Episode Summary:
The Fantastic Four (2005) film shows how gaining superpowers forces its characters to confront deep personal struggles with identity, acceptance, and responsibility. Cosmic radiation transformed four astronauts physically, but their greatest challenge wasn't Doctor Doom – it was accepting who they'd become.
Topics:
When we dive into the 2005 Fantastic Four film in our Marvel Month celebration, we're really exploring how these four characters navigate profound identity shifts after gaining their powers. The movie may be over fifteen years old, but its core message about self-acceptance resonates deeply with anyone who's experienced unwanted change.
Michael Chiklis's portrayal of Ben Grimm/The Thing serves as the emotional anchor, with his tragic struggle to accept his rocky exterior reflecting our universal fear of rejection. His character arc – from desperately seeking a cure to embracing his new form – mirrors our own journeys through acceptance.
Meanwhile, Ioan Gruffudd's Reed Richards wrestles with his scientific ambition versus his responsibility to others, Chris Evans brings charismatic energy as Johnny Storm (years before becoming Captain America), and Jessica Alba navigates Sue Storm's role as the team's emotional center despite the script's limitations.
Beyond dissecting performances, we explore how each character's power symbolizes their internal struggles: Reed stretching himself too thin, Sue feeling invisible, Johnny's fiery impulsiveness, and Ben's hardened exterior. These aren't just cool abilities – they're metaphors for human experience.
Key Takeaways:
• Ioan Gruffudd brings Reed Richards' intellectual gravitas to life despite being constantly torn between scientific pursuit and personal relationships
• Chris Evans's Johnny Storm captures the character's rebellious energy, improvisational wit, and thrill-seeking attitude as the Human Torch
• Jessica Alba portrays Sue Storm as the emotional anchor of the team despite the script's over-reliance on objectification
• Michael Chiklis delivers a standout performance as Ben Grimm/The Thing, bringing genuine pathos to his traumatic physical transformation
• The movie successfully establishes the family dynamic and interpersonal relationships that define the Fantastic Four
• Ben Grimm's journey toward self-acceptance provides the emotional core of the film
Apple Podcast Tags:
Fantastic Four 2005, Jessica Alba, Chris Evans, Ioan Gruffudd, Michael Chiklis, Marvel movies, superhero films, comic book adaptations, Sue Storm, Johnny Storm, The Thing, Mr Fantastic, Doctor Doom, Marvel Month, Fandom Portals Podcast
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:15):
Hello and welcome to the Fandom Portals podcast.
This is a podcast that exploreshow fandoms can help you learn
and grow.
We are looking at the FantasticFour movie from 2005.
It was fantastic.
Um, I'm here joined by myco-host, brash.
How you going today, brash?
Speaker 2 (00:28):
oh, not too bad.
I was going to try and come upwith more catchphrases for
fantasy four, but I realizedit's flame one and it's covering
time of the only two realcatchphrases that have, because
I don't believe that reedrichards no, they are.
Speaker 1 (00:38):
They're very serious.
Um, unless you know, acatchphrase could be sue storm,
telling reed to pull his headout of his work.
Speaker 2 (00:47):
And Reed could be saying one more minute.
Darling, I don't know.
Speaker 1 (00:49):
But yes, we are looking at the 2005 Fantastic
Four movie that was directed byTim Story, and in this movie a
group of astronauts gainsuperpowers after a cosmic
radiation exposure and they mustuse those powers to oppose the
plans of their enemy, dr VictorVon Doom.
This is the second part of ourfantastic for 2005 podcast, so
(01:09):
make sure you go and check outpart one if you haven't already.
And this is also part of ourmarvel month.
All month long we're going tobe looking at marvel material
and we also have a giveawaygoing on as well.
So during the month of marvel,brash and I have teamed up to
try and gain 15 points from ourtrivia segment, which usually
happens in in our part ones.
And if you want to win a familypass to the movies, that's
right, we'll send you to themovies on us.
(01:29):
Then all you have to do is goand join our mailing list, which
you can find atwwwbandandportalspodcastcom.
If you go to that website, youcan find where you will sign up
to our mailing list and if youwin, on the 30th of April we'll
email you a family pass for youto enjoy a movie on us, because
we love the theatre, we lovemovies and we like going to the
movies, so we wanted to extendthat to you guys as well, didn't
(01:52):
we, brash?
Oh yeah, please enjoy it on us.
That's how we do it, oh yeah,okay.
So in this podcast, guys, inthis part two, we're going to be
looking at how they performedtheir chemistry and what we hope
for Fantastic Four first stepsas well, and we're going to dive
into our popcorn perspectivesright now.
(02:12):
Alright, in this segment, wedive into standout characters
from the movie.
Each host picks their favouritecharacter and takes a close
look at why they thought thecharacter should be given your
attention.
All right, brash, the way thisis going to work is we're going
to pick a character, we're goingto talk about them and how they
were portrayed through the 2005movie, what our hopes are for
(02:33):
the Fantastic Four first steps,and then we're going to rate
their performance and theirrepresentation out of five.
Make sense, lovely, all right.
The first character that we'regoing to be doing is we're going
to be doing the man himself, mrFantastic Reed Richards, played
by Johan Griffith.
What did you think of hisperformance, brash?
Speaker 2 (02:49):
Almost perfect, I would have to say.
I thought he played the nerdywork-driven Reed Richards to a T
, like he was.
When it first came out and Isaw him on screen I was like,
hey, it's Reed Richards, that'sMr Fantastic right there, miles
(03:09):
Teller.
I love Miles Teller.
But when he came in I was like,hey, who's that guy?
Oh, oh, he was A bigger thanBen Green, yeah, and it was a
nice casting.
But 2005 casting was on point,I reckon, and Reed Richards, for
me, was absolutely brilliantand he pulled off the silver fox
(03:31):
grey hairline.
Speaker 1 (03:33):
I think it was interesting to know that Yohan
Griffith is a Welsh actor and hehad to try and put on the
American accent through themovie.
I think he did a pretty goodjob.
There are some points where youcan tell yeah, he did struggle.
Speaker 2 (03:44):
Yeah, because he kept getting new lines constantly.
He had to keep reloading newlines, trying to read those new
lines in an American accentconstantly.
Yeah, it messed him up a littlebit.
Speaker 1 (03:53):
But yeah, I think that Johan tried to aim for that
intellectual gravitas that ReedRichards has, which I think he
did kind of well.
But some people have said thathis performance was a little bit
too subdued, because you know,reed can often be seen at least
in the comic books as being verycold and calculating and
distant to his other FantasticFour family members, and I don't
(04:15):
think he was like that in thismovie.
He was actually pretty warmtowards the other members of the
Fantastic Four, or at least hepresented that leadership kind
of quality very, very well.
He always seemed like he wasreluctantly doing his work,
which is actually the true formof the comic book's version of
Reed Richards.
He's actually always in thatconstant struggle.
He's in a moral struggle allthe time, with his intellectual
(04:38):
ruthlessness of being absolutelydriven and focused to try and
make the world a better place,because he's the only one
intellectually that can do it,and also his love for his family
that needs his time, that, uh,that needs his care, that
relationship with sue that needsnurturing as well.
So he's always being pulled inso many different directions,
which is actually why he got hispowers of stretching um.
So with that in mind, I thinkthat, uh, griffith actually
(05:02):
played this pretty well, and Ithink that the only thing that
we didn't really see and we kindof see it a little bit more in
the rise of the silver surfermovie is where he's actually
being pulled in two directionsin terms of his relationship
with sue and his scientificpursuits, because in this one,
yes, he wants to cure ben somuch that's like drawing all of
his attention, but in this moviehe doesn't really have a
(05:24):
relationship with sue stormanymore.
Speaker 2 (05:26):
because, yeah, he's trying to recreate.
So in trying to help ben he'sworking for to help ben, but
then in the same vein he's alsoseeing that he's also slowly
winning back sue.
So he's sort of, yeah, doingthat bit of Tywin War and this
is one of the things I thoughtwas a bit forced in the movie
(05:50):
about that sort of dynamic forReed was that in then going and
taking that one afternoon offwith Sue, victor was able to
convince Ben.
Yeah, he doesn't like youanymore, oh yeah, and that's
that's why I, like it was wasn'table to convince Ben to.
Yeah, he doesn't like youanymore.
Oh, yeah, and that's why I wasa bit forced on Reed, whereas,
(06:12):
as you said, in the second movieit's a lot more natural because
there's a big disaster coming.
Speaker 1 (06:17):
But it's also his wedding and he's like no, I'm
going to get married Under thetable, which is exactly Reed
Richards through the comic bookrun, he's always doing the thing
that needs to be done at theexpense of his family, and that
also, yeah, sort of brings whichI don't think, uh, griffith
sort of portrayed as well as hecould have, was the, that
existential loneliness that thatkind of causes for reed, like
(06:39):
in the.
In the comic books, especiallythe hickman run between 2009,
2015, reed riches is portrayedas somebody who is going through
this internal struggle, notonly having all of these cosmic
burdens on his hands and tryingto maintain a family dynamic
where he needs closeness, butalso the fact that he is the
only one that is fighting thesebattles.
He's there with his family, butit's almost like he's fighting
(06:59):
them alone because there'snobody else that's really on his
level that he can use as anally to help him in the manner
that needs being helped.
He does portray the, the brain,in this.
He's definitely the scientificminded and he's he's also in
terms of his friendship with ben.
I don't think that is asdeveloped as it could have been
because, as you said before, youknow it, it turns on a switch
(07:20):
so quickly.
They do have a history that wesee about through their early
interactions in the 2005 movie,but I don't think it's as
in-depth as the Ben Grimm, reedRichards in the comic books,
because obviously they have moretime to develop that too.
So let's give this guy a rating.
Let's give him a rating out offive for Ewan Griffith and his
(07:41):
portrayal of Reed Richards inthe 2005 Fantastic Four movie.
What are you giving it out offive?
Brash, I was going to say three, oh, three and a half.
I think that that is verycomplimentary to his portrayal
and also its comic bookaccurateness with the story and
the time that we were given inthis almost two-hour movie.
Speaker 2 (08:00):
It was a pretty good read yeah, because it's hard to
do anything within it was justthe constraint of like two hours
and especially building fourmain characters, main good
characters and also a bad guycharacter and especially a
significant one like Doctor Doom.
Trying to build those fivecharacters into our movie.
Speaker 1 (08:22):
Yeah, and I think you know they they did do an okay
job at developing thesecharacters, but it was to the
detriment of any kind of plot.
All right, let's move on to ournext character, who is going to
be Johnny Storm the Human Torch, played by Chris Evans.
I'll go first for this one.
When Chris Evans came on thescreen as Johnny Storm the Human
Torch, I absolutely loved himas a teenager.
(08:42):
He was a guy I wanted to be.
He played the hotshot shotpersona and he was immediately
likable.
He was a showboat.
He showed this youthfularrogance and thrill-seeking
attitude.
He embodied the flame that hewould eventually then go and
take on as well.
And, funnily enough, chris evansactually improvised a lot of
his lines, because tim's storythought that, uh, chris evans
(09:03):
had the acting chops to do itfor one and for two.
He never felt like Johnny'slines should be something that
was planned, because he wasalways the one that kind of
played things by the seat of hispants anyway.
So Chris Evans, even at thatearly time in his career, was
able to pull off this role very,very well.
I think that in terms of hismatch with the comic books,
(09:25):
chris Evans played that wit andthat rebellious kind of attitude
and that thirst for the thrill.
Really well, because he in thecomic books is also one of the
four and the only one of thefour who doesn't really care
that he has changed.
It's almost like he loves thefact that these new powers give
him this extra bit of attentionand this new ability that he can
(09:47):
use, and it's a really, reallygood portrayal of Johnny Storm.
He lights up the screen, hesells the fun.
I really liked Chris Evans asJohnny Storm.
What are your thoughts, brash?
Speaker 2 (09:59):
I really liked him in the 2005 movie.
I have to say, though he was alittle bit annoying, but not to
say though he was a little bitannoying, but not to say that
that's a bad thing.
I feel the fact that he annoyedme was probably on point for
Johnny Storm.
He annoyed me like he annoyedBen Grimm.
I can see that those two'schemistry as well.
Speaker 1 (10:18):
Ben Grimm, michael Chiklis and Chris Evans as the
Human Torch that pranks the sortof dynamic as they were waiting
inside to be cured.
That's like the best montagethat they could have done in
this Fantastic Four.
It built relationship andcharacter development so quickly
and it made us like both ofthem really well.
It's also very comic accurate.
I shared a post on our threadstoday that shows Ben Grimm
(10:40):
throwing this massive water bombonto Johnny Storm and it's just
like it gives that energy.
Speaker 2 (10:44):
And that's what I kind of wish they sort of did as
well.
Like, to me it just seemed likeJohnny I think the thing that I
can know most about JohnnyStorm in the Desperate Five
movie, and I think it's becauseof the fact that they didn't
have enough time to foster therelationships.
It just really felt like likeat the start it was a bit it was
playful, but then towards thelike sort of middle of the movie
(11:07):
, ish, it just started to feelmean.
His attacks on the thing wasn'tlike that.
He's like oh, and what do youcall this thing?
He's like oh, that's the guywho did the thing.
Speaker 1 (11:17):
Everyone needs a mask he's a go on for a lot man come
on, yeah, dude, and like andlike.
Speaker 2 (11:23):
So I think for me he came off like he's got that at
the very start.
He's really good, the cockinessand everything that is really
good.
The dead evils like him diving,like him saying that the nurse
is gonna be his future wife,jumping out of the helicopter,
and he lied so on, point, sogreat.
Him kissing the girl in the car, uh, while he's on the
motorbike, real tom cruise stopgun sort of style.
Like, um, oh yeah, I loved allthat and then.
(11:46):
But then when they got thepowers in that he was still okay
.
But then as he kept griping onand on and on and on with ben
grim's character, or ben grimthe character, the thing it just
sort of was like I thought gotold and just started feeling
just mean for mean sake, likethe, like the whipped cream,
that was funny.
(12:06):
Like that little like, likethat sort of playfulness was
funny where you had to likewe're trying to tickle with the
feathers and realize he was arock and that that wasn't gonna
work.
So you end up using the otherside of it to tickle his nose,
like the harder stick part of it, um, to get him to do the.
Uh, slap his face with thewhipped cream.
That was great, but I but Iwish it was a bit more back and
forward, like the post you puton where Ben dropped the giant
(12:29):
water balloon on Johnny Storm.
I wish Ben he's not even aperson, he's a thing.
I get that in the comics, butin the movie it just seems so me
.
Speaker 1 (12:40):
I think that that's part of the growth that we don't
see in this movie from JohnnyStorm as well, because he stays
the same way the whole movie.
He's always that joker, whereasin the comic books you can
always sort of see that he'swrestling with this, wanting to
grow and wanting to be aprotector and wanting to be a
hero, which we do see in thismovie, but it doesn't really
(13:00):
translate to responsibility verymuch.
Speaker 2 (13:06):
So until the Silver surfer movie.
Yeah, the second one.
The second one is silver surferis where he actually, I
actually like johnny storm morebecause that's when he like, yes
, when he becomes the screw-up,when he becomes the um problem
and he's like, oh, I need to um,it's a humbling moment for him
which he doesn't get in thismovie because he has the coolest
power.
Speaker 1 (13:23):
His life doesn't change very much and everybody
loves him.
He doesn't look very differentat all and you know what?
He's got this energy about himand he's got that sort of
arrogant persona.
But in the comic books it showsthat that's actually hiding a
deeper struggle with self-imageinsecurity that he has.
Like he needs externalvalidation because he's so
(13:44):
unsure of himself and hisposition in the team On multiple
accounts.
He is unable to find a placewithin the family of the
Fantastic Four because they'reall so connected and they all
know their purpose and theirplace and he wants to be the
heroes but he's always seen asthis kid, this kid that can't
get anything right, or this kidthat is a hothead, or this
(14:05):
thrill seeker that just goes outand does things for fun.
And that's the Johnny Storm wegot in this movie which I think
is good comic book accuracy forthe start of his journey as the
Human Torch, because that'sliterally what it was From issue
one to three of the originalFantastic Four.
Johnny Storm was out for thethrill the whole time.
The original Fantastic FourJohnny Storm was out for the
(14:27):
thrill the whole time.
He was there just doingrebellious teenage stuff.
And then it wasn't until thelater runs.
It took until 2003,.
And we're talking the FantasticFour came out in 1961.
In 2003, he started to thendevelop into something a little
bit more.
So the fact that we got it inthe second movie is pretty good,
but in this movie I do agree.
I think that he was veryimmature the whole way through,
(14:48):
and I think he did that becauseobviously he was the one that
appealed to the teenage boyaudience the most.
Speaker 2 (14:52):
But yeah, but yeah, so, but on a whole as Johnny
Storm.
Speaker 1 (14:56):
What do you rate it?
Do you think I'll give you minefirst?
I reckon it's a 4.5 out of 5.
Actually, actually I'll give ita 4 out of 5 because, yeah,
there is that little elementthat he doesn't really grow.
He has no arc through thiswhole thing.
But in the first movie, as yousaid, we're developing 5
characters.
I think it was necessary tokind of portray him as that
almost comic relief, you mightsay, in this movie.
Speaker 2 (15:17):
So 4 out of 5 for me yeah, I was going to give him a
3 out of 5, but I'm going topush it up to a 4 as well,
noting that he was playing theEmotario character as well, the
reason why he doesn't get thatextra, like if he.
If they had had that back andforth between him and Ben, I
probably would have given it a 5out of 5, but he just came off
as like.
I know he's immature and he'sprobably like his only
(15:40):
insecurity is that's why he'spicking on Ben, because Ben's an
easy target to try and elevatehimself by putting someone else
down.
But to me he was just so mean,so mean.
But so there, chris Evans,amazing Johnny Storm.
I just wish they had of not hadhim pick on Ben either so much
(16:04):
or that made a bit more funloving than straight up.
Just me.
Speaker 1 (16:08):
All right, let's move on to Jessica Alba playing Sue
Storm or the Invisible Woman inFantastic Four 2005.
All right.
So I think in terms of thecomic book representation of Sue
Storm, this is the worstrepresented character.
I do think that Jessica Albaportrayed Sue Storm in the movie
as well as she could have.
(16:30):
I think that Sue Storm shouldbe the emotional compass and the
moral strength of Marvel'sfirst family.
I think that she was basicallyheavily leaned on for
objectification and thesuperficial look of her.
Basically she was the drawcardfor the target audience, you
might say, and to the pointwhere it is widely said that the
(16:50):
titular scene where she turnsherself invisible on the bridge,
only for the male charactersafter her to just get through
normally.
So the pointless striptease youmight say was in there just to
you know objectify her evenfurther.
She had some uh things to sayabout that and that scene wasn't
written in the movie untilafter she accepted the role.
So with that, with sue storm'scharacter being relegated to
(17:14):
that kind of thing, was a bigdisappointment for me because,
as as I said earlier, she is myfavorite member of the Fantastic
Four because she is thisemotional rock for the team and
it's epitomized most inFantastic Four 280 to 284 when
she actually becomes a darkpersona malice because the boys
(17:34):
in a Fantastic Four go withouther for a time and it shows just
how much emotional strengththey take from her.
She's able to reclaim herselfin the end and then it shows
that after that her strengthsdon't really lie in brute force
or anything like that.
It comes in her self-knowledgeand her compassion and her
control and that is what shethen offers to the other members
(17:55):
of the Fantastic Four.
And she is also probably themost powerful member of the
Fantastic Four.
She has the shields that cannot only shield everybody but
she can create them within aperson to stop oxygen or blood
from leaving or going into theheart.
She is an extremely powerfulperson in this Fantastic Four
team and I think that JessicaAlba did the best that she could
(18:17):
with the writing that she hasdone, but I think in terms of
her comic book comparison thisis an utterly woeful
representation for me.
I also think that it's alwaysbeen explained that Sue got her
powers of invisibility becauseReed never sees her and I don't
think that that's why she gother powers of invisibility in
force field.
I think that she got her powersof force field because she is
(18:38):
the emotional protector of theentire team and her children
when they do come along.
And she has an empower ofinvisibility because a lot of
the time she neglects her ownneeds for the needs of the team
and in that way she, her needs,are invisible.
So through that justificationis how I like to see sue storm
in the Fantastic Four andthrough this she was really only
(19:01):
given like power and successthrough the man's kind of world
of her being this scientificfigure or the second in charge
to Victor, but really because hethen went and proposed to her.
It was almost like she only gotthat promotion because Victor
despite Reed, which means herentire character development was
(19:22):
centered on the fact thatVictor and Reed were feuding,
which I didn't really enjoy withthat.
So I think Albert did a goodjob with what she was given and
she was obviously a draw for thebig teenage audience and she
did what she needed to do interms of the objectification and
all that kind of stuff.
But I just don't think that itkind of worked for me as a comic
(19:45):
book adaptation.
What about you?
Speaker 2 (19:47):
I 100% agree.
But yeah, and I feel, if itwasn't so, this comes back to
them forcing Victor to be themain bad guy in the first movie.
They had to have some sort ofanchor point for him to be upset
with the team, but more so Reed.
Unfortunately, Sue became thatthing because her portrayal of
(20:11):
Sue Storm I thought wasextremely good.
She is the one who's whenJohnny's playing up goals.
Johnny, when Ben's feeling downabout himself, says you're
alright, man, you're good, it'sall good, weals Johnny.
When Ben's feeling down abouthimself, he says you're all
right, man, you're good, it'sall good, we'll figure it out.
Reed's got this, just trust him.
Blah, blah.
And then when Reed's workingtoo hard or getting too focused
on his work or getting toodistracted by his work, able to
(20:34):
pull him out and say hey, youneed to refocus, just take a
break, refocus.
Speaker 1 (20:39):
Rash.
These are really good points.
Man, these are good points.
Speaker 2 (20:42):
So I feel like Sue Storm.
The character and the way Albaplays her is pretty spot on to
Sue.
The only thing is that it'sovershadowed by the
over-sexualization and the factthat she becomes the piece of
meat that Victor and Reed fightover Yep, the over sexualization
and the fact that she becomesthe piece of meat that victor
(21:02):
and reed fight over yep and umlike and yes, that pointless,
pointless strip scene which theydid again in the second movie
as well, like really early onthey did it again, I know yeah,
and she's like why does italways happen to me?
and it's like because, jessica,you are extremely beautiful.
But do that?
That is why and that gets theteenage boys in.
(21:25):
Yeah, but I I feel like, takeaway those stupid sexualization
moments, make victor's arcfanned over two movies or three
movies, instead of just tryingto somehow make him hate them so
much really quickly because ofa girl, and that's the only way
you can actually do it in thatshort span of time.
(21:46):
Take away that part and youhave a pretty spot on perfect
glue that holds the FantasticFour together.
In Sue Storm, jessica Alba.
Speaker 1 (21:54):
Yeah, one thing I would have liked to see as well
was a lot of the time in thecomics Sue kind of leads the
team because Reed's wrapped upin saving the world science like
he does.
So she takes a leadership rolequite often, and I think that
that's what they're going to doin the new Fantastic Four first
steps.
Maybe they're going to actuallylook at Sue as being more of a
leadership figure.
That being the case, I thinkthat's the case because in the
(22:16):
trailer you can see that, um,that Sue kind of leads these two
individuals through the Baxterbuilding as if she's the ceo of
the future foundation company,which which reed sort of
establishes, and he's more ofthe, the tv personality slash
science guy basically thatdevelops all the technology on
the side, like she's the face ofthe company, and that that sort
of strategic leadership, Ithink, of the team was kind of
(22:37):
missing as well, for me as well.
Like on an equal footing atleast everybody else and again
um.
Speaker 2 (22:43):
I believe it.
She shows that more in thesecond movie as the one who's
sort of like the um, like uh,starts calling some of the shots
, yeah, and also negotiatingwith the surfer as well, like
she's able to do that exactly,yeah, and she's.
She's sort of more taking pointand like, even when, um, they're
trying to save that Ferriswheel, in the end Reed comes up
(23:04):
with the idea to use Johnny'spowers to weld it back together.
But it's Sue, like when they'reall starting to fall apart and
Sue's like trying to hold thisFerris wheel out, she's the one
that's like hey, guys, gettogether, what are you doing?
Like I'm struggling herebecause I'm doing all the work.
And then that's when I sort oflike, because we're all sort of
(23:26):
bickering and falling apart, andSue's like like, guys, come on,
guys, we need to do something.
And everyone's sort of like allright, yeah, let's get into
gear.
Speaker 1 (23:33):
And then that's when Reed's like yeah, they start to
click the panic sets.
But she's the one, yeah, she'sthe one that sort of snaps them
into work mode.
You might say yeah.
Speaker 2 (23:42):
So again, I reckon Jessica Allaway did a really
good job.
It was just unfortunate thatthey forced her to be also the
eye candy and the piece of meatthat the guys fight over yeah,
alright.
Speaker 1 (23:56):
What do you rate her performance?
Speaker 2 (23:57):
I rate her performance.
If it was purely just of what Isee of Sue Storm and just
blocking out all thesexualization, I reckon she'd be
a 4, but because of all thesexualization that she was
forced to do in it it sort ofdrags her down to like a 3.5
yeah, I'll probably give her a 4because I think that the fact
that she was able to do what shewas able to do, but also
(24:18):
knowing that they were using hercharacter for that, is just a
testament for Descalba as anactress.
Speaker 1 (24:24):
She was able to go through and actually lean into
the aspects of the characterthat were positive in terms of
Sue Storm and not let thenegative that was happening
throughout the movie detractfrom her performance in other
aspects.
So you really convinced methrough this that there were
aspects of it that I kind oflooked at and didn't really
appreciate, because I do withthat thing that a lot of marvel
fans do when they've read a lotof the comic books which I have
(24:44):
I'm a big fan of the fantasticfour comics where you're kind of
looking at it going that's notwhat I know and that's not what
I love, and it's like theexpectation versus reality of it
kind of drew me out of it.
But when you're putting thosepoints together and saying you
know she actually does do thesethings within the movie is just
on a shorter scale, becauseobviously that's what they have
to do in a movie.
You really, yeah, pointed themout to me.
Speaker 2 (25:03):
Well, brash, I'm going to change my thing about
the four then, because I'm goingto ignore all this
sexualization and I'm just goingto go, based off her
performance, without those parts.
Speaker 1 (25:11):
Beauty.
Alright.
So with that, we're going tomove on to Michael Chiklis, who
plays Ben Grimm or the Thing inthe 2005 Fantastic Four movie.
First things first, we can'ttalk about Michael Chitlis
without talking about hisabsolute commitment to this role
through his tragictransformation of the thing, his
emotional isolation, but alsothe actor's isolation in terms
(25:33):
of he was the only one wearingprosthetics and the prosthetics
took three or six hours to apply.
It was extremely hot when theywere shooting in various
locations.
Speaker 2 (25:40):
However, they did have to do a Canada shootcouver
and he said he was verycomfortable there yeah, everyone
else was cold and he was warmand that was that fight like the
end fight scene.
Speaker 1 (25:48):
Yeah, that was the end fight scene and especially
because a lot of them were likewet with all the water and
things like that.
But yeah, you know, he got hispayoff in the end.
But uh, michael chiklis amassive fan of the comic books
he is he's definitely there topreserve the authenticness of
Ben Grimm and the Thing.
I think the main things thatthe Thing needs is he needs to
be the kind-hearted caramelcenter of the team.
(26:15):
He's like the big puppy dogthat everyone sort of gathers
around.
He has the potential to explode, obviously in moments of anger
when his people are being hurt,gathers around.
He has the potential to explode, obviously in moments of anger
when his people are being hurtand pushed around.
But I feel like he also needsto be that gooey center that
really unites and talks topeople through their problems
and is that supportive bestfriend or that emotional rock
you might say to Reed Richardswhich I feel like he is,
(26:36):
especially through their earlybreakup with Sue Storm.
Michael Chiklis plays him assomebody who's still friends
with Sue, understands why sheleft him, because that's
obviously his best friend,reed's biggest fault, which he
does not deny, and then you know, I think he is a character that
goes through that emotionalturmoil, that bitterness and
that loneliness get to him,which is why he succumbs to
(26:56):
Doom's offer to change himsooner, and it's why he also
gets so frustrated with Reed andSue after they take that one
afternoon off.
I think Checklist played thatreally really well as well.
He has some critical receptionsfor this that I've looked up.
Roger Ebert wrote thatChecklist brought a sense of
humanity to a man trapped in arock suit and he elicits genuine
(27:17):
sympathy in a film otherwisedevoid of much character depth.
Empire magazine also commentedhim or commended him rather, for
playing the thing really well.
They remarked that he anchorsthe film's emotionality, even
while buried in latex layers.
So he's his performance for mewas was really good.
Two things I wish they did interms of his character
(27:38):
development, which I don't knowhow they could have done, but
it's comic book accurate andwhich is what I want to see in
Fantastic Four First Steps isobviously his cultural identity
is that he's a Jewish superhero,so I would have liked to see a
little bit of that In FirstSteps.
They've got Ebon Mas Bakarak,who is a Jewish actor, to play
him.
I'm not sure if they'll diveinto that, but maybe there'll.
And then also, the thing is avery or.
(28:00):
Ben Grimm is a very prominentmember of the Yancey Street gang
in New York.
He grew up with nothing.
Basically in the comic books hewas a street kid and he still
has those ties to the communityof New York no-transcript, so
(28:30):
that, uh, chickless and the roleof the thing ben grim would
actually start to feel a littlebit of acceptance for his new
form.
But the biggest thing that theyhad to get right for the thing
is that he had to be the onethat was playing the person who
was the most emotionallydevastated from this
transformation, which I think hedid very well.
Speaker 2 (28:48):
Yeah, oh yeah, because I thought I got shit on
the whole entire movie.
Oh yeah, I have to sayMichael's probably the out of
all of them.
As much as I do love JessicaAlba's suit in the Underlayers,
michael was probably the bestperformer in this whole entire
movie and the one who probablytook the most care in it.
Speaker 1 (29:09):
Like even adding scenes like on the bridge, when
his ex-fiancee comes and leavesthe ring and he goes to pick it
up.
It was his idea to actuallystruggle with picking it up,
which was literally tear-jerkingwhen you watch that.
Speaker 2 (29:22):
That is so hard.
Speaker 1 (29:24):
In front of everybody .
Speaker 2 (29:25):
And yeah, and like you just imagine the rest of the
crowd just looking and justwatching him try to pick up this
ring and no one's like helpinghim, like it's just like.
But I do like eventually, likewhen the police go to arrest him
and everyone's like, and thefire pit is like hey guys, he's
a hero, and everyone startsclapping at you for him.
I didn't like that and when Ifirst watched it I was like I'm
(29:48):
like, ah, it's going to startturning around for him and
people are going to becauseinitially because that was their
first sort of showing, um, inthat, in that seat, that
everyone cheering for me, for me.
When I first saw it, I was like, oh cool, this is when people
are going to start turningaround and there's still,
there's still going to be, somefear towards him.
But this is where it's going tostart turning around and it's
(30:09):
going to be.
Everyone's going to startaccepting him gradually more now
and then that's pretty muchstraight away forgotten.
But everyone cheered him on thebridge and everyone goes back
to hating him again straightafter that.
It's it's like ah.
Speaker 1 (30:20):
Yeah, I think that was important to do, though,
because obviously Ben's arcthrough this whole thing was
finding that self-acceptance,and I really liked, at the end,
when he obviously succumbed toDoom's proposal to turn him
early, because he was notcomfortable with who he was in
himself in his new form.
Through this change andtraumatic event that he'd gone
(30:41):
through.
He wasn't comfortable with whohe was in himself in his new
form.
Through this change andtraumatic event that he'd gone
through, he wasn't comfortablewith who he was because he had
this strong attachment to who hewas previously and he couldn't
fathom, you know, being this newversion of ben grim.
But in the end, he decided tochange himself back to the thing
in order to help his friends,which was a really good
character development momentwhere you got to actually see,
(31:01):
hey, this is the thing, and thesame way with the comics that
you know is self-sacrificing,gives for his family and the
Fantastic Four and actually, youknow, puts other people first,
which is what he kind of does,sometimes to the detriment of
himself, but he is always theone that is being turned to for
those moments of strength,whether it be physical or
(31:22):
emotional.
So I kind of like that his arcwent in that way.
And then by the end of themovie, when Reed isn't at the
party on the boat and he'stalking to Ben and he says you
know, I could probably do this,that and the other to fix you up
, and Ben actually says you knowwhat?
All good, I'm good as is.
That's like the bestculminating part for his arc.
Speaker 2 (31:39):
for me, because of that way they went.
I think everyone cheering forhim on the bridge sort of then
makes that whole net, whole endarc of him self-sacrificing and
turning on them then being like,no, I need to help my friends
and you know I can do.
That is how I was, um, and I'lldo that for them.
(31:59):
It sort of sort of takes a step, makes him, makes them take a
step backwards, because allthese people he's been on camera
, he was being filmed,everyone's cheering for him.
I kind of wish that they'dcheer for the others, but still
looked at him with disdainbecause, realistically, he's the
one that started that crash bystanding in front of the truck
to save that guy.
Speaker 1 (32:17):
That's just quietly.
Speaker 2 (32:18):
He did.
He did the right thing bysaving the guy.
But in the meantime you saw ataxi fly over into a bunch of
gas tanks and explode.
The two inside the car is deadstraight up.
So many people died.
So many people died in thatcrash and the explosions saving
that one guy who wanted to killhimself.
I mean honestly, I mean youknow yeah, that's the bridge
(32:40):
scene.
Speaker 1 (32:40):
That is like it's a great production scene because
the amount of cgr the amount ofwork and all that.
All the work was really greatbut unfortunately in the story
the way that it was is just likeit just made no sense.
It was kind of like they neededto.
They needed to let thefantastic four show their powers
for the first time and that wasthe best they could come up
with.
That was, yeah, like they couldhave made doom come and zap
some stuff or, you know, just aregular old car crash.
Speaker 2 (33:04):
That.
Or even like, introduce adifferent bad guy to right there
, to for them to be like, ohwait, we got powers now we can
help in this situation.
And then show that and stilllike everyone's like everyone.
Be like oh man, that's so cool,you can stretch, oh man, that
everyone's like everyone.
Be like oh man, that's so cool,you can stretch, oh man, that's
so cool.
He turns into fire and fliesaround and shoots firewalls and
then, oh cool, she can goinvisible and make force fields
(33:24):
and stuff.
Oh, it's a rock.
And they could still do thatand that could still make that
sort of separation between themand alienating Ben, because
everyone's all fascinated withthem, the other three and still
has, because ben, which can helpthat sort of self-loathing grow
, yeah, to the point wherevictor's proposal is actually
(33:46):
more attractive than then.
Hey, they went away for thenight or for an afternoon, for a
couple hours.
They've forgotten about you and, realistically, the whole like
the thing was ready and um reedwas like it's ready, we just
somehow need more power, that's.
All they needed was more powerto run it, and it would have
worked.
Speaker 1 (34:05):
Yeah, the science was thin in this movie too, which I
didn't like.
For a fantastic four movie, Ineeded some techno babble like
star trek to keep me yeah, keepit like.
Speaker 2 (34:13):
But like the thing, the whole thing was ready, but
he just he wanted to make surebecause I want to make sure that
was and that that was anotherthing about reed him being so
meticulous and it it driving himelse nuts because he's being so
meticulous.
He just needed more power andit would have worked.
But he was struggling thatmoment to try and find a source
of power like that that could doit, because victor had to throw
(34:34):
a fair chunk of his energy inthere and he drew a lot of it
out as well.
But, um well, he gained a lot ofit as well from the discharge.
Yeah, he, in that afternoon hecame back.
He refreshed me like all right,guys, we need a lot of energy.
Oh, we know, we have asupernova who could probably
create a lot of energy.
Why don't we use Johnny topower it up?
(34:55):
Fair enough, power solved.
But they're like, but he's.
But there he comes sneaky.
Julian mcmahon hey, they'vegone out for the evening.
They don't love you anymore.
They think you're ugly andtedious too.
Speaker 1 (35:08):
Ha ha, they're never gonna fix you, even though the
machine's pretty much done yeah,he knew he was getting quick,
but yeah, I think that's anothertime where the, the writing
lets down the, the characterdevelopment.
But in terms of the actor, interms of the actor and the
character, I think, yeah, Iwould rate him.
I'd probably rate this guy afive.
I think five out of five for mefor Michael Chiklis and the
(35:30):
thing, just because hiscommitment to the authenticity
and also actually I'll probablygive it a 4.5 because I don't
think he was I'll give it a 4.5.
It wasn't as sensitive, as I'dlike the thing to be in terms of
like how he was emotionallythere for the rest of the
Fantastic Four, I'd say.
But you know he had just gonethrough a very traumatic event
and at the moment he was veryself-focused.
Speaker 2 (35:51):
I guess you could say yeah, well, within the span of
like not very long, he gotturned into a rock monster
monster.
His wife, who they like whenthey're talking about things
like you know, like we're gonnabe together forever, no matter
what, and then she's like, nah,straight up, straight up, he, he
went through enough that wouldbreak any normal person and, um,
(36:15):
his resilience, I think isdetrimental in that and what.
What actually I liked so muchabout like him and because as
much as johnny annoyed me abouthow mean he was to him,
detrimental in that and whatactually I liked so much about
him, because as much as Johnnyannoyed me about how mean he was
to him his resilience in justbrushing him off and everything
like that and just crushing hiscar and throwing it around.
Speaker 1 (36:32):
Yeah, no, it was a good ball I liked that To me.
Speaker 2 (36:34):
You need to do more kind of that stuff where Johnny
does stuff to either tease himor do stuff like that, so then
he gets him back by justthrowing his car.
Also I agree 4.5.
Speaker 1 (36:46):
Very good, all right, so let's get into our most
valuable takeaways.
This is the mvt section, themost valuable takeaway, the
heart and soul of this podcast,where we break down the one
thing that hits hardest, stucklongest or taught us something
new from what we just watched.
(37:07):
It's our moment to spotlightthe takeaway that made us think,
feel or see things differently,whether it's a killer, a moral
punch or a next level piece ofmovie craft.
This is what we learned fromFantastic Four 2005.
Do you want to go first, or me?
Speaker 2 (37:22):
You can go first because mine might tee off, okay
.
Speaker 1 (37:24):
So my one is about Ben Grimm and it is about the
inner struggle for acceptance.
So my most valuable takeawayfrom this is sort of in answer
to the question what do you dowhen something irreversible
happens to you or a changehappens to you and it changes
how you see yourself or how theworld sees you?
And it's very, very hard and ithappens to everybody.
(37:44):
It's something that happensthroughout everybody's life.
And I think that for Ben itwasn't just about the fact that
he changed and his looks changed, but his identity changed, like
his self-worth changed.
It was tied to his humanity andthe way that he was normal and
the way that he interacted withhis friends and his
relationships and hissignificant partners.
And he then had to sort ofshift and he had to force
(38:07):
himself to relearn how he sawhimself.
But then at the same time hewas going through the fact that
other people kind of saw him ina different light as well.
So it kind of equates thatworth with appearance or
function, like what he's able todo, and I think that that's a
(38:27):
pitfall that sometimes peoplefall into where they look at
external validation and there'salso this initial desperation to
undo that change like,especially when traumatic events
happen, it's like people wantto undo the bad thing that
happened to them, whereas whenwe hate who we've become, then
you become vulnerable to likeexploitation and you've got to
(38:49):
kind of learn that no externalchange will resolve the internal
rejection that you feel foryourself.
So the thing about the thing,the thing about the thing is
when he actually chooses to bethe thing again.
That's when he realizes, youknow, he stops seeing his
condition as a curse, he acceptshis identity as more than just
his form and you know, he'sshowing up with what he has at
(39:12):
that time and he has thisself-determination that he can
enact change and be himself.
And he gains showing up withwhat he has at that time and he
has this self-determination thathe can enact change and be
himself and he gains thisself-respect and this community
and this sense of purpose thathe's able to move with.
And it's also that message thatnot all change is chosen and
not all change is visible, butevery change gives us a chance
to either resist and remainbitter, or accept and adapt and
(39:36):
grow stronger, which is what Ithink he was able to do by the
end of the movie.
It's kind of like because forthe longest time with me I was
always somebody who I valued formyself.
That's something that I wantedto change.
A lot about myself was that Iwanted to be like organized and
punctual and on time to things,and I wanted to be able to
(39:56):
complete complex tasks and beable to do all those things.
So I had this self-perceptionof what I kind of wanted to be
and I was constantly trying tofix that about myself all my
life.
And then when I got a ADHDdiagnosis, I kind of had this
mentality where I was like well,I now I can't do that because
it's who I am Like, that's who Iam.
And you know, it wasn't the factthat I I couldn't do that
(40:21):
anymore or I couldn't worktowards doing that.
It was the fact that myself-perception of it was that
now, because this is now labeled, it's actually like a quote
mark detriment to me, it'ssomething that I can't do, where
, in fact, I kind of just had tolearn new ways to do it instead
of what the normal ways thatpeople would try to do those
things are.
So for me I kind of resonatedwith him, even though my
(40:45):
transformation, you might say,wasn't physical.
It was kind of like a mentalchange for me where I kind of
had to come to terms with thefact that the identity that I
wished for myself and the onethat I was working on, I had to
shift.
The manner in which I wastrying to achieve that and it
was.
It was really detrimental for awhile because I was like, why
isn't this working?
Why can't I stick to this?
Why can't I do this so in thatway?
(41:07):
And it's taken heaps of time,it's taken so much time, more
than a two-hour movie.
But that's kind of what Igained from this is that that
change that you go through youknow it doesn't always have to
be visible and doesn't alwayshave to like, but it has to be
chosen.
It has to be something that youchoose to do and you have to
accept and adapt and then grow,which is what Ben Grimm was able
(41:28):
to do in this movie, and youknow I'm still working on it,
but I feel like I've been ableto do it in some level too with
my thing.
So that's my takeaway.
Thanks, ben, that's beautiful.
Speaker 2 (41:40):
Thanks, man.
I'm pretty much going to haveto piggyback off what she said,
because mine was similar toyours in that it's no matter
what, whoever you are in thisworld, shit's always going to
happen and sometimes you justgotta roll the punches and it's
just um.
Have that.
It's hard, hard to do, but havethat acceptance of yourself.
(42:02):
Yeah, like how ben has to haveeventually come to the
acceptance that for him to dowhat he needs to do, which and
what he he thinks is right andhow he feels, and that is
protect his family, he has tomake that sacrifice of becoming
the thing and and then heaccepts that and becomes really
(42:23):
like his true self by acceptingthat same with like Johnny in
the second one, where he's likehas to sort of let go of that
attention seeking and vanity tobecome someone that the other
team can actually rely oninstead of becoming a nuisance.
Speaker 1 (42:38):
Yeah, he had to drop that mask, like the mask that
he'd been portraying toeverybody.
That made him feel safe,because he was showboating and
because if people don't likethat, that's fine, because
that's not really who I am.
Nobody sees the broken mebecause they see that showboat
and that's fine.
But whereas with Ben Grimm hisdifference was there for
(42:58):
everybody to see.
There was no masking.
That's the thing and you know,when you're going through things
like that it can lead you tosome dangerous paths because you
look for quick fixes anddifferent things work for
different people.
But you know a lot of peoplelook for quick fixes in
situations like that, orexternal solutions or validation
from others.
It's like a common human thing.
But yeah you've got to learn tobecome sort of self-determined
(43:24):
and get that sort of respect andhave self-acceptance as opposed
to other acceptance.
Speaker 2 (43:31):
Yeah and fantastic for and this is what I think,
what you're saying about the2015, how that one showed that
more the body dysmorphia side ofthings, I think that all of
them have gone through, like allthe Fantastic Four prime
examples, in different ways ofacceptance.
So Ben's is more physicalacceptance, johnny is more of a
(43:57):
Internal emotional, internalemotional maturity acceptance
and reads more of a.
He needs to accept the love andcare of people around him and
join in on that.
Speaker 1 (44:12):
Yeah, and also the limitations of his own
intelligence as well.
Speaker 2 (44:15):
Hubris is his hubris, yeah, instead of being like he
may be one of the smartestpeople on the planet, but that's
not going to solve all of hisproblems.
Um, and then sue is, she justneeds to accept the fact that
she can't be the emotional rockfor them in the heart and the
soul of them all the time.
She needs to take time forherself yes, perfect, um, and
(44:36):
and just needs that time toself-reflect and recharge.
And, as you were saying too,like I think, and everyone goes
through something's in a similarvein, but always different, and
it's just about accepting thatfact.
Like I wish I was, I wish myhair wasn't starting to recede,
even though I'm trying my bestto not let it recede.
(44:57):
I wish I was in better shapeNot that I'm in terrible shape,
but I wish I was just in theshape I was in like four years
ago, not that long ago andthere's things I can do to fix
that, but then there's alsoother things in my life that are
stopping me from focusing onthat, and there's things I can
do to fix that, but then there'salso other things in my life
that are stopping me fromfocusing on that, and there's
(45:18):
just so much going on and justat some point you just have to
be like all right, I can't, Ican't focus on trying to do all
these things.
I need to focus on one thing ata time and just accept that
life is chaotic and that I canonly do certain things and that
I can't do everything at once.
Speaker 1 (45:36):
Yeah, and I think also there is that acceptance
and that realization that thereis a version.
This is where everybody is likethere is a version of you that
you can be proud of and it's notlike all the way down the road
like you can be proud of who youare right now.
And there are things about youthat you can be proud of right
now, and you might be looking atthe things that you're you're
(45:58):
lacking in terms of what youdon't have, but there are also a
lot of things that you mighthave that you can be really sort
of accepting of as well.
And I think that's that's thefocus shift that that ben went
through in this movie.
Uh, he, he had to be acceptingof the fact that, hey, in this
particular situation, thesechanges that occurred to me are
actually really helpful becauseI can go and assist my friends,
and that's something that Ivalue.
I value being there for myfriends and I value being able
(46:21):
to help others, and this enablesme to do that really, really
well.
But then also you know, he notso much Johnny, but I feel like
that there is like a subtleacceptance that happens between
Johnny and Ben at the end, whenthey sort of meet up and he puts
a hand on his shoulder and Bensays you know, you did good kid,
and they kind of have thatlittle moment.
There's definitely like a backand forth between them.
But I think he surroundshimself and in the comics
(46:43):
especially, he surrounds himselfwith people that love him for
who he is, and that's that's thepart that helps him through is
because he can see and look atthe parts of himself that he
likes as well, which is what Ithink is the takeaway too.
Speaker 2 (46:58):
Yeah, and another thing you have to accept the now
and work for the future.
If you're not accepting the nowand you're too busy trying to
focus on too many futures, thenyou're never going to get there
because you're splittingyourself off in too many
directions.
Speaker 1 (47:14):
That's Reed Richards' problem as well, literally,
because in the comic books heactually forms a council of
Reeds, because he can't solveall the world's problems alone.
So instead of doing any sort ofself-work and you know,
actually I- need more of me,yeah he's like I need more of me
to do the jobs I can't do,instead of him going.
Actually, this is just out of mywheelhouse.
I can't do that and I need toaccept it.
And you know, that kind ofself-determination is admirable
(47:38):
to a point, but also it causes alot of problems because it
leads to the arc which involvesthe maker in the comic book
series, which is just a veryvolatile version of Reed.
That's basically solvingeverything at all costs, no
matter the humanity that'sinvolved, and I think that, like
that is a very important aspectof it too, is accepting the now
(47:58):
is good.
All right, let's rate it.
All right, the fandom portal'son board.
Guys, it's time to rate andrank.
Each host gives the movie ascore out of five.
Then we take the average andadd it to our official
letterboxd on board.
If you want to follow along,you can find and track our
rankings anytime you like at ourletterboxd, which is at
fandomportals.
(48:18):
Alright, brash, what are yougiving?
Fantastic 4 from 2005.
Speaker 2 (48:23):
I was going to give it like a 3, 3.5, but after like
, how much we've talked about itand all the things we've talked
about within it, and even whenI was talking about sue storm,
so I was just talking because Ilike the character and the more
I was talking about and howyou're saying that it helped you
, um, change your mind on sue.
I think I only I changed my ownmind on sue a little bit
(48:46):
talking about because, because,actually, just talking through
it, I was like yeah, no, she,she does a lot of that, does a
lot of that thing, and yeah.
So I think I'm going to give ita four, nice.
Speaker 1 (48:57):
I like it.
You know, initially as well, Igave it a 2.5.
Initially I gave it a 2.5.
But I think, after talkingabout it and seeing how, with
the time spent that they got inthis hour and 40 something
minutes with that, and theamount that they kind of develop
the characters that they needto, and how they tried to make
it as comic accurate as theycould, I'm a character guy so I
like characters in movies a lotbetter than I.
(49:18):
I will deal with a characterdriven plot movie.
We cannot fight the fact thatthe plot in this movie is thin.
The villain is absolute trashrepresented in terms of the
story.
However, he has played wellwith what has been given there,
so I'm probably happy to givethis a 3.5.
It is going to have with yourrating of 4 and mine of 3.5,
it's going to have an average of3.75, which means we have to
(49:40):
determine whether it is betteror worse than Spider-Man.
No Way Home.
Speaker 2 (49:45):
I honestly, again, this is still hard, this is hard
.
Speaker 1 (49:49):
I'm going to say under, though I will probably
say under as well.
Speaker 2 (49:55):
But by say if it was like the average was 3.75, like
Best Wish Board would be like3.74.
Speaker 1 (50:03):
Yes, only just, only, just below, only just Okay.
So we're going to put it on ourfandom portals on a board, guys
, and it is going to situnderneath Spider-Man no Way
Home, which means it is sevenoverall.
It sits directly above Sonicthe Hedgehog, so it's in our top
10.
Leading the fandom portals onboard is still the Crow, with an
average of 4.25.
(50:23):
So we'll see how we go.
Let's go into our sign-offs.
Alright, ladies and gentlemen,boys and girls, this is the end
of our first episode in ourMarvel month.
We have just looked atFantastic Four from the 2005 era
.
If you wanted to join ourcommunity, you can do so by
looking at our threads and ourInstagram and also our Reddit.
(50:44):
Those links are in the shownotes below and, as you may have
heard, we are doing a giveaway.
If Brash and I are able to earn15 points by learning so much
about all the Marvel movies thatwe're doing, then you will have
a chance to win a pass to takeyourself and your family to the
movies, because we love sendingyou guys to movies.
So if you wanted to join that,if you wanted to be entered into
the giveaway, then you need togo down into our show notes and
(51:06):
click onwwwbandomportalspodcastcom or
just type it into your webbrowser and sign on to our
emailing list and we will drawour winner on the 30th of April
and you may be able to sendyourself to the movies with your
family, or you can just sendyourself four times if you want.
In May, there is theThunderbolts coming out, which
is a Marvel movie, so you'll getyour pass just in time for that
(51:27):
.
So make sure you go and enterour giveaway, because it could
be you.
It could be you sitting inthere with a free movie on us
here at the Fandom Portalspodcast.
Ladies and gentlemen, boys andgirls here.
We are a small podcast, so wereally thrive on word of mouth.
If you would share this with afriend, that would be absolutely
amazing Anybody that lovesFantastic Four, any member of
(51:48):
your Fantastic Four family, orjust somebody that likes
superheroes or Marvel.
Next week, braj, do you want totalk about what we're doing
next week on the podcast?
Speaker 2 (51:58):
Yes, so next week will be New Mutants, new Mutants
.
Speaker 1 (52:02):
I have a soft spot for this movie as even though it
was critically not goodaccording to most people, I have
a soft spot for it.
I think there are elements ofthis that we can definitely
enjoy the new Minz that was madein 2020, directed by Josh Boone
.
That is our next movie that youcan see on the Phantom Portals
(52:23):
podcast.
Make sure you follow the showso you will not miss that
episode.
Brash, it has been an absolutepleasure.
Some may say it was fantastic.
Speaker 2 (52:32):
And for all our listeners out there.
Sometimes you may feelphysically rocky, sometimes you
just might be invisible, youmight feel stretched too thin or
sometimes just might beoverwhelmed with the fire that
is this world currently.
But just remember that we loveyou here and we appreciate every
single one of you can't tellthat.
Speaker 1 (52:52):
See you guys.
Thank you so much.
Hello and welcome to the Fandom Portals podcast.
This is a podcast that exploreshow fandoms can help you learn
and grow.
We are looking at the FantasticFour movie from 2005.
It was fantastic.
Um, I'm here joined by myco-host, brash.
How you going today, brash?
Speaker 2 (00:28):
oh, not too bad.
I was going to try and come upwith more catchphrases for
fantasy four, but I realizedit's flame one and it's covering
time of the only two realcatchphrases that have, because
I don't believe that reedrichards no, they are.
Speaker 1 (00:38):
They're very serious.
Um, unless you know, acatchphrase could be sue storm,
telling reed to pull his headout of his work.
Speaker 2 (00:47):
And Reed could be saying one more minute.
Darling, I don't know.
Speaker 1 (00:49):
But yes, we are looking at the 2005 Fantastic
Four movie that was directed byTim Story, and in this movie a
group of astronauts gainsuperpowers after a cosmic
radiation exposure and they mustuse those powers to oppose the
plans of their enemy, dr VictorVon Doom.
This is the second part of ourfantastic for 2005 podcast, so
(01:09):
make sure you go and check outpart one if you haven't already.
And this is also part of ourmarvel month.
All month long we're going tobe looking at marvel material
and we also have a giveawaygoing on as well.
So during the month of marvel,brash and I have teamed up to
try and gain 15 points from ourtrivia segment, which usually
happens in in our part ones.
And if you want to win a familypass to the movies, that's
right, we'll send you to themovies on us.
(01:29):
Then all you have to do is goand join our mailing list, which
you can find atwwwbandandportalspodcastcom.
If you go to that website, youcan find where you will sign up
to our mailing list and if youwin, on the 30th of April we'll
email you a family pass for youto enjoy a movie on us, because
we love the theatre, we lovemovies and we like going to the
movies, so we wanted to extendthat to you guys as well, didn't
(01:52):
we, brash?
Oh yeah, please enjoy it on us.
That's how we do it, oh yeah,okay.
So in this podcast, guys, inthis part two, we're going to be
looking at how they performedtheir chemistry and what we hope
for Fantastic Four first stepsas well, and we're going to dive
into our popcorn perspectivesright now.
(02:12):
Alright, in this segment, wedive into standout characters
from the movie.
Each host picks their favouritecharacter and takes a close
look at why they thought thecharacter should be given your
attention.
All right, brash, the way thisis going to work is we're going
to pick a character, we're goingto talk about them and how they
were portrayed through the 2005movie, what our hopes are for
(02:33):
the Fantastic Four first steps,and then we're going to rate
their performance and theirrepresentation out of five.
Make sense, lovely, all right.
The first character that we'regoing to be doing is we're going
to be doing the man himself, mrFantastic Reed Richards, played
by Johan Griffith.
What did you think of hisperformance, brash?
Speaker 2 (02:49):
Almost perfect, I would have to say.
I thought he played the nerdywork-driven Reed Richards to a T
, like he was.
When it first came out and Isaw him on screen I was like,
hey, it's Reed Richards, that'sMr Fantastic right there, miles
(03:09):
Teller.
I love Miles Teller.
But when he came in I was like,hey, who's that guy?
Oh, oh, he was A bigger thanBen Green, yeah, and it was a
nice casting.
But 2005 casting was on point,I reckon, and Reed Richards, for
me, was absolutely brilliantand he pulled off the silver fox
(03:31):
grey hairline.
Speaker 1 (03:33):
I think it was interesting to know that Yohan
Griffith is a Welsh actor and hehad to try and put on the
American accent through themovie.
I think he did a pretty goodjob.
There are some points where youcan tell yeah, he did struggle.
Speaker 2 (03:44):
Yeah, because he kept getting new lines constantly.
He had to keep reloading newlines, trying to read those new
lines in an American accentconstantly.
Yeah, it messed him up a littlebit.
Speaker 1 (03:53):
But yeah, I think that Johan tried to aim for that
intellectual gravitas that ReedRichards has, which I think he
did kind of well.
But some people have said thathis performance was a little bit
too subdued, because you know,reed can often be seen at least
in the comic books as being verycold and calculating and
distant to his other FantasticFour family members, and I don't
(04:15):
think he was like that in thismovie.
He was actually pretty warmtowards the other members of the
Fantastic Four, or at least hepresented that leadership kind
of quality very, very well.
He always seemed like he wasreluctantly doing his work,
which is actually the true formof the comic book's version of
Reed Richards.
He's actually always in thatconstant struggle.
He's in a moral struggle allthe time, with his intellectual
(04:38):
ruthlessness of being absolutelydriven and focused to try and
make the world a better place,because he's the only one
intellectually that can do it,and also his love for his family
that needs his time, that, uh,that needs his care, that
relationship with sue that needsnurturing as well.
So he's always being pulled inso many different directions,
which is actually why he got hispowers of stretching um.
So with that in mind, I thinkthat, uh, griffith actually
(05:02):
played this pretty well, and Ithink that the only thing that
we didn't really see and we kindof see it a little bit more in
the rise of the silver surfermovie is where he's actually
being pulled in two directionsin terms of his relationship
with sue and his scientificpursuits, because in this one,
yes, he wants to cure ben somuch that's like drawing all of
his attention, but in this moviehe doesn't really have a
(05:24):
relationship with sue stormanymore.
Speaker 2 (05:26):
because, yeah, he's trying to recreate.
So in trying to help ben he'sworking for to help ben, but
then in the same vein he's alsoseeing that he's also slowly
winning back sue.
So he's sort of, yeah, doingthat bit of Tywin War and this
is one of the things I thoughtwas a bit forced in the movie
(05:50):
about that sort of dynamic forReed was that in then going and
taking that one afternoon offwith Sue, victor was able to
convince Ben.
Yeah, he doesn't like youanymore, oh yeah, and that's
that's why I, like it was wasn'table to convince Ben to.
Yeah, he doesn't like youanymore.
Oh, yeah, and that's why I wasa bit forced on Reed, whereas,
(06:12):
as you said, in the second movieit's a lot more natural because
there's a big disaster coming.
Speaker 1 (06:17):
But it's also his wedding and he's like no, I'm
going to get married Under thetable, which is exactly Reed
Richards through the comic bookrun, he's always doing the thing
that needs to be done at theexpense of his family, and that
also, yeah, sort of brings whichI don't think, uh, griffith
sort of portrayed as well as hecould have, was the, that
existential loneliness that thatkind of causes for reed, like
(06:39):
in the.
In the comic books, especiallythe hickman run between 2009,
2015, reed riches is portrayedas somebody who is going through
this internal struggle, notonly having all of these cosmic
burdens on his hands and tryingto maintain a family dynamic
where he needs closeness, butalso the fact that he is the
only one that is fighting thesebattles.
He's there with his family, butit's almost like he's fighting
(06:59):
them alone because there'snobody else that's really on his
level that he can use as anally to help him in the manner
that needs being helped.
He does portray the, the brain,in this.
He's definitely the scientificminded and he's he's also in
terms of his friendship with ben.
I don't think that is asdeveloped as it could have been
because, as you said before, youknow it, it turns on a switch
(07:20):
so quickly.
They do have a history that wesee about through their early
interactions in the 2005 movie,but I don't think it's as
in-depth as the Ben Grimm, reedRichards in the comic books,
because obviously they have moretime to develop that too.
So let's give this guy a rating.
Let's give him a rating out offive for Ewan Griffith and his
(07:41):
portrayal of Reed Richards inthe 2005 Fantastic Four movie.
What are you giving it out offive?
Brash, I was going to say three, oh, three and a half.
I think that that is verycomplimentary to his portrayal
and also its comic bookaccurateness with the story and
the time that we were given inthis almost two-hour movie.
Speaker 2 (08:00):
It was a pretty good read yeah, because it's hard to
do anything within it was justthe constraint of like two hours
and especially building fourmain characters, main good
characters and also a bad guycharacter and especially a
significant one like Doctor Doom.
Trying to build those fivecharacters into our movie.
Speaker 1 (08:22):
Yeah, and I think you know they they did do an okay
job at developing thesecharacters, but it was to the
detriment of any kind of plot.
All right, let's move on to ournext character, who is going to
be Johnny Storm the Human Torch, played by Chris Evans.
I'll go first for this one.
When Chris Evans came on thescreen as Johnny Storm the Human
Torch, I absolutely loved himas a teenager.
(08:42):
He was a guy I wanted to be.
He played the hotshot shotpersona and he was immediately
likable.
He was a showboat.
He showed this youthfularrogance and thrill-seeking
attitude.
He embodied the flame that hewould eventually then go and
take on as well.
And, funnily enough, chris evansactually improvised a lot of
his lines, because tim's storythought that, uh, chris evans
(09:03):
had the acting chops to do itfor one and for two.
He never felt like Johnny'slines should be something that
was planned, because he wasalways the one that kind of
played things by the seat of hispants anyway.
So Chris Evans, even at thatearly time in his career, was
able to pull off this role very,very well.
I think that in terms of hismatch with the comic books,
(09:25):
chris Evans played that wit andthat rebellious kind of attitude
and that thirst for the thrill.
Really well, because he in thecomic books is also one of the
four and the only one of thefour who doesn't really care
that he has changed.
It's almost like he loves thefact that these new powers give
him this extra bit of attentionand this new ability that he can
(09:47):
use, and it's a really, reallygood portrayal of Johnny Storm.
He lights up the screen, hesells the fun.
I really liked Chris Evans asJohnny Storm.
What are your thoughts, brash?
Speaker 2 (09:59):
I really liked him in the 2005 movie.
I have to say, though he was alittle bit annoying, but not to
say though he was a little bitannoying, but not to say that
that's a bad thing.
I feel the fact that he annoyedme was probably on point for
Johnny Storm.
He annoyed me like he annoyedBen Grimm.
I can see that those two'schemistry as well.
Speaker 1 (10:18):
Ben Grimm, michael Chiklis and Chris Evans as the
Human Torch that pranks the sortof dynamic as they were waiting
inside to be cured.
That's like the best montagethat they could have done in
this Fantastic Four.
It built relationship andcharacter development so quickly
and it made us like both ofthem really well.
It's also very comic accurate.
I shared a post on our threadstoday that shows Ben Grimm
(10:40):
throwing this massive water bombonto Johnny Storm and it's just
like it gives that energy.
Speaker 2 (10:44):
And that's what I kind of wish they sort of did as
well.
Like, to me it just seemed likeJohnny I think the thing that I
can know most about JohnnyStorm in the Desperate Five
movie, and I think it's becauseof the fact that they didn't
have enough time to foster therelationships.
It just really felt like likeat the start it was a bit it was
playful, but then towards thelike sort of middle of the movie
(11:07):
, ish, it just started to feelmean.
His attacks on the thing wasn'tlike that.
He's like oh, and what do youcall this thing?
He's like oh, that's the guywho did the thing.
Speaker 1 (11:17):
Everyone needs a mask he's a go on for a lot man come
on, yeah, dude, and like andlike.
Speaker 2 (11:23):
So I think for me he came off like he's got that at
the very start.
He's really good, the cockinessand everything that is really
good.
The dead evils like him diving,like him saying that the nurse
is gonna be his future wife,jumping out of the helicopter,
and he lied so on, point, sogreat.
Him kissing the girl in the car, uh, while he's on the
motorbike, real tom cruise stopgun sort of style.
Like, um, oh yeah, I loved allthat and then.
(11:46):
But then when they got thepowers in that he was still okay
.
But then as he kept griping onand on and on and on with ben
grim's character, or ben grimthe character, the thing it just
sort of was like I thought gotold and just started feeling
just mean for mean sake, likethe, like the whipped cream,
that was funny.
(12:06):
Like that little like, likethat sort of playfulness was
funny where you had to likewe're trying to tickle with the
feathers and realize he was arock and that that wasn't gonna
work.
So you end up using the otherside of it to tickle his nose,
like the harder stick part of it, um, to get him to do the.
Uh, slap his face with thewhipped cream.
That was great, but I but Iwish it was a bit more back and
forward, like the post you puton where Ben dropped the giant
(12:29):
water balloon on Johnny Storm.
I wish Ben he's not even aperson, he's a thing.
I get that in the comics, butin the movie it just seems so me
.
Speaker 1 (12:40):
I think that that's part of the growth that we don't
see in this movie from JohnnyStorm as well, because he stays
the same way the whole movie.
He's always that joker, whereasin the comic books you can
always sort of see that he'swrestling with this, wanting to
grow and wanting to be aprotector and wanting to be a
hero, which we do see in thismovie, but it doesn't really
(13:00):
translate to responsibility verymuch.
Speaker 2 (13:06):
So until the Silver surfer movie.
Yeah, the second one.
The second one is silver surferis where he actually, I
actually like johnny storm morebecause that's when he like, yes
, when he becomes the screw-up,when he becomes the um problem
and he's like, oh, I need to um,it's a humbling moment for him
which he doesn't get in thismovie because he has the coolest
power.
Speaker 1 (13:23):
His life doesn't change very much and everybody
loves him.
He doesn't look very differentat all and you know what?
He's got this energy about himand he's got that sort of
arrogant persona.
But in the comic books it showsthat that's actually hiding a
deeper struggle with self-imageinsecurity that he has.
Like he needs externalvalidation because he's so
(13:44):
unsure of himself and hisposition in the team On multiple
accounts.
He is unable to find a placewithin the family of the
Fantastic Four because they'reall so connected and they all
know their purpose and theirplace and he wants to be the
heroes but he's always seen asthis kid, this kid that can't
get anything right, or this kidthat is a hothead, or this
(14:05):
thrill seeker that just goes outand does things for fun.
And that's the Johnny Storm wegot in this movie which I think
is good comic book accuracy forthe start of his journey as the
Human Torch, because that'sliterally what it was From issue
one to three of the originalFantastic Four.
Johnny Storm was out for thethrill the whole time.
The original Fantastic FourJohnny Storm was out for the
(14:27):
thrill the whole time.
He was there just doingrebellious teenage stuff.
And then it wasn't until thelater runs.
It took until 2003,.
And we're talking the FantasticFour came out in 1961.
In 2003, he started to thendevelop into something a little
bit more.
So the fact that we got it inthe second movie is pretty good,
but in this movie I do agree.
I think that he was veryimmature the whole way through,
(14:48):
and I think he did that becauseobviously he was the one that
appealed to the teenage boyaudience the most.
Speaker 2 (14:52):
But yeah, but yeah, so, but on a whole as Johnny
Storm.
Speaker 1 (14:56):
What do you rate it?
Do you think I'll give you minefirst?
I reckon it's a 4.5 out of 5.
Actually, actually I'll give ita 4 out of 5 because, yeah,
there is that little elementthat he doesn't really grow.
He has no arc through thiswhole thing.
But in the first movie, as yousaid, we're developing 5
characters.
I think it was necessary tokind of portray him as that
almost comic relief, you mightsay, in this movie.
Speaker 2 (15:17):
So 4 out of 5 for me yeah, I was going to give him a
3 out of 5, but I'm going topush it up to a 4 as well,
noting that he was playing theEmotario character as well, the
reason why he doesn't get thatextra, like if he.
If they had had that back andforth between him and Ben, I
probably would have given it a 5out of 5, but he just came off
as like.
I know he's immature and he'sprobably like his only
(15:40):
insecurity is that's why he'spicking on Ben, because Ben's an
easy target to try and elevatehimself by putting someone else
down.
But to me he was just so mean,so mean.
But so there, chris Evans,amazing Johnny Storm.
I just wish they had of not hadhim pick on Ben either so much
(16:04):
or that made a bit more funloving than straight up.
Just me.
Speaker 1 (16:08):
All right, let's move on to Jessica Alba playing Sue
Storm or the Invisible Woman inFantastic Four 2005.
All right.
So I think in terms of thecomic book representation of Sue
Storm, this is the worstrepresented character.
I do think that Jessica Albaportrayed Sue Storm in the movie
as well as she could have.
(16:30):
I think that Sue Storm shouldbe the emotional compass and the
moral strength of Marvel'sfirst family.
I think that she was basicallyheavily leaned on for
objectification and thesuperficial look of her.
Basically she was the drawcardfor the target audience, you
might say, and to the pointwhere it is widely said that the
(16:50):
titular scene where she turnsherself invisible on the bridge,
only for the male charactersafter her to just get through
normally.
So the pointless striptease youmight say was in there just to
you know objectify her evenfurther.
She had some uh things to sayabout that and that scene wasn't
written in the movie untilafter she accepted the role.
So with that, with sue storm'scharacter being relegated to
(17:14):
that kind of thing, was a bigdisappointment for me because,
as as I said earlier, she is myfavorite member of the Fantastic
Four because she is thisemotional rock for the team and
it's epitomized most inFantastic Four 280 to 284 when
she actually becomes a darkpersona malice because the boys
(17:34):
in a Fantastic Four go withouther for a time and it shows just
how much emotional strengththey take from her.
She's able to reclaim herselfin the end and then it shows
that after that her strengthsdon't really lie in brute force
or anything like that.
It comes in her self-knowledgeand her compassion and her
control and that is what shethen offers to the other members
(17:55):
of the Fantastic Four.
And she is also probably themost powerful member of the
Fantastic Four.
She has the shields that cannot only shield everybody but
she can create them within aperson to stop oxygen or blood
from leaving or going into theheart.
She is an extremely powerfulperson in this Fantastic Four
team and I think that JessicaAlba did the best that she could
(18:17):
with the writing that she hasdone, but I think in terms of
her comic book comparison thisis an utterly woeful
representation for me.
I also think that it's alwaysbeen explained that Sue got her
powers of invisibility becauseReed never sees her and I don't
think that that's why she gother powers of invisibility in
force field.
I think that she got her powersof force field because she is
(18:38):
the emotional protector of theentire team and her children
when they do come along.
And she has an empower ofinvisibility because a lot of
the time she neglects her ownneeds for the needs of the team
and in that way she, her needs,are invisible.
So through that justificationis how I like to see sue storm
in the Fantastic Four andthrough this she was really only
(19:01):
given like power and successthrough the man's kind of world
of her being this scientificfigure or the second in charge
to Victor, but really because hethen went and proposed to her.
It was almost like she only gotthat promotion because Victor
despite Reed, which means herentire character development was
(19:22):
centered on the fact thatVictor and Reed were feuding,
which I didn't really enjoy withthat.
So I think Albert did a goodjob with what she was given and
she was obviously a draw for thebig teenage audience and she
did what she needed to do interms of the objectification and
all that kind of stuff.
But I just don't think that itkind of worked for me as a comic
(19:45):
book adaptation.
What about you?
Speaker 2 (19:47):
I 100% agree.
But yeah, and I feel, if itwasn't so, this comes back to
them forcing Victor to be themain bad guy in the first movie.
They had to have some sort ofanchor point for him to be upset
with the team, but more so Reed.
Unfortunately, Sue became thatthing because her portrayal of
(20:11):
Sue Storm I thought wasextremely good.
She is the one who's whenJohnny's playing up goals.
Johnny, when Ben's feeling downabout himself, says you're
alright, man, you're good, it'sall good, weals Johnny.
When Ben's feeling down abouthimself, he says you're all
right, man, you're good, it'sall good, we'll figure it out.
Reed's got this, just trust him.
Blah, blah.
And then when Reed's workingtoo hard or getting too focused
on his work or getting toodistracted by his work, able to
(20:34):
pull him out and say hey, youneed to refocus, just take a
break, refocus.
Speaker 1 (20:39):
Rash.
These are really good points.
Man, these are good points.
Speaker 2 (20:42):
So I feel like Sue Storm.
The character and the way Albaplays her is pretty spot on to
Sue.
The only thing is that it'sovershadowed by the
over-sexualization and the factthat she becomes the piece of
meat that Victor and Reed fightover Yep, the over sexualization
and the fact that she becomesthe piece of meat that victor
(21:02):
and reed fight over yep and umlike and yes, that pointless,
pointless strip scene which theydid again in the second movie
as well, like really early onthey did it again, I know yeah,
and she's like why does italways happen to me?
and it's like because, jessica,you are extremely beautiful.
But do that?
That is why and that gets theteenage boys in.
(21:25):
Yeah, but I I feel like, takeaway those stupid sexualization
moments, make victor's arcfanned over two movies or three
movies, instead of just tryingto somehow make him hate them so
much really quickly because ofa girl, and that's the only way
you can actually do it in thatshort span of time.
(21:46):
Take away that part and youhave a pretty spot on perfect
glue that holds the FantasticFour together.
In Sue Storm, jessica Alba.
Speaker 1 (21:54):
Yeah, one thing I would have liked to see as well
was a lot of the time in thecomics Sue kind of leads the
team because Reed's wrapped upin saving the world science like
he does.
So she takes a leadership rolequite often, and I think that
that's what they're going to doin the new Fantastic Four first
steps.
Maybe they're going to actuallylook at Sue as being more of a
leadership figure.
That being the case, I thinkthat's the case because in the
(22:16):
trailer you can see that, um,that Sue kind of leads these two
individuals through the Baxterbuilding as if she's the ceo of
the future foundation company,which which reed sort of
establishes, and he's more ofthe, the tv personality slash
science guy basically thatdevelops all the technology on
the side, like she's the face ofthe company, and that that sort
of strategic leadership, Ithink, of the team was kind of
(22:37):
missing as well, for me as well.
Like on an equal footing atleast everybody else and again
um.
Speaker 2 (22:43):
I believe it.
She shows that more in thesecond movie as the one who's
sort of like the um, like uh,starts calling some of the shots
, yeah, and also negotiatingwith the surfer as well, like
she's able to do that exactly,yeah, and she's.
She's sort of more taking pointand like, even when, um, they're
trying to save that Ferriswheel, in the end Reed comes up
(23:04):
with the idea to use Johnny'spowers to weld it back together.
But it's Sue, like when they'reall starting to fall apart and
Sue's like trying to hold thisFerris wheel out, she's the one
that's like hey, guys, gettogether, what are you doing?
Like I'm struggling herebecause I'm doing all the work.
And then that's when I sort oflike, because we're all sort of
(23:26):
bickering and falling apart, andSue's like like, guys, come on,
guys, we need to do something.
And everyone's sort of like allright, yeah, let's get into
gear.
Speaker 1 (23:33):
And then that's when Reed's like yeah, they start to
click the panic sets.
But she's the one, yeah, she'sthe one that sort of snaps them
into work mode.
You might say yeah.
Speaker 2 (23:42):
So again, I reckon Jessica Allaway did a really
good job.
It was just unfortunate thatthey forced her to be also the
eye candy and the piece of meatthat the guys fight over yeah,
alright.
Speaker 1 (23:56):
What do you rate her performance?
Speaker 2 (23:57):
I rate her performance.
If it was purely just of what Isee of Sue Storm and just
blocking out all thesexualization, I reckon she'd be
a 4, but because of all thesexualization that she was
forced to do in it it sort ofdrags her down to like a 3.5
yeah, I'll probably give her a 4because I think that the fact
that she was able to do what shewas able to do, but also
(24:18):
knowing that they were using hercharacter for that, is just a
testament for Descalba as anactress.
Speaker 1 (24:24):
She was able to go through and actually lean into
the aspects of the characterthat were positive in terms of
Sue Storm and not let thenegative that was happening
throughout the movie detractfrom her performance in other
aspects.
So you really convinced methrough this that there were
aspects of it that I kind oflooked at and didn't really
appreciate, because I do withthat thing that a lot of marvel
fans do when they've read a lotof the comic books which I have
(24:44):
I'm a big fan of the fantasticfour comics where you're kind of
looking at it going that's notwhat I know and that's not what
I love, and it's like theexpectation versus reality of it
kind of drew me out of it.
But when you're putting thosepoints together and saying you
know she actually does do thesethings within the movie is just
on a shorter scale, becauseobviously that's what they have
to do in a movie.
You really, yeah, pointed themout to me.
Speaker 2 (25:03):
Well, brash, I'm going to change my thing about
the four then, because I'm goingto ignore all this
sexualization and I'm just goingto go, based off her
performance, without those parts.
Speaker 1 (25:11):
Beauty.
Alright.
So with that, we're going tomove on to Michael Chiklis, who
plays Ben Grimm or the Thing inthe 2005 Fantastic Four movie.
First things first, we can'ttalk about Michael Chitlis
without talking about hisabsolute commitment to this role
through his tragictransformation of the thing, his
emotional isolation, but alsothe actor's isolation in terms
(25:33):
of he was the only one wearingprosthetics and the prosthetics
took three or six hours to apply.
It was extremely hot when theywere shooting in various
locations.
Speaker 2 (25:40):
However, they did have to do a Canada shootcouver
and he said he was verycomfortable there yeah, everyone
else was cold and he was warmand that was that fight like the
end fight scene.
Speaker 1 (25:48):
Yeah, that was the end fight scene and especially
because a lot of them were likewet with all the water and
things like that.
But yeah, you know, he got hispayoff in the end.
But uh, michael chiklis amassive fan of the comic books
he is he's definitely there topreserve the authenticness of
Ben Grimm and the Thing.
I think the main things thatthe Thing needs is he needs to
be the kind-hearted caramelcenter of the team.
(26:15):
He's like the big puppy dogthat everyone sort of gathers
around.
He has the potential to explode, obviously in moments of anger
when his people are being hurt,gathers around.
He has the potential to explode, obviously in moments of anger
when his people are being hurtand pushed around.
But I feel like he also needsto be that gooey center that
really unites and talks topeople through their problems
and is that supportive bestfriend or that emotional rock
you might say to Reed Richardswhich I feel like he is,
(26:36):
especially through their earlybreakup with Sue Storm.
Michael Chiklis plays him assomebody who's still friends
with Sue, understands why sheleft him, because that's
obviously his best friend,reed's biggest fault, which he
does not deny, and then you know, I think he is a character that
goes through that emotionalturmoil, that bitterness and
that loneliness get to him,which is why he succumbs to
(26:56):
Doom's offer to change himsooner, and it's why he also
gets so frustrated with Reed andSue after they take that one
afternoon off.
I think Checklist played thatreally really well as well.
He has some critical receptionsfor this that I've looked up.
Roger Ebert wrote thatChecklist brought a sense of
humanity to a man trapped in arock suit and he elicits genuine
(27:17):
sympathy in a film otherwisedevoid of much character depth.
Empire magazine also commentedhim or commended him rather, for
playing the thing really well.
They remarked that he anchorsthe film's emotionality, even
while buried in latex layers.
So he's his performance for mewas was really good.
Two things I wish they did interms of his character
(27:38):
development, which I don't knowhow they could have done, but
it's comic book accurate andwhich is what I want to see in
Fantastic Four First Steps isobviously his cultural identity
is that he's a Jewish superhero,so I would have liked to see a
little bit of that In FirstSteps.
They've got Ebon Mas Bakarak,who is a Jewish actor, to play
him.
I'm not sure if they'll diveinto that, but maybe there'll.
And then also, the thing is avery or.
(28:00):
Ben Grimm is a very prominentmember of the Yancey Street gang
in New York.
He grew up with nothing.
Basically in the comic books hewas a street kid and he still
has those ties to the communityof New York no-transcript, so
(28:30):
that, uh, chickless and the roleof the thing ben grim would
actually start to feel a littlebit of acceptance for his new
form.
But the biggest thing that theyhad to get right for the thing
is that he had to be the onethat was playing the person who
was the most emotionallydevastated from this
transformation, which I think hedid very well.
Speaker 2 (28:48):
Yeah, oh yeah, because I thought I got shit on
the whole entire movie.
Oh yeah, I have to sayMichael's probably the out of
all of them.
As much as I do love JessicaAlba's suit in the Underlayers,
michael was probably the bestperformer in this whole entire
movie and the one who probablytook the most care in it.
Speaker 1 (29:09):
Like even adding scenes like on the bridge, when
his ex-fiancee comes and leavesthe ring and he goes to pick it
up.
It was his idea to actuallystruggle with picking it up,
which was literally tear-jerkingwhen you watch that.
Speaker 2 (29:22):
That is so hard.
Speaker 1 (29:24):
In front of everybody .
Speaker 2 (29:25):
And yeah, and like you just imagine the rest of the
crowd just looking and justwatching him try to pick up this
ring and no one's like helpinghim, like it's just like.
But I do like eventually, likewhen the police go to arrest him
and everyone's like, and thefire pit is like hey guys, he's
a hero, and everyone startsclapping at you for him.
I didn't like that and when Ifirst watched it I was like I'm
(29:48):
like, ah, it's going to startturning around for him and
people are going to becauseinitially because that was their
first sort of showing, um, inthat, in that seat, that
everyone cheering for me, for me.
When I first saw it, I was like, oh cool, this is when people
are going to start turningaround and there's still,
there's still going to be, somefear towards him.
But this is where it's going tostart turning around and it's
(30:09):
going to be.
Everyone's going to startaccepting him gradually more now
and then that's pretty muchstraight away forgotten.
But everyone cheered him on thebridge and everyone goes back
to hating him again straightafter that.
It's it's like ah.
Speaker 1 (30:20):
Yeah, I think that was important to do, though,
because obviously Ben's arcthrough this whole thing was
finding that self-acceptance,and I really liked, at the end,
when he obviously succumbed toDoom's proposal to turn him
early, because he was notcomfortable with who he was in
himself in his new form.
Through this change andtraumatic event that he'd gone
(30:41):
through.
He wasn't comfortable with whohe was in himself in his new
form.
Through this change andtraumatic event that he'd gone
through, he wasn't comfortablewith who he was because he had
this strong attachment to who hewas previously and he couldn't
fathom, you know, being this newversion of ben grim.
But in the end, he decided tochange himself back to the thing
in order to help his friends,which was a really good
character development momentwhere you got to actually see,
(31:01):
hey, this is the thing, and thesame way with the comics that
you know is self-sacrificing,gives for his family and the
Fantastic Four and actually, youknow, puts other people first,
which is what he kind of does,sometimes to the detriment of
himself, but he is always theone that is being turned to for
those moments of strength,whether it be physical or
(31:22):
emotional.
So I kind of like that his arcwent in that way.
And then by the end of themovie, when Reed isn't at the
party on the boat and he'stalking to Ben and he says you
know, I could probably do this,that and the other to fix you up
, and Ben actually says you knowwhat?
All good, I'm good as is.
That's like the bestculminating part for his arc.
Speaker 2 (31:39):
for me, because of that way they went.
I think everyone cheering forhim on the bridge sort of then
makes that whole net, whole endarc of him self-sacrificing and
turning on them then being like,no, I need to help my friends
and you know I can do.
That is how I was, um, and I'lldo that for them.
(31:59):
It sort of sort of takes a step, makes him, makes them take a
step backwards, because allthese people he's been on camera
, he was being filmed,everyone's cheering for him.
I kind of wish that they'dcheer for the others, but still
looked at him with disdainbecause, realistically, he's the
one that started that crash bystanding in front of the truck
to save that guy.
Speaker 1 (32:17):
That's just quietly.
Speaker 2 (32:18):
He did.
He did the right thing bysaving the guy.
But in the meantime you saw ataxi fly over into a bunch of
gas tanks and explode.
The two inside the car is deadstraight up.
So many people died.
So many people died in thatcrash and the explosions saving
that one guy who wanted to killhimself.
I mean honestly, I mean youknow yeah, that's the bridge
(32:40):
scene.
Speaker 1 (32:40):
That is like it's a great production scene because
the amount of cgr the amount ofwork and all that.
All the work was really greatbut unfortunately in the story
the way that it was is just likeit just made no sense.
It was kind of like they neededto.
They needed to let thefantastic four show their powers
for the first time and that wasthe best they could come up
with.
That was, yeah, like they couldhave made doom come and zap
some stuff or, you know, just aregular old car crash.
Speaker 2 (33:04):
That.
Or even like, introduce adifferent bad guy to right there
, to for them to be like, ohwait, we got powers now we can
help in this situation.
And then show that and stilllike everyone's like everyone.
Be like oh man, that's so cool,you can stretch, oh man, that
everyone's like everyone.
Be like oh man, that's so cool,you can stretch, oh man, that's
so cool.
He turns into fire and fliesaround and shoots firewalls and
then, oh cool, she can goinvisible and make force fields
(33:24):
and stuff.
Oh, it's a rock.
And they could still do thatand that could still make that
sort of separation between themand alienating Ben, because
everyone's all fascinated withthem, the other three and still
has, because ben, which can helpthat sort of self-loathing grow
, yeah, to the point wherevictor's proposal is actually
(33:46):
more attractive than then.
Hey, they went away for thenight or for an afternoon, for a
couple hours.
They've forgotten about you and, realistically, the whole like
the thing was ready and um reedwas like it's ready, we just
somehow need more power, that's.
All they needed was more powerto run it, and it would have
worked.
Speaker 1 (34:05):
Yeah, the science was thin in this movie too, which I
didn't like.
For a fantastic four movie, Ineeded some techno babble like
star trek to keep me yeah, keepit like.
Speaker 2 (34:13):
But like the thing, the whole thing was ready, but
he just he wanted to make surebecause I want to make sure that
was and that that was anotherthing about reed him being so
meticulous and it it driving himelse nuts because he's being so
meticulous.
He just needed more power andit would have worked.
But he was struggling thatmoment to try and find a source
of power like that that could doit, because victor had to throw
(34:34):
a fair chunk of his energy inthere and he drew a lot of it
out as well.
But, um well, he gained a lot ofit as well from the discharge.
Yeah, he, in that afternoon hecame back.
He refreshed me like all right,guys, we need a lot of energy.
Oh, we know, we have asupernova who could probably
create a lot of energy.
Why don't we use Johnny topower it up?
(34:55):
Fair enough, power solved.
But they're like, but he's.
But there he comes sneaky.
Julian mcmahon hey, they'vegone out for the evening.
They don't love you anymore.
They think you're ugly andtedious too.
Speaker 1 (35:08):
Ha ha, they're never gonna fix you, even though the
machine's pretty much done yeah,he knew he was getting quick,
but yeah, I think that's anothertime where the, the writing
lets down the, the characterdevelopment.
But in terms of the actor, interms of the actor and the
character, I think, yeah, Iwould rate him.
I'd probably rate this guy afive.
I think five out of five for mefor Michael Chiklis and the
(35:30):
thing, just because hiscommitment to the authenticity
and also actually I'll probablygive it a 4.5 because I don't
think he was I'll give it a 4.5.
It wasn't as sensitive, as I'dlike the thing to be in terms of
like how he was emotionallythere for the rest of the
Fantastic Four, I'd say.
But you know he had just gonethrough a very traumatic event
and at the moment he was veryself-focused.
Speaker 2 (35:51):
I guess you could say yeah, well, within the span of
like not very long, he gotturned into a rock monster
monster.
His wife, who they like whenthey're talking about things
like you know, like we're gonnabe together forever, no matter
what, and then she's like, nah,straight up, straight up, he, he
went through enough that wouldbreak any normal person and, um,
(36:15):
his resilience, I think isdetrimental in that and what.
What actually I liked so muchabout like him and because as
much as johnny annoyed me abouthow mean he was to him,
detrimental in that and whatactually I liked so much about
him, because as much as Johnnyannoyed me about how mean he was
to him his resilience in justbrushing him off and everything
like that and just crushing hiscar and throwing it around.
Speaker 1 (36:32):
Yeah, no, it was a good ball I liked that To me.
Speaker 2 (36:34):
You need to do more kind of that stuff where Johnny
does stuff to either tease himor do stuff like that, so then
he gets him back by justthrowing his car.
Also I agree 4.5.
Speaker 1 (36:46):
Very good, all right, so let's get into our most
valuable takeaways.
This is the mvt section, themost valuable takeaway, the
heart and soul of this podcast,where we break down the one
thing that hits hardest, stucklongest or taught us something
new from what we just watched.
(37:07):
It's our moment to spotlightthe takeaway that made us think,
feel or see things differently,whether it's a killer, a moral
punch or a next level piece ofmovie craft.
This is what we learned fromFantastic Four 2005.
Do you want to go first, or me?
Speaker 2 (37:22):
You can go first because mine might tee off, okay
.
Speaker 1 (37:24):
So my one is about Ben Grimm and it is about the
inner struggle for acceptance.
So my most valuable takeawayfrom this is sort of in answer
to the question what do you dowhen something irreversible
happens to you or a changehappens to you and it changes
how you see yourself or how theworld sees you?
And it's very, very hard and ithappens to everybody.
(37:44):
It's something that happensthroughout everybody's life.
And I think that for Ben itwasn't just about the fact that
he changed and his looks changed, but his identity changed, like
his self-worth changed.
It was tied to his humanity andthe way that he was normal and
the way that he interacted withhis friends and his
relationships and hissignificant partners.
And he then had to sort ofshift and he had to force
(38:07):
himself to relearn how he sawhimself.
But then at the same time hewas going through the fact that
other people kind of saw him ina different light as well.
So it kind of equates thatworth with appearance or
function, like what he's able todo, and I think that that's a
(38:27):
pitfall that sometimes peoplefall into where they look at
external validation and there'salso this initial desperation to
undo that change like,especially when traumatic events
happen, it's like people wantto undo the bad thing that
happened to them, whereas whenwe hate who we've become, then
you become vulnerable to likeexploitation and you've got to
(38:49):
kind of learn that no externalchange will resolve the internal
rejection that you feel foryourself.
So the thing about the thing,the thing about the thing is
when he actually chooses to bethe thing again.
That's when he realizes, youknow, he stops seeing his
condition as a curse, he acceptshis identity as more than just
his form and you know, he'sshowing up with what he has at
(39:12):
that time and he has thisself-determination that he can
enact change and be himself.
And he gains showing up withwhat he has at that time and he
has this self-determination thathe can enact change and be
himself and he gains thisself-respect and this community
and this sense of purpose thathe's able to move with.
And it's also that message thatnot all change is chosen and
not all change is visible, butevery change gives us a chance
to either resist and remainbitter, or accept and adapt and
(39:36):
grow stronger, which is what Ithink he was able to do by the
end of the movie.
It's kind of like because forthe longest time with me I was
always somebody who I valued formyself.
That's something that I wantedto change.
A lot about myself was that Iwanted to be like organized and
punctual and on time to things,and I wanted to be able to
(39:56):
complete complex tasks and beable to do all those things.
So I had this self-perceptionof what I kind of wanted to be
and I was constantly trying tofix that about myself all my
life.
And then when I got a ADHDdiagnosis, I kind of had this
mentality where I was like well,I now I can't do that because
it's who I am Like, that's who Iam.
And you know, it wasn't the factthat I I couldn't do that
(40:21):
anymore or I couldn't worktowards doing that.
It was the fact that myself-perception of it was that
now, because this is now labeled, it's actually like a quote
mark detriment to me, it'ssomething that I can't do, where
, in fact, I kind of just had tolearn new ways to do it instead
of what the normal ways thatpeople would try to do those
things are.
So for me I kind of resonatedwith him, even though my
(40:45):
transformation, you might say,wasn't physical.
It was kind of like a mentalchange for me where I kind of
had to come to terms with thefact that the identity that I
wished for myself and the onethat I was working on, I had to
shift.
The manner in which I wastrying to achieve that and it
was.
It was really detrimental for awhile because I was like, why
isn't this working?
Why can't I stick to this?
Why can't I do this so in thatway?
(41:07):
And it's taken heaps of time,it's taken so much time, more
than a two-hour movie.
But that's kind of what Igained from this is that that
change that you go through youknow it doesn't always have to
be visible and doesn't alwayshave to like, but it has to be
chosen.
It has to be something that youchoose to do and you have to
accept and adapt and then grow,which is what Ben Grimm was able
(41:28):
to do in this movie, and youknow I'm still working on it,
but I feel like I've been ableto do it in some level too with
my thing.
So that's my takeaway.
Thanks, ben, that's beautiful.
Speaker 2 (41:40):
Thanks, man.
I'm pretty much going to haveto piggyback off what she said,
because mine was similar toyours in that it's no matter
what, whoever you are in thisworld, shit's always going to
happen and sometimes you justgotta roll the punches and it's
just um.
Have that.
It's hard, hard to do, but havethat acceptance of yourself.
(42:02):
Yeah, like how ben has to haveeventually come to the
acceptance that for him to dowhat he needs to do, which and
what he he thinks is right andhow he feels, and that is
protect his family, he has tomake that sacrifice of becoming
the thing and and then heaccepts that and becomes really
(42:23):
like his true self by acceptingthat same with like Johnny in
the second one, where he's likehas to sort of let go of that
attention seeking and vanity tobecome someone that the other
team can actually rely oninstead of becoming a nuisance.
Speaker 1 (42:38):
Yeah, he had to drop that mask, like the mask that
he'd been portraying toeverybody.
That made him feel safe,because he was showboating and
because if people don't likethat, that's fine, because
that's not really who I am.
Nobody sees the broken mebecause they see that showboat
and that's fine.
But whereas with Ben Grimm hisdifference was there for
(42:58):
everybody to see.
There was no masking.
That's the thing and you know,when you're going through things
like that it can lead you tosome dangerous paths because you
look for quick fixes anddifferent things work for
different people.
But you know a lot of peoplelook for quick fixes in
situations like that, orexternal solutions or validation
from others.
It's like a common human thing.
But yeah you've got to learn tobecome sort of self-determined
(43:24):
and get that sort of respect andhave self-acceptance as opposed
to other acceptance.
Speaker 2 (43:31):
Yeah and fantastic for and this is what I think,
what you're saying about the2015, how that one showed that
more the body dysmorphia side ofthings, I think that all of
them have gone through, like allthe Fantastic Four prime
examples, in different ways ofacceptance.
So Ben's is more physicalacceptance, johnny is more of a
(43:57):
Internal emotional, internalemotional maturity acceptance
and reads more of a.
He needs to accept the love andcare of people around him and
join in on that.
Speaker 1 (44:12):
Yeah, and also the limitations of his own
intelligence as well.
Speaker 2 (44:15):
Hubris is his hubris, yeah, instead of being like he
may be one of the smartestpeople on the planet, but that's
not going to solve all of hisproblems.
Um, and then sue is, she justneeds to accept the fact that
she can't be the emotional rockfor them in the heart and the
soul of them all the time.
She needs to take time forherself yes, perfect, um, and
(44:36):
and just needs that time toself-reflect and recharge.
And, as you were saying too,like I think, and everyone goes
through something's in a similarvein, but always different, and
it's just about accepting thatfact.
Like I wish I was, I wish myhair wasn't starting to recede,
even though I'm trying my bestto not let it recede.
(44:57):
I wish I was in better shapeNot that I'm in terrible shape,
but I wish I was just in theshape I was in like four years
ago, not that long ago andthere's things I can do to fix
that, but then there's alsoother things in my life that are
stopping me from focusing onthat, and there's things I can
do to fix that, but then there'salso other things in my life
that are stopping me fromfocusing on that, and there's
(45:18):
just so much going on and justat some point you just have to
be like all right, I can't, Ican't focus on trying to do all
these things.
I need to focus on one thing ata time and just accept that
life is chaotic and that I canonly do certain things and that
I can't do everything at once.
Speaker 1 (45:36):
Yeah, and I think also there is that acceptance
and that realization that thereis a version.
This is where everybody is likethere is a version of you that
you can be proud of and it's notlike all the way down the road
like you can be proud of who youare right now.
And there are things about youthat you can be proud of right
now, and you might be looking atthe things that you're you're
(45:58):
lacking in terms of what youdon't have, but there are also a
lot of things that you mighthave that you can be really sort
of accepting of as well.
And I think that's that's thefocus shift that that ben went
through in this movie.
Uh, he, he had to be acceptingof the fact that, hey, in this
particular situation, thesechanges that occurred to me are
actually really helpful becauseI can go and assist my friends,
and that's something that Ivalue.
I value being there for myfriends and I value being able
(46:21):
to help others, and this enablesme to do that really, really
well.
But then also you know, he notso much Johnny, but I feel like
that there is like a subtleacceptance that happens between
Johnny and Ben at the end, whenthey sort of meet up and he puts
a hand on his shoulder and Bensays you know, you did good kid,
and they kind of have thatlittle moment.
There's definitely like a backand forth between them.
But I think he surroundshimself and in the comics
(46:43):
especially, he surrounds himselfwith people that love him for
who he is, and that's that's thepart that helps him through is
because he can see and look atthe parts of himself that he
likes as well, which is what Ithink is the takeaway too.
Speaker 2 (46:58):
Yeah, and another thing you have to accept the now
and work for the future.
If you're not accepting the nowand you're too busy trying to
focus on too many futures, thenyou're never going to get there
because you're splittingyourself off in too many
directions.
Speaker 1 (47:14):
That's Reed Richards' problem as well, literally,
because in the comic books heactually forms a council of
Reeds, because he can't solveall the world's problems alone.
So instead of doing any sort ofself-work and you know,
actually I- need more of me,yeah he's like I need more of me
to do the jobs I can't do,instead of him going.
Actually, this is just out of mywheelhouse.
I can't do that and I need toaccept it.
And you know, that kind ofself-determination is admirable
(47:38):
to a point, but also it causes alot of problems because it
leads to the arc which involvesthe maker in the comic book
series, which is just a veryvolatile version of Reed.
That's basically solvingeverything at all costs, no
matter the humanity that'sinvolved, and I think that, like
that is a very important aspectof it too, is accepting the now
(47:58):
is good.
All right, let's rate it.
All right, the fandom portal'son board.
Guys, it's time to rate andrank.
Each host gives the movie ascore out of five.
Then we take the average andadd it to our official
letterboxd on board.
If you want to follow along,you can find and track our
rankings anytime you like at ourletterboxd, which is at
fandomportals.
(48:18):
Alright, brash, what are yougiving?
Fantastic 4 from 2005.
Speaker 2 (48:23):
I was going to give it like a 3, 3.5, but after like
, how much we've talked about itand all the things we've talked
about within it, and even whenI was talking about sue storm,
so I was just talking because Ilike the character and the more
I was talking about and howyou're saying that it helped you
, um, change your mind on sue.
I think I only I changed my ownmind on sue a little bit
(48:46):
talking about because, because,actually, just talking through
it, I was like yeah, no, she,she does a lot of that, does a
lot of that thing, and yeah.
So I think I'm going to give ita four, nice.
Speaker 1 (48:57):
I like it.
You know, initially as well, Igave it a 2.5.
Initially I gave it a 2.5.
But I think, after talkingabout it and seeing how, with
the time spent that they got inthis hour and 40 something
minutes with that, and theamount that they kind of develop
the characters that they needto, and how they tried to make
it as comic accurate as theycould, I'm a character guy so I
like characters in movies a lotbetter than I.
(49:18):
I will deal with a characterdriven plot movie.
We cannot fight the fact thatthe plot in this movie is thin.
The villain is absolute trashrepresented in terms of the
story.
However, he has played wellwith what has been given there,
so I'm probably happy to givethis a 3.5.
It is going to have with yourrating of 4 and mine of 3.5,
it's going to have an average of3.75, which means we have to
(49:40):
determine whether it is betteror worse than Spider-Man.
No Way Home.
Speaker 2 (49:45):
I honestly, again, this is still hard, this is hard
.
Speaker 1 (49:49):
I'm going to say under, though I will probably
say under as well.
Speaker 2 (49:55):
But by say if it was like the average was 3.75, like
Best Wish Board would be like3.74.
Speaker 1 (50:03):
Yes, only just, only, just below, only just Okay.
So we're going to put it on ourfandom portals on a board, guys
, and it is going to situnderneath Spider-Man no Way
Home, which means it is sevenoverall.
It sits directly above Sonicthe Hedgehog, so it's in our top
10.
Leading the fandom portals onboard is still the Crow, with an
average of 4.25.
(50:23):
So we'll see how we go.
Let's go into our sign-offs.
Alright, ladies and gentlemen,boys and girls, this is the end
of our first episode in ourMarvel month.
We have just looked atFantastic Four from the 2005 era
.
If you wanted to join ourcommunity, you can do so by
looking at our threads and ourInstagram and also our Reddit.
(50:44):
Those links are in the shownotes below and, as you may have
heard, we are doing a giveaway.
If Brash and I are able to earn15 points by learning so much
about all the Marvel movies thatwe're doing, then you will have
a chance to win a pass to takeyourself and your family to the
movies, because we love sendingyou guys to movies.
So if you wanted to join that,if you wanted to be entered into
the giveaway, then you need togo down into our show notes and
(51:06):
click onwwwbandomportalspodcastcom or
just type it into your webbrowser and sign on to our
emailing list and we will drawour winner on the 30th of April
and you may be able to sendyourself to the movies with your
family, or you can just sendyourself four times if you want.
In May, there is theThunderbolts coming out, which
is a Marvel movie, so you'll getyour pass just in time for that
(51:27):
.
So make sure you go and enterour giveaway, because it could
be you.
It could be you sitting inthere with a free movie on us
here at the Fandom Portalspodcast.
Ladies and gentlemen, boys andgirls here.
We are a small podcast, so wereally thrive on word of mouth.
If you would share this with afriend, that would be absolutely
amazing Anybody that lovesFantastic Four, any member of
(51:48):
your Fantastic Four family, orjust somebody that likes
superheroes or Marvel.
Next week, braj, do you want totalk about what we're doing
next week on the podcast?
Speaker 2 (51:58):
Yes, so next week will be New Mutants, new Mutants
.
Speaker 1 (52:02):
I have a soft spot for this movie as even though it
was critically not goodaccording to most people, I have
a soft spot for it.
I think there are elements ofthis that we can definitely
enjoy the new Minz that was madein 2020, directed by Josh Boone
.
That is our next movie that youcan see on the Phantom Portals
(52:23):
podcast.
Make sure you follow the showso you will not miss that
episode.
Brash, it has been an absolutepleasure.
Some may say it was fantastic.
Speaker 2 (52:32):
And for all our listeners out there.
Sometimes you may feelphysically rocky, sometimes you
just might be invisible, youmight feel stretched too thin or
sometimes just might beoverwhelmed with the fire that
is this world currently.
But just remember that we loveyou here and we appreciate every
single one of you can't tellthat.
Speaker 1 (52:52):
See you guys.
Thank you so much.
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