Out of the Depths of Darkness: An Amish Woman's Story of Transformation and Triumph

Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Welcome to the Fuzzy Mike, the interview series, the
podcast, whatever Kevin wants tocall it.
It's Fuzzy Mike.
Hello, I'm Kevin Kline andthank you for joining me for
another episode of the FuzzyMike, where we get entertaining
conversation about mental healthand self-improvement.
What happens when a young girlraised in one of the strictest

(00:23):
Amish sects, the SwartzentruberAmish in Michigan?
What happens when she decidesto leave that life behind at 17
to live in a world she doesn'trealize she's completely
unequipped to navigate?
For my guest, naomiSchwarzentruber, that decision
plummets her into a hell thatnearly kills her.

(00:46):
Three times Naomi's book, theAmazing Adventures of an Amish
Stripper, an erotic memoir,which is available on Amazon.
It's not for the faint of heart.
I read the entire book.
The eroticism is blush-worthy,the exploitation she endured is
absolutely infuriating and,honestly, many of her own

(01:10):
decisions will leave youfrustrated, and that's
understated.
I don't recall the last time abook has given me reactions this
visceral, now likely, much tomy wife's dismay.
I wanted to start thisconversation off with Naomi, to
kind of bond with her, ok, andso I let her know that I live in

(01:31):
rural Missouri and whenever mywife and I drive north to Kansas
City we pass seven horse andbuggy signs that say share the
road.

Speaker 2 (01:41):
Oh wow, that's awesome.

Speaker 1 (01:43):
And so when my wife and I see believe they're Amish
I don't know if they're Amish orMennonite, you can maybe tell
us a difference but we don'tcall them Amish or Mennonite, we
call them share the roads oh,that's awesome there's some
share the roads that's awesomeso let's talk about your story,
because the book is.
There are times in that book,Naomi, where I want to grab you

(02:07):
by the shoulders and shake you.

Speaker 2 (02:09):
I know right.

Speaker 1 (02:10):
No, like more often than not, and so we're going to
get into this book.
But I want to talk about so thebook is called the Amazing
Adventures of Amish Stripper, anerotic memoir.
Reading it, I felt like I wascheating on my wife a couple of
times.
Holy smokes, dude.

Speaker 2 (02:25):
I know right, it's very spicy.
The radic seeds are very spicy,so Very spicy.

Speaker 1 (02:32):
I'm going to say that this is like ghost pepper spicy
.
It's a very intriguing memoirand to get to where you are now,
we have to start at thebeginning.
Tell us about growing up Amish,because you were.
You were Amish until you were17, right?

Speaker 2 (02:50):
Yes, so I was born into the Swartzentruber Amish,
which is one of the strictestsects, because there's a lot of
different kinds of Amish strictand less strict and I was one of
the strictest ones.
And there we have to wear longdresses down to our ankles and
they all like our.
We can't roll the sleeves pastour elbows, our hair has to be

(03:11):
covered and we have to wear abonnet and we can only wear dark
colors.
And as a little Amish girl Ialways liked the color pink, but
it was forbidden and it wasalmost taboo to talk about.
So I am now.
I love pink and I like to wearlots of pink.
But back then I couldn't and wehad.
We farmed with the horses.

(03:33):
There were no tractors, no cars, and we traveled by horse and
buggy as well.
If it was too far to go withhorse, a horse and buggy, we
would.
One of our neighbors would takeus in their vehicle.
So we were allowed to travel invehicles, but not drive them,
obviously, and to travel betweenstates we would travel by

(03:54):
greyhound or train.
And then we had a big farm.
When I grew up, we had over 20milking cows.
We milked the cows by hand.
We had 150 chickens.
So by the age of five I waswaking up early and setting the
table.
I would feed the chickens andfill the wood box and help with
cooking and cleaning and thingslike that Obviously not like

(04:19):
full on like my mom did, but Iwould help her out even at a
very young age and I actuallyenjoyed it because it made me
feel like I was part of thefamily by helping out.
That's what my whole family did.
We helped each other out and wehad three meals a day that we
sat together and ate and thatwas always.
My favorite time was mealtime,because we all got to be

(04:42):
together and joke and laugh andtalk about our day.
And there's 12 of us.
I have seven brothers and foursisters and I'm number four, so
I come from a large family and Iwent to school when I was
started school, when I was six,and they only go to eighth grade
.
We have a one room schoolhousewith about 20 to 30 students,

(05:04):
one teacher.
Sometimes, if there's closer to30 students, the teacher has a
helper and the teachers aresomeone that's out of school but
not yet married.

Speaker 1 (05:15):
Generally, so when you say one of the strictest
sects in Amish, you guys did nothave indoor plumbing.

Speaker 2 (05:25):
We did not have indoor plumbing.
We did not have indoor plumbing.
We had an outhouse.
Now, growing up until I was 12,until my parents bought a farm,
we rented a farm and we livedin a tiny.
It was a tiny little house andthere were 11 kids already in
three bedrooms.
It was super tiny and there theouthouse was like set back from
the house.
Bedrooms.
It was super tiny and there theouthouse was like set back from
the house and we would, even inthe winter, like it was

(05:48):
horrible.
We had to go outside and when Iwas there we did not use toilet
paper, we would use newspaperand we would like crumble it up
to make it softer.
And I remember going to mygrandma's house and there was
toilet paper and we always kindof choked like, oh, she's too
fancy or too good to usenewspaper.
But after I left and I would goback to visit now my family

(06:09):
uses toilet paper too.
But yeah, it was not fun to gooutside to use the outhouse in
the winter.

Speaker 1 (06:15):
So what do you do for showers and bathing when it's
you're in Michigan at this timeand Michigan is very cold in the
winter?

Speaker 2 (06:22):
Yes, so in the winter we actually so our kitchen in
this little house we had, likeit was like a separation One
side was for the kitchen table,the other side was our cooking
stove.
So we only took a bath in thewinter once a week, which was
Saturday nights, and we had toheat up all the water for
everyone and we had a biggalvanized tub.

(06:43):
A couple of kids would take abath and then we had to heat up
all the water for everyone andwe had a big galvanized tub.
A couple of kids would take abath and then we have to use
buckets and empty out the tuband refill it and heat the water
and stuff like that.
But we heated, we used the woodstove in the kitchen and that's
where we would take a bath inthe winter, and in the summer we
would do it in the wash house.

Speaker 1 (07:07):
And the wash house was very close to our house.
You guys had a generator.
If I read correctly in the book, you had a generator.
What?

Speaker 2 (07:11):
was that used for?
We didn't have like a okay Iguess maybe they're kind of like
generators.
We couldn't have like agenerator generator.
But they're little hondaengines and if that makes sense
they're like the little.
You can buy them at harperfreight.
I don't even know where myparent, why, my dad got them,
but you can.
We would use those to run thewashing machine and also to pump

(07:31):
the water from the well and torun the the table saw to cut
lumber.
So we were allowed to use thoselittle honda engines to do
things like that.
And my dad also had a sawmillwhich took a big engine and he
had a big stationary dieselengine that he ran a belt from
the sawmill to this engine andthat's how he operated his

(07:52):
sawmill.

Speaker 1 (07:54):
And you said that if you're going across state lines,
you have to go by train or bus.
Where do you get the money forthose tickets?

Speaker 2 (08:02):
Well, back when I was there we made money from the
farm, from milking cows.
We would sell the milk and thenmy dad had the sawmill so we
got he cut lots of lumber.
We got money from that.
We also sold baked goods andvegetables and things like that.
So that's I mean growing up.

(08:23):
My family was pretty poor, sothey didn't travel that much.
I actually only got to travelonce when I was like two,
between two and three I think,and I have very vague memories
of it.
My uncle got married in Ohio,so they don't travel that often,
at least back then they didn't.
I feel like they travel a lotmore now than they used to.

Speaker 1 (08:43):
Okay, and you did not grow up exclusively with Amish
neighbors.
You had, and you call them,english neighbors, correct?

Speaker 2 (08:51):
Yes, everyone that's not Amish.
We call them English.
It doesn't matter what countrythey're, from, what language
they speak, everyone's English.
I'm English now too, accordingto my family.
So yeah, so it.

Speaker 1 (09:03):
I mean, not only are you growing up in a very strict
environment and you're limitedin what your religion and your
family will allow you to do, butright across the street you've
got kids who have all theseEnglish freedoms.
How did that play into yourdesire to leave?

Speaker 2 (09:20):
When I was 13,.
We got new neighbors and theyhad a little daughter that was
11.
And she was literally just asfascinated by us as we were by
her and she started comingaround all the time and my
parents weren't happy but theykind of tolerated it.
And we also started going totheir house a little bit more.
And that's when I opened myeyes.

(09:41):
I was like, wow, she has abicycle.
I like opened my eyes.
I was like, wow, she has abicycle, she gets to wear
sandals and paint her nails andwear colorful t-shirts and her
hair is down and she can callher friends whenever she wants,
she gets to watch tv and listento the radio and that just
really like.
I was like, wow, that's so cool.
And I started rebelling in mycousins for some reason, that

(10:03):
kind of.
At the same time.
I don't know if it's because wewere teenagers we just started
opening our eyes and noticingthings a little bit more and we
started rebelling and like Ibought English, a couple
T-shirts and shorts and a pairof jeans from a yard sale when I
was 15.
And then I also wanted to buyEnglish panties and my sister's

(10:25):
from the yard sale and she'slike you don't know where those
were, like you can buy some atthe dollar store next time or
whenever we go to town.
And sure enough, when we wentto this store we went right to
the panty rack and I was likewow it was amazing.

Speaker 1 (10:38):
In the book you actually describe wearing
English panties, going to church, and the one thing that you did
not consider was what Peoplewalking behind you Right, yes, I
know, and I was actually.

Speaker 2 (10:56):
I did think about it because I remember when people
would walk behind, I would walkbehind my sisters or my mom.
You could kind of see theoutline of their Amish underwear
and I would hope that no onewould notice that I wasn't
wearing mine.
And then my cousins and I wewould go in the outhouse and we
would show each other ourEnglish panties and we thought

(11:16):
we were so cool and awesomebecause we were wearing
non-Amish underwear wearingnon-Amish underwear, uh-huh.

Speaker 1 (11:23):
So were you the only one in your family with 11
siblings who wanted to becomeEnglish, based on what you saw
across the street and yourneighbors who wanted to rebel?

Speaker 2 (11:42):
Or was there other siblings that decided you know
what?
I think that's a lifestyle forme too.
So there's two girls and oneboy older than me.
I'm number four on the kids, mysister just older than me.
Her and I actually planned onleaving together and we were
going to run away with our twocousins that were the same age
as us.
But my sister and I and,ironically, my two cousins, they
did run away, kind of to getnot like it was pretty close

(12:05):
together.
And then my sister and I weactually got into an argument
about this because we felt badthat if we both leave, mom only
has one older, old enoughdaughter to help her work on the
farm and we felt guilty or badto leave her like that.
And finally I was like you knowwhat, if I just run away first,
then it's up to her if shewants to choose to leave them

(12:28):
behind.
Like, I know it's selfish, Iwas selfish, but I was just, I
just wanted to leave, so I leftand then she left.
I left in July and she ended upleaving in October that same
year, but she went back eightmonths later and she's married
and has, I think, 12 kids.
11 or 12 kids yeah, wow, shewent back and the other than

(12:51):
that I have.
I always forget about thisbecause I'm not used to it.
Really, a couple years ago, oneof my younger brothers left
with his wife and four kids.
So they are not Amish, but it'sI don't know.
It's kind of strange becausekids, so they are not Amish, but
it's I don't know.
It's kind of strange because Iknow they're not Amish, but I
don't remember to call themoften because I'm not used to it

(13:12):
.
I think, and sometimes when Italk about it, people ask me I'm
like no, I'm the only one thatleft, but I'm not.
My brother left too.

Speaker 1 (13:19):
Well, what about your cousins?
Your cousins that you grew upwith, who were kind of
rebellious, like you said?

Speaker 2 (13:24):
They left and they're still.
Yeah, they're still Englishlike I am, but my sister did go
back.

Speaker 1 (13:31):
So that answers my question.
You could go back.

Speaker 2 (13:34):
Oh, absolutely.
I could go back anytime I wantand they would accept me and
take me in like nothing happened.
I mean not maybe not likenothing happened, but I'm always
welcome there.
If I got married then it wouldbe a little bit more challenging
.
I wouldn't be able to getremarried Amish unless my
English husband died, becausethey don't believe in divorce.

(13:56):
So once you're married there,that's it, and the only time
they can get remarried is if,let's say, I was Amish and I
married and my husband died.
Then I could get married again,but other than that they can't.

Speaker 1 (14:08):
It really is till death.
Do us part.

Speaker 2 (14:10):
Yes, no, it really is .

Speaker 1 (14:11):
But yeah.

Speaker 2 (14:12):
I could go back and my parents don't.
Before when I would go, theyreally pushed it a lot.
But now when I go, they alwayssay you know, there's still, we
still pray for you and if youever want to come back, you're
more than welcome to come back.
But they're not like oh pleasecome back, like they're not like
begging me to come back likebefore.
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (14:33):
How do Amish communicate without electricity
and without, because you guysweren't allowed to have phones?

Speaker 2 (14:38):
No phones so they travel by somehow.
You know, it's very interestingto me Somehow noose travels
really fast among the Amish,like they know everything, even
though they don't have TV or thenoose or phones.
But basically just when theysee each other, they talk, they
go by horse and buggy and Idon't know.

(15:00):
It's a very close knitcommunity so they're very
supportive of each other andthey help each other out a lot
and they see each other quite abit, I guess, and every other
Sunday they go to church.

Speaker 1 (15:15):
Is there an age at which an Amish boy or girl can
take the reins of the buggy?

Speaker 2 (15:21):
Kind of.
I mean, it's pretty young,usually when they start school
like maybe like second or thirdgrade.
I know when I was in thirdgrade I started to be able to
take the reins and drive thebuggy.
And then my brother that wasjust younger than me we would
actually argue sometimes becausehe's like I'm a boy and he was

(15:41):
used to working in the fieldsand driving the big teams so he
would oftentimes take the reins.
But he did.
Let me do it sometimes too,because it made me feel special
to be able to drive the horseand buggy.
And then, I don't know, I wasprobably like 10 to 12.
I was able to go places bymyself.
I would take the horses.
It was like my job to go takethem to the I think it's called

(16:04):
a farrier where you shoot thehorses.
So on Wednesdays I would takeone of the horses and I don't
know.
I always loved it.
I felt so free just riding inthe bucky with the horse.
It was very peaceful.

Speaker 1 (16:15):
How often do Amish go to church?

Speaker 2 (16:18):
Every other Sunday.

Speaker 1 (16:20):
That's it.

Speaker 2 (16:21):
That's it Every other Sunday, and so they work every
day except Sundays and Sunday.
They don't go to church.
Either they stay home and restand sleep and relax and play
games, or they can go visitanother Amish family, or another
Amish family can come to theirhouse, vice versa, but yeah,
only every other Sunday.

Speaker 1 (16:39):
And is church held in church?

Speaker 2 (16:42):
No, it's held at people's houses.
They take turns holding it atsomeone's house, so it has to be
a married couple and someonethat's in the same church in the
district and stuff like that.

Speaker 1 (16:56):
And you, according to the book, you enjoyed the days
where your family was the hostright.

Speaker 2 (17:03):
It was fun.
Your family was the host, right, it was fun.
I didn't like leading up to itbecause we had to clean
everything and it was like superbusy and stressful.
But the day of actual church Ienjoyed it because we get to
have like these we would makeschnitz pies that we would bake
on Fridays and we would usuallyonly make them for church and
they were for, like, the littlekids.
During the church they couldeat them, but when church was at

(17:31):
our house we got to eat themthe leftover ones, and leading
up to the church day, and theywere made from dried apples and
then they would soak them andthey would make them into these
little half moon pies calledschnitz pies.
So I always looked forward tothat.

Speaker 1 (17:40):
Yes, All right Now.
We have been talking about theAmish upbringing that you had,
and I'm shocked to find out thatAmish only go to church every
other Sunday.
But that's not the mostshocking thing I learned from
your book, naomi.

Speaker 2 (17:57):
Tell me about the singing and what happens after
the singing when we're 16 and ahalf, we get to join the singing
and that's where, after thesinging, when we're 16 and a
half, we get to join the singingand that's where, after the
church at 8 pm, from 8 to 10,the kids that are 16 and a half
and older that are not marriedgather and they sing and if they

(18:17):
want to date someone, that'swhen the boy gets to ask the
girl.
I imagine the girl can ask theboy too, and if they agree and
sometimes not even agree they,like everybody has.
It's called schnitzing.
It's the first date.
Everybody has to do it oncethey joined the singing.
So there was no boy in mycommunity, in my district, that

(18:39):
I was interested, no Amish guythat I was interested in.
But because I had to do this,one Sunday night after the
singing, some boys grabbed meand they're like who do you want
to date?
And I was like no one and Iripped away from them and I got
a few feet and they caught meagain Like more boys came to
help and they threw me in thebuggy with my second cousin and

(19:00):
I was like, oh my gosh, this ishorrible.
But I was in the buggy.
I was like, oh my gosh, this ishorrible.
But I was in the buggy, I waslike I have to do this anyway, I
might as well just get it overwith.
He tried to talk to me, I wasn'tinterested, and my sister.
So they take the girl, the boytakes the girl back to the
parents' house and they go intothe girl's bed and they're
supposed to like cuddle and kissbut not have sex.

(19:22):
And I cuddle and kiss but nothave sex and I didn't have my
own bedroom.
So my sister was like you canuse my bedroom.
And again he tried to, but Ijust I laid as far back to the
wall as I could and I didn't lethim touch me or kiss me and he
finally gave up and he was justthere till like 4 30 in the
morning and then he left and Ididn't sleep all night.
I I was just like thankgoodness he's gone.

Speaker 1 (19:44):
I wasn't interested 16 and a half years old and a
date is to spend the night inyour parents' house with another
boy.

Speaker 2 (19:56):
Yes, yes, that's how dating works in the Swartz and
Trooper Amish.
Dating among the Amish is notall the same.
I just want to say, be clear,like they all have their own
rules, like different sex, ofhow they date, but that was,
that's how the SwartzentrumAmish do it, yes, and how is
there?

Speaker 1 (20:15):
I guess you said that there could be kissing, there
could be cuddling, but no sex.
How is that enforced if there'snobody in the room with you?

Speaker 2 (20:23):
There's no one in the room and nobody ever talks to
us about sex or anything likethat, like it's never discussed.
You're just expected to like.
It's like this unspokenlanguage, like you're expected
to do this and not question itand not have sex.
It happens sometimes andsometimes the girl gets pregnant
and, for example, I have acouple of cousins that this

(20:46):
happened to.
They got pregnant, even a niece.
She got pregnant and she was 17or 18.
So her and her boyfriend andthey just got baptized and then
they got married, when generallythey don't get married until
they're 21.
And they had to get baptized at18.
The Amish, the SwartzentrubAmish, would get baptized and

(21:08):
then generally at 21, they getmarried, but they had to do it
sooner because she got pregnant.
So it does happen and itactually happens quite a bit now
, a lot more than it used to, Ifeel like when I was there.

Speaker 1 (21:20):
That was one of the frustrating things about the
book.
For me, naomi, is that youaren't taught sex in the Amish
community and then at 17, youleave and you were exploited,
you were taken advantage of.

Speaker 2 (21:37):
Absolutely, and I didn't realize it at the moment
that I was being taken advantageof or exploited.
I had no idea.

Speaker 1 (21:44):
Exactly, exactly.
So let me ask you and when?
When we talk about where you'reat in your life right now,
we'll go back to the fact thatyou only go to school until
you're in eighth grade in theAmish community.
But let's just jump right into.
You leave, you actually runaway.
You leave, you actually runaway.
And who?

(22:05):
Who were the people that pickedyou up?

Speaker 2 (22:13):
Well, it was.

Speaker 1 (22:13):
It was a couple actually but I didn't know that
we'll call them, kevin andChristine, because that's their
names in the book.

Speaker 2 (22:17):
But I met Kevin because my dad had the sawmill
but I didn't know him very welland I was picking strawberries
and by myself, and that's when Irealized I was like, oh, maybe
he could help me out, and I justblurted it out can I?
I want to run away, please helpme, I want to live with you.
And he's like you're crazy, youcan't do that.
But they, I don't know.

(22:38):
He exploited me even before Ileft, like he took me to the
barn for a blow job and I knowit was very uncomfortable, but
after I left I didn't like Isaid I didn't know he had a wife
and a son.
I didn't leave to be with himand they picked me up and then I
stayed with his mom for acouple months but I was lonely

(23:00):
and bored there.
So they remodeled their room intheir house and let me stay
there.
And after, like I didn't knowhow to say no to him about sex,
like I just and I.
It was a horrible situationbecause Christine was like a mom
to me, she was very kind andsuper nice to me, but yet here's
her husband exploiting me andeven like selling me to his.

(23:21):
He didn't know that hisneighbor was paying me for
blowjobs, but I don't know itwas.
It was a very uncomfortablesituation.

Speaker 1 (23:32):
Naomi in the in in the entire book.
Naomi, you have a difficulttime saying no to anybody and
anything.

Speaker 2 (23:39):
Right.

Speaker 1 (23:39):
Yeah, so and and and so my question then is did Kevin
bring this out in you, or didthe oppressive religion bring
that out in you?

Speaker 2 (23:52):
I.
That's the thing.
Like I'm not sure.
I really am not sure, but Ifeel sometimes like maybe it's
because when I first left, kevinexploited me.
Because when I first left,kevin exploited me, and so maybe

(24:12):
that's how my thought processworked throughout my life for
such a long time, because that'show I was conditioned when I
first left.
I didn't know how to say no toanyone and I just kept being
exploited and exploited, and itwas like a pattern throughout my
life.

Speaker 1 (24:22):
It was a big pattern throughout your life.

Speaker 2 (24:26):
Yes, and it's probably also from being
repressed, yes, and not knowinghow to like deal with saying no
to people or situations likethat, because I wasn't taught
about sex.
So it's probably a little bitof both.
That's what I'm guessing.

Speaker 1 (24:41):
Well, also in the community, that which you were,
you were brought up in, if I'mnot mistaken, no is not a word
in a woman's vocabulary in theAmish.

Speaker 2 (24:52):
I mean we get to say no, but it's not.
I don't know.
It's I don't know because, likeI didn't, I was only there
until I was 17, and I feel likewe were taught to be very
obedient as children.

Speaker 1 (25:08):
That's a great word.

Speaker 2 (25:09):
Yes, so maybe it's part of not knowing how to say
no, because I was raised to beobedient.

Speaker 1 (25:17):
So how different do you think your life would have
turned out if you hadn't met, orhad Kevin and Christina been
the ones to pick you up when youran away?

Speaker 2 (25:26):
I would hope that it would have been a lot more
positive.
I think I shoved down a lot ofthings and I just kept pushing
them down.
I think that's possibly why Igot into drugs so deep.
I was numbing myself because Inever dealt with that and I felt
such huge guilt for so longbecause I cheated on his wife

(25:51):
like we cheated on her and Ialways felt like it was my fault
because I didn't say no well,I'm going to take exception to
that.

Speaker 1 (25:58):
Naomi, I don't think you cheated on his wife.
I think Kevin forced you tocheat and you did not cheat on
his wife.
He cheated on his wife.
I think Kevin forced you tocheat and you did not cheat on
his wife.

Speaker 2 (26:06):
He cheated on his wife and he used you to do it,
and I actually recentlyapologized to her and she said
well, he was my husband and heshould have known better.
And she's like, don't blameyourself, because I just felt
like I don't know, I felt like Ineeded closure and to move on
from it.
I had to apologize to her andI'm glad I did, because she read

(26:26):
my book and she's like I alwaysknew anyway because of the way
you guys acted, but she's likeit wasn't your fault.
He was my husband and he shouldhave known better.

Speaker 1 (26:36):
Yeah, he was, he was.
Are they not together anymore?

Speaker 2 (26:39):
They're not together anymore.

Speaker 1 (26:41):
Imagine that.

Speaker 2 (26:42):
I know right.

Speaker 1 (26:47):
Yeah, imagine that.

Speaker 2 (26:48):
Yeah, so you ended up going back after you first ran
away, I did my first boyfriendbroke up with me and I was just
at such a crossroads I didn'tknow.
He took me to Minnesota andthere I am, in a new state.
Not many friends I was.
I was terrified and I was veryupset about the whole thing and
I was like maybe my destiny isnot to be English, maybe I'm

(27:10):
destined to be Amish, and I waslike I'll give it another try.
And I felt really horribleafter I was there and I because
my family was so excited to seeme and they made all new dresses
and bonnets and they were justsuper excited that I was there.
And after 10 days I ended upleaving again and I feel like
that was probably harder forthem possibly than the first

(27:32):
time, because they were excitedto have me back and then I just
like ripped all their hope outagain.

Speaker 1 (27:38):
Well, the book does a fantastic job of getting us
emotionally into you returning.
I didn't feel bad for you.
Uh, when you left, I felt badfor your mother.

Speaker 2 (27:52):
I felt bad for your siblings.

Speaker 1 (27:54):
You know I felt I was angry at you for going back.
I really was.
I was angry at you for goingback because all you wanted to
do was be English Didn't workout.
And you're like, oh, I'll justgo back, knowing full well that
you were going to leave again.

Speaker 2 (28:10):
You knew you were going to leave again.
It was like in my heart, like Iknow it was horrible and that's
I'm mad at myself for doing that.
Like I still like I don't knowthat I've ever fully forgiven
myself for that, because thatwas very wrong for me to do that
to them and hurt them.
Like I can't imagine if mydaughter like left and then she

(28:33):
came back and she's like oh, Ilove you, I'm here to stay, and
then she just like takes off andlike does this to me again,
like that, just I don't knowit's, it's I wish I didn't do
that.

Speaker 1 (28:41):
Yeah, I wish you didn't do that, naomi.

Speaker 2 (28:44):
I know Right Seriously.

Speaker 1 (28:46):
But here's the beautiful thing about this, Okay
Is that you ripped the heartsout of your family not once, but
twice.

Speaker 2 (28:55):
Right.

Speaker 1 (28:56):
But they accepted you back that time and they still
accept you back to this day andthey have just the same amount
of love for you that they didwhen you were still with them.
How does that make you feel?

Speaker 2 (29:12):
It's.
It makes me feel like it'sunbelievable because I feel
guilty for doing that to them,but it just makes me realize how
awesome and exceptional that myfamily is, Because even through
all of this, they still acceptme and love me and accept me

(29:34):
just the same as they always did.
And that makes me feel badbecause of what I did to them.
Like it's, it's reallyunfortunate.

Speaker 1 (29:43):
But it's a true testament to their level of
forgiveness.
Yes, and how they actually theyactually live what their
religious teachings preach.
Right, you know a lot of a lot,a lot of English, a lot of
Christians.
You know we'll say oh yeah,sure I can forgive, but bullshit
, a lot of Christians you know,will say oh yeah, sure I can
forgive but, bullshit.

Speaker 2 (30:02):
I know, right, yeah, right.
That's the one thing about theAmish they're the most forgiving
people and not just my family,like it's the Amish in general.
Some people have this badoutlook on the Amish and I'm
like they're actually the mostforgiving and really awesome
people.
Like I'm really grateful forthem, super grateful that they

(30:23):
allow me and they love when Ibring my daughter there.

Speaker 1 (30:27):
Like it's unbelievable how awesome they
are.
Well, I don't understand howsomebody could be anti-Amish.
You guys don't do anything tous.
You know you're a very peacefulcommunity.
As far as I know, you're a verypeaceful community and I mean,
I'm going to be flat out honestwith you.
When we see Amish people in thestore, you're like zoo animals
to us.
You're like, oh my God, therethey are.

Speaker 2 (30:50):
That's awesome.
You know, the biggest thingthat I get from my social media,
that people get mad when I postnothing about animals.
But they're always like oh, youguys run puppy mills, you abuse
your animals like you're themost horrible people and I'm
like, okay, first of all I don'targue with them, but first of
all, our animals are ourlivelihood.

(31:11):
If we don't take care of ourhorses and our cows, how are we
going to survive?
Like that's how we live with a,like we take they take good
care of their animals and sure,the dogs have puppies and but we
don't like at least in mycommunity I can't speak for all
of them, at least in mycommunity I never heard of puppy
mills ever, not even once.

(31:32):
And people in my community didnot abuse their horses and cows
Like they were very well takencare of.

Speaker 1 (31:39):
Yeah, I don't imagine how you could could, because
you are so dependent upon them.

Speaker 2 (31:43):
Exactly.
So, that I feel like is a hugelike misunderstanding and like
again I can only I don't knowabout all of them, but just
because there's a few bad apples, don't make all of them bad.
If you will.

Speaker 1 (31:57):
Your relationship with your father growing up it
was.
It's pretty strained even whenyou're in the house, because he
was he's a very stoic individual.

Speaker 2 (32:08):
Right, and he was.
Yes, and he was.
I don't know, he was a man offew words, if you will kind of,
but he was a businessman, a veryawesome businessman, if you
will Like.
He always had a lot of thingsgoing on, but I always felt like
there wasn't time for us, and Ican understand if you have 12

(32:28):
kids.

Speaker 1 (32:29):
I was going to say.

Speaker 2 (32:31):
How can you, you know , pay attention to all of them
and run a farm and a sawmill andmake money to support all of
them?
But he, I think my father is anamazing man and now we have
this unspoken agreement betweenthe two of us.
Like, I accept him and I don'texpect him to.
We have boundaries.
We accept each other'sboundaries, if that's, if you

(32:52):
will.
Like he doesn't talk to me much, but he's nice to me and he
plays with my daughter when shecomes.
He just loves her.
It's so cute, it's amazing.

Speaker 1 (33:03):
Well, one of the tenderest moments of the book
you share with the readers isthat on Sundays, when your dad
would shave.

Speaker 2 (33:10):
On Saturdays.

Speaker 1 (33:11):
On Saturdays, when your dad would shave, he would
do what.

Speaker 2 (33:15):
He would come oh, I could barely reach his desk it's
one of my first memories and hewould put a dab of shaving
cream on my nose and, like itwould make me giggle and he
would tickle me sometimes and Idon't know it was.
Those were very specialmemories and moments that I
would have that I had with myfather.

Speaker 1 (33:31):
Well, they're very special moments in the book.
You know, like I said, it's avery tender moment and you would
not expect that based on thedescription and the personality
that you portray him to have,which is quite understandable.
But how was love expressed inthe Amish community?

Speaker 2 (33:49):
So through actions like that, like they don't ever
tell us that they love us, butlike, for example, they would
take us I don't know, it wasn'tthat often, but like the shaving
cream and stuff like that, orthey would choke with us and
stuff like that Like duringmealtime or after mealtime we

(34:12):
would talk and laugh and it wasmore things like that Like we as
a family we knew we were lovedand that we all had our place in
the family.
And I guess, other than that Idon't really know how to express
it, but I just always knew thatthey loved me, even though they
didn't say it or do stuff likethat.

(34:32):
How is discipline?

Speaker 1 (34:35):
meted out.

Speaker 2 (34:35):
Discipline.
They would spank us andsometimes, if we were really bad
, they would get the.
We had this black belt oh butthey wouldn't like beat us, they
wouldn't like leave marks on usor anything, they would just
give us a couple whacks on ourbutt with the black belt.
But oh, when the belt wascoming out I was like, oh no I.

(34:59):
They disciplined us by spankingand I don't do that to my
daughter, but that's I alwayssay.
They did the best that theycould with what they had and how
they were taught.
What would necessitate thatlevel of discipline, like lying

(35:19):
or being really bad, like if wegot in a big fight with our
brothers, sisters sometimes,stuff like that how do you not
with 12 siblings under one roof,exactly.
No, it's going to be fights, yes, or I don't know.
Maybe it's something I blockedout.
I'm like I didn't get spankedvery often.

(35:41):
It was great.
And if we got in trouble atschool, if we did like got in
trouble at school, if we gotspanked or had to stand in the
corner at school we had to wewould get spanked at home.

Speaker 1 (35:57):
What do they teach you in Amish school?

Speaker 2 (35:58):
that you only go to eighth grade.
It's reading, writing, math andspelling and like in second
grade we have to learn how tospeak English and write in
English and also it's likephonics and stuff like that.
And then in fifth grade theyteach us to read, write and
spell in German.
But I already knew how to dothat.

(36:18):
I didn't know how to spell thatmuch a little bit.
I knew a lot of it alreadybecause all of our prayer books
and Bibles are in German.
So on Sundays when we didn'thave church, my mom would teach
us how to read from the Bible orthe prayer books.
And I knew I don't know, I waspretty young when I could start
reading in German but no history, no science or anything like

(36:41):
that.

Speaker 1 (36:42):
So I mean as far as like being able to do math and
read, I mean you're equipped togo out into the world.

Speaker 2 (36:49):
Oh, absolutely.

Speaker 1 (36:51):
But worldly knowledge not quite there.
No, not quite there exactly, sohow foreign was it to you when
you left the Amish community at17 oh it was.

Speaker 2 (37:06):
I thought, well, I was 17 and rebellious and I knew
everything.
But after I left I was like, oh, I really don't know anything,
hardly about the outside world.
And even though I had imaginedit was like this, full of bliss
and everything was just superawesome, there was a very
challenging for me at times toget used to it because I didn't

(37:28):
know really anything about theoutside world.
Like even going to a drive-thruthe first time, I was like what
is this like?
Why are we talking to thisthing on the side of the car?
It was really scary for me anda very big culture shock.
Or going to Walmart the firsttime, like I just froze because
I'd never been in a big store, Inever had to go shopping for

(37:49):
clothes.
I still don't like to goshopping for clothes because
it's overwhelming.
I never had to do that when Iwas Amish.
But it's just, there were a lotof culture shocks and it was a
lot more challenging than I hadimagined when I left Amish.
But it just, there were a lotof culture shocks and it was a
lot more challenging than I hadimagined when I left, and
sometimes I was like I just wantto go back, but I was like, no,
that's all I wanted was toleave.
So I'm going to hang in thereand make the most of it and

(38:13):
learn and do what I have to doto survive out here.

Speaker 1 (38:15):
So cause you've been English longer than you were
Amish, right?

Speaker 2 (38:20):
Yes.

Speaker 1 (38:20):
Yeah, like you were 17 years old when you left Amish
and you're well over 20 yearsnow in the English community.

Speaker 2 (38:26):
Right, I'm going to be 44 next month, so I've been
out for almost 27 years, yeah,and you look like you still need
to be carded, kid.
Thank you.
It's awesome Not sure how allthe things that I did in my life
.

Speaker 1 (38:43):
And that's what we're going to get at right now.
How do you maintain youryouthful appearance, how do you
maintain a full set of teethwhen you were so addicted to
drugs?

Speaker 2 (38:53):
I don't know.
Sometimes I think it's becauseof how I grew up eating like
healthy food and all, like wegrew our vegetables and
everything, like we didn't eatprocessed food.
So I feel like that contributedto it.
And even though we only brushedour teeth on Saturday nights I
know it freaks people out when Itell them that when I left I

(39:14):
did have 14 cavities and I gotthem taken care of.
I don't know, I guess I just,over the the years I brush my
teeth twice a day and I'm a verybig flosser and then, as far as
keeping my youthful look, I'msuper into eating healthy and
not a lot of junk food orprocessed food, and I take like

(39:35):
amino acids and like spirulinaand things that are good for me,
that nourish my body, becausefood can be medicine and food
can also make you very sick.
So I over the years, even whenI was a crackhead and I didn't
eat for three days sometimes Idon't know how my teeth didn't
fall out.

(39:55):
Honestly, I'm not sure how theyfall out, but they didn't and I
just that was two and a halfyears of my life that I did not
take care of my body and I don'tknow.
I'm lucky.
I'm grateful if you will.

Speaker 1 (40:10):
How lucky do you think you are to be alive?

Speaker 2 (40:13):
Extremely lucky because and I'm sure we'll get
into that but I had because ofthe drugs number one.
I'm very, extremely lucky to behere because I almost overdosed
one time and I have anear-death experience and I
write about that in the book,and then, when I was in Vegas,
my ex-boyfriend tried to kill meas well.
So I'm extremely grateful to behere today and speaking with

(40:36):
you.

Speaker 1 (40:36):
Oh, and at one point you did contemplate killing
yourself.

Speaker 2 (40:40):
Oh, absolutely.
There were a couple timesactually that I was like I just
want to end it.

Speaker 1 (40:45):
So was that a factor of depression, or was that a
factor of the amount of drugsyou were using and didn't see a
way out?

Speaker 2 (40:53):
Both.

Speaker 1 (40:54):
Okay.

Speaker 2 (40:55):
It was.
I was very depressed and I justfelt like I was just in this
hole and it just kept gettingbigger and bigger and I just
couldn't crawl out of it.
And it was just there was.
I felt like there was no light.
I couldn't just.
It was just so much darknessand I just was like, if I could
just end it all, like it would,all the pain would go away.
And what stopped you?

Speaker 1 (41:16):
What stopped you?

Speaker 2 (41:18):
My family actually, I would think about my family and
deep down I knew that somewhereI had the strength.
I just had to keep digging andI was determined not to give up
because, even though I wanted toso badly, there was some like
this little voice on my shoulderlike you can this, like you are

(41:41):
better than that, you can getaway from this and be strong and
live a happy life again.

Speaker 1 (41:48):
Well, in the book you definitely feel that you wanted
to get out of the situationthat you were in, constantly
using drugs, going from guy toguy.
A part of me wants to knowdrugs going from guy to guy?

Speaker 2 (42:04):
A part of me wants to know do you?
Think you were ADHD, it's avery big possibility.
It's a possibility.
I've had people tell me thatbefore.

Speaker 1 (42:12):
I've never been tested, but it's a possibility,
absolutely yeah.
I mean, I got that impressionin reading the book and the.
You know, your attention spanfor a guy was maybe a couple of
weeks, maybe a month or two, andthen boom onto the next, and
then boom onto the next.
It was almost like Kleenex.

Speaker 2 (42:28):
Right.

Speaker 1 (42:29):
Yeah, but I don't blame you and I don't fault you
for that, because you didn'thave a a working knowledge of
relationships coming out of theAmish community and you didn't
know what love actually shouldfeel like or should be.

Speaker 2 (42:46):
Right, and I feel like I was.
I felt so lonely and lost thatI was reaching out and searching
for love or someone just maybeeven just not to save me or to
be there for me.
And I was searching and it justI don't know.
I guess I just clung on topeople and then it didn't work

(43:07):
out and then I was just on thiscycle well it it's.

Speaker 1 (43:13):
You go from.
You go from seedy guy to aneven seedier guy, to an even
seedier guy, and at one pointI'm just like would you just
stop going and looking for guys,because everyone seems to be
worse than the previous.

Speaker 2 (43:32):
Right, and I realize now that I was looking and
searching for love outside ofmyself when I should have been
looking inside and loving myself, because if I didn't, if I
don't love myself, no one'sgoing to love be able to love me
.
I'm not, you know, and I didn'trealize that then and I was
searching for it out there whenI should have been in here,

(43:52):
looking for it in here.

Speaker 1 (43:54):
The uh the guest that .
I just had on last week Naomishe was a former playboy play
and that's what she.
You just said exactly what hermessage is you have to love
yourself before anybody can loveyou.

Speaker 2 (44:09):
Yes, that's, and I realize that now and back then I
just I don't know.
I didn't know because growingup Amish like I wasn't really
taught about love and then beingexploited right when I left, I
feel like it just was like thisbig thing that I don't know kind
of boiled over and it just Ididn't know how to bring it back

(44:29):
and love myself yeah and I wasjust searching for it out there
I mean that in talking to youand I knew because I watch a lot
of your ts and and you know Idid a lot of research on you.

Speaker 1 (44:40):
I read the entire book, okay.

Speaker 2 (44:42):
I did.

Speaker 1 (44:43):
I read the entire book and and I, I I want people
to protect you.
I know that you're harder thanhard because of you know,
stripper, prostitute, drugaddict, crackhead.
I know you've been through hell, but I just want someone to
protect you.

Speaker 2 (45:03):
I feel like I kind of have that person in my life now
my partner.
He is unbelievably magic.
He really is and he's the firstperson really in my life
besides one of my girlfriendsthat well, I actually have a
couple of couple girlfriends butthe first guy that saw me for
who I was.
I didn't have to lie to him andI was very open about my past

(45:26):
and he didn't judge me.
He didn't look at me anydifferent because I told him and
we were just friends at firstand then I didn't even realize
that I was attracted to him or Iwasn't looking for a
relationship like that.
But man he is, he's reallyamazing and he's really helpful

(45:47):
in protecting me, if you will,at points where I need and
guiding me sometimes and be justbeing there.
Even if it's a listening ear,he's there and bouncing off.
I have like a.
It's a listening ear, he'sthere and bouncing off.
I have like someone I canbounce ideas off or he's amazing
, I'm so grateful for him.

Speaker 1 (46:08):
Your relationship with him reminds me of my
relationship with my wife.
Okay, it was born of friendship.
Okay, and the number one, thenumber one attribute that he
must have from you is trust andhonesty trust and honesty.

Speaker 2 (46:26):
If you don't have that, then it's not going to
last and it's not going to goanywhere, and I have both of
those with him and I'm reallygrateful.

Speaker 1 (46:34):
Did it take you a long time to realize that you
deserve that?

Speaker 2 (46:38):
A long, long time and I always, I always did things
to compromise my relationships.

Speaker 1 (46:43):
Oh, did you really?
I read the book.

Speaker 2 (46:49):
Terrible.
I don't mean to laugh, but yes,I know.

Speaker 1 (46:52):
No, I think it's great that you can laugh.

Speaker 2 (46:54):
I wasn't doing it consciously.
I don't think or like I wasn'ttrying to, but it's just
something that I don't know.
I don't know why I did those,why I would compromise them.
Because it's what you knewRight, it's what you knew.

Speaker 1 (47:07):
It's what you were taught.
It's what you were taught byKevin, who picked you up when
you ran away the first time.

Speaker 2 (47:13):
Right To be dishonest .

Speaker 1 (47:17):
I mean you're old enough to make.
I blame him for a lot, Okay,and I hate that you named him
Kevin, by the way.

Speaker 2 (47:26):
Oh, I didn't think about that at all.
I'm sorry.
I'm so sorry, Kevin.

Speaker 1 (47:30):
That's okay.
That's okay.
Now you know that at least onenice Kevin exists, okay.

Speaker 2 (47:35):
Exactly.
He's definitely not all toblame because I was old enough
to make decisions.

Speaker 1 (47:42):
That's what I was going to say.

Speaker 2 (47:44):
I take responsibility for my part.
Like I was in the wrong.
I know that, and I just want tosay that I've had to forgive
myself because it was not justhis fault.
Sure, I wasn't quite an adultadult, but I was considered to
be a young adult.

Speaker 1 (47:59):
Sure, I wasn't quite an adult adult but I was
considered to be a young adult.
Age-wise, yes, but you were notequipped for those decisions.
You were not equipped for thosedecisions.

Speaker 2 (48:06):
I really wasn't.

Speaker 1 (48:07):
No, I know, and it's amazing where you are now, from
where you first started, whenyou were 17 years old and you
left what you call Amishville tobecome English.
There's some names in the bookthat I want to talk about, and
the first one is Dan.

Speaker 2 (48:26):
Oh, let's rest his soul in peace.
He is Wow I.
He was amazing.
He just wanted to help me.
He was honestly like I always.
I still feel bad for Danbecause all he ever wanted to do
was to guide me and love me andsupport me and not let people

(48:46):
hurt me.
That's all he wanted, and Iwould kind of just push him away
.

Speaker 1 (48:52):
Kind of.

Speaker 2 (48:53):
It makes me sad to think about that.
How much I pushed him away.
So, I didn't accept him.

Speaker 1 (49:00):
No, you didn't.
You accepted all of his giftsand you accepted his money.
Uh, he met you while you werestripping.
Um, why didn't you?
I mean he, he, I wanted you sobad to be with him.

Speaker 2 (49:16):
He was.
He was in his fifties and I wasyoung, so I looked at him more
like a dad figure and I feltlike if I was with him I
wouldn't be able to live my lifeand he would control me.
I don't know that he reallywould have.
He never tried to have sex withme and Rowan in the book.

(49:36):
He often tried to make us havesex, but Daniel's like no, I
don't want to, I don't want to,she doesn't want to, but I just.
I don't know.
It was really hard and I was.
I wasn't ready at the time toget away from the drugs and it
was very selfish of me what Idid to Dan.

Speaker 1 (49:56):
Well, you weren't alone.
Rowan had a lot to do with thatas well.
Absolutely Well, you weren'talone.

Speaker 2 (50:00):
Rowan had a lot to do with that as well, absolutely
so.

Speaker 1 (50:01):
Dan retires from work , and how long did it take you
to blow through $250,000 of hismoney?

Speaker 2 (50:10):
Like six months Jesus to me to think about, like it's
unbelievably horrible, and allhe wanted to do was to save me.
But he felt like he had tosmoke crack with us, to be with
me, because he didn't want tolose sight of me again, because

(50:30):
he didn't know where I was forquite some time.
And he once told me he wentdriving up and down the streets
in Grand Rapids and Muskegonwhere prostitutes were known to
walk, because he just wanted tofind me, to save me.
Even though I never told him atthat time that I was selling
myself or smoking crack, he knewwhat I was doing.
He was a very smart man, he wasan engineer and just.
He was very smart and in intune with me more than I wanted

(50:55):
him to be at the time.
And, gosh, he tried so hard.
It breaks my heart that the wayI treated him yeah, he's since
passed on yeah, he passed onyeah, he had a very weak heart
and I always worried that he wasgonna have a heart attack when
he would smoke crack because hehad a pacemaker and only a
little bit of his heart actualheart was working at the time.

Speaker 1 (51:17):
But you know, at least we got to hang out, I
guess yeah, yeah, better to haveloved and lost than never loved
at all.
Right exactly yes and he justwas such a good soul yeah, you
could just tell, you could tellin the book.
You do a great job of capturinghis essence in the book.
Um, yeah, that that he.

(51:37):
He was just there to look outfor you.

Speaker 2 (51:40):
He really was.
He wanted me to come home withhim and live.
He's like, you can just stayhere, I won't bother you pretty
much, you can just be here andget well.
That's all he wanted to do wasfor me to get well.

Speaker 1 (51:53):
And instead of you getting well, you made him bad.

Speaker 2 (51:56):
Yes, horrible.
I don't mean to laugh.
It's terrible, it's awful.

Speaker 1 (52:00):
Yes, horrible I don't mean to laugh.
It's terrible, it's awful.
That's the fact, though.

Speaker 2 (52:03):
But it is the fact.
It's really what happened.
I did and it wasn't.

Speaker 1 (52:07):
I don't.
I mean, yeah, you made thedecision to be a drug addict,
but it was the drugs that wereworking on him.
It wasn't you, it was the drugsthat were in you that were
working on him, Right?
The other person I want to askyou about and I think Randy is
his name in the book- oh gosh,which one's Randy.
That he would take you to Vegas.

Speaker 2 (52:28):
Oh, yeah, yeah, Randy .

Speaker 1 (52:30):
On the airplane.

Speaker 2 (52:31):
Yes.

Speaker 1 (52:31):
Yeah, did you ever feel I don't know sheepish?
Did you ever feel I meansheepish is the best word
calling him and saying I justblew through all that money
again?
Can I get more money and willyou take me back out to Vegas?

Speaker 2 (52:48):
Yes, yeah, I, yes, I would do that, and he was also
such a nice older gentleman, Imean sure, like he would give me
oral sex, but he never wantedanything from me other than that
.
He also wanted me to get mylife together and I felt
horrible when the money wouldrun out because I promised him
that I wasn't going to go smokecrack with those boys.

(53:10):
He called them those boys.
He's like you better not goblow this money with those boys
and smoke crack.
And I was like, oh, I won't.
And when I made that promise andI would tell him that, I really
in my heart felt like Iwouldn't, because when I was in
Vegas I didn't think aboutsmoking crack.
I felt like a human again.
But that's when I realized Ihad to get away from them if I
ever wanted to be clean, becauseas soon as we were going back

(53:33):
to the airport I thought aboutthem.
And boom, that feeling camedown back in my stomach where I
would get that craving I call itthat horrible craving that
would make me nauseous andsometimes I would throw up like
it was awful.
But yeah, he was also a nice,nice older gentleman that was
trying to help me.

Speaker 1 (53:53):
And you got all this money in Vegas by winning and
gambling.

Speaker 2 (53:57):
Yes.

Speaker 1 (53:58):
And.

Speaker 2 (53:58):
I would take it back and even sometimes before we
would go anywhere else, we wouldgo to that's like a crack house
or my friends that were smokingas well, and then we would end
up calling the dealer.
Sometimes we would even go tothe dealer before we would go
there.
After I came back from Vegaswith all this money and I don't

(54:19):
know it was, it was a horriblecycle I was stuck in.

Speaker 1 (54:24):
A horrible cycle you were stuck in that only kept
getting deeper and deeper anddeeper.
What was the bottom point?

Speaker 2 (54:31):
The bottom point was when I was up for five days and
I hardly ate and I didn't.
I didn't sleep for five daysand I talk about this in my book
, how I went to the bathroom andlike my period came and like my
whole life flashed before myeyes and I was dying.

(54:52):
I felt literally I was likeslipping away.
My soul was like trying to getout of my body and I think I had
an outer body experiencebecause like I felt like I was
dragging myself down the hallwayto go talk to Rowan and Dan and
I was yelling their names butthey wouldn't look at me or come
help me and finally I just wentback to the bathroom and I
don't know it was.

(55:12):
It was really horrible.

Speaker 1 (55:13):
You were hallucinating.

Speaker 2 (55:15):
I was hallucinating Right Obviously hallucinating
and finally Dan came running andhe just started crying when he
saw me because there was bloodall over the bathroom.
It was bad, it was a very badsituation, but that was like
when I hit rock bottom.
I feel like.

Speaker 1 (55:30):
And that was when you decided to move permanently to
Las Vegas to move into anapartment.

Speaker 2 (55:41):
I was like we need to get out of a hotel.
We were staying at hotels atthis time.
So we got an apartment and weall like did a pinky swear we're
never going to smoke crackagain.
Like the apartment was offlimits and then Dan went away
and Rowan and I couldn't helpourselves.
We're like just this one time.
And then we would smoke crackin the apartment and I would run
out of money.
That's when I was going toVegas and eventually I met this

(56:02):
guy, lance, in the book, andafter that I decided to move to
Las Vegas to get away.

Speaker 1 (56:12):
And when you moved to Vegas, how soon was it before
you started to go to the stripclubs and work?

Speaker 2 (56:21):
It was like 10 days.
I started working at SpearmintRhino.
I worked there for a couplemonths but I just felt like I
didn't really belong there.
It was too much, toooverwhelming, because it was
such a huge place and there wereso many girls that worked at
any given time.
I was more like the girl nextdoor.
I wasn't the pushy stripper, Iwas the bubbly fun outgoing

(56:42):
stripper and and then I startedworking at Cheetah's and there I
loved it Like I did really well.
When I started working atCheetah's, the house, mom was
really nice, the girls werereally nice and I felt like I
had like this little Vegasfamily.
It was amazing.

Speaker 1 (56:57):
As an Amish girl.
How were you able to take yourclothes off in front of people
the first time?

Speaker 2 (57:05):
Gosh, it was unbelievably scary and crazy.
I I couldn't believe that.
I did it.
Like when they pushed methrough that door on the stage
and they had told me the firstsong I have to take my top off
and the second song I have to becompletely naked, because it
was a nude strip club, I waslike, oh my gosh, there's no way
I can't do this, I can't do it.

(57:26):
And they're like, sure you can.
And my girlfriend's like, yes,you can, you got this.
And I was like trying not tocry, but it was overwhelming my
hair actually, I let my hairfall in front of my face and I
was like, oh, that is my shield.
They can't see me.
I know they could, but in myhead they couldn't.

Speaker 1 (57:50):
So that's how, even if I went, to go dance right now
, I would let my hair fall andbe my shield.
So did you ever get comfortable?
Yeah, I mean it's.
It reads like you gotcomfortable in a very quick time
.

Speaker 2 (58:00):
I did it.
It was like about four when Iwas in Minnesota dancing at the
first place.
That was around four months.
I never really got comfortable,like not 100%, like I would
always get super nervous andlike tense.
But once I would go on stagethe fear and the anxiety would
just kind of go away becausesomething would come alive
inside me and I would get superexcited and happy and it was fun

(58:22):
.
But the thought of going onstage was always really scary to
me and overwhelming those firstthat first while, and then in
Michigan it took me a couplemore months and then the girls
started teaching me pull tricksand I don't know.
Then it was like amazing to goon stage.
I looked forward to it.
I would actually ask to go up,even if it wasn't my turn, if I

(58:42):
wasn't busy, because I was soexcited to go on stage and learn
new pull tricks and justexercise.
It was super fun.
And to own my own sexuality forthe first time in my life.
It was very empowering.

Speaker 1 (58:55):
There's a picture in the book that uh of you on the
pole, and I can't remember whereit was, but the story where you
just went to a strip club andthey had a pole and you asked if
you could go up there andeverybody was like oh my God,
Wow, Look at her go.

Speaker 2 (59:12):
It was in Cancun.
That was actually in Cancun ata nightclub.

Speaker 1 (59:15):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (59:17):
I love tall poles because there was a couple of
like cheetahs didn't have tallpoles but Spoonman Rhino had a
really tall pole, so I did likethat when I worked there.
They had a really tall pole.
So I did like that when Iworked there.
They had a super tall pole.
But in Cancun that pole is thetallest pole I ever danced on.

Speaker 1 (59:33):
That was really awesome.

Speaker 2 (59:35):
Yeah, I miss pole dancing.
Honestly.
I just went to Country Thunderlast week, a week ago, and some
of the camps they have stripperpoles on platforms and I was
like oh my gosh, I haven't donethis in like four years.
I didn't go upside down, but Iwas like I gotta, just gotta go
up there and I did.

Speaker 1 (59:55):
I spun around and like three different spins and I
was like this is really fun no,you could put one in here rush
you could put one in the frontroom, naomi I have one actually
outside.

Speaker 2 (01:00:07):
It's outside on a platform, but I haven't pulled
it out since I became a mom.

Speaker 1 (01:00:13):
Yeah, yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:00:14):
But I used to have it in my other place before we
bought this place.

Speaker 1 (01:00:17):
It's a workout.

Speaker 2 (01:00:19):
It's a huge workout.
I know I was like I got supertired because I'm not used to
like doing that kind of stuffanymore when I was at Country
Thunder, but it's it's a it'svery good exercise and super fun
and just to let you know, ifyou haven't already deduced,
that I did read the entire book.

Speaker 1 (01:00:37):
Uh, risa was not a favorite name of yours no, not.

Speaker 2 (01:00:41):
At first I hated it.
I was like this is the mosthorrible name.
But the girls like at leastit's yours, like no one else has
it.
And guys always thought I saidlisa.
And it kind of became reallyawesome because when they would
say, oh, nice to meet you, lisa,I would say no, it's like lisa,
but with an r risa.
And then it was like aconversation starter and they're

(01:01:03):
like wow, I've never met anyonewith that name.
And I had that stage name thelongest, from 2004 until 2020.

Speaker 1 (01:01:10):
And how did?
Because it has it's.
It's a foreign name that has ameaning, right.

Speaker 2 (01:01:15):
Yes, it means laughter in Spanish.

Speaker 1 (01:01:17):
Okay.

Speaker 2 (01:01:18):
That's, that's.

Speaker 1 (01:01:19):
yeah, that's kind of flattering that another dancer
gave that to you then Well, sheworked at Spearmint Rhino.

Speaker 2 (01:01:26):
It was like a week and I didn't have my own name
and like the girls were talkingabout and some of the regulars
are like oh, you don't have yourname, like you're changing your
name every day and throughoutyour shifts, and I was like
there's so many girls like allthe names seem to be taken.
So she was like and I neverreally talked to her until then
she's like you need your ownname.
And I was like yes, she's likecome on, let me help you.

(01:01:48):
And she takes me to thedressing room and she's shouting
out names and I'm like no, no,no, these are not, don't.
They don't fit me.
And when she got Teresa's, she'slike oh my gosh, it's perfect.
It means laughter, it's you'rebubbly, it's perfect for you.
And I was like I don't like it.
She's like that's why you don'thave a name.
You're too picky.
This is going to be your name.
I was like fine, I was nothappy, but in the end I'm

(01:02:09):
grateful for her and I did endup liking it, but it took me a
long time to get used to itwasn't sugar?

Speaker 1 (01:02:15):
one of yours as well?

Speaker 2 (01:02:17):
yes, that was in Michigan at sensations.
For four years I was sugar.
I was also a girl.
She's like, oh my gosh, you'reso sweet.
Sugar, sugar, sugar, sugarshould be your name.
And she's like I was like theywon.
Sugar should be your name.
And she's like I was like theywon't believe me.
My name is sugar.
And she's like they don't giveyou enough money to know your
real name.
I was like okay, I thought thatwas funny.
She was one of the girls thattaught me a lot of poultry.

(01:02:41):
She was really good on thepoultry.
She actually teaches poultryclasses now.

Speaker 1 (01:02:44):
What is the typical clientele that you dealt with
when you were stripping?

Speaker 2 (01:02:49):
now, what is the typical clientele that you dealt
with when you were stripping?
I preferred the older gentlemen.
Actually, I don't know, forsome reason the younger guys
would make me nervous or I feltlike they were just there
looking for a date, and not thatthe older guys weren't.
Sometimes, because they wereand I'm probably judgmental I
always felt like the older guysprobably had more money and I
was there to make money.
I wasn't there looking fordates, I was there to work.

(01:03:09):
But I feel like the majority ofmy clientele was like
middle-aged men, maybe like 35to older, or sometimes even
maybe younger than 35.
But I didn't often go up toguys.
When I thought they were intheir 20s, I don't know, I was
actually intimidated anduncomfortable to walk up to guys
that when I thought they werelike in their twenties, I don't
know, I was actually intimidatedand uncomfortable to walk up to

(01:03:32):
them.

Speaker 1 (01:03:34):
Well, was there a maybe a psychological, uh,
component to you gravitatingtowards the older gentlemen
because of that kind of distantrelationship you had with your
own father?

Speaker 2 (01:03:45):
That's what I feel like Absolutely.
I feel like that always made memore gravitate towards the
older men because of that.

Speaker 1 (01:03:54):
Yeah, has your family read the book.
Do they know about the book?
Do they know about your life?

Speaker 2 (01:04:01):
I just found out.
Last week someone reached outto me on Instagram.
He's like I'm a really goodfriend of your family and a lot
of the Amish where you grew upand I was driving around to your
brother and I started askinghim about the strict rules and
he started telling this man.
My brother told this man aboutthe relationship I have with my
parents and then he tells theman about my book and he's like,

(01:04:22):
if you ever get the book, like,please let me read it.
And I guess this man went andbought the book and he read it
and he's like, don't worry, Iwill not let him read it, I will
not even tell him that I haveit, because I don't think that
he would understand what youwent through.
Now I have talked to not myparents but some of my siblings,
a lot of my siblings.
I've talked to them about someof the drug abuse, because

(01:04:46):
during my years of addiction Iwas more absent.
I didn't go see them very oftenand a couple of times I did, I
was not in good shape, like Iwas just a hot mess and they
knew I was up to something butthey didn't know what.
So I guess to give them closure, like they asked me a little
bit about it sometimes when Ivisited and and I actually not

(01:05:08):
in detail, like I go in the book, but I've told them that I
smoked crack and I did coke andstuff like that, but I don't
know.
So they know I have a book.
I don't know if my parents knowthat I was a stripper, but I
feel like it would be naive tothink that they don't, because
they somehow find out everything, but we've never talked about
it.
So, oh, sorry, my phone isringing, that's okay.

(01:05:31):
We've never talked about it andI don't feel comfortable
talking to them about it.

Speaker 1 (01:05:35):
You know, what's interesting is we've talked
about how growing up Amish didnot prepare you for being
English in life outside ofAmishville, life outside of
Amishville.
However, I think that there areparts of growing up Amish that
did prepare you for your life asa stripper and a call girl, and

(01:05:56):
that is the amount of secrecythat you had to carry.
You know you can't lie in theAmish community, so you pretty
much have to keep things bottledup.

Speaker 2 (01:06:08):
Well.

Speaker 1 (01:06:09):
I think you pretty much had to keep things bottled
up, right?
I think you pretty much had tokeep things bottled up in the
English life and you had tobecome a very good liar.

Speaker 2 (01:06:15):
Exactly, absolutely, and also even besides that.
Yes, I agree with that 100%.
And also I feel like the strongfoundation that I had growing
up, amish.
I feel like that's what gave methe strength to get through all
of that and come outside on theother side, Because I often,

(01:06:36):
when I was down in the dumps anddidn't know where I was going
to go or what I was going to do,I thought about my family and
how they would feel or like Idon't know.
I just want it to be better anddo better, because I didn't
want my family I don't know, Ijust thought about my family a
lot.
I didn't want them to worry orI know they're worried, but I

(01:06:58):
didn't want them to see me asthis bad person and I want it to
do better and live a betterlife.

Speaker 1 (01:07:04):
How did you hit the drug habit?

Speaker 2 (01:07:07):
Well, getting away from crack.
I moved to las vegas and thenin las vegas I did a lot of
ecstasy in molly and I evensmoked meth a couple times with
my boyfriend there.
But that reminded me of thecrack and I quickly was done
with that and then I just I dida lot of, even when I moved to
cal California.

(01:07:28):
I moved to California for sixyears and my boyfriend there he
didn't like drugs and I wouldhype that I was doing coke and
molly and ecstasy from him, andI guess how I was able to kick
it was with my current partner.
Like he would always tell me,like if I ever want to have kids
, like I have to take care of mybody.
And he's like people that dohard drugs like you have in your

(01:07:49):
past.
He's like they often die intheir 40s and that really opened
my eyes.
Like he a lot of like.
I don't know about a lot, but afew of his favorite rappers and
people like that that were intocoke they died in their early
40s.
So he always told me about that.
He's like if you keep doingthis, you're going to die that.
And he's like if you keep doingthis, you're going to die.

(01:08:09):
And that really opened my eyes.
And then I wanted to become amother and I was like well, if I
want to be a mom, I have to getmy body healthy, and that's
really how I stopped.

Speaker 1 (01:08:18):
So you did not go to any meetings, or it was just a
personal decision and you usedyour own inner strength to stick
to it.

Speaker 2 (01:08:26):
Yes, willpower and inner strength, and yes.

Speaker 1 (01:08:29):
And when was the last time you used?

Speaker 2 (01:08:31):
In 2018 was the last time I used Coke.

Speaker 1 (01:08:36):
Wow, good for you, buddy.

Speaker 2 (01:08:37):
Yeah, I don't even drink alcohol.
Now, like at Country Thunder Iopened up like one of those
little Malibu it's kind of likea white claw and I took one sip
and I was like, well, it just tome if when I, even when I just
take a sip of alcohol now sip,and I was like, well, it just to
me if when I, even when I justtake a sip of alcohol now it
feels like placing in my body.

Speaker 1 (01:08:56):
Yeah Well, most of that reason is because you're
not doing it to fulfill a void,because those voids have been
filled.

Speaker 2 (01:08:59):
now Right.

Speaker 1 (01:08:59):
You know you have love from a partner and you have
a baby girl.

Speaker 2 (01:09:04):
Yeah, and I feel like writing, writing my book.
I never realized that thatwasn't like part of the plan
when I started writing the book,but writing the book was super
therapeutic and I was able torelease a lot of the trauma that
I had.
And I'm on a healing journeynow and I don't need drugs to

(01:09:24):
get me through like I used to orjust to function like I felt,
like I couldn't function beforewithout drugs.

Speaker 1 (01:09:30):
Yeah, Well, being on a healing journey, you have to
be present.
You know healing is becauseyou're present and if you're
taking drugs you ain't present.

Speaker 2 (01:09:40):
Absolutely not.
You're just shoving it down andcovering it up and just trying
to numb the pain.
At least that's how I felt,like what I would do.

Speaker 1 (01:09:48):
Yeah, so congratulations to you on making
that decision, of being able tostick to it.
But I mean, you look great, youlook happy.

Speaker 2 (01:09:53):
You look healthy.

Speaker 1 (01:09:55):
You don't look like the same person I read about.

Speaker 2 (01:09:57):
Yeah, no, I definitely.
I found the peace and thefreedom that I was looking for
when I left Amish.
It took me 20 years but I'mfinally here and I'm grateful
for that and I'm grateful for mypartner to be so loving and
supportive of me and acceptingme for who I am and just being

(01:10:18):
by my side, Like I don't haveany family out here in Arizona
where I am, but he's amazing andI'm really grateful for him and
I'm grateful for my strengthsand where I am now biggest
regret biggest regret?
there's two.
I have two biggest regrets.
The one is going back to theAmish for a second and making

(01:10:42):
them believe that I was there tostay, and the second one is
hitting that crack pipe for thefirst time and doing that first
line of Coke Like.
Those are my biggest regrets,definitely.

Speaker 1 (01:10:56):
Uh, was the grass greener?

Speaker 2 (01:10:58):
Yes, I feel like it is now.
It wasn't for a long time, butabsolutely now.
I'm very happy and I live avery peaceful life.
I live on four acres and I havechickens, a garden and we have
a daughter, and it's just, it'speace.
My life is very peaceful.

Speaker 1 (01:11:14):
I think you're going to be a fantastic mom, and I say
that because you have afirsthand knowledge of what
oppression and repression can doto somebody you know.
And I don't think that meansthat you're going to be willy
nilly with your daughter, but Ithink it also means that you're
going to have a capability thatsomebody else doesn't have in in

(01:11:39):
child rearing, because you camefrom such a situation.

Speaker 2 (01:11:44):
I always tell her everything in moderation, like,
like I allow her, for example,soda.
She gets a tiny bit once in ablue moon, and that's just an
example, like I feel.
Or she would just eat chocolateall day if I would let her, or
snacks, but I don't.
And I tell her in moderationBecause I know if I repress her

(01:12:06):
from these things when she getsolder she might just go crazy
and rebel.
Like I didn't just like do all,like drink a whole bunch of
soda and eat a whole bunch ofchocolate, and I don't want that
to happen to her.
So I allow her to have like alittle bit here and there versus
none at all.
You know what?

Speaker 1 (01:12:24):
It does make sense.
Yeah, everything in moderation.
That that's a great motto and agreat philosophy to have in
life.

Speaker 2 (01:12:30):
I don't want to repress her.

Speaker 1 (01:12:33):
Well, because we've all seen how that turns out
Exactly.

Speaker 2 (01:12:38):
That's not the way to go, definitely not.

Speaker 1 (01:12:41):
One of the heartwarming things that I love
about the book.
It's towards the end and it isthe relationship that your
mother has with your daughterand is the relationship that
your mother has with yourdaughter.

Speaker 2 (01:12:49):
Oh, it's so heartwarming and it almost makes
me cry sometimes when I thinkabout it, because she just loves
my daughter, loves my parentsand they just love her.
Like my mom, like I don't evenI've never seen her dance in her
life, but my daughter was like15 months old and singing if
you're happy, if you're happyand you know it, clap your hands
.
And she had my mom dancing.

(01:13:11):
Like I was like what?
Like I wished I could record it, but I can't do that there.
But these are memories andthings that you know.
I will tell her when she's alittle bit older.

Speaker 1 (01:13:20):
Well, doesn't grandpa play peekaboo?

Speaker 2 (01:13:22):
Yes, and grandpa was playing peekaboo and hide and
seek and bouncing her on hisknee like, oh, it's so
heartwarming, like they justadore her.
My dad likes he.
The last time I was there was ayear ago in June.
It'll be a year in June and heteased her with she has this
bear that she loves.
And he'd be like, oh, I'm gonnasnuggle the bear and she's like

(01:13:44):
, no, no, dottie, she calls himmommy and Dottie's grandpa and
grandpa and she would get sooffended when Dottie would try
to cuddle the bear.
But it was cute.
He didn't make her cry oranything, but it was.
It was really fun.

Speaker 1 (01:13:56):
Had you experienced that at her age with your dad,
would you have left?

Speaker 2 (01:14:01):
No, probably not.
I mean, I can't say for sure,but most likely not If I would
have had, like all thatnurturing and loving care and
like um interaction maybe that'snot the right word, but um,
just there, like they were therefor me, like that, it might

(01:14:21):
have been different what's yourgreatest victory?
my greatest victory isovercoming my drug habits
definitely, actually andbecoming a mom, because I was
told I couldn't be a mom.
So that is probably thegreatest victory, because at 40,
I was told I couldn't have kidsand I finally gave up and five

(01:14:42):
months later I was pregnant withour daughter and this is by far
the greatest chapter of my life.
It's challenging at times butit's the most rewarding and I'm
just so grateful that I was ableto become a mom and my daughter
is just so loving and amazingand so smart and fun.
She is such a fun personalityand I'm very grateful for her.

Speaker 1 (01:15:05):
Tough question I got to ask it.
What's more demeaning strippingfor strangers, having sex with
strangers or buying drugs?

Speaker 2 (01:15:14):
having sex with strangers Probably.

Speaker 1 (01:15:16):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:15:17):
I feel like that's like the biggest taboo among
like the other people, that justpeople in general, like they
probably look down on me morefor being, you know, having sex
with strangers.

Speaker 1 (01:15:32):
How did you deal with that personally, in your own
mind, in your own soul?

Speaker 2 (01:15:38):
It's like I said, I'm on a healing journey.
It was something that I had toforgive myself.
It was very I had a lot ofguilt for a long time.
Very, I had a lot of guilt fora long time.
Like I would feel super guiltyand in like in my book I talk
about how many guys would have.
Like sometimes I would have sexseven times with seven guys in
one day when I would go to Vegas, just so I could support myself

(01:16:00):
financially.
And that was reallysoul-crushing and I just
basically I just had forgivemyself and I was doing it so I
could support myself financiallybecause I didn't want to depend
on anyone else and I had justgone to college and spent
$20,000, yet I couldn't supportmyself on the $11 an hour in LA

(01:16:23):
that I made from my being aphlebotomist, like it was.
It was a challenging time, butdefinitely yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:16:31):
It's interesting that you say that you know kicking
the drug habit, becoming a mom.
Nowhere in there did you saythat graduating from college and
getting a degree was was amajor triumph for you.

Speaker 2 (01:16:43):
You know I always I for some reason I forget about
that sometimes because that wasa huge deal to me.
Actually, I was so proud ofmyself and I'm still proud of
myself, but I don't.
I got my phlebotomy x-raytechnician and medical assistant
license all in one year and Igraduated.
I was just on top of the worldLike it was like the greatest
feeling ever and I was like I'mnever going to be a stripper or

(01:17:06):
prostitute ever in my life again.
Like I was so excited and earlyon after I got hired and I only
made $11 an hour and I had topay the student loan and my car
payment and stuff and I realizedthat I couldn't live off that
living in LA and it kind ofreally crushed me.
But I'm, that was such a hugething for me to graduate from

(01:17:31):
college.
I'm really proud of myself.
But I don't do that now, but Istill have my licenses.

Speaker 1 (01:17:37):
Yeah, what do you do now?

Speaker 2 (01:17:39):
I am a content creator and a stay-at-home mom.

Speaker 1 (01:17:43):
What do you create?
What do you create?

Speaker 2 (01:17:45):
I do TikTok and Instagram.
I'm Amish Inspiration on bothof them and I just do stories
about things about my life, evengrowing up Amish, or about my
life now.

Speaker 1 (01:17:59):
And why do you dress in Amish attire, sometimes for
your TikTok?

Speaker 2 (01:18:03):
How do Amish women ride horses?
Now, I don't know about all theAmish, but the Swartzentruber
Amish, which is the way I grewup.
The women were not allowed toride horses when I was there.
I think it helps to get peopleto understand where I came from,
from the Amish.
I know some people get mad.

(01:18:24):
They're like why do you dresslike this if you're not Amish?
And also my daughter, she lovesto wear her Amish dress.
My mom made her Amish dress andshe often says mom, I want to
wear my Amish dress.
So we wear our Amish dresstogether and it's just to bring
awareness.
Like I don't know, I knowpeople get mad sometimes, but it
makes me feel happy to wear myAmish dress.

(01:18:46):
Those are my roots.

Speaker 1 (01:18:48):
And your hope with the book is what.

Speaker 2 (01:18:50):
I hope to give them hope and inspire them Like I
really really hope that my and I.
I already know that it does,because I often get messages on
TikTok or Instagram and they'relike wow, your story is amazing.
You're giving me hope.
Like I'm still living my storyright now, but I too, hope one
day I can overcome what I'mgoing through the way you did.

(01:19:14):
So that makes me feel I don'tknow.
It sometimes brings tears to myeyes because I wish I could go
help them.
But I know that they have tolike be ready to move on and get
well.
But I just I encourage them toget support and you know people

(01:19:34):
there for them to help them getthrough it it brings cheer.
It brings cheers to your eyes,but does it also bring a sense
of anger that nobody was therefor you when you were going
through it sometimes it does,but I always feel like I'm I was
responsible for myself to getout of it, because I'm the one
that got myself there, Like Iknew that I had I.

(01:19:55):
If anyone was going to get meout of there, it was me, because
people tried to help me whenand I wasn't ready, Like like
Dan, for example, like he's like, come here, I will, you can get
well, but at that time I just,for some reason, I wasn't ready
to change or to be better.
I was sick somehow and I just Ineeded help, but I didn't
accept it.
So I really hope that my storyinspires others and that they

(01:20:19):
too can heal and move forwardand have a good life.

Speaker 1 (01:20:23):
Now, like I said at the beginning, there are parts
of the book where I just wantedto shake you by the shoulders
and just wake you up, and now Ijust want to hug you.
Kid.

Speaker 2 (01:20:33):
Oh, thank you, You're very welcome.

Speaker 1 (01:20:35):
I'm very proud to know you, to have met you, and
just super, super glad thatyou're on the path that you're
on.

Speaker 2 (01:20:43):
Thank you yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:20:45):
I'm sure you are.
Yeah, I'm sure you are.

Speaker 2 (01:20:48):
Absolutely Every day I wake up is a great day and I'm
grateful to get another chanceat life.

Speaker 1 (01:20:53):
And congratulate that partner of yours and give
Stormy a big hug from us, okay.

Speaker 2 (01:20:59):
I sure will, absolutely.

Speaker 1 (01:21:01):
Where can they go to pick up your book?

Speaker 2 (01:21:02):
Amazon.

Speaker 1 (01:21:04):
Okay.

Speaker 2 (01:21:04):
I don't know if I'm allowed to say that, but it's on
Amazon.

Speaker 1 (01:21:07):
Yeah, so I downloaded it from Amazon on my Kindle.

Speaker 2 (01:21:10):
Yeah, that's where.
That's where they, and if theygo to my website, it just takes
them to Amazon.
That's where it's available.

Speaker 1 (01:21:17):
Yeah, and it's a quick read.
It is.
It is a very quick read and Iwould suggest reading it alone.

Speaker 2 (01:21:24):
I know right, I know right, I, I know right, I know
right, I know for some peopleit's overwhelming or overbearing
, it's too much for some people.
Like it's porn, like I got acouple of reviews.
They're like it's toopornographic.
I'm like it says erotic memoir,like what were you expecting?

Speaker 1 (01:21:41):
Oh yeah, it'll make you blush.
It'll make you blush Exactly,but it's a true, triumphant
story of what you went through,what you overcame.

Speaker 2 (01:21:58):
You'll be angry at times, you'll be frustrated at
times and then you'll celebrateat times, and I think that's a
well-rounded book.
Thank you, I I, I think so andI hope that, like I said, I hope
it inspires people and givesthem hope.

Speaker 1 (01:22:07):
So, and I think it will do just that.
The Amazing Adventures of anAmish Stripper, an erotic memoir
, serves as a cautionary tale onthe ramifications of oppression
, the financial and physicalcost of drug addiction and the
mental toll the search forbelonging can bring.
In the end, though, Naomi'sstory is a triumph, proving that

(01:22:27):
with determination,perseverance and love we can
overcome anything.
My thanks to Naomi Swartz andTruber for joining me Again.
You can get Naomi's book, theAmazing Adventures of an Amish
Stripper an erotic memoir, atAmazon, and you can follow her
on Instagram at AmishInspiration.
If you'd be kind enough to givethe Fuzzy Mike a rating, I

(01:22:49):
would be grateful, and pleasesubscribe to the Fuzzy Mike
YouTube channel and share theFuzzy Mike with all of your
contacts.
Thank you, I appreciate you fordoing that.
The Fuzzy Mike is hosted andproduced by Kevin Kline.
Production elements by ZachSheish.
At the Radio Farm Social mediadirector is Trish Kline.
For a weekly dose ofpickup-inducing laughter, check

(01:23:11):
out the Tuttle Klein podcast.
It's the podcast I co-host withmy longtime radio partner of 25
years, Tim Tuttle.
We give you new episodes everyWednesday.
I'll be back next week with anew episode of the Fuzzy Mike.
I hope you'll join me then, andthank you for listening, that's
it for the Fuzzy Mike.
Thank you, the Fuzzy Mike withKevin Klein.

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Out of the Depths of Darkness: An Amish Woman's Story of Transformation and Triumph

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