November 21, 2023 • 40 mins
The CopDoc Podcast - Season 6 - Episode 116
Have you ever wondered how the intricate world of social media and public relations intertwine with law enforcement? Let’s unravel this with guest, Katie Nelson, from the Mountain View California Police Department. Katie moved from a career in journalism to managing social media and PR for the police force. She navigates the digital landscape of Silicon Valley, keeping accurate, timely communication with the community and efficiently managing the risks of online posting.
Our discussions took us on a journey into Katie's transition from journalism to policing. Her tales from her ride-along with a Narc unit, witnessing a friend and fellow officer wounded in the line of duty, and investigating the Speed Freak Killers. We delved into the crucial role of home security footage in police work and the unexpected challenges it can pose.
The conversation turned toward the future of law enforcement as we explored the implications of artificial intelligence. Katie shared some fascinating insights about the potential pitfalls of AI and how Mountain View PD is approaching this emergent technology. If you're curious about the intersection of social media, public relations, and law enforcement, this episode is a must-listen. It's not just about the nitty-gritty of police work, but also about the humanity behind the badge.
Contact us: copdoc.podcast@gmail.com
Website: www.copdocpodcast.com
If you'd like to arrange for facilitated training, or consulting, or talk about steps you might take to improve your leadership and help in your quest for promotion, contact Steve at stephen.morreale@gmail.com
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Intro (00:03):
Welcome to the Cop Doc podcast.
This podcast explores policeleadership issues and innovative
ideas.
The cop doc shares thoughts andideas as he talks with leaders
in policing communities,academia and other government
agencies.
And now please join Dr SteveMorreale and industry thought
(00:25):
leaders as they share theirinsights and experience.
Welcome to The CopD oc PpodcastPodcast
Steve Morreale (00:34):
Hello again everybody.
Steve Morreale, coming to youfrom Boston and you're listening
to the cop doc podcast.
Today we are again bi-coastal aconversation.
On the other end of the line isKatie Nelson and she's in
California right now.
Hello, Katie.
Katie Nelson (00:47):
Hi, how are you?
Steve Morreale (00:48):
I'm great.
So it's in the afternoon there,just pressing noontime.
It's three out here on the eastcoast and I came upon you
because of the things thatyou're writing Very, very
interesting things that you'rewriting using social media, and
ironically, you are the socialmedia and public relations
coordinator for Mountain View,California Police Department.
So you're a California girl.
Katie Nelson (01:07):
Yes, through and through.
Steve Morreale (01:08):
Okay, that's good.
So let's talk about how youended up in a police department,
when this probably was not onyour mind, but talk about going
to college and the kind ofreporting that you were doing
and tell the audience about that.
Katie Nelson (01:21):
At a very early age I realized I like to tell
stories and so I went to collegeand from Orange County
originally and did a complete180 and went to University of
California at Berkeley for threeyears and fell in love with
journalism and ended up out inwine country, which out here in
California is basically the Napaarea and decided.
(01:44):
Napa, sonoma area, this town ofLodi and then the city of
Stockton, which is where I wasbased and was brought in at 22
to be the wine business reporterand I wanted to cover higher
education.
I came from that environment sothat's what I was comfortable
with.
Had no idea about wine countrywine business, anything like
that.
I wasn't a wine drinker at thetime.
(02:05):
And about three months into mystint out there, my editor calls
me in and he says you're goingto be the new cops and courts
reporter.
And I said no, I'm not.
And he said no, yes, you are.
Like I did not have a say.
And that day, a few hours afterthat conversation, there was a
train that hit a car that hadbeen parked on the tracks.
(02:25):
A woman attempted to killherself and her daughter who was
sitting in the back seat andjust by happenstance, I beat the
police to the scene and I'mstanding there and they had the
firefighters had.
They were taking care of theyoung girl.
She was about five and thewoman was, didn't have a scratch
on her and she started runningat me and I was about I don't
know 10 feet in front of me andout of nowhere comes this arm
(02:47):
and just stops her in her tracks, basically clothes, lines her
and then wraps me in a bear hugand it was a believe you.
As a sergeant at the time Ithink he retired as a captain or
as a lieutenant Dave Nelson washis name and he turned around
and he goes you okay, kid.
And the woman was screaming sheunderstands, she gets it.
She's in my Bible study groupand all I could say in the
moment was I don't go to churchand that was all they needed.
(03:11):
And I caught the bug.
I went on a ride along a shortwhile later and fell in love
with the profession and I knew Ineeded to join it in some
capacity.
I remember calling my parentsat the time and I said I think I
want to go into law enforcement.
I was told no, you went tocollege.
Steve Morreale (03:27):
Oh, that's horrible.
There's plenty of collegeeducated police officers.
Katie Nelson (03:32):
My mom from the East Coast, my grandparents grew
up in Boston and we're familyof military, so it was.
I was a little devastated, butnot deterred, and came out to
the Bay Area stuck with thepublic safety beat it is.
It was my favorite thing to do.
I built some beautifulrelationships with some police
agencies both out in the CentralValley and then out here in the
(03:53):
Bay Area and found out that youcould basically be a reporter
for a police department as thePIO and a civilian capacity
ended up getting hired hereeight years ago and never looked
back.
Steve Morreale (04:03):
The rest is history.
Well, that's interesting andthat's such a.
It's really unusual.
The way people, the way you'relooking at it, your life will
turn.
And how am I doing a podcastand how did that come about?
And how are you doing socialmedia and public relations for a
police department?
When we talked before we cameon, I said so how is that
mountain view?
Katie Nelson (04:23):
And you said it's tiny, it's in the heart of
Silicon Valley, though, like wehave this this phrase just
everything kind of comes back tomountain view.
There are things that arehappening all over the country
and inevitably because of who ishere in our city you know these
little companies like Google,apple, facebook, microsoft
inevitably something alwayscomes back here, and so we're
kind of the little town with thebig footprint, so I'm very
(04:45):
lucky to work in this community,but I also get to see a lot of
interesting stuff, despite thefact that we are considered a
small to medium sized agency.
Steve Morreale (04:52):
That's great.
Well, yeah, why don't youdescribe that for a minute?
Because people are listeningfrom all over the world and
we're talking to Katie Nelson.
She is the social media andpublic relations coordinator for
Mountain View, CaliforniaPolice Department, which is out
in the Silicon Valley.
So talk about that.
How many people are on thatpolice department?
Katie Nelson (05:08):
So we have 96 torn and then about 100 or about 50
odd or 60 odd professional staff, and so we're about 160 strong
all together, which you know 80%of the country is small to
medium-sized agencies, so wefall right in that sector.
But what's so fascinating isthat Mountain View we are one of
16 or 17 in the United States,so we often get confused for
(05:29):
other mountain views, but we areat quite literally the heart of
Silicon Valley and despite thefact that the 10th largest city
is about 15 miles away from usin the country, san Jose a lot
of the tech world exists inMountain View.
We're only 12 square miles, sowe are a very small city by
comparison, but we have somevery, very heavy hitters in
terms of people who bring inbusiness, people who bring in
(05:53):
awareness and attention to thecity, and with that comes some
fascinating policeinvestigations and footprints in
the law enforcement.
Steve Morreale (06:00):
As you described , the many organizations that
call Mountain View home.
You're talking meta and you'retalking about Google and these
are things that sort of drivesocial media.
And in talking to some peopleon the podcast before, it is
hard to understand for many,including many people who are
senior in policing, to realizethat most people today do not
(06:24):
rely on TV or on radio or onprint.
They rely on social media, andI know that you know this quite
well.
But tell me your point of viewand how important it is for an
agency to tell its story.
Katie Nelson (06:41):
Well, I think what a lot of law enforcement
agencies need to understand isthat social media is not a nice
to have anymore, it's anecessity.
We are hitting almost athreshold of 100% utilization of
smartphones in this country, soit's just the nature of the
beast.
More people are inclined to usesocial media to get news or
information than they are to gointo a building to read a
(07:02):
newspaper, to watch TV or tolisten to the radio to get news.
They're going where they preferto communicate, and that's
normative behavior for a largenumber of the generational
groups that we have in thiscountry.
Even Facebook it's for oldpeople 55 and over are the
fastest growing demographic onthat platform, and that's at 50%
of people that use Facebook atleast.
(07:24):
And it's just.
If we are not in that space, ifwe are not making an effort to
be present in places, even ifwe're not comfortable using them
, our voices are going to becomeobsolete, this national
narrative that has kind ofdominated the viewpoint or the
umbrella assumption of what lawenforcement is and is not in
this country over the lastcouple of years.
That will persist if lawenforcement agencies don't make
(07:45):
an effort and designate someonein that capacity to help tell
the story of their agency.
There are 18,000 differentpolicing departments in this
country so that means there'stechnically 18,000 different
ways that a law enforcementagency could be to its community
and we're not a monolith rightand we're not a monolith like
the military.
But that means there's also18,000 different stories that
(08:07):
are out there.
Minimally that doesn't includeall of the women and men that
serve and what they bring to thebadge and what they bring to
this very noble line of work andwe would be remiss if we didn't
take that opportunity.
We can't rely on others to tellthat story.
Steve Morreale (08:20):
There are so many great stories that never
make it out and yet I mean,obviously, one of the things
that I use an awful lot isLinkedIn and Facebook to a
degree, but when you think aboutit ex Twitter, now ex, I'm not
sure what we call what a tweetwill be in the future.
I have no idea, but you'll bethe first to tell us, I'm sure.
(08:41):
But whether it's Instagram, aTikTok, facebook or whatever,
what are you using?
You're so many people my kidsincluded, and they're in their
30s rely on alerts.
They rely on something tonotify you on your phone,
because you have it all of thetime as to what's going on.
I know, and I'm sure towardsthe end of your period of time
(09:01):
in the print media, that veryoften you had to wait for the
deadline to get your story in,for it to be printed, and if you
didn't start tweeting or usingsome way to get information out
immediately, someone was goingto beat you to the punch.
True.
Katie Nelson (09:15):
Oh yeah, and it's fascinating, especially how ex
or Twitter, whatever you want tocall it is used, at least here
in the Bay Area.
Four out of five journalistsuse that platform to gather news
, so they don't have the time orresources to be able to deploy
to a scene to call a watchcommander or a PIO to gather
information and wait for thestory.
It's all about the race, it'sall about getting ahead, and so
(09:35):
social media is where thatreally begins to culminate into
the first iterations of a story,whether or not it's accurate,
and social media moves so fastthat something that's reported
two hours ago is not necessarilygoing to be what is reported
now.
Steve Morreale (09:47):
The facts are changing constantly Right, right
, right.
Katie Nelson (09:49):
Oh yeah, and the nature of the beast is such that
if you're not out there, it's.
When I teach, I say has anybodyever seen Talladega night?
And Ricky Bobby has his famousline.
He says if you're not first,you're last.
And that's exactly how it is insociety right now, with news
consumption and the use ofsocial media and the funneling
that exists on those platformswhen it comes to gathering and
(10:10):
consuming and digesting news.
Steve Morreale (10:12):
So you're doing an awful lot and you've become
involved with the IACP.
I've been a member since 1978.
You just stepped aside as thechair of the PIO section and
that kind of puts you in thedriver's seat about what's going
on all across the world.
Really.
And I want to talk about thisposition.
Were you the first to hold thisposition for this department?
How did that come about?
Katie Nelson (10:33):
No, I was the second.
So my former chief, who's nowthe under sheriff in San Mateo
County, was kind of an earlyadopter of social media and he
realized that social media wasbeing used at the time
predominantly as a one way pushof information.
People were just kind of takingin content and he was able to
justify to have a position doingthis full time.
(10:54):
Because often when if this is acollateral assignment, for
example when something doeshappen in a community there are
the needs of the residents andthen there's the needs of the
department, which is to keep theresidents safe first and
foremost.
It's very difficult to balanceboth worlds if your job first
and foremost is to be a cop, andso he was able to justify
creating a professional staffposition for this.
(11:15):
There was a woman in it prior tomyself for about a year and a
half and then I had met her forcoffee as a reporter to cover
Silicon Valley crime inparticular, and at the end of an
hour coffee she said would youever want to do this job?
And I kind of giggled and Isaid, oh sure you know why not,
like it sounds great.
Four months later she gave me acall and she said I'm leaving
the jobs yours if you want it,and so I came in as on like a
(11:37):
trial basis for six months.
Steve Morreale (11:39):
And they weren't sure they could trust you just
yet.
Katie Nelson (11:41):
I was 25.
I was a baby.
I wouldn't trust me either andfell in love, and it's been a
heck of a ride so far, and I,you know, love every day.
Steve Morreale (11:52):
So let's talk about this job and what kind of
advice that people can garnerfrom this conversation.
Social media, mountain View.
What is your process?
What do you do routinely?
Katie Nelson (12:05):
The most difficult thing about social media
regardless of whether you havesomebody in this position, that
this is their job isproductivity finding those
stories.
As you said, a lot of the goodstories don't come out.
This is a humble bunch that youwork with, regardless of where
you are.
And finding the stories,finding the processes to explain
the nuances, to describe whatmakes your department different
(12:27):
or how things are done inMountain View compared to Boston
, it's all opportunity, and sofinding the subject matter
experts within the department totalk about that, finding even
people who are willing to havetheir photo taken, to have that
humanity, to the story of havingpeople see people like them.
That's our day to day really.
And then, if it bleeds, itleads.
That's the old adage and itcontinues to exist.
(12:48):
So, of course, everythingpivots when news does happen or
when you know a circumstancerequires the attention from a
public safety perspective.
Steve Morreale (12:55):
I have the opportunity of seeing you on
video and I'm seeing a boardbehind you and it says topics
now without giving up the ship.
What is that list for?
Katie Nelson (13:05):
So that list is things that when patrol officers
in particular go out into thecommunity and they're at a scene
or they're just driving around,you know, doing their patrol
checks, or they're walking theirbeats, those are topics that
people bring up, that they havequestions about, and so that is
basically our idea board for themonth of things that we have
prepared.
Steve Morreale (13:24):
What are these?
Are the things that being fedto you from officers about the
concerns of the areas ofinterest from the citizens.
Is that fair?
Katie Nelson (13:31):
Yes, and it's something either that I'll see.
I'm reading the logs and Inoticed that we have something
called community relations calls.
So people will or they'll, goout and they'll have
conversations with communitymembers.
It's through events or it's,you know, our patrol officers
practically coming into myoffice and saying this is what
we got asked a lot about overthe last week.
I don't know, have you heardanything about that?
And like today is World SeniorCitizens Day, guess what we're
(13:53):
probably going to be doing postsabout ways to protect senior
citizens from scams.
You know, those are all topicsthat come about and things that
we plan out.
We have, quite literally, acontent calendar that we look at
and think of where we canconnect with our audiences and
educate them and inform andcreate conversation.
Steve Morreale (14:09):
So do you also serve as the PIO, I presume?
Katie Nelson (14:11):
I do so I have the ultimate millennial job.
I sit on the internet for 10hours a day at least and engage
and converse with audiencemembers, but then I also serve
in the traditional PIO rulewhere media inquires about
incidents or cases.
If we have a major event, I'mout and serving as the conduit
between the journalists and thepolice department.
(14:31):
That I have a kind of amultifaceted and very dynamic
role.
Steve Morreale (14:35):
I understand that position very well.
For several years I was the PIOfor the Drug Enforcement
Administration up here in NewEngland.
Katie Nelson (14:40):
So lucky you.
Steve Morreale (14:41):
Well, no, no, I enjoyed it and I missed it when
I gave it up, but it certainlyis helpful and you begin to
understand what you can say andwhat you shouldn't say.
But I want to go back to thissocial media, because this is
very intriguing to me and, Ihope, to everybody else, and
that is if you don't have afootprint, then you're leaving
people behind.
You know, a lot of people arerelying on social media for
(15:02):
information about its policedepartment.
What's going on instead ofgetting 75 calls?
Hey, I heard a siren comingdown the street and I saw some
police cars what's going onthere?
And I you know that people makethese kind of calls.
They want to know what's goingon in my neighborhood.
Katie Nelson (15:15):
Good.
The biggest issue is when weget our dispatch flooded with
calls about power outages.
It's very real.
Steve Morreale (15:21):
What is it?
When is it coming back and whatyeah, I'm out Do you know and
can you call the power company?
I understand all of that stuff,but in terms of what Mountain
View and what you do getting themessage out, what do you use?
Katie Nelson (15:32):
We have a pretty solid toolkit.
We have Facebook.
It is the most popular platformin the world 3 billion with a B
active monthly users.
Twitter or X or whatever it is.
That's still a valuablecommodity for our journalists,
so we know that that's where ourreporters are for the most part
.
Next door is our hyper localconnectivity.
Steve Morreale (15:48):
We never even heard that.
Yes, I use it myself.
Katie Nelson (15:51):
Yeah, we care about that greatly because
that's the audience that nooffense to anyone else that may
be listening to this, butthey're the audience that
matters most.
Those are our residents.
And then Instagram and Snapchatare our last two and those are
very visually compellingplatforms to us to kind of tell
the story from pictures worth athousand words kind of mentality
.
Steve Morreale (16:08):
I want to ask you this question what's the
secret to pump stuff out onmultiple platforms?
Katie Nelson (16:15):
There's tools out there.
I know there are.
Don't use them.
Steve Morreale (16:19):
Okay, good, so you don't rely on them.
Katie Nelson (16:21):
No, I don't.
I believe in native posting.
For all platforms social media,the language platforms, the
dialects everyone's going tohave something a little bit
different and they're allcompetitors.
So if you have links on oneplatform that lead them to
another platform, facebook's notgoing to like that.
You're sending folks to Twitteror next door, and, especially
with the way that the platformsare continually evolving, they
often lock you out or you haveto have an account to be able to
(16:42):
sign in, and so I don't want tolimit our audiences from being
able to see our content.
So I take the time to be ableto post individually to all of
the platforms, and that alsoreally mitigates a lot of the
potential risk management issuesthat we have in the event that
we have a major incidentinvolving, let's say, an officer
, or there is a critical eventthat has garnered a lot of media
(17:05):
attention.
That is a national story.
I don't want to lookinsensitive because we are
posting about our fluffy caninesand there's a community reeling
from a traumatic incident.
Steve Morreale (17:16):
Oh, I see.
So if you had timed somethinglike that right, yeah, yes, it
would be dispassionate if youdid that, or at least that
somebody could say you're in themiddle of this and you're
talking about yeah, fluffy, wetry and have a high EQ.
Well, that's good.
I appreciate that.
So your job, let's talk abouthow you grab your stories.
Your role is in command staffmeetings.
(17:38):
What access you have to theplayers at the time before a
crisis or in the middle of acrisis?
Katie Nelson (17:45):
So my role if this was not a critical incident, is
I have full access to thedepartment.
I go and I will work withofficer, sergeants, detectives,
whomever to call together theinformation that I am trying to
use to create a post and then,based on my knowledge of how
journalism works typically,whatever the media cycle is here
, I try and time itappropriately so that if I would
(18:06):
like to potentially getcoverage, I time it well enough
I am a member of command staffand that I go to command staff
meetings.
Like I said, I'm not sworn,though, so I am professional
staff.
Steve Morreale (18:16):
But you have a seat at the table right, I do.
You have to, you have to RightGo ahead.
Katie Nelson (18:20):
Oh, thank you.
And then in a critical incident,I report directly to a captain,
so I'm one, basically one stepremoved from the chief.
And so in a critical incident,ideally I sit in the command
post with the chief and eitherthe primary incident commander
or the captain and we assesswhat information goes out, what
that process looks like, howoften we're posting to try and
(18:43):
quell the rumor mill, make surethat the stakeholders within the
city are taken care of and alsothat our community is informed,
and we ride that wave until theconclusion of the event.
Sometimes it's a fairly quickprocess and we get to that kind
of that settling in a few hours.
It could run all day that we'vehad incidents where we've been
running at 16 hours and it'sstill going.
(19:04):
So it's a commitment for sure,especially under my former chief
, chris Chung.
He understood that there wasthis delicate but symbiotic
balance that existed betweencommunity information, public
safety and the care and feedingof all of the players involved
to ensure that everybody feltthat they had access to us, that
they were updated regularly andthat their concerns or their
(19:26):
questions were addressed in anappropriate and efficient manner
.
That's a very delicate balanceto try and maintain.
Steve Morreale (19:31):
So we're talking to Katie Nelson and she's out
in Mountain View, california,with the police department.
She is the social media and PRcoordinator and the PIO and, in
fact, as you are balancing allof these things, what I had said
earlier and one of my petpeeves is, if you're going to
have a footprint using socialmedia for a police department
(19:52):
whether you're a department ofthree, 25 or 5,000, you have to
keep it current, and that's avery, very difficult job to do.
And one of the things that I doin classes that students sort
of like and the first thing I dois I want you to go to your
hometown, I want you to look atthe website for the police
department and critique it, lookat its social media, tell me if
it's up to date, tell me if theinformation you're looking for
(20:14):
is there.
What's missing?
If you were a consultant, whatwould you tell them that people
like yourselves want to knowabout?
And it's quite funny because insome cases, you say they've got
Facebook and they have, I guess,instagram and they haven't
updated it for two weeks.
So once we do it, I think youknow I do it too.
I'm looking for somebody.
I'm going to look it up just ageneral web search.
(20:36):
If I don't find it in the firsttime, I'm just going to move on
to somebody else.
Either keep me posted withinformation or I'll find
somebody else.
So tell me how you keep that upto date.
Katie Nelson (20:46):
I will say people are two things they're dramatic
and they're lazy.
If they have to read a lot orif they have to go searching for
something, you're going to losethose valuable basically that
trust, those deposits in thebank of community trust.
And so ensuring that ourcommunity has regular and timely
information, that's my primaryjob.
So at least five days a week Iam ensuring that we have
something posted on social mediafor them to have access to, be
(21:09):
it something about thedepartment or an incident itself
that occurred in the communitythat we think is of interest.
I have a lot of responsibilityin terms of determining what
constitutes a case or anincident of note, but also just
being present on those platforms.
It's called social listening.
That's huge because if thelonger people have to wait to
hear from you, the more they'regoing to fill in the gaps
themselves or, like you said,they're going to go to another
(21:30):
source of information that mayor may not have accurate,
reflective content orinformation of what we are doing
, what is going on.
It happened yesterday.
We had a homicide in ourcommunity, first one this year.
Knock on what.
Hopefully it's our last.
But people were going andasking their neighbors.
They were on other platformstalking, and if I hadn't been
able to see that and engage andfollow up, who knows where that
(21:51):
story could have gone.
But being able to inform theinvestigators, the command staff
and others about what washappening and what people were
talking about on platforms likeNextdoor, on platforms like Ring
, on platforms like Facebook,that was huge because that sets
in motion hey, we're on aticking clock here, we need to
keep up.
If we don't keep up, we'regoing to become obsolete.
If we become obsolete, we'regoing to get ignored.
(22:13):
And if we get it ignored,that's it, our status, and it's
very much a status symbol ofbeing a primary source of
information.
It takes 1,000 good experiencesto build that up.
It takes one bad experience totear it all down.
I didn't want it to be, and Idon't ever want it to be, one
instance that we basically losethe trust and the faith of our
community.
Steve Morreale (22:30):
That's a big job and a big responsibility,
certainly what has happened overand over again and as we watch
events unfold.
The use of video evidence bothfrom city or municipal sources,
but also from you said Ring,from cameras on people's houses.
How important is that and howimportant is that in some of
your messaging?
Katie Nelson (22:49):
It's huge the more advanced technology becomes,
not just in the social mediarealm but in the realm of home
security footage.
Solving crimes and having thatbe able to recognize an
individual because of clearfootage from home security
cameras has been huge.
It also helps us better piecetogether what exactly happened.
There is always going to begood old-fashioned police work.
(23:11):
You figure it out.
The way that society hasevolved and the way that
technology has evolved can onlyhelp enhance that further.
And so being able to ask forthings like that and have that
community, have that vestedinterest in keeping their city
safe, that's just an added bonusof this outreach that we can
have in a digital space.
We're not going to necessarilybe able to do that by going door
to door.
That takes time, that takeseffort that we may or may not
(23:33):
have.
But social media is expeditesthat process exponentially and
it allows us to reach far morepeople than we would be able to
if we were walking door to doorand our one officer and our one
sergeant would be able toaccomplish.
Steve Morreale (23:46):
So is Katie Nelson adapting to AI.
Katie Nelson (23:49):
Not at this time.
No, because I don't know enoughabout it.
Am I doing research on it?
Absolutely, but the biggestconcerns much like TikTok, this
has been a conversation in ourcity is the access, the
understanding of the softwareand privacy concerns.
So those three things.
I unfortunately don't get tomake any of those decisions on
whether or not we use those.
Use those, but theconversations around that are
(24:11):
happening.
I'll be curious to see, with AIin the next six months to a
year, how fast it evolves, whatgood it is doing for society and
where the pain points orpitfalls are.
Steve Morreale (24:23):
I was just going to say what the pitfalls are.
Yeah, good, good, good.
I think the same myself, as anoutsider that's becoming insider
professional staff, butnonetheless a member of this
police organization.
What were the changes of viewsthat you had coming from the
outside as a reporter and nowbeing on the inside to see
(24:44):
behind the curtain?
Katie Nelson (24:45):
Time.
Time is totally differentinside versus outside.
When I would be at a scene as areporter, I'd be looking at my
watch and I'd be like God, theyare taking forever.
That on the inside is like youblink and suddenly it's two
hours later.
Time is so warped and you neverhave enough of it inside the
tape.
I'll use that at most people'sstand outside the tape versus
(25:07):
inside the tape.
Inside the tape, things aremoving so fast and things are so
chaotic, even if it doesn'tseem like it or if you have a
process in place.
Outside the tape it feels likean eternity waiting.
That doesn't excuse a lawenforcement agency's ability to
communicate, though.
There are still things that canbe done, efforts that can be
made to at least update withwhat you can, whether or not the
(25:28):
investigation itself is, in,whatever phase it is, you can
still share information and notjeopardize the integrity of what
your detectives are trying tohandle or your patrol officers.
Steve Morreale (25:37):
So that's good, and rather than saying no
comment, here's what we can sayand here's what we can't at the
time, and here's the reason wecan't.
And I think what you're tryingto be is transparent, my guess
and to answer the questions thatyou can and to be honest about
those that you can't, becauseExactly how do you approach that
?
Katie Nelson (25:54):
I tell people it's okay to say I don't know, but
as a public servant, it's ourjob to be able to follow up with
.
But I'll find out for you andestablishing those parameters or
those boundaries, either withyour community or with your
reporters, about when they canexpect an update, what that
update could potentially entail,what a process of an
investigation looks like or whatthey can or cannot reveal.
(26:15):
Because, at the end of the day,something else that I learned
was you know, everybody's gotconstitutional rights to a fair
and impartial jury of theirpeers.
Journalists are constantlyhungry for the last little bit
of tidbit of information thatthey can, you know, share with
their readers.
But, as our duty in lawenforcement, we can't take the
jury pool.
There are certain things thatshould be found out throughout
(26:36):
the process of, you know, thejudicial process, not
necessarily in a press releasefrom a law enforcement agency,
and that is a continual stickingpoint.
But it's fascinating to see andbalance everything between the
integrity of the investigationbeing accessible and transparent
, although I find transparent tobe kind of an overused buzzword
, because that's just how itshould be.
(26:56):
It should not be.
People should not have to fightfor information from you ever.
You should be making everyeffort always, because the more
that you are, the more you getugly early.
The more you get out that youare able to, the more people are
going to give you somebreathing room, the less
inclined they're going to be togo somewhere else.
And guess what?
Your phones are going to stopringing, your email is going to
stop going off, because peopleare going to be learned enough
(27:19):
to know that if you do it right,they're just going to be able
to wait.
They're going to know to gowhere you are and receive the
information.
Steve Morreale (27:25):
So you're on the inside now.
I'm assuming that when youbegan the work as a crime report
, that you had a certain respectfor what officers had to do,
but I suppose that that haschanged as you come to know them
in a completely different way.
Yes, so talk about that.
Katie Nelson (27:40):
Honestly, when I was a journalist it was all fun
and games for me.
It was like I got to.
I'm sure I got taken on opsthat I never should have been
taken on to.
I remember one time I was on aride along with the NARC unit,
with a Central Valley agency,and the Detective Sergeant
turned around and looked at meand he said if you hear gunshots
, just duck, don't get out ofthe car.
(28:02):
And like at the time I was likewhoa, this sounds so exciting,
okay.
And then, like 30 seconds later, the bad guy goes running by
the car which was an old Jeep,by the way, not protected at all
with ballistic proof anythingand then the Sergeant runs by me
and he just yells at me he'spassing the car, stay down.
It was all fun and games.
I come here and I see how mucheffort, time away from their
(28:23):
families, long hours, thatpeople put in.
My soon to be husband is aSergeant and he oh, you're
buying into it, Katie, oh yeahthe first several years of our
relationship he was theDetective Sergeant over our
homicide unit, our bureau, andhis phone was going off every
night.
There were times where onweekends it would be we'd be in
(28:45):
the middle of breakfast and he'dhave to go up and investigate.
You know a horrific crime and Ihave the awareness now so much
more, of how much is on the line.
One of our good friends wasshot and wounded in the line of
duty last summer and seeing himjust a couple of hours after he
had been ambushed he's lucky tobe alive and to know that I may
(29:05):
not be able to look at him todayis if things had gone horribly
awry.
I don't think people who arenot in law enforcement are in a
first responder capacity thatincludes firefighters, military.
They don't understand thegravity of how much is carried
that is invisible in this lineof work, what is being offered
up to a vast majority ofstrangers without, for the most
part without any hope ofreciprocity, yeah.
(29:29):
Yeah, and not understanding thecontext and the dedication to
duty and, as you say, sort ofthe we all take, we all make a
promise, we take an oath and weI myself included when we joined
the department, and we don'ttake that lightly.
Steve Morreale (29:41):
Yeah, no, I understand that and, as you said
, and now you're living it ifthat's the case, you're now
going to be married to anofficer and have a relationship.
You understand firsthand, as somany wives do for sure, my own
included, because it's not aneasy job and it's not for the
faint of heart.
What is your aha moment?
You know, at that point in time, here you're a young buck.
(30:02):
You're saying yes, right,you're saying yes, you're going
to be.
They're basically going to openthe curtain and let you, let
you in behind the curtain, butthat curtain has to close too,
to a degree no different that itdoes in the medical profession
than it does in in the writingprofession.
Right, the journalistprofession, schools, there are
certain things that are for thediscipline.
(30:23):
But now you're inside.
What's the aha moment?
You know where did you get thebite?
That this is what I want to do,this is who I want to serve,
this is who I want to help.
Katie Nelson (30:32):
I mean, my grandfather was a captain in the
Navy and so I grew up aroundpublic service in some capacity
and the invisibility of service,because you know people don't
see the acts that go into itevery day and I think I always
liked the idea of lawenforcement, whether or not I
was going to admit it, but myfirst ride along in Lodi,
california, was it?
(30:52):
I remember there was, I was outon a ride along and of course
everything was to use the termout here code, for it was
peaceful, it was quiet, and allof a sudden the radio goes off
and there is a armed robberyinvolving a gun at an auto parts
store in the middle of town.
The suspect is still on scene.
We were clear across the otherside of town and that officer
(31:12):
she flipped on her lights and wehit the gas so hard I'm fairly
certain I felt like a G forceand we made it to this auto
parts store as the guy isbooking it down the road.
Not too far away, any, a pistolwhipped, I think, at least one
individual inside the store andthat rush of oh my God, we're
going to go get the bad guy.
I was 22.
(31:33):
And I just thought this is it?
I could not think of doinganything else, and I had that
bug throughout my journalismcareer.
I made it my mission to developgood rapport and relationships
with all the police departmentsthat I interacted with.
There was a time, though, whenI really knew that something.
There was something else there.
We stopped in and San JoaquinCounty.
(31:53):
They were investigating, orthey had reopened an
investigation into the speedfreak killers.
They were a dynamic, prolificduo that murdered at least a
handful of women and young women, including teenagers, in the
San Joaquin County area in the80s and early 90s, and there was
just something.
I was the day before I was setto interview one of them.
(32:15):
He was up for parole.
He hung himself, and I thoughtthere was just something weird
about that, and I was like whatisn't he's telling people?
Why is you know?
Why are all these people leftto wonder?
Three months later, I get a call.
They had started to dig out ina remote area of the county, and
I ended up connecting with adetective out there, and he said
get out here.
We found some bones and talkingwith the families, basically
(32:38):
going through the entirere-greaving process, with one
family in particular after theirdaughter had been found on a
hillside.
Her clothes were still fairlyintact I mean, she had withered
away quite a bit, but there wasstill hair and this husband and
wife they had been through helland back and then they were
revisiting it and I got to gothrough that entire process with
(32:59):
them and it was such an honoras morbid as that sounds it was
such an honor to be invited intothat space and to see this
happen and understand just howmuch it meant to have some
semblance of understanding notclosure per se, but
understanding of what wasfinally going to happen to their
daughter.
And I was able to go to thefuneral and I was able to stay
(33:20):
in touch with them after, andthat left a mark.
Steve Morreale (33:24):
So what you're saying here and when I bring it
back to the police departmentand the officers that do the
work day in and day out and haveto work overtime and have to
hunt and have to put their liveson the line, it seems to me
that one of the things that youare trying to do is to humanize
the police officer, that theyhave families, that they have
(33:48):
difficulties, that they haveillnesses and yet they still do
their job.
And so I presume these are someof the stories you're looking
for to share the good thingsthat people are willing to do,
not just chase bad guys.
Katie Nelson (34:01):
Yes, and that exists every day.
There were my soon to behusband, two years ago now had
to oversee the investigation ofa woman who allegedly murdered
her newborn son and the impactand toll that that and I have a
five year old stepdaughter, sothat she was three at the time
the impact that that had on him.
(34:22):
He ended up writing a note tothe public about here's how this
is impacting us.
So I had been through theprocess of seeing a cold case
basically start to have someclosure there.
This was an active case wherethat baby had been through
unimaginable horrors and he andhis team investigated this and I
don't know that he had ever hada case like that before.
And watching him process that,watching that team process that
(34:44):
and stay here until all hours tofind the evidence, to try and
have that be a clear cutpresentation to the district
attorney's office of she knewwhat she was doing.
Here's how we know.
And then just the emotional tollthey're all parents watching
them having to carry home thatburden.
That was not only hard to watchbut I was so proud of how
(35:06):
dedicated they were in spite ofthe horrors that they saw and
knowing what they were going tohave to look at when they get
home and feel that connection orthat anger or that sadness.
They worked around the clock,they did not stop, and that has
been time and again.
They have done that for variouscases and for various people,
and the justice that they seekfor the victims is unimaginable,
(35:27):
and it is.
I said this is a nobleprofession, it absolutely is,
and there are a lot of noblepeople here.
That's good to hear.
Steve Morreale (35:34):
So we're going to wind down and we're talking
to Katie Nelson.
She's out in Mountain View,california, today and
representing the Mountain ViewPolice Department.
What I would ask is you do anawful lot of training and you
are an advocate for using socialmedia and how to best deal with
the media, and what kinds ofadvice can you give to an
(35:57):
organization that has dabbled insocial media but probably has
not yet mastered it or made it apriority?
What kind of advice can yougive?
Katie Nelson (36:06):
I would say the best piece of advice would be to
understand that silence in adigital space, in an article, in
an interview, anywhere, butespecially in a digital space,
silence is an answer In thecourt of public opinion, the
highest court in the land rightnow, silence is the most damning
and most damaging thing to anorganization's reputation,
especially in law enforcement.
(36:27):
You may not be comfortable inthis space, but you've got to
get comfortable because this isthe nature of the beast.
Now it is not feedingjournalists for their stories to
be printed or to be put ontheir website or to be put on
the 10 or 11 o'clock news.
The playing field has beenleveled by social media.
You have a key opportunity andchance now to have your voice,
be at the forefront and to be inthe driver's seat of
(36:49):
information, especially when itcomes to your story, your
narrative.
If you are not there on socialmedia in particular, you are
giving somebody else the keys tothe kingdom.
You're handing it over andsaying here's the license to
tell our story for us, whetheror not they're going to do a
good job at it.
Everybody in the department whoserves in a role, especially as
a social media coordinator, as aPIO.
They are the ones who are ableto best begin the process of
(37:11):
articulating the true story of adepartment.
Afford your agency and affordthe profession the opportunity
to negate this narrative that wehave been seeing for so long
now about what law enforcementis assumed to be.
A lot of those assumptions arenot true or they're not real,
but it's time that peopleunderstand.
The fastest, easiest way to dothat is to be present in a
digital space.
Steve Morreale (37:31):
Here's my yaba Yaba Katie.
For God's sakes, how manyplatforms are there Now?
You added next door.
I've got to be on next door.
I've got to be on X, I've gotto be on Instagram, I've got to
be on Meta.
What's important, devil'sadvocate.
Katie Nelson (37:47):
I know what's important to your community.
That's how we know.
We ask them where do you preferto communicate?
We don't have the luxuryanymore of asking people to come
to us.
We need to go where they are tostart, the sooner you can be in
their space and present intheir environment.
When it comes to at least theircommunication preferences,
you're going to chip away atthat barrier or that trust gap
that exists because of what hashappened over the last several
(38:09):
years.
Steve Morreale (38:09):
Yeah, I mean, I think what you just raised is
something I hadn't thought aboutin a long time.
If ever, I'm a big one forpushing surveys out and asking
how they feel.
Have you interacted with us?
How are you treated?
What can we do better?
But imagine if one of thequestions is where do you get
your news?
Where do you get?
Intro (38:27):
your information.
Steve Morreale (38:28):
How can we communicate with you In social
media and give them a list?
That's a great piece of advice.
Thank you very much for that.
That's great.
Katie Nelson (38:37):
Welcome.
Steve Morreale (38:38):
So what's that last thing?
What's on your bucket list?
What are you having to do?
What's on your to-do list forthe rest of the week or for the
rest of the month?
Katie Nelson (38:44):
It's so funny.
I have my to-do list right hereof the things that I want to
accomplish over the nextbasically year.
Something that I have beenhoping to achieve is to have a
more holistic, robust anddetailed critical incident
response model that can bescaled or replicated at any size
(39:04):
agency small, medium, large.
One of the best agencies that Ihave seen do that is the
Metropolitan Police Departmentand the New Zealand Police
Department.
They have just been able toachieve levels of response and
information sharing that arestill hit or miss here in the
United States.
So my bucket list is toactually speak with them and get
their perspective and theiroutlines on how this looks, so
(39:27):
that at least here in the UnitedStates we can begin to have a
better foundational practice forcritical incident response
models.
When it comes specifically tocommunication, I'm not talking
about tactics or operation.
I'm talking specifically aboutensuring that our internal and
external stakeholders are takencare of when it comes to
understanding what is happeningwith our department.
Steve Morreale (39:45):
That's great.
Well, it's been a pleasure tofinally connect with you.
I really appreciate it.
We've been talking to KatieNelson, and she is the social
media and public relationscoordinator at Mountain View,
california, someone who startedin wine.
And here's a question you saidyou weren't drinking wine.
Did you change?
Katie Nelson (40:01):
Oh yes.
So okay, so now you learned,you inherited that.
Steve Morreale (40:05):
So, thank you.
This is great to be able totalk about, so important to talk
about social media and what youdo and sharing.
I appreciate it.
So thank you very, very much.
Katie Nelson (40:15):
Thank you.
Steve Morreale (40:15):
So that's it.
Another episode is in the can.
We thank you for listening.
We want you to stay safe.
Keep up the good work, despitethe noise.
Stay tuned for more episodes.
I'm Steve Morreale The CopDocPodcast.
Intro (40:26):
Thanks, Thanks for listening to The CopDoc Podcast
with Dr Steve Morreale.
Steve is a retired lawenforcement practitioner and
manager, turned academic andscholar from Worcester State
University.
Please tune into The CopDocPodcast for regular episodes of
interviews with thought leadersin policing.
Welcome to the Cop Doc podcast.
This podcast explores policeleadership issues and innovative
ideas.
The cop doc shares thoughts andideas as he talks with leaders
in policing communities,academia and other government
agencies.
And now please join Dr SteveMorreale and industry thought
(00:25):
leaders as they share theirinsights and experience.
Welcome to The CopD oc PpodcastPodcast
Steve Morreale (00:34):
Hello again everybody.
Steve Morreale, coming to youfrom Boston and you're listening
to the cop doc podcast.
Today we are again bi-coastal aconversation.
On the other end of the line isKatie Nelson and she's in
California right now.
Hello, Katie.
Katie Nelson (00:47):
Hi, how are you?
Steve Morreale (00:48):
I'm great.
So it's in the afternoon there,just pressing noontime.
It's three out here on the eastcoast and I came upon you
because of the things thatyou're writing Very, very
interesting things that you'rewriting using social media, and
ironically, you are the socialmedia and public relations
coordinator for Mountain View,California Police Department.
So you're a California girl.
Katie Nelson (01:07):
Yes, through and through.
Steve Morreale (01:08):
Okay, that's good.
So let's talk about how youended up in a police department,
when this probably was not onyour mind, but talk about going
to college and the kind ofreporting that you were doing
and tell the audience about that.
Katie Nelson (01:21):
At a very early age I realized I like to tell
stories and so I went to collegeand from Orange County
originally and did a complete180 and went to University of
California at Berkeley for threeyears and fell in love with
journalism and ended up out inwine country, which out here in
California is basically the Napaarea and decided.
(01:44):
Napa, sonoma area, this town ofLodi and then the city of
Stockton, which is where I wasbased and was brought in at 22
to be the wine business reporterand I wanted to cover higher
education.
I came from that environment sothat's what I was comfortable
with.
Had no idea about wine countrywine business, anything like
that.
I wasn't a wine drinker at thetime.
(02:05):
And about three months into mystint out there, my editor calls
me in and he says you're goingto be the new cops and courts
reporter.
And I said no, I'm not.
And he said no, yes, you are.
Like I did not have a say.
And that day, a few hours afterthat conversation, there was a
train that hit a car that hadbeen parked on the tracks.
(02:25):
A woman attempted to killherself and her daughter who was
sitting in the back seat andjust by happenstance, I beat the
police to the scene and I'mstanding there and they had the
firefighters had.
They were taking care of theyoung girl.
She was about five and thewoman was, didn't have a scratch
on her and she started runningat me and I was about I don't
know 10 feet in front of me andout of nowhere comes this arm
(02:47):
and just stops her in her tracks, basically clothes, lines her
and then wraps me in a bear hugand it was a believe you.
As a sergeant at the time Ithink he retired as a captain or
as a lieutenant Dave Nelson washis name and he turned around
and he goes you okay, kid.
And the woman was screaming sheunderstands, she gets it.
She's in my Bible study groupand all I could say in the
moment was I don't go to churchand that was all they needed.
(03:11):
And I caught the bug.
I went on a ride along a shortwhile later and fell in love
with the profession and I knew Ineeded to join it in some
capacity.
I remember calling my parentsat the time and I said I think I
want to go into law enforcement.
I was told no, you went tocollege.
Steve Morreale (03:27):
Oh, that's horrible.
There's plenty of collegeeducated police officers.
Katie Nelson (03:32):
My mom from the East Coast, my grandparents grew
up in Boston and we're familyof military, so it was.
I was a little devastated, butnot deterred, and came out to
the Bay Area stuck with thepublic safety beat it is.
It was my favorite thing to do.
I built some beautifulrelationships with some police
agencies both out in the CentralValley and then out here in the
(03:53):
Bay Area and found out that youcould basically be a reporter
for a police department as thePIO and a civilian capacity
ended up getting hired hereeight years ago and never looked
back.
Steve Morreale (04:03):
The rest is history.
Well, that's interesting andthat's such a.
It's really unusual.
The way people, the way you'relooking at it, your life will
turn.
And how am I doing a podcastand how did that come about?
And how are you doing socialmedia and public relations for a
police department?
When we talked before we cameon, I said so how is that
mountain view?
Katie Nelson (04:23):
And you said it's tiny, it's in the heart of
Silicon Valley, though, like wehave this this phrase just
everything kind of comes back tomountain view.
There are things that arehappening all over the country
and inevitably because of who ishere in our city you know these
little companies like Google,apple, facebook, microsoft
inevitably something alwayscomes back here, and so we're
kind of the little town with thebig footprint, so I'm very
(04:45):
lucky to work in this community,but I also get to see a lot of
interesting stuff, despite thefact that we are considered a
small to medium sized agency.
Steve Morreale (04:52):
That's great.
Well, yeah, why don't youdescribe that for a minute?
Because people are listeningfrom all over the world and
we're talking to Katie Nelson.
She is the social media andpublic relations coordinator for
Mountain View, CaliforniaPolice Department, which is out
in the Silicon Valley.
So talk about that.
How many people are on thatpolice department?
Katie Nelson (05:08):
So we have 96 torn and then about 100 or about 50
odd or 60 odd professional staff, and so we're about 160 strong
all together, which you know 80%of the country is small to
medium-sized agencies, so wefall right in that sector.
But what's so fascinating isthat Mountain View we are one of
16 or 17 in the United States,so we often get confused for
(05:29):
other mountain views, but we areat quite literally the heart of
Silicon Valley and despite thefact that the 10th largest city
is about 15 miles away from usin the country, san Jose a lot
of the tech world exists inMountain View.
We're only 12 square miles, sowe are a very small city by
comparison, but we have somevery, very heavy hitters in
terms of people who bring inbusiness, people who bring in
(05:53):
awareness and attention to thecity, and with that comes some
fascinating policeinvestigations and footprints in
the law enforcement.
Steve Morreale (06:00):
As you described , the many organizations that
call Mountain View home.
You're talking meta and you'retalking about Google and these
are things that sort of drivesocial media.
And in talking to some peopleon the podcast before, it is
hard to understand for many,including many people who are
senior in policing, to realizethat most people today do not
(06:24):
rely on TV or on radio or onprint.
They rely on social media, andI know that you know this quite
well.
But tell me your point of viewand how important it is for an
agency to tell its story.
Katie Nelson (06:41):
Well, I think what a lot of law enforcement
agencies need to understand isthat social media is not a nice
to have anymore, it's anecessity.
We are hitting almost athreshold of 100% utilization of
smartphones in this country, soit's just the nature of the
beast.
More people are inclined to usesocial media to get news or
information than they are to gointo a building to read a
(07:02):
newspaper, to watch TV or tolisten to the radio to get news.
They're going where they preferto communicate, and that's
normative behavior for a largenumber of the generational
groups that we have in thiscountry.
Even Facebook it's for oldpeople 55 and over are the
fastest growing demographic onthat platform, and that's at 50%
of people that use Facebook atleast.
(07:24):
And it's just.
If we are not in that space, ifwe are not making an effort to
be present in places, even ifwe're not comfortable using them
, our voices are going to becomeobsolete, this national
narrative that has kind ofdominated the viewpoint or the
umbrella assumption of what lawenforcement is and is not in
this country over the lastcouple of years.
That will persist if lawenforcement agencies don't make
(07:45):
an effort and designate someonein that capacity to help tell
the story of their agency.
There are 18,000 differentpolicing departments in this
country so that means there'stechnically 18,000 different
ways that a law enforcementagency could be to its community
and we're not a monolith rightand we're not a monolith like
the military.
But that means there's also18,000 different stories that
(08:07):
are out there.
Minimally that doesn't includeall of the women and men that
serve and what they bring to thebadge and what they bring to
this very noble line of work andwe would be remiss if we didn't
take that opportunity.
We can't rely on others to tellthat story.
Steve Morreale (08:20):
There are so many great stories that never
make it out and yet I mean,obviously, one of the things
that I use an awful lot isLinkedIn and Facebook to a
degree, but when you think aboutit ex Twitter, now ex, I'm not
sure what we call what a tweetwill be in the future.
I have no idea, but you'll bethe first to tell us, I'm sure.
(08:41):
But whether it's Instagram, aTikTok, facebook or whatever,
what are you using?
You're so many people my kidsincluded, and they're in their
30s rely on alerts.
They rely on something tonotify you on your phone,
because you have it all of thetime as to what's going on.
I know, and I'm sure towardsthe end of your period of time
(09:01):
in the print media, that veryoften you had to wait for the
deadline to get your story in,for it to be printed, and if you
didn't start tweeting or usingsome way to get information out
immediately, someone was goingto beat you to the punch.
True.
Katie Nelson (09:15):
Oh yeah, and it's fascinating, especially how ex
or Twitter, whatever you want tocall it is used, at least here
in the Bay Area.
Four out of five journalistsuse that platform to gather news
, so they don't have the time orresources to be able to deploy
to a scene to call a watchcommander or a PIO to gather
information and wait for thestory.
It's all about the race, it'sall about getting ahead, and so
(09:35):
social media is where thatreally begins to culminate into
the first iterations of a story,whether or not it's accurate,
and social media moves so fastthat something that's reported
two hours ago is not necessarilygoing to be what is reported
now.
Steve Morreale (09:47):
The facts are changing constantly Right, right
, right.
Katie Nelson (09:49):
Oh yeah, and the nature of the beast is such that
if you're not out there, it's.
When I teach, I say has anybodyever seen Talladega night?
And Ricky Bobby has his famousline.
He says if you're not first,you're last.
And that's exactly how it is insociety right now, with news
consumption and the use ofsocial media and the funneling
that exists on those platformswhen it comes to gathering and
(10:10):
consuming and digesting news.
Steve Morreale (10:12):
So you're doing an awful lot and you've become
involved with the IACP.
I've been a member since 1978.
You just stepped aside as thechair of the PIO section and
that kind of puts you in thedriver's seat about what's going
on all across the world.
Really.
And I want to talk about thisposition.
Were you the first to hold thisposition for this department?
How did that come about?
Katie Nelson (10:33):
No, I was the second.
So my former chief, who's nowthe under sheriff in San Mateo
County, was kind of an earlyadopter of social media and he
realized that social media wasbeing used at the time
predominantly as a one way pushof information.
People were just kind of takingin content and he was able to
justify to have a position doingthis full time.
(10:54):
Because often when if this is acollateral assignment, for
example when something doeshappen in a community there are
the needs of the residents andthen there's the needs of the
department, which is to keep theresidents safe first and
foremost.
It's very difficult to balanceboth worlds if your job first
and foremost is to be a cop, andso he was able to justify
creating a professional staffposition for this.
(11:15):
There was a woman in it prior tomyself for about a year and a
half and then I had met her forcoffee as a reporter to cover
Silicon Valley crime inparticular, and at the end of an
hour coffee she said would youever want to do this job?
And I kind of giggled and Isaid, oh sure you know why not,
like it sounds great.
Four months later she gave me acall and she said I'm leaving
the jobs yours if you want it,and so I came in as on like a
(11:37):
trial basis for six months.
Steve Morreale (11:39):
And they weren't sure they could trust you just
yet.
Katie Nelson (11:41):
I was 25.
I was a baby.
I wouldn't trust me either andfell in love, and it's been a
heck of a ride so far, and I,you know, love every day.
Steve Morreale (11:52):
So let's talk about this job and what kind of
advice that people can garnerfrom this conversation.
Social media, mountain View.
What is your process?
What do you do routinely?
Katie Nelson (12:05):
The most difficult thing about social media
regardless of whether you havesomebody in this position, that
this is their job isproductivity finding those
stories.
As you said, a lot of the goodstories don't come out.
This is a humble bunch that youwork with, regardless of where
you are.
And finding the stories,finding the processes to explain
the nuances, to describe whatmakes your department different
(12:27):
or how things are done inMountain View compared to Boston
, it's all opportunity, and sofinding the subject matter
experts within the department totalk about that, finding even
people who are willing to havetheir photo taken, to have that
humanity, to the story of havingpeople see people like them.
That's our day to day really.
And then, if it bleeds, itleads.
That's the old adage and itcontinues to exist.
(12:48):
So, of course, everythingpivots when news does happen or
when you know a circumstancerequires the attention from a
public safety perspective.
Steve Morreale (12:55):
I have the opportunity of seeing you on
video and I'm seeing a boardbehind you and it says topics
now without giving up the ship.
What is that list for?
Katie Nelson (13:05):
So that list is things that when patrol officers
in particular go out into thecommunity and they're at a scene
or they're just driving around,you know, doing their patrol
checks, or they're walking theirbeats, those are topics that
people bring up, that they havequestions about, and so that is
basically our idea board for themonth of things that we have
prepared.
Steve Morreale (13:24):
What are these?
Are the things that being fedto you from officers about the
concerns of the areas ofinterest from the citizens.
Is that fair?
Katie Nelson (13:31):
Yes, and it's something either that I'll see.
I'm reading the logs and Inoticed that we have something
called community relations calls.
So people will or they'll, goout and they'll have
conversations with communitymembers.
It's through events or it's,you know, our patrol officers
practically coming into myoffice and saying this is what
we got asked a lot about overthe last week.
I don't know, have you heardanything about that?
And like today is World SeniorCitizens Day, guess what we're
(13:53):
probably going to be doing postsabout ways to protect senior
citizens from scams.
You know, those are all topicsthat come about and things that
we plan out.
We have, quite literally, acontent calendar that we look at
and think of where we canconnect with our audiences and
educate them and inform andcreate conversation.
Steve Morreale (14:09):
So do you also serve as the PIO, I presume?
Katie Nelson (14:11):
I do so I have the ultimate millennial job.
I sit on the internet for 10hours a day at least and engage
and converse with audiencemembers, but then I also serve
in the traditional PIO rulewhere media inquires about
incidents or cases.
If we have a major event, I'mout and serving as the conduit
between the journalists and thepolice department.
(14:31):
That I have a kind of amultifaceted and very dynamic
role.
Steve Morreale (14:35):
I understand that position very well.
For several years I was the PIOfor the Drug Enforcement
Administration up here in NewEngland.
Katie Nelson (14:40):
So lucky you.
Steve Morreale (14:41):
Well, no, no, I enjoyed it and I missed it when
I gave it up, but it certainlyis helpful and you begin to
understand what you can say andwhat you shouldn't say.
But I want to go back to thissocial media, because this is
very intriguing to me and, Ihope, to everybody else, and
that is if you don't have afootprint, then you're leaving
people behind.
You know, a lot of people arerelying on social media for
(15:02):
information about its policedepartment.
What's going on instead ofgetting 75 calls?
Hey, I heard a siren comingdown the street and I saw some
police cars what's going onthere?
And I you know that people makethese kind of calls.
They want to know what's goingon in my neighborhood.
Katie Nelson (15:15):
Good.
The biggest issue is when weget our dispatch flooded with
calls about power outages.
It's very real.
Steve Morreale (15:21):
What is it?
When is it coming back and whatyeah, I'm out Do you know and
can you call the power company?
I understand all of that stuff,but in terms of what Mountain
View and what you do getting themessage out, what do you use?
Katie Nelson (15:32):
We have a pretty solid toolkit.
We have Facebook.
It is the most popular platformin the world 3 billion with a B
active monthly users.
Twitter or X or whatever it is.
That's still a valuablecommodity for our journalists,
so we know that that's where ourreporters are for the most part
.
Next door is our hyper localconnectivity.
Steve Morreale (15:48):
We never even heard that.
Yes, I use it myself.
Katie Nelson (15:51):
Yeah, we care about that greatly because
that's the audience that nooffense to anyone else that may
be listening to this, butthey're the audience that
matters most.
Those are our residents.
And then Instagram and Snapchatare our last two and those are
very visually compellingplatforms to us to kind of tell
the story from pictures worth athousand words kind of mentality
.
Steve Morreale (16:08):
I want to ask you this question what's the
secret to pump stuff out onmultiple platforms?
Katie Nelson (16:15):
There's tools out there.
I know there are.
Don't use them.
Steve Morreale (16:19):
Okay, good, so you don't rely on them.
Katie Nelson (16:21):
No, I don't.
I believe in native posting.
For all platforms social media,the language platforms, the
dialects everyone's going tohave something a little bit
different and they're allcompetitors.
So if you have links on oneplatform that lead them to
another platform, facebook's notgoing to like that.
You're sending folks to Twitteror next door, and, especially
with the way that the platformsare continually evolving, they
often lock you out or you haveto have an account to be able to
(16:42):
sign in, and so I don't want tolimit our audiences from being
able to see our content.
So I take the time to be ableto post individually to all of
the platforms, and that alsoreally mitigates a lot of the
potential risk management issuesthat we have in the event that
we have a major incidentinvolving, let's say, an officer
, or there is a critical eventthat has garnered a lot of media
(17:05):
attention.
That is a national story.
I don't want to lookinsensitive because we are
posting about our fluffy caninesand there's a community reeling
from a traumatic incident.
Steve Morreale (17:16):
Oh, I see.
So if you had timed somethinglike that right, yeah, yes, it
would be dispassionate if youdid that, or at least that
somebody could say you're in themiddle of this and you're
talking about yeah, fluffy, wetry and have a high EQ.
Well, that's good.
I appreciate that.
So your job, let's talk abouthow you grab your stories.
Your role is in command staffmeetings.
(17:38):
What access you have to theplayers at the time before a
crisis or in the middle of acrisis?
Katie Nelson (17:45):
So my role if this was not a critical incident, is
I have full access to thedepartment.
I go and I will work withofficer, sergeants, detectives,
whomever to call together theinformation that I am trying to
use to create a post and then,based on my knowledge of how
journalism works typically,whatever the media cycle is here
, I try and time itappropriately so that if I would
(18:06):
like to potentially getcoverage, I time it well enough
I am a member of command staffand that I go to command staff
meetings.
Like I said, I'm not sworn,though, so I am professional
staff.
Steve Morreale (18:16):
But you have a seat at the table right, I do.
You have to, you have to RightGo ahead.
Katie Nelson (18:20):
Oh, thank you.
And then in a critical incident,I report directly to a captain,
so I'm one, basically one stepremoved from the chief.
And so in a critical incident,ideally I sit in the command
post with the chief and eitherthe primary incident commander
or the captain and we assesswhat information goes out, what
that process looks like, howoften we're posting to try and
(18:43):
quell the rumor mill, make surethat the stakeholders within the
city are taken care of and alsothat our community is informed,
and we ride that wave until theconclusion of the event.
Sometimes it's a fairly quickprocess and we get to that kind
of that settling in a few hours.
It could run all day that we'vehad incidents where we've been
running at 16 hours and it'sstill going.
(19:04):
So it's a commitment for sure,especially under my former chief
, chris Chung.
He understood that there wasthis delicate but symbiotic
balance that existed betweencommunity information, public
safety and the care and feedingof all of the players involved
to ensure that everybody feltthat they had access to us, that
they were updated regularly andthat their concerns or their
(19:26):
questions were addressed in anappropriate and efficient manner
.
That's a very delicate balanceto try and maintain.
Steve Morreale (19:31):
So we're talking to Katie Nelson and she's out
in Mountain View, california,with the police department.
She is the social media and PRcoordinator and the PIO and, in
fact, as you are balancing allof these things, what I had said
earlier and one of my petpeeves is, if you're going to
have a footprint using socialmedia for a police department
(19:52):
whether you're a department ofthree, 25 or 5,000, you have to
keep it current, and that's avery, very difficult job to do.
And one of the things that I doin classes that students sort
of like and the first thing I dois I want you to go to your
hometown, I want you to look atthe website for the police
department and critique it, lookat its social media, tell me if
it's up to date, tell me if theinformation you're looking for
(20:14):
is there.
What's missing?
If you were a consultant, whatwould you tell them that people
like yourselves want to knowabout?
And it's quite funny because insome cases, you say they've got
Facebook and they have, I guess,instagram and they haven't
updated it for two weeks.
So once we do it, I think youknow I do it too.
I'm looking for somebody.
I'm going to look it up just ageneral web search.
(20:36):
If I don't find it in the firsttime, I'm just going to move on
to somebody else.
Either keep me posted withinformation or I'll find
somebody else.
So tell me how you keep that upto date.
Katie Nelson (20:46):
I will say people are two things they're dramatic
and they're lazy.
If they have to read a lot orif they have to go searching for
something, you're going to losethose valuable basically that
trust, those deposits in thebank of community trust.
And so ensuring that ourcommunity has regular and timely
information, that's my primaryjob.
So at least five days a week Iam ensuring that we have
something posted on social mediafor them to have access to, be
(21:09):
it something about thedepartment or an incident itself
that occurred in the communitythat we think is of interest.
I have a lot of responsibilityin terms of determining what
constitutes a case or anincident of note, but also just
being present on those platforms.
It's called social listening.
That's huge because if thelonger people have to wait to
hear from you, the more they'regoing to fill in the gaps
themselves or, like you said,they're going to go to another
(21:30):
source of information that mayor may not have accurate,
reflective content orinformation of what we are doing
, what is going on.
It happened yesterday.
We had a homicide in ourcommunity, first one this year.
Knock on what.
Hopefully it's our last.
But people were going andasking their neighbors.
They were on other platformstalking, and if I hadn't been
able to see that and engage andfollow up, who knows where that
(21:51):
story could have gone.
But being able to inform theinvestigators, the command staff
and others about what washappening and what people were
talking about on platforms likeNextdoor, on platforms like Ring
, on platforms like Facebook,that was huge because that sets
in motion hey, we're on aticking clock here, we need to
keep up.
If we don't keep up, we'regoing to become obsolete.
If we become obsolete, we'regoing to get ignored.
(22:13):
And if we get it ignored,that's it, our status, and it's
very much a status symbol ofbeing a primary source of
information.
It takes 1,000 good experiencesto build that up.
It takes one bad experience totear it all down.
I didn't want it to be, and Idon't ever want it to be, one
instance that we basically losethe trust and the faith of our
community.
Steve Morreale (22:30):
That's a big job and a big responsibility,
certainly what has happened overand over again and as we watch
events unfold.
The use of video evidence bothfrom city or municipal sources,
but also from you said Ring,from cameras on people's houses.
How important is that and howimportant is that in some of
your messaging?
Katie Nelson (22:49):
It's huge the more advanced technology becomes,
not just in the social mediarealm but in the realm of home
security footage.
Solving crimes and having thatbe able to recognize an
individual because of clearfootage from home security
cameras has been huge.
It also helps us better piecetogether what exactly happened.
There is always going to begood old-fashioned police work.
(23:11):
You figure it out.
The way that society hasevolved and the way that
technology has evolved can onlyhelp enhance that further.
And so being able to ask forthings like that and have that
community, have that vestedinterest in keeping their city
safe, that's just an added bonusof this outreach that we can
have in a digital space.
We're not going to necessarilybe able to do that by going door
to door.
That takes time, that takeseffort that we may or may not
(23:33):
have.
But social media is expeditesthat process exponentially and
it allows us to reach far morepeople than we would be able to
if we were walking door to doorand our one officer and our one
sergeant would be able toaccomplish.
Steve Morreale (23:46):
So is Katie Nelson adapting to AI.
Katie Nelson (23:49):
Not at this time.
No, because I don't know enoughabout it.
Am I doing research on it?
Absolutely, but the biggestconcerns much like TikTok, this
has been a conversation in ourcity is the access, the
understanding of the softwareand privacy concerns.
So those three things.
I unfortunately don't get tomake any of those decisions on
whether or not we use those.
Use those, but theconversations around that are
(24:11):
happening.
I'll be curious to see, with AIin the next six months to a
year, how fast it evolves, whatgood it is doing for society and
where the pain points orpitfalls are.
Steve Morreale (24:23):
I was just going to say what the pitfalls are.
Yeah, good, good, good.
I think the same myself, as anoutsider that's becoming insider
professional staff, butnonetheless a member of this
police organization.
What were the changes of viewsthat you had coming from the
outside as a reporter and nowbeing on the inside to see
(24:44):
behind the curtain?
Katie Nelson (24:45):
Time.
Time is totally differentinside versus outside.
When I would be at a scene as areporter, I'd be looking at my
watch and I'd be like God, theyare taking forever.
That on the inside is like youblink and suddenly it's two
hours later.
Time is so warped and you neverhave enough of it inside the
tape.
I'll use that at most people'sstand outside the tape versus
(25:07):
inside the tape.
Inside the tape, things aremoving so fast and things are so
chaotic, even if it doesn'tseem like it or if you have a
process in place.
Outside the tape it feels likean eternity waiting.
That doesn't excuse a lawenforcement agency's ability to
communicate, though.
There are still things that canbe done, efforts that can be
made to at least update withwhat you can, whether or not the
(25:28):
investigation itself is, in,whatever phase it is, you can
still share information and notjeopardize the integrity of what
your detectives are trying tohandle or your patrol officers.
Steve Morreale (25:37):
So that's good, and rather than saying no
comment, here's what we can sayand here's what we can't at the
time, and here's the reason wecan't.
And I think what you're tryingto be is transparent, my guess
and to answer the questions thatyou can and to be honest about
those that you can't, becauseExactly how do you approach that
?
Katie Nelson (25:54):
I tell people it's okay to say I don't know, but
as a public servant, it's ourjob to be able to follow up with
.
But I'll find out for you andestablishing those parameters or
those boundaries, either withyour community or with your
reporters, about when they canexpect an update, what that
update could potentially entail,what a process of an
investigation looks like or whatthey can or cannot reveal.
(26:15):
Because, at the end of the day,something else that I learned
was you know, everybody's gotconstitutional rights to a fair
and impartial jury of theirpeers.
Journalists are constantlyhungry for the last little bit
of tidbit of information thatthey can, you know, share with
their readers.
But, as our duty in lawenforcement, we can't take the
jury pool.
There are certain things thatshould be found out throughout
(26:36):
the process of, you know, thejudicial process, not
necessarily in a press releasefrom a law enforcement agency,
and that is a continual stickingpoint.
But it's fascinating to see andbalance everything between the
integrity of the investigationbeing accessible and transparent
, although I find transparent tobe kind of an overused buzzword
, because that's just how itshould be.
(26:56):
It should not be.
People should not have to fightfor information from you ever.
You should be making everyeffort always, because the more
that you are, the more you getugly early.
The more you get out that youare able to, the more people are
going to give you somebreathing room, the less
inclined they're going to be togo somewhere else.
And guess what?
Your phones are going to stopringing, your email is going to
stop going off, because peopleare going to be learned enough
(27:19):
to know that if you do it right,they're just going to be able
to wait.
They're going to know to gowhere you are and receive the
information.
Steve Morreale (27:25):
So you're on the inside now.
I'm assuming that when youbegan the work as a crime report
, that you had a certain respectfor what officers had to do,
but I suppose that that haschanged as you come to know them
in a completely different way.
Yes, so talk about that.
Katie Nelson (27:40):
Honestly, when I was a journalist it was all fun
and games for me.
It was like I got to.
I'm sure I got taken on opsthat I never should have been
taken on to.
I remember one time I was on aride along with the NARC unit,
with a Central Valley agency,and the Detective Sergeant
turned around and looked at meand he said if you hear gunshots
, just duck, don't get out ofthe car.
(28:02):
And like at the time I was likewhoa, this sounds so exciting,
okay.
And then, like 30 seconds later, the bad guy goes running by
the car which was an old Jeep,by the way, not protected at all
with ballistic proof anythingand then the Sergeant runs by me
and he just yells at me he'spassing the car, stay down.
It was all fun and games.
I come here and I see how mucheffort, time away from their
(28:23):
families, long hours, thatpeople put in.
My soon to be husband is aSergeant and he oh, you're
buying into it, Katie, oh yeahthe first several years of our
relationship he was theDetective Sergeant over our
homicide unit, our bureau, andhis phone was going off every
night.
There were times where onweekends it would be we'd be in
(28:45):
the middle of breakfast and he'dhave to go up and investigate.
You know a horrific crime and Ihave the awareness now so much
more, of how much is on the line.
One of our good friends wasshot and wounded in the line of
duty last summer and seeing himjust a couple of hours after he
had been ambushed he's lucky tobe alive and to know that I may
(29:05):
not be able to look at him todayis if things had gone horribly
awry.
I don't think people who arenot in law enforcement are in a
first responder capacity thatincludes firefighters, military.
They don't understand thegravity of how much is carried
that is invisible in this lineof work, what is being offered
up to a vast majority ofstrangers without, for the most
part without any hope ofreciprocity, yeah.
(29:29):
Yeah, and not understanding thecontext and the dedication to
duty and, as you say, sort ofthe we all take, we all make a
promise, we take an oath and weI myself included when we joined
the department, and we don'ttake that lightly.
Steve Morreale (29:41):
Yeah, no, I understand that and, as you said
, and now you're living it ifthat's the case, you're now
going to be married to anofficer and have a relationship.
You understand firsthand, as somany wives do for sure, my own
included, because it's not aneasy job and it's not for the
faint of heart.
What is your aha moment?
You know, at that point in time, here you're a young buck.
(30:02):
You're saying yes, right,you're saying yes, you're going
to be.
They're basically going to openthe curtain and let you, let
you in behind the curtain, butthat curtain has to close too,
to a degree no different that itdoes in the medical profession
than it does in in the writingprofession.
Right, the journalistprofession, schools, there are
certain things that are for thediscipline.
(30:23):
But now you're inside.
What's the aha moment?
You know where did you get thebite?
That this is what I want to do,this is who I want to serve,
this is who I want to help.
Katie Nelson (30:32):
I mean, my grandfather was a captain in the
Navy and so I grew up aroundpublic service in some capacity
and the invisibility of service,because you know people don't
see the acts that go into itevery day and I think I always
liked the idea of lawenforcement, whether or not I
was going to admit it, but myfirst ride along in Lodi,
california, was it?
(30:52):
I remember there was, I was outon a ride along and of course
everything was to use the termout here code, for it was
peaceful, it was quiet, and allof a sudden the radio goes off
and there is a armed robberyinvolving a gun at an auto parts
store in the middle of town.
The suspect is still on scene.
We were clear across the otherside of town and that officer
(31:12):
she flipped on her lights and wehit the gas so hard I'm fairly
certain I felt like a G forceand we made it to this auto
parts store as the guy isbooking it down the road.
Not too far away, any, a pistolwhipped, I think, at least one
individual inside the store andthat rush of oh my God, we're
going to go get the bad guy.
I was 22.
(31:33):
And I just thought this is it?
I could not think of doinganything else, and I had that
bug throughout my journalismcareer.
I made it my mission to developgood rapport and relationships
with all the police departmentsthat I interacted with.
There was a time, though, whenI really knew that something.
There was something else there.
We stopped in and San JoaquinCounty.
(31:53):
They were investigating, orthey had reopened an
investigation into the speedfreak killers.
They were a dynamic, prolificduo that murdered at least a
handful of women and young women, including teenagers, in the
San Joaquin County area in the80s and early 90s, and there was
just something.
I was the day before I was setto interview one of them.
(32:15):
He was up for parole.
He hung himself, and I thoughtthere was just something weird
about that, and I was like whatisn't he's telling people?
Why is you know?
Why are all these people leftto wonder?
Three months later, I get a call.
They had started to dig out ina remote area of the county, and
I ended up connecting with adetective out there, and he said
get out here.
We found some bones and talkingwith the families, basically
(32:38):
going through the entirere-greaving process, with one
family in particular after theirdaughter had been found on a
hillside.
Her clothes were still fairlyintact I mean, she had withered
away quite a bit, but there wasstill hair and this husband and
wife they had been through helland back and then they were
revisiting it and I got to gothrough that entire process with
(32:59):
them and it was such an honoras morbid as that sounds it was
such an honor to be invited intothat space and to see this
happen and understand just howmuch it meant to have some
semblance of understanding notclosure per se, but
understanding of what wasfinally going to happen to their
daughter.
And I was able to go to thefuneral and I was able to stay
(33:20):
in touch with them after, andthat left a mark.
Steve Morreale (33:24):
So what you're saying here and when I bring it
back to the police departmentand the officers that do the
work day in and day out and haveto work overtime and have to
hunt and have to put their liveson the line, it seems to me
that one of the things that youare trying to do is to humanize
the police officer, that theyhave families, that they have
(33:48):
difficulties, that they haveillnesses and yet they still do
their job.
And so I presume these are someof the stories you're looking
for to share the good thingsthat people are willing to do,
not just chase bad guys.
Katie Nelson (34:01):
Yes, and that exists every day.
There were my soon to behusband, two years ago now had
to oversee the investigation ofa woman who allegedly murdered
her newborn son and the impactand toll that that and I have a
five year old stepdaughter, sothat she was three at the time
the impact that that had on him.
(34:22):
He ended up writing a note tothe public about here's how this
is impacting us.
So I had been through theprocess of seeing a cold case
basically start to have someclosure there.
This was an active case wherethat baby had been through
unimaginable horrors and he andhis team investigated this and I
don't know that he had ever hada case like that before.
And watching him process that,watching that team process that
(34:44):
and stay here until all hours tofind the evidence, to try and
have that be a clear cutpresentation to the district
attorney's office of she knewwhat she was doing.
Here's how we know.
And then just the emotional tollthey're all parents watching
them having to carry home thatburden.
That was not only hard to watchbut I was so proud of how
(35:06):
dedicated they were in spite ofthe horrors that they saw and
knowing what they were going tohave to look at when they get
home and feel that connection orthat anger or that sadness.
They worked around the clock,they did not stop, and that has
been time and again.
They have done that for variouscases and for various people,
and the justice that they seekfor the victims is unimaginable,
(35:27):
and it is.
I said this is a nobleprofession, it absolutely is,
and there are a lot of noblepeople here.
That's good to hear.
Steve Morreale (35:34):
So we're going to wind down and we're talking
to Katie Nelson.
She's out in Mountain View,california, today and
representing the Mountain ViewPolice Department.
What I would ask is you do anawful lot of training and you
are an advocate for using socialmedia and how to best deal with
the media, and what kinds ofadvice can you give to an
(35:57):
organization that has dabbled insocial media but probably has
not yet mastered it or made it apriority?
What kind of advice can yougive?
Katie Nelson (36:06):
I would say the best piece of advice would be to
understand that silence in adigital space, in an article, in
an interview, anywhere, butespecially in a digital space,
silence is an answer In thecourt of public opinion, the
highest court in the land rightnow, silence is the most damning
and most damaging thing to anorganization's reputation,
especially in law enforcement.
(36:27):
You may not be comfortable inthis space, but you've got to
get comfortable because this isthe nature of the beast.
Now it is not feedingjournalists for their stories to
be printed or to be put ontheir website or to be put on
the 10 or 11 o'clock news.
The playing field has beenleveled by social media.
You have a key opportunity andchance now to have your voice,
be at the forefront and to be inthe driver's seat of
(36:49):
information, especially when itcomes to your story, your
narrative.
If you are not there on socialmedia in particular, you are
giving somebody else the keys tothe kingdom.
You're handing it over andsaying here's the license to
tell our story for us, whetheror not they're going to do a
good job at it.
Everybody in the department whoserves in a role, especially as
a social media coordinator, as aPIO.
They are the ones who are ableto best begin the process of
(37:11):
articulating the true story of adepartment.
Afford your agency and affordthe profession the opportunity
to negate this narrative that wehave been seeing for so long
now about what law enforcementis assumed to be.
A lot of those assumptions arenot true or they're not real,
but it's time that peopleunderstand.
The fastest, easiest way to dothat is to be present in a
digital space.
Steve Morreale (37:31):
Here's my yaba Yaba Katie.
For God's sakes, how manyplatforms are there Now?
You added next door.
I've got to be on next door.
I've got to be on X, I've gotto be on Instagram, I've got to
be on Meta.
What's important, devil'sadvocate.
Katie Nelson (37:47):
I know what's important to your community.
That's how we know.
We ask them where do you preferto communicate?
We don't have the luxuryanymore of asking people to come
to us.
We need to go where they are tostart, the sooner you can be in
their space and present intheir environment.
When it comes to at least theircommunication preferences,
you're going to chip away atthat barrier or that trust gap
that exists because of what hashappened over the last several
(38:09):
years.
Steve Morreale (38:09):
Yeah, I mean, I think what you just raised is
something I hadn't thought aboutin a long time.
If ever, I'm a big one forpushing surveys out and asking
how they feel.
Have you interacted with us?
How are you treated?
What can we do better?
But imagine if one of thequestions is where do you get
your news?
Where do you get?
Intro (38:27):
your information.
Steve Morreale (38:28):
How can we communicate with you In social
media and give them a list?
That's a great piece of advice.
Thank you very much for that.
That's great.
Katie Nelson (38:37):
Welcome.
Steve Morreale (38:38):
So what's that last thing?
What's on your bucket list?
What are you having to do?
What's on your to-do list forthe rest of the week or for the
rest of the month?
Katie Nelson (38:44):
It's so funny.
I have my to-do list right hereof the things that I want to
accomplish over the nextbasically year.
Something that I have beenhoping to achieve is to have a
more holistic, robust anddetailed critical incident
response model that can bescaled or replicated at any size
(39:04):
agency small, medium, large.
One of the best agencies that Ihave seen do that is the
Metropolitan Police Departmentand the New Zealand Police
Department.
They have just been able toachieve levels of response and
information sharing that arestill hit or miss here in the
United States.
So my bucket list is toactually speak with them and get
their perspective and theiroutlines on how this looks, so
(39:27):
that at least here in the UnitedStates we can begin to have a
better foundational practice forcritical incident response
models.
When it comes specifically tocommunication, I'm not talking
about tactics or operation.
I'm talking specifically aboutensuring that our internal and
external stakeholders are takencare of when it comes to
understanding what is happeningwith our department.
Steve Morreale (39:45):
That's great.
Well, it's been a pleasure tofinally connect with you.
I really appreciate it.
We've been talking to KatieNelson, and she is the social
media and public relationscoordinator at Mountain View,
california, someone who startedin wine.
And here's a question you saidyou weren't drinking wine.
Did you change?
Katie Nelson (40:01):
Oh yes.
So okay, so now you learned,you inherited that.
Steve Morreale (40:05):
So, thank you.
This is great to be able totalk about, so important to talk
about social media and what youdo and sharing.
I appreciate it.
So thank you very, very much.
Katie Nelson (40:15):
Thank you.
Steve Morreale (40:15):
So that's it.
Another episode is in the can.
We thank you for listening.
We want you to stay safe.
Keep up the good work, despitethe noise.
Stay tuned for more episodes.
I'm Steve Morreale The CopDocPodcast.
Intro (40:26):
Thanks, Thanks for listening to The CopDoc Podcast
with Dr Steve Morreale.
Steve is a retired lawenforcement practitioner and
manager, turned academic andscholar from Worcester State
University.
Please tune into The CopDocPodcast for regular episodes of
interviews with thought leadersin policing.
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