The one where a barn falls on Rachel

"Are You Tired of Being Paid Less Than You're Worth?" or How Rachel Ended Up an Electrician Apprentice

This week, we're joined by Rachel Cannon, Rebecca's sister, who has had one heck of a career journey. She graduated during a recession, worked as a bicycle tour guide, switched majors, and picked up plenty of peculiar internships—like putting snails in jars at the Smithsonian. Rachel eventually found her calling in the trades as an electrician apprentice.

We chat about how unpaid internships only benefit the rich, how kids shouldn't be able to take out thousands of dollars in loans for college, and how it took many burly men 45 minutes to pull Rachel out from under a barn that collapsed on her once.

Rachel also gives us a crash course in unions and labor rights, the benefits of union work, and how freakin' awesome it is to have transparency and fair wages. Despite often being the only woman on the job site, she emphasizes practical boundaries and enjoys the mental health benefits of a physically active job. 

Unions are like condoms. If someone tells you you don't need one, you probably do.

You can find Rachel on:

Bluesky: @rachelthecannon

Mentioned in this episode:

• IBEW local 280 - International Brotherhood of Electrical Workers (IBEW)

Have a suggestion for our next episode? A burnout story to share? Send us a text!

Support the show

The Burnout Collective Podcast is hosted by Jamie Young and Rebecca McCracken. We’ve had every ounce of inspiration sucked out by years of startups and hustle culture, and we’re trying to reclaim our creativity. Join us and our guests as we explore how to restart and reenergize our brains. Every Thursday at 5pm PT, we stream live on twitch.tv/TheBurnoutCollective.

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Music track: Snap Your Fingers by Aylex
Source: https://freetouse.com/music

Episode Transcript

Audio 1.02 (00:00):
So so wait when do you get to be like a journeyman

(00:02):
a journey woman if you will

Audio 1.03 (00:04):
A journey person, please, Jamie.

Audio 1.05 (00:06):
Damn.
She got your ass,

Audio 1.04 (00:07):
ass
I am Jamie.
And I'm Rebecca.
Welcome to the BurnoutCollective.

Audio 1.05 (00:18):
Hello?

Audio 1.02 (00:19):
Hello.
Welcome in.
Welcome in.
Today we have with us

Audio 1.03 (00:26):
Hello

Audio 1.02 (00:27):
I'm so sorry.
As a, as a younger siblingmyself, I always hated it so
much when people always like,that's so and so's sister.
But this is

Audio 1.05 (00:36):
Mm-hmm.

Audio 1.02 (00:38):
she's much better than Rebecca, so we love that.

Audio 1.03 (00:41):
true

Audio 1.02 (00:42):
Is Rachel, our guest.
And, she

Audio 1.05 (00:47):
She is my sister.
Honestly, thank you for joiningus.
Do you just want us, you wannastart off sort of like where you
were, take us through yourjourney to where you are now.

Audio 1.03 (00:57):
so I like a lot of millennials in an our group.
Graduated in 2010, so this waswhen the job market had tanked.
and I was living Washington dc Iwent to American University.
'cause as we were all, many ofus told in high school like, oh,
hey, you need to go to a collegeyou're smart and you need to
take out student loans and makeit happen.
and so I went to this collegeand I didn't know what I wanted

(01:19):
to do the entire time.
I changed my major three timesat least.
But I graduated in 2010 with adegree in international studies
and communication and a minor increative writing.
And so I applied to somethinglike 40 or 50 jobs, for admin
assistant roles or stuff thatwas supposed to be entry level.

(01:42):
But, I didn't get a single oneof them.
I didn't even get, I think Icalled back one interview and I
didn't know how to dress forinterviews or anything.
So, I didn't get any of thosejobs.
But fortunately during college Ihad picked up a part-time job as
a bicycle tour guide in downtowndc.
And so when I graduated theywere like, how about you be a
manager for$15 an hour plusoccasional tips?

(02:03):
And I was like, sure, thatsounds like best money I could
be making at the time.
so

Audio 1.02 (02:09):
get in tips, typically?
What was like typical tips?
Do you remember?

Audio 1.03 (02:12):
I don't know, because I didn't count them.
I just shoved them in mypockets.
And then when I did laundry,every time I did laundry, I made
a

Audio 1.02 (02:18):
She's not a Taurus.
She is not Taurus.
Go on.

Audio 1.05 (02:20):
No, we would know,

Audio 1.03 (02:23):
The tips were pretty substantial.
Also.
I was like 65, 70 hours a week,but I wasn't eligible for
overtime'cause it job.
So

Audio 1.05 (02:31):
Oh my God.

Audio 1.03 (02:32):
anyway.
Yeah.
so I was made feel at time like,oh, perhaps if you can't find a
job, you should probably go tograd school because you can just
write out the recession and geta graduate degree.
And so with very little,contrary to.
What I wound up doing, I waslike, I'm gonna major
anthropology and sociology andI'm gonna become a professor.

(02:53):
Had I taken any anthrop classesundergrad?
No.
that was what I was gonna do.
And so I took out a lot of loansand, two semesters in academia
was like, are we allowed to cusson this podcast?

Audio 1.05 (03:06):
Fuck yeah.

Audio 1.03 (03:07):
Okay I was

Audio 1.02 (03:08):
You've heard us.
Please,

Audio 1.03 (03:09):
I just wanted to make sure.
I was like, this is bullshit.
I hate all of this.
I don't, this is basically justlike white man's burden
repackaged the 20th, 21stcentury don't deal with any of
this.
And so I switched to the veryuseful degree of museum studies,
which was a really fun time.

Audio 1.05 (03:25):
You need to tell them about my favorite
internship that you ever did,ever in Alaska during this.

Audio 1.03 (03:30):
yeah.
Okay.
So all of, so here's thebullshit thing about DC
internships of them are unpaid.
And was broke'cause I was livingoff student loans.
And so I found a paid internshipin Alaska of all places.
And I, it was at the HammerMuseum because by the time I did
this

Audio 1.02 (03:49):
The Hammer Museum.

Audio 1.03 (03:51):
It's a museum about hammers.
If you go to Google Street Viewand you look for Hans Alaska
Hammer Museum, you can pull itup and there's a sign on the
roof that says the Hammer Museumthat made out hammers.
And then there's a giant hammerthe owner built right in front
of the museum.

Audio 1.05 (04:08):
Okay, so just FYI, I told Jamie you had an internship
at the Hammer Museum, except Igot it wrong and said fork, so.

Audio 1.03 (04:15):
Museum

Audio 1.02 (04:16):
even remember you me that

Audio 1.03 (04:19):
I got paid$150 week, at that time I was better than
free.
they, they gave I had time.
I don't remember a lot of

Audio 1.02 (04:29):
Oh, they paid for housing for you?

Audio 1.03 (04:31):
I stayed with the, one of the board person because
there, there was a board.
I stayed in his house.

Audio 1.02 (04:37):
Oh,

Audio 1.03 (04:38):
Yeah.
anyway, I, I did that.
I could really go into a lot of,I put snails and jars for 300
hours.
that was another internship thatI had.
did that for free dead snailsand jars.
that was at,

Audio 1.05 (04:51):
For the, oh, for the Smithsonian.

Audio 1.03 (04:53):
People are always like, did you

Audio 1.02 (04:54):
Rebecca would never put nails jars.
She would never

Audio 1.03 (04:58):
No, she would not.
She would die.
go well

Audio 1.05 (05:01):
I would die.

Audio 1.03 (05:02):
But they were all

Audio 1.05 (05:03):
And they were, are we talking like little cute
snails or like the really grossones?

Audio 1.03 (05:09):
freshwater snails.
They were little, like

Audio 1.05 (05:12):
Okay, that's fine.

Audio 1.03 (05:13):
no, and it is funny 'cause people ask like it's some
big prestigious thing like, didyou work for the And I'm like, I
sure did.
Do you wanna know what I did?
know, I put snails and jars forfor a year.
yeah, I got out of and, it was2014 and I got a job at a bike

(05:35):
shop because that was the onlything that I could find.
And finally, after a lot of timeapplying with my brand new shiny
master's degree, I got a jobworking guest services at a
well-known museum in downtown DCthat shall remain nameless if I
can keep it nameless.
and that was a very crowdedmuseum.
It was a for-profit museum timeI started working there and I

(05:57):
spent a lot of time just like.
Shuttling crowds in and out andyelling at people and trying to
make sure that the visitorexperience was good and, and
yelling at my staff.
Were having cell phones on andhaving a radio on while trying
to deal with guests.
And it was, it was, it was a Itwas a lot.
the people I worked with wereamazing, will say that.

(06:17):
But the guests nightmares.
made that job horrible yes.

Audio 1.05 (06:22):
Did you wake up every day and look at your
Master's degree and go, yes.

Audio 1.03 (06:26):
the the of

Audio 1.02 (06:28):
that knife, you're just turning that knife in her.

Audio 1.03 (06:30):
no, I know.
And it was like, it was one ofthose things where it was the
manager my department, I thinkhe was really degree, but all
the people that I actuallyworked with, they were like, you
don't need a degree to do thisjob.
And I'm like, I know.
I am so aware.
And they were all better at thatjob than me

Audio 1.02 (06:44):
You're like, shut the fuck up, everybody.
stop it out.

Audio 1.03 (06:48):
I was like, I don't like the center of attention.
I, I too mousy.
I, I don't, I'm a terriblemanager because people would
come to me with their problemsand I'd be like, oh my God,
really?
Yes, of course you can have theday off.
Paid no problem.
I was not a good just really notat all.
I was working and I saw a niceman who worked for the exhibits
department painting a display,in the lobby.
And during grad school I had hada job where I was installing

(07:11):
bicycle racks around DC and solike using power tools and
drilling into concrete and likeputting the things you lock
bicycles to in the ground.
so I knew I liked painting and Iknew I liked power tools.
And I saw this man working on anexhibit and I said, Hey, if you
ever need help buildingexhibits, would you please let
me know?
I have so much experience usinga hammer drill.

(07:32):
And so I started working asecond job, at that museum and
coming in early in the morningsand helping the exhibit guy like
clean the exhibits because wewere opening a new museum.
And so then during this wholeprocess, I wound up taking on a
third job as the project managerfor the, all the curators and
the museum

Audio 1.02 (07:49):
that was your third mistake

Audio 1.03 (07:51):
I I've, I've made so many and all of them

Audio 1.05 (07:53):
At, hold on.

Audio 1.03 (07:54):
were expensive.

Audio 1.05 (07:55):
We have to tell you the rule.
We have to tell you the rule.
What's the rule, Jamie?
We don't what?
We don't work for free.
We don't work for free.

Audio 1.03 (08:03):
I, and you know what?
You're so right.
And I really wish that somebodywould've taken me and shaken me
by and been like,

Audio 1.02 (08:08):
we all wish that when we were that age Yeah

Audio 1.05 (08:11):
Oh yeah.

Audio 1.03 (08:12):
I was like 26.
Like I had

Audio 1.02 (08:14):
Rebecca Like never was never

Audio 1.03 (08:18):
Never.
Not once.
Working for startups, they nevertake you, ever.

Audio 1.05 (08:22):
they 100% like got three full jobs outta you.
That's crazy.

Audio 1.03 (08:27):
No, and I was, I was at the time getting paid like
45, 40$7,000 year.
I'm very open about all themoney I was making because it's
not So it's

Audio 1.05 (08:36):
Not to mention it's a for-profit, and so then you're
not even eligible for, loanforgiveness or anything.

Audio 1.03 (08:42):
did, they did transition to a nonprofit while
I was like in the first couple

Audio 1.05 (08:46):
Ooh, all

Audio 1.03 (08:48):
museum started off as like a cash cow for this,
this who owns it.
but so I, I wound up doing theexhibits thing and I really love
that.
And the guy that I worked with,he taught me how to use the saws
and to build little putartifacts on.
They sent me off to mount makingcamps so I could learn how outta
brass, to hold artifacts on thewall.
and I loved it so much and Iloved working with my hands and

(09:10):
I loved being behind the scenesand I loved not having to talk
to a single goddamn day Like itwas the best job.
I was so happy.
and so.
I spent seven days a weekhelping them open up that new
museum.
And then by the time the newmuseum opened, I said, Hey, I
would like a raise.
And they went, Hmm.
We're not sure about that.
So it took them three months todecide that I dec I needed like

(09:32):
a little bump then Covidhappened.

Audio 1.02 (09:35):
It was like 3 2 They're like here's 2

Audio 1.03 (09:38):
The museum had no budget.
'cause we had just spent likebillions of dollars on a new
building.
We were all getting takenadvantage of right and left.
The whole, the whole nonprofiteverybody is getting taken
advantage Our parents did thebest to support me that they
could.
And I was on a scholarship forundergrad at grad school, like I
was on my own.
and I about nobody should evergive 20 something year olds a

(09:59):
hundred thousand plus dollarsloans.
that's not a good idea.

Audio 1.05 (10:03):
No, they give 17 year olds loans for college,
like actual children.
It's,

Audio 1.03 (10:09):
it's a

Audio 1.05 (10:11):
I.

Audio 1.03 (10:12):
So, yeah.
so anyway, story short, butthere, there's no making this
short.
so I, okay, so Covid happenedMarch, 2020 and then.
Rather than fire all of us, theCOO of our museum, who actually
is like, she's a, she was abadass.
she did a decent job doing whatshe did.
she gave everybody, she loweredour salaries by a certain

(10:33):
percentage, and the people wereat the top got the highest
percentage off of theirsalaries.
But mine was still like asignificant enough amount where
like I really couldn't affordanything.
And I was living in likesomebody's moldy basement in
Tacoma Park, I think I reached apoint between the pandemic and
not seeing my friends andeverybody just had like various
meltdowns and various life.

(10:54):
And I know I'm alone in this,but I was like, fuck this, I'm
done.
And so I applied for a jobacross the country in Bend,
Oregon, at another museum thatshall remain nameless.
and I moved all the way acrossthe country, worked this job,
and was like, wow.
All of the same problems arehere, except they're worse.

Audio 1.02 (11:11):
Oh

Audio 1.03 (11:11):
Just the leadership was out to lunch.
I, I liked my job, but my bosswas just, did not give a fuck.
I was hired as exhibitpreparator, which was a job that
like technically was qualifiedfor, but I had no guidance as
the, how the museum functioned.
So I was

Audio 1.05 (11:28):
Prepare.
Prepare her.

Audio 1.03 (11:30):
Yeah.
Usually that's somebody whotakes care of artifacts and all
the mount making and all

Audio 1.02 (11:34):
think it's preparator

Audio 1.03 (11:36):
like preparator tur if you're French but it's
typically is somebody who takescare of the artifacts and
prepares them for display inthe, in the exhibits.
But I also had a job as like anexhibit technician.
So doing all the building andthe lighting the dah, dah, dah,
dah, dah, dah with my boss whodidn't care.

Audio 1.05 (11:54):
So two jobs.
Two more jobs, two jobs

Audio 1.02 (11:56):
So bosses that like don't care And it's like how are
these in these leadership roleswhen they don't give a shit

Audio 1.03 (12:03):
the, the job market in Bend is not great.
So if you have a college degreeand you're in bend, like Mm,
good luck.
tough out

Audio 1.02 (12:09):
Good Good luck to you Rachel

Audio 1.03 (12:11):
Yeah Thank you.
Thank you.
So, so I quit that job too, andthe reason I quit that job is
because, and this is where wewere getting to, I promise, is I
applied to, an apprenticeshipwith the International of
Electrical Workers.
I'm, I'm driving my little, likemy partner calls it my little
baby race car around.
And I hear this radio commercialthat was like, are you tired of

(12:32):
being paid less than your worth?
And I said, yes, yes, I am.
To the radio display.
and it was like, then considerapplying to the IBAW, which is
the local electric electricalunion.
and I was not the targetaudience for these ads.
The target audience for theseads are non-union electricians.
and they were like, you couldmake more money with us and a

(12:52):
pension and have healthcare anda 401k.
And I was like, boy, that soundsreally great.
if I applied to and so I didwell, this is a lark.
They're never gonna want me.
There's no fucking way I'mgetting into this.
I'm a, at that point I was likea 3-year-old female, and I'm
like, they're not gonna fuckinghire me.
but

Audio 1.05 (13:11):
if I recall someone was dazzling, was the exact word
that I remember.

Audio 1.03 (13:17):
hear how I got into the apprenticeship?

Audio 1.05 (13:20):
Absolutely.

Audio 1.03 (13:21):
I'm sitting waiting in the, in the, the hall, which
is the hall is the, the, home ofthe, the local, that you have in
And I was ner home kings.
I was nervously waiting.
this guy was like, are youapplying to the program?
And I said, yes.
He was like, you're a chick,you'll be fine.
I was like, Kay.

(13:41):
you know what?
Honestly, if that was anadvantage, I'll fucking take it
because white men

Audio 1.05 (13:45):
It is the one.
You get one advantage.
Fine.
Great.
Take

Audio 1.03 (13:49):
don't hear white men being like, oh, they probably
only let me in'cause I'm a whiteman.
Like, how often do you hearthat?
So I was like, cool.
But, also I aced the aptitudetest'cause you have to take a
test that proves that you knowhow to, how to do reading and
math.
And I got a, like I got every, Ijust smashed it the goddamn park
if I do say so myself.
And then the interviewcommittee, At this point, you'll
recall I have had 50 somethinginterviews in my life for jobs

(14:13):
that I don't care about.
I actually care about this one,like I wanna get in, but I've
had so many interviews thatlike, you can't phase me with
anything anymore.
And so it was like a committeeof electricians that were
sitting in there and they wereall waiting for me.
And I was in my like, littlebutton down and my like little
work just I had no nervousnessat all.
None at all.
And I was like, I know I can dothis.

(14:35):
And so I think I maybe workedthe room a little bit and I made
them laugh.
and I found out later I scored a98 on there and somebody need
her in field.

Audio 1.02 (14:45):
fuck yeah

Audio 1.05 (14:46):
A 98

Audio 1.03 (14:47):
a 98 out of a hundred.

Audio 1.05 (14:49):
you had, you had two points less'cause of that
vagina.

Audio 1.03 (14:52):
probably That's okay

Audio 1.05 (14:53):
points off.

Audio 1.03 (14:55):
it turns out that the man who's actually our
training director, he found outI was from DC and they wanted to
know all about this museum thatI worked at.
And so he was like, I took mykids there.
And I was like, that's amazing.
So if you find something toconnect with people in the
interview you got it in the bag,For people who aren't super
familiar with how trades unionswork, which I, there's so much
to know.
Like we could have a podcast onlike how trades unions work,

(15:18):
but, you are part of the IBEW,but then your local is wherever
you happen to just work at likeyour home local, it's where you
do your apprenticeship.
IBW members, once they gothrough the apprenticeship and
they're a journeyman, so theyhave their electrical license,
can travel around to differentlocals in the country.
So that's the idea I.

Audio 1.02 (15:36):
Cool

Audio 1.05 (15:37):
I'd love to go more 'cause I'm, I am guessing a lot
of people who are eitherlistening or watching are not
super familiar with unions andsort of why, aside from the
pension, one of the things youmentioned was just like making
sure you had better workconditions and that you were
getting a specific amount andlike are actually taken care of.
And I'd love for you to go inmore detail about what the union
does for you as a worker.

Audio 1.03 (15:59):
Absolutely.
actually, the, biggest reasonthat I applied was because even
before you apply, anybody canlook up the wage scale of how
much people in my local or anylocal make.
And so you know that as a firstcoming, a first year incoming
apprentice, you're gonna thismuch second year this much, and
they lay it all out for you.
So on the job site, you feelvery comfortable talking about

(16:20):
how much you make because it'snot a big secret like everybody
knows.
And the, by the second term.
of the apprenticeship, I wasgonna be making the same that I
was making at the museum afterwhat amounted to a 10 year of
paid and jobs.
So that was a no brainer for me,where it was like, I can

Audio 1.05 (16:38):
That's crazy.

Audio 1.03 (16:40):
right?
I can only move back from here.
and then on top of that, so, so,so with the union you have power
of collective bargaining.
And so when you go in and youapply for a job normally in the
private sector, or yeah, I guessthe private sector, you, you
have to sit there and be like, Iam worth this and this and this
and this, and you should much.
And then back and forth.
With the IBEW specifically, thatprocess happens with a committee

(17:02):
of people from the IBEW, whichrepresents the workers and nika,
which is the National ElectricalContractors Association.
And they represent all of, likethe businesses, right?
So every year a meeting and theyget together and they look at,
cost of living increases.
They look at the job market,they look at things that the IBW
thinks their workers are gonnaneed, and they say, we want this

(17:23):
much.
And then Nikki comes back andthey, they negotiate and then
every year they come out with araise.
thus far it's been every yearsince I've been in the union,
which is

Audio 1.05 (17:31):
So, so they advocate for more pay for you

Audio 1.03 (17:35):
Mm-hmm.
And

Audio 1.05 (17:36):
and to make sure everyone is fairly paid.

Audio 1.03 (17:38):
And then what happens is they'll agree on like
a, a lump rate.
So like, okay, so over timewe're gonna make.
An extra, this much money, like$3 and 54 cents this year.
And then what they do that backto the membership.
And at the union meetings, wethen vote on how we're gonna
allocate those funds.
And the things that you put thatfunding towards that, say it's$3

(17:58):
and 54 cents, is you could say,okay, we want$1 on our, on our
check, so we'll see an extradollar on the paycheck.
We want$1 to one of ourpensions, another dollar to
another of pensions, and 50cents towards our flex plan.
the membership ultimatelydecides on what they do with
that money because we pay ourdues.
And so we have our, our, ourdues that we, it's like 50

(18:19):
something dollars a month.
and goes towards that bargainingprocess as, as well as like us
being guaranteed jobs wherewe're at, sort So, as union
member, I am represented

Audio 1.05 (18:32):
Hold on.
The other really important thingtoo that I wanna touch on, which
again blew my mind, is that thepart about guaranteed work, but
when you are laid off, youactually are still able to like
collect and you're taken care ofthat way too.

Audio 1.03 (18:46):
Yes.
Yeah, so I, I kind of misspokewhen I said guaranteed just, it
acts kinda like a big tempagency there are certain who
have agreed to only union.
And so there's a big pool ofworkers that they can draw from.
And so say a big data center,which is happens where I live,
and they need 130 electricians,they can draw everybody from

(19:09):
that local who needs a job aswell as travelers from outside.
So you, you get priority for thework that's in your local if you
are a member of that

Audio 1.05 (19:17):
Mm-hmm.

Audio 1.03 (19:18):
what I'm sorry.

Audio 1.05 (19:20):
Oh, just like when, like when you aren't working,
you're still able to collectunemployment and then you can
say I'm in the union, so youdon't have to prove like

Audio 1.02 (19:29):
yeah you get

Audio 1.05 (19:29):
the job

Audio 1.02 (19:30):
get to bypass paperwork like that's the best
part

Audio 1.03 (19:32):
It's great.
Yeah.
And I don't have to do much.
I don't really have to do anypaperwork in my current job
because I'm or a supervisor.
I'm just an apprentice and it'sgreat.
But anyway, so yes, if you getlaid off, which fun fact I did
today, you go and file forunemployment as you normally do.
And I Oregon and so unemploymentbenefits are actually good here.
and normally, yeah, normallywith unemployment you have to

(19:54):
fill out all the you applied toand everything.
And as member of the union, youcan just click a box that says,
I'm a of a closed book union andI'm not allowed to look for work
outside of this particularsystem that I'm in.
And then you don't to fillanything else And you collect a
check and then, yeah, and thenyou an apprentice wait for a

(20:15):
call for the training center.
call you and be like, Hey, guesswhat?
You're gonna go work for JoeSchmoe's electrical, doing
apartments tomorrow.
And you're So I'm waiting onthat call right now.
As a journeyman, it's different.
As a journeyman you have more,mean, say in your own life.
Like you can decide where you'regonna go work as an apprentice.
They're like, your job.
And you're like, sounds good

Audio 1.02 (20:36):
So so wait when do you get to be like a journeyman
a journey woman if you will

Audio 1.03 (20:40):
A journey person, please, Jamie.

Audio 1.02 (20:42):
Yeah Fair Fair

Audio 1.05 (20:43):
damn.
She got your ass,

Audio 1.04 (20:44):
ass

Audio 1.05 (20:45):
sorry.

Audio 1.03 (20:46):
the, initialism for, journeymen is actually jw.
It's like journey worker is theidea.
put that in, in Facebook post,people be like, do you mean
Jehovah's Witness?

Audio 1.02 (20:56):
Oh God Yeah Don't do Yeah don't no

Audio 1.05 (20:59):
do they tell you how long it's gonna be?
Like when you are, when you'relike, Hey, you're going to work?
Or is it just like you have towait, kind of like subs where
they get a call every day?
Or is it like, for this amountof time you're working, at this
place?

Audio 1.03 (21:10):
it's, it's more the sec first, where they're like, I
don't know how long it's gonnabe, that's why I go to meetings
because at the union meetings,they talk about all the work
that's coming up.
And so I have a pretty good ideaof if I get laid off, if there
job for me.
And they publish the outta workso know how long is, you how are
in front of And that is the oneirritating thing is there is

(21:31):
nothing you can get ahead onlist.
you are in your place online andyou will wait for a job.
a little socialist in thatsense, but I'm, I'm with that.
I feel like the fairness is theworth it,

Audio 1.05 (21:43):
Yeah.
Honestly, I was surprised too atthe dues for$57, like for all
that protection and all thestuff that they do for you.
I would pay double, honestly.
That's great.

Audio 1.03 (21:53):
Thank Thank a lot of, yeah, and a lot of union
busting, like one of biggesttechniques is like, they take
your money.
well, okay, yeah, but like, youget something for it.
It's invested for you.
You don't have to argue for yourown wages.
and this is why national rightto Work is bad.
But before we get into that, toanswer your question, Jamie, so
you, in my state, and in moststates, you have to have 8,000

(22:16):
on the job training hours, whichis four or five years, unless
while, then it could be longer.
And then you have 10 terms ofschooling at 80 hours each.
So 800 hours of schooling on topof that.
And that's where they teach youlike how transformers work or
how generators work or how notto set yourself on fire.
yeah.
they're they're

Audio 1.02 (22:37):
on fire

Audio 1.03 (22:38):
unless you, unless you really want The other day,
oh I felt so

Audio 1.02 (22:42):
on fire and get away with it

Audio 1.03 (22:44):
no, I didn't quite, but I had a water heater, which
is, it's two hot wires and theconduit that's around them had
like bit into the wires, which Ididn't realize.
'cause when you tighten it down,it like cis in and it cut open
one of the wires.
And so one of the plumbersturned on the breaker and the
thing just went.
But the plumber was fine.
And I fixed it, but I still felt

Audio 1.02 (23:05):
he is fine He's fine

Audio 1.03 (23:07):
He, came to find me and he was was that supposed to
explode?
And I was like, yeah, uhhuh

Audio 1.05 (23:13):
the

Audio 1.03 (23:14):
fires

Audio 1.02 (23:14):
don't know what you're talking about What
exploded

Audio 1.03 (23:18):
are we, yeah, but, but that is actually things
about, the union.
And I've talked to, journeymenwho have worked in the non-union
side, and they say that with theunion side of things, there is
more of an emphasis on safety.
and so even though they might bepaying us a little bit more for
a job, they're paying less forlike what they call fingers in
the ditch, which is, yeah, so,so like the idea

Audio 1.02 (23:40):
ditch coincidentally was my nickname in college

Audio 1.03 (23:42):
nice Yeah.
So, so the idea is less peoplethat get hurt on a job, the less
expensive the job is.
it's if they're paying out a tonof money in insurance
settlements, then the job isgonna be more expensive.
So if you pay your workers moreof an emphasis on safety, like
the job gonna cost lessultimately.
And so that's one of thearguments for like, why people
should hire union.

(24:03):
We have mandatory OSHA training,which is the most boring fucking
thing in the world, but likeit's important.
Um

Audio 1.05 (24:08):
Mm-hmm.

Audio 1.03 (24:09):
and things, things like, don't put two hot wires
together with a conduit'causethey'll explode.
Like I knew that, I just didn'tknow that it had happened.
So

Audio 1.02 (24:19):
you knew that You just you just it for yourself
firsthand

Audio 1.03 (24:23):
I did.

Audio 1.05 (24:24):
and you get overtime too, right?

Audio 1.03 (24:25):
Yes.
when I, so, and they also doovertime per day?
For,

Audio 1.02 (24:29):
Rebecca's like local union right now She's like well

Audio 1.03 (24:33):
for, Because a lot jobs, it's, or more a week with
ours, work more than eight in aday.
So if I work 9.5 hours one dayand seven the next day, I still
get overtime for an hour and ahalf.
Mm-hmm.
For now.

Audio 1.02 (24:46):
Ash said I thought this was funny The best saying
I've heard is this Unions arelike condoms If someone tells
you that you don't need one youdefinitely do

Audio 1.03 (24:54):
Yeah.
I love that.
I love that Definitely.
They got a bad rap in theeighties with Reagan, and there
was a lot of anti-union bustingand things like

Audio 1.05 (25:03):
Propaganda.
Propaganda.
Propaganda.

Audio 1.02 (25:06):
it what it Yeah

Audio 1.03 (25:07):
Yeah.
And, and now, I think mostAmericans are like, 70% of'em
were like, yeah, unions aregreat.
We should definitely supportpeople who are making us our
coffee or working at the grocerystore.
but unfortunately that's not theway that our leadership is
necessarily shaking out.
So,

Audio 1.05 (25:23):
Oh, they hate just, just like condoms.
They're like, Ew.
They make us feel weird.
We don't like'em.

Audio 1.03 (25:28):
yes.

Audio 1.02 (25:29):
really I really just don't like wearing them I don't
like wearing

Audio 1.05 (25:32):
Just doesn't feel the same as when I can exploit
people.

Audio 1.02 (25:36):
exploit That perfect perfect word for that Good job

Audio 1.03 (25:39):
Then you don't have the consequences'cause you don't
care'cause you're sitting inyour mansion I'm, I'm pro
anybody unionizing and the IBWis we'll, we'll take, we'll take
anybody.
there were steel workers whowanted over in Eugene and my
local was like, we'll, we'lltake you on.
Even though not electricalworkers, they found some to do
it.

Audio 1.02 (25:56):
Oh that's cool

Audio 1.05 (25:57):
that was the thing you said yesterday.
You were like, there's no veneerof like loyalty.
Which is very interestingbecause a lot of like desk jobs
tend to be like, where are youalso, you're gonna go and it's
kinda like this forced loyalty,but with you it sounds like
that's not there at all and, andpeople are free to move around
as they need to do.

Audio 1.03 (26:15):
a, big fat whore is what I am and actually, what
happened, what happenedyesterday is a pretty because
the contractor that I was for,the shop that I'm working for,
they're, they're good guys.
Like they've, they've tried tokeep me busy with work.
they've done their best, but youjust sometimes reach a point
where they didn't get any jobs.
And so the supervisor called meand he was like, Hey, You could
wait for a job and collectunemployment and continue to be

(26:37):
employed with us, but we can'tpay you right now.
Or you could just take a layoffand go see if there's another
project needs work.
And I was, I happened to knowthere are a lot of jobs that are
coming up and that are gonnaneed workers.
And so it makes way more sensefor to go on the books as, as
they on the books means, you'reon the out of work list.
and so he wasn't like, oh, butdon't leave us.
And I, which is amazing'cause I,the every single museum that

(27:00):
I've worked for, especially theone in DC was like, oh, but
you're leaving us.
It's like, it's like you owethem.
Like you never owe your employeranything.
And I know you guys know that,but like, I just wish they would
tell children or teenagers thatlike, you owe

Audio 1.02 (27:13):
I I wish that we like truly knew that like early
in our careers you know

Audio 1.03 (27:17):
Right.
And then, and then you can't getguilt tripped into staying.
'cause it doesn't sense for meto just like sit around and not
get paid when I could, companyneeds an apprentice and I can go

Audio 1.05 (27:27):
Jamie and I have talked about, like, it starts at
school where it's like you getthe best attendance award and
you know, if you're there everyday.
And then I, I don't know if it'schanged, but growing up at our
high school, when, when the kidswent to trade school, they
literally got sent in the shortbus and people would talk super
derisively about like, thetrades go.
Like that's where all theburnouts go.

(27:48):
when actually they are nowgainfully employed, have their
own fucking plumbing companiesor electrical companies, and are
making more money than any ofus.
And I wish, and instead it waslike, go to school.
That's where you get it.
But, actually trade schoolversus college, you, I can't see
so far I haven't been, youhaven't shown me any of the
downsides.

(28:09):
you're protected, you have aunion, you're making more money.

Audio 1.03 (28:12):
Yeah, a hundred percent.
And I, I, yes, I don't, I don'tdisagree and.
Yeah.
Also, my health insurance isincluded in my work.
So every hour that work, I get$10 towards my health insurance.
And then if I work 140 hours aweek, which is slightly less
full-time, I get health

Audio 1.02 (28:30):
Under 40 a You mean Month

Audio 1.03 (28:32):
140.
Sorry, a hundred, 140 a month.
Yeah.

Audio 1.02 (28:35):
I was like all right Time to talk about burnout
ladies and gentlemen

Audio 1.03 (28:40):
and, and rebecca you're com You're totally right.
I participate in some outreachprograms that our, our training
center puts schoolers and,counselors and teachers so that
they know about these programs.
'cause it's not just electrical.
the plumbers have a great uniontoo.
The steam fitters, the boilermakers.
and we, we have these programsso that

Audio 1.05 (28:58):
I don't know.
Hold on.
You gotta explain what those twolast ones are.

Audio 1.03 (29:01):
the steam fitters and the boiler makers will the
steam, you know what, I, Iactually don't necessarily know
myself.

Audio 1.05 (29:07):
Okay.

Audio 1.02 (29:08):
How dare Rebecca How dare you embarrass her

Audio 1.03 (29:11):
no, no, no, no.
You're

Audio 1.05 (29:12):
I know.
I don't know what they are.
I've never heard of the firstone.

Audio 1.03 (29:16):
it's a tradesperson who constructs, assembles,
maintains repairs heavy metalstructures like boilers and
pressure vessels.
It can also refer to a drinkliquor, usually whiskey served
alongside beer.
and steam, steam fitters do,it's, it's another pipe trade.
Whether they

Audio 1.05 (29:33):
oh, okay.
Got it.
Got it.

Audio 1.03 (29:35):
systems.

Audio 1.02 (29:36):
Oh steam fitter Isn't the drink one I thought it
like I go up to a bar and I'mlike bartender gimme a

Audio 1.03 (29:42):
should You know order a steam fitter and see
what happens.
I'd curious.
They'll just plunk like a nicelesbian with good arms on the
table and be like there you go

Audio 1.02 (29:50):
Yes

Audio 1.03 (29:51):
So

Audio 1.02 (29:52):
Or they're or they go I don't want any trouble I
don't want any trouble And justtake money outta the cash
register and give it to me

Audio 1.03 (29:58):
to you.

Audio 1.05 (29:59):
yeah, the L-G-B-T-Q representation you were telling
us was like

Audio 1.03 (30:02):
Mm-hmm.

Audio 1.05 (30:03):
crazy progressive and just super inclusive, which.
Again, it's delightful to hear.

Audio 1.03 (30:09):
Yes and I will not.
Okay.
So it's heavily dependent onwhere you're at.
So where I'm at, that's notnecessarily the case.
I am oftentimes the only femaleon a job site, and I do not talk
about my sexuality at all,'causenone of their goddamn business.
But, but, but, a lot of placeswhere unions are stronger, so

(30:30):
not surprisingly, cities,coastal areas, so places like
Portland New York City and LosAngeles and San Francisco.
when you go to these, we have,we have conferences and meetings
every year.
So you go and you talk aboutbeing a woman in trades or being
a person in the trades and, talkabout issues facing your
particular category of person.
And it's not just the women.
They also have the electricalWorkers Minority Caucus in the

(30:52):
IBW and, what's it called?
One that's specifically gearedtowards young people, but.
The one that they have everyyear.
It's called Tradeswomen BuildNations.
That's for all, all tradesrepresented.
So unionized trades, for femaleidentifying persons.
And you walk into a room full ofwomen who are in the female

(31:14):
identifying persons, sorry, whoare in the trade.
And I swear to God, like 50 to65% of that room is queer in, in
some way.
And you don't necessarily, youdon't need to ask him and be
like, so are you queer?
You just know.

Audio 1.05 (31:29):
Yeah,

Audio 1.02 (31:29):
how that go over

Audio 1.05 (31:31):
out of their

Audio 1.03 (31:31):
what yeah, the

Audio 1.05 (31:33):
Yeah, they'd have the bandanas sticking outta
their pocket in differentcolors.

Audio 1.03 (31:36):
the trucker hats.
And then they're all hooking upafter the plenary sessions and
their hotel rooms.
so it's just, and, and thenactually, I went to a really
excellent, breakout session atthe last Tradeswoman donations
to at.
It was for LGBTQ pluscommunities, and they had the
most colorful panel of people Ihave ever seen, including two
trans women who were electricalworkers, both of whom had, whom

(31:59):
had blue hair.
And then

Audio 1.05 (32:02):
What?

Audio 1.03 (32:02):
I, I, I I know.
See Jamie, you would fit in the,with the blue hairs.

Audio 1.02 (32:08):
with blue hairs

Audio 1.03 (32:09):
and then like this, lady

Audio 1.02 (32:11):
Don't make it a slur Geez Sorry

Audio 1.03 (32:14):
oh,

Audio 1.05 (32:14):
look at that blue hair over there.

Audio 1.03 (32:16):
so actually my co some of my coworkers who are
more conservatively minded haveused that as a those blue

Audio 1.02 (32:23):
Oh my God

Audio 1.03 (32:24):
blue hair.

Audio 1.05 (32:25):
Oh,

Audio 1.03 (32:26):
like, of

Audio 1.05 (32:26):
Reclaim that word, Jamie.
Reclaim it.
Make it yours again.
Jesus.

Audio 1.02 (32:32):
My

Audio 1.03 (32:32):
But

Audio 1.02 (32:33):
one of them blue

Audio 1.03 (32:34):
I wanted hairs

Audio 1.05 (32:36):
what's up?
My blue hair.

Audio 1.03 (32:38):
It was a really uplifting session and it he
hearing all these people talkabout their stories and like
women who were and coming upthrough the trades in the And,
one of them helps lead anorganization called Pride at
Work, which I donate to monthlythat supports, I guess queer
people at, in all box of work.
So it was great.
a huge, a huge representationfor that sort of thing.

(33:00):
And even in my local, which ismore like I said, rurally,
conservatively minded, they dohave all these mandatory, like
DEIA classes, in, in ourschooling, right?
And so even if the guys who arelistening to these don't agree
with what's being said, theyain't allowed to say shit.
So there's that.

Audio 1.05 (33:20):
They just mutter about it in the truck on their
way home

Audio 1.03 (33:22):
and, and to, to be fair, like most of the guys I
work with are actually, and areand, and am in school with, are
excellent.
Like the only troubles I've everhad are from like old crotchety
men.
From way back the that I

Audio 1.02 (33:35):
off all the old crotchety men We'll be fine

Audio 1.03 (33:37):
yeah, yeah, the guys who I work with who were like,
honestly, 55 and younger arefine.
So there's that.
By fine, I mean, we can havefrank discussions about things
that we vehemently disagree witheach other about.

Audio 1.05 (33:51):
You, you have more patience than I do.

Audio 1.03 (33:54):
eh,

Audio 1.05 (33:54):
What has your mental health been like now that you're
you've been in this for a while,so just, you talked, you kind of
gave this briefly where it's Iam not a manager of guest
services, and you were just sohappy not talking to people.
Like, where are you nowmentally?
do you like your job?
Do you feel invigorated?

Audio 1.03 (34:07):
What day is it?

Audio 1.05 (34:09):
Okay.

Audio 1.03 (34:10):
I, I'm not, I'm not a very indoorsy person.
I like being indoors, butworking in inside an office all
day in front of a computer makesme incredibly antsy.
And so when I am working outsideor I'm just moving around all
day, I, my mental health is somuch better.
I routinely would get 15 to20,000 steps a day at my last
job.
And it just I like to be movingand that helps so much.

(34:32):
there are certain things.
it's not, it's not all sunshineand roses.
There are certain tasks that Ido where they're menial and
they're dumb and you stand stillfor them and they take

Audio 1.05 (34:41):
Hold on.
Are they any dumber than snailsand jars, though?
That's kind of like, that's likethe,

Audio 1.03 (34:47):
and I, and you know what?
I had to be earning a master'sfor that shit.
So,

Audio 1.02 (34:51):
It blows my

Audio 1.05 (34:52):
that's true.

Audio 1.03 (34:54):
so, things like fire where you're basically like
shooting fireproof putty intoholes that you've drilled.
it's not the most thrillingthing in the world, but, you
listen to podcasts and you geton with your day.
but I would say that my mentalhealth has been, has been good.

Audio 1.02 (35:06):
Please uh out the the Burnout Collective anywhere
that you listen to your podcasts

Audio 1.03 (35:12):
It's, And, and guys help, honestly, I do.
I listen to podcasts work, andI'm not just saying this, but I
guys on

Audio 1.05 (35:20):
I would listen to us at work, honestly.

Audio 1.03 (35:23):
it's, nice to reminded.
I'm like, oh, there's like otherwomen out there with jobs just
because I don't get to see anywomen in the work workplace,
ever.
So it's just, I don't know.
I like what you guys do.

Audio 1.05 (35:35):
Do you feel uncomfortable at all?
Like when you're out there, whenyou are the only girl?
Like

Audio 1.03 (35:39):
Not anymore.

Audio 1.05 (35:40):
safe.
Okay,

Audio 1.03 (35:43):
No.
If they've, honestly, I think Imake them more uncomfortable
than they make me

Audio 1.05 (35:48):
perfect.
Keep it that way.
Become ungovernable.

Audio 1.02 (35:51):
needs to be A hundred

Audio 1.03 (35:52):
yeah, because they're good guys and they don't
wanna be

Audio 1.05 (35:55):
They're walking.
They're walking to the truckswith their Wolverine pink claws.

Audio 1.03 (35:59):
there's, there's, well, no, and like, I was, I was
back one day, and this was rightafter I had come back from an
injury and I, I guess I waslimping.
I didn't realize it, I wascarrying this huge tote and this
one guy like ran up behind meand he was like, let me carry
that for you.
And so there are times whenyou're like, don't treat me like
a girl, but you're also like, Ireally

Audio 1.02 (36:18):
thank God

Audio 1.03 (36:19):
Thank you Right.
you

Audio 1.02 (36:20):
I like that every day of my I fucking got this I
don't need help

Audio 1.03 (36:25):
yeah.
And so I, I do appreciate thosemoments, like another guy who
won't eat in the lunch trailerwhen I'm there,

Audio 1.05 (36:32):
Oh, that's because his wife doesn't let him be
alone with other women.
without another

Audio 1.03 (36:36):
that thing.
That is a There are guys I worklike tell their wives about me

Audio 1.02 (36:41):
what

Audio 1.03 (36:42):
and it's like, wait, no, I know, I know, I know.
it's it's few and far betweenmany I swear to God, like most
of them just bitch about theirwives.
that's their primary occupationis drinking and bitching about
their wives.
And I'm like, your life is you.

Audio 1.02 (36:56):
Oh my God

Audio 1.05 (36:58):
But Ash wants to know it was uncomfortable to
start with, like finding.
Yeah, I can imagine.

Audio 1.03 (37:04):
and, and also because I am not, I am not a
country girl and where I live isvery rural and these guys are
all, they really like cars.
They like guns, they like andoff-roading and stuff.
That is, is fine.
And I'm sure I would like it ifI knew how to do any of it, but
I'm I like playing the piano andI doing art and books.
Eh, so like, we don't, we don'toften have things to talk about.

(37:26):
So I I just listen to them talkabout cars, and I try to learn
stuff every once in a I'm so, Idon't, I I really hate cars

Audio 1.05 (37:36):
I couldn't, your patience level is fantastic
'cause I would just get soannoyed.

Audio 1.03 (37:43):
I think it comes from, I've always felt that it,
much as I say I don't likepeople, that's not really true
because every person that Iencounter, I'm like, they're
like a book.
And you, they have all thesedifferent chapters and all these
different stories, and there'sso much to every person that you
meet

Audio 1.02 (38:01):
That's exactly how I feel and I just watched Rebecca
roll her eyes so hard

Audio 1.03 (38:05):
I know, and I, I know.
I'm like, Rebecca does

Audio 1.05 (38:06):
I am sorry.
The taurus.
taurus Snap judgment is,

Audio 1.03 (38:10):
You what?
I've known you for 36 years.
It's cool.
I knew you weren't gonna agreeme, but true.
And actually this is why Iwanted anthropology is because
people are and so head, and thisis, I also really dates and
interviews for the same reason.
Because you never run out ofthings about because you, I just
met this person, I need to knoweverything about them.

Audio 1.02 (38:29):
Oh God

Audio 1.03 (38:30):
So that helps sometimes

Audio 1.02 (38:32):
about

Audio 1.05 (38:33):
true.
We will do that.

Audio 1.03 (38:35):
but you have to keep it socially acceptable

Audio 1.05 (38:37):
the first time I went to Robert's apartment, I
just immediately started diggingthrough his closet and all of
his drawers and being like, whatis this?
What are these pictures?
Who is

Audio 1.02 (38:46):
Rachel would you ever first time you went to a
partner's place when you weredating

Audio 1.03 (38:51):
Not the first was on a, in a relationship that was on
the rocks

Audio 1.02 (38:56):
I've just never done that period

Audio 1.03 (38:58):
Oh I've done it once and I felt so bad.
I've genuinely never done itagain.

Audio 1.05 (39:03):
Oh no, he was right there.
No, he was literally right thereand I'm like, tell me who

Audio 1.04 (39:06):
is this?

Audio 1.05 (39:07):
What are you doing?
Oh, yeah, no, he was literallyright there and I was just at
like, who is this?
In this picture?
Is your mom dead?
like just,

Audio 1.03 (39:15):
do you of that I don't, I don't, I don't think I,
I don't think I could do that.
I could not do that.

Audio 1.02 (39:22):
your

Audio 1.05 (39:22):
I mean, I think it's like just ripped that bandaid
off and I needed to know if hewas a serial killer, so,

Audio 1.03 (39:27):
I, I support it.
I'm not judging.
I just, I, I like putting myselfin your position of doing that.
It makes me feel so deeplyuncomfortable on so many levels,
but maybe you that, like give afuck

Audio 1.05 (39:37):
Oh no, I love it.
I love going through people's

Audio 1.02 (39:40):
doesn't have that Give a fuck

Audio 1.03 (39:41):
I know, I know.
I

Audio 1.02 (39:43):
give a fucks

Audio 1.03 (39:45):
fucks to give.

Audio 1.05 (39:47):
No, that's what you have to start in strong, like a
new person you start to workwith.
What is your religious trauma?
Are your parents divorced?
Yeah.
You

Audio 1.02 (39:54):
I know

Audio 1.03 (39:55):
the wild thing

Audio 1.02 (39:56):
I do wanna know that

Audio 1.03 (39:58):
and there is so much of it and, and so many of these
guys, and I don't know if it'sbecause I'm a girl, but they
will tell you everythingimmediately.
And want me to like them, andthey, they

Audio 1.05 (40:09):
it's'cause my stupid wife doesn't listen to me.
I can't talk like this at home.

Audio 1.03 (40:13):
ki he feel bad for them.
You're like, I'm sorry forwhatever you're going through.
not everything about you greatand I definitely wouldn't
fucking marry you.
But it's like they need someoneto talk to.
And so I was talking to one ofmy, my

Audio 1.05 (40:24):
Hold on a minute.
You know who's fuckingtherapist?
Go to therapy.

Audio 1.03 (40:28):
Okay.
And so I will say I have learnedthe hard way to put up
boundaries.
Like I have learned this thehard way because inevitably I
start telling them things aboutmyself, and then those things
always come back to bite mebecause these men gossip like
fucking middle schoolers, youwould not believe.
Like they have no filters andthey just say everything.
So if they know stuff about you,they're gonna share it with

(40:50):
everybody else.
And then suddenly everybodyknows your business.
And it's not

Audio 1.05 (40:54):
This is why you, they can't be in leadership.
They're too emotional.
I mean, that's why theyshouldn't lead.

Audio 1.03 (40:59):
It's, it's, and

Audio 1.02 (41:00):
I I also just so many men like it's gotta be like
a high percentage of men Treat alot of women a lot of partners
as therapists or mothers

Audio 1.05 (41:11):
Mm-hmm.

Audio 1.03 (41:12):
yeah,

Audio 1.02 (41:13):
Don't do that Don't be that guy

Audio 1.05 (41:16):
You have to be mommy wife.

Audio 1.02 (41:18):
says I think sometimes guys automatically see
women as safe places to shareemotions with other men not
being safe And yes they shouldgo to therapy not burden the
women in their lives YepPatriarchy

Audio 1.05 (41:29):
Yeah.

Audio 1.03 (41:30):
Yeah.
And I, again, like I, I'mpretty, I'm pretty naive, just
like inherently.
And so, like, it took me aminute to learn this, that I
don't have to be that person.
And if, if I get to know theseguys one-on-one, then sure, like
I'll listen to them.
But I've told them now, now Ihave told them that if they come
to me with my first piece ofthen dump her off the cuff.

(41:52):
Like I don't have to.
I'm dump her.
I don't care.
Lemme move on with my daybecause I need to go back to
work.
I'm here to work.
I'm not here to be your goddamntherapist.
And it's taken me a long time tobuild that up though, right?
Like at first I was like, oh, ofcourse I'll listen to your
problems because I shouldrespect you because you're a
journeyman.
And now I'm like, fuck off.
Like I need to work it.
It's taken me a minute.

Audio 1.05 (42:09):
Healthy boundaries at work.
Look at you.
Very good.

Audio 1.03 (42:12):
I know.
I'm working on it.
So

Audio 1.02 (42:15):
doing great

Audio 1.05 (42:17):
No, that's great.
No, genuinely.
That was great.

Audio 1.03 (42:19):
Thanks.
And I, I really, I liked my lastcrew too.
they were just, they were goodguys.
we had great conversations.
None of us were on same pagepolitically, but like we talked
about it and we got through theday together and we would go out
and have pizza and beer afterwork.
So

Audio 1.02 (42:32):
I

Audio 1.05 (42:33):
All right,

Audio 1.02 (42:33):
did wanna ask cause I have never heard the story
from you I wanna hear the barnstory us maybe a little
background Tell us the story ifyou're comfortable

Audio 1.05 (42:44):
Rachel Cannon, Barnes survivor.

Audio 1.03 (42:47):
Okay.
How much preamble do you wantfor this?

Audio 1.05 (42:51):
Do it.
Just do it

Audio 1.04 (42:52):
all

Audio 1.02 (42:52):
a whole story a whole dramatic story Let's go
take a drink

Audio 1.03 (42:56):
work my storytelling skills.
Okay.
I am not a country girl and torural Oregon to, to buy a house
with my partner who I'd knownfor all of four months.
And we have an acre and a half,neither one of us fucking idea
how to manage an acre and So wehad this shitty old pull like
four ponderosa pine trees in theground with a roof and some

(43:18):
siding around it.
That was, crappy to say theleast.
And pieces of it were fallingdown.
And so I had the bright idea ofwhat if we took this eyesore
down, just tore all this, the,the siding off, and we turned it
into a nice chicken coop ourchickens and like a greenhouse
structure.
So it turns out that when youput just straight ass.

(43:38):
Trees in the ground when thesoil is very acidic and they're
sitting there for probably 27years or so.
The wood is no longerstructurally sound I'm out there
one day and I said to Caleb,Hey, we should pour concrete
footings for this to shore upthis structure.
And he was like, okay, I'll goto the hardware store and I'll
get some bags of concrete.

(43:58):
And I'm like clearing out theremnants of what used to be the
chicken coop.
'cause we had temporarilyrehomed the chicken so we could
do this project, right?
I hear a, I stopped and I went,oh, that's probably And.
I hear err and I went, boys,boys.
And I was like, trying to shoshove the dogs away, like get
them out of the way.
And I started to run and thenran as the barn fell this onto

(44:25):
me.
I ran in exactly the wrongdirection.
and this whole fucking thingjust teeter totters down right
on top of me.
and it landed with a corner ofit under a burn barrel and
tilted down like this, right?
And I am right next to the burnbarrel.
And so that was the only thingthat kept that fucking roof that

(44:45):
probably weighed well over athousand pounds just from
smashing me.
Right?
my first thought was after allthe dusty cleared was,
motherfucker, this is gonna beexpensive, God dammit.
And my second thought was, wherethe hell are my dogs?
So I like I had just this muchto look out underneath, like
the, the, the roof.

(45:06):
And I saw our Pomeranian huh,what's going is exciting.
And then our other dog was like,oh, what's happening?
And so okay, the dogs are alive.
Cool

Audio 1.02 (45:14):
are safe

Audio 1.03 (45:16):
And like, and when shit like this happens, you're
just kind of in like a state ofokay, handle I'm in.

Audio 1.05 (45:20):
No, barns don't fall on people.

Audio 1.03 (45:22):
I don't remember exactly happened but

Audio 1.02 (45:25):
had any experience with this Rebecca She has
percent time had this The barnfell on

Audio 1.03 (45:33):
It's you statistically speaking, you are
correct.
A hundred percent of the timethe barn falls on people.
I thought, okay, I can't affordan ambulance I can probably
crawl out, like I got space.
And so I start to move, but I'mlaying on my side and the hip
that was under me was like,Nope.
The screams.
I have Scrum, it was, it morethan anything I've ever felt in
my entire life.

(45:54):
And so I kept trying and Icouldn't move and I was just, I
started yelling and I was like,somebody please help, please
help.
I don't know, dunno what, no onecan hear me.
'cause there was a fucking barnon top of me.
So sometime during this I textmy, instructor for my schooling.
'cause I have my phone on me andI was like, I won't be in class
tomorrow.
Number one.

Audio 1.02 (46:12):
first thing you do with phone

Audio 1.03 (46:14):
It was in the cycle somewhere.
And I called my sister and I waslike, okay, so first of all, I'm
fine.
Second of all, you need to callmom and dad

Audio 1.05 (46:23):
No, no, no, no, no, no.
The first time you called and Ijust heard you screaming and I
heard men's voices and then youhung

Audio 1.03 (46:30):
okay.
So I called

Audio 1.02 (46:31):
Oh my God

Audio 1.03 (46:32):
1 1 Okay.
That's good to

Audio 1.05 (46:33):
and I thought she was getting fucking, I don't
even know, but

Audio 1.03 (46:38):
Okay,

Audio 1.05 (46:39):
yeah,

Audio 1.03 (46:39):
So, okay, so I did call 9 1 1 before I called you.
This is good to know.
I did not know that.
so I called 9 1 1 and theoperator stayed on the phone
with me and she was like, justhang out.
Like people will come.
And a whole crew of 15 people,men, tall men, burly men in
fireman suits, came to our yardas our dogs are oh, hi.
I heard them say the dogs arefriendly.

(47:01):
And then they spent about 45minutes trying to figure out how
to get out from underneath thisbarn.
This

Audio 1.02 (47:06):
selfies while she's under the barn with the hot bur
men Mm-hmm

Audio 1.03 (47:10):
yeah.
I thought about it and was like,that's tacky.
Like I can't do you also haveremember that time, like my
partner who is a straight male,was at the hardware store and I
tried to call him twice and hedidn't pick up his

Audio 1.02 (47:23):
Oh my God

Audio 1.03 (47:26):
So he gets home from not picking up his phone.
I texted him nine one one, getyour ass home help.
just get home.
And so he comes home and he, hedoesn't the ambulances there.
And so he comes home to a bunchof men, like trying to get me
from out, from underneath thebarn.
And he couldn't do anything'cause they were like, you can't
help just go sit, go sit in yourcar, go sit away.

(47:47):
And they spent 45 minutesarguing over how to get me out.
And at some, at one point theywere like, what if we like
chainsaw this piece of wood?
And I was like, that is seveninches from my head.
Please do not take a chainsaw.
Seven inches from my head.
and eventually they decided tolike basically, do the ice
rescue thing where you like geton your stomach and you pull
somebody out and then you haveanother person holding onto that

(48:07):
person's feet.
And so they had to drag me outon the hip.
That was dislocated.
And don't know if you've everdislocated anything.
Yeah, I can spare you the

Audio 1.02 (48:16):
not

Audio 1.03 (48:16):
but it hurt a lot.
And then they had to

Audio 1.05 (48:20):
A lot.

Audio 1.03 (48:21):
Very, like I I'm not a screamer.
I'm not a screamer, I'm notemotional.
I I screamed from my toes manytimes.
they put me very carefully ontoa stretcher and then I heard one
of them say, give her fentanyl.
And I was like, I don't wantfentanyl.
Fentanyl.
No, it's bad.

Audio 1.05 (48:34):
Yes.

Audio 1.03 (48:35):
of it at this point anyway.
'cause I'm still in shock andtrying to process whatever's
happening.
I'm really glad they gave me thefenal.
And

Audio 1.02 (48:41):
glad they gave you the fentanyl too

Audio 1.03 (48:43):
yeah.
And then on the way out ride wasa half an hour to the hospital
'cause I live in the middle ofgoddamn nowhere.
and they got the ambulance stuckat a certain point'cause they
had rolled into some soft dirtand so it took em a little bit
to figure out how to get theambulance out of the dirt.

Audio 1.05 (48:57):
Oh God.

Audio 1.03 (48:58):
I get to the hospital eventually and they,
I've never done ketamine forfun, but I, I, I now know what
ketamine is like and it issomething so

Audio 1.02 (49:09):
and boy is it something

Audio 1.03 (49:11):
so, like, I don't even know where to like end the
story at, but basically like

Audio 1.02 (49:15):
barn survivor It It hurt a lot

Audio 1.03 (49:18):
it hurt a

Audio 1.05 (49:18):
I think the actual breaking of your fucking hip, it
did break.
It wasn't just dislocated.
You broke

Audio 1.03 (49:23):
did.
Yeah.
And so because it, it snappedwith such force, it, the
acetabular region, which back ofyour pelvis, broken two

Audio 1.02 (49:31):
Love that

Audio 1.03 (49:32):
And so I, I was out for three months.
I was not allowed to go anywhereor do three months, which I am
not good at sitting still.
So I was outta And I will saythat the, my major takeaway from
this story is that shit happensand you just deal with it.
that's, as we get older, shitjust fucking happens.

(49:53):
People die, barns fall on Likepeople get cancer.
You could lose your job,whatever it is.
And it sucks and you can talkabout it and you can process it,
but like all you can really dois continue to move forward.
Otherwise you just fall over anddie.
I don't mean that to be

Audio 1.05 (50:06):
And don't talk to Rachel about it at work.
She doesn't wanna hear it, don'ttalk to her about it at work,
about anything.
Whatever shit has happened toyou.
I don't want you working.

Audio 1.03 (50:15):
I think after, after this happened to me, I've heard
from guys who are like, oh yeah,like I went off running one time
and I like broke my leg in 17places and I was outta work for
four months.
my partner's dad was telling meabout a time when he did really
traumatic to it It they really,people just get hurt lot.
They just, yeah.
It happens.
And so now I have my story, Iguess I don't recommend it for

(50:38):
anybody.

Audio 1.02 (50:39):
Hey at least you have your fun fact When you meet
new people you know

Audio 1.03 (50:42):
Right?

Audio 1.05 (50:42):
Mm-hmm.

Audio 1.02 (50:44):
an entire barn fell on me and I lived

Audio 1.03 (50:46):
Yeah, yeah, totally.
So, I, oh, oh, so rather thanconstructing a new coop I had
spent$400 on material for, I hada broken fucking hip.
My partner was like, I'm notbuilding a fucking chicken,
chicken cuppa.
We were like, okay.
So we found somebody to take thechickens as animals, not as to
eat, just,

Audio 1.02 (51:06):
Okay She saw my face She's

Audio 1.03 (51:08):
So I was like, they didn't, I don't think they ate
chickens, but it ate mybusiness.
So

Audio 1.02 (51:12):
I just remember been to oh I guess I've been to
Portland a few times now but thefirst time I ever went to
Portland I was just doing a lotof like touristy things and a
lot of different hikes and stuffI remember coming down from a
hike I don't remember what itwas and it was just like like
the trail started and ended inthis little neighborhood I'm

(51:32):
walking through the neighborhoodand the house like immediately
to my left I just look andthere's just like three chickens
in the backyard just and I waslike

Audio 1.03 (51:40):
just hanging out.

Audio 1.02 (51:40):
I'm in Portland

Audio 1.03 (51:42):
We, we also had chickens.
Their names were lemon, cello,hookers, and blackjack.

Audio 1.02 (51:48):
Those

Audio 1.03 (51:48):
no I'm sorry.
We had two chickens at the timeof this barn falling incident
because one of them got eaten bythe neighbor's cat.
This is, this is why I thinkpeople are like, I'm gonna move
for the country and forget allmy problems.
No, you're not.
No you're not.
Because you have to keeplivestock alive Yeah.
And you can't just take them inyour house and cuddle them and
make them yours.
You can, but those people arecrazy.

(52:10):
So I don't know people who arelike, I just wanna move and I
want acreage and I want land.
No, you don't stay in yourapartment.
It's so much easier.
Like, I know it's expensive, butyou don't have to have a barn on
you or like figure out what todo

Audio 1.02 (52:25):
Let this warning stopping renting Don't a barn
might on

Audio 1.05 (52:31):
i.
Well, honestly, thank you somuch.
Like this has been truly, again,this is something we don't talk
about or know about at all,honestly, and

Audio 1.03 (52:40):
Barn

Audio 1.05 (52:41):
is a ton of great information.
Yes.

Audio 1.02 (52:44):
everything

Audio 1.03 (52:45):
Okay.
Yeah.
And it's system, but I thinkthat collective bargaining thing
and, and the ability to talkabout wages at work without this
like bullshit of, we don't talkto about how much we're

Audio 1.05 (53:01):
Yeah.
Pay transparency is almostnon-existent.
We've had it once, I've had itonce.
I don't know if had it more thantime at the startup we were at.
We had, but that's'cause we hada great HR person.
but I've never had it anywhereelse and have been actively
discouraged from talking abouthow much I make.

Audio 1.02 (53:18):
Yeah

Audio 1.03 (53:18):
For me it's always been like, I don't.
Make enough like, have anybodycare about Like who, who the
fuck cares that I make 48,000 ayear?
Although I was in a position atone point where I was hiring as
I, I was helping hire two peoplewho made$60,000 a year.
So I, I had the final say on whowe hired, who made$12,000 a year
more than I did.

Audio 1.02 (53:39):
That's insane

Audio 1.03 (53:39):
And I up for myself and I really wish that I would
have,

Audio 1.05 (53:45):
no, this is great.
And I, I think honestly, I planto just poke on the internet.
I, I find it fascinating and Ilove, I, I love you telling us
everything.
Like I know you could probablytalk about this for hours.

Audio 1.03 (53:58):
could,

Audio 1.05 (53:58):
I have lots of questions.

Audio 1.03 (53:59):
and

Audio 1.02 (54:00):
we'll just

Audio 1.05 (54:00):
No, this is wonderful.
Yeah, no, thank you so

Audio 1.02 (54:03):
cosmic in chat here said anytime I get told not to
talk about how much I make Iimmediately tell everyone I see
Yeah that's how I feel I

Audio 1.03 (54:11):
I was gonna say, I'm also, within our local, I'm also
the recording secretary for ourSisters committee, so I guess if
anybody has questions aboutthings like that or they wanna
know about unionized trades, I'malways happy to help people
drink the Kool-Aid.
I Kool-Aid.
It's delicious.
that's all.
Yeah.
Yeah.
and I would also encouragepeople that, like when, if

(54:32):
you're reading the news and seesome of this bullshit about like
national right to work.
Or how people are anti-union orhow they're trying to rewrite
the laws in really sneaky waysthat are bad for American
workers.
read up on those things like ifyou have time, do that research
so that you can talk openlyabout them.
So if you meet somebody who'slike, well, I don't agree with
unions, you can actually belike, well, let me tell you.

(54:54):
I that that's really importantfor people to know as Americans
and as

Audio 1.05 (54:59):
We will put your email in the, show notes
genuinely, thank you so much.
I, I can't wait to have you backand hear more about this.
I, I think it's important to getthis info out'cause I didn't
know anything about it and Idon't think a lot of people know
a lot about it.

Audio 1.03 (55:11):
It's a deep hole.
It's a deep, and there's a lotof holes to go down right now,
so thank you for taking, thankyou so much for having me, and
it was really lovely to talk tothe both I love what you do and
I'm, I'm so happy that you'redoing this and filling this
niche for who just need toscream and not to avoid void
into like

Audio 1.05 (55:24):
Why not?
Stop, stop.

Audio 1.02 (55:27):
Also like Rachel and I figured out like how similar
we are and like now we're alsogonna be friends.
Thank you so much.
I'm so glad I got to

Audio 1.05 (55:35):
No, thank you.
Thank you.

Audio 1.02 (55:36):
get to

Audio 1.03 (55:36):
Yeah you

Audio 1.05 (55:37):
All right, well we will see you guys next Thursday.

Audio 1.02 (55:40):
Yeah.
See you next week.
Thank you everybody.
Thank you for being here.
The Burnout Collective is hostedby me, Jamie Young, and me,
Rebecca McCracken.
You can find all our episodesplus show
[e-mail].
Follow the discord link on ourwebsite to join the Burnout
community.
You can also find us on TikTokand Instagram.

(56:00):
If you're interested in being aguest on a future episode or
have questions or feedback, youcan email us at
[e-mail].