Kathe Petchel began her education career working as a public school teacher before opening her own preschool center in 1984. She now owns three sites serving more than 300 families in Charlottesville, Virginia.
In 2017, Kathe joined HINGE Advisors, where she now works in business development. In this podcast, she shares her tips on using creative leadership and assessments to train child care center staff.
Among the topics she discusses:
- How to "gamify" staff assessments
- Tips for compliance checklists
- Using secret shoppers for your own center as well as for your competition
- Camera observations
And if you missed Kathe's last podcast with us on how to engage with your child care center's Gen Z employees (and increasingly, parents too!) , listen here for tips that center owners and directors must understand about the newest generation in the workplace!
To reach Kathe, email her at kpetchel@hingeadvisors.com. You also can visit hingeadvisors.com as well as brightbeginningsva.com to learn more about her work!
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:08):
Welcome to the Childcare Business Podcast,
brought to you by ProCareSolutions. This podcast is all
about giving childcare ,preschool, daycare, after
school , and other earlyeducation professionals. A fun
and upbeat way to learn aboutstrategies and inspiration you
can use to thrive. You'll hearfrom a variety of childcare
(00:29):
thought leaders, includingeducators, owners, and industry
experts on ways to innovate, tomeet the needs of the children
you serve. From practical tipsfor managing operations to
uplifting stories oftransformation and triumph,
this podcast will be chock fullof insights you can use to
fully realize the potential ofyour childcare business. Let's
(00:50):
jump in.
Speaker 2 (00:53):
Hello
Speaker 3 (00:54):
Everybody, and welcome to the Childcare
Business Podcast. My name isLeah Woodbury. I'm the head of
content here at ProCareSolutions, and I'm so happy to
have you join us today. And I'mespecially thrilled that we
have Kathy Petal with us. I'msure a lot of you know her and
have heard her. Um, she's beenin the industry a long time
(01:16):
sharing her expertise. Shebegan her education career
working as a public schoolteacher before opening her own
preschool center in 1984. Shenow owns three sites, serving
more than 300 families inCharlottesville, Virginia. In
2017, Kathy joined HingeAdvisors where she now works in
(01:36):
business development, and todayshe's gonna share her tips on
using creative leadership andassessments to train childcare
center staff. Welcome, Kathy .
Speaker 4 (01:46):
Hi, Leah. It's so great to be here. Thanks for
having me.
Speaker 3 (01:49):
Oh, it's our pleasure. So before we get
started, I always like to startevery podcast, getting a little
bit of background on ourguests. Can you, can you talk a
little bit about how you gotinto ECE?
Speaker 4 (02:02):
Yes. Um, well, ECE is my favorite topic, so yes.
Okay . Um, so I got into earlychildhood. I'm one of the lucky
ones. I always knew I wanted tobe a teacher, and I think it
started as being the oldest offour kids. My mom had four kids
within five years, so I wasalways like, you know, the
mother duck for my littlesiblings. And so , um, that
(02:24):
just started me off on theearly childhood field . You
know , I just always dreamed ofbeing a teacher and , um, you
know, from all of my jobs wererelated to education, except
when I was Wendy for theopening day of Wendy's because
of the hair . Um , thatwas , anyway, but otherwise,
lifeguard swim instructor,playground instructor, of
(02:46):
course, babysitter, gymnasticsteacher, and so on. So, that's
how I got into it. I went toPenn State and , uh, my degree
is in early childhoodeducation, elementary ed, early
childhood, and then an emphasiswith , um, health and fitness ,
um, pe. And after I graduated,I started teaching , um,
kindergarten and first grade,and I loved it. I did it for
(03:09):
about four years. And then whenI had my first child , um, who
is now 40 , um, I , um, Istarted Bright Beginnings. So
that's, you know, we're havingour 40th anniversary when I
started , um, brightBeginnings. And so o over the
years, I've, I think I'vestarted five schools, sold one,
(03:30):
one the church, one of theleast back. But, so I've done a
little bit of everything interms of business development ,
um, and really as a teacher,and I think most of your
listeners would agree , um,they wouldn't be listening if
they didn't wanna learn. And Ithink that's one special thing
about teachers is we arelifelong learners. And of
(03:51):
course, we aspire for ourchildren to be as well . And,
and also the parents that wenurture. You know, I think many
times people forget that wenurture parents, and naturally
today we're talking about theteachers that we nurture. So ,
um, being a lifelong learner,I've been in different
mastermind groups, works , youknow, chamber, and, you know,
different things in my localcommunity. Um, and then along
(04:13):
the way , um, I, I love what Ido, but I'm not gonna say I was
bored, but I felt like I was ata place in my career where I
could add value for otherpeople instead of just
developing schools on my own.
And so, along the way, I metKathy Lagan , who's our CEO and
President at Hinge Advisors.
And just the timing was perfectthat , um, my team was fully in
(04:37):
place. This is before Covid notsaying it's fully in place now
because we're all having ourlittle bumps, which is what I'm
here to talk about today. Um,but I joined Hinge started as
client relations. My positionnow is on the business
development team. And so atHinge, we sell schools, and
ultimately, hardly any ownersstart out, you know, opening
(04:58):
day. They're excited aboutcurriculum and, and s you know,
what are the, what's the foodthey're serving and how are
they developing children'sminds? They don't think about
how they're going to exit, andone day everyone exits. So the
thing we do at Hinge is helpyou, whatever stage you're in,
we're going to help you developyour business. So it's better.
(05:19):
And that just resonated with meso much. And so the bulk of
what I do is, along with clientrelations and working with ,
um, owners when they're readyto exit, I also develop
curriculum. So , um, anyway,that's, you know, that's the,
that's the short version, eventhough it took me a while to
say it.
Speaker 3 (05:38):
. No, it's
good. It's a good background.
You've, you really have done,done it all. So
Speaker 4 (05:45):
I'm still trying to find more to do. .
Speaker 3 (05:47):
It's , I believe that . So let's, let's
shift to today. Um, creativeleadership and assessments to
train childcare center staff.
And a word you use when talkingabout this topic is
gamification. Can, what, whatdoes that mean?
Speaker 4 (06:05):
I love that word.
Mm-Hmm . And almost no oneknows it, but anyone that uses
their computer or plays withvideo games, that's what it's,
it's, it's how can you achieveand help your brain develop
better and faster by making itfun? It's what we do as early
childhood educators every day,all day, we do fun things to
teach children scissor skills.
(06:26):
You know, take a bite, take abite, take a bite, pretend
they're a crocodile with theirscissors, for example,
everything we do is hands-onand play-based, or, you know,
we, it should be, or we try tohave it that way. Why wouldn't
we do that with our staff? Andso gamification is just a , a
kind of a fancy word to say,how can I make my teaching more
(06:49):
interesting so that my learnersactually retain the
information. And so much inearly childhood is creating
habits. For example, handwashing or diapering, there's
certain exact ways. Cleaning ,um, that's another really good
one. Certain specific ways oneshould complete tasks. And, you
know, that's what I love aboutearly childhood. It's an art
(07:12):
and a science. The science is,there's a certain way to do
things in some, in some cases,and then sometimes there's not,
you know, how you teachchildren different concepts in
art or , um, you know,different developmental
concepts could be varied, buthow you diaper should be pretty
on track and, and in , uh, youknow, habitual.
Speaker 3 (07:35):
So big picture, we're talking gamification.
Let's tie that into Gen Z,which you know a lot about. And
if anybody missed the podcastKathy did with us on Gen Z, I'm
gonna put a link to it in theshow notes, because it's one
you definitely wanna check out.
Um, these are the childcarecenter employees who came of
age during the pandemic and who, who can really benefit from a
(07:58):
reward system that comes fromgamification. So Kathy , can
you talk us through that alittle bit?
Speaker 4 (08:04):
Yes, absolutely. So you're right. Gen Z came of age
during the pandemic, and I havea big soft spot for them. Um,
sometimes we all get a littleirritated, but when we think
about, typically right nowthey're between maybe age 12 to
25 or 26. And the ones Iparticularly like to talk about
are the ones we hire. So the 18to, it might be 24 to 26 year
(08:28):
olds. The key to remember onthis also is that if we can't
figure out how to work withthem, we're going to have
trouble working with theirparents because this generation
are the mommies and daddiesnow. So , um, just like every
generation thinks they knowmore than the one before Gen Z,
really , um, they had a , atraumatic growing up those
(08:51):
years. So think about all thethings they lost. You know,
they missed graduations, theirhigh school, college, law
school, grad school, medicalschool, all of it was very
different than the norm. Um,and so in general, the Gen Z ,
um, they, you know, they aspireto be the next TikTok star, or
they wanna have an Amazonstore, or they want to create
(09:15):
on Etsy and, you know, makemillions of dollars. Um, and
part of it is they're veryfamily oriented and value what
their moms and dads tell them.
So they've been told, similarto the, the , um, what boomers
did with millennials, you cando anything. Mm-Hmm . Well, yes
and no. You can do anything,but usually an older generation
(09:36):
wants the younger one to dobetter and better than them .
Um, and you can do anything,but they , um, they're not
necessarily patient and willingto put the time in. And so in
the early childhood field, whenwe're bringing staff in, it's a
challenge. There's so manyrules and regulations that we
have to follow and to get, youknow, a generation Z or it
(10:00):
doesn't really matter.
Different people want to complywith certain rules, and then
others think I know better thanyou. And so for a Gen Z, making
it as fun as possible, and thatdoesn't just pertain to Gen Z,
it's any generation , um,making something fun, anything
tedious, you know , there'sdifferent ways we learn. So
anything tedious , um, is , uh,more , uh, manageable if it's
(10:24):
fun. So, and think about this,we compete against retail, the
fast food we compete againstAmazon workers. You know, we
have like a Amazon warehousenear, near here. Mm-Hmm ,
. And I actuallycompete against the Amazon
warehouse, you know, $25 anhour. That's more of a director
salary and my area. And so whenwe have to compete, we wanna
(10:48):
make sure our environments arebeautiful environments, and
it's a really fun place to cometo work. So the first thing I
would say is asking anygeneration what they're
interested in doing. Are theyinterested in , um, growing and
learning? Are they interestedin sort of team building
activities? Do they want to, Ido this at interviews in the be
(11:08):
, uh, during an interview, Isay something like this , um,
Leah , I am so excited to haveyou join my company. It's
called Bright Beginnings. Um, Ihope you're with us a very long
time, but I want you to leaveus better than you are today.
Whether that means you've gotnew friends, you've developed
certain skills, you have becomemore educated, we'd love to
(11:30):
offer you to get a CDA whenyou're with us, and so on. And
so, I always set the stage thatI care about them and their
growth and development. Andthat just filters right into
the fact is there's a lot tolearn. So asking them, what do
you wanna learn from the get go? And then helping customize it
is really important. Let'sthink about what types of
(11:53):
learners we have. And so thelearners, and just think about
this. If you're at a ProCaretraining or you're at any type
of , um, training your boss oryour company wants you to go
to, are you visual? And so ,uh, a lot of the Gen Z, for
example, would be very visual.
Think about what they didduring Covid. They're on their
(12:13):
laptops, they're on theirphones. Mm-Hmm. ,
they're up in the bedroom.
They're listening to the momand dad downstairs, try to
figure out who's going to worktoday. Are we both going to
work? Oh, what abouthomeschooling the younger
brother or sister? And sothey're learning visually. Um,
so with a Gen Z or , or manygenerations that are visual
(12:33):
learners, creating videos isgreat, but you know, what's
better? Having them create thevideos?
Speaker 3 (12:41):
Oh, that's a great idea.
Speaker 4 (12:43):
So fun. Yeah . So, you know, taking the doll in
the classroom and, you know,giving a , giving gamifying it
, you know, I'm gonna giveeverybody 15 minutes. I did
this not too long ago at astaff meeting. Everybody has 15
minutes. Team up with a partnerand ready, set. Go create a
video of something. And youcould give topics like how to
change a diaper, how toproperly wash hands, how to get
(13:06):
kiddos to move from one spaceto another space. I had , I had
had to greet parents and I, itwas hilarious. One staff member
was the mommy dragging the kidin with other staff member
, and then thedirectors at the front desk and
you know, they just had so muchfun. And the concept of how to
agree to parententhusiastically eye contact
using their name, you know ,um, with good energy hit home
(13:30):
for everybody because we roleplayed it. You could have the
auditory learners, and so theywanna listen to a podcast.
That's what we're doing rightnow. We're just, you know, you
could be on your walk gettingyour steps in listening to, you
know, a podcast. I like thekinesthetic learners because
that's the hands-on. And so Idid this recently, got a bunch
(13:50):
of materials, flour and saltand, you know, food coloring.
And , um, let's see, it wasbaby powder. Um, different
lotions, dawn detergent, andgave recipes. They created
videos of how do you makebubbles? Um, how do you make
bubbles? The trick on bubbles,most teachers know this dawn
detergent and a little bit ofglycerin. And so giving them ,
(14:15):
um, recipes like that, nowthey're gonna remember. And
then when they have that momentin the classroom with the
children that , that they needsomething to do those over and
over activities I call them, orthings you need to do, you just
need to pull outta your bag oftricks, you know ? Mm-Hmm .
, your littleMary Poppins bag, they know how
to do that. Or they know how tomake cloud dough or Kool-Aid
(14:35):
Play-Doh. And so providing, andso that is fantastic for a
kinesthetic learner. There'smultiple other learners. The
other one I'll highlight wouldbe, if you're a musical
learner, you're probably prettygood with math . So I'm not ,
and I'm not , but Learnerpreschool teachers are, think
about back in the day , um,five little Ducks went out one
(14:57):
day over the field and faraway, you know, talking about
counting or when you teach ,um, teachers about chanting ,
um, either recipes or chanting,you know, they can create their
own little rap about diaperchanging or about lining up in
the hall. Or I had a teacherthat was excellent. Um, she
(15:17):
just moved away. Uh, but shehad been in the army, so she
created all the cadences whenthe kiddos lined up. Wow . I
mean , I was a TV show, it wasreally cute . Cute . So
musical. I could go on and on,but I know you have more
questions for me,.
Speaker 3 (15:33):
I'm just picturing it. I wanna see the video of
the, the woman from the Armywith the little people that
Speaker 4 (15:38):
So cute. Yeah . And I thought , that is really
cool. Oh my gosh. Because , andshe had that, you know, voice,
that deep voice and, you know,rhythmic cadence for those
kiddos. And it wasn't like theywere in the army and they had
to line up a certain way. Itwas very fun. .
Speaker 3 (15:54):
Oh, that's great.
Okay, so let's talk compliancechecklists. Oh, I'm sorry. You
know what, let me switch, letme switch the order on that.
Let's unpack this a little bitmore. Can you, can you give us
some tips for gamifyingcompliance assessments? Am I
understanding it correctly thatthat's tying routine checks and
(16:16):
observations to rewards?
Speaker 4 (16:19):
So you can do it however you want. And , um, if
I confuse anyone , because Iget all enthusiastic and I talk
kind of fast, , feelfree to reach out to me and I
can talk you through whatyou're trying to do. Okay . So
it depends what you're tryingto do. Okay . So , um, and
remember I said the reason Igot into hinge years ago, 2017,
everything was going so well atmy schools before Covid. Mm-Hmm
(16:42):
. . I had anexecutive director that had
been with me for many years.
Everything, you know, I , Ifelt like I didn't wanna grow
the school. I wanted to dosomething different. I wanted
to add value back to theindustry. And so, but then
Covid hit my executive directorafter 18 years left to start
our own school, which we'lltalk about that in a minute,
because she is one of my secretshoppers now when we get to
(17:05):
secret shopping. Okay. Um ,because, you know, maintaining
good relationships with yourformer staff is a really good
idea, if at all possible.
Mm-Hmm, , um,sometimes it's not. Um, but
anyway , so , um, it dependswhat your goal is. So if you've
got a team that is , you know,really , um, you should have me
on for the stages of teaming,because I think I might have
(17:27):
talked about that. Maybe not toyou guys though , um, stages of
a team, if, if it's a lot ofnew staff or a lot of staff
that are different generationsthat need to work on gelling as
a team, it , that's somethingdifferent than the majority. So
that would be more of a teamingstrategy. But if you just need
(17:48):
compliance on the basics, then,you know, there's certain
things we can't be flexibleabout. We have to wash hands,
we have to serve food at acertain time. We have to
provide certain curriculum.
Infant room is even much morecomplicated. So when I say
scorecards, or when I say KPIs,it really depends on where your
(18:08):
school is. So knowing whereyour program is, what are the
strengths? Of course, you know,you know that from licensing,
you know that from your parentreviews, that you know that
from your enrollment, you know,from your staff turnover. All
of those things are indicationsof possibly indications of
quality. And I would reallycall it opportunity, a growth
(18:29):
opportunities. Um, so when youhave a , a weaker staff, a
staff that maybe they're GenZs, think about the Gen Zs
again, and not just Gen Zs,kind of anyone after Covid.
Yeah . The Gen Zs didn't have afirst job like everybody else
did . So they're at home. Theydidn't get to go be a lifeguard
in the summer 'cause they werestuck at home, or they didn't
(18:52):
get to do the afterschool job.
So not only are we trainingthem on 580 regs in Virginia,
at least , um, we're teachingthem work ethic, commitment,
follow through , you know, yourteam needs you, all of that. So
if you're at that basic level ,um, room observations, of
(19:14):
course, secret shopping isn'tquite as good for that secret.
Shopping's better for like,enrollment culture. How does
the school look, smell, feel,all of that. But compliance, it
is like a scorecard. I docamera observations and you
know, obviously you are ,you've already done some online
(19:34):
assessments, you've done all ofyour trainings. So it really
depends on what your goal is.
So for the basic level, afteryou've trained your staff, then
I like to, I like to make itreally fun and either team
oriented. So all the teachersin the baby room, you know, are
working towards, you know,always hand washing before and
(19:56):
after every diapering andalways doing all the bleach
water and soapy water and soon. Mm-Hmm. . And
so a great way to do that wouldbe a camera observation. If
you're working on culture withyour staff, a camera
observation isn't as good aswalking in and assessing like a
secret shopper might do. Um, ifyou're the owner and you go to
(20:17):
your school, and people alwayslaugh. They say they see my car
pull up and you know, they, youknow, jump, you know, get , you
know, get, you know, they hopto it. Yeah . They , um, they
know, oh, and then, you know,walkie talkie, Kathy's here,
Kathy's here. That's notreally, I mean, that's great
that they're respectful, butthat you don't really want
that. You really want them tojust do it naturally and in a
(20:41):
habitual way. I don't know if Ianswered the question. I kind
of went off a little bit on a ,a big picture .
Speaker 3 (20:48):
No , . No,
no. That's great. Was there
anything else you wanted totalk, like compliance
checklists or did we kind ofhit, did we cover all the
bases? Was there anything elseyou wanted to, wanted to
discuss? Well,
Speaker 4 (21:00):
So the first thing would be get, figure out what
your goal is. And then thesecond thing is get buy-in.
Make sure that your team knowswhat you're trying to do. Okay.
Um, and then, you know, there'sall kinds of compliance, but if
you're doing general compliance, um, I like to do scorecards,
(21:20):
or I like to do, have thedirectors, you know, regularly
in classrooms looking at whatyou're working on. So you could
have people with differentgoals in the same classroom.
Mm-Hmm . , youcould have your different
locations having differentgoals. So that's like in
general , um, the way you couldtrack. And then you , we didn't
(21:40):
really talk about, well , letme just , um, again, if you,
you know, the purpose and thenthis is how I would break down
compliance. I would start withthe most important thing is
your safety and compliance. Sothat would be your diapering,
your hand washing , maintainingyour ratios, having children in
the appropriate age groupsrather than moving them around
the building, which sometimeswe have to do. And then in
(22:03):
infant rooms, you'd wanna makesure you're documenting the
eating, the sleeping, thediaper, the tummy time, and so
on. So once you've got that,that's like base safety, then
you could go to how are weinteracting with the children?
We're , you know, honestly, Ithink that's the most
important, but I can't , uh, Ican't put that before safety.
So second is nurturing andteacher interactions with the
(22:28):
children, and that would alsoinclude your great curriculum
the next . So you could beassessing all of that. And so
I'd probably have a separatechecklist for those things.
Again, you're customizing itthe way your school needs it or
your team needs it. You coulduse your parents' surveys. Um ,
you could use your exitinterviews with staff or
(22:49):
parents to know, oh, here'ssome gaps we have. And then I
would look , um, after that Iwould look at your own
policies. So one of my policiesis cell phones . It drives me
crazy. I'm terrified someone'seyes will be off the kiddos and
there'll be an accident. Sothat would be one I kind of am
pretty strict about, actuallyvery strict. One I've let go of
(23:13):
is dress code. I personallythink there should be a
particular dress code, butespecially with the Gen Z, I
used to be like, all aboutpiercings. I had to let go of
piercings. You know, I, I, Iexplained it that, and I'm a
boomer, so, you know, there'sthat , um, I explained it that
(23:33):
children, you are , you , youare the child's role model when
they're at school all day. Andhonestly, they're at school
with us more than they're athome with mommy and daddy. So
when you have , uh, piercing inyour nose, of course they wanna
be like Miss Leah andstick a pin in their nose. I
just had to let go of that.
Same thing with tattoos. Iwould ju I would justify
(23:56):
tattoos and I would explain,well, you know, I'm afraid the
children will wanna model afteryou and take that ink pen or
that permanent marker and drawa robot on them or whatever
they like. I had to let go ofthat. Um, but what are your
policies that you don't wannalet go of?
Speaker 3 (24:11):
Mm-Hmm.
. Mm-Hmm.
Speaker 4 (24:13):
. Um,
and then I go to , um, and then
I'm like a little nitpickyabout making sure the children,
especially the babies, all thekids, but babies get a buggy
ride because we know from allthe science, if they're
outside, it's the five sensesand their eyes develop when you
point out the bird and, and soon. And so you can look at, you
(24:33):
know, schedules and do , um, docompliance on schedules as
well.
Speaker 3 (24:39):
Oh, very cool. I was just thinking to my , um, to my
son's daycare and all that ,there are a lot of the Gen Z
tattoos, nose piercings, and I,I'd never even thought about
it. I was just so, so used toit. So , that must be
the norm to kind of let thatpart go..
Speaker 4 (24:56):
Yeah . And you tolerate it because you're used
to it now. And that's me too. Imean, honestly, does that
really matter? If they arewonderful with children, it
doesn't matter. And I knowthat, but I, you know, I feel
like my brand is a certainbrand, and I think most owners
feel that way. Um, and so it's,it's totally fine. You know,
what I don't want is a teacherto not be nurturing and kind
(25:20):
and, you know, and welcoming toyou as a mommy and so on.
Speaker 3 (25:24):
Yeah. So you touched on this a little bit before the
camera observations. And thisis part of your, your creative
leadership plan, right? And sohow, how does that work? How do
you, how do you do thatsuccessfully?
Speaker 4 (25:40):
It's not always successful. Okay. Um , it's
nuanced. Um, and so it's hardto hear. You are not doing
something well in a job, right?
Yeah . I mean, that hurts .
It's just like your high schoolteacher, like giving you
whatever in algebra, you know?
Yeah . D or a d. And so it,it's, it needs to be sensitive
and nuanced, but once you, youknow, work with a team that,
(26:03):
hey, we need to get betterabout X, Y, or Z, one thing we
can do that'll be really fun.
And that's why you gamify it.
You, you know, it's sort of thesticker, the carrot. The carrot
is the fun part. And so what Idid was , um, it's like
threefold decided what weneeded to evaluate. And so we
started just with basiclicensing compliance in one of
(26:25):
the schools. I had a lot of newpeople. Some of the staff
weren't taking some thingsseriously, you know, hand
washing , for example, can'tlet that one go. Um, and, and
so I had someone offsiteobserve on the cameras pretty
much throughout the day andscore the room, the teachers
just on the basics. So we didan overwhelm with all the regs
(26:48):
and all my policies. We weren'tlooking at dress code or
piercings, . We were,we were looking at, you know,
cell phone . We were looking,but we were mostly looking at
the safety piece. So, and thenyou can go and build on that to
the next, you know, what's thenurturing, like, what's the
curriculum like? And then youcan go to, you know, are they
following the policies? Andthen you can go to, you know,
(27:10):
you can just go as deep as youwant. So starting, starting
like that. And so I only had mygallon , so I hired, actually
moved a director that was athome with children, but former
director for me. So she knewexactly how I would wanna speak
to teachers, exactly what tolook for. And then she would
also be able to givesuggestions. You had trouble
(27:33):
doing X, Y, Z, here's asuggestion, or here's the link
to , um, or just copied andpasted the policy in the , um,
the ops manual and so on. Andso if there was something like
a room was out of ratio, aparent dropped off and the
teacher didn't say, do you mindwaiting a couple minutes, Leah
(27:53):
till Ms . Barbara gets in? Um,if she didn't do what she
should have done, then shewould quickly call or text the
director and say, such and suchroom, you know, needs help. So
we had even go that level. Um,because, you know, if you don't
have the base and you wannacatch everyone in the beginning
of their work with you, nothave to , um, redo bad habits,
(28:18):
you want to , um, catch themright away so they know. And
it's not like bad teacher. It'smore like, oops, here's another
way we could have handled this.
And it's not perfect. Andthat's, that's , um, so some of
the negative feedback I gotwas, oh, big brother's watching
me. Mm-Hmm . .
And so you have to build in thepositives too . And you have to
(28:41):
text the director and say,fantastic project. Oh my gosh,
the way so and so moved thechildren from the classroom to
outside. And keeping them alltogether was fantastic today. I
mean, I would almost say liketwo or three times more
positive than corrective. Wealso ask the teachers, how do
you want feedback? That's superimportant. Mm-Hmm ,
(29:04):
. I like kudosrather than negative feedback,
just like anyone. And so if ,uh, but if I can learn and
watch the camera, there's maybethere's a bite in the
classroom, there's a , youknow, you get these little
biters that, you know, they gothrough a stage. And so for the
teachers, you know, what's theroom set up ? Like, what were ,
what was happening right beforethe bite is, you know, is the
(29:27):
child hungry? Is the childtired? You know, and so on. Um,
so really watching and lettingthem see the video is helpful.
Um, some people, many of ourstaff did not wanna interrupt
their brain and the flow oftheir day. They would rather
hear at the end of the day, andthey would rather have their
(29:48):
director tell them , or theywould rather just an in general
at a staff meeting, here's theclassrooms that, you know,
scored really high. Here's whatthey're doing really well,
here's the reminders and callit a day like that. You really
have to be sensitive on this.
It works great, but you'vegotta be sensitive. Now, quite
a few people, I , the people Iknow that do this , um, score
(30:09):
and do really nice bonuses,either financial bonuses, gift
cards, you could do like kudos, um, in your staff newsletter,
you can, you know , talk toparents. You can have their
name tags with a bunch oflittle, like I have my, one of
my logos is the sunshine andthen birds . And so you could
have, I don't do this, but Icould , um, have a bunch of
(30:31):
little sons for, you know, forthey did the best on on
observations. You have to haveobservations , um, in person as
well. That's actually moreimportant. But a camera
observation is something thatdoes work if you are very
careful about it. And thenbefore I do a camera
observation, I'm going to findout what their , um, language
(30:54):
of appreciation is . This is sofunny. Um, once in a while you
ask someone what their languageof appreciation is without
explaining what it means, whichmost of us in the industry know
it's based on a book. Um, andthere's five ways that people
prefer being appreciated inearly childhood. Typically,
(31:15):
it's , um, words ofappreciation were , uh, like
affirmation acts of s Soaffirmation, oh my gosh,
amazing job doing thatpainting, art project, you
know, yesterday, or I love myday , how you did my day with
the tires . Um, the next onethat people like is acts of
service. So the rooms are mets,all the goldfish crackers are
(31:38):
all over the floor. And youcome in with the broom and the
dust pan and you help clean up.
That's an act of service.
Another one is quality time.
Everyone always wants to talkto the director. And the
director's always too busy andit hurts people's feelings. And
the director thinks, don't youknow, I have to do my job. Um,
so quality time, then gifts. SoI hit gifts early on this, but
(32:03):
sometimes these other thingsare more important. And then
the last one is like, touch ahigh five, a hug, a pat on the
back, that type of thing. So ifyou know that and you do your
camera observations and thenyou know how they want to
receive feedback, it goes muchbetter.
Speaker 3 (32:20):
Okay. That's a really good, you ask my
question
Speaker 4 (32:23):
And I talk for 20 minutes.
Speaker 3 (32:25):
Sorry's my favorite part of these podcasts. Like
seeing where they go and hear .
Yeah. Hearing everything youhave to say. It's, it's great.
So the most important part ofany game scoring. Yeah
. So let's say, okay, so let'ssay you're a center director,
you've gone full intogamification for assessments.
(32:45):
How do you keep score?
Speaker 4 (32:48):
So depending on what your goal is, uhhuh , um, I
keep the score. So you wannastart slowly. So I started with
scoring just five or six items,and I started with sa the
safety one. Um, now we'reworking on, and different,
different classrooms, were atdifferent levels, but if
(33:09):
they're at a higher level, thenthey're scoring, like one of my
, for instance for my directorswas I want everyone to take
this leadership class online.
It's fantastic. It was free.
This one, I had them do. Andthe first person to finish is
gonna get a hundred dollars .
Well, you know, and that's notscoring. That's like, show me
(33:29):
you've completed it. Show methat you care about leadership.
Show me. And I think two peoplekind of tied, so two people Got
it. So that's an easy scorewhere it's tied to a quick
reward. Mm-Hmm.
Speaker 3 (33:41):
Speaker 4 (33:41):
Other scoring is just someone watching and
observing. Um, of course,everyone I'm sure, you know,
listening to this has some typeof compliance checklist.
Whether it's one that's fun todo is the figure eight where
you go through your wholebuilding twice a day. Mm-Hmm .
. Um , and youstart and you go start in your
parking lot in your trash can .
(34:02):
And you know your flowers thatyou know aren't dead. Hopefully
, because you don'twanna tell parents, we take
great care of kids, but wecan't like weed our flowers.
Mm-Hmm . . Um ,and we go through the building
in a particular way with afacility checklist, and you can
score that. And then the end ofthe day, someone different goes
in a different directionthrough the building, and you
compare the checklist and youcan score that. Um, so that's
(34:27):
one easy way. The cameraobservations, as I said, you
can score higher the things youreally care about most. So,
Mm-Hmm . dresscode is less highly scored or
maybe not scored at all versus,you know, the safety. The
safety for instance. Um, andthen I was working with a group
(34:48):
in New Jersey a couple yearsago, and they were scoring with
a bingo card. So they did a biggiant bingo card in the
kitchen. And every time people,you know, so like Bingo,
B-I-N-G-O, so, but they didwhatever acronym they needed.
So it's like hand washingdiapering, you know , um, all
day notes completed, you know,the, the ProCare engage type
(35:10):
thing. All that's completed byeverybody. And you score and
you can work towards a groupgoal that way. I like that a
lot. I do too . Um , I just dida kudos jar a couple weeks ago
at one of my schools. Everybodyis sort of a little down on
out. People were on vacation,we had subs. I just went in and
I thought, ah , we just needto, you know, perk everybody up
(35:32):
a little bit. And so we talkedabout teaming and the stages of
teaming and how it is .
Remember how I said like, Leah, we're so excited. You're at
bright beginnings. Hope you'rehere for a really long time.
The other thing I say atinterviews is, here's what
you're gonna do. You are goingto come in and as much as we're
excited that you're our newtoddler teacher, Leah , so
excited, you're gonna irritatesomebody, you're gonna make a
(35:55):
mistake. You are going to cometo work late accidentally. And
you are gonna get a littlepushback. They are going to
drive you insane becausethey're gonna gossip. Hopefully
not, but you know, or they'regoing to , um, you know,
irritate you in some way.
That's the storming part of, ofteaming. You start and it's a
(36:16):
honeymoon stage, and then youget to kinda like when you date
your husband or yoursignificant other, it's all
good until it's not. And you'vegotta get through that storming
stage. If you teach your newcandidates from the beginning,
this isn't all rosy. It's superfun, but it's not perfect. And
you say to your staff, Hey, nowLeah's joining us. She is going
(36:38):
to be the new toddler teacher.
You know, let's, you know,let's give her a lot of grace.
Let's everybody who's going tobe her mentor, everybody, you
know, let's help Leah , youknow, through any storms we
have. And then we get to , um,normalizing. Norming is the
third stage. Only after you alldo that, can you get to perform
and that's what you're lookingfor. But if you are saying to
(37:00):
staff, this is what we're goingthrough. So that's what was
going on with this team I hadat one of my schools. And so
they were storming a littlebit, you know, people were
coming in late, you know, oh,110 degrees in July in
Charlottesville. And so theywere frustrated. So we just
talked about teaming, we talkedabout the stages, we talked
about who we still needed tohire, what positions we needed.
(37:23):
We talked about enrollment.
Really, they were doing greatwith all their licensing and
compliance. So it really wasmore the , um, the, the people
part. And so we went around andsaid what , um, what everyone
liked about a particular personand got this big jar and got
these really cute littlepapers. And so for the next
(37:45):
week, everyone did. Iencouraged them. Let's do , um,
a kudos jar. And so I startedthat night and I wrote, and ,
and some of them were, youknow, like you came in, you
know, when you really didn'tfeel well, you had a migraine,
you took your migraine medicineand you came in. Kudos to,
So-and-So put it in the jar.
And so then we went around,everybody did that. And then I
(38:07):
made a point to show the kudosdoesn't have to be about the
kids. It doesn't have to beabout, you know, any one
particular thing. I'm trying towork on them understanding and
appreciating each other. So Idid a kudos for Bonnie. She is
a TA afternoon. She does, shecomes in and does , um, baby
breaks and then , uh, closes inthe afternoon. She's the
(38:31):
world's best cleaner. In fact,she used to be a housekeeper.
Mm-Hmm . , herkudos was, oh my gosh, Bonnie,
I had no idea that theattachment on this certain
vacuum would clean theupholstery in the lobby. Kudos
to Bonnie for cleaning ouryellow chairs. And so, and then
I said , um, I'm giving you twokudos. And gave her another
(38:51):
one. And so that started thepositivity. And so then the
next week at the meeting,'cause I'm not at all the
meetings, I have directors andexec people, but I do like to
when I am in town. And so thenext week we dumped out the
kudos jar. We also asked theparents to do it too, which was
really sweet. And so we readevery kudos. And the person
(39:15):
that got the most got to pickup prize out of the grab grab
bag . And I think I gave likethe top three people got to
have a prize.
Speaker 3 (39:23):
Oh, I love that.
It's, it is just so rewarding.
Just those little, yeah. Like alittle thing. Like, not like
you did this big huge,wonderful thing, right , like
this Yeah. To to feelrecognized though. Yeah .
Speaker 4 (39:35):
Yeah, yeah . Just the little things. Yeah . And
so that has developed yourculture, I think.
Speaker 3 (39:40):
Yeah. Okay. And I, I have to know more about these
secret shoppers. Um , okay .
How does this , how does thiswork? And that you have such a
good relationship with a formeremployee that, that she's doing
that for you. That's, thatalone is pretty incredible.
Speaker 4 (39:55):
I'm gonna tell her to listen to this podcast. Her
name is PJ and I love her somuch. Um, she worked with me
for 18 years. So fun . Shestarted out, she had her own
in-home childcare , and thenshe started out as my copy girl
. Like she would go and copystuff on the copier. I quickly
realized she was way, way morequalified than make , you know,
being a office assistant. Soshe ended up working her way
(40:18):
from director to exec director.
And so now whenever I needfresh eyes or because I worked
so closely with her, she knowsme. She knows exactly what I
want. And she also helpeddevelop our policies. Mm-Hmm .
. So someone likethat, that's been on your team,
I would just encouragelisteners to give them a second
chance to come back or see ifyou can find something else for
(40:42):
them to do that is still withintheir skillset . She won't come
back full-time because she hasa big school of her own. Um, we
don't compete with each other.
She's far enough away. But boydoes she really like it when I
call and say, I need your help.
I need to pick your brain. Andso she'll just go into all of
my schools spot check, do, andshe'll do. We have a licensing
(41:05):
checklist, a facility matrix.
We have a curriculum check, astaff check. We have paperwork
checks, all, you know, all thematrixes. And again, I'm happy
to share if someone wantssample ones. Um, I know you
guys have so much stuff too.
Um, but she'll come in, shehas, you know, key code. She
just comes in and gives anassessment. And her goal, at
(41:29):
first when she did it, youknow, she got sort of rolled
eyes and now what, you know,now we're , we just got through
the camera observations, nowwe're having somebody in
person. But that fresh eyesmatters a lot. The director
misses it, or the director hasa different relationship with
the staff. Mm-Hmm . When I goin , uh, they, you know , you
(41:50):
know, they perform , uh, whensomebody different comes in,
unexpected, it's, it's likelicensing actually. She kind of
simulates licensing for them.
And so that works great. Andthen she'll call me or she'll
do an email report and calland, you know, and she catches
things way before , um, youknow, right away. So we don't
(42:13):
let something fester. You know,at first one of the schools she
would go in and, you know, shewas greeted with , um, it was
actually quite a couple of thestaff were from other
countries, so, you know ,there's that culture piece too.
Um, they were, English is asecond language, so they were
really intimidated. She comesin, you know, with her little
(42:33):
clipboard, kind of likelicensing, and they were
intimidated. So it took a whilefor the , for them to warm up.
I don't really want them to befriendly. I want her to come in
with really fresh eyes. So thatgoes, that works great. There's
, um, a couple national , um,secret shoppers. One thing I
haven't done, and I don't thinkmy schools would do great at, I
(42:56):
don't know , um, is answeringphones. You can secret shop.
Um, and what I'd say is ifyou're in a mastermind group or
your friends with othercompetitors in, you know,
different areas of the country,secret shop for each other on
the phone, that works reallygreat. Um, did they answer
within three rings? I don'twant my teachers to answer the
(43:17):
phone if children are crying inthe background or if they're
attending to a child. So ofcourse our voicemail says, you
know, thank you for calling. If, um, you know, we can't wait
to talk to you. If you aregetting a voice message , uh,
it's because we're working withthe children right now, we'll
call you back. You know, thattype of thing. But secret
shopping phone is also reallygood.
Speaker 3 (43:40):
Yeah. Yeah. It's , I mean that's a lot of times
probably people's firstinteraction, right? With the
center, just calling to ahundred set up a tour or
something like that. Mm-Hmm.
. Yeah. Firstimpression.
Speaker 4 (43:52):
Yeah, exactly.
Speaker 3 (43:54):
All right . Kathy , this has been really great. Is
there anything that I didn'task you and I should have or
that, that you think peopleshould know about gamification,
about assessments, aboutchecklists?
Speaker 4 (44:05):
Um , I'm sure there is Leah , let's see, I've gotta
look at my notes briefly . Um,well, the , on the secret
shopping , uh, that is, ifyou've got a former staff
member, I would encourage youto maybe reach out to them on
that. It's also really goodsecret shop or Secret Shop
phone calls , um, like anat-home parent that , um, you
(44:28):
know, wants to do a couplemornings a week, just pop into
your schools and just, you know, um, get in the car after the,
after the visit and just takesome notes and shoot it off to
the director. Um, you know, I ,I pay, you know, I, I don't
know, 50 to a hundred dollarsfor a , a good secret shop per
time. Um, you're gonna catch somuch that way. Um , you could
(44:50):
also, if you have parentambassadors or raving fans at
your school, you could offer atuition discount or pay them to
do it for one of your otherlocations. Could also secret
shop your competitors guys.
That's a really good one. Youknow, what does Brighton shiny
down the street doing that I'mnot. So that would be something
(45:13):
else I would suggest.
Speaker 3 (45:14):
Oh , that's great.
Well, Kathy , thank you so muchfor coming. Could you , um, let
our listeners know how theycould , um, reach out to you to
learn more about the work youdo? Uh , either website or
social media, anything?
Speaker 4 (45:28):
Well, if you're interested in Bright
Beginnings, it's BrightBeginnings va, like Virginia
Bright Beginnings va.com. Uh,and then we've got some really
nice Facebook pages as well.
Bright Beginnings,Charlottesville. And then I, I
have several other Facebookpages relating to our locations
here. And then if you'reinterested about Hinge, either
me speaking for your groups orknowing where I'll be speaking
(45:51):
next , um, it would be my emailis K petal , PET like Tom,
CHEL, at hinge advisors.com .
And of course, hingeadvisors.com is our website.
Um, and I, I love to talk shop,so happy to answer emails or
connect with listeners.
Speaker 3 (46:11):
Well, Kathy , thank you again. Thank you to
everybody who took the time tolisten to this podcast. Um, we
at ProCare Solutions do wannasay thank you to everybody in
ECE and childcare for theimportant work that you're
doing every day . We are happyto support you and we hope you
are, continue to enjoy thispodcast and let your friends,
family, parents, staff,everybody know about it, all
(46:34):
the, all the good resources wehave. Have a great day,
everyone. Thank you.
Speaker 4 (46:39):
Thanks, Leo .
Speaker 1 (46:42):
Thank you for listening to this episode of
the Childcare Business Podcast.
To get more insights on ways tosucceed in your childcare
business, make sure to hitsubscribe in your podcast app
so you never miss an episode.
And if you want even morechildcare , business tips ,
tricks, and strategies, headover to our resource
center@procaresoftware.com.
(47:03):
Until next time.
Welcome to the Childcare Business Podcast,
brought to you by ProCareSolutions. This podcast is all
about giving childcare ,preschool, daycare, after
school , and other earlyeducation professionals. A fun
and upbeat way to learn aboutstrategies and inspiration you
can use to thrive. You'll hearfrom a variety of childcare
(00:29):
thought leaders, includingeducators, owners, and industry
experts on ways to innovate, tomeet the needs of the children
you serve. From practical tipsfor managing operations to
uplifting stories oftransformation and triumph,
this podcast will be chock fullof insights you can use to
fully realize the potential ofyour childcare business. Let's
(00:50):
jump in.
Speaker 2 (00:53):
Hello
Speaker 3 (00:54):
Everybody, and welcome to the Childcare
Business Podcast. My name isLeah Woodbury. I'm the head of
content here at ProCareSolutions, and I'm so happy to
have you join us today. And I'mespecially thrilled that we
have Kathy Petal with us. I'msure a lot of you know her and
have heard her. Um, she's beenin the industry a long time
(01:16):
sharing her expertise. Shebegan her education career
working as a public schoolteacher before opening her own
preschool center in 1984. Shenow owns three sites, serving
more than 300 families inCharlottesville, Virginia. In
2017, Kathy joined HingeAdvisors where she now works in
(01:36):
business development, and todayshe's gonna share her tips on
using creative leadership andassessments to train childcare
center staff. Welcome, Kathy .
Speaker 4 (01:46):
Hi, Leah. It's so great to be here. Thanks for
having me.
Speaker 3 (01:49):
Oh, it's our pleasure. So before we get
started, I always like to startevery podcast, getting a little
bit of background on ourguests. Can you, can you talk a
little bit about how you gotinto ECE?
Speaker 4 (02:02):
Yes. Um, well, ECE is my favorite topic, so yes.
Okay . Um, so I got into earlychildhood. I'm one of the lucky
ones. I always knew I wanted tobe a teacher, and I think it
started as being the oldest offour kids. My mom had four kids
within five years, so I wasalways like, you know, the
mother duck for my littlesiblings. And so , um, that
(02:24):
just started me off on theearly childhood field . You
know , I just always dreamed ofbeing a teacher and , um, you
know, from all of my jobs wererelated to education, except
when I was Wendy for theopening day of Wendy's because
of the hair
lifeguard swim instructor,playground instructor, of
(02:46):
course, babysitter, gymnasticsteacher, and so on. So, that's
how I got into it. I went toPenn State and , uh, my degree
is in early childhoodeducation, elementary ed, early
childhood, and then an emphasiswith , um, health and fitness ,
um, pe. And after I graduated,I started teaching , um,
kindergarten and first grade,and I loved it. I did it for
(03:09):
about four years. And then whenI had my first child , um, who
is now 40 , um, I , um, Istarted Bright Beginnings. So
that's, you know, we're havingour 40th anniversary when I
started , um, brightBeginnings. And so o over the
years, I've, I think I'vestarted five schools, sold one,
(03:30):
one the church, one of theleast back. But, so I've done a
little bit of everything interms of business development ,
um, and really as a teacher,and I think most of your
listeners would agree , um,they wouldn't be listening if
they didn't wanna learn. And Ithink that's one special thing
about teachers is we arelifelong learners. And of
(03:51):
course, we aspire for ourchildren to be as well . And,
and also the parents that wenurture. You know, I think many
times people forget that wenurture parents, and naturally
today we're talking about theteachers that we nurture. So ,
um, being a lifelong learner,I've been in different
mastermind groups, works , youknow, chamber, and, you know,
different things in my localcommunity. Um, and then along
(04:13):
the way , um, I, I love what Ido, but I'm not gonna say I was
bored, but I felt like I was ata place in my career where I
could add value for otherpeople instead of just
developing schools on my own.
And so, along the way, I metKathy Lagan , who's our CEO and
President at Hinge Advisors.
And just the timing was perfectthat , um, my team was fully in
(04:37):
place. This is before Covid notsaying it's fully in place now
because we're all having ourlittle bumps, which is what I'm
here to talk about today. Um,but I joined Hinge started as
client relations. My positionnow is on the business
development team. And so atHinge, we sell schools, and
ultimately, hardly any ownersstart out, you know, opening
(04:58):
day. They're excited aboutcurriculum and, and s you know,
what are the, what's the foodthey're serving and how are
they developing children'sminds? They don't think about
how they're going to exit, andone day everyone exits. So the
thing we do at Hinge is helpyou, whatever stage you're in,
we're going to help you developyour business. So it's better.
(05:19):
And that just resonated with meso much. And so the bulk of
what I do is, along with clientrelations and working with ,
um, owners when they're readyto exit, I also develop
curriculum. So , um, anyway,that's, you know, that's the,
that's the short version, eventhough it took me a while to
say it.
Speaker 3 (05:38):
You've, you really have done,done it all. So
Speaker 4 (05:45):
I'm still trying to find more to do.
Speaker 3 (05:47):
It's , I believe that
shift to today. Um, creativeleadership and assessments to
train childcare center staff.
And a word you use when talkingabout this topic is
gamification. Can, what, whatdoes that mean?
Speaker 4 (06:05):
I love that word.
Mm-Hmm . And almost no oneknows it, but anyone that uses
their computer or plays withvideo games, that's what it's,
it's, it's how can you achieveand help your brain develop
better and faster by making itfun? It's what we do as early
childhood educators every day,all day, we do fun things to
teach children scissor skills.
(06:26):
You know, take a bite, take abite, take a bite, pretend
they're a crocodile with theirscissors, for example,
everything we do is hands-onand play-based, or, you know,
we, it should be, or we try tohave it that way. Why wouldn't
we do that with our staff? Andso gamification is just a , a
kind of a fancy word to say,how can I make my teaching more
(06:49):
interesting so that my learnersactually retain the
information. And so much inearly childhood is creating
habits. For example, handwashing or diapering, there's
certain exact ways. Cleaning ,um, that's another really good
one. Certain specific ways oneshould complete tasks. And, you
know, that's what I love aboutearly childhood. It's an art
(07:12):
and a science. The science is,there's a certain way to do
things in some, in some cases,and then sometimes there's not,
you know, how you teachchildren different concepts in
art or , um, you know,different developmental
concepts could be varied, buthow you diaper should be pretty
on track and, and in , uh, youknow, habitual.
Speaker 3 (07:35):
So big picture, we're talking gamification.
Let's tie that into Gen Z,which you know a lot about. And
if anybody missed the podcastKathy did with us on Gen Z, I'm
gonna put a link to it in theshow notes, because it's one
you definitely wanna check out.
Um, these are the childcarecenter employees who came of
age during the pandemic and who, who can really benefit from a
(07:58):
reward system that comes fromgamification. So Kathy , can
you talk us through that alittle bit?
Speaker 4 (08:04):
Yes, absolutely. So you're right. Gen Z came of age
during the pandemic, and I havea big soft spot for them. Um,
sometimes we all get a littleirritated, but when we think
about, typically right nowthey're between maybe age 12 to
25 or 26. And the ones Iparticularly like to talk about
are the ones we hire. So the 18to, it might be 24 to 26 year
(08:28):
olds. The key to remember onthis also is that if we can't
figure out how to work withthem, we're going to have
trouble working with theirparents because this generation
are the mommies and daddiesnow. So , um, just like every
generation thinks they knowmore than the one before Gen Z,
really , um, they had a , atraumatic growing up those
(08:51):
years. So think about all thethings they lost. You know,
they missed graduations, theirhigh school, college, law
school, grad school, medicalschool, all of it was very
different than the norm. Um,and so in general, the Gen Z ,
um, they, you know, they aspireto be the next TikTok star, or
they wanna have an Amazonstore, or they want to create
(09:15):
on Etsy and, you know, makemillions of dollars. Um, and
part of it is they're veryfamily oriented and value what
their moms and dads tell them.
So they've been told, similarto the, the , um, what boomers
did with millennials, you cando anything. Mm-Hmm . Well, yes
and no. You can do anything,but usually an older generation
(09:36):
wants the younger one to dobetter and better than them .
Um, and you can do anything,but they , um, they're not
necessarily patient and willingto put the time in. And so in
the early childhood field, whenwe're bringing staff in, it's a
challenge. There's so manyrules and regulations that we
have to follow and to get, youknow, a generation Z or it
(10:00):
doesn't really matter.
Different people want to complywith certain rules, and then
others think I know better thanyou. And so for a Gen Z, making
it as fun as possible, and thatdoesn't just pertain to Gen Z,
it's any generation , um,making something fun, anything
tedious, you know , there'sdifferent ways we learn. So
anything tedious , um, is , uh,more , uh, manageable if it's
(10:24):
fun. So, and think about this,we compete against retail, the
fast food we compete againstAmazon workers. You know, we
have like a Amazon warehousenear, near here. Mm-Hmm ,
warehouse, you know, $25 anhour. That's more of a director
salary and my area. And so whenwe have to compete, we wanna
(10:48):
make sure our environments arebeautiful environments, and
it's a really fun place to cometo work. So the first thing I
would say is asking anygeneration what they're
interested in doing. Are theyinterested in , um, growing and
learning? Are they interestedin sort of team building
activities? Do they want to, Ido this at interviews in the be
(11:08):
, uh, during an interview, Isay something like this , um,
Leah , I am so excited to haveyou join my company. It's
called Bright Beginnings. Um, Ihope you're with us a very long
time, but I want you to leaveus better than you are today.
Whether that means you've gotnew friends, you've developed
certain skills, you have becomemore educated, we'd love to
(11:30):
offer you to get a CDA whenyou're with us, and so on. And
so, I always set the stage thatI care about them and their
growth and development. Andthat just filters right into
the fact is there's a lot tolearn. So asking them, what do
you wanna learn from the get go? And then helping customize it
is really important. Let'sthink about what types of
(11:53):
learners we have. And so thelearners, and just think about
this. If you're at a ProCaretraining or you're at any type
of , um, training your boss oryour company wants you to go
to, are you visual? And so ,uh, a lot of the Gen Z, for
example, would be very visual.
Think about what they didduring Covid. They're on their
(12:13):
laptops, they're on theirphones. Mm-Hmm.
they're up in the bedroom.
They're listening to the momand dad downstairs, try to
figure out who's going to worktoday. Are we both going to
work? Oh, what abouthomeschooling the younger
brother or sister? And sothey're learning visually. Um,
so with a Gen Z or , or manygenerations that are visual
(12:33):
learners, creating videos isgreat, but you know, what's
better? Having them create thevideos?
Speaker 3 (12:41):
Oh, that's a great idea.
Speaker 4 (12:43):
So fun. Yeah . So, you know, taking the doll in
the classroom and, you know,giving a , giving gamifying it
, you know, I'm gonna giveeverybody 15 minutes. I did
this not too long ago at astaff meeting. Everybody has 15
minutes. Team up with a partnerand ready, set. Go create a
video of something. And youcould give topics like how to
change a diaper, how toproperly wash hands, how to get
(13:06):
kiddos to move from one spaceto another space. I had , I had
had to greet parents and I, itwas hilarious. One staff member
was the mommy dragging the kidin with other staff member
you know, they just had so muchfun. And the concept of how to
agree to parententhusiastically eye contact
using their name, you know ,um, with good energy hit home
(13:30):
for everybody because we roleplayed it. You could have the
auditory learners, and so theywanna listen to a podcast.
That's what we're doing rightnow. We're just, you know, you
could be on your walk gettingyour steps in listening to, you
know, a podcast. I like thekinesthetic learners because
that's the hands-on. And so Idid this recently, got a bunch
(13:50):
of materials, flour and saltand, you know, food coloring.
And , um, let's see, it wasbaby powder. Um, different
lotions, dawn detergent, andgave recipes. They created
videos of how do you makebubbles? Um, how do you make
bubbles? The trick on bubbles,most teachers know this dawn
detergent and a little bit ofglycerin. And so giving them ,
(14:15):
um, recipes like that, nowthey're gonna remember. And
then when they have that momentin the classroom with the
children that , that they needsomething to do those over and
over activities I call them, orthings you need to do, you just
need to pull outta your bag oftricks, you know ? Mm-Hmm .
to do that. Or they know how tomake cloud dough or Kool-Aid
(14:35):
Play-Doh. And so providing, andso that is fantastic for a
kinesthetic learner. There'smultiple other learners. The
other one I'll highlight wouldbe, if you're a musical
learner, you're probably prettygood with math . So I'm not ,
and I'm not , but Learnerpreschool teachers are, think
about back in the day , um,five little Ducks went out one
(14:57):
day over the field and faraway, you know, talking about
counting or when you teach ,um, teachers about chanting ,
um, either recipes or chanting,you know, they can create their
own little rap about diaperchanging or about lining up in
the hall. Or I had a teacherthat was excellent. Um, she
(15:17):
just moved away. Uh, but shehad been in the army, so she
created all the cadences whenthe kiddos lined up. Wow . I
mean , I was a TV show, it wasreally cute . Cute . So
musical. I could go on and on,but I know you have more
questions for me,
Speaker 3 (15:33):
I'm just picturing it. I wanna see the video of
the, the woman from the Armywith the little people that
Speaker 4 (15:38):
So cute. Yeah . And I thought , that is really
cool. Oh my gosh. Because , andshe had that, you know, voice,
that deep voice and, you know,rhythmic cadence for those
kiddos. And it wasn't like theywere in the army and they had
to line up a certain way. Itwas very fun.
Speaker 3 (15:54):
Oh, that's great.
Okay, so let's talk compliancechecklists. Oh, I'm sorry. You
know what, let me switch, letme switch the order on that.
Let's unpack this a little bitmore. Can you, can you give us
some tips for gamifyingcompliance assessments? Am I
understanding it correctly thatthat's tying routine checks and
(16:16):
observations to rewards?
Speaker 4 (16:19):
So you can do it however you want. And , um, if
I confuse anyone , because Iget all enthusiastic and I talk
kind of fast,
can talk you through whatyou're trying to do. Okay . So
it depends what you're tryingto do. Okay . So , um, and
remember I said the reason Igot into hinge years ago, 2017,
everything was going so well atmy schools before Covid. Mm-Hmm
(16:42):
.
been with me for many years.
Everything, you know, I , Ifelt like I didn't wanna grow
the school. I wanted to dosomething different. I wanted
to add value back to theindustry. And so, but then
Covid hit my executive directorafter 18 years left to start
our own school, which we'lltalk about that in a minute,
because she is one of my secretshoppers now when we get to
(17:05):
secret shopping. Okay. Um ,because, you know, maintaining
good relationships with yourformer staff is a really good
idea, if at all possible.
Mm-Hmm,
anyway , so , um, it dependswhat your goal is. So if you've
got a team that is , you know,really , um, you should have me
on for the stages of teaming,because I think I might have
(17:27):
talked about that. Maybe not toyou guys though , um, stages of
a team, if, if it's a lot ofnew staff or a lot of staff
that are different generationsthat need to work on gelling as
a team, it , that's somethingdifferent than the majority. So
that would be more of a teamingstrategy. But if you just need
(17:48):
compliance on the basics, then,you know, there's certain
things we can't be flexibleabout. We have to wash hands,
we have to serve food at acertain time. We have to
provide certain curriculum.
Infant room is even much morecomplicated. So when I say
scorecards, or when I say KPIs,it really depends on where your
(18:08):
school is. So knowing whereyour program is, what are the
strengths? Of course, you know,you know that from licensing,
you know that from your parentreviews, that you know that
from your enrollment, you know,from your staff turnover. All
of those things are indicationsof possibly indications of
quality. And I would reallycall it opportunity, a growth
(18:29):
opportunities. Um, so when youhave a , a weaker staff, a
staff that maybe they're GenZs, think about the Gen Zs
again, and not just Gen Zs,kind of anyone after Covid.
Yeah . The Gen Zs didn't have afirst job like everybody else
did . So they're at home. Theydidn't get to go be a lifeguard
in the summer 'cause they werestuck at home, or they didn't
(18:52):
get to do the afterschool job.
So not only are we trainingthem on 580 regs in Virginia,
at least , um, we're teachingthem work ethic, commitment,
follow through , you know, yourteam needs you, all of that. So
if you're at that basic level ,um, room observations, of
(19:14):
course, secret shopping isn'tquite as good for that secret.
Shopping's better for like,enrollment culture. How does
the school look, smell, feel,all of that. But compliance, it
is like a scorecard. I docamera observations and you
know, obviously you are ,you've already done some online
(19:34):
assessments, you've done all ofyour trainings. So it really
depends on what your goal is.
So for the basic level, afteryou've trained your staff, then
I like to, I like to make itreally fun and either team
oriented. So all the teachersin the baby room, you know, are
working towards, you know,always hand washing before and
(19:56):
after every diapering andalways doing all the bleach
water and soapy water and soon. Mm-Hmm.
so a great way to do that wouldbe a camera observation. If
you're working on culture withyour staff, a camera
observation isn't as good aswalking in and assessing like a
secret shopper might do. Um, ifyou're the owner and you go to
(20:17):
your school, and people alwayslaugh. They say they see my car
pull up and you know, they, youknow, jump, you know, get , you
know, get, you know, they hopto it. Yeah . They , um, they
know, oh, and then, you know,walkie talkie, Kathy's here,
Kathy's here. That's notreally, I mean, that's great
that they're respectful, butthat you don't really want
that. You really want them tojust do it naturally and in a
(20:41):
habitual way. I don't know if Ianswered the question. I kind
of went off a little bit on a ,a big picture .
Speaker 3 (20:48):
No ,
anything else you wanted totalk, like compliance
checklists or did we kind ofhit, did we cover all the
bases? Was there anything elseyou wanted to, wanted to
discuss? Well,
Speaker 4 (21:00):
So the first thing would be get, figure out what
your goal is. And then thesecond thing is get buy-in.
Make sure that your team knowswhat you're trying to do. Okay.
Um, and then, you know, there'sall kinds of compliance, but if
you're doing general compliance, um, I like to do scorecards,
(21:20):
or I like to do, have thedirectors, you know, regularly
in classrooms looking at whatyou're working on. So you could
have people with differentgoals in the same classroom.
Mm-Hmm .
locations having differentgoals. So that's like in
general , um, the way you couldtrack. And then you , we didn't
(21:40):
really talk about, well , letme just , um, again, if you,
you know, the purpose and thenthis is how I would break down
compliance. I would start withthe most important thing is
your safety and compliance. Sothat would be your diapering,
your hand washing , maintainingyour ratios, having children in
the appropriate age groupsrather than moving them around
the building, which sometimeswe have to do. And then in
(22:03):
infant rooms, you'd wanna makesure you're documenting the
eating, the sleeping, thediaper, the tummy time, and so
on. So once you've got that,that's like base safety, then
you could go to how are weinteracting with the children?
We're , you know, honestly, Ithink that's the most
important, but I can't , uh, Ican't put that before safety.
So second is nurturing andteacher interactions with the
(22:28):
children, and that would alsoinclude your great curriculum
the next . So you could beassessing all of that. And so
I'd probably have a separatechecklist for those things.
Again, you're customizing itthe way your school needs it or
your team needs it. You coulduse your parents' surveys. Um ,
you could use your exitinterviews with staff or
(22:49):
parents to know, oh, here'ssome gaps we have. And then I
would look , um, after that Iwould look at your own
policies. So one of my policiesis cell phones . It drives me
crazy. I'm terrified someone'seyes will be off the kiddos and
there'll be an accident. Sothat would be one I kind of am
pretty strict about, actuallyvery strict. One I've let go of
(23:13):
is dress code. I personallythink there should be a
particular dress code, butespecially with the Gen Z, I
used to be like, all aboutpiercings. I had to let go of
piercings. You know, I, I, Iexplained it that, and I'm a
boomer, so, you know, there'sthat , um, I explained it that
(23:33):
children, you are , you , youare the child's role model when
they're at school all day. Andhonestly, they're at school
with us more than they're athome with mommy and daddy. So
when you have , uh, piercing inyour nose, of course they wanna
be like Miss Leah
just had to let go of that.
Same thing with tattoos. Iwould ju I would justify
(23:56):
tattoos and I would explain,well, you know, I'm afraid the
children will wanna model afteryou and take that ink pen or
that permanent marker and drawa robot on them or whatever
they like. I had to let go ofthat. Um, but what are your
policies that you don't wannalet go of?
Speaker 3 (24:11):
Mm-Hmm.
Speaker 4 (24:13):
I'm like a little nitpickyabout making sure the children,
especially the babies, all thekids, but babies get a buggy
ride because we know from allthe science, if they're
outside, it's the five sensesand their eyes develop when you
point out the bird and, and soon. And so you can look at, you
(24:33):
know, schedules and do , um, docompliance on schedules as
well.
Speaker 3 (24:39):
Oh, very cool. I was just thinking to my , um, to my
son's daycare and all that ,there are a lot of the Gen Z
tattoos, nose piercings, and I,I'd never even thought about
it. I was just so, so used toit. So
the norm to kind of let thatpart go.
Speaker 4 (24:56):
Yeah . And you tolerate it because you're used
to it now. And that's me too. Imean, honestly, does that
really matter? If they arewonderful with children, it
doesn't matter. And I knowthat, but I, you know, I feel
like my brand is a certainbrand, and I think most owners
feel that way. Um, and so it's,it's totally fine. You know,
what I don't want is a teacherto not be nurturing and kind
(25:20):
and, you know, and welcoming toyou as a mommy and so on.
Speaker 3 (25:24):
Yeah. So you touched on this a little bit before the
camera observations. And thisis part of your, your creative
leadership plan, right? And sohow, how does that work? How do
you, how do you do thatsuccessfully?
Speaker 4 (25:40):
It's not always successful. Okay. Um , it's
nuanced. Um, and so it's hardto hear. You are not doing
something well in a job, right?
Yeah . I mean, that hurts .
It's just like your high schoolteacher, like giving you
whatever in algebra, you know?
Yeah . D or a d. And so it,it's, it needs to be sensitive
and nuanced, but once you, youknow, work with a team that,
(26:03):
hey, we need to get betterabout X, Y, or Z, one thing we
can do that'll be really fun.
And that's why you gamify it.
You, you know, it's sort of thesticker, the carrot. The carrot
is the fun part. And so what Idid was , um, it's like
threefold decided what weneeded to evaluate. And so we
started just with basiclicensing compliance in one of
(26:25):
the schools. I had a lot of newpeople. Some of the staff
weren't taking some thingsseriously, you know, hand
washing , for example, can'tlet that one go. Um, and, and
so I had someone offsiteobserve on the cameras pretty
much throughout the day andscore the room, the teachers
just on the basics. So we didan overwhelm with all the regs
(26:48):
and all my policies. We weren'tlooking at dress code or
piercings,
cell phone . We were looking,but we were mostly looking at
the safety piece. So, and thenyou can go and build on that to
the next, you know, what's thenurturing, like, what's the
curriculum like? And then youcan go to, you know, are they
following the policies? Andthen you can go to, you know,
(27:10):
you can just go as deep as youwant. So starting, starting
like that. And so I only had mygallon , so I hired, actually
moved a director that was athome with children, but former
director for me. So she knewexactly how I would wanna speak
to teachers, exactly what tolook for. And then she would
also be able to givesuggestions. You had trouble
(27:33):
doing X, Y, Z, here's asuggestion, or here's the link
to , um, or just copied andpasted the policy in the , um,
the ops manual and so on. Andso if there was something like
a room was out of ratio, aparent dropped off and the
teacher didn't say, do you mindwaiting a couple minutes, Leah
(27:53):
till Ms . Barbara gets in? Um,if she didn't do what she
should have done, then shewould quickly call or text the
director and say, such and suchroom, you know, needs help. So
we had even go that level. Um,because, you know, if you don't
have the base and you wannacatch everyone in the beginning
of their work with you, nothave to , um, redo bad habits,
(28:18):
you want to , um, catch themright away so they know. And
it's not like bad teacher. It'smore like, oops, here's another
way we could have handled this.
And it's not perfect. Andthat's, that's , um, so some of
the negative feedback I gotwas, oh, big brother's watching
me. Mm-Hmm .
And so you have to build in thepositives too . And you have to
(28:41):
text the director and say,fantastic project. Oh my gosh,
the way so and so moved thechildren from the classroom to
outside. And keeping them alltogether was fantastic today. I
mean, I would almost say liketwo or three times more
positive than corrective. Wealso ask the teachers, how do
you want feedback? That's superimportant. Mm-Hmm ,
(29:04):
just like anyone. And so if ,uh, but if I can learn and
watch the camera, there's maybethere's a bite in the
classroom, there's a , youknow, you get these little
biters that, you know, they gothrough a stage. And so for the
teachers, you know, what's theroom set up ? Like, what were ,
what was happening right beforethe bite is, you know, is the
(29:27):
child hungry? Is the childtired? You know, and so on. Um,
so really watching and lettingthem see the video is helpful.
Um, some people, many of ourstaff did not wanna interrupt
their brain and the flow oftheir day. They would rather
hear at the end of the day, andthey would rather have their
(29:48):
director tell them , or theywould rather just an in general
at a staff meeting, here's theclassrooms that, you know,
scored really high. Here's whatthey're doing really well,
here's the reminders and callit a day like that. You really
have to be sensitive on this.
It works great, but you'vegotta be sensitive. Now, quite
a few people, I , the people Iknow that do this , um, score
(30:09):
and do really nice bonuses,either financial bonuses, gift
cards, you could do like kudos, um, in your staff newsletter,
you can, you know , talk toparents. You can have their
name tags with a bunch oflittle, like I have my, one of
my logos is the sunshine andthen birds . And so you could
have, I don't do this, but Icould , um, have a bunch of
(30:31):
little sons for, you know, forthey did the best on on
observations. You have to haveobservations , um, in person as
well. That's actually moreimportant. But a camera
observation is something thatdoes work if you are very
careful about it. And thenbefore I do a camera
observation, I'm going to findout what their , um, language
(30:54):
of appreciation is . This is sofunny. Um, once in a while you
ask someone what their languageof appreciation is without
explaining what it means, whichmost of us in the industry know
it's based on a book. Um, andthere's five ways that people
prefer being appreciated inearly childhood. Typically,
(31:15):
it's , um, words ofappreciation were , uh, like
affirmation acts of s Soaffirmation, oh my gosh,
amazing job doing thatpainting, art project, you
know, yesterday, or I love myday , how you did my day with
the tires . Um, the next onethat people like is acts of
service. So the rooms are mets,all the goldfish crackers are
(31:38):
all over the floor. And youcome in with the broom and the
dust pan and you help clean up.
That's an act of service.
Another one is quality time.
Everyone always wants to talkto the director. And the
director's always too busy andit hurts people's feelings. And
the director thinks, don't youknow, I have to do my job. Um,
so quality time, then gifts. SoI hit gifts early on this, but
(32:03):
sometimes these other thingsare more important. And then
the last one is like, touch ahigh five, a hug, a pat on the
back, that type of thing. So ifyou know that and you do your
camera observations and thenyou know how they want to
receive feedback, it goes muchbetter.
Speaker 3 (32:20):
Okay. That's a really good, you ask my
question
Speaker 4 (32:23):
And I talk for 20 minutes.
Speaker 3 (32:25):
Sorry's my favorite part of these podcasts. Like
seeing where they go and hear .
Yeah. Hearing everything youhave to say. It's, it's great.
So the most important part ofany game scoring
. So let's say, okay, so let'ssay you're a center director,
you've gone full intogamification for assessments.
(32:45):
How do you keep score?
Speaker 4 (32:48):
So depending on what your goal is, uhhuh , um, I
keep the score. So you wannastart slowly. So I started with
scoring just five or six items,and I started with sa the
safety one. Um, now we'reworking on, and different,
different classrooms, were atdifferent levels, but if
(33:09):
they're at a higher level, thenthey're scoring, like one of my
, for instance for my directorswas I want everyone to take
this leadership class online.
It's fantastic. It was free.
This one, I had them do. Andthe first person to finish is
gonna get a hundred dollars .
Well, you know, and that's notscoring. That's like, show me
(33:29):
you've completed it. Show methat you care about leadership.
Show me. And I think two peoplekind of tied, so two people Got
it. So that's an easy scorewhere it's tied to a quick
reward. Mm-Hmm.
Speaker 3 (33:41):
Speaker 4 (33:41):
Other scoring is just someone watching and
observing. Um, of course,everyone I'm sure, you know,
listening to this has some typeof compliance checklist.
Whether it's one that's fun todo is the figure eight where
you go through your wholebuilding twice a day. Mm-Hmm .
parking lot in your trash can .
(34:02):
And you know your flowers thatyou know aren't dead. Hopefully
great care of kids, but wecan't like weed our flowers.
Mm-Hmm .
in a particular way with afacility checklist, and you can
score that. And then the end ofthe day, someone different goes
in a different directionthrough the building, and you
compare the checklist and youcan score that. Um, so that's
(34:27):
one easy way. The cameraobservations, as I said, you
can score higher the things youreally care about most. So,
Mm-Hmm .
maybe not scored at all versus,you know, the safety. The
safety for instance. Um, andthen I was working with a group
(34:48):
in New Jersey a couple yearsago, and they were scoring with
a bingo card. So they did a biggiant bingo card in the
kitchen. And every time people,you know, so like Bingo,
B-I-N-G-O, so, but they didwhatever acronym they needed.
So it's like hand washingdiapering, you know , um, all
day notes completed, you know,the, the ProCare engage type
(35:10):
thing. All that's completed byeverybody. And you score and
you can work towards a groupgoal that way. I like that a
lot. I do too . Um , I just dida kudos jar a couple weeks ago
at one of my schools. Everybodyis sort of a little down on
out. People were on vacation,we had subs. I just went in and
I thought, ah , we just needto, you know, perk everybody up
(35:32):
a little bit. And so we talkedabout teaming and the stages of
teaming and how it is .
Remember how I said like, Leah, we're so excited. You're at
bright beginnings. Hope you'rehere for a really long time.
The other thing I say atinterviews is, here's what
you're gonna do. You are goingto come in and as much as we're
excited that you're our newtoddler teacher, Leah , so
excited, you're gonna irritatesomebody, you're gonna make a
(35:55):
mistake. You are going to cometo work late accidentally. And
you are gonna get a littlepushback. They are going to
drive you insane becausethey're gonna gossip. Hopefully
not, but you know, or they'regoing to , um, you know,
irritate you in some way.
That's the storming part of, ofteaming. You start and it's a
(36:16):
honeymoon stage, and then youget to kinda like when you date
your husband or yoursignificant other, it's all
good until it's not. And you'vegotta get through that storming
stage. If you teach your newcandidates from the beginning,
this isn't all rosy. It's superfun, but it's not perfect. And
you say to your staff, Hey, nowLeah's joining us. She is going
(36:38):
to be the new toddler teacher.
You know, let's, you know,let's give her a lot of grace.
Let's everybody who's going tobe her mentor, everybody, you
know, let's help Leah , youknow, through any storms we
have. And then we get to , um,normalizing. Norming is the
third stage. Only after you alldo that, can you get to perform
and that's what you're lookingfor. But if you are saying to
(37:00):
staff, this is what we're goingthrough. So that's what was
going on with this team I hadat one of my schools. And so
they were storming a littlebit, you know, people were
coming in late, you know, oh,110 degrees in July in
Charlottesville. And so theywere frustrated. So we just
talked about teaming, we talkedabout the stages, we talked
about who we still needed tohire, what positions we needed.
(37:23):
We talked about enrollment.
Really, they were doing greatwith all their licensing and
compliance. So it really wasmore the , um, the, the people
part. And so we went around andsaid what , um, what everyone
liked about a particular personand got this big jar and got
these really cute littlepapers. And so for the next
(37:45):
week, everyone did. Iencouraged them. Let's do , um,
a kudos jar. And so I startedthat night and I wrote, and ,
and some of them were, youknow, like you came in, you
know, when you really didn'tfeel well, you had a migraine,
you took your migraine medicineand you came in. Kudos to,
So-and-So put it in the jar.
And so then we went around,everybody did that. And then I
(38:07):
made a point to show the kudosdoesn't have to be about the
kids. It doesn't have to beabout, you know, any one
particular thing. I'm trying towork on them understanding and
appreciating each other. So Idid a kudos for Bonnie. She is
a TA afternoon. She does, shecomes in and does , um, baby
breaks and then , uh, closes inthe afternoon. She's the
(38:31):
world's best cleaner. In fact,she used to be a housekeeper.
Mm-Hmm .
I had no idea that theattachment on this certain
vacuum would clean theupholstery in the lobby. Kudos
to Bonnie for cleaning ouryellow chairs. And so, and then
I said , um, I'm giving you twokudos. And gave her another
(38:51):
one. And so that started thepositivity. And so then the
next week at the meeting,'cause I'm not at all the
meetings, I have directors andexec people, but I do like to
when I am in town. And so thenext week we dumped out the
kudos jar. We also asked theparents to do it too, which was
really sweet. And so we readevery kudos. And the person
(39:15):
that got the most got to pickup prize out of the grab grab
bag . And I think I gave likethe top three people got to
have a prize.
Speaker 3 (39:23):
Oh, I love that.
It's, it is just so rewarding.
Just those little, yeah. Like alittle thing. Like, not like
you did this big huge,wonderful thing, right , like
this Yeah. To to feelrecognized though. Yeah .
Speaker 4 (39:35):
Yeah, yeah . Just the little things. Yeah . And
so that has developed yourculture, I think.
Speaker 3 (39:40):
Yeah. Okay. And I, I have to know more about these
secret shoppers. Um , okay .
How does this , how does thiswork? And that you have such a
good relationship with a formeremployee that, that she's doing
that for you. That's, thatalone is pretty incredible.
Speaker 4 (39:55):
I'm gonna tell her to listen to this podcast. Her
name is PJ and I love her somuch. Um, she worked with me
for 18 years. So fun . Shestarted out, she had her own
in-home childcare , and thenshe started out as my copy girl
. Like she would go and copystuff on the copier. I quickly
realized she was way, way morequalified than make , you know,
being a office assistant. Soshe ended up working her way
(40:18):
from director to exec director.
And so now whenever I needfresh eyes or because I worked
so closely with her, she knowsme. She knows exactly what I
want. And she also helpeddevelop our policies. Mm-Hmm .
I would just encouragelisteners to give them a second
chance to come back or see ifyou can find something else for
(40:42):
them to do that is still withintheir skillset . She won't come
back full-time because she hasa big school of her own. Um, we
don't compete with each other.
She's far enough away. But boydoes she really like it when I
call and say, I need your help.
I need to pick your brain. Andso she'll just go into all of
my schools spot check, do, andshe'll do. We have a licensing
(41:05):
checklist, a facility matrix.
We have a curriculum check, astaff check. We have paperwork
checks, all, you know, all thematrixes. And again, I'm happy
to share if someone wantssample ones. Um, I know you
guys have so much stuff too.
Um, but she'll come in, shehas, you know, key code. She
just comes in and gives anassessment. And her goal, at
(41:29):
first when she did it, youknow, she got sort of rolled
eyes and now what, you know,now we're , we just got through
the camera observations, nowwe're having somebody in
person. But that fresh eyesmatters a lot. The director
misses it, or the director hasa different relationship with
the staff. Mm-Hmm . When I goin , uh, they, you know , you
(41:50):
know, they perform , uh, whensomebody different comes in,
unexpected, it's, it's likelicensing actually. She kind of
simulates licensing for them.
And so that works great. Andthen she'll call me or she'll
do an email report and calland, you know, and she catches
things way before , um, youknow, right away. So we don't
(42:13):
let something fester. You know,at first one of the schools she
would go in and, you know, shewas greeted with , um, it was
actually quite a couple of thestaff were from other
countries, so, you know ,there's that culture piece too.
Um, they were, English is asecond language, so they were
really intimidated. She comesin, you know, with her little
(42:33):
clipboard, kind of likelicensing, and they were
intimidated. So it took a whilefor the , for them to warm up.
I don't really want them to befriendly. I want her to come in
with really fresh eyes. So thatgoes, that works great. There's
, um, a couple national , um,secret shoppers. One thing I
haven't done, and I don't thinkmy schools would do great at, I
(42:56):
don't know , um, is answeringphones. You can secret shop.
Um, and what I'd say is ifyou're in a mastermind group or
your friends with othercompetitors in, you know,
different areas of the country,secret shop for each other on
the phone, that works reallygreat. Um, did they answer
within three rings? I don'twant my teachers to answer the
(43:17):
phone if children are crying inthe background or if they're
attending to a child. So ofcourse our voicemail says, you
know, thank you for calling. If, um, you know, we can't wait
to talk to you. If you aregetting a voice message , uh,
it's because we're working withthe children right now, we'll
call you back. You know, thattype of thing. But secret
shopping phone is also reallygood.
Speaker 3 (43:40):
Yeah. Yeah. It's , I mean that's a lot of times
probably people's firstinteraction, right? With the
center, just calling to ahundred set up a tour or
something like that. Mm-Hmm.
Speaker 4 (43:52):
Yeah, exactly.
Speaker 3 (43:54):
All right . Kathy , this has been really great. Is
there anything that I didn'task you and I should have or
that, that you think peopleshould know about gamification,
about assessments, aboutchecklists?
Speaker 4 (44:05):
Um , I'm sure there is Leah , let's see, I've gotta
look at my notes briefly . Um,well, the , on the secret
shopping , uh, that is, ifyou've got a former staff
member, I would encourage youto maybe reach out to them on
that. It's also really goodsecret shop or Secret Shop
phone calls , um, like anat-home parent that , um, you
(44:28):
know, wants to do a couplemornings a week, just pop into
your schools and just, you know, um, get in the car after the,
after the visit and just takesome notes and shoot it off to
the director. Um, you know, I ,I pay, you know, I, I don't
know, 50 to a hundred dollarsfor a , a good secret shop per
time. Um, you're gonna catch somuch that way. Um , you could
(44:50):
also, if you have parentambassadors or raving fans at
your school, you could offer atuition discount or pay them to
do it for one of your otherlocations. Could also secret
shop your competitors guys.
That's a really good one. Youknow, what does Brighton shiny
down the street doing that I'mnot. So that would be something
(45:13):
else I would suggest.
Speaker 3 (45:14):
Oh , that's great.
Well, Kathy , thank you so muchfor coming. Could you , um, let
our listeners know how theycould , um, reach out to you to
learn more about the work youdo? Uh , either website or
social media, anything?
Speaker 4 (45:28):
Well, if you're interested in Bright
Beginnings, it's BrightBeginnings va, like Virginia
Bright Beginnings va.com. Uh,and then we've got some really
nice Facebook pages as well.
Bright Beginnings,Charlottesville. And then I, I
have several other Facebookpages relating to our locations
here. And then if you'reinterested about Hinge, either
me speaking for your groups orknowing where I'll be speaking
(45:51):
next , um, it would be my emailis K petal , PET like Tom,
CHEL, at hinge advisors.com .
And of course, hingeadvisors.com is our website.
Um, and I, I love to talk shop,so happy to answer emails or
connect with listeners.
Speaker 3 (46:11):
Well, Kathy , thank you again. Thank you to
everybody who took the time tolisten to this podcast. Um, we
at ProCare Solutions do wannasay thank you to everybody in
ECE and childcare for theimportant work that you're
doing every day . We are happyto support you and we hope you
are, continue to enjoy thispodcast and let your friends,
family, parents, staff,everybody know about it, all
(46:34):
the, all the good resources wehave. Have a great day,
everyone. Thank you.
Speaker 4 (46:39):
Thanks, Leo .
Speaker 1 (46:42):
Thank you for listening to this episode of
the Childcare Business Podcast.
To get more insights on ways tosucceed in your childcare
business, make sure to hitsubscribe in your podcast app
so you never miss an episode.
And if you want even morechildcare , business tips ,
tricks, and strategies, headover to our resource
center@procaresoftware.com.
(47:03):
Until next time.
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