Something Old, Something Terrifying - Season 2: The Well

Hey, Who fans and welcome to Episode 422.

The Doctor and Belinda arrive at a remote dig site where ancient history is colliding with something far more sinister. As tensions rise and minds begin to fray, it’s not clear what’s real or who’s in control.

We chat about the episode’s eerie tone, the way it leans into psychological horror, and the strength of Belinda’s performance alongside the Doctor, plus a few thoughts on the pacing and how it fits into the broader run of Season 2 so far.

This is The Big Blue Box Podcast

Join us each week for a new episode every Friday from your hosts Garry and Adam. We talk news, reviews, commentaries and general chat on everything Doctor Who PLUS listen to our monthly Round Table episodes with the whole team. Check out our website where you can also listen to all of our episodes for free along with the amazing reviews and articles from our writing team.

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Have a fantastic week and until next time remember... Aaaaaaaaaaallons-y!

Episode Transcript

(00:19):
Hey, hey, hey. Who Fans andwelcome to the Big Blue Box Podcast.
My name is Garry.
My name is Adam.
Welcome to episode 422.
Yeehaw.

(00:46):
Welcome back, everybody, toanother episode. We hope you're keeping
well and safe. We hope you'vehad a cracking week and that you've
all managed to do somethingDoctor. Doctor who related.
Oh, wow. I didn't stand achance there.
I have to win one week back.Yeah, of course, you've run away

(01:06):
with it the last few weeks.
That was something else. Didyou notice I give the old yeehaw
there, mate? I've beenlistening to the Round table episode
this morning and I noticedthat one of our writing team gave
a yeehaw in the intro and I'mlike, okay, we're up in our game.
Are we? All right?
Did. Yeah, I think I commentedon that in the intro as well. Somebody

(01:27):
gave us a yeehaw, which isvery American. Very nice.
Yeah, yeah. So I thought I'dgive a yeehaw back.
Thank you. Well, you canlegitimately say it for. Because
of where you're based, right?
Exactly, mate. Yes, I can.
In deep in the heart of Texas.
That's right. Yeehaw. Yeah.

(01:48):
So, big Blue Box listener,welcome back. We've got our review
of the well to throw at you.Yes, you're a bit late on this one
this week. Apologies, myfault. Had arranged to record earlier
in the week, but things thatI'd forgotten about had to be done.
Things to do, places to go,people to see and all that jazz.

(02:11):
So it's a late one. Thursday.I can't remember the last time we
recorded on a Thursday.
No, I know, mate. Yeah, it'sall right. It's good. It's letting
it all. It's all sunk in. Yes,my thoughts are gathered. I feel
like, yeah, I'm ready to diveinto this one.
Ready to rock and roll. Haveyou. Is this a multiple viewing for
you or is it just the ones?
No, I gave it to. I've givenit two viewings this week just to

(02:34):
sort of really soak it up.
Yeah, cool, Cool. I think it'sneeded, isn't it?
You know, I always like togive it up to two views, mate. Yeah,
yeah.
Once as a fan, once as areviewer. Not in that order necessarily.
Take your pick. Whatever.Before we crack on with thus said

(02:56):
review, make sure you'refollowing the podcast on your favorite
podcast app of choice. Thatway you won't miss an episode when
they land every single. Well,at this point in the week, it's Just
whenever we get it done. Butit's usually at this point sort of
a Tuesday at the minute afterwe read the episodes, so you won't
miss notification for those.Plus, as Adam said, we have the roundtable

(03:19):
episode that's just gone outthat happens once a month where we
gather, we gather all thewriters and we just chat about something
to do with Doctor who. Wenormally review and get those guys
thoughts on something. So onthe one that went out this week,
we spoke about and did a bitof a recap on the Capital Cutaway
event a few weeks ago inLondon. Spoke about that, which is

(03:39):
very cool. And then I gotthose guys to chat about their thoughts
on season two so far, now thatwe're a few episodes in. So that
was very cool. So you won'tmiss those as well. You can also
listen online over at thewebsite bigblueboxpodcast.co.uk.
listen for free on there. Andwhile you're on the website you can
read the really cool reviewsand articles and everything from

(04:01):
the writing team. Go and checkthose out. There are links there
to the socials as well. Wechat Doctor who all the time, so
come and connect with us. Giveus a like and a follow and chat Doctor
who. We also have a freeDiscord server link is on the website.
Hop in there. Chat loads ofDoctor who with very cool who fans.
And also don't forget toremember to check out my co host
channel on YouTube. The latestone, very cool. The old vinyl. Tracking

(04:26):
down Record store day. Go andcheck out Adam's channel on YouTube.
It's the geek's Handbag.
The Geek sandbag, yes. Justuploaded that new video. You can
go and see the massive recordstore that I went to here in Texas.
I mean I nearly got lost inthere, mate. It was. It was a bit
like a Tardis. You walkthrough this little door and it just
was vast. It was incredible. Ispent hours in there and looking

(04:47):
for a Dr. Who vinyl. So it'sDr. Who related. Yeah, go and check
out my latest vid if you sofeel like it.
Can check them out. Yeah,Adam's on the same name in on the
socials, the Geek Sandbag.
So that's it.
Yeah, gonna have a chat aboutall things geekery. But seriously
though, great channel thatAdam's been running for donkeys years
now. Loads of cool stuff onthere. Yeah, so loads of Doctor who

(05:11):
stuff to get stuck in overthere. Alrighty, with that being
said, let's crack on, bud.What we're reviewing this week.
Yeah. So Here we are in shoothis second season with episode three
now and it's called the well.
Hamlet.
And jump.

(05:31):
Jump.
Jump. Colony base 1515 daysago. All contact was lost, the base
went silent.
This whole world is cold,lifeless and dead. You should stay
suited. What if no one'salive? They're all went mad. Any

(05:56):
sign of trouble, shoot to kill.
What?
What is it?
What happened?
I thought I saw.
You thought you saw a person?
I. I didn't, did I? It's anempty room. There's no one there
who. Creepy vibes, mate.Creepy vibes. This one. So the. Well,

(06:24):
it was first broadcast on 26April, so mere days prior to when
we're recording this. It was aruntime usual for this season, about
40ish minutes. This one waswritten by. This was co written by
Russell T. Davis and SharmaAngel Woelfel. Directed by Amanda

(06:44):
Brochi. Stars Shooter Gatma ofcourse as the Doctor and Varada Sethu
as Belinda. And then about adozen supporting cast members. And
the synopsis for this one isfar in the future. On a tough, brutal
planet, a devastated miningcolony has only one survivor. To
discover the truth, the Doctorand Belinda must face absolute terror.

(07:09):
So, mate, as seems to be thecase with this season so far, picking
up exactly where last week'sepisode left off left us. What are
your thoughts, mate? Asalways, out the gate on this one.
Out the gate, mate. I thoughtit was a good episode. Some good
stuff this week. We do seem tobe finding our feet a bit, I think,

(07:33):
with shooters Doctor thisseason. I wish we'd seen a bit more
of this the last season, butyou know, it is what it is. Good
stuff. This is the kind ofDoctor who I like, mate, where it's
got a dark edge to it, acreepy atmosphere. I don't think
we should have this everyweek, but it's certainly the sort
of Doctor who that I sit downand enjoy. A slow burner in some

(07:56):
senses. I don't know if kidswould have stuck with this. I think
they may have found it a bitboring. But as an adult, I really
enjoyed it. I'm not goingcrazy about it as much as some people,
so I once again had to lookonline because I didn't get to watch
this till Sunday evening. AndI saw a hugely positive, probably

(08:17):
the most positive I've seenfor a long time, even more than last
week's. People were like 10out of 10. This is already in my
top five best ever Doctor whostories. And I'm like, whoa, What?
You know. So I Was reallygeared up to watch this, mate, but
made sure that my expectationsweren't too high. Didn't want to
go into it too much. But, yes,I can see why people enjoyed it.

(08:39):
I. I'm not going to be givingit a 10 out of 10 when we get to
the scores. The reasons forthat, just quickly, it's because
I, although I really enjoyed,did feel like it was all stuff I'd
seen before. So I was kind ofsat there thinking, this is good,
but, you know, the whole it'sbehind your back. And it felt like

(08:59):
a mix between Midnight, which,of course, it's a sort of sequel
to. Which is cool, I think,but it felt like a mix between Midnight
and the Satan Pit and a lot ofother things. And it. To me, it didn't
feel very original, but thatdoesn't mean it wasn't good. So I
wasn't going crazy about it inthe same way that some people were.
I wouldn't put it up there inmy top five because I think when

(09:20):
you break it down and you getrid of some great direction, good
performances from the cast,you know, the actual story is fairly
basic, you know, but, yeah,that's, you know, I don't want to
take away from the enjoymentthat I had for the episode, which
was that I thought it was agood one this week, but not perfect.

(09:40):
It's not going to be a 10 forme, but it will certainly be up there
with a fairly decent score.How about yourself?
H. Yeah, I. Kind of. Kind ofon the same line of thinking as you
on this one, dude. Although Ithink I. I'm not sure if I enjoyed
it as much as you did, by thesound of it.
Okay.
Mainly for the reasons thatyou've literally just said. I think

(10:02):
it started off really well forme, but then by the end of the episode
I thought, this is justtreading the same ground that we've
been through. And like yousaid, it's. It's a mix of. It's like,
turn left, Midnight. Same.Yeah, Those kind of things that Russell's
done before. It's. It's. Andit wasn't scary enough for me either.

(10:27):
I will say, oh, okay. Itstarted off being quite creepy and
I thought, okay, this is. Thisis pretty cool. But then it just
fizzles out to, there'snothing wrong with this kind of approach
to. To. To trying to be creepyand scary and stuff, you know, where.
Excuse me, you can't reallysee the monster as such. In this

(10:48):
episode, we saw like veryfleeting, sort of little tiny like
one second it's on screen andthen it's gone again. So it wasn't
too bad, it wasn't terrible,that sort of thing. And there was
a. There was a Matt Smithepisode, wasn't there? Was it called
Hyde Hide?
Yeah.
Where they played on thisthing of, you know, out of the corner
of your eye sort of thing. Soyou can't really see the thing directly,

(11:11):
but you kind of knowsomething's there. So for me, it
would have been far scarierand far creepier to do a full on
possession story. You know,the, the deaf character, Alice. Yeah,
it would have been far betterfor her to have been properly possessed

(11:32):
by this thing rather thanthis, like I said, this trope that's
been done before with turnleft where, oh, there's something
behind you. It's very panto tome, this stuff. It's very much like
something behind you. Yeah.Oh, look, there's something behind
you. And then there isn'tturns around. It's like, no, there's
nothing behind me. It's like,oh, yes, there is all this stuff.
So I enjoyed it to a degree,don't get me wrong. I think it was.

(11:55):
I think it's the best episodeof the season so far.
Yeah.
And there is a lot to likeabout it. But on the other hand,
it was one of those storieswhere I flip flopped a lot as I went
through both times watchingit, where one second I'm thinking,
oh, this is great stuff. Andthen literally within a few seconds
I'm like, I'm bored nowbecause I've seen this bit done before.

(12:16):
I've seen the way that thissort of turns out. And then because
of that, the, the ending justbecomes mega predictable because
of. Yeah, you know, so, yeah,I liked it on one hand and then literally
at the drop of a hat, on theother hand I'm like, this is. I'm
bored out of my mind. So,yeah, it was definitely a tale of

(12:37):
two halves for me, this one.
Yeah, I hear you, mate. Imean, that's the thing. It's not
an episode. I mean, I enjoyedit. But is it one that I'm going
to reach for to watch again?You know, not anytime soon. I'd happily
watch it if it was on, on thetv, you know, if I turned it on and
it was on. But yeah, that'sthe thing because it felt very familiar
in lots of its, you know,ideas that were going on in it. Like

(13:00):
it's behind you and all thissort of stuff. And it did feel like
a combination of Episodes, Ifound it almost predictable, you
know, when I was watching it,when they were like, don't go behind
it, I thought, well, they'reall good. At some point they're all
going to go and try and findthe creature behind her and then
they're all going to die and,you know, it's going to jump to another
host. And I could almost sortof. I was sort of almost one step
ahead of the episode the wholetime I was watching it. I felt, even

(13:22):
on a first watch, you know,and I agree with you about on a rewatch,
I do find myself getting alittle bit bored, you know, because
it is a slow burner. So I'mnot trying to take away anything
from the episode. But that's.That's, you know, that's what I mean
when I say that it felt almostlike we were retreading stuff rather
than anything new, if you knowwhat I mean. We did have fun. I watched

(13:45):
it the first time with mypartner. We did have fun trying to
freeze frame to see thecreature, because it is. I think
it's on there for like half aframe or something. And we had so
many goes and we finally gotit. We're like, yes, we've managed
to do it. And you do. You justsee the tiniest. You just sort of
see this head just behind it.You really barely see it, but I kind

(14:08):
of like that. But again, itwas predictable that we were never
going to see it. I thought we,you know, we are. Although it's kind
of been seen as a sequel toMidnight, we are never going to see
the creature. You know, again,that's a bit predictable. And. And
just on the subject ofMidnight, mate, because this is a
kind of sequel to it, in asense. Midnight is one of the big

(14:30):
reasons I always like to watchan episode twice, because I've never
had such a big turnaround onan episode as I did with Midnight.
I really did not like Midnightas an episode on a first watch. When
it aired, I thought. I think Idescribed it as like an episode of
EastEnders in Space, whereeveryone's just shouting each other,
all right, make it back overhere. You know, I really didn't get

(14:53):
the fuss about Midnight atall. And yet when I finally, finally
rewatched it, I was like, satthinking, this is great. You know,
it's almost like I waswatching a different episode. I couldn't
understand why it hadn'tclicked for me the first time around.
It was definitely one of thoseepisodes where everybody loved it
and I didn't. And so that iswhy I always like to give an episode

(15:15):
of the Watch, because I nowgenuinely think Midnight is a great,
great bottled, containedepisode. But the. Well, as a sequel.
I don't know if Midnightneeded a sequel, to be honest with
you, but it kind of worked ina sense. We got a cool flashback,
a tenant and whatever thecharacter's name that, you know,
that's it. But it's not upthere with Midnight for me, even

(15:37):
on second watch. It's just agood. Would you call it a sequel,
mate? I guess. I don't know.
It kind of companion. Yeah,yeah, yeah. Midnight is an absolute
belter of a story becauseit's. It does the same kind of thing
that it does in this one, butjust to a more effective. A more

(15:58):
effective way of doing it.Because in that. In Midnight, you
know, the character sky playedbrilliantly by Leslie Sharp in that
episode.
That's it. Yeah.
She does this really coolthing where it kind of gets you guessing
for a few minutes. It's like,is she possessed? Is she not? What's
going on? And it really built.That episode builds up the tension

(16:22):
because, you know, you hear,like the banging on the outside of
the thing.
Yes.
For a little while and it, youknow, and it builds up and you think,
what's going on? And the onlytime that you really understand what's
going on and it clicks is whenthe Doctor's talking and then Skye's
character starts to mimic theDoctor and they start speaking at
the same time. You rememberthat bit? And then. Yes, the Doctor

(16:44):
loses his voice because skythen starts to anticipate and say
what the Doctor's gonna sayahead of him. And it's just really.
It's really creepy. It'sreally well done. So I was hoping
for that kind of stuff in thisepisode, which is why I was really
hoping they would do a properpossession story, because it makes

(17:06):
it more personal to thecharacter. Because in this one, however
much I enjoyed Rose AilingEllis's performance as Alice, I thought
she was really good, such asweet character. And it was one of
those times where the act didthe performance. And I will say this
story had some goodperformances. Her performance kind

(17:26):
of gave you that emotionalconnection. And so when she was in
tears quite a lot and she wasdesperate to just go home because
she's got a daughter and thatsort of thing, you really felt for
her, but at the same time, youwere like, well, there's no. There's
no kind of. Although you're.You've built a connection because

(17:47):
her performance is Good. Andyou feel for her, the. The. The monster
or the entity, whatever youwant to call it, it's because they
gave it. Even if it was, likeyou said, just a half a frame or
very, you know, these fleetingmoments, as soon as you've given
the monster any kind ofphysical image, any kind of physical

(18:09):
thing form, bang. That's theillusion gone. You know, you're no
longer dealing with this kindof weird, cryptic, ghostly kind of
thing. You're now just. You'reup against an actual thing and it
kind of takes the magic away alittle bit, you know, takes the.
Takes the edge off the. Offthe creepiness. Whereas Midnight

(18:32):
kept that very much. You were100%. You didn't see the thing ever.
Yeah.
You know, it was all donethrough the performances of the characters
and that was what made it socreepy. So, yeah, I was hoping for
that again, like rinse andrepeat, because that would have made
it way scarier. But. But theperformances were pretty sweet, though,
dude.
Yeah, I mean, I've. I hearwhat you say, mate. I absolutely

(18:54):
do. I. I didn't mind that wesaw the flash of the. The creature.
I didn't mind that because Iknew that's all we were going to
see. I thought, we're nevergoing to actually see it any more
than they're showing us. And Iwas. I was fine with that. I think
that's absolutely, you know,correct. I wouldn't have wanted to
see the creature, but. Yeah,I. I get what you mean. It. Perhaps

(19:15):
it would have been scarier ifthey were actually possessed by it.
I have to say, mate, the. Thestar of the show, and I hope I'm
not jumping ahead here, butthe person that really made this
episode for me and Iabsolutely think deserves all the
sort of 10 out of 10 thatpeople were sort of saying on. On
X and stuff, is Alice, playedby Rose. How to say her name? Rose.

(19:39):
Ailing Ellis.
Ailing Rosa.
Sorry. She was absolutelyfantastic, mate. What I loved about
performance was that when theepisode starts, I could not tell
if she was evil or scared or,you know, the look she was giving
you. You weren't quite surewhat was going on. And I just thought
her performance was fantasticin this. To me, it really. I wouldn't

(20:02):
say held the episode togetherbecause the other cast were good
in their own way, some morethan others, but I just thought she
was as at the heart of theepisode. She was absolutely brilliant.
And, you know, on a rewatch,she's really what keeps me engaged
in the episode. She wasbrilliant in it. I thought.
Yeah, no, I totally agree,mate. Yeah, she was really good.

(20:25):
I think she was probably thebest. Like, my favorite performance
in this one.
Oh, definitely. For me. Yeah.
Yeah. Just because she. Shesold it. Like, as soon as you go
into that whole area and thisis after they've discovered all the
dead bodies and the smashedmirrors and all that stuff, it's
a bit like something out ofAliens that, you know, they've got

(20:48):
the. The scanner and they'relike, oh, there's a heartbeat. You
know, there's one personbeyond the room. You know, in that
room, beyond the door. You.You assumed that you were going to
open the door and see some.Either a human that's just gone absolutely
berserk and is, you know,doing their nut, or you would see
a monster or something becausesomebody has killed all these people.

(21:11):
And, yeah, you just see thisreally upset woman just sat there,
just desperate to get home.And there was a bit just before the
opening intro thing kicked in,where so the Doctor has done some
sign language and communicatewith her and stuff. And just before
the credits kick in, thiscamera zooms into her face and her

(21:33):
face changes, doesn't it?
Yes.
You know, and I think that'swhere you and I were on the same
page with that bit, becauseyou thought, is she secretly evil
here? Does she know what'sgoing on? Is she the antagonist of
the story? Is she playing thisa bit? Is she playing sort of false
ignorance? Because she knows.I mean, ultimately she did kind of

(21:57):
know what was going on. Wefind out a bit later, don't we, that.
That she's aware of what's.More kind of aware of what's causing
it. Yeah, she knows thatthere's something that's attached
to her and, and, and whypeople have gone nuts and so on.
So, yeah, her performance was.She sold it right out of the traps.

(22:17):
It was very, very good. So.And a bit of a happy ending for her
as well. You don't really seethat too often with these sorts of
characters, do you? It'snormally especially that we've seen
in the last couple of episodeswith Doctor who, where, you know,
people are biting the dustleft, right and center. So it's good
that there's a bit of a happyending for her and she. She escaped.

(22:40):
But, you know, that happyending is. Then the game flipped
on its head, where we've gotsomebody sacrificing himself and
didn't have a happy ending, but.
And also, yeah, because we gotlike a sort of almost like, oh, there's
a. It was unintentionally. Iactually didn't even realize I was
going to do that until I washalfway through it. But there's,

(23:01):
yes, a twist at the end thatmaybe the entity isn't dead, so she
sacrificed herself for nothingbecause it's still there. So not
such a happy ending for now.What was that character called? Because
she was actually the otherperson I thought was very good in
this.
Oh, that was Shaya. So I'lllet you say the actress's name, but

(23:22):
go for it.
I've already forgotten. We hadto Google how to pronounce her real
name.
And I've already.
I thought she was good aswell, because you mentioned Alien
earlier. And, you know, whenyou get an ensemble car, sometimes
they put this strong characterin there, but they're actually annoying

(23:44):
and you actually want them todie. I thought she actually managed
to pitch a performance ofbeing strong, but I didn't want her
to die. I actually thought shewas quite good, although I didn't.
Didn't like it when she hadold Cassio. Was he called not Casio?
It's a watch, isn't it? Oh,no, he is Casio. Yeah. When she had

(24:05):
him killed, I was like, whoa,A bit harsh. I mean, she did say
she had to do it, but I waslike, oh, that's, you know, you've
murdered someone. So not all good.
Not all good. Yeah.
And he did what needed to bedone, I guess.
Yeah. And he was. He was alittle bit annoying, to be honest
with you.
He was.

(24:25):
He was a little bit like ideasabove his station and kind of confusing
as well as to what he did,what he did. Because we'd all just
witnessed, you know, first ofall, somebody being killed by. And
this was. This was quite funnyto me, to be honest with you, is
that when somebody stepsbehind Alice, nothing really happens

(24:52):
to them. They're just lookingaround. Oh, there's nobody here.
We'll keep going. And thenRussell, being Russell, threw in
this quirky thing where ifyou're exactly behind that person,
so if you were looking down atthem from above, if you were at midnight
or 12 o'clock, directly behindthem, then something would happen
to you. So we have this, like,what felt like five minutes of people

(25:16):
just of just, you know,zipping around in a circle as they
were being picked off one byone. Nobody shouts, stop. Yeah, nobody
moves. Because obviously whatwe're doing now is all killing ourselves,
so just stop. So even thoughCasio's just witnessed all this,
he's like, right, I can sortthis Out. I'm taking charge. Code

(25:38):
red. Get out the way. And thenwhat does he go and do? Like, mate,
you've. You've literally justwatched all these people die.
Yeah.
So now you've. You've justwitnessed, you know, somebody being
killed. So you then go andtest, you know, you're gonna dip
my toe in the water, seewhat's going on. So then he starts
the chain reaction ofeverybody being killed. So, yeah,

(26:00):
you can see why Shaya sort ofsteps in and she's like, you know,
instead of shouting, like,literally, everybody stop. Don't
move. Nobody turn around.Nobody run in the circle. Just stop.
She's like, yeah, face me.That'll take him out. Face me, face
me. Because she knows she'slike, directly in front of him at
that point. So, yeah, a coupleof weird choices from the. From the

(26:26):
characters. I was gonna saythe actors then, but in terms of
Casio, Christopher Chung, Iremember seeing the casting announcement
for him on. On the Socials acouple of months ago. Yeah, me too,
thinking, ah, that could be apretty cool character. Because they
don't typically do sort ofcasting announcement for supporting
actors unless they're prettycool. So I was thinking, oh, this

(26:47):
is probably gonna be a goodcharacter. But, yeah, a bit annoying,
if I'm being honest.
Yeah, yeah. No, I must admit,I mean, I. I haven't heard of him.
So when he was announced, itwas. I was a bit like, who? But,
yeah, he played that annoyingcharacter quite well. So when he
did die, I didn't really feelanything for him, to be honest. But
I did like the bit where hetold the Doctor off for calling him

(27:08):
babe. Because I'd be the same.I'd be like, oh, don't you know that
all that stuff's getting on mywick, to be honest? So I got. I quite
enjoyed it when he Doctor off.Although the. The Doctor coming back
with okay, hun made me wanna.
Oh, yeah, you gave him a slap,wouldn't you?
Oh, I'd have to. I'll just belike, shut up. But, yeah, no, I wasn't

(27:30):
too upset when poor El Casiogot it, to be brutally honest. But
I was a bit like, harsh,ruthless, mate.
Yeah, you've got. You've gotto take charge sometimes and do what's
necessary. Yeah. Can I justpick up on something as well? That's.
That's getting on my wick,like you just mentioned.
Yeah, go for it.
Get this off my chest quickly.I'm kind of not really in the feeling.

(27:54):
This whole Scooby Doo Thingstill, mate. Remember I mentioned
this last week? They did itagain at the beginning, so. Yeah,
at the beginning, when they'rearound the console and they're still
going through this. Oh, yeah.There's something wrong with the
TARDIS or something wrong withthe Earth on this date or something,
you know, And I think theDoctor's trying to smooth over the

(28:15):
cracks a little bit. He'slike, don't worry, every time this
happens, we're getting closerand closer back to. To bringing you
back home.
Yeah.
And so that's over in a coupleof minutes. And then we've got this.
I don't know, we got thisweird thing with Belinda as well,
where she's down in the dumps.Clearly she's upset, she's not home,
she's frustrated. And then atthe snap of fingers, she's smiling

(28:38):
and beaming and she's ready torock and roll and. And all that stuff.
So, you know when the Doctor.When she says to the Doctors, does
that mean we can changeclothes? And then the Doctor's off
on one. You know, he's like,oh, this is gonna be amazing. And
then they play Britney Spears,I think.
Yeah.
Yep. So you see two. Two doorsinside the tardis. One at the top
that they run through, or thebottom, can't remember, but it's.

(29:01):
They do that thing where theyrun through the door and then literally
within a second, they'recoming through the other door with
new clothes on and stuff. Doesthat make sense? You know what bit
I'm talking about?
Yeah, yeah, I do, yeah.
Yeah. That's really notsitting right with me, mate. It feels
like a. It feels like a ScoobyDoo cartoon. And it's. I don't know

(29:21):
about you, it probably doesn'tbother you, but I'm think I'm. When
I. As soon as I watched thatthe first time around, I was like,
please don't do. Why are youdoing that? It's. It's completely
out of place, not just forthis season, but just Doctor who
in general. It just makes thisweird. I don't know, it just. It's.
It's trying to be like ananimated show, but it's not. It does

(29:45):
not. It's not sitting rightwith me, mate.
Okay. No, that's fair enough.I mean, it. I have to be honest,
the whole going through onedoor, coming out the other, it doesn't
really bother me, mate. I wasfinding the Doctor quite cringe in
those earlier scenes. Youknow, they're starting to make him
a bit hyper, like Jodie'sDoctor. And that. That's, you know,
some people will love that andsome people like myself will just
find it a bit like, tone itdown, you know, all this. You know,

(30:09):
no offense to Shooty, but heis starting to play the character
a lot like Eric in SexEducation. The other character play
was like, yes, now you'reenjoying this. And it's all a little
bit over the top for my taste.You know, I can only say it from
my point of view. Some peoplelove it. I get that. But. So that's
starting to grate on me morethan, you know, than the sort of

(30:30):
door change thing. But, youknow, when Britney kicks in and it's
all a bit ott, I was. Itwasn't the best start the episode
for me. But, yeah, the wholeclothes change thing, I don't mind
that. But what I found odd wasthe spacesuits matched perfectly
with the, you know, thespacesuits that the. The crew were

(30:51):
wearing when they. When theycome outside the tardis, which I
don't know is the TARDIS nowjust. Does it have a wardrobe that
has, you know, exact suits forevery occasion? I just found. I found
that odd. So they've. They've.Yeah. I mean, how does. How does
that work? It's just aconvenience thing, I know, to move
the story on quickly. But, youknow, that's. Yeah, we're a bit odd,

(31:15):
isn't it, that, you know, theTalis now can pick out the exact
suits that they need to wearfor every occasion, every planet
they land on. I don't know. Sothat niggled me more than. Than the
actual Scooby Doo door thing.But I absolutely hear what you're
saying. Yeah, I've gotBrittany in my head now, mate.
Oh, God, yeah. Oh, Going backto some performances, mate. So we've

(31:38):
touched on. We've touched onAlice. She was really cool.
Very good.
Really. That was a highlightof the story for me. She was excellent.
Yes.
Yeah. Because she had a goodmix of the. When you. It was kind
of a layered performancebecause when you go sort of one layer
below on the surface, she'scoming across as just terrified and

(31:59):
she just wants to go homebecause she has this daughter and
so on, and. But on a layerbelow that, she's kind of. She's
kind of being selfish aboutit, but in a good way, because she
knows that something isattached to it. She knows that there's
something not right, that it'sattached to her because she's figured
out that when you killsomebody who is supposedly Possessed

(32:24):
or has got this thingattached. It then attaches itself
to you. When you killsomebody, you then in, you know,
you inherit this thing. Soshe's kind of doing it a way where
she doesn't want to reveal toomuch because if she does, then they
won't take her home.
Yeah.
And then it almost collapsesor, you know, almost comes crumbling
down around her. Because whenthey do realize that something's

(32:44):
not right with her, thedoctor's like, you know, you can't
leave. You know, we can't. Youknow, that's what this thing wants,
is to get off this planet andgo somewhere else and all that stuff.
So. So she's kind of selfishabout being coy about stuff, but
it's in a good way becauseshe's just got her best intentions
at heart sort of thing. Sobecause of that layered performance,

(33:05):
it was great to see thatcharacter on screen at any time.
She was very cool. Andactually one scene, dude, that was
kind of cool. That was. Didhave that nice build up. Like we
saw in Midnight was when we dohave that thing where Belinda looks
up and just for a second, shesees something behind Alice, you

(33:26):
know, and that while thedoctor's off with Shaya and. And
Cassio investigating the. The.Well, yes. Everyone's kind of on
edge, you know, and everyone'slike, oh, what's going on? Did you
see something behind? Did younot? Well, you know, you said you
saw something, so why are yougoing back on it now? You know what's
going on. That whole build up,that was really cool, that bit.
Yeah, I think. Is that the bitwhere she's putting the bandage on?

(33:48):
Yes.
And she just looks. Yes,that's. Yeah, that was good. That
whole. I think that middlesection was pretty good. Like you
say, the build up worked quitewell. You said earlier, like, it
felt like five minutes, youknow, when one scene sort of went
on for like five minutes, itfelt like it was dragging sort of
thing. That's what I meantwhen I said, you know, I can't imagine

(34:08):
a younger audience stickingwith this episode because Russell
keeps telling us he's goingfor this demographic of under. What
is it? He's going for, like,the younger audience. There's no
way. I don't think a kid wouldhave sat for this. It would have
been way too slow. So, youknow, as I said, I. As an adult,
I enjoyed it and I think itwas nice to have an episode like

(34:30):
that this week. But, yeah, Ithink this episode would have been
a bit of a turn off for kids.I Don't know, it might have scared
them enough to keep themengaged. I'm not sure.
Maybe. Maybe.
Yeah. But that. That middlesection, I mean, there were moments
when I think we tuned out alittle bit and you said you felt
the episode fizzled offtowards the end. I would agree with
that. And that's. Sadly,that's two weeks running where we

(34:51):
felt like that. And onceagain, my partner got to about three
quarters of the way throughand, yeah. Suddenly got up to get
a drink and I thought, oh,it's lost him again. And it was about
the same sort of point, aboutsort of three quarters the way for
the episode. So I think thereis something in that, to be fair.
Yeah, yeah. You know, you'reprobably right on that, dude. Yeah.

(35:13):
This is one that I had. I notwatched with. With Wifey on this
one.
Oh, I was about to ask.
Yeah, yeah. So, yeah, we'vehad a busy week, so hence us recording
quite late. But, yeah, we'venot sat down and watched this one.
We might do. We might. Theweekend. Stick it on. And before
we watch the. The next one,what's the next one called?

(35:34):
Lucky, Lucky Day. Yeah.
But anyway, yeah, soeveryone's really good. Shaya's performance
was pretty cool. The leader ofthe pack to begin with, then gets
pulled rank on by Casio, thenshe kills him, then she's back in
charge. But what was coolabout, I thought, between Shay as
character and Catio is thispower play between them and the Doctor.

(35:57):
So, you know, when the Doctorpulls out the sonic screwdriver and
RE enables all the CCTVfootage and everything, and she's
like, how'd you do that? He'slike, magic. You know, they carry
on and Casio sort of rolls hiseyes, like, here we go. And then
those little digs that arehaving at each other. So I think
Casio says something like, doI have to take orders from this Doctor?

(36:21):
You know, Shay's like, yes,you do. So I really like that triangle
of those three and, you know,who's actually in charge, who's really
calling the shots and. Andwhat's going on. So that was cool.
Yeah, Yeah, I agree. Becausethat's why I liked her characters.
I felt like she was sort of,you know, questioning the Doctor
and there was a sort of bit ofto and throw between those, like

(36:42):
you said, those three, really.But that's why I kind of liked it,
because sometimes thosecharacters become annoying, don't
they? Because they're justquestioning the Doctor. It's like
just, you know, you can seethat he knows what he's doing and
he's in charge, so just lethim get on with it. But I felt like,
yeah, the whole tensionbetween those three did sort of add
something to the build up. Andit was a good moment, wasn't it,
when the. The Doctor sort ofsays, what's the name of this planet?

(37:06):
What year is it? You know,when it starts to sort of question
and he's sort of putting twoand two together. I thought that
was a nice moment between thethree of them. And also this thing
of, you know, they don't knowhumans. Humans don't seem to be,
you know, the human race.They're like, what? Who? What? You
know, that's a cool thing.That works for me much better than,

(37:28):
you know, the scenes of theTARDIS trying to get back to that
date, which, yeah, we get it.We don't need it every single episode,
you know, I mean, it's almostlike a recap, isn't it? But when
they're adding a bit moremystery into it, like people don't
even know the human race orit's been forgotten, you know, that
was kind of cool as well, I thought.
Yeah, yeah. And that was goingto be my summary for the episode,
dude. It was going to be. Ididn't really care for this being

(37:51):
a sequel to Midnight becauseof the way they handled the. The
entity. I didn't really carefor that, all that stuff. The three
things that were intriguing ofinterest to me was, yeah, this thing
where Belinda's asking themabout the human race and Earth and
nobody has a clue what she'stalking about. I think that's because

(38:11):
at this point in. In historyor whatever, the. The Lombardo people
and Earth are supposed to bein this kind of big joint foundation
of planets and. Andeverything, so they should know what
Earth is and the humans andeverything, but none of them know.
So that was pretty cool. And Ithink she brings it up at the end

(38:31):
as well, when they're back inthe tardis.
Yeah, she's.
All of a sudden, she clicks.She remembers this conversation that
she had and she's like, theydon't know who we are or anything
like that. The second thingwas Mrs.
Flood, she's back.
She's back again. That wassomething of too hard for me, mate.

(38:52):
Let's pick up on that quicklybecause this is exactly what we had
with Season Twist in the lastseason, where this person shows up
at the end of each episodeplaying a different character. It's
almost rinse and repeat, mate.Isn't it from. From before. So it's
so bloody frustrating, mate,Doctor who at this point, because

(39:13):
just when I feel like, yeah,this is freaking sweet, like, this
is so cool, my mind just thenimmediately reminds itself. Yeah,
but you've seen all this before.
Yeah.
You're like, we're literallystrolling down memory lane in the
space of a year. Well, we hadall this anyway, mate, that. The
Mrs. Flood thing, that's kindof caught. We had a bit more conversation

(39:34):
from her this time as well,didn't we? We're slowly getting more
and more stuff from her. So itstarted off, didn't it? These tiny
little cryptic things like,you know, what's the matter if you've
never seen a TARDIS before?Going, now we're going to, like.
Did the Doctor carry aVindicator with him? Yes, you know,
exactly what I wanted to hear,sort of thing. So we're getting a
little bit more from her as wego through the season, but it just

(39:56):
feels like the same approachand the same thing that we had with
Susan Twist. So I don't knowwhat your thoughts are on that, dude.
Yeah, I mean, I am liking theMrs. Flood cameos and I particularly
this week's because, like yousaid it, there was a bit more intrigue
of, oh, has he got that devicewith him? Good, Just as I thought.
And so it sounds like Mrs.Flood. It's all playing into Mrs.

(40:17):
Flood's hands. Everything's,you know, falling into place for
Mrs. Flood for whatever thebig reveal is going to be. So I liked
that. I just hope the payoffis good, mate, because that's the
thing, it does feel very muchthe same as the Susan Twist, which,
to be honest, again, fizzledout. So let's hope this has a better
payoff because I am quiteinvested in the Mrs. Flood thing

(40:38):
and I do like seeing it pop upevery week. But. Yeah, I know what
you mean. It does feel a bitlike this whole episode, really.
It's a combination of stuffwe've. That's all been sort of seen
and done before. But that'snot to say it doesn't work. It's
just. Yeah, it's still a bit.For one of a better phrase, what
you've just said, mate, alittle bit rinse and repeat. Which

(40:58):
does make me lead me on to myother thing of. I don't know how
I feel about Midnight having asequel either, because. Because Midnight
is now an episode that I doregard very highly. I have Seen the
Light. You know, it is a greatepisode. I. It's Sometimes you should
just leave those things there,you know? So I don't know how I feel

(41:20):
about it having a sequel, butI don't think it didn't ruin anything
about Midnight, did it? Itjust kind of played off the themes
of Midnight. So I think in asense it works as a sequel. But.
But I don't know, I just thinkMidnight is something quite special.
I think as an episode, I thinkmaybe it should have been just left
as that. I don't know. It's abit like Blink, isn't it? It's a

(41:41):
great episode. And then theydo the other angel ones and they
completely sort of lose theirsort of specialness, if you like.
But I don't know. Mrs. BloodThing, mate. Didn't mind it. Didn't
mind it at all.
Yeah, No, I don't think itneeded a sequel, but we'll get. That's
a whole nother podcast episode.
Yeah.
Russell's originality at theminute, but no, I don't think it

(42:03):
needed another sequel. Sorry.A sequel. But yeah, Mrs. Flood. Yeah,
really enjoying what's. It'smore a case of I just can't wait
to see where she's going topop up next week and.
Yeah. What's she going to bewearing next week? Yeah.
Let's get on to. So the othersupporting cast members, they were.
A few of them had a few lineshere and there, but they were just

(42:25):
sort of cannon fodder for themost part, weren't they? Yeah, yeah.
So nice conversations betweenBelinda and. I can't remember the.
I think it was Mo. Was it Moor Hanno, one of the two who sort
of had a chat with Belinda.She was kind of cool, but the rest
of them were sort of cannonfodder. Let's move on to shooty and

(42:52):
Shooty and Verada. SoBelinda's still really cool, mate.
I think she's a very cool.Have you seen this thing online that
people think that she's the Ronnie.
Oh, really?
And not Mrs. Flood all of a sudden?
No, no, I hadn't seen that.
Yeah. Yeah. I can't. I can'tremember the exact detail. Somebody
had put a video on. It'seither YouTube or Twitter. Can't

(43:14):
remember. They're saying, my.This is my theory about Belinda being
the Rani. And it snowballedand I don't know, but she's. She
was definitely very cool inthis. Again, I feel like we are slipping
into a little bit of a trapwith, you know, the whole shooty's
doctor crying in everyepisode. I Feel like we are. We are

(43:35):
slipping into a slight trapwith her character where 99% of her
performance. Verada'sperformance is great and she's very
strong and. But she's also gota nice, caring side because she's
a nurse and all that stuff.But her character seems to flip flop
quite quickly between beingupset that she's not being taken

(43:57):
home to earth, upset that theTARDIS is not working, all that sort
of thing, and then, as I saidearlier, just that feels like at
the snap of your fingers,she's smiling and ready to adventure
and ready to crack on, andshe's kind of going between those
two really quickly. So I lovedher performance again, as I have
done since the beginning, butI do feel like we're sort of going

(44:19):
into a rut of, you know, isshe going to be upset and moping
around at the beginning ofnext episode? For the first two minutes,
the Doctor's going to give hera smile and a hug and a little, you
know, flirty thing, and thenshe's going to be fine. And then
at the end of the episode,she's going to be back to being mopey
and sad again. Do you knowwhat I mean? There's a bit of a pattern

(44:40):
forming.
Yeah. A bit of a template,like. Yeah, we start the episode
like this, then we do thatand. Yeah, I absolutely get what
you mean. As far as Belinda,as a character goes, mate, I like
her, but she's not setting myworld on fire. I haven't sort of
warmed to her particularly.She's just kind of there and I like
her, but that's as far as itgoes. I need to see a bit more, really.

(45:02):
I need to see more from thecharacter to really sort of cement
her up there. As you know,she's not like Martha for me, like
Martha. I loved Martha andDonna, such a strong character. Donna's
probably one of my favoritecompanions. Where does Belinda sit?
For me right now, kind of justthere, you know, she's so. I need
to see some more characterdevelopment from her and I think

(45:23):
that plays into what you'resaying. I can't have her just moping
around every week, you know,and then being, you know, this caring
character, then, you know,need to see more. But you. You saying
about the Rani series has justreminded me that we've actually got
this whole mystery aroundBelinda, which I'd completely forgotten
about until you start talkingabout the Rani, and I'm like, oh,

(45:45):
yeah, we don't. There's thisthing about her being in Boom. As
a totally different character.Now, that's not been mentioned again,
is it, since episode one?
No, it hasn't, no.
So that, you know, how's thatgoing to play into things? So maybe
there is a good mystery thereto come around Belinda's character
and hopefully she will be morememorable because right now, mate,
she's likable. But when thisseries ends and we're talking about

(46:09):
companions like Donna, Martha,Rose, where's Belinda gonna be? You
know, when we're sat aroundthe table having a few pints, I feel
like at the minute I'm. She'sgonna be forgotten. Unless that's,
you know, something happens orwe get some more character development.
I did like the scene, though,where she's talking about sign language
and Alice says, you know,you're a nurse and you don't know

(46:31):
sign language. It did sort ofmake me think, oh, yeah, you know,
there's a lot of people outthere that need sign language and
we kind of, you know, it's asort of specialized thing, isn't
it, to do sign languages? Youknow, you. Maybe we should have it
in, you know, when people aretraining to be nurses and doctors.
So, you know, that was a coollittle scene, I thought. So stuff
like. That's nice. Just needto see a bit more of it, I think.

(46:52):
Yeah, no, I agree. Andinteresting fact, the casting crew
went on a deaf awareness course.
Oh, really?
Yeah, in support of Roseailing Ellis's character. So they
could be a bit more, I guess,comfortable around acting around
somebody with who is deaf and.And I guess learning some basic sign

(47:13):
and all that stuff. So thatwas cool.
I've actually genuinely. I'vealways wanted to learn sign language,
actually, myself. It'ssomething I've wanted to do, but
because I have a terriblememory as. As regular listeners will
know who listen to podcasts,can't remember an actor's name half
the time when I've justwatched them. So I always feel like

(47:33):
I'm just not going to be ableto remember all the stuff. So I've
kind of always talked myselfout of it, but it is something I
think is quite important. I'dlove to be able to go out to somebody
and be able to do signlanguage. Maybe one day I'll give
that a go. I don't know.
Yeah, that'd be cool,actually. Yeah, I wouldn't mind doing
that.
Do you agree with me aboutBelinda, though, mate? Is she doing

(47:54):
much as a companion for you,or do you. Are you like me? Do you
just like her? But. Or Are youreally sort of thinking they've got
good chemistry right now?
Well, I think her performanceis really, really good. I think we
needed. I think we needed acompanion that wasn't just falling
all over the Doctor every fiveminutes, you know, and somebody who
was a bit stronger and a bitmore. Somebody who's more. Not just

(48:22):
swept up in the whole vibearound the Doctor as much, I think
so. Somebody who's strongerand just knows what they want. So
I think that part of it isreally cool and I'm really enjoying,
you know, how. How VaradaSethu is coming across like that.
The, the, the downside to thatis exactly what you've said is that
because she's like that, Ithink it's hard to sort of warm to

(48:45):
her because she's not givingyou that Donna vibe or Martha vibe.
You know, you haven't got thatkind of nice warm. You'd think twice
about asking her for a hug atthe moment.
Yeah, yeah.
You know, you'd be a bittentative and approach with caution,
you know, where a shooter. Youjust, like, hug. You'd be like, yeah,
babes, it'd be all over yoursort of thing. So she's like the

(49:08):
opposite, isn't she? I thinkthat's kind of, in the grand scheme
of things, that's probablyneeded. Having that contrast between
the Doctor being that way andthen Belinda being, you know, the
opposite almost.
Yeah, yeah. Could be a gooddynamic here, see how it plays out.
Yeah. And what do you think toshoot you then in this one? We've.
We obviously get the tears. Ithink I, I'm. I'm now just looking

(49:32):
out for an episode where hedoesn't cry, rather.
Yeah, same.
You know, it's kind of. I knowthat's. I know that's a common thing
amongst fandom at the moment.And people listening probably like,
oh, yeah, you guys are justsaying what everyone's saying. But
it is a, you know, is a thing.It's become a thing, isn't it, with
this Doctor and, And the tearsand stuff. But I thought Shushi was
really good in this one. Dude,I thought he was. There was a couple

(49:54):
of scenes where he lookedabsolutely terrified, like literally
had just peeped his pants.There was one scene where it kind
of puts the, the room on holda little bit. So that's one. That's
actually one of the timeswhere I think shooty does command
the room a bit and does havesome presence where, you know, that

(50:16):
scene after everyone has beensort of, you know, systematically
murdered, going around In acircle. He kind of puts a hold on
the room, doesn't he, andstops everybody, slows everybody
down. And then he approachesAelis and then he does this thing
where he starts to look roundpast her sort of thing, trying to
see what this thing is. Andthen he hears these whispers, doesn't

(50:39):
he? And he. And he says tothem that this. This entity whispered
his real name.
Oh, yeah, I'd forgotten that.
Yeah, yeah. And his eyes startwelling up. I mean, don't get me
wrong, it's one of those timeswhere it's justifiable, him welling
up like that, because he. Heseems absolutely terrified. So that

(51:01):
was a nice little bit where,you know, because we don't know,
you know, nobody knows aDoctor's name other than River Song.
And now this creature isobviously been able to sort of psychically,
you know, see what's going oninside the Doctor's head. So there
was a couple of scenes likethat where he played terrifying.
And also the bit where he'scoming to the realization that he's

(51:21):
been on this planet before,you know, when he's asking Shaya,
you know, what. What. What wasthe name of the planet before? You
know, when she says Midnight.And then he just, you know, crapped
his pants again and, you know,and he's off. So a couple of annoying
little bits, but mainly verygood, I thought.
Yeah. I mean, the cryingscene, mate, this would have been

(51:42):
a good episode to have that. Ithink it's justified. It's. It does,
you know, like, he reallysells it to me that he's terrified
and when he says, you know, itknows my name, great scene, but the
impact of it for me has beencompletely lost because he just cries
every week. And I know we'vesaid that before, but that's how
I feel. I just felt like,yeah, this would have. This would

(52:03):
have had such an emotionalpunch, but instead I'm just sat there
saying, oh, here we go, herecome the tears, here comes the waterworks.
It just loses, honestly. Butit was. I'm not saying it wasn't
a good scene. It was, but itjust lost the majority of the impact
it was supposed to havebecause, yeah, it's just another
week where the Doctor cries.But in terms of Shooter's performance,

(52:24):
mate, for the most part, Ithought it was good. Right. Actually,
it. No, shoot, his performanceis good, but the way the Doctor was
written and is being writtenat the moment is such a mixed bag
for me because I like shooty,but, you know, there are times when
his Doctor is really gettingon my tits, quite frankly. Like the

(52:45):
whole babes, the kicking, justthe. It's just not for me. But I
love it when he takes theperformance down and like you says,
commands the room. Fantastic,you know, but this is absolutely
down to the writing and notshoot his performance. He's delivering
what is on that page and he'sdoing it well. But it's just there

(53:05):
are certain elements, theDoctor which are. I'm finding a grating
on me, quite frankly, in thesame way that Jody's Doctor did,
where she's just bouncing offthe walls to completely take him
out of the scene. I'm findingthe same feelings towards shoot his
Doctor at times. Thankfully,he does have this more darker side
where they bring theperformance down, which is definitely

(53:25):
working. So I want to see moreof that because I think, yeah, when
he. When he. When we see theDoctor like that, for me, that is
much better. That's much morelike the Doctor I want to see, rather
than someone that's dancingaround the room to Britney Spears
every week and calling peoplehoney and all that. It's just not
for me. And I can't stressthat enough, mate, because I know

(53:46):
that there are people outthere that will like it. I can only
talk about the sort of Doctorthat I like to see, and that's what
I saw in the latter part ofthe episode where he's, yeah, taking
control and he knows what heneeds to do.
Yeah, yeah, No, I agree withyou. But, yeah, and that's the thing
to remember as well, is we canonly say what we. We're not going

(54:07):
to sort of pander to, youknow, what's going on in fandom at
any point was literally justour own, you know, what we want to
see in. In Doctor who andstuff. So. Yeah, yeah, I think that's
important. But no, I agree.Yeah. The fact that he cries all
the time now just dilutes theeffect of when he does cry. Because
like you said, it's like, youknow, oh, here we go again.
It's almost just like, here itis again.

(54:29):
Yeah, yeah, exactly. Yeah.It's almost like it's a similar thing.
Sort of a boy that cried wolfsort of thing, isn't it? You can
only see it so many timesbefore you think, oh, yeah, okay,
so, yeah, I know what youmean. Two things I want to finish
up from my point of view, bud.The first one is that I was so up
for Murray Gold coming back,but I'll be honest, mate, his music's

(54:54):
just killing it for Me, likemost episodes, I have to do this
thing where I have to rewind10 seconds because I'm like, what
did they say there? BecauseMurray's music is blasting out. Yeah.
And I have to sort of Skipback in 10 seconds. Okay, that's
what they said. And I'm justnot feeling the music, mate. I hate

(55:14):
to be a negative ninny on thisstuff, I really do. And I'm such
a fan of Murray. You. You,both, you and I are huge fans, aren't
we, of Murray golden and hismusic. But for some reason, mate,
it's not. It's not landing forme in this season especially. And
I think it's because we don'thave any repeatable hooks or melodies

(55:36):
that are associated to certaincharacters. You know, like back in
the day, we used to get reallynice themes for. For each doctor
and then each companion. Itwas those little motifs so that,
you know, as you go througheach story, there was like a little
consistent hook, you know,that gave you that nice warm fuzzy
feeling almost, which I'm justnot getting that from. From Murray's

(55:58):
music on. I didn't really feelit so much on last season, season
one, but this one, I'm reallygetting that vibe where it's just.
Just feels like generic sci fimusic. It doesn't feel. I don't know,
it's like. It's weird. It'slike we have these little moments
that just sound amazing. Youthink, Right, that's really cool.
And then 80% of the music'sjust. You know, if you just went

(56:22):
to YouTube or some stockroyalty music website and just typed
in science fiction, you justhear that a thousand times over.
So I'm getting that vibe. Andthen the second thing, mate, was,
as always, visually stunning.Like the production, the design,
all that stuff. Amazinglooking series as it has been for

(56:44):
a few years now. But everyseason it seems to just hop up a
little bit in terms of visualfidelity and. And the design and
stuff. So that's no different.It looks amazing. So just a couple
of things to finish up for me, dude.
Yeah, visually, mate, Iabsolutely agree. Brilliant. The
episode looked class, lookedfantastic. Direction really, really

(57:06):
good. I don't know who thedirector was. I think you mentioned
her earlier, but.
Yeah, that was Amanda Brochi.
Yep. Great direction. Music,mate. Kind of agree with you. This
is an episode where Murraywould normally absolutely shine with
doing the creepy stuff. Ican't think of any. I can't even
remember the music in it,apart from when the entity appears

(57:29):
behind the back. We sort ofget this. I think somebody. I don't
know where I heard this,somebody compared it to a clattering
of saucepans or something, butit was enough to make me jump the
first time, so it obviouslyworked. So there was a couple of
little good moments fromMurray in there. But I kind of agree
with you in a sense, mate,because I love Murray's music. I
mean, he was a bit of a. Hewasn't the cheeriest of chaps when

(57:52):
I met him in real life. So amI a fan of Murray himself? Maybe
not so much, but I love hismusic. I think he's done some great
stuff with Doctor who in thepast, but does feel a little bit
hit or miss at the moment. Andyes, the dialogue. Now, I don't know
if this is down to Murray'smusic being too loud or the actors
mumbling or a bad mix or. Orall of that, but I genuinely nearly

(58:16):
put the subtitles on in thefirst half of this episode. I couldn't
hear anything anyone wassaying. And maybe I'm just getting
old, but. Because I wastalking about Mahiring before we
kicked off the show, actually.But no, I. I agree with you, mate.
I. I genuinely couldn'tunderstand some of what was being
said for a. I don't know, notnecessarily a large portion of this

(58:36):
episode, but for certainly forsome of it. And I don't know if that's
the mix or the music beingoverbearing or what, but I. I was
the same, mate. So it's notjust you. You know, maybe we're both
just getting old.
We're getting miserable old buggers.
Yeah, that's it. We are.
Okay. Have you got anythingelse on your notes, dude?

(58:57):
Let me have a quick look. Idon't think so. No, I think we've
pretty much covered it, to behonest. Yeah.
Okie dokie scores. And I thinkit's your turn to go first on this
one, buddy.
Yeah. Okay. I'm gonna go withthe same score as last week, actually.
It was nearly. It was nearlyan 8, but I'm going 7.5. I'm really

(59:17):
stuck between those two scoresbecause I think I enjoyed it the
same as last week, mate. Andonce again, it's the ending that's
kind of fizzled out, and it'sthe fact that I just felt like I
was watching stuff that I'dseen before, but, like a diff. I
don't know, it just didn'tfeel that original to me. So do I
give it an eight? It's not.No, I'm gonna stick with 7.5 because

(59:40):
that's what I wrote. But it'salmost an eight. It was good. It'll
probably sound like I didn'tenjoy it. I did, but it just wasn't
quite up there for me.
7.5, 7.5. I'm gonna go with a6.5 for me. I think the fact that,
the fact, the fact that, don'tget me wrong, I thought this was

(01:00:02):
a decent episode in terms ofseason to. I think it's the best
one we've had so far. And thereason why I'm not scoring any higher
is because I just can't getpast the fact that we've been down.
It's not just that we've beento midnight before and that sort
of thing, but various elementsin the story have all been done the

(01:00:25):
same way. So for you it didn'tbother you too much. But for me that
really knocked the score downwas the originality factor. I honestly
felt like I was just watchinga rehash, you know, of, you know,
like in, you know, with someTV shows right where they were on
air like 10, 15 years ago andthen somebody like Netflix, you know,

(01:00:51):
reboots it, you get a newerversion of it and you, you're watching
it and you're thinking, ohyeah, this is, it's on the surface,
what I'm watching visually andexperiencing is new. But I know what's
happening, I understand andknow what's going on behind the scenes.
And that's what it felt like.Watching this felt like I was enjoying

(01:01:14):
it on the surface. But thenthe nuts and bolts of it were like,
yeah, I've done all thisbefore a few times.
So I mean, I said it earlier,didn't I though? Although I was enjoying
the episode, I felt like I washalf a step ahead of the episode
in terms of I knew what wascoming. I thought it's going to jump
to another host in a minute,blah, blah. So, yeah, I, I would

(01:01:34):
agree with that.
Yes. Alrighty. So 7.5 fromhim, a 6.5 from me and I think we'll,
we'll wrap it there, dude, forepisode 422.
Alright.

(01:02:13):
Thank you, thank you. Thankyou so much for listening to another
episode of the Big Blue box.That was 422. And our review of the.
Well from season two, it was a7.5 from Adam, 6.5 from me. We'll
be back next week for ourreview of the next episode, which
is Lucky Day, which is A Ruby Story.

(01:02:35):
Is this a Doctor Light one.
A lot of people have said it'sgoing to be a doctor like one, but
I'm not too sure. Not divedinto and tried to fish out some details,
but Ruby's definitely back.Yeah. So we'll see.
Look forward to seeing Rubyagain. Actually. I like Ruby.
Yeah, yeah, same should begood. In the meantime, dear listener,

(01:02:55):
thank you very much again forlistening and make sure you're following
or subscribing to the show inyour preferred podcast app, especially
if you're a newbie to theshow. If this is your first time
listening to Big Blue Box,we'd love to have you along as we
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button, whatever it is in yourapp so you don't miss notifications

(01:03:16):
when new episodes drop. And ifyou're one of the old grizzled ancients
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(01:03:39):
out Adam's channel on YouTube.It's once again the Geeks Handbag.
The Geeks Handbag. I'm underthat name on all the socials that
geeks handbag and YouTube indeed.
Go and check out Adam's stuff.So until next week, my name's Garry.
My name's Adam and REM Sat.