we get joybut when you shut it off you
have created nothing in yourlife this is very scary and i
know we're talking about a lot alot of topics i know i want to
SPEAKER_01 (32:16):
expand on all of them but let's go back to the
loneliness i know let's go backto the loneliness
SPEAKER_00 (32:20):
right loneliness in the relationship i think i
didn't address that yes and soit's again to me very
straightforward comes topersonal responsibility of when
you are with your partner it'svery easy to get consumed
because I think there's only somuch strength in a day you have
to complete your work and thencomplete your chores and the
only other person who is rightthere is your partner so you do
(32:42):
easy things together but againall these you know this is the
easy things like all thesebirthdays and holidays they
don't happen every day so Ithink it's fun to plan something
for people in advance so youknow you're going to socialize
with other people later butlet's talk
SPEAKER_01 (32:55):
about the people who don't have the partner, right?
I'm talking about the people whochronically been single and
lonely for many years or foryears, right?
So talk about, let's talk aboutthose people who, and I'm not
talking about exceptions of therules.
I'm talking about successfulpeople.
I'm talking about people who areestablished.
(33:15):
I'm talking about interestingpeople, smart people.
I'm talking about like theoutcasts, right?
I'm talking, and I have bothfriends, female and male
friends, extremely successful,very intelligent, Yet, I feel
and then I shared with them thatand I see from their lifestyle
that they are lonely.
And going back to what we talkedbefore, I'm trying to understand
(33:36):
and discuss and maybe share someideas.
Okay, what do we do to feel lesslonely?
And I know one of the thingsmore of in depth things that we
touched upon is not planning,not organizing, but what you
mentioned earlier is to figuringout your life purpose,
SPEAKER_00 (33:54):
right?
Yes, okay, life purpose.
purpose, yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (33:56):
Do you want to expand on that?
Let's talk about life purpose,how it connects to your
lifestyle, making choices, andbeing or not being lonely.
SPEAKER_00 (34:07):
So it's obviously the biggest question or one of
the biggest questions on theplanet.
What is the purpose of life?
Everybody's trying to figureout.
Well, not everybody.
Some people who are interestedtry to figure out.
Philosophers are talking aboutit.
That's why the subject is fun.
But to me, it's It doesn't haveto be so global, dramatic,
(34:28):
right?
There is a purpose of life to befigured out as a philosophical
topic.
But then there's also kind of agoal for your personal life.
What is the purpose of yourlife?
And I think a lot of, there'smisconception that it has to be
something dramatic, right?
And there has to be calling inyour life what your purpose of
life is.
(34:48):
And I think that if you areafter 30 and you don't have a
purpose of life, you better pickone that is random.
Let me tell you what I mean.
You pick up a random purpose oflife that is grand, that is big.
And to me, to me, this is verystraightforward, very obvious
(35:11):
how, and I should encourage alot of people to adopt this
purpose of life is helpingothers.
Okay, so your purpose of helpingothers, once you establish, and
of course, you can pick manyother different purposes in
life, right?
And guess what?
You can change your purpose inlife as you grow older.
It's not a contract you sign andyou have to stick with it.
(35:32):
But understanding what you'reliving for gives you a lot of
direction.
It gives you a lot of directionin your relationships, gives you
a lot of direction in how youspend your free time, what kind
of job you do.
And that is very helpful.
There's too many choices, toomuch noise in modern life.
So if you have one thingstraight, and even if it's for
the next five years, you havethis goal, purpose in life, not
(35:53):
goal, purpose in life, I thinkit will be helpful you will be
really really helpful for youand that around that purpose you
will form your social andromantic interactions so if you
have a big purpose in life Ithink it's you will be kind of
understanding that you need agood strong friend circle family
(36:15):
circle strong partner next toyou and that means that when you
are thinking about dating rightyou're not going to be dating
you know just to hang out.
You will be dating with theperson who will help you achieve
your life purpose and who willbe happy for you to have that
life purpose who will besupporting your life purpose
(36:38):
while pursuing their own.
Yeah,
SPEAKER_01 (36:40):
but look, many people say my purpose in life is
to travel.
My purpose in life is enjoying
SPEAKER_00 (36:46):
the moment.
You cannot choose purpose inlife something that you can get
out of the way within a year.
You can travel for a year, youcan visit most Most of the
countries in the world, ifyou're a good planner, you can
visit all the 192 countries inthe world and get it over with.
That is not purpose, that isgoals.
(37:08):
Goals is great, but purpose issomething more deeper, something
spiritual.
It's one of those things that Ialso believe strongly affect
your health.
How?
Okay, so prisoners, so peoplewho are in prison, in prison
pretty much for life likeimagine yourself in that
situation you're in prison forlife you cannot choose a job you
(37:35):
cannot choose to slip in youcannot choose to wake up early
you cannot choose to change youcannot choose to be a slob you
cannot choose anything there isno choices there is no
perspectives it's very difficultto internalize that that causes
a lot of health decay becauseyour body right why am your body
(37:56):
will respond to yourpsychological thoughts of there
is no purpose in living.
However, when you take some, Iread the book, I think it's
called Say Yes to Life.
It was a very small book.
It was given to me by our dadwhen I was going through some
rough times in life.
And it was written by apsychologist who found himself
(38:20):
in a concentration camp and howit was extremely difficult to
find purpose in life.
and do there for anything.
So you don't eat if you don'tthink you're gonna live
tomorrow.
You don't move around if youdon't think you're gonna live
tomorrow.
You don't talk to your friend orperson next to you if there is
no point in tomorrow.
And so he was describing how byhaving the purpose in life, how
(38:44):
he made his purpose, right?
He's gonna see his family, he'sgonna see his children, how that
would get him through camp andhe survived it, right?
To write the book and then hewould continue teaching in
universities And he saw thatpeople who would give up, they
would just die faster.
So there is, and I'm sure thereis other research that I cannot
(39:04):
quote right now, but I'm sure itexists, how this purpose in life
gets you moving, gets you beingproductive.
And again, in a creative way,you take care of your body, you
take care of others, you producethings in life, you produce
value to others.
And back to the lonelinessthing, that if you take it as a
selfish thing, you're sit withit at home and you think how
(39:26):
lonely you are and the questionalways is to you what kind of
value do you provide to otherpeople and value is not
necessarily that oh I'm thisgood looking person and we're
good looking people we can hangout together value okay this is
how I see it but value right canbe something more like how many
(39:49):
people can say I have a personwho's got my back if my
apartment burned down car burneddown
SPEAKER_01 (39:54):
you know I can share something with you I did an
experiment I deactivated myInstagram for a week and I was
wondering who will reach out tome and see if I'm okay I'm not
gonna name it but there was onlytwo people two people from my
circle reached out to me andasked if I'm okay I was okay but
I was just doing like a test andI realized it doesn't mean how
(40:15):
many followers you have itdoesn't mean how many comments
you have all of that doesn'teven matter right the real life
right now right here the processpresent matters the most.
Forget about the past.
Forget about the future.
This is the moment where we livein.
And going back to your thought,right, to the loneliness and to
(40:36):
being responsible and to havingthe life purpose.
it feels like, in my case, youmight take a lifetime to find
your life purpose, right?
It's like, okay, so, I mean,I've been thinking
SPEAKER_00 (40:48):
about it.
Like, what is your, how do you?
I think a passive approach.
Like, I'm gonna be waiting, I'mgonna be waiting my whole life,
and has it been described, thatrevolutionary moment where you
were waiting on your sofa verypatiently, and then your purpose
in life appeared, and thenyou're like, from now on, I have
a better life because I havethat purpose.
(41:10):
It never happens like this.
I think purpose in life, peopleencounter it through the
experiences.
It means they have to be outthere, they have to be doing
things, they have to beparticipating in things that
make them uncomfortable, right?
I know it's hard, right?
But we can talk about how to doit.
It's all in your power.
It's your personalresponsibility.
(41:30):
But if you're like, oh, let mego volunteer at the pet shelter
and you see the pets and youencounter that and then you're
like, oh...
I think this is what I reallyfeel valuable doing this.
So I think maybe this is mypurpose in life, right?
And I want to help pets.
I want to advocate for differentlaws.
(41:52):
I want to help every single dogor cat, whatever.
You encounter that purpose inlife.
And it means that you have to bedoing a lot of things.
It means that you have torealize your personal
responsibility to live afulfilling life.
And living a fulfilling life iswhen you're actually doing
things and not, yeah, on thephone, scrolling, blah, But I
understand people get tired.
(42:13):
But it means you have to thinkwhat is it that you like to do?
How do you bring value?
And you're creative.
You're curious.
You go and you do that.
And through going through allthese experiences, you will
encounter your purpose of life.
But if you don't have a purposeof life, there is plenty of
purposes of life to borrow fromother people.
And I think people's life wouldchange dramatically if they
(42:33):
adopt somebody else's purpose inlife and they try to pursue that
direction.
So how you live your life howyou kind of encourage other
people to live their lives,align with that direction, will
give you a sense of purpose.
And I think it's gonna be veryhelpful.
And then with time, maybe you'llencounter a different purpose in
life, right?
That you actually, you know,that you're like, oh, this is
(42:56):
that moment, shebang.
Now I know my purpose in life.
But in the meantime, there's somuch work to be done in the
world.
Oh my God, people need to startdoing things, right?
People need to go out there,figure out and try.
And bring your friends whileyou're doing something cool.
And this is how you establishthat connection.
This is what cures yourloneliness.
(43:16):
This is when you become valuablefor other people.
And again, it's not materialthing.
It's not a vanity thing.
It's not Instagram thing.
Where somebody with peopledepend on you for, you know, I
don't know, maybe it'sdirection.
Like, oh, what are we doingtoday?
Or what, of course, I love thevolunteering thing, which can
also be tricky because I thinkthere's a lot of useless things.
(43:38):
But volunteering is great.
If you're doing the kind ofvolunteering, bring your friends
along.
And yeah, you're passionate, Ithink it shows, and you're
actually doing something.
You're producing something.
I don't think I
SPEAKER_01 (43:53):
can add anything more to this.
SPEAKER_00 (43:57):
But let's see, going back to what is it that I do,
like step one, right?
To wrap it up, right?
To wrap it up, yeah.
Let's summarize,
SPEAKER_01 (44:05):
because I know there's so much still to dig in.
SPEAKER_00 (44:08):
Yeah, exactly.
It's one of those topics.
So I think step one in anyendeavor is research.
I think you would agree becauseI know for your work, you do
tons of research.
I know you're the queen ofresearch.
You have to learn, figure out,read different perspectives.
And this one is research of justlike, I don't know how other
people's brains work, right?
They just know mine.
(44:28):
But what is it that like sparkssomething?
Oh, that was interesting thoughtin your brain throughout the
day.
Like what was that, right?
You saw something, whatever,grocery store at work and
something sparked some kind ofan emotion.
Go into that and startresearching.
Are there more events like, Idon't know, you're passionate
about food, you're passionateabout ballet, whatever.
Something sparked your interest,start pursuing that and then
(44:51):
think like how can you add morevalue to it, right?
So first I think it's researchand then I think another thing
to do is to support people whoare already doing something,
right?
Because if you reverse and youthink if I would be creating
something and I have this, Idon't know, weird passion, I'm
trying to save all the dollarsright and somebody else you know
(45:15):
their thing aligns with yoursyou see they're trying to do
something and maybe it's alittle strange or funny
unconventional it's like whatare you doing just support all
the you know interesting peopleall the weird people right so I
think that's another thing and Idon't know you want to add the
third one for me no I must I'mwaiting for the third one I know
(45:35):
okay well let me think about thethird one and I think maybe the
third one it would be to breakout of the speech patterns,
right?
So speech patterns, hi, how areyou?
I'm good.
Oh my God, this is amazing.
This is great.
Like, can we break out of that?
And can you like respond to aperson with something more
substantial?
Let's ban
SPEAKER_01 (45:54):
the words like iconic.
SPEAKER_00 (45:57):
Yeah.
Amazing.
Like put things throughyourself, maybe, right?
And respond with your emotionsand add to what they're saying.
That creates socialization.
Am I saying this word correctly?
Socialization, yeah, that'sright.
Well, I think this is This is a
SPEAKER_01 (46:11):
good start.
I think we touched the tip ofthe iceberg.
And I know, guys, this is alittle preview of our phone
conversations that last liketwo, three hours while I'm
driving from work, while she'sdriving from work.
And we have these conversationsand topics that help me a lot in
my life.
And that's how we communicatewith Anna.
(46:33):
By the way, I call her Malaya.
I think I called you one time.
We just call each other Malayabecause I'm...
we're gonna keep the secret whyone day we'll tell okay one day
we'll tell but we call eachother malaya um so we have these
conversations every day so youguys had a little exclusive
sneak preview um into ourconversation so thank you um
(46:55):
anna for being on the basic showthank you for sharing your input
and um i hope and i know i seeyou in the next episode next
week okay see you in the nextepisode thank you so much bye
bye
SPEAKER_00 (47:10):
so
SPEAKER_02 (47:11):
you
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