December 16, 2022 • 22 mins
In this podcast episode, we learn about the journey of a successful assistant professor in the department of pathology. Her research background involves drugs of abuse and understanding how they lead to inflammation in the brain. She talks about her educational background, which is quite lengthy and includes several breaks, but ultimately led her to where she is today. She shares personal stories of her struggles with test-taking, her experience as a mom, and how her personal history with substance use disorder inspired her to connect her research to people.
The podcast guest emphasizes the importance of hands-on work in science and taking constructive criticism. She encourages young people who are interested in a career in science to participate in any kind of science and to bring out their personalities, while also maintaining professionalism. She shares a personal story of how her fourth-grade teacher inspired her to pursue science and how she never forgot that lesson.
Overall, this podcast episode is an excellent source of inspiration for anyone who is interested in pursuing a career in science, regardless of their background or struggles. It is a testament that anyone can overcome obstacles and achieve their dream with hard work, perseverance, and the right mentor.
Thanks for listening to the Infectious Science Podcast. Be sure to visit infectiousscience.org to join the conversation, access the show notes, and don’t forget to sign up for our newsletter to receive our free materials.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Daniele Swetnam (00:04):
Welcome to the infectious Science Podcast.
Matt Dacso (00:06):
This is not just another Science Podcast.
Infectious
Daniele Swetnam (00:09):
science is produced by a team from the
University of Texas MedicalBranch and the Galveston
national lab
Matt Dacso (00:13):
where we study some of the most dangerous viruses on
the planet.
Daniele Swetnam (00:17):
Our goal is to inspire future scientists
towards a career in science witha focus on one health,
Matt Dacso (00:22):
one health one planet. That's right, when other
approaches
Daniele Swetnam (00:25):
public health threats by examining the
connections between people,plants, animals and the
environment we all share.
Matt Dacso (00:31):
The show will explore how one health is your
health. So sit back and learn
Daniele Swetnam (00:36):
something infectious science where
enthusiasm for science
Matt Dacso (00:39):
is contagious.
Daniele Swetnam (00:44):
Hi, everyone.
Today we are going to talk witha new friend of mine, Lisa
Cisneros, who is an assistantprofessor here at UTMB. So Hi,
Lisa, welcome.
Unknown (00:54):
Thank you. Hi, how are you?
Daniele Swetnam (00:56):
Good. How are you?
Unknown (00:58):
I'm good. It's Friday.
Daniele Swetnam (00:59):
Yeah, happy Friday. Okay, Lisa. So tell me a
little bit about what you do nowand what kind of research you're
interested in.
Unknown (01:06):
So right now, I'm an assistant professor in the
department of pathology, whichis kind of cool, because some of
my research history involvesdrugs of abuse, and
understanding how they areleading to inflammation in the
brain. So when people thinkabout drugs of abuse, you don't
think about necessarilypathology, right. But what we
have seen is that some of thesedrugs, activate antiviral
(01:29):
responses. And so that's reallyimportant for viruses that we
know get into the brain. And sothat's really kind of where our
research is leading to rightnow.
Daniele Swetnam (01:38):
What kind of educational background did you
have to go through in order toget to where you are now?
Unknown (01:43):
So it's pretty lengthy story. I graduated from high
school in 2000. And I knew thatI loved science. I was head
cheerleader. I was in all theseclubs, but I was also a huge
nerd. And I graduated with likeseven credits of science. Every
elective I could take was ascience elective. My parents
(02:03):
were very conservative. So I hadlike a 10pm curfew. And so when
I got into college, I wentcrazy. I moved out of my parents
house. Yeah. And I didn't do sogreat. My first two years, I was
on probation. And I ended upgetting out of school, I met my
(02:24):
husband, we started a family. Iwent back and got my bachelor's
and didn't finish until 2007.
And I did that really close towhere my parents were because at
that time, I had two kidsalready. And where was that?
That was South Texas. So thatwas in Brownsville University of
Texas Rio Grande Valley now, butit used to be University of
Texas Brownsville. Okay. And Igrew up in Harlingen. And so we
(02:45):
were down there for a reallylong time till 2007 When I got
my bachelor's, Oh, wow. And thenI applied for a research
position at UT Southwestern. Idid about a year when I got
pregnant, and I quit. And thenwhen my daughter was my youngest
daughter, she was about sixmonths. And I was like, I think
(03:07):
I want to go to graduate school.
And I wasn't really sure whatthat meant. All I knew is it was
like another degree. And at thatpoint, I felt like a
professional student. So I waslike, I want to go back to
school. So I applied to theUniversity of North Texas Health
Science Center in Fort Worth.
And I got a letter that I hadbeen accepted as an MBRs. Rise
scholar. And what's that? MBRs,right. It's like a minority
(03:32):
research scholarship to helpdiversify the scientific way.
And as an undergrad inBrownsville, I was an MBRs rise
scholar there. So I think thathelped me get that fellowship.
And then I was at UNC HealthScience Center in 2009. The day
my youngest turned one,orientation. And I was there
(03:54):
until 2015 When I finished so
Daniele Swetnam (04:00):
how was that for you going to grad school and
being a mom at the same time?
Unknown (04:04):
I was the oldest graduate student. Yeah, I was
the only mother. And I wascommuting an hour for that first
year.
Daniele Swetnam (04:10):
Holy moly.
Okay, so you had a lot on yourplate. And
Unknown (04:13):
I didn't do so well, then either. I was on probation
after my first year of graduateschool. I'm just not a good test
taker. I'm very detail oriented.
So when I would study, I triedto memorize all the details
instead of the broader picture.
Yeah. And so that it took me awhile to learn them. Yeah, I
think that's
Daniele Swetnam (04:30):
something that a lot of people don't know about
scientists and graduate schoolthat not everyone in science is
like a straight A student who'slike really good at test taking.
I'm really bad at test taking,too. It's more about the
creativity and the ideas.
Unknown (04:43):
Yes. I always like to say you have to think outside of
the box. Right, right. Yeah. How
Daniele Swetnam (04:49):
did your family adjust to you do all that and
stuff in the lab and have to goback and forth. So I was really
Unknown (04:55):
fortunate that my pre doc mentor was also a woman with
Children. Okay. And thedifference? Yeah, huge
difference. Yeah. And she wasamazing. So she allowed me the
flexibility to be able to gopick up my kids from school and
take them home. And so it wasreally helpful. Also, my kids
school was across the streetfrom graduate school. And I
(05:18):
lived across the street from mykids school. So everything was
like, yeah, right there. Right.
So that was really helpful. Andmy husband owns his own
business. Okay. So again, alittle bit of flexibility. Yes.
So much flexibility. Yeah,
Daniele Swetnam (05:30):
you know, we get stuck in this. What's the
clear cut trajectory? But itseems like you took breaks, you
came back again, you really didthis on your own terms. You were
like the boss of your owncareer. I love that. Yeah. Yeah.
That's so awesome. That's soencouraging for me. And what
kind of research did you do ingrad school.
Unknown (05:46):
So when I was in graduate school, I knew I wanted
to do virus or so you went toScience Center. It's a
relatively smaller graduateschool, and it's an osteopathic
training school. So they don'ttrain medical doctors, they
train DEOs. And so when I waslooking at mentors, there was
(06:07):
only one mentor on the wholecampus who did virus work. And
so I approached her. And shetold me that she wasn't
accepting students, but I waspersistent. And finally, she was
like, This chick is not gonnaleave me alone, fine, just come
home to the lab, do yourrotation. So I chose her as my
last rotation. Or actually, Iguess she chose me as her last
(06:28):
rotation. And I did a little bitof work. But I think what she
liked was that I had already hadresearch experience. And so I
started working on HIV, learninghow to culture primary human
astrocytes. And in that lab, weused fetal tissue. So we would
get aborted fetuses and we wouldisolate astrocytes and neurons.
(06:52):
And so I learned all of thatprocess. And not just the
science, but also the ethicalbackground, using that kind of
tissue. Yeah, and she was a hugeadvocate, when she was at
Nebraska, to utilize that kindof tissue and research. And she
did the same thing. They're inFort Worth. And so I remember,
you know how, as a mentor, youhave to fill out the paperwork,
(07:14):
how the student did satisfactoryor unsatisfactory, she gave me
an unsatisfactory, I thought Iwas gonna die. I was still
commuting an hour. At thispoint, she told me, you should
probably think about movingcloser. As a graduate student,
you're gonna have to spend moretime in the lab. And so then the
next year, I move closer, sheaccepted me into her lab. And
(07:35):
then she handed me a grant thatshe was a co PI on, right. i One
of the aims was methamphetamineand HIV. And I was like, I never
imagined myself working withsubstances of abuse. Because
personally, with my husband andmyself, we have a history of
like substance use disorder. Andso it felt weird, but it also
(07:55):
felt like it was meant to be.
And so I just started working onmethamphetamine and HIV, looking
at targets in the brain thatactivate some different kinds of
neurotoxic modalities and stuff.
Daniele Swetnam (08:09):
So different pathways. Interesting. Do you
think that gave you more of anedge because of your personal
experience with your researcharea, that it made it more
important to you are that youhad different insights or
Unknown (08:20):
so I really try and connect my research to people.
And I think that having thathistory, I've done more than
just science here in Galveston.
I've done like the Gulf CoastRecovery Center, and I've sat
with people and their groupcounseling sessions. And I've
talked to them about my history.
(08:41):
And I remember them being like,oh, my gosh, you did this and
your doctor. No. And I'm like,Yeah, I mean, I overcame it,
thank God. Because not everybodydoes. It's a disease. But I
think being able to encouragepeople is really nice for me,
and it helps me also connect itall to the science.
Daniele Swetnam (08:59):
Wow, I'm so I'm so glad that you got to make
that connection. So what wereyour early inspirations then
even before that, you said thatin high school, you were the
cheerleader, but you also were anerd? Where did that nerdiness
come from? Where did itoriginate?
Unknown (09:13):
I had a fourth grade teacher. Her name was Miss
Vincent. And I remember the veryfirst day of school, she walked
into class with a big pythonaround her neck, oh, my God. And
she was dressed up like in thisforest outfit, and like, you
know, came in the X. She wasn'ta science teacher. She was all
subjects. But she was emphasizedthe science. Yeah. And that was
(09:36):
the first year I had a sciencefair project. And what was your
project? I have to know what wasyour project. So I wanted to
build a volcano so bad. So meand my best friend paired up and
we built a volcano. But Iremember that she failed us
because I didn't understand theconcept of a hypothesis. Okay,
and I couldn't develop ahypothesis for a volcano.
Daniele Swetnam (10:00):
more of like an engineering project like can I
develop the spa can so that'sstill pretty hard.
Unknown (10:08):
Why remember heard? I think it was It wasn't really
like a fail, right? It was kindof like more of a discussion.
Like you don't get to compete atCity Science Fair this year,
because you don't have ahypothesis. Yeah. I know. But
then I always had a hypothesisafter that. Early lesson. That's
right.
Daniele Swetnam (10:29):
So that's where it all started in your fourth
grade. Fourth
Unknown (10:31):
grade.
Daniele Swetnam (10:32):
Where's your fourth grade teacher? Now? Does
she know that she inspired?
Unknown (10:35):
I don't think so. That would be really awesome, though.
Should look her up if you can't
Daniele Swetnam (10:39):
if she would like to know that.
Unknown (10:41):
I don't remember her first name, though.
Daniele Swetnam (10:44):
I wonder if I'm sure like your school. Maybe you
can contact your school. Theyprobably totally let
Unknown (10:49):
me do it. Yeah.
Daniele Swetnam (10:51):
Oh, my gosh.
But if she's still a teacher,then that would be awesome.
Unknown (10:54):
Can I come and talk to your kids? Oh, my gosh, I'd be
so
Daniele Swetnam (10:57):
awesome. And then you can show up with your
Unknown (10:59):
your snot a Python.
Daniele Swetnam (11:03):
We'll find you some like little red sneakers?
Unknown (11:05):
Yeah. All right. So
Daniele Swetnam (11:08):
do you have any advice for any young people who
might be listening and beinginterested in a career in
science?
Unknown (11:14):
I think hands on work is really important. So if
somebody is not sure if they'reinterested or not, one of the
best things to do is get yourhands dirty. When my kids were
little, I would always ask theteachers if I could come and do
something with them. And wewould always extract DNA from
our cheeks. Yeah. And they justall loved it so much. And I
(11:38):
think that things like thatreally push people into these
kinds of careers. So I thinkdefinitely, if you have an
opportunity to participate inany kind of science, that's
number one. And also, being ableto take constructive criticism
is so before it is so hard. Thefirst time I presented as a pre
(12:02):
Doc, I'm obviously a woman inscience. I have a history of
being a cheerleader, I have avery bubbly personality. After
my first presentation, my mentortook me to the site. And she was
she told me, You're so coy.
She's like, why are you flirtingwith the audience. And I was
like, I am. She's like, you'reflipping your hair, and like,
(12:22):
you know, doing all this stuff.
And I was like, I didn'trealize, you know, that's just
me. And so I ended up takinglike speech classes to learn how
to speak in a more professionalmanner. But bringing out your
personality is also important isso now that I'm here, and now
that I've established myself alittle bit, I used to hide my
(12:46):
bubbliness before, but now Ithink that I'm able to bring it
out maybe because I'm moreconfident or I feel a little bit
more in a better position to dothat. Yeah, but I'm just
learning how to be yourself butalso that professionalism has to
stay. So that's really importanttoo. Yeah, how
Daniele Swetnam (13:03):
to balance the personal and professional. Your
science, personality,
Unknown (13:09):
science, personality. I love that I think everybody
should have one. Urinary
Matt Dacso (13:18):
Crimean Congo hemorrhagic fever is a viral
disease transmitted by ticks.
It's generally found in Asia,Africa and Europe, and as the
most widespread tick bornedisease in the world. It is also
the second most widespread causeof hemorrhagic fever after
dengue. The disease got itscurious name from the fact that
it was separately found in theCrimean peninsula, and the Congo
many years apart, and it tookscientists more than a decade to
(13:41):
figure out that what they werelooking at, were actually the
same diseases. The viruscirculates in nature between
ticks and a variety of animalspecies. But ticks and animals
do not develop disease. Onlyhumans develop disease, which
can sometimes be very severe,with bleeding seen under the
skin, or even from the mouth andnose. Mortality can be as high
(14:03):
as 30%. Over the last 20 years,we have seen an increase in
cases with discovery of thedisease in new areas, most
likely due in large part tohuman activity. And now you know
about Crimean Congo hemorrhagicfever. This has been your viral
minute.
Daniele Swetnam (14:23):
It's super interesting to me about your
kind of non traditional pathfrom high school to now you're a
professor. And I was wonderinghow this kind of non traditional
path and your interestingbackground influences how you
interact with your students now?
Unknown (14:37):
Well, like I said, I struggled a lot with courses and
like just kind of getting intothe detail of things instead of
the broader picture. And so whenI have students or even lab
technicians or researchscientist postdocs, I feel like
everybody can be successful ifthey're in the right
environment, right. I try toreally learn how each individual
(14:59):
is Can can be the mostsuccessful. So everybody has a
completely differentpersonality. Yeah. And my lab is
a family, it's my second family,and everybody has to come
together and feel good. I thinkthat based on my own personal
experiences, I really do try tobring in students who are also
from non traditionalbackgrounds, and students who
(15:21):
are really eager, because I'veheard other professors say, I
never accept a student, thefirst time they asked me, you
know, they have to show me theywant it. Yeah, and I don't
believe that. I feel like, ifthey come to me, then they've
had me in their mind. And ifthey can justify to me what they
think their future in the lab islike, and if they can get along
(15:44):
with the other lab membersduring a rotation, I want to
take you if I can take you, Iwant to take them or bring them
all to me. And so right now Ihave two graduate students, one
of them grew up on a farm in NewYork, she's a little bit she
doesn't want to mess up, right.
And she's also kind of nervousabout using cells and stuff. So
(16:05):
we're training her through allof that, and patient. And my
other graduate student isactually from Mexico, she has
two children, she reminds me somuch, so much of me that she's
an MD in Mexico. So she cameover here, and I actually
directly admitted her into mylab. And then she just got a
(16:26):
really competitive scholarship.
So I'm so I'm so excited forher. But in the end, I want them
to know that I'm there tosupport them. And I'm not there
to make their life crazy. Idon't expect them to be in the
lab at midnight, or on theweekends. I think, if you can
manage your time wisely, you candefinitely structure your
(16:48):
schedule so that you're therefrom Monday through Friday.
Because I also hear a lot ofprofessors who are like, Oh, my
students should be expected tobe here for 12 hours a day on
weekends. And I don't think anyof that's necessary. While I
hold expectations for the peoplethat I mentor and work with. I
also expect them to hold theirown expectations. Right, right.
(17:09):
And so this is something that Ialways bring up to them. Yes, I
want you to reach thisthreshold. But what do you want
to reach? Yeah, what are yourexpectations of me also? And so
I think that I'm like thatbecause of my history and my own
personal pathway to where I amnow.
Daniele Swetnam (17:30):
Yeah, that's so interesting. I sounds a lot like
you care about the studentthemselves, not just as a
student, as a scientist,
Unknown (17:37):
they're part of my family, right?
Daniele Swetnam (17:41):
So you were mentioned before, that your
research centers around how druguse can influence how viruses
affect the brain? And can youtell me a little bit about how
you do that? What does a normalday in one of your experiments
look like? Like, what are yourexperiments like?
Unknown (17:56):
So when we are doing in vivo modeling of self
administration, what's in vivomean, in vivo, like an animal's
Oh, so a lot of my work is incells, but we also do some
animal work. And some of thestuff that we've done before
with collaborations with theCenter for addiction research,
is we use a really standardizedanimal model that's really well
(18:18):
established. And it's a selfadministration rat model, okay.
And so the rat basically has acatheter into their very large
artery or vein and in theirback, and the rat is put into a
chamber and they're allowed topress a lever for drug, okay.
And that's really how theyestablish this self
administration of these drugs ofabuse. And that's really
(18:42):
important because establishingself administration is part of
the circuitry in the brain. Soone part of your brain talking
to another part of your brain.
And if you give the animal thedrug with a needle, it's not the
same thing, because they're notallowed to establish those
connections. Yeah. And that'sreally important for the
research that we're doing. Andso I always say everybody's eyes
are like, pop open when I say wework with drugs of abuse,
(19:05):
because you don't meet first ofall Hispanic female who's a
scientist, right? Everyone'slike, you're a scientist. I'm
like, Yeah, I'm saying this. Andthen when you tell them that
you're working with drugs ofabuse, they're just like, wow,
tell me more. That's sointeresting.
Daniele Swetnam (19:21):
So at least you said that when you first started
grad school, your little one wasonly one years old. Now. They're
a little bit older. So do youwant to talk to us a little bit
about how what did they thinkabout their mom being a fancy
pants? Professor? Are they proudof you? Are they embarrassed?
Like what did they think?
Unknown (19:38):
Well, I certainly hope they're proud of me. But I'm now
there's so much older. So I havelike my 19 year old my son, and
when I was 17 year old and myyoungest, who was one is now 14,
and my 19 year old, he was neverreally into schools. He had
ADHD. And so I was just as longas you pick a career just do so.
(19:59):
Yeah. So He's following in myhusband's footsteps and he's
doing plumbing. You know, itbrings them on. Yeah, I don't
have to pay his car payments.
And then my 17 year old, she'ssuper artsy and craftsy. And she
is doing media arts and digitalarts. And so I have an amazing
lab logo. And the techy guy inmy lab designed it, but my
(20:22):
daughter, I commissioned her andpaid her to make it super
professional and illustrator.
And so I think I'm trying tokind of pitch that like be a
scientific illustrator. Oh,that'd be so we'll see if I can
kind of get her in there. And myyoungest one, I think she's
going to be the one to go intosome sort of science field. I
(20:44):
know she's Googled me at schoolbefore. Yeah, showed her friend
Yeah, and showed her from mymom's a doctor. I always have to
be I'm not that kind of doctorthough. Everybody thinks for an
MD. But I hope that they're allreally proud
Daniele Swetnam (21:01):
of you. Well, thank you so much, Lisa, for
hanging out with us today andtalking about your life and your
story. And if any of youlistening at home want to know
more about Lisa's work, you cancheck her out, check the show
notes, and we'll leave moreinformation about her research
and where you can find her onsocial media. So thanks for
listening. And thanks, Lisa.
Unknown (21:22):
Thank you guys so much for including me I really
appreciate.
Daniele Swetnam (21:26):
Thanks for listening to the infectious
Science Podcast. Be sure to hitsubscribe, and visit infectious
science.org to join theconversation, access the show
notes and to sign up for ournewsletter and receive our free
materials.
Matt Dacso (21:37):
If you enjoy this new episode of infectious
science, please leave us areview on Apple podcasts and
Spotify. And go ahead and sharethis episode with some of your
friends.
Daniele Swetnam (21:47):
Also, don't hesitate to ask questions and
tell us what topics you'd likeus to cover for future episodes.
To get in touch, drop a line inthe comments section or send us
a message on social media.
Matt Dacso (21:56):
So we'll see you next time for a new episode. And
in the meantime, stay happy stayhealthy. stay interested
Welcome to the infectious Science Podcast.
Matt Dacso (00:06):
This is not just another Science Podcast.
Infectious
Daniele Swetnam (00:09):
science is produced by a team from the
University of Texas MedicalBranch and the Galveston
national lab
Matt Dacso (00:13):
where we study some of the most dangerous viruses on
the planet.
Daniele Swetnam (00:17):
Our goal is to inspire future scientists
towards a career in science witha focus on one health,
Matt Dacso (00:22):
one health one planet. That's right, when other
approaches
Daniele Swetnam (00:25):
public health threats by examining the
connections between people,plants, animals and the
environment we all share.
Matt Dacso (00:31):
The show will explore how one health is your
health. So sit back and learn
Daniele Swetnam (00:36):
something infectious science where
enthusiasm for science
Matt Dacso (00:39):
is contagious.
Daniele Swetnam (00:44):
Hi, everyone.
Today we are going to talk witha new friend of mine, Lisa
Cisneros, who is an assistantprofessor here at UTMB. So Hi,
Lisa, welcome.
Unknown (00:54):
Thank you. Hi, how are you?
Daniele Swetnam (00:56):
Good. How are you?
Unknown (00:58):
I'm good. It's Friday.
Daniele Swetnam (00:59):
Yeah, happy Friday. Okay, Lisa. So tell me a
little bit about what you do nowand what kind of research you're
interested in.
Unknown (01:06):
So right now, I'm an assistant professor in the
department of pathology, whichis kind of cool, because some of
my research history involvesdrugs of abuse, and
understanding how they areleading to inflammation in the
brain. So when people thinkabout drugs of abuse, you don't
think about necessarilypathology, right. But what we
have seen is that some of thesedrugs, activate antiviral
(01:29):
responses. And so that's reallyimportant for viruses that we
know get into the brain. And sothat's really kind of where our
research is leading to rightnow.
Daniele Swetnam (01:38):
What kind of educational background did you
have to go through in order toget to where you are now?
Unknown (01:43):
So it's pretty lengthy story. I graduated from high
school in 2000. And I knew thatI loved science. I was head
cheerleader. I was in all theseclubs, but I was also a huge
nerd. And I graduated with likeseven credits of science. Every
elective I could take was ascience elective. My parents
(02:03):
were very conservative. So I hadlike a 10pm curfew. And so when
I got into college, I wentcrazy. I moved out of my parents
house. Yeah. And I didn't do sogreat. My first two years, I was
on probation. And I ended upgetting out of school, I met my
(02:24):
husband, we started a family. Iwent back and got my bachelor's
and didn't finish until 2007.
And I did that really close towhere my parents were because at
that time, I had two kidsalready. And where was that?
That was South Texas. So thatwas in Brownsville University of
Texas Rio Grande Valley now, butit used to be University of
Texas Brownsville. Okay. And Igrew up in Harlingen. And so we
(02:45):
were down there for a reallylong time till 2007 When I got
my bachelor's, Oh, wow. And thenI applied for a research
position at UT Southwestern. Idid about a year when I got
pregnant, and I quit. And thenwhen my daughter was my youngest
daughter, she was about sixmonths. And I was like, I think
(03:07):
I want to go to graduate school.
And I wasn't really sure whatthat meant. All I knew is it was
like another degree. And at thatpoint, I felt like a
professional student. So I waslike, I want to go back to
school. So I applied to theUniversity of North Texas Health
Science Center in Fort Worth.
And I got a letter that I hadbeen accepted as an MBRs. Rise
scholar. And what's that? MBRs,right. It's like a minority
(03:32):
research scholarship to helpdiversify the scientific way.
And as an undergrad inBrownsville, I was an MBRs rise
scholar there. So I think thathelped me get that fellowship.
And then I was at UNC HealthScience Center in 2009. The day
my youngest turned one,orientation. And I was there
(03:54):
until 2015 When I finished so
Daniele Swetnam (04:00):
how was that for you going to grad school and
being a mom at the same time?
Unknown (04:04):
I was the oldest graduate student. Yeah, I was
the only mother. And I wascommuting an hour for that first
year.
Daniele Swetnam (04:10):
Holy moly.
Okay, so you had a lot on yourplate. And
Unknown (04:13):
I didn't do so well, then either. I was on probation
after my first year of graduateschool. I'm just not a good test
taker. I'm very detail oriented.
So when I would study, I triedto memorize all the details
instead of the broader picture.
Yeah. And so that it took me awhile to learn them. Yeah, I
think that's
Daniele Swetnam (04:30):
something that a lot of people don't know about
scientists and graduate schoolthat not everyone in science is
like a straight A student who'slike really good at test taking.
I'm really bad at test taking,too. It's more about the
creativity and the ideas.
Unknown (04:43):
Yes. I always like to say you have to think outside of
the box. Right, right. Yeah. How
Daniele Swetnam (04:49):
did your family adjust to you do all that and
stuff in the lab and have to goback and forth. So I was really
Unknown (04:55):
fortunate that my pre doc mentor was also a woman with
Children. Okay. And thedifference? Yeah, huge
difference. Yeah. And she wasamazing. So she allowed me the
flexibility to be able to gopick up my kids from school and
take them home. And so it wasreally helpful. Also, my kids
school was across the streetfrom graduate school. And I
(05:18):
lived across the street from mykids school. So everything was
like, yeah, right there. Right.
So that was really helpful. Andmy husband owns his own
business. Okay. So again, alittle bit of flexibility. Yes.
So much flexibility. Yeah,
Daniele Swetnam (05:30):
you know, we get stuck in this. What's the
clear cut trajectory? But itseems like you took breaks, you
came back again, you really didthis on your own terms. You were
like the boss of your owncareer. I love that. Yeah. Yeah.
That's so awesome. That's soencouraging for me. And what
kind of research did you do ingrad school.
Unknown (05:46):
So when I was in graduate school, I knew I wanted
to do virus or so you went toScience Center. It's a
relatively smaller graduateschool, and it's an osteopathic
training school. So they don'ttrain medical doctors, they
train DEOs. And so when I waslooking at mentors, there was
(06:07):
only one mentor on the wholecampus who did virus work. And
so I approached her. And shetold me that she wasn't
accepting students, but I waspersistent. And finally, she was
like, This chick is not gonnaleave me alone, fine, just come
home to the lab, do yourrotation. So I chose her as my
last rotation. Or actually, Iguess she chose me as her last
(06:28):
rotation. And I did a little bitof work. But I think what she
liked was that I had already hadresearch experience. And so I
started working on HIV, learninghow to culture primary human
astrocytes. And in that lab, weused fetal tissue. So we would
get aborted fetuses and we wouldisolate astrocytes and neurons.
(06:52):
And so I learned all of thatprocess. And not just the
science, but also the ethicalbackground, using that kind of
tissue. Yeah, and she was a hugeadvocate, when she was at
Nebraska, to utilize that kindof tissue and research. And she
did the same thing. They're inFort Worth. And so I remember,
you know how, as a mentor, youhave to fill out the paperwork,
(07:14):
how the student did satisfactoryor unsatisfactory, she gave me
an unsatisfactory, I thought Iwas gonna die. I was still
commuting an hour. At thispoint, she told me, you should
probably think about movingcloser. As a graduate student,
you're gonna have to spend moretime in the lab. And so then the
next year, I move closer, sheaccepted me into her lab. And
(07:35):
then she handed me a grant thatshe was a co PI on, right. i One
of the aims was methamphetamineand HIV. And I was like, I never
imagined myself working withsubstances of abuse. Because
personally, with my husband andmyself, we have a history of
like substance use disorder. Andso it felt weird, but it also
(07:55):
felt like it was meant to be.
And so I just started working onmethamphetamine and HIV, looking
at targets in the brain thatactivate some different kinds of
neurotoxic modalities and stuff.
Daniele Swetnam (08:09):
So different pathways. Interesting. Do you
think that gave you more of anedge because of your personal
experience with your researcharea, that it made it more
important to you are that youhad different insights or
Unknown (08:20):
so I really try and connect my research to people.
And I think that having thathistory, I've done more than
just science here in Galveston.
I've done like the Gulf CoastRecovery Center, and I've sat
with people and their groupcounseling sessions. And I've
talked to them about my history.
(08:41):
And I remember them being like,oh, my gosh, you did this and
your doctor. No. And I'm like,Yeah, I mean, I overcame it,
thank God. Because not everybodydoes. It's a disease. But I
think being able to encouragepeople is really nice for me,
and it helps me also connect itall to the science.
Daniele Swetnam (08:59):
Wow, I'm so I'm so glad that you got to make
that connection. So what wereyour early inspirations then
even before that, you said thatin high school, you were the
cheerleader, but you also were anerd? Where did that nerdiness
come from? Where did itoriginate?
Unknown (09:13):
I had a fourth grade teacher. Her name was Miss
Vincent. And I remember the veryfirst day of school, she walked
into class with a big pythonaround her neck, oh, my God. And
she was dressed up like in thisforest outfit, and like, you
know, came in the X. She wasn'ta science teacher. She was all
subjects. But she was emphasizedthe science. Yeah. And that was
(09:36):
the first year I had a sciencefair project. And what was your
project? I have to know what wasyour project. So I wanted to
build a volcano so bad. So meand my best friend paired up and
we built a volcano. But Iremember that she failed us
because I didn't understand theconcept of a hypothesis. Okay,
and I couldn't develop ahypothesis for a volcano.
Daniele Swetnam (10:00):
more of like an engineering project like can I
develop the spa can so that'sstill pretty hard.
Unknown (10:08):
Why remember heard? I think it was It wasn't really
like a fail, right? It was kindof like more of a discussion.
Like you don't get to compete atCity Science Fair this year,
because you don't have ahypothesis. Yeah. I know. But
then I always had a hypothesisafter that. Early lesson. That's
right.
Daniele Swetnam (10:29):
So that's where it all started in your fourth
grade. Fourth
Unknown (10:31):
grade.
Daniele Swetnam (10:32):
Where's your fourth grade teacher? Now? Does
she know that she inspired?
Unknown (10:35):
I don't think so. That would be really awesome, though.
Should look her up if you can't
Daniele Swetnam (10:39):
if she would like to know that.
Unknown (10:41):
I don't remember her first name, though.
Daniele Swetnam (10:44):
I wonder if I'm sure like your school. Maybe you
can contact your school. Theyprobably totally let
Unknown (10:49):
me do it. Yeah.
Daniele Swetnam (10:51):
Oh, my gosh.
But if she's still a teacher,then that would be awesome.
Unknown (10:54):
Can I come and talk to your kids? Oh, my gosh, I'd be
so
Daniele Swetnam (10:57):
awesome. And then you can show up with your
Unknown (10:59):
your snot a Python.
Daniele Swetnam (11:03):
We'll find you some like little red sneakers?
Unknown (11:05):
Yeah. All right. So
Daniele Swetnam (11:08):
do you have any advice for any young people who
might be listening and beinginterested in a career in
science?
Unknown (11:14):
I think hands on work is really important. So if
somebody is not sure if they'reinterested or not, one of the
best things to do is get yourhands dirty. When my kids were
little, I would always ask theteachers if I could come and do
something with them. And wewould always extract DNA from
our cheeks. Yeah. And they justall loved it so much. And I
(11:38):
think that things like thatreally push people into these
kinds of careers. So I thinkdefinitely, if you have an
opportunity to participate inany kind of science, that's
number one. And also, being ableto take constructive criticism
is so before it is so hard. Thefirst time I presented as a pre
(12:02):
Doc, I'm obviously a woman inscience. I have a history of
being a cheerleader, I have avery bubbly personality. After
my first presentation, my mentortook me to the site. And she was
she told me, You're so coy.
She's like, why are you flirtingwith the audience. And I was
like, I am. She's like, you'reflipping your hair, and like,
(12:22):
you know, doing all this stuff.
And I was like, I didn'trealize, you know, that's just
me. And so I ended up takinglike speech classes to learn how
to speak in a more professionalmanner. But bringing out your
personality is also important isso now that I'm here, and now
that I've established myself alittle bit, I used to hide my
(12:46):
bubbliness before, but now Ithink that I'm able to bring it
out maybe because I'm moreconfident or I feel a little bit
more in a better position to dothat. Yeah, but I'm just
learning how to be yourself butalso that professionalism has to
stay. So that's really importanttoo. Yeah, how
Daniele Swetnam (13:03):
to balance the personal and professional. Your
science, personality,
Unknown (13:09):
science, personality. I love that I think everybody
should have one. Urinary
Matt Dacso (13:18):
Crimean Congo hemorrhagic fever is a viral
disease transmitted by ticks.
It's generally found in Asia,Africa and Europe, and as the
most widespread tick bornedisease in the world. It is also
the second most widespread causeof hemorrhagic fever after
dengue. The disease got itscurious name from the fact that
it was separately found in theCrimean peninsula, and the Congo
many years apart, and it tookscientists more than a decade to
(13:41):
figure out that what they werelooking at, were actually the
same diseases. The viruscirculates in nature between
ticks and a variety of animalspecies. But ticks and animals
do not develop disease. Onlyhumans develop disease, which
can sometimes be very severe,with bleeding seen under the
skin, or even from the mouth andnose. Mortality can be as high
(14:03):
as 30%. Over the last 20 years,we have seen an increase in
cases with discovery of thedisease in new areas, most
likely due in large part tohuman activity. And now you know
about Crimean Congo hemorrhagicfever. This has been your viral
minute.
Daniele Swetnam (14:23):
It's super interesting to me about your
kind of non traditional pathfrom high school to now you're a
professor. And I was wonderinghow this kind of non traditional
path and your interestingbackground influences how you
interact with your students now?
Unknown (14:37):
Well, like I said, I struggled a lot with courses and
like just kind of getting intothe detail of things instead of
the broader picture. And so whenI have students or even lab
technicians or researchscientist postdocs, I feel like
everybody can be successful ifthey're in the right
environment, right. I try toreally learn how each individual
(14:59):
is Can can be the mostsuccessful. So everybody has a
completely differentpersonality. Yeah. And my lab is
a family, it's my second family,and everybody has to come
together and feel good. I thinkthat based on my own personal
experiences, I really do try tobring in students who are also
from non traditionalbackgrounds, and students who
(15:21):
are really eager, because I'veheard other professors say, I
never accept a student, thefirst time they asked me, you
know, they have to show me theywant it. Yeah, and I don't
believe that. I feel like, ifthey come to me, then they've
had me in their mind. And ifthey can justify to me what they
think their future in the lab islike, and if they can get along
(15:44):
with the other lab membersduring a rotation, I want to
take you if I can take you, Iwant to take them or bring them
all to me. And so right now Ihave two graduate students, one
of them grew up on a farm in NewYork, she's a little bit she
doesn't want to mess up, right.
And she's also kind of nervousabout using cells and stuff. So
(16:05):
we're training her through allof that, and patient. And my
other graduate student isactually from Mexico, she has
two children, she reminds me somuch, so much of me that she's
an MD in Mexico. So she cameover here, and I actually
directly admitted her into mylab. And then she just got a
(16:26):
really competitive scholarship.
So I'm so I'm so excited forher. But in the end, I want them
to know that I'm there tosupport them. And I'm not there
to make their life crazy. Idon't expect them to be in the
lab at midnight, or on theweekends. I think, if you can
manage your time wisely, you candefinitely structure your
(16:48):
schedule so that you're therefrom Monday through Friday.
Because I also hear a lot ofprofessors who are like, Oh, my
students should be expected tobe here for 12 hours a day on
weekends. And I don't think anyof that's necessary. While I
hold expectations for the peoplethat I mentor and work with. I
also expect them to hold theirown expectations. Right, right.
(17:09):
And so this is something that Ialways bring up to them. Yes, I
want you to reach thisthreshold. But what do you want
to reach? Yeah, what are yourexpectations of me also? And so
I think that I'm like thatbecause of my history and my own
personal pathway to where I amnow.
Daniele Swetnam (17:30):
Yeah, that's so interesting. I sounds a lot like
you care about the studentthemselves, not just as a
student, as a scientist,
Unknown (17:37):
they're part of my family, right?
Daniele Swetnam (17:41):
So you were mentioned before, that your
research centers around how druguse can influence how viruses
affect the brain? And can youtell me a little bit about how
you do that? What does a normalday in one of your experiments
look like? Like, what are yourexperiments like?
Unknown (17:56):
So when we are doing in vivo modeling of self
administration, what's in vivomean, in vivo, like an animal's
Oh, so a lot of my work is incells, but we also do some
animal work. And some of thestuff that we've done before
with collaborations with theCenter for addiction research,
is we use a really standardizedanimal model that's really well
(18:18):
established. And it's a selfadministration rat model, okay.
And so the rat basically has acatheter into their very large
artery or vein and in theirback, and the rat is put into a
chamber and they're allowed topress a lever for drug, okay.
And that's really how theyestablish this self
administration of these drugs ofabuse. And that's really
(18:42):
important because establishingself administration is part of
the circuitry in the brain. Soone part of your brain talking
to another part of your brain.
And if you give the animal thedrug with a needle, it's not the
same thing, because they're notallowed to establish those
connections. Yeah. And that'sreally important for the
research that we're doing. Andso I always say everybody's eyes
are like, pop open when I say wework with drugs of abuse,
(19:05):
because you don't meet first ofall Hispanic female who's a
scientist, right? Everyone'slike, you're a scientist. I'm
like, Yeah, I'm saying this. Andthen when you tell them that
you're working with drugs ofabuse, they're just like, wow,
tell me more. That's sointeresting.
Daniele Swetnam (19:21):
So at least you said that when you first started
grad school, your little one wasonly one years old. Now. They're
a little bit older. So do youwant to talk to us a little bit
about how what did they thinkabout their mom being a fancy
pants? Professor? Are they proudof you? Are they embarrassed?
Like what did they think?
Unknown (19:38):
Well, I certainly hope they're proud of me. But I'm now
there's so much older. So I havelike my 19 year old my son, and
when I was 17 year old and myyoungest, who was one is now 14,
and my 19 year old, he was neverreally into schools. He had
ADHD. And so I was just as longas you pick a career just do so.
(19:59):
Yeah. So He's following in myhusband's footsteps and he's
doing plumbing. You know, itbrings them on. Yeah, I don't
have to pay his car payments.
And then my 17 year old, she'ssuper artsy and craftsy. And she
is doing media arts and digitalarts. And so I have an amazing
lab logo. And the techy guy inmy lab designed it, but my
(20:22):
daughter, I commissioned her andpaid her to make it super
professional and illustrator.
And so I think I'm trying tokind of pitch that like be a
scientific illustrator. Oh,that'd be so we'll see if I can
kind of get her in there. And myyoungest one, I think she's
going to be the one to go intosome sort of science field. I
(20:44):
know she's Googled me at schoolbefore. Yeah, showed her friend
Yeah, and showed her from mymom's a doctor. I always have to
be I'm not that kind of doctorthough. Everybody thinks for an
MD. But I hope that they're allreally proud
Daniele Swetnam (21:01):
of you. Well, thank you so much, Lisa, for
hanging out with us today andtalking about your life and your
story. And if any of youlistening at home want to know
more about Lisa's work, you cancheck her out, check the show
notes, and we'll leave moreinformation about her research
and where you can find her onsocial media. So thanks for
listening. And thanks, Lisa.
Unknown (21:22):
Thank you guys so much for including me I really
appreciate.
Daniele Swetnam (21:26):
Thanks for listening to the infectious
Science Podcast. Be sure to hitsubscribe, and visit infectious
science.org to join theconversation, access the show
notes and to sign up for ournewsletter and receive our free
materials.
Matt Dacso (21:37):
If you enjoy this new episode of infectious
science, please leave us areview on Apple podcasts and
Spotify. And go ahead and sharethis episode with some of your
friends.
Daniele Swetnam (21:47):
Also, don't hesitate to ask questions and
tell us what topics you'd likeus to cover for future episodes.
To get in touch, drop a line inthe comments section or send us
a message on social media.
Matt Dacso (21:56):
So we'll see you next time for a new episode. And
in the meantime, stay happy stayhealthy. stay interested
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