November 17, 2024 • 29 mins
Deadpool & Wolverine, the only Marvel Cinematic Universe movie this year, levels up in terms of budget but isn't bothered about evolving emotionally.
We discuss the film’s relentless humour, the ugly CGI, and the confusingly complicated plot. There’s time for self-reference, but not for self-reflection in the Deadpool films, as Ryan Reynolds continues to overwhelm every aspect of them.
We also talk about where the film stands in the ever-expanding MCU, and whether it would even work five years down the line.
—
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:16):
Hi, I'm Akara. And I'm Rohan Nahar.
Welcome. To the long take.
We've been off for a while, but we're back after and we're today
we're discussing the model movieTemple and Woline, which is now
on streaming or Disney Plus, wherever you have it after a
Seattle release. The only Marvel movie to see or
actually incidentally enough after like, I don't know how
many years of like having three or four each year.
(00:39):
And it's also like integrating like the Fox and was properly
into the MCU sort of thing. Yeah.
What do you make of this one? Yeah, all of these movies are, I
don't know, they're competently made.
They can get very annoying. But then ultimately they're so
unmemorable that you can't really have strong opinions
(01:01):
about them, is what I. Feel yeah, I think I think you
got off like on this possibly like the biggest point of the
bad is that yeah, that's the my also my issue with these movies,
especially this one, I would sayactually more than the last two
is that it's so relentlessly focused on like what's happening
to the MCU right now that it sort of either forgets or
(01:24):
doesn't actually care how this movie would work if I watched it
in say 2013. Like it would not work at all
because you know the memory of like what happened to the MCU
post end game would be like a distant memory for most of us.
Wouldn't people wouldn't really care.
You're you're if you replay a movie, you want to it to be like
fun and on its on its own because the jokes are funny, you
(01:46):
know, on on the base of the jokeand not the fact that what we
are all going through in culturally of that era.
So, yeah, I think the movie is like so focused on like, just
like what has been happening to the Marvel sort of world after
the end game, sort of like and the whole Disney Plus like sort
of debacle because they had to make too much content everywhere
(02:09):
is that it forgets that you haveto be a good movie separate from
all that. Yeah, but then it also spends so
much time looking back further, right?
Like the early 2000s and stuff. Yeah, because it's like it knows
that it's going to be the last movie that gets to do that,
that, you know, sort of pays a tribute to the Fox's X-Men
(02:30):
universe. Is that like, I feel like Ryan
Reynolds was like, no, I must use this movie to like, you
know, pay homage to everyone whodid, like, a great job, which is
why the movie and if you remember, the end credits is
literally like a sea of compilations of, like, behind
the scenes moments. Yeah.
Like, I was like, so sentimental.
I was like, this is completely not In Sync with what your movie
(02:51):
has been poking fun at everyone.But right now you're like,
you're. But I was like, oh, that's where
it's coming from. It's coming from a place of
like, he's like, I want to ensure that, you know, these
people who like put in there whatever blood and sweat are
like remembered. The problem with all three
Deadpool movies, and this one more particularly, is that deep
(03:13):
down there is a very nice sentimental idea behind it,
right? But then it comes across as
almost an afterthought. And the way that the movie is
kind of designed, which is just relentless jokes, right?
Made by just one person, it kindof buries all the
(03:36):
sentimentality, which I feel hurts the movie because if you
think about it, the premise isn't too dissimilar to
something that you might see in like a Pixar movie, right?
There's this like this land where the forgotten kind of
characters go, but they all bandtogether to be like, no, we
might be forgotten, but we're kind of, you know, we we're,
(03:59):
we're important to, we deserve to have a voice, etcetera,
etcetera. It's a very sentimental idea.
And at one point it was sort of a, you know, forgotten
character. It's just eviled it into
existence. But then this, this is hardly
how they're selling the movie, right?
This is hardly what the movie isactually about.
(04:20):
Because they also have the time travel nonsense.
They also have the multiverse craziness.
They also have Wolverine there, but that is more important to
the movie than the actual heart,right?
Which is odd because in any other film they would focus on
this over all the, you know, razzmatazz.
(04:43):
Yeah, but like those people are like abroad to almost like give
the movie like an emotional foundation, right?
They're like, yeah, yeah. We, we we care for these
characters. We haven't forgotten them.
We want you to know. And like they're introduced in
like the most like South Indian fashion possible of.
Like yeah, exactly. Like people walking in an ultra
slow MO, like a like, yeah, yeah, quite trailer, yeah,
(05:07):
moving apart. Or some, it's not like
integrated into the plot where like one person comes and then,
you know, whatever. It's like we we have this.
Fashion like ramp watch. You know, like.
Everyone's coming in slow motion, like one person is
throwing a car, one person got blades are coming, one person
got something else coming. Like why?
Like, what is this? Like, I know it's like almost
(05:28):
like the moments are built because they know in the
audience people will be shoutingat the screen.
They're like, Oh yeah, a blade aya.
Oh yeah, a Bo aya. Like that's what it is built to
like, juice out every last like moment from that.
Yeah, which is the odd, which iswhat I realized.
I don't know which movie it was.I think Spider Man or something
(05:49):
which I watched in like a semi empty theatre and they were like
laugh pauses and stuff which felt so awkward because there
was nobody there to laugh. Yeah, it's like it's.
Ultra with this one, because it's like two different sort of
fan bases, right? Like a lot of people who have
seen the MCU, like maybe like they've seen every entry.
(06:10):
You ask them if they've seen like X-Men X2, X-Men United and
1st Class and they'll be like, Idon't know what those movies are
like that. Actually.
That's a large part of the fan base, right?
And now you're bringing these two together and expecting that
people have watched like X-Men Origins, Wolverine, I haven't
seen that. No, but see The thing is that
it's almost slightly bold of them to kind of not just into
(06:34):
having any sort of feeling for these characters because it's
not like they're showing us likeJean Grey or Cyclopska romance
or something like that. Literally 1 character to has
never even been in the movie before Channing Tatumala.
They're they're banking on the fact that people have followed
the news cycle at some level. Yeah.
It's like you not only have you watched these movies, you have
(06:55):
also followed like the production details of them.
Yeah. Yeah, massive deep cuts, right.
It's not like no one says Kevin Feige, Ryan Adel says Feige.
He doesn't say Kevin. So you'll have to like you have
to be really into this universe to like get more all the movies
jokes which in. Fairness, I'm guessing at this
point, if you're watching Deadpool, Wolverine, you sort of
(07:18):
right. You at least you know who Feige
is. I mean, I'm guessing most people
would. I'm sure like is he got parent
general? They'll be like, what?
What does that mean? But then there will be lost,
like like Feige won't be the only thing that kind of
alienates them because it is, after all, like the third movie
in the Deadpool franchise plus like the 25th or whatever in the
(07:39):
MCU. So like 35th probably.
Oh my God. But yeah, the the weird thing
about it is, is is it almost gets away with it also, right?
Because like, I have no feelingsfor Chris Evans called Johnny
Storm or whatever. Yeah, I haven't even seen those
movies. I've seen, only seen like
rushes, you know, when they usedto play on like TV channels on
(08:02):
TV. That's how I know of those
movies, the Blade movies. I've never seen the Blade
movies, which I I had. I had no idea there was a
trilogy of those movies. I knew I like, came across that
fact while I was writing the review for this movie.
Like, oh, there's like three of them and.
One of them is direct by Guillermo del Toro.
Yeah, yeah. That I think also I came across
doing the research and then Electra I never bothered because
(08:24):
it's like the Deadpool and also Deadpool, sorry, Daredevil,
Daredevil. You see, it's so sounding so
similar. That one never got like great
review. So why would I watch like a spin
off of that? Movie so like.
Massive like you're you're almost like digging like
characters javasthi from the bottom of you know, like
forgotten realm and being like yeah, yeah, Mahal Logan.
(08:48):
No. And there's an argument to be
made that these characters sort of deserve to be forgotten,
right? Because they're like hardly like
glory days and like this was these these people are like,
like those movies were terrible.Like Electron is terrible like.
And you're putting these like characters from a different era
of like enormous, like, you know, it has to be like
(09:09):
millionaire or like Gen. X era because in the 2000s.
And then I'm putting them next to a character from like a one
off movie called Logan. And this teenager is roaming
around and I'm like, it's like, sure, she was in a great movie,
but why is she suddenly here, right?
And then they're like, you know,it's not even the same one,
apparently. So when she's like, or she, when
she starts, at least she's the same one.
And Wolverine is the same 1. So when they start talking to
(09:30):
each other, when like, and then I'm like, but yeah, same
character. Haini, you are trying to invoke
an or you're trying to hit upon an emotional beat that the
wonderful movie Logan established, and you're doing it
with the characters who are not the same characters.
Why would you think this would work for me?
Yeah, Yeah, they don't. They like kind of announce that
in the first scene that you Dusra Logan or something.
Yeah. And like, why would you try to
(09:52):
pull on their heartstring? It's, it's the, it's not the
same people. I mean, so that stuff really
doesn't bother me because if I'mnot invested in the 1st place
and I don't really care if you're trying to kind of pull
out my heart because I'm like, like, I don't care.
You just tell me a good story, right?
And John, I mean, this is also one of those movies where they
(10:16):
want to come across as sort of, you know, rambunctious or
whatever, but then everything feels so tightly controlled,
like every, every joke that he makes, you know, that, you know,
they, they came up with like 15 versions and they tested all 15
versions and then somebody came in.
(10:37):
I mean, this and Ant Man 3, I feel are the two biggest
inspirations behind like the HBOshow, which we spoke about last
time. Also konsata.
The franchise, yes, probably referenced it.
Yeah, yeah, yeah. The franchise, because this
certainly feels like, you know, like Ryan Reynolds certainly
(11:02):
fits the build for at least one character on that show.
Because I, I don't know, like this poor guy, right?
Because he is so chained to thischaracter that, I mean,
obviously we know that he's kindof changed his entire real life
personality to kind of mirror Deadpool.
(11:24):
And the fact that we, or even the other roles he gets at this
point are basically like Deadpool without the copyrighted
character. Yeah, which is strange thing,
right? And here also it's the the it's
not like he's trying to evolve as a performer, don't forget,
but even the character, right? You watch the first Deadpool
(11:44):
movie and you watch this one andhe's basically the same person.
There is no like Dasal Hoga. Hey, I'm 10 years older or
whatever. You know, I'm I'm not wiser, but
at least I'm slightly more evolved.
None of that is happening. There's none of the self
reflection or anything. You know, as an actor, he might
(12:05):
want to kind of be like, well, let's change the character up a
little bit because then at leastI'll have some something new to
do. But then because the character
is so juvenile and because the character is so relentlessly
kind of almost challenging you to kind of get annoyed at him.
Yeah. Which?
Is why I think his way to like push for the at least in small
(12:26):
amounts is to basically play variants of him right, which is
why he shows up as that long haired Ted pool.
He's like shall at least throughthis character I'll get to like,
play some other beat. For like 2 minutes no, but it
hurts the movie right? Because because I mean the the
the emotional kind of sentimental stuff aside, if
(12:47):
every scene in the movie is likeof a similar tone, then it gets
either it gets annoying or it gets old.
And and you don't want to enter like the third act of your movie
with especially this one, because it's not like, as you
know, small budget as the previous, though, at least the
(13:08):
first one. There's one that really like
this is like an MCU movie, right, because it's a ugly and B
it's like, hum, hum, special effects make whatever, Don't
don't worry about it. So all of that is anyway going
to be distracting from the story, right, Because you're
looking at the screen and you'relike, Oh my God, like, are you
(13:29):
really trying to, you know, mimic old boy of all things
here? But then you're doing it
because, like every character, every every one of those 55
Deadpools is CGI. They look robbery even is like
you. Don't even understand like why
certain things worked in a different movie that you're
(13:50):
right. Like it's not the free down even
down to the framing of it or like the emotional sort of how
you arrived at that moment, whatyou're doing around it.
It's not like just like they're focusing on like what this will
like recreate on some level, butthen they'll add like other
different things, right? Then the dog will show up like 4
times. That dog will like think dies or
(14:11):
something if I remember. Then the other Deadpool dies in
the middle. Then then the other guy shows
up. Who's that guy?
What do they call him? Like the his best friend or
whatever who like in the human world, he shows up and everyone
starts going Gaga around him. He's like, Oh yeah, you are the
hero. You are the anchor being of this
universe. More time pass over.
So like, there's no thorough lanky.
(14:31):
Yeah, there's like a khichdi of ideas and they want to hit every
beat in that final phenome. Yeah, plus they want to do all
that low key stuff also, which Ididn't watch that show, but I
was like, what is this? I remember watching like one or
two episodes of it, so I was. Strangely enough for a movie
like you know, normally like these movies are like you want
(14:51):
to watch the other movies to understand them, but like
strangely, I felt Loki is actually the most crucial
element to watch if you want to understand this show full sorry
this movie fully. What did you think about the
villain with multiple with two villains?
I remember. Oh, yeah, two villains.
Yeah. OK, there's that succession guy.
I completely forgot that he had a role to play.
But yeah, the main villain is sort of is more at least goes to
(15:13):
Emma Koran, right. She's at least occupy the
screen, screen more. Yeah.
I felt like she brought a different energy at least, you
know, like, so the CGS stuff waslike, very eerie.
And you're sort of like, gives you, like, goosebumps or
whatever. And it's like she was giving the
movie something where, like, youknow, otherwise, Hugh Jackman is
stuck in this beat where he has to, like, respond always, like,
sort of seriously, right. He's not allowed to, like,
(15:34):
really beat, like, talkative. So it's like it's either grunts
or it's like one or two words orMax.
That reminds me, he has that onescene, right, which is like his
Oscar scene, the one where he makes fun of like, Ryan Reynolds
slash Deadpool. Yeah.
Was pretty good. Like, I was like 8 second.
Did nobody tell you that you don't have to be this good in
this movie? Like, you're suddenly elevating
(15:57):
the weaker standard like, considerably and nothing is
going to kind of even attempt tomatch what you're doing in this
one scene. So I would like, just bring it
down. Yes.
Suddenly, Ashley. Oh, yeah.
Now suddenly we are like, reallydoing acting now.
So. Yeah.
I actually thought Corinne was good as Cassandra, didn't mind
her at all. But yeah, even I remember.
(16:18):
But I think the problem eventually is that she just gets
lost in the mess because they will pull the story in a
different direction. As we discussed, they'll end up
in that one room cave where thenthey'll introduce every hero
slowly and then that becomes themovie for half an hour.
So completely loses the like thewhen is that a driving force?
Right? It's not like she's still there
(16:38):
in the back of her. She's planned this and she'll
show up any second. No, she's on pause now and she
would only matter when they'll start to go back to her
compound. Like until then she has like no
purpose. Shockingly, I discovered that
the I'm forgetting the name of that limbo land where they kind
of end up. I.
Think the wide if I'm not. The wide Yes, shockingly, I
(16:59):
discovered that it's again like.A low key thing right?
And if you should see the low key, then that world again makes
a lot more. Sense OK, so like that purple
desert kind of that. Shows up twice, which I should
eat everyone up is a reference to a purple cloud which shows up
in Loki. Oh my God.
It reminds me of like Fantastic Beasts where like I remember
there was some sort of like tentthat would eat.
(17:21):
Yeah, that thing is real. That's a real location, that
desert thing, the most fake looking set of the entire movie,
which, I mean, honestly, if you're going to create a fake
New York, then you can create a fake desert also, wouldn't that
be cheaper? But they've for some reason
thought of shooting in a real desert thing and creating a fake
(17:42):
New York. So none of this makes sense.
Especially, yeah, because we've discussed this before and I
think like, this was like early pandemic.
I don't know which movie it was,but I think probably those
Avengers, Infinity War and End Game where they decided that we
have too many secrets to keep and we cannot be seen outdoors.
Yeah. So every movie started to be
(18:03):
shot like under Yeah and then kind of broke the industry,
right? Because then I.
Remember, I think the Thor love and Thunder was the crowning
moment. But like crowning moment.
I'm saying ironically like the opposite way where I was just
like Taika Viditi like doesn't know how backgrounds work,
right? I'm like, you can't put like
blotches of blue and purple in the background and call it a day
(18:25):
bro. Like that's not how backgrounds
work. Yeah.
So to me, this is just like a very, very expensive version of,
you know, something like that David Davan nonsense.
You know, this barely resembles a movie, which is a string of
gags, stuff that you're supposedto point at and kind of clap.
If anything like ran Ros will belike no like I was intentionally
doing that. That is the point.
(18:46):
So your criticism is actually a compliment.
Thank you. Yeah, but then he gets away with
everything by saying, oh, Yitu, Pata and Amuje.
Yeah, like you can be sincere also, and you can be tongue in
cheek also and be like, of course I'm winking at yeah,
everything except like that moment.
Like you point out that you knowyou don't actually care for any
of her friends. Like if you look at it, he
started to save the universe because he cares for these
(19:06):
people right? Which are shown at the beginning
his ex fiance, the other people around him, I don't know any of
their names because the movie doesn't care for them so I
cannot care care for them. So they show up in the beginning
all that gang and they show up in the end and we are told that
Deadpool case for all these people that's why he's doing it.
And I'm like why? If the movie is literally
telling me they don't matter because they don't show up more
(19:27):
than like 2 minutes and I think 3 or of the 10 get like a
dialogue then then I don't buy your angle of the same my world
so then buy you like. The wife doesn't even get a line
right? Yeah.
I know. I think the XP also gets a line.
I think she probably gets more lines than anyone because she's
also like I think 3rd or 4th on the bill call sheet, but like.
I remember that she was like super top build, yeah, but she
(19:50):
had like. Probably like 3 lines.
There are actually people who are like only smiling.
They're literally people who only smile because they're not
given lines like that. Their level of involvement.
I'm like. I mean, yeah, so that's the
problem with the problem with these movies.
Yeah, because the movies are just like, yeah, as you said,
(20:11):
they're like series of gags and just string them together, 5000
of them. I mean, that's probably a way to
kind of do a better version of this, I'm sure.
But they're kind of it's like Ryan Reynolds, like he, he's
chained to this character and these movies are chained to this
sort of format. They can't really do anything
(20:32):
else. If they do something else then
people will be like, excuse me, what they happen to be like,
very popular and stuff so. Speaking of popular, this is
like consider all time, which like we already mentioned for
Marvel, but it's almost like funny, like, you know, like
these are the movies like when they were acquiring Fox, they're
almost like, you know, semi unrelevant and you know, they
were like sliding away. Deadpool was like sort of
(20:54):
working for it, but like everything else was like like
actual little garbage. You know, like the X-Men movies
were going nowhere when they acquired them.
And suddenly Marvel now finds itin a place where they actually
needed this movie to work. You know, like, they were, like,
on a string of failures, earning, I think, less than what
they were spending to make thesemovies.
And now they find themselves in a year where they've cleared out
(21:14):
the entire calendar, at least inmovie sense, and just just
released this one like that. Like how that's how much, like,
Deadpool and Wolverine mean to them, which is why when they
make the joke, you know, when hemakes the random joke, he's like
Hugh Jackman, you're gonna be doing this until you're dead.
Like, I feel like that's actually true.
Like they're gonna keep bringinghim back even in the next two
Avengers movies. Yeah, which is, which is like a
(21:34):
depressing thought, right? Because.
Yeah, because you cannot joke about it, which is what this
movie does, you know? And then still keep doing it
because then it defeats the purpose of like that joke.
You are the joke then. Yeah, plus, I mean, they fail to
recognize a good thing when theyhave it, right?
Because enough criticism has been kind of lobbed at them
about, you know, there are no stakes in these movies, which is
(21:58):
why Infinity War as well made asit was, it isn't a great movie
because 5 seconds after the credits roll, you're like, oh,
of course they'll be back. Which is a terrible position to
be in, right. Because that's a great kind of
you dug for yourself because youmade a really good movie.
But because like actual life anddeath means so little to you,
(22:19):
you've you've kind of erased theemotional kind of wallop of that
movie and which which is what happens with this one as well.
Because Tumjit Navi Boloki, sameLogan, but.
You know that's what you're doing, right?
Because no one really cares who is the same Logan.
Like the point is that you have brought back huge Jackman.
Like that's what you're cashing in on is that people love him
and we will love him as Wolverine.
(22:41):
They don't really care what kindversion of Wolverine is he's
playing. Yeah.
So I mean the and and and the way that these things are going,
like I have lost interest. I had lost interest like I think
a couple of years ago with everybody else at the same time,
we all collectively lost interest in these movies.
I don't know if there's any way to kind of get back into into
(23:02):
this unless you kind of make a stand alone thing which which is
what's. Up.
This is proving right because the last movie, I think was the
Marvels, if I'm not wrong, last year did not work.
That's the one I was referencingthat made less money, money than
its budget. But then this one actually did
work. Like people did go out and see,
at least in the numbers at the box office.
Yeah. People like these characters.
(23:24):
Exactly. So I think it's gonna be like up
and down now the Marvel's era oflike, you know, that they can
use the goodwill of one movie tomake the next movie work.
Like which used to happen in thedays like Ant man man could make
money or random yeah, Guardians would make money after they made
like, you know, Avengers and stuff like those things are gone
now. And it's literally depends on
(23:44):
each movie has has to like sell itself to the world because this
is made so much now like this TVshows like I didn't I'm not even
finishing the things I'm starting anymore.
Yeah. So they've, they've lost that
like position that they had witha very covered position where
people were hungry to watch everything they were putting
out. And they were forgiving of
mediocre. Yeah, so forgiving, right?
(24:04):
Because the Thor movie was a garbage for a while, then they
got good and they got bad again so people watched them
regardless. They were.
They gave a pass to the second Tiger movie also which is
shocking. Yeah, Avengers first was good,
but then the second Avengers wasn't bad, but then people was
like, that's fine because there are more movies coming and then
in every one end game, sort of like what like the height again.
(24:26):
So people are for game against. Like there was so much there in
that Infinity, whatever saga they call it, which is like
downright mediocre, if not like actually bad or terrible, but
it's it's you can pave it over because there's enough stuff
around it to like, you know, hold the ship or whatever.
But that's not the case anymore.People are like not forgiving
anymore. They're like too much, too much,
like too bad. Just to get out of my way.
(24:48):
I will like TuneIn when I feel like, which is what the case is
now. I think guardians also like did
well for them, the Guardians 3 and then things didn't do well
in between and then Deadpool didwell and there's no guarantee
now. I think the next one is like
some captain, like a four or something if I'm not wrong.
Which is still being shot, I read somewhere.
Oh wow, so good luck to that. But yeah, like it's now each
movie will be like it's own, like test for them.
(25:10):
Yeah, and I'm not going to watchall of them like I used to watch
all of them, but I'm not going to watch all of them anymore.
I'm just going to watch the onesthat I want to watch.
You know, if, for instance, if Denzel is actually in Black
Panther 3 and I'm going to watchthat even though I did not like
black. Panther, I did not like Black
Panther two. Yeah, I'm very like angry
sometime, actually in this case is because you've, I don't know,
(25:30):
like actually like I should be angry at like Marvel, right.
And they're like, yeah, they're throwing money at Ryan Kugra.
So he's like got them. But then I'm like, wait, now I
should I'm partially angry at Ryan Kugra as well for like
wasting his talent, like and being in the Marvel units for
like, what, a half a decade now?Like bro, go make something
else. Yeah, yeah, I mean, it's fine.
Like, you take that money and make that whatever he's making
(25:50):
some vampire. No, no.
But I'm saying between Black Panther one and Pepper and two,
he did not make anything with that money.
So that's when it's annoying. I don't mind if you do one for
you, one for me, completely OK with that.
But then. Honestly, I don't begrudge him
for doing Black Panther 2 because it's not like he was
doing like a sequel to Ant Man or something, you know?
He was doing a sequel to like a like a little Best Picture
(26:13):
nominee. But I'm saying if he goes
directly from back in two to back in three, I will be
disappointed. Then it's annoying, yeah.
But yeah, I understand what you're saying.
I mean, this is they have, for the longest time, they had like
sort of a stronghold over the industry, right?
Like everybody had to be a part and everybody was almost like
like a slave. And I think in some ways that's
(26:33):
still there, right? Because Downing junior went
away, did stuff like Oppenheimerand a couple of other things and
it's now back, which like that stays a.
Lot longest time, all of them, like I think Downey Junior and
Chris Evans were actually complaining about, you know,
like we are stuck here. Please help us escape.
And they got out and like, but they're going back now that
(26:54):
Russo, they're going back because they're whatever they're
doing elsewhere is not really working on the same level.
So they feel like they've lost their quote UN quote mojo or
like, you know, they want to like, go back to that level
where they were like ruling the box office in the world.
So everyone's chasing that. And that's what they're chasing
and that's what they're going back to.
So in a way, like, I feel like that still exists.
Like Avengers, the next two one,they're gonna sell on the fact
(27:15):
of, you know, the characters, not the characters, the actors
they recruit around. Yeah.
Plus. They're going to do like
Fantastic Four and all of those.People which like, yeah, they've
already got like people, right? We love, right, Like Pedro
Pascal's in it, Vanessa Kirby's in it.
Like they have enough money to throw at these actors to get
them on board. And they will do that for, like,
(27:35):
Avengers. And they will find a way to,
like, make, make those movies into two billion orders.
Yeah. But yeah, I mean, but it's not
the. Same cultural cache.
I feel like it used to be in the2000 tens, yeah.
Because you've lost the goodwill, right?
You've done, you've done, you've, you had it for a while
and then and then you kind of squandered your position.
You kind of. Just like like 15 things on
(27:56):
people in one year and you people are like, I'm out.
No, but if all 15 of them were good then people would still be
in. It's a quality thing.
I. Feel like they go hand in hand,
but yeah, you could be right. But yeah, this is, I mean, maybe
this kind of worked for them, but it really it doesn't really
work as a yeah. But it's a standalone thing,
(28:17):
right? There's no back contribution
from this. Because of this, people are not
gonna watch more Marvel movies. They'll be watch one more with
randoms and Hugh Jackman becausethat probably they might watch
an Avengers because of it because you can do just file
everyone into one movie, but that this won't make people
watch like say Captain America 4or whatever they're coming down
the line. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
It's almost to the point. It's like.
(28:37):
Unrelated. Yeah, that transfer that used to
happen is that transfer is gone for Marvel.
Yeah, which is a scanty positionto be in after making a billion
or whatever dollars to still be not sure.
Yeah, right. Time to wrap it up.
Yep. OK, then that's all for this
episode of The Long Take. You can follow us on Facebook,
(28:58):
YouTube, Instagram and Threads at the Long Take Pod.
You can write to us at the Long Take pod@gmail.com.
Please leave us a rating and review the Evolution episode and
we will see you next week. Thanks for listening.
Hi, I'm Akara. And I'm Rohan Nahar.
Welcome. To the long take.
We've been off for a while, but we're back after and we're today
we're discussing the model movieTemple and Woline, which is now
on streaming or Disney Plus, wherever you have it after a
Seattle release. The only Marvel movie to see or
actually incidentally enough after like, I don't know how
many years of like having three or four each year.
(00:39):
And it's also like integrating like the Fox and was properly
into the MCU sort of thing. Yeah.
What do you make of this one? Yeah, all of these movies are, I
don't know, they're competently made.
They can get very annoying. But then ultimately they're so
unmemorable that you can't really have strong opinions
(01:01):
about them, is what I. Feel yeah, I think I think you
got off like on this possibly like the biggest point of the
bad is that yeah, that's the my also my issue with these movies,
especially this one, I would sayactually more than the last two
is that it's so relentlessly focused on like what's happening
to the MCU right now that it sort of either forgets or
(01:24):
doesn't actually care how this movie would work if I watched it
in say 2013. Like it would not work at all
because you know the memory of like what happened to the MCU
post end game would be like a distant memory for most of us.
Wouldn't people wouldn't really care.
You're you're if you replay a movie, you want to it to be like
fun and on its on its own because the jokes are funny, you
(01:46):
know, on on the base of the jokeand not the fact that what we
are all going through in culturally of that era.
So, yeah, I think the movie is like so focused on like, just
like what has been happening to the Marvel sort of world after
the end game, sort of like and the whole Disney Plus like sort
of debacle because they had to make too much content everywhere
(02:09):
is that it forgets that you haveto be a good movie separate from
all that. Yeah, but then it also spends so
much time looking back further, right?
Like the early 2000s and stuff. Yeah, because it's like it knows
that it's going to be the last movie that gets to do that,
that, you know, sort of pays a tribute to the Fox's X-Men
(02:30):
universe. Is that like, I feel like Ryan
Reynolds was like, no, I must use this movie to like, you
know, pay homage to everyone whodid, like, a great job, which is
why the movie and if you remember, the end credits is
literally like a sea of compilations of, like, behind
the scenes moments. Yeah.
Like, I was like, so sentimental.
I was like, this is completely not In Sync with what your movie
(02:51):
has been poking fun at everyone.But right now you're like,
you're. But I was like, oh, that's where
it's coming from. It's coming from a place of
like, he's like, I want to ensure that, you know, these
people who like put in there whatever blood and sweat are
like remembered. The problem with all three
Deadpool movies, and this one more particularly, is that deep
(03:13):
down there is a very nice sentimental idea behind it,
right? But then it comes across as
almost an afterthought. And the way that the movie is
kind of designed, which is just relentless jokes, right?
Made by just one person, it kindof buries all the
(03:36):
sentimentality, which I feel hurts the movie because if you
think about it, the premise isn't too dissimilar to
something that you might see in like a Pixar movie, right?
There's this like this land where the forgotten kind of
characters go, but they all bandtogether to be like, no, we
might be forgotten, but we're kind of, you know, we we're,
(03:59):
we're important to, we deserve to have a voice, etcetera,
etcetera. It's a very sentimental idea.
And at one point it was sort of a, you know, forgotten
character. It's just eviled it into
existence. But then this, this is hardly
how they're selling the movie, right?
This is hardly what the movie isactually about.
(04:20):
Because they also have the time travel nonsense.
They also have the multiverse craziness.
They also have Wolverine there, but that is more important to
the movie than the actual heart,right?
Which is odd because in any other film they would focus on
this over all the, you know, razzmatazz.
(04:43):
Yeah, but like those people are like abroad to almost like give
the movie like an emotional foundation, right?
They're like, yeah, yeah. We, we we care for these
characters. We haven't forgotten them.
We want you to know. And like they're introduced in
like the most like South Indian fashion possible of.
Like yeah, exactly. Like people walking in an ultra
slow MO, like a like, yeah, yeah, quite trailer, yeah,
(05:07):
moving apart. Or some, it's not like
integrated into the plot where like one person comes and then,
you know, whatever. It's like we we have this.
Fashion like ramp watch. You know, like.
Everyone's coming in slow motion, like one person is
throwing a car, one person got blades are coming, one person
got something else coming. Like why?
Like, what is this? Like, I know it's like almost
(05:28):
like the moments are built because they know in the
audience people will be shoutingat the screen.
They're like, Oh yeah, a blade aya.
Oh yeah, a Bo aya. Like that's what it is built to
like, juice out every last like moment from that.
Yeah, which is the odd, which iswhat I realized.
I don't know which movie it was.I think Spider Man or something
(05:49):
which I watched in like a semi empty theatre and they were like
laugh pauses and stuff which felt so awkward because there
was nobody there to laugh. Yeah, it's like it's.
Ultra with this one, because it's like two different sort of
fan bases, right? Like a lot of people who have
seen the MCU, like maybe like they've seen every entry.
(06:10):
You ask them if they've seen like X-Men X2, X-Men United and
1st Class and they'll be like, Idon't know what those movies are
like that. Actually.
That's a large part of the fan base, right?
And now you're bringing these two together and expecting that
people have watched like X-Men Origins, Wolverine, I haven't
seen that. No, but see The thing is that
it's almost slightly bold of them to kind of not just into
(06:34):
having any sort of feeling for these characters because it's
not like they're showing us likeJean Grey or Cyclopska romance
or something like that. Literally 1 character to has
never even been in the movie before Channing Tatumala.
They're they're banking on the fact that people have followed
the news cycle at some level. Yeah.
It's like you not only have you watched these movies, you have
(06:55):
also followed like the production details of them.
Yeah. Yeah, massive deep cuts, right.
It's not like no one says Kevin Feige, Ryan Adel says Feige.
He doesn't say Kevin. So you'll have to like you have
to be really into this universe to like get more all the movies
jokes which in. Fairness, I'm guessing at this
point, if you're watching Deadpool, Wolverine, you sort of
(07:18):
right. You at least you know who Feige
is. I mean, I'm guessing most people
would. I'm sure like is he got parent
general? They'll be like, what?
What does that mean? But then there will be lost,
like like Feige won't be the only thing that kind of
alienates them because it is, after all, like the third movie
in the Deadpool franchise plus like the 25th or whatever in the
(07:39):
MCU. So like 35th probably.
Oh my God. But yeah, the the weird thing
about it is, is is it almost gets away with it also, right?
Because like, I have no feelingsfor Chris Evans called Johnny
Storm or whatever. Yeah, I haven't even seen those
movies. I've seen, only seen like
rushes, you know, when they usedto play on like TV channels on
(08:02):
TV. That's how I know of those
movies, the Blade movies. I've never seen the Blade
movies, which I I had. I had no idea there was a
trilogy of those movies. I knew I like, came across that
fact while I was writing the review for this movie.
Like, oh, there's like three of them and.
One of them is direct by Guillermo del Toro.
Yeah, yeah. That I think also I came across
doing the research and then Electra I never bothered because
(08:24):
it's like the Deadpool and also Deadpool, sorry, Daredevil,
Daredevil. You see, it's so sounding so
similar. That one never got like great
review. So why would I watch like a spin
off of that? Movie so like.
Massive like you're you're almost like digging like
characters javasthi from the bottom of you know, like
forgotten realm and being like yeah, yeah, Mahal Logan.
(08:48):
No. And there's an argument to be
made that these characters sort of deserve to be forgotten,
right? Because they're like hardly like
glory days and like this was these these people are like,
like those movies were terrible.Like Electron is terrible like.
And you're putting these like characters from a different era
of like enormous, like, you know, it has to be like
(09:09):
millionaire or like Gen. X era because in the 2000s.
And then I'm putting them next to a character from like a one
off movie called Logan. And this teenager is roaming
around and I'm like, it's like, sure, she was in a great movie,
but why is she suddenly here, right?
And then they're like, you know,it's not even the same one,
apparently. So when she's like, or she, when
she starts, at least she's the same one.
And Wolverine is the same 1. So when they start talking to
(09:30):
each other, when like, and then I'm like, but yeah, same
character. Haini, you are trying to invoke
an or you're trying to hit upon an emotional beat that the
wonderful movie Logan established, and you're doing it
with the characters who are not the same characters.
Why would you think this would work for me?
Yeah, Yeah, they don't. They like kind of announce that
in the first scene that you Dusra Logan or something.
Yeah. And like, why would you try to
(09:52):
pull on their heartstring? It's, it's the, it's not the
same people. I mean, so that stuff really
doesn't bother me because if I'mnot invested in the 1st place
and I don't really care if you're trying to kind of pull
out my heart because I'm like, like, I don't care.
You just tell me a good story, right?
And John, I mean, this is also one of those movies where they
(10:16):
want to come across as sort of, you know, rambunctious or
whatever, but then everything feels so tightly controlled,
like every, every joke that he makes, you know, that, you know,
they, they came up with like 15 versions and they tested all 15
versions and then somebody came in.
(10:37):
I mean, this and Ant Man 3, I feel are the two biggest
inspirations behind like the HBOshow, which we spoke about last
time. Also konsata.
The franchise, yes, probably referenced it.
Yeah, yeah, yeah. The franchise, because this
certainly feels like, you know, like Ryan Reynolds certainly
(11:02):
fits the build for at least one character on that show.
Because I, I don't know, like this poor guy, right?
Because he is so chained to thischaracter that, I mean,
obviously we know that he's kindof changed his entire real life
personality to kind of mirror Deadpool.
(11:24):
And the fact that we, or even the other roles he gets at this
point are basically like Deadpool without the copyrighted
character. Yeah, which is strange thing,
right? And here also it's the the it's
not like he's trying to evolve as a performer, don't forget,
but even the character, right? You watch the first Deadpool
(11:44):
movie and you watch this one andhe's basically the same person.
There is no like Dasal Hoga. Hey, I'm 10 years older or
whatever. You know, I'm I'm not wiser, but
at least I'm slightly more evolved.
None of that is happening. There's none of the self
reflection or anything. You know, as an actor, he might
(12:05):
want to kind of be like, well, let's change the character up a
little bit because then at leastI'll have some something new to
do. But then because the character
is so juvenile and because the character is so relentlessly
kind of almost challenging you to kind of get annoyed at him.
Yeah. Which?
Is why I think his way to like push for the at least in small
(12:26):
amounts is to basically play variants of him right, which is
why he shows up as that long haired Ted pool.
He's like shall at least throughthis character I'll get to like,
play some other beat. For like 2 minutes no, but it
hurts the movie right? Because because I mean the the
the emotional kind of sentimental stuff aside, if
(12:47):
every scene in the movie is likeof a similar tone, then it gets
either it gets annoying or it gets old.
And and you don't want to enter like the third act of your movie
with especially this one, because it's not like, as you
know, small budget as the previous, though, at least the
(13:08):
first one. There's one that really like
this is like an MCU movie, right, because it's a ugly and B
it's like, hum, hum, special effects make whatever, Don't
don't worry about it. So all of that is anyway going
to be distracting from the story, right, Because you're
looking at the screen and you'relike, Oh my God, like, are you
(13:29):
really trying to, you know, mimic old boy of all things
here? But then you're doing it
because, like every character, every every one of those 55
Deadpools is CGI. They look robbery even is like
you. Don't even understand like why
certain things worked in a different movie that you're
(13:50):
right. Like it's not the free down even
down to the framing of it or like the emotional sort of how
you arrived at that moment, whatyou're doing around it.
It's not like just like they're focusing on like what this will
like recreate on some level, butthen they'll add like other
different things, right? Then the dog will show up like 4
times. That dog will like think dies or
(14:11):
something if I remember. Then the other Deadpool dies in
the middle. Then then the other guy shows
up. Who's that guy?
What do they call him? Like the his best friend or
whatever who like in the human world, he shows up and everyone
starts going Gaga around him. He's like, Oh yeah, you are the
hero. You are the anchor being of this
universe. More time pass over.
So like, there's no thorough lanky.
(14:31):
Yeah, there's like a khichdi of ideas and they want to hit every
beat in that final phenome. Yeah, plus they want to do all
that low key stuff also, which Ididn't watch that show, but I
was like, what is this? I remember watching like one or
two episodes of it, so I was. Strangely enough for a movie
like you know, normally like these movies are like you want
(14:51):
to watch the other movies to understand them, but like
strangely, I felt Loki is actually the most crucial
element to watch if you want to understand this show full sorry
this movie fully. What did you think about the
villain with multiple with two villains?
I remember. Oh, yeah, two villains.
Yeah. OK, there's that succession guy.
I completely forgot that he had a role to play.
But yeah, the main villain is sort of is more at least goes to
(15:13):
Emma Koran, right. She's at least occupy the
screen, screen more. Yeah.
I felt like she brought a different energy at least, you
know, like, so the CGS stuff waslike, very eerie.
And you're sort of like, gives you, like, goosebumps or
whatever. And it's like she was giving the
movie something where, like, youknow, otherwise, Hugh Jackman is
stuck in this beat where he has to, like, respond always, like,
sort of seriously, right. He's not allowed to, like,
(15:34):
really beat, like, talkative. So it's like it's either grunts
or it's like one or two words orMax.
That reminds me, he has that onescene, right, which is like his
Oscar scene, the one where he makes fun of like, Ryan Reynolds
slash Deadpool. Yeah.
Was pretty good. Like, I was like 8 second.
Did nobody tell you that you don't have to be this good in
this movie? Like, you're suddenly elevating
(15:57):
the weaker standard like, considerably and nothing is
going to kind of even attempt tomatch what you're doing in this
one scene. So I would like, just bring it
down. Yes.
Suddenly, Ashley. Oh, yeah.
Now suddenly we are like, reallydoing acting now.
So. Yeah.
I actually thought Corinne was good as Cassandra, didn't mind
her at all. But yeah, even I remember.
(16:18):
But I think the problem eventually is that she just gets
lost in the mess because they will pull the story in a
different direction. As we discussed, they'll end up
in that one room cave where thenthey'll introduce every hero
slowly and then that becomes themovie for half an hour.
So completely loses the like thewhen is that a driving force?
Right? It's not like she's still there
(16:38):
in the back of her. She's planned this and she'll
show up any second. No, she's on pause now and she
would only matter when they'll start to go back to her
compound. Like until then she has like no
purpose. Shockingly, I discovered that
the I'm forgetting the name of that limbo land where they kind
of end up. I.
Think the wide if I'm not. The wide Yes, shockingly, I
(16:59):
discovered that it's again like.A low key thing right?
And if you should see the low key, then that world again makes
a lot more. Sense OK, so like that purple
desert kind of that. Shows up twice, which I should
eat everyone up is a reference to a purple cloud which shows up
in Loki. Oh my God.
It reminds me of like Fantastic Beasts where like I remember
there was some sort of like tentthat would eat.
(17:21):
Yeah, that thing is real. That's a real location, that
desert thing, the most fake looking set of the entire movie,
which, I mean, honestly, if you're going to create a fake
New York, then you can create a fake desert also, wouldn't that
be cheaper? But they've for some reason
thought of shooting in a real desert thing and creating a fake
(17:42):
New York. So none of this makes sense.
Especially, yeah, because we've discussed this before and I
think like, this was like early pandemic.
I don't know which movie it was,but I think probably those
Avengers, Infinity War and End Game where they decided that we
have too many secrets to keep and we cannot be seen outdoors.
Yeah. So every movie started to be
(18:03):
shot like under Yeah and then kind of broke the industry,
right? Because then I.
Remember, I think the Thor love and Thunder was the crowning
moment. But like crowning moment.
I'm saying ironically like the opposite way where I was just
like Taika Viditi like doesn't know how backgrounds work,
right? I'm like, you can't put like
blotches of blue and purple in the background and call it a day
(18:25):
bro. Like that's not how backgrounds
work. Yeah.
So to me, this is just like a very, very expensive version of,
you know, something like that David Davan nonsense.
You know, this barely resembles a movie, which is a string of
gags, stuff that you're supposedto point at and kind of clap.
If anything like ran Ros will belike no like I was intentionally
doing that. That is the point.
(18:46):
So your criticism is actually a compliment.
Thank you. Yeah, but then he gets away with
everything by saying, oh, Yitu, Pata and Amuje.
Yeah, like you can be sincere also, and you can be tongue in
cheek also and be like, of course I'm winking at yeah,
everything except like that moment.
Like you point out that you knowyou don't actually care for any
of her friends. Like if you look at it, he
started to save the universe because he cares for these
(19:06):
people right? Which are shown at the beginning
his ex fiance, the other people around him, I don't know any of
their names because the movie doesn't care for them so I
cannot care care for them. So they show up in the beginning
all that gang and they show up in the end and we are told that
Deadpool case for all these people that's why he's doing it.
And I'm like why? If the movie is literally
telling me they don't matter because they don't show up more
(19:27):
than like 2 minutes and I think 3 or of the 10 get like a
dialogue then then I don't buy your angle of the same my world
so then buy you like. The wife doesn't even get a line
right? Yeah.
I know. I think the XP also gets a line.
I think she probably gets more lines than anyone because she's
also like I think 3rd or 4th on the bill call sheet, but like.
I remember that she was like super top build, yeah, but she
(19:50):
had like. Probably like 3 lines.
There are actually people who are like only smiling.
They're literally people who only smile because they're not
given lines like that. Their level of involvement.
I'm like. I mean, yeah, so that's the
problem with the problem with these movies.
Yeah, because the movies are just like, yeah, as you said,
(20:11):
they're like series of gags and just string them together, 5000
of them. I mean, that's probably a way to
kind of do a better version of this, I'm sure.
But they're kind of it's like Ryan Reynolds, like he, he's
chained to this character and these movies are chained to this
sort of format. They can't really do anything
(20:32):
else. If they do something else then
people will be like, excuse me, what they happen to be like,
very popular and stuff so. Speaking of popular, this is
like consider all time, which like we already mentioned for
Marvel, but it's almost like funny, like, you know, like
these are the movies like when they were acquiring Fox, they're
almost like, you know, semi unrelevant and you know, they
were like sliding away. Deadpool was like sort of
(20:54):
working for it, but like everything else was like like
actual little garbage. You know, like the X-Men movies
were going nowhere when they acquired them.
And suddenly Marvel now finds itin a place where they actually
needed this movie to work. You know, like, they were, like,
on a string of failures, earning, I think, less than what
they were spending to make thesemovies.
And now they find themselves in a year where they've cleared out
(21:14):
the entire calendar, at least inmovie sense, and just just
released this one like that. Like how that's how much, like,
Deadpool and Wolverine mean to them, which is why when they
make the joke, you know, when hemakes the random joke, he's like
Hugh Jackman, you're gonna be doing this until you're dead.
Like, I feel like that's actually true.
Like they're gonna keep bringinghim back even in the next two
Avengers movies. Yeah, which is, which is like a
(21:34):
depressing thought, right? Because.
Yeah, because you cannot joke about it, which is what this
movie does, you know? And then still keep doing it
because then it defeats the purpose of like that joke.
You are the joke then. Yeah, plus, I mean, they fail to
recognize a good thing when theyhave it, right?
Because enough criticism has been kind of lobbed at them
about, you know, there are no stakes in these movies, which is
(21:58):
why Infinity War as well made asit was, it isn't a great movie
because 5 seconds after the credits roll, you're like, oh,
of course they'll be back. Which is a terrible position to
be in, right. Because that's a great kind of
you dug for yourself because youmade a really good movie.
But because like actual life anddeath means so little to you,
(22:19):
you've you've kind of erased theemotional kind of wallop of that
movie and which which is what happens with this one as well.
Because Tumjit Navi Boloki, sameLogan, but.
You know that's what you're doing, right?
Because no one really cares who is the same Logan.
Like the point is that you have brought back huge Jackman.
Like that's what you're cashing in on is that people love him
and we will love him as Wolverine.
(22:41):
They don't really care what kindversion of Wolverine is he's
playing. Yeah.
So I mean the and and and the way that these things are going,
like I have lost interest. I had lost interest like I think
a couple of years ago with everybody else at the same time,
we all collectively lost interest in these movies.
I don't know if there's any way to kind of get back into into
(23:02):
this unless you kind of make a stand alone thing which which is
what's. Up.
This is proving right because the last movie, I think was the
Marvels, if I'm not wrong, last year did not work.
That's the one I was referencingthat made less money, money than
its budget. But then this one actually did
work. Like people did go out and see,
at least in the numbers at the box office.
Yeah. People like these characters.
(23:24):
Exactly. So I think it's gonna be like up
and down now the Marvel's era oflike, you know, that they can
use the goodwill of one movie tomake the next movie work.
Like which used to happen in thedays like Ant man man could make
money or random yeah, Guardians would make money after they made
like, you know, Avengers and stuff like those things are gone
now. And it's literally depends on
(23:44):
each movie has has to like sell itself to the world because this
is made so much now like this TVshows like I didn't I'm not even
finishing the things I'm starting anymore.
Yeah. So they've, they've lost that
like position that they had witha very covered position where
people were hungry to watch everything they were putting
out. And they were forgiving of
mediocre. Yeah, so forgiving, right?
(24:04):
Because the Thor movie was a garbage for a while, then they
got good and they got bad again so people watched them
regardless. They were.
They gave a pass to the second Tiger movie also which is
shocking. Yeah, Avengers first was good,
but then the second Avengers wasn't bad, but then people was
like, that's fine because there are more movies coming and then
in every one end game, sort of like what like the height again.
(24:26):
So people are for game against. Like there was so much there in
that Infinity, whatever saga they call it, which is like
downright mediocre, if not like actually bad or terrible, but
it's it's you can pave it over because there's enough stuff
around it to like, you know, hold the ship or whatever.
But that's not the case anymore.People are like not forgiving
anymore. They're like too much, too much,
like too bad. Just to get out of my way.
(24:48):
I will like TuneIn when I feel like, which is what the case is
now. I think guardians also like did
well for them, the Guardians 3 and then things didn't do well
in between and then Deadpool didwell and there's no guarantee
now. I think the next one is like
some captain, like a four or something if I'm not wrong.
Which is still being shot, I read somewhere.
Oh wow, so good luck to that. But yeah, like it's now each
movie will be like it's own, like test for them.
(25:10):
Yeah, and I'm not going to watchall of them like I used to watch
all of them, but I'm not going to watch all of them anymore.
I'm just going to watch the onesthat I want to watch.
You know, if, for instance, if Denzel is actually in Black
Panther 3 and I'm going to watchthat even though I did not like
black. Panther, I did not like Black
Panther two. Yeah, I'm very like angry
sometime, actually in this case is because you've, I don't know,
(25:30):
like actually like I should be angry at like Marvel, right.
And they're like, yeah, they're throwing money at Ryan Kugra.
So he's like got them. But then I'm like, wait, now I
should I'm partially angry at Ryan Kugra as well for like
wasting his talent, like and being in the Marvel units for
like, what, a half a decade now?Like bro, go make something
else. Yeah, yeah, I mean, it's fine.
Like, you take that money and make that whatever he's making
(25:50):
some vampire. No, no.
But I'm saying between Black Panther one and Pepper and two,
he did not make anything with that money.
So that's when it's annoying. I don't mind if you do one for
you, one for me, completely OK with that.
But then. Honestly, I don't begrudge him
for doing Black Panther 2 because it's not like he was
doing like a sequel to Ant Man or something, you know?
He was doing a sequel to like a like a little Best Picture
(26:13):
nominee. But I'm saying if he goes
directly from back in two to back in three, I will be
disappointed. Then it's annoying, yeah.
But yeah, I understand what you're saying.
I mean, this is they have, for the longest time, they had like
sort of a stronghold over the industry, right?
Like everybody had to be a part and everybody was almost like
like a slave. And I think in some ways that's
(26:33):
still there, right? Because Downing junior went
away, did stuff like Oppenheimerand a couple of other things and
it's now back, which like that stays a.
Lot longest time, all of them, like I think Downey Junior and
Chris Evans were actually complaining about, you know,
like we are stuck here. Please help us escape.
And they got out and like, but they're going back now that
(26:54):
Russo, they're going back because they're whatever they're
doing elsewhere is not really working on the same level.
So they feel like they've lost their quote UN quote mojo or
like, you know, they want to like, go back to that level
where they were like ruling the box office in the world.
So everyone's chasing that. And that's what they're chasing
and that's what they're going back to.
So in a way, like, I feel like that still exists.
Like Avengers, the next two one,they're gonna sell on the fact
(27:15):
of, you know, the characters, not the characters, the actors
they recruit around. Yeah.
Plus. They're going to do like
Fantastic Four and all of those.People which like, yeah, they've
already got like people, right? We love, right, Like Pedro
Pascal's in it, Vanessa Kirby's in it.
Like they have enough money to throw at these actors to get
them on board. And they will do that for, like,
(27:35):
Avengers. And they will find a way to,
like, make, make those movies into two billion orders.
Yeah. But yeah, I mean, but it's not
the. Same cultural cache.
I feel like it used to be in the2000 tens, yeah.
Because you've lost the goodwill, right?
You've done, you've done, you've, you had it for a while
and then and then you kind of squandered your position.
You kind of. Just like like 15 things on
(27:56):
people in one year and you people are like, I'm out.
No, but if all 15 of them were good then people would still be
in. It's a quality thing.
I. Feel like they go hand in hand,
but yeah, you could be right. But yeah, this is, I mean, maybe
this kind of worked for them, but it really it doesn't really
work as a yeah. But it's a standalone thing,
(28:17):
right? There's no back contribution
from this. Because of this, people are not
gonna watch more Marvel movies. They'll be watch one more with
randoms and Hugh Jackman becausethat probably they might watch
an Avengers because of it because you can do just file
everyone into one movie, but that this won't make people
watch like say Captain America 4or whatever they're coming down
the line. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
It's almost to the point. It's like.
(28:37):
Unrelated. Yeah, that transfer that used to
happen is that transfer is gone for Marvel.
Yeah, which is a scanty positionto be in after making a billion
or whatever dollars to still be not sure.
Yeah, right. Time to wrap it up.
Yep. OK, then that's all for this
episode of The Long Take. You can follow us on Facebook,
(28:58):
YouTube, Instagram and Threads at the Long Take Pod.
You can write to us at the Long Take pod@gmail.com.
Please leave us a rating and review the Evolution episode and
we will see you next week. Thanks for listening.
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