October 24, 2024 • 34 mins
Samantha Phillips is an insurance broker who specializes in insuring child care centers, a job that is especially tough this days as ECE businesses struggle to find and keep insurance.
Costs are soaring. Samantha said she has a client in Massachusetts whose insurance DOUBLED, from $25,000 a year to $50,000 a year .. and the client had never filed a claim. And paying that amount was the client's only option.
That's just one example Samantha shares during this podcast. She also gives examples of court verdicts and settlements stemming from cases in child care centers that are affecting premiums, as well as how licensing inspections are playing a role in skyrocketing costs.
Samantha also gives tips on how to keep your current insurance, which is getting harder and harder to do, as well as what you can do to shop around to try to find lower prices. One such tip is to write an insurance narrative to show that you have a strong management team and that your approach to protecting your property is proactive rather than reactive.
To get more advice from Samantha, check out her Facebook page or visit comployhr.com.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:08):
Welcome to the Childcare Business Podcast,
brought to you by ProCareSolutions. This podcast is all
about giving childcare ,preschool, daycare, after
school , and other earlyeducation professionals. A fun
and upbeat way to learn aboutstrategies and inspiration you
can use to thrive. You'll hearfrom a variety of childcare
(00:29):
thought leaders, includingeducators, owners, and industry
experts on ways to innovate, tomeet the needs of the children
you serve. From practical tipsfor managing operations to
uplifting stories oftransformation and triumph,
this podcast will be chock fullof insights you can use to
fully realize the potential ofyour childcare business. Let's
(00:50):
jump in.
Speaker 2 (00:54):
Hello everyone, and welcome to the Childcare
Business Podcast. My name isLeah Woodbury. Um, I'm our head
of content here at ProCareSolutions, and I'm really happy
to have you all join us today.
Um, we're thrilled to haveSamantha Phillips with us.
She's an expert in a topic thatwe really don't talk enough
about enough, but we know isconstantly on the minds of
(01:16):
childcare center owners anddirectors, and that is
childcare insurance. And she'sone of the rare people out
there who specializes ininsuring and helping insur
helping childcare centers findinsurance. So, welcome,
Samantha. Thank
Speaker 3 (01:32):
You so much for having me. Um, trying to ensure
childcare centers seems moreappropriate these days.
Speaker 2 (01:40):
Yeah, I think that that would be a better
description, wouldn't it?
. So before we jumpinto that , um, we always like
to start these podcasts,getting a little bit of
background on our guests , andyour story is particularly
unique. So you were aninsurance agent, your son got
hurt, it was at his preschool,I think, and Mm-Hmm.
. And what, whathappened and how did that, that
(02:01):
motivate you?
Speaker 3 (02:03):
Yeah, so my, my first , um, my first role at an
insurance agency, I started outas their receptionist, and
there was a preschool,literally right down the
street. It was less than half amile. And my son was enrolled
there because it was reallyconvenient to be able to work
at the insurance agency. Andhis preschool was so close.
(02:26):
Mm-Hmm. . Um, andthen I get a call one day that
he'd been hurt. He was runningin the classroom, shocker. Um,
and ran into the cubbies thatwere hanging on the wall and
gashed his forehead open. Um ,when the director called me,
you know, our , the directorshave such a, a skill with their
words , um, and are veryfinessed and keeping parents
(02:48):
calm whenever they relay newslike that. And so I always
laugh now because I finished myemail that I was working on
before I left to go get him ,because the way she explained
it, it didn't sound as , uh, as, uh, pressing of an injury as
it was. Yeah . Um, but anyways,so it, that ended up being a, a
(03:09):
really traumatic experience forhe and I both because he needed
stitches. And I'm literally inthis doctor's office curled up
in a ball in the corner with myears plugged in my eye or my
ears, yeah. Ears plugged, eyesclosed because the numbing
medicine that they used toinject around the site where he
needed stitches so that hewouldn't feel it did not work.
(03:32):
And he was screaming bloodymurder for mommy to rescue him.
And I couldn't because heneeded the stitches. And if I
were to stop what was takingplace, there's no way that he
was gonna let them touch himagain. And it took my husband,
who is a, a very solid guy ,um, and four other staff
members to hold this littlehuman down to be able to stitch
(03:52):
him up with as much as he waswailing. It was awful. Um, fast
forward , the director was veryconcerned. You know, she had
called and checked on him whilewe were at home, just loving on
each other next couple of daysbecause we both needed that
reassurance like, mommy isthere for you. And when I took
him back, the director askedme, would our insurance cover
this? Because the agency that Iworked at at the time insured
(04:16):
his preschool. And it was likea light bulb went off in my
head because I realized in thatmoment that if an agency, or if
we are the agency that isinsuring this preschool and
they are right down the streetfrom us and they don't know if
the coverage that we have inplace for them would cover a
scenario like that, then we'renot doing a good enough job
(04:37):
educating our clients on thetypes of coverages they have
and claim scenarios that theycould protect them against. And
so that really was what set meon this trajectory of, well,
I'm gonna rewrite thatnarrative and be the one that
educates educators. Um, and soI've been looking for different
ways to do it ever since.
Speaker 2 (04:57):
Well, you have a ton of really, really great
knowledge, so I'm reallyexcited to jump in and and pick
your brain. Thank you. Andshift to today. So like I said
earlier here at ProCare, we'rehearing a lot of our customers
talking about renewal premiumskyrocketing. Mm-Hmm .
. Is thishappening? Is this happening
everywhere? What's the reason?
(05:19):
What kind of, what kind ofinsight can you give us on
what's going on?
Speaker 3 (05:22):
Yeah, absolutely.
Um, definitely happeningnationwide. Some states are
experiencing it , uh, a littlebit rougher than others because
of catastrophic exposure, liketornado prone states or
hurricane prone states,wildfires , um, those sorts of
states, the property premiumincreases are hitting them just
(05:43):
as hard, but nationally, allchildcare , um, programs are
really experiencing a shift inthe liability. Um, what
companies are willing to offer,what they're looking at as far
as underwriting guidelines ,um, the premiums that they're
willing to renew if they'reeven willing to offer renewal.
Um, I started seeing red flagsthat we were headed in the
(06:07):
direction , um, or headedtowards where we are right now
last September. And so I'veofficially been talking about
the childcare insurance crisisfor a year now. Just trying my
best to make people aware of,look, this is coming. Um, there
are some things you can do tolessen the impact, but it's
gonna be painful and it's gonnaget worse before it gets
better. And we are definitelyin the thick of the suck right
(06:29):
now. Um, it's, it's pretty bad.
Premium increases are higherthan they have ever been. Some
programs are experiencing asmuch as five times what their
premium was just last year andwithout having ever filed any
claims. Um, so that's thereality that programs are
facing right now.
Speaker 2 (06:48):
Well, I saw you posted on your , um, Facebook
page, which we will link to inthe show notes 'cause you share
such good information. Um, youwere comparing this year's
renewal premium cost versuslast year, and
Speaker 3 (07:01):
Yes.
Speaker 2 (07:02):
The one that jumped
Speaker 3 (07:03):
Out, and that was back in December last year. Yes
. So it's gotten evenprogressively worse now.
Speaker 2 (07:09):
Oh . I mean, the numbers were just staggering.
One, it was a two site center.
It went from like 15,000 up to22,000. So I mean Mm-Hmm .
$6,500 increase.
I mean, it was just wild.
Speaker 3 (07:26):
Yeah. And that, you know , the whole purpose of
that pose too was to let peopleknow sometimes it's easier to
see a number form Yeah . Whatit is that I'm talking about
when I say childcare insurancecrisis, what does that mean?
Um, and so that was the bestway that I could think of to
provide a visual for thingsaren't good right now. Um, you
know, I've got a client inMassachusetts that went, single
(07:48):
sites , went from paying around25,000 a year to 50,000 a year
and had never filed any claims.
Well, established business hadbeen in the industry for 25
years, and that that $50,000option was literally our only
option for her. So her choiceswere pay it or operate without
insurance, which is not, youcan't do that in Massachusetts
(08:10):
and nobody would want toanyways.
Speaker 2 (08:12):
No, no, no. And then the , when you were talking
about no, no claims, could you,could you give us some examples
of recent verdicts orsettlements that are, that are
maybe affecting these premiumson claims that have been made ?
Speaker 3 (08:27):
Yeah . So I actually got some insurance companies
are very tightlipped wheneverit comes to sharing claims
data. Um, which doesn't help uson the risk management side
when we're trying to figureout, well, what can we do to
keep claims from occurring?
Well, if we don't know wherethe largest majority of claims
are happening, then it's hardto figure out how to keep them
from happening. Mm-Hmm.
(08:48):
. Um, but I didhave one company that shared
some information with me onsome of their recent verdicts,
an abuse molestation claimwhere a male employee had had
improper contact with severalchildren, paid 2.8, just under
$2.9 million , um, had a childslide down. Um, it's hard to
(09:11):
wrap my mind around why a ropewould be anywhere near a slide,
but the child's neck got caughtin the rope, ended up choking
them. That paid out $1.5million. Um, a mother of a
child fell when she slipped onbubbles from a birthday party
that they had on site that paid$863,000. Um, an infant died
(09:35):
from SIDS while taking a napthat was $846,000. So, and
that's just a handful of, ofclaims examples, but when you
add in also property losses,I've seen water damage claims
from sprinkler systems, thefire sprinkler systems that are
designed to te protect yourproperty from fire. I've seen
them cause so much water damagefrom temperatures outside
(09:58):
freezing and causing those popsto burst because they weren't ,
weren't properly winterized.
Um, and those claims areseveral hundreds of thousands
of dollars and a long time forrepairs .
Speaker 2 (10:11):
Repairs . Oh . So, and because of this, some
insurance companies, they'rejust leaving childcare , right?
They're just saying, we're not,we're not messing with this. Is
that, is that what you're
Speaker 3 (10:21):
Saying? Yeah , they're like, peace , I'm out.
Mm-Hmm . .
Speaker 2 (10:23):
Yeah. Oh ,
Speaker 3 (10:24):
And there was, there was always a small pool of
insurance companies to beginwith that would ensure
childcare , I would say at anygiven time, no more than about
15 companies , um, in the, whatwe call the admitted market.
And , um, we lost about half ofthose in Q4 2023. The about
(10:45):
half of the ones that are leftnow are only regional
providers, which means theydon't insure every state. They
only insure anywhere from 10 to20 states across the us . Um,
so then you've got a very smallselection, especially for those
, um, providers operating instates that don't have access
to the regional providersbecause they don't, they don't
(11:08):
insure in that state. Yeah .
And then also with thecompanies that are left, we're
seeing just drastic changes inwhat they're looking for and
what they're willing to insure. So it's really like trying to
find a suitable insuranceprovider for every program.
Now. It's like looking for aneedle in a haystack. You have
to check all the right boxes inorder to be accepted into the
(11:31):
few programs that are left outthere.
Speaker 2 (11:34):
And how are , um, licensing inspections playing
into that? Um, and I honestly,I think very
Speaker 3 (11:41):
Heavily,
Speaker 2 (11:41):
This could probably be an entire podcast in itself.
So they're , so these insurancecompanies are actually digging
into inspection reports, likeat the state level? Yes . Or
Speaker 3 (11:51):
Yes, they are going online. They're reviewing the ,
um, the state inspectionreports. They're looking at the
violations. Um, repetitiousviolations really shows that
either you don't care about theproblem or you don't care about
fixing it. Um, any violationsthat could pose harm to a
(12:11):
child, such as brokenplayground equipment or , um,
background checks is a big one.
Um, access to hazardouschemicals, things violations
like that. The insurancecompanies look at those as,
okay, if these are the types ofthings they're cited for in
their inspection reports,they're obviously more of a
(12:32):
risky program because theydon't have the right systems
and balances in place to makesure that these violations
aren't occurring. Um, sothey're really on the lookout
for those inspection reportsand using them as a means of
determining, is this programworth ensuring they're not
because they have safeoperations, or do we want to
(12:54):
decline to wrap them justsimply based on what we see in
the inspection reports.
Speaker 2 (12:59):
Okay . Okay . So before we, before we move into
what centers can do, and Ipromise that's coming, I'm sure
everybody's waiting. ,I'd love to pick your brain a
little bit about the recentNACI liability insurance survey
, um, naci National Associationfor the Education of Young
Children. I'm sure all, all ourlisteners knew that. Um, it's
(13:21):
def one step that youmentioned, or that you
highlighted, I should say fromthe report, is that 62% of
respondents reported that theirprogram had difficulty finding
liability insurance or findingaffordable liability insurance.
Mm-Hmm . . Andthat the top named reason for
non-renewals is the insurancecompany is no longer iur
(13:43):
childcare . And you talkedabout this before, but I just
wanted to see if you could go alittle bit deeper into how that
those figures jive with whatyou're seeing and hearing. Is
it more in one part of thecountry? Are there regions
where things are maybe betterthan another or, or any other
insights you might have onthose stats?
Speaker 3 (14:03):
Yeah. Um, definitely in line with what I've been
seeing. And I was veryfortunate to get to work with
Nay . They had reached out andasked to pick my brain on
helping them curate thequestions so that they could
collect the right information.
Um , so I got to play a really,a really heavy role in that.
But there was almost avalidation in it because I'm
(14:23):
like, finally, finally we haveofficial data. I've had so many
people reaching out aboutadvocacy initiatives, and we
didn't have firm data otherthan, you know, just individual
people's stories. Mm-Hmm .
. And here I'vebeen saying all along that, you
know, this is an issue. Um, soto actually see in number form
that 62% of providers areexperiencing difficulty was, it
(14:49):
wasn't really alarming to me ,but it, it was alarming, if
that makes sense. It does. Um,and it does . And then the, the
top reason being that insurancecompanies are exiting. I mean,
that absolutely made sensebecause I personally, I mean,
I'm still insuring clients andmy team is, our bandwidth is so
(15:10):
stretched thin because we arereally struggling to try and
make sure that our currentclients stay insured, and then
we get calls regularly withpeople in desperation because
they can't find insurance.
Their agent hasn't been able tofind them replacement coverage.
I've never received so manycalls, messages, text messages
, um, from providers that arenow uninsured because their
(15:31):
coverage lapsed when theiragent couldn't find them
anything. Um, and so for us tobe in that state, but see
numbers that reflect that, I'mreally hoping that the data,
and I attended Nacey's webinaryesterday where they kind of
went over that , um, that finalreview or that final draft. And
most of the advocates that wereon that call talked about, they
(15:53):
are hoping as well that thisdata will help us , help us
advance advocacy initiativesforward. Because, you know,
anybody in a position of powerwants to see firm figures. They
wanna see is this truly anissue? They don't wanna just
hear stories, show me the data.
And that's where we're at nowwith that , uh, survey.
Speaker 2 (16:12):
Oh, well that is, that is good news that yeah,
you have the data to back upwhat we know is happening, so
that's amazing. Yes. Okay. Sowe've gone through what's going
on. Let's talk about whatchildcare center leaders can
do. So if we could start withhow to keep insurance, that
would be great. How do we, howdo we keep it, if we're at
(16:36):
least for the most part, happyabout it? ,
Speaker 3 (16:39):
Um, this is, this one's very simple, but , um,
pay your bills , uh, very, veryeasy. Just make sure that your
premiums get paid. Insurancecompanies are looking for
reasons not to renew problemaccounts. And if you are a
client that regularly non pays, um, or you're late in paying,
(17:04):
don't give an opportunity for adeclination or a , or not
necessarily a declination. Inthat case, it would be , um,
refusal to reinstate due tononpayment of premium. So don't
give an extra reason to bedropped by an insurance company
for something as simple as notpaying your premium. Stay on
top of that. Make sure thepremiums are paid by their due
(17:26):
date . Um, that's the biggestone. If you've got it, then you
can keep it. Just make sure youpay your bills. Um , other
things, if you do get dropped,most people are facing
non-renewals. You know, we'reseeing that a lot. So for the
people that don't have arenewal bill to be able to pay
and they don't have thatluxury, you've gotta start
(17:46):
early. Um, and I would not waitfor the non-renewal to come
either, because most states,the legal , um, the legal
requirement to send you noticeby the insurance company is
anywhere from 30 days to 60days. It is taking my team no
less than 30 days to findinsurance quotes. And that
doesn't even count the processfor the applications we have to
(18:10):
collect the loss runs we haveto order. So I would say at
minimum, it takes us right now,45 days to even try and get
quotes. And that's still withus maybe getting quotes
trickling in right down to theexpiration date. So if you're
waiting to receive anon-renewal thinking, well,
this isn't gonna happen to me,or it hasn't happened to me
yet, that's because theinsurance company is not
(18:30):
legally required to send younotice until 45 days out or 30
days out, depending on whatyour state requirement is. So I
would recommend as a Plan B,just in case, reach out to an
insurance agency thatspecializes in childcare and
get that ball rolling just incase you don't get the renewal
offer and you open your mailone day and find the
(18:52):
non-renewal. Speaking of that,I think a lot of people are
sitting on their , um,insurance company mail, because
right at this point, they'reexpecting that renewal offer to
come, like it usually does, andwell , it's just a bill that
needs to be paid. So if theysee a , a letter on their desk
from Philadelphia, forinstance, well, they might be
thinking that is their renewalpremium invoice. And so they'll
(19:15):
get to it when they get to it .
They know they typically haveto pay it before they , um,
policy expires. But what mightbe in that envelope is a
non-renewal notice. And if youset on that mail and aren't
aware of it and can't startacting on it as soon as you're
aware, well then it furtherdelays the, the process and you
not, you potentially not beingable to get replacement
(19:36):
coverage in time .
Speaker 2 (19:38):
Okay.
Speaker 3 (19:41):
Um, um, there's also, you know, proactive
things that programs can do ,um, as far as showcasing that
they've got it going on. I havean insurance narrative template
that I created to help proproviders show that , um, you
know, they have a strongmanagement team in place that
(20:01):
their admin team knows whatthey're doing, that the , um,
the approach they take toprotecting their property is
proactive, not reactive. Thosesorts of things are valuable to
an insurance company, and theywanna know they're looking for
the right partners right now.
They don't wanna insure any andevery business. So it's our job
(20:23):
to paint that picture to theinsurance companies. We've got
to show them, and you've gottahelp us by providing that
information. That narrativetemplate is a great way to do
that, to help show why yourprogram is worth ensuring and
why you are a smart , a smartrisk for the insurance company.
Speaker 2 (20:42):
What about, are there any services or that,
that might leave a childcarecenter exposed that might make
an insurance company go, eh , Idon't know that you should be
doing that?
Speaker 3 (20:54):
Yes. Um, the ones that come to mind right off the
top of my head, birthdayparties, any kind of special
events. Um, and you know,that's, that's difficult
because that's an additionalrevenue stream for a lot of
programs. And when you'refacing infl , like, trust me,
I, I get it to all theproviders that are listing
(21:14):
like, I get it. Um, but that isa , um, that is a sore spot for
insurance companies becauseit's an additional exposure.
And that bubble incident thatpaid $850,000 wouldn't have
happened had it not been for abirthday party on site . Um,
another one that is a soresubject for providers is , um,
(21:38):
to employees in every room atall times for accountability
purposes. That is not requiredin every state and not always
mandated by ratios. So , um, alot of insurance companies now
are making that a mandate inorder to be able to offer
coverage. And for programs thatdon't have the ability to
incorporate that, that leavesthem out of one less insurance
(22:01):
option that might have beenavailable to them . Um, the
other one that comes to mind isfield trips. The types of field
trips that you go on. I had adeclination because there was a
rock climbing picture on thewebsite, the indoor rock
climbing , um, and you couldn'tsee the ground and there was no
(22:23):
harnessing involved. So thepicture on the website made it
look like this child is 30 feetup in the air at the very top
of the rock climbing wall. Andin the full picture, they are
two feet off the ground. Um,but the insurance company
looked at the website, saw thatpicture, and they declined over
it. So the types of field tripsthat you go on, if they involve
(22:44):
, uh, all the fun stuff, youknow, trampoline, park ,
, uh, yeah . Poles ,uh, anything involving water
slides, rock climbing, like allof your, your high risk or high
injury prone types of fieldtrips are also a con a concern
right now.
Speaker 2 (23:04):
So get those photos all that off.
Speaker 3 (23:07):
Clean up your Facebook, clean up your
website. .
Speaker 2 (23:10):
Yeah. All right . So let's say, oops , I lost my
spot. All right . We've gone, what about insurance
shopping? Can you talk us aboutthat? Talk to us a little bit
about that. Let's say you'vedone everything you can, you've
kept your insurance, but youwanna know what else is out
(23:30):
there. How can a center goabout getting a good policy? I
mean, for a, for a fair price?
Speaker 3 (23:37):
Yeah. Um, good policy and fair price are hard
to find right now. Yeah . Um ,you really have to check all
the boxes we're what we'reseeing, even for the, the best
programs. Um, the coverageoptions have changed quite a
bit. We used to be able to geta million dollars in abuse
liability coverage very easily.
(23:58):
And now , um, my team and I arerunning into sub limited
amounts 500,000 or less veryregularly. Um, so really
finding an agent thatspecializes in childcare is
gonna be your your best bet.
Um, there are several of us outthere. Um, it's not a large
(24:21):
pool , but find somebody thatspecializes in this industry.
And the reason that's soimportant is those companies
will have the best access tomarkets that cater to this
industry. Most generalistagents, the local guy down the
street might have access to a ,um, an insurance company that
(24:41):
can insure a lot of differenttypes of businesses, but not
necessarily multiple companiesthat can insure childcare
businesses, because his job isto ensure anything that walks
through the door that mightcontact him for business
insurance. Mm-Hmm .
a specialist hascompanies , um, specific to
this industry. So start thereand then be willing to complete
(25:02):
the, the paperwork there is,the application process is
really time consuming andtedious, but it's so important
because that application canliterally make or break whether
you're gonna get a quote ornot. And how you answer those
application questions can alsomake or break whether you get a
quote, I had a clientaccidentally answer. Um, and
(25:22):
mind you, I have a full-timeperson in addition to myself
that screens these applicationsfor red flags to make sure that
there aren't questions thatmight be answered in a way that
is gonna cause the insurancecompany concern. And if there
is, we're gonna have to reachout and get additional
insights. Um, we missed thecorporal punishment question in
how they answered it. Uh, theyhad answered that yes, they do
(25:46):
allow corporal punishment, butjust below or no, they said no,
they don't allow corporalpunishment. But the question
just below that said, have youever had any corporal
punishment liability claimsmade against you? That they
answered yes, it was byaccident. I didn't catch it. Oh
. And I was getting declinationafter declination after
declination and couldn't figureout why. Finally, one
(26:08):
underwriter told me, we don'thave any markets , um, that
will accept that corporalpunishment exposure. None of my
clients allow corporalpunishment. What do you mean
the corporal punishmentexposure? At which point I
found out it was the way thatthat question was answered on
the application. So now itlooks fishy. If I were to go
back to all of these insurancecompanies and say, oh, by the
(26:29):
way, that was an accident. Soreally pay close attention to
the applications, fill them outthoroughly. Yes, they're a pain
in the butt, but it just,you've gotta do it right now.
You've gotta embrace this upand do it and be careful , um,
how you're filling them out.
Speaker 2 (26:46):
And then you talked too about , um, getting a lot
of data together, like even a ,about the type of building,
even if you're leasing thebuilding. Oh , like what's on,
what's on that list? Should yoube able to, to rattle off for a
, for a application
Speaker 3 (27:02):
Application , there are four main pieces of
information years specificallythat you're gonna need to know
whether or not you own thebuilding. That is the year the
roof was last updated plumbing,HVAC systems and electrical, or
wiring, plumbing, roof, hvac,electrical. Those are the four
things that you'll be asked onevery insurance application,
(27:26):
even if you don't own thebuilding, the reason that
information is necessary isyou're still running a
childcare program in thatfacility. So what the insurance
company is looking at it isthrough the lens of, okay, well
if you are , if you've got ahundred little human bodies
running around in here, but60-year-old wiring and it's an
(27:46):
electrical hazard waiting tohappen because that old wiring
hasn't been brought up tomodern building code, then
that's a potential fire hazardwith a hundred little bodies in
the building that would have tobe evacuated. So that's why
it's a concern. Same with theroof. Um, if it's a landlord
situation, if that roof is notin decent shape, well your
(28:07):
contents inside that theinsurance you are asking the
insurance company to insure ,um, would be exposed to
whatever water damage from the,the leaky roof plumbing. Same
situation. If you've got oldcorroded plumbing, then you're
exposing your contents to waterdamage. Um, what was the other
(28:28):
one? Plumbing, HVAC roof. Oh,and then heating and air
conditioning systems. That'smore , um, that's more of an
important , uh, need to know instates that are prone to very
high heat, like Texas andArizona. But regardless, all
programs, if you own thebuilding, if you lease the
building, you'll be asked forthose four pieces of info.
Speaker 2 (28:51):
And then you touched on this earlier, like , um,
telling a better story with anarrative. Can you give us a
couple tips for, for how to dothat on these applications?
Speaker 3 (29:02):
Yeah, so what you'd wanna do is highlight anything
that makes your program lookless risky to an insurance
company. That's really all itis. Um, we wanna think of it
from a risk managementstandpoint. If your management
team has been with you for 10years, going strong, if you
have , um, if you've had aclean licensing report , uh,
(29:27):
the last three visits thatthey've come out that's worth
mentioning. If you're involvedin any indi industry
associations. Um, I had , um,this was a few years ago, but a
client, when I mentioned thatthey were part of the
Association of Early LearningLE Leaders, A ELL , um, it
saved her $5,000 on herliability premium. So it was a
(29:48):
pretty significant discount.
But letting insurance companiesknow that you're part of
industry associations teachingyou how to be better and do
better at what you do isvaluable information. Same
thing about , um, yourproperty. Property is a really
key piece right now. Um, do youhave water leak detection
(30:08):
sensors that will alert youearly so that it helps prevent
future a hundred thousanddollars worth of , uh, water
damage claims? Um, no, no childleft behind. Auto alarms on the
buses shows that you're takingan extra step to make sure that
there aren't any children leftunattended on the bus. Um, what
(30:31):
else,
Speaker 2 (30:33):
What about as far as like compliant , like
explaining violations? Is therea way to, to do that, to kind
of tell your side of the storytoo?
Speaker 3 (30:42):
So the, the, I just revised the template , um, to
create a whole section , um,for licensing violations. Oh ,
okay . Which you really want tokey on, on both for licensing
violations and if you've hadprior claim history, what you
want to paint there is if ithappened, it happened, what did
(31:02):
you do to keep it fromhappening again? Mm-Hmm.
, that's howwe're gonna control the
perspective there. Same withthe claims situations. If you
had a claim happen, how did youlearn from it? What did you
change? Like if you had a, thefire sprinkler system league ,
did you get on a winterizationcontract after that? Did you
install the water leakdetection sensors that shows
that you learned from that andimplemented change to keep it
(31:23):
from reoccurring with licensingviolations? Did you retrain
staff? Um , did you implementnew policies and procedures?
Did you implement one placecompliance software? Um, things
of that nature help it . One,it shows accountability. You
are accepting, you know, this,it is what it is, this
happened, but we used it as alearning opportunity and we're
(31:46):
doing these things differentlynow to keep it from happening
again. Mm-Hmm .that is really valuable to the
insurance company.
Speaker 2 (31:54):
Did we cover everything? Is there any,
anything else that you shouldgo over in the narrative?
Speaker 3 (31:59):
Oh , we could probably go on for
another hour. .
Speaker 2 (32:04):
Okay. Well, we are wrapping up our time with you.
Is there anything I didn't askyou that you think I should
have or that you think childchildcare center owners,
directors, leaders should know,or should, should really take
away as they and as they stoplistening to this podcast?
Speaker 3 (32:26):
The , the biggest takeaway that I have right now
is don't be one of those peoplethat thinks that this is not
going to happen to you. Andthen be stuck in a situation
where you are worried about ifyou can open your doors
tomorrow because you don't haveinsurance yet, your policies
have expired and you can't,y'all, it is hard. It is so
(32:46):
hard right now. Um, I'm anagent that fights for my
clients, that fights for theindustry, and it is, it's
brutal right now for us. So ,um, do yourself a favor and
start early, as early as youcan. Just have a plan B, even
if you don't need it. Itdoesn't hurt to have a plan B.
That's my biggest thing. Startearly.
Speaker 2 (33:07):
Okay. Well thank you Samantha, so much for coming.
Could you please share whereour listeners can find out more
about you? Like a , a websiteor any way to contact you?
Speaker 3 (33:19):
Yeah. Um, I'm pretty flexible. I've got lots of
methods that you can contactme. Okay . Um , I know you said
Joel, you'll reference theFacebook page, but I do Yep .
Post a lot of updates there.
Um, that's Sam Phillips CommaChildcare Insurance Agents .
Um, you can also reach outthrough our website. It's
employee hr.com . Um, and yeah,those are probably the two best
(33:45):
methods. I don't think I wannagive my cell phone on here.
Speaker 2 (33:47):
. , I
get that. Well, again, thank
you so much and thank you toeverybody who took the time to
listen to this podcast today.
Um, we know how busy you are ,um, dealing with things like
insurance and also,also educating young learners.
We're so grateful to supportyou every day here at ProCare.
Um, thank you everybody, and wewill see you next time.
Speaker 1 (34:12):
Thank you for listening to this episode of
the Childcare Business Podcast.
To get more insights on ways tosucceed in your childcare
business, make sure to hitsubscribe in your podcast app
so you never miss an episode.
And if you want even morechildcare , business tips,
tricks, and strategies, headover to our resource
center@procaresoftware.com.
(34:32):
Until next time.
Welcome to the Childcare Business Podcast,
brought to you by ProCareSolutions. This podcast is all
about giving childcare ,preschool, daycare, after
school , and other earlyeducation professionals. A fun
and upbeat way to learn aboutstrategies and inspiration you
can use to thrive. You'll hearfrom a variety of childcare
(00:29):
thought leaders, includingeducators, owners, and industry
experts on ways to innovate, tomeet the needs of the children
you serve. From practical tipsfor managing operations to
uplifting stories oftransformation and triumph,
this podcast will be chock fullof insights you can use to
fully realize the potential ofyour childcare business. Let's
(00:50):
jump in.
Speaker 2 (00:54):
Hello everyone, and welcome to the Childcare
Business Podcast. My name isLeah Woodbury. Um, I'm our head
of content here at ProCareSolutions, and I'm really happy
to have you all join us today.
Um, we're thrilled to haveSamantha Phillips with us.
She's an expert in a topic thatwe really don't talk enough
about enough, but we know isconstantly on the minds of
(01:16):
childcare center owners anddirectors, and that is
childcare insurance. And she'sone of the rare people out
there who specializes ininsuring and helping insur
helping childcare centers findinsurance. So, welcome,
Samantha. Thank
Speaker 3 (01:32):
You so much for having me. Um, trying to ensure
childcare centers seems moreappropriate these days.
Speaker 2 (01:40):
Yeah, I think that that would be a better
description, wouldn't it?
to start these podcasts,getting a little bit of
background on our guests , andyour story is particularly
unique. So you were aninsurance agent, your son got
hurt, it was at his preschool,I think, and Mm-Hmm.
(02:01):
motivate you?
Speaker 3 (02:03):
Yeah, so my, my first , um, my first role at an
insurance agency, I started outas their receptionist, and
there was a preschool,literally right down the
street. It was less than half amile. And my son was enrolled
there because it was reallyconvenient to be able to work
at the insurance agency. Andhis preschool was so close.
(02:26):
Mm-Hmm.
he'd been hurt. He was runningin the classroom, shocker. Um,
and ran into the cubbies thatwere hanging on the wall and
gashed his forehead open. Um ,when the director called me,
you know, our , the directorshave such a, a skill with their
words , um, and are veryfinessed and keeping parents
(02:48):
calm whenever they relay newslike that. And so I always
laugh now because I finished myemail that I was working on
before I left to go get him ,because the way she explained
it, it didn't sound as , uh, as, uh, pressing of an injury as
it was. Yeah . Um, but anyways,so it, that ended up being a, a
(03:09):
really traumatic experience forhe and I both because he needed
stitches. And I'm literally inthis doctor's office curled up
in a ball in the corner with myears plugged in my eye or my
ears, yeah. Ears plugged, eyesclosed because the numbing
medicine that they used toinject around the site where he
needed stitches so that hewouldn't feel it did not work.
(03:32):
And he was screaming bloodymurder for mommy to rescue him.
And I couldn't because heneeded the stitches. And if I
were to stop what was takingplace, there's no way that he
was gonna let them touch himagain. And it took my husband,
who is a, a very solid guy ,um, and four other staff
members to hold this littlehuman down to be able to stitch
(03:52):
him up with as much as he waswailing. It was awful. Um, fast
forward , the director was veryconcerned. You know, she had
called and checked on him whilewe were at home, just loving on
each other next couple of daysbecause we both needed that
reassurance like, mommy isthere for you. And when I took
him back, the director askedme, would our insurance cover
this? Because the agency that Iworked at at the time insured
(04:16):
his preschool. And it was likea light bulb went off in my
head because I realized in thatmoment that if an agency, or if
we are the agency that isinsuring this preschool and
they are right down the streetfrom us and they don't know if
the coverage that we have inplace for them would cover a
scenario like that, then we'renot doing a good enough job
(04:37):
educating our clients on thetypes of coverages they have
and claim scenarios that theycould protect them against. And
so that really was what set meon this trajectory of, well,
I'm gonna rewrite thatnarrative and be the one that
educates educators. Um, and soI've been looking for different
ways to do it ever since.
Speaker 2 (04:57):
Well, you have a ton of really, really great
knowledge, so I'm reallyexcited to jump in and and pick
your brain. Thank you. Andshift to today. So like I said
earlier here at ProCare, we'rehearing a lot of our customers
talking about renewal premiumskyrocketing. Mm-Hmm .
everywhere? What's the reason?
(05:19):
What kind of, what kind ofinsight can you give us on
what's going on?
Speaker 3 (05:22):
Yeah, absolutely.
Um, definitely happeningnationwide. Some states are
experiencing it , uh, a littlebit rougher than others because
of catastrophic exposure, liketornado prone states or
hurricane prone states,wildfires , um, those sorts of
states, the property premiumincreases are hitting them just
(05:43):
as hard, but nationally, allchildcare , um, programs are
really experiencing a shift inthe liability. Um, what
companies are willing to offer,what they're looking at as far
as underwriting guidelines ,um, the premiums that they're
willing to renew if they'reeven willing to offer renewal.
Um, I started seeing red flagsthat we were headed in the
(06:07):
direction , um, or headedtowards where we are right now
last September. And so I'veofficially been talking about
the childcare insurance crisisfor a year now. Just trying my
best to make people aware of,look, this is coming. Um, there
are some things you can do tolessen the impact, but it's
gonna be painful and it's gonnaget worse before it gets
better. And we are definitelyin the thick of the suck right
(06:29):
now. Um, it's, it's pretty bad.
Premium increases are higherthan they have ever been. Some
programs are experiencing asmuch as five times what their
premium was just last year andwithout having ever filed any
claims. Um, so that's thereality that programs are
facing right now.
Speaker 2 (06:48):
Well, I saw you posted on your , um, Facebook
page, which we will link to inthe show notes 'cause you share
such good information. Um, youwere comparing this year's
renewal premium cost versuslast year, and
Speaker 3 (07:01):
Yes.
Speaker 2 (07:02):
The one that jumped
Speaker 3 (07:03):
Out, and that was back in December last year. Yes
. So it's gotten evenprogressively worse now.
Speaker 2 (07:09):
Oh . I mean, the numbers were just staggering.
One, it was a two site center.
It went from like 15,000 up to22,000. So I mean Mm-Hmm .
I mean, it was just wild.
Speaker 3 (07:26):
Yeah. And that, you know , the whole purpose of
that pose too was to let peopleknow sometimes it's easier to
see a number form Yeah . Whatit is that I'm talking about
when I say childcare insurancecrisis, what does that mean?
Um, and so that was the bestway that I could think of to
provide a visual for thingsaren't good right now. Um, you
know, I've got a client inMassachusetts that went, single
(07:48):
sites , went from paying around25,000 a year to 50,000 a year
and had never filed any claims.
Well, established business hadbeen in the industry for 25
years, and that that $50,000option was literally our only
option for her. So her choiceswere pay it or operate without
insurance, which is not, youcan't do that in Massachusetts
(08:10):
and nobody would want toanyways.
Speaker 2 (08:12):
No, no, no. And then the , when you were talking
about no, no claims, could you,could you give us some examples
of recent verdicts orsettlements that are, that are
maybe affecting these premiumson claims that have been made ?
Speaker 3 (08:27):
Yeah . So I actually got some insurance companies
are very tightlipped wheneverit comes to sharing claims
data. Um, which doesn't help uson the risk management side
when we're trying to figureout, well, what can we do to
keep claims from occurring?
Well, if we don't know wherethe largest majority of claims
are happening, then it's hardto figure out how to keep them
from happening. Mm-Hmm.
(08:48):
some information with me onsome of their recent verdicts,
an abuse molestation claimwhere a male employee had had
improper contact with severalchildren, paid 2.8, just under
$2.9 million , um, had a childslide down. Um, it's hard to
(09:11):
wrap my mind around why a ropewould be anywhere near a slide,
but the child's neck got caughtin the rope, ended up choking
them. That paid out $1.5million. Um, a mother of a
child fell when she slipped onbubbles from a birthday party
that they had on site that paid$863,000. Um, an infant died
(09:35):
from SIDS while taking a napthat was $846,000. So, and
that's just a handful of, ofclaims examples, but when you
add in also property losses,I've seen water damage claims
from sprinkler systems, thefire sprinkler systems that are
designed to te protect yourproperty from fire. I've seen
them cause so much water damagefrom temperatures outside
(09:58):
freezing and causing those popsto burst because they weren't ,
weren't properly winterized.
Um, and those claims areseveral hundreds of thousands
of dollars and a long time forrepairs .
Speaker 2 (10:11):
Repairs . Oh . So, and because of this, some
insurance companies, they'rejust leaving childcare , right?
They're just saying, we're not,we're not messing with this. Is
that, is that what you're
Speaker 3 (10:21):
Saying? Yeah , they're like, peace , I'm out.
Mm-Hmm .
Speaker 2 (10:23):
Yeah. Oh ,
Speaker 3 (10:24):
And there was, there was always a small pool of
insurance companies to beginwith that would ensure
childcare , I would say at anygiven time, no more than about
15 companies , um, in the, whatwe call the admitted market.
And , um, we lost about half ofthose in Q4 2023. The about
(10:45):
half of the ones that are leftnow are only regional
providers, which means theydon't insure every state. They
only insure anywhere from 10 to20 states across the us . Um,
so then you've got a very smallselection, especially for those
, um, providers operating instates that don't have access
to the regional providersbecause they don't, they don't
(11:08):
insure in that state. Yeah .
And then also with thecompanies that are left, we're
seeing just drastic changes inwhat they're looking for and
what they're willing to insure. So it's really like trying to
find a suitable insuranceprovider for every program.
Now. It's like looking for aneedle in a haystack. You have
to check all the right boxes inorder to be accepted into the
(11:31):
few programs that are left outthere.
Speaker 2 (11:34):
And how are , um, licensing inspections playing
into that? Um, and I honestly,I think very
Speaker 3 (11:41):
Heavily,
Speaker 2 (11:41):
This could probably be an entire podcast in itself.
So they're , so these insurancecompanies are actually digging
into inspection reports, likeat the state level? Yes . Or
Speaker 3 (11:51):
Yes, they are going online. They're reviewing the ,
um, the state inspectionreports. They're looking at the
violations. Um, repetitiousviolations really shows that
either you don't care about theproblem or you don't care about
fixing it. Um, any violationsthat could pose harm to a
(12:11):
child, such as brokenplayground equipment or , um,
background checks is a big one.
Um, access to hazardouschemicals, things violations
like that. The insurancecompanies look at those as,
okay, if these are the types ofthings they're cited for in
their inspection reports,they're obviously more of a
(12:32):
risky program because theydon't have the right systems
and balances in place to makesure that these violations
aren't occurring. Um, sothey're really on the lookout
for those inspection reportsand using them as a means of
determining, is this programworth ensuring they're not
because they have safeoperations, or do we want to
(12:54):
decline to wrap them justsimply based on what we see in
the inspection reports.
Speaker 2 (12:59):
Okay . Okay . So before we, before we move into
what centers can do, and Ipromise that's coming, I'm sure
everybody's waiting.
little bit about the recentNACI liability insurance survey
, um, naci National Associationfor the Education of Young
Children. I'm sure all, all ourlisteners knew that. Um, it's
(13:21):
def one step that youmentioned, or that you
highlighted, I should say fromthe report, is that 62% of
respondents reported that theirprogram had difficulty finding
liability insurance or findingaffordable liability insurance.
Mm-Hmm .
non-renewals is the insurancecompany is no longer iur
(13:43):
childcare . And you talkedabout this before, but I just
wanted to see if you could go alittle bit deeper into how that
those figures jive with whatyou're seeing and hearing. Is
it more in one part of thecountry? Are there regions
where things are maybe betterthan another or, or any other
insights you might have onthose stats?
Speaker 3 (14:03):
Yeah. Um, definitely in line with what I've been
seeing. And I was veryfortunate to get to work with
Nay . They had reached out andasked to pick my brain on
helping them curate thequestions so that they could
collect the right information.
Um , so I got to play a really,a really heavy role in that.
But there was almost avalidation in it because I'm
(14:23):
like, finally, finally we haveofficial data. I've had so many
people reaching out aboutadvocacy initiatives, and we
didn't have firm data otherthan, you know, just individual
people's stories. Mm-Hmm .
know, this is an issue. Um, soto actually see in number form
that 62% of providers areexperiencing difficulty was, it
(14:49):
wasn't really alarming to me ,but it, it was alarming, if
that makes sense. It does. Um,and it does . And then the, the
top reason being that insurancecompanies are exiting. I mean,
that absolutely made sensebecause I personally, I mean,
I'm still insuring clients andmy team is, our bandwidth is so
(15:10):
stretched thin because we arereally struggling to try and
make sure that our currentclients stay insured, and then
we get calls regularly withpeople in desperation because
they can't find insurance.
Their agent hasn't been able tofind them replacement coverage.
I've never received so manycalls, messages, text messages
, um, from providers that arenow uninsured because their
(15:31):
coverage lapsed when theiragent couldn't find them
anything. Um, and so for us tobe in that state, but see
numbers that reflect that, I'mreally hoping that the data,
and I attended Nacey's webinaryesterday where they kind of
went over that , um, that finalreview or that final draft. And
most of the advocates that wereon that call talked about, they
(15:53):
are hoping as well that thisdata will help us , help us
advance advocacy initiativesforward. Because, you know,
anybody in a position of powerwants to see firm figures. They
wanna see is this truly anissue? They don't wanna just
hear stories, show me the data.
And that's where we're at nowwith that , uh, survey.
Speaker 2 (16:12):
Oh, well that is, that is good news that yeah,
you have the data to back upwhat we know is happening, so
that's amazing. Yes. Okay. Sowe've gone through what's going
on. Let's talk about whatchildcare center leaders can
do. So if we could start withhow to keep insurance, that
would be great. How do we, howdo we keep it, if we're at
(16:36):
least for the most part, happyabout it?
Speaker 3 (16:39):
Um, this is, this one's very simple, but , um,
pay your bills , uh, very, veryeasy. Just make sure that your
premiums get paid. Insurancecompanies are looking for
reasons not to renew problemaccounts. And if you are a
client that regularly non pays, um, or you're late in paying,
(17:04):
don't give an opportunity for adeclination or a , or not
necessarily a declination. Inthat case, it would be , um,
refusal to reinstate due tononpayment of premium. So don't
give an extra reason to bedropped by an insurance company
for something as simple as notpaying your premium. Stay on
top of that. Make sure thepremiums are paid by their due
(17:26):
date . Um, that's the biggestone. If you've got it, then you
can keep it. Just make sure youpay your bills. Um , other
things, if you do get dropped,most people are facing
non-renewals. You know, we'reseeing that a lot. So for the
people that don't have arenewal bill to be able to pay
and they don't have thatluxury, you've gotta start
(17:46):
early. Um, and I would not waitfor the non-renewal to come
either, because most states,the legal , um, the legal
requirement to send you noticeby the insurance company is
anywhere from 30 days to 60days. It is taking my team no
less than 30 days to findinsurance quotes. And that
doesn't even count the processfor the applications we have to
(18:10):
collect the loss runs we haveto order. So I would say at
minimum, it takes us right now,45 days to even try and get
quotes. And that's still withus maybe getting quotes
trickling in right down to theexpiration date. So if you're
waiting to receive anon-renewal thinking, well,
this isn't gonna happen to me,or it hasn't happened to me
yet, that's because theinsurance company is not
(18:30):
legally required to send younotice until 45 days out or 30
days out, depending on whatyour state requirement is. So I
would recommend as a Plan B,just in case, reach out to an
insurance agency thatspecializes in childcare and
get that ball rolling just incase you don't get the renewal
offer and you open your mailone day and find the
(18:52):
non-renewal. Speaking of that,I think a lot of people are
sitting on their , um,insurance company mail, because
right at this point, they'reexpecting that renewal offer to
come, like it usually does, andwell , it's just a bill that
needs to be paid. So if theysee a , a letter on their desk
from Philadelphia, forinstance, well, they might be
thinking that is their renewalpremium invoice. And so they'll
(19:15):
get to it when they get to it .
They know they typically haveto pay it before they , um,
policy expires. But what mightbe in that envelope is a
non-renewal notice. And if youset on that mail and aren't
aware of it and can't startacting on it as soon as you're
aware, well then it furtherdelays the, the process and you
not, you potentially not beingable to get replacement
(19:36):
coverage in time .
Speaker 2 (19:38):
Okay.
Speaker 3 (19:41):
Um, um, there's also, you know, proactive
things that programs can do ,um, as far as showcasing that
they've got it going on. I havean insurance narrative template
that I created to help proproviders show that , um, you
know, they have a strongmanagement team in place that
(20:01):
their admin team knows whatthey're doing, that the , um,
the approach they take toprotecting their property is
proactive, not reactive. Thosesorts of things are valuable to
an insurance company, and theywanna know they're looking for
the right partners right now.
They don't wanna insure any andevery business. So it's our job
(20:23):
to paint that picture to theinsurance companies. We've got
to show them, and you've gottahelp us by providing that
information. That narrativetemplate is a great way to do
that, to help show why yourprogram is worth ensuring and
why you are a smart , a smartrisk for the insurance company.
Speaker 2 (20:42):
What about, are there any services or that,
that might leave a childcarecenter exposed that might make
an insurance company go, eh , Idon't know that you should be
doing that?
Speaker 3 (20:54):
Yes. Um, the ones that come to mind right off the
top of my head, birthdayparties, any kind of special
events. Um, and you know,that's, that's difficult
because that's an additionalrevenue stream for a lot of
programs. And when you'refacing infl , like, trust me,
I, I get it to all theproviders that are listing
(21:14):
like, I get it. Um, but that isa , um, that is a sore spot for
insurance companies becauseit's an additional exposure.
And that bubble incident thatpaid $850,000 wouldn't have
happened had it not been for abirthday party on site . Um,
another one that is a soresubject for providers is , um,
(21:38):
to employees in every room atall times for accountability
purposes. That is not requiredin every state and not always
mandated by ratios. So , um, alot of insurance companies now
are making that a mandate inorder to be able to offer
coverage. And for programs thatdon't have the ability to
incorporate that, that leavesthem out of one less insurance
(22:01):
option that might have beenavailable to them . Um, the
other one that comes to mind isfield trips. The types of field
trips that you go on. I had adeclination because there was a
rock climbing picture on thewebsite, the indoor rock
climbing , um, and you couldn'tsee the ground and there was no
(22:23):
harnessing involved. So thepicture on the website made it
look like this child is 30 feetup in the air at the very top
of the rock climbing wall. Andin the full picture, they are
two feet off the ground. Um,but the insurance company
looked at the website, saw thatpicture, and they declined over
it. So the types of field tripsthat you go on, if they involve
(22:44):
, uh, all the fun stuff, youknow, trampoline, park ,
slides, rock climbing, like allof your, your high risk or high
injury prone types of fieldtrips are also a con a concern
right now.
Speaker 2 (23:04):
So get those photos all that off.
Speaker 3 (23:07):
Clean up your Facebook, clean up your
website.
Speaker 2 (23:10):
Yeah. All right . So let's say, oops , I lost my
spot. All right . We've gone
shopping? Can you talk us aboutthat? Talk to us a little bit
about that. Let's say you'vedone everything you can, you've
kept your insurance, but youwanna know what else is out
(23:30):
there. How can a center goabout getting a good policy? I
mean, for a, for a fair price?
Speaker 3 (23:37):
Yeah. Um, good policy and fair price are hard
to find right now. Yeah . Um ,you really have to check all
the boxes we're what we'reseeing, even for the, the best
programs. Um, the coverageoptions have changed quite a
bit. We used to be able to geta million dollars in abuse
liability coverage very easily.
(23:58):
And now , um, my team and I arerunning into sub limited
amounts 500,000 or less veryregularly. Um, so really
finding an agent thatspecializes in childcare is
gonna be your your best bet.
Um, there are several of us outthere. Um, it's not a large
(24:21):
pool , but find somebody thatspecializes in this industry.
And the reason that's soimportant is those companies
will have the best access tomarkets that cater to this
industry. Most generalistagents, the local guy down the
street might have access to a ,um, an insurance company that
(24:41):
can insure a lot of differenttypes of businesses, but not
necessarily multiple companiesthat can insure childcare
businesses, because his job isto ensure anything that walks
through the door that mightcontact him for business
insurance. Mm-Hmm .
this industry. So start thereand then be willing to complete
(25:02):
the, the paperwork there is,the application process is
really time consuming andtedious, but it's so important
because that application canliterally make or break whether
you're gonna get a quote ornot. And how you answer those
application questions can alsomake or break whether you get a
quote, I had a clientaccidentally answer. Um, and
(25:22):
mind you, I have a full-timeperson in addition to myself
that screens these applicationsfor red flags to make sure that
there aren't questions thatmight be answered in a way that
is gonna cause the insurancecompany concern. And if there
is, we're gonna have to reachout and get additional
insights. Um, we missed thecorporal punishment question in
how they answered it. Uh, theyhad answered that yes, they do
(25:46):
allow corporal punishment, butjust below or no, they said no,
they don't allow corporalpunishment. But the question
just below that said, have youever had any corporal
punishment liability claimsmade against you? That they
answered yes, it was byaccident. I didn't catch it. Oh
. And I was getting declinationafter declination after
declination and couldn't figureout why. Finally, one
(26:08):
underwriter told me, we don'thave any markets , um, that
will accept that corporalpunishment exposure. None of my
clients allow corporalpunishment. What do you mean
the corporal punishmentexposure? At which point I
found out it was the way thatthat question was answered on
the application. So now itlooks fishy. If I were to go
back to all of these insurancecompanies and say, oh, by the
(26:29):
way, that was an accident. Soreally pay close attention to
the applications, fill them outthoroughly. Yes, they're a pain
in the butt, but it just,you've gotta do it right now.
You've gotta embrace this upand do it and be careful , um,
how you're filling them out.
Speaker 2 (26:46):
And then you talked too about , um, getting a lot
of data together, like even a ,about the type of building,
even if you're leasing thebuilding. Oh , like what's on,
what's on that list? Should yoube able to, to rattle off for a
, for a application
Speaker 3 (27:02):
Application , there are four main pieces of
information years specificallythat you're gonna need to know
whether or not you own thebuilding. That is the year the
roof was last updated plumbing,HVAC systems and electrical, or
wiring, plumbing, roof, hvac,electrical. Those are the four
things that you'll be asked onevery insurance application,
(27:26):
even if you don't own thebuilding, the reason that
information is necessary isyou're still running a
childcare program in thatfacility. So what the insurance
company is looking at it isthrough the lens of, okay, well
if you are , if you've got ahundred little human bodies
running around in here, but60-year-old wiring and it's an
(27:46):
electrical hazard waiting tohappen because that old wiring
hasn't been brought up tomodern building code, then
that's a potential fire hazardwith a hundred little bodies in
the building that would have tobe evacuated. So that's why
it's a concern. Same with theroof. Um, if it's a landlord
situation, if that roof is notin decent shape, well your
(28:07):
contents inside that theinsurance you are asking the
insurance company to insure ,um, would be exposed to
whatever water damage from the,the leaky roof plumbing. Same
situation. If you've got oldcorroded plumbing, then you're
exposing your contents to waterdamage. Um, what was the other
(28:28):
one? Plumbing, HVAC roof. Oh,and then heating and air
conditioning systems. That'smore , um, that's more of an
important , uh, need to know instates that are prone to very
high heat, like Texas andArizona. But regardless, all
programs, if you own thebuilding, if you lease the
building, you'll be asked forthose four pieces of info.
Speaker 2 (28:51):
And then you touched on this earlier, like , um,
telling a better story with anarrative. Can you give us a
couple tips for, for how to dothat on these applications?
Speaker 3 (29:02):
Yeah, so what you'd wanna do is highlight anything
that makes your program lookless risky to an insurance
company. That's really all itis. Um, we wanna think of it
from a risk managementstandpoint. If your management
team has been with you for 10years, going strong, if you
have , um, if you've had aclean licensing report , uh,
(29:27):
the last three visits thatthey've come out that's worth
mentioning. If you're involvedin any indi industry
associations. Um, I had , um,this was a few years ago, but a
client, when I mentioned thatthey were part of the
Association of Early LearningLE Leaders, A ELL , um, it
saved her $5,000 on herliability premium. So it was a
(29:48):
pretty significant discount.
But letting insurance companiesknow that you're part of
industry associations teachingyou how to be better and do
better at what you do isvaluable information. Same
thing about , um, yourproperty. Property is a really
key piece right now. Um, do youhave water leak detection
(30:08):
sensors that will alert youearly so that it helps prevent
future a hundred thousanddollars worth of , uh, water
damage claims? Um, no, no childleft behind. Auto alarms on the
buses shows that you're takingan extra step to make sure that
there aren't any children leftunattended on the bus. Um, what
(30:31):
else,
Speaker 2 (30:33):
What about as far as like compliant , like
explaining violations? Is therea way to, to do that, to kind
of tell your side of the storytoo?
Speaker 3 (30:42):
So the, the, I just revised the template , um, to
create a whole section , um,for licensing violations. Oh ,
okay . Which you really want tokey on, on both for licensing
violations and if you've hadprior claim history, what you
want to paint there is if ithappened, it happened, what did
(31:02):
you do to keep it fromhappening again? Mm-Hmm.
perspective there. Same withthe claims situations. If you
had a claim happen, how did youlearn from it? What did you
change? Like if you had a, thefire sprinkler system league ,
did you get on a winterizationcontract after that? Did you
install the water leakdetection sensors that shows
that you learned from that andimplemented change to keep it
(31:23):
from reoccurring with licensingviolations? Did you retrain
staff? Um , did you implementnew policies and procedures?
Did you implement one placecompliance software? Um, things
of that nature help it . One,it shows accountability. You
are accepting, you know, this,it is what it is, this
happened, but we used it as alearning opportunity and we're
(31:46):
doing these things differentlynow to keep it from happening
again. Mm-Hmm .
insurance company.
Speaker 2 (31:54):
Did we cover everything? Is there any,
anything else that you shouldgo over in the narrative?
Speaker 3 (31:59):
Oh , we could probably go on for
another hour.
Speaker 2 (32:04):
Okay. Well, we are wrapping up our time with you.
Is there anything I didn't askyou that you think I should
have or that you think childchildcare center owners,
directors, leaders should know,or should, should really take
away as they and as they stoplistening to this podcast?
Speaker 3 (32:26):
The , the biggest takeaway that I have right now
is don't be one of those peoplethat thinks that this is not
going to happen to you. Andthen be stuck in a situation
where you are worried about ifyou can open your doors
tomorrow because you don't haveinsurance yet, your policies
have expired and you can't,y'all, it is hard. It is so
(32:46):
hard right now. Um, I'm anagent that fights for my
clients, that fights for theindustry, and it is, it's
brutal right now for us. So ,um, do yourself a favor and
start early, as early as youcan. Just have a plan B, even
if you don't need it. Itdoesn't hurt to have a plan B.
That's my biggest thing. Startearly.
Speaker 2 (33:07):
Okay. Well thank you Samantha, so much for coming.
Could you please share whereour listeners can find out more
about you? Like a , a websiteor any way to contact you?
Speaker 3 (33:19):
Yeah. Um, I'm pretty flexible. I've got lots of
methods that you can contactme. Okay . Um , I know you said
Joel, you'll reference theFacebook page, but I do Yep .
Post a lot of updates there.
Um, that's Sam Phillips CommaChildcare Insurance Agents .
Um, you can also reach outthrough our website. It's
employee hr.com . Um, and yeah,those are probably the two best
(33:45):
methods. I don't think I wannagive my cell phone on here.
Speaker 2 (33:47):
you so much and thank you toeverybody who took the time to
listen to this podcast today.
Um, we know how busy you are ,um, dealing with things like
insurance and also
We're so grateful to supportyou every day here at ProCare.
Um, thank you everybody, and wewill see you next time.
Speaker 1 (34:12):
Thank you for listening to this episode of
the Childcare Business Podcast.
To get more insights on ways tosucceed in your childcare
business, make sure to hitsubscribe in your podcast app
so you never miss an episode.
And if you want even morechildcare , business tips,
tricks, and strategies, headover to our resource
center@procaresoftware.com.
(34:32):
Until next time.
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