What happens when you remove the biggest triggers from a child’s day and the seizures stop? We sit down with Paige Carter to unpack a remarkable shift since Oakland left school, the role stress and heat play in absence and atonic seizures, and why the family is cautiously considering CBD oil after exhausting conventional options. From risperidone’s early wins and later costs, to stimulants that sparked agitation, to a thick, red seizure medicine that collided with PDA-driven demand avoidance, this is a grounded look at tailoring care to a child’s nervous system.
We get practical about legal access, quality control, and avoiding THC in paediatric use, and talk through gentle dosing tactics that respect autonomy—tiny drops on bread, full transparency, and slow titration under specialist oversight. Paige shares why a psychiatrist may join the team alongside neurology and paediatrics, and how cause–effect thinking helps Oakland link heat, stress, and seizure risk to asking for support when he needs it. With summer on the way and a year on the road ahead, the family is planning for flexible care while keeping anxiety low and trust high.
inclusiveoak.com.au
danabaltutis.com, mytherapyhouse.com.au, https://mytherapyhouse.com.au/your-childs-therapy-journey/ https://www.danabaltutis.com/services
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Episode Transcript
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SPEAKER_01 (00:03):
Hi everyone, and welcome to week five of Paige
Carter's from Inclusive OakUnschooling series.
Paige Carter is a parent,advocate, champion, amazing mum
of two children with PDA, one ofwhom is not attending school
(00:25):
this term, and we're followingher journey with Oakland.
And I'm a speech pathologist whogeeks out on PDA.
And why I say that is becausePaige and I were just having a
chat before we started thispodcast, and we started talking
everything about PDA.
And I said, let's stop and let'sstart talking on the podcast.
(00:48):
Welcome, Paige Carter.
Thank you so much for having meagain.
So, Paige, I want to know.
Week five coming into oh, it'smid-November.
The Christmas pageant has justbeen.
So Christmas season is starting.
How are you guys faring?
SPEAKER_02 (01:08):
We're okay.
This week has just been a bitboring, really.
Oakland is really just likeplainest iPad, plain's
PlayStation, just really justwanting to chill out.
Nothing much has changed here,but we're good.
We're just preparing for ourtrip.
It's all getting very close andjust yeah, just taking day by
(01:29):
day.
Have you packed the house yet orwhere are you at with that?
Uh yep.
So we've gone through like allof the cupboards and everything.
Everything left out is eitherstuff that we really need or
it's going in our caravan.
So it's just like really likethe big furniture, like TVs and
stuff like that we need left.
(01:50):
So yeah, it we're we're if wehad to, we could pack up and be
gone within a couple of days.
SPEAKER_01 (01:56):
And where are you going to be putting your
furniture?
Are you going to be putting itin storage or just leaving it in
the house?
SPEAKER_02 (02:02):
No, so we have a big shed on our property, so we are
not including the shed in therental and we're storing it in
there.
SPEAKER_01 (02:09):
Yeah, okay.
So can do you think that Oaklandsees a difference in his
environment?
SPEAKER_02 (02:18):
Not so much yet, not hugely, because all the things
that he uses and he findscomfort in it are all still
there.
unknown (02:28):
Right.
SPEAKER_02 (02:28):
But he will also come this time next week.
So next weekend's the bigweekend when we start moving the
bigger stuff, and then he'll hewill start to get a little bit
upset by it, I think maybe.
Well, I don't know if he'll getupset.
As long as we don't take hisPlayStation and his TV, I think
he'll be sweet.
SPEAKER_01 (02:46):
So how are the transitions going to get Lacey
to school?
Is are they still difficult?
SPEAKER_02 (02:54):
Yeah, still the same.
I don't, yeah, I don't reallyhaven't come up with an answer
of how to make them easier.
But yeah, we just we I think Ijust brace myself, we just know
it's coming and try and dealwith it the best we can.
And just try and limit theamount of times like you know, I
do the school drop-off, but thenI don't expect him to go
(03:16):
anywhere else and come in thecar anywhere else with me during
the day.
Because I know that thattransitioning from home to the
car and back again is hard.
So I just limit it as much as Ican.
SPEAKER_01 (03:27):
Yeah, right.
So before we started thisepisode, you said, Do you want
to talk about somethingcontroversial?
And I said, Yes, always.
And I said, What is it?
And you said we are looking atstarting Oakland on CBD oil.
Okay, so sorry about this,everyone.
I'm in a hotel in Perth, andthere is a lot of traffic
(03:51):
outside, and I can't, you know,I can't erase it or anything.
So what Paige said was, you'rethinking about starting Oakland
on CBD oil, is that right?
Correct, yes.
So why is this controversial?
Tell me.
SPEAKER_02 (04:06):
Um, I think obviously it's you know, it's
made from a drug that isillegal, right?
SPEAKER_01 (04:13):
Like tell people who don't know what CBD oil is, what
is it exactly?
SPEAKER_02 (04:19):
Okay, so it's extracted from marijuana, is the
I guess the easiest, mostsimple, blunt way to explain it.
But it's not very well known forhaving good medical modalities
to it if it's used in the rightway.
(04:40):
So we're we're consideringtrying it for him because we
feel like we've tried everythingelse.
I think I did say last week he'snow refusing to take his epilom,
which is his seizure meds, andhe's not on any like ADHD meds
or anything like that because wecan't find anything that works
(05:01):
for him.
He was on Respiridone, which wecalled his magic med, and we
loved it.
It was great for him, but hejust outgrew it and it no longer
worked for him after being on itfor four and a half years.
SPEAKER_01 (05:12):
So his his uh nervous system habituated to it,
is that right?
SPEAKER_02 (05:17):
Yeah, um, well, yeah, so we used to up the dose
every six months.
We'd go to his pediatrician, andhis pediatrician managed that
for us.
And then it got to a stage whereone, he put on a lot of weight
on Respiridone, a lot of weight,it was concerning.
And also it got to the pointwhere we used to up, obviously,
(05:40):
like I said, every six months,but then it got to a point where
two months in and we desperatelyneed to up it again.
Um, so it just wasn't havingthat like that lasting effect
anymore.
And the more we up it, you know,the worse it was for him.
Um, so yeah, his pediatricianjust said, like, this is when
like when we get to this pointis when it's not working
(06:04):
anymore.
So we had to take him off of it,but we have not found
successfully anything else thatworks for him.
We've tried Dex, we've triedRitalin, we've tried Bivance,
we've tried intuitivecaterpress, all the things we've
tried them and what else?
New Lactol, we've tried lots ofdifferent things, nothing works.
(06:25):
Um it's yeah, it either just hasno effect on him or it makes him
really, really angry um andkeeps him up all night and you
know, all those sorts of things.
So it just seems like CBD oil issomething that we haven't tried.
Um and it's we thought it wasgood because CBD oil is well
(06:47):
known for treating epilepsy aswell as aggressive behaviours.
So why not give him one thingthat helps him with two of the
things that he needs medicationfor?
SPEAKER_01 (06:57):
Yeah.
And you mentioned earlier thathe's no longer wanting to take
his seizure medication.
What's that about?
How, why, and how do you know,and and things like that?
SPEAKER_02 (07:08):
I I feel like it's a PDA thing.
I feel like he it's the demandof taking it, he's been taking
it for so long.
He we know he doesn't want totake it because he'll just throw
it at you.
And so he took, he was supposedto take 15 mil of it twice a
day.
Um, and the demand, I think, oflike us giving it to him and him
all he he's really strugglingwith eating at the moment.
(07:30):
So him having to eat before hetakes it, and there was just so
many things that he had to do.
So, yeah, it's just so whatcouldn't get him to consistently
take it.
So we spoke to his neurologist,and she just ended up taking him
off of it because it's one ofthose meds where, unless you're
taking it consistently, then youshouldn't be taking it.
SPEAKER_01 (07:52):
Right.
And is that like a capsule youneed to swallow or anything like
that?
SPEAKER_02 (07:56):
So it's it's medicine and it's with a taste,
yes, with a taste, and it's it'sred and thick.
SPEAKER_01 (08:04):
Uh-huh.
So that could be difficult aswell.
So, what's gonna be thedifference around his demand
avoidance of taking then CBDoil?
SPEAKER_02 (08:15):
Uh, so CBD oil is just a couple of drops, so it's
it's not like he wouldn't haveto take like 15 mil of it.
And with it being a couple ofdrop drops, something that the
urologist said, and you know,this isn't me recommending for
anyone to do this.
This is just what we were toldis a way to do it, is you just
put that couple of drops on likea piece of bread, and you just
(08:38):
give them that to eat ratherthan them actually having to be
like right now, it's time foryour meds.
It kind of makes that demand alittle bit easier.
SPEAKER_01 (08:47):
And do you will he know that he's taking the CBD
oil?
Will you let him know?
Yeah, because absolutelyaffirming, right?
That's about that's newer.
Absolutely.
SPEAKER_02 (08:57):
Yeah, it's not like tricking.
I think it no, we we don't wantto trick him, and we'll be very
open and honest with him aboutit to his ability of
understanding it.
But I think so.
When he was on Respiridone, heknew that Respiridone made him
feel better.
He liked taking it and he and hewas always happy to take that.
We never had issues getting himto take that.
(09:21):
So I feel like if he sees thatit does make him feel better, if
it works, you know, we haven'ttried it yet, we don't know if
it's gonna work, but if it doeswork and he sees it does make
him feel a lot better, then itmight he might just willingly
like want to take it.
SPEAKER_01 (09:39):
And I've read research around children who are
fussy eaters, and often childrenwho are fussy eaters are the
ones that have got gut issues,and they almost know intuitively
what food is going to make themfeel uncomfortable, whether it's
gassy, whether it's constipated,whether it's nauseous.
(10:03):
And I really believe childrencan feel, because that's the
introspie, right?
Children can feel when somethingis okay in their body and when
something is not okay, just likeyeah, yeah, definitely.
SPEAKER_02 (10:20):
So and I think so it does make sense that he's now
stopped wanting to take hisepilom, um, which is the seizure
medication, because so he's notat school, and so stressful
environments are reallytriggering for his epilepsy.
So we've taken out the stressfulenvironment, and also the heat
(10:40):
is a trigger for his epilepsy,it's not hot at the moment, so
we've taken away the two maintriggers for his seizures.
So he's in his mind, he's like,Well, I'm not gonna have a
seizure because it's not hot andI and I don't feel stressed.
So, like I know his his nervoussystem is stressed, like I get
that, but he doesn't feel he'snot in a stressful environment
(11:04):
for hours on end during the day.
So I think in his mind, he'slike, Well, I don't need it
because like he doesn't have theunderstanding that I need to
take that every day.
In his mind, he's like, Well, Idon't feel like I'm not in
situations where I feel like I'mgonna have a seizure, so I don't
need it.
Like a cause-effect, right?
Yeah, cause effect.
So whereas if he because when hewas at school, he would
(11:27):
willingly take it and he wouldeven say, like, Mom, I haven't
had my meds yet.
Because he's he gets scared ofhaving a seizure.
He doesn't want to have it.
So I do predict that once itstarts getting warmer and we
take off on our trip and we'respending a lot more time
outside, that he may ask me forit.
He may say, Mom, I haven't hadmy meds.
Um, because he is worried abouthaving a seizure, but at the
(11:50):
moment he's not worried aboutit.
SPEAKER_01 (11:52):
If that makes sense, like yeah, absolutely 100%.
Has he had any seizures in thelast week?
No, he hasn't had any since he'sbeen finished school.
Wow, Paige.
Yeah, huge.
And when he was in school, howmany seizures would he have?
Every day.
Every day.
(12:13):
Was it at a particular time ofday, like in the afternoon, in
the morning?
SPEAKER_02 (12:17):
Uh it was it typically at school when they
would ring me and they would saythat he's he's seizing again,
like you have to do you want himto stay, you're gonna come get
him.
Like, yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (12:27):
And were they like the big ones, grandma, or were
they petite?
SPEAKER_02 (12:30):
Uh no, so he has absence seizures and atonic
seizures.
SPEAKER_01 (12:36):
So his atonic seizures are he'll either just
go completely limp, he'll justbe sitting there, he'll just
like flop, or he will like sayhe's running, he'll just drop,
and he won't say you'll knowit's a seizure because he won't
save himself, so he'll justsplat like his nervous system is
(12:59):
so overwhelmed, it actuallystops, it just shuts off his
body, right?
Yeah, so I've heard aboutcatatonia.
Have you heard of catatonia?
That's when someone is likereally stuck.
I guess I'm not sure.
That's not my area, but I'veseen I've had some clients with
(13:22):
catatonia where they're justreally stuck and they can't
move, they can't get up.
You know, is it something likethat, or or does it does it like
he'll drop and then like half anhour later he's okay?
SPEAKER_02 (13:37):
Uh yeah, so he'll drop, and normally within like a
max 30 seconds or something,he'll come to.
And he'll kind of he'll come outof it.
And sometimes he's alright,sometimes he will just get up as
if nothing's happened and go.
Sometimes he'll cry, sometimeshe'll be really tired.
(13:58):
It just depends, like every itcan be different every time.
SPEAKER_01 (14:03):
So basically, his brain has got activity that it
can't bear, and that's when itshuts down.
So there's been none of that gotnot one during his um schooling,
deschooling phase.
SPEAKER_02 (14:18):
No, no, and then so before all of this kind of
started happening at school, sohe had kindy not last year, the
year before, and then to termlike the end of term two last
year.
So we had a year and a halfwhere he didn't have well, we
(14:41):
had nearly 12 months where hedidn't have any seizures.
And we had like yep, so I so heI think he he did have a couple
at Kindi.
So, but within a year and ahalf, he only had a couple of
seizures.
Um, like, and literally, likeI'm I'm talking two or three,
like not many at all, over awhole year and a half.
(15:03):
And I think that was where hedid have a couple was in the
first half of Kindi when it waskind of, you know, he was
transitioning.
Yep.
Um, and it was hot.
That could have literally justbeen heat that triggered those.
But then there was 12 months,like nearly 12 months, where he
had none once he was settledinto Kindi.
(15:24):
And yeah, he was going reallywell.
SPEAKER_01 (15:26):
And then you said like last year, term two, that's
when things changed in hisclass.
SPEAKER_02 (15:32):
There were more so it's like yeah, end of term two,
the well, like they had thetransitions for the mid-year
intake and then mid-year intakein term three, and well, it all
went belly up from there, yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (15:45):
And that's when there were quite a few seizures.
Yes, yeah.
SPEAKER_02 (15:49):
So that's when they started again, yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (15:51):
Yeah, yeah.
Wow, wow.
And when you talk about CBD oil,is there anyone that has
prescribed that for you, or isthat something you guys have
read?
And what what how does thatwork?
How does that work?
SPEAKER_02 (16:07):
We haven't successfully found anyone to
prescribe it to us yet.
There's only certain doctorsthat are allowed to prescribe
it.
So unfortunately, Oakland'spediatrician is not one of them.
He's not on the registered listto prescribe it.
We are in discussion withOakland, has seen two
(16:27):
neurologists, so one on thepublic system and one in the
private system.
The lady, the neurologist thatis seen in the private system.
She, I have spoken to her, sheis willing to prescribe it, but
she's not willing to prescribeit until April because she's
going on maternity leave inDecember.
So she doesn't want to start himon it and then not have anyone
(16:49):
to like contact, oversee itwhile she's on that leave.
Um so we I've also I also amgoing to speak to his
neurologist in the publicsystem.
However, she's off on leave atthe moment, she's severely hurt
herself.
So we have an appointment withher in December.
So I will speak to her about it,but I'm not sure if she'll
(17:12):
prescribe it because apparentlyin the public sector they have
very strict guidelines aboutwhen they're allowed to
prescribe it or when they're notallowed to prescribe it.
So we Oakland may not fit withinthose guidelines.
SPEAKER_01 (17:25):
And is it different for adults and children?
I'm not sure.
We're not sure that could be thecase.
And it does say, I know thatI've read about it, and it does
talk about that it really needsto be overseen by healthcare
professionals.
So don't just go and get it.
And and the other thing theytalk about is the type of
(17:45):
product that you have, you know,like it's gonna be the right
thing, it's gotta be the rightthing for the person.
SPEAKER_02 (17:52):
A lot of advice that I've been given for because
Oakland is a child, is don't getanything with THC in it.
So THC is the I want to get thisright, is part of it that I
don't know how to say thispolitically correct, so just
(18:14):
excuse me, I'm just gonna say ithow it is because I'm a bit
blunt like that, is the partthat gets you high.
Yeah.
So that you obviously from youdon't want that, so you that
needs to be extracted and it'sthe CBD that you want.
Okay, yeah.
Yeah.
Uh I'm not explaining that verywell, but just go and have a
look if you're interested.
SPEAKER_01 (18:34):
Oh, it's psychoactive THC.
THC is psychoactive and it makesyou high.
Yeah, so you've got to bereally, really, and the side
effects of that could becognitive effect, it could have
dependency risks and yes,increase the anxiety.
Yeah.
SPEAKER_02 (18:50):
Whereas when it's CBD, that you you take away a
lot of that.
SPEAKER_01 (18:55):
Yeah.
So now I want to get into themedical professionals that you
guys.
So you've said you've got aneurologist, pediatrician, GP.
What about a psychiatrist?
SPEAKER_02 (19:08):
So, no, we haven't explored the idea of an ex a
psychiatrist for Oakland yet.
It is something that we aregoing to look for look for in
the near future.
We've been lucky enough thatOakland's pediatrician is
amazing and he has managedOakland's medication quite
happily until now.
But definitely when we see himat the end of November, we will
(19:28):
be talking about the possibilityof bringing in a psychiatrist
because we we feel like we'vecome to the end of the line of
what his pediatrician can helpus with.
We've tried all the things, andyou know, now we're wanting to
explore things such as CBD thathis pediatrician can't help
with.
So we will look at potentiallygoing down that route.
SPEAKER_01 (19:51):
And I guess why I'm asking is that tomorrow at the
PDA, inaugural PDA conferencehere in Perth, when I'm looking
at the program, there is quite afew, or there's a couple at
least, psychiatrists presenting.
And one that's presenting, who'sthe chief psychiatrist of WA,
(20:13):
Dr.
Nathan Gibson, he's presentingon the impact of PDA on mental
health.
So that will be reallyinteresting.
And then there's anotherpsychiatrist that's presenting
on the psychopharmacology updateof children with PDA.
And I guess, like for me, I keepand I had Bianca on who has
(20:35):
bipolar and autism and ADHD, andshe was talking about her
psychiatrist and how importanther psychiatrist was for her,
well, healing, it's it's notrecovery, but for her management
of her of her abilities,capabilities.
So, you know, I'm just thinking,are there any psychiatrists that
(21:01):
you know of in Adelaide thatcould be helpful for someone
like Oakland?
Unfortunately, I haven't comeacross any.
SPEAKER_02 (21:09):
From what I've heard, it's really hard to find
a pediatric psychiatrist inAdelaide.
But like I said, it is somethingthat I will look into.
And we are willing to gointerstate, like we have gone
interstate before for medicalthings.
Um, and I guess that ties inreally well with the fact that
we are going to be travelingAustralia next year, so we will
(21:32):
be able to, you know, maybe makeit work for different places
that we're in if there's someonethat we really want to see.
But I will be getting moreinformation from Oakland's
pediatrician on that when we seehim at the end of this month and
just see who he recommends.
SPEAKER_01 (21:47):
Yeah, exactly.
And I think, wouldn't it bewonderful if he knew of someone
that is a pediatricianpsychiatrist interstate, and he
could actually work with themand with you, you know, so you
could do that.
Absolutely.
And maybe because there isdual-trained pediatrician and
psychiatrist also presentingtomorrow, and maybe this would
(22:11):
be something good to give toyour pediatrician, like the
digital access to thisconference.
So someone like yourpediatrician could actually
access these doctors presentingabout the latest research in
pediatric.
I'm sure that our pediatricianwill he's probably there to be
honest.
SPEAKER_02 (22:30):
If not, he will he will be watching it.
But yeah, if if he happened tonot, I will ask him about it.
Um, but I'd be very surprised ifhe's not there.
SPEAKER_01 (22:38):
Yeah, uh, it'll be really, really interesting,
won't it?
Um, so Paige, how have you beenlooking after yourself?
I can see your eyebrows arebeautifully done.
So thank you.
Beautifying of your eyebrows,which is really important.
Some pampering.
SPEAKER_02 (22:58):
I did.
I went and had my eyebrowsmicrobladed on Saturday.
It was one of my little like, itwas my thing I wanted to do for
me before we went away.
I just don't like having myeyebrows done, and I normally
just go and get them like tintedand waxed or whatever, but
obviously when you're on theroad, that's harder, it's harder
(23:20):
to do that, and also it ends upbeing more expensive anyway.
So I went and I it was reallycool actually the way that this
happened.
So I got recommended this ladynear where I live, and so I rung
her and we you know had a goodchat.
I booked in and then I went andlooked, looked on her Instagram,
and I was like, I recognize thislady, and but for the life of
(23:42):
me, I could not work out wherefrom, but her face just looked
familiar.
Then I walked in and she's like,Paige, I'm like, yeah, she's
like, I know you, and I waslike, Oh my god, I know you too.
Where?
How?
Like, I don't understand.
She's like, I reckon I came toone of your events.
So back when I used to docollaborative events with
(24:02):
someone, and she was one oftheir clients, and she came to
one of our events years ago, buther hair's changed now, like she
looked completely different.
Um, but I still recognized herface.
Um, and it turns out she is mumof an autistic child, and she is
recently diagnosed herself.
So I just loved that it was likea full circle moment, and I was
(24:24):
supporting anotherneurodivergent woman in business
as well.
Uh, it was so cool, and we justfelt so comfortable there with
each other, just chatting andjust like getting each other's
little books, you know, it wascool.
SPEAKER_01 (24:35):
Yeah, yeah.
And you know, there is thatwhole uh theory about energy and
frequencies, and we areattracted to like-minded,
like-purpose people, right?
And that's how you and I met,right?
Yeah, so tell me, for I do notknow anything about eyebrows.
(24:56):
What is micro blading?
That sounds like someone skatingover your eyebrows.
That sounds painful.
What is that?
Yeah, look, I don't know how toexplain it.
SPEAKER_02 (25:09):
I I guess it's it's it's not a tattoo, but it it
lasts like a year.
Okay.
So yeah, she uses it, almostlooks like a like a scalpel.
Okay.
And they just kind of likescratch and the I don't know how
to explain it.
I'm really bad at this.
I just go and say, yeah, like dowhat's gonna last me a year.
SPEAKER_01 (25:32):
So microblading, I'm just reading up on my my on my
Google.
Microblading is a semi-permanentcosmetic tattoo that creates the
look of fuller shaped eyebrows,right?
And it usually takes two tothree hours for the first
session, and four to eight weekslater, a short touch-up.
And the results last 12 to 24months.
(25:55):
Wow, depending on type andaftercare.
Wow, thanks, Paige.
I had no idea that somethinglike that existed, even so
amazing, so amazing.
Yes, I can see you're soexpressive with your new
eyebrows, they look great.
What does Oakland think?
Does he does he see them or not?
SPEAKER_02 (26:16):
He hates them whenever I get my eyebrows done.
Whenever I he's like, Oh, notagain, get away from me.
I hate them.
He goes, I like your normalface.
Bless him.
SPEAKER_01 (26:30):
And that's probably because there's a lot of emotion
in the eyebrows, right?
Because when I look at you now,I mean, people can't see you
right now, but you've got a lotof emotion because you can
really see the eyebrows raisingand going down and all sorts of
things.
So he probably focuses on theeyebrows and not the eyes,
right?
Yeah, yes.
(26:51):
Wow.
SPEAKER_02 (26:52):
He does not like them at all.
He gets very frustrating.
SPEAKER_01 (26:56):
Can he look at your can he look at your face when
you've had them done?
SPEAKER_02 (27:02):
He will, but not not like he'll he will avoid it.
He will look at me, but he willavoid it for a little while,
only a couple of hours orwhatever, and then he'll get
used to it, and then it's likeit kind of just becomes the new
normal and he forgets.
SPEAKER_01 (27:16):
Yeah, that's right.
It's like if you've got yourhair colored or hair cut or
anything like that, right?
SPEAKER_02 (27:22):
He says to me, he said to me on Saturday night,
yes, I had them done onSaturday, he was don't worry,
mummy, me still love you, evenif you have bad eyebrows.
SPEAKER_01 (27:32):
Sorry, I had to clap there.
I love it.
And you know what they say, outof the mouths of babes.
Yeah, literally.
Oh bless, oh bless.
So, Paige, is there anythingelse you want to catch us up on?
What is happening in yourbusiness this week after you
launched your wonderful new uhproducts and services?
(27:55):
What is going on in Inclusivo?
SPEAKER_02 (27:58):
So I've just got my my membership, the Inclusion
Collective, and we've added somedads into the group this week,
which is really exciting.
Wow.
We had our coffee catch up,which was awesome.
I got to see some beautifulmums, and it's just really nice.
We've made like a the dads havea group chat and us mums have
one, and then we have a groupone.
I booked in the masterclassesfor this month and next month.
(28:24):
Yeah, it's just all reallyexciting.
Just really kind of just gettinginto the swing of the way that
it works now because it'sslightly different.
I read I had ran our liveeducation call the other night,
which was really good.
Yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (28:40):
So with dads, do you support the dads as well, or
does hubby support the dads?
SPEAKER_02 (28:46):
So I'm not in the dads group chat, however, I can
support the dads like witheducation and stuff like that.
Yeah, absolutely happy tosupport them.
We're gonna do some like dad'scatch-ups, and my husband will
run those.
So there'll be certain thingsthat my husband will run, and
then certain things that I canstill help the dads with if they
wanted to understand certainthings.
SPEAKER_01 (29:07):
Because tomorrow in the afternoon at the PDA
conference, there's a wholething about supporting dads of
PDAers.
And one is PDA Parent AdminSupport Group, PDA Dads, What
Really Works.
And the other one is by DarrenBrandes, he's the executive
general manager and registeredpsychologist, a PDA parent, and
(29:29):
he's presenting on PDA Dads, TheProfessional Perspective.
So I think this conference willbe for you, Paige.
And I'm definitely going to belistening, that's for sure.
I think that'll be great.
And I guess the other thing ishow do you fit in looking after
Oakland and you know, havingyour coffee catch ups?
(29:51):
Are your coffee catch ups onlineor are they face to face?
SPEAKER_02 (29:55):
Uh so my coffee catch ups are face to face once
a month.
And I Work it in so that they'reon the Wednesday once like so.
My husband has one Wednesday offa fortnight to look after
Oakland, and what I've done iswork that in with when the
coffee catch up is on a monthlybasis.
(30:15):
Okay.
SPEAKER_01 (30:16):
So when you're on the road, when you're on the
road, will you online the coffeecatch-ups?
Like, are they all going to gettogether?
Because there might be peoplethat are listening page that are
all over Australia and they'dlove to be at your coffee
catch-ups.
So are you going to have, Iguess my question is, are you
going to have an online coffeecatch up?
SPEAKER_02 (30:38):
Uh so at this stage, no.
Uh, but what I'm gonna do, sofor the mums that are in
Adelaide or the the parents andcarers that are in Adelaide,
sorry, I'm so used to sayingmums.
Uh for the coffee catch-ups arefor any parent or carer that
that's in the membership.
So I'll still organise the datesfor Adelaide and they'll still
(31:01):
go ahead face to face so thatthey can all still catch up.
And then I will join via likeFaceTime so I can still catch up
with everybody.
But what I plan on doing for nowis in every kind of I guess
place that I am for a week ormore, I'm going to post in the
community Facebook groups aboutthe inclusion collective,
(31:25):
explain who I am, and see ifthere's any parents of autistic
kids that want to catch up,however, that may look.
SPEAKER_01 (31:32):
Oh, that'll be amazing.
So I'm just going to do thatlike all around Australia.
Amazing.
Like having a real face-to-facewith Paige Carter, wherever you
are, whether you're in PortLincoln, Sejuna, Perth,
Brisbane.
SPEAKER_02 (31:48):
So I guess I've already connected, you know,
because I've had my page forfive years now.
So over those five years, I'veconnected with lots of people
around the country.
And there's some that I've Italk to regularly.
So there's some that I'm reallylooking forward to catching up
with, and then hopefully theirfriends will like that.
(32:11):
They'll, you know, will want tocome and we can do a bit of a
you know, coffee catch-upsaround around Australia.
SPEAKER_01 (32:17):
Are you going to be just on the mainland or are you
going to Tasmania as well?
SPEAKER_02 (32:21):
Uh no, not doing Tassie this time.
SPEAKER_01 (32:24):
Sorry, Tasmanians, we love you.
But not this time.
Yeah, not this time.
Doesn't mean we won't get there.
SPEAKER_02 (32:31):
Right.
SPEAKER_00 (32:32):
Um, but Rob doesn't have to see.
SPEAKER_02 (32:35):
There's only so much you can see in 11 months.
So that's right.
That's right, absolutely.
Yeah.
But we do have the connectionand clarity calls in uh in oh I
nearly said empower her in theinclusion collective.
So they are calls where you cancome on literally just to sit
and have a coffee and have achat, or you can come on and ask
(32:56):
questions, or going like gainclarity about something, or get
one of those things off yourto-do list that you've been
putting off and you need a bodydouble.
But those calls are whatever youneed them to be.
So, like for people that arearound Australia that want to
connect, they would be kindprobably what you would be more
(33:18):
likely to join online as acoffee catch up, potentially.
Yeah, quite unit.
I run them twice.
SPEAKER_01 (33:26):
And if you don't drink coffee twice a month, and
if you don't drink coffee,that's okay.
You can have a water catch-up,you can have a tea.
I don't drink coffee.
I don't drink coffee, I justcall it a coffee catch-up.
Love it, I love it.
Thank you so much again, Paige.
I can't wait to talk to you nextweek because I'm going to be
coming in with all these ideasto discuss with you.
(33:50):
And hopefully, you'll have seena couple of these sessions as
well, and we can start pullingapart some of this stuff that
has been on the PDA conferencetomorrow.
And what I love, it's theinaugural one, which means it's
the first one.
And I think it's interestingthat it is in Perth.
(34:11):
And I think it's in Perthbecause PDA Perth hosting it.
And, you know, they're they'resaying that they're connecting
over 700 adult PDAs, parents andcarers, school and home
educators, pediatricians,psychiatrists, GPs, health
professionals, academics, andstudents.
So I am really looking forwardto this.
(34:33):
And maybe one year it will be inAdelaide, Paige, where you
posted in Adelaide.
Sarah, love it.
Yeah, she's I think she's on apanel tomorrow as well, so it'll
be interesting to see.
So exciting.
So thank you, Paige.
And I'll let you go for theevening.
And I look forward to hearingwhat is in store for you next
(34:56):
week.
You and I clearly chat then andhubby.
Okay, see you.
Bye.
Thanks.
Bye.
Hi everyone, and welcome to week five of Paige
Carter's from Inclusive OakUnschooling series.
Paige Carter is a parent,advocate, champion, amazing mum
of two children with PDA, one ofwhom is not attending school
(00:25):
this term, and we're followingher journey with Oakland.
And I'm a speech pathologist whogeeks out on PDA.
And why I say that is becausePaige and I were just having a
chat before we started thispodcast, and we started talking
everything about PDA.
And I said, let's stop and let'sstart talking on the podcast.
(00:48):
Welcome, Paige Carter.
Thank you so much for having meagain.
So, Paige, I want to know.
Week five coming into oh, it'smid-November.
The Christmas pageant has justbeen.
So Christmas season is starting.
How are you guys faring?
SPEAKER_02 (01:08):
We're okay.
This week has just been a bitboring, really.
Oakland is really just likeplainest iPad, plain's
PlayStation, just really justwanting to chill out.
Nothing much has changed here,but we're good.
We're just preparing for ourtrip.
It's all getting very close andjust yeah, just taking day by
(01:29):
day.
Have you packed the house yet orwhere are you at with that?
Uh yep.
So we've gone through like allof the cupboards and everything.
Everything left out is eitherstuff that we really need or
it's going in our caravan.
So it's just like really likethe big furniture, like TVs and
stuff like that we need left.
(01:50):
So yeah, it we're we're if wehad to, we could pack up and be
gone within a couple of days.
SPEAKER_01 (01:56):
And where are you going to be putting your
furniture?
Are you going to be putting itin storage or just leaving it in
the house?
SPEAKER_02 (02:02):
No, so we have a big shed on our property, so we are
not including the shed in therental and we're storing it in
there.
SPEAKER_01 (02:09):
Yeah, okay.
So can do you think that Oaklandsees a difference in his
environment?
SPEAKER_02 (02:18):
Not so much yet, not hugely, because all the things
that he uses and he findscomfort in it are all still
there.
unknown (02:28):
Right.
SPEAKER_02 (02:28):
But he will also come this time next week.
So next weekend's the bigweekend when we start moving the
bigger stuff, and then he'll hewill start to get a little bit
upset by it, I think maybe.
Well, I don't know if he'll getupset.
As long as we don't take hisPlayStation and his TV, I think
he'll be sweet.
SPEAKER_01 (02:46):
So how are the transitions going to get Lacey
to school?
Is are they still difficult?
SPEAKER_02 (02:54):
Yeah, still the same.
I don't, yeah, I don't reallyhaven't come up with an answer
of how to make them easier.
But yeah, we just we I think Ijust brace myself, we just know
it's coming and try and dealwith it the best we can.
And just try and limit theamount of times like you know, I
do the school drop-off, but thenI don't expect him to go
(03:16):
anywhere else and come in thecar anywhere else with me during
the day.
Because I know that thattransitioning from home to the
car and back again is hard.
So I just limit it as much as Ican.
SPEAKER_01 (03:27):
Yeah, right.
So before we started thisepisode, you said, Do you want
to talk about somethingcontroversial?
And I said, Yes, always.
And I said, What is it?
And you said we are looking atstarting Oakland on CBD oil.
Okay, so sorry about this,everyone.
I'm in a hotel in Perth, andthere is a lot of traffic
(03:51):
outside, and I can't, you know,I can't erase it or anything.
So what Paige said was, you'rethinking about starting Oakland
on CBD oil, is that right?
Correct, yes.
So why is this controversial?
Tell me.
SPEAKER_02 (04:06):
Um, I think obviously it's you know, it's
made from a drug that isillegal, right?
SPEAKER_01 (04:13):
Like tell people who don't know what CBD oil is, what
is it exactly?
SPEAKER_02 (04:19):
Okay, so it's extracted from marijuana, is the
I guess the easiest, mostsimple, blunt way to explain it.
But it's not very well known forhaving good medical modalities
to it if it's used in the rightway.
(04:40):
So we're we're consideringtrying it for him because we
feel like we've tried everythingelse.
I think I did say last week he'snow refusing to take his epilom,
which is his seizure meds, andhe's not on any like ADHD meds
or anything like that because wecan't find anything that works
(05:01):
for him.
He was on Respiridone, which wecalled his magic med, and we
loved it.
It was great for him, but hejust outgrew it and it no longer
worked for him after being on itfor four and a half years.
SPEAKER_01 (05:12):
So his his uh nervous system habituated to it,
is that right?
SPEAKER_02 (05:17):
Yeah, um, well, yeah, so we used to up the dose
every six months.
We'd go to his pediatrician, andhis pediatrician managed that
for us.
And then it got to a stage whereone, he put on a lot of weight
on Respiridone, a lot of weight,it was concerning.
And also it got to the pointwhere we used to up, obviously,
(05:40):
like I said, every six months,but then it got to a point where
two months in and we desperatelyneed to up it again.
Um, so it just wasn't havingthat like that lasting effect
anymore.
And the more we up it, you know,the worse it was for him.
Um, so yeah, his pediatricianjust said, like, this is when
like when we get to this pointis when it's not working
(06:04):
anymore.
So we had to take him off of it,but we have not found
successfully anything else thatworks for him.
We've tried Dex, we've triedRitalin, we've tried Bivance,
we've tried intuitivecaterpress, all the things we've
tried them and what else?
New Lactol, we've tried lots ofdifferent things, nothing works.
(06:25):
Um it's yeah, it either just hasno effect on him or it makes him
really, really angry um andkeeps him up all night and you
know, all those sorts of things.
So it just seems like CBD oil issomething that we haven't tried.
Um and it's we thought it wasgood because CBD oil is well
(06:47):
known for treating epilepsy aswell as aggressive behaviours.
So why not give him one thingthat helps him with two of the
things that he needs medicationfor?
SPEAKER_01 (06:57):
Yeah.
And you mentioned earlier thathe's no longer wanting to take
his seizure medication.
What's that about?
How, why, and how do you know,and and things like that?
SPEAKER_02 (07:08):
I I feel like it's a PDA thing.
I feel like he it's the demandof taking it, he's been taking
it for so long.
He we know he doesn't want totake it because he'll just throw
it at you.
And so he took, he was supposedto take 15 mil of it twice a
day.
Um, and the demand, I think, oflike us giving it to him and him
all he he's really strugglingwith eating at the moment.
(07:30):
So him having to eat before hetakes it, and there was just so
many things that he had to do.
So, yeah, it's just so whatcouldn't get him to consistently
take it.
So we spoke to his neurologist,and she just ended up taking him
off of it because it's one ofthose meds where, unless you're
taking it consistently, then youshouldn't be taking it.
SPEAKER_01 (07:52):
Right.
And is that like a capsule youneed to swallow or anything like
that?
SPEAKER_02 (07:56):
So it's it's medicine and it's with a taste,
yes, with a taste, and it's it'sred and thick.
SPEAKER_01 (08:04):
Uh-huh.
So that could be difficult aswell.
So, what's gonna be thedifference around his demand
avoidance of taking then CBDoil?
SPEAKER_02 (08:15):
Uh, so CBD oil is just a couple of drops, so it's
it's not like he wouldn't haveto take like 15 mil of it.
And with it being a couple ofdrop drops, something that the
urologist said, and you know,this isn't me recommending for
anyone to do this.
This is just what we were toldis a way to do it, is you just
put that couple of drops on likea piece of bread, and you just
(08:38):
give them that to eat ratherthan them actually having to be
like right now, it's time foryour meds.
It kind of makes that demand alittle bit easier.
SPEAKER_01 (08:47):
And do you will he know that he's taking the CBD
oil?
Will you let him know?
Yeah, because absolutelyaffirming, right?
That's about that's newer.
Absolutely.
SPEAKER_02 (08:57):
Yeah, it's not like tricking.
I think it no, we we don't wantto trick him, and we'll be very
open and honest with him aboutit to his ability of
understanding it.
But I think so.
When he was on Respiridone, heknew that Respiridone made him
feel better.
He liked taking it and he and hewas always happy to take that.
We never had issues getting himto take that.
(09:21):
So I feel like if he sees thatit does make him feel better, if
it works, you know, we haven'ttried it yet, we don't know if
it's gonna work, but if it doeswork and he sees it does make
him feel a lot better, then itmight he might just willingly
like want to take it.
SPEAKER_01 (09:39):
And I've read research around children who are
fussy eaters, and often childrenwho are fussy eaters are the
ones that have got gut issues,and they almost know intuitively
what food is going to make themfeel uncomfortable, whether it's
gassy, whether it's constipated,whether it's nauseous.
(10:03):
And I really believe childrencan feel, because that's the
introspie, right?
Children can feel when somethingis okay in their body and when
something is not okay, just likeyeah, yeah, definitely.
SPEAKER_02 (10:20):
So and I think so it does make sense that he's now
stopped wanting to take hisepilom, um, which is the seizure
medication, because so he's notat school, and so stressful
environments are reallytriggering for his epilepsy.
So we've taken out the stressfulenvironment, and also the heat
(10:40):
is a trigger for his epilepsy,it's not hot at the moment, so
we've taken away the two maintriggers for his seizures.
So he's in his mind, he's like,Well, I'm not gonna have a
seizure because it's not hot andI and I don't feel stressed.
So, like I know his his nervoussystem is stressed, like I get
that, but he doesn't feel he'snot in a stressful environment
(11:04):
for hours on end during the day.
So I think in his mind, he'slike, Well, I don't need it
because like he doesn't have theunderstanding that I need to
take that every day.
In his mind, he's like, Well, Idon't feel like I'm not in
situations where I feel like I'mgonna have a seizure, so I don't
need it.
Like a cause-effect, right?
Yeah, cause effect.
So whereas if he because when hewas at school, he would
(11:27):
willingly take it and he wouldeven say, like, Mom, I haven't
had my meds yet.
Because he's he gets scared ofhaving a seizure.
He doesn't want to have it.
So I do predict that once itstarts getting warmer and we
take off on our trip and we'respending a lot more time
outside, that he may ask me forit.
He may say, Mom, I haven't hadmy meds.
Um, because he is worried abouthaving a seizure, but at the
(11:50):
moment he's not worried aboutit.
SPEAKER_01 (11:52):
If that makes sense, like yeah, absolutely 100%.
Has he had any seizures in thelast week?
No, he hasn't had any since he'sbeen finished school.
Wow, Paige.
Yeah, huge.
And when he was in school, howmany seizures would he have?
Every day.
Every day.
(12:13):
Was it at a particular time ofday, like in the afternoon, in
the morning?
SPEAKER_02 (12:17):
Uh it was it typically at school when they
would ring me and they would saythat he's he's seizing again,
like you have to do you want himto stay, you're gonna come get
him.
Like, yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (12:27):
And were they like the big ones, grandma, or were
they petite?
SPEAKER_02 (12:30):
Uh no, so he has absence seizures and atonic
seizures.
SPEAKER_01 (12:36):
So his atonic seizures are he'll either just
go completely limp, he'll justbe sitting there, he'll just
like flop, or he will like sayhe's running, he'll just drop,
and he won't say you'll knowit's a seizure because he won't
save himself, so he'll justsplat like his nervous system is
(12:59):
so overwhelmed, it actuallystops, it just shuts off his
body, right?
Yeah, so I've heard aboutcatatonia.
Have you heard of catatonia?
That's when someone is likereally stuck.
I guess I'm not sure.
That's not my area, but I'veseen I've had some clients with
(13:22):
catatonia where they're justreally stuck and they can't
move, they can't get up.
You know, is it something likethat, or or does it does it like
he'll drop and then like half anhour later he's okay?
SPEAKER_02 (13:37):
Uh yeah, so he'll drop, and normally within like a
max 30 seconds or something,he'll come to.
And he'll kind of he'll come outof it.
And sometimes he's alright,sometimes he will just get up as
if nothing's happened and go.
Sometimes he'll cry, sometimeshe'll be really tired.
(13:58):
It just depends, like every itcan be different every time.
SPEAKER_01 (14:03):
So basically, his brain has got activity that it
can't bear, and that's when itshuts down.
So there's been none of that gotnot one during his um schooling,
deschooling phase.
SPEAKER_02 (14:18):
No, no, and then so before all of this kind of
started happening at school, sohe had kindy not last year, the
year before, and then to termlike the end of term two last
year.
So we had a year and a halfwhere he didn't have well, we
(14:41):
had nearly 12 months where hedidn't have any seizures.
And we had like yep, so I so heI think he he did have a couple
at Kindi.
So, but within a year and ahalf, he only had a couple of
seizures.
Um, like, and literally, likeI'm I'm talking two or three,
like not many at all, over awhole year and a half.
(15:03):
And I think that was where hedid have a couple was in the
first half of Kindi when it waskind of, you know, he was
transitioning.
Yep.
Um, and it was hot.
That could have literally justbeen heat that triggered those.
But then there was 12 months,like nearly 12 months, where he
had none once he was settledinto Kindi.
(15:24):
And yeah, he was going reallywell.
SPEAKER_01 (15:26):
And then you said like last year, term two, that's
when things changed in hisclass.
SPEAKER_02 (15:32):
There were more so it's like yeah, end of term two,
the well, like they had thetransitions for the mid-year
intake and then mid-year intakein term three, and well, it all
went belly up from there, yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (15:45):
And that's when there were quite a few seizures.
Yes, yeah.
SPEAKER_02 (15:49):
So that's when they started again, yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (15:51):
Yeah, yeah.
Wow, wow.
And when you talk about CBD oil,is there anyone that has
prescribed that for you, or isthat something you guys have
read?
And what what how does thatwork?
How does that work?
SPEAKER_02 (16:07):
We haven't successfully found anyone to
prescribe it to us yet.
There's only certain doctorsthat are allowed to prescribe
it.
So unfortunately, Oakland'spediatrician is not one of them.
He's not on the registered listto prescribe it.
We are in discussion withOakland, has seen two
(16:27):
neurologists, so one on thepublic system and one in the
private system.
The lady, the neurologist thatis seen in the private system.
She, I have spoken to her, sheis willing to prescribe it, but
she's not willing to prescribeit until April because she's
going on maternity leave inDecember.
So she doesn't want to start himon it and then not have anyone
(16:49):
to like contact, oversee itwhile she's on that leave.
Um so we I've also I also amgoing to speak to his
neurologist in the publicsystem.
However, she's off on leave atthe moment, she's severely hurt
herself.
So we have an appointment withher in December.
So I will speak to her about it,but I'm not sure if she'll
(17:12):
prescribe it because apparentlyin the public sector they have
very strict guidelines aboutwhen they're allowed to
prescribe it or when they're notallowed to prescribe it.
So we Oakland may not fit withinthose guidelines.
SPEAKER_01 (17:25):
And is it different for adults and children?
I'm not sure.
We're not sure that could be thecase.
And it does say, I know thatI've read about it, and it does
talk about that it really needsto be overseen by healthcare
professionals.
So don't just go and get it.
And and the other thing theytalk about is the type of
(17:45):
product that you have, you know,like it's gonna be the right
thing, it's gotta be the rightthing for the person.
SPEAKER_02 (17:52):
A lot of advice that I've been given for because
Oakland is a child, is don't getanything with THC in it.
So THC is the I want to get thisright, is part of it that I
don't know how to say thispolitically correct, so just
(18:14):
excuse me, I'm just gonna say ithow it is because I'm a bit
blunt like that, is the partthat gets you high.
Yeah.
So that you obviously from youdon't want that, so you that
needs to be extracted and it'sthe CBD that you want.
Okay, yeah.
Yeah.
Uh I'm not explaining that verywell, but just go and have a
look if you're interested.
SPEAKER_01 (18:34):
Oh, it's psychoactive THC.
THC is psychoactive and it makesyou high.
Yeah, so you've got to bereally, really, and the side
effects of that could becognitive effect, it could have
dependency risks and yes,increase the anxiety.
Yeah.
SPEAKER_02 (18:50):
Whereas when it's CBD, that you you take away a
lot of that.
SPEAKER_01 (18:55):
Yeah.
So now I want to get into themedical professionals that you
guys.
So you've said you've got aneurologist, pediatrician, GP.
What about a psychiatrist?
SPEAKER_02 (19:08):
So, no, we haven't explored the idea of an ex a
psychiatrist for Oakland yet.
It is something that we aregoing to look for look for in
the near future.
We've been lucky enough thatOakland's pediatrician is
amazing and he has managedOakland's medication quite
happily until now.
But definitely when we see himat the end of November, we will
(19:28):
be talking about the possibilityof bringing in a psychiatrist
because we we feel like we'vecome to the end of the line of
what his pediatrician can helpus with.
We've tried all the things, andyou know, now we're wanting to
explore things such as CBD thathis pediatrician can't help
with.
So we will look at potentiallygoing down that route.
SPEAKER_01 (19:51):
And I guess why I'm asking is that tomorrow at the
PDA, inaugural PDA conferencehere in Perth, when I'm looking
at the program, there is quite afew, or there's a couple at
least, psychiatrists presenting.
And one that's presenting, who'sthe chief psychiatrist of WA,
(20:13):
Dr.
Nathan Gibson, he's presentingon the impact of PDA on mental
health.
So that will be reallyinteresting.
And then there's anotherpsychiatrist that's presenting
on the psychopharmacology updateof children with PDA.
And I guess, like for me, I keepand I had Bianca on who has
(20:35):
bipolar and autism and ADHD, andshe was talking about her
psychiatrist and how importanther psychiatrist was for her,
well, healing, it's it's notrecovery, but for her management
of her of her abilities,capabilities.
So, you know, I'm just thinking,are there any psychiatrists that
(21:01):
you know of in Adelaide thatcould be helpful for someone
like Oakland?
Unfortunately, I haven't comeacross any.
SPEAKER_02 (21:09):
From what I've heard, it's really hard to find
a pediatric psychiatrist inAdelaide.
But like I said, it is somethingthat I will look into.
And we are willing to gointerstate, like we have gone
interstate before for medicalthings.
Um, and I guess that ties inreally well with the fact that
we are going to be travelingAustralia next year, so we will
(21:32):
be able to, you know, maybe makeit work for different places
that we're in if there's someonethat we really want to see.
But I will be getting moreinformation from Oakland's
pediatrician on that when we seehim at the end of this month and
just see who he recommends.
SPEAKER_01 (21:47):
Yeah, exactly.
And I think, wouldn't it bewonderful if he knew of someone
that is a pediatricianpsychiatrist interstate, and he
could actually work with themand with you, you know, so you
could do that.
Absolutely.
And maybe because there isdual-trained pediatrician and
psychiatrist also presentingtomorrow, and maybe this would
(22:11):
be something good to give toyour pediatrician, like the
digital access to thisconference.
So someone like yourpediatrician could actually
access these doctors presentingabout the latest research in
pediatric.
I'm sure that our pediatricianwill he's probably there to be
honest.
SPEAKER_02 (22:30):
If not, he will he will be watching it.
But yeah, if if he happened tonot, I will ask him about it.
Um, but I'd be very surprised ifhe's not there.
SPEAKER_01 (22:38):
Yeah, uh, it'll be really, really interesting,
won't it?
Um, so Paige, how have you beenlooking after yourself?
I can see your eyebrows arebeautifully done.
So thank you.
Beautifying of your eyebrows,which is really important.
Some pampering.
SPEAKER_02 (22:58):
I did.
I went and had my eyebrowsmicrobladed on Saturday.
It was one of my little like, itwas my thing I wanted to do for
me before we went away.
I just don't like having myeyebrows done, and I normally
just go and get them like tintedand waxed or whatever, but
obviously when you're on theroad, that's harder, it's harder
(23:20):
to do that, and also it ends upbeing more expensive anyway.
So I went and I it was reallycool actually the way that this
happened.
So I got recommended this ladynear where I live, and so I rung
her and we you know had a goodchat.
I booked in and then I went andlooked, looked on her Instagram,
and I was like, I recognize thislady, and but for the life of
(23:42):
me, I could not work out wherefrom, but her face just looked
familiar.
Then I walked in and she's like,Paige, I'm like, yeah, she's
like, I know you, and I waslike, Oh my god, I know you too.
Where?
How?
Like, I don't understand.
She's like, I reckon I came toone of your events.
So back when I used to docollaborative events with
(24:02):
someone, and she was one oftheir clients, and she came to
one of our events years ago, buther hair's changed now, like she
looked completely different.
Um, but I still recognized herface.
Um, and it turns out she is mumof an autistic child, and she is
recently diagnosed herself.
So I just loved that it was likea full circle moment, and I was
(24:24):
supporting anotherneurodivergent woman in business
as well.
Uh, it was so cool, and we justfelt so comfortable there with
each other, just chatting andjust like getting each other's
little books, you know, it wascool.
SPEAKER_01 (24:35):
Yeah, yeah.
And you know, there is thatwhole uh theory about energy and
frequencies, and we areattracted to like-minded,
like-purpose people, right?
And that's how you and I met,right?
Yeah, so tell me, for I do notknow anything about eyebrows.
(24:56):
What is micro blading?
That sounds like someone skatingover your eyebrows.
That sounds painful.
What is that?
Yeah, look, I don't know how toexplain it.
SPEAKER_02 (25:09):
I I guess it's it's it's not a tattoo, but it it
lasts like a year.
Okay.
So yeah, she uses it, almostlooks like a like a scalpel.
Okay.
And they just kind of likescratch and the I don't know how
to explain it.
I'm really bad at this.
I just go and say, yeah, like dowhat's gonna last me a year.
SPEAKER_01 (25:32):
So microblading, I'm just reading up on my my on my
Google.
Microblading is a semi-permanentcosmetic tattoo that creates the
look of fuller shaped eyebrows,right?
And it usually takes two tothree hours for the first
session, and four to eight weekslater, a short touch-up.
And the results last 12 to 24months.
(25:55):
Wow, depending on type andaftercare.
Wow, thanks, Paige.
I had no idea that somethinglike that existed, even so
amazing, so amazing.
Yes, I can see you're soexpressive with your new
eyebrows, they look great.
What does Oakland think?
Does he does he see them or not?
SPEAKER_02 (26:16):
He hates them whenever I get my eyebrows done.
Whenever I he's like, Oh, notagain, get away from me.
I hate them.
He goes, I like your normalface.
Bless him.
SPEAKER_01 (26:30):
And that's probably because there's a lot of emotion
in the eyebrows, right?
Because when I look at you now,I mean, people can't see you
right now, but you've got a lotof emotion because you can
really see the eyebrows raisingand going down and all sorts of
things.
So he probably focuses on theeyebrows and not the eyes,
right?
Yeah, yes.
(26:51):
Wow.
SPEAKER_02 (26:52):
He does not like them at all.
He gets very frustrating.
SPEAKER_01 (26:56):
Can he look at your can he look at your face when
you've had them done?
SPEAKER_02 (27:02):
He will, but not not like he'll he will avoid it.
He will look at me, but he willavoid it for a little while,
only a couple of hours orwhatever, and then he'll get
used to it, and then it's likeit kind of just becomes the new
normal and he forgets.
SPEAKER_01 (27:16):
Yeah, that's right.
It's like if you've got yourhair colored or hair cut or
anything like that, right?
SPEAKER_02 (27:22):
He says to me, he said to me on Saturday night,
yes, I had them done onSaturday, he was don't worry,
mummy, me still love you, evenif you have bad eyebrows.
SPEAKER_01 (27:32):
Sorry, I had to clap there.
I love it.
And you know what they say, outof the mouths of babes.
Yeah, literally.
Oh bless, oh bless.
So, Paige, is there anythingelse you want to catch us up on?
What is happening in yourbusiness this week after you
launched your wonderful new uhproducts and services?
(27:55):
What is going on in Inclusivo?
SPEAKER_02 (27:58):
So I've just got my my membership, the Inclusion
Collective, and we've added somedads into the group this week,
which is really exciting.
Wow.
We had our coffee catch up,which was awesome.
I got to see some beautifulmums, and it's just really nice.
We've made like a the dads havea group chat and us mums have
one, and then we have a groupone.
I booked in the masterclassesfor this month and next month.
(28:24):
Yeah, it's just all reallyexciting.
Just really kind of just gettinginto the swing of the way that
it works now because it'sslightly different.
I read I had ran our liveeducation call the other night,
which was really good.
Yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (28:40):
So with dads, do you support the dads as well, or
does hubby support the dads?
SPEAKER_02 (28:46):
So I'm not in the dads group chat, however, I can
support the dads like witheducation and stuff like that.
Yeah, absolutely happy tosupport them.
We're gonna do some like dad'scatch-ups, and my husband will
run those.
So there'll be certain thingsthat my husband will run, and
then certain things that I canstill help the dads with if they
wanted to understand certainthings.
SPEAKER_01 (29:07):
Because tomorrow in the afternoon at the PDA
conference, there's a wholething about supporting dads of
PDAers.
And one is PDA Parent AdminSupport Group, PDA Dads, What
Really Works.
And the other one is by DarrenBrandes, he's the executive
general manager and registeredpsychologist, a PDA parent, and
(29:29):
he's presenting on PDA Dads, TheProfessional Perspective.
So I think this conference willbe for you, Paige.
And I'm definitely going to belistening, that's for sure.
I think that'll be great.
And I guess the other thing ishow do you fit in looking after
Oakland and you know, havingyour coffee catch ups?
(29:51):
Are your coffee catch ups onlineor are they face to face?
SPEAKER_02 (29:55):
Uh so my coffee catch ups are face to face once
a month.
And I Work it in so that they'reon the Wednesday once like so.
My husband has one Wednesday offa fortnight to look after
Oakland, and what I've done iswork that in with when the
coffee catch up is on a monthlybasis.
(30:15):
Okay.
SPEAKER_01 (30:16):
So when you're on the road, when you're on the
road, will you online the coffeecatch-ups?
Like, are they all going to gettogether?
Because there might be peoplethat are listening page that are
all over Australia and they'dlove to be at your coffee
catch-ups.
So are you going to have, Iguess my question is, are you
going to have an online coffeecatch up?
SPEAKER_02 (30:38):
Uh so at this stage, no.
Uh, but what I'm gonna do, sofor the mums that are in
Adelaide or the the parents andcarers that are in Adelaide,
sorry, I'm so used to sayingmums.
Uh for the coffee catch-ups arefor any parent or carer that
that's in the membership.
So I'll still organise the datesfor Adelaide and they'll still
(31:01):
go ahead face to face so thatthey can all still catch up.
And then I will join via likeFaceTime so I can still catch up
with everybody.
But what I plan on doing for nowis in every kind of I guess
place that I am for a week ormore, I'm going to post in the
community Facebook groups aboutthe inclusion collective,
(31:25):
explain who I am, and see ifthere's any parents of autistic
kids that want to catch up,however, that may look.
SPEAKER_01 (31:32):
Oh, that'll be amazing.
So I'm just going to do thatlike all around Australia.
Amazing.
Like having a real face-to-facewith Paige Carter, wherever you
are, whether you're in PortLincoln, Sejuna, Perth,
Brisbane.
SPEAKER_02 (31:48):
So I guess I've already connected, you know,
because I've had my page forfive years now.
So over those five years, I'veconnected with lots of people
around the country.
And there's some that I've Italk to regularly.
So there's some that I'm reallylooking forward to catching up
with, and then hopefully theirfriends will like that.
(32:11):
They'll, you know, will want tocome and we can do a bit of a
you know, coffee catch-upsaround around Australia.
SPEAKER_01 (32:17):
Are you going to be just on the mainland or are you
going to Tasmania as well?
SPEAKER_02 (32:21):
Uh no, not doing Tassie this time.
SPEAKER_01 (32:24):
Sorry, Tasmanians, we love you.
But not this time.
Yeah, not this time.
Doesn't mean we won't get there.
SPEAKER_02 (32:31):
Right.
SPEAKER_00 (32:32):
Um, but Rob doesn't have to see.
SPEAKER_02 (32:35):
There's only so much you can see in 11 months.
So that's right.
That's right, absolutely.
Yeah.
But we do have the connectionand clarity calls in uh in oh I
nearly said empower her in theinclusion collective.
So they are calls where you cancome on literally just to sit
and have a coffee and have achat, or you can come on and ask
(32:56):
questions, or going like gainclarity about something, or get
one of those things off yourto-do list that you've been
putting off and you need a bodydouble.
But those calls are whatever youneed them to be.
So, like for people that arearound Australia that want to
connect, they would be kindprobably what you would be more
(33:18):
likely to join online as acoffee catch up, potentially.
Yeah, quite unit.
I run them twice.
SPEAKER_01 (33:26):
And if you don't drink coffee twice a month, and
if you don't drink coffee,that's okay.
You can have a water catch-up,you can have a tea.
I don't drink coffee.
I don't drink coffee, I justcall it a coffee catch-up.
Love it, I love it.
Thank you so much again, Paige.
I can't wait to talk to you nextweek because I'm going to be
coming in with all these ideasto discuss with you.
(33:50):
And hopefully, you'll have seena couple of these sessions as
well, and we can start pullingapart some of this stuff that
has been on the PDA conferencetomorrow.
And what I love, it's theinaugural one, which means it's
the first one.
And I think it's interestingthat it is in Perth.
(34:11):
And I think it's in Perthbecause PDA Perth hosting it.
And, you know, they're they'resaying that they're connecting
over 700 adult PDAs, parents andcarers, school and home
educators, pediatricians,psychiatrists, GPs, health
professionals, academics, andstudents.
So I am really looking forwardto this.
(34:33):
And maybe one year it will be inAdelaide, Paige, where you
posted in Adelaide.
Sarah, love it.
Yeah, she's I think she's on apanel tomorrow as well, so it'll
be interesting to see.
So exciting.
So thank you, Paige.
And I'll let you go for theevening.
And I look forward to hearingwhat is in store for you next
(34:56):
week.
You and I clearly chat then andhubby.
Okay, see you.
Bye.
Thanks.
Bye.
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