037 Relationship Fitness: The Philosophy of Fitness Ep. 27

Explore some key components to a thriving relationship with us as we unpack some of the Philosophy Of Fitness! 

04:11 Atomic Habits: An Easy & Proven Way to Build Good Habits & Break Bad Ones by James Clear: Your environment can have a massive affect on your actions. So one way to develop a new healthy habit, is to construct an environment that prompts you to do those things you want to do. 

05:52 Relationship Fitness, how lessons in the gym can be applied to our relationships.

08:09 We are seldom taught, as children, explicit methods for having good relationships.

10:31 Art of Manliness Podcast Ep. on Rites of Passage (don't let the title turn you off, this is a beautiful podcast episode!)

12:23 If you're interested in some really fascinating history of the roles of women in ancient Greece, check out: The Immortality Key: The Secret History of the Religion with No Name by Brian C. Muraresku.

13:03 One reason why young men and boys will act mean or aloof when they are attracted to someone. 

15:49 Intention: With fitness, we have to be intentional about offsetting the perils of modern life. Good relationships don't necessarily take "work", but they do take intentional practice and presence. 

22:48 Watch the opening credits to "F is for Family" as a great analogy to what we're talking about in losing intention.

26:47 Relationships, like fitness, can deteriorate out of a lack of consistent, intentional practice. Just like you don't mean to get out of shape, it just happens, so too can our relationships get deconditioned when left to unintentional whims. 

28:41 We are all changing all the time. Don't fall into the trap of assumptions about yourself, your partner, and your relationship. 

29:18 Entering into a relationship can be seen as an implicit contract. You are now responsible for considering someone else besides yourself. 

30:04 Just like being genetically predisposed to accel at a certain sport, compatibility can reduce the friction (work needed) in your relationship. 

39:27 If you're seeking compatibility, work on yourself and becoming the type of person who will be attractive to what you want.

48:45 Progre

Couples - Proven Fitness & Intimacy Practices To Achieve Your Health and Relationship Goals Together!
To learn more or book a brainstorming call, visit HowToFitTogether.com

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Tali (00:18):
Tali Zabari, and you're listening to the Philosophy of
Fitness podcast on the

Cody (00:22):
live All Your Life Network.
Hi honey.
Hey, baby.

Tali (00:44):
So today's icebreaker, I can't believe I just started a
sentence with, so, oh, I thoughtI was getting better at that I
guess not.
My icebreaker for today is whatis your favorite part about our
new setup?
Oh, man.
I don't know if people who arewatching this could even tell,
but for us, this is huge.

Cody (01:02):
I think so.
So we did have a work table inhere and the work table was six
feet long, which is kind ofgreat for one person, but two
people working side by side.
It's a little crampy.
It was crampy especially cuz weboth have two monitor setups and
or potentially and So yeah.
This is so great.
My favorite part is that you'reasking a favorite Sorry,

Tali (01:26):
I should know better.

Cody (01:27):
I like that it's black.
It's on theme.
So if you're watching this onYouTube, you can see

Tali (01:31):
that it's kind of not on theme though, because the theme
of this room is supposed to beStar Trek.
Yes.
And Star Trek's a lot of white.

Cody (01:38):
It is a lot of cream colors and whites gray probably
for filming futuristic.
But this is futuristic.
I think it

Tali (01:44):
looks great.
It's a hell of a lot morefuturistic than it was in here.
Yes, It's amazing what this roomlooked like before.
Gosh.
Oh man.
There was so much crop in here.

Cody (01:54):
Yeah.
This will not be in the shownotes cuz I just don't wanna dig
for pictures and put'em upsomewhere.
But I didn't even think we have'em.
It was so embarrassing.
At some point we'll show somebefore and after pictures.
Yeah.
Okay.
It's, it's quite a step up.
Yeah.
It's

Tali (02:06):
a little scary over in that corner, but it's off camera
so it's all good.

Cody (02:09):
Yeah.
So if you're li a longtimelistener of the Live All Your
Life podcast, we are now onYouTube.
Has a one episode a go.
Yeah.
And then we've upgraded ourstudio.
So I think it looks a littlebetter.
And here we are.

Tali (02:25):
Yes.
And my favorite part I think isso far having room for
everything.
Mm-hmm.
Cause I like to have a candleand my inspirational quote from
my mom, and my lotion and mydiffuser.
Diffuser.
Diffuser.
Yeah.
And your pins I want all that atmy fingertips.

(02:45):
And it feels like I have roomfor everything.
And things are also like tuckingaway.
Yes.
Nicely.
And we don't have the chairsyet.
I know that's coming, but.
it makes me really excited aboutwriting again.
Mm-hmm.
I haven't written a damn thingin a year at least.
Yeah.
And so this feels like a veryconducive setup for long

(03:07):
stretches of work.
Yes, absolutely.
And it's been a really long timesince it's felt that way.
You know, since we lived in ourapartment in Portland, I had my
own desk set up.
Mm-hmm.
And then you ran side by shovedyour desk in there somehow that
room was so cramped too.
Yeah.
But it wasn't reallycomfortable.
My desk was a, an antique vanityand it was like all the wrong

(03:31):
proportions and I think I justhad a regular chair and it, like
I said, it was not conducive togreat creative work.
However, the window and the viewout that window was spectacular.
Mm-hmm.
this will be in the daytime.
Yes.
I think.
Yeah.
Anyway, so it's just feelingvery organized.

(03:52):
It's important to me to alwayshave space for all my things but
not feel overrun with crap.

Cody (03:58):
Yeah.
So right here on the icebreaker,I think we have something of
value to bring, which is if youread Atomic Habits by James
Clear, he talks about how ourenvironment affects our habitual
nature and that we sort of dothings on autopilot.
Sometimes based on theenvironment that we're used to.
So like a, an example of a badhabit is a lot of people get

(04:21):
used to snacking in front of thetv and then it's almost like
they have to snack when they'rein front of the TV cuz they feel
weird sitting and watching atelevision show without putting
something in their mouth.
what am I supposed to do with myhands?
Yeah.
It becomes this weird likeconnection that your brain makes
between, okay, we're doing this,which means we are also doing
this other thing.
And so he talks about havingspecific spaces in your house

(04:42):
that you associate with thethings that you want to do.
So you have like a particularchair that you sit in that your
guitar is next to and that'syour guitar chair.
And that's what you do when yousit there.
And this is definitely acreative workspace for us.
I think it's

Tali (04:59):
uh, Well we really wanted a room dedicated to that.
Yeah.
And I actually love doing mywork from bed and we have a bed
in our office for that reason.
But the view out of our windowsis so gorgeous and the light in
our room is so gorgeous.
Mm-hmm.
So I might not be supercutthroat on those

Cody (05:18):
rules.
I know you aren't cuz you're allover the place.
Yeah.

Tali (05:22):
And that's why you like me, part of your

Cody (05:23):
nature.
Adorably.
A D D A D D.

Tali (05:28):
Okay.
Do you wanna introduce today'stopic since Yeah.
We actually have shared notesthis time around and I think
it's because this topic requiresa little bit of exploring
mm-hmm.
and there are some major themes,but I hope it's more anecdotal
the deeper we

Cody (05:45):
get.
Yeah.
We're wing it

Tali (05:48):
winging it.
Oh, okay.
You're saying it with a twang.
Got it.
Yeah.

Cody (05:52):
So we're we're talking today about the parallels
between lessons learned in the.
AKA fitness and relationshipsand how you can apply certain
principles that we practice inthe gym or in fitness in
general, and how that can carryover to principles that are
applied into relationships forthe benefit.

(06:13):
In positive ways.
In positive ways, yeah.
For the benefit.
So these are big, broadconcepts.
Sometimes I feel like in, inphilosophy, one of the things
that's fun is to try to findparallels and examples where
principles carry over from onearea of life to another.

(06:33):
And I think sometimes whenthat's fun, it's easy to feel
like you're reaching a littlebit.
And so with this particularepisode, I feel like I'm just
sort of had to seek parallels,whereas previous episodes and
topics that we've talked about,it's like glaring in your face,
uhhuh, like, oh, this principlethat I'm learning in the gym, I
can really apply to otherthings.
And in this one, I feel like.

(06:54):
The things that I came up withare a little bit more like
analogies of like, oh, we dothis in the gym, and so we can
kind of use that as an exampleof how we carry ourselves in
other areas of life.

Tali (07:06):
Well, I think I can speak to the reasoning behind that.
I was just gonna preface thiswhole topic by saying, you know,
we are not relationship expertsone, but two, I know personally
in my early life, I've neverbeen taught about healthy
relationships explicitly.
You know, we absorb so much ofwhat we see and very rarely, you

(07:29):
know, our parents stopping intheir tracks and being like,
Hey, kids, don't follow thatexample.
That's actually something thatyou should not do.
Yeah.
You know, so much just getsswept under the rug or the norms
that we see in relationships.
Mm-hmm.
we don't realize are like reallydysfunctional until much later
and or until we re experiencethem ourselves.
And so, you know, that's thesame.

(07:53):
with the gym too.
There's a lot of dysfunction inthe athletic world when it comes
to mindset around gyms like bodydysmorphia and like not wanting
to be training around otherpeople and embarrassment, like
all sorts of dark stuff.
But just wanted to speak to thenature of like why this topic

(08:13):
felt elusive.
And I think that that's becausewe're also not taught about
relationships mm-hmm.
in a concrete way.
Yeah.
That until you seek it outyourself.

Cody (08:23):
No, that's a good point.
There's many things that I feellike our culture does not
intentionally teach, teachchildren as they're growing up.
It's like there are examples tofollow and there's sort of like
a zeitgeist or a a, you know, atheme in a culture or in that
kid's environment, but they'renot explicitly taught.

(08:43):
certain things and relationshipsis definitely part of, part of
the top of that.
There's some interesting folksout there who write about rights
of passage and how a lot ofancient cultures, there was very
distinct rights of passage.
Mm-hmm.
and sort of like a, a barmitzvah.
Yeah.
Being an example.
But some cultures had manyrights of passages like, you

(09:04):
know, there's sort of like fromchildhood to adulthood, and then
there's like adulthood to afamily and family to does a, a
leader in the community and doesa kindergarten graduation count?
Yes.
See, that doesn't, that's theproblem is There's, it's like we
have a lot of rituals in oursociety, but the rituals
themselves are sort ofmeaningless.
Can I just say

Tali (09:23):
something hilarious that I saw on Instagram today?
It was a reel of someone who hadposted that traditions are just
pure pressure from dead people.
I thought that was so funny.

Cody (09:37):
That's good.
But sometimes those rights ofpassage had a lot of weight and
meaning to'em because they wereopportunities for elders to
teach younger people about theculture and about expectations
or about ways of conductingyourself that are gonna be
productive for you and helpfulas an individual.

Tali (09:57):
Well, a lot of them, like at least with the Bar Mitzvah,
it requires many, many months ofstudying.
Mm-hmm.
and for lots of Jewish people inthe States, for instance you
know, our bar mitzvah and don'tspeak Hebrew, so like they're
having to learn a language inthe process.
And so there's quite a largeinvestment on the student side

(10:17):
as well.
Mm-hmm.
and, you know, they're readingin front of their community.
It's a very big deal.
Yeah.
Yeah.
It's not just being like,congrats, you are now of age to
go to elementary school.
It's.
It's quite different.

Cody (10:31):
Yeah, I, I heard a really cool podcast I will link to in
the show notes of the podcast iscalled The Art of Manliness.
It's been been around for a longtime cuz he was a blogger before
podcasts took off.
So this guy's been around, Ifor, I'm apologize, I'm
forgetting his name at themoment, but I will put it in the
description of the show.
So

Tali (10:50):
how bet it comes to you at some point while we're
recording.

Cody (10:53):
But he is interviewing a a person.
I think he wrote a book aboutit, but he led his son and then
later his daughter throughcertain rights of passages.
And it was a really cool thingbecause it was like they would
go for like, A week of just thefather and son.
They would go somewhere for likea week, they'd go to a beach
house or something like that andhe would just impart like life

(11:15):
lessons that you should knowentering this next chapter of
your life kind of thing.
And prepared him and, and lateron when he was older it was like
some grueling tests like goingout in the camping in the woods
or something and they'd have tomake a fire, you know, like all
these kind things.
Do you remember that

Tali (11:32):
episode of Orange is a New Black where Oh gosh, whoever
that like super cool, likesouthern lady is.
She was kind of backwards andher dad like left her in the
woods by herself and yeah, thatwas really extreme, like timed
her to see how long she couldtake her to get home.
Yeah.
Yeah.
That kind of reminds me

Cody (11:49):
of that.
Yeah.
But I think there's a lot ofthat that's lost in this culture
and sometimes it's just simplethings like how to have better
communication skills with yourspouse.
It was lost in our culturethrough generations.
Do you think that that was evera thing?
Well, you know, I, if youbelieve everything you see on

(12:09):
tv, it's like you go back toVictorian age and it's like
women were property.
And it's a situation where it isa very top down authoritative.

Tali (12:18):
Well, and I'm sure they did authoritarian teach you that
like, you know, you're gonnagrow up one day to be some men's
prize.

Cody (12:23):
Yeah.
But if you go back far enough inhistory, you know, if you go
back to the Licia and things in,in ancient ly Greece ly Yeah,
the ly.
Oh.
And if you go back to like theancient Greeks before the Romans
got there, it was not aspatriarchal in ancient times as

(12:44):
it was later on.
You know, the, the highpriestesses, for instance, that
ran the religions.
They were women who wereimparting a lot of the teaching
of their spiritual traditionsand things like that.
So before the Romans came in andkind of made it the patriarchal
thing and started burningwitches, et cetera,

Tali (13:03):
Yeah, I, so I did see something the other day also
online.
It was something about like, weshould not be teaching our girls
that it's okay that a boy ismean to you when he likes you.
And I think that that's such aninteresting thing to think about
because I've had many boys bemean to me, and I've always felt

(13:26):
like, I've always thought like,oh, he must like me, or I've
actually like been in thatsituation where that was
actually proven to be true.
Mm-hmm.
I don't fucking understand wherethat comes from.
Well,

Cody (13:37):
I can tell you Okay.
That, well, I can't tell you inall cases at all times, but I'm
just saying as a general rule, Ithink the reason, especially why
young men fall into that trap isbecause they're shamed and
embarrassed.
They're not.
Again, this kind of goes back toour teaching from, from our
quote unquote elders.
They're teased and ridiculed.

(13:59):
Oh, you go to puppy love, you'recrushed.
You know?
And embarrass the kidrelentlessly.
So of course when he has thosefeelings come up, it's more
macho and like saves face andsaves him from embarrassment.
If he

Tali (14:12):
embarrasses a girl pushes well

Cody (14:15):
just dish it out sort of pushes you away.
Like, no, I'm not thatinterested.
You know, like he's being, he'swanting her to chase him because
he doesn't want to.
The shame that's coming withbeing teased as a young boy.
Sure.
And especially when you're ingrade school or junior high,
like everything is fuckingembarrassing anyway.

(14:36):
So it's true to be ridiculed byyour parents or, or teachers for
having a crush on a girl, likeyou're gonna try to like play it
off as if, no, I don't really.
Yeah.
But

Tali (14:48):
man, that can spiral so hard.
Like if you think about cases ofabuse mm-hmm.
For people to equate that withlove.
Absolutely.
Like an act of love.
I hear what you're saying.
It totally traces back to, Imean, that's, I guess I bring
that up because that's the onlything that I've seen explicitly
said on the internet.
Mm-hmm.
as of late, that would speak toteaching children about

(15:12):
healthier boundaries aroundrelationships.

Cody (15:15):
Well, absolutely.
I agree with the boundary aspectof that, but I'm just saying y
it's to say that boys or men areinherently that way and they're,
and those types of people shouldjust be avoided, is missing the
root causes.

Tali (15:30):
Right?
Well, like along with thatshould be let's

Cody (15:32):
stop, let's stop shaming kids.
Let's stop shaming kids forhaving feelings, emotions, and
desires.
Yeah.
Let's talk to them as if they'refucking humans and allow them to
explore those things withoutshame and ridicule and being
made fun of.
Yeah.
And then you probably havebetter behavior.

Tali (15:48):
I agree.
So yeah, there's definitely theflip side.
It's like, that's what we shouldbe teaching our girls, but what
should we be teaching our boystoo?
Exactly.

Cody (15:55):
Exactly.
Yeah.

Tali (15:56):
Okay, so to fitness, what's the first point?
Intention?
Well,

Cody (16:01):
I think I, I think intention goes hand in hand with
what we're talking about becausewe're not taught really how to
have healthy relationships in ain an objective, intentional
way.
We're only modeled and thosemodels are what we see on TV as
kids, you know?
Yes.
They're not experienced,

Tali (16:19):
they're just seen.
Yeah.

Cody (16:20):
They're, you get your parents as an example, you get
glimpses into like other, asparents when you go for an, you
know, stay the night at theirhouse or something

Tali (16:30):
when, when you're a kid, you don't have a lot of choice
over that exposure.

Cody (16:34):
Right.
And so I think that carries overa little bit to intention, but
when I first wrote the, thenote.
For intention.
I was talking about ourintention in our relationship.
So in fitness, we live in aculture most people where they
don't get a lot of physicalactivity, and even if they do
get physical activity in a job,a lot of it's repetitive.

(16:57):
Mm-hmm.
And so you're, you know, loadinga truck every day or something
and it's back, back breakingwork.
It's not helping you be fit init, you know, fit.
It's just breaking you downMm-hmm.
So in our culture, in our modernsociety, fitness has to be a
very intentional thing.
We have to actually look, okay,what did, what do I need to
balance out the other aspects ofmy lifestyle?

(17:17):
Yeah.
Because sitting on the couch isdeath.
So what's the opposite of that?
Like, I need to get out and Ineed to move and I need to lift
weight and I need to take careof myself.
And so there's an intentionthat's involved in order to just
be healthy.
And I think that we also tend tohave, because we don't have
explicit.
Instruction on how to havehealthy relationships.

(17:40):
What's often modeled for us issort of a set it and forget it
thing.
Like, oh, we were so in love, wehad this amazing courtship, and
we were engaged and we gotmarried.
End of story.
Mm-hmm.
And it's like, what?
Well, what about after that?
You know?
And there's no in, there's aloss of intention around the
relationship.
And so we see that wither anddie eventually.

(18:01):
And we see the cliche seven yearitch, you know, and after you're
together for seven years, youjust kind of start to get sick
of each other or, or at leastapathetic.
Or people who are married for 20or 30 years and they kind of
were just like roommates, youknow, and that kind of
situation.
Yeah.
And I wholeheartedly believe alot of that is just because of a

(18:22):
lack of intention around therelationship.
They felt like, Early spark intheir love was enough to just
carry'em through their life and

Tali (18:31):
or that it's just a phase that you'll only experience that
kind of heightened state ofbeing in the beginning and it's
not possible Yeah.
To stretch that out or revive itor whatever.
Like, that's just what thebeginning phase of a
relationship looks like.
Yeah.
Like we've talked about whenyou're learning a new skill and
there's like this huge wave orwhat did I ruin something?

(18:53):
Yeah.
Just
pause

Cody (18:54):
talking for a second.
Oh,

Tali (18:57):
did I turn it off?
No, no.
But it bumped.
I just, oh.
There's this huge like,exponential curve right at the
beginning of how much you'relearning and able to progress,
and then things really taperoff.
Mm-hmm.
However, there's still at leastlike thinking of weightlifting.

(19:18):
Like the programs areperiodized, they're still meant
to.
Strive for more, lift more.
Mm-hmm.
And you have to get a little bitmore creative once you've gotten
to that point.
And I would say that that's thesame in relationships too.

Cody (19:30):
Yeah.
That's a actually a really goodanalogy.
It's not even in the notes, butit relates to the in

Tali (19:35):
there are no notes, of course.
It's not in the notes

Cody (19:37):
and in in relates to the intention aspect.
But you're also talking abouttaking that intention and using
an assessment tool to see are westill thriving?
Yes.
And if you're not, you have tochange something.
Something has to change us.
You can't just keep doing thesame shit and expect things to
magically turn around.

(19:57):
You're not gonna wake up onemorning and be like, oh, the
spark is back.
You know, you, it takesintention.
And I hear in you here, andwe've talked about this before,
that people are like, well,relationships take work.
You gotta work on it.
It's work, work, work.
And it's like, hmm, i, I likeintention better, cuz it doesn't
have to be a grueling, slog,painful thing.

(20:19):
all the time.
Uhhuh, painful things come up.
That's, that's just life.
That's not relationships.
That's like being a human

Tali (20:24):
being.
Well, the intention, just likewith training, prepares you for
those challenging moments,right?
Yeah.
Because you're practicing yourcommunication, your dedication
to the relationship, yourcommitment, your quality time
together, knowing each other.
And it's the same with training.
Like we're training inweightlifting for competition.

(20:46):
You know, we're not, I mean, theBulgarian do it a little bit
differently, but we're not likemaxing out every day.
We're not pushing ourselves tothat difficult threshold every
day.
Mm-hmm.
But we're training consistentlyenough so that when that day
does come, we'll be able tohandle it and do it well.
Yeah.
Yeah.
And I would say that that's thesame in relationships too.
You know, if you are notwatering it, if you're not

(21:08):
giving it light, if you're notsupporting it regularly, are you

Cody (21:12):
mixing your analogies?

Tali (21:14):
perhaps?
I'm trying to think of thingsoutside of the gym world too.
Yes.
Especially, you know, in realmsthat I'm not great in, but plant
care.

Cody (21:23):
Yeah.

Tali (21:26):
don't count on me for that.
But yeah, if you aren't presentwith your partner or
intentionally moving throughyour relationship, both of you
doing it mm-hmm.
when really challenging thingsdo come up, I really do think
that it would set you up toreally fall short.
And I can only really speak tothat f you know, the

(21:48):
relationships that I'm thinkingof that did not end well.
It's hard because the first one,like we were so, so young, and
then the one just before you wasso, so short.
Mm-hmm.
and I don't feel like I got toknow him at all between, from
when I met him to when we brokeup a year later.

(22:08):
And so can you speak to thatfrom many of your.
past relationships in terms oflike setting that intention or
not and how that like, yeah, Imean how, like competition day
or like when something reallyhit the fan, like how that might
have fed in, like, I'm curiousif there's really, this is
theoretical.

Cody (22:26):
Yeah.
Well, like at this point, it,it's, I think we'll take it out
of the competition world for aminute and just talk about
general fitness, because I thinkthat's a little more applicable
to how I see relationshipsdeteriorate.
Okay.
Which is, I was married for 20years.
I was together with her for over20 years.
And I, I, the whole idea of setit and forget it was not an

(22:51):
intentional thought.
Like that wasn't a consciousthought that like, oh, we're
married and everything's gonnabe fine now, you know, that was
never a, a, a conscious thought.
But what happens is a lot oftimes you have kids, you have
job, you have money struggles,you know, financial.
Hurdles too, overcome sometimesphysical things and illness and

(23:12):
life comes at you.
You know, it's kind of like theopening credits to f is for
family That shows hilarious thefirst few seasons especially.
But if you watch the openingcredits, it's like this kid, and
he's like, he floats full, fullof hopes and he is like, yeah.
Floating through the sky andthen all of a sudden a draft

(23:33):
notice hits his face and then heis like wearing a uniform and
then he starts to lose his hair.
And it's like, and then heplunks down in this chair and he
is just like, what, what thefuck happened?
Kind of look on his face.
And that, that really sums upthe American life for a lot of
people.
Mm-hmm.
you know, you get really caughtup in the responsibilities of
being.

(23:53):
A husband and a father and abreadwinner and blah, blah,
blah.
And same for the wife or otherhusband or whoever is different
kind of struggle.
Yeah.
Yeah.
There's all kinds ofrelationship structures, but I
think the struggles can be verycommonly felt in raising a
family particularly.
And sometimes there's not moneyfor date nights and there's more

(24:16):
stress than there is time on thecalendar.
And so that lack of intentionwasn't out of just carelessness,
it was because it wasn't broughtto our attention that you also
need to work on therelationship.
I said that word work, but youalso need to be intentional with
that relationship and not be,you know, for me, I was like

(24:39):
really caught up in my businesspursuits, like really caught up
in it.
And you see this cliche on TVwhere it's like the rich guy
who's caught up, I was fuckingbroke and really caught up in my
business.
Like I feel, I felt like, man,if I could just get ahead
financially, the rest of ourlife would probably be a lot
better.
And so it
could

Tali (24:55):
be worse.
You could be Nie Thompson.
Yeah.

Cody (24:58):
So, so I think that lack of intention is just part of a,
in our culture, just part of ourlifestyle of like trying to make
it in Well it's

Tali (25:06):
the norm.
Yeah.
Right.
Like to have all those things.
And I feel like a lot of folksnowadays, like whether it's
purely financial or not, arereally challenging those norms
of family planning.
Mm-hmm.
you know, like I would neverhave considered having kids with
you seriously if we weren'tliving out here.

(25:28):
you know, if we were living backin Portland and like nine to
Fiveing and Yeah.
Doing that whole dance.
Yeah.
Different stories.
Well, we've talked about thatbefore.
Like we live somewhere now whereI feel like we're closer to
family.
We live in a beautiful placewith space and opportunity.
Mm-hmm.
that we just didn't have livingin Portland.

(25:48):
You know, like I would make mychoices off of those things
because I have certain values ora desire for my life with a
family to look a certain way.
Mm-hmm.
and I don't really care to moveforward with it if that's
compromised.
Yeah.

Cody (26:05):
Like being able to spend time together, Yeah.
A lot of people.
Absolutely.
Yeah.

Tali (26:09):
And the, for a lot of people, that's not a given.
Yeah.
You know, I know my mom hastalked about having a lot of
regret for being a workaholic,but.
what else could she have done,you know?
Mm-hmm.
I really have a lot of respectfor her, and a lot of times when
she brings up feeling guiltyabout it, I'm like, lady, don't

(26:31):
even worry about it.
you know, our quality timetogether now is so amazing and I
feel like I had a really greatchildhood regardless of the
challenges that my family had.
Mm-hmm.
because they told me they lovedme all the time.
like that was the most importantthing to hear.
Yeah.
Yeah.

Cody (26:47):
Well, the reason I took it out of competition is, I think,
getting back to your analogy isthat it's very analogous to
being deconditioned.
You know, you get caught up inwork life and trying to squeeze
in some recreation or something,so you don't go crazy because
you're just like stressed outabout finances and trying to
raise kids and like all the, allthe pressures that come with

(27:09):
that.
Mm-hmm.
and you get deconditioned in therelationship the same way people
do with fitness.
They don't intend to get out ofshape and broken down and
overweight and all theseproblems that plague our

Tali (27:21):
society.
Yeah, there's backsliding andthen even the intention
threshold

Cody (27:25):
really changes.
Yeah.
I mean, how many athletes haveyou met who are like in their
forties or fifties and they'relike overweight and kind of
broke down and outta shape andthey're struggling.
But in high school, man or incollege, they were amazing.
And it's like, well, it'sbecause they got outta that
sport and they got married andhad kids in like a life.
Put it on the shelf.
Yeah.
They put all the, excuse me, allthe training and everything on
the shelf, and they're stilleating the calories of an

(27:48):
athlete, but they're not working'em off.
And then that just kind ofspirals into like pizza night
every Friday for the kids.
That, that was my life.
You know, we had

Tali (27:56):
like, spaghetti night sounded pretty epic.

Cody (27:58):
Yeah.
We had, yeah, we did.
We had spaghetti night, we hadtaco night.
We had we do taco night now.
Yeah.
But we weren't healthier tacoslike.
I dunno.
There was a lot of tortilla anda lot of chips and a lot of
cheese and Yeah.
And that was normal.
That was just like, that's howwe get through the week.
We can look forward to PizzaFriday.
And watching a couple of moviesthat we got from the, from

(28:21):
Blockbuster.

Tali (28:22):
My family or my mom, my sister and I, we did pizza
parties every while.
Every once in a while that'swhat we called them and we would
put a tablecloth on the floorand we would have like a picnic
in our television room.
Nice.
Yeah.
Cuz we were not allowed to eatin front of the television, so
it always felt like reallyspecial.
That's a good habit.
Mm-hmm.
Yeah.
It was fun.

Cody (28:39):
Yeah.
So intention, that's a big deal.
And I think that really goesover to another note I had,
which is just that you'rechanging over time.
Okay.
And if you're not intentional,I'm paying attention.
If you're not paying attention,we are all changing over time.
Change is the only thing thatjust never leaves us.

(29:01):
Right.

Tali (29:02):
What did you say you're.
Thriving or perishing.

Cody (29:04):
Yeah.
And if you're not payingattention to your own personal
changes and your partner'schanges you can kind of wake up
one day, 10 years down the roadand not know each other very
well.
Yeah.
We see that, you know, quite abit and well, and that's

Tali (29:18):
a responsibility I think people need to consider too,
when they're entering arelationship.
You are, you are signing up tobe in that relationship.
You know, it's not about justlike attaching yourself to
somebody for financial gain orvalidation or like, whatever the
fuck, like, you are actuallykind of like signing a contract
in a way of like, I'm not onlyresponsible for myself, but I

(29:39):
also have accountability tosomebody else too.
Mm-hmm.
to me that sounds like baselineyou know?
It really does.
And I think it kind of circlesback to what you were saying
about relationships being work.
You wanna write on that?
I, I'm talking about it rightnow.
Okay.
About relationships being work.

(30:00):
and there's this kind of badgeof honor around that.
And I know I was someone whofelt that way, like in
relationships previous to hourswhere I was like, oh man, this
is so much work.
Like this must be it Like thismust be, this must be

Cody (30:14):
worth it cuz I'm working
all

Tali (30:15):
yes.
Yeah.
Working my ass off.
And it's And it was verydifferent when I met you and I'm
not sure if I'm gonna equate itto like a low barrier to entry
sort of situation.
I'm trying to think like howthis translates to fitness
somehow.
But you were like, relationshipsdon't have to be hard.
Mm-hmm.
they can be easy.
I guess that goes intocompatibility.

(30:35):
Yeah.
But that can wait if you wannaNo, I think

Cody (30:38):
that's, no that, I think that's a perfect entryway into
that idea that you.
are born with a certain type ofbody and that's just truth.
We all have genetics thatpredispose us to probably being
able to do certain activitiesmore efficiently than other
people.
Some people are better runnersbecause of their genetics than

(31:01):
other people who may be betterweightlifters because of their
genetics.
That doesn't mean it doesn'ttake work.
You have to like be intentional.
You have to do the training, youhave to eat properly, get sleep,
et cetera, et cetera.
Mm-hmm.
but it, there's no denying thatpeople of certain height and
stature or whatever are going tohave an advantage in certain
sports.
Yes.
Over someone else.

(31:22):
Yes.
That's just not.
an arguable point.
And

Tali (31:25):
it's, well, it's not to say that you can't excel in a
sport that maybe you're notquote unquote built for, but
there are going to be, you know,if you aren't a competitive
sport, you are gonna bump upagainst people who are more
genetically inclined to dobetter than you.

Cody (31:39):
Yeah.
And I think it's true in whatyou were just talking about with
us is that we, we got reallylucky finding each other because
when I, it was one of our veryfirst dates that we went on, I
was like, you know, it couldjust be easy.
Like, it doesn't have to be astruggle.
And in my mind, I was justthinking all it would take is
for the other person to be aseasygoing as I am, Like I, I

(32:04):
don't want to be upset aboutshit all the time and be drama
driven and, you know, I, Iwanted that lifestyle for
myself.
And at the time I was sort oflike thinking I would just be
arms distance from people.
And maybe ha be polyamorous orsomething and have like
different, different ladies fordifferent occasions.

(32:26):
Harem.
Yeah.
Well a culture of people that,that I didn't have to work so
hard to like, make it work.
You know?
Like if I wanna watch a sillymovie with somebody, but I could
talk philosophy with somebodyelse because I don't want to
have to fight to put that, likethat round peg in a square hole.

Tali (32:44):
Yes.
And we talked about it, wephrased it as like having a
reduction of friction Yes.
In relationships.
Yeah.
Because in my experience, itfelt like there was always
things just like coming to astandstill or a screeching halt
or some big like bump in theroad that was like so hard to
get over.
And it was just like, all right,when's the next one gonna show

(33:04):
up?
Yeah.

Cody (33:06):
But with you, when we met, I felt like everything.
Easy.
Like I kept testing the watersof like different aspects.
You know, we, we went on amotorcycle date and that was
great and we ate good food andthat was great.
And we had a beer and that wasgreat.
And we went to a fancy Italianrestaurant and that was great
and jazz.
And we talked about deep thingsand we joked around and we made
each other laugh and it's like,wow, this, all these different

(33:28):
things.
I was like, easy with thisperson, so why can't it just be
easy?
But I think it just speaks toour compatibility.
Yes.
You know, it's like we're builtfor this sport.
Yes.
No

Tali (33:38):
worries.
Yeah.
You and I have a lot of commoninterests and I think just
operate very similarly in theworld and that goes down to very
similar fears and insecuritiestoo.
So I think not having barriersin communicating those things
mm-hmm.

(33:58):
or when they come up, likethere's a lot of compassion for
one another cuz we understandthose themes really well.
And.
You know, I think that there'sjust this desire to have forward
motion and to be inrelationships that have a lot of
friction or a high barrier toentry, I guess.
You know, those might requirereassessing.
And in the fitness world, youknow, when I was a young person,

(34:20):
I, I swam, I played volleyball.
These are sports for very tall,lanky people.
I didn't do very well.
Like, I'd love to swim, but I, Iprobably wouldn't have done very
well.
Mm-hmm.
a competitive realm.
You might

Cody (34:35):
tell our listener how tall you

Tali (34:37):
are.
I'm five one on a good day ifshe stretches.
Yeah.
I've got very short limbs.
And only once I foundweightlifting, not only did I
love it, but it was like, ohwow.
Like I can do this.
Well, it took until I was like,I don't know, 19, 20 years old

(34:58):
to find that.
And I know we've talked about itbefore on another podcast, but
you know, there was a whilewhere I really wanted to be like
a sports consultant for people.
And the way that I imagined whatthat job would be like is to
have some sort of fitnessassessment and help people find

(35:18):
like what sport they might dowell in just based on their
physical makeup.
Of course, like temperament andinterest is really important
too.
Yeah.
Like, well, it's part of somepeople who really love, like
yoga for the like kind of woowootake it easy kind of part of it.

(35:38):
The official side of it.
I mean, yeah.
I mean, not all yogas arecreated equal.
Right?
Or not all yoga is createdequal.
Sorry.
It's like a dear dears thing.
but I don't know.
It never spoke to me becauselike I wanna rage in the gym and
I wanna feel like reallyhardcore.
And weightlifting gave me thattoo.
So not only was it great for thetype of body that I have, but it

(35:59):
also spoke to my interests andthe way that I wanted to feel.
And so I think that it could bea really valuable service.
Obviously it would have to bebuilt from scratch.
I've never heard of anythinglike it.
It would be so cool if that didexist already.
Mm-hmm.
means there's demand for it.
Mm-hmm.
didn't you just post somethingthat said that?
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Cody (36:19):
It was basically, don't get upset when you see the
things that you're trying tocreate out in the world already,
because that's not a reason foryou to stop.
It's actually proof that there'smarket Yes.
Market for

Tali (36:30):
it, which is nice that someone else carved it out for
you, I guess.
Yeah.
Yeah.
So compatibility, you know, thatcould be something to take in
consideration when it comes toyour athletic pursuits as well.
Like we talk about this with ourclients, like, what can you do
that's just gonna keep theneedle moving?
Mm-hmm.
in the right direction.
Like, don't try to be a runnerif you fucking hate it.

(36:52):
Right.
You know you're gonna fight itevery time that you put shoes
on.
Yeah.
You know, or even before you putyour shoes on, do something
that's exciting to you.
Mm-hmm.
that's easy to work in, youknow, allow that love to grow.

Cody (37:06):
Yeah.
I've been a coach now for 19years.
Whoa.
Crazy.
But I, well for a little whilethere was like drinking the
CrossFit Kool-Aid prettyhardcore.
And so, you know, part of it'sjust, cuz that was our business
model.
So it's like, well if you don'twanna do CrossFit, you probably
not gonna fit in here.
But I also sort of got to thismindset because I.

(37:29):
Was so appreciative of themethodology that I was
constantly trying to just tuckpeople into it.
And now in my coaching life andmy coaching career, I am
currently coaching a handful ofpeople.
And no, two of them are trainingsimilarly.
Like really they're all trainingpretty differently from each

(37:50):
other.
Different completely differentstyles of training, right?
So I think that compatibility isreally important because it, it
reduces that friction, first ofall, for the per person to be
compliant to actually do workthat's gonna benefit them in
their.

Tali (38:08):
in their health pursuits, but how many clients have we
tricked into CrossFit?
Who didn't even know they weredoing it?
I would say all of my personaltrading clients.
Yeah.
With the exception of the onethat I have right now.
Yeah.

Cody (38:18):
Well, and sometimes for conditioning, and I'll sneak in
a little bit in, in somepeople's workouts, but not
everybody.
Well,

Tali (38:24):
CrossFit of course, is like a lifestyle and a culture
and all these other things, butwhen you're talking about the
movement specifically, or thestructures of the workouts, like
I squish that stuff in all thetime, even if it's like quote
unquote irrelevant because, youknow, I don't coach CrossFit
anymore, but like I still drinkthat Kool-Aid in terms of anyone

(38:44):
can do it.
Maybe not anyone.
Everyone can do it to the samedegree.
You know, we've bumped intoclients who are probably doing
what?
Just a bump.
Oh, new setup.
Sorry.
We have run into clients beforewho either are like so
deconditioned or.
I think about like a coupleclients who are more like

(39:07):
challenged in their posture tosuch a degree that their
movement patterns cannot be goodat this point in time.
Mm-hmm.
And that maybe this isn't theright avenue, but that's such a
small number of folks whohaven't benefited from it that
I've worked with personally.
Mm-hmm.

Cody (39:25):
Oh, yeah.
Yeah.
Getting back to the relationshipanalogy, I think that there's
something to be said for you,you and I just, not just finding
each other in a compatibilityway, but we are also at the
height of our personaldevelopment as individuals when
we found each other.
Yeah.
So I think that speaks to alittle bit of what you're

(39:45):
talking about too, as far aslike, you, you can't just enter.
An arena of fitness or athleticpursuit or whatever at a, at a
level you want if you're notthere.
And so you might have to scaleor change the programming a
little bit to match where you'reat.
And I think it's the same withrelationships.
If you're wanting, like your bigrelationship, your your life

(40:09):
partner situation, but you arenot in a healthy head space to
be able to do that.
You might want to change yourexpectations and be like, I'm
gonna date for a while.
I'm gonna have some fun and I'mgonna work on my shit.
Yeah.
I'm gonna work on my ability tocommunicate honestly and take
responsibility for, you know, myfinances or whatever it is, or
my health, my fitness.

(40:30):
You know, like that's actuallypart of it.
And, and as you're developing asa person, you're gonna raise the
bar of the person that you canexpect to then be compatible
with.

Tali (40:38):
Sure.
And yes, I think yourcompatibility can change
dependent on your own personaljourney.
I always kind of fight back whenpeople are like, oh, I need to
get my shit together before Istart dating.
I think a lot of times peoplecan, I mean, you and I have
helped each other through somuch.
Yeah.
That's not what I meant.
I know.
I just, it kind of sounded likethat kind of reminded me of that

(41:00):
concept.
Cause I hear it all the time andI'm like, Ugh, I don't really
buy into it.
But

Cody (41:05):
it's more about attracting the right kind of person.
Yes.
I think like if you're wanting alife partner, like the person,
like I'm saying, you need to beready.
You need to be in a matureenough place and practice
communication and things likethat.
You and I have improved

Tali (41:17):
the course, but even if you're not, like, even if your
communication sucks, that's whatI'm saying, like you can't get
all your ducks in a row and thenlook for what you want.
You, we've talked about thiswhen it comes to like starting a
business or whatever, right?
Like you just gotta ship it.
You've gotta get, but you haveto action.
Yes.
But I do think the importantthing though is the assessment.
How many times have we been inrelationships where we're with

(41:39):
somebody we're not compatiblewith, but we're not really
willing to acknowledge thatbecause like what?
It's just buzzing in themicrophone.
Boom.
Sorry.
It's fine.
But we're not willing toprioritize that.
Like the chemical lust orwhatever is like overshadowing
the realistic potential for ahealthy relationship.

(42:02):
like that always gets bypassed.
I, I mean, I've been there.
Mm-hmm.
easily.
Yeah.

Cody (42:06):
I'm not saying you have to be perfect to find the right
person.
I'm saying you have to be onthat path though.
Like, there are people who arereally lazy in their own
personal development.
Like a lot of people that's,most people like, right, right.

Tali (42:16):
Not Are you saying those people shouldn't be in

Cody (42:17):
relationships?
No, I'm saying that they can'texpect to have an amazing,
healthy relationship with lessfriction if they have shitty
habits around communication.
Some of your past partnersyou've talked to me about who
are like so fucking closed offthat, you know, you'll like look
fond fondly in their eyes andthey're like, what?
What's wrong?
You know, like, like there's no,what are you looking at me for?

(42:40):
There's no depth there.
Yeah.
And it's because they're notpractice and they don't fucking
want it.
And so you, you gotta, you gottaknow yourself before you can
think that you're gonna findsomebody who is the person of
your desires.
You need to ask yourself like,am I the person?
that somebody else would desire.
That has the qualities that I'mlooking for.

Tali (43:01):
Sure.
But I'm also not gonna rule outthat like people deserve to be
in relationships.
Whether or not they're on thatpath too.
I think about like, how doesthat translate into the gym?
Like that's a way of kind ofclarifying this concept.
And you know, we see people inthe gym doing dumb shit all the
time.

(43:21):
Mm-hmm.
like they might not be on theright path, but they're there.
That's

Cody (43:28):
my point.
They're there.
They're trying.
They're working on it.
Okay.
I'm saying you have to be on apath to getting to know yourself
and improving if you expect tofind a quality partner.
Does that make sense?
Like you can't expect some Iguess, let's put it this way,
people who are on that path donot like to hang out with people
who are not on that path.

(43:48):
It's true.
It's g grading.
Like, I can't, like, I, I'malways looking to develop and,
and be a better person.
So, and it kind of drives mefucking crazy to sit in a room
and talk to somebody for twohours who's like, nothing to
talk about except TV orsomething.
I'm like, Ugh, this is thekilling me.
So I'm, I'm just saying like, ifyou have this idea of the, the,

(44:10):
like this amazing person youwanna meet, look at yourself and
see like, am I living up to bean A person who would attract a
person like that?
And then that takes some selfknowledge and some personal
development and at least anattempt to be on that path.
None of us are gonna be like,perfect.
And then meet the other perfectperson.

(44:30):
That's not what I'm saying.
Mm-hmm.
But you gotta be somebody who's.
introspective and living anexamined life if that's the kind
of person you want to attract.
But what

Tali (44:39):
if people don't want an examined

Cody (44:41):
life?
Then they better expect

Tali (44:43):
to also be with somebody who doesn't have an exam.
Exactly.

Cody (44:46):
I think that's fair to say.
That's fine.
And maybe you can be happy thatway, but I'm skeptical because
I, everybody,

Tali (44:53):
everybody, I've never seen that model, but is so
subjective, sweetheart.
Yep.

Cody (44:56):
No, I'm saying I have never seen that modeled.
Yeah.
I have never seen people who arecontent at just like working a
nine to five eating junk foodsitting in front of the tv.
Let's not.
Good

Tali (45:08):
for you physically

Cody (45:09):
buying recreational shit treatments on weekends.
No, I'm talking about thisparticular lifestyle everybody
I've ever known who are in thatlifestyle are fucking miserable.
They hate each other.
They're yelling at their kids.
They have shit all over thehouse.
Like this is, this is what'sbeen modeled for me is like you
either live a self-examine lifeand you're trying to like
improve your position or you'replaying the role of a victim.

(45:30):
and you're fucking miserable.
And most of the people aroundyou, the mercy of your life are
miserable too.

Tali (45:34):
Yeah.
Well, think about what you weresaying about, you know, getting
caught up and being a husband,the breadwinner, a man, all
those things.
I mean, having so much of thatin the way, in the way can
really stall some of thoseefforts.
I don't know.
Oh, yeah.

(45:55):
It just feels a little

Cody (45:55):
harsh.
I'm just trying to elevatepeople like I'm just saying, if
you want to have like a reallyincredible relationship, start
working on yourself.
I don't think this is acontroversial thing to say,
honey, that you should work onyourself if you want to, if you
want a good person that youshould be with, try to be a good
person.
Yeah.

(46:16):
Like step up and try to begenerous and try to work on your
communication skills and yourpatience and

Tali (46:21):
things like that.
I think there's a, a way ofphrasing it that doesn't have to
be like, you should do this.
It's more just like, Investingin yourself is an act of
self-love.
Yeah.
And knowing that you'redeserving of love in return is
not something I think people areinherently feeling.

(46:42):
You know, I just wanna changethe language around it a little
bit, where it's not like youshould be continuously
outputting, outputting,outputting.
Like, that's exhausting anddaunting, I think.
And a prob maybe a tall orderfor some, so, but if you kind of
turn it like inward of likerespecting yourself and you
know, wanting more for yourselfmm-hmm.

(47:04):
that will attract, you know, ahealthy relationship.
That's exactly what I'm tryingto say.
That's exactly what I'm tryingto say.
I'm just trying to be a littlesofter about it.

Cody (47:12):
And I'm, and I'm never, I'm not saying anybody should
live a self-examine life.
My point is, you shouldn't havecertain expectations if you're
not willing to.
Put in the effort for thosethings.
Sure.
And

Tali (47:28):
that goes, that's just a self-entitled, and that's the
same in the gym too.
Like we've talked about.
Like no one can do your reps foryou.
Like you are gonna get out whatyou put in.
Mm-hmm.
And it's really challengingsometimes working with clients
who are like, well, I'm notseeing results.
I wonder what's going on.
Like I've been that, I've beenthat client too, like of

(47:48):
nutrition coaches, fitnesscoaches, whatever, being like,
well they must be doingsomething wrong.
My coach must be doing somethingwrong cuz I'm not experiencing
any results.
And then I had to be like, well,am I actually trying really
hard?
Probably not And I feel like Ican be harsh about that because
I've been that person and it's,it was bullshit.

(48:11):
But I think that that'ssomething to really ask yourself
like in relationships and inyour fitness life.
Like, am I really putting in, amI matching what I'm hoping to
get out of it?
Yeah,

Cody (48:22):
that's exactly.
Yeah.
You can't expect certain resultsto just magically come your way
because you want them.

Tali (48:29):
Yeah.
You can want something all theway to the moon and it doesn't
really matter.
Yeah.
If you're not backing it up withreal work.
Yeah.
Yeah.
That's my point.
Oh, I love when we talk aboutthings like this.
I'm like, let's go work out

Cody (48:43):
Yes.
We need, we need to so one thingI wrote down was multifaceted
and just like fitness.
So we, I think when you say theword fitness, a lot of people
equate it with working out inthe gym.
Okay.
But as you know, what you put inyour mouth is half the battle at
least.

(49:03):
And it,

Tali (49:04):
I think it's more than that.
I really do.
Yeah.

Cody (49:07):
Well, it depends on who you are, but but it's always
part of the equation, no matterwho you are.
Sure.
Proper sleep is something thatis.
being talked about a little morenowadays, but I still think,
even though it's talked aboutmore on certain podcasts and
stuff, I still think people ingeneral kind of like, yeah,

(49:27):
yeah, I'll sleep when I'm dead.
Right.
Or, that would be nice.
Or That'd be nice.
Yeah.
And they don't realize it's onthe chopping block.
Yes, always.
All the time.
Always.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Sleep is always the thing thatgets sacrificed and we do it

Tali (49:37):
all the time, too.

Cody (49:38):
All the time and, and it is critical for your health.
Yeah.
I mean, it's absolutely criticalto, and it's kind of a crazy
thing to think about that welive in a society where you're
shamed for something that's likea normal bodily function like,
You gotta pee, you've gottabreathe oxygen.
You know, you gotta, your hearthas to pump.
You have to fucking sleep.

(49:59):
It's a biological imperative.
You have to sleep.
And if you're not sleepingenough, you're not gonna be
healthy.
Are you saying

Tali (50:04):
that people need to sleep together?

Cody (50:08):
So my point is that fitness is more than one factor.
Like you can work your ass off.
And if you're not taking, I seeproper care and recovery and
sleep and nutrition andhydration and relationships as
part of it.
I mean, like, there's, there's alot to being

Tali (50:23):
a healthy person.
That's so important.
It's so true.
Yeah.
I think that's really easilyoverlooked, like your whole
lifestyle.
Needs to come together.
We've talked about that, I thinkof like everything falling into
place.
Mm-hmm.
and how to identify thosekeystone habits that allow for
kind of like batching those goodhabits.
Yeah.
Yeah.
I think that's super importantto mention.
I'm excited to see what yourrelationship parallel

Cody (50:45):
is.
Yeah.
Well I think just before I gothere, I think some of this can,
you know, you can see how it's atheme in our society, and I
don't know if it's because ofwhen we became an industrialized
society, that factory workers,you have one job, this is what
you do, you, you put the screwin the hole and then when the
next one comes, you put thescrew in the hole again and

(51:06):
that's what you do.
And so we started living in thisvery compartmentalized thing.
You know, like people have onejob, that's your job, that's
what you do.
Whereas you go further andfurther back in history and
people were much morewell-rounded, like they knew how
to do shit, you know, forthemselves.
And I think it's crazy.
Or like

Tali (51:23):
when position would have many skills, like if you're a
business owner.
Yeah, we were just talkingabout, yeah.
If you were the shift inbusiness owners versus having a
job and working for somebodyelse over Yeah.
The last a

Cody (51:34):
hundred years.
Yeah.
If you were the, the blacksmithin the town or something, you
had a lot of skills around thatthing that you did, but you also
had to, I don't know, talk tocustomers and and, and take care
of your accounting workworkspace and Yeah.
And your accounting andeverything.
So,

Tali (51:49):
and probably have to raise a donkey.
Mm-hmm.
didn't they like, have donkeys?
who were doing something maybeand thinking about that scene in
Pirates of the Caribbean.
Yeah.
Remember he is like in ablacksmith

Cody (52:02):
shop.
Yeah.
Well the, you can use shopdonkeys to like produce energy
or maybe like a Right.
A water wheel

Tali (52:09):
or something, but it was some sort of wheel mechanism.
Gosh.
Okay.
My point is

Cody (52:14):
before we get completely derailed on Pirates of the
Caribbean shows how much I

Tali (52:17):
know how to do

Cody (52:18):
That's The more specialized we become.
I think the more we've gottenthis mindset of kind of being
myopic about things.
Our medical, our westernmedicine is much, is very much
like this.
You know, you come in with asymptom, we're gonna treat that
symptom.
There's not a view of theholistic health of the person.
There's a lot of talk around itnowadays, but I still don't see

(52:39):
it.
Like, I don't see that when I goto the doctor.
It's funny cuz you hear about ita lot, like, oh, we're taking a
more holistic approach and beingmore open-minded.
And then you go to the doctorand it's the same shit.
They sit you down and it's like,oh, it's a sore throat.
Let me look in there, let metake this test.
Let's just gotta be, let's,let's just address this, this
thing, this one thing that youcame in for.
I don't

Tali (52:56):
know.
I feel like I had kind of aholistic experience at the
dentist.
At the dentist.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Western medicine.
Yeah.
But I,

Cody (53:05):
I, my point is that we live in a culture that is kind
of trying to like separateeverything from each other.
We talked about this in a littlebit in our last episode of it's
true of like, I agree, Easternculture is kind of like, we're
all connected and cooperative.
That's, that's how nature works.
And integral to each other.
Yeah.
Yeah.
And in Western philosophies, alot of it's like we, there's
delineation and the scientificmethod where you isolate a

(53:29):
variable and you, you know,everything is being divided and
categorized and so it's kind ofa natural way for us to think
that, oh, fitness means workingout.
No, fitness means a lot morethan that.
You, you really have to changeyour lifestyle if you wanna be
healthy and, and vibrant and,and, and thriving.
Thriving takes more than justshowing up at the gym.

Tali (53:50):
Well, and to speak to sport really quickly, I forget
what I was listening to orreading the other day.
but it was an important thing tonote that, you know, high level
athletes of any sport are notfit.
No.
Oh, you know who it was?
It depends on how yourdefinition of fitness it was.

(54:10):
Hogan, gosh, what's her firstname?
She was a weightlifter that Ireally loved.
She's been off the scene for awhile and she's kind of working
her way back, but reallyfabulous weightlifter.
And she's like, you know, evenat my best, you know, she
competed at a very high level.
She was like, you know, even atmy best I wouldn't consider
myself fit because I was pushingmy body in a repetitive movement

(54:32):
over and over and over again.
Mm-hmm.
and neglecting all of theseother areas of fitness, like,
you know, balance, coordination,stability, like all these other
components that may not.
Be like the main lifts to train.
Yeah.
If you look at that forweightlifting, yeah.
And I, I feel like I've gotten afeel for that.
You know, my body moves in avery particular way very well,

(54:54):
but that's because I've put lotsof hours behind it.
But, you know, try to put me ina plank and I'm dying.
Yeah.

Cody (55:00):
Dying.
And some of it to be, especiallyat the elite levels, you have to
sacrifice your health for thatsport.
Yes.
And I'm not just talking aboutlike football injuries, but if
you look at really that's one of'em really extreme examples of
like people who doultra-marathons, a hundred
milers and stuff.
The elite, elite runners inthose really long distance
races, a lot of them are veryfrail people.

(55:23):
Like, they're very lightweight.
They can't move external loadsvery efficiently.
And I'm not just talking aboutin the gym, but just like in
life, they're not gonna be ableto pick up a 50 pound bag of
mulch to go out to the gardenwith.
It's a struggle.
It's a, it's a specialty.
It's, yeah, because they'vespecialized and then you flip
that coin on the other side andyou look at like the super
heavyweight power lifters, theyain't gotta run around the

(55:45):
block, but it's because they're,they are intentionally trying to
be as bulky and thick and strongas possible because all they
need to do is lift that fuckingweight off the floor about two
feet and they're done.
And they become so specializedthat they sacrificed their
health in, in a holistic

Tali (56:02):
Sense.
When Ken was at his largest forbody building, he said he
couldn't button his top buttonof his shirt cuz he couldn't
reach, cuz his arms were and hischest were so big.
But yeah, I think that'simportant to note that just
talking about thewell-roundedness of what fitness
really entails.
Mm-hmm.
sports', actually not a greatexample of that.

(56:23):
That's a very elite mm-hmm.
group of people who are, youknow, if you're thinking about
the Olympics for instance it's avery small.
Elite group of people who areliterally dedicating all of
their time to this, which meanstheir sacrifice elsewhere.
Yeah.
And that's what I've tried to,and that's why CrossFits so
cool.
Yeah.
Plugging that in

Cody (56:43):
Yeah, that's what I was about to say is that that was a
big selling point that I'vetried to teach people about in
CrossFit is like, the reason wedo such varied things is not
because it's fun, it is not,because it keeps it interesting.
It does.
And it's not because we'retrying to like torture you with
things that you're uncomfortablewith all the time.
It's because even you will, it'sbecause you want to be as

(57:03):
well-rounded as possible.
Well, you prevent

Tali (57:05):
injury.
Yeah.
That way you're

Cody (57:07):
building a wide base of fitness.
Yes.
And that's the whole point ofCrossFit.
And then if you wanna take thatwide base and build on it, you
can if you wanna specialized asyou did.
Yeah.

Tali (57:17):
Yes, there is that pyramid.
We should totally put that inthere.
Yeah.
Do you remember the CrossFitperiod?
Pyramid?
What was it called?
it had to

Cody (57:24):
have a better name than that.
Probably some hierarchy ofsomething I, hierarchy

Tali (57:27):
of fitness, I don't know.
Yeah.
And I think I'll put it in theshow notes so I can, nutrition
was down at the bottom.
Yeah.
Nutrition was first as the baseand then cardio.
And we're, I'm talking about apyramid, like kinda like the
food pyramid, which I hope hasbeen amended.

Cody (57:39):
Hopefully it's been burned at the stake

Tali (57:41):
Anyway, nutrition was down at the bottom as the widest
base.
Mm-hmm.
And then at the very, very topwas sport.
Yes.

Cody (57:48):
Yep.
Yeah.
So now taking this to therelationship realm.
Yeah.
I'm here.
Excited to hear it.
I just don't think that kind ofin line with that theme of set
it and forget it as not beingthe best approach that it takes.
It intention is that it takes alot of different types of skills
to have successful, fulfilling,and exciting relationships.

(58:11):
And I wanna put exciting inthere because I think it's
possible to stay excited foryour partner as well.
Yeah.
You know, but.
You can't rely on one thing.
So like if you're just relyingon like, date nights, okay,
we're gonna have this tradition,we're gonna do date nights,

Tali (58:28):
you can go on a date night, and it'd be truly crap.
Yeah.

Cody (58:32):
or just practically ignoring each other the whole
time.
Yeah.
Or having the same conversationor just talking about the kids
or whatever it is.
Like this kind of repetitivething.
It's not doing anything for you.
It's

Tali (58:42):
not really like relationship centric.

Cody (58:44):
Yeah.
And, and even if it is, it's,it's myopic.
Like if you're going on datesevery week, but you never have
sex, sorry, it's probably notgonna be the dynamic, incredible
connection that you hope for ina partnership.
Not, not everybody maybe putsthe same value on sex that I do
or that we do, but I think it'sreally important to look at all

(59:05):
the aspects of what you want outof your relationship and realize
that you kind of have to takethat CrossFit approach.
You have to have a, a wide baseof like, okay, I need to improve
my communication skills.
We need to practice.
honest, forthrightcommunication.
We need to check in regularly sothat a bunch of time doesn't go
by without knowing what's onyour mind.

(59:25):
You know?
We have to carve out qualitytime together.
Some of that's opportunities forgrowth.
Yeah.
Opportunities to grow together,especially like you and I trying
new things.
Yeah.
Yeah.
You and I like will dabble inlike courses and books and
things like that together sothat we're not just always going
on our own path on everything.

Tali (59:44):
Yeah.
We have a new venture coming upso soon.
I'm really excited.
Which one?

Cody (59:48):
Our modeling gig.
Oh yeah.
That's gonna be fun.
Yeah.

Tali (59:51):
So I did my first modeling gig for a figure drying class in
town, which is nude and I'vealways wanted to do it ever
since college and an opportunitycame up and I was like, I'm a
sign up.
Yep.
And I, you know, I'm not likethe most.
Pleased with my body at thistime and I'm feeling really

(01:00:13):
great about doing that.
Anyway.
Yeah, like it's this really coolfeedback loop where the novelty
of the experience is outweighingmy insecurities, which is That's
great.
The best way to live And so intwo weeks you and I are gonna be
doing it together.
Yes.
For Valentine's Day.
Yep.
I'm so excited.

Cody (01:00:32):
Yeah.
So we'll both be posing in thenude for the artists and you and
I have talked about doing thatsince early on in our
relationship.
Yes.
We actually tried, we tried todo it in Portland once we
offered ourselves to a studioand they were just like, nah,

Tali (01:00:45):
Well, apparently men, male models aren't men are
disgusting.
Standard or something.

Cody (01:00:51):
Where was I?
Oh, multifaceted.
So yeah, I think that it's just

Tali (01:00:55):
we ended on growth is,

Cody (01:00:57):
yeah.
We ended on growth.
Yeah.
Your own personal development ispart of that.
Staying fit and healthy for eachother, I think, or for yourself,
but you know,

Tali (01:01:06):
being physically able to do all those things that we just
talked

Cody (01:01:08):
about.
Yeah, yeah.
There's just so many differentaspects and you can't, I can't,
I'm not saying you, you can'tslide on one or two or whatever.
Like of course nobody's gonna beperfect and Well, you can, you
can choose.
Yeah.
But you certainly should beself-aware and aware of what's
happening in your relationshipand all the facets and not just
let something slide because it'sdifficult to approach or

(01:01:32):
inconvenient or something yourpartner doesn't seem interested
in like that.
Those things need to becommunicated.
So I think that's just anotheranalogy to fitness.
having a successful relationshipisn't going on.
Dates a k, a, going to the gym.
It's all the things.

Tali (01:01:49):
Yes.
And I would say that this is anopportunity to kind of con
compare and contrast the idea ofcompatibility that we were
talking about before where thismight be an idea where
incompatibility is kind of coolto explore.
Like we talked about growthbeing one of those avenues to

(01:02:11):
explore or to maintain.
Mm-hmm.
And you know, just becauseyou're not a great communicator
doesn't mean you can't becomeone.
And so some of these facets,like they might not come
naturally to you, but thatdoesn't mean that you shouldn't
try.

Cody (01:02:29):
Yeah.
Well, that's a great segue intoanother aspect that I wanted to
talk about, which is you and Ireally wholeheartedly believe in
the power of having a coach.
Mm-hmm.
We are coaches and we havecoaches.
And yes, having a mentor is anincredible, powerful tool for
development in any area of yourlife.

(01:02:52):
I really believe, like the olderI get and the more experienced I
have under my belt, the more Ijust wanna push people to like
find a mentor.
Like, if you wanna learn how todraw, go take a fucking class.
And if the class isn't, doesn'tsuit you, find somebody, find
another person that you cancommunicate well and you're
getting good feedback from andall that.

(01:03:13):
Because having a coach or slashmentor is one of the most
valuable ways to leverage yourprogress in anything.
And I think before you get to acatastrophe in your relationship
where you feel like you have togo to marriage counseling in
order to save the relationship,seek out mentorship, even when

(01:03:34):
things are good, like whenthings are better, you know, in
our.
relationship.
You, you'll remember this, Ithink it was our first year
together, we had a sit down withyour mom mm-hmm.
and we were talking about likehow to communicate certain
boundaries for each other orlike can, do you remember
Remember that?
Yes.
Yeah.

(01:03:54):
And, and, and attachment issuesthat we kind of had.
We were at Joyce's house.
Yeah.
We were at Joyce's house.
We sat down with your mom andI'm just saying like, was that
just like on the fly?
Yeah.
I don't remember how ithappened, but we were like,

Tali (01:04:07):
I don't know.
Well, I had a lot of fear aroundbeing a competitive weightlifter
and having my life and like allthese things I was doing and
being in a relationship becausein my experience, relationship
meant trapped.
Mm-hmm.
or meant all of your time beingconsumed or whatever.

Cody (01:04:26):
Yeah.
And that fear kind of led you tobe sort of resentful if I asked
a question like, how late do youthink you'll be at, well, No,
your fucking business kind ofattitude.
I would never say that.
You never said that to me.
But it was like the attitude andit was like, well, I would

Tali (01:04:39):
take that as like a flag.

Cody (01:04:41):
Why are you asking?
And it's like, I don't care,like how late you wanna be out,
but I also don't want to lay inbed worrying that you're in a
car accident or something.
So, and your mom kind of helpedkind of alleviate that.
It's like, well, of course it'slike a courtesy.
If you live with somebody, evenif they're not your romantic
partner, it's just a nice thingto do to tell people like, I'm
gonna be out and don't worry ifI'm not home by this time, I'm

(01:05:02):
i'll, I'll, I'm fine.
Or check in with a text orsomething.
It doesn't mean I'm trying tolike parent you.
Yeah.
Or put, put boundaries on you.
Well this doesn't,

Tali (01:05:10):
early in our relationship, like you said, I was super
skittish about that kind ofstuff.
So I'm

Cody (01:05:14):
not pointing a finger at you.
I'm just saying like, warmed upto it.
I'm just saying like in that, inthat instance, it was so
beneficial for us to have athird party to help us wor like.
Communicate that to each otherbetter.
Like you and I communicatedbetter with each other because
we had your mom to kind ofbounce ideas off of.

Tali (01:05:33):
But you were just saying that you should seek counseling
even when things are good.
Well, that was a struggle.

Cody (01:05:39):
Well, it was a struggle, but you and I were in the early
stages of our relationship.
Like this wasn't like, we'regonna break up over this.
This was just like, eh, this isa little sticky spot.
We should talk to somebody.
Yeah.
Right.
So my point is, and you know,you and I since then, we've read
books on relationships.
We've listened to podcasts onrelationships.

(01:06:00):
We've we've taken we've watchedmasterclass videos mm-hmm.
on certain aspects of ourrelationship

Tali (01:06:07):
and just to improve on things that

Cody (01:06:08):
are already great.
Exactly.
And that's my point.
And so get a coach, folks, likeeven if it's not a therapist or
somebody like dramatic, that youhave to go to seek out somebody
who has a great relationship.
And it doesn't

Tali (01:06:21):
have to be scary, like, you know, we've talked about
reaching out to our friends Ohyeah.
Like our friends who are also inrelationships that we admire or
whatever.
Mm-hmm.
feels solid and they've beenhelpful.

Cody (01:06:35):
Yeah, absolutely.
Yeah.
Yeah.
So I think mentorship issomething just like getting a
coach is gonna be much moreeffective in the gym.
Finding a mentor coach a friendwho's a good example, not some
friend who has a shittyrelationship but

Tali (01:06:51):
like somebody that's so important, do not glaze over
that.
You should really ask advicefrom people who have what you
think will get like, soundadvice from.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah.
It's tricky because sometimesyou just wanna talk to the
person who's nearest to you.
Yeah.
But people give advice all thetime.
Yeah.
Be ready, but be what's theword?

(01:07:12):
Discerning about the advice thatyou follow.
Yeah.

Cody (01:07:15):
And I think same goes for gym coaches too.
This all Oh yeah.
And I think this also reallyparallels another thing I wanted
to bring up, which is that inthe gym, the culture matters.
Gym culture really matters inthe progress of the individuals
who show up there.
I when I worked at, I'm, I'mgonna not name names, but I

(01:07:36):
worked at a big corporate gym inthe early days.
Ah, forgot I'm gonna name namesB, total Fitness.
Oh my God.
I'm not, because they're not,they're not even in business
anymore.
Okay.
And it, they're des they deserveto not be in business anymore.
I went to

Tali (01:07:49):
Bally's in high

Cody (01:07:50):
school, but I remember this like customer appreciation
day situation and they hadfucking crispy creams brought in
like donuts into the gym.
And I'm like, so many of thesepeople are struggling.
With their nutrition, or maybetheir nutrition isn't even a
part of it already and they'rein here struggling in the gym

(01:08:11):
and you bring in fucking donutsto the gym.
And I was, me and a couple ofthe other coaches or trainers at
the time were really pissedabout it.
Like, what manager thought thiswas a great idea for corporate
to provide donuts to themembers?
I'm

Tali (01:08:26):
making a face because I used to bring donuts for my
weightlifting team on Saturdays.

Cody (01:08:30):
Yeah.
Well that's weightliftingthough, right?
It's not, what's the difference?
Because CrossFit gyms we're,we're talking about the general
fitness, right?
We're talking about peopletrying to get generally

Tali (01:08:41):
fit.
We were talking about, I mean,we earned the calories.

Cody (01:08:44):
Yeah.
I'm saying what, what, likeweightlifters have macros
they're following and, and notall of them, and have,

Tali (01:08:50):
a lot of them are struggling to make weight and
have to take credit card bathsor saunas or like some bullshit,
like spit into a cup for a fewhours to make weight.
Yeah.
I'm sure he sabotaged somebody.

Cody (01:09:00):
It's not good.
But you had a different, sorryguys.
my point is that yourenvironment matters and if you
want to be fit, the best adviceI can give you other than
getting a good coach, is to putyourself around a bunch of fit
people.
Yeah.
And I, I saw another example ofthis that is kind of sad that

(01:09:21):
Bally's used to do.
They used to have like a ladiesonly section and my

Tali (01:09:25):
college gym was like that, but it was a lady's only hour.
And I was, no, I hated it somuch.

Cody (01:09:31):
They had, I understand why the purpose behind the ladies
only section or whatever.
But the problem that I would seeis in some of the classes that
were in that area, how do I saythis everybody there, including
the instructor, was not in goodshape.
Okay.
And I would see people sign upfor that class, and I'm like,

(01:09:52):
well, I, I understand thatyou're trying to be in an, an
environment where you'recomfortable cuz you're, maybe
you have some, you know, bodydysmorphia or whatever you wanna
describe it as, shame around theway you look and the way that
you move and your ignorance offitness principles.
Like maybe you're, you wanna besomewhere you're comfortable and
not embarrassed to show up.
I get Sure, I get that.

(01:10:14):
But if you are doing the samething as other people who are
not getting very good results,you can't expect to get good
results yourself either.
Right?
And so the people that I wouldsee come into the gym who looked
the same, who were embarrassedto be there, but they pushed
through that and they went intoa class where there's a bunch of

(01:10:34):
fit people around them andthey're looking at like, oh God,
I'm like the, the new kid here.
But those people got in shape.
Those people are the ones whoactually, they came, they became
closer to their peers, theybecame closer to what was being
modeled around them, rose theoccasion.
And a lot of that is theculture.
you become very much like thepeople you hang out with.

(01:10:55):
That's just a law of nature.

Tali (01:10:57):
We've talked about association Yeah.
And depth before.
Yeah.
And how important that is.
And I

Cody (01:11:01):
think it's true in relationships.
If you are hanging out, like ifyou are a single person and your
environment is a bunch of likeparty going single people with a
bunch of drama going on, andthen you get in a serious
relationship, there's a reasonwhy a lot of people like lose
their friends to relationships.
And some of it's not all badbecause I think if you, if all

(01:11:23):
of your association and yourpartner's association is with a
bunch of single people who arepartying or maybe not having
healthy relationships and youtoo are trying to like make it
work.
That association can reallydrag, drag you down because
you're gonna be getting advicefrom friends who are, it's
probably not really in your bestinterest to take that advice

(01:11:43):
from them, given the fact thatthey don't have a healthy
relationship to model of.
Yeah.
We were just talking about that.
So having friends and you, youand I have experienced this
recently where, you know, youand I have developed a real
practice in the last five yearsof being super vulnerable and
honest in our communication.
Mm-hmm.
and just being willing to putourselves out there with each

(01:12:05):
other and it's starting to bleedover into the way we communicate
with other people.
Yeah.
And recently we've made friendswith other couples who are sort
of like doing that in front ofus.
You know, I can think of atleast two other couples here
locally that we've hung out withwhere we talk about some pretty
intimate things and I'm like,wow, this is amazing that people
would like, be willing to like,bring up these real kind of

(01:12:27):
conversations.
Yeah.
But that's, I think in partbecause we're trying to develop
a, a proper community of thepeople we want to associate
with, that's gonna help have apositive feedback loop for the
type of relationship that we

Tali (01:12:39):
want.
I notice that a lot hanging outwith people and how easy it is
to kind of mirror their energy.
And I catch myself a lot in themoment of like, I don't, I don't
really wanna like, replicatethat out into the world and I
feel myself doing it sometimes.
But I think developing thatawareness is super huge.

(01:13:01):
Yeah.
You know, it can be, it can be atough habit to break, but rather
than telling yourself No, kindof like in coaching, when you
want somebody to move a certainway, you don't tell them what
they're doing wrong.
Mm-hmm.
you steer them in the directionof doing something, right?
Yeah.

Cody (01:13:15):
So seek out an, an environment.

Tali (01:13:17):
that's in positively

Cody (01:13:18):
reinforcing you.
Yes.
And that is modeling what youwant.
Yes.
Yeah.
And that's true for any area ofyour life, but it applies just
as much to relationships.
If you're hanging around peoplewho roll their eyes about their
spouse or run'em down.
Yeah, that's such a bad one.
Um, Talk negatively about thembehind their back or even in
front of'em, like embarrassingthem.
Like if you're, if that's yourfriends like that, that's gonna

(01:13:42):
be a problem because that'sgonna become your norm.
You're gonna feel like that'sjust how spouses do.
That's just how relationshipswork.
And that is not true.
That's just the people you'rehanging out with.
So.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Just a really critical thing to,and it's hard, it's really hard
if you're close to somebody orbeen friends for 20 years or
whatever it is to change thatassociation.

(01:14:03):
Is it?
Well, and that's normal

Tali (01:14:04):
too, in our culture.
It just is.
Yeah.
It's everywhere.
Yeah.
Yeah.

Cody (01:14:10):
Wom pomp.
But something to think about itis The other thing I wanted to,
that we've talked about, but Ijust wanted to bring it up as a
critical component of thefitness carryover to
relationships.
Okay.
Is honesty, because that alwaysworks its way in somehow.
Yeah.
Well, in the world of fitness,if you are like lying about the

(01:14:34):
weight, talk about this.
If you're lying about theweights that you're lifting,
even if it's like lying toyourself.
And what I mean by that is we,we see ego sometimes where
people put more on the bar, thenthey can really handle, and
their, their movement patterns,their form goes to shit, and
they're unwilling to acknowledgethat.
and then they put on theirrecord like, oh, I deadlifted

(01:14:58):
475, like, shit.
And it's like, well, yeah, butyou looked like you were about
to.
Yeah.

Tali (01:15:04):
So I have issues with that on squat videos online.
Yeah.
All the time.
This is just a pet peeve ofmine.
If you're in a sport wheresquatting below parallel is work
as a, as a standard.
Mm-hmm.
don't be posting videos of yourclients who are not squatting

(01:15:24):
below parallel and being like,pr Yeah, yeah, yeah.
I, I know that I'm being soharsh when I'm saying that, but
it irks me.
Well, there's

Cody (01:15:31):
an objective reality and that's There's an objective
standard I should say, forthings like that.
I see the same thing.
Pushups, like, oh, I can do ahundred pushups.
Like, really?
Cuz I haven't seen you do oneyet because they're like half,
half range of motion Ouch.
And so that's what I mean byhonesty.
Sometimes you don't even know ityourself.
Well if you're the

Tali (01:15:52):
cheerleader coach, yeah.
You let that stuff slidesometimes.
Yeah.
You can't do it a cheerleadercause you wanna, you wanna
positively reinforce yourclient, but you might be doing
them a disservice.

Cody (01:16:01):
Absolutely, you are.
But there's that sort ofinadvertent dishonesty where
they're like, the person may notrealize that they're.
sort of cheating.
But there's also, I've seenpeople who just always seem to
not quite hit all the numbers.
Like in a CrossFit workout whereyou're supposed to do 15 pushups
and 10 pullups and then run outthe door guilty.

(01:16:23):
And it's like, sometimes I'llnotice somebody who's like
getting ahead and I'm like, man,you, you didn't seem to be doing
those for very long.
And then I'll start counting andit's a class of 20 people, but
I'll start counting this oneperson cuz they're suspect.
And it's like, so every time youcome in you miscount.
So it's 12 pullups and I mean 12pushups instead of 15, like
every round.
That, that doesn't seem like amistake to me.

(01:16:44):
That seems like dishonesty,

Tali (01:16:46):
I think that there's something else going on there
though, because I've been, I wassaying I'm guilty of that.
And when I feel really obsessiveabout counting my reps, that's
when I move really, reallyslowly.
and the workout, like no longerhas the stimulus right, is
achieving the stimulus that itprefer it's asking for.
And when I feel like I'm gettingthe stimulus that I.

(01:17:08):
Want out of it.
I'm not counting as strictly,and I just would like to
structure exercise or theworkouts differently, like max
effort this, or a one minute ofthat or something that like can
mitigate that because I wouldwould say that that's, I mean
that would be my experience.

(01:17:28):
Yeah.
There's

Cody (01:17:28):
definitely innocent miscounting.
I'm not saying that that's notthe case, but I also know that
there's intentional miscountingbecause they want to get on that
leader base.

Tali (01:17:37):
Well, as long as you are, I mean, as long as you're honest
about it, like we're sayingmm-hmm.
like, yeah, I might not havedone all the reps, but if you're
like, oh yeah, dude did RX andblah, blah, blah.
Yeah.
Or like, you know, there wasthat one year of the CrossFit
games where they were doing likevideo submissions and like
everybody was commenting.
I think it was like, is his.

(01:17:59):
I wanna say his name is JeffBridges.
But isn't that the actor?

Cody (01:18:01):
No.
No.
Yeah, that's an actor.
who

Tali (01:18:03):
is the guy that I'm thinking of.
Short term man.
Yeah.
Had a really silly mustache thatyear.
You know who I'm talking about?

Cody (01:18:12):
Bridges is the right name, I think.
But

Tali (01:18:15):
Dan Bridget?
No, that's Dan Bailey.
I don't know.
Go ahead.
Anyway, there was like such anuproar over his reps and people
were like, he's gotta redo it.
And I think it was likethrusters or something.
Mm-hmm.
And it was either range ofmotion or rep count or something
and the workout was accepted andhe was like in the top leader
spot.
I think that is when it'sproblematic, like, yeah.

(01:18:35):
If you are not hurting anyone inthe process or like misleading
or like tricking anybody.
Mm-hmm.
or trying to take credit orsomething for something that you
didn't do.
Like that's what, it'sproblematic.
That's why doping affectsothers, not just you.

Cody (01:18:51):
Yes.
Well, let me push back a littlebit on that because if you're
not being honest about your repsor your weight lifted or
whatever objective measurementyou're

Tali (01:18:59):
looking for in relationships, that wouldn't be

Cody (01:19:01):
very good.
Well, in fitness we talked aboutin our last podcast mm-hmm.
that is published right beforethis one we talked about start
where you're at.
And part of starting whereyou're at is knowing where
you're at, like being honestwith yourself and knowing
self-assessment.
And so we got into a little bitof discussion on assessment and
part of the cure of.
Of, oh, sorry.

(01:19:22):
It was a different podcast.
It was personal developmentversus comparing yourself to
others and Oh, yes.
One of the traps.

Tali (01:19:28):
That's what published

Cody (01:19:29):
this week.
One of the ways that you canavoid compar, like unhealthy
comparisons to other people isto be honest about where you're
at and then compare yourself toyourself.
Yes.
So I want to be better thanyesterday.
That's my only real objectivewith my fitness, is to like
improve.
And if I want to improve, I haveto take measurements and

(01:19:49):
objective measurements of, toknow where I'm at, to know that
I'm improving.
And if you are lying about thoseobjective measurements, you have
no fucking clue if you'reimproving or not.

Tali (01:19:59):
Yeah.
You're just gonna be out therefloating.
And something that I shouldmention too is, you know, if
there's anybody else like mewho, you know, like I was
talking about, the different, ifI'm counting that I'm moving
really slowly or if I'm notcounting, that also means that I
didn't scale the workoutappropriately, probably.
Right?
Yeah.
Like, I sh should be able tomove quickly and get that

(01:20:20):
stimulus if I pulled back onwhatever movement variation,
right?
Yeah.
And I think that that is, youknow, speaking to what you're
saying about knowing whereyou're at and yeah, I think
that's a really importantcomponent.
Yeah.
And I also think that it wouldbe beneficial to structure
workouts like that or like, Giveguidelines, like you should do a

(01:20:43):
weight where you can do fivereps without stopping.
Like, I really love like thoseYeah, because they're objective
at that point.
It's not like it should beheavy.
Yeah, it's, or it should be 95pounds.
It should be something that youcan move continuously.
Like Diane, for instance, if youcouldn't get the first 11
deadlifts.
out of 21 Unbroken.

(01:21:04):
Mm-hmm.
in my opinion.
You've gone too heavy.
Absolutely.
Yeah.
Yeah.
I love those kinds of things.
I love the nuances of workoutslike that, and I think sharing
that information goes a reallylong way, especially in group
fitness, when you are requiringpeople to take agency.
Yeah.
And those moments,

Cody (01:21:21):
and that's the wonderful thing about having objective
measurements of like the, thedistance, the weight travels,
how much the weight is, how manyreps it is, and how much time,
like all those variables puttogether, gives you a very clear
understanding of the workout andthe stimulus.
And it's an objectivemeasurement of where you are.
Like there's no kind of gettingaround it.
There's no bullshit around it.
Mm-hmm.
So the more objectivemeasurements you can find, the

(01:21:44):
clearer picture you have forlike self-knowledge.
assessment.
So every workout becomes anassessment.
So carrying this over torelationships though, is that
honesty is, for us has been sortof the, the, the cornerstone of
what has made our relationshipso amazing, in my opinion.
Yes.
There's the compatibility, theshared interest in reducing

(01:22:10):
resistance all types ofcompatibility in terms of like
our aesthetic appreciation ofthe world.
You know, like we, we enjoybeautiful things and we wanna
surround ourselves that way.
Our personal development there'sall these aspects and our, in
our own health, for instance, inour fitness, like there's, you
can go down this list of allthese things that you and I
really do intentionally, but theone cornerstone that all of that

(01:22:34):
is really contingent on is ourblatant honesty with each other,
I think.
Yeah.
and

Tali (01:22:43):
it is, don't think can be, nothing's being hidden,
nothing's being sugar coated.

Cody (01:22:47):
And so just like the fitness analogy we were talking
about, we know where we're atYeah.
You and I know where we're at inour relationship at any given
time and when it's off a littlebit, we know, like we feel it
acutely if it's just off alittle bit, it's like, man,
something is not right.
And we, we address it, we don't,right there and then, right
there and then, yeah, whetherit's convenient or not.

(01:23:08):
But the only reason we can pickup on that is because of the
honest factor of it.
We're not cheating reps.
We're not, we're not ignoringany aspect of our relationship
to the detriment of not knowingwhere we're at.
And we're not deceiving eachother, or, and we're trying to
be honest with ourselves.
And that honesty in everysituation gives us.

(01:23:31):
assessment tool, if you will.
Yeah.
And our ability to know if we'reconnecting well and to obviously
to know each other better.
Yeah.

Tali (01:23:39):
Yeah.
And no one's, no one's lost.
There's no mystery going onhere, you know?
Mm-hmm.
When I hear that other peoplefeel that way about their
partners, I'm like, Ooh, thatsounds really uncomfortable.
Like, how do you live togetherthat way?
Yeah.
But you and I also make a lot oflike, extraordinary efforts to
spend time together when we feellike our jobs or whatever are

(01:24:01):
taking away from that.
So we, we put a lot of effort inthat regard.
But you said something reallyimportant just then, and we, we
mentioned, we talked about itearlier this week on a personal
matter of how when there isfriction or tension or distance,
it is felt acutely.
Mm-hmm.
and that constant checking in,like if you think about it in a

(01:24:24):
physical way in regards tosport, like being, having like
awareness of your body.
Yeah.
An injury when things are comingup or if your energy is low,
like these are all importantthings to be aware of in your
physical pursuits as well.
Like you need to be able tolisten to your body.
If it can't be pushed, youshouldn't push it.
Or if you're being easy onyourself, you gotta ramp it up.

(01:24:47):
Mm-hmm.
like having an awareness of yourbody and developing a
sensitivity to that kind of, inthe way that we talk about it
with food too in terms of, youknow, people are allergic to all
kinds of stuff and just kind oflike, you know, having
inflammatory responses to allsorts of things that they're
eating and not really thinkinganything of it because we don't
really have a sensitivity aroundit anymore because our system is

(01:25:10):
just shot all the time.
Mm-hmm.
And so I think that that's justan important theme as well in
terms of developing and asensitivity to when.
your boundaries are beingcrossed.
Or when you're not feeling safeor heard or whatever it is, like
that's such an important thingto act upon when it's happening

(01:25:36):
because that is not only aself-knowledge, but something
for your partner to be like, oh,I didn't realize whatever I
said, you know, made you feelthis way.
I probably won't do thatanymore.
Like you and I have had thatconversation many times where
we've told each other how weinterpret the way something
someone said.

(01:25:56):
And I know I've been so carefulto never say things to you in a
way that would make you feelinsecure or feel badly or
pressured or anything like that.
You know, like, I don't wannamake you feel that way.
And we can only teach ourpartners explicitly.
We can't assume that they knowthese things.
Right.
And I think, like we weretalking about in the very

(01:26:17):
beginning of the podcast, whichis.
These things aren't taughtexplicitly.
Mm-hmm.
So we have to, we have to putthat knowledge out there in the
world.
You know, we can't make theassumption that anybody knows
how to take care of us or loveus.

Cody (01:26:28):
Yeah.
The, that the whole mind readeraspect of, of romantic
relationships is ridiculous.
Like, well, if they loved me,they should know.
That is a bullshit statementbecause nobody can read your
fucking mind, no matter how muchthey love you.
Yeah.
If they don't know what youneed.
If you don't say it.
So, and those needs change.
And those needs change.
Exactly.
Yeah.
We change so it takes constantvigilance and honesty and you

(01:26:53):
and I practice something thatsome of you may have heard of as
radical honesty.
I tend to not, I hate that wedon't like that term because for
us it's just, it's honesty.
Like there is no gray area ofwhat's honest and what's not.
It's, it's either honest, honestor it's
not.

Tali (01:27:08):
And radical honesty makes it sound scary.
Yeah.
To.
I don't know why, but like yousaid, it doesn't have to be this
like huge, lofty thing.
It can be a baseline.
Yeah.
An approachable baseline.
Yeah.

Cody (01:27:21):
And so there's nothing that you and I don't share with
each other or not willing to gothere?
Whether that's our phone chatswith other people or our, our,
our weird thoughts that we haveor insecurities or something
that we're feeling bad about orphysical limitations, like
whatever it is.
Like it's on the table and it'sout there and we approach it as

(01:27:43):
quickly as possible.
It's part of that aspect ofhonesty is to not wait to the
right moment.
Because same with fitness.

Tali (01:27:51):
Don't wait till the new year.
Yeah.

Cody (01:27:52):
Because.
that is kind of a form ofdishonesty if you think about
it.
It's like, oh, I have this thingI need to bring up, but I'm not
gonna bring it up till nextTuesday cuz we've got this
little shit going on.
And it's like, well you're,that, that means you're keeping
something from the other person.

Tali (01:28:04):
Lying by omission, I think is what it's called.

Cody (01:28:06):
Yeah.
So if that's what you mean byradical, then I guess we're
radical, but to us it's just,it's action

Tali (01:28:12):
oriented, honest.
Yeah.
Which we talk about in fitnessall the time on our podcast.
Yeah.
Which is like, do it now.
Don't do it now.
Don't wait, just do something.
Yeah.
Another one.
And I would say it's the same inrelationships.
Like be action oriented.
Yes.
Yeah.

Cody (01:28:26):
Forthright.
Mm-hmm.
Yeah.
I think that covers it for me.
How about you?

Tali (01:28:31):
We talked about a lot more than.
We originally discussed, whichis delightful.
I was a little Yeah.

Cody (01:28:37):
Worried.
It's phenomen at an hour and ahalf.
It's kind of, that's a, that'sgreat.
That's a fun one.
It was, and I'm sure there'll bea lot more.
I feel like every time we wrapup one of these episodes, I feel
like, well, if we're outliningour book called The Philosophy
of Fitness, this is just abrainstorming session for that
chapter that it's probably gonnabe expanded on even more by the
time we actually sit down towrite it.

(01:28:58):
You

Tali (01:28:58):
know, it's funny cuz every time you bring up the book I'm
like, oh, we're still gonnawrite a

Cody (01:29:00):
book.
Hell yeah.
We got so much material now.
Okay.
Okay.
Oh shit.
I lost my train of thought.
I was gonna say something.
I'm so sorry.
I, so important.
Okay.

Tali (01:29:13):
You were saying that you like to expand on these ideas?

Cody (01:29:15):
Oh, yes.
So on our website, if you go toHow to Fit together, dot com
mm-hmm.
How to Fit together.com.
You'll see some of the recentthings we're working on in our
coaching lives, but you'll alsosee the podcast page there, woo.
And the podcast page now has anorange button that you can click
on and you can be on the show.

(01:29:37):
So if you have a comment or aquestion about today's episode,
go there now and you can recorda short message for us and find
a quiet place, you know, so thatit's a good quality for us.
And we'll put it on next week'sepisode and discuss a little bit
of what you bring to the table.
So if you have an idea, someinput, we've had feedback from

(01:29:58):
at least three people.
That I can think of off the topof my head who has said, I've
listened to your podcast, and Iwanted to jump in with this
idea.
Right.
And it was killing me.
And well, now you can, you cango there and you can let us know
what your thoughts are on thistopic, and then we will do a
little recap in a future episodewhere we'll play your voice memo
on the air, and then we'llfurther discuss what you bring

(01:30:19):
up for us.
So I'm so excited about thatfuture, really.
Yeah.
I'm really excited for this longtime coming to be.
Yeah.
We've intended to do that fromthe start, but I just it took me
a while to get the technicalaspect.

Tali (01:30:29):
There's a lot going on over, over here.

Cody (01:30:31):
So we're excited to have this podcast be more of a
collaborative effort with youwho are listening.
And I think that's it for me.
Yeah.
All right.
Well, we'll see you guys in a.
I love you.
I love you too.

Tali (01:30:50):
This episode was produced by Tali Zari and Cody Limbaugh.
Check out our writing, coachingservices and home studying
adventures at live all yourlife.com.
For show notes, resourcesmentioned, or to submit a
question or contribution, clickon the podcast tab.