Empowering Communities with Carol Fairman

Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
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(00:21):
Hello all, my entrepreneurs and business leaders, and welcome to
the Michael Esposito Show, where I interview titans of industry
in order to inform, educate, and inspire you to be great.
My guest today has a knack for building lasting relationships.
She has led fundraising efforts that raised over three million dollars,

(00:42):
moving her ministry from financial struggles to abundance. Her record
breaking fundraising initiatives have saved thousands of lives, leaving a
lasting impact on the community. Recognizing donor retention as key
to community service, effectively communicates with donors to inspire actions

(01:04):
for long term impact. She aims to aid over one
hundred thousand nonprofit leaders in doubling their raised funds to
broaden their community impact by twenty twenty eight. She is
the CEO of a Center of Hope CPC, Inc. And

(01:25):
a certified behavioral consultant. Please welcome Carol Fairman. Welcome, Carol, Hi.

Speaker 2 (01:34):
It's good to be here today. Thank you.

Speaker 1 (01:36):
I know we've been having a nice little conversation prior
to getting on the air, and I think what's so
fascinating about your bio there is you raise over three
million dollars. You put an emphasis on communicating to donors.

(01:57):
Before we got on the air, you talked a little
bit about on stages and speaking in public and sharing
the mission of your organization with so many people and
taking this organization that was essentially failing or I hate
to say that about an organization, but essentially not meeting
its goals and you just ten extit twelve exit, one

(02:20):
hundred exit to where it is today. And you did
that in a large part by trusting in your team
and by working with your community, but in a large
part also by communicating and speaking out in public. And
the reason why I bring this up right now is
because you have a little secret to tell everyone. Do
you want to share that little secret with everyone about

(02:42):
your public speaking?

Speaker 2 (02:44):
Oh? That, I don't enjoy it, the secrets that you're
talking about. It's like, oh, I got a few secrets
right now.

Speaker 1 (02:52):
But that's the secret. Yeah? That and The reason why
am I want to bring that up right away is
because of course you and I were just talking about it,
of you getting on the podcast and feeling some nerves there,
but also because you pushed a fear aside in order
to do good for others. You took something you know,
you knew that by by becoming the CEO of this organization,

(03:15):
that you'd be the face of the organization, and that
it would be required of you to communicate with the community,
the donors and everybody, and not just through an email
or a memo, but through face to face interactions, through
getting on stages, through standing in public at Chamber of Commerces,
business associations, all the rest of the things where you're
in front of a large audience and you push those

(03:37):
fears aside in order to help others. And I just
want to commend you for that, because of course, you
know I mentioned to you that you know, my background
is in of course public speaking, coaching and training and
all the other stuff, and so I understand the challenge
and the fear behind it all. But also as an entrepreneur,
as somebody who aspires to be like someone like you,

(04:02):
it is inspiring to see someone just push fear out
of the way to do good for others. So you're
an inspiration.

Speaker 2 (04:11):
Ah, thank you, you're very kind of saying. But it
was it was not easy, and uh, you know sometimes
you just it's like you just got to get out there,
get it done and do it and you just gotta
push it all aside. There was no choice. I accepted
a job that I didn't fully understand what all those
responsibilities were going to be. And when they said, okay, well,

(04:35):
the next phase of your training and stepping into the
executive director of this ministry is you're going to start speaking,
you know, on stages and raising money. And I'm like,
you're kidding me, because I don't I don't do that.
I don't know how to do it, and I don't
do that. And they're like, oh, well, you're going to learn.

(04:55):
And so it was sink or swim.

Speaker 1 (04:58):
What are what are some of the feelings that you
get when or that you used to get you might
still get them. Now, What were some of the feelings
that you would get before going out on stage and speaking?

Speaker 2 (05:09):
Oh, it was awful at first, and I just want
to just kind of zip ahead to the time that
I am not anxious to step up to a microphone
means that I'm too big for my breeches and it's
time to step away because I don't want to lose
sight of that. I don't ever want to get so
cocky that I think, oh, I can just do this.

(05:29):
But it was so bad. I literally would just want
to vomit, you know, and the sweats and the fear,
the dry throw I mean, it was just I couldn't
sleep the night before. Most of my venues are usually
speak about twenty five to thirty, maybe thirty eight churches
a year, so every Sunday I'm usually at a different church,

(05:53):
plus sprinkling in you know, chambers and events, and I
would just have these tear fine nightmares the night before,
like I'd show up at the wrong location, right. That
was always the worst. And you get there and you're
realize you're like, oh, no, I'm on the other side
of the county. How am I gonna get there? It
was awful. So it was all this built up fear,

(06:16):
and then then when you get up there, you're just
sweat and anxious, and then you think, well, what if
I get it wrong? Well, they don't know what you
were gonna say, how are they even gonna know that
I get it wrong? So it's just all these things
that would just get in the way, and I would
just oh, it's so crippling. Thank God, it's not like
that for me anymore. But I still get nervous, just

(06:37):
in different ways.

Speaker 1 (06:38):
Why is it not like that for you anymore?

Speaker 2 (06:42):
You know? I think, you know, this is year seven
for me in the public speaking, and so I would
just kind of put some tips and tricks in place
for myself. And so I think it's just recognizing that
nothing is nothing bad is gonna happen to me. And
more importantly, I'm in a room full of people that

(07:03):
are excited to hear what I have to say, you know.
So I'm my own enemy in this really, you know,
because I've been invited to speak. So it's not like
they're gonna throw tomatoes at me or whatever that looks like.
Because you're invited to be here. They want you to succeed.
But we get caught up in the junk in our head.

Speaker 1 (07:23):
What were some of the tips that you mentioned that
you thought about.

Speaker 2 (07:26):
Oh, my favorite tip is I wear glasses to see
for distance, and so when I walk up to the stage,
I need them if I'm in alive, and I'll step
up because I don't want a trip, and then you know,
make a full of myself. But the glasses go in
my hair or on the podium, and then I can't
see anybody, right, I mean, I see them, but I

(07:50):
can't necessarily see like if they're scowling at me. Just
so all of a sudden, I'm just having a party
because the room is just like they're a bunch of
blur people and I can't tell. And so that's the
biggest thing, because if I can't make eye contact really
with them, you know, then it's all good. So I'm
just you know, that's my favorite tip. Other than that,

(08:13):
it's just you know, yeah.

Speaker 1 (08:15):
That's an interesting tip. That one makes me think about
changing your reality and changing the story you're telling yourself.
In that you're you're going up there telling yourself a story,
and you're physically changing that whole story by taking your
glasses off. You're going you know what, there aren't that
many people, and they all just kind of blend in
with each other, and I want them all to smile,

(08:35):
and so they're all smiling.

Speaker 2 (08:37):
That's it. So that was that was the biggest game changer,
and then it just everything else just settles down. And
so once I implemented that, it just gets easier and easier.
And then just with practice, showing up, keeping your you know. Unfortunately,
also my messaging is very consistent and so and when

(08:58):
I figured out how to connect with them in a
way that matters, it just makes it easy. I get
nervous for different reasons now, mostly am I going to
hit the goal? Yeah? You know, I don't know. So
it's just watching myself grow and developing the process. It's
been fun. It's been a fun journey, and I've gone

(09:20):
from a place to really where I'm more excited to
get on stage now because I know that I'm connecting
people to things that they could do or how they
can get involved, whether it's volunteering or giving to support
it so somebody else can and just being able to
say thank you. And so once I've learned to shift

(09:41):
that messaging and hold on to what it's going to
do for somebody else, and it has nothing to do
with me. They don't know that I'm afraid. They don't
know if I'm going to miss or say something wrong.
They don't care. They just want to hear the good
news and what they can do or how they can
ca connect with it. So it's a game changer when

(10:03):
you get out of your head.

Speaker 1 (10:04):
Yeah, and I mean huge game changer when you get
out of your head. A couple of things that you're
saying there and on that topic what you just said there,
when you get out of your head, I forget who
it was, but he said when I stopped listen, when
I stopped listening to myself and I started talking to myself,

(10:24):
everything changed. And so because when we listen to ourselves,
we're hearing all of the negative thoughts that are trying
to keep us safe. They're trying to keep us safe, right,
they're trying to say, you know, stay behind the curtain.
You won't have to face all of those scals that
you're afraid of, right, stay behind the curtain. You won't
you won't trip on the stage. Stay behind the curtain,
you won't swallow the wrong way when when you drink

(10:45):
that sip of water. You know, stay behind the curtain.
But if you start talking to yourself and you say,
I need to go out there, and I want to
go out there, and I need to spread this message,
so I love that, and you just made me think
about that quick question for you in terms of you said,
I love these different tips that you put out there
because they are tips that I one thousand percent stand behind,

(11:07):
which is practice, practice, practice, practice practice. I'm a toast master.
I practice weekly. I go to my toast Master's meetings,
and I don't look at anybody from one level to another.
There are beginners in my toast Master's club that are
nervous and that stutter and stutter, meaning like they say
a lot of ums, and they don't really aren't able
to get their thought across very clearly all the way

(11:30):
to one of my mentors who was a professional speaker.
And I still go as as I guess a professional
speaker and practice and rehearse there. And I think practice
is one of the best ways to quell your fears.
Another thing that you mentioned was consistency in your message,

(11:50):
and I think another one of those. I mean just
tremendous to have consistency, because then you could speak more
impromptu because the message is always the same, it's just
a different audience. And how do you tailor it to
that audience and how do you connect with this person
and that person which leads me to my question that
I have for you in terms of connection. I love
that you said you started connecting more with your audience,

(12:13):
and I'd love if you could share a little bit
more about that. And I think you kind of touched
on it in terms of the giving and a couple
other things that you mentioned there, But I really love,
from the public speaking side of you, if you could
share what it felt like for you to connect with
your audience and what were some of the things that
you did to connect with them.

Speaker 2 (12:30):
Yeah. You know, connection is so important and it's about
building relationships. And we can speak at people all day long,
but if we are not engaging them, right, they're just
their eyes have glazed over. And I learned along the

(12:50):
way that there are just people that are all about numbers. Right.
Once I started diving into personality types and how people
are hearing and receiving things, I'm very much a particular
personality and I'm just like, give me the facts. I
want the details. Let's move along, move along, move along.
And really learning the emotional storytelling side was just hard

(13:14):
for me, and so when I was first putting the
message out, I'm like, here's all the statistics about what
we're doing over here, and here's all the numbers, and
all the people that are not in numbers, people they
don't care. They want the heart story. How are we
impacting lives? So I had to figure out what does
that blend look like, recognizing that there are people that

(13:37):
just want to hear the stories. They don't care about
the numbers, And so I had to get outside of
who I was as a person and deliver messages that
they can touch everybody that's in the room, because we
don't know who's sitting in those seats. Some of them
I may never see again, but I have to know
that I'm connecting with them. So I put in this

(13:59):
beautiful full blend, if you will, of here's the story
of who we're serving, and these are the ways you
can get involved in. It's wrapped in a hug of
a thank you for your support already, but this interesting
invitation for you to get involved if you haven't already
started giving to our ministry or volunteering, throwing in those

(14:22):
statistics along the way and just inspiring them to either
give or to serve, or just say right on, you
keep doing it and I'll write the check or whatever
that looks like, but connecting them so they can see
themselves somewhere in the ministry or the message that you're giving.

(14:42):
And so I run everything through the lens of our
mission statement because that's what brought them there from in
the first place. But I got to connect with them
in the right way. And it's that intentionality that makes
that difference. For sure.

Speaker 1 (15:00):
You remind me of somebody who I've heard recently speak.
He's the president of a local university here in New York.
It's a sunny university of New Paults and it's the
president is a doctor Darrell Wheeler, and what he speaks
to is very similar to what you said is in
that he said, whenever he addresses his team, whenever he

(15:23):
addresses the student body, whenever he addresses the community, he
always refers back to the mission of the organization and
what is the mission of the organization, And what are
the values that I can lean into and lean on
to be able to tailor this message for you or
speak this message for you. And it's something that always

(15:45):
helps him with that. I thought that was pretty neat.
The other thing you mentioned, yeah, and you know you
mentioned ministry, and you know, ministry of course is typically
tied to religious beliefs, spirituality, God, and regardless of wherever
anybody is right now in terms of their spiritual journey,
whether they believe don't believe, UH, doesn't really matter for

(16:07):
what I what my question is in terms of this,
I'm interested in. When you said before, you're talking about
taking your glasses off so you don't see anybody. And
again this is my public speaking coach hat coming on
one of one of the tips that I typically have
for people who don't have the option of taking glasses off,
Like I toubt myself as having eagle vision, like I

(16:30):
can see from miles away. I it's kind of my
it's kind of my thing. I love to challenge myself
with like those eye charts and seeing can I read
that bottom line? Can I take another step back? So
I am going I Am going to see every audience member.
That's my goal. And so so for people like me
that are out there, we have the people in the
audience that are our as Simon Sinek would call it

(16:52):
our champions, and then we have the people as you
would call them, that are scowling. And the advice that
we have have for anybody going out and speaking in
public is to focus on our champions. Whether we are
able to persuade or get the person with the scal
on their face to turn around or not is almost

(17:12):
doesn't matter. As long as we're focused on the people
that are smiling, that are nodding along, that are cheering
us on. Focus on them. They're the people that you're
there to speak to. They're the people you're connecting with.
It's not to say to not do what you said
that you're doing in terms of blending and bringing out
you know, making emotional and statistical. It's not to say
not to do that. I'm what we're saying, and I

(17:33):
know that you're on the same page as me in
terms of your agreement. Here is when when you do
see the crowd, is that it's no longer about you,
it's about them. And That's where I'm going with all
of this in terms of the spirituality thing, is that
so if we're if we're looking at the idea of
it's no longer about me, it's about them, and we're
looking at our cheerleaders out there, our champions out there,

(17:55):
and it's about them, how much of that and in
terms of your spirit rtuality and of course it being
a ministry, how much of that also helps you be
able to move beyond your fear of knowing that it's
no longer about you, it's about a greater good.

Speaker 2 (18:12):
Oh yeah, and that that is actually key number one
for me, because it's no secret if you see me
out in facebook land or wherever I'm at, it is
about my walk with the Lord, and I am serving
my community because he asked me. To believe me, I

(18:34):
wouldn't have been on a stage, especially in the ministry
that we work in, if it wasn't because I was
asked to do this. And so I just trust him
and I get out of the way, and as I
put it on his vessel, and I go with what
I think he wants to say, and I just say it,

(18:55):
and I don't have to take my glasses off anymore.
Sometimes now it's just a habit. I just want to
say that, because when I first started, I was terrified.
But it's it shifts, and when you get into that
comfort zone and when you begin to recognize that these
people are your champions and there are going to be

(19:16):
those that are scowling. But since you open this door
a little or a lot, really that person that's grumpy
or doesn't want to hear what I have to say.
It's none of my business. It's just not my business.
That's between him and God. If something I've said in
that particular format that we're talking about when I'm in

(19:36):
a church, right, that's not what I that's not my problem.
It's none of my business what he thinks of me.
I just am here to do a thing, and I'm
here to report this good news. Tell you the impact
that you're giving is making. And I'm going to shout
it from the rooftop. And we are a religious nonprofit
and I am gonna, you know, praise Him all the

(19:57):
way through it. Now, when I'm a workshop, and you know,
I do other you know, fundraising trainings and things like
that that are you know, I guess religious or secular,
however you want to put those. You know, I do
work in both of those. But but my faith doesn't change.
And it is my motivation to just go help people

(20:20):
thrive in their space, whether they're launching a business, whether
they just need a friend to chat with, or if
we're getting on stages. It's just about you know, empowering,
encouraging and supporting people and whatever they're doing.

Speaker 1 (20:38):
And my coach likes to tells me, likes to tell
me other people's opinions are none of your business.

Speaker 2 (20:45):
Yeah, that's the phrase I was looking for. It isn't
any of my business.

Speaker 1 (20:48):
It's none of my business. And you just never know
what someone's dealing with either. I mean, so exactly, how
often have we made an assumption about someone because of
let's say, a scowl on their face and we go, oh,
they don't like me, or they don't like the message
I'm sharing, and come to find out they're dealing with
an emotional issue they just came out of are really

(21:09):
they heard got terrible news and they're just not there.
They're not present in that moment and.

Speaker 2 (21:15):
They weren't even listening. You had nothing to do with you.
Like I'm over here thinking about where we're eating the
dinner and I don't want to have lunch with a
as Susie and they're scowling, and I'm thinking, oh gosh,
what did I say.

Speaker 1 (21:26):
I'll be honest, so my you know you and I
were in similar paths. I'm not very I always say
this only because like I don't go to church and
I don't pray to a God or anything. But so
I say, I'm not very religious, but I was raised Catholic,
and I'm raising my daughter's Catholic and they're doing their
sacraments and everything. But I'm more of a spiritual person.

(21:49):
And so what I'm saying here is I'm more of
a spiritual person. I'm more of a self development type
of person and focusing on you know, how we can
change our thoughts, change our mind and go into every
moment with a positive attitude, that we could really just
decide that we're going to be happy or that we're
going to be positive and all this other stuff. And
this is all wonderful stuff, right, But yesterday I had

(22:09):
an argument with my wife and and it was it
was it was such a you know, and these are
these kinds of arguments that are just just so silly,
but you know, it's usually because there's something underlying, and
it had to do with family and engagements. Right, It's
always that, Right, it's going to this person's house, going
to that person's house. Where are we going here? Where
are we going there? When is this you know, that

(22:30):
person wants me to come, This person wants me to come,
And there's always this like pull push and pull from
from family and obligations, and because you know, you just
come out of the holidays and you come out of
all this other stuff, and you've already had a lot
of it, and you've just dealt with so much tension
in that space, the one little thing just sets it off.
And that's tipic. That's essentially what happened. Was it was

(22:51):
like something so like it was actually a highpathetical that
I raised. I said, I might have to I'm because
they may need. It was like such a hypothetical and
we got into it and it was like, when we
were making up from the argument, I was just like,
and it's so silly because it was a hypothetical. But
that wasn't the point, And that's not the point that
I'm bringing up here. The point that I'm bringing up

(23:12):
is that we did have the argument, and we were
really upset with each other. My feelings were hurt, her
feelings were hurt, and because her parents were also under
pressure because she's trying to have this argument with me
and finish it and she's got to get to the
bus to pick up our daughter while I'm also trying
to finish up some work. So it's like we got

(23:32):
this time crunch on us while we're trying to resolve
this issue, and unfortunately, because the bus was coming, she
literally had to run out in the middle of our argument.
And again, we're both very self aware, and we're like,
both of our feelings are hurt, but we're angry with
each other. And she left the house. And this is
the part that I'm bringing up for everyone. I was

(23:54):
so angry. And I have nothing but positive affirmations all
around my office, and I write them on post its
and I have them and I see them all. And
I have all my self development stuff around me, my tapes,
all my stuff, my Tony Robbinson, and I have my
growth day app up and all this other stuff. And
yet I'm looking at it all and I'm going, but
I'm angry, and I'm going, oh, this is what people

(24:18):
must feel like when they have just devastating life experiences
of a divorce or the loss of a family member,
or a diagnosis of some sort. And this is like
the feeling that they carry with them. I know that
me and my wife are going to make up once
we finished talking for another fifteen twenty minutes, which is
actually what happened, right it's going to take us some

(24:39):
time to get over the fight because we need to
reconnect and all that other stuff. Like we even talked
about that for tonight. We want to watch a movie
together and make sure that we reconnect. But this is
the pain that some people carry with them and somebody
like myself who's in that self development space, who works
on this stuff every single day, I'm having trouble getting
out of this environ, getting out of my mental environment

(25:02):
in just a small, little meaningless argument with my wife,
going back to that person with the scal on their
face as an audience member, or going back to that
person that we might interact with and make assumptions on.
I mean, we don't know what they just dealt with
and that they can't change their state. Yeah, you know,
doesn't that put it in perspective? It's like crazy, it

(25:24):
really does.

Speaker 2 (25:25):
Yeah. Yeah, it's so crazy. Yeah, a powerful insight because again,
we've got you know, we just point everything to ourselves
and we don't necessarily pause to consider others. And so
you know, that is a great example. You know that

(25:46):
you were experiencing that and then able to think, wow, okay,
that could be the guy sitting in the pew being
all grumpy too, being caught in that moment. How do
we get out of that? Interesting?

Speaker 1 (25:59):
And you think about gratitude. You mentioned it earlier in
terms of gratitude, and I'll share this and I want
you to want to get into more about your story too,
But it's just it's top of mind right now with
what we're talking about in terms of gratitude. I recently
had a colonoscraphy TM I all right, but don't worry
about it. But there's a reason why. There's a reason
why I'm bringing this up. I recently had a I

(26:20):
recently had a colonoscophy just because there was some digestion
issues that I was having. So I'm forty two, it's
a little ahead of time. So anyway, I'm also experiencing
some other I don't know, life crisises, I guess in
terms of my business and finances and everything and trying
to figure things out without oversharing there. But so here's

(26:43):
here's the part about gratitude that I want to share
with everybody, and that I know that you and I
can talk some more on is It was actually this morning,
I'm dealing with some things and I journaled on it
and I journaled. I probably this is probably my longest
journal entry I've ever done. I've probably sat there for
about an hour, journaling on some of the things that

(27:03):
I'm experiencing and the pain and everything and what I'm
working through and how I'm finding solutions for and what
I'm grateful for, and even writing a letter to myself
in the future. And so anyway, I walk away from
there and I go to get the mail, and in
the mail is my is. I could see it's from
the healthcare clinic. And so anyway, I'm getting it and

(27:24):
as I'm opening it. As i'm opening it, I'm opening
it and I'm just like, ah, man, I really need
a win, Like, you know, things are really tough right now,
it'd be I'd really need a win right now. And
I'm reading it and it says, you know, you're a
Kolonaska be came back. Everything's benign, You're you know, you
don't need to be seen for ten years. And I
closed the letter and I just like brush it aside,
and I'm like, I really need a win right now.
And I'm like, hold on, Michael, did you just did

(27:47):
you just realize what you just read?

Speaker 2 (27:50):
Right?

Speaker 1 (27:50):
And how lucky you are. And so where I bring
up gratitude is how often we take for granted what
we have. So simple, is that right?

Speaker 2 (28:02):
It is? Yeah, as simple as getting the good news,
and we overlook those simple things like oh, it's my
test results.

Speaker 1 (28:12):
Yeah nine, okay, whatever, chuck it over to the win, right,
like I should freaking frame and now that I say it,
I should be I should freaking frame those test results
because there's no bigger win than our health.

Speaker 2 (28:28):
Yeah, especially with all the concerns that you have when
you went into it. It's a it's a relief. It's like, Okay,
that's good to know. What can I do moving forward
and keep you know, keep getting those good marks if.

Speaker 1 (28:42):
You will, you know, on the health and I got
it because I want to throw it back to you
now on the healthy here you mentioned earlier it was
so funny before we jumped on the air, you said, oh,
I noticed you were stalking me on Facebook and like
in my posts. And I was like, and in my mind,
I'm going, well, yeah, I got to get to know
my guests a little bit.

Speaker 2 (29:01):
You know.

Speaker 1 (29:01):
I read your bio, I go to your website, I
check out your socials. I want to know who I'm
talking to. And I noticed on your social that you
you're on this fitness journey, and I'd love for you
to share a little bit about that fitness journey and
what you're doing, because you're posting pictures of yourself and
in very vulnerable states. Yeah, tell us about this.

Speaker 2 (29:21):
Yeah, and I'll go live too. I don't usually paint
the barn, if you will, you know, the makeup and
all this stuff. So, oh, it's been a journey, and
I won't go too deep. But there was a time
in my life that I ate my emotions just to
hide from, you know, my then husband. It was a

(29:42):
very toxic marriage for eleven years. I've two grown adult children.
But to survive that awful environment, I just ate. I
just ate ate the bigger I got that ex husband
would leave me alone kind of thing, and I just
ate the emotions and raise my babies. And when that
marriage finally came to an end, you know, here's Carol,

(30:05):
early thirties, two hundred and fifty plus pounds alone raising
a ten and seven year old. What am I gonna do?
It was a stay at home mom, hadn't worked at
all when I raised I was a stay at home mom,
and I just ate and eight and eight and eight
and eight, and you know, I was saved from that

(30:30):
bad marriage and now I'm married, you know, twenty years,
and I just say, it's God's talk about gratitude, God's gift.
I have always believed that a woman's role is to
be a good wife and be a good mom. Those
are my two roles. Everything else was a bonus. That's

(30:50):
how I was raised and believed. Of course, that was
really when I was young, and my mind has expanded
a lot more than just that. So let me be
clear on that, because as we grow, we just grow
and learn. And so I ate eight eight eight, and
I was just this terrible blob of a hot mess,
you know, raising babies, and now here I am. I
don't have a job. I got these two kids, and

(31:11):
what am I gonna do? And so I ended up
getting a part time job and then met my now
husband through our positions in another nonprofit minustry, and then
I thought I really need to just kind of get
my life back. And so I just thought, Okay, I'm
going to start losing weight. And so I didn't get

(31:33):
on the scale. I had lost a few pounds before
I weighed at two point fifty. Okay, so that's scary.
I was like a three X. I'm like five foot
and a half inch. I'm not a giant chick. So
I was this stubby little thing, right And so then
you know, I get married and the journey continues. So
I've lost one hundred pounds and it's just a thing

(31:55):
that I do. When in that process, I became a
personal trainer in a zoomba and struck or did all
the things right. But I can't let that side of
me down or go. So I've been coaching you know,
others in their health journey for a long time. That's
why when I started seeing you out there, I was like,
oh man, you know, like all my suboddy selfies are

(32:16):
I just you know, finished workout, and I'm giving somebody
some encouragement because literally, there was a time that I
wanted to get started on a workout and the wind
for the day was I was able to reach down
and tie my shoe right because I couldn't breathe. I
couldn't do those things. And I'm you know, I'm not
some size zero. I still have a long way to

(32:37):
go in my journey and had some health complications along
the way, So the scale goes up and down and
up and down. But you know what, I show up
every single day for a workout and I'm constantly on
that journey. So that's how that kind of came into
the fold. I still coach people. I don't teach in
the local gym anymore and things like that. When I

(32:58):
stepped into this role, I kind of had to let
go with some of that, but it still show up
for that workout coach people.

Speaker 1 (33:04):
That's so motivational, like what you just said there in
terms of you know where you were and where you
are today and then posting and every day because you're
one hundred percent right in terms of you know, inspiring others.
You know behind one of you and behind you and
one of the selfies that you have. There's a fitness
instructor on the big screen and he's got ripped arms

(33:25):
and abs and he's like, he's like my dream, right,
He's like what I wish what I what I wish
I could look like?

Speaker 2 (33:31):
Right?

Speaker 1 (33:32):
Don't we all exactly? But that's not always reality, right,
And and I think it's so important for people to
see someone like you, a real person who's working a
job who's dealing with emotional and health and all the
other things, and yet still goes and hits it and
still goes to the gym and does what she needs

(33:53):
to do to be healthy. And I think that that
is so inspirational. I mean, of course his are very inspirational,
but I think the real and not that he's not
a real person. I mean every one of those people
are real people. It's just where their their attention is,
right like, as Tony Robbins says, right where attention goes,

(34:14):
energy flows, and yeah, five.

Speaker 2 (34:16):
Hours to work out every day. It looks i'd have
those cut ridges.

Speaker 1 (34:19):
And all that, and we do have that, but we
have a bigger calling and you do, and so we're
going to talk some more about that now. So I
you know, I again I just want to commend you
on your fitness journey. I love those I think those
pictures were so cool. I saw them, I was just like, oh,
it was interesting, because you know, I always look into
my gas and I'm like, Okay, what kind of conversation
we're going to have and where's this going to go? Yeah,

(34:41):
and there's just something about your facial expressions that I
was just like, I could just tell you're a very empathetic, caring,
thoughtful person. And in those pictures, those selfies that you took,
it really draws that out of like you could just
see that in you. And I'm like, Okay, I know
exactly where we're going with this woman.

Speaker 2 (35:03):
Yeah, there's there's you know, I'm not I don't have
a poker face. I guess it just there it is.

Speaker 1 (35:09):
You know, we're we're half we're halfway into our interview
and I never even asked you where you're from, but
I love to get into a little bit of a
backstory of of where you're from, especially since you're you're
you live in Georgia. I don't know if that's where
you were were born and raised, but I would love
that you could just share a little bit about your
upbringing and some mentors in your life as you started

(35:29):
getting into the non for profit world.

Speaker 2 (35:32):
Ah well, I was born in Burlington, New Jersey, so
I'm a Jersey girl. I may have lost the I
lost a lot of my It's funny, I've lost my
Yankee twang. But when I'm here, most people say, oh,
you're not from around here. And then when I go
home up North, they're like, oh, you sound so similar,

(35:52):
and it's like whoa. And then my kids will say
when they they knew they were in trouble, they're like,
you better run. Moms Yankees hanging out what So. Anyway,
So I was born in Berlinton, New Jersey, was raised
mostly in like Long Valley, New Jersey, kind of up north,
just outside of New York and so, and then when

(36:16):
I went off to college in North Carolina, my parents
did the thing. Like I went to college, they sold
the house and moved right so they moved down to Georgia.
And then I've kind of been all over the map
ever since college in North Carolina. When I was in
my first marriage, he was in the military. Part of

(36:39):
Oh I went to fight. It's fight for college, but
it's fight for university now. It was in Meisenheimer, North Carolina,
just outside Salisbury. So when I first we sounded out,
I goes Slisbury. Where's that? Then they're like, oh, you're
one of them Yanks. It's Salisbury.

Speaker 1 (37:00):
That's funny though Yank's a term down there.

Speaker 2 (37:03):
Yeah. Yeah, not as much now, you know. But when
in the eighties when I came you know, eighty seven,
when I graduated high school. Gosh, I'm feeling old and
dating myself. But that was how I started coming down south.
Was when my parents moved and I had spent some
time overseas in Norway because my ex husband was in Nato.

(37:26):
So I lived in Norway for two years and then
you know, bounced around a little and then landed in Martin, Georgia,
where it's where I've met my now husband and we've
been we're due east of Atlanta, kind of like Bulldog
Nation here in tiny Monroe, Georgia, and I just love

(37:48):
it here, and so that's that's kind of how I
landed here.

Speaker 1 (37:51):
Cool little journey there. It's funny you and I share
that in common. So I live in upstate New York,
or at least since I'm from Queens, New York, which
is the New York City, would call where I live
upstate New York. It's the Poughkeepsie area. Most people in
the Albany and North in Syracuse areas would say that
this is downstate, but being that I'm from Queens, anything
north of the Bronx is upstate. And with what you're saying,

(38:13):
I'm living here now. I'm in my twentieth year going
to twenty first up here people probably because of my
public speaking background, people don't really notice that I have
much of an accent. They you know it is, it
is kind of what it is. But my New York
City people, friends, family are just like, oh, you've turned

(38:33):
into an upstate and then upstate people like my people
in this area sometimes will be like, oh, that's that.
You know, you got that city coming out. I don't
get that city vibe that much anymore because I'm so
polished in terms of my public speaking. But when I'm
down in the city, I either sound like I'm an
Upstater or when I'm with my brother and my brother

(38:53):
in law, i am you would think I'm like out
of one of those Italian movies. The way we talk funny.

Speaker 2 (39:00):
It's yeah, you know, so I've been down south for
twenty plus years now, and so it just oh, probably
more like thirty if I own that truth, but it's
you know, so then you're just somewhere in between. But
I love getting you know, I miss you know, real food,
Like there's just no real food. They don't know how

(39:20):
to do pizza. Oh Lord save me. They can't make
a pizza. Agi. I can't find a proper HOGI anywhere.

Speaker 1 (39:27):
It's it's the challenges of it. And then and so
you're you've always well, I don't know if you've always been,
but at least in terms of like being part of
the Salvation Army for eleven years and with what you're
doing now for seven years, you've been a part of nonprofits.
What about the nonprofit space? You know, really major heart

(39:48):
saying you made you want to move into that space?
What about it inspired you to be a part of
non nonprofits?

Speaker 2 (39:55):
You know, it just kind of landed there. So, you know,
rolling backwards, it's when my ex husband and I when
we when we parted ways, he went off to Colorado
for a job and I'm like, I'm not going anywhere
else with you. That's it. So basically it was kind
of like abandoned. And a friend that my son was

(40:16):
in the cub Scouts and it was associated with the
Salvation Army and they needed a caseworker, and so the
captain at the time said, you know, hey, you need
a job and I need a caseworker. Want to work
for us? And I'm like, I don't know how to
do that. I mean, I went to school to be
a teacher, but never taught a day ever. And you know,

(40:38):
because I jumped right into just being a mom and
I loved it, and so I said, well, if you'll
train me, I'll do it. And then I've just it.
Just I grew with the Salvation Army, fell in love
with the social services stuff that I was doing for them,
and it just grew and progressed from there. So I

(40:59):
fell into it. If somebody, I even said to my
husband just the other day, if somebody would have told
me that I'd be running a successful nonprofit ministry doing
what we do, I would have laughed at them because
I never saw myself doing this. I was either going
to be as a school teacher and a mom, and

(41:20):
that's all I ever thought. I never would have thought
that all that would get here. So it just grew
and it was one new opportunity after the other. I'm like, sure,
i'll try that. I don't know what I'm doing, but
I'll figure it out. I'll learn about it. And that
was just how it happened. But I came kicking and
screaming to this job. I didn't want it.

Speaker 1 (41:43):
Who was the person that kind of mentored you or
shepherded you into it.

Speaker 2 (41:50):
You know. It was a group of people. I was
praying because I needed a new job. We're going to
get very religious if we're going down this track, Yes,
that's how I just want to go, you know. So
the the church administrator role I have for a long
time was just getting really hard to be there, and

(42:12):
they were just making changes that just weren't me, and
I thought, okay, I got to change. Something's got to change.
Nobody would hire me. Everywhere I was going looking, No,
you've been a nonprofit. How are you going to work
in a for profit? Look, I just want a job.
I'll do good. But nobody wanted to hire me. And
so I was praying with my prayer group people and

(42:36):
the church administrator came across an email where the nonprofit
that I'm working for was reaching out to pastor saying,
we're looking for an assistant executive director to train and
into this new role so that the founder of the
ministry can begin retiring. And she says, oh, this is

(42:57):
your job. I'm like, yeah, I don't think so. I
don't know anything about that topic. I don't have an opinion,
and I just I don't think I can do that
she goes, I'm telling you this job is for you,
and I'm like, yeah, I don't think so. And so
then I just I thought, well, I better just apply

(43:18):
for it. Anyway, I'm just gonna be trapped. But I
don't know anything about this ministry. So I applied, didn't
hear anything for months, and then all of a sudden,
I get an email from the lady that the founder
of this ministry, saying, we'd like to bring you in
for an interview talk about I just so I show

(43:41):
up for this interview, but I didn't even know anything
about the ministry, didn't even know they existed. I'd lived
in the same town with this ministry for fifteen years,
drove my daughter by this building to soccer practice, and
had no clue. And so I'm in the interview and
they asked me, so, what do you know about our minutes?
And I said, what I read on the internet before

(44:03):
coming here. I don't even know how to have this job,
even to this day. I spent my whole interview trying
to tell them all the reasons nation and hire me.
And here I sit, so, you know, I don't know.
So I just I didn't have a heart for it,
but the Lord just kept saying, Okay, this is what
we're doing. So I lace up my shoes and say

(44:25):
let's go, and here I am. And I had to
learn it all. I didn't know any of it. I mean,
I knew about nonprofits. I've managed people before, but I've
never run it as a whole and had to be
the face of it and learn all the things, not
just how to raise money for it and run the business,

(44:45):
but actually the day to day operations is serving the
community in it. So it's just been, ah, we're wind ride.

Speaker 1 (44:54):
There's something about prayer I think that taps into our
subconscious minds and you know, I know, you know, for
someone who like yourself, was religious and and praise to God,
it's it's God's voice. It's it's a voice that we
hear in our minds. I'm just interested in that process

(45:15):
for you, in terms of prayer and what you hear
and how you're able to kind of maybe take what
you hear and and turn it into a reality, because
I think that it applies in so many different ways.

Speaker 2 (45:30):
Sure, sure I was I was the worst at prayer
for a long time, and so I just want to
put that on the table because prayer, right, well, I'm
just you know, it's not you know, it's a it's
a hard discipline.

Speaker 1 (45:46):
Right, Okay, like doing it regularly, just and.

Speaker 2 (45:50):
Learning how to do it because you're like, I'm just
gonna you know, I'm super plain here, so this is
what you get because you know, I remember you want
me to just talk to him, like it's just a weird,
awkward thing pouring out of your heart and you're in
a room by yourself, like what is that? Right, it's
a little weird, you know, getting comfortable in that and

(46:11):
learning learning how to pray. It's just it's just been.

Speaker 1 (46:15):
Hard because I guess you did to Catholic school.

Speaker 2 (46:19):
No, I'm not. I was. I was raised Presbyterian, you know,
I grew up with Catholic friends, and that's likely different.

Speaker 1 (46:27):
I went to Catholic school. You learn how to pray there, right, Yeah.

Speaker 2 (46:35):
I'd be hard pressed in that as well. And so
it's just you know, learning how to have that conversation,
an honest conversation, and reading the Word every day and
allowing the scriptures to to talk to me. It's just
been something that's developed in me over the years because
in my younger years it was like I went to

(46:57):
church because mom and Dad made me go to church.
You know, I came back to the church, you know
when I realized, you know, my life is a mess.
I didn't know what I was going to do raising
these babies. And I found my way back in. And
then my face just continues to grow. And so my
daily like literally I'm up at four forty five, I'm

(47:18):
in there doing that workout, posting that picture that you
were talking about earlier. And then I'm in here and
I'm chatting with the Lord because I can't get through
the day without him. It's That's where I'm at in this,
and I'm pouring out my heart. Who do I need
to be praying for? Who do I need to help? Lord,
I've got this big decision, show me what is your

(47:39):
heart in this? How can you use me today? And
then I'm reading the scriptures and it just you know,
I don't I don't even know how to put it
into words, but I always know in the moment what
God needs me to do or say. And so but
it's a hard discipline.

Speaker 1 (48:00):
What about what about what you hear in terms of
a response or what the response is like allows you
to decipher what you need to do. So you mentioned
you asked a question such as, Lord, what was it
that you want me to do today? Or what is
it that you need me to do today? And then
from there you kind of you kind of go.

Speaker 2 (48:18):
About, yeah, like here's the best example that I have
of that. It's like this piece. So I don't I
don't know how much creeping you did or if you
saw my.

Speaker 1 (48:30):
That was about it, just the five likes that you got.
I saw it not but I can't do that much research,
but I saw it.

Speaker 2 (48:39):
So I did a live video a couple of weeks ago.
So we stumbled upon this piece of property, and our
ministry just paid cash and we bought a building. But
let me tell you that was a scary purchase. And
so I'm like, okay, Lord, do we bring the ministry
checkbook way down to back to be in super needing

(49:02):
to rely on? Like I got three months of payroll.
That's where I'm at. We went through this, but asking
and you get this sweet sense of peace is kind
of how he talks to me. I don't hear like
God saying, Carol, go by the building. Is this peace
that that? It's like, Okay, this seems pleasing, it seems

(49:25):
to be in line with what I understand, and I
say to him things like, if this isn't the building
for us, then make it hard, shut the door. We
can't do this, or we can't do that, And those
are the sort of the ways I had I trust
him to reveal to me. But it's this I don't know,
a sense that that he's guiding me into. I yeah, yeah,

(49:49):
these are hard to put words to.

Speaker 1 (49:51):
Yeah. Actually, I want to reflect some of the stuff
that you just said and that you did for everybody
who's listening. So one of the what I what I
just picked up on is you get a So you're
asking this question, and this is the reason why this
is important everyone is that whether you're religious or not,
or spiritual or not, or whatever it is. But your

(50:13):
meditation and mindfulness is something that I practice and I
highly recommend to everyone. However you choose to be mindful
and meditate. And what you're speaking to Carol is that
as we put the questions out into the universe, into
the spiritual realm, into God's hands. As we put the
question out, there are feelings that we receive after we

(50:36):
put the question out and sometimes the feelings can be
received as nerves or anxiety, and that might be that
might tell you something. I can't tell you what that's
going to tell you. I know what that rhyme might
feel in that moment. What you mentioned is that you
feel when it's the right one for you, write decision
for you, you feel a sense of calmness. And what
I want, what I want everybody to picture right now,

(50:59):
is what I saw you do, which is you took
your hands and you brought them below your chest and
buy your belly area, and you almost embraced yourself and
rose it up through your chest. And I'm not astute
in what any of that necessarily means, but what I

(51:19):
can say is that it's much different than putting your
arms out and putting them over your head. It's much
different than putting your arms out in front of you.
It's much different than holding them to your heart. To me,
it just says that it's like a full body experience
that you have, and that's what it speaks to for me.
So that's what I picked up on. And so I
think that part of the reason why I asked this,
of course, is because there's so many leaders listening right

(51:42):
now and every one of you are a leader. So
many leaders listening right now and have big decisions to make.
And I think when you take that moment to reflect,
to pray, to meditate, and you receive a sign of
what you're talking about. This calmness, this stillness, this excitement,
this joy, these are the different ways that you're being
spoken to as to whether the decision is a good

(52:04):
decision or not. The other thing that you mentioned is
that you said and if it's not a good decision,
then slam a door shut, make it difficult, make a challenge.
And so what that says to me is that there
are always going to be signs. There are always going
to be flags. I've had several experiences in my life
where a couple of red flags went up. You know,

(52:26):
I'm speaking with someone and a red flag goes up
and they say something else, and another red flag goes up,
and then you know, a week goes by or two
weeks go by, and something happens where I decide to
not move forward with them. But did it really happen
that I didn't decide not to move forward with them?
Or was it a choice because I had certain red
flags go up? A lot of times it was. It

(52:47):
was maybe an unconscious choice, but it was a choice.
And so these are the signs that we have to
pay attention to. Whether again, whether we're religious or not,
there are signs that happen, and I think what you're
talking about is being con just of those signs is
paying attention. Okay, you know why didn't the banker meet
with me that day to sign the loan for the
for the building? You know why did the real estate

(53:08):
agent show up twenty minutes late and I ended up
having to go to another appointment. We missed each other.
These are all reasons that this might not just be
the right deal. And again, you know, whether you're religious
or not, or believe in coincidence or not, it really
is almost the universe speaking to you and letting you know, like, hey,
you might want to just think about this some more.

(53:28):
And the other thing that you did was towards the
end there you said, I don't know how to put
it into words, and then you kind of brought your
hands together and brought them closer to your heart, and
I felt that that was awesome.

Speaker 2 (53:40):
My crosses is down here and I'm just reaching. Yeah,
you know, for whom just strengthen and give me as words,
that kind of thing.

Speaker 1 (53:49):
But I think that that says so much too in
terms of your body language, and that you know you
bring it right into your heart. Is that I don't
know how to say this, but it's in my heart.
And I think that that is all so powerful for
everyone to hear you say about when you pray, but
also just when you're reflecting, when you're meditating, when you're praying,
or when you're connecting. Is you know you've got to

(54:12):
feel it in your.

Speaker 2 (54:13):
Heart absolutely, I mean even when you think about I
mean sometimes you get around and you're out and about
and there's just that person that just doesn't vibe. They're creepy,
you get away, right. We were quick to notice those
things too, So we should notice the red flags that
that we might be picking up on as well. Not

(54:34):
just I'm always I don't want to get caught up
in what I think I'm supposed to do just because
I want want, want that, you know, but really just
sitting with it, discerning you know, Okay, is this the
next best step? Right? Is this the thing we're supposed
to do? But being in tune? What are you? What
are what are your mentors speaking into you. For me,

(54:58):
you know, it's God, And I have a trust the
group that I go to to bounce those ideas off of.
Am I going to receive them? Am I going to
accept them if they say something I don't want them
to say? Right? Those all those things, and you couple
that with with feeling. You know, what are you sensing?
What are you feeling? That mindfulness that you're speaking about,

(55:19):
that quiet one on one time. Those things are so important.

Speaker 1 (55:24):
What I love about religion is is that that mindfulness,
is that connection and reflection that that religion makes us do.
I remember many years ago, I remember thinking I would
hear about all these successful people who go through AA
and they're like, you know, I was, you know, it's
just down to the dumps and you know, recovering alcoholic

(55:45):
or recovering drunk drug addict and you know, went to
AA saved my life and then And the reason why
you hear this story is because there at the time,
I was listening to a lot of a show called
Opie and Anthony and they would have a lot of
comics on. So I'm hearing a story because it's a
success full comic and we see it in the business
world too, And I remember thinking back then, this is
well over ten years ago. You know, how can somebody

(56:09):
in that state become successful? Why are they successful? And
what I learned now is that people who are spiritual
in religion or in an AA type of program, or
even in the self or not even but in the
self development world or professional development world, is that you're
always always seeking to grow, seeking for more knowledge, but

(56:32):
always reflecting and moving forward from that reflection. And what
I mean by that is you're you're reflecting on your
your wins and also your failures, and you're not allowing
either one to define your next step. And that's right,
and so it's it's very interesting with what you were
just saying in terms of like what you have and

(56:53):
the prayer and all the people. I just I love it.
I love it. This is this is so cool. But
I want to get into your ministry because there's a
lot of that you do there too that I want
to learn from My parents and other community members. Back
in ninety three started a non for profit called Forgod
and Children of Haiti, and it's one that I support
and I'm doing a seventy two hour fast for and

(57:14):
it's tied to our heritage. I'm half Haitian, my mother's Haitian.
And it's an organization that at it's in its heyday
in the nineties, when my parents in the community was
fully behind it. It was raising thousands of dollars on
an an annual basis and on a regular consistent basis.
And since then, my parents are now seventy five, and

(57:35):
many of the board members have since passed and are
much older and are no longer a part of it.
And it's really my siblings and myself who kind of
carry the baton, but not in a unified way, not
in a way an organized way that I should say.
We are unified, but maybe not organized. And so I
have a lot of questions in what you do because
we're probably in the same similar situation, a lot worse,

(57:58):
i'd say, than when you picked up the baton at
your organization. So I'd love to dig into some of
the work that you did in order to bring it
from where it was to where it is today. And
I'll and I'll add to that question. You do consulting
and coaching for people who have nonprofits and for business leaders.

(58:20):
That's part of your business as well, it's it's not
part of the ministry, it's part of your business. And
so I think if you could, of course use your
ministry experience, but put that consultant hat on In terms
of my question of you know, when you have a
non for profit that's kind of just you know there
and it's not making any forward momentum, what are some
of the steps to take to get it to where

(58:42):
your ministry is?

Speaker 2 (58:44):
Yeah, I was. I was starting from scratch in this,
you know, so I was stepping into the role I
was learning. And so nonprofits are fragile, and this is
going to be key for you as your parents are
phasing out of the ministry. Somebody's got to become the
face of that ministry. That upsets the donors because they've

(59:08):
only known like Avon was the founder, so she'd been
running the ministry for twenty one years. Everybody that's been
giving has been giving because they had a connection with her.
Who is this person over here you're bringing in? We
don't know anything about her, and so it has to
be done very carefully, and so they were wise in

(59:30):
what they did. So when they brought me on, maybe
the budget prior to me was like I don't know,
seventy five thousand to one hundred thousand for the year.
It was a tiny nonprofit and they took a big
leap in bringing me in. So when I started, the
budget was one hundred and fifty thousand dollars and they

(59:53):
weren't even and it was literally almost deposit to deposit
figuring out how we were going to make it. And
I like the fourth employee that they had, so it was,
you know, we were bare bones with these big dreams,
and here we are putting somebody new in the seat.
How are we going to protect these donors and how

(01:00:13):
are we gonna build keep them confident that the ministry's
not going anywhere, nothing is going to change, the mission
isn't going to change. Just this person that's stepping in
to carry that mission forward. And Avon still works with me,
she's in my donor care. But it starts by getting

(01:00:35):
to learn who the donors are and getting out in
the community and so people can begin to see me
as the leader. So I spent a whole year and
all I did was go to all the any event
in town. If there was a chamber meeting, I was there.
If there was a ribbon cutting, at the new business
I was there, you know, going to every single church

(01:00:57):
that supports us, getting to know the pastor if there
was a meeting that was open to the public, this
chick was sitting in that room getting to know the
community and getting involved. If there was a wing fling,
I was at the wing fleeing. If it was a
you know, a fall festival, I was there. The ride
on the motorcycles with the American Legion. Whatever it is,

(01:01:19):
you show up, you get involved, getting people the opportunity
to know who you are. You know, because prior to that,
aren't you the lady that teaches at the zooma at
the gym? Yeah, there's a lot more to Carol than
the zoomba lady, you know. So you've got to get
out there and get connected and know them. And so

(01:01:41):
that was and so it doesn't happen overnight. You got
to build those connections. And so, you know, as I
stepped into that and grew that and started to get
to know who those donors were, then it was like, Okay,
now I kind of know who these people are and
how much they give. What do I got to do next?
So I had like had to learn and all this
on my own, you know, because I just I didn't

(01:02:04):
know anything, and this is all why trying to learn
the ministry and what it is we do at the
same time. So there were a lot of moving pieces,
and it wasn't until about two years ago. I went
two years ago, maybe three years ago. So I was
getting better at it, refining and trying to take what

(01:02:25):
I thought, yeah, you guys can do this better and
try to you know, improve them on our speaking opportunities
and figuring out how to do that better. And then
I had the privilege to sit in a room at
a training conference with doctor Henry Cloud, who is the
author of Boundaries and some other books, and he gave

(01:02:49):
this simple plan of how to connect with donors and
I took that and I ran with it, and I thought, yeah,
I don't know how I'm going to do this, and
so out of that I developed like a five y
five donor connect plan. And I realized that I had
all these people and they were giving money to the Ministry,

(01:03:11):
but I had no idea why they were giving So
how did I even know if I was you know,
we were just filling up their inbox with all these things.
The open rates were pretty good. But I didn't know
if I was connecting with any of them because I
had no idea why they were giving, and so I thought, okay, well,
how am I going to fix that? So then it's

(01:03:32):
smile and dial. Next thing I knew, I'm like, come
on down, I want to have a tour. I'd like
to get to know you. And so then it meant
I had to have phone conversations, send individual emails to
people because I had no idea why they were giving.
So I did not just know and identify who was giving.
But then I realized, you know, okay, now I got

(01:03:53):
to connect with these people because I need to put
my Columbo hat on and figure out why they're given. Right,
And so then I started having conversations and then I
started listening more, and then these people just started becoming
a part of my life. And the next thing I know,
I'm writing them a little note congratulations on your grand baby,
well done on your retirement, or I'm so glad you know,

(01:04:16):
congratulations on your first baby. Oh you got three puppies, right,
they're excited to know that you notice that they got
all these puppies or whatever it is. But really connecting
with them because so often nonprofits treat their donors like
an ATM and they're not your personal ATM, and we

(01:04:38):
can't treat them like that. Oh we need money, give, gift, give,
But what have you done in between to help them
be seen and heard and connected to your ministry? Those
things are so important and when you do that, over time,
they just you can't. You could go to them with anything,

(01:04:59):
and they're excited and they're fired up because it's not
just them writing an empty check. They're a part of
the process. They're a part of the journey. I'm a
part of their life, they're a part of mine. And so, yeah,
you can't do that with all of your donors, but
if you're making an effort to do that with key
donors and adding people and adding people into that communication plan,

(01:05:23):
you just get these rich relationships that are so much
more than just serving the people you're trying to serve.
But you become a part of their life. They're encouraging you,
you're encouraging them, and you're just building this incredible relationship.
And then as they you know, if you've got a

(01:05:44):
younger person, as they grow and they become you know,
they're getting more income. Those gifts get bigger and get
bigger and bigger and bigger, and so it's just understanding
how to nurture and connect with them in a variet
any ways. And so when I work with people one
on one, I mean it took donor. I had to
drill down into my donor database and understand who these

(01:06:08):
people were. And so when I help other ministries do this,
you know, I roll up my sleeves. I mean we're
deep diving and we're looking at your database. Do you
know this person? Do you know why they give? Do
they even know what your mission statement is? Right? These
things all matter? And so that's really and in how

(01:06:29):
I did it, and it just builds up over time.
And so now we look in at a six hundred
thousand dollar budget. Last year we broke two ministry records
and last week Thursday, we wired money and paid cash
for that building I told you about. We're moving into

(01:06:49):
a medical clinic debt free. I mean, we're starting over
building those funds back up. But we're nonprofit. We're not
supposed to keep that money. We're supposed to keep pushing it.
And so it's exciting, you know, to see how those
relationships will shift you from this poverty mindset of oh goodness,
am I going to have to cut programs? Oh goodness,

(01:07:11):
are we going to make payroll? And you shift to
an abundance mindset that that's key changing those soundtracks in
your head. You got to get rid of the garbage.
People are excited to give for a reason. You just
got to know why and give them what they want
to know. And it's beyond just the ministry. You need

(01:07:34):
to know your donors. So I don't know if that
helps that.

Speaker 1 (01:07:42):
I wrote down a lot of notes in terms of that.
There was a lot of learning right there, and I'll
reflect some of it back to you, and I also
have some follow up questions and so for everybody listening,
especially my parents, now especially myself really in terms of
what I want to do for that return of Haiti.
A couple of things that I heard you say that
I think are vital here is is digging into the

(01:08:05):
why are they giving you? You said it a few times.
It's important, you know, it's you know, back to the
whole public speaking conversation that we had, It's the same thing.
It's it's why are they there? You know, if if
we're on stage speaking and we don't know why we're
you know, why are our audience is there? Then we're

(01:08:26):
speaking at the thin air and you know, I speak
a lot on leadership and if I'm if my audience
could care less about leadership, and you know, they want
to learn about how to get fit. Let's say, right,
and they only want to learn about how to get
big biceps and six pack abs that we were joking
about earlier. That's what they want to learn about. Nothing
wrong with that, right there, they're there for a bodybuilder conference,

(01:08:48):
let's say. And I get on stage and I don't
know why they're in the audience, and I just start
speaking about leadership and how to connect with your team
and create a winning culture. Well, I just missed the
mark by I like a million feet miles, right, So
I think I hope that that also helps everybody really
see what we're talking about here, is that you know,

(01:09:09):
why are they giving why? You know? Yes, yes, the
reality is yes, people will cut a check because it's
just part of their habit. It's part of maybe their
text right off, or something about the mission spoke to them,
and the mission has a really good way of following
up and just asking for that donation and so yep,
they're they're solid for twenty five bucks a month. But

(01:09:30):
imagine if you told them why they're giving that twenty
five bucks a month, that might turn into all, oh yeah, right.

Speaker 2 (01:09:35):
Be comes a lot bigger. Zero was on the end
of that check.

Speaker 1 (01:09:39):
That's right when you turn into the Y. So I
think that that's huge and I think we could kind
of and I wrote down mistake here, and I thought
this was so so key in that treating your donors
like an ATM. You said that, and I was like, wow,
I could see you saying that to ten thousand people
with your glasses on, right, because isn't that the mistake

(01:10:02):
we make? I mean, I'm I'm definitely somebody who's done
that right where it's like this blanket, Hey give us,
you know, give us money for this, for that, you
know what I remember for N ninety five masks during COVID,
and it's just it's just, yeah, they get that, they
get that thank you email response because they gave a
PayPal donation, but they didn't get a true thank you

(01:10:25):
from me, and they didn't really see that the money
bought N ninety five masks or who it really helped
in Haiti. And so to that point, it's treating them
like an ATM. It's saying, just give me money, Just
give me money, just give me money. And I knew
that there was some there was some burnout on my
end when I was doing that, because I was just like,

(01:10:46):
I'm tired of asking for money. And I think back
to your point, Yeah, that's what's going to happen, because
they're also tired of giving you money. When you go
back to the why, it's no longer an ATM, because
you know why they're giving money, and you're giving them
a reason to give them money. And I think what
the big part to all of that is what you
said is that personal connection. Is that you started drilling

(01:11:09):
down and creating a personal connection with as you said,
not every single one of your donors. It's almost impossible
when you get to a certain size. But as as
much as you can to write a handwritten letter, to
send a thoughtful email, to make a thoughtful post, to
be in contact on a personal level with your donors

(01:11:32):
and let them know here's the impact that you've created.
You know, it doesn't always have to be you know,
congratulations on your first baby or whatever it is. It
could simply be you all donated x amount and here's
where that money went, and it's that communication. So I
thought that was so huge and I want to just
kind of really highlight this for everyone listening and what

(01:11:53):
you said, know why and what they want to know.
And I thought that that was so huge. And so
my follow up question to all of that, which you
gave us so much, is you have your five x
five card. Is all of that on the five by
five card or is there something else in all of
that that you want to add to it?

Speaker 2 (01:12:13):
Well, my five by five tracker, I'm just making sure
like I'm looking at because it does lead up to okay,
so you're connecting with them, but that way when you're
inviting them. I use this especially for my boarder directors.
It invite them to our major fundraising event, and so
that five by five or these are the critical ways
we're connecting over five months, so that when we invite

(01:12:37):
them to gala, our major fundraising event every year, they're
not automatically thinking, oh, a gala, that means it's gonna
cost me money. No, they are so fired up because
they know what's going on. They're excited about the vision.
They're excited about the stories and celebration that they're gonna hear,

(01:12:58):
and then they're gonna want to bring all their friends,
and then you have this huge event that's successful. But
you can't just all of a sudden, put a five
week email campaign in and hope that they're all going
to come all fired up and ready to write a check.
It doesn't work that way. You have to build those relationships.
And I want to put a pause here. If you

(01:13:21):
are not a nonprofit and listening to this, just flip
the coin. You need to know why your customer is
shopping from your company. You're not going to be able
to call every single customer that walks through your business door.
But again, getting in tune with your why your people
are shopping with you, you could do the same thing

(01:13:43):
in that in the same way. It doesn't just have
to be for a nonprofit. You know, if you've got
a coaching business or you're you know, got a brick
and mortar, get to know Susie that's coming in and
buying a cup of coffee every week with her bagel, right,
just get to know her a little. But so these
things were beyond just you know and nonprofit fundraising. There
are lots of ways to apply communication and connecting, even

(01:14:08):
if you just apply it to a family member like
Aunt Susie that drives you crazy and you've got to
fix that relationship, you know, or whatever. You just apply
these things and make them work. Life is so much
better when we do.

Speaker 1 (01:14:20):
Yeah, and you said, and it builds that excitement. I
like that too. So you're yeah. So in you're five
by five, you're talking five months prior. You're getting to
know them, you're connecting with them, you're finding out why
are they being a part of it, You're giving them
what they want. So if they're saying, hey, I'm a
part of this because I want to help you know,
part of and we're going to get into what you
do in your organization and your ministry, but I want

(01:14:43):
to help these babies see Christmas and and all these
different things that you do. Okay, now you know that
that's what you're going to give them more of. Or
maybe they're saying, hey, you know what I really enjoy
sending clothes your way. Okay, great, that's what I'm gonna
speak to you more on, is the clothes or the
donation side of things. And so I love this build
up and then what you said excitement and then the

(01:15:04):
gala is excitement, and you know you're saying that, and
it's bringing back memories for me with when I'm saying
about Forgotten Turn of Haiti being at its at its peak,
my parents and again other family members who were involved
and on the board. But you know, my parents are
the ones that I knew because I lived in their house,
so I knew it was going on behind the scenes.

(01:15:25):
They would so we Forgotten Turn of Haiti started, and
it was the reason why it started. And I'll be
brief because I want to get into your ministry. The
reason why it started was my mother's Haitian and my
father's in the medical field, and he had done a
trip to Haiti and to visit some orphanages that we
had already been donating to a on a non formal level.
We had been donating. We had a connection with a

(01:15:45):
priest called father named Father Rick Foschett, who is vital
to this whole conversation, and so we had a connection
with him, and so we were donating to this orphanage.
And so my father went there with my grandmother and
another friend, another Pa physician's assistant, and they were recorded
and they saw and I remember seeing the recordings of
these babies. And at the time, it's when the Aige
crisis with its peak and Haiti and they recorded these

(01:16:09):
babies and all this other stuff, and I remember seeing this,
and they came home and my father had said to
my mother, we got to do something. And that's when
they formalized for God and Children of Haiti, and that's
where the name came from. And from there as a community.
And back to exactly what you're saying, I think that
this is really putting what you're saying into reality. Is
that from there At the same time, excuse me, at

(01:16:30):
the same time, my mother had organized a French Mass
at our in our parish every month, so we were already,
to your point, building this community on a monthly basis.
And the French Mass would take place once a month
and it was always followed by an hour get together
coffee and bagels and doughnuts and cookies and different Haitian

(01:16:55):
pets and different Haitian foods, and music sometimes and on
all these different things. And then slowly they would start
having like the little masquerade ball, and slowly we would
have these dinners and the whole community would come together.
And then when FCCH was formalized, those things became more
of an FCCH thing of like donations for FCCH after

(01:17:16):
the Mass and the dinner for FCCH after the Mass.
And then soon we would have what would be something
like our big Gallo where we would have an art
show and the art show, the whole community would come
together and we'd build these beautiful big structures to house
Haitian art and we had famous Haitian artists come through

(01:17:38):
and sell their paintings, making a donation to Forgot in
turn of Haiti. And so with what you're saying, I
witnessed and didn't realize what I was witnessing. It's everything
you said is that from the beginning, there was a cause.
There was a reason why we got involved, which were
the babies and the orphanage and the hospital and soon

(01:17:59):
to be and there was a reason. It was a
why everybody was bought into that why there was a
community around it that was always being fed information and
given back to in terms of the mass and the
donuts and the coffee and the conversations. And we had
all these little dinners and festivities that led into our

(01:18:21):
big fundraising gala, which was our art show where I
mean paintings sold for like fifty grand at these art shows.
I mean, you know they weren't cheap and people were
showing up and buying them. How was that possible? It
was what you said. They were excited, So I love
you know you said all of that, and it just
brought that up and I just was just like, this
is so tangible, and I want to get to your

(01:18:42):
minutes sture.

Speaker 2 (01:18:42):
For sharing that story. That is just beautiful. And see
that just in watching you, because I don't guess they're
going to see but you're just like you're just pouring
it out with such passion and excitement. That really touched
you and it made an impression and I could it's
just oozing out of you. So that's really cool. Sorry

(01:19:03):
about that, I mean to derail you, but you're very
passionate about No.

Speaker 1 (01:19:08):
You did not derail me whatsoever. You are tapping right
into what you know, which is I am. I could
feel it. It's true. It's I can see it because
I lived it, and I have some wonderful memories of
the art shows and everything, and and you're helping me
see what I'm missing right now for what we need
to do. So no, you're you never do that's right,

(01:19:33):
you can't. You can't derail me. I'm we're here together.
I told you that, and I love this, and yeah,
you know it was it really was a wonderful experience.
And I was just a young boy and it really
did have an impression on me. So it was really cool.
I would love to now get into your ministry and
the work that you do because we talk so much
about your background and your passion and how you help
other people, and you just helped me and my goodness,

(01:19:55):
it was like a little coaching session. Thank you for
my free thirty minute session that I get with you.
That's but you also this ministry that you you have
it as I as I kind of just touched on
something like I think two hundred and twelve babies got
to see their first Christmas because of the work that
you do. So I'd love if you could share some

(01:20:16):
about this ministry and the word that you speak.

Speaker 2 (01:20:20):
Okay, yeah, so gosh, it's such a joy and I
get a little emotional and to try to keep it
in chest.

Speaker 1 (01:20:27):
That's all right. I got tissues and so do you.
So we're good to go. All right, get your box
ready everyone.

Speaker 2 (01:20:33):
Yeah. So you know, so the founder of this ministry
of Vonn had two abortions over her lifetime, and when
she came to the Lord, her heart was broken and
she she always just says, the Lord whispered to her

(01:20:54):
heart that she wanted to help other women not feel
the pain that she had carried all those years out
of that guilt, and so she started a Center of
Hope way back in think seventy nine eighty. Anyway, we're
twenty eight years old. You'll have to do the math.
I don't do math. And so out of that she

(01:21:15):
wanted to put a resource center together to help other
women and help them find healing after and that resulted
in to this beautiful ministry where we're providing no charge
pregnancy tests, no charge ultrasounds, We do birthing classes, we
do options counseling. So if she wants to carry her

(01:21:38):
baby but place the child in adoption, we help facilitate that.
We have fatherhood programs and we just mentor these moms
and we help them, you know, make a life plan
for their child. We do not perform abortions. We do
not refer for them. But if she chooses that and
wants to come back and just have somebody that has

(01:22:00):
had an abortion walker through that healing process, we're there
and everything we do is free of charge, and it's
just the honor to be able to, you know, help
people through the process. Our youngest girl right now is
twelve years old. That's a sixth grade child, a child

(01:22:21):
having a child, and you know, so you know, there's
just a lot of things in that and being able
to just come up alongside families and equip them with
what they need and help them make a life plan
for that child, whether they're placing in a loving home
for adoption or we're helping them parent. It's just this

(01:22:45):
beautiful experience. And we're helping men. We have a fatherhood
mentorship program where other men will come in and mentor
these men and help them learn to be a dad.
And two years ago we launched an abortion recovery program
for men because I speaking in the churches or the
community and then men, I was finding these men coming

(01:23:07):
up and they're just sobbing and just saying, you know,
it never occurred to me that you know, I drove
my sister to have an abortion and I feel guilty
about that, or I pressured my girlfriend and or a
couple of weeks ago, I had a guy come up
and say he went to a college reunion and found

(01:23:28):
out his college girlfriend sweetheart aborted their child and didn't
tell him. And now he's like, I was a dad
and didn't know it, and I don't know how to
process that. That's huge. Families are hurting, and we just
decided to fill that gap. So all of our ministry

(01:23:48):
programs are free of charge because of our donors, and
we meet them where they are and we're just a
safe place to talk if you want to talk. And
we're providing those medical services, you know, up to an
extent for no charge. I'm gonna have an ob on
hand one day, and I'm gonna walk them all the

(01:24:09):
way through that pregnancy outside our educational components. Because they're
earning diapers and wipes and their pack and play, they
get a brand new car seat, all of those things
are free. Most moms stay with us until they're about
eight the baby's eighteen months, and because they just feel
loved and accepted, because sometimes we're the only family that

(01:24:29):
that young mom may have, and so you know, not
all of them are you know, young, you know, because
we have women in their thirties forties, we've had some like, oh,
we thought we were done. Surprise, you know, we're gonna
start all over again, honey. And so some are crisis
pregnancies and some are just families that need a little

(01:24:50):
extra help to get through their pregnancy. We get to
open our door for that. And so that's like a
really brief overview of what we do. It's it's not complete.
We have a mobile unit too, as well as two
brick and mortar locations, and we are completely diffree by
the way. That's important.

Speaker 1 (01:25:08):
That is very important, and that speaks to the business
side of things and your leadership and how you do
how you how you do your leadership. And we'll get
there in a second. I just want to stay where
we are here. The mobile unit is a newer piece
to to your to what you do, just because this
does really hit me and and I'm sure it hits

(01:25:30):
so many out there, the twelve year old. How do
you guys deal with that? And you don't have to
get into too many specifics about it, but you know,
obviously there's I mean not obviously, but at least, I'm
assuming there's a lot at play here that just isn't right,

(01:25:50):
and so I'm just my question really lies in the
sense of like how how how do you deal with that? Yeah,
it's just like soch a, That's all I got for you,
is like, how do you deal with that?

Speaker 2 (01:26:01):
How do you help with this one? Yeah, this one
was a little unique. This is not our first twelve
year old. We had one that was a couple of
years ago a victim of you know, an assault, and
so that's you know, we're mandatory reporters and we you know,
we do we follow the letter of the law in

(01:26:21):
those things. This particular group, uh, this little couple was
a twelve and thirteen year old. It was a yeah,
and you know, their families get together all the time,
and they were just unattended for a short time, and
so the families are coming up alongside them. So this
was a very interesting situation. But we are not well

(01:26:45):
equipped in you know, how do you teach a child
to parent a child. You know, we have a lot
of great resources, and it's you know, when you really
think about the sixth grader, that's you know, frightening.

Speaker 1 (01:27:03):
And so I feel, yeah, like it's almost like unfair
to them too, like to not have a childhood, right.

Speaker 2 (01:27:13):
And so, and we don't always get to know the
other side of the story. Sometimes we're just confirming the
pregnancy and we're doing that ultrasound, and sometimes they just
move on and and we don't know what they have
or haven't done. And with this particular situation, their parents
are coming up alongside them, and the parents are going
to raise the baby and then the kids will go

(01:27:35):
back to being kids. That's their family plan. But it
looks different for so many people. All we do is
we're a safe place for them to get the resources
that they need. And this family, they're just handling it
all privately, so we're not really going to be a
part of that journey. And I you know, and we've

(01:27:55):
been praying harder, what can we how can we better
serve children? How do we protect our children in this?
And I don't know what that looks like. I don't
even know how to begin to protect our children, you know,
I mean this was just two kids on their own.

Speaker 1 (01:28:15):
What's some of the support that you provide these younger couples.

Speaker 2 (01:28:20):
Well, with younger couples, like I said, we have we
have trained advocates that meet with them weekly, and so like,
if she's let's just say she's a fifteen year old
girl pregnant, she has no idea what's going to even
be going on in her body, and so we're starting
with that and we're walking, Okay, this is what your
body's doing. These are the things that are going to happen,

(01:28:42):
this is what the emotions you're going to feel, these things, right,
we're walking with her through that process. And so each
step of the way, it's built on their program, like
they're meeting their needs. So if this is her third pregnancy,
we're looking at a whole different thing. If she's married

(01:29:03):
and established, we're helping them in a different way. So
each you know, each situation is so unique that we
just have the tools to match it up. For her,
she's living on somebody's sofa, We're gonna help her get
a job. We're gonna help her builds out, you know,
the resume she needs or get the skills that she needs,

(01:29:25):
and connect her in ways where she can get off
of the friend's sofa and build a life for her
and her child. And so it just it's just so
unique though, and so it's but in general we're there
with we're just life affirming resources. If I can't buy
it or do it, I know how to get her

(01:29:46):
the help she needs, or him the help because we
do come up alongside that dad too, he's a vital
part of that process.

Speaker 1 (01:29:54):
Oh my goodness. Yeah, I mean as a father myself,
I see that. You know it's you know, my my
wife does always. I used to like to think that
it was fifty to fifty, but it certainly isn't, and
it just isn't. Like I'll hear the girls like, I'll
be this is my favorite. I'll literally be sitting in

(01:30:15):
front of them. I will literally be like, I'm not
even like when I know I over use the word literal,
I know that I use I over use the word literal,
But in this situation, I'm saying, like Denise and Tentley
can see my eyeballs and I can see their eyeballs.
They will be looking at me and they will say, Mommy,
can you please or can I have or can we go?

(01:30:36):
And I'm like, I'm right here. People, but they know
they know who makes the decisions, but also they also
know who's going to get it for them, Like can
I get a cup of water? And I'm like right,
I'm like I could get you the cup of water.
They're like, yeah, but we know that we're gonna have
to ask five times before you get up. Michael Nice,
I got to teach them to get their own right,

(01:30:56):
be the dependent. That's what dads are there for. But
but yeah, I think that that's obviously a vital part
is mentoring the dads. Because you know, I was driving
with my daughter the other day, So this is what happened.
I coached basketball, and I coached my daughter's basketball teams.
And my older daughter, her name is Denise, she's nine,

(01:31:17):
and then my younger daughter is Tenley, she's six. And
on Tuesday nights, I take Tenley to the to the
practice because I want her to get engaged in the
practice for next year in basketball. And this particular Tuesday's
it was our last practice, and so I created a
parent's kids game, and so my wife was coming and
so was Tenley, and I thought Tenley was going to

(01:31:37):
go with my wife. And so I'm headed out the
door and Telly comes running. She go, I'm going with you, dad,
And I was like what really, Like, why aren't you
going to with mom, like like I said, like eyeball
to eyeball, and they'll ask for her and I'm like,
why don't you going to and she goes, I want
to go with you. I want to go with you.
So anyway, so we get in the car and we're
driving and I go, why do you want to go
with me? And she goes cause I like you? And
I was like, what, Like Tenley's funny, she literally said that.

(01:31:57):
She goes cause I like you, and I go, I go,
why do you like me? She goes cause you're my dad?
Like duh, Like not dad. But what I'm saying is,
you know, this is the mind of a six year old,
and that's as simple as it is for them. But
really what she's saying is, you know, because you're there
for me, because you're you do all these other things
like me, because of all this stuff. And so I

(01:32:18):
think it's so important that these dads who are part
of these families that are maybe disjointed or for the
first time or really young, or don't have the support
or haven't had the role models in their lives. I
see the importance of them learning how to be a
part of that child's life because even if they're going
to ask for mom all the time, even if they're
going to rely ninety percent on mom, that ten percent

(01:32:42):
is huge in that kid's life. And it's more than
ten percent, but you know, right.

Speaker 2 (01:32:47):
But absolutely, yeah. Uh.

Speaker 1 (01:32:50):
The other part I wanted to ask you about your
ministry is we talked about you getting on stages. We
talked about you going to thirty churches, fifty churches something
you said like that, and you're going out and you
have this consistent message. I am very interested in this
message that you share. And the reason why I ask
this question is business and non for profit are different

(01:33:11):
in a way because you know, in a business, there's
a product that someone's buying and they're going to use it.
So if if I'm pitching a product and I know
why people are there to buy it, of course, right,
we talked about that earlier. I know they're buying it
because it's gonna they're going to use it in their life,
and I just need to share that with them. When
we're talking non for profit, we're talking donations and fundraising.

(01:33:31):
This isn't something they're going to use in their life.
This is something that is unique and touching to them
and Also, you're not the only non for profit that
goes into their church, so there are other things that
are unique and touching to them and that they want
to donate too as well. So what is it about
your message and your messaging that reaches people to the

(01:33:54):
point where they want to donate and they want to
give more? And you know, of course this is with
the underlying of knowing why they're and giving them and
all those other things. But really what I'm focused on
in this question is your messaging.

Speaker 2 (01:34:06):
Yeah, so I've learned to tell her story. I don't
go in and just say hey, we call it a
baby bottle boomerang is what we call it. We have
these little bottles and I get to go in and
they'll take a bottle home and they fill it up
with change your dollars and they bring it back and
so we call it our baby bottle boomerang campaigns. Some

(01:34:30):
have heartbeat campaigns, whatever they want to call it. But
I give them an open heart story. I'm just telling
them the story. And I mean, I could just tell
you one if that's which is that helps, but so
we I'll just I'll just do it. Yes, I'm on stage.

(01:34:52):
I don't have my glasses on, but let's pretend that
you're actually on and working into your eyes. So this
this mom comes in and uh oh man ah, she's
pretty sure she's pregnant. They've got three kids at home,
dad's already working two jobs, and she just knows she's

(01:35:14):
pregnant again. So we meet with her. We talk with her,
and she is adamant she's aborting that child. They can't,
they cannot have another mouth to feed. She refuses to
tell her husband that he's got one more mouth that
he's got to feed. So she's just overwhelmed and she
just doesn't want to bring this into their already difficult

(01:35:36):
family life. And of course that pregnancy test confirmed her
white worst nightmare, and we prayed with her. She sobbed.
She said, you know, God's gonna forgive me if I
have this abortion, that's fine, but I can't do this.
She got in there and had that ultrasound and you know,

(01:35:56):
saw that baby, that heartbeat, and she just saw and
she's like, I just can't do this to my husband.
I just can't. We've already got kids and I just
can't do this. And so we tried to follow up
with her. She was going to have that abortion, and
we always call, We always invite them back in to talk,

(01:36:18):
let us walk you through that healing process. We hear nothing,
and so sometimes we just don't know what's going to happen,
but we still fight to teach her the truth, help
her see that she's got a safe place to come
to without judgment. We're just here for whoever needs us,

(01:36:41):
and we're going to help them and we're going to
walk with them. And so I just wanted to thank
you for your support, your mission. Support is really impacting lives,
whether we see it on the front end or we don't.
And I just want to give you three ways today
that you can get involved, how you can be available
for women like her that come through our doors, no

(01:37:03):
matter the result. And then that's when I open up
the opportunity for them to serve and our centers come volunteer,
spend some time talking with a mom or dad, help
them navigate how to parent. Or if you're not comfortable
and you don't want to meet with them, there are
plenty other ways. You could write a thank you note,

(01:37:25):
You can sort donations. We have a Hope closet that
you can organize and make the baby boutique absolutely beautiful
for mom to shop in. But if you feel led
to serve in this ministry, we can plug you in.
We need prayer warriors. Would you just stop and pray
that the girl that's home alone and afraid to pick
up the phone. Would you just pray that she knows

(01:37:47):
and makes that appointment and comes in and lets us
help her and love on her. Would you pray for
the person that's going to serve her. And if you
feel led to give financially, we're going to ask you
to do that. We're going to provide a way to
do that. And today you're going to take home this bottle,
pray about it, share it with your family, think about

(01:38:08):
that girl that's going to be impacted. How many diapers
and wipes that can buy for a mom They can't
afford it, but give as you feel it led to give.
And then we provide those options. And then I say, oh,
you didn't think I was going to leave you hanging
about that, mom? Did you? Well? Let me tell you
a couple of weeks ago, we were at a fall
festival and this mom walks up to us and says, hey,

(01:38:31):
do you remember me? And of course we did, but
we never approached them in the community. We want to
honor that because some women come and see us because
and they don't want anyone to know they've been. But
she comes up and she said, I just wanted to
thank you for being there when I was terrified, and
I want to introduce you to someone. And out from

(01:38:55):
behind her came that stroller and that sweet little baby
who was almost two at this point. And so we
had been praying for her, not knowing what decision that
family made, but because we listened, because we didn't judge
her for her decision to think I wasn't going to
tell my husband that we had one more mouth to feed. No,

(01:39:18):
we just received her where she was, and we loved
her where she was, and we accepted that decision. Whether
it's my personal preference or not, is not the thing there.
But we met her where she was, and then wasn't
a year later, a little over a year, we found
out that she chies life. And then right behind that

(01:39:40):
baby was dad with one of the other kids bouncing
on his shoulder. And we got to meet the dad
who thanked us for saving his family. And so that's
the impact your gift is making. And I just want
to thank you for that, and I pick up says,

(01:40:01):
I pick up my glasses and I walk off the stage.
And so that's how you get people to connect with
your ministry. You tell them a story that they can
find themselves in and they connect. God does the work
or however that works for them, but that's how they

(01:40:21):
get connected. They need to see and hear the impact.
Not all of them have good endings. Someday I'll tell
you the twin story or you could go look that
one up too, but it's just incredible. When you connect
the story to the mission, to the ask, it all

(01:40:45):
comes together. And it's not just asking them to be
that ATM. Can you just be a prayer warrior for us?
Or if you know someone, because you know, I get
a lot of older people, older men and ladies, and
the ladies like, well, I have no more babies, I'm ninety.
You know how am I gonna? Hell? Oh, you can pray?

(01:41:06):
Or what if you're having a conversation with your niece
or another family member, Now you know there's a resource
that she can go to for free services. Right, that's
how you help. And so that's how I connect people
to our ministry and that's how I share and communicate that.

Speaker 1 (01:41:25):
Message, and you do that effectively.

Speaker 2 (01:41:30):
Thank you. And yeah, I was stumbling a lot.

Speaker 1 (01:41:32):
No way. You had me in tears as you can
see for and you know, I mean part of part
of while you were sharing it. I actually didn't know
that you were giving your actual I guess talk that
you do because it did feel very one to one.
It wasn't until you kind of let me know, and
then that's when I asked for the donation or whatever

(01:41:54):
it was that you said. I was like, oh wait, okay,
she's actually in it right now. I'll tell you when
you talk about seeing that that mother again in the stroller,
and I was like, whoop, that was it? Like I was,
I was keeping it together and then you hit me
with that one there and then boom. It really got
to me in my heart. And so I can see
how that can really translate to others and really move

(01:42:16):
move them to do something. I'm also curious in terms
of like mentorship and mentor programs, because you are in
Georgia and you know, outside of being able to ship
you things, do you offer mentorship and things of that
nature to via zoom? Is that something or is it
all in person.

Speaker 2 (01:42:36):
For the clinic services that we provide, or me helping
other directors. I want to make sure.

Speaker 1 (01:42:43):
Oh well, I guess we could answer both. So where
I'm asking is because you got me in my heart.
You you shot the arrow and it hit and I'm
thinking about the dads and what I had said earlier,
and I'm just as you were saying it. I was like,
all right, I don't know how I could help her,
but maybe I can jump on a zoom and be
like a mentor to somebody dads, but I can't be
there because it's in Georgia. So that you guys offers

(01:43:05):
in person.

Speaker 2 (01:43:07):
We do have some zoom opportunities, but we have super
strict criterias to work with that mom and dad and
there is a very deliberate process in that. And so
you know, I'm not saying no, but not just for.

Speaker 1 (01:43:22):
Me, but for anybody listening. Of course.

Speaker 2 (01:43:24):
Yeah, that's that's so true. But we do, you know,
because our patients and moms and dads are coming in person,
and so a lot of it is in person ventoring
in that way. But you know, during COVID we had
to shift and so we did do some zoom related

(01:43:44):
but we have to be really careful with Hippa and
all the things. No worries.

Speaker 1 (01:43:48):
You got some prayer warriors here for you and thinking
about those people that you serve, because I mean, that
story was very touching, and I had heard a quote
or saw a quote. I forget how how it came
about where it said when someone says they're praying for you,
that they are speaking to God about you, And think
about how powerful that is. And again, you know, regardless

(01:44:12):
of religious beliefs or spirituality beliefs, just like when someone's
praying for you or saying you know you're in like
I say more, I usually say to someone, you're in
my thoughts today. You know that's saying that like I'm
pushing everything out of my mind and I'm thinking of you,
I'm thinking of your family, I'm thinking of you, and
it's so it's a direct path to my consciousness, to

(01:44:32):
my spirituality, to my universe, to your God, to my God,
to whatever it is. And so so you, you and
your people are all in my thoughts today. So you
got a prayer worrior right here in terms of what
you just mentioned, of what you offer in terms of
your counseling and your coaching. Is that something that you
offer on Zoom?

Speaker 2 (01:44:54):
I do, I mean with people regularly. Sometimes executive directors
are too busy with them, but most of the time
we might just be on a phone call and I'm
helping them cultivate those relationships. I'm helping them build out
their annual plans of how they're communicating with their donors.
I do all of that just depending on what at

(01:45:16):
what level they want to work at that I didn't
want to circle back to the other they can volunteer.
We do have things like Amazon lists where they can
send diapers and wipes and things like that, and you know,
so those are other ways that people help. A lot
of places have baby showers for us and then deliver
you know, the baby items to us or ship them
via Amazon that kind of thing, and so virtual, you know,

(01:45:40):
baby showers can be done.

Speaker 1 (01:45:41):
So we'll definitely have to have those links in the
show notes for everybody listening here is that we'll have
those We will get those links into the show notes
for you so that you can find that Amazon list
and be able to send something. I think just amazing.
Your messaging is so spot on. From from now I'll
put the I'll put the effective communication public speaking coach

(01:46:01):
hat on, and you really do I mean you you,
Like I said, from an evaluator standpoint, which is sometimes
what I do in toast Masters, you connected with me.
I really felt like you were telling me the story.
And only because of this formatting that we're in, you
kind of shifted, you put a different hat on to

(01:46:23):
let me know what you were going to do next.
But I can see that if you're standing in front
of me, you're delivering that. I could feel the emotion
behind it. There's the because there's such a connection between
you and that mom, whether you met her or not,
or it was a story that was shared with you,
there's a believability behind it all of like, okay, I

(01:46:45):
know that that what's happening, what she's telling me is true.
And you're painting the picture so beautifully in a way
where I can visualize. I can see the ultrasound happening.
I can see you at the out in the public
and her coming up with the stroller. You know, so
you did such a great job of effectively painting that

(01:47:08):
picture and then sprinkling in there how people can help.
And the other thing I liked about the way that
you sprinkled in there. How people can help is that
you made it very clear it doesn't have to be monetary.
And I think that that's another thing that we all
that many businesses and non for profits fall short on,
is there's this expectation of purchase or donation in that

(01:47:30):
I'm here for you to get to buy for me,
I'm here for you to give me donations. And when
we put that expectation on our audience, it's almost unfair
to them because they're like, well, what the heck am
I here for. I thought I was here for an
educational seminar. I thought I was here to learn about
your ministry. And so when you remove the expectation and say, hey,
I really just want you to learn, and you know,
get the free consultation with me so that you can

(01:47:50):
learn more and if you want to move forward with me,
then of course I have a fee because we can't
work for free. And it's the same with the donation
if you want to. I love the Prayer Warrior, and
I just I think you did such a great spot
on job in your message.

Speaker 2 (01:48:04):
It's taken years to perfect it, lots of falling down
you know, and you just learn from it. And literally
that three minute speech, well it was a slightly different story,
but I raised one hundred and eight thousand dollars on
just that three minute talk in multiple churches. And so

(01:48:25):
it's just you have to you got to connect. It
all starts with sparking that connection and being clear about it.
It's the intention, you know, and the intentionality behind it.
And I get all fired up and I you know,
and I've come a long way because when I agreed
to take this job, like one of the things is

(01:48:46):
I've never had an abortion, and I don't have that experience,
and I'm like, how could I lead a ministry? How
can I lead a team when it's not a part
of my story? How am I supposed to do that?
But I that I had so much brokenness in my
own self and that I can relate to some of
the women that walk through our doors because I had

(01:49:07):
an abusive marriage in the past, and now I'm in
the place my husband, whose name is Michael, by the way,
is just this amazing man who loves me well and
is my biggest champion, and it's just this beautiful journey
and he's every Sunday wherever I'm speaking, he's right there

(01:49:29):
and he's my champion, and this is our thing together.
And the Lord worked it all out. But I had
no idea what I was doing. But I'm like, all right,
I'm a buckle up and learn and here we go.
And so it's stepping into the fear. It's allowing yourself
to turn it into excitement and just running with it

(01:49:50):
because what's the worst thing that's gonna happen. You've encouraged
someone today because your story matters. You've made a difference.
So that's that's kind of how I put it all together.
But it's just years of learning, trial and error and
narrowing it down and figuring out what works. And I'm

(01:50:11):
kind of I feel like I'm a high five myself
because I brought you down to tears. So now I
want to know when the gift's coming.

Speaker 1 (01:50:18):
Oh it's there. No, Like I said, you can do
it too.

Speaker 2 (01:50:25):
You know you could do that too. Tell the the
orphans story. You can take the same thing and run
with it and build it back into what your mom
was doing with the meals and all those things and
getting It's the telling of the stories, right, That's how
people connect people want to be involved in a story.
They don't want to be talked at, right, and too

(01:50:47):
often we just talk out people draw them in.

Speaker 1 (01:50:52):
Yes, and I agree with you wholeheartedly on all of that.
I just noticed the time on where we're at and so,
but I do want to us your leadership skills because
what you just shared pretty much everything you just shared
there is is really how you lead. And you said
that that you lean into your team's gifts and their
talents and knowing that they have the skills and and

(01:51:13):
pick up where where you where you lack is what
you wrote down. And I think that that's such a
great leadership quality to have to to know and trust
your team, uh and what they do. And then you
do something else that I think is brilliant, which is
your disk assessments and oh yeah, and seeing the different
personalities because you know that matters too. Is if you

(01:51:36):
could understand someone's personalities is huge as well, and how
that impacts the organization.

Speaker 2 (01:51:41):
Yeah, because if you don't, if you don't understand the
type of person you're talking to, how do you expect
to connect? Again, I was I'm a sharp D. I'm
like high D, and give me the list and get
to the point. And if I'm up there getting to
the point, how how is that person that is social
and really wants the story ever going to connect with
me if I'm going up there with a list. And

(01:52:03):
that was a hard thing to learn. And and as
in and I do the assessments with my staff, and we,
you know, we come together and we learn about how
each other's personalities are. And and then I we just
I just stay out of their way. I just like, oh,
they run the place, I just raise the money. And

(01:52:23):
and that's exactly what it is. And so we've got
the two locations in a mobile unit and they run it.
I pop in, I high five them, I love them,
I equip them, I empower them. We gather frequently, you know,
but I don't pretend to know it all by any
stretch of the imagination. And I need to let them

(01:52:45):
thrive because we all bring something different to the table.
But when we and when when everybody is working in
their giftedness and in their strengths, it's this well oiled
machine and you are unstoppable because you're just all together
moving the mission and the vision forward together. And so

(01:53:06):
I'm speaking to the donors, but they're taking what I
call myself a treasure transplanter, you know, because a lot
of Christians are like they want to store up their
treasures in heaven for their big crown when they get there. Well,
I'm going to help you transport that into my ministry
and you're getting your little crown in heaven because people

(01:53:26):
are looking where to give. They want to give. People
want to give. People are generous by nature, So help
them connect. But empower your team to do the thing
that they've been called to do. And I stay out
of their way and I lift them up along the way.
And so that's how I lead. Now, I'll put my
foot down, you know. You got to pay attention. And

(01:53:48):
I have to put my foot down every once in
a while and redirect them to stay in their lane.
But it's very infrequently because we come together and we
under we get each other, and it just flows the
right people the bus, isn't that, Jim Collins good to great?
You gotta have the right people from right seats on
the bus. Something like that.

Speaker 1 (01:54:07):
That's a good throwback right there. Yeah, And you know
you mentioned a couple of your mentors, and we're going
to get into your mantra here, but just to just
to put them out there because I think it's so important,
because you said you're self taught and and a lot
of your learnings have come from Pete Vargas Ten Next
Stages and Tamara Low's Kingdom Builders and doctor Robert Rome
and the personality insights, you know, being self taught, like

(01:54:29):
that's tremendous, that that takes a lot of will power
and work, right.

Speaker 2 (01:54:35):
Yeah, yeah, And you were I don't like to.

Speaker 1 (01:54:37):
Fail, and you were recently I saw you had a
little win and it was because my little uh Facebook
trolling of you that you were on a webinar with
Pete Vargas.

Speaker 2 (01:54:48):
Oh my goodness, Yes that was was that Tuesday, totally
out of the blue and not expecting it. But you know,
I meet, you know, I have a coach. You know,
we all invest if we're really trying to grow, and
I've been reporting some numbers and there I get this
email and they're like, you know, hey, we want you
to show up. You made the leader board. You want
to come find out where you're at. Don't miss it.

(01:55:10):
And literally I'm meeting with contractors trying to get in
the building. I'm a hot mess, and I'm like, all right,
so I rearranged my schedule look like a hot mess.
And the next thing I know, I'm like being shouted
out for some fundraising numbers and Pete Vargas and me
one on one and like answering questions on the fly,

(01:55:30):
talk about you know, wow. And then the next thing,
I always naming my name again because you know, all
these ministry records because I took some of his training
and I met, I went to Wisconsin and set with
you know, Pat Quinn and crafted my message. And you know,
when you anyway, so you creeper, you're creeping.

Speaker 1 (01:55:55):
But what you were going to say, when you invest
in yourself, right, Like I felt like that's we're going
with it.

Speaker 2 (01:56:00):
Yeah, that that's that's where the growth happens. That's how
you you just continue to thrive and you tackle those fears, right,
you leave the fear behind and you just you just
crush it. You just say okay, what's next, and you
get excited and hungry. And so that's kind of where
I'm at because yeah, oh I just love this. I

(01:56:21):
feel like I could just talk for hours. There's so
many things to dig into, sir.

Speaker 1 (01:56:27):
That's what happens when when you have cool people on
a on a show like this. I love talking to
somebody like you. Uh yeah, So I'm going to put
a challenge out for you before we get to your mantra,
the Great American speak off next year, I want to
see you there.

Speaker 2 (01:56:41):
Oh you know, I didn't. I was like, I do
not have the bandwidth.

Speaker 1 (01:56:46):
Honestly, I get that.

Speaker 2 (01:56:47):
I had considered it, but I was like, I don't like. Oh,
I'm like, I don't all the way out there.

Speaker 1 (01:56:54):
That's it. Yes, I I have the Personally, I have
the bandwidth personal I have. I love all of that,
the travel, I have the bandwidth, like I could do it.
But I also have a family, and that family doesn't
have to be yeah to be like you know, remember
remember I still have to be the dad too. I

(01:57:15):
always love to know what drives people and what you know,
you know, when you get your feet on the ground
in the morning, you know, what's the thing that that
stands out. And so I always ask about their personal
mantra or inspirational quote or thoughts they have. And I
don't know if that's true for me because I just
thought about it. I'm like, when I wake up I
think I just wake up and stare at the ceiling
for a little while, and then I get up. I
don't know if I but anyway, don't want to lose

(01:57:37):
track here. Yours yours is, and let us not grow
weary of doing good work a Galatians six ' nine.
Is that Galatians right?

Speaker 2 (01:57:51):
Yeap? Galicians? Yeah, Galatious six nine. Yeah, let us not
get weary of doing good work?

Speaker 1 (01:57:57):
Tell us about that one.

Speaker 2 (01:57:59):
Well. I just want to help people. I just want
to help people be successful in whatever it is. And
I don't ever want to grow weary of helping people
launch their business, launch their ministry, whether it's sitting with
a mom and encouraging her, sitting with a volunteer and
helping them find the strength to step into whatever's next

(01:58:22):
for them that next season. I don't ever want to
grow weary. But just serving the people that show up
in my lane, you never know, and so I just
don't want to grow weary of it. I just want
to serve with holy boldness and excitement, and I always
want to really just be ready for the next thing,
even though I can't keep up with God.

Speaker 1 (01:58:42):
Lately, You're doing awesome. You're doing awesome. I think. I
don't know if you have it written down somewhere, but
serve with holy boldness? That was really cool. Is that
something you say all that? Yeah?

Speaker 2 (01:58:54):
I do say it all the time. I read I've
read that book. Oh what was it? It was a
chip Ingram book, and he talked about you know how
we that's a lost thing, and that it's okay to
serve with holy boldness, that we each have gifts and
talents and we need to use them, and we need

(01:59:15):
to be proud to use them. If we want to
change out the holy boldness for pride, there's a fine
line which but if you're good with it, use it,
use it for the glory of God and or just
the ability to lift somebody else. This is such a
broken world we see, there's so much junk going out there.

(01:59:36):
Let's just go out and do the good whether and
do it excitedly, do it with boldness, and who cares
what other people think? Just get out there and just
do it, do the do How old is that phrase?

Speaker 1 (01:59:50):
I am so inspired by you. It's just been such
a great time with you today. You are truly an inspiration.
And I don't just say that you I mean, we went,
we've we've had some some public speaking training here, we
got into your ministry. You got me crying, uh and
and holy boldness. That's a that's that's a keeper for me.

(02:00:12):
I love that one. That's a really awesome one. It's
just been so cool having you on today.

Speaker 2 (02:00:17):
It's been an honor to get to know you, sir,
and I'm excited for you know what it is you're
doing giving people the opportunity to come together, have conversations
and grow and learn because I've learned a lot too.
And in the validation of what I've been investing in.
Thank you for saying, you know, well done right, So

(02:00:38):
thank you for that knowing that I'm not doing it
too shabby.

Speaker 1 (02:00:41):
No, You're you're doing pretty darn awesome. You're doing pretty
darn awesome for all of our audio listeners. Of course,
this so all be in the show notes, but could
you just share your different handles way that people way
that people can creep on you, your different handles, your website.
You have a great website there that has some courses,
that has ways to get to know you. So if
you could just share some of that for audio listeners.

Speaker 2 (02:01:03):
Yeah, Carolfairman dot com. This is my name, and you
know clear connect with Carol at gmail dot com if
you want me to email you the the five by
five plan that I use because I'm happy to help you,
you know, grow your business. And I think it's just
Carol Fairman underscore on Insta, you know anyway, and yeah,

(02:01:28):
I don't I'm not really good with my handles. I
just show up. I'm a party happening everywhere. Come join it.
If you want to be cheered on as you do
your workout, I'm gonna give you the virtual high five.
If you need help connecting, I'm going to help you
run your nonprofit. I do want to get with you later, Michael, Sure,
and just kind of help you, you know, get that

(02:01:49):
up and going and work with your board or whatever
we can do to to do that. But it's just
any way I can serve you, I'm happy to do that.
You win the community as a whole that's listening.

Speaker 1 (02:01:59):
I appreciate that. And so what Carol's speaking to there
is you can definitely go to her website It's Carolfairman
dot com and you can book a free consultation with
her and in that free consultation kind of go over
some of the things that I got to do on
my podcast. So it's a lot easier than starting your
own podcast to get your free fifteen minutes with her.
Trust me, having your own podcast is not easy. So

(02:02:22):
just go ahead, go to her website and book a
session with her and you'll be able to get that.
And then I'm sure all of hers so I know
that all of her social links are right there, so
you can just jump on there and follow her there.
So it's been a pleasure and an honor having you
on today. Thanks so much for coming on the show.

Speaker 2 (02:02:38):
Yes, thank you, sir, it's been a joy to get
to know you and your audience.

Speaker 1 (02:02:41):
Thank you for listening to The Michael Esposito Show. For
show notes, video clips, and more episodes, go to Michael
Esposito Inc. Dot com backslash podcast. Thank you again to
our sponsor ten ten Insurance Services helping businesses get the
right insurance for all their insurance needs. Visit dent dot
io to get a quote that's d E N ten

(02:03:05):
dot io and remember when you buy an insurance policy
from denten, you're giving back on a global scale. This
episode was produced by Uncle Mike at the iHeart Studios
in Poughkeepsie. Special thanks to Lara Rodrian for the opportunity
and my team at mike Lesposito Ink

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