September 30, 2022 • 49 mins
As child care centers struggle to find and keep good teachers and other staff, building resilience is key.
In this podcast, Donna Skea joins us from Quebec to share some tips on doing just that!
Donna is the founder of The Infinite Educator, which provides workshops on all aspects of early childhood education, including on building resiliency in the childcare workforce, which is what she’ll be discussing with us today.
She also is an early childhood education professor at Vanier College.
Listen as Donna talks about getting back to the basics of why we love child care and early childhood educationand the importance of building community and offering professional development, as well as more!
Check Donna's Facebook page if you'd like to learn more about her services, as well as her page on LinkedIn! You also can email her at donna@theinfiniteeducator.ca.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:08):
Welcome to the Childcare Business Podcast,
brought to you by ProCareSolutions.
This podcast is all about givingchildcare, preschool, daycare,
afterschool, and other earlyeducation professionals.
A fun and upbeat way to learnabout strategies and inspiration
you can use to thrive.
You'll hear from a variety ofchildcare thought leaders,
(00:29):
including educators, owners, andindustry experts on ways to
innovate, to meet the needs ofthe children you serve.
From practical tips for managingoperations to uplifting stories
of transformation and triumph,this podcast will be chalk full
of insights you can use to fullyrealize the potential of your
childcare business.
(00:50):
Let's jump in.
Speaker 2 (00:53):
Welcome everybody to the Childcare Business Podcast.
Uh, excited to be with you again.
This is Ryan Walt, and, uh, asalways, uh, our marketing team
has scanned the industry, both,uh, you know, domestically here
in the US but also North Americain general.
And so I'm super excited fortoday's guest.
(01:14):
Uh, Donna Ski, uh, is with usfrom Quebec, and we'll talk a
little bit about, uh, Quebec andmaybe Montreal and, uh, learn a
little bit about that part ofthe world.
But, um, Donna is the founder ofthe Infinite Educator, uh, which
provides workshops on allaspects of early childhood
education, including on buildingresiliency in the childcare
(01:35):
workforce, uh, which is whatwe're gonna spend some time
talking about today.
Um, Donna is also an earlychildhood educator, education
professor, excuse me, at, uh,Veneer College.
And I'll see if she, um, how doI pronounce it, Donna?
Speaker 3 (01:50):
It's at Vanet College.
Speaker 2 (01:53):
Vanay College.
Yeah.
And let me just with that, saywelcome to the show, Donna.
It's nice to meet you.
Speaker 3 (01:59):
Thank you, Ryan.
I really appreciated you.
Invited me on.
This is very exciting.
All the way up from Canada.
.
Speaker 2 (02:05):
Yeah.
Van.
So it's, I pronounced it wrong.
And that was one of the things Iwas gonna ask you, cuz I've
never been to Quebec.
And are you, are you inMontreal?
Are you right In Montreal?
Yes.
So, yes,
Speaker 3 (02:17):
I'm, uh, in the west island of Montreal.
Yes.
Speaker 2 (02:20):
All right.
So for our audience, cuz I wouldsay that predominantly our
audience is gonna be in the USalthough we have lots of
customers as well in theprovinces across Canada.
Um, for our audience who hasmaybe never been to Quebec,
what, what is Quebec known for?
Like, i I, is there somethingQuebec is known for?
(02:42):
And maybe a follow up question,more specific.
If somebody was gonna come toQuebec and only had one day to
spend there, anything thatyou're like, if you're gonna be
in Montreal, in province ingeneral, you have to do this.
Speaker 3 (02:58):
Okay.
Now we are, um, known for whatthey call and, uh, that means,
uh, having a good time.
So, uh, when you come to Quebec,um, the place that you would
probably spend your day at wouldbe the old port.
And so the old port is just whatit sounds like it is.
(03:18):
The old buildings from likethree, 400 years ago.
Cobblestone streets, amazingfood.
Uh, every restaurant has a, um,like a outdoor eating area where
you can just enjoy and peoplewatch.
There is, um, so many activitiesto do down there.
(03:39):
You're right on the water.
We are an island, so, uh,there's a lot of stuff that we,
we can do there.
Uh, right now we're justfinishing up the, the, uh, just
for laughs Uh, our 40thanniversary and all the
comedians come in from allaround the world to come to our,
um, our little town.
(04:00):
And, uh, that's always, uh, abig party.
I was down there last week andit was like dancing in the
streets and it was like, that'skind of what Montreal is known
for, for being a bit of a, a funtime when you come to Quebec,
Speaker 2 (04:14):
When you come to, I like that.
So, I mean, that's actually, if,if anything, if there's a
tourism department that wantsto, you know, hire you, the
attraction come into Quebec is,it's a place to have fun.
So old port.
Yes.
When you're walking around oldPort, and this is maybe my lack
of knowledge of the area, but isthere a lot of French speaking
(04:35):
people in the area?
Is it like predominantly Frenchor do most people speak English?
Speaker 3 (04:41):
Well, it's predo.
The province itself ispredominantly French.
Mm-hmm.
.
But in the tourist areas,particularly Old Port, downtown
Montreal, that area, we are allbilingual.
So, um, if you come in and say,Hi, I'd like to seek for two,
we're like, Sure, come on in.
But if you come in in French andsay, uh, I'm, so there's always
(05:08):
at, um, opportunity.
We are a very, Montreal inparticular is a very bilingual,
um, part of Quebec.
Other places are definitely morefrancophone, more French, um,
but Montreal known for astourism and we have to cater to
everybody coming in.
So yes, we're all quitebilingual.
Speaker 2 (05:28):
That's amazing.
So this might be a good segue alittle bit into like our topic
and, you know, early childhoodeducation and, and education in
general.
But going all the way back, areyou from Montreal, um,
originally and then in school inQuebec.
Is that actually part of thecurriculum?
Like, so the bilingual, um, kindof approach to, you know,
(05:51):
learning language.
Is every student go through bothEnglish and French, or how does
that work?
Or is it just kind of organicbecause a
Speaker 3 (05:58):
Lot of, Well, it's much interesting cause I don't
wanna get too much intopolitics, but, um, the English
children in the province ofQuebec are lucky enough to be
given the opportunity to becomebilingual.
So I have three daughters andthey are completely and
absolutely bilingual.
It's because they learned inschool.
(06:20):
My oldest daughter was veryproficient in French, so she did
her kindergarten to grade threein French only, and then
switched to English.
And then my, my twins, I have aset of twins.
Um, they did, uh, 50 50 inFrench.
So when they was French one daywas English.
So they learned, they, theybuilt up both languages at the
(06:41):
same time.
And that starts in kindergarten.
In fact, it actually starts inour daycares.
Speaker 2 (06:47):
That's amazing.
So do the, do families then getto choose which of those tracks
as best for their child?
Like the 50 50 versus the fullimmersion?
Or is that like student?
Speaker 3 (06:57):
Yes.
For the English children, yes.
For the English children, theyhave a choice to make, um, for
them to, and usually they canfigure out whether or not the
child is, uh, proficient in asecond language early on because
of the exposure.
And if they feel comfortable,um, they'll put their children
and immerse their children intoFrench.
(07:18):
So if they stay here in theprovince of Quebec, and they're
perfectly bilingual, you know,the, the world is their own,
because now they have their,they have two languages in the
French system, it's a littleless English.
Um, they don't really see thebilingualism as a benefit as
much as the English C having thetwo languages.
(07:39):
So the microphone children,although they learn a lot now
through social media andwatching TV and all of that
stuff, they don't necessarilyget as much English as the, as
the English get French
Speaker 2 (07:52):
As the English get French.
I love that.
You know, I mean, I think as astudent looking back, I took
Spanish one like five times.
Like I tell that story like,like I just never could quite
get myself to, you know, learnthe language when it was in a
classroom setting for getting agrade.
But in traveling abroad, whenyou actually, you know, interact
(08:13):
in places where if you wannatalk story and be able to
interact with other humanbeings, not being able to do
that is a huge motivator tolearn a language.
Mm-hmm.
.
And so I love, you know, placesthat, you know, immerse children
in that early.
Cause I think it's such anadvantage, um, you know, for
them to be able to be bilingualand that opens up so many doors
(08:33):
internationally and travel.
So that's cool.
And
Speaker 3 (08:36):
That, and yeah.
And in our daycare system, um, alot of the daycares, um, that I
work with, they're consideredbilingual.
So especially in the older agegroups.
So let's say in the threes andthe fours, there'll be one
educator that only speaks Frenchand there'll be one educator
that only speaks English.
So like story time by the Frencheducator will be French songs
(09:00):
and French, uh, story books andyou know, French conversation
and then English educator.
So, and they sweeped off.
So even if the children don'tnecessarily have both languages
when they go into elementaryschool, they have the exposure
to both languages before theyenter into kindergarten.
Speaker 2 (09:20):
I love that.
And is that like, maybe talkinga little bit about childcare in
Quebec in general, is it, is itsimilar to what you know about
like us and other provinceswhere, you know, families that
need their children in childcare, it's an out of pocket expense
for families if they can affordit and then the government
subsidizes those who need help?
(09:41):
Or is the government moreinvolved in Quebec around
childcare than in other places?
Oh,
Speaker 3 (09:46):
We are much more, yeah, we are much more involved.
And I would say probably in the,oh my goodness, early two
thousands, um, we had agovernment come into, um, into
power and they won on the ideaof$5 a day daycare.
Speaker 2 (10:05):
Wow.
Speaker 3 (10:06):
They implemented, and so they won and then,
then they had to implement$5 aday daycare, um, which was done
in increments.
And so I would say by oh 2004,2005, uh, right across the board
(10:26):
it was$5 a day.
Now since things have changedand and governments have
changed, but right now ourparents right across the board,
unless it's a non subsidizedlike home daycare or something
like that, every parent paysabout$10 a day for their
children.
Speaker 2 (10:44):
Wow.
And
Speaker 3 (10:45):
The rest of it is subsidized by the government.
It is really a government kindof, um, cause we have this thing
, uh, we have government onecenters, um, they're called
.
They're CPEs, we call'em CPEs.
And they are nonprofit earlychildhood centers that, um, are
(11:08):
some of the best in our province, any of the CPEs.
And they all government funded,um, educators are paid at, uh,
19 and 20.
I think the max you can get is25, 20$6 an hour now.
Um, you know, they have to bequalified.
They, they have to meet certaincriteria and parents pay about
(11:30):
$10.
I think it's$10 and 35 cents orsomething like that now, um, a
day.
Speaker 2 (11:35):
That's amazing.
And, and I like, I could liketalk about this for a long time
too, cause I'm so curious aboutit too.
But does that put the four, theprivately run center?
So for the entrepreneurs who runchildcare in Quebec, does that,
is it a difficult business tocreate a sustainable business
business that's going to likeprovide uh, uh, living?
Speaker 3 (11:57):
No, because the need, the need for childcare is so
cute.
Even if, um, because whathappened, and I don't think they
recognized that this was gonnahappen before, it was like, I
don't know, 45,$50 a day.
Right.
So a lot of people, a lot ofmothers were staying home with
their children until theirchildren went to kindergarten.
(12:19):
Well, with the, uh, introductionof, you know, affordable
childcare, all tons of womenwent back to work.
And so the need for childcare ishuge here in Quebec, most uh,
families have two parents thatare at work full time.
Right.
Because now it's affordable tobe able to go back to work.
(12:42):
Like even if they take a portionof that, I mean, uh, you know,
it's 250 ballers maybe, uh, amonth for childcare for
Speaker 2 (12:51):
Child, which makes more sense cuz they can afford
it.
But when it was so expensive, itwas like, Yeah.
Speaker 3 (12:55):
When it's,
Speaker 2 (12:55):
I'm paying more than I'm making in that second
income.
Yeah, exactly.
So how did, so how did you getinto like outta curiosity?
So when you go all the way back,I ask this sometimes if Yes,
early days when you thoughtabout, oh, what I wanna be when
I grow up.
That famous question that kidsget asked, was it, do you
remember thinking like, what doI wanna be when, when I, when I
(13:18):
grow up?
Was it always something in thiseducation role?
Or did that come later for you?
Speaker 3 (13:25):
Well, all the way back to, um, my grade six
experience, um, I was sittingthere the first day.
I totally, it's eye right now.
And we need volunteers help outin the kind class as I can say.
(13:55):
The rest is the history.
I went in there, the teacher waslovely, she was lovely to me.
The children, um, accepted me.
Um, I, I spent every moment Icould, even though I was my
grade six year, I'm supposed tobe getting ready for high school
and being on that.
Cool, You know, Im grade six now.
I was hanging out with thechildren in the kindergarten
(14:16):
class.
I was just loving every momentof it.
So, you know, that's when,
Speaker 2 (14:23):
Go ahead, I'm sorry.
Speaker 3 (14:24):
I said, and like 30 years later, I've been in the
field 30 years later, I stillabsolutely love what I do.
Um, I totally believe in thefield of early childhood and I,
and I'm a huge advocate foreducators.
I just think I, I, I lucked out.
I really lucked out in findingwhere my passion was.
Speaker 2 (14:45):
Yeah.
It's not, it's not commonunfortunately.
Or maybe it's more common thanwe think, but you know, that
kind of adage of like, findsomething that you're really
passionate about and then figureout how to make a career out of
it or, or something to thateffect of, you know, actually
waking up every day and beingexcited about what you do is an
amazing gift.
(15:05):
And, you know, obviously for usto have people in the industry,
that approach work that way isso fun to be around.
Did you, how did you then becomea professor?
Walk me through that path reallyquick cuz if I'm not mistaken, a
a big majority of your careerhas been teaching early
education curriculum at VeneerCollege, right?
Or Vanny College.
(15:26):
Vanny College.
Um, yeah.
How did you get into that?
Speaker 3 (15:29):
For 10 years, I was, uh, an early childhood educator.
So I am by trade, a qualifiedearly childhood educator.
I loved it.
And then I started havingchildren of my own.
Um, and so my oldest daughter,who was now 23, um, she would go
off to daycare.
I would go off to daycare andthen I would come home and she
(15:53):
would be like, playing with me,Mommy.
And I was like, Uh, I don'twanna.
Speaker 2 (16:00):
I'm tired.
Speaker 3 (16:01):
Yeah.
I love you, but I'm, I, and, andso I kinda had a sort of a, a
moment where I was like, Wait aminute.
I'm giving all of my energy, allof my, all of the good stuff,
um, to everybody else's childrenand, and not saving enough for
my own.
Um, and um, and at that timealso there, early childhood
(16:27):
educators, um, so we're talkinglike, we're talking late
nineties, right?
So, uh, salaries were poor.
Um, zero recognition.
But I knew I wanted to stay inthis field, so I decided at that
time.
So my oldest at the time wasfour, and I decided to go back
(16:50):
and do my masters.
And, uh, and so I started to domy master's and I, uh, saw an ad
in the paper for, uh, VanyaCollege, looking for early
childhood professors.
And I'm like, I'm just gonna, inmy CV eventually could hire me.
(17:11):
Sorry.
And
Speaker 2 (17:12):
Cv, just just to confirm your CV means what In
Speaker 3 (17:16):
Oh, my resume.
Speaker 2 (17:17):
Your resume.
Speaker 3 (17:18):
Ok.
Sorry.
Ok.
There is gonna be a little bitof a language thing.
Anyway, so I, I sent in myresume and uh, and they called
me for an interview and I waslike, maybe three courses into
my master.
And, uh, and I went for aninterview.
There was 12 people at the table, and then me, uh, yeah, the
(17:41):
dean, the associate dean, this,that, the department.
It was like the, was everybody.
So I went on and on.
I had the interview, got the job.
Um, and so I was doing mymaster's.
And then, uh, I was, I startedteaching at college and, uh, you
know, went on and had, and ittook me years to get my master's
(18:05):
degree, but I got it.
And, uh,
Speaker 2 (18:08):
So you got your master's while you were teaching
there as well, So kind of doingthe dual track, like you're a
professor, you're teaching, butyou're also completing your
master's at the same time.
Speaker 3 (18:18):
Yeah.
And raising
Speaker 2 (18:20):
And raising children.
Yeah.
Twins.
So you kind of like, Hey, ifyou're gonna do life, do it.
Right.
Right.
Just,
Speaker 3 (18:26):
I know it's like, you know, learning the candle at
both ends with the kids to bed,write a paper, go to bed, you
know, get up, eat, you know, itwas all,
Speaker 2 (18:36):
Maybe, maybe think once in a while.
Speaker 3 (18:38):
I don't think I could do it now, but back then I had a
lot of energy.
Speaker 2 (18:41):
Yeah.
It's amazing.
Moms are superheroes and, youknow, in general.
And so to hear stories of like,you know, putting in all that
time and effort to get to whereyou are, what did, so I know
you've been there for manyyears.
Talk about what happened duringCovid and in particular you
decided to kind of branch outand, and I know that's always a
risk to step in.
(19:02):
This will kind of lead us into,I think, our conversation, some
of the topic for today.
But I know it sounds like youkind of took a risk on something
that you had been wanting to dofor a while, which is, is doing
something outside of theclassroom in terms of consulting
and education.
So talk about, you know,infinite education and what led
to that.
Speaker 3 (19:19):
Well, it was interesting.
So during, um, one of the thingsthat I was noticing, uh, in my
classroom, uh, with my students,with myself, um, with the
children and with the educators.
I have lots of friends in thefield, lots of people that I
know.
It was hard.
(19:40):
We struggled a lot, um, doing onteaching students to become
early childhood educators onZoom.
It was, it was, I'm gonna say itwas terrible.
It was terrible.
I was teaching a course on howto build effective relationships
with children while I couldn'teven engage with my students.
(20:03):
So it was all of the, thesechallenges.
And then, uh, I, I could seethat people were just getting
worn down.
And, um, last summer, I kind of,like you said, took a bit of a,
and I recognized that there waskinda a gap in the field of, um,
(20:26):
people giving workshops, whetherit in person or Zoom.
I found, particularly here in myprovince in English, there
seemed to be a lack of a bridgebetween, um, daycare or
preschool and elementary school.
And here incorrectly we'restarting to implement.
What we have is, I don't know ifyou guys like a junior
(20:48):
kindergarten or a, or a, youknow, a pre-k preschool.
Yeah, preschool.
But in the school system.
So they were implementing fouryear olds and five year olds, or
the five year olds werekindergarten, but they were
implementing four year olds inthe, in the elementary school
system.
But without giving anybody, um,any tools to be able to manage
(21:13):
what it's like a four year old,four year, and know in care,
three year old, four year old,and even five year old, how you
manage them, the curriculum, thebuilding, the effective
relationship, it's verydifferent than how you would do
it in an elementary schoolsystem, right?
So it's not the same.
And there were so many teacherswho were working with Ks, uh,
(21:37):
pre-Ks that didn't have theskills or the tools that they
needed.
And so I kind of formed mycompany, uh, with the notion
that I could help out in thedaycare system as well as, uh,
I'm also working in the schoolsystem helping teachers
understand preschool children.
(21:59):
So giving workshops on what is apreschool child, what does a
preschool environment look like,what does, And it just all came
together.
And being somebody's so superpassionate about this field, you
know, the idea of the infiniteeducator, It's funny, I have
been a professor for 20 years,but if you ask me what I do for
a living, I'm an early foundededucator.
Speaker 2 (22:20):
That's still what you do at the
Speaker 3 (22:22):
Core.
Oh, what I do as a core, despitethe fact that I've put in more
years as a professor, I just, Iam an educator.
That's who I am.
So along comes the name alongcomes the company, and it kinda
just, it really did blow up.
Uh, for me.
I've been very fortunate.
(22:42):
I've made lots of greatconnections.
I'm working with a lot of theEnglish school boards here in
Quebec.
I have, uh, workshops coming up.
I'm gonna be giving a conferenceat, um, at the teachers, uh,
convention this year.
I've been asked to do some workwith daycare educators in the
school system.
(23:03):
Uh, so it just kind all cameabout and it's been something,
you know, that that kinda beingin the back of your mind, you're
like, I really like to do this.
And I was very fortunate.
I have a friend who's a businesscoach that took me on and kind
of helped me with the businessside of it, because I know early
childhood, but I don't know, poyou know, taxes and all the
(23:25):
other stuff goes along withrunning a company or, or even
setting up a company.
So she took me under her wingand, and I just kind of went
from there.
So I'm kind of a one man show,You know, I've got the, the, the
drum and the symbols and the
Speaker 2 (23:42):
Yeah.
Everything, everything.
The instruments,
Speaker 3 (23:44):
Everything is, Yeah.
That's all me.
I've got the Harmonic ready togo.
I'm, I'm the one man show.
But it's been such an amazingexperience.
I've met so many phenomenalpeople.
Um, uh, two weeks ago I gave aworkshop.
I just have, I'm going off andtangent, I apologize.
But I gave a workshop inAustralia, so I, I, yeah, I did
(24:07):
a Zoom.
Speaker 2 (24:08):
That's amazing.
Speaker 3 (24:09):
I did
Speaker 2 (24:09):
Find, and there's no such, by the way, there's no
such things as tangents on thispodcast.
We just go wherever it takes.
Ok.
Speaker 3 (24:16):
I have to tell you what an experience for me to be
able to meet up 20 educatorsfrom the other side of the
world.
Um, I had to get up at 4:30 AMto give a 6:30 PM uh, workshop.
I didn't care.
They're like, Oh, we're sorry.
I don't care.
I don't care.
That's, it was the most amazingthing.
(24:37):
And Ryan, I have to tell you,the issues that are happening
here in North America, they'rehappening, happening in
Australia.
The burnout, the, the lack ofmotivation, the the need for
purpose, the whole thing that's,that's happening with the, with
the field, with the professionand why so many people are
leaving, It's happeningglobally.
(25:00):
It's just not here in NorthAmerica or in the US or in
Canada.
It's a global issue.
Speaker 2 (25:05):
It's universal.
Well, and that, I think that'sone of the ways that we found
you, Donna, you know, kind of, Idon't know if it was through
social media or LinkedIn or somework that you were doing that
was made public, but I know youhad done a poll and you know,
this theme for us, when we talkwith our customers and when we
talk with, you know, guests onour show, and when we do
webinars, the whole theme ofburnout, staffing, retention,
(25:27):
and the challenges around thattopic is like, I mean, it's,
it's the common thread that Ithink has run through the
industry and all ourconversations over the past six
months with guests.
But I know you had done a pollrecently, just a simple poll
somewhere around like, how manyof you who are early educators
are planning to stay in theindustry?
And I think that caught ourattention because the results
(25:50):
were pretty disheartening, ifI'm not mistaken.
Is that right?
Speaker 3 (25:53):
Yes.
I was actually quite surprisedat how low it was for the people
that were going go back.
Only 3% said absolutely thatthey were gonna go back into the
, um, what was the 33 said?
33% said that they were gonnatake the summer to think about
it, which means they probablywere also looking around to see
(26:13):
what else is out there.
Mm-hmm.
.
But 43% had said that it wasjust too hard and they were
gonna walk away and they weregonna try to look for something
else.
43%
Speaker 2 (26:24):
That yes, almost half of the workers in the space,
Which, you know, we've seen alot of statistics about the
burnout.
And I, you know, I know you'vetalked about this around, you
know, during covid there was alot of extra stress put on
teachers and all the extraprotocols and that you were
around, you know, kids who, youknow, were sick and maybe were
more at risk, and there's allthese extra things that were
(26:44):
already added on top of a reallydifficult job that, you know,
everybody could probably arguewas underpaid.
And so you start to add that upas a teacher, and it's like,
Wow, I love kids.
I wanna spend my time and energydoing this, but all of these
things are kind of gettingstacked against me.
I don't, One of the things thathas come outta that for you is
in your conversations, istalking a lot about resiliency
(27:06):
and, and how we as an industryor as individual owners of
childcare programs, how they canhelp build resiliency in their
staff.
Like, do you have any like,practical takeaways or things
you can share about, like, whatyou found in terms of how you
build that, how somebody canbuild that kind of resiliency in
the face of what they're dealingwith right now?
Speaker 3 (27:25):
Well, I think one of the things that I've learned
from, um, from visiting lots andlots of daycare, so part of my
job as a professor is I go fromdaycare to daycare supervising
students in their stash.
So I get get to have a lot ofconversations with the
educators.
I've been also with the ownersand the directors of these
(27:45):
centers.
So I, I get to know what's goingon in the industry.
I'm not just sitting, you know,in my professor tower or
whatever.
It's, I really get to hearwhat's going on now, how
directors can really support,um, educators.
I think it's really important,uh, that there needs to be that
support.
And, and the things that arecoming out that I'm hearing from
(28:08):
the educators is obviously it's,it's, it's a very low paying
job.
But the thing is, it's not justabout the pay, right?
We know we're going into a job.
We know we're going into a fieldthat we're not gonna get paid
for.
We're there for a greaterpurpose, and we kinda want to be
supported in that.
But it's a really tough job,right?
(28:29):
It is a really physically,emotionally, mentally demanding
job to be an early childhoodeducator.
So if directors really wantedsome support, if they can't
afford to give all the educatorssome, um, more money, which we
know we can, it can happen.
Or, you know, very few ed uh,owners can do that.
(28:49):
Um, I would suggest having extrasupport staff, having one extra
person in your center to help atthose crucial critical times of
the day, you know, going into aninfant room, um, and all of a
sudden the ratio is like, Idon't know, 10 children to three
adults as opposed to just two.
And, and dealing with thechildren that way, that always
(29:13):
helps.
Or helping, you know, thetoddler, uh, educator getting,
uh, you know, 12 childrendressed up in snowsuits.
Let me tell you that, thatthat's, that'll break your back.
Speaker 2 (29:25):
That's cool.
Speaker 3 (29:27):
That's right.
Talking educators, um,especially now that I'm giving
the workshops, is that they dowant more tools.
They want more skills, They wantmore professional development in
how to deal with the challengingbehavior because children and
(29:49):
parents have changed.
Um, you know, the demand for thedifferent types of curriculum
has changed, the dynamics in theclassroom has changed, you know,
uh, so all of those things, um,if the educator doesn't know
what to do or doesn't have thetools to be able to, um, to
(30:09):
manage their classroom, thatmakes for a way more stressful,
uh, environment and makes aneducator wanna leave.
But if the educator will stay,even if they're making a low
salary, if they know that thereis, you know, uh, you know, I
like to say that Bay centersneed to be like a community, you
know, a community whereeverybody helps each other,
(30:31):
everybody works together.
So you get the community, youget the professional development
support and that they need sothat they have the tools to be
able to be efficient in theirjob and to be able to just to
give them that extra little bitof help when they need it.
It says to the educators, Ivalue you.
I value what you are doing, andI wanna help you to be the best
(30:56):
educator that you can be.
And I think that's one of thethings that helps on the, the
outside of it, on the inside ofit, as an educator, we really
have to sort of look atourselves.
One of the things that I'venoticed with educators, um,
during the pandemicparticularly, and I think
everybody's kind of done, thisis like kind of a head down kind
(31:18):
of thing.
Just get it done.
Just get it done.
Just get it done.
Right.
You know, just get through yourday.
Just get through your day.
I know I'm nervous.
I'm, I'm worried that I'm gonnabring this home to my family.
I'm like, just get it done.
And now that we're past that andnow it's time to kind of look up
again and see the positivethings.
I do this whole thing in myworkshop about being grateful
(31:41):
about switching our mindset tosomething more positive and to
being able to sort of see theimportance of our job and, and
the legacy in which we provide,um, for these children and for
the families.
Um, there's a great TED talk by,uh, Adele Lawler called the
(32:03):
Unconditional Kindness, uh,towards children.
And she said that if you workwith children, you become a
memory in their memory bank.
And what kind of memory do youwanna be in that child's memory
bank?
So if we look up and change ourmindset to being positive, yes,
(32:25):
this pandemic, there's nothingwe can do about it, but we still
can have a positive attitude.
And we have to recognize at thesame time as educators and all
the adults that are aroundchildren, they're watching us.
They're looking for cues from uson how to manage this.
Cause if you figure a child whois two or three years old, they
(32:47):
only know the pandemic.
This is what they know.
This is their life.
And they're looking to theadults in their life to give
them cues on, should I be reallyscared?
Should I not wanna be near otherpeople?
Should I, should I always haveto have my mask on?
Do I have to wash my hands athousand times a day?
Like, what is it that, you know,what are the messages the adults
(33:09):
are sending to the childrenduring this pandemic?
And cause their educators arechildren, what, 6, 7, 8, 9 hours
a day?
It's really important thateducators recognize, Oh, wait a
minute, somebody's watching me.
Speaker 2 (33:24):
Yeah, I've got a bunch, a set of eyes watching me
throughout the day.
But I think, you know, what I,what I hear you say, which
resonates with me and I think isso true, is, is for a lot of
people in our space andeducators that have been in the
classrooms, either during andbefore, Covid is remembering why
they do what they do.
Like it's been maybe hard to dothat over the past couple of
(33:46):
years with all those extrathings that we talked about, and
some of the stresses that theemotional, the mental, even the
physical stresses that youmentioned come with the job.
But I think what I'm hearing yousay is, you know, getting back
to basics on why you've decidedthis career path and remembering
mm-hmm.
, you know, that'snot all about money.
And we certainly understandthat, that, you know, that's
always a part of theconversation that people have to
(34:07):
factor in.
But it's, it's, people chosethis path because they had a
passion about it and, and caredabout it.
Yeah.
Did you, you mentioned earlier,like, yeah, there's a purpose to
it for sure.
I mean, maybe, you know, one ofthe most mission driven, you
know, careers somebody couldchoose investing in, you know,
early education, for sure.
(34:27):
You, you referenced earlier thechanges that providers have gone
through and teachers have seenhappen when you referenced
changes.
Did, do you specifically meanchanges that have come over the
last two and a half yearsthrough c or even like, for you
personally watching thisindustry over the last 20 years,
things have changed a lot.
Like, is it, have you seen a lotof change in your experience
(34:47):
even over the last couple years?
Or were those things alreadyhappening and Covid just kind of
like, um, highlighted at more ofthat makes sense?
Speaker 3 (34:56):
Yes.
Yes.
I, I do definitely see thatthere's a, it was coming down,
It was coming and then, thenpandemic.
The pandemic definitely made,uh, put a real big spotlight on
it.
Uh, the changes in children'sbehavior, changes in parenting,
styles changing in the industryin of itself.
(35:17):
Uh, people coming and going, nothaving that kind of stability,
um, that, that kind of stuff is,is, is detrimental to the
children and it's detrimental tothe educator, um, because she
doesn't know who she's gonna beworking with, uh, from one week
to another.
Um, children and theirbehavioral issues more and more,
and I am a hundred percent in,uh, in favor of inclusion.
(35:42):
And I think that they should,children should be all children
should be included in daycarecenters, but not all educators
are equipped with the tools tobe able to deal with children
with, uh, exceptionalities.
So, you know, we want everybodyto come into the centers, We
(36:02):
want everybody there, but wejust don't always have the
tools.
And parents have thisinteresting thing, they bring a
whole other dynamic into it,right?
Being, being a parent, Um, youknow, depending on the type of
parents who have some, mostparents are so grateful, um,
that the educators are there,that they love their children,
(36:24):
that they can go to work andfeel safe knowing that their
child is cared for, um, and allof that.
But, you know, there are theoccasional parents that are
challenging and expect, havehigh expectations, and some of
them are very unrealisticexpectations.
Like, no, I'm not teaching yourthree year old how to read
.
Like, it's just, you know, it'sjust not, it's not, it's not
(36:45):
appropriate.
Um, but you know, it, it allchanges and it all comes, um,
with how confident an educatorfeels in the classroom.
I know educators who have beenin the field for 30 years and
still will come across a childthat'll make them scratch their
head and go, I don't know whatto do with this one.
Speaker 2 (37:05):
, first time
I've seen this one.
Yeah, there's all, and those arethe ones you remember, right?
Like in my brief experiences ofhelping with young kids,
especially as my kids wereyounger and help with different
things that they were involvedin.
The challenging ones, which Ilove about, you know, the Little
Rascals or whatever you wannacall, like, they're the ones you
remember.
Like, they
Speaker 3 (37:24):
Love those,
Speaker 2 (37:25):
They even imprint.
I know.
So do I, and like they havepersonality and maybe there's
different, unique challenges,but it ends up being the ones
that you really remember too.
Speaker 3 (37:34):
Absolutely.
Absolutely.
Those are the ones that may havepushed your buttons.
Those are the ones that mayhave, you know, you've gone
through all of your tools andyou still can't figure out how
to get this job to listen toyou.
Um, and those are the ones youlook back, you'll remember that
child's name, you remember who,you know exactly what he looks
like, and you remember all ofthe hilarious stories that you
(37:55):
have about, I mean, it wasn'tfunny then, but
Speaker 2 (37:58):
Yeah, exactly.
It's funny now in retrospect.
Exactly, exactly.
Speaker 3 (38:02):
It was in retrospect, you're gonna go, ok, that was
pretty funny.
But then you, yeah, you're like,Well, I
Speaker 2 (38:08):
Think that's why educators too, you know, you
have those kids that then they,you know, they, they come back,
or there's a moment where they,they thank you for something
that you did, or, you know, youwere out sick and, and they were
like, Where were you?
We miss, like, and you realizethat, like you said earlier, you
know, these educators are makingsuch an impact, and sometimes
they don't see it on a day byday basis, but when those little
(38:28):
things come out, I think itobviously instills and, you
know, reminds everybody whythey've chosen this path.
Mm-hmm.
,.
What would you say, like, outtacuriosity, with all the people
that you talked to, Donna andthe, and the seminars that
you're doing now, burnout for aneducator, right?
Like, we're seeing a lot ofpeople leave the industry.
Your poll that you did talkedabout the fact that, you know,
(38:48):
maybe up to half of the, thepeople that were surveyed, or at
least thinking about notreturning to their role as
teachers in early education.
Like, is there a recommendationthat you would have or something
that you've seen to be effectivein, in regards to like, Hey,
instead of leaving, maybe you'refeeling burnt out right now.
Is there something that youwould suggest or an effective
(39:11):
tool to say, Hey, maybe taking apause if you're feeling burnt
out, because is this a temporarything and we still need you in
this industry?
Any like practical advice onthat, on that area?
Speaker 3 (39:23):
Well, I, yeah, I really do think that burnout is
very real in the field of earlychildhood.
And, and we see it in teachers,we see it in educators, Um, and
more so, uh, since the pandemic,because, you know, uh, if
anybody's seen, uh, what thenurses were wearing, that's
exactly what the early childhoodeducators were wearing, right?
(39:43):
They were wearing visors, theywere wearing masks, they were
wearing robes, they were wearinggloves and having to do their
work with that was just, just alot, you know?
It was just a lot.
And you're right.
I think pause.
I think one of the things thatwe talk a lot about in this
profession, and I don't wannagive too much lip service
because I really think it'simportant, but we're, we're
(40:04):
really big on the self care.
But I, I do believe that it isimportant for educators to
recognize that, you know,sometimes you do have to take a
pause.
Sometimes you have to say, Okay,well I know I only have, you
know, two weeks vacation, butcan I have three and I'll, I'll
take the, the cut and pay orwhatever, Um, just to be able to
(40:26):
take that pause.
Because we all know you cannotwork with children if your cup
is empty.
If your cup is empty, this iswhen you, um, you know, you
start to resent being in thefield, you start being angry.
You're not the best person thatyou want to be, and you leave.
I, I find, and I, I, I saw thatsometimes in myself where I kind
(40:49):
of went, Okay, well that wasn'ta very good day, and how can I
make tomorrow a better day?
And recognizing that, um, and,and looking at it sort of in an
sort of a intentional way.
Like, how can I do better?
And what's happening here?
Oh, I didn't get enough sleep,or I'm still hungry, or, you
know, like, like it was just anoverall bad day.
(41:11):
I need, I need to take a break.
I need a few minutes to, to, towalk away, or I need to take,
you know, an extra week or thisweekend, I'm not gonna do
anything.
Um, but I also think it has todo a little bit with your
attitude.
Like every morning you wake up,you have a choice, you make a
decision about how you're goingto work with those children
(41:33):
every single day.
That's your choice.
You're making that choice.
My students ask me that all thetime when they see an educator
that, you know, may not bedoing, you know, best practice
or whatever, and I say, Well,every day it's a choice.
They wake up and they make thedecision on how they're going to
act with the children.
And, but they also have torecognize what they need for
(41:54):
themselves as well.
Speaker 2 (41:56):
Yeah.
That's part of the formula.
You're right.
And I know, I, I think I readthis that you said this
somewhere, but it, it, it runtrue to me.
Like at least as teachersapproach that day, you said
earlier, you know, beinggrateful and actually choosing
to look at the things to begrateful for, but also like when
they're in the classroom withstudents, um, maybe it was some
expert who had talked aboutthis, but actually thinking of
(42:18):
your students as this is theirfirst day and their last day all
once, like, if you walked intothe classroom feeling like every
single student, this is theirfirst day in the class.
Yeah.
And or their last day.
Like, Yeah, what is theimpression that I wanna leave?
What's gonna make them beexcited about coming back?
What's gonna leave, you know,the legacy or the mark, you
know, if it's their last day inmy class, how do I want them to
(42:39):
leave that?
And I think that was a goodpractical tip as far as like how
to get the right state of mind.
Mm-hmm.
When, when teachers
Speaker 3 (42:45):
Walk in the class, this was their only day.
Yeah.
In your classroom, what wouldthat day look like?
And I think if you think thatevery single day, not every day
in daycare, I dunno, as adaycare educator, I could tell
you the Tuesdays and theWednesdays never look the same.
Friday's not the same as Monday.
You know, like every day in theclassroom is a different day
(43:07):
because of dynamics and childrenand, and all of that stuff.
But if you are intention, if youintention is to walk through
that classroom with the idea ofthe looking up.
Today's gonna be a good day.
I'm gonna have these childrenwatching me.
How can I use positive language?
How can I, you know, engage withthem?
(43:27):
And I think one of the thingsthat we have to remember as
early childhood educators isthat we are working with
children.
And children are awesome.
They're amazing to be around.
They're hilarious.
I can't tell you how many timesI have fallen off my little
stool because I was laughing sohard at what a child had said.
(43:52):
They're open, they're honest,they have a such a sense of
wonder about them.
And, you know, creativity andimagination.
And just to be able to have that, to be around that, for me, I,
that was my highlight.
I just sitting there listeningto their conversations, having
(44:13):
conversations with Twitter, youhave a conversation with a bunch
of four year olds, and I'mtelling you, go little, It's a
lot of fun.
Speaker 2 (44:21):
Yeah.
Well, you start to realize, likeadults, we ruin things.
The the older we give, the morewe track through life, we start
to take everything so serious orwe think things differently to a
five year old, you're like, Ohman, this is just simple.
You're exactly right.
That's a great soundbite for usto use the children.
Being around children isawesome.
Um, we, Donna, if, if peoplewant to find out more about, you
(44:45):
know, the work that you're doingand, and if what they're hearing
on this, you know, podcastresonates around like, Oh yeah,
I need, I need more of that.
I need to kind of tap into someof this stuff and these topics
that tos talking about.
How, how can our audience findyou?
Like, where are you on socialmedias or anything like that.
Speaker 3 (45:04):
Okay.
So thank you for asking.
I do appreciate that.
Um, I do, um, a lot of peoplehave found me through LinkedIn,
uh, which is Donna Ski, Uh, youcan find me there.
S k e a.
Um, and then you can also findme, I'm on Facebook.
I have the Infinite EducatorFacebook page there, and you can
(45:27):
also reach me at Donna theinfinite educator ca.
So that's all one word.
Speaker 2 (45:33):
Got it.
And, and your, the work thatyou're doing with Infinite
Educator right now is focusedon, you're, I know you're
giving, you know, participatingin different seminars and
workshops.
Are you doing private consultingand those types of things as
well?
Or are you just waiting to seehow opens up?
Speaker 3 (45:49):
Well, you know, you know what I'm, uh, you know, I'm
pretty game for everything.
And I have done, in the past, Ihave actually even gone into
daycare centers and, you know,put my, a educator clothes back
on and worked in the classroomwith educators and dealt with
like behavior issues and maybescheduling issues and, and sort
(46:13):
of like boots on the ground.
I've talked to educators aboutwhat to do about, you know,
staffing issues.
I've had, uh, workshops withschool boards.
I've had workshops with, uh,educators, teachers, uh,
directors.
Uh, I've given a fewconferences.
So I'm a intimate educator wassupposed to be like this.
(46:34):
And it's sort of turned into ajack of all trains kinda.
And, but I, I love, I love itbecause it's, it's, I, I have
all of this information thatI've learned over the last 30
years that I really, reallywanna share with people.
Um, I'm, I'm really goodlistener and I really believe
that I hear what people want orneed and I try my best to
(47:00):
provide, uh, daycares with that.
And I, and I listen to thedirector, but I also listen to
the educators, which I think isa big thing too, because it is a
community, It is part of,everybody needs to work together
to, to create this wonderfulatmosphere for the children and
their families.
Speaker 2 (47:20):
Yeah.
And I think you have like, Imean, to your point about how
it's kind of taken its ownlittle life of its own, this,
this business that you started,I think that's, you know, what
happens when you take a step offaith and a door opens up and
then, you know, also you have areally, I think, unique
perspective on the industry justby, you know, teaching educators
for as many years as you have,but also staying current with
(47:40):
what's happening inside the fourwalls of the centers.
Um, you know, it's obvious thatyou've got a passion for it and
have a lot to share.
So I hope, um, you know, peoplewho are looking for those types
of resources will reach out andgive you some more connections
and, and vice versa.
Um, last bonus question, cuz Iknow I wanna be respectful of
your time.
Okay.
This is completely off topic.
(48:01):
It's going back to Montreal, oldpoor, Somebody listens to this
show and they say, Wow, I didnot know Quebec was known for so
much fun.
That's gonna be on my list tovisit.
Somebody lands in Montreal,they're at the old Port area
restaurant recommendation.
You're in the old port and youhave to experience real Montreal
(48:24):
restaurant cuisine in therecommendation that comes to
mind.
Speaker 3 (48:30):
Laal laal.
It is a, a hole in the wall.
It doesn't even have a sign.
Uh, reservations only, but oh mygoodness.
Will you eat well?
And I I could probably name 12places you gotta go to do beef
and you gotta go and have smokemeat and you have to go and have
an authentic bagel.
(48:51):
And you have, we eat and weparty
Speaker 2 (48:54):
.
That's a good, that's a goodcombination.
So what, so, but the fact that,that's the one that you
mentioned out of all of'em.
So say it one more time and doesit, does it have a translation
into English?
Speaker 3 (49:05):
Uh, lak is, uh, the big eat.
Speaker 2 (49:09):
The big eat that.
That is a great way to end theshow.
And Donna, we really appreciate,it's, it's fun to meet you.
Awesome to hear what, Thank youso much there.
And, uh, you know, hopefully wecan have a round to at some
point.
Speaker 3 (49:22):
That would be great.
And appreciate that.
Thank you.
Speaker 2 (49:25):
All right.
Take care.
Speaker 1 (49:26):
Thank you for listening to this episode of the
Childcare Business Podcast.
To get more insights on ways tosucceed in your childcare
business, make sure to hitsubscribe in your podcast app so
you never miss an episode.
And if you want even morechildcare, business tips,
tricks, and strategies, headover to our resource
center@procaresoftware.com.
(49:46):
Until next time.
Welcome to the Childcare Business Podcast,
brought to you by ProCareSolutions.
This podcast is all about givingchildcare, preschool, daycare,
afterschool, and other earlyeducation professionals.
A fun and upbeat way to learnabout strategies and inspiration
you can use to thrive.
You'll hear from a variety ofchildcare thought leaders,
(00:29):
including educators, owners, andindustry experts on ways to
innovate, to meet the needs ofthe children you serve.
From practical tips for managingoperations to uplifting stories
of transformation and triumph,this podcast will be chalk full
of insights you can use to fullyrealize the potential of your
childcare business.
(00:50):
Let's jump in.
Speaker 2 (00:53):
Welcome everybody to the Childcare Business Podcast.
Uh, excited to be with you again.
This is Ryan Walt, and, uh, asalways, uh, our marketing team
has scanned the industry, both,uh, you know, domestically here
in the US but also North Americain general.
And so I'm super excited fortoday's guest.
(01:14):
Uh, Donna Ski, uh, is with usfrom Quebec, and we'll talk a
little bit about, uh, Quebec andmaybe Montreal and, uh, learn a
little bit about that part ofthe world.
But, um, Donna is the founder ofthe Infinite Educator, uh, which
provides workshops on allaspects of early childhood
education, including on buildingresiliency in the childcare
(01:35):
workforce, uh, which is whatwe're gonna spend some time
talking about today.
Um, Donna is also an earlychildhood educator, education
professor, excuse me, at, uh,Veneer College.
And I'll see if she, um, how doI pronounce it, Donna?
Speaker 3 (01:50):
It's at Vanet College.
Speaker 2 (01:53):
Vanay College.
Yeah.
And let me just with that, saywelcome to the show, Donna.
It's nice to meet you.
Speaker 3 (01:59):
Thank you, Ryan.
I really appreciated you.
Invited me on.
This is very exciting.
All the way up from Canada.
Speaker 2 (02:05):
Yeah.
Van.
So it's, I pronounced it wrong.
And that was one of the things Iwas gonna ask you, cuz I've
never been to Quebec.
And are you, are you inMontreal?
Are you right In Montreal?
Yes.
So, yes,
Speaker 3 (02:17):
I'm, uh, in the west island of Montreal.
Yes.
Speaker 2 (02:20):
All right.
So for our audience, cuz I wouldsay that predominantly our
audience is gonna be in the USalthough we have lots of
customers as well in theprovinces across Canada.
Um, for our audience who hasmaybe never been to Quebec,
what, what is Quebec known for?
Like, i I, is there somethingQuebec is known for?
(02:42):
And maybe a follow up question,more specific.
If somebody was gonna come toQuebec and only had one day to
spend there, anything thatyou're like, if you're gonna be
in Montreal, in province ingeneral, you have to do this.
Speaker 3 (02:58):
Okay.
Now we are, um, known for whatthey call and, uh, that means,
uh, having a good time.
So, uh, when you come to Quebec,um, the place that you would
probably spend your day at wouldbe the old port.
And so the old port is just whatit sounds like it is.
(03:18):
The old buildings from likethree, 400 years ago.
Cobblestone streets, amazingfood.
Uh, every restaurant has a, um,like a outdoor eating area where
you can just enjoy and peoplewatch.
There is, um, so many activitiesto do down there.
(03:39):
You're right on the water.
We are an island, so, uh,there's a lot of stuff that we,
we can do there.
Uh, right now we're justfinishing up the, the, uh, just
for laughs Uh, our 40thanniversary and all the
comedians come in from allaround the world to come to our,
um, our little town.
(04:00):
And, uh, that's always, uh, abig party.
I was down there last week andit was like dancing in the
streets and it was like, that'skind of what Montreal is known
for, for being a bit of a, a funtime when you come to Quebec,
Speaker 2 (04:14):
When you come to, I like that.
So, I mean, that's actually, if,if anything, if there's a
tourism department that wantsto, you know, hire you, the
attraction come into Quebec is,it's a place to have fun.
So old port.
Yes.
When you're walking around oldPort, and this is maybe my lack
of knowledge of the area, but isthere a lot of French speaking
(04:35):
people in the area?
Is it like predominantly Frenchor do most people speak English?
Speaker 3 (04:41):
Well, it's predo.
The province itself ispredominantly French.
Mm-hmm.
But in the tourist areas,particularly Old Port, downtown
Montreal, that area, we are allbilingual.
So, um, if you come in and say,Hi, I'd like to seek for two,
we're like, Sure, come on in.
But if you come in in French andsay, uh, I'm, so there's always
(05:08):
at, um, opportunity.
We are a very, Montreal inparticular is a very bilingual,
um, part of Quebec.
Other places are definitely morefrancophone, more French, um,
but Montreal known for astourism and we have to cater to
everybody coming in.
So yes, we're all quitebilingual.
Speaker 2 (05:28):
That's amazing.
So this might be a good segue alittle bit into like our topic
and, you know, early childhoodeducation and, and education in
general.
But going all the way back, areyou from Montreal, um,
originally and then in school inQuebec.
Is that actually part of thecurriculum?
Like, so the bilingual, um, kindof approach to, you know,
(05:51):
learning language.
Is every student go through bothEnglish and French, or how does
that work?
Or is it just kind of organicbecause a
Speaker 3 (05:58):
Lot of, Well, it's much interesting cause I don't
wanna get too much intopolitics, but, um, the English
children in the province ofQuebec are lucky enough to be
given the opportunity to becomebilingual.
So I have three daughters andthey are completely and
absolutely bilingual.
It's because they learned inschool.
(06:20):
My oldest daughter was veryproficient in French, so she did
her kindergarten to grade threein French only, and then
switched to English.
And then my, my twins, I have aset of twins.
Um, they did, uh, 50 50 inFrench.
So when they was French one daywas English.
So they learned, they, theybuilt up both languages at the
(06:41):
same time.
And that starts in kindergarten.
In fact, it actually starts inour daycares.
Speaker 2 (06:47):
That's amazing.
So do the, do families then getto choose which of those tracks
as best for their child?
Like the 50 50 versus the fullimmersion?
Or is that like student?
Speaker 3 (06:57):
Yes.
For the English children, yes.
For the English children, theyhave a choice to make, um, for
them to, and usually they canfigure out whether or not the
child is, uh, proficient in asecond language early on because
of the exposure.
And if they feel comfortable,um, they'll put their children
and immerse their children intoFrench.
(07:18):
So if they stay here in theprovince of Quebec, and they're
perfectly bilingual, you know,the, the world is their own,
because now they have their,they have two languages in the
French system, it's a littleless English.
Um, they don't really see thebilingualism as a benefit as
much as the English C having thetwo languages.
(07:39):
So the microphone children,although they learn a lot now
through social media andwatching TV and all of that
stuff, they don't necessarilyget as much English as the, as
the English get French
Speaker 2 (07:52):
As the English get French.
I love that.
You know, I mean, I think as astudent looking back, I took
Spanish one like five times.
Like I tell that story like,like I just never could quite
get myself to, you know, learnthe language when it was in a
classroom setting for getting agrade.
But in traveling abroad, whenyou actually, you know, interact
(08:13):
in places where if you wannatalk story and be able to
interact with other humanbeings, not being able to do
that is a huge motivator tolearn a language.
Mm-hmm.
And so I love, you know, placesthat, you know, immerse children
in that early.
Cause I think it's such anadvantage, um, you know, for
them to be able to be bilingualand that opens up so many doors
(08:33):
internationally and travel.
So that's cool.
And
Speaker 3 (08:36):
That, and yeah.
And in our daycare system, um, alot of the daycares, um, that I
work with, they're consideredbilingual.
So especially in the older agegroups.
So let's say in the threes andthe fours, there'll be one
educator that only speaks Frenchand there'll be one educator
that only speaks English.
So like story time by the Frencheducator will be French songs
(09:00):
and French, uh, story books andyou know, French conversation
and then English educator.
So, and they sweeped off.
So even if the children don'tnecessarily have both languages
when they go into elementaryschool, they have the exposure
to both languages before theyenter into kindergarten.
Speaker 2 (09:20):
I love that.
And is that like, maybe talkinga little bit about childcare in
Quebec in general, is it, is itsimilar to what you know about
like us and other provinceswhere, you know, families that
need their children in childcare, it's an out of pocket expense
for families if they can affordit and then the government
subsidizes those who need help?
(09:41):
Or is the government moreinvolved in Quebec around
childcare than in other places?
Oh,
Speaker 3 (09:46):
We are much more, yeah, we are much more involved.
And I would say probably in the,oh my goodness, early two
thousands, um, we had agovernment come into, um, into
power and they won on the ideaof$5 a day daycare.
Speaker 2 (10:05):
Wow.
Speaker 3 (10:06):
They implemented, and so they won
then they had to implement$5 aday daycare, um, which was done
in increments.
And so I would say by oh 2004,2005, uh, right across the board
(10:26):
it was$5 a day.
Now since things have changedand and governments have
changed, but right now ourparents right across the board,
unless it's a non subsidizedlike home daycare or something
like that, every parent paysabout$10 a day for their
children.
Speaker 2 (10:44):
Wow.
And
Speaker 3 (10:45):
The rest of it is subsidized by the government.
It is really a government kindof, um, cause we have this thing
, uh, we have government onecenters, um, they're called
They're CPEs, we call'em CPEs.
And they are nonprofit earlychildhood centers that, um, are
(11:08):
some of the best in our province, any of the CPEs.
And they all government funded,um, educators are paid at, uh,
19 and 20.
I think the max you can get is25, 20$6 an hour now.
Um, you know, they have to bequalified.
They, they have to meet certaincriteria and parents pay about
(11:30):
$10.
I think it's$10 and 35 cents orsomething like that now, um, a
day.
Speaker 2 (11:35):
That's amazing.
And, and I like, I could liketalk about this for a long time
too, cause I'm so curious aboutit too.
But does that put the four, theprivately run center?
So for the entrepreneurs who runchildcare in Quebec, does that,
is it a difficult business tocreate a sustainable business
business that's going to likeprovide uh, uh, living?
Speaker 3 (11:57):
No, because the need, the need for childcare is so
cute.
Even if, um, because whathappened, and I don't think they
recognized that this was gonnahappen before, it was like, I
don't know, 45,$50 a day.
Right.
So a lot of people, a lot ofmothers were staying home with
their children until theirchildren went to kindergarten.
(12:19):
Well, with the, uh, introductionof, you know, affordable
childcare, all tons of womenwent back to work.
And so the need for childcare ishuge here in Quebec, most uh,
families have two parents thatare at work full time.
Right.
Because now it's affordable tobe able to go back to work.
(12:42):
Like even if they take a portionof that, I mean, uh, you know,
it's 250 ballers maybe, uh, amonth for childcare for
Speaker 2 (12:51):
Child, which makes more sense cuz they can afford
it.
But when it was so expensive, itwas like, Yeah.
Speaker 3 (12:55):
When it's,
Speaker 2 (12:55):
I'm paying more than I'm making in that second
income.
Yeah, exactly.
So how did, so how did you getinto like outta curiosity?
So when you go all the way back,I ask this sometimes if Yes,
early days when you thoughtabout, oh, what I wanna be when
I grow up.
That famous question that kidsget asked, was it, do you
remember thinking like, what doI wanna be when, when I, when I
(13:18):
grow up?
Was it always something in thiseducation role?
Or did that come later for you?
Speaker 3 (13:25):
Well, all the way back to, um, my grade six
experience, um, I was sittingthere the first day.
I totally, it's eye right now.
And we need volunteers help outin the kind class as I can say.
(13:55):
The rest is the history.
I went in there, the teacher waslovely, she was lovely to me.
The children, um, accepted me.
Um, I, I spent every moment Icould, even though I was my
grade six year, I'm supposed tobe getting ready for high school
and being on that.
Cool, You know, Im grade six now.
I was hanging out with thechildren in the kindergarten
(14:16):
class.
I was just loving every momentof it.
So, you know, that's when,
Speaker 2 (14:23):
Go ahead, I'm sorry.
Speaker 3 (14:24):
I said, and like 30 years later, I've been in the
field 30 years later, I stillabsolutely love what I do.
Um, I totally believe in thefield of early childhood and I,
and I'm a huge advocate foreducators.
I just think I, I, I lucked out.
I really lucked out in findingwhere my passion was.
Speaker 2 (14:45):
Yeah.
It's not, it's not commonunfortunately.
Or maybe it's more common thanwe think, but you know, that
kind of adage of like, findsomething that you're really
passionate about and then figureout how to make a career out of
it or, or something to thateffect of, you know, actually
waking up every day and beingexcited about what you do is an
amazing gift.
(15:05):
And, you know, obviously for usto have people in the industry,
that approach work that way isso fun to be around.
Did you, how did you then becomea professor?
Walk me through that path reallyquick cuz if I'm not mistaken, a
a big majority of your careerhas been teaching early
education curriculum at VeneerCollege, right?
Or Vanny College.
(15:26):
Vanny College.
Um, yeah.
How did you get into that?
Speaker 3 (15:29):
For 10 years, I was, uh, an early childhood educator.
So I am by trade, a qualifiedearly childhood educator.
I loved it.
And then I started havingchildren of my own.
Um, and so my oldest daughter,who was now 23, um, she would go
off to daycare.
I would go off to daycare andthen I would come home and she
(15:53):
would be like, playing with me,Mommy.
And I was like, Uh, I don'twanna
Speaker 2 (16:00):
I'm tired.
Speaker 3 (16:01):
Yeah.
I love you, but I'm, I, and, andso I kinda had a sort of a, a
moment where I was like, Wait aminute.
I'm giving all of my energy, allof my, all of the good stuff,
um, to everybody else's childrenand, and not saving enough for
my own.
Um, and um, and at that timealso there, early childhood
(16:27):
educators, um, so we're talkinglike, we're talking late
nineties, right?
So, uh, salaries were poor.
Um, zero recognition.
But I knew I wanted to stay inthis field, so I decided at that
time.
So my oldest at the time wasfour, and I decided to go back
(16:50):
and do my masters.
And, uh, and so I started to domy master's and I, uh, saw an ad
in the paper for, uh, VanyaCollege, looking for early
childhood professors.
And I'm like, I'm just gonna, inmy CV eventually could hire me.
(17:11):
Sorry.
And
Speaker 2 (17:12):
Cv, just just to confirm your CV means what In
Speaker 3 (17:16):
Oh, my resume.
Speaker 2 (17:17):
Your resume.
Speaker 3 (17:18):
Ok.
Sorry.
Ok.
There is gonna be a little bitof a language thing.
Anyway, so I, I sent in myresume and uh, and they called
me for an interview and I waslike, maybe three courses into
my master.
And, uh, and I went for aninterview.
There was 12 people at the table, and then me, uh, yeah, the
(17:41):
dean, the associate dean, this,that, the department.
It was like the, was everybody.
So I went on and on.
I had the interview, got the job.
Um, and so I was doing mymaster's.
And then, uh, I was, I startedteaching at college and, uh, you
know, went on and had, and ittook me years to get my master's
(18:05):
degree, but I got it.
And, uh,
Speaker 2 (18:08):
So you got your master's while you were teaching
there as well, So kind of doingthe dual track, like you're a
professor, you're teaching, butyou're also completing your
master's at the same time.
Speaker 3 (18:18):
Yeah.
And raising
Speaker 2 (18:20):
And raising children.
Yeah.
Twins.
So you kind of like, Hey, ifyou're gonna do life, do it.
Right.
Right.
Just,
Speaker 3 (18:26):
I know it's like, you know, learning the candle at
both ends with the kids to bed,write a paper, go to bed, you
know, get up, eat, you know, itwas all,
Speaker 2 (18:36):
Maybe, maybe think once in a while.
Speaker 3 (18:38):
I don't think I could do it now, but back then I had a
lot of energy.
Speaker 2 (18:41):
Yeah.
It's amazing.
Moms are superheroes and, youknow, in general.
And so to hear stories of like,you know, putting in all that
time and effort to get to whereyou are, what did, so I know
you've been there for manyyears.
Talk about what happened duringCovid and in particular you
decided to kind of branch outand, and I know that's always a
risk to step in.
(19:02):
This will kind of lead us into,I think, our conversation, some
of the topic for today.
But I know it sounds like youkind of took a risk on something
that you had been wanting to dofor a while, which is, is doing
something outside of theclassroom in terms of consulting
and education.
So talk about, you know,infinite education and what led
to that.
Speaker 3 (19:19):
Well, it was interesting.
So during, um, one of the thingsthat I was noticing, uh, in my
classroom, uh, with my students,with myself, um, with the
children and with the educators.
I have lots of friends in thefield, lots of people that I
know.
It was hard.
(19:40):
We struggled a lot, um, doing onteaching students to become
early childhood educators onZoom.
It was, it was, I'm gonna say itwas terrible.
It was terrible.
I was teaching a course on howto build effective relationships
with children while I couldn'teven engage with my students.
(20:03):
So it was all of the, thesechallenges.
And then, uh, I, I could seethat people were just getting
worn down.
And, um, last summer, I kind of,like you said, took a bit of a,
and I recognized that there waskinda a gap in the field of, um,
(20:26):
people giving workshops, whetherit in person or Zoom.
I found, particularly here in myprovince in English, there
seemed to be a lack of a bridgebetween, um, daycare or
preschool and elementary school.
And here incorrectly we'restarting to implement.
What we have is, I don't know ifyou guys like a junior
(20:48):
kindergarten or a, or a, youknow, a pre-k preschool.
Yeah, preschool.
But in the school system.
So they were implementing fouryear olds and five year olds, or
the five year olds werekindergarten, but they were
implementing four year olds inthe, in the elementary school
system.
But without giving anybody, um,any tools to be able to manage
(21:13):
what it's like a four year old,four year, and know in care,
three year old, four year old,and even five year old, how you
manage them, the curriculum, thebuilding, the effective
relationship, it's verydifferent than how you would do
it in an elementary schoolsystem, right?
So it's not the same.
And there were so many teacherswho were working with Ks, uh,
(21:37):
pre-Ks that didn't have theskills or the tools that they
needed.
And so I kind of formed mycompany, uh, with the notion
that I could help out in thedaycare system as well as, uh,
I'm also working in the schoolsystem helping teachers
understand preschool children.
(21:59):
So giving workshops on what is apreschool child, what does a
preschool environment look like,what does, And it just all came
together.
And being somebody's so superpassionate about this field, you
know, the idea of the infiniteeducator, It's funny, I have
been a professor for 20 years,but if you ask me what I do for
a living, I'm an early foundededucator.
Speaker 2 (22:20):
That's still what you do at the
Speaker 3 (22:22):
Core.
Oh, what I do as a core, despitethe fact that I've put in more
years as a professor, I just, Iam an educator.
That's who I am.
So along comes the name alongcomes the company, and it kinda
just, it really did blow up.
Uh, for me.
I've been very fortunate.
(22:42):
I've made lots of greatconnections.
I'm working with a lot of theEnglish school boards here in
Quebec.
I have, uh, workshops coming up.
I'm gonna be giving a conferenceat, um, at the teachers, uh,
convention this year.
I've been asked to do some workwith daycare educators in the
school system.
(23:03):
Uh, so it just kind all cameabout and it's been something,
you know, that that kinda beingin the back of your mind, you're
like, I really like to do this.
And I was very fortunate.
I have a friend who's a businesscoach that took me on and kind
of helped me with the businessside of it, because I know early
childhood, but I don't know, poyou know, taxes and all the
(23:25):
other stuff goes along withrunning a company or, or even
setting up a company.
So she took me under her wingand, and I just kind of went
from there.
So I'm kind of a one man show,You know, I've got the, the, the
drum and the symbols and the
Speaker 2 (23:42):
Yeah.
Everything, everything.
The instruments,
Speaker 3 (23:44):
Everything is, Yeah.
That's all me.
I've got the Harmonic ready togo.
I'm, I'm the one man show.
But it's been such an amazingexperience.
I've met so many phenomenalpeople.
Um, uh, two weeks ago I gave aworkshop.
I just have, I'm going off andtangent, I apologize.
But I gave a workshop inAustralia, so I, I, yeah, I did
(24:07):
a Zoom.
Speaker 2 (24:08):
That's amazing.
Speaker 3 (24:09):
I did
Speaker 2 (24:09):
Find, and there's no such, by the way, there's no
such things as tangents on thispodcast.
We just go wherever it takes.
Ok.
Speaker 3 (24:16):
I have to tell you what an experience for me to be
able to meet up 20 educatorsfrom the other side of the
world.
Um, I had to get up at 4:30 AMto give a 6:30 PM uh, workshop.
I didn't care.
They're like, Oh, we're sorry.
I don't care.
I don't care.
That's, it was the most amazingthing.
(24:37):
And Ryan, I have to tell you,the issues that are happening
here in North America, they'rehappening, happening in
Australia.
The burnout, the, the lack ofmotivation, the the need for
purpose, the whole thing that's,that's happening with the, with
the field, with the professionand why so many people are
leaving, It's happeningglobally.
(25:00):
It's just not here in NorthAmerica or in the US or in
Canada.
It's a global issue.
Speaker 2 (25:05):
It's universal.
Well, and that, I think that'sone of the ways that we found
you, Donna, you know, kind of, Idon't know if it was through
social media or LinkedIn or somework that you were doing that
was made public, but I know youhad done a poll and you know,
this theme for us, when we talkwith our customers and when we
talk with, you know, guests onour show, and when we do
webinars, the whole theme ofburnout, staffing, retention,
(25:27):
and the challenges around thattopic is like, I mean, it's,
it's the common thread that Ithink has run through the
industry and all ourconversations over the past six
months with guests.
But I know you had done a pollrecently, just a simple poll
somewhere around like, how manyof you who are early educators
are planning to stay in theindustry?
And I think that caught ourattention because the results
(25:50):
were pretty disheartening, ifI'm not mistaken.
Is that right?
Speaker 3 (25:53):
Yes.
I was actually quite surprisedat how low it was for the people
that were going go back.
Only 3% said absolutely thatthey were gonna go back into the
, um, what was the 33 said?
33% said that they were gonnatake the summer to think about
it, which means they probablywere also looking around to see
(26:13):
what else is out there.
Mm-hmm.
But 43% had said that it wasjust too hard and they were
gonna walk away and they weregonna try to look for something
else.
43%
Speaker 2 (26:24):
That yes, almost half of the workers in the space,
Which, you know, we've seen alot of statistics about the
burnout.
And I, you know, I know you'vetalked about this around, you
know, during covid there was alot of extra stress put on
teachers and all the extraprotocols and that you were
around, you know, kids who, youknow, were sick and maybe were
more at risk, and there's allthese extra things that were
(26:44):
already added on top of a reallydifficult job that, you know,
everybody could probably arguewas underpaid.
And so you start to add that upas a teacher, and it's like,
Wow, I love kids.
I wanna spend my time and energydoing this, but all of these
things are kind of gettingstacked against me.
I don't, One of the things thathas come outta that for you is
in your conversations, istalking a lot about resiliency
(27:06):
and, and how we as an industryor as individual owners of
childcare programs, how they canhelp build resiliency in their
staff.
Like, do you have any like,practical takeaways or things
you can share about, like, whatyou found in terms of how you
build that, how somebody canbuild that kind of resiliency in
the face of what they're dealingwith right now?
Speaker 3 (27:25):
Well, I think one of the things that I've learned
from, um, from visiting lots andlots of daycare, so part of my
job as a professor is I go fromdaycare to daycare supervising
students in their stash.
So I get get to have a lot ofconversations with the
educators.
I've been also with the ownersand the directors of these
(27:45):
centers.
So I, I get to know what's goingon in the industry.
I'm not just sitting, you know,in my professor tower or
whatever.
It's, I really get to hearwhat's going on now, how
directors can really support,um, educators.
I think it's really important,uh, that there needs to be that
support.
And, and the things that arecoming out that I'm hearing from
(28:08):
the educators is obviously it's,it's, it's a very low paying
job.
But the thing is, it's not justabout the pay, right?
We know we're going into a job.
We know we're going into a fieldthat we're not gonna get paid
for.
We're there for a greaterpurpose, and we kinda want to be
supported in that.
But it's a really tough job,right?
(28:29):
It is a really physically,emotionally, mentally demanding
job to be an early childhoodeducator.
So if directors really wantedsome support, if they can't
afford to give all the educatorssome, um, more money, which we
know we can, it can happen.
Or, you know, very few ed uh,owners can do that.
(28:49):
Um, I would suggest having extrasupport staff, having one extra
person in your center to help atthose crucial critical times of
the day, you know, going into aninfant room, um, and all of a
sudden the ratio is like, Idon't know, 10 children to three
adults as opposed to just two.
And, and dealing with thechildren that way, that always
(29:13):
helps.
Or helping, you know, thetoddler, uh, educator getting,
uh, you know, 12 childrendressed up in snowsuits.
Let me tell you that, thatthat's, that'll break your back.
Speaker 2 (29:25):
That's cool.
Speaker 3 (29:27):
That's right.
Talking educators, um,especially now that I'm giving
the workshops, is that they dowant more tools.
They want more skills, They wantmore professional development in
how to deal with the challengingbehavior because children and
(29:49):
parents have changed.
Um, you know, the demand for thedifferent types of curriculum
has changed, the dynamics in theclassroom has changed, you know,
uh, so all of those things, um,if the educator doesn't know
what to do or doesn't have thetools to be able to, um, to
(30:09):
manage their classroom, thatmakes for a way more stressful,
uh, environment and makes aneducator wanna leave.
But if the educator will stay,even if they're making a low
salary, if they know that thereis, you know, uh, you know, I
like to say that Bay centersneed to be like a community, you
know, a community whereeverybody helps each other,
(30:31):
everybody works together.
So you get the community, youget the professional development
support and that they need sothat they have the tools to be
able to be efficient in theirjob and to be able to just to
give them that extra little bitof help when they need it.
It says to the educators, Ivalue you.
I value what you are doing, andI wanna help you to be the best
(30:56):
educator that you can be.
And I think that's one of thethings that helps on the, the
outside of it, on the inside ofit, as an educator, we really
have to sort of look atourselves.
One of the things that I'venoticed with educators, um,
during the pandemicparticularly, and I think
everybody's kind of done, thisis like kind of a head down kind
(31:18):
of thing.
Just get it done.
Just get it done.
Just get it done.
Right.
You know, just get through yourday.
Just get through your day.
I know I'm nervous.
I'm, I'm worried that I'm gonnabring this home to my family.
I'm like, just get it done.
And now that we're past that andnow it's time to kind of look up
again and see the positivethings.
I do this whole thing in myworkshop about being grateful
(31:41):
about switching our mindset tosomething more positive and to
being able to sort of see theimportance of our job and, and
the legacy in which we provide,um, for these children and for
the families.
Um, there's a great TED talk by,uh, Adele Lawler called the
(32:03):
Unconditional Kindness, uh,towards children.
And she said that if you workwith children, you become a
memory in their memory bank.
And what kind of memory do youwanna be in that child's memory
bank?
So if we look up and change ourmindset to being positive, yes,
(32:25):
this pandemic, there's nothingwe can do about it, but we still
can have a positive attitude.
And we have to recognize at thesame time as educators and all
the adults that are aroundchildren, they're watching us.
They're looking for cues from uson how to manage this.
Cause if you figure a child whois two or three years old, they
(32:47):
only know the pandemic.
This is what they know.
This is their life.
And they're looking to theadults in their life to give
them cues on, should I be reallyscared?
Should I not wanna be near otherpeople?
Should I, should I always haveto have my mask on?
Do I have to wash my hands athousand times a day?
Like, what is it that, you know,what are the messages the adults
(33:09):
are sending to the childrenduring this pandemic?
And cause their educators arechildren, what, 6, 7, 8, 9 hours
a day?
It's really important thateducators recognize, Oh, wait a
minute, somebody's watching me.
Speaker 2 (33:24):
Yeah, I've got a bunch, a set of eyes watching me
throughout the day.
But I think, you know, what I,what I hear you say, which
resonates with me and I think isso true, is, is for a lot of
people in our space andeducators that have been in the
classrooms, either during andbefore, Covid is remembering why
they do what they do.
Like it's been maybe hard to dothat over the past couple of
(33:46):
years with all those extrathings that we talked about, and
some of the stresses that theemotional, the mental, even the
physical stresses that youmentioned come with the job.
But I think what I'm hearing yousay is, you know, getting back
to basics on why you've decidedthis career path and remembering
mm-hmm.
And we certainly understandthat, that, you know, that's
always a part of theconversation that people have to
(34:07):
factor in.
But it's, it's, people chosethis path because they had a
passion about it and, and caredabout it.
Yeah.
Did you, you mentioned earlier,like, yeah, there's a purpose to
it for sure.
I mean, maybe, you know, one ofthe most mission driven, you
know, careers somebody couldchoose investing in, you know,
early education, for sure.
(34:27):
You, you referenced earlier thechanges that providers have gone
through and teachers have seenhappen when you referenced
changes.
Did, do you specifically meanchanges that have come over the
last two and a half yearsthrough c or even like, for you
personally watching thisindustry over the last 20 years,
things have changed a lot.
Like, is it, have you seen a lotof change in your experience
(34:47):
even over the last couple years?
Or were those things alreadyhappening and Covid just kind of
like, um, highlighted at more ofthat makes sense?
Speaker 3 (34:56):
Yes.
Yes.
I, I do definitely see thatthere's a, it was coming down,
It was coming and then, thenpandemic.
The pandemic definitely made,uh, put a real big spotlight on
it.
Uh, the changes in children'sbehavior, changes in parenting,
styles changing in the industryin of itself.
(35:17):
Uh, people coming and going, nothaving that kind of stability,
um, that, that kind of stuff is,is, is detrimental to the
children and it's detrimental tothe educator, um, because she
doesn't know who she's gonna beworking with, uh, from one week
to another.
Um, children and theirbehavioral issues more and more,
and I am a hundred percent in,uh, in favor of inclusion.
(35:42):
And I think that they should,children should be all children
should be included in daycarecenters, but not all educators
are equipped with the tools tobe able to deal with children
with, uh, exceptionalities.
So, you know, we want everybodyto come into the centers, We
(36:02):
want everybody there, but wejust don't always have the
tools.
And parents have thisinteresting thing, they bring a
whole other dynamic into it,right?
Being, being a parent, Um, youknow, depending on the type of
parents who have some, mostparents are so grateful, um,
that the educators are there,that they love their children,
(36:24):
that they can go to work andfeel safe knowing that their
child is cared for, um, and allof that.
But, you know, there are theoccasional parents that are
challenging and expect, havehigh expectations, and some of
them are very unrealisticexpectations.
Like, no, I'm not teaching yourthree year old how to read
Like, it's just, you know, it'sjust not, it's not, it's not
(36:45):
appropriate.
Um, but you know, it, it allchanges and it all comes, um,
with how confident an educatorfeels in the classroom.
I know educators who have beenin the field for 30 years and
still will come across a childthat'll make them scratch their
head and go, I don't know whatto do with this one.
Speaker 2 (37:05):
Yeah, there's all, and those arethe ones you remember, right?
Like in my brief experiences ofhelping with young kids,
especially as my kids wereyounger and help with different
things that they were involvedin.
The challenging ones, which Ilove about, you know, the Little
Rascals or whatever you wannacall, like, they're the ones you
remember.
Like, they
Speaker 3 (37:24):
Love those,
Speaker 2 (37:25):
They even imprint.
I know.
So do I, and like they havepersonality and maybe there's
different, unique challenges,but it ends up being the ones
that you really remember too.
Speaker 3 (37:34):
Absolutely.
Absolutely.
Those are the ones that may havepushed your buttons.
Those are the ones that mayhave, you know, you've gone
through all of your tools andyou still can't figure out how
to get this job to listen toyou.
Um, and those are the ones youlook back, you'll remember that
child's name, you remember who,you know exactly what he looks
like, and you remember all ofthe hilarious stories that you
(37:55):
have about, I mean, it wasn'tfunny then, but
Speaker 2 (37:58):
Yeah, exactly.
It's funny now in retrospect.
Exactly, exactly.
Speaker 3 (38:02):
It was in retrospect, you're gonna go, ok, that was
pretty funny.
But then you, yeah, you're like,Well, I
Speaker 2 (38:08):
Think that's why educators too, you know, you
have those kids that then they,you know, they, they come back,
or there's a moment where they,they thank you for something
that you did, or, you know, youwere out sick and, and they were
like, Where were you?
We miss, like, and you realizethat, like you said earlier, you
know, these educators are makingsuch an impact, and sometimes
they don't see it on a day byday basis, but when those little
(38:28):
things come out, I think itobviously instills and, you
know, reminds everybody whythey've chosen this path.
Mm-hmm.
What would you say, like, outtacuriosity, with all the people
that you talked to, Donna andthe, and the seminars that
you're doing now, burnout for aneducator, right?
Like, we're seeing a lot ofpeople leave the industry.
Your poll that you did talkedabout the fact that, you know,
(38:48):
maybe up to half of the, thepeople that were surveyed, or at
least thinking about notreturning to their role as
teachers in early education.
Like, is there a recommendationthat you would have or something
that you've seen to be effectivein, in regards to like, Hey,
instead of leaving, maybe you'refeeling burnt out right now.
Is there something that youwould suggest or an effective
(39:11):
tool to say, Hey, maybe taking apause if you're feeling burnt
out, because is this a temporarything and we still need you in
this industry?
Any like practical advice onthat, on that area?
Speaker 3 (39:23):
Well, I, yeah, I really do think that burnout is
very real in the field of earlychildhood.
And, and we see it in teachers,we see it in educators, Um, and
more so, uh, since the pandemic,because, you know, uh, if
anybody's seen, uh, what thenurses were wearing, that's
exactly what the early childhoodeducators were wearing, right?
(39:43):
They were wearing visors, theywere wearing masks, they were
wearing robes, they were wearinggloves and having to do their
work with that was just, just alot, you know?
It was just a lot.
And you're right.
I think pause.
I think one of the things thatwe talk a lot about in this
profession, and I don't wannagive too much lip service
because I really think it'simportant, but we're, we're
(40:04):
really big on the self care.
But I, I do believe that it isimportant for educators to
recognize that, you know,sometimes you do have to take a
pause.
Sometimes you have to say, Okay,well I know I only have, you
know, two weeks vacation, butcan I have three and I'll, I'll
take the, the cut and pay orwhatever, Um, just to be able to
(40:26):
take that pause.
Because we all know you cannotwork with children if your cup
is empty.
If your cup is empty, this iswhen you, um, you know, you
start to resent being in thefield, you start being angry.
You're not the best person thatyou want to be, and you leave.
I, I find, and I, I, I saw thatsometimes in myself where I kind
(40:49):
of went, Okay, well that wasn'ta very good day, and how can I
make tomorrow a better day?
And recognizing that, um, and,and looking at it sort of in an
sort of a intentional way.
Like, how can I do better?
And what's happening here?
Oh, I didn't get enough sleep,or I'm still hungry, or, you
know, like, like it was just anoverall bad day.
(41:11):
I need, I need to take a break.
I need a few minutes to, to, towalk away, or I need to take,
you know, an extra week or thisweekend, I'm not gonna do
anything.
Um, but I also think it has todo a little bit with your
attitude.
Like every morning you wake up,you have a choice, you make a
decision about how you're goingto work with those children
(41:33):
every single day.
That's your choice.
You're making that choice.
My students ask me that all thetime when they see an educator
that, you know, may not bedoing, you know, best practice
or whatever, and I say, Well,every day it's a choice.
They wake up and they make thedecision on how they're going to
act with the children.
And, but they also have torecognize what they need for
(41:54):
themselves as well.
Speaker 2 (41:56):
Yeah.
That's part of the formula.
You're right.
And I know, I, I think I readthis that you said this
somewhere, but it, it, it runtrue to me.
Like at least as teachersapproach that day, you said
earlier, you know, beinggrateful and actually choosing
to look at the things to begrateful for, but also like when
they're in the classroom withstudents, um, maybe it was some
expert who had talked aboutthis, but actually thinking of
(42:18):
your students as this is theirfirst day and their last day all
once, like, if you walked intothe classroom feeling like every
single student, this is theirfirst day in the class.
Yeah.
And or their last day.
Like, Yeah, what is theimpression that I wanna leave?
What's gonna make them beexcited about coming back?
What's gonna leave, you know,the legacy or the mark, you
know, if it's their last day inmy class, how do I want them to
(42:39):
leave that?
And I think that was a goodpractical tip as far as like how
to get the right state of mind.
Mm-hmm.
When, when teachers
Speaker 3 (42:45):
Walk in the class, this was their only day.
Yeah.
In your classroom, what wouldthat day look like?
And I think if you think thatevery single day, not every day
in daycare, I dunno, as adaycare educator, I could tell
you the Tuesdays and theWednesdays never look the same.
Friday's not the same as Monday.
You know, like every day in theclassroom is a different day
(43:07):
because of dynamics and childrenand, and all of that stuff.
But if you are intention, if youintention is to walk through
that classroom with the idea ofthe looking up.
Today's gonna be a good day.
I'm gonna have these childrenwatching me.
How can I use positive language?
How can I, you know, engage withthem?
(43:27):
And I think one of the thingsthat we have to remember as
early childhood educators isthat we are working with
children.
And children are awesome
They're amazing to be around.
They're hilarious.
I can't tell you how many timesI have fallen off my little
stool because I was laughing sohard at what a child had said.
(43:52):
They're open, they're honest,they have a such a sense of
wonder about them.
And, you know, creativity andimagination.
And just to be able to have that, to be around that, for me, I,
that was my highlight.
I just sitting there listeningto their conversations, having
(44:13):
conversations with Twitter, youhave a conversation with a bunch
of four year olds, and I'mtelling you, go little, It's a
lot of fun.
Speaker 2 (44:21):
Yeah.
Well, you start to realize, likeadults, we ruin things.
The the older we give, the morewe track through life, we start
to take everything so serious orwe think things differently to a
five year old, you're like, Ohman, this is just simple.
You're exactly right.
That's a great soundbite for usto use the children.
Being around children isawesome.
Um, we, Donna, if, if peoplewant to find out more about, you
(44:45):
know, the work that you're doingand, and if what they're hearing
on this, you know, podcastresonates around like, Oh yeah,
I need, I need more of that.
I need to kind of tap into someof this stuff and these topics
that tos talking about.
How, how can our audience findyou?
Like, where are you on socialmedias or anything like that.
Speaker 3 (45:04):
Okay.
So thank you for asking.
I do appreciate that.
Um, I do, um, a lot of peoplehave found me through LinkedIn,
uh, which is Donna Ski, Uh, youcan find me there.
S k e a.
Um, and then you can also findme, I'm on Facebook.
I have the Infinite EducatorFacebook page there, and you can
(45:27):
also reach me at Donna theinfinite educator ca.
So that's all one word.
Speaker 2 (45:33):
Got it.
And, and your, the work thatyou're doing with Infinite
Educator right now is focusedon, you're, I know you're
giving, you know, participatingin different seminars and
workshops.
Are you doing private consultingand those types of things as
well?
Or are you just waiting to seehow opens up?
Speaker 3 (45:49):
Well, you know, you know what I'm, uh, you know, I'm
pretty game for everything.
And I have done, in the past, Ihave actually even gone into
daycare centers and, you know,put my, a educator clothes back
on and worked in the classroomwith educators and dealt with
like behavior issues and maybescheduling issues and, and sort
(46:13):
of like boots on the ground.
I've talked to educators aboutwhat to do about, you know,
staffing issues.
I've had, uh, workshops withschool boards.
I've had workshops with, uh,educators, teachers, uh,
directors.
Uh, I've given a fewconferences.
So I'm a intimate educator wassupposed to be like this.
(46:34):
And it's sort of turned into ajack of all trains kinda.
And, but I, I love, I love itbecause it's, it's, I, I have
all of this information thatI've learned over the last 30
years that I really, reallywanna share with people.
Um, I'm, I'm really goodlistener and I really believe
that I hear what people want orneed and I try my best to
(47:00):
provide, uh, daycares with that.
And I, and I listen to thedirector, but I also listen to
the educators, which I think isa big thing too, because it is a
community, It is part of,everybody needs to work together
to, to create this wonderfulatmosphere for the children and
their families.
Speaker 2 (47:20):
Yeah.
And I think you have like, Imean, to your point about how
it's kind of taken its ownlittle life of its own, this,
this business that you started,I think that's, you know, what
happens when you take a step offaith and a door opens up and
then, you know, also you have areally, I think, unique
perspective on the industry justby, you know, teaching educators
for as many years as you have,but also staying current with
(47:40):
what's happening inside the fourwalls of the centers.
Um, you know, it's obvious thatyou've got a passion for it and
have a lot to share.
So I hope, um, you know, peoplewho are looking for those types
of resources will reach out andgive you some more connections
and, and vice versa.
Um, last bonus question, cuz Iknow I wanna be respectful of
your time.
Okay.
This is completely off topic.
(48:01):
It's going back to Montreal, oldpoor, Somebody listens to this
show and they say, Wow, I didnot know Quebec was known for so
much fun.
That's gonna be on my list tovisit.
Somebody lands in Montreal,they're at the old Port area
restaurant recommendation.
You're in the old port and youhave to experience real Montreal
(48:24):
restaurant cuisine in therecommendation that comes to
mind.
Speaker 3 (48:30):
Laal laal.
It is a, a hole in the wall.
It doesn't even have a sign.
Uh, reservations only, but oh mygoodness.
Will you eat well?
And I I could probably name 12places you gotta go to do beef
and you gotta go and have smokemeat and you have to go and have
an authentic bagel.
(48:51):
And you have, we eat and weparty
Speaker 2 (48:54):
That's a good, that's a goodcombination.
So what, so, but the fact that,that's the one that you
mentioned out of all of'em.
So say it one more time and doesit, does it have a translation
into English?
Speaker 3 (49:05):
Uh, lak is, uh, the big eat.
Speaker 2 (49:09):
The big eat that.
That is a great way to end theshow.
And Donna, we really appreciate,it's, it's fun to meet you.
Awesome to hear what, Thank youso much there.
And, uh, you know, hopefully wecan have a round to at some
point.
Speaker 3 (49:22):
That would be great.
And appreciate that.
Thank you.
Speaker 2 (49:25):
All right.
Take care.
Speaker 1 (49:26):
Thank you for listening to this episode of the
Childcare Business Podcast.
To get more insights on ways tosucceed in your childcare
business, make sure to hitsubscribe in your podcast app so
you never miss an episode.
And if you want even morechildcare, business tips,
tricks, and strategies, headover to our resource
center@procaresoftware.com.
(49:46):
Until next time.
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