Unlocking the Secrets of Cellular Aging: A Conversation with Dr. Nichola Conlon

Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:04):
Hi everyone, welcome to another episode of the Daria
el podcast.
This episode is going to belife changing.
Now, the only way it's going tobe life changing if you sit and
listen until the very end, asthis is going to be a very in
depth conversation that willaffect not just your health and

(00:26):
well-being but the way you lookat your body and the way you
look at your lifestyle and theway you look at medicine today.
So today's guest, dr NicolaConlon.
She's a molecular biologistspecializing in the study of
cellular aging.
So she has a very uniquebackground since, after a career
in drug development, she wentinto the private sector and

(00:51):
founded her own company calledNuchito Laboratories to deliver
disruptive innovation in thefield of aging and rejuvenation,
as well as health span.
So a little bit to hereducation.
She received her PhD inphysiology and molecular biology
from Newcastle University,which is home of one of the

(01:13):
largest institutions in agingresearch in the world and
certainly the largest in Europe,and so I'm really excited to
pick her brain on.
What is it that we canpractically do today like
literally starting afterlistening to this podcast

(01:33):
practically adopt to improve ourhealth, and not just as far as
longevity, meaning living longerand we're going to talk about
those definition but also livinghealthier, which is, I think,
more interesting, at least forme personally.
So, nicola, welcome to mypodcast and before we, you know,

(01:59):
dive into the science Now.
You left a very lucrative jobin drug development and decided
to take on the risk of becomingan entrepreneur and create your
own supplement company, like.
Can you please explain to us,because this is such a huge

(02:22):
shift?
There must have been somethingcompelling that you have
experienced during your careerand education that made you do
that.
Could you kind of walk usthrough that moment where you
made that decision and how didit come about?

Speaker 2 (02:39):
Yeah, that's a great question because when I made
that decision, a lot of peoplearound me said you're crazy.
Like what are you doing?
You've got this amazing jobthat you've studied so hard to
get working in drug development.
You know you're leadingprojects designing drugs that
are going to help people, butactually I'd become quite

(03:01):
disillusioned with the world ofdrug development.
Well, for two main reasons.
The first was that it justtakes so long for any scientific
breakthrough to actually gettranslated and go all the way
through to the clinic.
We've got this hugetranslational gap.
You know different people saydifferent numbers, but you're
looking at around 15 years fromthings being first discovered in

(03:24):
a scientific, academiclaboratory and then actually
going all the way through allthe development, the trials and
getting it to a person that canactually benefit from it.
So for me that's just crazy.
That's some of the things I wasworking on.
We're never going to helpanyone anytime soon.
And secondly, the other thing Inoticed was that a lot of
molecules that worked reallywell when we were testing them

(03:47):
in our experiments were not drugmolecules.
They were molecules that werenatural molecules, things that
were found in foods andnutrients and, you know, things
that were already regulated asdietary supplements.
And in some cases they wereoutperforming some of the
molecules that we were going toinvest hundreds of millions in.
But companies aren't interestedin them if they can't patent

(04:10):
them because they're not drugsor they're not, you know,
chemical molecules that peopledon't already own or know about.
So you know, I was looking atthis situation where I was like
hang on a minute.
We are got all of thesemolecules that actually work
well in fixing what we want tofix in the body and addressing

(04:31):
the problems we want to address,but we're putting them in the
bin and we're not doing anythingabout them, even though we
already know they're welltolerated, they're safe, and
just because of commercialreasons, which I understand, but
we're not going to pursue them.
But ethically, this is wrong.
You know, we should be doingsomething with this.
So that's what.
That was the moment that mademe sort of decide hang on, why

(04:55):
don't I start a company thatdoes all of the same research,
development, testing that adrugs company does?
But rather than look at thedrugs, let's look at the things
that we can get into consumerproducts and get to market
quickly, so we can actually getthis science to people in the
meantime.

Speaker 1 (05:12):
So, from a business standpoint, it is like this
podcast is also somewhat aboutbusiness and entrepreneurship,
even though today's topic ismainly going to focus around
health and wellness.
But what was the compellingmoment?
What was the moment where youdecided to let go a lucrative

(05:36):
job, a well-paying job?
Because there's a lot of peoplethat currently work at their
job and there are some ethicalbattles going around based on
what they experience and whatthey see.
But because they get paid, well, they just kind of close an eye
on it and just go with it andkind of shrug their shoulders

(05:59):
and say, oh well, there'snothing I can do about it.
I'm just working here and aslong as I'm getting paid and
putting bread on the table andcan feed my family, I don't want
to have anything to do with it.
I don't want to stir up anycontroversy, but for you to make
this shift I know you told usyou saw that the naturally

(06:23):
occurring molecules in natureand our body are much more
effective in treating or, moreso, preventing issues.
But what was that compellingmoment for you?
Was there any specificincidents where you said you
know what this is?
It I'm out?

Speaker 2 (06:41):
I think, a mixture of things.
I think.
Firstly, you know, some peopledo just go to work for the money
and that is all that mattersfor me.
You know, I've never reallyknown what I wanted to do.
I always followed a career pathof something that I was
interested in, and that's how Iwas led down the scientific
route.
I was fascinated by the body.
I've always wanted to dosomething that, you know, was

(07:04):
purpose driven, and, you know,it's not about just putting the
food on the table, it's aboutwe're trying to make things
better in the world.
And so I think part of it was,you know, just a deep rooted
ethical principle within me.
And secondly, experience, inthat I had saw my grandparents

(07:26):
suffer terribly when it came toaging, and now I was looking at
things in the lab that actuallycould have helped them.
And aging is something thataffects everyone.
You know it's something it'snot some diseases only affect
specific people, but aging issomething that can really really

(07:48):
significantly limit a lot ofpeople's lives and potential.
And for me it was simply a caseof I don't want to end up like
that.
I don't want my parents to endup like that.
I'm sure many, many otherpeople who have elderly
relatives do not, you know, wishthere was an alternative, and
here we are looking atalternatives that are going to

(08:10):
go in the bin.
So let's do something with them.

Speaker 1 (08:15):
Yeah, it doesn't look like aging has even started in
your case.
So I'm kind of I was kind ofcurious to see what was for you,
the compelling moment, becauseusually we have to associate
significant pain and sufferingwith our current situation to
kind of change or someone nearand close to us to like, in your

(08:38):
case, your parents to see thatwe don't want to see them suffer
, and then, if we see we can dosomething about it, we then do
that.
Now for the listeners, in caseyou're listening and thinking
this, all of this is kind oflike fluff talk.
It's just well-being and I wantto frame it properly because

(09:05):
it's very important.
It's something that personally,after 15 years of medical
education and 15 years ofpractice, having grown up in a
family of physicians my dad wasan internal medicine physician,
my brother is an ophthalmologistso all my life, since I was
born, I was in touch with themedical field and so I had this

(09:29):
almost blind trust to thepractice of medicine, and when
someone came to me, even startedthe discussion with an
alternative type of medicinewhich involved not medication or
a specific diagnosis, Iliterally rolled up my eyes and

(09:53):
walked the other way and I justthought they're crazy and we
often, you know that's thetribalism in us and I just
didn't even listen to them untilI started aging myself and
until I saw my father becomingold and his diagnosis is still

(10:17):
unclear, but I really think hehas some sort of dementia or
Alzheimer's.
He has lots of long term andshort term memory, mostly short
term memory, and so I look backat his lifestyle.
Of course you know he grew upin 50s and 60s where everybody
was smoking.

(10:37):
I remember I used to go to hisoffice and there was in his
consultation room.
There was literally an ashtrayand he was smoking while he was
talking to his patients abouthealth and uh, but that was you
know.
For those of you listening andyou're too young probably to
even um, remember that you mighthave seen it in an old movie

(10:58):
from the 60s um, even athleteswere smoking and so, uh, you
look at that, how far we've come, which is pretty significant.
But when I started turningmid-40s I'm 51 now and when I
started in my late 40s, theselittle aches and pains started

(11:23):
coming up that I never had forabsolutely no reason.
I would wake up in the morningand I would get out of bed and I
was like why is my knee hurting?
I didn't do anything yesterday.
I would play tennis, and thenmy shoulder was hurting and then
I had a labrum tear.
And it's not like I played inWimbledon, I just played on the

(11:46):
court outside for an hour with afriend and so everything was
starting to hurt.
I felt bloated, I just felttired.
Around 10, 11am I just felttired.
I felt I need some sugar to getme going, and then dad helped

(12:06):
me for an hour and thenafternoon I was even exhausted.
I couldn't wait to go home andit was this vicious cycle and I
thought maybe I'm getting old.
Maybe that's what people saywhen they say you're getting old
.
And so I went for my annualphysical.
I love my primary care doctor,she's amazing.

(12:26):
But she pretty much said Yep,your, your blood tests are all
good and you don't need to comehere.
Just come back when you're 50for your colonoscopy, and that's
it.
And I walked out of our officethinking like, but I'm feeling
like you know, I'm not feelingmyself, I'm tired.
And she's like, yeah, maybe youknow.

(12:49):
Just, you know, just get somerest, maybe you're working too
hard.
So I thought, well, she is true, she's right, I'm working a lot
.
So maybe that's it, maybe Ishould get more sleep and all of
that stuff.
But it's kind of the stuff thatwe accept when we get.
We kind of accept the agingaspect because we're told by our
doctors that it's that's how itis Right.

(13:11):
So until my shoulder pain didn'timprove and, um, I was at a
casual dinner with friends andthere was this orthopedic
surgeon his name is Matt and Ijust ran by him.
I said, look, I hate whenpeople and parties or dinners
they come and ask me medicalquestion and I hate to ask you.
I don't want to bother you, butman, my right shoulder is just

(13:34):
for two years, it's just notgetting better.
I just can't do.
I can't play tennis anymore, Ican't do the activities and my,
my knee is like bothering me.
I had an MRI and it just showschondromalacia, which is just a
fancy medical term for agingcartilage.
So I literally thought I had ameniscus tear, but none of that.

(13:55):
I said, what can I do?
And so he introduced me towhich we're going to talk about
in detail, to NAD and NMN, whichare some supplements that we're
going to really delve deep intoin this conversation.
So if you really want to knowabout it.
Please stay tuned until the endof this podcast.

(14:16):
So I blindly, because I was sodesperate, I said where can I
get it?
And right then and there at thedinner table, I went online and
I bought myself NMN powder.
And then, when I went home, Istarted doing research.
I wanted to know what's thescience?
Is it just some BS?
And that's what got me on thispath and that's what got me into

(14:38):
the science and that's where Ihad literally my awakening, my
awakening.
And so a couple of interestingfacts for the audience, before I
hit you with a millionquestions, nicola.
I just want the audience to knowthat, if we look at the past
hundred years, we've come a longway when it comes to lifespan

(14:59):
and healthspan, but somethingchanged about 30 years ago, 40
years ago, where we haven'treally progressed much.
As a matter of fact, in mostWestern countries, and
specifically I can speak for theUS, not only the health span
has declined, meaning the rateof chronic disease has increased

(15:20):
, not decreased.
With all the modern medicine,we have the rate of chronic
disease, and we're talking aboutdiabetes, heart disease,
neurologic disorders,alzheimer's and even
psychological neurologicdisorders in children, like
attention deficit disorder, alot of neurological disorders,

(15:41):
all these chronic diseases haveactually increased in the past
30 years.
Disorders, all these chronicdiseases have actually increased
in the past 30 years.
So and the lifespan,interestingly in the United
States, has regressed by about,I think, 1.6 or 1.8 years in the
past 20 years.
And so that to me was shockingto look into because no one

(16:05):
talks about it.
I was in awe of our modernmedicine.
I was always raving, even to mypatients I said we're lucky to
live in this time and age wherewe have all this modern medicine
.
But little I knew is really totreat chronic disease, is just
waiting for disease to happeninstead of preventing it.
So some facts are about 93% ofAmericans today live in

(16:25):
metabolic dysfunction.
I'm pretty sure it's verysimilar in the UK.
You know it's most developedcountries.
They're kind of similar.
But I think Europeans arehealthier just because you don't
have the amount of this ultraprocessed foods that we have,
just because they're banned inEurope.
So ultra processed food in theUS I don't know if you knew

(16:47):
Nicola make up to 70% of ourcalories here in the United
States.
I mean by ultra processed Imean just to definition of
processed versus ultra processed.
For example, yogurt isprocessed right, which doesn't
mean it's bad.
So processed food is.
Almost everything we eat isprocessed.
Milk is processed, but thenultra-processed is if you mix it

(17:09):
with sugars, with maybe somecolors, and that's what I mean
by ultra-processed.
Our sleeping hours havedecreased by two hours in the
past 100 years, so we'resleeping less.
That's a biggie, and two hoursof sleep is really significant.
We're going to get to that.
And we are outdoors about 7% ofour time in a 24-hour period.

(17:33):
Only 7% of a 24-hour period wespend outdoors.
And the other thing is also, welive in a thermal neutral
environment, which means ourtemperatures is fully controlled
by air conditioning to like 70,72 degrees, whatever that is,
and we don't have the adversityof hot and cold anymore.

(17:58):
And we've become more sedentary, meaning the average person
does not get in 5,000 steps.
So those are the facts, andthey are certainly correlated to
the fact that our health spanis decreasing and our lifespan
is decreasing.
And then you look at the bluezones in the world, where the

(18:22):
number of centurions is 80%, andthen you look at their
lifestyles.
They don't have any of theseproblems.
Now for the audience.
Nicole, I want you to explainthe meaning of longevity.
Also, how do you differentiatelifespan with healthspan, and
what should we rather focus on,and why?

Speaker 2 (18:42):
Yeah, that's a great question and you know, when I
first got into the world oflongevity, shall we say, this
was 10 years ago now, and backthen, you know, not many people
lay people, shall we say weretalking about this.
If I had a conversation withthe average person about what I

(19:03):
did and spoke about longevity,their immediate response would
have been, oh, like, this is aload of rubbish.
Like, why would we want to livelonger?
You know, why would we want tobe in a care home longer?
Their immediate thought wasthat longevity is all about just
living longer.

Speaker 1 (19:24):
Meaning suffering for a longer time.

Speaker 2 (19:26):
Exactly Suffering.
You know, unfortunately, we dohave this problem where our
lifespan is way longer than ourhealth span.
So lifespan, simply the numberof years you will live according
to your birth certificate, youknow, your health span is
actually the proportion of thatlifespan that you actually live
in good health, and that is thebit that longevity science is

(19:50):
really focused on improving.
It's about how do we live theselong lifespans that we now have
, thanks to modern medicine andsanitation and all those other
great things that no one wouldever argue were a bad idea live

(20:13):
the majority of it in goodhealth.
Because at the moment, wereally have this gap and you
know, I think, for for a woman,for example, in the uk, their
lifespan on average is 83 years.
Their health span, on the otherend, is only 64 years.
So that is a huge proportion.
That that's 19 years.

Speaker 1 (20:29):
Wow.

Speaker 2 (20:30):
Where we're expected to be in poor health at current
rate.

Speaker 1 (20:34):
It's almost like you can't wait to die.
Once you have chronic disease,you just hope you die a least
painful death.

Speaker 2 (20:43):
So a lot of people will say, well, oh, you know,
I'm happy to live my life.
As soon as I get ill, shoot me,kind of thing.
You know, that's really common,something awful that people say
they're like I don't want to endup like my parents, like, if I
get like that, do not let melive.
That is the reality of it.
That is what a lot of peoplewill say.
So the moment that you starttalking about potentially doing

(21:05):
something with longevity, peoplealways assume that it's all
about just making us live formore years, but don't start to
consider this idea of being inbetter health.
And the main reason for that isthat for a long, long time,
everyone, including scientists,have believed that aging was an
inevitable process, that it wassomething that was programmed

(21:26):
into us, that once it started,you literally couldn't stop it.
So if you ask people aboutaging and what it is, they will
just say it's this natural thing, it's a fact of life.
Um, you know, there's nothingyou can do about it, and that is
the best way that people canrationalize and sort of
comprehend something quite awfulthat is actually.

(21:46):
You know, they just say it'sjust a fact of life because it's
not nice.
You know?
No, there's no secret that alot of the aging process is not
nice.

Speaker 1 (21:56):
Well, how do you explain it then?
Because there are people thatsay well, if it was true, how
come my doctor doesn't talk tome about this?
Can you?
Can you explain that argumentLike why?

Speaker 2 (22:11):
The whole issue.
There is the translational gapbetween what is happening at a
scientific level and what we areproving as scientists, versus
how long it actually then takesto get that through into the
clinic, and I think that is themain issue here.
So, for example, when I firstgot into this, this field, 10

(22:33):
years ago, even for me as ascientist, I was like wow, this
is incredible, like how, howhave I not heard about this?
And this science is new.
You know, this is not somethingthat has been around that long,
for a long time.
It was even argued within thefield of longevity whether it
was even possible to slow theaging process.

(22:56):
But now the research comingthrough and all of the science
really does prove that aging isa modifiable process.
It is not a one way street, andI guess one of the main pieces
of evidence that reallydemonstrated that aging was
reversible was when scientistsreally started to look at

(23:18):
something called our biologicalage.
So our chronological age is justthe number of years that we've
been around on the planet.
Our biological age, on theother hand, is the age at which
we are on the inside at acellular level, and it's now
found that you can measure this.
So scientists have worked outmultiple different ways to

(23:39):
measure this biological age, andthe really interesting thing
was that when they worked outhow to measure this, quite often
many people's biological age onthe inside did not match their
chronological age.
So, for example, you said youwere 50.
You may measure your biologicalage and it could be more like
age 40 or, on the bad side, itcould be like age 60, and for

(24:04):
scientists that was reallyexciting because it proved two
really important things.
The first thing it it provedwas that aging is not fixed,
because for a long time it hadbeen argued that it was this
fixed program thing that youcould not do anything about.
But if that was the case, thenyour chronological age should
always match your biological ageand everyone should age at the

(24:25):
same rate internally.
But they don't.
And that shows us that there'sthings that are going on inside
of our bodies, specifically inour cells, that are either
speeding up the aging process orslowing it down.
And if there's something thatis speeding it up or slowing it
down, it means, first of all,it's not fixed and, second of
all, there are things going onin our cells that we can

(24:45):
possibly target to manipulatethat aging process.
The second thing it proved wasthat you could actually measure
aging, because, again, anotherhuge area of controversy for
people is well, you're tellingme that you're going to slow
aging, but how on earth do wemeasure this?
Like you can't do a clinicaltrial where you know it's like
science fiction, yeah.
You wait and see how long ittakes for people to die or

(25:08):
something.
It's like how do you measure it?
But again, this was a way tomeasure it and since these sort
of tests have become availableand this type of science has
been deciphered, it's meant thatthere have been huge
advancements in the aging field,because we are now looking at
what is happening in the cellsto drive aging and also we have
ways to measure to see ifinterventions are actually

(25:29):
working.

Speaker 1 (25:31):
Yeah, I think it's fascinating.
When I first heard about it,just like you, it sounded to me
like science fiction, becauseall my life I was told
completely arbitrary commentslike 90% of what happens to you
is based on your DNA and 10% isjust based on the environment.
And you just accept thesethings because if someone that
you respect says that, you takeit as a fact and you don't

(25:55):
question it.
And in reality it's probablythe other way around.
To dogs, to horses and nowhuman trials going on where we

(26:16):
actually have proven not only wecan slow down the biologic
aging, we can actually reverseit and better even, we can cure
chronic disease and even, forexample, blindness in mice.
So when you hear this stuff,you can't help but to get
curious and to question whattraditional medicine has been
postulating for decades.
And I think we live in a timewhere the internet and social

(26:40):
media has made the science soaccessible to the layman.
And there's all these companies, direct-to-consumer lab testing
and biomarker analysis whereanybody can take the health in
their own hands.
You don't just have to and I'mnot saying not to trust your
primary care doctor, but if Ibreak an arm or I come up with

(27:03):
an illness, I'm going to go tomy doctor, but when I'm healthy
my doctor is not going to doanything about it.
But I don't want to get ill, Idon't want to get sick, I don't
want to have chronic disease,and the beauty about today's
world is we can take it in ourown hands.
The problem, though, for most isthere's so much information out

(27:26):
there that people get confusedthere, that people get confused.
So that's the number one uhhurdle or point of friction in
people taking um initiative.
The other one is people arescared to know what's wrong with
them.
I have this conversations withmy patients, and especially with
the ones that haven't seen adoctor in years.

(27:48):
I mean, I'm talking about a 50or 60 year old that hasn't gone
to the doctor in 10 years andwhen I just simply ask why
they're like, well, I'm not sick, I only go to the doctor where
I'm sick.
So there, and then when I ask alittle bit more questions, I
find out that they're actuallyscared to know if there's
anything wrong with them andthey just don't want to know and

(28:12):
almost like turn a blind eye,and and they just don't want to
know, and that's, I think, whypeople are more hesitant in
pursuing or or taking control oftheir own health, um, until
there is something bad thathappens either to them or a
loved one.
That's when they get reallyscared and feel, okay, I have to

(28:34):
do something.
And um, so I don't know what,um, what, uh, your experience
has been with trying to getthrough um clinicians?
Uh, I don't know if you canmaybe share some experiences you
had in conversing with somedoctors that completely, like,

(28:57):
not made fun of your science butactually refused even to look
into it.
Have you ever experiencedanything like that?

Speaker 2 (29:04):
Oh yeah, like a lot and there's.
You know, there's been a lot oftimes in the past where I have
to say that a lot of medicaldoctors would outright dismiss
anything that I spoke about.
You know you could kind of seethem going.
Oh yeah, you know, that'sreally interesting.
Lovely to meet you.

Speaker 1 (29:23):
But why do you think?
Why do you?

Speaker 2 (29:27):
think that.
I think it is because this issuch a radically different way
of thinking about aging and,again, we have always been led
to believe that aging wasnothing you could do anything
about really, and therefore youjust had to deal with the
consequences as they came up oneby one, and this is flipping
everything that we've ever beentaught, whether as a medical

(29:49):
professional or just the averageperson that's going to visit
their doctor.
This is flipping it all upsidedown on its head.
So the real change in the wayof thinking is this idea that
you know, first of all, we callit healthcare, but really it's
not healthcare, it's sick care.

Speaker 1 (30:07):
Sick care.

Speaker 2 (30:07):
You know, you just hit the nail on the head before
before.
We only go to the doctor whenwe're sick, and actually the
body is extremely good atmasking a lot of illness and
failures before they start toappear on the outside as
symptoms, and that means thatusually by the time we're at the
doctor, it's something that isquite hard to fix and there's

(30:27):
already quite a lot of damagedone in the body that probably
could have been preventable.
The other thing is that whenyou think of aging and, oh, I
guess, when you think ofdiseases, the most common
diseases and illnesses thatpeople are going to the doctors
for the majority of them are agerelated.

(30:47):
So our health care spend overage 50 just goes through the
roof.
That you know.
And then the last few years ofa person's life is when the
biggest spend for healthcarehappens.
It's all age-related.
If you look at the majordiseases, you know the heart
disease, cardiovascular disease,cancer, cognitive decline,

(31:08):
dementia, all of those things.
Cognitive decline, dementia,all of those things the biggest
risk factor above everythingelse is your age.
That doesn't matter for diet,smoking, anything like that.
Age is your biggest risk factorfor the onset of the major
diseases cardiovascular cancer,dementia, your risk of all of
those goes up exponentially withage.

(31:29):
So a big shift in thinkingwithin the longevity space and
with the scientists in thisfield was hang on a minute.
At the minute what we do is welook at all of these diseases
individually, we research themall as separate institutes,
separate scientists haveseparate conferences, separate
ways to deal with them, separatedepartments and hospitals.

(31:51):
Yet the biggest risk factor forall of these things is actually
our age.
So if you turn this around abit, why don't you say, well, is
actually age the root cause ofall of these different diseases?
And actually all of thesedifferent diseases are symptoms
of aging.
And therefore, if they're allsymptoms of aging, well, isn't

(32:14):
aging actually the disease?
And why don't we target theroot cause and target aging?
Because if we can do something,even a little something, about
the aging process, then it wouldhave an impact on all of these
different age-related diseasesin one go.
And for a long time that wasthought of as pretty radical,

(32:36):
you know, really really crazy.
But now all of the evidencecoming out shows, in fact, if
you can slow the rate ofcellular aging, you can actually
reduce the risk of manydifferent things that are
leading to these age-relateddiseases and therefore
ultimately improve health spanacross the board.
So rather than just say, forexample, eliminating cancer.

(32:59):
So if you think of all themoney that goes into cancer
research, even if cancer neverexisted anymore and we cured it,
everyone would still getdementia, everyone's still going
to get heart disease,cardiovascular disease and all
the other age-related problems.
So this is a completelydifferent way of thinking about
it.
And now you know, when I hadthis conversation with people

(33:23):
maybe it's like you know, five,six years ago people were like,
okay, it makes sense, but stillweren't convinced.
But now the data, the evidence,the discussion, the
conversation around it hasbecome so great it can't be
ignored anymore.
And in fact last it's probablylast month I went to a
conference and this was in theUK and the UK is very different

(33:46):
to the US.
I'd say the actually, despitewhat you may think, has a lot
more preventative healthcarethan the UK because we have the
NHS and everyone just relies onthat.
I went to a conference and itwas full of GPs, general
practitioners, all saying do youknow what?
We are ready to listen to this.

(34:06):
Something has to be done.
It is not sustainable the waywe're going.
And now actually we are going tostart looking more at
preventative care, and you knowthey were going off their own
backs to this conference to sayI am sick of not being able to
offer this type of thing to mypatients.
The science is really credible.
It's really strong.
How do I just learn it myselfso I can start incorporating it

(34:27):
into my consultations?

Speaker 1 (34:29):
Amazing.
So it's very refreshing to hearthat, because I, as a
anti-aging doctor and surgeonwho mainly performs cosmetic and
rejuvenative surgery andprocedures, I feel ethically
almost obligated, which I haveactually changed the course of

(34:52):
my practice.
I feel ethically obligated tohave these conversations with my
patients where I think this isa primary care job, and here I
am talking to my patients aboutit, and the reason why I feel
that we in the aestheticindustry are so well positioned
is patients that come to us.
They care about theirappearance, they care about

(35:15):
their well-being and they care,therefore, about their health
and they're ready to makelifestyle changes and they're
not happy with the status quoand they want to go through a
transformation.
They want to obtain theirself-esteem and self-confidence
back.
They want to be more active andI see it on my patients.
Once they do a transformationlet's say, I do a facelift on a

(35:39):
patient and literally they look15 years younger it motivates
them to also change theirlifestyle, to go out more, to
make more connections with otherhuman beings, to be more active
to change their diet beings, tobe more active to change their
diet, and now I have made itpart of my practice and
consultation to educate themabout everything that I'm
learning still every day.

(36:00):
But whatever new thing that I'mlearning in the longevity and
anti-aging science I share withmy patients, and the excitement,
the relief that I see in mypatients is so overwhelming.
It motivates me even to gofurther, because it's almost

(36:23):
like they're thirsty for thisinformation, they're longing for
it and they don't know where toget information.
They feel overwhelmed.
Trying to do their own research, they get bombarded with all
this information.
They don't know how tointerpret it because they don't
have the scientific knowledgeand background, and it's very
hard to digest this type ofinformation as a layman.

(36:45):
I mean because you really needto understand the hallmarks of
cellular aging to be able towrap your head around the fact
that, look, we actually canreverse our biologic age, you
can become younger, and that isnot science fiction.

(37:05):
And so I want you to walk usthrough several key hallmarks of
cellular aging and as theyrelate to what we perceive
clinically and how it makes usfeel and look clinically.
And I know you've published anarticle in the PRS a couple of

(37:26):
years ago as it relates to skinand anti-aging, which is a great
article, and I wish I had readit then and not later.
But again, my awareness wasn'tinto this field at that time,
which shame on me.
But I want you to walk usthrough some of the hallmarks of

(37:49):
cellular aging.
I know we're going to get alittle bit nerdier here, but
also maybe explain it in a waythat someone with just a basic
high school science canunderstand and wrap their head
around it.

Speaker 2 (38:06):
Yeah, so the hallmarks of aging has been one
of the I guess one of the keychanges in the field.
That has shown us what isactually causing aging at the
cellular level, and I think, forthe average person, one of the
real mindset shifts that needsto happen is that, traditionally

(38:28):
, when we think about anythingto do with aging, we always
think about how we look.
We always think about theappearance, the visible signs
and symptoms of aging, maybe howwe're feeling, but what we
actually need to understand is,despite the way we feel or the
way that we look due to aging,actually everything that is
causing the aging process ishappening deep within our bodies

(38:51):
, at the cellular level.
That is where it is allhappening, and this means that,
whilst we've really focused ontreating aging at the surface
level, actually, if we reallywant to have a major impact, we
need to now start thinking abouttreating aging from the inside,
at the cellular level.
And this is where the hallmarksof aging comes in, because

(39:12):
these are 12 things thatscientists have discovered seem
to go wrong in our cells anddrive the aging process.
So these particular hallmarks.
As they get worse, aging getsworse, and if you make the
hallmarks better, aging slowsdown and even reverses.
So there are 12 differentthings and you're right we can't

(39:33):
go into all of them becausethat would be totally geeking
out for hours.

Speaker 1 (39:38):
That would be another podcast.
Maybe we would do like a geekypodcast.

Speaker 2 (39:41):
Yeah, maybe, but let's just think about you know,
just think about use skin foran example.
So how do these things that wesee on the outside with age
relate to what's happening?
on the inside.
So one of the most commonhallmarks of aging is DNA damage
.
So we know in our cells theyall have DNA and the DNA is the
blueprint for the cell to teachit to do everything that it

(40:04):
needs to do.
It's its instruction guide andconstantly we're getting damaged
.
So this could be from our diet,from pollution in the case of
skin, from UV, from the sun.
It's constantly damaging thisDNA and when we're young, our
cells are very good at repairingthis DNA damage.
In fact, we get around 10,000pieces of DNA damage in every

(40:27):
cell every day and our bodiesjust deal with it and repair it.
We have this army.

Speaker 1 (40:32):
This is from the day we're born.

Speaker 2 (40:34):
by the way, you know, this is crazy, this is not.

Speaker 1 (40:37):
This is not for old, senile people that get DNA
damage.
This is from the day we're born.
Our DNA gets hammered.

Speaker 2 (40:44):
Hammered constantly and we have an army of literally
an army of DNA repair enzymesthat is going around looking for
damage.
As soon as it spots some damage, it's repaired before we even
know that it's an issue, andwhen we're younger we're very
good at doing this.
It just happens.
But as we're older, this DNArepair seems to get turned down,

(41:05):
and this is one of thehallmarks of aging the fact that
our cells can't repair this DNAanymore.
And when it comes to skin, areal classic sign of a lack of
DNA repair is hyperpigmentationand the brown spots that we get
on our skin as we get older.
Because there's a certain typeof cell in our skin called our
melanocytes, and they are theskin cells that produce the

(41:27):
melanin which gives our pigmentin our skin, and when they get
too much DNA damage, theysuddenly have this reaction and
start overproducing the pigment,and that's why we get this
classic sign of pigmentation.
So that is probably one of themost famous hallmarks.
The second one that I'llprobably would be a good idea to

(41:48):
discuss is something calledsenescence.
Would be a good idea to discussis something called senescence.
Now, this is actually linked tothe first hallmark, so
senescence is when a cell getsso much damage that the cell
goes.
Oh my goodness, there's toomuch to repair.
Even our army of repairproteins is overwhelmed.
We need to just shut this downbefore this cell becomes

(42:11):
dangerous.
It may become cancerous, it maygo rogue, because this DNA
instruction manual is notworking anymore.
So we just need to shut thecell down and rather than get
rid of the cell, this dangerousrogue cell, out of the body,
it's much quicker and easier forthe body just to tell it to go
to sleep.
So effectively, the cellbecomes what we know as

(42:32):
senescent it's a sleeping cell.

Speaker 1 (42:34):
Now that has a negative effect on our body.
Can you kind of tell us whathappens, what those senescent
cells actually do in our body?

Speaker 2 (42:43):
Yeah.
So for a long time it wasthought that these cells just
stay asleep and don't doanything and they're harmless.
But we now know that theyactually secrete a lot of
inflammation and they're oftenreferred to as zombie cells,
because they're like thesesleeping cells that are actually
giving off all of this toxicwaste, and this inflammation is
actually another hallmark ofaging.

(43:03):
So chronic low-gradeinflammation in our bodies is a
key driver of the aging process.
So when you look at thesesenescent cells in skin, not
only are they giving offinflammation, which is actually
degrading our collagen andelastin, which leads to, you
know, lines, wrinkles, loss ofelasticity, but also they're

(43:25):
sitting there taking up spaceand they're not making our own
natural collagen like theyshould be, which is why our
collagen production goes down.
We also know that thisinflammation is causing things
like redness and rosacea.
So very quickly you can seethat you know for our skin.
A long time we've just said, oh, you know, wrinkles, lack of

(43:46):
collagen, but it's like, yeah,but why is there a lack of
collagen?
You know why is?

Speaker 1 (43:51):
it suddenly gone and, and it's funny, people are so
obsessed with, uh, takingcollagen and they're just
everybody's so focused oningesting raw material instead
of tackling the root cause andletting your body take care of
business.
And it's?
It's fascinating fascinating atcellular level what our body is

(44:15):
capable of doing if we know howto let it do what it can do,
instead of throwing more rawmaterial at it in a cellular
functional capacity that itcan't really work.
It's almost like you have afactory, you don't have enough
factory workers and you keepbringing raw material with

(44:36):
trucks to the factory and hopingyou can increase your
production, and yet you knowyour factory workers are
striking or are quitting and youdon't have anybody that can
actually run the factory.
And that's what's happening aswe age, you know.
And the cellular inflammationthat's what's happening as we
age, uh, you know, and thecellular inflammation that that
you uh discuss, that affects ourskin, is what affected me, my

(44:58):
muscles, my tendons, um, um, mybrain, you know talking about
brain fog, even vision.
It affects every cell in yourbody and, um, you know, within
the context of this podcast, ofcourse, um, you know, your skin
is the most important part, butreally, um, your brain, your

(45:22):
eyes and your skeletal, skeletalmuscle function is really what
disables you to then get intothat vicious cycle of becoming
less and less active and thenaccelerating all these hallmarks
of aging, and I think we candisrupt it now, and we're going
to talk about how we can disruptthat pattern.

(45:43):
So that's one thing, and sowhat's another hallmark?

Speaker 2 (45:49):
So another one that is probably quite a famous one
is mitochondrial dysfunction,which sounds really complicated
but it's not.
It's basically in our cells wehave these energy powerhouses
that literally take our food andconvert it into the energy that
our whole body needs tofunction.
And these powerhouses arecalled our mitochondria, and as

(46:11):
we get older they start todysfunction.
So they're kind of like a powerplant that has become old and
it's not as efficient anymore.
It's leaking toxic waste andreally it should be getting
decommissioned and closed down,but it's not.
It's still running, trying tochurn out energy and it's doing
it in a very wasteful manner.

(46:32):
And that's exactlymitochondrial dysfunction.
Our panic power plants in ourcells just don't function like
like they used to.
They're not producing as muchenergy.
So we start to experiencethings on the outside like
tiredness, fatigue.
In terms of the skin, you seereduced, reduced skin cell
turnover, because the cellsliterally don't have the energy
to do it.
You also see, and again, anincrease in inflammation,

(46:55):
because these toxic power plantsare giving off free radicals
and other damaging things thatare then causing problems in the
cell and damaging componentsand giving off inflammation that
then goes on to affect the restof the body.
So that is another really keyhallmark of aging and I think,
looking at the hallmarks,there's 12, but I'd say DNA

(47:18):
damage, senescence,mitochondrial dysfunction and
inflammation are probably theones that are most well-studied
and are probably the things thatare to studied and are probably
the things that are today, thethings that we can probably do
something about in terms oftrying to promote our health
span in everyday life, shall wesay.

Speaker 1 (47:41):
And this is very interesting.
I hope you've been reallylistening carefully to these
three main hallmarks because,remember, in the beginning I
told you I felt I startedfeeling tired every day.
I had all these aches.
I felt, like you know,obviously my skin was aging, but
I've been really diligent.
I have my own skincare line andproduct I've been using

(48:04):
religiously for 10 years, soluckily, my skin hasn't been
aging too bad.
But that's an external thing.
That can be even augmentedinternally, which is probably
more effective, and I've provenit to myself over the past year
by just changing my lifestyle,taking certain supplementations
that we'll come to and talkabout, that are significantly,

(48:24):
like exponentially improved.
Not just my skin, my hair, like, my nails grow faster, they're
not brittle anymore.
All my aches, the entireinflammation in my body is gone.
And I've measured, I'mmeasuring it with biomarkers.
I use uh inside tracker andevery three to four months I get
, uh, my biomarkers measured.
And we're going to talk aboutsome of the biomarkers that are

(48:47):
essential to measure, because Ithink unless you measure an
outcome and a change, you reallywon't know what you're doing.
You will be doing thingsrandomly, and I think that's
another strategy that has to beimplemented and there's so many
direct-to-consumer apps andsites that you don't even need

(49:10):
your doctor.
You just go to a lab, they sendyour biomarkers to that company
and they analyze it for you andyou can keep track and you see
how you've improved based onyour lifestyle modifications and
the supplementation and yourdiet, and so that's something
that I've been doing actively inthe past year and significantly
reduced my biologic age.

(49:31):
And so talk to me about youknow there's so many measures
that we can use to measure ourbiologic age that gets confusing
.
You know there's so manydifferent metrics.
What is like the most commonand most reliable metric where
we can really measure ourbiologic age?
So for someone that wants toknow, hey, am I doing well?

(49:54):
So I listened to Dr Conlon andDr Hamra.
I'm all in Starting tomorrowI'm going to turn back my
biologic age.
Is there anything that they canmeasure it?
Is there any marker, biologicmarker that they can measure how
well they're doing?

Speaker 2 (50:11):
Yeah, so there are two main ways that you can
measure your biological age.
Well, there are three really.
So the first one is somethingcalled measuring the length of
your telomeres.
Now, this is not one that I'drecommend, but I'm going to
mention it because if you startGoogling it it's probably going
to come up and you're basicallytelomere shortening is another

(50:37):
hallmark of aging.
So in your cells you have yourDNA and when you look at you
know a Google image of DNA, youwill see these little
chromosomes that look likelittle squiggly things, and on
the ends of these chromosomesthey have basically your
telomeres.
Now, telomeres, you candescribe them as being like the
plastic bits on the end of yourshoelace to stop your shoelace

(50:59):
from unwinding.
Well, a telomere is kind oflike the same thing for your DNA
.
It's on the end of your DNA tostop the DNA from fraying or
unwinding, because you do notwant that to happen.
Now, as you get older, it seemsthat the length of these
telomeres decreases.
So there are some companiesthat will offer telomere
measurements and they will lookat the length of your telomeres

(51:19):
and use that to predict how oldyour cells are, and that's
probably like biological agemeasuring, sort of generation
one, um, where it was the bestthat we used to have, but now
there are way more superiormeasurements.
The issue with this type ofmeasurement is that it's usually
very specific to the cell type.

(51:41):
So if you're measuring telomerelength in your blood, then it's
only kind of telling you theage of the blood and not the
rest of the tissues.
So this is when the next sortof generation of biological age
testing came out, and this issomething called epigenetic
testing.
So again, if you think of yourDNA in your cells, every single

(52:07):
cell has the same set of DNA.
Yeah, cells are very different.
You could have a skin cell, oryou could have a liver cell or a
hair cell, even though each ofthese cells is genetically
identical.
Okay, so the way that a livercell becomes a liver cell and a
skin cell becomes a skin cell isvia a process called

(52:28):
epigenetics, and this basicallymeans that our cells turn on
different patterns of genes tobecome different things.
So the same thing happens as weget older.
So if we were to take a sampleof cells from a young person,
what you would see is that theircells generally have a very
different pattern of genesswitched on to a sample of cells

(52:52):
out of an older person, theywill have a much more older
pattern of cells switched on.
So sorry, pattern of genesswitched on, and this is what we
call epigenetic drift.
So our cells seem to drift fromhaving a very specific set of
genes switched on when we'reyoung that are associated with
things like low inflammation andlots of repair and less damage.

(53:14):
It's drifting all the waythrough to having all those
beneficial genes sort ofswitched off and actually bad
genes switched on, things thatare driving inflammation and
turning down repair.
And if you measure thisepigenetic pattern, you can
predict the biological age ofthe person.
So epigenetic age tests havebecome really common again.

(53:36):
Like you mentioned, these arethings that you can order online
.
You can do it as a finger prickblood test.
The other one to measure issomething called your glycan age
and this works in a verysimilar way to epigenetics,
apart from it's not measuringthe patterns of genes, it's
actually measuring patterns ofsugar molecules on your immune

(53:57):
cells and in a very similar way.
When you're young you will havea very specific pattern which
is anti-inflammatory essentially, and as you get older you seem
to have a very different patternthat becomes way more
anti-inflammatory essentially,and as you get older you seem to
have a very different patternthat becomes way more
pro-inflammatory.
So again, this is another testkit that you can get and it
measures biological age.

Speaker 1 (54:18):
Yeah, I think that glycan age is probably one of
the most practical andrelatively accurate ones that
anybody can do starting tomorrow, and I'll put the link down
below in the podcast for peopleif you're interested, because
it's good to have a basis bywhich you can measure your

(54:38):
improvement and then go fromthere.
Now, are there any?
Now we talked about all ofthese hallmarks of aging.
So if someone is interesting tomake a change today, are there
any supplements that one cantake?
Is it as easy as taking a pilland then everything will be fine

(55:02):
?
Or what do you recommend peopleto do if they're really
interested?
What are the main key elementsof their lifestyles that you
recommend to change?

Speaker 2 (55:15):
And then also, as it relates to supplementation and
dietary modification, yeah, so Ithink the first key thing to
point out is that actually,lifestyle has a major role.
So we touched on this earlierthat many people think aging is
down to your genetics, and thisis a really common misconception

(55:37):
that you know how well you willage is just based on the genes
you inherited.

Speaker 1 (55:42):
You know people say oh, my mom's got great genes,
you look so good, it must beyour genes.

Speaker 2 (55:48):
It's absolutely not.
Um, in fact there's.
There's different percentagesand different studies, but in in
some studies it's been shown,you know, like huge population
studies, it's actually beenshown that actually 90 is your
lifestyle and the other 10 isyour lifestyle and the other 10%
is your genes.
Other studies estimate it'smore like 70-30.

(56:10):
But it's between.
You know, 70% and 90% isactually lifestyle, so that's
huge.

Speaker 1 (56:17):
It's exactly the opposite of what we were told
for decades, which was, for me,a paradigm shift in the way I
think about aging.
And this is, for me, wasprobably the most life-changing
and attitude-changing fact inall my medical career that I've
ever encountered, because it'salmost like someone telling me

(56:38):
hey, the earth is not flat, it'sround.
And I actually see through atelescope.
I'm like, oh my God, you'reright, it's actually round.
So for me, that's how it was.

Speaker 2 (56:48):
And the reason for this and the reason that we
really now understand why ourlifestyle can have such a big
impact, is because of its linkwith epigenetics, which I just
explained, is this idea thateven though we've got our
genetics, which is set, actuallythe genes that are switched on
and off are not set.

(57:08):
They're changing all of thetime and actually it's our
external environment that isinfluencing which genes are
switched on or off and it's ourlifestyle that is literally
affecting our biology and howour genes are expressed.
So that is why our lifestylecan have such a major impact,

(57:29):
and you know, just to thinkabout those things.
So I have a supplement company,but I am the first person to
say that supplements are not thefirst thing that you should be
doing.
You know there are so manyother things that you should be
doing first that can have such amajor impact on your health and
how well you will age.
The first thing is your diet.

(57:50):
So diet is so underestimatedand diet influences our health,
span, our longevity, in two ways.
The first way it influences usis that, literally, food is
medicine, and this is one thingthat I say time and time again
when people question why I leftmy job in drug development to

(58:11):
start a supplement company.
I always say to them your bodyhas no idea what is a drug, what
is a nutrient, what is asupplement?
Actually, they all have a verypowerful biological effect in
the body.
Your body isn't going oh, it'sa drug, it's not a drug, so I'm
not going to let it do anythingright you know, actually our

(58:33):
diet is full of compounds thatare constantly influencing our
biology.
So if you are eating the ultraprocessed american diet that is
beige and full of sugar and fullof all sorts of unnatural
things that are harmful, that isgoing to be actually aging you,
it is going to be increasinginflammation in the body and

(58:56):
also it's depriving you from alot of the phytochemicals, the
nutrients, the beneficialmolecules that are actually in
plants, and then all the fruits,the vegetables, the herbs, the
spices.
We know that if you can flipfrom the standard american diet
to more of the mediterraneandiet that is full of good fats

(59:18):
rather than, you know,polysaturated fats, and actually
also full of lots of differentplant molecules, you are going
to be getting nature's medicinecabinet All of those beneficial
compounds that are actuallyswitching on the good genes and
the good pathways in your body.

Speaker 1 (59:36):
Yeah, I think if I could pick one dietary, if I
could give one dietary advice,if I could give one dietary
advice or if I could blame oneelement in our diet that causes
the most damage andsignificantly accelerates aging
at cellular level.
It's probably sugar.

(01:00:01):
I was just going to say that Iguess which one is good for me.
I mean, I know, look, peopleare listening to us and we
probably sound like a brokenrecord, but it's almost like one
of those things that's, youknow how something is right in
front of you.
It's so close that you don'tsee it.
I think that is.
And because everybody talksabout it, people are like, oh

(01:00:22):
God, you know.
And you have conversations likeno, I don't eat any sugar.
And then I realized people don'tknow what in our food consists
of sugar.
People don't know.
They don't know that all thesestarches that we eat they're
actually sugar.
They're just sugar moleculesthat are attached to each other
and so our body breaks it up tosugar and that attaches to all

(01:00:43):
of our proteins and pretty muchputs them out of commission, to
the point that they can't dowhat they were designed to do
and hence our biologic ageincreases.
And so if you could cut oneelement out, is the sugar.
And people don't want tosacrifice because that's where
they get their dopamine.
I mean you tell a drug addictnot to get their fix, they're

(01:01:09):
going to fight you.
I mean that's why drug addictsgo and steal or even kill people
just to get to their drugbecause they're addicted to it,
and sugar is probably the mostaddictive element in our diet
today, and that's why it's sodifficult for people to get rid
of it.
And that's probably the numberone element that makes us sick

(01:01:31):
and is the root cause of allchronic disease.

Speaker 2 (01:01:35):
Completely agree.
It's so pro-inflammatory.
It causes glycation in our body, which is where sugar becomes
bound to proteins like collagen,elastinin, causing our arteries
to stiffen our skin problems.
My one piece of advice toanybody who, you know, doesn't
believe that sugar is an issueor you know it doesn't really

(01:01:58):
want to admit that maybe they'reeating too much sugar is is
wear a continuous glucosemonitor.
You know, you see the peoplewith the little discs wear a
continuous glucose monitor.
You know, you see the peoplewith the little discs.
Wear a continuous glucosemonitor for two weeks and you
will entirely change yourrelationship with food.
Because the problem is a lot ofthe eating that we do is
mindless.
You know, we're just constantly.
Oh, you know, we see somethingand just go, oh, I'll just have

(01:02:20):
a little snack.
And we're told we have to eatevery two hours and whatnot.
Every time you put something inyour mouth, your body has to go
through this huge process ofdealing with it and we don't see
because the body just dealswith it and gets on.
But if you can actually see inreal time when you put that
biscuit or that cake or whateverin your mouth, thinking, oh,

(01:02:42):
I'll just have it as a littlesnack with a coffee or whatever,
and then all of a sudden yousee in real time on a graph oh,
it's going up, look at my sugarin my blood, it's going through
the roof and then it's crashing.
And then, oh, look, I feelhungry again.
What a surprise.
Um, I've had a blood sugar crashand you suddenly realize that
the the effort that your bodyhas to go to every time you're

(01:03:05):
putting something in your mouth,and that makes you really
reconsider.
Maybe I'll not have the snackin between breakfast and lunch,
Maybe I'll you know, wait tilllunchtime, maybe I won't have
that mega bowl of sugar cerealfor breakfast.

Speaker 1 (01:03:22):
I think that brings me to the biggest anti-aging
advice that I can give theaudience is that, first of all,
these sugar spikes, they causeour insulin to spike with it and
you know, especially one of thehallmarks of aging is that we
lose insulin sensitivity andthat insulin sensitivity is
another aspect that you know.

(01:03:44):
That's why we get type 2diabetes.
And you know your doctors tellyou well, you know, I guess
you're 50 years old or 60 yearsold You're.
You know it's just part ofaging.
You know, here, get somemetformin, which metformin, by
the way, is a great drug, is agreat anti-aging drug.
Some people just are taking itfor anti-aging purposes, but
it's purposes, but you shouldn'taccept it.

(01:04:06):
And I think one of thestrategies that anyone can
implement today to work towardsanti-aging is avoid these
snackings that you're talkingabout, nicole.
I mean, I used to be a biggersnacker and it I I prided myself
of being a snacker that I don'teat large meals, and now I

(01:04:30):
basically have one, maybe twomeals a day.
You know I do time restricted,I follow a time restricted diet
because you know that reallygives my body a chance to clean
up the mess.
You know all these senescentcells.
You know science has shown, asyou know, you put a little

(01:04:55):
adversity and stress into yourcells, not stress as far as
working harder or not sleeping,not that type of stress, but
stress at the cellular levelthat adversity is shown that
this actually has an anti-agingeffect and increases a level of
a certain molecule in our bodythat's called NAD, which is one

(01:05:21):
of the products that yourcompany actually not the NAD
itself, but the boosting aspectof the NAD that your supplement
is actually targeting, and sowe're going to talk about.
I want you to explain what yoursupplement does in that regard,
but I also want the audience notto miss on this important piece

(01:05:43):
of information that you canboost your NAD, which is in
charge of the energy in yourbody which is actually produced
in your mitochondria.
You can increase that throughexercise, diet and everything we
just talked about sleep, stressreduction as far as mental

(01:06:03):
stress, not as far as cellularstress, because cellular stress,
again, is adversity for thecell.
That is anti-aging, whether itis temperature changes, heat and
cold.
Everybody has heard of the coldplunges or saunas.
That improves your health andit is an anti-aging strategy.

(01:06:24):
But as far as cellular level,you can actually supplement,
take a supplement or help boostthe energy of your cell using
supplementation that you cancombine together with lifestyle
changes to double down on it,which is what I'm doing today,

(01:06:44):
and I've seen significantchanges in my mental health, in
my energy level, in theinflammation, in my sugar levels
, and that caused me to be moreactive and instead of going to
the gym once a week, I'm in agym every day because I have the
energy, I'm not tired aroundnoon or afternoon and in the

(01:07:10):
morning I'm as sharp as a tackand I can't wait to tackle the
day.
So tell me about NAD and tellme what the problem is as we age
with that and what strategiesyour research has shown to be
most effective in addressingthat issue is something that
people can literally starttomorrow.

Speaker 2 (01:07:31):
Yeah, so NAD was one of the areas that I just got so
excited about when reallystarting to look at all of the
research in terms of how wecould impact cellular aging.
And basically, it's a naturalmolecule that's already found in
every single cell in our bodyand it's really important for

(01:07:51):
hundreds of different reactions.
But the two things it's mostimportant for are, firstly,
energy production, so thosemitochondrial power plants.
Nad literally helps to take thefood that we eat and do the
energy conversion process tomake our energy.
And secondly, remember I saidabout all of those army of

(01:08:11):
repair proteins that are goingaround fixing things in our
cells continuously.
Well, it seems also that NAD hasa role of acting as a fuel to
basically power a lot of thoserepair processes.
And what's been found is thatas we get older, nad seems to
decline in our cells and thatmeans, as NAD goes down, we have
less energy production.

(01:08:32):
So we start to experience thethings like brain fog, tiredness
, fatigue, lack of stamina,reduced skin cell turnover and
also we have less repair goingon because there's less NAD to
fuel all these repair processes.
So we start to see anaccumulation of cellular damage
and then this starts to causeall of these hallmarks and these

(01:08:54):
problems that we were talkingabout earlier, and that decline
is significant?

Speaker 1 (01:09:00):
Yeah, it's really significant.

Speaker 2 (01:09:01):
So it's estimated that it halves every 20 years.
And this is from birth.
So even by the time you're 20,you've lost half your levels of
NAD.
So even by the time you're 20,you've lost half your levels of
nad.
Then, by the time you're 40,that amount is halved again.
And it's no surprise that thisis around the time when we
really suddenly start to feelthat we're not invincible
anymore and actually we arestarting to feel the signs and
symptoms of aging.

(01:09:22):
It's really heavily correlatedwith this decline in nad.
So scientists said, right, well, we got this molecule, it's
keeping all of these, you know,our energy production switch on,
our repair up and when it goesdown it causes all these
problems.
So what happens if we justdon't let it decline?
And basically, to cut a verylong story short, there's

(01:09:42):
hundreds, if not thousands, ofscientific publications now that
show that if you can keep NADtopped up or restore NAD levels,
it has all round benefits, fromnot only the cellular level but
all the way through to allround health span benefits.
So when NAD is boosted in cells, we see an increase in all of

(01:10:05):
the repair processes and energyproduction.
We see an actual positiveimpact on all of the hallmarks
of aging and so far it's one ofthe only things that has been
found to have a positive impacton all of the hallmarks At a
whole body level.
You know we're seeing in animalstudies and now even human

(01:10:25):
studies.
We're seeing improvements tothings like cardiovascular
function, reduction ininflammation and even reversal
of biological age.

Speaker 1 (01:10:34):
And that's something that, what I alluded to, has
really changed my life and justin a very short period of time,
explain people what yourresearch has shown that in only
in what like 28 days, you'veseen significant changes by
people taking these NAD boostingsupplements that you're

(01:10:56):
discovered.

Speaker 2 (01:10:57):
Yeah.
So when we realized that NADwas so important, I started
looking at how people were, youknow, using this information and
it became evident that therewere some supplements out there
that were designed to boost NADlevels.
But this goes back to a commentthat you made earlier.
A lot of these supplements areactually what we know as

(01:11:18):
precursors, things like NMN orNR.
They're precursors to NAD.
They're like the buildingblocks that our body uses to
make NAD, and when I startedlooking into the reason why NAD
was declining in our cells, Icouldn't find any evidence that
suggested that the reason NADgoes down is because our body

(01:11:38):
doesn't have enough of theseprecursors, these building
blocks.
Actually, all of the evidenceshows that NAD declines because
the factory in our cells,literally that NAD declines
because the factory in our cells, literally that takes the
precursor and turns it into NAD.
That is what declines with age.
So for me it was kind of one ofthose moments where it was like,
hang on a minute, theseproducts don't make much

(01:12:00):
scientific sense, so why don'twe try to do this differently?
You know, our body's very goodat making NAD when it's young.
It just seems to get turneddown these pathways that are
producing it, the enzyme that'sproducing it gets turned down.
So let's design a supplementthat has ingredients in it that
actually switches back on yourown natural nad production.

(01:12:21):
So that is exactly what wedesigned our nad boosting
product to do.
And again, you know, because ofmy background as a scientist, I
was very keen to prove that thisis not snake oil and this does
actually help people in reversebiological age.
So we did a full double blind,placebo, controlled crossover

(01:12:42):
study, which is like a goldstandard in terms of clinical
studies.
Not many supplements have thattype of study and we proved that
not only does it boost nadlevels, but also it works by
actually switching back on yourbody's own natural nad
production.
So it fixes the root cause ofthe problem.
We showed it reducesinflammation, it reduces

(01:13:05):
glycation and also we use glycanage and measured biological age
and demonstrated that it doesindeed reverse the biological
age of cells and this is inhumans, not animals.

Speaker 1 (01:13:17):
I know and here's the beauty for decades we had
animal studies where we hadshown that in animals, but
there's not many clinical trialsor human studies, which are
more, increasing more, andyou're one of the big
contributors today, and so Ilove that now we have a metric,
now we have a reallystandardized way of testing it

(01:13:39):
where we can actually prove it.
Now I just took it before evenI came across your study,
because I was like I havenothing to lose, you know, as
long as it doesn't harm, I'mjust going to take it because I
don't want to wait 10 years forresearch to prove something that
we've proven is working inanimals.

(01:14:00):
As long as it doesn't hurt me,I'm taking it.
So I'm not giving advice topeople just taking random
supplements.
I'm just saying where my logicwas.
And when I saw this significantchange in a very short, like
within a month, nikolai, withina month alone I felt it like I
felt when I read your study.
I'm like I'm exactly like thosepeople in your study, but of

(01:14:23):
course, I optimize other stufftoo.
I I changed my lifestyle.
I cut out all the sugars, otherstuff too.
I changed my lifestyle.
I cut out all the sugars.
I got more sleep.
I exercise more.
I eat much more healthconscious.
I do intermittent fasting.
I also take a lot of foods thathave all these polyphenols.

(01:14:46):
They have the flavonoids andall these molecular substrates
that basically improve the NADsynthesis pathway, which is one
of the basis of your supplement.
So can you talk about the twomain ingredients of your
supplement?
That so for the layman.

Speaker 2 (01:15:26):
Ingredients of your supplement that so for if anyone
looks on the back of the tubthey'll say, oh, these are quite
natural botanical typeingredients.
How are these working?
So we have two ingredients inthere that are actually designed
to switch back on the cellsnatural NAD production pathway.
So it's a specific enzyme inthis pathway that makes NAD and

(01:15:48):
we use a specific ingredientcalled rutin.
Now rutin contains an activemolecule called quercetin and
this can be found in certainfoods such as apples, onions.
They tend to have decentamounts of quercetin.
It's hard to get the exactamount you would need to

(01:16:08):
actually, you know, have theeffect, but it can be used as an
additive form.
We also use parsley and a lotof people go why have you got
parsley in there?
That's a really unusual thing.
So parsley actually has anactive ingredient in it called
apigenin, and apigenin is aninhibitor of something in our

(01:16:30):
cells called cd38, which drivesa lot of chronic low-grade
inflammation that actuallydegrades a lot of rnad.
Now you can eat parsley to getthe apigenin.
Um, but unfortunately you haveto eat like a truckload of
parsley yeah, a huge amount ofparsley and nobody ever would
want to eat that amount ofparsley.
But having said, that you knowpeople say to us well, why, you

(01:16:53):
know?
Why do you not just use pureapigenin?
Why are you still putting it inas the parsley?
And again, I just go back tothe fact that these molecules,
although they may be isolated inlabs and turned into pure
molecules that are put insupplements, they never existed
like that in nature, which meansit's very hard for our body and

(01:17:14):
our gut to absorb them in thatformat.
If you take it in the wholefood format or the extract
format, you definitely get waymore absorption.
So my PhD was actually inbioavailability, which is why
I'm so particular about whatsort of ingredients go in?
um, but yeah, another one greentea.
Green tea has a very powerfulactive ingredient called egcg

(01:17:38):
and this is a catechin andbasically what this does is it
inhibits some other methylationprocesses that degrade our nad
as we get older.
So again, just looking at allof these natural things that are
already there and available,that we have put into a
supplement in the rightcombination, the right amounts
the right formulation that isthen proven in a human clinical

(01:18:01):
trial to reverse biological agejust shows that we do not need
drugs.
You the things that we can bedoing now that actually can have
real significant impact on ourcellular health.

Speaker 1 (01:18:15):
Absolutely, and for anyone that is interested to try
it out, I'll put a link downbelow.
And it's definitely worthtrying.
And it's definitely worthtrying.
However, you should accompanythis with the lifestyle changes

(01:18:36):
that we discussed, or elseyou're just really not.
I don't know if I don't knowwhat your study has looked at.
Did your study look at peoplein accordance with lifestyle
changes, or did they maintaintheir lifestyle and then just
take that?

Speaker 2 (01:18:50):
this was we had to get them to maintain lifestyle,
make no changes.

Speaker 1 (01:18:54):
So just to see if it's a pearly the supplement.

Speaker 2 (01:18:57):
But you know, just to sort of quickly like whiz
through the lifestyle thingsthat I would say.
Diet we've already discussedthat that's extremely important.
Exercise I mean you know itgoes without saying exercise
it's been shown in a study thatthose people who engaged in 12
and a half hours of activity,exercise activity a week, show a

(01:19:20):
42 reduction in all causemortality like there is no drug
on this earth that has such abeneficial effect.
And you want to be looking atincorporating both high
intensity interval training andthat actually switches on energy
stress pathways.
So you were talking earlierabout this idea of putting

(01:19:41):
yourselves under a little bit ofstress and this is a concept
called hormesis and it'sbasically the fact that many of
the beneficial pathways in ourcells that kickstart repair only
ever get switched on if we putour bodies under a little bit of
stress.
Otherwise they don't bother.
And this goes back to evolutionand the way that our biology is

(01:20:01):
designed.
It's not designed to be sittingall day at a computer, having
three meals a day and fivesnacks.
Is designed to be runningaround finding our food, going
for periods without food andthen suddenly the body has to go
oh, no food.
I need to kickstart repair.
I need to be not be wasteful.
Unfortunately, those thingsaren't getting switched on in

(01:20:23):
our modern lifestyles, so thingslike high intensity interval
training can really help toactivate some of those pathways.
Intermittent fasting, like youmentioned as well, also will
activate similar pathways in thebody.
When it comes to exercisemuscle, muscle mass decreases by
three to eight percent per yearafter age 30.

(01:20:46):
Muscle mass is massively linkedto longevity.
It's very important to maintainthat.

Speaker 1 (01:20:52):
And then that's where most of our mitochondria reside
yeah, exactly that and that'swhere energy factories are they
are, and just in.

Speaker 2 (01:20:59):
They are first of all where the energy factories are
better at removing sugar andthings like that, for insulin
resistance, but also justgenerally.
We know that as muscle massdeclines, people are more at
risk of falls, and actuallyfalls are one of the biggest
killers of older people, becauseonce somebody has fallen and
broken a hip or whatever, thenthey cannot, you know, live.

(01:21:22):
They can't all of the otherthings.
The cognitive function goesdown, they can't get out, they
can't be doing any otherexercise.
Everything then starts to know.

Speaker 1 (01:21:32):
I think you touched on a very important topic, which
is muscle mass, is one of thethings that the primary care
physician doesn't emphasizeenough.
You know, it's almost like weaccept our physical decline.
The problem is, as we get older, we lose muscle mass.
Our body is less capable ofcreating new muscle mass for two

(01:21:56):
reasons Our caloric intake thatcomes from protein mainly
decreases, so people are nottaking enough protein.
And, secondary, you need to dosome sort of resistance training
to actively build muscle mass,to put the protein into muscle,
or else the protein will just beturned into fat because you're

(01:22:19):
just sitting around and you'resedentary, you're not active,
and all of that is going to beturned into sugar and that's not
going to be utilized by yourbody and in turn it's going to
be stored around all your organs, your livers, kidney, heart,
everywhere as fat storage, andthat's what gives us chronic

(01:22:40):
disease and illness.
So I think, focusing for anyonethat is above the age of 50 and
is accepting their age as anexcuse or using it as an excuse
to be less active, you have todo the opposite, because unless
you build up your muscle mass,you will not be able to store

(01:23:03):
the glucose, because your muscleis, in general, the biggest
storage unit for sugar Muscle is, in general, the biggest
storage unit for sugar.
And also you're decreasing thenumber of mitochondria that

(01:23:24):
produces the NAD, which are yourenergy factories, produces the
ATP, which is energy, what ourbody uses as energy.
So the only way to come out ofthat vicious cycle again I sound
like a broken record.
The only way to come out of thatvicious cycle again I sound
like a broken record.
You have to hit the gym andjust doing a little bit cardio
is not enough.
You actually have, by strengthtraining, I don't mean
bodybuilding, I just meanmaintaining your muscle mass,
and that's something yousignificantly lose as you age

(01:23:47):
and then, like you said, nicola,it contributes to falls.
And then also, increasing yourmuscle mass actually increases
your bone density, makes yourtendons and ligaments thicker,
gets rid of the inflammatoryprocesses that happen in those
parts of your body body andboosting it, together with NAD

(01:24:12):
boosters and propersupplementation based on your
particular body, which hasrelated to your diet and
lifestyle supplements, like youknow, from your vitamin D,
vitamin K, your magnesium, allthe good stuff.
That is beyond this podcastright now that you can find
enough information online.
I think it's the key is reallyin combining all those things,
but I think our job here is toexplain you the processes at a

(01:24:36):
cellular level that contributeto improving your health span
and with that, also yourlifespan.

Speaker 2 (01:24:48):
Exactly that your health span and with that, also
your lifespan.
Exactly that it's.
You know, it's just.
I think a lot of people aresick of hearing the same things
like oh, do this, do that withyour diet, exercise, sleep.
Everyone's so sick of it yeah,we've heard it all before, but I
think now it's about looking atall of those things in a new

(01:25:08):
light and, you know,understanding actually there is
the significant impact they arehaving on our bodies, and then
also being able to measure thatthese things are having an
impact, being able to see thatif you are changing your diet,
it really is lowering yourglycan age, it's lowering the
inflammation, it's loweringbiological age, and seeing that

(01:25:30):
a lifestyle change can make sucha massive impact.
Um, you know, sleep again.

Speaker 1 (01:25:36):
That's another thing we haven't even touched upon yet
it's so important Um sleep isjust it's how many hours of
sleep do you recommend uh to be,um recommend to be, to have
shown like significantly to beanti aging?
How many hours of sleep?
I know there's differentphilosophies about sleep, but by

(01:25:58):
sleep we also are talking aboutquality sleep.
Which?

Speaker 2 (01:26:00):
is.

Speaker 1 (01:26:01):
REM sleep, Like if you're in bed for eight hours.
You're not sleeping for eighthours, you're probably sleeping
like maybe seven hours or sevenand a half hours.
So can you talk about aboutthat?
How many hours of sleep do youactually get?

Speaker 2 (01:26:14):
so I aim for seven, seven to eight, and seven to
eight is what is recommended.
So it seems that sleep has abit of a u-shaped curve, which
means that too little is too bad, but also too much is also too
bad.
So around eight hours seems tobe the sweet spot for most
people.
There's less than one percentof people that can actually get

(01:26:36):
away with less than six hourssleep, with not get, without
getting some sort of health, umbenefit, decline in health, from
it.
So I think less than sixdefinitely not good.
And even up until very recently,I think you know, especially
between professionals and youknow people I guess in type

(01:26:57):
doctors, people that you'reworking with, there is almost
like a thing of like, oh howlittle sleep can we survive on,
and like it's like a badge ofhonor, but it's really, really
not a good thing.
And and you know what, therewas something that I saw
recently which actually I meanit, it really shocked me, but
then it didn't.
But it was that the WorldHealth Organization have

(01:27:20):
actually classified shift workas a potential carcinogen
because of the so much evidenceof how much shift work ruins our
sleep and has such a profoundimpact on health that the the
world health organization haveliterally labeled it actually

(01:27:42):
I'm not surprised.

Speaker 1 (01:27:42):
I'm actually surprised to hear that,
especially coming from a WorldHealth Organization which in the
past decade I've kind ofchanged my opinion about them,
but that's a different topic.
It's that it makes sense,because the one thing is not
about how much sleep you get,but also when you get it,

(01:28:05):
meaning you should wake up atthe same time every day and go
to sleep at the same time,because your body is really
depending all the functions inyour body based on the hormones
that get released.
They're really based on thecircadian rhythm that you don't
want to change it.
It's not like you sleep andwake up the same time during the

(01:28:25):
weekend and on weekends youcompletely disturb it.
That significantly alters thepattern and with that you're
cellular aging.

Speaker 2 (01:28:32):
Yeah, exactly that.
It's about the timing of goingto sleep, and that is just
something that people don'tappreciate.
Going to bed and getting eighthours sleep between 1 am and
nine is very different to goingto bed at 10 and getting eight
hours sleep.
And if you one day you're goingto bed at 10, the next day

(01:28:53):
you're going to bed at 1am, yourcircadian rhythm, which is
meant to be a 24 hour cycle, issuddenly either becoming
compressed or stretched, andthen that knocks everything
everything else that iscontrolling you know out of sync
as well.
So, yes, having you know, good,good bedtime routine, so trying
to go to bed at the same timeand wake up at the same time is
very important andnon-negotiable.

Speaker 1 (01:29:16):
Sorry, that's non, that's non-negotiable.
So so let's put that in thecategory of the non-negotiable.
So sleep, eight hours of sleepand the same pattern
non-negotiable yeah, exactlywhat's the second one?

Speaker 2 (01:29:28):
the second non-negotiable, aside from sleep
, is definitely the diet makingsure that you're getting 30
different plants in your dieteach week.
And this, can you know thissounds people go.
That's so difficult.
It's not have a fruit saladwith five, six different fruits
in.
Have a actual salad withdifferent types of leaves, herbs
, spices, nuts, seeds, evenchocolate.

(01:29:50):
You know a bit of darkchocolate.
It's coming from a plant thathas got powerful antioxidants in
.
You can very easily get 30different plants and again, that
is shown to help reversebiological age.
So that would be number two.

Speaker 1 (01:30:04):
As well as protein.
So protein you know a lot ofthere's all these vegan movement
and such but there areessential amino acids, that
meaning the amino acids that ourbody doesn't make, is incapable
of making, and they come onlyfrom animal sources or eggs.
You know red meat, fish,chicken.
You know, specifically leucineglycine, and they're important

(01:30:28):
for your brain, they'reimportant for your vision,
they're important for your skin.
So if you are vegetarian orvegan, you have to make sure
that you supplement thoseessential amino acids one or the
other way, otherwise you'regoing to get really sick.
So protein is important.
There is the currentrecommendation of protein.
To me is way below what oneshould be taking, which is kind

(01:30:53):
of like the main, just basesurvival for your body survival,
but definitely not optimal,which is optimal.
You're supposed to take about0.8 gram per pound of protein.
So that's important.
Otherwise you can't buildmuscle mass and you won't have
any energy to do your exercise.
So sleep diet is non-negotiable.

(01:31:14):
What's the third one?
Exercise Unsurprisingly how manyhours a week, would you say, is
important.

Speaker 2 (01:31:22):
So the study shows 12 and a half, but the reality is
that for someone doing nothing,anything is better than nothing.
Um, again, studies have shownthat you know, people don't even
do any steps.
Even getting 4 000 steps a dayhas been shown to improve
cognitive function.
I mean, versus someone thatdoes nothing.
So doing something is betterthan nothing?
Um, but you know, absolutelytry and you know, just make

(01:31:47):
different choices.
Think about getting out for awalk at lunchtime rather than
sitting, and try to get to thegym.
Try to mix up gym, not justdoing cardio, which a lot of
people do.
Do some resistance training.
It's really important, as we'vealready mentioned.

Speaker 1 (01:32:02):
I think to that point .
I had a separate podcast acouple of years ago with a
neurologist who is an expert inbrain health.
His studies actually showedthat walking one mile a day
increases the size of yourhippocampus by 40%, which is in
charge of your memory andpreventative for Alzheimer's

(01:32:23):
dementia.
So one mile a day, that'snothing the know.
The definition is interesting.
I was shocked to hear that thedefinition of a sedentary, of
someone that is sedentary, isless than 5,000 steps a day.
That equates to roughly 2.7miles, and unless you have a dog
or something that you have towalk three times a day, you're

(01:32:48):
not going to get in 5,000 steps.

Speaker 2 (01:32:50):
Think about actually going and doing it.

Speaker 1 (01:32:53):
And that's the one factor that is significantly
associated with all-causemortality by a significant
number.
I don't know the exact number,but that alone, the definition
of sedentary is less than 5,000steps a day, and that doesn't
even include your resistancetraining.
That is even more important aswe age, since we lose muscle
mass as we age yeah.

(01:33:14):
So that's the third one.
What's?
Is there a fourth or fifth one?
So my fourth would be.

Speaker 2 (01:33:20):
So we've talked about good stress for the body, the
kind of what can make youstronger stress, but the other
type of stress is psychologicalstress the bad?
Stress and you know a lot ofpeople will say, oh, I'm not
stressed, I'm fine.
But stress is very relative andyou know lots of people are
living in chronic states ofstress and they just get used to

(01:33:40):
it and actually the when youare stressed, you have elevated
cortisol, which is incrediblypro-inflammatory, and this is a
real issue that people arechronically stressed have a lot
of inflammation and this isaccelerating aging.
So even in people that don'tthink they're stressed, even
doing things like meditation,breath work which again is

(01:34:03):
something that a lot of peoplehave perceived as being quite
woo woo and you know, oh, I'mnot going to meditate and you
know what difference is thatgoing to make but actually there
are literally studies nowshowing that meditation can
actually reduce inflammation inyour body and also extend the
length of your telomeres.
So just by sitting, meditating,you can calm calming the brain

(01:34:27):
and calming the body, you canactually reverse two of the
hallmarks of aging there 100,and that's that's where I think
cynicism can kill you.

Speaker 1 (01:34:37):
And I think one of the things about mental health
is not often talked about and weit's almost seen as a sign of
weakness, um, if you admit it ordo anything about it.
But in our society it has beenchanging and that's a good thing
.
So mental health is one of thebig stressors, probably if not

(01:34:58):
the biggest stressor, especiallyin the Western world that is
fast-paced and we put everythingonto ourselves and just blame
others, and then let theexternal uh onto ourselves and
just blame others, and then letthe external uh facts of life,
like, really affect us in aterrible way, and stress has
been therefore associated withuh on all-cause mortality and
cancer because it significantlyincreases uh inflammation in our

(01:35:22):
body.
And uh, these, these are, thisis science.
By the way, guys, this is notlike us like.
This is not opinion.
This is science.
By the way, guys, this is notlike us, like.
This is not opinion.

Speaker 2 (01:35:30):
This is true science.

Speaker 1 (01:35:31):
Yeah, this is not theory, for those of you who
have.

Speaker 2 (01:35:34):
For me as a scientist , everything that I talk about
is not theory.
There is science to back it upin terms of the stress.
There was literally a studydone that showed that acute
traumatic episodes so thingslike surgery, things like
pregnancy even they classifiedas a traumatic episodes.
So things like surgery, thingslike pregnancy even they
classified as a traumaticepisode increased biological age

(01:35:55):
and this was reversible.
So that is the key thing thatit's reversible.

Speaker 1 (01:36:00):
I can't tell you, every time I take a history on a
patient that suddenly has anacute autoimmune disease,
whether it is skin related,whether it is uh system related,
like lupus, um, it always therewas always a preceding um
stressful event in their lives,like a that shocked the system,

(01:36:22):
and that's how our body respondsand it just puts our immune
system out of array and thesethings happen.
So it's not fluff talk.
Meditation is not like holdinghands and singing a song is
really affects your health.
So that's a fourth one.
Is there a fifth one?

Speaker 2 (01:36:39):
You know, I think they would be the best ones,
they would be my go tos andobviously I also.

Speaker 1 (01:36:46):
I also take NAD supplement, but I think for a
lot of people I was going to sayto that point.
My fifth, non-negotiable, whichis what you just mentioned, is
optimizing my biomarkers throughsupplementation, meaning areas,
supplements that are deficientin my body based on what I'm

(01:37:09):
eating, and then I use thosebiomarkers to improve my diet
and lifestyle.
I look at them as signs, butwhile I'm doing that, I'm
supplementing them, and we'retalking about stuff like vitamin
C, vitamin D, vitamin K,magnesium.
I actually take ashwagandha forjust reduce my cortisol level,
just because the nature of mywork is very stressful, even

(01:37:32):
though I have to include moremindfulness in my life that in
order to reduce my stress.
That way, and you know a bunchof other supplements.
I think I take about 12 or 13different supplements.
Um, together with my lifestylechanges, and partly also because
I'm experimenting, I'm justfollowing to see which one

(01:37:54):
affects my biomarkers.
But I think, to conclude, thelessons we learned from this
conversation is you can't justchange your life with
supplements.
You have to make lifestylemodifications.
Using current science that isundeniably affecting our health
through boosting our immunesystem and turning back the

(01:38:38):
biologic clock.
So, for those of you who haveheard about NAD and I mean
people are getting infusions,injections and all kinds of
stuff because it's not verybioavailable.
I love your approach to it toboost the enzymes and the
substrates.
That actually enables our cell,which is an amazing ecosystem

(01:39:01):
that actually can produce theNAD on its own if we help it out
.
I think that's a much smarterapproach.
And if you want to take NMNwhich is something I do, but it
certainly won't be the onlything that you should take, as
we just discussed that, yourability to turn NMN into NAD

(01:39:22):
decreases as we age, so you needsome sort of boosting agent.
So I will put the link downbelow for people that want to
try it out.
There is going to be a discountcode if you want to try it out
for the first time, and I thinkwhat is it like?
30?
Is there 30 tablets?
They take one a day, or howdoes that work?

Speaker 2 (01:39:41):
So it's six capsules a day.

Speaker 1 (01:39:43):
Six capsules a day, so when should they take it?
In the morning or in theevening?

Speaker 2 (01:39:49):
so do they.
When should they take it in themorning or in the evening?

Speaker 1 (01:39:50):
we would recommend taking it more towards morning,
midday if possible, just becausethat that sort of yeah within
your natural circadian rhythm ofnad um, but we recommend taking
it with food as well I actually, when I started, I mistakenly
took the nad boosters and I'm inthe evening and I couldn't.
I literally couldn't sleep.
I was like I was wired, I waslike up ready to go to work, so

(01:40:12):
take it in.
I take it in the morning myself, you know, um, or early, um
afternoon, or midday and um, um,nicola, thank you so much.
I know this was supposed to bean hour where, uh, I knew that
it's not going to happen.
In an hour it's just so much todiscuss, especially to frame it
properly for the audience sothey understand what we're

(01:40:32):
talking about.
I'm really so grateful, not justfor you coming on to the show
to help educate my audience, butalso for the research that
you're doing, that you're doing.
I think we need more people andscientists like yourself that
don't think about drugs andrather think about how we can

(01:40:54):
improve our lives, and I thinkwe've arrived at a time in
society where people are ready.
I think 10 years ago would havebeen difficult.
I think today there's not apatient I talked to is not ready
to implement these types ofchanges, and the distrust
towards medicine hassignificantly increased in the

(01:41:16):
recent years, especially afterCOVID, and people are ready to
really grab the bull by thehorns and just take their health
in their own hands and be incontrol of their own faith, and
the evidence is out there.
So thank you so much, nicola,and I hope we meet one day in

(01:41:38):
one of these conferences andmeetings and I will definitely
have you back on this podcast,because there's so much stuff
that we didn't have time todiscuss.
It's going to be a littlenerdier one, a little more one
that is more specific into thebasic science of what we
mentioned today.
I think it would be great to doa part two for anyone that's

(01:42:00):
interested, and thank you somuch.

Speaker 2 (01:42:02):
Yeah, no, thank you for having me.
I think we definitely couldhave spoke for another hour, or
even two.

Speaker 1 (01:42:08):
Right me.

Speaker 2 (01:42:11):
I think we definitely could have spoke for another
hour or even two, right um, butI just hope it's inspired some
people to think differentlyabout aging, because it really
is the future.
So thank you so much all right,everyone episode's over.

Speaker 1 (01:42:21):
Um, I hope you enjoyed my conversation with
anti-aging scientist dr nicolaconlon from Nuchito Time Plus,
and if you'd like to try her NADbooster supplement, please just
click on the link in thecaption and get your discount
code DrHamrah20, d-r-h-a-m-r-a-h20.

(01:42:46):
No space and again, as always,please don't forget to leave me
a review on Apple, itunes andSpotify or any other outlet.
You listen to this podcast anduntil next time, bye-bye.

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