August 20, 2025 • 23 mins
What if your biggest margin killer isn’t Facebook ads—but your supply chain? On this 193rd episode of The E-Comm Show, Andrew Maff sits down with Izzy Rosenzweig, founder and CEO of Portless. After launching his own DTC brand and facing costly inventory mistakes, Izzy built Portless to solve a problem no one talks about enough: tariffs and inefficient fulfillment.
We dig deep into how tariffs are affecting brands right now, why traditional warehousing models are outdated, and how operational efficiency is the hidden backbone of brand and customer experience.If you’re scaling or sitting on inventory, this episode is a tactical masterclass in turning operations into opportunity.
What You’ll Learn in This Episode:
- Why smart brands are rethinking their entire supply chain—and how it impacts everything from customer experience to profit margins
- The truth about tariffs in 2025: What’s real, what’s outdated, and how to protect your bottom line
- How to turn your supply chain into a competitive advantage (not just an operational cost center)
- Tariff engineering and other lesser-known strategies to reduce costs and improve cash flow
- How Portless gives DTC brands a fully local, premium experience—straight from China-based fulfillment
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Izzy Rosenzweig (00:03):
The biggest myth we saw was the term
transaction value. What is thedefinition of transaction value?
Andrew Maff (00:09):
Welcome to the E comm Show podcast. I am your
host. Andrew MAFF, owner andfounder of blue tusker, from
groundbreaking industry updatesto success stories and
strategies, get to know the insand outs of the e Commerce
Industry from top leaders in thespace. Let's get into it.
Hello everyone, and welcome toanother episode of the E comm
show as usual. I am your host,Andrew Maff, and today I welcome
(00:30):
back Izzy Rosenzweig, who is theCEO and founder over at
Portless. Izzy, how you doing?
Man? How's it been?
Izzy Rosenzweig (00:36):
Doing great! Andrew, thank you for having me
for a second time, very excitedabout it.
Andrew Maff (00:39):
No, problem. Do you know it's all so we almost
nailed it. We, well, as of therecording today, we're almost
exactly a year out from whenyour last episode was published,
so we'll get a nice annual recapfrom Izzy over at Portless.
Super excited. I know the amountof stuff that has happened since
the last time you and I spoke iswe'll need multiple
(01:03):
episodesbetween now and the nextannual catch up you and I have,
but let's start off kind of theusual, and I'll give you the
floor.Tell us a little bit aboutyour background, how you got
started with portless, and thenwe'll jump into the good stuff.
Izzy Rosenzweig (01:16):
Absolutely. So I was originally a brand owner.
I ran a brand for about 10years, I ran it in the home and
kitchen space, direct toconsumer. The first two years of
running that business, I ran itin the traditional supply chain
model that most e commerce stilldo today, which is I was buying
goods from somewhere overseas.
My stuff was mainly China,Vietnam, and I was putting stuff
on shipping containers, and thatwas just an absolute brutal way
(01:40):
to buy goods from a cash flowperspective. I'd put out 50k
100k 250k at a time, and thatwas just always waiting,
waiting, waiting, waiting,waiting for the goods to get
here. Once it got here, iswaiting for it to sell. So I get
cash out of inventory. Then Irealized I made a wrong bet on
prediction. So I'm trying to buyfour to six months in advance,
and I would have excessinventory which I had to
(02:01):
liquidate, or whatever, likelose money on the sale. It was
really hard, but that was theway I ran the first years of
that business. Then I pivoted,or I got very lucky, I met early
Alibaba executives, and theykind of introduced me to this
evolving space of what we callthe direct supply chain model,
which is, you don't need to putstuff on boats, keep goods near
(02:21):
the factories, in facilitiesnear the factories. We have two
in China, two in Vietnam and andship from there. And essentially
what the way it works is, oncewe have the goods in our
facilities, we could delivergoods in about six days across
the US, 100% local experience.
So a customer makes an orderwithin 24 hours, there is a USPS
(02:43):
tracking number, five dayslater, your driver puts on the
front door. USPS label oranother regional carriers label
either be non branded or brandedpackaging, whatever the customer
wants, but the brand, thecustomer has exact same
experience as the idea straightbut from a brand's perspective,
I argue everything changes, andthat's how I ran my brand for 10
(03:04):
years. We're all of a sudden, mycash flow was incredible. I was
applying goods Well, I didn't, Ididn't even put out turn 50
grand at a time or a milliondollars at a time, because it
wasn't buying six months. I wasbuying four weeks at a time, and
then as I was selling, I wasrebuying the right SKUs, the
right colors. So it was avoidingexcess inventory, because I
(03:24):
wasn't reinvesting in bad SKUs,and I was capturing demand in
season of the good SKUs. So theright colors, the right
products, and scaling it, I wasnever out of stock. I constantly
buying more. So that business,we were able to scale quite
aggressively. We builtinfrastructure, software and
logistics solutions around thatentire business. That business
did about 100 million in revenueand amazing cash flow. I did
(03:48):
shift out of the brand to thebrand business, the DTC business
to B to B business. When iOS 14happened. So if your marketing
world, you remember, there was aperiod about a year, I would say
that IRS 14, we got releasedbasically Apple's privacy
update. Apple said, I'm nolonger sending meta any data or
any anyone data. So if you're inthe marketing world, which we
(04:09):
were driving a lot of ourrevenue through marketing,
everything kind of went chaotic,and we couldn't see our
marketing attribution. So westarted to do is lean into the
infrastructure, the software,the solutions we built from a
logistics perspective, and welaunched Portless to help other
brands be more sophisticatedwhen it comes to cash flow. And
now we're fortunate. We supporthundreds of brands across the
(04:30):
US, UK and Australia and someWestern Europe, and we deliver
goods five, six days from fromthe from near the factory to the
well in our facilities near thefactory, so brand can
manufacture within one to twodays later, it's in our
facility. They start selling. Wepick back, have that order
delivered to the customer'sfront door five to six days
(04:50):
later, fully local experience.
Brands go from a million dollarsin inventory upfront to now last
250k and they're restocking onthe right stuff, so they're
getting cash back faster, lessmoney in inventory. So that's
what we do at Portless, andthat's how I got into it.
Andrew Maff (05:06):
Interesting. Okay, so you've, you've been on the
show, you know that my knowledgeand operations and inventory
management is impressively low,but I have questions. So first
thing I'm thinking about, it allmakes a ton of sense, right?
Like, I know we I was luckyenough to have the founder of
butcherbox on the show, and hisoperational skill set was, it
(05:28):
was really impressive listen tobut he talked about the same
problems. Of like, in thebeginning, you got to order so
much and then you're basicallyjust playing catch up all the
time. You're chasing your tailthe whole time with the Portless
solution. Makes a ton of sense.
What I'm curious about is, ifyou're now ordering, you now
need to order less quantitiesfrom your factory. Wouldn't that
theoretically increase yourcosts on the factory side,
(05:50):
because you're not doing as bigof a bulk purchase? And then my
other question being, if I canbulk ship a ton of stuff through
a boat and then be able to shipit individually out of a 3PL
versus leaving it overseas andthen doing it from that way?
Wouldn't I potentially be payingmore on the individual order,
because it's now coming, Iassume, from a plane or
(06:14):
something like that?
Izzy Rosenzweig (06:16):
Both great questions. So let's do one at a
time. First, let's talk aboutMOQ in general, we've seen a new
shift out of China, where Brent,where factories are starting to
put a premium on lower MOQ. Now,why they're doing that is
because Shein has proven overthe last 10 years that if you're
a factory and you're willing totake bets on smaller MOQ, yes,
(06:36):
the factory won't make as muchmoney. But then the brand could
find winners faster, and thenthey get once, get winners
faster. Everyone wins. The brandwins, and the factory wins. So
we've seen, we've seen factoriesgo down in the apparel space.
Let's say one roll of fabric, 50units in that one roll, so you
could test and not charge youmuch of a premium. So that's,
that's one in general. It's afundamental shift away factories
(06:59):
looking at manufacturing. Soit's called small batch
manufacturing. It is the kind ofevolution that Shein has
invented or has perfected, andbrands are leaning into it. Now,
again, small batch manufacturingonly works if you're filling
your from your factory, becauseyou gotta stop really quickly.
The next thing is, let's say itgoes up by 10% let's just say
your COG goes from $5 to $5.50now you have to have a question,
(07:20):
okay, I'm paying 50 cents more,but what's my velocity of sales?
So if you do a, you know, 10,000upfront, but you lost, but you
messed up on 30% of the averageexcess inventory rate. So you
messed up 30% on yourpredictions. Now you have a 30%
write off, that's, you know, $5times 30% or whatever your
inventory is, you will actuallymake more money on your PnL,
(07:42):
forget about cash flow. Cashflow is amazing in this model,
but you actually have net betterprofits by avoiding excess
inventory. If it's an essential,like, if you sell this all day
every day, of course, like, whynot? But if it's newer, or
you're not sure how the season'sgonna go, last year was good.
Would be good this next year,the slight cost, and it's very
slight, it's not even 10%usually, but whatever that cost
(08:03):
is, well, what's the cost ofexcess inventory? What's the
cost of not restocking andreally fast from your factory
Okay,the cost.
So you're right, I want to sayyou're right. You're right
depending on the customer. Soand having an inventory? That is
a cost that you got to do yourcalculations with? So that's
your first question. Should Imove on to the second one?
Andrew Maff (08:09):
Go for it. Yeah.
You're on a roll.
that's why we don't service allcustomers. If you're in the
furniture business, do boats,you're in bulky business, you
(08:30):
know, whatever, if you're if youcould fit in a shoe box or less,
think like shoes, cosmetics,clothing, all that type of
stuff. The cost per flight isn'tthat expensive when we have many
orders in a single pallet. Sotwo things keep in mind. First
thing is, we do zone skipping.
What does that mean if you wereusing a 3PL on the West Coast?
Well, if you're so LA is, let'sget zone one. But you got to
(08:53):
ship orders to New York, you gotto ship orders to Chicago. You
got to ship orders to Miami,Texas. You'r paying a premium.
The further goes from your corelocation. It's called zone one
through zone eight. So yourshipping rates in LA might be
five bucks, but your shipping toNew York might be eight bucks,
even if you have two locations,East Coast and West Coast, okay,
you still have zone one throughzone four. So first what we're
(09:13):
doing is, when we put stuff onplanes, we're going to six
injection points, LA, Chicago,New York, Arizona, Texas, Miami
and sometimes Atlanta, whichmeans we're zone skipping.
You're never paying more thelast mile than zone one or zone
two. Okay, that's great. You'resaving on the last mile. How
about the airplane? Well, theairplane, it's all about us
blending many different ordersin the single palette. And the
example I give is, pretendyou're in the jewelry business
(09:36):
and you're selling a pair ofearrings. How many orders of a
pair of appearance, could I fiton a single pallet? A million,
like 100,000 so your cost perorder is pennies in that
scenario, and your last mile isown. Skipping. Our shipping
rates start at $5 door to door,customs clearance to the
customer's front door for aquarter pound. Obviously, as it
(10:03):
gets larger and bulkier, getsmore expensive. So, that's a
pair of earrings. Let's say evenunder $5 like $5 $4 and
something and 80 somethingcents. But you could scale up to
a T shirt. You could scale it upto a dress at a certain scale.
Once you're, like an extremeexample, once you're selling
furniture, well, obviously notgonna fit one furniture, one
pallet, but as long as you'reunder five pounds or fits in a
shoe box, um, most likely yourshipping rates will be very
similar to our shipping rates,so you're almost apples to
(10:24):
apples on the shipping rates,but now you unlock cash flow,
you unlock, avoiding excessinventory, your ability to test
faster. And there's one otherother advantage I'll talk about
is connected to the tariffconversation, but I'll get into
that good i love the segue.
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Izzy Rosenzweig (11:18):
Should I jump in?
Andrew Maff (11:19):
Yeah, let's go for it. That's what I'm ready to
get. That's what I'm here for.
So that was, that was what I wasalluding to like in the past
year, I'm like, Oh, great. Thisis gonna be perfect, because
this is the tariffs 101,conversation I know we're about
to have. And you're in China,Vietnam, let's go what's
happened in the past year?
Izzy Rosenzweig (11:35):
Let's go big or go home. Okay, so this is what
happened when we spoke last yearDominicus existed and and
everyone says, oh, Americanbrand Shein, the only exist in
this business. Because ofDominicus, I fought it forever.
You could find me in every majornews article, from Bloomberg to
New York Times to CV. That isnot correct. People use this
(11:57):
model for the ultimate cash flowmodel. It is a supply chain
game. It is the efficiency andagile inventory. So when
inventory, when Dominicus wentaway, all that happened is
you're paying, you're payingyour import tax on it the same
way you would pay import tax ifyou use a shipping container. We
haven't lost a single customer.
We're set. We are shipping thesame amount of orders every
single day that we did beforeDominicus and after Dominicus.
(12:20):
Yes, you're paying import tax,but import tax, let's say right
now it's 30% there's 20%reciprocal, or 10% reciprocal,
20% fentanol. Then there'ssection 301, and base tariffs.
So you're anywhere between 30 to50% okay, so if you are a $10
COG item, you're adding three to$5 on your retail but that $10
item, you're probably sellingfor some for $75 now you got to
(12:41):
sell 79.99 again. It'sinflationary. It sucks.
Everyone's done it. It's notslowing down. Ecomm is pumping.
At 145% tariffs. I would argueTrump was going to bankrupt the
economy. He was going tobankrupt 10s of 1000s of brands.
But at a 30 to 50% tariffs,people are living with that,
people are scaling with it, youknow. So it is working. So now
(13:03):
the prior yes, Dominicus is gonefor everybody. Everyone's got a
pay import tax side, side note,not Vietnam. We'll put that to
the side for a minute. Chinafirst. But our customers still
the major financial advantage,which is, if you're a brand and
you're importing a milliondollars of goods, and you're
doing it through the traditionalway, through boats, you need to
(13:25):
put your checkbook and write acheck to the CDP for $500,000
the day it hits the ports. It'snot in your warehouse yet. You
haven't sold a single shoe or asingle shirt. You need to write
an additional $500,000 and cashto support. That's not your
bank. In our model, you're notspending a penny on import
duties day one. It's sitting incountry of origin, sitting in
(13:47):
China. You're not it's not inAmerica.You don't pay import
duties. You sell your shirt.
Let's say you sell, in thiscase, the pen. You collect money
from the customer. Money's inyour bank at that point, we ship
it. And only when that ordercrosses the border, you're
paying import duties, so you gotto pay the same 500,000 over
time, but you're collecting themoney up front, and that, in
itself, is game changing. Sure,sure. Dominicus is gone, but you
(14:10):
but the people that use usaren't laying out that money.
They're using that money foroperations, these, money for
marketing, these, that money forwhatever they got around their
business, versus thecompetitors, the ones are using
these, the old supply chainmodel, they just lost that much
more money in their operations.
So not only does cash flow stillexist, not only does the agile
inventory still exist, and notonly are brands still scaling
this model, but now they alsohave financial advantage, which
(14:32):
is tax deferment, and that ishuge.
Andrew Maff (14:36):
Yeah. So are you seeing more and more like
warehouses 3PLs, kind of thingpopping up within China and
Vietnam to start allowing formore of this to happen. And
you're going to start seeing, Iguess, warehouses and three PLS,
start to dwindle in the States.
Izzy Rosenzweig (14:52):
I don't think so. I don't think it'll dwindle.
I mean, we're probably thelargest one that we know in this
model. We're in China, Vietnam,are opening up in India, but the
US, like, to me, e-commerce isso big, there's always gonna be
a local need. So I don't, Iwould say Canada, Mexico getting
crushed. So if you were doingthis model of Canada, Mexico,
(15:14):
using it for Dominicus, that'sshipping either to the US or us,
because once you're in thosemodels, like it was all about
Dominicus, but Dominicus isgone. Why are you using it? Now,
Dominicus is gone for China. Itis still existing for every
other country in the world. Soif you're shipping out of our
(15:38):
Vietnam location, you arelegally allowed to import,
import, duty free, as long asyour transaction value is under
or your retail value is under$800 so that is that's still
around, and it's supposed to goaway based on the big, beautiful
bill, July 2027, end of June orearly July 2027, there's a lot
of time to use that so, soMexico and Canada are still
leveraging it for brands thatare manufactured and not in
China, still leveraging it like,why not? It's there. You could
use it. You should use it. Yeah,so that that that model still
(16:01):
existing, which is quiteinteresting.
Andrew Maff (16:03):
What would you say is, like, the biggest myth right
now? Because there's so manytheories there every especially
when the terrorist first startedbecoming thing, I swear I got
some cold email every fiveminutes about someone who's
like, here's what you got to do.
And they were all different. Inyour opinion. What is kind of
the biggest myth right now thatbrands are struggling with
regarding the tariffs?
Izzy Rosenzweig (16:24):
Yeah, I would say there was, in the early
days, there were so much noise.
I would say people that are, Iwant to call theminfluencers,
people that will post a lotabout it, but they didn't
necessarily speak to tradelawyers to validate what they
were posting. They were justseeing what they believe was
true, versus versus speaking tolawyers. So it is definitely
complex. It's very complex, verycomplex world. But I would say
(16:44):
that the biggest myth we saw wasthe term transaction value. What
is the definition of transactionvalue? So a lot of people
saying, oh, transaction value.
If you are shipping goods intothe United States, you have to
use transaction value. Well,historically, transaction value
was retail value. That was whenit was under Dominicus. The
(17:05):
Dominicus rule, the import ofrecord was the ultimate
consignee. And the ultimateconsignee their transaction
value, because they're theimport of record, was what they
bought on the retail site. Butin the new model, where now it's
moving towards commercial entry,not under Dominicus, the
merchant is the input of record,and the merchant's transaction
value is not retail. TheMerchant's transaction value is
(17:27):
what they are buying it fromtheir seller, and their seller
is the factory. So it's actuallyFOB China. So it's not I use
carefully the word Cog, I don'twant to use the word COG,
because COG could look at costof goods. So it's not the raw
material cost, it's the fullydeveloped product once, and what
you're paying for from thefactory. The factory obviously
has to make a margin and beprofitable, so it's what you're
(17:49):
buying, what is your invoicefrom your factory, that is
transaction value. So there wasa lot of misconception, and we
worked with trade lawyers, andwe kind of explained it many,
many times, and consistently,this has been the the agreed
upon. So if you are shippinggoods, let's say in our model,
or in the other models fromVietnam or China, the transact
(18:09):
your taxes is on yourtransaction value. And that is,
that was a big misconceptionearly days.
Andrew Maff (18:15):
Interesting. Okay, I understand that. So last year
you're on the show, and we hadno idea this was going to
happen. So let's now say you'reback on the show next summer.
What do you think we're going tobe talking about? What happens
between now and then?
Izzy Rosenzweig (18:33):
Great question.
I do think what's nice is we'repost the chaotic side. I mean,
still chaos, but I do think theway Trump approached it, the way
the administration approachedit, I won't say him, but maybe
he's the trade leader. The tradenegotiators was they went very
extreme, very fast. One thing wethink is clear is that Trump
wants the economy do well. Hewants a great stock market. He
(18:54):
wants the economy to well. Hewants to make money. He also
wants the economy to well. Boththings want to be true. He wants
additional revenue, and he wantsthe economy to do well it to me
that the path he was going onwith going extreme, they say, is
like his art of the deal, thathe keeps playing, go really
extreme, grab leverage, and thennegotiate where it's somewhere
in the middle. So what's nice ishe's done the extreme part,
which is the painful part. We'repast that now. We're now to
(19:17):
where he wants to show themarket and the economy that he
is a good negotiator, and he'llhe'll do well for the American
people in the taxpayers, whichis, there will be, therewill be
taxes. If you look at the UK,let's call it our tier one
partner. Baseline is 10% youlook at China, it's at 30% you
look at Vietnam, is at 20% somost likely, as long as you're
(19:38):
not pissing him off too much,and you're doing business with
them, you will see import dutiesanywhere between 10 to 30% I
don't think it'll be higher thanthat, and I don't think it'll be
lower than that, which now tellsyou, okay, we know where we live
and what we you know wherebrands cannot make decisions.
Well, do I want to go toVietnam? Well, he just announced
(19:58):
a Vietnam deal, and now it's a20% additional on top of base.
Okay, the spread isn't so muchanywhere between China &
Vietnam. It's still there, butit's not huge. So like we're
seeing now, I think a lot moreclear direction, and therefore
brands are able to makedecisions. And I do see brands
starting to diversify a bit likeno people have learned their
lessons, not not all their eggsin one basket. Do I do on a
(20:20):
little bit in Vietnam? Do I do alittle bit in India? End of the
day, the problem is that Chinais so robust, ecosystem when it
comes to manufacturing. We don'tsee people moving that much, to
be honest. Unless you're huge,hundreds of millions of revenue,
then we're seeingdiversification. But at least
there's stability, and peoplekind of know where they live.
They could price according tothat stability. So I think we're
(20:42):
in a much, much better spot. SoI do think by the time next
year, there will be deals made.
Every country will be different.
I would say those are the Ithink there'll be more stability
compared to this year.
Andrew Maff (20:56):
Yeah. And so you think we're back to kind of a
the new norm, I guess, at thatpoint?
Izzy Rosenzweig (21:02):
The new norm, which is tariffs and import
duties.
Andrew Maff (21:05):
Yeah.
Izzy Rosenzweig (21:05):
And also, I would say, over the longer run,
while Dominicus still exists inUnited States, from Vietnam and
Dominicus exist in manycountries around the world, by
the way, exists Australia forunder 1000 Australia dollars,
exist to Europe for 150 euros,and existed to the UK, under 135
GBP, directionally diminishwhat's going away around the
around the world. The only onethat is increasing, it is
(21:27):
Argentina, the ultimate freetrade guy. But everyone else is
probably going to, know, get ridof it, which is fine. It's like,
I mean, Europe is calling 2028so they don't move as fast. I
would say that's another, youknow, trend we're saying,
Andrew Maff (21:43):
Yeah, interesting.
Izzy man, awesome, fantastic.
I'm already looking forward tonext year so we can do this
again. This was great, obviouslynormal. Really appreciate having
on the show. I'd love to giveyou the floor let everyone know
where they can find out moreabout you and more about
Portless.
Izzy Rosenzweig (21:59):
Hey, again.
Thank you so much for having meon the show. Always a blast. If
you want to learn, I post a loton LinkedIn. You can follow me
@Izzy Rosenzweig on LinkedIn,feel free to send me a DM,
therefore to learn more.
Also@portless.com we have a tonof information, podcasts,
webinars, case studies. Youlearn about, educate yourself
about the model for us, this isour position is this is the
(22:19):
evolution of logistics for Ecommerce, and either you go with
that trend or your competitorswill, and you'll they'll
probably take market share. Solearn about it. At a minimum,
learn about it. Educateyourself. And if you want to
learn more, reach out to us.
We'd love the opportunity to
Andrew Maff (22:35):
Izzy, thank you again, sir. Really appreciate
you having the show and everyoneover the Portless team, thank
talk to you.
you as well. As usual, everyonewho tuned in, thank you as well.
Please make sure you do theusual thing, rate review,
subscribe all that fun stuff. Onwhichever podcast platform you
prefer, or head over to theEcommshow.com to check out all
of our previous episodes. But asusual, thank you all for joining
us. See you next time, have agood one.
Narrator (22:55):
Thank you for tuning in to the E comm show. Head over
to ecommshow.com to subscribe onyour favorite podcast platform
or on the BlueTusker YouTubechannel, the Ecomm Show is
brought to you by BlueTusker, afull service digital marketing
company specifically for Ecommerce sellers looking to
accelerate their growth. Go tobluetuskr.com now for more
(23:17):
information, make sure to tunein next week for another amazing
episode of the E comm show you.
The biggest myth we saw was the term
transaction value. What is thedefinition of transaction value?
Andrew Maff (00:09):
Welcome to the E comm Show podcast. I am your
host. Andrew MAFF, owner andfounder of blue tusker, from
groundbreaking industry updatesto success stories and
strategies, get to know the insand outs of the e Commerce
Industry from top leaders in thespace. Let's get into it.
Hello everyone, and welcome toanother episode of the E comm
show as usual. I am your host,Andrew Maff, and today I welcome
(00:30):
back Izzy Rosenzweig, who is theCEO and founder over at
Portless. Izzy, how you doing?
Man? How's it been?
Izzy Rosenzweig (00:36):
Doing great! Andrew, thank you for having me
for a second time, very excitedabout it.
Andrew Maff (00:39):
No, problem. Do you know it's all so we almost
nailed it. We, well, as of therecording today, we're almost
exactly a year out from whenyour last episode was published,
so we'll get a nice annual recapfrom Izzy over at Portless.
Super excited. I know the amountof stuff that has happened since
the last time you and I spoke iswe'll need multiple
(01:03):
episodesbetween now and the nextannual catch up you and I have,
but let's start off kind of theusual, and I'll give you the
floor.Tell us a little bit aboutyour background, how you got
started with portless, and thenwe'll jump into the good stuff.
Izzy Rosenzweig (01:16):
Absolutely. So I was originally a brand owner.
I ran a brand for about 10years, I ran it in the home and
kitchen space, direct toconsumer. The first two years of
running that business, I ran itin the traditional supply chain
model that most e commerce stilldo today, which is I was buying
goods from somewhere overseas.
My stuff was mainly China,Vietnam, and I was putting stuff
on shipping containers, and thatwas just an absolute brutal way
(01:40):
to buy goods from a cash flowperspective. I'd put out 50k
100k 250k at a time, and thatwas just always waiting,
waiting, waiting, waiting,waiting for the goods to get
here. Once it got here, iswaiting for it to sell. So I get
cash out of inventory. Then Irealized I made a wrong bet on
prediction. So I'm trying to buyfour to six months in advance,
and I would have excessinventory which I had to
(02:01):
liquidate, or whatever, likelose money on the sale. It was
really hard, but that was theway I ran the first years of
that business. Then I pivoted,or I got very lucky, I met early
Alibaba executives, and theykind of introduced me to this
evolving space of what we callthe direct supply chain model,
which is, you don't need to putstuff on boats, keep goods near
(02:21):
the factories, in facilitiesnear the factories. We have two
in China, two in Vietnam and andship from there. And essentially
what the way it works is, oncewe have the goods in our
facilities, we could delivergoods in about six days across
the US, 100% local experience.
So a customer makes an orderwithin 24 hours, there is a USPS
(02:43):
tracking number, five dayslater, your driver puts on the
front door. USPS label oranother regional carriers label
either be non branded or brandedpackaging, whatever the customer
wants, but the brand, thecustomer has exact same
experience as the idea straightbut from a brand's perspective,
I argue everything changes, andthat's how I ran my brand for 10
(03:04):
years. We're all of a sudden, mycash flow was incredible. I was
applying goods Well, I didn't, Ididn't even put out turn 50
grand at a time or a milliondollars at a time, because it
wasn't buying six months. I wasbuying four weeks at a time, and
then as I was selling, I wasrebuying the right SKUs, the
right colors. So it was avoidingexcess inventory, because I
(03:24):
wasn't reinvesting in bad SKUs,and I was capturing demand in
season of the good SKUs. So theright colors, the right
products, and scaling it, I wasnever out of stock. I constantly
buying more. So that business,we were able to scale quite
aggressively. We builtinfrastructure, software and
logistics solutions around thatentire business. That business
did about 100 million in revenueand amazing cash flow. I did
(03:48):
shift out of the brand to thebrand business, the DTC business
to B to B business. When iOS 14happened. So if your marketing
world, you remember, there was aperiod about a year, I would say
that IRS 14, we got releasedbasically Apple's privacy
update. Apple said, I'm nolonger sending meta any data or
any anyone data. So if you're inthe marketing world, which we
(04:09):
were driving a lot of ourrevenue through marketing,
everything kind of went chaotic,and we couldn't see our
marketing attribution. So westarted to do is lean into the
infrastructure, the software,the solutions we built from a
logistics perspective, and welaunched Portless to help other
brands be more sophisticatedwhen it comes to cash flow. And
now we're fortunate. We supporthundreds of brands across the
(04:30):
US, UK and Australia and someWestern Europe, and we deliver
goods five, six days from fromthe from near the factory to the
well in our facilities near thefactory, so brand can
manufacture within one to twodays later, it's in our
facility. They start selling. Wepick back, have that order
delivered to the customer'sfront door five to six days
(04:50):
later, fully local experience.
Brands go from a million dollarsin inventory upfront to now last
250k and they're restocking onthe right stuff, so they're
getting cash back faster, lessmoney in inventory. So that's
what we do at Portless, andthat's how I got into it.
Andrew Maff (05:06):
Interesting. Okay, so you've, you've been on the
show, you know that my knowledgeand operations and inventory
management is impressively low,but I have questions. So first
thing I'm thinking about, it allmakes a ton of sense, right?
Like, I know we I was luckyenough to have the founder of
butcherbox on the show, and hisoperational skill set was, it
(05:28):
was really impressive listen tobut he talked about the same
problems. Of like, in thebeginning, you got to order so
much and then you're basicallyjust playing catch up all the
time. You're chasing your tailthe whole time with the Portless
solution. Makes a ton of sense.
What I'm curious about is, ifyou're now ordering, you now
need to order less quantitiesfrom your factory. Wouldn't that
theoretically increase yourcosts on the factory side,
(05:50):
because you're not doing as bigof a bulk purchase? And then my
other question being, if I canbulk ship a ton of stuff through
a boat and then be able to shipit individually out of a 3PL
versus leaving it overseas andthen doing it from that way?
Wouldn't I potentially be payingmore on the individual order,
because it's now coming, Iassume, from a plane or
(06:14):
something like that?
Izzy Rosenzweig (06:16):
Both great questions. So let's do one at a
time. First, let's talk aboutMOQ in general, we've seen a new
shift out of China, where Brent,where factories are starting to
put a premium on lower MOQ. Now,why they're doing that is
because Shein has proven overthe last 10 years that if you're
a factory and you're willing totake bets on smaller MOQ, yes,
(06:36):
the factory won't make as muchmoney. But then the brand could
find winners faster, and thenthey get once, get winners
faster. Everyone wins. The brandwins, and the factory wins. So
we've seen, we've seen factoriesgo down in the apparel space.
Let's say one roll of fabric, 50units in that one roll, so you
could test and not charge youmuch of a premium. So that's,
that's one in general. It's afundamental shift away factories
(06:59):
looking at manufacturing. Soit's called small batch
manufacturing. It is the kind ofevolution that Shein has
invented or has perfected, andbrands are leaning into it. Now,
again, small batch manufacturingonly works if you're filling
your from your factory, becauseyou gotta stop really quickly.
The next thing is, let's say itgoes up by 10% let's just say
your COG goes from $5 to $5.50now you have to have a question,
(07:20):
okay, I'm paying 50 cents more,but what's my velocity of sales?
So if you do a, you know, 10,000upfront, but you lost, but you
messed up on 30% of the averageexcess inventory rate. So you
messed up 30% on yourpredictions. Now you have a 30%
write off, that's, you know, $5times 30% or whatever your
inventory is, you will actuallymake more money on your PnL,
(07:42):
forget about cash flow. Cashflow is amazing in this model,
but you actually have net betterprofits by avoiding excess
inventory. If it's an essential,like, if you sell this all day
every day, of course, like, whynot? But if it's newer, or
you're not sure how the season'sgonna go, last year was good.
Would be good this next year,the slight cost, and it's very
slight, it's not even 10%usually, but whatever that cost
(08:03):
is, well, what's the cost ofexcess inventory? What's the
cost of not restocking andreally fast from your factory
Okay,the cost.
So you're right, I want to sayyou're right. You're right
depending on the customer. Soand having an inventory? That is
a cost that you got to do yourcalculations with? So that's
your first question. Should Imove on to the second one?
Andrew Maff (08:09):
Go for it. Yeah.
You're on a roll.
that's why we don't service allcustomers. If you're in the
furniture business, do boats,you're in bulky business, you
(08:30):
know, whatever, if you're if youcould fit in a shoe box or less,
think like shoes, cosmetics,clothing, all that type of
stuff. The cost per flight isn'tthat expensive when we have many
orders in a single pallet. Sotwo things keep in mind. First
thing is, we do zone skipping.
What does that mean if you wereusing a 3PL on the West Coast?
Well, if you're so LA is, let'sget zone one. But you got to
(08:53):
ship orders to New York, you gotto ship orders to Chicago. You
got to ship orders to Miami,Texas. You'r paying a premium.
The further goes from your corelocation. It's called zone one
through zone eight. So yourshipping rates in LA might be
five bucks, but your shipping toNew York might be eight bucks,
even if you have two locations,East Coast and West Coast, okay,
you still have zone one throughzone four. So first what we're
(09:13):
doing is, when we put stuff onplanes, we're going to six
injection points, LA, Chicago,New York, Arizona, Texas, Miami
and sometimes Atlanta, whichmeans we're zone skipping.
You're never paying more thelast mile than zone one or zone
two. Okay, that's great. You'resaving on the last mile. How
about the airplane? Well, theairplane, it's all about us
blending many different ordersin the single palette. And the
example I give is, pretendyou're in the jewelry business
(09:36):
and you're selling a pair ofearrings. How many orders of a
pair of appearance, could I fiton a single pallet? A million,
like 100,000 so your cost perorder is pennies in that
scenario, and your last mile isown. Skipping. Our shipping
rates start at $5 door to door,customs clearance to the
customer's front door for aquarter pound. Obviously, as it
(10:03):
gets larger and bulkier, getsmore expensive. So, that's a
pair of earrings. Let's say evenunder $5 like $5 $4 and
something and 80 somethingcents. But you could scale up to
a T shirt. You could scale it upto a dress at a certain scale.
Once you're, like an extremeexample, once you're selling
furniture, well, obviously notgonna fit one furniture, one
pallet, but as long as you'reunder five pounds or fits in a
shoe box, um, most likely yourshipping rates will be very
similar to our shipping rates,so you're almost apples to
(10:24):
apples on the shipping rates,but now you unlock cash flow,
you unlock, avoiding excessinventory, your ability to test
faster. And there's one otherother advantage I'll talk about
is connected to the tariffconversation, but I'll get into
that good i love the segue.
Narrator (10:46):
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revenue, bluetuskr has helpedmany brands like yours excel.
Unlike other marketing partners,BlueTuskr leverages a team of
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(11:07):
business from the rest. Ready toscale your marketinginitiatives?
Visit their website,bluetuskr.com, that's B, l, u,
e, t, u, s, k, r.com. Oh,
Izzy Rosenzweig (11:18):
Should I jump in?
Andrew Maff (11:19):
Yeah, let's go for it. That's what I'm ready to
get. That's what I'm here for.
So that was, that was what I wasalluding to like in the past
year, I'm like, Oh, great. Thisis gonna be perfect, because
this is the tariffs 101,conversation I know we're about
to have. And you're in China,Vietnam, let's go what's
happened in the past year?
Izzy Rosenzweig (11:35):
Let's go big or go home. Okay, so this is what
happened when we spoke last yearDominicus existed and and
everyone says, oh, Americanbrand Shein, the only exist in
this business. Because ofDominicus, I fought it forever.
You could find me in every majornews article, from Bloomberg to
New York Times to CV. That isnot correct. People use this
(11:57):
model for the ultimate cash flowmodel. It is a supply chain
game. It is the efficiency andagile inventory. So when
inventory, when Dominicus wentaway, all that happened is
you're paying, you're payingyour import tax on it the same
way you would pay import tax ifyou use a shipping container. We
haven't lost a single customer.
We're set. We are shipping thesame amount of orders every
single day that we did beforeDominicus and after Dominicus.
(12:20):
Yes, you're paying import tax,but import tax, let's say right
now it's 30% there's 20%reciprocal, or 10% reciprocal,
20% fentanol. Then there'ssection 301, and base tariffs.
So you're anywhere between 30 to50% okay, so if you are a $10
COG item, you're adding three to$5 on your retail but that $10
item, you're probably sellingfor some for $75 now you got to
(12:41):
sell 79.99 again. It'sinflationary. It sucks.
Everyone's done it. It's notslowing down. Ecomm is pumping.
At 145% tariffs. I would argueTrump was going to bankrupt the
economy. He was going tobankrupt 10s of 1000s of brands.
But at a 30 to 50% tariffs,people are living with that,
people are scaling with it, youknow. So it is working. So now
(13:03):
the prior yes, Dominicus is gonefor everybody. Everyone's got a
pay import tax side, side note,not Vietnam. We'll put that to
the side for a minute. Chinafirst. But our customers still
the major financial advantage,which is, if you're a brand and
you're importing a milliondollars of goods, and you're
doing it through the traditionalway, through boats, you need to
(13:25):
put your checkbook and write acheck to the CDP for $500,000
the day it hits the ports. It'snot in your warehouse yet. You
haven't sold a single shoe or asingle shirt. You need to write
an additional $500,000 and cashto support. That's not your
bank. In our model, you're notspending a penny on import
duties day one. It's sitting incountry of origin, sitting in
(13:47):
China. You're not it's not inAmerica.You don't pay import
duties. You sell your shirt.
Let's say you sell, in thiscase, the pen. You collect money
from the customer. Money's inyour bank at that point, we ship
it. And only when that ordercrosses the border, you're
paying import duties, so you gotto pay the same 500,000 over
time, but you're collecting themoney up front, and that, in
itself, is game changing. Sure,sure. Dominicus is gone, but you
(14:10):
but the people that use usaren't laying out that money.
They're using that money foroperations, these, money for
marketing, these, that money forwhatever they got around their
business, versus thecompetitors, the ones are using
these, the old supply chainmodel, they just lost that much
more money in their operations.
So not only does cash flow stillexist, not only does the agile
inventory still exist, and notonly are brands still scaling
this model, but now they alsohave financial advantage, which
(14:32):
is tax deferment, and that ishuge.
Andrew Maff (14:36):
Yeah. So are you seeing more and more like
warehouses 3PLs, kind of thingpopping up within China and
Vietnam to start allowing formore of this to happen. And
you're going to start seeing, Iguess, warehouses and three PLS,
start to dwindle in the States.
Izzy Rosenzweig (14:52):
I don't think so. I don't think it'll dwindle.
I mean, we're probably thelargest one that we know in this
model. We're in China, Vietnam,are opening up in India, but the
US, like, to me, e-commerce isso big, there's always gonna be
a local need. So I don't, Iwould say Canada, Mexico getting
crushed. So if you were doingthis model of Canada, Mexico,
(15:14):
using it for Dominicus, that'sshipping either to the US or us,
because once you're in thosemodels, like it was all about
Dominicus, but Dominicus isgone. Why are you using it? Now,
Dominicus is gone for China. Itis still existing for every
other country in the world. Soif you're shipping out of our
(15:38):
Vietnam location, you arelegally allowed to import,
import, duty free, as long asyour transaction value is under
or your retail value is under$800 so that is that's still
around, and it's supposed to goaway based on the big, beautiful
bill, July 2027, end of June orearly July 2027, there's a lot
of time to use that so, soMexico and Canada are still
leveraging it for brands thatare manufactured and not in
China, still leveraging it like,why not? It's there. You could
use it. You should use it. Yeah,so that that that model still
(16:01):
existing, which is quiteinteresting.
Andrew Maff (16:03):
What would you say is, like, the biggest myth right
now? Because there's so manytheories there every especially
when the terrorist first startedbecoming thing, I swear I got
some cold email every fiveminutes about someone who's
like, here's what you got to do.
And they were all different. Inyour opinion. What is kind of
the biggest myth right now thatbrands are struggling with
regarding the tariffs?
Izzy Rosenzweig (16:24):
Yeah, I would say there was, in the early
days, there were so much noise.
I would say people that are, Iwant to call theminfluencers,
people that will post a lotabout it, but they didn't
necessarily speak to tradelawyers to validate what they
were posting. They were justseeing what they believe was
true, versus versus speaking tolawyers. So it is definitely
complex. It's very complex, verycomplex world. But I would say
(16:44):
that the biggest myth we saw wasthe term transaction value. What
is the definition of transactionvalue? So a lot of people
saying, oh, transaction value.
If you are shipping goods intothe United States, you have to
use transaction value. Well,historically, transaction value
was retail value. That was whenit was under Dominicus. The
(17:05):
Dominicus rule, the import ofrecord was the ultimate
consignee. And the ultimateconsignee their transaction
value, because they're theimport of record, was what they
bought on the retail site. Butin the new model, where now it's
moving towards commercial entry,not under Dominicus, the
merchant is the input of record,and the merchant's transaction
value is not retail. TheMerchant's transaction value is
(17:27):
what they are buying it fromtheir seller, and their seller
is the factory. So it's actuallyFOB China. So it's not I use
carefully the word Cog, I don'twant to use the word COG,
because COG could look at costof goods. So it's not the raw
material cost, it's the fullydeveloped product once, and what
you're paying for from thefactory. The factory obviously
has to make a margin and beprofitable, so it's what you're
(17:49):
buying, what is your invoicefrom your factory, that is
transaction value. So there wasa lot of misconception, and we
worked with trade lawyers, andwe kind of explained it many,
many times, and consistently,this has been the the agreed
upon. So if you are shippinggoods, let's say in our model,
or in the other models fromVietnam or China, the transact
(18:09):
your taxes is on yourtransaction value. And that is,
that was a big misconceptionearly days.
Andrew Maff (18:15):
Interesting. Okay, I understand that. So last year
you're on the show, and we hadno idea this was going to
happen. So let's now say you'reback on the show next summer.
What do you think we're going tobe talking about? What happens
between now and then?
Izzy Rosenzweig (18:33):
Great question.
I do think what's nice is we'repost the chaotic side. I mean,
still chaos, but I do think theway Trump approached it, the way
the administration approachedit, I won't say him, but maybe
he's the trade leader. The tradenegotiators was they went very
extreme, very fast. One thing wethink is clear is that Trump
wants the economy do well. Hewants a great stock market. He
(18:54):
wants the economy to well. Hewants to make money. He also
wants the economy to well. Boththings want to be true. He wants
additional revenue, and he wantsthe economy to do well it to me
that the path he was going onwith going extreme, they say, is
like his art of the deal, thathe keeps playing, go really
extreme, grab leverage, and thennegotiate where it's somewhere
in the middle. So what's nice ishe's done the extreme part,
which is the painful part. We'repast that now. We're now to
(19:17):
where he wants to show themarket and the economy that he
is a good negotiator, and he'llhe'll do well for the American
people in the taxpayers, whichis, there will be, therewill be
taxes. If you look at the UK,let's call it our tier one
partner. Baseline is 10% youlook at China, it's at 30% you
look at Vietnam, is at 20% somost likely, as long as you're
(19:38):
not pissing him off too much,and you're doing business with
them, you will see import dutiesanywhere between 10 to 30% I
don't think it'll be higher thanthat, and I don't think it'll be
lower than that, which now tellsyou, okay, we know where we live
and what we you know wherebrands cannot make decisions.
Well, do I want to go toVietnam? Well, he just announced
(19:58):
a Vietnam deal, and now it's a20% additional on top of base.
Okay, the spread isn't so muchanywhere between China &
Vietnam. It's still there, butit's not huge. So like we're
seeing now, I think a lot moreclear direction, and therefore
brands are able to makedecisions. And I do see brands
starting to diversify a bit likeno people have learned their
lessons, not not all their eggsin one basket. Do I do on a
(20:20):
little bit in Vietnam? Do I do alittle bit in India? End of the
day, the problem is that Chinais so robust, ecosystem when it
comes to manufacturing. We don'tsee people moving that much, to
be honest. Unless you're huge,hundreds of millions of revenue,
then we're seeingdiversification. But at least
there's stability, and peoplekind of know where they live.
They could price according tothat stability. So I think we're
(20:42):
in a much, much better spot. SoI do think by the time next
year, there will be deals made.
Every country will be different.
I would say those are the Ithink there'll be more stability
compared to this year.
Andrew Maff (20:56):
Yeah. And so you think we're back to kind of a
the new norm, I guess, at thatpoint?
Izzy Rosenzweig (21:02):
The new norm, which is tariffs and import
duties.
Andrew Maff (21:05):
Yeah.
Izzy Rosenzweig (21:05):
And also, I would say, over the longer run,
while Dominicus still exists inUnited States, from Vietnam and
Dominicus exist in manycountries around the world, by
the way, exists Australia forunder 1000 Australia dollars,
exist to Europe for 150 euros,and existed to the UK, under 135
GBP, directionally diminishwhat's going away around the
around the world. The only onethat is increasing, it is
(21:27):
Argentina, the ultimate freetrade guy. But everyone else is
probably going to, know, get ridof it, which is fine. It's like,
I mean, Europe is calling 2028so they don't move as fast. I
would say that's another, youknow, trend we're saying,
Andrew Maff (21:43):
Yeah, interesting.
Izzy man, awesome, fantastic.
I'm already looking forward tonext year so we can do this
again. This was great, obviouslynormal. Really appreciate having
on the show. I'd love to giveyou the floor let everyone know
where they can find out moreabout you and more about
Portless.
Izzy Rosenzweig (21:59):
Hey, again.
Thank you so much for having meon the show. Always a blast. If
you want to learn, I post a loton LinkedIn. You can follow me
@Izzy Rosenzweig on LinkedIn,feel free to send me a DM,
therefore to learn more.
Also@portless.com we have a tonof information, podcasts,
webinars, case studies. Youlearn about, educate yourself
about the model for us, this isour position is this is the
(22:19):
evolution of logistics for Ecommerce, and either you go with
that trend or your competitorswill, and you'll they'll
probably take market share. Solearn about it. At a minimum,
learn about it. Educateyourself. And if you want to
learn more, reach out to us.
We'd love the opportunity to
Andrew Maff (22:35):
Izzy, thank you again, sir. Really appreciate
you having the show and everyoneover the Portless team, thank
talk to you.
you as well. As usual, everyonewho tuned in, thank you as well.
Please make sure you do theusual thing, rate review,
subscribe all that fun stuff. Onwhichever podcast platform you
prefer, or head over to theEcommshow.com to check out all
of our previous episodes. But asusual, thank you all for joining
us. See you next time, have agood one.
Narrator (22:55):
Thank you for tuning in to the E comm show. Head over
to ecommshow.com to subscribe onyour favorite podcast platform
or on the BlueTusker YouTubechannel, the Ecomm Show is
brought to you by BlueTusker, afull service digital marketing
company specifically for Ecommerce sellers looking to
accelerate their growth. Go tobluetuskr.com now for more
(23:17):
information, make sure to tunein next week for another amazing
episode of the E comm show you.
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The official podcast of comedian Joe Rogan.