Episode 36 – “Listening to Your Customers”: Inside Avro’s Customer-Led Approach to GSE - The GSE Podcast

Episode Transcript
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Matt Weitzel (00:01):
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you by Fort Brand, not youreveryday GSE provider.
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Visit fortbrandcom to learnmore.
This is Brad Compton, this isLuke Brown, this is Jeff Barrett
, this is Tessa Farson and youare listening to the GSE Podcast
.
All right, well, this is Mattwith the GSE Podcast, and I am

(01:08):
with Avro GSE today, and we areactually at the Fort Brand MCO
location.
For those of you who don't know, that means Orlando, and we are
sitting in the conference roomat our Orlando maintenance
facility, and this will be thefirst podcast that I have
recorded under the Fort Brandbanner and it happens to be at

(01:31):
the Fort Brand location.
So I really appreciate Avrojoining me today.
I have Caden Scott and AndrewSnare and Simon on the phone
here.
Andrew and Caden were niceenough to come to Orlando and
they're sitting in front of meand Simon is on the telephone
here.
So, caden, how's it going today, buddy, yeah very good, thank

(01:53):
you.

Kaden Scott (01:54):
Thank you very much , matt, for having us on.

Yeah, not a problem, andrew, how you doing?
Oh, I'm doing fantastic.

Andrew Snair (02:00):
Are you?
Yeah, the West Coast timechange hasn't quite cut up to me
yet, so we're kind of playingit a little bit by year, but
this morning feels great.
Thanks for having us on.

Yeah, not a problem.
I guess I didn't realize thatyou were West Coast.

Yeah, I live in Portland and work out of
Portland.

Oh, okay, nice, Okay.
And then so, andrew, how didyou get started in the GSE
industry?
So, andrew, how did you getstarted in the GSE industry?

Yeah, that's an interesting question, Probably a
little more simple than some ofthe other stories out there,
but I've always been in accountmanagement, so that's been my
focus for the last 10 years, andan opportunity came up with
Avro.
Avro is a newer company on thescene and they were growing
rapidly and there's thisinteresting opportunity to be

(02:44):
part of something that's growingand actually help build out the
client relations strategy andthe account management strategy.
And so that's what drew me toAvro is there's this one-time
opportunity to really pick mypeople, set the strategy, sit
down with the leadership teamand make sure that we're all
going in the same direction andto capture really the long-term

(03:05):
potential.
And so I had known, I knew theGM there and I knew the CEO of
Saskark, which is the parentcompany of Avro, and so that was
kind of my way in in 2023, westarted talking and then,
towards the end of 2023, we madethe switch and I formally came
on as sales manager.

Oh, okay, nice.
So no GSE experience, justaccount manager experience.

Exactly so.
No GSE experience.
My experience in accountmanagement had been almost in a
project management role forprofessional services, so it was
for a design build firm focusedon basically class A office fit
out and so completely differentindustry, but all the
principles applied to setting upthat type of organization and

(03:48):
that type of department where wewanted to have very, very
thorough reach, and we alsowanted to have a strategy to not
only really harvest what we hadgrown and expanded into, which
was the ground handling market,but to also open the airline
market up for Avro.

Okay, nice.
And then how are you findingthe GSE industry to be?
Oh, it's an amazing industry.

I've never been in an industry like it.
It's so niche and so small andit's amazing how everyone's
connected, so it's almost makesour job simple.
Yeah, if you've got the goodproducts and the good services,
it almost does the work for youin some regard.
Um so, and it's been a pleasuremeeting you know yourself and

(04:31):
so many other people on at theghi show and looking forward to
the gse expo coming up here inthe next four weeks, I guess
yeah, man for sure.

And then we also have like, as I mentioned,
cadence here, and, uh, I thinkeverybody in the industry knows
Cadence, cadence.
How did you get your start inthe GSE industry?

It's quite an interesting question.
It's a family business.
In 1991, my dad started SaskArk.
We added in 2011, a companycalled Axiom, which is like we
manufacture light towers,generators and that kind of
lighting equipment, and then wewere basically reselling

(05:09):
SafeSmart, which is accessequipment.
So there's a lot of likemaintenance platforms and all
that sort of stuff.
So we were already kind ofdealing with some MRO and kind
of in the industry.
And, sorry, nine years ago wedecided, well, we're already
talking to a lot of thesecontacts, let's work on like
let's set up Avro and, you know,start selling GSE equipment.

(05:30):
And I guess, for myself, sevenyears ago I started at SaskArk
as a just a forklift and welderin the shop and did that for
three years and then I guess,yeah, then went into an office
role for a couple of years andthen two and a half years ago I
basically I wanted to get intoselling and I was kind of
looking around and with Saskarkit's such a complicated like

(05:52):
it's structural steel there's.
It's such a complex selling.
You really have to know the insand outs of welding and struts
and wellers and all that kind ofstuff.
And so I I, yeah, I came overto Avro and actually, andrew was
my boss for the first year.
I actually joined about sixmonths before Andrew.

Okay.

And same thing as what Andrew said is, once we
kind of got into it and set thestage and all got aligned, I
think it's very, very incrediblewhat we as a team have set and
our vision to, basically becausewe kind of got into the
industry just technicallytrading product Like we never.
We weren't true OEM, so we werebringing in products and out of
Indiana, out of Asia, whitelabeling it and selling it,

(06:34):
which was working okay.
But I guess from a qualitystandpoint we saw a huge
opportunity to, as wetransitioned to OEM, to really
improve that because we were nothappy with the level ourself
and anyway.
So yeah, that's kind of a briefintroduction on how I was.

Okay, so in the beginning Avro was not
manufacturing things themselves.
You were buying from othermanufacturers, you know, and
then putting the Avro sticker onthat and then that was now Avro
.
Now that has changed in thelast.
How long?
Yeah, probably.

I would say a year ago we started the journey.
Obviously the tariffs reallyhelped that and kind of the
current government in the US,which I would say we're very
thankful that it's pushed us tostart this transition.
But now we've set up.
So we have a factory inManitoba making our non-powered
equipment, we have one inMinnesota making non-powered

(07:29):
equipment, we have one inEstonia and one in Italy for
making our ground power unitsand then we still are using a
lot of we have a lot of, I guess, product coming out of Asia,
still that we'll betransitioning in the first
quarter of the year into intoother Minnesota, wisconsin.

So yep, okay, so are you just currently now
manufacturing everything at Avro, or is there still some things
that you're, that you're whitelabeling there?

is on some of it.
We've what we've done, likewith the Estonia plant and the
Italian plant.
We've it's a combination likewhere we've partnered with them
and kind of co-engineered forthe North American market, okay,
and so we've set up likeseparate assembly lines
specifically for us, okay, um,but then our non-powered
equipment and a lot of our liketractors and stuff that's,

(08:16):
that's our own, like ournon-powered stuff.
I was talking yesterday withwith one of our plant managers
and we're able to now, like ourbaggage carts, for example.
We're able to go up to 85 cartsa week if we want.
So basically what we've done iswe've set up like quality
product with product or sorry,with factories that are able to
really get volume, and that'skind of our key thing was, as we

(08:39):
transitioned, we didn't want todo any low quality products,
like we used to do a lot offixed axle baggage carts, for
example.
Now we're only doing torsionand galvan yield just to try
really bring the bar up, becauseit was just not aligned with
our kind of corporate vision.

Yeah.

Selling that kind of product?

Yeah, that's interesting because that was one
of the first tasks that we weregiven from the Saskark
leadership team or the Avroleadership team the same thing.
But they had asked us to reachout to every one of our clients
and every one of our prospectiveclients and we had a series of
questions about the quality ofthe service you're getting.
And this is going back to early2024, yeah and um, and so we

(09:18):
did these calls and I think wetalked to probably 80 people in
the industry and got all thisfeedback and we kept hearing
that they love the Avro team,they love the people, they love
the attentiveness.
There was large improvementsthat we had to make on parts and
service.
Then product quality was theother big thing that came up and

(09:40):
it seemed like if we fixedthose two issues that we would
have lifelong clients that wouldcontinue to grow every year.
But those two issues is kind ofwhat kept Caden and myself busy
for the last basically two years, working through those
corrections, resetting up theteam on the parts and service
and the parts and service, caden, you can talk about how much

(10:01):
has changed.
I mean before you know, therewasn't exactly the proper system
, those systems in place, butthey needed to be refined and
tweaked, and then we didn't haveenough locations, so we were
cross border shipping and sowith tariff and custom delays
like our duties and everythinglike there was unpredictability
in that, and so that's reallywhere we've been focusing on and

(10:23):
course correcting, and then youcan definitely see it, as some
of these bigger airlines arestarting to use us.
It's because they've had thatexperience and they've kind of
seen that journey.
And so that's kind of the wholegoal is we're making changes,
but how do we bring our clientsalong for the journey as well?

Yeah, for sure.
And then I imagine thatbringing on Simon was very
important in that journey aswell.

Yes, yes, yes, Simon, he is absolutely awesome
to have on the team.
I mean he can speak to it butkind of along the whole journey
is transitioning.
He's probably the main guy kindof overseeing all of that.

Yes, simon, talk to us a little bit about what
you're doing from the productdevelopment side.

Simone Livraghi (11:03):
Okay, so I'm Simon Livraghi.
I joined Adro in April 2025.
My background experience is inground handling and
manufacturing GSE.
My previous role.
I was the general manager inBlissbox in Thailand and I've

(11:27):
been with them for almost a year.
So with Valor, I decided tochange my career and move to
America and yeah, yeah, I amprobably my new face in this
continent, but I've been in thisindustry for many, many years.

(11:47):
My objective here is to expandthe product range and establish
manufacturing in North America.
So I follow both of thenon-motorized and the motorized
equipment, of the non-motorizedand the motorized equipment.
So so far, we got a very goodstage of non-motorized was the

(12:14):
first phase of our developmentprojects.
So now we have a car, baggagecars, cargo car and dollies and
made in Canada, and dollies andmade in Canada.
From the motorized equipment,we are coming up with new
products.
Some will be displayed in Vegaslike a towable conveyor belt.

(12:36):
Also the GPU, the electric GPUand the battery GPU.
So the development now we seenext year releasing new products
that I can't disclose at themoment, but something good is
coming up in.
January and we will be able todisclose that at late fall this

(13:02):
year.
So this is what I'm doing.
Of course, with my backgroundand my experience in
manufacturing, this helped a lotto speed up all these
development processes and openup factories and production
lines to start producing theseequipment in North America.

Okay, and then so recently, you know, tell me if
I'm wrong, but I know a littlebit about Avro so you all
recently come out with some newGPUs, You've come out with a new
pushback series, the Titanseries.
Is that correct?
Yeah, and then what else islike yeah, sorry, go ahead.
Simon.
What were you going to say?

Yeah, we're coming up with a new bag
extractor series, diesel andelectric.
We're not in the phase yet todisclose so much, but this is a
new product that is going tocome in and is going to be fully
made in North America.
So, as Kaylin said before,politics or geopolitics push us

(14:05):
into these projects and we aregetting in there and we believe
the North American customer willappreciate a lot in this
quality product development inthe continent.

And just to jump on , I would say what Simonon said,
like we were gonna do it.
It was in our five-year planbut obviously we've kind of
compressed our five-year planinto our one-year plan, so to
speak.
But we're actually very, verythankful because what it really
allows us to do like obviouslyit's massive investment, you
know, designing these productsand setting up assembly lines
and all this stuff but just toeven bring the quality and the

(14:44):
just the level, the standard ofthe equipment up, you know, when
it's made right in northamerica, is our core focus.
Yes, we are doing exports andwe have excess product
availability, but it's justreally enabled us to bring the
bar up on our whole productquality and our parts and our
service, and which we're reallyhappy about because that's our

(15:04):
long-term vision is just to setup for north america and just
hone in on that basically, did Imiss where the the location is
in north america, or have youdisclosed it, or is it not ready
to be disclosed?
I can't remember yeah, so we dohave one in minnesota right now
which is which is going good andit's a lot of like.
We have a lot of parts comingout of there and equipment is
there and then we arepotentially what Simon's

(15:27):
speaking as to.
That will either be Minnesotaor Wisconsin.

Okay, like another manufacturing facility, so the
one in Minnesota currently, isthat all non-motorized at the
moment.

So actually right now in Minnesota we have, I
guess we have two, one a,basically just a pdi and parts
warehouse where we bringequipment in that's maybe not
made in north america at thispoint, like for example the gpus
or whatever that we're makingin italy.
So we'll bring them in, do thepdi load bank and test them
before sending them out, okay,and then parts and then we do

(15:58):
have for our some of our likeour lab and water carts made in
Minnesota, about 40 minutes fromour other location.
Yeah, so it will, depending onwhere we do the tractors, that
will also be a separate, aseparate one as well.

So what is the second?
Uh, the second one that youwere talking about, the.
What are the capabilities ofthat Minnesota for the lab and
water cart?
Are you all just assemblingthere or like?
What does that look like?

Yep, so Are you all just assembling there or like
what does that look like?
Yep, so that is like top tobottom welding.
Oh wow, yep.

You getting in there and welding again, yeah.

I think the people wouldn't appreciate my welds.
They want something that lasts.
Okay, got it.

That's.
One of the fascinating things,though, is that it's like the
whole strategic direction ofAvro has changed.
And when we're going talkinginto the actual OEM process,
like for our bag carts, we'reactually manufacturing our own
components.
So we're bending the metal inthat plant to actually
manufacture our own torsionaxles.
So before we were having toactually keep a massive amount

(17:00):
of parts in stock, which we'restill doing.
But also when you're making thepart yourself on the
manufacturing floor, I meanyou've got the part there, you
have the design like how easy togo out and grab that part from
the manufacturing floor if youneeded to, yeah Right.
And so it's kind of coming backto the point where we're in
control of everything.

And I think, as we kind of look and like, as we
leverage the whole corecapabilities of Saskart Group.
Like you might say, out of thefour companies that Saskart
Group has, avro is the smallest,but what we have is we have a
huge financial backing that'sbasically allowing us to do
these investments, but we alsohave a full network of various
strategic partnerships.
So, for example, like these, asAndrew's saying, on the whole

(17:41):
non-powered equipment, like it'stop to bottom, we're
manufacturing it.
There's three patents on it,the torsion axle, everything is
built in-house and what we didis one of our plants that is in
Manitoba, that's set upbasically just to hammer these
things out is that's the reasonwhy we can hit these volumes

(18:03):
Like we are.
I know right now we're notrunning at 85 carts a week,
we're running at about 50.
I know right now we're notrunning at 85 carts a week,
we're running at about 50.
But what's so incredible, Iguess, as we've got together as
a team and aligned and allworking in the same direction,
is basically from seven months.
We had nothing to do with anynon-powered equipment besides
trading, and now we have one ofthe biggest production
capacities.
That's in North America.
It's Terra Free.
We're shipping them globallynow with flat pack options.
It's tariff free.
We're shipping them globallynow with flat pack options, and

(18:23):
so it just kind of goes to showthat as we really got together
as a team and we're aligned thetransition and how quick it can
happen.
Yeah, that's an amazing story.

I can't believe that.
So before you all were kind of,like you said, buying other
people's equipment, reselling it.
Now you're manufacturing it allyourself.
And so I know that when I waswith XSEED, we had some issues
with some you know verybeginning product line right out
of Avro.
I think we supported you guyslike from day one kind of thing,

(18:53):
and we had some issues.
You were able to come in thereand help us out, solve those
issues and then give us, youknow, new product and which was
in the Titan series is, I think,what ended up coming out of
that and we've had all good,positive feedback about the
Titan and you really took careof us and so we really
appreciate that right and weappreciate the partnership.

(19:15):
And so how have you handled?
Because, like you said, youwent from white labeling
products and now manufacturingthemselves.
Like, how are you all?

supporting that stuff that was out in the field
from the very beginning.
So that goes back to my commentearlier about keeping a lot of
parts in stock still.
So we're obligated to supporteverything that's out in the
field for basically the next 10,15 years, right?

Exactly.

So it's a long-term game.
Caden, you can kind of diveinto the details on that.

Yeah, like it's a very, very interesting question
because I think like, as youwere speaking as kind of the
teething problems, you might say, like when I first joined Avro
I was like, hey, we're goingplaces where, you know, this is
looking pretty good.
And it became very, very clearwithin a few months that there
was very big issues in the partsand service side.
And I mean, ultimately, we allknow it's powered equipment,

(20:09):
it's going to break, but how isit to fix it?
Everything's going to break,but how easy is it for parts,
how easy is it for service?
And I think we really saw ahuge opportunity to just
dramatically increase that andexpand that capability.
And so, as Andrew said, likewe're obligated to support it.
But with cross border as well,you know, if you have parts in
Canada, you ship them across.
They could be in customs forfive minutes or five weeks, you

(20:32):
don't know, depending on if theguy you know or, yeah, depending
on how, how he's feeling thatday, basically.
But basically we've added inour parts and service team.
This year alone there's sixpeople that have been added that
are just outbound selling partsand service, and our parts
stock has increased by over 15times what it was at the start
of the year in both locations.

(20:53):
So if it's in the US, it willship from the US, if it's in
Canada, it will ship from Canada, just to avoid delays.
And basically, we look at apiece of equipment and if I call
for an order of part, I don'twant to wait any time, I don't,
which we're not quite like we're.
We have a lot, lot more stockcoming in, but so by the end of
the year we'll get there.
But yeah, so we we have a verybig inventory of parts.

Yeah, I remember what you called me about a year,
year and a half ago and youknow we were kind of discussing
the strategy with parts andwhere they should be located and
and you know what your visionwas and all that kind of stuff.
And then you moved on thatalmost immediately.
I remember getting off thephone with you and I was
thinking, oh well, this is goingto take forever to set up and
Caden had it done in a matter ofweeks probably.

(21:36):
But but that's amazing thatyou're able to support.
So what is a?
What are the?
From a technician standpoint?
You know, something goes down.
Do you all have travelingtechnicians?
What?
What does that?
What does that kind of likesupport group look like?

Yep, so we, we have roughly four of our own
internal like Avro technicians,but then we also have a network
in the U?
S with, you know, third partyones that we will use.
So we can dispatch our own ifit's, if we think we need to, or
if we can dispatch one of themand, you know, get on a video
call or try diagnose it that way, but also a lot of our like our

(22:11):
GPUs and all that stuff.
It's all like telematics.
We can go on our computer anddiagnose it from Oxbow or
Minnesota, etc.
Sort of thing.

So yeah, that's yeah, that's pretty cool, yeah.
And then, um, like you said,parts stocks.
You know heavy it's in the U S,so it can ship out, probably
next day, get to get to whereverit needs to be, yep, okay, all
right, let's start talking about, uh, some products specifically
.
So I think when you all started, you did not have pushbacks.

(22:40):
Is that correct?
That's something that's kind ofmore recent, and is the Titan
series your first kind ofiteration of the pushback?
I guess?

So we did start with one pushback.

It was a basic.

It was called the PT2690D, Okay, and so that
pushback was kind of where weentered the market, we cut our
teeth on that, yeah, and weended up getting so much
feedback like positive feedbackon it.
But also we had there's likelittle critiques from our
clients and it kind of speaks tothe overall direction of the

(23:14):
sales team where, instead ofjust calling and trying to sell
product when we started makingthis transition for supply chain
, it's all about getting clientfeedback and bringing them the
clients to the process fordesign, development and R&D and
collecting that feedback so wecan actually make a better
product and bringing the clientsalong for that journey.
And on the PT2690D there wasjust quite a few changes or

(23:35):
requests for change that cameout of all that feedback.
And that's what the Titanseries is.
It's our approach to capturingthe feedback we got in the North
American market on the PT2690Dand then producing a quality
product with all those featuresthat were requested, like a
different engine, for example,remote diagnostics, and then
also different qualitycomponents within the actual cab

(23:57):
itself.

And you look at that Titan PT350, for example.
It's high speed towingcapability, it's come standard
with transmission coolers andit's a higher output engine than
our competition.
And I mean we basically justafter as Andrew said, like after
getting customer led feedback,it's like what are the things
that is missing from our currentproduct and how can we

(24:21):
integrate that into our newproducts?
That is missing from ourcurrent product and how can we
integrate that into our newproducts?
And I think that goes to speakas to our whole product kind of
portfolio.
As we're launching products ornew products are coming out,
we're getting direct it'scustomer led feedback.
That's really, you know, evenon the design of these baggage
carts and stuff, we had multiplecalls with the engineering
teams at American Airlines andother people that came in and

(24:42):
they said they were very heavilyinvolved with just all the
specs and I mean Unify there'squite a few that were just which
I mean is really kind of theway that we've broken into the
market so quick.
I would say it's just becauseit's what it's actually what the
people want.

Oh, I like that.
What the people want, is thatthe?
New slogan for Avro what thepeople want.

Yeah, it should be .
Our new slogan is best onground.
Oh, best on ground, so it'slike we view it as a mindset.
So it's an internal challenge,almost Like are we showing up
every day.
Are we the best on ground?
Did we answer that email thebest we could?
Did we get back to that clientthe quickest?
It's kind of like a test thatwe all think about.

I like it, yeah, and with that so like best on
ground.
That's kind of like ourexternal Everything can be
measured off that, butinternally it's like we're on it
, we're human, we're unstoppable.
So yeah, we're going to makemistakes, we're human, but we're
fix it, we're unstoppable.
Just keep driving forward tomake stuff happen.

Yeah, I mean, you all are always on top of it.
I got to say, uh, when I askfor quotes or when I make phone
calls, you guys, you alwaysanswer.
I can't say the same for myself, because I'm always recording
podcasts, but uh, uh, but.
But you all are, um, you allare fantastic at that.
So is it a full series ofpushbacks?
Um, so you go the whole way, upto wide body.

Yeah, so the special thing about the Titan
series is that it has the rightengineering approach.
So we've got hydraulic coolersand transmission coolers and
what it allows is what Keatonmentioned is the long haul
towing capability.
Oh really.
So you're seeing like some ofthe airlines now standardize on
this unit, and we took thatfirst step with X Exceed on that

(26:25):
demo unit in Tampa, but we'restandardized in that capacity
now with that airline and it'sbecause of that feature.
So instead of spending hundredsof thousands more on a tow
barless unit for the rightapplication and for maintenance
tows, this is a unit for thatjob.
That's incredible.

So it's very.
I didn't.
That's incredible.
So it's very I didn't realizethat.
Yeah, it's very, verystrategically Cade should have
done a better job selling thatunit.
It's very strategicallyengineered.

So we're actually solving a problem.
I mean, the problem in theindustry is that if you take a
standard pushback or tow tractorthat's conventional and you
start using that for long, longtoast.

You're going to burn the engine of the
transmission.

So that's our specific value for that
application with this unit.

Oh, wow, that's amazing.
I'm glad to ask that questionnow because I had no idea.
That's fantastic, guys.
That's a huge issue thatairlines and ground handlers are
dealing with all the time, soway to go on that one.
So how are the sales of thosegoing in the US?
Pretty good, yeah, so we'resold out of all of our
production for this year.

Wow.
So production is our constraintright now.

I should start putting in POs now.
Is that what you're telling me?

Exactly.

That's why we came here today.
I love it so all right.
So let's dive into the GPUsreal quick.
So that's kind of a fairly newproduct for you guys.
Where's that being manufactured?
What does the long term looklike for that?
And kind of go through thatproduct line with me?

Yep, I don't know, simon, do you want to take that
one?

Yes, for sure.
Yeah, so just to give you anoverview, our bestselling GPU at
the moment is still the diesel,and it's a product completely
different to what ourcompetitors have, because the
engine rotates at 1500 rpm andis much lower compared to our

(28:23):
competitors, and this givesincredible advantage to the
customer into fuel consumptionsand into the reduction of noise
on the ramp that today is aquite big issue, so that saving

(28:43):
in fuel consumption is extremelyhigh and this is our key
selling feature and we had donethis involving our customer and
listen a lot to the customervoice, and this is what we do in
our product development.
Yeah, we have also another line.

(29:05):
That is, the battery.
Gpu Today is very popular, Ithink, all over the world where
there are power supplyinfrastructure facilities, and
then, to not forget, theelectric GPU, especially for the
MRO and for airports wherethere is the proper power supply

(29:30):
.
So this is a complete gamechanger in our product range.

Yeah, I agree.
Where's that being manufacturedat the moment?
I can't remember.
Is that in Italy?

So the electric GPU are manufactured in Estonia
.
Okay and sorry, I forget to saysomething about these GPUs.
The efficiency is around 96%,and what currently other

(30:05):
manufacturers do, that they'reefficient in converting the
energy, are around 60-70%.
Even that is focused on thepower savings.
So this has been our corephilosophy in designing GPUs.

Yeah, nice, okay, yeah.
And then the diesel and thebattery GPUs are in Italy, yeah,
okay.

Gotcha, and even on that I mean, we're now air
freighting them over, because wecan't get them over here quick
enough.

Jeez yeah.

So no, I mean, as Simon said, I mean there's a
reason kind of why they'reselling so quick, it's?
He went over the efficienciesof both.

So you have nineties, you have one eighties,
is that?
Do you have a one 80 battery?

Yeah, Wow, yep, yep.
So so there's one being airshipped.
What?
What model is it as being airshipped?
They'll be in New York in twoweeks.
Yeah, so that's a 90 diesel.
Yeah, 90 diesel.
We're air shipping one in for aclient to new york in two weeks
, so maybe we can meet up thereand do a little review on that

(31:08):
yeah, when's it land, uh, firstweek of september, and where in
new york, in new york.

Oh okay, oh well, you know I might be able to make
that trip who knows?

yeah, you know, I have an office in new york now,
so I don't really have a lot ofexcuses.

I guess I haven't been up to the new fort brand
off.
Oh, and it's not new fort brand, is it's been there?
I have been there, but, uh, Iwas actually.
They were a customer of minethe last time that I was there,
uh, and now I work for them, soyeah so, yeah, I do need to go
and visit new york.
Maybe I should, uh, maybe I gogo see this new GPU that's just
landed.
Um, so then baggage tractorsyou offer.

(31:45):
I'm seeing a diesel baggagetractor, is that?
Is that the only power optionat the moment is diesel, or do
you have gas?
Yep.

Um, so we've gas, diesel and an electric.

Okay, and then with gas?
What?
What engine are you using?
So it is the.

PSI 2.4.
Okay, but we do have the optionfor the Deutz 2.9.
Okay.

As well.
So yep, and then electric.
You're using lithium, or canthey do lithium or lead acid or
Yep?

Both.
So we basically just set themup for whatever we can drop,
basically any battery and yep.

Nice, yeah, we're battery agnostic on the electric
.

Oh, that's nice of you guys.

Yeah, y'all are the best.
That's amazing.
We just Well.
The lithium market is changingso quickly.
I know the pricing's increasingRight Like the batteries
themselves, are a massive chunkof the overall expenditure now
For sure.
When you're talking about atractor and then you know, every
company seems to have theirdifferent.
Every airliner ground handlerseems to have a different
approach on who they want tostandardize on.

(32:44):
So we like picking partnersthat have great service on the
battery side so that we can beconfident that we can walk away
in one regard from that sale andknow that they'll be taken care
of on the battery after salesservice and making sure that
there will always be diagnosticsthere or telematics and whatnot
.
But it's definitely a changingmarket, for sure.

I'm glad you brought that up.
So if I have a battery supplierthat I want to work with
exclusively, can I put that intoyour Avro unit or do I have to
go with the battery that youhave selected?

No, we work with your preferred supplier for
batteries, but then if I don'thave a preferred supplier, you
all can help me out 100%, yeah,supplier for batteries, but then
if I don't have a preferredsupplier, you all can.
You all can help me out 100,yeah, and I think, as we have
kind of learned from our pastexperiences like the, we had so
much opportunity in the aftersales areas like going down
every level of our supply chainwhich has a lot of involvement

(33:35):
from our c-suite is like what isthe partnership like as far as,
like you know, even engines orstuff like how, how easy are
they to deal with?
Because we want to be supportfrom top to bottom.
So we've been matching ourlevel of what we want for after
sales with all of ourpartnerships in the supply chain
area, which is, I think, aswe've looked at it through that
lens, it's really helped usbring that level up.

For sure, yeah.
And then let's dive in reallyquickly, because you mentioned
telematics.
So same kind of question, right?
Which is do you all havetelematics on your units, like
inherently?
If so, which units do you haveit on?
If you don't, can I have youput, if I have a preferred
supplier, put it onto your units.
So I will let one of the two ofyou guys answer that.

Yeah, no, we've got telematics on the Titan
series, We've got it on the GPUsand then it's an option on our
other equipment.
I think where we're goinglong-term is to actually roll
out an extensive platform fortelematics and tracking.
So we've partnered up with acompany and it's in development
right now to actually have aplatform where our clients can

(34:39):
log into and get all that dataand have like control over all
that data and be able to trackeach unit and it's a way for us
to diagnose remotely but alsoit's a useful data point for our
clients is kind of what I'msaying.
So we're going to go in thatdirection of building that out
more.
It's somewhat, our offeringright now is telematics and it's

(35:01):
going to be um, we've gotaccess, remote access, to that
on the titan series and ourclients have access to it,
obviously.
But we want to build that outand have it kind of a key
feature across every product inour portfolio, every powered
piece, nice.
So that's going to be like aend of quarter four rollout, I
think is what we're thinking.
Um, okay, yeah, we're incontract, in contract, but we're

(35:22):
at least three months out.

So we'll be done by the expo.
No, no, nope, man, that's sad.
Oh well, all right, the expo.
What do you bring into the expo?
Can you tell?
If there's things you can'ttell me, that's fine.
But you can tell me, like 90%.

Yep, so we'll have two GPUs battery GPU, electric
GPU over a cargo cart or baggagecart of a Titan PT350.
And, oh, sorry, and a lithiumtractor, baggage tractor, Gotcha
.

And then are you all indoor or outdoor?
I can't remember Indoor Nice.

Oh, that's big.
Oh, the sunburn I got last timewas too bad, oh man, we were
all.
Sunburn I got last time was toobad, oh man.

We were all making fun of you behind your back.
I mean, it was, yeah, he lookedbad.
Guys, yeah, oh man, yeah, well,that's awesome.
And then belt loaders Do youall have belt loaders?
Yeah, yeah, you do, tell meabout a belt loader, yeah so
we'll talk about the gas beltloaders.

So here's a little story.
Oh, I love stories.
Yeah, we were working with aground handler up in Calgary
going back about a year and ahalf ago and they bought about
12 of our belt loaders and thisis a classic example of there
are some things on it that justweren't working well, some
different components and maybedesign features that just didn't
match their spec.
Anyways, they did this demo,they came back with the feedback

(36:48):
and we actually worked with theairport authority on some of
the regulations and some of thefeatures, developing those
features.
But we essentially had to goback into our supply chain and
change like probably eightdifferent components on this, on
this belt loader, and we madethose changes and, like those
have had an absolute stellar runsince those changes like we

(37:09):
haven't gotten one call on partsand service for basically the
last 18 months.
But what that did is that weactually changed the spec on all
of our belt loaders goingforward.
So all that client feedback wascaptured in that product
development.
And now the client feedback hascome.
We've made the changes, it'sbeen proven and like now when we

(37:29):
go out and demo a belt loader,it's got all those changes and
clients love it.
So it's kind of an example oflike a kind of like a rough go,
like a rough start with like ayou know one client, but all
that feedback has been captured.
In the last like two yearswe've made those changes and
that's kind of what keeps theteam at Avro absolutely pumped.
It's because we're in real time, we're making these changes and

(37:50):
we're moving fast.
But that's why the accountmanagement team needs to bring
the clients along for thejourney.

I mean, it sounds like the moral of this podcast
is listen to your customers.

A hundred percent.
Yeah, absolutely yeah.
Our first on our firstleadership session end of 2023.
We had all these outstandingparts of service issues.
We had product quality concerns, and I remember the leadership
team at SASC.
We were all sitting around thetable and they like didn't
tolerate at all.
Like the GM was put on the spot, like everyone was put on the
spot as far as why there waseven these issues outstanding,

(38:24):
and that's kind of what drove alot of the change.

And I think like the SAS car kind of influence
with manufacturing stuff fromday one and just kind of how
their parts and serviceexperience and how they're like
I mean, even in maintenancethere with all their equipment I
mean there's a very, verydocumented process for how deep
you know just keep making surethe stuff is caught up on
maintenance that sort of thing.
And there's they came hard, Iremember, and since then there

(38:52):
was definitely quite a fewchanges even on the management
side at Avro, and I was just newthere for three months and it
was definitely an eye opener.

Yeah, one of the key things is we basically
flatten the structure soeveryone is accountable in the
company Everyone.
We all work together as oneteam.
There's not like a massivechain of command that people
have to climb to get feedback tothe top.
So I think the one thing that'sreally helped us move fast when
we need to.

Yeah, I know, when I call Caden about stuff, he
listens, you know, and that'simportant.
People want somebody whoactually listens, and then the
stuff gets done almostimmediately.
So I will say that I will giveCaden credit there, for sure.
So what part of your productline really haven't we covered
at this point?
I think we got bag carts, wegoties, we have pushbacks, belt
loaders, bag tractors, gpus.

(39:44):
What else?
Are you guys doing anythingelse?
Or can we not talk about itright now?
Or I mean, what are y'all going?
after, just like we're having acomplete, um you know, gate
series.

Here I mean is that we're after no, so we're
strategically focused on belowwing ground support equipment.
So that's our strategic focusIn the future.
It's almost like we might be—.

Where's my?

air start.
Ah well, we can talk to Simonabout that?

Where's my air?

conditioner.

I was going to say Simon's— we have the air
conditioner.

He's in development, so we have the air
conditioner.
Okay, if you want one, we canget one.

Okay, so do we have what?
30 ton, 60 ton, Yep 110?

Yep, yep.

We have a 30 ton, we have 60 ton, we have 110
.
Wow, it can become hybrid.
It can be plugged in the poweroutlet on the wall and you can
make it working withoutswitching on the engine.
Wow, the wall and you can makeit working without switching on
the engine.

So, wow, it is a sort of you know, asia, that
would fit also using side anglesor closed places.
Yeah, okay, so those arecurrently in production or those
are ready to roll out at anytime.
What's the time frame look likeon those?
Yeah, simon's probably ahead ofus on this.

Yeah, they are in production and we're going to
start delivering them by springnext year.

Okay.

Not earlier than that.

Nice, all right, look at that.
I got something out of you guys, at least you know.
So I knew I'd break them downto the listeners so nice.

So another quick story, like this week some guy
called me a customer, very, verygood customer, and said, like
I'm getting an invoice for theparts, which is no problem
because, like the day we box theparts and put them on the shelf
for the courier to pick them up, we confirm it, so the invoice
will go the next morning.
But he said the issue is I'malso the same day getting a
follow-up saying you know, haveI received all the parts and

(41:44):
have a?
You know like, can you pleaseconfirm the packing slip and
everything's correct?
And he said like, like how canyou expect me to do this?
But it's, you know, it mighttake three, four days to come or
whatever.
And so it's like that makes Imean, yeah, that's, you can't
expect that.
So within five minutes we hadchanged our process to seven
days, first follow up andreceiving, and on, you know,

(42:06):
making sure they got all thestuff.
And I called him back and hewas just pumped that like within
he called, said it was an issueand we rewrote our process,
just changed that little thing.
And he was like, well, that'sawesome, thank you very much.

Yeah, like I said, the one thing I'll give you
credit for is you're all over it.
You know, when I bringsomething forward, like it just
doesn't just go and nothinghappens, right, like you all
always make you know, somethinghappens, yep.

Right and I think it's a testament.
Like the whole team, as Andrewspoke about flattening the
structure and focusing more onexecution than just.
You know, the whole hierarchystuff't work.
There's too much red tape.

Yeah, yeah, so everyone is involved in the
details, so everyone knowsactually how to do make the
changes, how to do the thingsthat need to get done, and so
that's kind of like the keydifference, because before, when
we had so many layers, therewas like disconnect between
actually how do you do somethingthat maybe, like an account
manager is doing or you knowsomeone else is doing on the
team like how do you actuallymake that change?

(43:05):
And if you're disconnected fromthe details, then it's actually
hard to drive that change andmake sure it's done right, and
so that's kind of I think that'sbeen helpful just to get
everyone working on the sameteam in the details.
Everyone knows what's happening, everyone knows the process and
how to fix things.

Yeah, I like it.
When am I going to get a tourof the the facility in Minnesota
?
Is it ready?
Is it tour ready or are wegoing to wait for a new facility
?

Probably.

January, january yeah.

Yeah, that's when the next one's going to be set
up.
Okay, yep.

And they're probably-.
See, I'm just slowly but surely, I'm pulling the string, guys.

Yeah, it's going to be January because we've got
client commitments for deliveryout of that facility in quarter
two next year.

So will that be like the flagship facility kind
of the one in January?

I think so, like for the baggage tractors.
I mean, we already have acouple hundred units that are
booked, that we have dates wehave to hit, okay.
So it's kind of a yeah, we haveno option.

So are you spending a lot of time in
Minnesota recently?

Yeah, yeah, yeah, I've spent a lot of time in
Minnesota, and then Simon will.
He's been spending a lot oftime traveling and it's no, it's
exciting.
Where do you live right now?
Caden In Oxbow, saskatchewan.
So it's a town, 1,200 people.

(44:25):
Wow, okay, and that is where.
So it's actually 15 miles fromthe US border.
I'm a US citizen, as my mom's,from Michigan, but in that town,
that is where Saskark wasstarted.
Oh, okay, so that's kind of whythe 1,200 people.

That's a smaller town than I grew up, in which I
didn't.
Yeah, that's crazy man.

Avro picked it strategically.
It's like if we pick a smallenough town, we can own the town
Exactly.

Right.
Yeah, we're going to start anAvro town next.
We have to play our cards,right.

Yeah, exactly.

That's hilarious.

What about you, Matt?
Where did you?

Yeah, so I grew up in Kentucky.
Took me a while to drop theaccent.
I've been working on that eversince I got out of college.
I'm like I got to get rid ofthis thing because I sound like
a redneck, but not that rednecksare bad.
We're not saying anything badabout rednecks I love them
because I am one, but I had todrop the accent for the podcast,
right.
But I think my town had 7,000people growing up, but my
graduating high school class had43 people in it.

(45:22):
Okay, so, but I think only 38graduated, you know.
But I mean that's beside thepoint, but, but I went to a very
, very small school, so, but youknow, I probably had more, I
probably had less people in mygraduating class than you did, I
would imagine.
Right.

Yeah, Well, I was.
I was the only one.

You were the only one.
Yeah, oh, my gosh, never mind.
Okay, I thought I might have abeat on that one at least.

The school I went to when I graduated, there was
15 people in the whole school.
What?

That's crazy.

Well, what was the story about you?
Because you were a sprinterright.

Yeah, I was a sprinter.

yeah, yeah, and with that whole car.
There was that car theft inthat rental car.

Oh yeah, oh, that's it.
That is a good story, butanyway.
So I didn't ever think it wouldcome into use in my
professional life and I don'tknow why I told you this story,
but it's funny that I did so.
I worked for EnterpriseRent-A-Car and the first day on
my job and listeners of thepodcast will know that I worked
for Enterprise because that'show I met Brad Compton, that's
how I got into the industry.
But anyway, let's go back today one.

(46:46):
Day one.
I didn't know the systems yet.
You have to learn how to usethe computer system and
everything.
Well, I didn't know how to dothat.
So they're like hey, listen, doyou want to go out on a repo?
And I'm like no way I get to goon a repo.
And they're like yeah, so arepo is like go get a car that
the person has stopped paying on.
They defaulted on it.
So I hop in the car with themanager and we drive over to

(47:08):
this guy's house and she stops acouple houses away and she says
so that's the car sitting inthe driveway, we have the extra
key and what you're going to dois you're going to get out of
this car and run as fast as youcan get in the car and drive off
.
So, uh, I was like you know, Imean, it was like a superhero,

(47:33):
you know, and uh, so anyway.
So she pulls up and, uh, Igrabbed the keys and I sprint
and as I'm sprinting towards thecar, a guy comes out of this,
like you know, completelydilapidated house in a wife
beater, and starts screaming and, you know, yelling at me and

(47:54):
I'm like, oh my God, and I hopin the car and I sped off, but
see that my speed, if I wouldhave been any slower, the guy
would have got me.
You know what I mean.
Like this was his only mode oftransportation, so, anyway, so
that's my story, and we usuallyend these podcasts with GSE
stories.
So this is not necessarily aGSE story, but at least the

(48:17):
listeners get that story.
So, caden, thanks for bringingthat up.

That's a fantastic story.

Oh, thanks.

Yeah, that's like.
That's like definitely a casestudy on why it's definitely a
case.
You know why you should befocused on sprinting rather than
like long distance.
Yeah, it's like where in lifewill you ever use long distance?
Never, Exactly Right.

Yeah, exactly, and my wife was a marathon runner
and when we met I told her youknow, I'm a runner right and
what.
I didn't specify that I wasactually a sprinter because I'm
not a runner right.
Like I went out for a crosscountry and I lasted one
practice and I was like I'm outof here, like this is ridiculous
.
You know I can't run the longdistances, so yeah.

(48:57):
So, caden, what is your?
What is your GSE story?

do you have?
A good one for us well, this iskind of a before my GSE.
You know, before I was involvedwith GSE.
But what I was thinking is,before I worked at Saskirk I was
a worked for a company calledSunset Concrete for probably
eight months.
So I was a labor, you know,cutting rebar, driving the skids
here, doing all that stuff, andmy, the boss there was a very

(49:23):
old school.
He would smack you around thetops if you needed to get stuff
done.
I mean not physically.

Yeah, okay, all right.
I was like oh, is this a smack?
You?
That's all right.
Just a little one, no, justyeah.

But I was in the skid steer and I was backing up
and I lifted the bucket andturned around and you know, went
out and he came up to thewindow and he said he said, do
you have neck problems?
And I said, you know, not to myknowledge.
I mean, it feels like it'sworking pretty good.
He said from now on you back up, you turn your head and back up
.
It was just one thing.

(49:57):
From that site I've taken a lotof note from that guy just how
it's a long-lasting impressionof how involved in the detail
that guy was and his work.
He was a guy that everyonecalls him and I think that
that's just you know, kind of,as Andrew said, into the detail
that we're involved in.
Like it's just kind of the.
You know you have to getinvolved in the detail.
If you can't get the smallthings right, you're not going

(50:21):
to get the big things right.

Anyways, that's kind of a dude.
I love that.
Yeah, intro yeah, no, I likethat I've brought.
I like how you tied it in I.

Yeah, I appreciate that yeah, but yeah, it's just
something that brought from thatthat I have a lot of respect
for that man and yeah yeah, andnow you're, you're still
thinking about that today.

Yeah, so it must have meant something to you.

So all right, andrew, you're up yeah, I don't
really have a good gse story.
I mean, the whole journey atavro has been my gse story.
Yeah, um, like there hasn'tbeen one single defining.
I know experience like like Ihaven't repoed a car oh, like a
gse tractor or anything likethat so, um, but yeah, I, I
definitely feel like the um.

(50:57):
My experience at avro I've onlybeen there two years, but just
that, that experience ofstarting with something and
having to make continuousimprovement and then seeing the
progress has just been awesome.
It's been very rewarding and Ithink it's been rewarding for
the team as well.

Yeah, that's good, simon, I think you're up next.
You got a good GSC story for us.

Oh, I have 20 years of GSC stories, you need
to just pick one.
Oh, I have 20 years of GSEstories, you need to just pick
one.
So let's say that in my journey, my good GSE story is that in
my previous employment at BlissFox, I have two senior persons

(51:39):
in the organization that havebeen in the industry One just
retired three or four years ago,that working in the GSE
industry since 1984.
So they transmit to me really ahuge technical background, that

(52:02):
learning on the field, learningon the books and learning
really how to build good andquality GSE equipment.
And I believe this is my goodstory, because this kind of
experience and background you'renot getting it so easy today,

(52:26):
especially working on the field,and I need to say thank you to
them.
Maybe I can mention their nameOne is Graham, he just retired a
few years ago, and one is Steve, that's still in this industry.
That's my good story.

Yeah.
No, that's a great story.
That's yeah.
Great story, that's yeah.
So it's all.
It's all about the work man,you know what I mean and putting
in the work, and you guys aredefinitely, definitely doing
that at avro.
You know, like I said, themoral of the podcast listen to
the customer and um, andbuilding good equipment, you
know.
So what, what else do we?
What else do we?
Did I miss anything?
That's what I always ask at theend of these things.

(53:01):
I feel like we've done a prettygood job covering the product
line.
I think you all done a greatjob of of kind of explaining
your strategy, and I'm tryingnot to divulge too much to matt,
but um, but in the end, I gotsome stuff out of you.

So uh, did I miss anything though caden no, I, I
don't think.
So.
Yeah, no, I mean, thank youvery much, matt, for having us
on, and this is great.
I was talking to Andrew on theway about.
We've listened to a lot ofthese podcasts and one of our
directors, probably seven monthsago, said you need to get on
that thing.
And here we are.
So, no, thank you very much.

No, thank you, Matt, really appreciate it.

Yeah, no, this has been great.
I always enjoy talking to youguys and I appreciate the
partnership.
And, yeah, we look forward togetting more Avro into our fleet
and also looking forward toseeing you guys in Las Vegas
here very, very soon, absolutely, yeah, we're excited.
Oh wait, last question here Doyou all have any good like

(53:56):
little tchotchkes or anythingyou're going to be handing out
at the booth, anything thatpeople should come by and grab?

All I think yeah, quite a few things, yeah quite a
few things, yeah, yeah and somegiveaways and yeah, I've got it
.

I've got an avro backpack.

That that's killer , you know so um, so I
appreciate that that's gonethrough like another level of
r&d since we gave that I havethe latest one here.

Oh okay, never mind guys listeners.

I'm getting a new one, so we listened to our
customer.

They said ah, I like this.
Like you know, it's a greatbackpack, but there's a few
things.

Okay, here we are All right.
Well, I'm about to get the newone, so I'm going to let
everybody go because I'm excitednow.
So thank you all so much forlistening to the GSE podcast.
Thank you for tuning in to thisepisode of the GSE podcast.
We hope you found itinformative and engaging.
If this episode resonated withyou, please share it with your

(54:48):
colleagues and peers in theground support equipment
community.
Your support is invaluable tous.
We'd appreciate it if you couldtake a moment to rate and
review our podcast.
Your feedback not onlyencourages us, but also helps
expand our reach within the GSEcommunity.
Keep an eye out for moreepisodes as we continue to
explore the dynamic world ofground operations, bringing you

(55:09):
the latest trends, insights andstories from the industry.
Thank you for listening to theGSE Podcast.
Until we meet again, staygrounded and keep pushing
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Episode 36 – “Listening to Your Customers”: Inside Avro’s Customer-Led Approach to GSE

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Ruthie's Table 4

Dateline NBC

.css-15opob5{left:0;position:absolute;top:0.8rem;} All Episodes

.css-14f5ked{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:2;overflow:hidden;}Episode 36 – “Listening to Your Customers”: Inside Avro’s Customer-Led Approach to GSE