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June 25, 2025 26 mins
Sean Brace opens the Daily Ticket talking Phillies-Astros Game 2 as the Phils drop the opener, 
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Episode Transcript

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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Number one on your car radio preset hand the new
and improved Diehard Radio app w D A S and
w D two seven three D Philadelpia is Fox Sports Radio.

Speaker 2 (00:08):
The Gambler.

Speaker 1 (00:40):
Story two and that's driven out toward right center field
and hit pretty well, long run for Rojas.

Speaker 2 (00:45):
Look you gotta see that.

Speaker 1 (00:48):
Opposite field hold for Cooper Hubble, head of the Astros
bowl pen.

Speaker 2 (00:52):
What nothing Euston. Here's the two two twang.

Speaker 1 (00:56):
And the best hand hold up on the fastball away.
In fact, is the ballgame Cooper Hubbles home run in
the eighth inning the difference tonight as the Astros defeat
the Philadelphia Phillies once to nothing. Cannons are blazing out
there in h Town HS down on the rise. Of course, Unfortunately,

(01:19):
I have to open up with the fact that the
Phillies ended up losing a tough one last night, one
two nothing. Good afternoon, everybody Sean Brace on a daily
ticket with you here, still hot, still rolling solo on
a Wednesday NBA Draft this evening. Major League Baseball action
as we speak, got some other odds and ends to
get to as far as NFL is concerned. Some shifting

(01:41):
of some movement how about some line movement. Yeah, on
June to twenty fifth. Very interesting. We'll get into a
little bit of that. And oh, by the way, I
always have to correct something. Yeah, this is an issue.
I'm live by myself. I do a show. I know better.
I know better to trust the internet, no better. And

(02:01):
if you listened yesterday, as soon as I said it,
I go, just want to put out there.

Speaker 2 (02:06):
And I normally am not that guy.

Speaker 1 (02:09):
You know, I'm not the allegedly Yeah, like if you
just say allegedly, you're you're good to go, right, Like,
no one's gonna press any charges. Allegedly that's what they said, Allegedly,
this is what took place, Allegedly. I am not that
type of person. But as I was saying yesterday, I go,
you know, this could be something that did not take place.

(02:33):
And I know that everybody is running with it right
now on the timeline, and I'll get into it a
little bit later. I'm not gonna open up with it.
But that was shame on me. So I have to
offer a correction, not an apology. I'm not afraid to
apologize from time to time, but a correction, all right.
Remember they used to do that at the papers. I'm
sure they still do three days later. Oh, we made

(02:56):
an error all the way at the bottom of C six.
All right, let's talk about the Phillies and the Ashtros
last night and June to twenty fourth ball game Tuesday
evening in Houston, won nothing a final score. We talked
a lot about that game yesterday with Kyle Fisher. Great
pitching matchup between Valdez and Ranger Suarez. Lineups that have potential.

(03:19):
But you knew that the Juices were gonna be going.
It was a low, low number at seven and a half.
The Phillies I thought were a decent play at plus
one twenty nine, just because of the performances that Ranger
Suarez has been giving the Phillies as of late, basically
this whole season since he's come back. You know, Ultimately,
I thought that they were a good play. And it's

(03:40):
one you take on your chin, right, It's one that
you say it's a loss.

Speaker 2 (03:45):
It was the wrong side.

Speaker 1 (03:47):
But all in all, plus one twenty nine for the
fightings down there in Houston. Give it to me anyways,
one nothing, as I said, you as your final score,
a total of nine hits. We talked a lot about
the shrikeouts yesterday with Ranger Suarez and his was at
four and a half at minus one forty five, if
I'm not mistaken, so extremely juiced up. But you knew

(04:07):
he was going to get that number as he's hit
it every single time out this season when it's been
four and a half. But bottom line, as he got
to seven, he went over the six is what I said.
I would stretch it up to, which got you into
plus money. But as you heard, it's a tough pill
to swallow in the eighth inning, and you know the
Cooper Hummel comes up left fielder. Who oh, by the way,

(04:31):
if I'm not mistaken at this point in time, I
thought they said last.

Speaker 2 (04:38):
Night on the broadcast his only home run? Is that correct?
Why can't I find it here?

Speaker 1 (04:44):
He got at bats, runs, hits, doubles, triples, there it is.
It's a second home run on the season. So not
a guy that's known for exactly what he did last night.
But credit where credit is due. Ranger Suarez made a
mistake on the pitch. He took an opposite field and
that was all she wrote. But you know it's funny
because I was looking at my timeline earlier today and

(05:05):
Harry Mays, the great Harry Mace We're Swinging and Inger,
which will be coming up today six pm.

Speaker 2 (05:10):
Said he enjoyed. He enjoyed that game. I'm right there
with you here.

Speaker 1 (05:16):
You know it's funny and this isn't you know anything, Harry,
I just I was laughing at the fact that, like,
you know, we have to put something out there like that,
I or do we right?

Speaker 2 (05:26):
Like? Was that not universal last night for people.

Speaker 1 (05:30):
To watch those two lefties, those Southpaws dueling it out,
performing at that type of level with these two teams
that are in first place, that potentially could give us
a rematch from two years ago in the Fall Classic.
If you didn't like, if you didn't enjoy that game
last night, I want to hear from you.

Speaker 2 (05:50):
Why how did you not tune into that game?

Speaker 1 (05:53):
Going you know what, eh, I'd rather see a game
that's six to five or give me some home runs. No,
that was awesome. It was two great pitchers where we
built them up. They didn't need it all that much.
They've been performing hell that is now excuse me, I
think nine straight starts for Valdez to be undefeated, to

(06:15):
come away with the Victor and I think eight out
of his last nine as far as wins is concerned,
dude's been on fire.

Speaker 2 (06:19):
It's been incredible. But we know what he's capable of.

Speaker 1 (06:24):
We watched the firsthand, and I know he had his
moments where people were like ah again last year, I
think there were a good stretch that the batters were
able to get around on him, and we're knocking him
around pretty good. But that's a guy that I would
love to tow the rubber, as they say for me
every fifth day.

Speaker 2 (06:44):
Again, I loved it. That was a great game.

Speaker 1 (06:46):
I'm stealing Harry's sweet on that one because I would
love to get anybody's thoughts that would look at that
game and say, you.

Speaker 2 (06:52):
Know what, it was boring, it was a dud.

Speaker 1 (06:54):
I want some action, I want some energy, I want
some juice, and I think we're gonna butt heads over that.
So if you want to get involved to that conversational piece,
please do so. A fox PHL gambler, F Fox PHL Gambler.

Speaker 2 (07:06):
You gotta roll on and.

Speaker 1 (07:07):
This is what it's all about, because guess what, Zach
Wheeler on the mound tonight in game two. Here for
the fightings taken on the Houston Astros Game two in Houston.
Of course, uh eight ten eight o five first pitch
eight ten eight ten first pitch minus won sixty four
for Zach Wheeler and Colton Gordon getting the start tonight

(07:31):
for the Houston Nationals. We'll talk a little bit about
Gordon and why he's getting to start this evening, but
bottom line is, you have to look at the Phillies
here and that's why they're priced up as high as
they are at minus one sixty four. Wheeler on the mounds.
Seven and a half is our total. Again, this is
the reason why I look at Zach Wheeler as a
potential really good pick for Cy Young. The money was

(07:52):
there eleven to one, twelve to one in some shops,
just as last week was concerned. I know there's a
guy by the name of Paul Skeens who is actually
pitching and having trouble today. How about that, sports fans, Wow.
In the fourth inning, the Pirates are now trailing the
brew Crew four to nothing. I think Skeens had a
high pitch cow heading into the second inning. Let me

(08:13):
go ahead and pull that up real quick as far
as what he did today, and I'm not gonna sit here.

Speaker 2 (08:18):
And say, oh, now now's the time to fire on him. No, no, no,
no again.

Speaker 1 (08:22):
Prices are what prices are, and they're gonna fluctuate throughout
the course of one sixty two. So if you don't
see a price you like right now, maybe it will
change over the next two to three weeks, month, whatever
it may be, and then you could get more involved
with the award season as far as cy Young's are concerned.
But right now, let's see here you have Why is

(08:42):
this not working for me? Excuse me, I'm struggling with
the computer. Yeah, he gave up four runs in the
second inning, so Skeen's currently still in the game. Four hits,
four earned, two walks, four strikeouts. With that Lo Lo
Lo still one point eight five ERA. Anyways, back over

(09:02):
to Zach Wheeler tonight. You gotta like him again. That's
a Houston Astros lineup that does not strike out a lot,
so that could potentially be something that I'm targeting. I
know everybody lives to take Zach Wheeler over on the strikeouts.
It's not something that maybe I would be pushing tonight.
Let's take a look at what those numbers are right here,
right now. As far as Zach Wheeler on DraftKings Sportsbook,

(09:24):
the total four Wheeler tonight is eight plus at plus
one thirty six and a half is the under at
plus one twenty. It's a good number. It's Zach Wheeler.
I hate to say the under there, but I'm probably
gonna if he gave me seven and a half, I
would love to take it on that one, but six
and a half.

Speaker 2 (09:44):
I could see him getting around that number. I would
still take the.

Speaker 1 (09:47):
Under plus one twenty on Wheeler. Definitely not taking the
over at six and a half. That mightus won fifty five.

Speaker 2 (09:51):
Like I said, that is a.

Speaker 1 (09:52):
Good, good Astros lineup that does not strike out a lot.
So something to keep in mind there as far as
that is concerned. Again, all eyes on the Phillies and
the Houston Astros. I saw MLB Networked did a huge
breakdown on them earlier this morning. Of course, ESPN spent
a little bit of time on it because just two
great pitchers going head to head and oh, by the way,

(10:14):
you just look at what the season's success is right
here right now, both teams in first place. It would
not shock me if the Astros are potential to win
the American League.

Speaker 2 (10:23):
I think there's some good money to be made.

Speaker 1 (10:25):
We went over those odds yesterday, no reason to do
so right now, but ultimately it's a weak American League.

Speaker 2 (10:31):
You got the Yankees, you got.

Speaker 1 (10:33):
The Detroit Tigers, and you have the Houston Astros and
a pretty big drop off to the rest. For my money, again,
I think you look over in the National League, as
we were discussing as well yesterday, the National League. I
don't put the Mets in the category as World Series contenders.

Speaker 2 (10:49):
I just don't.

Speaker 1 (10:50):
I would look at the Cubs as more of a
World Series contender than the New York Mets. I would
look at the Reds potentially as contenders just because of
a p and I know that, you know, you look around,
everyone's got flaws. But I'm just not sold on what
the Mets are as far as a rotation is concerned.
Great bats, great offense, pretty big drop off from one

(11:12):
through four through the rest of the order. But you know,
when you look at the league as a whole, nationally
and American League both, and you're looking for value, looking
for plays. At this point in time on June to
twenty fifth, I would probably say that there is a
better chance of Houston and the American League being a
little bit more of a contender as a whole than

(11:32):
the National League. But anyways, we'll talk more about the
big picture stuff as the summer rolls on. Here, right here,
right now, Let's remove the World Series conversation, please if
you want to mind, and let's talk a little bit
more about tonight's game again, Gordon. He will be making
his first start against the Phillies, the first interleague appearance
for him. He was a triple A guy brought up,

(11:55):
and he has issued five walks, has struck out thir
thirty four in seven start, So something to.

Speaker 2 (12:01):
Keep your eye on right now.

Speaker 1 (12:04):
As far as where I'm at with him, potentially, the
book isn't out there, but I do like the chances
for this Phillies lineup to go down there, especially after
what took place last night. You gotta imagine, you have
to imagine that if you're in the offense and they
go out there and you're not able to get a
run home and your pitcher goes out Mo's down seven,
gives you eight solid, seven plus solid, and you still

(12:27):
lose that game. It's gonna it's gonna irk you a
little bit. It's gonna frustrate you a little bit, and
you better not follow up by not giving run.

Speaker 2 (12:36):
Support to your ace and Zach Wheeler.

Speaker 1 (12:39):
So I do like the Phillies' chances this evening to
go down there and get that victory again. Wheeler on
the mount so you know it's juiced up at once
again here on a DraftKings sportsbook. Minus one sixty four
plus one forty four for Colton A.

Speaker 2 (12:54):
Gordon.

Speaker 1 (12:55):
Just not a good game really to talk about anything
from the offensive side for the Phillies.

Speaker 2 (13:00):
Struggles across the board.

Speaker 1 (13:01):
Oh and oh for seven with runners in scoring position
last night, so hopefully that will change. Of course, it
starts and ends there. You gotta produce on the offensive side.
I do believe Wheeler will get the job done again
under on the strikeouts. Give me to Phillies minus one
sixty four all right, from the fightings in the world
of Major League Baseball over if you would not mind

(13:23):
to the NFL the NBA draft, as I have NFL
draft written down, but you know they use it both there.
It's the NBA draft chime and the NFL draft chime,
but a big one for us here in Philadelphia. Of
course seventy six ers with the third overall pick, who
will they be selecting? Money Money, Money Money coming in

(13:44):
on VJ Edgecomb Right now, most sportsbooks are floating around
the minus seven hundred minus seven to fifty minus eight hundred.

Speaker 2 (13:50):
It is looking like this will be VJ Edgecomb.

Speaker 1 (13:53):
Sam Austry's gonna join me coming up at about four
oh five later today. From the score, we will die
sacked all things VJ edgeco.

Speaker 2 (14:01):
Where does he fit the expectations next year?

Speaker 1 (14:04):
And that's one of the big questions that I have
today is number one, is Darryl Morey not on the
hot seat? Like you know, Mark, hevery junior hopped on
the show yesterday and he made a great case on
why he's not in my mind in his mind, and
he did say that he was probably going to be

(14:24):
in the minority with that take.

Speaker 2 (14:26):
But I don't care about that.

Speaker 1 (14:28):
I like big picture question and I know professional sports
aren't what we do on a day to day, But
if you were hired to deliver and let's say you're
hired to deliver ratings to a radio station, you're hired
to deliver ratings to a television show, You're hired to

(14:52):
one of my friends left a bread company to take
on another bread company, and he was brought in to
help out sales, right, to take some of his partnerships
that he's built up over the years, the relationships that
are the foundation everything being successful in the business world.
To carry that over, sure to the new destination. But
at the end of that destination, and the fine print

(15:15):
of that contract is, yeah, we're paying you X, but
this is what we expect and if you don't meet
those numbers, what are we doing? We gotta find somebody else.
Darryl Moray has not delivered for the seventy six ers,
right like, this team has not been a success under
Darryl Morray.

Speaker 2 (15:35):
Correct.

Speaker 1 (15:36):
Sure, you could find some things that he's done, right, Sure,
you can look at some draft picks that you're like, damn,
Daryl Moray had the eye for that great job. But
this team has not gotten to the promised land. This
team has not taken the step that we expected them
to take. In the last two to three seasons. They

(15:56):
have been the better team in some of those spots.
They had an opportunity to be Boston in that series
with the Game six at home and choked, right like,
you're hired to be fired ultimately in all things professional sports.
But Daryl Morey, like, what type of lifeline is this
guy on? If his seat isn't hot, what are we

(16:17):
doing or are we living in right now? This is Philadelphia.
You gotta deliver. You gotta bring me a championship. You
have to give me a path to an Eastern Conference finals.
You gotta take me to an NBA finals. And oh,
by the way, something that we have at bed for
over two damn duck Aids. I'll tell you what I

(16:40):
am excited about this. This is the first time that
I've actually had juice for the seventy six ers since
November last year was so disappointing that it pained me
to get home, put my butt on the couch and
watch them for two plus hours.

Speaker 2 (16:59):
It pays.

Speaker 1 (17:02):
First time that actually have a little bit of positive juice,
positive energy to talk about this franchise and what's going
to take place tonight. Don't you dare screw it up
by trading back. Go and get the player and hopefully VJ.
Edgecomb is the guy and he will turn into something
that can contribute next year.

Speaker 2 (17:22):
What that is?

Speaker 1 (17:23):
I really am all over the place when it comes
to expectations, I don't really have much, just because I
don't know where he fits on the roster, who's coming back.
We still got to answer those questions. But Sean Bnard
and I were talking, and Seawan's coming up a little
bit later at five o'clock. Again we're front and center
off things NBA draft tonight. Sean said twenty five plus minutes.

(17:45):
I guess if you're the third overall pick in the
NBA Draft, you better find a way on the floor.
Else we might have a little bit of a mistake.
But you look around what that roster potentially could be
versus what it was last year with the expectations, I
don't know. I don't really see that type of minutes
coming his way. But again I could be wrong, and

(18:05):
I do know this. If I am wrong with the
expectation as far as PT is concerned for Edgecombe or
whoever date select that three, it's probably a good thing.
That means he's a hell of a lot better than
what I think he is at this current time of
his career.

Speaker 2 (18:19):
All these guys are so young.

Speaker 1 (18:21):
Edgecombe nineteen, you know, Cooper Flag's eighteen, Aacet Bailey's eighteen,
you know, like you just look at some of these guys.
And Jared Smith had a good take. Our good friend
Jared Smith was talking about the nil and how much
of it has changed for a lot of players that
are coming out early. But you know, when you are
discussed in the top five, top ten picks, you know

(18:43):
you've been told that for a long time. That's not
going to change. But man, these guys are so young,
so the expectations for them to come in and have
an impact on this team with the roster they're currently
constructed with guys who you know are going to play
if healthy. If then we'll see what happen weapons again.
NBA Draft tonight and we will be all over for

(19:04):
you tomorrow, recap and everything. We're gonna be live a
little bit later tonight via the timeline and also Sean
Barnard will be doing stuff for DraftKings DK network.

Speaker 2 (19:14):
He's gonna be running a live blogs.

Speaker 1 (19:16):
We're gonna see ways that we can push that on
all of our timelines, but we will go live immediately
following a pick.

Speaker 2 (19:22):
And who knows, I do know this much. We have
had some fireworks already in the NBA offseason.

Speaker 1 (19:29):
It just started the NBA Finals just finished up on
Sunday night. Did you pay attention? Did you watch? Were
you one of the sixteen million that did tune in?
As high as nineteen million? Still low as hell for
a Game seven? But I digress. The NBA season just
wrapped up on Sunday. We've already had major trades, three

(19:54):
of them in fact, if I'm not mistaken, only three,
probably more, but one or two from the Boston Celtics,
a team that we thought were going to win it
all last year or at least make the NBA Finals
to take on the Oklahoma City Thunder. Was not the case.
Indiana was the better team. Boston did not get past

(20:14):
the Knicks and get an opportunity to play in the
NBA Finals. Don't know what would have happened, but bottom line is,
the front office for the Boston Celtics said enough is enough.
It's time to move off of big time contracts between
Drew Holiday and Christaps Porzingis. And now there's rumors out
there that potentially other Boston Celtic players could be on

(20:35):
the move. Look, I'm all for clearing house, trying to
or not clearing house, but clearing some some contracts porzingis.

Speaker 2 (20:45):
I think you got what you wanted. You got the championship, right.

Speaker 1 (20:49):
The rest is Gravy Drew Holiday somewhat of an injury
last year, right, But I don't remember Drew to be
too much of an injury prone type of player. I
could be mistaken on that. And it was easy getting
a little bit older, so you understand, you want to
get a little bit younger. And it was a good
trade from Boston's perspective. Simons is a good player and

(21:10):
the picks that came in on their way. But here
we are, just three days since the NBA Finals ended.
We've had pretty big trades taking place this week. We
got the draft going down tonight, so you know we're
going to see some shucking in jiving up there in Brooklyn.
We're off and running right now. What will the Knicks do?

(21:32):
Are they going to be making moves? Doesn't seem like that.
You know, they were one of the bigger topics as
far as conversation is concerned. Teams that would make moves
have to get that roster right. Cat staying, I think
we might see some fireworks this evening. I do I
wonder if our guests will be in agreement with me.

(21:53):
Julian Edlow from DraftKings. Great day to have Julian as
he's normally on a Thursday, today's Wednesday with the NBA,
so he's joining us here. He'll give us the perspective
on Boston. You're without Jason Tatum for a pretty good
portion next year. And now I'm hearing and reading again
rumors and you Windo, you want to believe what you

(22:13):
want to believe that Jalen Brown could potentially be traded?
What I just I know when you win a championship
and they have multiple to speak on, no doubt about it.
They've been a very successful franchise. Sometimes you got to
just trust the process. That team has earned that one
if you want to use it for them. But if

(22:36):
I was a fan of the Boston Celtics and I'm
without Tatum and you move Jalen Brown, I don't know
if there was anything back in return that would calm
me down, I would be irked to ump degree. I'd
be hot. Those dudes did it? Jalen Brown performed at

(22:59):
a high level, won a championship. Did it happen last year? No?

Speaker 2 (23:03):
Guess what.

Speaker 1 (23:03):
It's tough to repeat. That's why that seven straight different
NBA champions It is tough to repeat. I know we
all want to give okay, see, next year's championship could
very well happen their favorites at plus two forty, but
it's tough.

Speaker 2 (23:22):
I do know this.

Speaker 1 (23:23):
Jaylen Brown Jason Tatum are two key pieces that I
would rather have on my team than not. And as
I said, Tatum's gonna miss a significant portion next year,
and you're gonna move Brown. I'm not buying it, but
we'll find out from Julian Edlow what's real and what's not.
We'll also give the betting perspective from tonight's game or
tonight's draft. Excuse me as far as money and odds

(23:45):
moving numbers all over the place, and if there is
any possible value for us to fire the day of
the draft. Normally the numbers are so locked in at
this point in time, juiced up that really, you know,
if you need to make some money and you're looking
to make money on the NBA Draft two to three
weeks ago, a month ago would have been the time.

(24:06):
But information pays, and sometimes things slipped into cracks. Julian
is normally pretty good on top of all that, and
he does a great job covering all things for a
DraftKings sports book. He'll join us coming up here in
just about five minutes. Again, we got a lot to
get to, some dumb, good conversations, fun conversations, big time conversations.
One that I would like to get into just a

(24:28):
real quick jab Last night, as I don't know if
you saw this, but a fan in the White Sox
White Sox Arizona Diamondbacks made a comment from the field
and could tell Marte literally started crying on the field,

(24:49):
and you would just wonder, what the hell could somebody
have said? And immediately you think racial right wasn't the
case this fan who has now been banned from White
Sox games, and if I'm not mistaken, banned from all
MLB parks, which is a good thing. I say, we
make them famous, put them on the camera, let's see
who it was. Let's hear you know, we got a

(25:09):
million one podcast out there, Get this guy in a podcast,
love to hear it, and then let's set up Marte
for an opportunity to go one on one with this spectator,
this idiot. Anyways, he made a comment about Marte's mother
who passed away, I believe to a car accident a
few years ago and the Dominican Republic. Dude literally had

(25:31):
to stop the game and be consoled. It was sad.
It was very sad. They want to update the story.
As I said, dudes banned from all parks, which is
a good thing. But man, that was crazy. And I
know there's some dumb, dumb guming.

Speaker 2 (25:47):
Back in my day out there, but.

Speaker 1 (25:50):
I'll tell you what to be able to hear something
like that. Man, that's just crazy to me. But we
can't be having that. Be better people out there on man,
crazy story out of Chicago with the White Sox.

Speaker 2 (26:03):
We do have a day game action. As a matter
of fact, they are in action.

Speaker 1 (26:06):
Oh by the way, and credit to the White Sox
who put up a billboard out in center field saying
that baseball is family. We stand with Heel Marte. I
thought that was a very nice job by the Chicago
White Sox. Give them a tip of the cap on
that one. And currently lead four to two in that
game against the Dimebags. So, like I said, a bunch
of odds and ends we're gonna get to but all

(26:27):
eyes on tonight's NBA draft.

Speaker 2 (26:30):
Julian Edlow will joined me on.

Speaker 1 (26:32):
The other side from DraftKings, Sports, Boob Jail and Brown
potentially on the move.

Speaker 2 (26:37):
What type of percentage has he even given that?

Speaker 1 (26:39):
Has he given it out any thought and doesn't make
the least bit of sense to Julian Edlow from Boston.

Speaker 2 (26:45):
He'll join me on the other side, so daily ticket
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Current and classic episodes, featuring compelling true-crime mysteries, powerful documentaries and in-depth investigations. Follow now to get the latest episodes of Dateline NBC completely free, or subscribe to Dateline Premium for ad-free listening and exclusive bonus content: DatelinePremium.com

Bookmarked by Reese's Book Club

Bookmarked by Reese's Book Club

Welcome to Bookmarked by Reese’s Book Club — the podcast where great stories, bold women, and irresistible conversations collide! Hosted by award-winning journalist Danielle Robay, each week new episodes balance thoughtful literary insight with the fervor of buzzy book trends, pop culture and more. Bookmarked brings together celebrities, tastemakers, influencers and authors from Reese's Book Club and beyond to share stories that transcend the page. Pull up a chair. You’re not just listening — you’re part of the conversation.

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