Jersey Girl (2004) – Kevin Smith’s Sweetest Swing, Ben Affleck and JLo's Off Screen Impact and Embracing Quirky Authenticity

Episode Summary:
In this episode of The Fandom Portals Podcast, Aaron and Brash revisit Kevin Smith’s most divisive film: Jersey Girl. Departing from his usual vulgar wit and the View Askewniverse, Smith explores fatherhood, grief, and second chances in this misunderstood dramedy starring Ben Affleck, Liv Tyler, and George Carlin. The hosts reflect on how real-life publicity, editing regrets, and emotional resonance shaped this movie’s legacy—and whether it deserves its Razzie rep. Plus, insights from Reddit and Threads, Kevin Smith trivia, and the always chaotic Fandom Fact Face-Off.

Topics:

• Kevin Smith’s pivot from Jay & Silent Bob to heartfelt drama
• The Bennifer effect: How tabloids tanked Jersey Girl’s reception
• George Carlin’s final role and understated performance
• The child actor conundrum: Raquel Castro’s performance
• Why Liv Tyler’s character feels dated (and a little cringey)
• Behind-the-scenes regret: the 30 minutes cut due to J.Lo backlash
• Ben Affleck’s subtle performance and emotional arc
• Deleted scenes, missed cameos, and Bruce Springsteen’s near-involvement
• Personal reflections on fatherhood, identity, and living for love over legacy

Key Takeaways:

• Jersey Girl was Smith’s personal risk—a film about loss, parenting, and redemption—but got buried under Bennifer gossip and fan expectations.
• Kevin Smith now regrets cutting 30 minutes of emotional depth due to public backlash.
• The film’s emotional core lies in accepting love in unexpected places and embracing quirky authenticity, like Ollie supporting Gertie’s oddball Sweeney Todd musical.
• Ben Affleck’s nuanced grief performance gets more credit today than it did in 2004.
• The message: True love isn’t reshaping people to fit your world—it’s choosing to enter theirs, flaws and all.

Quotes:

“True love isn't about molding someone into your world—it's about stepping into theirs.”
 “He kept calling her ‘the kid’—until the moment he saw her for who she was.”
 “You’re the only thing I’ve ever been good at.”
 “That street sweeper was the Batmobile to her. That’s all that matters.”

Apple Podcast Tags:
Jersey Girl, Kevin Smith, Ben Affleck, Liv Tyler, George Carlin, View Askewniverse, Movie Analysis, Fatherhood Films, Pop Culture Podcast, Geek Freaks Network, Fandom Portals Podcast, Movie Trivia, Film Deep Dive, 2000s Cinema, Jennifer Lopez

Contact Us:
Website: https://www.fandomportalspodcast.com/

Instagram: instagram.com/fandomportals/?locale=en
Threads: threads.net/@fandomportals
Email: [e-mail]
Letterboxd: https://letterboxd.com/fandomportals

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
All right, in this episode, we are going to be
covering Jersey Girl, made in2004, and you will learn how
stepping away from Kevin Smith'sunusual style shaped the fate
of Jersey Girl, how thesurprising power of real world
publicity can impact the moviefor better or worse, and you
will also learn why embracingindividuality might just be the
secret to building stronger,more meaningful relationships.

(00:22):
Welcome to the Fandom Portalspodcast, the podcast that

(00:42):
explores how fandoms can help uslearn and grow.
This week, Brash and I aretackling the Kevin Smith classic
Jersey Girl, made in 2004.
It's a movie about a widowerwho must look after his
precocious daughter and rebuildhis life and career after he's
sidelined by an unexpectedtragedy and a personal blow-up.
Before we get into that, we'regoing to do our gratitudes.
Brash, how are you going today?

Speaker 2 (01:04):
I am very good.
I was actually trying to findsomething from the movie I could
quote on my entrance at IntroInn and unfortunately, that's
okay, because you're the onlything I've ever been good at.
Ooh, yeah, got it Nice.
I was going to go the line fromone of the only lines I found
really funny, from when the kidshave to to at the very start,
when the kids are doing liketheir hotel or talking about

(01:26):
their parents jobs and the longkids like oh, my parents are
very religious.
I could hear him screaming atjesus.
I thought I was like ah yes noum, anyway, what are you
grateful for, brad?
What's?

Speaker 1 (01:38):
like grateful for um.

Speaker 2 (01:41):
I am grateful for my neighbors.
This week I had to go away forwork for just a night and they
fed their little buddy, ace, forme, and I'm always grateful.
They're always there to help meout if I need it or look after
Ace when I need it, which isn'ttoo often.
And the next time will be whenwe go to Melbourne to watch

(02:02):
Critical Role.
And that's four nights, fivedays, being away from Ace.
So I struggled one night.
Let's see how long I can goafter five days.

Speaker 1 (02:13):
I feel the same way, man, I feel the same way.
Yeah, very excited for CriticalRole trip to Melbourne, but,
yeah, the time away from lovedones and loved pets and things
like that is going to be tricky.
My gratitude in the spirit ofthis movie, jersey Girl, goes to
my partner, kalia.
I've talked about her on thepodcast before but I'm very
thankful for her.
This movie, especially in someof the themes in it, made me

(02:37):
realize how lucky I am to raisechildren with a loving and
devoted partner.
So thank you, kalia, for allthat you do, thank you for the
sacrifices you make and I loveyou very much.

Speaker 2 (02:43):
From Aaron no, I need to tell you more I do I need to
tell you more?

Speaker 1 (02:47):
and here I am telling it publicly to lots of people
in front of Brash.
Thank you very much.
I love you, Carly.
All right, Enough of the sappystuff, let's get into a Right
now.
Brash with Jersey Girl.
Okay, here's the call sheet.
This movie was directed byKevin Smith.
It was his sixth movie.
It was also written by KevinSmith.

(03:08):
Do you know any other KevinSmith movies?
Brash, I know nearly all ofthem, I believe.

Speaker 2 (03:14):
Give us a few.
Hasting Amy.
Yes, clerks, clerks.
2.
Clerks 3.
James Silent Bob.
James Silent Bob Strikes Back,correct Bob.
And Bob Bob struck back,correct, correct, correct.
Then you got more rats.

Speaker 1 (03:27):
duplex dogma, one of my favorite movies of all time.

Speaker 2 (03:29):
Yes, dogma rules genocide Bob reboot, which was
it was out.
It was a movie.
Yeah, there's the ones I canthink of.
And sorry, it wasn't genocideBob, it's genocide Bob strikes
back.
That's the movie, not genocideBob and then genocide Bob back,
but anyway, I got a sneezecoming.
I should Bust, bust, bust Goodmovies Dogma I love Dogma.

(03:49):
Dogma's one of my all timefavourite movies.

Speaker 1 (03:51):
He's definitely got a style which I think he did step
away from for Jersey Girl.
I saw an interview with himwhere he said that his mum was
quite happy with this onebecause he stepped away from his
usual language-rich type ofmovies where the four-letter
words are quite well-practicedand the themes are also quite
well-practiced.
So Kevin Smith's mother wasvery pleased with this one.

(04:13):
This movie stars Ben Affleck.
I have been on a Ben Affleckbinge for the last month and a
half.
I'm trying to watch as manymovies of Ben Affleck as I can,
and some of you might say thatis a monumentous feat, because
you know he has some really goodmovies and he also has some
absolute trash movies and he hassome that are very much in
between.
But I think he's a talentedactor and also a talented

(04:38):
filmmaker and a talented writeras well.
So this one is one of his moregrounded roles in a emotionally
driven sort of movie.
He is the leading characteralongside Liv Tyler.
He's also alongside GeorgeCarlin.
What do you think of GeorgeCarlin Rash?

Speaker 2 (04:54):
I love George Carlin.
The only time I've the more.
The most I've seen GeorgeCarlin is in Kevin Smith movies.
Yep.

Speaker 1 (05:00):
Some of the most I've seen.

Speaker 2 (05:01):
Yeah, comedy specials and I always loved George
Carlin.

Speaker 1 (05:08):
Yeah, I think he played a more serious role than
what people were used to seeinghim in, and Kevin Smith kind of
wanted to show his acting chopsin that space.
This was the last movie that hewas in before he unfortunately
passed away.
This one also has JenniferLopez in it for a brief period
of time We'll talk about that alittle bit later but it also
starred Raquel Castroro, whoplayed gertie.
The young girl in this moviebrashes on record as hating, uh,

(05:31):
child actors yep, unashamedlyhating child actors.
on raquel castro, just brieflymostly annoying sometimes all
right, as all seven-year yearolds should be Mostly annoying,
but sometimes alright.
This budget was $35 million andit made $35.5 million worldwide
, so it was considered a flop,so much so that it was nominated

(05:53):
for a Razzie Lots of Razzies.
Do you know what a Razzie is,brash?

Speaker 2 (05:56):
Like the worst movie of the year or something.

Speaker 1 (05:58):
It's pretty much the opposite of the Oscar.
It's called the GoldenRaspberry Awards, so basically,
when people blow the raspberryto a movie, not a serious award
show, it's a parody award showthat honors the worst films, and
Jersey Girl receivednominations for the worst actor
in Ben Affleck, worst supportingactress in Liv Tyler and the
worst on-screen couple, withAffleck and Jennifer Lopez being

(06:19):
nominated.
Jesus, they didn't win, but Ithink the public reception of
Ben Affleck and Jennifer Lopezinfluenced those votes at the
time, which is a bit of a shame,because this was a bit of a
passion project and a personalproject for Kevin Smith, and the
fact that it wasn't sosuccessful may have been
something that he's reflected onin years to come.

(06:41):
All right, let's get into ourhot takes.
This is our hot takes segment,where we discuss our first
thoughts of the media and unpackthe boldest opinions, from what
surprised us to what split theroom.
We'll also highlight your hottakes from our threads and
Instagram and Reddit communities.
So if you want to get involvedin that, check out the show
notes below.

(07:02):
This is your hot takes onJersey Girl 2004.
Br brash, what are your overallthoughts on the movie?
When was the first time youwatched this movie I think I
actually watched it.

Speaker 2 (07:12):
My mom bought it, I think, and I decided to watch it
with her in the lounge room, soI think I was moving about 14,
15 I think it was a similar age.

Speaker 1 (07:22):
My my introduction to this was a dvd.
I don't know who bought it, butyes, I watched it as well.
I think the first thing thatstood out to me was the fact
that I remember when this cameout there was a whole lot of
buzz around Jennifer Lopez andBen Affleck, which we'll get
into a little bit later.
But Jennifer Lopez didn'tappear in the film very much.

(07:44):
She was cut pretty early out,taken to heaven, you might say,
in childbirth.
She died yeah, she did.
I think this was a bit of adifferent movie for Kevin Smith
to bring out.
It was a love letter tofatherhood, so they say, and it
was inspired by the fact thatKevin Smith himself had just had
a child, harley Quinn Smith andI saw an interview with him

(08:11):
talking about the inspirationfor this movie and he saw his
wife playing with his daughterand he thought to himself how
lucky he was to have her andwhat it would be like to raise
that child without her.
And he wanted to explore thatand he wrote 50 pages of a
script and put it to the side.
And then a while later he wastalking to Ben Affleck at a 4th
of July party at Ben Affleck'shouse and Ben Affleck was just
coming off a few sort of bigHollywood projects like Pearl

(08:33):
Harbor and he was marketing thatmovie out everywhere and he
just wanted to get to somethinga little bit more grounded,
character driven.
That was dialogue heavy andKevin Smith said well, I've got
something here that I've written.
He handed the script over, orsent it over to Ben Affleck days
later and Ben loved the idea.
He thought it was exactly whathe needed to do, so he dove onto
it, being frequentcollaborators as well.

(08:54):
So the two of them got workingonto Jersey Girl.
But did you enjoy it upon yourfirst watch, brach?
Did you enjoy it on this watch?
What were your thoughts?

Speaker 2 (09:02):
Probably enjoyed it on the first watch, more so than
the second watch, because onthe first watch I was only 14,
15.
I was still young and dreamingabout the future and it probably
still hit me in the feels and,being from a family that's a
broken family, I didn't reallyget to see my dad too often.
I don't get to really see mydad too often, so I think sort

(09:24):
of it'd be harder, like not somuch that my dad's father was
dead and not in my life at all,but he wasn't always in my life.
So I think back then probablyhit me a bit.
It probably was like a bit of anicer watch and also I was a
fan of Kevin Smith's work andalso the titles in it and, being

(09:48):
a teenage boy, that's alwaysjust a good watch.
But yeah, uh, this watch.
However, yeah, it was like Ididn't feel as emotionally
towards it as I thought I wouldbe like looking at something.
I know they're not not thatdifferent in age, but for some
reason ben affleck just seems somuch older than live tyler.
For some reason it alwaysseemed like the Tyler was almost
a teenager and he was an adult.

Speaker 1 (10:04):
Well, I think in the movie he's in his mid-30s and
she's telling him that she's 26,27, so there is a bit of an age
difference there.

Speaker 2 (10:13):
I mean, yeah, but it seems it seems a bit more like
huge than that, because she'slike, oh, I'm doing the college
report and it seems like in his30s, like it.
Just it's just like because,and also like she's very like
spirited and happy and free andlots of flittery and stuff like

(10:34):
that and I don't know.
It just seems the connectionwas just not there for me.
Yeah, and then I'd forgottenJeff Lopez was even in the movie
and honestly, I couldn't eventell it was her when looking at
her until she spoke and I'm like, ah, it's Jeff Lopez, because
he has the same voice ineverything.
Yeah, yeah, it was a good watch,don't get me wrong.

(10:54):
It was still a good watch, butfor me it just wasn't as
impactful as it probably wasback when I was younger and now,
so that I'm in my 30s as welland don't have a family or
anything like that that I haveto worry about, it sort of
misses the mark for me, I guessfor me, because I'm like you

(11:16):
with family and obviously itmight impact you a little bit
differently.
Me, it's just like well, that'swhat you get for falling in
love, you idiot.

Speaker 1 (11:26):
My take was a little bit different to that.
I did enjoy the movie, but forme I was watching Ben Affleck
come to a realization that Ithink is pretty obvious.
So obviously he's trying to gethis career on track, but in the
process of that he's alsodetracting away from his
relationship with those peoplethat love him a lot, also

(11:46):
detracting away from hisrelationship with those people
that love him a lot.
And I think in my kind of lifeI have positioned myself in a
place where I can be there formy family as much as possible,
whilst also providing and beingthe provider and the protector
that I can be.
So for me it didn't really hitas an emotional realization that
Ben Affleck's character ofOllie goes through I didn't
think the same thing that he didand go through the journey as

(12:08):
he went through it.
It was almost for me watchinghim catch up.
I guess and that might sound,you know, arrogant or whatever
but I'm a very similar age towhat Ollie is in this story.
I'm a father of two as well andI think that, yeah, it just it
wasn't, and I'm not aaspirational businessman like he

(12:28):
is in this in the musicindustry, but it wasn't so much
of a hard shift for me, if youknow what I mean.
It was almost like a naturalkind of shift into like it was
difficult, it was tricky, butthat shift about being
aspirational with my work andthen also fatherhood like I've
always tried to sort of balancethem as best I can and always
prioritize fatherhood where Icould, whilst also still

(12:50):
providing so for me it was alittle bit of annoyance watching
Ben Affleck's character andthen I also looking at some of
the themes that were in this.
Now, like watching this andseeing some of the themes about
like how forward Liv Tyler'scharacter is upon just meeting
Ben Affleck's character, thatwas a little bit of a cringe for
me as well when I was watchingit.

(13:11):
Everybody can have their ownthing, that's fine, no judgment,
but it just felt a little bitforward for me.
I felt a bit uncomfortablewatching it, honestly, at my age
now.
So I like the movie, it's anenjoyable watch and I think
there's some definitely poignantthemes in it that can be
explored.
But yeah, I'm the same as you.
I didn't really enjoy it asmuch as I kind of did the first

(13:31):
time I watched it, where it wasa little bit more emotionally
impactful.
So, yeah, similar vibes.
Let's see what our threads hadto say.
Peruna, 2001.
Frequent commenter.
I think we mentioned thisperson last week as well.
So, peruna, thank you forcontinually commenting on our
threads.
They said I remember a lot ofdrama outside of the movie with
Ben Affleck and Jennifer Lopezand also Kevin Smith's first

(13:52):
move outside the Jay and SilentBob universe Funny because
everyone judged it because ofJiggly and didn't realize that
J-Lo was only in it.
Briefly.
I liked it in which Kevin Smithhad continued to make some
serious things.
I think I agree with some ofwhat Peruna said, but I also
disagree because I do like KevinSmith's comedic stuff as well

(14:13):
and I have watched him say ininterviews that this was like a
stretch for him.
It was him trying to flex hismuscles to do something a little
bit more serious, a little bitmore grounded, something that
was apart from the universe thathe's usually known for.
I think it's called the AskewUniverse or Askew Universe, yeah
, and it's basically theuniverse that features those

(14:34):
five interconnected movies withJay and Silent Bob as recurring
characters.
The thing with that is KevinSmith.
Yeah, yeah.
Kevin Smith also said that hewanted to try and make a movie
without the safety net of hispast movies to help him.
So a lot of times when he waswriting gags or writing jokes,

(14:56):
if he didn't know how to finishoff a punchline, he could just
slip in a gag or a reference toan old movie and an old
character and rely on some ofthe work he'd done before.
But he wanted to see if hecould go without that in this
Jersey Girl and tell a littlebit more of a personal story
about a message he wanted toportray.
We have Hagen Gabriel who saysthe little girl was funny, she

(15:17):
should have had a career incommercials or something, and
that they liked George Carlin init as well.
I think I agree with all ofthose points GC Sears says.
I always had a soft spot forJersey Girl, rewatched it a few
years ago and still enjoyed it,though Liv Tyler's character and
material hasn't aged well as Idiscussed before.

Speaker 2 (15:37):
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
I still have to say I love LivTyler.
For me it wasn't so much likeI'm comfortable, it was more
like it just seemed forced topush the story along.

Speaker 1 (15:46):
I think so too, and it was kind of exploring that.
It was almost like a will hejump at it or will he not, to
prove how dedicated he is toraising his child, like the
fabling test of morality for thecharacter of Ollie.
Will he jump at this chance orwill he continue to raise his
daughter and honour theconnection that he had with his
widowed partner or not?

(16:08):
Like that's kind of what itfelt like for me.
And then you know the manner inwhich of her forwardness it
also played into the part whereshe seemed like she was a little
bit more spirited and a littlebit younger than he was because
he'd already gone through acareer upward trend in the music
business and then a downfall,and then he then worked again.

(16:30):
you know, seven years had passedas he was raising his daughter
and seven years he was doing thestreet sweeper job.
So yeah, it's just kind ofdisplaced those two a little bit
.
We have BlackRockJoe, who was afan of our D&D Valiant Odyssey
show, and shout out to Joe ifyou're listening to this one for
following us over to our newpodcast, the Absolute Legend.
He says not a horrible movie atall, and I can agree with that

(16:52):
too.
Outside of the Box podcast,which is Christine, who's
guested on this show as well,she says hi Christine, yeah, hi
Christine.
It introduced her to SweeneyTodd, which is now one of her
favorite musicals of all time.

Speaker 2 (17:05):
One of my favorite musicals of all time as well.
I absolutely love Sweeney Todd.

Speaker 1 (17:09):
I love the movie adaptation of the musical
starring Johnny Depp and Helena.

Speaker 2 (17:13):
That was also extremely good as well.

Speaker 1 (17:15):
Yeah, yeah.
So I think this was actually myintroduction to Sweeney Todd
too, because I'd never heard ofit prior as well, Sweeney Todd
being the musical performancethat Gertie and Ollie and her
family does at the end of themovie in the third act.
All right, Seems like mostlypositive from our threads that
they say a lot of the same thingwhere it's.
The movie was underrated at thetime, but generally heartfelt

(17:40):
and quite well liked.
Let's see what our Reddit hasto say.
Yes, we have CursedSnowman5000.
That says I actually thought itwas a pretty good movie and
wish this was the avenue.
Kevin had gone down as amaturing director after leaving
the Jay and Silent Bob stuffwith Strikes Back, but sadly
that is not what happened.

Speaker 2 (17:59):
And probably a good thing, because then we wouldn't
have the boys.

Speaker 1 (18:04):
Hmm, did he write that or adapt it?

Speaker 2 (18:07):
And probably a good thing, because then we wouldn't
have the boys.
Mm, mm, did he write that oradapt it?
Yeah, he's the one thatproduced it, him and Kripke.
Oh nice From.

Speaker 1 (18:12):
Supernatural.
Yeah, Yep.
So we have DFGDF.
It says it's not his best movieand, as recent years have shown
, it's definitely not his worstmovie by a mile as well, Even if
critics ripped it apart at thetime.
That was more about theJennifer Ben thing that was
going on kind of right in themiddle of his filmography and a
good middle-quotest kind ofmovie for the recent decade, and

(18:37):
the performances were fun.
We also have a really, reallylong answer that comes from
Nolpillv2, and basically thesummary of it says that that
they find kevin smith the onlyone that can really bring the
heartfeltedness of a john hughesmovie into something that has

(18:57):
dick jokes and star wars babbleand characters that are older
than 20.
But he says that jersey girldoesn't really exemplify this,
but it is genuinely a sweetmovie and that they remember it
pretty fondly as well.
So I think it's quitepositively received now in 2025,
but I don't think that was thecase in 2004.

(19:18):
Yeah, it's definitely the casein Rotten Tomatoes as well the
aggregate site and they'vebasically given it a 42% on the
tomato meter and for theaudience score it's not much
better a 48%, I think.
At the time it was definitelynot well received, but now it is

(19:39):
viewed a little bit more kindly.
All right with that.
Let's get into our fandom factface-off.
All right With that.
Let's get into our fandom factface-off.
All right, the hosts gohead-to-head with the trivia
battle about the focus medialearning new facts along the way
.
When the hosts collectivelygain 25 points from correct
answers, we will give away amovie voucher to someone on our

(20:00):
mailing list.
Our mailing list link is atwwwfandomportalspodcastcom and
we will send you one email everymonth with our newsletter and
also any giveaway updates.
So far we have nine points,which means we need 16 more
before the giveaway activates.
Brash, I might go first thistime, Alright.
So this time my question foryou is there was a major

(20:23):
character and subplot that wasalmost entirely cut from the
final film of Jersey Girl.
Do you know who that characteror actor was?
They only appear briefly inthis movie, at the start and
through the middle, but they didhave a bigger part to play.

Speaker 2 (20:42):
Not Jason Briggs was it.

Speaker 1 (20:43):
It was Jason Briggs.
Yeah, the co-worker played byJason Briggs.
He was the comic foil.

Speaker 2 (20:49):
Yeah, I thought that he was meant to be a bigger part
in this movie.
Like he like because he wasjust in his life, then out of
his life, then back in his life,yeah, he kind of I thought like
he'd be like come visit him andshit like that, or something
like that.
Yeah, or stay friends.

Speaker 1 (21:03):
Yeah, yeah, I actually liked how he re-entered
the movie where he said he'sbeen waiting years For a chance
to help him out.

Speaker 2 (21:11):
Yeah, I thought that was very sweet.

Speaker 1 (21:13):
I thought that was a really good way to re-enter him.
So I didn't feel like hischaracter was just there,
because that was pulled on theheartstrings for me.
But it does say that Smith feltthat the tone was too
inconsistent for Briggs'character because he played
almost the comic foil toAffleck's character and provided
levity in the film in theheavier moments and he wanted to

(21:34):
do something heartfelt.
So it didn't really fit thetone.
And because of thatinconsistently, a lot of his
scenes were cut from thetheatrical release.
But you can see them on thedeleted scenes of DVD extras if
you want to as well.
But Jason Biggs, obviouslyfamous for playing Jim in
American Pie and I think thiswas actually during the time
when American Pie was coming out, wasn't it Because this is 2004

(21:56):
.
Yeah, 2004.
And American Pie was prettymuch around the same time.
So he did have that tag alongwith him as well to be this
comedic comic relief kind ofcharacter.
So he did have that tag alongwith him as well to be this
comedic comic relief kind ofcharacter.
So he was cut completely, allright.
So that's one point.
Your go, brash, my go.

Speaker 2 (22:09):
So in the movie, when Ben Affleck's character, olly
and Gertie are talking about theplay that she wants to do for
the school play, she talks aboutcats and then, of course,
because cats are no longeraround best, when you're Todd
and Ben Affleck says, oh, areyou sure it's a musical, and

(22:33):
he's like.
I remember once losing a betand having to go see a show, a
musical, where they were all onroller skates.
It was terrible.
I had a terrible time, do youremember?

Speaker 1 (22:48):
or do you know what musical they were talking about?
A musical on roller skates, onroller skates.
I have no idea.
Very famous one.

Speaker 2 (22:54):
Is it?
Is it Rent?
It's not Rent Is it Hair.
No, it's not Hair.
It's written by Andrew LloydWebber, very famous.
Is it Starlight Express?
It is Starlight Express, yes,about train, about a.
It's similar.
It's very.
For me it sort of seems like avery similar vein of what Cars 3

(23:16):
is, so an old-style locomotivewants to try and test his mettle
against the newer, upgradedlocomotives, and it's about his
journey on being a faster andbetter train than the new ones.

Speaker 1 (23:29):
This would appeal to lots of different audiences,
especially amongst thosechildren who absolutely love
trains, like Thomas the TankEngine.

Speaker 2 (23:39):
I have a friend in high school who absolutely loves
trains.
We used to call him just trainboy because he was just just
obsessed with trains.
Like he actually ended up whenhe went to Union Melbourne.
He'd go to the place where theyhave like the, where they like
take kids and that for rides ontheir trains.
He used to go to that and heused to drive the trains for the

(23:59):
kids and everything around them.
Yeah, it was really good.

Speaker 1 (24:02):
Very cool.

Speaker 2 (24:03):
Very, very, very into it.
Lovely, no, but I'm pretty sure.
Yeah, he is the composer,andrew Lloyd Webber.
Andrew Lloyd Webber for Phantomof the Opera.
He is, yes, and Jesus Christ ofthe Star and School of Rock.
You are correct it wasStarlight Express.

Speaker 1 (24:18):
Okay, my next question.
As we've discussed, the opinionof people over the film Jersey
Girl has changed over time.
Most notably, kevin Smith hassome personal regrets based on
Jersey Girl.
Do you know what one of thebiggest regrets he has regarding

(24:40):
this movie?
Busting Jennifer Lopez.
It has something to do withJennifer Lopez, but that is not
correct.

Speaker 2 (24:45):
That's probably my own personal thing, so I'm not a
big Jennifer Lopez fan.

Speaker 1 (24:48):
But okay, because of the drama between Ben Affleck
and Jennifer Lopez, mm-hmm, hedid something because of that,
all of the stuff that washappening with Ben Affleck and
Jennifer the time he didsomething to his movie to try
and accommodate for publicbacklash you know, is it to make

(25:10):
him seem like they're all goodwhen they weren't?

Speaker 2 (25:13):
no, so basically he had, I don't know I don't know
what the drama is betweenjennifer lopez and benefit,
because I just didn't give ashit yeah, yeah, no.

Speaker 1 (25:22):
Um, basically he made the movie about 30 minutes
longer and it had footage ofabout 30 minutes explaining the
relationship between Ollie andGertrude.
Ben Affleck and JenniferLopez's character and it
provided more emotional weightwhen she actually passed and
then also the connection thatOllie had with her as to why he

(25:42):
loved her so much.
So that sort of grounding,emotional scenes between
Gertrude and Ollie helpedexplain his grief later on.
So Smith has said that he cutthat because of the backlash
everybody was having towardsJennifer.

Speaker 2 (25:57):
Lopez.

Speaker 1 (25:58):
And it really compromised the emotional weight
of the film.
And he says, if he was a moreseasoned director and if he was
somebody who was also, he feltvery vulnerable because he was
putting forward a very personalstory and he wanted it to really
work well.
So he listened to that backlashand cut parts of the movie out
based on public opinion, insteadof going by what his artistic

(26:20):
vision was.
And he regrets that now and heuses it as a learning experience
in his career today.
All right, you're good my go.

Speaker 2 (26:29):
So kevin smith named the main character of ollie,
who's played by ben affleck,because of work he was doing
just before making this movie.
Do you know the character thatben affleck's character is based
off of?

Speaker 1 (26:46):
Well, the name yes, I do so.
He is named Ollie, which isnamed on Oliver Queen, which is
Green Arrow, and I think he didthat because he was writing some
.

Speaker 2 (26:55):
He was writing Green Arrow just before that.
Yes, because Green Arrow is oneof my Well, my top, equal, top
favorite DC character character.
So I've got green arrow andnight waiting.
They're my two favorite dccharacters, both of which don't
have powers.

Speaker 1 (27:12):
Very good.
Kevin Smith is famous forwriting Marvel Mites as well.
With Joe Quesada he's doneheaps of Spider-Man and Black
Cat stuff and he's also done abunch of Daredevil when he
worked for Marvel.
He's also a frequent DC comicbook writer as well, and
currently in this day and age,in 2025, he's writing Archie

(27:35):
comics comics and mostspecifically, archie meets Jay
and Silent Bob.
So very big in the comic scene,kevin Smith, and I think he's
even got a podcast where hetalks about that kind of thing
as well.
He very much so does.
Yes, yeah, all right, all right, point for the pill, my turn,
okay.
So this movie had a verydifferent ending than what was

(27:57):
portrayed on screen, and a veryfamous musician was meant to
appear in the film but ended updeclining due to scheduling
conflicts.
Do you know who that musicianwas?
And your clue is they have avery strong connection to New
Jersey and Kevin Smith is a bigfan.

Speaker 2 (28:15):
I know at one point Bruce Willis was meant to be in
the role of.
Will Smith yeah, that's correct, they didn't, but I don't.
That's what.
When you said, oh, there'ssomeone else meant to be in the
thing, I'm like cool, is it theBruce Willis one?
But no, no, it's a musicianthat I have no idea who it is,
who's who is a New Jersey.

Speaker 1 (28:38):
One of his songs features in the soundtrack and
he has a nickname known as theBoss.

Speaker 2 (28:44):
Oh, fuck, yeah, jeans , red fucking scarf hanging out
of the back of it, fucking Bruce.

Speaker 1 (28:51):
Springsteen.
Yes, it is.
Bruce Springsteen was meant tohave a cameo in this movie
because the climax instead ofOllie going and having an
interview in his old jobposition, he was actually
supposed to be going to a BruceSpringsteen concert in order to
connect with some people thereto potentially have a new job

(29:12):
connection, and BruceSpringsteen was supposed to
cameo.
He declined due to schedulingconflicts and he still allowed
Kevin Smith to use imagery andmusic for his cinematic feature.
So we almost had BruceSpringsteen in this movie but we
didn't end up doing it and theend of the movie was
subsequently changed and I thinkthe end of the movie works a

(29:32):
little bit better because itactually defines the choice that
Ollie had to make.
You know, he's not going to thisrecreational concert.
He's actually this lifelongdream that he's had to be a
music producer or a PR agent,where he's worrying about how
everybody else thinks ofparticular music artists and the
position that he has in thisposition of power.
He's worried about all thedifferent things that are

(29:54):
happening there.
He actually has to make aconscious choice to turn and
pivot away from that and movefurther into fatherhood, and he
did so through his conversationwith Will Smith, noting that he
is just a guy who wants to playin the mud with his kids.
So I think that the endingworked a little bit better than
what was originally planned.
So unfortunate that BruceSpringsteen wasn't in the movie,
but also fortunate for thestorytelling purposes.

(30:15):
Alright, that is a point to theKitty Brash, it is your go.

Speaker 2 (30:20):
Okay, this one might be a little bit hard because
it's going to test how closelyyou're watching, like looking at
a particular scene.
But in the video store you seefour videos that actually star
both Ben Affleck and Liv Taylor.

(30:41):
Can you name what those moviesare?

Speaker 1 (30:43):
Well, I know that.
Ben Affleck and Liv Taylor,well, there's not the ones where
they're effectively in together.

Speaker 2 (30:49):
They're just movies that they were in Right and I
say, if you get two out of thefour, Well was it Chasing Amy?

Speaker 1 (30:55):
Chasing Amy?
No, it wasn't.
Ch Well, was it Chasing Amy?
Chasing Amy?
No, it wasn't Chasing Amy.
Wasn't Chasing Amy?
Oh, Good Will Hunting, yeah.
Also written by Matt Damon andBen Affleck.

Speaker 2 (31:06):
And he actually in the movie Ollie is standing
right next to another movie thathe is in A very poetic movie
Stars Geoffrey Rush and GwynethPaltrow.

Speaker 1 (31:20):
Oh, shakespeare in Love.
Shakespeare in Love.
Yes, he only plays a small partin that one, I believe.
I mean, yeah, he plays NedAllen in that one, or Ned Allen?

Speaker 2 (31:30):
That was one of the other niche ones.
There is one he was standinglike.
He stands right next to.

Speaker 1 (31:35):
I'll just tell you some of the Liv Tyler movies
lord of the rings one, two andthree stealing beauty dealing
beauty where she ispredominantly on the cover of
that yeah yeah yeah, stealingbeauty that one also stars
jeremy irons in it as well yeah,and that's.

(31:56):
That's a bit of a mature film.
You might say Yep.

Speaker 2 (32:01):
It's even got Rachel Weisz in it too.
Yeah, yeah, but yes.
So Stealing Beauty, Good Will,Hunting Phantoms was another one
that was in the VR store aswell.
Yeah, yeah, phantoms was avideo that you could see in the
VR store when they were lookingaround at all the videos.

Speaker 1 (32:17):
That's one of Ben Affleck's first roles.

Speaker 2 (32:18):
Yep, so they had a bit of placement there for some
of the movies that they were in,yeah, which I thought, which I
expected to see more.
I thought I'd see a lot more oftheir films, just like placed
around that video store.

Speaker 1 (32:31):
Yeah, especially with Kevin Smith's like attitude
towards situational comedy.
Like that.
I would have thought the same.
And also I also liked in themovie when they're going to pick
out a movie to rent and thenGertie picks up Men in Black
like Will Smith, yeah, and BenAffleck's character, ollie, says
anything but that she alwayswants to rent out Dirty Dancing.

(32:52):
So I also loved seeing in thismovie the the hearkening back to
when we used to go to the videostores all the time and also
not to be crass or anything likethat but when pornography films
used to be on VHS tape in theback of video stores.
Never went into those areasNever went into those areas, but
I always wondered what wasthere.
It's just crazy to see howtimes have changed.

(33:14):
It's like a little time capsule, and that was in like 2004 as
well, so that was only about,you know, 21 years ago.

Speaker 2 (33:25):
Even that sort of scene has changed.
They're all like sort of old90s films.
Yeah, so like 1998 forShakespeare in Love, 1997 for
Good Will Hunting, 1998 forPhantoms and then 1996, I think
it was for Stealing Beauty.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, soearly 90s films, or mid-90s
films or mid-90s films, yeah,which fit the time, because

(33:47):
that's the time periods thatthey were in at the age of 90s
yeah.

Speaker 1 (33:50):
Exactly right.
I don't think I get that onebecause I took too many clues.
So for this week's Fandom FactFace-Off, together we got four
points, which is definitelyabove average, which is great,
which means that we have 13points total, meaning we need 12
more to go until this giveawayactivates.
Remember, if you wanted to be apart of the giveaway, join our
mailing list, which is atwwwfandomportalspodcastcom, and

(34:14):
you can also find us on all oursocial medias, so you can come
and check us out there too.
All right, let's get into ourSet Secrets segment.
Set Secrets is where hosts lookbehind the scenes and focus on
the movie to give you all theinformation on what went right,
what went wrong and what wasinteresting about the way the
movie was made.
A couple of things I want totalk about in this segment,

(34:35):
brash.
One, of course, is the impactthat Bennifer had on this movie,
and the other is Kevin Smith'schanging attitude towards this
movie as time has gone on.
I know you're an absolute fanof everything to do with
celebrities, so why don't yougive us all the information you
have on Bennifer?
Okay so when it comes toBennifer, I'm absolutely joking.

(34:56):
Listeners of the BennetPorter's podcast Rash staunchly
doesn't really care do not carefor every bullshit their
personal life is their personallife.
I don't give a shit about it andyou know what?
I think Kevin Smith, benAffleck and Jennifer Lopez
wished that everybody had theopinion that you had, because
the Bennifer craze was a mediaoversaturation that happened in

(35:18):
the early 2000s.
It resulted in both of thoseactors, jennifer Lopez and Ben
Affleck, having their livesbasically in the spotlight all
the time from the paparazzi.
It resulted in poor filmchoices from both actors,
especially Ben Affleck, whosecareer took a nosedive during
that time, especially for themovie that was Jiggly, which is

(35:41):
a 2003 movie.
That was an enormous criticalbox office failure and it was
really panned for its badwriting and the awkward
chemistry between Ben Affleckand Jennifer Lopez, which you
wouldn't think would be the case, because if they're a couple in
real life, the chemistry shouldbe natural on set.
We've seen that happen lots andlots of times as well, but it
became a particular sort ofpunchline, you might say, which

(36:06):
led people to think that, youknow, people were prioritizing
fame over the quality of work,and we've seen that happen as
well, where somebody is cast ina role because they're famous or
they think they could sell themovie more so than if they were
actually a fitting part for therole.
So Gigli was an absolute bustand the tabloid overload you
might say between Ben Affleckand Jennifer Lopez relationship

(36:28):
became.
It was literally the obsessionof the 2000s.
They were probably one of thefirst people that actually had a
couple nickname and that's beena trend that's gone on forever
and ever, whether we like it ornot.
They were doing everythingtogether, including the music
video jenny from the block.
Do you remember that song?
brash, jenny from the block yeahit was at every 2000 disco that

(36:49):
you ever went to and it was anearworm for the longest time as
well.
Yeah, yeah, it was basicallyturning admiration into like a
mockery.
They were just everywhere.
It was the time when thepaparazzi were just going wild.
They didn't really helpthemselves because days before
their 2003 wedding, jennifer andBen cancelled their wedding

(37:09):
ceremony, saying that there wastoo much media attention.
But then they officially brokeup in 2004.
So whether that was the realreason, and you know, to be fair
, for them it would bedefinitely hard to have a
relationship in those kinds ofenvironments, and a lot of it
may or may not have been theirfault.
Relationships can do a lot forcelebrity careers, but in this
case it did the precise opposite.

(37:30):
So Jersey Girl was supposed tobe a bit of a personal project
for Ben to get back to hisgrounded roots, and it was also
sort of a not a favor to KevinSmith.
But he wanted to work withsomebody he was familiar with
and comfortable with and, justyou know, slide back into acting
through character and dialoguelike he enjoyed.
And he kind of got caught up inthis Bennifer escapade and, as

(37:53):
I said before, you know it kindof damaged the reputation of the
film.
I watched an interview with theproducer of Jersey Girl and he
said that they did lots of testscreenings for Jersey Girl and
had lots of different versionswith lots of different cuts of
the film, whether some had a lotof Jennifer Lopez and some had
not much of Jennifer Lopez.

(38:13):
And he said you know sometimesthat the feedback you can get is
kind of nuanced so you can moveyour film around it to make it
more audience accepted.
But in this case he said it wasliterally overwhelming the not
hatred hatred is a bit of astrong word but the disdain or
the dislike for the character ofJennifer Lopez and Ben Affleck
together on screen.

(38:34):
They just thought it wasanother sort of sellout move
where they were trying to putthe hottest celebrity couple in
a film together to sell moretickets and sell more movie
going experiences.
So it didn't help them out atall.

Speaker 2 (38:43):
Yeah, no, it was a choice made.

Speaker 1 (38:47):
I think so, I think so, and for Kevin Smith as well.

Speaker 2 (38:51):
I think for him it probably would have been because
, like him and Ben Affleck arefriends.
So I think he sort of and, asyou said earlier, how he's made
that choice and he's like,looking back up, I wouldn't have
made that same choice because,like, sometimes you've got to
just think about the productover sort of the marketing of it
, the marketing of it, yeah, andhow it's going to reflect on

(39:13):
your friends, being like BenAffleck and that in it as well,
and just sort of just go withyour gut on it and go with what
you reckon.

Speaker 1 (39:21):
Yeah, I think that it .
I don't know if it affectedtheir friendships.
I don't know.

Speaker 2 (39:26):
I was going to say it wouldn't affect it, but he
would have done it to I don'tknow, to try and help their
image of his friend Ben oh right, yeah, yeah, yeah.
Yes, exactly, oh right, yeah,yeah, yeah, yes, exactly.
I see what you're saying now.
Yeah, he said he probablyshould have.
Sorry, ben, but we're not gonna.
We're gonna not worry aboutyour personal issues.
We're gonna try and make sureit's a good movie.

Speaker 1 (39:44):
Put the movie out as it should be and have the the
story be told as it needs to be.
Because, yeah, kevin Smith hashas said, you know, he made this
, this movie for his daughterand it was his kind of first
grown-up film in quotation marksit was the first one where he
was moving away from his famouscharacters and his safety nets,
so he was taking a bit of a risk.
But kevin smith has also saidthat he thinks that ben

(40:07):
affleck's performance was washonest and also underrated by a
lot of people, and I can seesome scenes where the nuance of
his performance definitely showsthrough.
There are a few takes.
I know that the scene where heis given the news that Gertrude
has passed away, that was shot alot of different times and he
reacted in a lot of differentways.
At one point he got so physicalin the performance that he

(40:30):
ended up vomiting, and that wasone of the ones where the test
screen was shown to a publicaudience and it was met with
laughter, unfortunately.
So with that they decided tochange that and I think the
performance that they landed onfor that was nuanced enough to
show the impact of it.
But for me it was what happenedafter that moment where he was

(40:50):
completely disengaged from thechild, where he was completely
non-attending towards the child,he still had a business-minded
attitude.
He was basically trying to moveon as if that thing in the room
crying upstairs didn't exist.
And that was the kind ofunderrated performance I think
Kevin Smith is talking aboutwith Ben Affleck, because it's
sort of he was so committed tothat part, in that sort of way

(41:13):
he was playing that that it didsell off to me.
And that was what I was talkingabout before in my hot take
segment where I said I was justwaiting for him to kind of catch
up and realize that what heshould be doing is looking after
his daughter, which is exactlywhat George Carlin's character
was telling him at the time aswell.
So, or his father as well.
I think that it's definitely ashame, because there are lots of

(41:36):
times when you can harness themassive public attention for a
good reason for a movie, but inthis case I think it just got so
wild, so quick and everybodywas just sick of Ben Affleck and
Jennifer Lopez that it justdidn't do any favours for the
movie even little things, likethe whole time between sort of

(41:57):
that part where um his wifeGertrude dies, he just calls
baby Gertrude, just the baby orthe kid, yeah, or the kid.
That's a really important,important observation.

Speaker 2 (42:09):
Not even by name, yeah not even by name at all.
It's more like it was more likean annoying thing than it was
like annoying distraction thingin the background rather than an
actual child.
And yeah, that was the partthat I picked up.
I'm like he keeps calling itthe baby and the kid, Yep, and
I'm like that's your daughter,dude.

Speaker 1 (42:31):
Yeah, exactly, I think that was done
intentionally, like that's beenpretty clever.
Writing from Kevin Smith becausethe moment he does call her
Gertie, that's when he has thatmonologue with the baby where he
starts to realise and open upand say how much that he did
miss the baby's mother and thenat the end of that he promised
to do better.
And then that's when we see himpicking her up from school in

(42:53):
the street, sweeper theBatmobile.
Which funny story.
He endeder the Batmobile, yeah,the Batmobile.
Which funny story.
He ended up driving a Batmobileas the new Batman.
But I think that that's when hewas.
That was when his charactertook that turn.
And then the seven years wherehe dedicated himself to being a
father was where we start him inthat sort of story space as the

(43:14):
new Ollie and where his growthis going to happen from there.
So it's almost a tale of twostories him coming to terms with
the fact that he needs to be afather and go through that
grieving process, and then thesecond one is where his old life
comes knocking at his dooragain and is he going to value
his old life or his new lifeagain?
I think that this was a genuineattempt for Kevin Smith to do an

(43:35):
emotional piece of storytellingand I think honestly that
Affleck and Tyler and alsoGeorge Carlin's performances
weren't the cringiest things inthe world.
I watched movies where youreally can't just sit through
the dialogue.
I think this one was okay.
The only time I feltembarrassed was during the times
when Tyler was beingexcessively forward around that
kind of thing.
But yeah, I think I stand withKevin Smith where he says he

(43:58):
wishes he stood by.
He wishes he stood by the moviethat he made and he might have
had something stronger in termsof Jersey Girl.
But you know, sometimes youcan't fight bad publicity.
They say publicity is good andbad and any publicity is good
publicity, but in this case itdefinitely was not.

Speaker 2 (44:16):
But, yeah, we're watching it again.
You can see where it was goingwith it.
It is, in essence, a beautifulstory about yeah, but for me I
don't know if it means to be amovie, because I love Kevin
Smith and everything as well.
But if you're going to watch amovie about, well, they probably

(44:37):
copied it off of Jersey Girlactually, to be honest, but
Kevin Smith's movie from 2019, Ithink it was um Fatherhood,
where his wife dies and he isthen stuck looking after the
child and has to try and dealwith that, and I was like
watching Jersey Girl and I'mlike this is like what would be
like the prototype to whatFatherhood is.

Speaker 1 (45:00):
Oh yeah, the Kevin Hart movie.
Oh, so did I say Kevin Smith?
Yeah, you did.
Kevin Hart movie yeah, directedby Paul White.
Yeah, I remember that one.

Speaker 2 (45:08):
Yeah, I remember I watched Fatherhood and I was
like I think it made me cry whenI watched it or maybe tear up.
At least I don't really watchit often in movies, more in
anime.

Speaker 1 (45:19):
but anyway, I will admit I cried in this movie.
When I watched it again for thepodcast, I cried at the end
when you know he realises andthey're together and they're
doing the play together and thatkind of thing like that.
That made me cry a little bit.
No, it didn't hit me that hard.
No, I'm just a big baby, aren'tI?

Speaker 2 (45:38):
Yeah, but yeah, oh, fatherhood, yeah.
So I think like you couldprobably this would be in like
the building blocks for what Ireckon fatherhood.

Speaker 1 (45:48):
Yeah, I would definitely say that.
I think it's some of theinspiration for it and even
though it's got common themesyou know where a father and I
actually wonder.
I wonder how mothers would viewthis movie.
You know how the fathers arehaving a really hard time being
a single, single father.

Speaker 2 (46:05):
And like all the state of her mom's and shit like
yeah, uh-huh, yeah, we have todeal with this shit anyway.

Speaker 1 (46:10):
No matter what Exactly Not.
So, yeah, when you're at work,that's my life.

Speaker 2 (46:14):
Thank you.

Speaker 1 (46:16):
Yeah.
So that's exactly why I need tothank Kalia more, because she
does this like I'm not an absentfather by any means, but she
definitely does a lot of thehard yards and a lot of the
heavy lifting in that space.
But that we've definitelydigressed from the set secrets.
But we'll go into our mostvaluable takeaways now All right
, to our most valuable takeawaysnow, all right.

(46:38):
This is the heart and soul ofthe podcast, where we break down
the one thing that hit hardest,stuck longest or taught us
something new from what we justwatched.
It is our moment to spotlightthe takeaway that made us think,
feel or see things differently.
This is what we learned fromJersey Girl 2004.
So I talked to you about mymost valuable takeaway before
Brash.
It is pretty much that I wantedto talk about something that

(46:58):
was a little bit universal,because we know that the
underlying message to this isBen Affleck's character, ollie,
learning that being a father ismore important than any kind of
aspirational job that he mightgo for, and some of the real
journey and growing that he willgo on can be done through that
journey of parenting.
But I think that for me, thething that hit the hardest was

(47:22):
that true love isn't aboutmolding someone into your world,
like getting his whole familyto fit into his world in New
York, but it's about steppinginto others' world or stepping
into New Jersey, quirks and all.
So it doesn't look as glamorousin New Jersey, it's not as high
profile, there's not as manypeople patting you on the back.
But you will be fulfilled in acompletely different and new way

(47:43):
by embracing the quirks of whatyou have and what brings you
joy, rather than seeking joy andapproval from others.
That was kind of my mosttakeaway from this, and I think
it comes most poignantly in thescene where Ollie is willing to
embrace Gertie's individualityby.

(48:06):
You know, at first she wantedto do a cat's musical, but once
she went and saw the SweeneyTodd musical she wanted to do
the song God, that's Good fromSweeney Todd in her musical.
And you know, you know as afather you have two options
there.
You could say, oh, honey,that's not really appropriate,
age-appropriate, audience, youknow, really sort of squash that
creativity and that drive thatshe has.

(48:26):
Or you could do what Ollie didand get the whole family
together to rehearse, geteverybody involved in the
musical, really embrace andsurround her for her idea, love
her unconditionally and accepther for the individual and
special nature that sheobviously has.
She's weird, she's quirky, butshe's unapologetically her and

(48:47):
he's being a father who embracesthat about her.
So it doesn't have to be afather-daughter relationship
where that happens.
It can be any relationshipwhere you're really just you
know, finding what really makessomeone who they are, and loving
them for that person or just atleast allowing them to be that
person in your presence, withoutjudgment.
That's what I took from thismovie is sort of like a

(49:09):
universal lesson yeah and yeah.

Speaker 2 (49:12):
When you're telling me about, I'm like, yeah, that
is a good take on it.
My take was just don't fall inlove, don't have children.
No, that is a horrible take anddon't do that If you can find
love, do it.

Speaker 1 (49:23):
I think that love comes in many forms.

Speaker 2 (49:26):
If you want to be rich and famous, don't have
children and don't have a family.

Speaker 1 (49:30):
Well, that's kind of what he unintentionally learns,
isn't it?
Yeah, yeah, intentionallylearns, isn't it?
But, yeah, yeah, I think thatit's all.
It also goes back to what wewere talking about in our ready
or not episode, where all he'snot really trying to fit in, as
it were, he's not trying to bepolished in his role in New
Jersey as father and streetsweeper and it it.
I think he's happiest orhappier in those years where

(49:52):
he's doing a job that pays verylittle recognition from anybody
other than himself and hisfather and his daughter loves
him for it unconditionally like.

Speaker 2 (50:02):
That's the relationship and the fact that
he pulls up in a street sweeperand she's so excited about that
exactly in front of a prepschool, by the look of it too
yeah, and, and.
For me, if I would beembarrassed to pick up my kids
from high school in a streetsuit.
But then if I was pulled up andI'd be embarrassed, but if I
looked out and I saw my daughterrunning towards me with that

(50:23):
smile on her face, I would belike you know what the rest?

Speaker 1 (50:29):
doesn't matter, it is pretty fucking cool, exactly
right.
Yeah, I think it's easy to placeour expectations on our kids as
well, like or even everybodyelse you know, and that that's
just pressuring and it makes itharder and for the kids to be
and grow up who they are andhave that sort of
self-confidence, to bethemselves in a space and have
them not lean into peer pressureand things like that.

(50:51):
But it's far more rewarding tolean into and embrace anybody as
their full self and shedefinitely exhibited that when
she performed the Sweeney Toddmusical with everybody that
loves her as well, even thoseuncles that weren't really her
uncles.

Speaker 2 (51:07):
Of course they were his uncles?

Speaker 1 (51:08):
Yeah, those men are not related to you yeah.
Yeah, I think he definitelylearns as well.
Yeah, yeah, I think he hedefinitely learns as well.
You know, he chooses love overimage and he, he chooses being
authentic in his life as opposedto being in control of where
his career is going, and all ofthose things, I think, are
really beautiful undertones inthe movie of jersey girl.

(51:30):
That can be celebrated and, youknow, it just goes to show that
letting go of how things shouldbe can sometimes be the first
step towards a more meaningfullife, and a meaningful life may
not look how you pictured it inthe first place.
It may actually be somethingthat takes you by surprise.
So that's what I took from thismovie of Jersey Girl, and I
know it has a lot of very clearmessaging, but I tried to go

(51:56):
with something a little bit moresort of subtle that could be
taken for everybody, not justsort of fathers and parents in
this instance.
But yeah, you ready to rate it?
I'm ready to rate it.
All right, let's rate it.

(52:17):
This is the Fandom Portals on aBoard.
It's time to rate it and rankit.
Each host has five stars togive this movie out of five
categories Story and script,characters and performance,
direction and tone, visuals andsoundtrack and our overall
enjoyment.
If it hit the mark, hosts awarda star.
If it didn't, hosts keep thestar.
If it was almost great butmissed the mark, hosts award a
star.
If it didn't, hosts keep thestar.
If it was almost great butmissed the mark, it gets awarded

(52:39):
half a star.
By the end of the segment, eachhost will have their own score
for the movie out of five, andthen we take the average and put
it on our official LetterboxdHonor Board list.
If you want to look at ourHonor Board list, you can find
it and track our rankingsanytime which is at
fandomportals on Letterboxd Allright rankings.
Anytime which is atfandomportals on Letterboxd

(52:59):
Alright Brash.
I'm going to start with thestory and the script.
I think this had some emotionalmessaging.
It's pretty genuine in its take.
It explores ambition versusfatherhood with sincerity.
I do think that it's a bitsimple in its narrative and it
lacks strong dramatic stakes orany kind of structure in that
sort of space.
As I said before, it's a storyplayed out in two parts and you

(53:20):
can obviously tell that somecuts had been done through that
space too.
The dialogue seems authentic,but there is also times where it
seems a little bit dated forthis age, so for those reasons
I'm going to give it a half star.

Speaker 2 (53:30):
Yep, I couldn't agree more.
I'm of a similar mind.
Yep, I couldn't agree more.
Um, I'm of a similar mind.
Uh, also half a star for me, asI think more so.
Like the story and even even itbeing simple is fine and the
story is a beautiful story, um,one that, like I, I wish, like I

(53:51):
think, in kevin's mind, thatthe, the original vision he had
for it, I think, is one ofabsolute beauty.
But, yes, unfortunately, Ithink, due to parts getting cut
out and also the speed in whichsome of the story is played
through, I think, dulls it downto a half a star.

Speaker 1 (54:14):
That's a point too.
I think it's just over 90minutes, isn't it this one, and
it does go through quite a bigsort of portion of it, and I
also find that the act structureis a little bit unconventional.
But the last act, I think, is alittle bit rushed too.
It just seems to all happenvery, very quickly.

Speaker 2 (54:30):
Very quickly.

Speaker 1 (54:31):
And then also the beginning act as well is rushed
through, which is no.
Like Kevin Smith has said, hecut a lot out of the beginning
and that really detracts fromthe relationship of Ben Affleck
and Jennifer Lopez, which thenlessens the stakes and emotional
impact of her passing.
So yeah, I think half a star ispretty good and generous for us
here.
All right, let's go on tocharacters and performance.

(54:53):
So for me it was Raquel Castrothat stood out the most as the
child actor.
She was annoying, as aseven-year-old should be, but
she was also.
She'd gotten to that stage, asseven-year-olds do, where they
start to figure out that adultsare sometimes full of shit, and
she portrayed that pretty well.
She was able to be emotional intimes when she needed to be
emotional, but obviously therewere times when her acting and

(55:13):
also the acting of of othersaround her, sort of lacked.
So ben affleck gave somepassable and nuanced performance
in parts, but I think it waskind of inconsistent and same
same as live tyler as well, andgeorge carlin uh, they all you
know the chemistry between themall work, but the depth is kind
of limited in this.

Speaker 2 (55:32):
So half a star for me as well hi, yeah, I no star for
me from this, don't get mewrong.
I enjoyed Ben Affleck as anactor, tyler as an actor, but it
just yeah, it was hard to.
I found it hard to believe them.

Speaker 1 (55:48):
Actually, that is a good point as well.
Their chemistry together.
Live Tyler and Ben Affleck.
Armageddon was way better.
Armageddon was way better.
Armageddon was way better.
Yes, 100% better, and I thinkthat one came before this.
It did so they had history yeah, they had history, but it just
didn't seem to click or work andI think that's what I think
that might be, what the reasonwhy is?

Speaker 2 (56:07):
because they've had that history.
They came into this one that ismore.
It seems more friendly.
Yeah, that's exactly it.
More as like they're just palsthan they're meant to be
romantically involved.

Speaker 1 (56:18):
Yeah, I think that might've been an a intentional
choice for Kevin Smith, becauseI don't think he wanted Liv
Tyler's character of Maya to bethe romantic launch pad, you
might say, for Ben Affleck's newlife as a single dad looking
for love.

Speaker 2 (56:33):
I think he wanted to keep the story focused on a
father-daughter relationship, Ithink initially that the Maya
character was going to beportrayed by Joe Lauren Adams,
oh.
But then he's like oh no, Ican't do that, because then it's
going to be two chasing Amy.

Speaker 1 (56:51):
Yeah, I actually think there was another actor he
had in mind as well.
I've forgotten who, but she wasvery short.

Speaker 2 (56:56):
Oh, yeah, eliza, Eliza Doucheclue.
Yeah, eliza, doucheclue, shewas my crush when I was a
teenager.
She's from the Chew Lootermovie.

Speaker 1 (57:09):
Bring it on.
Bring it on Buffy the VampireSlayer.

Speaker 2 (57:12):
Yeah, she was in Buffy.

Speaker 1 (57:13):
Yeah, she was in Buffy the Vampire Slayer.
Yeah, she's in Buffy.
Yeah, she plays Faith.
Yeah, she most poignantly playsShe-Hulk in a lot of different.

Speaker 2 (57:21):
Marvel projects.
The voice of.

Speaker 1 (57:22):
Yeah, yeah.
So yeah, they were going to getEliza Dushku, but she stands at
a five foot nothing and wouldhave looked childlike next to
Ben Affleck's 6'3 physique.

Speaker 2 (57:30):
And also is an even bigger guy, because she was born
in 1980.
Yep, so she's even three yearsyounger than what Liv Tyler is.
And then Liv Tyler was born in77 and Ben Affleck's 73.

Speaker 1 (57:44):
That's good memory, dude.
That's exactly point on.
Yeah, how the fuck did you dothat?
72 for Ben Affleck?
Oh, 72?
.
Yeah, I'll give you that.

Speaker 2 (57:53):
Yeah, so that would have been an even bigger age gap
than what?
Eight years or something.

Speaker 1 (58:00):
Let's go to direction and tone.
So for me, for this one hesoftens his usual style Kevin
Smith does.
It's heartfelt as opposed tocomedic.
It's steady, it's not reallyflashy.
It's commendable what he triedto do, but it's not really
cinematic and he compromised onhis vision.
So I'm tossing up between zeroand half a star for this one.

(58:22):
I think for the tone it doeshave a nice warm tone throughout
.
I'm probably going to give itzero.

Speaker 2 (58:28):
I'm going to give it a half star Because I think for
me the acting was complimented,because of the tone, because as
much as I didn't like well, asmuch as the actors fell short,
for me I think the scenes andjust the effects of how they

(58:56):
shot it made up for it.
Looking at the backdrops of,like New Jersey, yeah, the
cityscapes, cityscapes.
But like you see the difference, like they show the difference,
like New York was alwaysflasher and clean and then New
York always looked rougher andmore downgraded.

Speaker 1 (59:13):
Oh yeah, jersey did yeah.

Speaker 2 (59:14):
They showed the two parts of it.
I thought the direction thatwent that way that sort of
helped with the acting.

Speaker 1 (59:24):
Yeah, with the next one that we're going to do with
visuals and sounds, I feel likethose contrasting images of New
Jersey and New York reallyplayed into the aesthetic of the
film to the point where, eventhough New Jersey looked like it
was roughed up, it was almostlike the diamond in a rough you
know what I mean.
Or the caramel center to therough outside.
That's what you find in NewJersey, and we know that Kevin

(59:46):
Smith has a very big affinityfor New Jersey as a setting.
A lot of his movies are setthere.
And then New York as well,being flashy and shiny on the
outside.
Even the status of OllieTrinkie's character, where he
wears these suits, his hair'salways done.
He's in a room full of peoplethat are always smiling, dressed
to the nines, but truehappiness evades him.

(01:00:07):
So I think that that visualconnection was pretty good.
I think that the score waspretty.
I don't know.
There's not much I can reallywrite home about the score.
The one song that kind of hitme was the Fleetwood Mac song
that was playing.
I don't know what that one'scalled Landslide, landslide,
landslide.
That was one that sort ofresonated emotionally with me.

(01:00:28):
So I think I'll probably givevisuals and sound.
Half a star just for thatjuxtaposition of the two cities,
mirroring the character'sjourney, and also for the
inclusion of the song Landslidein a very pivotal and poignant
moment.
So what about you for visualsand sound?

Speaker 2 (01:00:44):
Again, going on to the tone of it, I think the
visuals helped with the tone ofthe movie.
As I was saying before, withthe differences between New
Jersey and New York.
I like the basicness of it.
So you got what you had like.
The New Jersey was the streets,you had the sort of the front

(01:01:07):
visual of the school, you hadthe father's house, you had the
bar and the movie store.
Those were the New Jerseyplaces.
And then New York places was allthe high rises, the big
apartments and um, all theflashy board, board meetings and
stuff in there, um, will smith,uh, showing that they had, and
then with all the, though, I dodo one thing I want to point out

(01:01:29):
.
When they did the, is I, when Ihad all the reporters there for
Will Smith, like looking atthat crowd of reporters.

Speaker 1 (01:01:39):
All those reporters looked like they came from New
Jersey yeah, and you know whatall those reporters in that
crowd also looked like all ofthe disgruntled New Jerseyans
when they were going to fix thepothole too.
So those extras were obviouslyre-hired for the same mob scene.

Speaker 2 (01:01:53):
You might say and like how they acted.
I like that's not real, but hey, so for me I'll say Half-Tired
yeah, like the music I wish,because usually in Chasing Amy
there's good, really good musicin Chasing Amy.
The soundtrack yeah, thesoundtrack I thought was.

(01:02:15):
I was hoping it would be alittle bit better, but it wasn't
still.
Yep.

Speaker 1 (01:02:19):
Okay and lastly, let's go for overall enjoyment
and rewatch ability.
I don't think a rewatch for meis essential.
It's definitely not one of BenAffleck's best films.
It's gentle and sincere andit's watched for me.
It's good for for parents andfor that messaging.
But I think for me, if I wasgoing to watch a kevin smith

(01:02:40):
film and even a ben affleck film, I probably wouldn't put this
one on.
That being said, for the, forits emotional messaging and the
fact that I do like watchinggeorge carlin in this, and I
think I'll give it half a starfor enjoyment.

Speaker 2 (01:02:53):
Um, yeah, I'll look.
I'm probably never going towatch this movie again, to be
honest.
Yep, I was.
Actually I'm kind of excitedabout watching it again because
I'm like, oh, I haven't seenLittle Tyler in ages in anything
.
I'm like last time I saw herwas in How's Tonya.
I was watching that, what wasit?
Lone Star 911, where she playsone of the medical first

(01:03:13):
responders.
I was really excited and thenafter watching it, I was like
all right, yeah, that was athing, that was a thing I just
did.
Yeah, that was 90 minutes orsomething.
So, for me because this issomething probably more personal
to Kevin, about something veryspecific, it's probably not
targeted towards someone like me.

(01:03:34):
Yep, specific, it's probablynot targeted towards someone
like me.
Yep, it's for enjoyment.
So, yeah, but I'll have.
I'd have to give it zero starsbecause, yeah, for me, like had
no emotional sort of buy-in.
Buy-in for me, yeah, it didn'ttug at any emotional strings for
me because I don't havechildren or wives to worry about
.

Speaker 1 (01:03:50):
So I think that leaves you with a total of one
and a half stars and it gives mea total of two stars.
So let's see where it sits onour Venom portals on a board.
So with 1.75, we have a newlast place movie, oh shit, yeah.
So Red One, which is currentlyat 20, starring the Rock and

(01:04:10):
Chris Evans.
It got an average of two fromboth of us, and this one here
will score 1.75.
So it is currently our Razziewinner.
Jersey Girl gets to be the lastplace in the Sorry Kevin Smith.
Sorry Kevin Smith.
We'll have to do another KevinSmith movie to make it up to him
.

Speaker 2 (01:04:27):
If we need dog masks, oh well, I think it'll be close
.

Speaker 1 (01:04:31):
I think it'll be good .
But yeah, this one heredefinitely sits at our 21 spot
at 1.75 for Jersey Girl.
All right, let's get into oursign-offs.
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(01:04:51):
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(01:05:13):
giveaway.
So if you wanted to have any ofyour opinions read out on our
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Next week, we have an interviewwith Michael Papalethereau, who
is an Australian filmmaker, andhe is going to teach us how to
make a professional film fromscratch.
He is currently doing the filmfestival circuit for one of his

(01:05:38):
short films called crossroads,and we got to chat with him and
sit down and learn everythingthat he has to teach us about
filmmaking.
So that's what's coming next.
That's it for me, aaron keeplearning, keep growing, keep
loving fandoms.

Speaker 2 (01:05:51):
brash thanks everyone for coming by and listening to
us or me mainly ramble on, and Iappreciate every single one of
you.