Episode Transcript
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SPEAKER_01 (00:00):
Okay, so we've all
kind of grown up with this idea,
haven't we?
That our DNA is well, it's setin stone, like a script written
the day we're born that dictateseverything, how we age, what
diseases we might get.
SPEAKER_00 (00:13):
Exactly.
It felt very deterministic for along time.
You know, this sense that we'rejust passengers watching our
biological story unfold.
SPEAKER_01 (00:19):
Aaron Powell Right.
But what's so incredible andwhat we're diving into today is
that this picture is, well, it'schanging dramatically, isn't it?
SPEAKER_00 (00:28):
It really is.
The fundamental DNA sequence,the letters, they don't change.
But how those letters are read,how they're expressed, that's
remarkably flexible, you knowthe old saying.
SPEAKER_01 (00:38):
The genes load the
gun.
SPEAKER_00 (00:39):
But environment
pulls the trigger or lifestyle
pulls the trigger, and that'swhere the power lies.
SPEAKER_01 (00:43):
And that feeling of
control, that's really the heart
of epigenetics, right?
Epimemeing above the gene.
Precisely.
Think of it like this (00:50):
your DNA
is the computer hardware, fixed,
the epigenome.
That's the software.
It's this layer of chemical tagson top of the DNA.
Software that's constantly beingupdated by well, by life.
SPEAKER_00 (01:02):
You got it.
By the food you eat, how muchyou sleep, how you move, your
stress levels, even youremotions, these things send
signals.
SPEAKER_01 (01:10):
And these signals
add or remove those chemical
tags.
SPEAKER_00 (01:13):
Exactly.
They act like dimmer switches,turning genes up or down, on or
off.
They instruct the hardware howto run.
SPEAKER_01 (01:20):
So our mission for
this deep dive is basically to
understand those instructions.
Because the really big takeawayhere seems to be that our daily
choices aren't just habits,they're actual molecular
messages to our DNA.
That's the core concept.
They are precise communications.
And yeah, they generally fallinto those five big areas diet,
sleep, movement, stress, andemotion.
(01:42):
Let's maybe dig into the how.
What's the main mechanism thesesignals use?
I know DNA methylation comes upa lot.
It sounds complex.
SPEAKER_00 (01:48):
It sounds technical,
but the concept is fairly
straightforward.
Methylation is basicallysticking a tiny chemical cap, a
methyl group, onto a specificspot on the DNA.
SPEAKER_01 (01:57):
Like a sticky note.
SPEAKER_00 (01:58):
Kind of, yeah.
And usually when that methylgroup is stuck on, especially in
certain key areas, it tells thegene nearby to quiet down, to be
silent.
SPEAKER_01 (02:06):
Okay, so it's a
silencer.
How does something like dietinfluence where those sticky
notes go?
SPEAKER_00 (02:11):
Well, diet provides
the actual raw materials for
this whole process.
To make and place those methyltags accurately, your body needs
specific nutrients.
We call them methyl donors.
Things like folate, B vitamins,especially B12 and B6 choline,
betaine.
You find these in leafy greens,legumes, eggs, liver.
SPEAKER_01 (02:31):
So if you don't eat
enough spinach or beans, your
your body physically can't putthe silence tags in the right
places.
SPEAKER_00 (02:36):
It struggles, yeah.
The machinery can't runsmoothly.
It's like trying to writeinstructions without enough ink.
You get faulty gene regulation.
It can't properly silence genesthat maybe should be quiet, like
certain inflammatory ones.
SPEAKER_01 (02:48):
Wow.
Okay.
So eating well isn't justgeneral health.
It's providing the literal toolsfor gene regulation.
What about sleep?
How does that factor inepigenetically?
SPEAKER_00 (02:58):
Sleep is crucial for
repair and maintenance.
When we don't get enough deeprestorative sleep, systems
involved in, say, DNA repair gethindered.
Think about things like theSurtuan proteins.
SPEAKER_01 (03:09):
Yeah, yes, the
longevity genes.
Lack of sleep messes with them.
SPEAKER_00 (03:13):
It does.
Poor sleep sends a strong signalof stress and inflammation.
It basically tells the bodythings aren't safe, we're under
threat.
This can activate pathways likeNFD.
SPEAKER_01 (03:25):
Which is known for
switching on inflammation.
SPEAKER_00 (03:27):
Right, exactly.
So molecularly, losing sleep islike telling your cells to
constantly be on high alert,diverting energy to defense
instead of repair and building.
SPEAKER_01 (03:37):
That makes sense.
And it feels like a naturalbridge to stress and emotion.
These feel psychological, butyou're saying they have tangible
chemical effects on our genes.
How does worrying about adeadline translate to a methyl
group?
SPEAKER_00 (03:49):
Through hormones,
primarily.
The main pathway is the HPAaxis, the hypothalamic pituitary
adrenal axis.
Your brain perceives stress,real or imagined.
SPEAKER_01 (03:58):
Like that deadline
or relationship trouble.
SPEAKER_00 (04:00):
Right.
And it signals the release ofstress hormones, especially
cortisol.
A little bit is fine, helpfuleven, but chronic stress means
sustained high cortisol.
SPEAKER_01 (04:08):
And that constant
cortisol bath does what to the
epigenome?
SPEAKER_00 (04:11):
It acts like a
master controller, shifting
priorities.
It dials down processes relatedto long-term health and dials up
immediate survival responses,often promoting inflammation and
suppressing anti-inflammatorygenes.
The body gets stuck in fight orflight.
SPEAKER_01 (04:27):
So the body
interprets chronic worry the
same way it might interpret, Idon't know, running from a
predator at a molecular level.
SPEAKER_00 (04:34):
Aaron Powell
Essentially, yes.
It's a perceived danger signal.
But the flip side is also true.
Things like mindfulness,meditation, gratitude practices
shown to lower cortisol and calmthe HPA axis, they actually
change gene expression.
SPEAKER_01 (04:49):
Change it how?
SPEAKER_00 (04:50):
Studies have shown
they can quiet down those
pro-inflammatory genes and boostgenes involved in immune
regulation.
So your mindset, your emotionalstate, it really does have
chemical weight.
It instructs the epigenome.
SPEAKER_01 (05:01):
That's quite
profound.
That our thoughts can sendmolecular instructions.
Okay, so if our lifestyle isconstantly sending these
signals, how do we actuallymeasure the result?
Especially in terms of aging.
That's where these effigeneticclocks come in, I gather.
SPEAKER_00 (05:13):
Yes, exactly.
DNA methylation patterns turnout to be one of the best
biomarkers we have forbiological age, how old your
body functionally is, not justhow many birthdays you've had.
SPEAKER_01 (05:22):
How do they work?
Are they looking at methylationeverywhere?
SPEAKER_00 (05:25):
They focus on
specific sites on the DNA called
CPG sites, where methylationlevels predictably change with
age.
Some sites tend to gain methylgroups over time, silencing
genes, while others might losethem.
SPEAKER_01 (05:37):
And scientists
developed algorithms, clocks
like the Horvath clock orGrimmage.
SPEAKER_00 (05:42):
Right.
These clocks analyze themethylation patterns at hundreds
of these specific sites andcalculate a biological age.
And often this biological age isa much better predictor of
health span and lifespan thanyour chronological age.
SPEAKER_01 (05:55):
So I could be 45,
but if I've lived a really
stressful life with poor sleepand diet, your epigenetic clock
might read 55 or even older.
SPEAKER_00 (06:04):
It reflects the
accumulated wear and tear, the
danger signals your body hasreceived.
Okay, that's sobering.
But here's the really criticalquestion: Can we turn back the
clock?
Is this methylation patternfixed once it's laid down, or
can we actually reverse it?
This is where it gets incrediblyexciting.
The answer is yes, we canreverse it.
(06:25):
And not just marginally, we'retalking about significant
measurable reversal.
SPEAKER_01 (06:29):
Really?
So it's not just slowing downaging, but potentially making
ourselves functionally younger.
SPEAKER_00 (06:33):
Aaron Ross Powell
That's what the evidence is
pointing towards.
The body is remarkablyresponsive when given the right
signals.
SPEAKER_01 (06:39):
Is there a specific
study that really demonstrates
this?
Something concrete?
SPEAKER_00 (06:43):
Aaron Powell Yeah.
A really interesting one was theTRIME Trial Thymus Regeneration,
Immunorestoration, and InsulinMitigation published in 2019.
Dr.
Greg Faye led it.
SPEAKER_01 (06:52):
Okay, what did they
do?
SPEAKER_00 (06:53):
They gave
participants a combination of
growth hormone and a couple ofother substances, alongside
lifestyle advice, aiming toregenerate the thymus gland,
which normally shrinkssignificantly with age.
They tracked their biologicalage using several epigenetic
clocks over a year.
SPEAKER_01 (07:09):
And the result.
SPEAKER_00 (07:10):
On average, the
participants reversed their
biological age by about 2.5years over that one year of
intervention.
Their epigenetic clocksliterally wound backwards.
SPEAKER_01 (07:22):
Wow.
Two and a half years youngerbiologically in just one year.
SPEAKER_00 (07:25):
Exactly.
It was a small study, but apowerful proof of concept.
It showed that sendingcoordinated signals of repair
and rejuvenation acrossdifferent systems can make a
measurable difference fairlyquickly.
(07:46):
It suggests the system is highlydynamic, which makes sense if
you think about the biggerpicture.
SPEAKER_01 (07:50):
Which is.
Well, fundamentally, at acellular level, the body is
constantly assessing itsenvironment.
It's asking one basic question:
are we safe or are we in danger? (07:56):
undefined
And our lifestyle choices arethe answer we give it.
SPEAKER_00 (08:05):
Precisely.
If the signals indicate safety,good nutrition, adequate rest,
manageable stress, positivesocial connection, the body
thinks, okay, it's safe toinvest in long-term projects.
SPEAKER_01 (08:16):
Like repairing DNA,
optimizing metabolism, building
strong tissues.
SPEAKER_00 (08:20):
Exactly.
Resources go towards repair,growth, and thriving.
Genes related to longevity andrestoration get prioritized.
SPEAKER_01 (08:27):
But if the signals
are danger, chronic stress, poor
sleep, toxins, nutrientdeficiency.
SPEAKER_00 (08:32):
Then the body shifts
into survival mode.
It thinks we're under attack,forget long-term building, we
need to defend ourselves now.
Resources get diverted toimmediate defense, inflammation
ramps up, and repair processesget put on the back burner.
SPEAKER_01 (08:44):
And that constant
state of perceived crisis that's
accelerated aging.
SPEAKER_00 (08:49):
That's a huge part
of it.
So longevity, from thisepigenetic perspective, is
really the science of signalingsafety to your body
consistently.
SPEAKER_01 (08:56):
It's about
convincing yourselves it's okay
to invest in the future.
SPEAKER_00 (09:00):
You could say that.
By resting properly, nourishingyourself well, moving
appropriately, managing stress,cultivating positive emotions,
you're not just being healthy.
You are actively instructingyour genes to build a longer,
healthier life.
SPEAKER_01 (09:13):
It reframes
self-care as biological
instruction, as a deep form ofcommunication.
SPEAKER_00 (09:19):
It really does.
It puts the power back in ourhands.
SPEAKER_01 (09:22):
So wrapping this up,
the core message seems
incredibly hopeful.
Our story isn't pre-written inour DNA code.
It's being written constantly byhow we live.
Our genes are listening.
SPEAKER_00 (09:33):
They are, listening
to your rhythms, your food, your
stress, even your thoughts,waiting for instructions.
So let's make this actionablefor everyone listening.
The challenge for this week:
choose just one small daily (09:42):
undefined
habit that sends a clear signalof safety and repair.
Could be anything within thosefive pillars.
SPEAKER_01 (09:50):
Right.
Maybe it's taking just twominutes of slow, deep breaths
before you eat each meal to calmthat stress response.
Or maybe adding one extraserving of dark leafy greens to
those methel donors every day.
SPEAKER_00 (10:01):
Or committing to
getting to bed just 30 minutes
earlier to support that crucialrepair time.
Pick one thing.
Do it consistently this week.
And as you do it, maybe reflecton this idea.
Your body is listening, thesesmall acts are instructions.
What if you could actually hearyourselves responding, saying,
Okay, message received, let'sbuild?
That's a powerful thought tocarry forward.
SPEAKER_01 (10:22):
It really is.
The potential is right there inour daily choices.