How to Get BASED: Julian, Isabella, & Adam (Bitcoin Talk on THE Bitcoin Podcast)

Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
what our company wants to do is make people wake up

(00:05):
and choose their own path.
Because obviously if you're still sleeping,
you don't know what's going on.
You can't blame people that don't know,
but if you know and you choose the wrong thing,
I mean, that's all on you.
It's way easier to trick somebody
than to convince somebody they have been tricked.
And there's a lot of people that have been tricked
and they're going to fight for their trickery.

(00:27):
They're going to fight because, you know,
daddy government told them that it was the way
and that was the right thing.
Telling them they're wrong, that they've been lied to,
is very difficult and very offensive.
And so I think that we're doing what's necessary
and learning what is necessary to slowly educate people
to wake them up.
There are millions and millions of people around the world

(00:48):
who are so close and all they need is that little push
of curiosity into Bitcoin.
And once they start to kind of like understand it,
everything else is already in place.
And those people are going to be the ones
that push this movement out to everyone else.
Today's episode is Bitcoin Talk, where I talk with my guests

(01:27):
about Bitcoin and whatever else comes up.
Today I have not one, not two, but three guests,
Julian, Isabella and Adam, who collectively make up
the media and production company, GetBased.
But calling them a media and production company
honestly seems like a disservice
because this crew is truly changing the game

(01:48):
when it comes to based content
that actually reaches outside of the Bitcoin Echo Chamber.
This was a really fun conversation
and it ranges all over the place
from what it means to be based
to creating content that pulls people out of the matrix,
to how to fix the broken fiat system,
to fundraising and sponsorship for content creators,

(02:10):
to their recent documentary on Bitcoin adoption in Peru
and a whole lot more.
I highly, highly recommend you follow Julian, Isabella
and Adam, plus their channel, GetBasedTV.
Their content is highly informative, it is hilarious.
And of course, it is exceptionally based.
You can find all their links in the show notes.

(02:32):
Before we dive in, do me a favor and subscribe
to the Bitcoin podcast wherever you are listening
and give this show a five star rating.
Or don't, Bitcoin doesn't care,
but I truly would appreciate it.
Also, just a heads up that you can find links
in the show notes to get discounts
on the Bitcoin only,
Bitbox O2 hardware wallet from Bitbox Swiss

(02:53):
and on 5G SIM cards from Cloaked Wireless,
to protect you from SIM swap attacks.
The promo code is Walker for both.
If you'd rather watch this show than listen,
head to the show notes for links to watch on YouTube,
rumble and now on Noster via highlighter.
But if you're like me and you prefer to just listen
to your podcasts, I highly recommend you check out

(03:14):
fountain.fm.
Not only can you send Bitcoin to your favorite podcasters
to give value for value, but you can earn Bitcoin
just for listening to this fucking podcast.
And if you're already listening to the Bitcoin podcast
on fountain, consider giving this show a boost
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Finally, if you are a Bitcoin only company

(03:35):
interested in sponsoring another fucking Bitcoin podcast,
hit me up on social media or through the website,
Bitcoinpodcast.net.
Without further ado, let's get into this Bitcoin talk
with the Git based crew.
Now back to Bitcoin baby NGU.
I think this is actually a very powerful narrative

(03:55):
is like within the Bitcoin space, yes, number go up,
but baby go up.
We need to repopulate the earth with Bitcoin babies.
I think it's important.
Next generation go up, man.
That's the way.
Yeah, it's, they're generated like generation B, right?
But Unicode Bitcoin B maybe, I don't know.
It's called generation B.
No, I think they're actually like generation alpha

(04:16):
or something.
Alpha?
I think aren't kids that are being born right now,
like generation alpha.
I think it is alpha.
I think if you're like your old gen right now,
you're alpha, yeah.
I don't know, some bureaucrats.
I mean, honestly, generation alpha sounds pretty cool.
Like you don't want to be generation beta, but like,

(04:38):
but you know, at least generation B.
Monikers anyways, like who came up with this?
That sounds like such a badass.
I feel like they have to live up to the name though.
Like after being called generation alpha out of all of them,
you had the baby boomers were like, they're screwed.
Then you had Gen Z.
What is that?
Then you got babies alpha.
They're like.

(04:58):
I feel like everybody forgets about Gen X too.
Like Gen X was just kind of like, Gen X is like,
so like my parents are boomers.
Like the generate like on the tail end of boomers,
like so they're younger boomers.
It's the generation that came like right after the boomers.
And I don't know why it's X exactly.
There's probably some reason for the nomenclature,

(05:21):
but they're like, I think Gen Xers are like mid forties to like 60,
something like that.
Does that sound right?
My mom said Gen X then.
Yeah, there you go.
But but there I feel like they're like the forgotten generation.
Like the boomers have just basically like the boomers
never handed over power to Gen X.
They just kind of kept it.

(05:41):
They were like, you guys can't be trusted with this, you know.
But I don't know if the boomers can either, honestly.
But I feel like that's what the Alphas are going to be like.
They're going to be like, it's all on us.
The generation that changes everything.
Because we've everything for them.
So once you take over.
The pendulum swinging like appropriately so that the Alpha

(06:03):
Gen can can be, you know, proper Alpha.
Like like you said, Julian, like, you know, baby NGU,
which is great, like sound money now, you know, having like a
foothold in existence.
We've got like, you know, I feel like society as a whole is
understanding why low time preference is good.
Right. Like, you know, our Gen was like, you know, social media sweet.

(06:25):
Let's scroll this thing for seven hours.
And then the next generation Gen Z is like, is like, oh, wow,
everyone scrolls. This is fantastic.
And now the next Gen is like, wait a minute, scrolling sucks.
We need to change that.
Sea Dwells are no good.
You know, I need to figure out my my life.
And I think that's going to be a good thing.
We talk about the fall of the West here, but man, I was looking at

(06:47):
South Korea, I think they have the lowest birth rate in the world.
It's zero point seven or zero point eight kids per couple there.
Lots of government has spent just like, I think 25 billion dollars
since 2006 to try and like come up with initiatives to get people to start
having kids. And it's just a disaster there.
So we need to export some of our baby.

(07:07):
They should just make condoms illegal.
Like what do you mean come up with initiatives?
25 billion pay me the 25 bill.
I'll just take away all the condoms.
You'll have kids like nothing.
What are you going to do with all those condoms?
What kind of an affair is playing?
Didn't happen to China, though.
They had like the one child ban so people could only have one child.

(07:28):
And then now they don't have enough population.
Well, they have way too many men because every problem that happened
goes to everyone kept on killing their daughters because they
they wanted their bloodline to survive and or their their last name
to survive, which is even more vain.
And so now they got like, yeah, they're chalked up with men.
There's no women.
Yeah, I read the stat that it's like it's getting close to 11 men in China

(07:51):
per 10 women, which means that unless you're gay and or leave the country,
like you're probably going to die alone in China.
It's pretty rough for men.
Hang on, 11 men per one woman.
If you're one of the 11, there's a good chance that like if you don't
leave the country to find a partner or you turn out to be gay,
and I don't know if that's legal in China.

(08:12):
You can't you're done, right?
Like you're not going to have a kid because you're just not going to the
numbers just don't work in your favor.
Well, if you're gay, you're not going to have a kid because the
the science doesn't work out in your favor either.
Yeah. Yeah.
I don't know if if that's if it's legal or acceptable in China to come out
publicly is homosexual yet.
The the wild thing about China is like that is just the one child policy

(08:34):
is such a fucking clear example of the terrible unintended consequences
of centralized government control of anything.
Like, but it's just so blatant.
It's like, well, we'll just limit everyone to one child.
What could go wrong?
And it's like, well, OK, we all want boys.
It's cobra. Well, the bad thing about that is like those are the worst
policies just like central banking because they do always look good in the short term

(08:56):
and people can't see 30, 40 years out.
But like the next two to five or 10 years looked pretty good for them with that policy,
just like it was for us with central banking.
But, you know, nobody cares what happens 30 years from now, right?
It's just so distant in people's time preferences.
But the thing with China is like they're just open about it.
They're like work. Yeah. You know, this is how we are.

(09:18):
This is how it is.
But then we have countries like the United States that they're like,
oh, freedom, all this, come here, be free.
And then all of a sudden they bombard you with so much so many laws
that you're really not free at all.
So then I have my respect for China.
You know, I got to give them you have to give them credit.
They're like blatantly like communists that they control your life.

(09:42):
They don't try to hide it at all.
So that's why I feel like the United States, it's sort of like a two faced person
that is like, yeah, we're nice, come.
And then they're just as strict and just as bad as China.
I would say I would agree with that to an extent.
I would also say I would still rather live in the United States of America
any day than they live in China.

(10:03):
I would live in China either.
But yeah, yeah, like it's just scary, though, because you see it's weird
when you start to see them doing things in China, like, for instance,
like digital IDs and rolling out CBD season, just social credit scores.
And then you see those same sorts of ideas floated in purportedly
free democratic societies like the United States.

(10:26):
And you're like, well, hold on, literally like the antithesis of our values
in a country's form is doing this, but you're proposing it here.
Like you hear yourself, right?
Like that's why I found like the China Bitcoin mining ban to be like
such a perfect example of that.
Because it's like the Chinese government did not like Bitcoin.
I think they banned themselves from it, though, right?
There's still massive amounts of hash rate coming from China.

(10:49):
Local, you know, municipal provinces love it because they've got something
to do with all that excess hydro and excess power that they have and they make money.
But then it's like when you see the U.S. start to have anti Bitcoin rhetoric,
which I think is also kind of shifting a little bit now.
But now you're like, well, you're just you're mimicking like the people that
in the same breath you're saying are bad and are our enemy and we need to have,

(11:11):
you know, escalating trade wars with, but you're saying, oh, no,
but on Bitcoin, they've got that part right.
Like it's just so logically inconsistent.
The mind boggles.
Hang on, hang on.
Are you suggesting that the governments are talking out of both sides of their
mouth?
What is this hate speech that you have going on here, Walker?
Come on.
I know, I know, I know.
I know, I know, I'm how dare I?

(11:33):
I'm going to be sent to the Gulag for some reeducation.
At minimum.
You know, and speaking of going to the Gulags for reeducation,
I'm your guys content has been so fucking fire, by the way.
Like I just want to say, and it is insanely based as the name would suggest.
But I start to worry that you guys start speaking too much truth, you know, and boy,

(11:58):
like the Gulags may be waiting for you if you guys keep being so based.
That's what I worry about.
This is what Bitcoin is for.
This is why Bitcoin is so important and why everything always comes back to
Bitcoin, because what are they going to take away?
Right.
They can debank you, but if you have Bitcoin in self custody, that's OK.

(12:20):
They can make you pay, you know, a bunch of money and fines.
But if you've got Bitcoin, you've been, you know, consistently having low time
preference and have a good stack of Bitcoin, that's fine.
You can afford to do that.
They can go ahead and try to punish you.
But again, if you've got your stack of Bitcoin, you jump on a plane and get out of here.
They, you know, so it's like the only way anyone can punish you for speaking truth

(12:44):
and making nonviolent crimes is because you are broke and controlled.
And the benefit about being in Bitcoin is that you are not broke or controlled.
And like I've been debanked, you know, for like a long time.
And I have a very easy time living because I've got Bitcoin in self custody and, you
know, there's like Bitcoin adjacent products that I can use.

(13:05):
And so I think this is why and people don't realize like they don't realize what
freedoms are taken away until they need the freedoms at hand.
And no one ever, no one ever needs the freedom at hand until it's too late.
Like, and I think the trucker protest that we had here in Canada was a phenomenal
example of that. And again, the only thing, the only thing that was not affected by the trucker,

(13:29):
you know, or the government overreach during that protest was Bitcoin in self custody.
Right. The GoFundMe's were all confiscated.
The Bitcoin that went through custodians were all confiscated.
Bitcoin verified to a node, no problem.
And I think that's a powerful message.
And so I'm not concerned.
I mean, I've been a target of the banks for a long time, which has been fine.

(13:53):
I think, you know, Isabella and Julian, I don't know.
I don't know if they know what they're getting into, but.
I would reckon a bet that I don't think there's anyone in the Bitcoin space who has
been as debanked as often as you have at him.
Like the amount of accounts closed.
I don't think anyone can beat you on that record.
No, it's for sure.
Like even my wife is banned from multiple banks.

(14:16):
It's it's it's quite hilarious.
What did you do?
What was your heinous crime to be?
Debank so many times.
Seriously, like, yeah, yeah, no, they won't tell me.
So the like the way that the debanking typically works is
like when it was me, so I'm like, I'm done now.
I have a small credit union here in Alberta and and they also bank our

(14:37):
like our like the public company that I that I run.
And so part of our negotiations there was that the CEO of the company
gets a checking account.
We had like that that's in the in the in the contract.
And so every other one, I'll have an account.
I'll get it open.
You know, I'll do the whole thing like send my direct deposit, you know,

(14:59):
have the have like whatever, like it's just a checking account.
Epcor, like our hydro comes out of it.
The phone bills come out like it's pretty basic.
And then three to four months later, I got a letter that's just like
we were evaluating your account.
You're outside of our risk profile.
Effective this day, it's going to be closed.
And so a few times I called actually I live streamed one time with TD.

(15:21):
Who's like one of the biggest banks here.
I live streamed like the two hour phone call that I had with them.
And it boiled down to they're not going to tell me why there's no logic
bind it and and off they go.
The funny part about TD though is so they originally gave me a seven year
ban. They were like, we are not going to bank you for seven years.

(15:42):
What? Well, that's dumb.
But okay. So then that was in 2015.
So in 2023, my seven years are up and I'm like, man, I could really use
a bank account. So I'm going to go and try to open one.
So I go there and I'm like rolling in.
I got my ID and like we're going through and the lady takes me to the back
and we're like going through all the paperwork.
And then she kind of was like, oh, this is a weird thing here.

(16:04):
I got to go check with someone.
I was like, okay, you know, go have a look thinking like, yeah, that makes
sense. You know, I was banned.
Now I'm not banned.
Like this is, you know, I imagine this is going to be some, some weirdness.
And then she comes back and she's like, oh, you're banned.
And I was like, oh, no, no, no, don't worry.
That seven year ban is over.
Like I'm good now.
She's like, no, I just heard your seven year ban was upgraded to a lifetime ban.

(16:25):
You're not able to do it.
And I was like, oh, that's weird because I haven't banked here in seven years.
I'm not sure what I could have done to make, you know, the ban upgraded.
Like, literally I've got zero activity between banning and, and, and now, you know,
what's the problem?
And she's like, oh, well, we can't disclose our, our internals.

(16:46):
And, and, and so, you know, I, I, I'm not at liberty to say basically.
And what the fuck was that?
How do you buy a house?
Yeah, with like, like.
Cash.
Cash.
Cash or, or what I actually had to do and, and shout out, let in for this.
I actually had to take a loan like backed against Bitcoin, take the cash from the loan

(17:10):
and get that wired into a trust at the lawyers so the lawyers could pay.
And then I could like basically, you know, repay the, repay the loan.
Like it's, it's completely goofy.
That's insane.
And yeah.
And, and one time.
Like, and people don't realize this, like, you know, I actually, and I have a bit of a,

(17:31):
like a humble opinion on this.
Like I actually don't fault the banks.
I, I believe in the free market and I believe that a private business, like you better believe
that the Scotiabank of CEO or if the CEO of Scotiabank wants a Bitcoin will account.
The answer is hell no, like just no way.
Just, just because you don't deserve sound money.
And I believe that I have the right to tell him no.
And, and all the big banks, like, you know, I'm talking to you specifically big bank CEOs,

(17:54):
like you're not getting an account of Bitcoin well.
But the problem is that you can actually transact and cash in this country.
And so the banks have this unusual side-handed power where you can't pay taxes with cash.
You can't buy a house with cash.
You can't buy a car with cash.
I went to go buy my wife an SUV and I'm talking to the dealer and we're like, yeah,
okay, we get the, we get the price.

(18:14):
It's all good.
And I'm like, I got to pay in cash though.
He's like, cash is no problem.
We love cash.
I was like, okay, fantastic.
So I like walking with my duffel bag and he was like, what's in the bag?
I was like cash.
He's like, oh, I thought you meant a check.
I was like, if I went to check, I would have said a check.
I said cash and I said cash.
And that's what I meant.
He's like, oh, well, we got to give the cash to the police.
The police are going to hold it for 10 days.

(18:34):
All this nonsense.
And I'm like, no, you don't like, that's just wrong.
You don't have to do that.
And the way that I know that is because I deal with cash every single day and I
don't have to give it to the police.
So, you know, you don't have to give it to the police, but they've got these weird,
backhanded like rules and the banks have these weird regulations or like internal
policies that force everyone to not deal in cash.

(18:57):
And, you know, I'm obviously an edge case.
There's not, like, there's not millions of, you know, guys in my situation,
but it does showcase how backwards the banking system is and how much power
they have, which I think is problematic.
It's just nuts because like cash is like quite literally legal tender.
Like, there's the only legal tender.

(19:18):
Yeah, like you're kind of like legally required to accept it for payment of
goods and services and all debts, public and private.
It's like the whole thing.
Like it's nuts.
I can't tell you how many times I've been walking down.
We work on White Avenue, which is like, you know, restaurant road here in
Edmonton and like I got a sandwich spot.
But when that summer spot is too busy, I go to the next sandwich spot and I went

(19:42):
to go like the sandwich was like whatever, 13 or $14.
I give him a $20 bill and he's like, Oh, we don't have change.
And I was like, dude, it's six bucks.
You don't have, you don't have a couple of tunies in your tail.
Like what are you talking about?
You don't have change.
He's like, yeah, we don't make change.
We just don't take cash.
And it's like, oh, what I've noticed is for businesses that don't have like

(20:06):
the actual owners running them, it's easier for them to do everything
through cards because they don't got to deal with their, you know, custom,
not their customers, but their workers stealing from them.
Like it's easier to steal.
But the thing at the same time, if you start thinking about it, if you have
everything through card, they're tracking every single payment.

(20:28):
And I noticed that in third world countries, obviously they love cash
because if they have cash, they don't have to report all of their earnings in
cash.
So it's like kind of like, it's crazy how the first, like the more advanced
countries are getting brainwashed for like to do everything electronically
because it's easier and they're taking, you know, the complications away.

(20:52):
Like, oh, don't get robbed by your own employees that you hire.
But you know what?
We'll track everything.
And at the end of the day, I feel like they'll end up paying way more in
taxes than they would if they got robbed by their own employees.
The thieves that are bureaucrats are worse than the thieves that are teenagers.

(21:12):
The crazy thing to do is like cash is final settlement.
Like that's the great thing about it.
It's like once that bill changes hands,
transaction complete, and I am now the owner of that cash.
It's like credit cards.
Like that can be clawed back, like, you know, a month later.
And as a business owner, it's like, okay, not only are you paying fees for that

(21:35):
privilege, but you also might not actually have that credit that you think you have.
Or you have to pay sums of money or time to just keep that dollar.
Like my mom worked, she was a bookkeeper for a restaurant and
all the time they would have like, you know, the credit card companies calling
and saying, oh, this is getting charged back.

(21:56):
You know, our client wasn't there, blah, blah, blah.
And my mom, like bless her heart, she would spend all of her time,
like for the next days, you know, digging through the receipts.
It's like, no, no, no, here's signature.
It's like, oh, no, that doesn't look like our client signature.
And it's like, no, here's the video of his drunk ass signing the receipt.
Like, yes, it is him.

(22:16):
And then it's like, oh, okay.
But she had to spend tens of hours, which to her employer is, you know,
hundreds, thousands of dollars, you know, to like fix that.
And that's just for one single charge back.
Like what happens when they're once a week, once a month and we're just such
in a habit of like, oh, the credit card, yeah, fraud, you know,
got to get a new card, no problem.

(22:38):
People don't realize the merchants pay for that, which in turn comes out of their
profit, which in turn goes back into the prices.
It just makes everything more expensive.
Yeah.
That's what I think in Miami, people like literally they're like,
we're going to go out and put everything on the card, charge everything,
get tables, get booze, whatever.
And then the next day they call their credit card account and say that wasn't them.

(23:02):
Yeah.
And we don't realize like how pernicious it is for small businesses,
especially restaurants, because restaurants are lucky if they make like a five
to 10 percent profit margin.
And I think like average charge back rates are about 2%.
So imagine you're squeaking by with like 5% profit and then randomly you get a phone
call, half of that profits gone because you have to dispute it with a credit card

(23:22):
provider and like they're not going to give you all the details.
And it's like you can go out of business tomorrow just because of a charge back
if you're a restaurant or a very low margin business.
100% man, it's it's brutal.
Brutal.
So yeah, I mean, Bitcoin, like final set, like finality right away.
You don't have to worry with like some sticky fingers.
You know, you just have a watch only like it just it's just solved so many problems.

(23:45):
It's it's absolutely.
Well, except if you're using Ethereum, Ethereum you can do chargebacks with.
You just need to have a big enough amount and then.
Yeah, you just call it italic and the Ethereum foundation and they'll just like
little control Zed action and off they go.
Bitcoin fixes this.
Ethereum does not.
I want to know how that transition because Adam, you've been unbanked for like your

(24:07):
whole Bitcoin career.
So how has it been and how has Bitcoin like evolved in it?
Is it easier now to pay people than it was like back in the day?
Like how did you survive back in the day to now?
Like he literally.
He needed.
That's like a well story.
Yeah, everything that Adam needed to get banking features.

(24:27):
He just built.
It's crazy.
Literally.
This is actually a perfect segue to the general question I like to open with.
And by open, I mean, after a lot of banter and sometimes I forget to ask the
question, but I do want to know from each of you and Adam, we can start with you.
Like who are you and how did you get here today?
So Isabella, thank you because you set that up just perfect.

(24:47):
You're the cohost, man.
I know I love it.
I love it.
I like better talking about other people than myself.
I get intimidated with podcasts.
Don't worry.
This is this is a zero intimidation zone.
It's a yeah, this is a safe space, but like a real safe space, not like a fake safe
space.

(25:09):
But anyway, Adam, you want to kick us off with that?
Because I am also very curious like how that transition has felt to you.
Yeah.
Yeah.
So found Bitcoin in like 2013, it had just hit all time highs of 100 bucks.
And I was like, fake internet money worth 100 bucks.
I'm going to be a hero on Reddit and prove everyone wrong, which is how all the best,

(25:33):
you know, Bitcoin maxies start.
I just gave a presentation at the Canadian Bitcoin conference where I said there's like
two and then it branched into three kinds of people.
There's like pre Bitcoin maximalists and then there's Bitcoin maximalists.
And and that's like fully my my journey is, you know, going from like hater,
disbeliever to like, oh, hey, that encryption actually kind of makes.

(25:55):
Oh, hey, this consensus also kind of made.
Wait a second.
It's got this level of decentralization and it's got proof of work.
Well, how does the economy money works like that?
Well, yeah, Bitcoin is way better.
And then it's like, oh, wow, Bitcoin is just the obvious answer.
And so started selling Bitcoin, just put an ad on like Kajiji and Craigslist.
I was just like, yo, I'm selling Bitcoin like, you know, call me just with my like

(26:20):
normal phone number on the internet and, you know, had a couple meetings a month
and then a couple of week.
And then, yeah, I just kind of turned into like, like every day I was meeting
someone talking about Bitcoin.
I like I probably had four concetius coins passed through my hands like before

(26:40):
they were, you know, like really frigging awesome.
I know a guy that's got two right now, one of them's for sale and and.
Good ones.
Yeah.
Can you for anyone that doesn't know, can you can you explain what that is?
So they were like coins that were minted with a private key with one coin on them,
like verifiably, you know, kind of sealed and then sold in a limited quantity.

(27:04):
And they sell it a premium to Bitcoin because they're obviously worth a Bitcoin.
You can strip the key,
but they're like they're rare.
They're a piece of Bitcoin history at this point.
And like I remember unwrapping one in McDonald's.
And this I'd never heard of it before.
And this lady came and she was like, I broke up with my boyfriend and he gave me
this stupid coin.

(27:24):
I got to get some money like blah, blah, blah.
And I was like, all right.
Well, this is obviously a scam.
She's like, no, there's some QR code on it.
Like he said, if you peel something back, then you get some code and then you can
get the Bitcoin and I like cracked it, ripped it with my ice cream sundae beside me.
Like like a noob.

(27:45):
And I like, yeah, just ripped the private key.
And I was like, OK, yeah, here's your I think I gave her like 500 bucks.
Was the price of Bitcoin at the time.
And I was like, here you go.
Like thanks very much.
And then probably the coin is somewhere sitting in my basement or like, you know,
I'm kind of a hoarder, so I didn't throw it away.
But yeah, like there's little things like that.
And then gold, like actually gold.

(28:06):
No, they're like there.
I don't think they're gold anyways.
Not the.
What I don't know, Walker, do you know?
I do not think they were actually made of gold because at that time,
like an ounce of gold was worth significantly more than a than a Bitcoin.
So I would just like their gold plated.

(28:26):
Like their metal, like with like a gold, you know, wrapping, I guess.
Peter Schiff would still like them is what you're saying.
They are shiny.
Yeah.
And then, and then, yeah, I then found Bitcoin ATMs.
And I was like, wow, this is way better than
meeting people and kind of deploy to me.
How did you buy Bitcoin?

(28:48):
Just beer?
Because that's what you understand.
Back in the day, how did people buy Bitcoin?
Yeah, I was a huge middleman.
So there was a shop in Calgary run by Dave Bradley, who like now works with us
at Bitcoin Well, and I would drive down to see Dave, like a couple times a month.
I just stock up on Bitcoins and then just come back to Edmonton and sell them.

(29:12):
And then I'd be out and I'd call them and be like, hey, I need some coins.
And I'd drive back down and bring them like cash or a check or whatever.
And then come back and sell them.
And yeah, that was the old days.
That was kind of like there was no and then and then eventually, like,
you know, in 2015, there was some exchanges.
There was an exchange here in Canada called CA Vertex, which

(29:35):
I don't I think it rugged a couple people.
But as far as like exchanges that once were that are now closed, it was like
pretty good.
And then there was Wallet of Satoshi and then, of course,
Quadriga were kind of the main three.
I remember in 2015, I think I was at a conference in Toronto,
like a Bitcoin conference in Toronto.
And I was sitting with like I had lunch with the like with Jerry from Quadriga,

(30:00):
Mike from Wallet of Satoshi.
And I don't think the CA Vertex guy was there.
But it was like this was all this was Bitcoin.
It was everything that was that was how it worked.
And yeah, and that's that was that.
And then slowly, you know, after that, like,
you know, running a Bitcoin ATM business has Bitcoin and cash.

(30:24):
So there's a bunch of problems there and started kind of losing banks and blah,
blah, blah. And then eventually I kind of started getting in trouble myself.
So I was like, OK, well, I need to find a way to like I've got Bitcoin and this is
very good, but how do I, you know, how do I buy groceries?
And so it was like use a credit card and then, you know, try to find a payment

(30:46):
that would pay my credit card off and so give them Bitcoin.
And then that kind of just morphed into like effectively what Bitcoin well is
today, which is a place to use to use Bitcoin.
But there was no like farmers market selling eggs for stats or anything like that.
I'm I'm I'm like pretty bullish on that.
I think that's very important.

(31:07):
But it's going to be interesting to see.
Like, I mean, we went, the three of us to Vancouver, we used Bitcoin.
And it was it was a challenging experience.
Like that day also happened to be like the worst day because LND and LN and
Lightning Core were like fighting.
So there was some like protocol issues.
But I yeah, I think I think I am a great example of someone running a legitimate

(31:31):
business publicly traded that the banks just don't like.
And therefore I have no access to my money.
My wife is losing access to her money.
And it's it's shocking how little care,
how much bureaucracy there is inside the bank.
It's I've got I've got so many insane stories of like just crazy things that I've

(31:52):
done inside the bank as like a result of what they've done to get what I what I want.
Like we sold a house one time and had the money deposited into a checking account,
which was in my name.
And the bank column was like, you're done.
You know, it got it got the letter in the whole bit.
And I was like, OK, well, I need this money in cash.
Like I'm not taking a bank draft.
So for two weeks, we argue about whether or not I can have it in cash.

(32:15):
Finally, they're like, OK, we'll get it in cash Friday, 4 p.m.
You got to show up at the bank.
You know, we'll have it ready for you.
We'll go to the back room and say we'll count it and then you can leave.
Perfect. No problem.
So I walk into the bank on time.
Like it's all good.
Ready to like rock up my backpack.
And they're like,
oh, here's a check.

(32:35):
We we had to write you a draft.
And I was like freaked out.
I was like, I would not chill.
I was like, this is not cool, you guys.
Like I don't have banks and it was like, you know, it was like a like.
It was like, you know, 700 K.
It was a big sum of money.
And I was like, guys, I need this in cash.
I have no other place to put this.
No banks like you guys got to give me cash.

(32:56):
Like no, no.
And then the guys are telling me there was nothing he could do.
And I was like, OK, fine, put it in my wife's name.
And he's like, no, the draft is written.
There's nothing I can do.
It's there. It's printed. It's done.
Jesus. So I took this seven thousand
dollar bank draft right in front of him and I ripped it.
And I said, hey, my draft is broken.

(33:16):
When you're making the new one, do you mind putting it in my wife's name?
And he like he got very upset.
He turned all red.
He like stormed off to the back and they had to like it was actually kind of a big
deal. They had to like call Toronto and then I do a bunch of stuff.
I just signed like a whole bunch of paperwork.
And but then I got it.
I got the draft in in my wife's name.

(33:37):
And it's just like it goes to show that they don't care.
Like, you know, we go through weeks of discussion about exactly how this money
had to be delivered to me.
They just completely disregarded that and then refused to do, you know,
I compromise on saying, like, OK, fine, we'll put it in my wife's name.
Again, petrify that I won't actually be able to touch that cash.
And then, you know, nothing we can do, nothing we can do, nothing we can do.

(34:00):
And, you know, well, look at that.
This fake, this fake money is broken.
Why don't you go ahead and do something about that and just do the thing that I
don't want you to do. So yeah, those experiences, that'll radicalize you as a
like as a human being where you just like this is so broken.
It furthers the mission, man.

(34:21):
Like it like when I when I tell people that Bitcoin will exist to to enable
independence, they're like, ah, you know, what does that mean?
I'm independent. I've got my money in the bank.
I got my RSPs and my 401k.
I'm so independent.
And it's like, really? Because let me tell you a story over the last seven years,
how independent I've been, you know, doing all the things that I was told to do

(34:42):
with the exception of like starting a Bitcoin business.
So yeah, how dare you?
And yeah, we're seeing it more and more like we saw Kanye West get debanked
for having some like, you know, not so great opinions.
We're seeing we saw a church this year, a church took a pro-life
stance publicly and the church lost their bank account.
Like we're seeing time with the trucker protest, like we're seeing time and time

(35:05):
again, your opinions, your free speech kind of has some some consequences
that you might not expect, which makes it, you know, maybe not such a free speech
environment.
Yeah.
Well, I appreciate the the background because it's I mean, like you've just
radicalized me even more.
I've been lucky enough not to be debanked.

(35:27):
But but Isabella, I'd love to hear from you as well and and and Julian,
in whichever order you two choose, you guys are the team, I'll let you fight it out.
Who are you?
How'd you get here today?
And maybe also what what radicalized you?
Oh, no, you go first.
You've been pretty quiet.

(35:48):
Yeah, I know I like listening to these stories.
Yeah, me too.
After Adam's story, everybody looks like a wimp now.
I know it's it's it's OK.
We're all in the same boat there to like the bank.
Our reckoning is coming.
You'll see. Yeah. Yeah.
All right. Well, Isabella, kick us off.
All right. So my story, I have more of a funny story of how I got into Bitcoin.

(36:14):
It happened in 2021.
So I graduated college and obviously like I had to work.
So I ended up, you know, mid pandemic.
There was no no places we're hiring.
So what I ended up doing was a friend of mine was working at a fulfillment hub.

(36:34):
And he was like, hey, like, I know the owner.
Why don't you go for an interview?
And I go for an interview.
And I didn't really know I kind of like went in there to pitch them myself.
You know, like I'm a really hard worker.
Like, let me know what I can do anything.
And in the middle of the meeting, they were like, you know what?
Why don't we do like, you know, you study journalism.

(36:56):
Why don't we do an online e-commerce, you know, daily news type of thing?
So I pitched to them the idea that, you know, I would run this whole business of
sending the news of what was happening with all the shipments.
Because at this time, Amazon was booming, dropshipping, everything.
So all the clothes, all the merchants and everything was in the products were

(37:20):
coming from China. And I don't know if you guys remember, but in 2021,
there was a shipment of boat that just sank and nobody was getting their stuff.
But nobody knew about that.
So I kind of like pitched to them that idea.
And I start doing Econ, like the name was called Econ Daily News.

(37:40):
And I start running it whatever day to day.
And then Bitcoin, the Bitcoin conference was happening in Windwood.
And at the time I lived in Miami and my boyfriend calls me, he's like, yo,
you have to go to cover the Bitcoin conference.
Bitcoin is online internet money.
You know, you're doing an e-commerce website.

(38:02):
You have to go and cover the event.
So I go into the event and I find out that the tickets for media were like around
$300 and I emailed them to get some media pass and they're like, no,
it costs money, whatever.
So I tell my boss, like my boss, I was like, hey,
we have to go and cover Bitcoin Daily News, you know, the Bitcoin conference.

(38:23):
He's like, yeah, all right, perfect.
Go. And I'm like, no, but we have to pay like $300.
I'm not going to pay at time.
You have to go by yourself and figure it out.
And they weren't giving me the media passes.
So I was like, shit, what do I do?
So I decided to create this, you know,
brand awareness by doing this free coffee stand outside, because in my mind,

(38:48):
I was like, everybody's going to be lining up outside and that way I can cover
the event. If I can't be inside, I'll be outside. Same thing.
And I realize, all right, but I just can't stand there.
Right. So I start emailing all the speakers.
So I look at the speakers list and there were like 200 of them.

(39:08):
And I would send them same message to all of them.
I would get banned on Instagram for like an hour because I kept sending the same
message, so I would have to go on Twitter.
And then that's when I started realizing all these people were super big on Twitter.
And I had never used Twitter.
I had Twitter back in the day, but I never used it.

(39:30):
So as I'm emailing all of them, only two people wrote back.
And it was Ben from VTC Sessions and Alex Swetski.
But Ben was like, hey, I can't meet you for this interview.
But, you know, like maybe another time.
And Alex Swetski, like in my message, I was like, hey, I'm a startup.

(39:52):
Could I could I do an interview for you while you're here in Miami?
I'll give you free coffee.
And Alex Swetski was like, I don't like coffee.
And I'm like, all right, I'll give you cookies.
He's like, no, I don't like sugar.
And I'm like, OK, well, can I just interview you for, you know, EGOM Daily News?

(40:13):
He's like, no, but come to this meetup that is happening before the conference.
And I was like, fine, I'll go to the meetup and I'll, you know, see what I can get there,
cover something.
And he sends me this like two links.
He's like, you got to get telegram.
You got to get signal.
We don't use WhatsApp.
We don't use I message.
And I'm like, OK, so I'm downloading everything.

(40:37):
And I show up to like the meetup that was at seven.
And I go in, it was at this ramen noodles place in Brickle.
And I'm sitting there and all of a sudden, you know, he didn't show up at seven.
It was just like a random meetup.
And I overhear this couple talking about Bitcoin.
And I'm like, hey, guys, could I sit with you?

(40:58):
And they start telling me about Bitcoin, the community.
And I start asking more questions.
And I realized these are the smartest people I have ever met.
I'm like, something has to be right here.
After a couple hours, Alex shows up and they start teaching me everything.

(41:20):
The community is so nice.
That's one thing like people from the outside don't get.
How did like maybe they're intimidating online, but in person, they are very nice.
They have the patience to explain everything.
Everybody was just like high on life because the pandemic, they didn't have
their conference in 2020.
So this was like the first conference that they were all having, because I think

(41:43):
they moved it from California.
And when we're sitting there after a while, Alex is like, you know what?
I like you.
I'm going to help you get into the conference.
Come tomorrow at noon and we'll figure it out.
So I end up going to the conference through Alex as his media person.
And I end up obviously covering the whole conference in a he I was sort of like

(42:09):
his personal chauffeur, I was Maddox and Francis.
I would drive them everywhere and they would sneak me into all like the after
events and everything and I'm just getting orange spilled in the car in Miami by
Francis telling me like, you need to understand, you're not free until you have
your own money, your own money is Bitcoin.

(42:32):
After those three days, I remember selling all my stocks and just going all in on
Bitcoin in like peak 69 K.
And I've been in it ever since.
Man, that's a that is a great.
Like quite a whirlwind introduction, though, like that definitely like not typical.

(42:52):
You had some of probably the best, let's say, orange pilling mentors that you
that you could have had.
Like that's that's pretty incredible.
And you know, you're so right about the there's such a massive gap between the
perception of toxic Bitcoiners online.
And then if you're ever in person, like anyone who's been to a conference knows
this, like people are so happy to share their time with you, to share their

(43:13):
expertise, to share their knowledge, like it's like, yeah, we may be toxic online,
but that's just because we like we got to keep our guard up.
You know, we got to fend off all of the fiat fuckery that's out there.
But like, you know, you get to sit where all just people, right?
Yeah, they're the nicest people ever.
I remember when I joined and being part, obviously, it's super overwhelming.

(43:36):
I'm probably the one that joined like the latest.
So not having any knowledge about Bitcoin and then going into like the Bitcoin
industry, like you get so overwhelmed because people are so smart.
And I remember thinking that we don't realize how early we still are.
Because once you're in the Bitcoin community, you're like, oh, you know,

(44:00):
you know, we are trained past, you know, we should have bought in this time.
Like that a lot of people I hear like say that like, oh, you know,
you know, but we don't realize that the majority of the population,
they still don't get Bitcoin at all.
It's we are still early, like really fucking early.

(44:24):
Really early, which is a good thing.
And now, Julian, you will be forced to speak.
Who are you?
How did you get here today to be spinning up this new media empire
with these other two based individuals?
You know, it's so funny, like
because Adams, I know that Adam got started in 2013.
I realized I got started in 2013, too.

(44:45):
And our paths could not be any more different, but yet they've kind of come
around, you know, after 11 years, I found Bitcoin in 2013 because I literally
just wanted peer to peer electronic cash to buy vegetables on the internet that I
couldn't buy without. And that's that's all I cared about.
I was like, I just like they say that I need this thing to get the actual thing

(45:06):
that I want. So I'll grok it a little bit just enough to be able to use it.
I get my thing and I don't touch it for another three years.
And then I start hearing about it again in 2016.
I'm just finishing up my film degree at UBC.
I am about to graduate.
I have a little bit of leftover student loans to my name about three thousand
bucks worth. And so I hear about it again through our favorite our favorite

(45:31):
shitcoin, Ethereum, and I kind of go all in on that, you know, sold the whole smart
contract thing. It's Bitcoin 2.0.
I like the sound of that because Bitcoin 1.0 was a little bit daunting
for me when I first used it.
And that was three days before the Dow hack.
And so I buy Ethereum within three days, it drops down.

(45:52):
And I'm like, oh, man, that's, you know, that was all the money I had left.
You know, at least I'll make it back, you know, a couple of months at work.
But let's just hold on a little and see what happens.
And it got me down this rabbit hole of learning, oh, can they reverse the blockchain?
What's the point of that if they can just undo it?
And that is what kind of brought me back into Bitcoin is learning about all that.

(46:12):
But it took a very long time for that full circle to complete.
In the meantime, I got really into Ethereum smart contracts.
Learning about this stuff eventually went down a very dark path in terms of
things that Bitcoin Maxis wouldn't approve of.
I started my own video production company and our flag shipped offering was doing
video animations for ICOs back in 2017.

(46:36):
So I I rose to the top.
If you look up my business, Kinetic Cuts or you look up ICO animated explainer,
my website is still like top four or five on the SEO for that.
And we produced something like
20 or 30 ICO videos for some of the biggest ones.
We did work for Binance's BNB token.

(46:59):
We did like a couple of little things for that.
So yeah, I got really into that shit corner and I was sold.
Like I didn't think it was like a shit coin.
I thought blockchain changes, everything decentralized ledgers.
And it really took like, you know, seeing that whole thing collapse,
the pandemic and basically it wasn't really until I heard Michael Saylor
talking about it and differentiating the difference or the outlining the difference

(47:21):
between Bitcoin and crypto that I finally said, enough with this crypto stick,
the real revolution's Bitcoin, it's the only one that's going to last.
I've seen enough of them fall and I've seen the faults that all of them just keep
keep seeming to repeat.
And then I said, OK, like that was a very long journey to get there and understand
the difference. And so I want to shorten that for the other people.

(47:43):
And the best way I know how to do that is just by making videos.
Got in front of the camera.
I've been doing YouTube since around 2019, 2020.
I didn't get into it more seriously until 22.
And did all I could on my own while still trying to balance, you know,
another business and income and dealing with Bitcoin.
And then the level up moment came.

(48:04):
It was in 22 that I met Adam.
I forget how exactly we connected.
I was I was doing like a little podcast thing, trying to interview some people.
And I just really hit it off with Adam,
invited him down to Guatemala because I wanted to go review a Bitcoin circular
economy. I did a little trip to El Salvador in 21.
That was fun.
I know a lot of people like in the Bitcoin space,

(48:26):
avoided the Vax and I didn't unfortunately.
And the only reason was because I wanted to film a Bitcoin documentary down
El Salvador and you needed it.
And I was like, OK, well, I'll take the poison and the
destroyed sperm count just to make my film.
Ended up doing that.
And then 22 comes around.
I have this idea. I want to go back down there.
We'll do one in Guatemala.
Adam comes with me.

(48:46):
We do this film there.
It does really well, have a blast doing it and collaborating with another person.
And then later that year, Mike Peterson from
Bitcoin Beach sees that film and says, hey, you should check out what this
group motive is doing in Peru.
I look into that.
They have like 15 to 19 circular economies down there.
And I have to make a film about that, but it's a bit of a bigger trip.

(49:10):
So I'm like, OK, I got to find someone to come with me.
I've been following Isabella, I think, from the Bitcoin magazine stuff.
And then I just saw that you posted.
Oh, like it's Proving Independence Day.
So I DM her.
I'm like, yo, I want to do this documentary.
Come with me. We'll figure it out.
She's like, yes, I heard later that she thought I was a serial killer and that's fine.

(49:31):
We make that in December.
It came out a week or two ago.
But in between that, I say, look, I got these two awesome energetic individuals
that love Bitcoin, that really want to do something different in this space, too,
in terms of media.
Let's just band together and we'll we'll make something of it.
And that is that is how GetBased got here.

(49:52):
I love the journey.
And I actually I want to I want to dig into the
the doc that you guys made in Peru, because it was first of all, it was fucking awesome.
And like it was really genuinely powerful and incredibly eye opening.
And I'll link it in the show notes, because I thought it was just exceptionally well done.

(50:14):
The story that you guys told down there was really important and kind of shifted
my perspectives on some things as well.
And I want to want to get into that a little bit.
But maybe can you just talk a little bit about like, what is kind of the ethos
behind GetBased and maybe a better question?
What does what does getting based?
What does based mean to you?

(50:34):
I just asked right before we got on here, I fired off a tweet and a note on Noster,
saying like, OK, what does based mean to you?
And I got a lot of different responses.
But I'm curious to you guys, what does it mean to get based?
And how does that factor into like how you guys look at producing content?
And who are you targeting with that content?

(50:54):
Yeah, that's a really good question.
And it is evolving.
But let's let's nail that with like a little lightning round first with just the
meaning of based for me, it means being authentic and sometimes authentic to a fault.
Like just saying things and not being fearful of what the crowd is going to react
to when it comes to it and as long as you're sticking to the truth,
like not letting people's reactions shake you.

(51:18):
I like that. What about you, Isabella?
Yo, I didn't even know what based was.
They actually taught me based and Julian keep telling me that I say it wrong.
He's like, you can't use based.
You can't use it so liberally.
You've got to be you've got to use it to make sense.
It sounds so cool.
Like for me, it's like, you know, you're based.
Like you're a dope human being.

(51:40):
So for I'm probably the worst one to say what this based mean.
But from what I've gathered from them is someone that honestly just, you know,
has woken up from the truth, you know, they took the it's the red pill they take,
right? You know, the orange one, not the ninth quail.
Yeah, exactly.

(52:01):
That's how I think like someone that knows what's going on.
So I think that's probably what our company wants to do is make people wake up
and choose their own path.
Because obviously, if you're still sleeping, you don't know what's going on.
So you can't really be like, you can't blame people that don't know.

(52:23):
But if you know and you choose the wrong thing, I mean, that's all on you.
Amen.
Adam, what about you?
It's a mixture of both those things.
It's it's it's being awake.
It's it's understanding, you know, the truth, being able to critically think,
understanding that, you know, we don't take your word.
We don't we don't trust what you have to say.

(52:44):
I mean, I think BTC pay server just released that video.
My trust in you is broken.
And like that is the that is the ethos.
It's you don't trust what people have to say.
But then to Issa's point there, like the next phase is communication.
The next phase is helping other people wake up.
Because I would be nowhere if it weren't for, you know, my community and the people

(53:07):
that I trust, because I've verified and understanding from them, you know,
how important it is to to tell other people and to talk to other people.
And I think that being based is like, yeah, not not being afraid to say what you know
to be true. And, you know, there was like, especially throughout, I think,

(53:30):
my like baseness increased dramatically throughout COVID and like disagreeing
with lots of it, but then, you know, taking the stance of like,
like, no, I'm not going to wear your mask.
I'm not going to be rude to you.
But I'm going to politely decline your ridiculous obligations.

(53:50):
I'm not going to take your medicine.
My kids will not be taking your medicine.
Like, I, you know, we had like, we sent my kids to school without masks with, you know,
and we had to get like fancy letters that said they were not going to wear a mask
and like, you know, the whole doctor stamp and everything, but we did that.
We did the extra work.
And then it was interesting, like seeing parents text me and be like,
what's the deal? How come?

(54:11):
And I'm like, it's not it's it's it's worse than to wear a mask.
Here's the science. Here's the reason.
And then what do you know?
A couple of weeks later, you know, their kids are not wearing a mask.
And like when you don't perpetuate like
compliance to the blind is perpetuation of the lie.
And that's specific to COVID, but now like generally speaking, like if we don't
talk about Bitcoin to people that don't know otherwise, you know,

(54:36):
we're perpetuating the lie of central banking.
If we don't talk about, you know, the negativity of seed oils to our health,
you know, we're perpetuating the lie that is big food.
And that goes forever.
That drives forever.
If I don't tell you about life, you know, after death and and like,
you know, what eternity looks like, that's a perpetuation of the lie that is,

(55:00):
you know, the great fall and say like it goes, it literally translates across all
of life. And I think that being based as someone that knows the truth,
has verified the truth, understands the truth to be real,
seeks more truth and then tells as many people as possible.
But I also think there's a bit of a balance there because we run the risk

(55:23):
of being in our echo chamber, just like, you know, circle jerking each other off,
like getting all excited about, about whatever it is we're excited about.
And having that, like, I think, I think the biggest risk to Bitcoin,
the biggest risk to being awake is that people perceive us to be toxic and

(55:43):
that people won't come near us because, you know, they're intimidated or they're
afraid. And I think that collectively we need to be based and we need to
deliver that message in such a positive, welcoming light that people are like,
I want to hear more about what that guy has to say.
Because like, I don't know about you, but there's been zero street corner

(56:06):
preachers that have ever converted anybody to like, you know, Christ.
You do that by like loving people. And I think that the same attitude
applies to Bitcoiners in like, you know, shouting that you're going to be poor
and broke and dumb and dead is probably not how you're going to orange pill someone.
Once you have a relationship, it certainly is.

(56:27):
But that initial contact piece is so, and that's why I love this, this,
this organization and this team is because, you know, we've got that message
and we're nailing that message home.
We're doing it in a modern, exciting and positive way that people are like,
I don't disagree with what that guy has to say, but I actually might, you know,

(56:48):
I didn't mind how we delivered that. Maybe I'll check it out again.
And then it happens again and again.
And then it's like, well, that's actually a really good point.
I didn't consider that. Now maybe I'm, I'm, you know, I'm starting to open
my mouth for the orange pill.
And, and, and then it kind of, it trickles down, but it's, it's a low time
preference game. It's way easier to trick somebody than to convince somebody

(57:11):
they have been tricked. This is one of my favorite mantras or quotes from this
space. And there's a lot of people that have been tricked and they're going to
fight for their trickery. They're going to fight because, you know,
daddy government told them that it was the way and that was the right thing.
Telling them they're wrong, that they've been lied to is very difficult and
very offensive. And so I think that, you know, we're doing what's necessary and

(57:35):
learning what is necessary to slowly educate people to, to wake them up.
If you consider yourself a based individual who pursues truth and does
not trust, but verifies, then you need some based open source Bitcoin only
hardware. Head to bitbox.swiss slash Walker and use promo code Walker for

(57:58):
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The bitbox o2 is easy as hell to use whether you're brand new to Bitcoin
or you are a well seasoned psychopath. It's Bitcoin only.
And again, it is fully open source. You can head to their GitHub and verify

(58:22):
that for yourself. There is no need to trust me.
When you go to bitbox.swiss slash Walker and use the promo code Walker,
not only do you get 5% off, but you also help support this fucking podcast.
So seriously, thank you. And thank you to bitbox for being a sponsor of this
show since the early days. It means a lot for a based company like yourselves

(58:45):
to believe in this little old podcast.
Well, you know, it's funny you say that because yesterday I was having
conversation with my mom about the pharmaceutical industry.
And what I've been realizing is the truth is coming out eventually.
You know, and now we have things to back it up.
So we were discussing Adderall use and the thing is like now everybody's

(59:08):
using Adderall and she thinks it's okay because everybody's using it.
And she's like, I have to trust the doctor. What the doctor saying, I'm like,
mom, Oxy, Oxy, Oxy, that's literally what's going on.
The doctors were prescribing Oxy Coding to everybody and anybody.
That's your proof that you cannot trust the doctor.

(59:30):
Even like you have to even do your own research,
even though the doctor says is okay. And being woke yesterday,
I was like going back to back to doctor, doctor's appointments and the
ability for them to tell you how like, take this medication, take this
medication. Oh, you have acne. They were giving me a medication that I have

(59:52):
to get blood work every single month. I was like, how is that even okay?
Like what? And my mom was like freaking out. She was like, oh my goodness,
you're going to have to be on antibiotics for the rest of your life.
And it's like, you cannot even trust the doctors.
And now we have proof that they even fucked up, that the whole system is

(01:00:14):
corrupt. And sometimes we just got to remind them and be like,
they are the ones that are in charge of putting all these people on
people that, you know, like broke their legs or that had a concussion,
whatever, they put them on oxycontin and then all of a sudden they're heroin
addicts. People forget that. And it's like,

(01:00:35):
you have to constantly keep reminding them that the system is corrupt.
There are like, if you look a little bit further,
there's some, you know, proof that they fucked up and that things are not how
they seem. They are, they just forget. And it's,
it's something that the incentives are so perverse and so broken.

(01:00:58):
And it's, it is so systemic. And you know, it's like,
this is where Bitcoiners get grief sometimes because we're like, well,
you know, Bitcoin fixes this because, you know, fix the money, fix the world.
But what we really mean is also fix the money,
thereby fixing the incentives, thereby allowing the world to heal,
to, to become better because it's these perverted incentives.
Like to the, to your example with, with doctors, it's like, well, why, you know,

(01:01:22):
why are they pushing that? Well,
cause they were getting kickbacks from big pharma for every new script that
they're writing. And like, okay,
so they're going to write as many scripts as they can because the incentives are
so broken that they allow them to get rich by prescribing poison.
Like that's messed up. Like the incentive shouldn't be structured that way.
And I really appreciate these,

(01:01:43):
these examples or these definitions of what based is,
cause I think those are, they're right in the money and what like to distill what,
what you've all three kind of said here, it's, it's about integrity,
but not just having integrity,
not being afraid to speak up and share your views that are based on your
principles that you have come to,

(01:02:03):
not just because you ingested someone else's worldview and regurgitated it,
changing a few words, you know,
chat, chit, bt style and made it your own mantra. No, no, no,
it's because you did the work to understand it, to approach something and come up
with a thought that is actually original and well-reasoned.
And that's why you're sharing it.
And internalized. I think that's the key is like, we're not just

(01:02:25):
practicing what we preach, but we're also believe what we, what we talk about.
And I think that's a, that's a special thing.
It really is. And Julian, I think you may have started to want to say something
and I want to let you run if you do.
Oh, I was just going to say, I think, um, like,
I think where we differ in the challenge here is that we can have these beliefs

(01:02:46):
and I think a lot of people do, but people's approaches are so different to it.
And I think there's a lot of base people out here and the approach they've
generally taken is let's do it through these like raw conversations or let's
write a book. And I think these things are effective,
but we have to look at when, when we want to move the cultural mindset and we want
to get people to think a certain way to seek out the truth,

(01:03:08):
it still has to be approached sort of like a sales funnel.
If you want the movement to succeed.
And I think the number one thing that Bitcoin's been missing is like that,
that top of the sales funnel. Like we have the middle,
we have those deeper conversations.
If you want to get in depth about anything on Bitcoin, there's a podcast for it.
And then you have, you know, bottom of the funnel, BTC sessions has all the
tutorials and like how to actually physically get yourself there and get

(01:03:30):
sovereign, but we're missing those hooks that really again,
like break out of the echo chambers and just get people curious to ask questions.
And sometimes that content, like it's got to be, you know,
those like little silly 60 second shorts that we do.
But I still think while you're at the top of the funnel,
you can go a little bit deeper and exploring things and really peaking
people's interest and intrigue. And it's just that's the,

(01:03:52):
that's kind of the area where I really like to play.
And I think all of us have kind of like come together on is there's so much room
there. You know, when we look at who has,
who has the top of funnel on the other side, it's, it's big media.
It's Hollywood. They get to produce these films that, you know,
send out certain messages. They get to have fun on their talk shows.
Stephen Colbert gets to dress up people in like vaccine needles and do like a

(01:04:15):
vax dance. And it's, it's, it's propaganda.
But, you know, what we're doing is still a belief structure.
And this is going to sound weird, but like we need to do our own propaganda.
We need to do it well because it's, it's propaganda that pushes people towards
the truth, that pushes people towards finding self-responsibility and

(01:04:37):
meaning and purpose. And I think it's all for a good cause if it's approached like
that, but that is, I think the path moving forward.
I think the most important thing that Bitcoin is creating besides the protocol
for sound money is a, is the subset of values that kind of come with what you
basically need to adopt as a person in order to really grok Bitcoin is,

(01:04:57):
which you have to understand that you cannot trust, you know, anything.
You have to figure out trust minimization in all of these things.
You have to figure out trust minimization in all aspects of life and really go
towards verification. And you can preach that as much as you can,
but people don't get it until they're kind of like clocked into it and they
start seeing their friends and their family and the culture kind of coalesce

(01:05:22):
around that idea. And yeah, that's sort of like, you know, that's sort of the goal
right now. I think also there's a lot of talk in Bitcoin about how we need to
get out of the echo chamber and some people go all the way to the other end of the
spectrum. They're like, okay, like we really need to get out of this echo
chamber. We need to appeal to the people who are enemies first. So we're going to
go to like, we're going to do, you know, and there's nothing wrong with this.

(01:05:43):
We're going to do the progressive Bitcoiners podcast. We got to get people
who are like so far on the other side and start roping them into what we're
doing. And we've done a bit of that too in some sense because we're talking
about, you know, these like human rights use cases for Bitcoin. And I think that
kind of appeals across the spectrum. But I think where the real meat is,
and people don't really realize this is I think that there's a ton of people that,
you know, Adam and I have called like the 90%ers that are 90% there. They just

(01:06:07):
don't actually have the understanding of what Bitcoin is and how it plays into
the value set that we pretty much identically share with them. And the people
I'm talking about the 90%ers are the people who are homesteaders who are
fully, you know, self sovereign in their food supply, their energy that understand,
you know, the value of keeping everything community tight versus relying on like a
federal state. We're talking about the libertarians, which, you know, surprisingly

(01:06:31):
have very little knowledge on Bitcoin and are reaching out all the time to
Bitcoiners to get them to speak and explain this stuff a little better to
them. You know, we're talking about, you know, the, I don't know, the 15 plus
million people down in Argentina who voted for Malay because they want to,
you know, take charge of their own path and their own economic destiny and
manifest that. There are millions and millions of people around the world who

(01:06:54):
are so close and all they need is that little push of curiosity into Bitcoin.
And once they start to kind of like understand it, everything else is
already in place. And those people are going to be the ones that push this
movement out to everyone else. I think that's such an important point. And one
of the things I love about the content that you guys are producing is it is

(01:07:16):
pain point focused first, because even if you don't, you have no idea Bitcoin
exists. So let's, you know, hypothetically, you have no idea somehow you have
missed it in the news and everything else. You just, you don't even know it
exists. So a video about Bitcoin, that's, first of all, it's not going to come up
in your algorithmic, you know, feeding funnel that's being given to you. It's

(01:07:39):
not even, you're not even going to see it. But if you do see it and someone's
leading with Bitcoin, well, you're checked out right away and you're clicking
on to the next one, you know, you're scrolling. But when you start with the
pain points, when you start with, you know, and it's like, you know, any sort of
good marketing or product design, it's like, you know, the old mattress thing,
like you're not selling somebody a mattress, you're selling them a good night's

(01:08:00):
sleep. So first you have to like, you look tired, man, you're probably not sleeping
very well, are you? Like, boy, you know, I bet you'd love to get a full eight
hours on like, and so that that's how you sell you don't sell it with, here's
this mattress and here's all the fancy, you know, whoopsy things it can do and
like, wow, look at how springy it is. No, and that's what I love about your guys
content is that it starts out with like the the shrinkflation video that you

(01:08:23):
guys did recently. Or or even the the banking one, the one with Jamie Dimon
that you did, I love that one, it was just rock solid, few Epstein references
in there too, which I love, just wonderful. But but this is what actually
hooks people in. Because if you can get them to agree that, yes, this is, you

(01:08:45):
know, XYZ is a problem. Yes, this is also a problem that affects me. Yes, this is
something that I think is kind of fucked up. Then they're more, you know,
they're more open to receiving that that orange pill. Because a lot of people
feel that there is a problem, they know there's a problem deep down. And they
don't exactly know what the problem is, but they know something's broken. But

(01:09:07):
even if they do know that what's broken is the money, they don't know what the
solution is. And so I think to your point about the 90%, there are so many people
who are looking for a solution. Because all they can do right now is complain
about the problems. And Bitcoin, they may not know it yet, but it is that
solution. But you have to be able to get them to agree with you on the problems

(01:09:28):
first, to be able to get them that extra, you know, that extra 10% of the way. So
I love the way you guys approach that. And I mean, how have you have you seen, I
know you've had some stuff go pretty darn viral recently. Like the one which was
great, Julian and Isabella, where you pushed Julian out of the way, you know,

(01:09:52):
you're like, just start rattling off a ton of super based things, right? Like that one
blew the hell up, right? Is that one of your, I would assume most viral ones so far,
like across platforms? It was a pretty big one. Yeah. On Twitter, they love that stuff.
Isabella really didn't want to do that. I know. Really? So cringe. I'm like, trust me.

(01:10:13):
It was good. Like it worked really well. And like you threw in a little bit of Bitcoin.
A little bit. Just a little sprinkle. Just a little sprinkle. The thing is a lot of people
are like, Oh, all these things are out on the internet. But creating all this content,
once you have to go deep into the rabbit holes. And one thing that we've noticed is

(01:10:34):
the research is so hard to find because they dig it and dig it and dig it. So when people are like,
Oh, they're not learning because they're not putting in the time. It's not even just that.
Like they're trying to suppress all this information that backs up all the claims,

(01:10:56):
you know, and we see it constantly, especially like with the Boeing plane. If you want to Google
the people, like the whistleblowers, you can't find all of them there. You can't find pictures of them.
They bury the things so deep. So people after two minutes of, you know, trying to search,
they forget and they're like, Oh, I'm not going to Google that anymore. So we can't even blame

(01:11:20):
the people for even trying because they probably do try to put in the work. But they make it so
hard for people to find the truth that it's insane what they're doing. It's kind of scary when you
start to think about it. Sort of like what, I don't know if you guys have all read 1984, but it's
sort of, I feel like, you know, George Orwell was a visionary. I don't know if he did lay down a road

(01:11:46):
map for these countries to start treating us like that. Or, you know, he was a visionary and he saw
it before his time. But it's crazy to me how hard this information is hard to get on people's hands
because nowadays they're just blowing even when I'm saying it coming from, you know, from a Fiat,

(01:12:08):
you know, TV channel where we used to, you know, do news and everything. We're not even getting
the right information because the information is really hard to find. What I worry about too with
this is like, this is a pro and a con thing. But the reason that like YouTube, every single streaming
platform has like, since 2014, they all peaked in the amount of time that the average American

(01:12:32):
spends watching it. So Netflix peaked 2014, people watched less Netflix today than they did back then.
The only platform that has increased viewer time since the peak of all the streaming platforms
is YouTube, right? And why is that? Well, it's constantly fresh. You're constantly getting new
shows. You don't have to worry about a union telling you what you can and can't produce.

(01:12:52):
And it's great. And I don't know how much time you guys spend on YouTube, but I spend an ungodly
amount of time watching videos. And it's just knows exactly what I want to watch. And the cost
to create the shows that we're creating now, like if I wanted to do that 15, 20 years ago,
it would take like a whole team. And now I got Google and YouTube and chat, EPT. The problem is,
is now with what AI is doing is that it's empowering people to think I can basically make anything

(01:13:16):
because I have a little tool in front of me that can do all the research. The problem is, is you
can't, you literally cannot do research on specific subjects on these things and they deter you from
going down those rabbit holes. I wanted to do this like funny script. And this is the most tame thing
ever. This happened last night. I wanted to do a script of like the top three pickup lines to use

(01:13:37):
on Janet Yellen, Treasury Secretary, former Fed Reserve. Oh, I love this already. I'm like,
I'm not good with jokes. Let's try and get Chachi P to figure it out. So I ask,
I'm writing a script and I want, you know, I want to hit on Secretary Yellen. Like, can you give me
some funny like play on words? And the first thing it says is we have to be careful and respectful
of public figures. We wouldn't want to say anything disrespectful. And it gives me these really lame

(01:14:00):
jokes. And I said, can we dial up the raunchiness? Can we dial it up a little bit more? And Chachi
P is like, I can't do that. I can't, I can't have you say anything that's disrespectful to our
secretary chairwoman. And I get this like red violation marking. If you've ever used Chachi
P to get too far, it's like, you can't do that. These are jokes. These are jokes. This is not,

(01:14:21):
I'm not trying to create or find evidence on something or even like look up a like a wrong
thing fact. It's like, I just want some raunchy jokes and I can, you know, tone it down if I need
to and it wouldn't do it. And so people don't realize like the perniciousness of that is that
if I'm inclined to make a video researching a really, you know, a taboo topic, for instance,

(01:14:43):
and I'm getting these on every platform I use, grok too. I mean, Elon is the free speech guy,
but you can't get too deep on grok with this stuff too. Now that everyone relies on these,
you know, GPT programs to do their research, they're just getting turned away. And then you
couple that with Google not wanting to show you this stuff. The hardest script we're putting
together the script on basically the transgender industrial complex and how pharmaceutical

(01:15:06):
companies are profiteering off of gender dysphoria. And my God, there are a lot of studies out there,
but they are basically impossible to find. We've had to contact people in this space that have
looked at these studies and get them just mailed directly to us. Oh my God, find them on Google
and these other research databases, they're just completely buried. So yeah, it's sad.

(01:15:28):
It is, you know, quick, quick aside here. Have you guys tried unleash dot chat?
That NVK put out there?
Unleashed.chat. You can first of all top up your account in Bitcoin. They don't save any data.
So all any data you have is stored locally. You can clear it anytime. Nothing's, you know,

(01:15:52):
saved on any servers. They have multiple, multiple LLMs for you to choose from with
different rates for how much, you know, each token costs basically. But you top it up with Bitcoin,
it's completely private. You don't need to use an email to sign in even if you don't want to.
It's very nice. And because I talked to him about this on the show and he basically said,

(01:16:14):
all of these LLMs, they have guardrails put in. To what you said, Julian, if you start asking
these certain types of questions, they'll be like, well, hey, now let's be respectful. We wouldn't
want to ruffle anyone's feathers up at the top of the pyramid, you know? And he's just doing
whatever he can to pull out like, and there's a whole community of open source people who take

(01:16:35):
these models that have been made open source and try to find whatever guardrails they can. And maybe
they can't find all of them, but they find as many as they can and they rip them out. And so he
surfaces those models, you pay for your consumption in Bitcoin, which great. And it works exceptionally
well. Like, and I'll run it side by side with chat GPT sometimes. And chat GPT is still, I would say,

(01:16:58):
it's a cleaner experience if you're operating within the bounds of what they want you to ask.
But this one, you can like, try it out, ask anything unleash.chat, I would highly recommend it
to anybody who is frustrated with chat GPT. But like, that's, that's also the beauty of, like,
while it is kind of fucked up and sad and scary that there are so many guardrails put in place.

(01:17:20):
And not just on these GPT models, but on Google itself, like we saw that when Google came out
with their own little AI, and it was like, make the picture the founding fathers. And it's like,
wow, I didn't know they looked like that. That's a little weird. But at the same time,
while there's all of that happening, information wants to be free, right? It wants, it wants to

(01:17:41):
propagate as much as it can want anything. And so like, I am so well, it's, it's easy to get nihilistic
about some of these things, because it's like, our fucking overlords are putting all of these goddamn,
you know, bumper rails in place for us. It's like, well, there's also a bunch of super based
people out there who are like, nah, let's, let's rip off those training wheels and let's see how

(01:18:01):
fast this thing can go. And so that's, that is a thing I'm hopeful about. At least there's based
people out there who know what they're doing with code and can free this information a little bit.
Because, but it's kind of, if you start thinking about it, because if you guys started using chat
GPT at the, like, you know, when it first came out and it was open source and people were using it,

(01:18:23):
it was incredible. The things that you could do were insane. But then they start putting all these
limits and these boundaries. And I don't think we're slow, like we were not realizing it,
but we're being tracked everything with every single thing. So you put in your email there,

(01:18:43):
let's say that email is connected to your Amazon. And then I don't know if you guys have whole
foods, but now if you go to whole foods, you can even pay with your hand. And the thing is at first,
I didn't realize I was like, why would they want to connect your Amazon account to whole foods?
And then I start realizing it's all to, to like, get your history to know what you like,

(01:19:07):
so they can predict everything about you because you link your Amazon account to your whole foods.
So now they know what you're buying in whole foods, you know, they know what you're interested in,
they know what you feed your body, they know all your Amazon orders, they know what you're
searching on chat GPT. And the thing is it's all connected and it's all to get ads to fund you so

(01:19:30):
you can spend more money and feed it to the top 1% and it's this vicious cycle that innocent people
are just like falling into this trap because convenience, chat GPT is a convenience. Everything
is a convenience now. Oh, I'll just link it to my email. There it's all connected. Like,

(01:19:53):
they're making us depend on the system for convenience. Why do we have, you know, an Apple
and I'm, you know, a victim to this. I don't write down my passwords anymore. I use, you know, my phone
to save all my passwords, but we're handing, you know, these companies that store all these,
like all this data because for convenience, even Tesla, Tesla is super insane. They have these,

(01:20:26):
most of us think, oh, they're saving electricity, blah, blah, blah. No, what Tesla's actually doing
is every little thing, they're tracking it and saving it into this sort of like data warehouse.
So if you have a Tesla, the way that you put your AC in the car, that's being noted. The, when you

(01:20:47):
put on your blinkers, when, you know, put down your window, every little thing is being tracked and
kept for God knows how long in these data warehouses. So we're all like, oh, Elon Musk, freedom of
speech, we have to be careful. This man has so much information about all of us. And the thing

(01:21:11):
is the way that he's doing it is super sneaky, you know, in a way that we don't realize, but all
these people have all their information in these data warehouses. Now he has all of our information
because of X plus the people that now get paid on X from, you know, from Elon, he's getting all this

(01:21:31):
and just can track and know what you're going to do because we're all human and we're like animals
of habit. I was watching a podcast and they say, if you do one thing, like let's say you lie,
that's not the first time you've lied before, you know, like you've lied again, like you've
lied before. So when we see people do one thing, they've done it again. So Elon is just stacking

(01:21:58):
all our patterns and he's going to be able to predict everything from all of us. It's kind of scary.
Yeah, I used to think because I used to be really into analyzing, you know, how much is this company
valued or overvalued. And the market before Elon got involved on Twitter totally had it wrong.
Like I think the market gave Twitter a $25 billion valuation and you look at the daily active users,

(01:22:24):
I think it's around $150 million. And the power of that data, like you can basically through
language modeling, you can figure out, you know, who's going to react, you know, very intensely
to criticism, right? And these LLMs are able to find data that we just wouldn't think of,
they can make these connections. And like you can like, Isabel, you're totally right about the

(01:22:46):
predictive modeling. Like, you know, what you do in your Tesla is one thing, but being able to
basically assess like speech and behavior patterns through someone's incessant tweeting, that's
super valuable. And there's millions of people who every day are giving all that data over to X,
and they're time stamped. And it's like, that data is so granular and so valuable and will

(01:23:07):
continue to be valuable as long as you're alive. And then the next step for them is, oh, we're
going to implement, you know, payment rails and X so that we can start logging your transaction data
as well. I mean, it is, he got a steal for $30, $40 billion when you look at it like that,
because that is going to be valuable for like 10s and hundreds of years, unless the regulators

(01:23:28):
come down on it, which we'll see. But we have noster for that. Well, I would actually like to
ask you guys, because you've done something which I've tried to do as well on noster. And I just
so you guys know, I will say noster, not not Noster, but I also say hodl, not hodl. So just,
I just want to put that out there just to let you guys know I'm a hodl guy, but I'm a Noster guy.

(01:23:49):
So okay, we'll have to agree to disagree potato potato. Yeah, okay, we'll let it slide there.
And that's the beauty of these things, right? You know, say it however you want, like, you know,
Bitcoin doesn't care. Noster doesn't care. But you guys have done mean,
uh, Bitcoin, right? It's actually tick coin. I don't know if you guys have done this like

(01:24:11):
noster first, kind of strategy with deploying a lot of your content like I think for the
documentary, you did that as well, where you're like, look, we're going to put this up to try and
kind of put our, our voice where our values are, you know, our money, where our mouth is,
and try to distribute content on this open, decentralized permissionless network first.
And then yeah, we're still, we're going to put it on YouTube. We're going to put it on X. We're

(01:24:33):
going to, you know, I don't know, put it on rumble as well, whatever. But I'd love to hear
just a little bit about, because, you know, we're talking about all this data ownership.
And, uh, Isabella, you had an awesome quote from, I'm forgetting which video it was of yours, but
one of the recent videos you guys released, which is every day we make a choice between ownership
and being owned. And I thought that was really beautiful. And Noster is kind of,

(01:24:57):
kind of flipping the script there where it's like, no, no, no, you own, this is your private key and
public key, you own this, and you can take that and go to whatever client you want. You're not
siloed into a walled garden. So I'd love to hear about as content creators, making very based
content that has, uh, like this new video you're coming out with, will probably get flagged,

(01:25:18):
uh, and de-boosted on, on YouTube, you know, just, just guessing, uh, that it might.
Be de-boosted on YouTube. We'll see. Yeah, right. So, right. So how have you guys found that
experience? Are you thinking also about how to kind of create more, let's say, Noster first
experience is moving forward? How does that factor into kind of your content creation strategy in

(01:25:40):
general? And what do you guys see as like the, you know, the, the benefits for other content
creators who might be feeling a bit trapped in these walled gardens? I'll give my take on it.
Um, what I really enjoyed about Noster, Noster is, uh, it does feel like something new. I remember
back in the day, you know, the, the MSN messenger IRC chat rooms and it's, it's got that vibe where

(01:26:05):
even though everything you're posting is public, it sort of feels like no one except your core,
you know, Noster buddies are going to see it. And maybe one day you can go back and like go
through all of Jack's and my old posts to see what we were like yapping about on, on Noster. But
um, there's two things. Number one, I have been incredibly blessed and it's probably been a lot
because you share my content Walker. Um, but like, I've gotten a lot of sats from posting videos on

(01:26:31):
there and not enough to like pay for all the content, but there's a pathway there. And I, I, I
think the pathway is if, if Noster can get maybe 10 to 50 times more daily active users, a lot of
content creators could use that as a primary source of income. So that's the barriers. You guys got
to figure out how to 10 X or 50 X that thing over there and, and you know, I'll do my best, but

(01:26:52):
you know, right now definitely, you know, oh, having to pick a client and, uh, you know, these
things are dodgy. They don't work half the time. It makes it hard for people, but like every day
there's some brand new client like primal. It's just a killer experience and it's been very easy
to just recommend people get started with primal. Um, the, the second thing that I really love about
Noster is even though it's all public, anyone can go in there and they can see my posts if they're

(01:27:15):
a day early. There's something really cool about posting something to that community where I know
that it's mostly Bitcoiners and just seeing how the stats rank up. It gives me almost a predictive
capability of if a video is going to go viral because, you know, I'll have, I think I have about
four or 5,000 followers on Noster. And if I post a video that gets 200 likes within the first day,

(01:27:36):
I know that's going to get 10 to 100,000 on the other platforms. If I post one that gets, you
know, 30, 40, it'll just do kind of average. And it's, that's had a 99% hit rate for me. So I post
my videos, my shorts a day early on Noster, they get shared around, they take off on one of the
big ones, the big four Instagram, TikTok, YouTube right after. And that's kind of fun. And that also

(01:28:00):
lets you get some early data on what you're doing before you kind of really broadcast it to the
world. Now that's not going to exist if Noster gets, you know, to the same level of adoption as
Instagram, TikTok, or even, you know, a palpable percentage of it. But it's really fun right now
because it's kind of this like testing ground. And I also find the vibe on Noster is very positive.

(01:28:20):
So people will like leave longer comments and get a little bit more granular when they're critiquing
you. So yeah, for me, it's just, it's, it's a fun thing. And I think the killer feature is the,
is the zapping. That is, that network just has to grow a little bit. But the, the, what's, what's,

(01:28:41):
what's the term, the flywheel effect will really start once I think you can get to about 100,000
daily active users. Because then you're going to have at least 20, 30 content creators from
different niches, not just Bitcoin, probably making daily content on there. And they're going to be
getting zapped, and they're going to tell all their friends, and it's just going to get going. I
think right now it's, it's like me and you and a couple other people. There's not a lot of video

(01:29:04):
people on there, but I don't think it's that far. And it's just, it's a question of what pushes people
to it. The problem with these decentralized open protocols is people usually get pushed to them
out of fear or greed. The greed component doesn't really work with Noster because there's no monetary
unit attached to it. So when we think about, you know, how is Noster going to get, you know,
pushed a lot, it's kind of, it kind of relies on centralized authorities clamping down on

(01:29:28):
a communication channels and people saying, Hey, I need to have an open source alternative.
And I wish there was another way about it, but that's what probably makes the adoption of Noster
a little bit trickier than Bitcoin in the long run. Adam, what about you? Yeah, yeah, I think,
I mean, bang on, I think when we come down to it, I mean, Isis quote is the, that's the one there,

(01:29:49):
you own or be owned. And I think that the downside to Noster is the same downside to Bitcoin,
which is the lack of centralization. There's no marketing team. There's no, there's no leadership
group. We've got, we've got, you know, we'll call them fans, right? Like Jack is doing a great job
pushing the Noster way. But again, it's, it's done to a certain community. And I think that if

(01:30:17):
social media as a whole took 10, 15 years to like, become the conglomerate that it is today,
it's probably 25, 30 years for decentralized versions of that to happen. And to Julian's point,
the thing that nobody realizes yet to the very few people, especially on the left, realize is that

(01:30:40):
when you vote for censorship, you vote to censor yourself as well, because opinions change on
both sides as the pendulum swings. And right now it's the right getting censored. And right now
it's the right flocking to Noster and platforms like rumble. And I think that it will be a matter
of time before the opposite viewpoints are criticized by the clowns in power at the time. And

(01:31:04):
that'll push people to censorship resistant platforms. But I think that it'll be
for right now anyways, it's going to feel really awesome. And it's going to be more of a positive
vibe because it's like it's what Twitter was 15 years ago, it's what Bitcoin was 10 years ago.
It's like there's no, you know, like the early days of Bitcoin, there was no block wars

(01:31:28):
contemplated like that that exists because it was a small group of people pretty aligned,
like 99% aligned in what happened. But then as more people come in, different opinions,
different motives, different incentives, different ideas of the future, different time
preferences, they start to try to change things, they start to try to, you know, mix things up

(01:31:49):
and make things a little bit different. And I think though, the key to success for decentralized
platforms like that are going to be platforms like rumble, which are like we're free speech,
but we're centralized. And then eventually, you know, it's kind of like that gateway into
a truly decentralized platform and protocol. So yeah, I'm like, I'm super bullish on Noster.

(01:32:10):
I think it's fantastic. I think you need to, it's like Bitcoin, man, you have to lower your
time preference to be successful on there. You have to understand that there's no algo pushing
virality. Like it's just your community. That's it. It's only your community that can push
virality. But there is too, like there's, you know, there is minor hacks that you can do

(01:32:31):
on Noster because of the centralization that exists in clients and how certain clients work.
But at the end of the day, I think it's a, it's, it's going to take time and we have to all check
our time preference. Like we're, you know, I think Julian's zaps there are a complete edge case. I
think we're years, decade away from, you know, having viable like monetization on that with,

(01:32:56):
especially with no ads and it becomes this pay to play, which again, Bitcoin fixes. So yeah,
super bullish. But I think my cautionary tale is like, check your time preference and understand
that it's a time it like, it takes time when you don't have a marketing department and a central
leader making decisions, everything is slower. And sometimes that's okay. I think that's fine to

(01:33:19):
preserve the integrity and the, and the, and the benefits that, you know, and the problems that
it's solving.
He said, Bella, how's, how was your experience on there? Because you've been pretty active for a
while. I think Adam has to dip here. I don't want to, yeah, no worries. Um, yeah, wait, how, how are
you guys doing on time? Cause I just, I got, I got time still. I just realized the time was flying.

(01:33:43):
Okay.
The only one here with a real job.
Okay.
We're just influencers here.
Yeah. Yeah. This, we're, we're not live. So you're good. Yeah. Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
Yeah.
I'm gonna, I'm gonna rip for real. Walker is a pleasure man looking forward to chatting more in
the future. And uh, yeah, stay sovereign everyone. See you later.

(01:34:06):
See you.
Stay sovereign.
Get bait.
Stay sovereign.
Okay. Yeah. He said, go to the bathroom.
Thank you.
If you, if you, you guys, you guys, you guys, good, you guys good for a couple more minutes
cause I actually would love to, to dig into, uh, uh, to your experience. Get, get to that
bathroom. Come on now. Uh, I, I would love to dig into the experience in, uh, in Peru a little

(01:34:31):
bit if you guys are game. Um, I probably shouldn't have saved it for the end, but we just got,
there were so many based things to discuss.
Oh, Adam, Adam is like, it's, it's hard to get three people on a podcast that have such
different backgrounds cause Adam can like, he has some unbelievable stories that are
really dying into you.
So I, I know. I'd, yeah, we're, we're gonna have to, we're gonna have to do, maybe we'll

(01:34:55):
just have a, we'll have a semi semi regular based catch up with you guys. Cause I'm,
honestly, I'm just loving the content you guys are creating. And I think it is very much
like it's scratching an itch that has been there for a while and you guys are, you're
doing it very well.
Thank you. I hope so. I think, um,
um, yeah, like you feel these things out, like that there is a market for it. Um, and

(01:35:20):
the, the challenges is like, we know the demand is there. We do as much as we can with the supply,
but the, the tricky part is, is you run into these models, like everybody wants Uber Eats,
but who pays for it in the end, right? Like the shareholders pay for it because this model
is not unprofitable. And so that's the tricky part of a very conservative person. I don't like

(01:35:41):
borrowing money to do things, but I also have an endless spigot of very expensive ideas to get the
word across. And it's like, what ones do we pursue first versus try and stay solvent through all
this, right? Yeah. So yeah, it's, uh, and honestly, it's a, it's a good thing to kind of talk about

(01:36:03):
maybe in relation to how you guys fundraised for that trip to Peru as well, because that,
that was a pretty cool effort. And I think that it's again, it's so easy in the Bitcoin
space community, whatever you want to call it, uh, to get flack for taking money for what you do.

(01:36:26):
Like, and you know, Carl and I as an example, like we were able to do a lot of the stuff that
we were doing prior to having a child, uh, and, and being a little bit shorter on time.
Uh, but you know, we were, we had to like a couple of sponsorships, uh, and, but for the most part,
just we're doing everything as kind of a side projects because we, you know, had

(01:36:47):
fiat jobs and we're comfortable with that. And we're like, okay, let's, you know, we're going
to be very choosy about any potential sponsorships that we do. But at, at the same time, it's like,
like if for people that are going full into like creating content in and around Bitcoin, like you
need to still pay the bills and put food on the table. And like, and I think people seem to think

(01:37:11):
because they have a couple examples of like the really big folks in the space, like the biggest
podcasters who have, you know, like tons of sponsorship opportunities and make a bunch of
money from this, they think that somehow like that's just always available and on the table for
everyone. But it's like, no, that, that is not the case. It's especially in more bearish times.
It seems like it's, you know, pulling teeth to try and get any of that. So I'd love to dig into

(01:37:35):
how you guys had, you know, the struggles you had trying to fund that trip and just kind of,
oh, she's back already. You know, I don't, I don't even know if I'm going to, I'm going to cut this
part. I might just, I might just leave this part in and just enjoy it on the side. But no,
they're breaks. But before we, so Isabella, I wanted to dive into the Peru story a little bit,
but before that, I did want to give you a chance if there was anything on the no-ster side that

(01:37:58):
you wanted to add on there before we kind of change gears a little. For the no-ster or no-ster,
I would just have to say, honestly, like I started using it a lot, but I still feel like there's
some barriers to entry, especially with the video content. Cause there's, you can't post like long

(01:38:20):
form videos. So you get so discouraged all the time when you want to post something. And then it
says like, oh, sorry, like exporting, you know, failed, you got to try again. And that has been
like such a huge turnoff for me because it keeps me from going because I'm like trying to upload,
because I'm a visual person. So I want to share so many things like visually, like what I do,

(01:38:46):
because that's how I like to see things. And we tend to do like what we want to see.
So for me, like I tried at the beginning a lot, but that has been one of the things that I
has guided me to stay on like, you know, censored platforms, because it needs to improve. I feel

(01:39:08):
like at the same time, like it needs time and it's new and I like to be part of it obviously at the
beginning, but that would be my only concern with Nostra. I'll give you guys a couple of,
if I may, a couple of tips for longer form. So I don't know if you've seen what Pablo's doing

(01:39:29):
with highlighter. No. If you just go to highlighter.com, you'll, I highly recommend you check it out.
Sort of like it's like similar to Patreon. Exactly. But it's also like a really, he's,
first of all, he's an incredible developer, but he's building out some really nice tools.
The great domain name, highlighter.com. I know somebody just gave him the domain that they
had lying around, I guess, like incredible domain name. If I had a domain that cool though, I would

(01:39:53):
give it to Pablo as well because he's amazing. And then in addition, so I've started uploading
all my shows onto highlighter, but I do the upload through, there's, if you go to satellite.earth,
another cool domain, they will let you, you can pay in Bitcoin for storage space. So you can upload

(01:40:13):
a bunch of, I've uploaded like all my recent shows to there. And then I just drop the URL
into highlighter, copy and paste the same info from YouTube, and it's good to go. So it's,
it also may be an interesting, like for what you guys do, I'm sure people would love to see
like behind the scenes stuff, you know, like you can offer that as, you know, a tier of perks.

(01:40:35):
Okay. If you guys want to, if you want to support us for however many sats a month or a year,
like we'll give you some access to this, like, you know, behind the scenes bloopers, how it's
made, you know, what are our tips and tricks for other content creators, just something to think
about. And I can, I can drop you guys some links afterwards, but highly recommend highlighter.
And Pablo is like, it's improving on a daily basis. I just had an issue with a video uploading,

(01:40:56):
I DM'd him, I was like, Hey, is this just me or is like, and he's like, Oh, no, found the bug,
just fixed it and deployed should be good to go now. I love that. I love that. I've used so many
like apps. Yeah. But we can download a YouTube and then you put it there. No, no, I just take
the, like the raw file that I'm using that I'm also uploading to YouTube or Rumble, Twitter,
whatever. And I just, I just drop it and I hosted on this satellite.Earth. And then I can drop the

(01:41:20):
link right into highlighter. It pulls the video from satellite.Earth. You can upload a thumbnail,
all of that still. And it's all displayed on your profile in highlighter in a really,
really visually appealing way. So I'm going to give that a shot. My big challenge is I've been
using this one called Nostra.Build. And like, I feel bad. Because the other day I like called out
the guys, I was saying, Hey, like, I thought I got a year subscription. And now it's telling me I

(01:41:43):
didn't and I paid for this and it wasn't working. And they like fix it real quick. But the thing was,
it was they've, they've kept a fixed sat price for data. And I get it. Like we want to live on a
Bitcoin standard. We want to use Bitcoin as unit of account. But the one thing that should be very
deflationary in all terms is data, like data storage. And so it was something like five gigabytes. It

(01:42:04):
was, you know, almost $200 of Bitcoin for five gigabytes of annual hosting, which to me was like,
that's one video for me. I'm not going to pay that much to host one video. So it's tough. I get it.
Like you have to, the businesses have to make sense. But the thing with data is it's all economies
of scale. And so people, I want to support these things, but we've got to get the price down as

(01:42:25):
Bitcoin or somehow, you know, if they're hosting their own data servers, that's one thing. But
yeah, data is the one thing that it's like phones, like we're just used to getting more for less all
the time. But if you use Bitcoin as unit of account, it's the opposite. You're getting less for more
every time those sats are so valuable as time goes on. So it's a really hard thing to

(01:42:46):
peg. It's true. I think these businesses will figure it out too. Like I've got a chance to meet
Nostra Build in person down in Costa Rica. Awesome dude. Like doing incredible stuff. And
I think it's, there's going to be hiccups with these sorts of things because like,
you know, we're still early, still early with Bitcoin, very still early with Nostra.

(01:43:08):
These things will improve. And they also, like we can, that's the great thing about this kind of
Nostra community being small is that when you have a problem or you see an opportunity to do
something better, like you can actually like talk to the developer on Nostra and be like, hey,
here's how I think this experience could be improved. And like that's a beautiful thing that
people like it's really good real time feedback. So I would, yeah, keep finding things that don't

(01:43:32):
work and let people know how they can work. And that's a, that's how we all get a little bit
better. But yeah, I'll drop you guys some links. But for anyone listening, you should also check
out highlighter.com. And if you go to highlighter.com slash Walker, you can become a TIT coin maximalist
subscriber. So yeah, yeah, yeah, a little, little plug. But okay, I want to, so we,

(01:43:55):
Julie and I were chatting just about like the difficulties of fundraising in the Bitcoin
space. And I also wanted to talk about Peru, because you guys, for anyone that hasn't
gone to their YouTube channel, I'll drop it in the show notes. Incredible, like 45 minute, I think,
documentary. I hope that it'd be, let's, when are we going to see that thing on Netflix first
of all, or at least maybe on, maybe on Amazon? It was incredible though. So I, but I'm not going

(01:44:23):
to talk about it anymore because you guys were there and made it. So talk to me about that
experience. Talk to me also about like the difficulties with making it happen from a
financial standpoint and actually like, because that was a big, a large undertaking, a lot of
travel, a lot of work. So how was it all? Oh man, it was, uh, you know what, like all things

(01:44:45):
considered, I actually think it went a lot smoother than I anticipated because I always,
I'm one of these people that just always prepares for the worst. So I was like, oh, maybe like,
we had these planes very tightly scheduled back to back to back between all the locations and
it's Peru and you never know what's going to happen. And these little airports in the middle
of nowhere. But that all worked out. I did definitely, taking it on was tricky because I knew

(01:45:10):
if we're going to do this right, like there's 15 towns, we got to, we can't just visit one,
like we got to go to a couple and we'll try and find the ones that are the most, you know, unique
and distinct. And yeah, it involved, you know, take plane tickets for three to four people
each time. Isabella's cousin went to help us film a lot of this stuff too, hotels for all of us,

(01:45:33):
making sure that we didn't get, you know, Zika or dengue or food poisoning, although Isabella
didn't escape that one. But there's a lot of considerations and like usually all the docs
I've done, it's just been, I go with a camera and I make it happen. But I wanted the vibe for
this one to be a little bit different or rather than me, you know, basically recapping what I

(01:45:53):
experienced, I really wanted people to feel it through our eyes. And I've gotten some criticism
on the doc where people say, Oh, it kind of just feels like a very long like vacation vlog. But I
really enjoy that style a lot more because it keeps you as an active participant in what's going on
rather than, Hey, we went here and we did this and the B roll is really nice, but it's just like
Julian's voice over for, you know, for 30 minutes. And it was a lot more fun getting in the weeds

(01:46:17):
there, you know, capturing our feelings in real time and then letting the people that we interviewed
tell the story, you know, hopefully a lot more than we had to. But yeah, the big challenge with
that was, okay, we're going to pull this off, we're going to need to raise, you know, 10,
$15,000 probably to do it right. And I thought the only way we're going to do that is I don't

(01:46:42):
have the sponsor connections to pull that off and get, you know, maybe five or six monsters
that would put in like two or 3000 each. And I was really wracking my brain and my last resort was
I'll sell the coins. I'll take the hit for the fifth, sixth time I'll sell a crap with a Bitcoin
and make a video. That was the fallback plan. But the idea came from Mike Peterson because

(01:47:07):
he's been doing Bitcoin Beach for a while. They've done these crowdfunding, you know,
mini campaigns where they've raised Bitcoin and they've been very successful doing it. And he said,
look, just do it all out in the open, you know, tell people what your intent is, show them the plan,
and then give them different ways to contribute, right? Don't just say, hey, give us whatever you
can afford, you know, gametize it, give them some perks. And so that just, it just clicked with me

(01:47:30):
because a long time ago I used to do videos for Kickstarter projects. And so that's all about perks,
like people feel like they click something and they're buying it and they're getting something in
return. The tricky part is when you're funding a film, what are you going to give people, right?
You know, a credit in the movie. So we had to kind of think, you know, what are things that we can do?
And one of the ideas was to do these donations in person and Isabella filmed all those,

(01:47:52):
she's been posting them on the GetBased site. So, you know, you give 50 bucks worth of Bitcoin,
we give away 25, we film it, you get to be a part of the story. We had these like producer credits,
we had different levels of sponsorship. So, you know, one where you have your just your name in
there. A second where we do, you know, like a full credit or we show your product in the video,

(01:48:13):
Crypto Clokes had their signs and the Bitcoin trading cards, we gave those out and that became
part of the film. That was a cool scene, by the way. Yeah, the kids with the cards, that was really
cool. They were loving that. And then the third part was you get the full 45 second call out and
it feels genuine and we had a great sponsor with the Bitcoin Coalition of Canada there. It was,

(01:48:34):
it was, I was really happy that they're the ones who nipped at that versus, you know, go buy this,
wallet or that, because it kind of, that would change the vibe if I started selling a product.
And this was more a sponsorship about, we know what we're trying to do in Canada and I'm Canadian.
So, that was awesome. But yeah, between, you know, I would say the big donors made up, you know,
40, 50% of the raise and then the rest was about 130 plus plebs with donations between, you know,

(01:49:00):
a thousand sats to 200,000 sats, which is, you know, like a dollar to $100 or so. And that carried
us over the line. And then number went up during the production. So, we were going to stay in this
dingy hotel in Akitos, but Akitos is not the place where you want to stay in a hotel without AC.
And the number went up and we were like, okay, like, let's, let's do it properly at the Hilton.

(01:49:25):
It's only going to be one night anyways. Let's do like the Double Tree Hilton that's right in the
middle of town. We'll feel decent after a bunch of like, you know, running around the jungle.
And yeah, we still went like a little over budget, but you know, I'm so grateful for everything
that everyone like helped us raise with that. And I think there are some other films in Bitcoin

(01:49:45):
that have done like a crowdfunding campaign, but I think a lot of that is planned from the top down
where they kind of, you know, they've already picked out their sponsors ahead of time and
they're just looking for revolving donations. And for us, it was very clear it was, you know,
a quarter of a Bitcoin, we can pull this off and number went up and it worked. And I think
when you have that clear end goal, it just makes it easier for people to just hit the

(01:50:06):
the donate button and they can buy a perk on the way. And yeah, it worked out.
But you got to be real here. We got rejected by a ton of huge sponsors that we wanted.
You know, and that's one of the things that we noticed really good point pushed us to start
get based because we had these great ideas and not many people, you know, have the time,

(01:50:31):
most importantly, you know, to drop everything and go to a different country and cover what
they're doing. So we were like, why don't we try to, you know, get some sponsors to, you know,
help us make it happen. And the amount of rejection that we noticed, they don't want to
take risks. Something, you know, I don't know, you know, I don't want to get hate here, but,

(01:50:53):
you know, love all the Bitcoin companies, but most of them are sort of Fiat based. They're,
they have Fiat mentalities. They're like, we don't want to risk anything. We don't want to go
outside the boundaries outside the safe zone, which is sponsoring, you know, just the big
podcasters. We don't want to take any risks. We want, you know, something that is

(01:51:15):
concrete will get us the numbers. Yeah. Give us the KPIs. Like we need to know all your viewers
should get metrics before and we're going to, you know, the CPM has to be within this range.
Like that stuff. Yeah. Yeah. That's what kind of like sort of obviously the Bitcoin community
pulled through, but I was kind of like brokenhearted with the whole, the lack of trying to, you know,

(01:51:39):
incentivize things that are outside the box because Bitcoin in itself, it's thinking outside of the
box, not being stuck in status quo. And we see some of these companies try to play in its safe,
try to, you know, they don't, they have all this money for marketing, but they want to market
how they, how the Fiat companies market. I'm not saying like, Oh, just don't, you know, I'm not

(01:52:05):
trying to be like, you should sponsor every little thing or everyone that gives you. But when it's
a project that it's not for the people, but it's for, you know, these communities or organizations
that are honestly, that might not have the funds to keep pursuing and doing good out in the world.

(01:52:28):
That's what I was like. That's kind of fucked. Well, it's okay. It's tough, right? Because we
can't act like we deserve their money or like, you know, like people like motive, like motive.
How are they running out of money when they're doing what supposedly all the Bitcoiners think
they should do? You know, I'll give you like, I'll wrap this in a bow because I don't want to

(01:52:52):
like name names and I did a whole presentation in adopting Bitcoin about this. So I'm going to
talk about this, but all the donors that we got, basically all of our founder led companies with
probably less than five employees, a really small businesses sponsored this. And, you know,
between Isabel and I, like we reached out to at least half a dozen or more bigger Bitcoin

(01:53:13):
companies, exchanges, brokers, et cetera, we got rejected by all of them. I've, I think between
us, we've heard back from at least half that say, Oh man, I wish we got involved in that or like,
Oh, we'll sponsor it now. And I'm like, what's out? It's done. Like you had your chance. You
didn't believe in us. So sorry, catch us on the next one, I guess. But you know what, it's, it's,
we have to do this too, right? Like we can't go around thinking that, you know, we've perfected

(01:53:37):
this game and there isn't room for improvement and that, you know, we have the numbers to earn,
you know, multi-thousand dollar sponsorships. Like we have to put in the proof of work as well.
And eventually the thing is, is that, you know, when this train does take off and there is,
you know, real momentum and we're starting to grow a following that is comparable to some of
the biggest players in the space, we're going to be the most expensive things to sponsor because

(01:53:58):
it's not just going to be about, you get this name attached to it, you get three names attached to it,
and all our productions are super like high fidelity things. It's not a person in a studio.
It's like we're going out and we're launching things in outer space. That's a video we have
coming soon. And then, you know, we're traveling around the world to like 20 countries to see
what Bitcoin adoption is like. So the projects will get bigger and bigger and bigger. And the

(01:54:23):
asks out of the sponsors are going to get bigger and bigger and bigger. So, um,
So if you're listening to this as a sponsor, get in now while you, while you can still afford it.
Get the grandfather grade because yeah, this train is not going to stop. I will,
I will burn through my Bitcoin stash to make sure that the stuff that we do get
I don't want to like hate to like the sponsors and stuff, but for me, it's more like preach what

(01:54:46):
you sell, you know, if you're preaching out there, something, do something like, you know what I mean?
For me, that's like my mentality of it. You're in the riskiest industry in the world, like
reputation wise, financial wise, but you want to treat your marketing like you're in the safest
industry in the world. And it's like, yeah, that's not going to work forever. That's kind of like,

(01:55:09):
obviously like I respect all companies do whatever you want to do, but preach what you
sell at the same time, you know, like, no, I'm not even saying it like for us, but you know,
for me, what it's like motive, what it like, how are we letting motive run out of funds? Like that
project, what Valley and Rick are doing over in Peru is mind blowing because

(01:55:36):
they're not only teaching people about Bitcoin, they're using it as a tool for freedom because
eventually that's what it's going to come down to. People are going to use Bitcoin peer to peer,
you know, all this about the government. Most of the people are not going to care about that.
They're just going to use it for peer to peer electronic cash system. And motive is helping them

(01:56:00):
build their values because as a Bitcoiner, that's one of the things that unifies all of us, our
values. We sort of have like the same mentality, not like the same mentality, but we all value freedom,
we all value family, we all want to make and leave the world better than we found it through
decentralized money. I think that's where the phrase fix the money, fix the world comes through.

(01:56:24):
So they're fixing the world and also adding the money in there and changing the money system.
So it breaks my heart to see how some companies don't value the work that they're doing. I'm not
saying that they don't value it, but they don't support it. And even if you don't have the funds

(01:56:46):
to do it, at least try to see how you can help them change all these individuals because they're
going out and doing the hard work. They're the ones that are going out to places where they can get
Zika, where they can get food poisoning, where they can get in trouble with the gangs. They're

(01:57:08):
the ones that are putting their faces out there, leading every day, helping homeless kids that are
in really ruin families. They see it every single day and they're putting in the work,
they're putting in the power of work through and they're trying to manage all of this.
And I think as Bitcoiners, we should have companies like organizations like that and

(01:57:35):
talk about them, help them out. What do you need help with? They don't even have to like, you don't
have to donate money to them if you don't have the funds, but they need a lot of help with their,
whether it's social media or I was talking to Valer like trying to help him out, how he can
sell the products from like the people that are doing them and sell them to Bitcoiners

(01:57:59):
because they don't have a lot of people to help. So that's more or less like where my anger and
frustration comes from and disappointment from the Bitcoin community, where we should be helping
out companies like that instead of worrying about number go up, worrying about because the number
go up, that's going to come eventually. I'll tell you where the incentives are kind of like

(01:58:23):
warped on this and it's tricky and every business has to approach it differently, but I would say
right now, there's probably only about like seven or eight podcasts in that are like Bitcoin only,
Bitcoin focused that have a staff of at least three people and are able to sustain and pay
those bills for those three or four people. You know, the ones like, you know, Breedlove,
McCormack, Natalie Brunel, these podcasts, there's a certain quota of big name guests that they have

(01:58:50):
to get on those shows and that's why you see, you know, a couple of these people keep reappearing
on these podcasts every month seemingly. And it's because that's a guaranteed business model.
We need to show these people on the podcast and that's like almost reserved space for the big names
because you just have to pay the bills, right? If you get new guests that no one's heard of every
single time, you're not going to pay the bills. And Nico was saying this when you were in Toronto,

(01:59:12):
like it took Joe Rogan five years to monetize that podcast. And there is, you want to have as many
dialogues as you can with people when you're running a show, but there are considerations of,
you know, maybe it was a little rough because I took too many new guests and no one knew who
they were and nobody really went down that rabbit hole. And now I can't pay the bills this month.
Let's get back an old favorite, right? And I think because the Bitcoin space is so tight

(01:59:39):
and the number one thing to sell to Bitcoiners is affirmation that their number is going to go up,
the inclination is always to get a lot of macro people on your show because it definitely guarantees
viewership. What I hope is that, you know, as number does go up, some of these, you know,
hosts can take more risks and the people that they get on are very small followings just to chase

(01:59:59):
a different type of story a little bit more. And I think you see that like I remember like in 21,
I was just seeing all these new people show up. But during the bear markets, you know, it's the
classics that hold the fork because we need to have that reminder that everything is going to be okay.
So I think it will change. And I think, you know, the number one thing for motive, I think
necessarily is not that, you know, we need to all make sure that people get donated,

(02:00:22):
donate to them, but we just need to get their story out. So my hope is that, you know, Walker,
you bring on Valley sometime and he can tell you the whole story of motive or, you know,
I'd love to go Cormac and get them on because he has, he has the meat of it. We just went there
and saw it for eight days, but that guy has endless stories about how Bitcoin has changed the lives
down there and then all the things that he's had to struggle with in order to get it to work.
But yeah, it's all coming. I remain positive on it, but you have to understand the financial

(02:00:47):
incentives are aligned sometimes to not take risks with guests and putting certain people in the
spotlight. That's why I keep my fiat mining job so that I'm very grateful to my one and only
sponsor Bitbox and the Bitbox 02 Bitcoin only hardware wallet. But because they did take a
risk on me very early when I like had hardly any downloads or anything and like shout out to them

(02:01:11):
that's really awesome. And I've heard that they've done that for a lot of people too because there
are those companies out there who will take that risk and say, you know what, we know you're not
like a big player right now, but hey, let's grow together. Like that's a pretty cool thing. And
the companies that you're mentioning that are, you know, smaller that took a took a risk on you
guys to help you produce this incredible documentary. Like I highly encourage everyone to go check it

(02:01:35):
out. I'll link it in the show notes like please take it is worth 45 minutes of your time, share it,
you know, with your friends, family, strangers on the internet. Like it's really powerful. And I
would love to have the motive folks on here if you can make that connection as well, because
that would be fantastic. And I think these stories are, they're so important to tell. And

(02:01:57):
you can also like who doesn't love a little macro, sure, a little bit of bullishness and a little
bit of doomerism about how the dollar is collapsing and everything's fucked, but we have Bitcoin,
so you're all safe. But like I can only listen to those so many times. And I think a lot of people
also there, they crave these stories of how Bitcoin is helping people that they didn't even know

(02:02:20):
existed. And like that's what I, you know, like that's the one of the things that was just like
shocking from your documentary was like the whole story with the kids like literally drinking
rainwater out of puddles. I was just like, fuck, that like truly breaks my heart. And these guys
are out there every day trying to actively improve the lives of these people, but not just like,

(02:02:44):
Hey, here's some Bitcoin, it's like they're, you know, they're teaching them to fish versus,
you know, giving them a fish to eat. And like, I thought that was really powerful. And so I want
to thank you guys for telling those stories. And I cannot wait to see what you all do next.
I realize we've, we've gone for a, we've ripped for a solid two hours here and that could go for
more. But your time is scarce, much like Bitcoin, even though Bitcoin podcasts may be abundant.

(02:03:08):
But where can you, I'll drop all your links in the show notes. Where should people go though,
if they want to, you know, they want to watch GetBasedTV, if they want to support you guys,
if they want to support Motive, I know you dropped QR's at the end of the video, but where should
people go to, to look at more of what you guys are doing? Yeah, YouTube and Twitter is the spot at

(02:03:29):
GetBasedTV. That's where we're posting all our stuff. Isabella is really rocking that GetBasedTV
Twitter lately. I didn't know that was going to be on the scale. She's a really good Twitter, I guess.
We have a competition, Julie. If GetBased Twitter gets more than 10,000 followers by the end of the
year, Julian's going to give me one. Oh, you have to pass me. Yeah. No, no, no, no. You were at 10K

(02:03:53):
when you said that. No, I said you have to pass me. You have to pass me in Twitter. GetBased
Twitter account, passed his Twitter account. He's going to give me 100,000 sets. Oh, okay. I'm
going to help make this happen. I want to share the goodies. Yeah. Yeah. No, it's fun. And this is
something I've learned too, is that we have this highly produced content, GetBasedTV, like the

(02:04:17):
documentaries, the shows, research. But I find a lot of the time it just goes back to people just
want to get to know you. And so Isabella posting these little behind the scenes from our productions,
people just love those. So we're going to keep doing that, try and build a little like, you know,
I guess, following around what we're doing. But yeah, at GetBasedTV, for those who don't know

(02:04:38):
the repertoire, Isabella has a show called Wrong Think. That's every two to slash three weeks,
depending on how fast we can turn it around. Adam's got a weekly show where he's, you know,
reviewing clips and different things. And then I am trying to get out one surprise unique documentary
every single month. And that train will continue until we can keep adding more people to our roster

(02:05:00):
to make even more content. So yeah. After my sponsor, Rant, I don't think we're going to get
wrong things. Sponsor. No, you're, but you know what? This girl's crazy. No, you're going to get
based sponsors is what you're going to get. Like that's the kind of sponsors you want, right? Like
you want people who believe in the mission because you guys aren't trying to suck up to anyone.

(02:05:22):
And I respect that. Like it's, you know, somebody's got to draw a line in the sand. So and I'm glad
you guys are out there making content. I enjoy the heck out of it. Makes me laugh, makes me the
documentary was also, I'm just like, hold it together, like hold it together. You don't realize
your podcast too. Are you kidding me? Your news are the only ones I like to listen to because

(02:05:45):
it's so funny. You're so in a voice the way that I put it and I remember and I cook at the same
time as I listen to the news break. I'm honored for that. I really am. You don't realize, but like
the biggest bummer in the last year is you guys having a kid and not doing new shorts. I know.
I got into, I used to do. Yeah, careful when you say that, Julie. It's okay. You guys are enjoying

(02:06:09):
your kid. I'm not enjoying your kid as much. I enjoyed your content more than your kid. We'll
see a follow will come through. He might surprise you. I'm telling you, man, I used to do these
really straight lace videos, no comedy, anything. I just delivering information all the time and I
saw your stuff and I was like, this is, this is what we need more of. Like we need more people
to actually have fun with what they're doing. And it was because of your videos. That's why I

(02:06:31):
started doing these like, if you had 24 hours with me things, it was you guys that inspired me to
like push myself and do a little like whack, bring my like high school acting classes back
into the shorts that I do. And it's, it's, it's winning. Like people want to be entertained.
People want to have fun and you can have so much fun making fun of central bankers. Like it's just
limitless. I really hope Carly didn't put away the wig box. Oh no, we, my God, we've got so many,

(02:06:56):
so many wigs. I thought you're going to be part of the skits. I was hoping secretly hoping.
Once you can, you know, sit up on his own a little bit better. We'll get him out there.
He's, I think he's going to be a jokester. Like, I don't know how he can't be with
parents like us, but yeah, it's an exciting, and don't worry, Carly's got the itch to start

(02:07:20):
making some things again. You guys are starting out a family first, you know, that's your priority.
Well, you know what? It's a, in this day and age, just starting a family is pretty based.
It turns out like who, who knew? I know, but guys, I've really enjoyed this. This was a pleasure.
I'll get this out, get this out as soon as I can. And thanks for all the work you guys do.

(02:07:45):
I think it's really valuable. You guys are doing something that nobody else is doing in terms of
the quality and also the scope of the content that you're creating. And you're reaching outside this
Bitcoin echo chamber and bubble. And I think we need more of that. So I hope you guys inspire
even more people to, to get based and, and to watch GetBasedTV. And yeah, thanks for sharing

(02:08:06):
your scarce time with me. I genuinely appreciate it. Thanks so much for having us Walker. We're,
we're big fans. I love it. We got a big Bitcoin family going on here. It's sweet.
Absolutely. Get based. You guys can use.
Yeah, yeah, get Bitcoin. Bitcoin maximalism.

(02:08:28):
And that's a wrap on this Bitcoin talk episode of the Bitcoin podcast. If you're a Bitcoin only
company interested in sponsoring another fucking Bitcoin podcast, head to Bitcoin podcast.net
slash sponsor. If you're enjoying the Bitcoin podcast, consider giving a five star review
wherever you listen or sharing this show with your network or don't Bitcoin doesn't care.

(02:08:53):
You can find me on noster by going to primal.net slash Walker. And if you want to follow the Bitcoin
podcast on Twitter, go to at TIT coin podcast and at Walker America. You can also find the video
version of this podcast at youtube.com slash at Walker America and at Walker America on rumble.
Bitcoin is scarce. There will only ever be 21 million, but Bitcoin podcasts are abundant. So

(02:09:18):
thank you for spending your scarce time to listen to another fucking Bitcoin podcast.
Until next time, stay free.

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