January 28, 2025 • 31 mins
Ready to take your career to the next level? In this episode of The Mid-Career GPS Podcast, I will guide you through everything you need to know about finding the ideal career or leadership coach to help you thrive professionally.
Whether you're stuck in career stagnation, navigating transitions, or striving for that next promotion, this episode is your go-to resource for making informed decisions about your coaching investment.
We’ll explore the critical differences between coaching and therapy, helping you understand how coaching empowers you to take charge of your professional journey. Learn how to assess potential coaches based on referrals, testimonials, experience, and their ability to align with your personal and professional goals. Discover why investing in the right coach can yield significant returns, including promotions, salary increases, and clarity in your career path.
Key topics include:
- Coaching vs. therapy: Understanding the distinctions
- How to identify your unique needs and goals
- Evaluating coaches based on fit, style, and certifications
- The financial ROI of career coaching
- Building a coaching structure for accountability and success
- Why a transformative coach-client relationship matters
As a certified career coach, I share insights into my tailored coaching services, workshops, and digital resources designed to help you construct your mid-career GPS. Whether you’re seeking one-on-one support or inspiration through my free newsletters and social media content, I’m here to help you chart your course confidently.
Ready to get started? Now, let’s explore how the right coach can help you achieve your professional aspirations. Don’t forget to connect with me on LinkedIn and follow John Neral Coaching for ongoing insights and support.
Thank you for listening to The Mid-Career GPS Podcast.
Please leave a rating and review on Apple Podcasts here.
Visit https://johnneral.com/resources to get The Mid-Career Job Search Jumpstart and join The Mid-Career GPS Membership Community.
Visit https://johnneral.com to join The Mid-Career GPS Newsletter, a free, twice-weekly career and leadership resource for mid-career professionals.
Connect with John on LinkedIn here.
Get John's New Mid-Career Journal on Amazon here.
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Subscribe to John's YouTube Channel here.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
John Neral (00:00):
Hey there, if you've ever considered hiring a coach
for your career or yourleadership, how do you know
which one's the best?
How do you know which coach isthe right one for you?
It's a question I'veexperienced and one I get asked
a lot with people who areseeking to find a career coach
(00:21):
for them, and that's why, inthis episode, I'm going to peel
back the curtain on my processand my business to help you pick
the coach you believe will helpyou get the results you want.
So let's get started.
Hello, my friends, this is theMid-Career GPS Podcast and I'm
(00:49):
your host, John Neral.
I help mid-career professionalslike you find a job they love,
or love the job they have, usingmy proven four-step formula.
I've been thinking about doingthis episode for a while and I'm
glad I've got some time withyou this week to talk to you
about not just how you find acareer coach or leadership coach
(01:11):
, but also why having a coachmay be exactly what you need
right now to elevate or advanceyour career.
The new year without questionJanuary has been a lot okay and
if you have been following thenews, if you have been following
(01:32):
what this currentadministration is doing, it is
understandable that you might befeeling a little anxious, upset
, angry, frustrated over some ofthe executive orders and the
impacts that are directlyhitting the federal workforce,
but some fear that some of thatmay, or already has, trickled
(01:55):
down into the corporateworkforce, for example, the
executive order about everybodybeing back in the office five
days a week.
We're seeing other companiesfall in line with that as well,
and so, based on yourcircumstance or situation, that
may be something you're notliking.
(02:16):
There are other things that arehappening as well.
If you've been following me fora while, you know I typically
tend to not get into politics onthis podcast.
I will tell you this before weget started I am not surprised
by anything that has happened.
I followed both campaigns very,very closely leading up to the
(02:39):
election.
I am not surprised by anythingthat has happened.
That doesn't mean I am notsaddened or upset by it.
So you're sitting there andyou're thinking well, I'm not
really sure where my career isgoing.
I'm not really sure what mightbe next.
I've heard about this coachingthing and I'm kind of wondering
(03:03):
how do I navigate all of this tofigure out what's the best move
for me?
So here's the thing Coaching isnot therapy.
I know it's really important wemake that distinction because
there are times in a coachingrelationship personal things may
(03:25):
come up, especially if you'relooking, say, for a life coach.
Certainly, in career coachingthere are times when my clients
may bring something personalbecause it's impacting their
work a little bit.
Certainly okay, coaching themon it.
I am not a therapist.
I am not a trained, licensedtherapist in any way, shape or
form, nor do I claim to be right.
(03:46):
But by definition, a coach isgoing to take you from a
functioning state to an optimalstate.
A therapist typically works withpeople who are in a state of
dysfunction and moves them to afunctioning state all right, and
moves them to a functioningstate all right.
That dysfunction is notnecessarily quote-unquote bad,
(04:09):
but there is something thatmight be blocking them from
functioning at a better levelthan what they are.
Okay.
I've been in therapy severaltimes in my life, absolutely
what I needed.
I'm grateful for having mytherapist when I've had them,
and there are also times whenI've had coaches and I'm very
grateful for them as well, butit's a very clear and delineated
line between the two, right?
(04:33):
So, as a coach like one of thethings that I will, I will often
say to my clients, or even topeople who are inquiring about
coaching, is that my job as acoach is to hold your agenda.
We will often set a particulargoal at the beginning of the
session.
I'll ask them what success maylook like and then we will work
(04:55):
toward achieving that goal.
Let's say, for example, I'mworking with a client who is
mid-level, senior-level position.
They might be in finance,project management, consulting,
whatever it be.
I work with people across avariety of different industries
and they come to me and they sayJohn, I have had it with work
(05:20):
and I just wanna go greet peopleat Walmart.
Personally, I would not likethat job.
That job would bring up a lotof anxiety for me, not because I
don't like people, but becauseI just wouldn't like that job.
That's not something I'd reallywanna do.
That doesn't matter.
As a coach, my job is to getreally curious with them and say
(05:45):
what's attracting you to thatposition?
What makes that position moreintriguing to you than what
you're doing now?
Is that position going to beable to help you meet your goals
, your responsibilities?
How does that position betteryour work and your life in some
way, shape or form?
That's about keeping theclient's agenda front and center
(06:06):
and not my own desire, which isI would never want to do that
job.
I always make it a point to sayhi to those people, but I would
never want to do that job.
So what you also need to knowand you are probably very well
aware of this also is that thecoaching industry has blown up
(06:28):
over the last few years.
There are people out there,like myself, who are trained and
certified at being a coach.
There are people out there whosimply call themselves a coach.
Both could be good, both couldbe bad.
That's why you, as the client,the paying customer, needs to do
(06:52):
your work in terms of who isthe best coach for you.
Now.
I had a background ininstructional coaching before I
moved into corporate, career andexecutive coaching, and one of
the things that was really,really important for me was to
go get certified.
I found a program called IPEC,the Institute for Professional
(07:16):
Excellence in Coaching.
I started my training inNovember of 2016.
The following year, afteralmost about 10 months, 11
months, almost a year I obtainedmy coaching certification, and
that included over 300 hours ofin-person and virtual
(07:37):
instruction, along withpracticum hours as well.
There was a lot of work for meto get that certification.
I did my research.
The academic in me was allabout like this was the program
I want to go through and that'swhy this month I am very proud
to say I am celebrating eightyears in my business, and who I
(08:01):
have helped has certainlyevolved over the years.
But today my primary focus ishelping mid-career professionals
, who are typically mid-level,holding titles between manager
and senior director.
They're usually between theages of 35 and 50.
(08:22):
Their biggest pain point isthat they don't wanna be stuck
and when I ask them what stuckactually means, they will tell
me that they don't wanna bestuck in their organization
because there's no place forthem to move or to elevate or be
promoted within theirorganization.
But they also don't wanna bestuck if they're stepping
(08:44):
outside of their organization.
But they also don't want to bestuck if they're stepping
outside of their organizationand they get overwhelmed by all
of the things they think theyshould do to find a new job.
So when somebody comes to meand they share with me where
they're particularly stuck andif they meet a lot of the
(09:05):
criteria for what I consider tobe an ideal client, that becomes
a great opportunity for us towork together.
So when you're looking for acoach, there's lots of ways you
could find particular coaches,for example, referrals.
Talk to your friends, yourfamily members, your colleagues,
(09:30):
your peers.
Have they ever worked with acoach?
Who do they work with?
Did they like working with them?
Referrals are a huge part of mybusiness because when a client
has a tremendous experienceworking with me and they get the
results and achieve the goalsthat they wanted, they're going
to go tell people look, here'swho I worked with.
(09:50):
You need to go talk to this guy.
And then oftentimes, they comeand they hire me as well.
So I'm always grateful forreferrals.
Okay, you may also find a coachon social media.
You may find it through aGoogle search even, and see who
pops up.
But a podcast like this withover 280 episodes if you're
(10:11):
trying to navigate a careertransition, you can get a really
good idea of who I am and whatI'm like by listening to this
podcast, both either as a soloepisode or an episode where I
interview somebody.
Episode or an episode where Iinterview somebody.
Do your research.
Who do you want to work with?
Do you want to work with a manor a woman?
(10:37):
Do you want to work withsomebody who has a lot of
experience within your industryor not?
Do you care if they're marriedor single, gay, straight,
whatever that might be?
You have an idea in terms ofwho you believe you are going to
work best with, and if you aregoing to invest money in your
(10:57):
career and leadershipdevelopment, why would you not
pick someone that you believe isa great fit for you?
And that's the first thing.
You've got to make sure youknow what fit looks like.
Additionally, what's theirexperience?
What's their career path hasbeen?
(11:18):
How long have they been doingthis?
Do you want somebody whosepersonality is very strict and
regimented, or do you wantsomebody who is okay with a joke
, is okay, keeping things alittle lighthearted from time to
time?
I tell my clients all the timewe're going to do a lot of work,
we are going to have some funwhile we do it and we're going
(11:40):
to have some laughs along theway, and that's what's going to
make this work important.
So personality is important.
The other thing is how do youwant to be held accountable If
you're going to try to find anew job or elevate your career
in some way?
What do the accountabilitystructures look like and how
(12:06):
hard of a touch do you want?
I know that when I've hiredcoaches in the past especially
business coaches whom I'veworked with I do not want
someone who's going to beyelling at me in my face,
especially over Zoom.
Okay.
I also don't want somebodywho's going to be overly
aggressive in a way that I'mgoing to find to be a turnoff.
(12:28):
If I'm coming to you because Ineed support in, say, growing my
business, there's a veryspecific person who I know I am
successful with and someone whoI'm not.
Additionally, what are theresults the coach has gotten?
What are the testimonials?
(12:49):
Say about them on their website, on their LinkedIn profile, and
look.
Testimonials and results aregreat ways to see what people
have experienced.
You know what they'veexperienced by working with
somebody as their coach.
You don't need hundreds uponhundreds, upon hundreds of
(13:12):
recommendations and testimonialsto know that someone is
credible.
You're also not going to readall of them.
What you want is thatcredibility and social proof
that that person's legit, so fitis extremely important.
But then you have to look atthe function, and when we talk
(13:34):
about function, what I want youto think about is what's the
transformation you're seeking?
The transformation is gettingyou from point A to point B.
Is that coach the person to getyou there?
I have had people who havereached out and said, well, can
(13:55):
you guarantee me you're going tofind me a new job?
And my answer is always no.
First of all, as a coach, I'mnot a headhunter recruiter.
I'm not a job finder.
I can take you through mycoaching.
I can take you through myprogram.
I can coach you as best as Iwill one-on-one, but I am not
there with you in the room whenyou are interviewing for a job
(14:20):
and there are things outside ofmy control that I cannot promise
.
I cannot promise someonethey're going to get the job.
What I can promise is that theywill tell their story more
effectively and impactfully thanthey've ever done.
Based on our coaching, I canpromise them and guarantee that
(14:42):
they will tell their story froma place of value and service far
differently than they've everdone before.
I can promise them that theywill have the tools, the
strategies and the skills toknow how to network and find a
new job in this market.
But if you, as the client, arenot willing to do the work I'm
(15:02):
not your genie in a bottleclient are not willing to do the
work.
I'm not your genie in a bottle.
I can't make magic happen ifyou're not going to do the work.
So, when you think about thefunction, is it one-on-one
coaching?
Is it group coaching?
Is it an online course?
How is their program structured?
Essentially, what you areasking is what is their
(15:23):
container?
The container is how theydeliver their coaching.
So for me it is primarilyone-on-one, but I am getting
ready to launch a membershipcommunity and getting into this
membership community formid-career professionals is
going to be a different level ofmy business that I've never
(15:44):
launched before but have spentyears working on this idea.
The community is at a differentlevel where you will still get
support from me, but it'll bemore of a group-type setting
within the membership.
But it'll be Q&A, it'll be anopportunity for focus seat
(16:06):
coaching.
It will be information andeducation every month around
navigating either the careeraspect of your mid-career
journey, like finding a new job,for example, or it's focused on
your leadership and elevatingyour career within your current
organization.
It's that duality of.
(16:28):
There'll be people in the groupwho are trying to find a job
they love and there will also bepeople who are trying to love
the job they have even more.
If you are interested insomething like that, the place
to go is my website.
It's johnnerlcom.
It's my namej-o-h-n-n-e-r-a-lcom.
(16:50):
Right there on the homepage isa space for you to sign up and
get on the waitlist for themid-career GPS community that is
going to launch in quarter oneof 2025.
I'm so excited to get this outthere and getting on the wait
list.
You're going to be the firstones to hear about it.
But the function is thecontainer.
What's the container that coachis providing?
(17:13):
That's going to be best for you.
Additionally, we got to talkabout money.
Coaching is not a free service.
It's not.
If you're going to invest in acoach, just like you would
invest in a personal trainer oryou would invest in a financial
(17:37):
advisor, you are paying for aprofessional service.
There are coaches who charge alittle.
There are coaches who charge alot.
There are coaches who chargesomewhere in the middle.
I know, based on my marketresearch, that my one-on-one
coaching for three months rightnow, at the time of this
(17:58):
recording in January of 2025, is$3,500.
If that's in your budget, weshould talk.
If it's not in your budget, themembership community may be a
more viable option.
But what I will often say toclients is the amount of money
(18:22):
you invest is all about yourtransformation and you're
investing in me as your coachand you and yourself to get the
results you want.
So I've had people say to me ohmy gosh, that's really
expensive.
I had others go.
Oh, that's totally reasonable,it's all a thought.
It's all a thought based onwhat you're willing to invest.
(18:44):
But here's the thing If youbelieve that coaching is the
path to help you elevate yourcareer and you believe that I'm
the right coach for you, here'show the numbers break down.
Let's say you are making.
We're going to make the matheasy.
Let's say you make $100,000 ayear.
We're going to make the matheasy.
(19:07):
Let's say you make $100,000 ayear If you get an internal
promotion.
Typically what we see issomewhere between a 6% to 10%
raise.
If you are leveraging yourtalents and expertise outside of
the organization, we see thatpercentage increase somewhere
around the 8% to 15% mark.
So keep the math easy.
Let's say you get a 10% raise,and one of the things I help my
(19:31):
clients do as well is we talkabout negotiating their contract
or negotiating their job offer.
So if you're making $100,000,you get a 10% raise.
That's $10,000.
After taxes, you're probablylooking somewhere in the
ballpark of, say, $7,000.
Again, we'll keep the math easy.
So if three months of coachingright now is $3,500, that job
(19:54):
raise, that promotion,financially pays for itself
within the first year, not tomention the lifetime dollars you
will continually earn becauseyou've elevated yourself,
promoted yourself, you'regetting more money and the
lifetime dollars will compoundon top of that.
(20:15):
So the finance piece we have totalk about money.
This is what I do for afull-time job.
I am grateful that I get to dothis for eight years and
continuing to look to do thiseven more.
But you have to look at thefinance and see if that's
aligned with your budget andwhat you specifically want.
But here's the biggestconsideration and this is the
(20:38):
one that I will offer you.
Most people miss, and this iswhy I know, through my coaching,
when I help my clients, we talkabout this as well in terms of
their career path.
But how does this move youforward?
There is no point in lookingfor or hiring a coach if you
(21:05):
don't believe that coach isgoing to help move you forward.
Whatever your particular goalsare, they are yours, but moving
you forward is the biggesttransformation you could have.
I have had people whom I workedwith in the first couple years
(21:29):
of my business One.
Some still work with me.
Secondly, they will reach backout and say, oh my gosh, john, I
just got promoted.
Here's what we had talked aboutyears ago.
I never forgot that.
That was so powerful.
That warms my heart because myclients reaching their goals and
(21:52):
achieving the success they want.
That is why I do this.
That is why I get in front ofthe mic every single week with
you to help you build thatcomponent of your mid-career GPS
to whatever is going to be next.
And so you might be sittingthere saying, okay, john, well,
how do you work with people?
Well, there's free content.
Free content like this podcast.
(22:15):
Free content like my weeklynewsletter that goes out twice a
week.
You can get that on my websiteat johnnerrellcom.
Free content like my blog, whatI post on LinkedIn or what I
post on Instagram or Facebook.
I put a ton of free content outthere.
Free content is just that.
(22:36):
It's free.
Free content is valuable.
I repeatedly have people comeback and say this was really
helpful.
This was great.
You want to engage with me at afree level.
There's plenty of free contentfor that.
The other way I work with peopleis people who are customers.
That means they have bought aparticular service of mine, or
(22:59):
course.
So I have a couple of digitalcourses that are out there.
One is called From CareerCrossroads to Career Clarity a
step-by-step guide for findingyour sweet spot at mid-career.
I have an interview prep coursecalled A Simple Five-Step
Strategy for Crushing your NextInterview.
I do a LinkedIn profile audit.
You can find all of those on mywebsite at johnnarrellcom under
(23:22):
the courses section, butthey're typically an offer that
is less than $100 that allowsyou to come in and buy some paid
content that is going to helpyou more so than the free
content.
There is a reason why it's paid.
There is an additional level ofvalue in buying that particular
(23:44):
service.
The last piece is that youbecome a client.
Whether you're a client who'sgoing to come into my new
community or you're one of myprivate one-on-one coaching
clients, you now enter into afar different relationship with
me as a client because we arepersonally interacting.
(24:07):
When you buy one of my digitalcourses, you get me recorded.
You know you get lifetimeaccess to the course in that
regard, but that's just there.
Okay, you come into mycommunity or my private coaching
.
Now you get a different levelof support because you are
directly working with me.
(24:28):
Yes, that is a paid service.
So one of the things I did veryearly on in my business and I
would be remiss if I didn't talkabout this was I did what was
called a free session, or I dida consultation or a strategy
call, and I did them because Iwas new.
(24:51):
I did them because it was agreat opportunity for me to
build rapport with a potentialclient, and some of them became
clients and some of them didn't.
But here's what's happened,especially over the last year,
as this coaching industry hasevolved and changed.
There are people out there andI would be willing to bet some
(25:15):
of you might be listening tothis podcast as well and
thinking, oh, I could just get afree session from a coach and I
never have to pay.
There are coaches out therethat still do free sessions.
I do not.
I do not.
My work, my caseload, myexperience is such that I simply
(25:40):
do not do free sessions anymore.
If you want to work with me,you want to experience what's
working with me.
There is a way to book what Iam now calling a leadership or
career strategy session.
It's a 45-minute session.
At the time of this recording,in January of 2025, it's $197.
(26:01):
If you roll up into privatecoaching with me one-on-one, you
can take that and apply that tothe cost of the coaching
package.
Anybody that wants to work withme.
The first step is book aleadership or career strategy
session.
Get to know what a coachingsession is like.
Yes, you do have to pay for it.
If you don't want to hire meafter that, we've had a great
(26:22):
call.
If you do want to hire me afterthat, I do have to pay for it.
If you don't want to hire meafter that, we've had a great
call.
If you do want to hire me afterthat, I apply that to the cost
of the coaching package.
But I do not offer free sessionsanymore.
I just simply do not have thetime to do that and it is not
fair to those people who areinterested in hiring me as a
coach, who want to get that fullexperience.
(26:45):
That's why I offer that at areduced rate.
So if you are interested inbooking that particular strategy
session, go to my website,johnnarrellcom.
Click on the Work With Me tabor About Me section, and you
will be able to see that rightthere.
But in closing, here's what youneed to know.
If you are looking for a coach.
(27:07):
It is an investment.
You're gonna spend money onyour career development and
right now money isn't growing ontrees.
So if you're willing to makethat investment and this is
something you really really wantfor your transformation then by
all means do your research andmake sure you find the coach
(27:31):
that you connect with that is agreat fit for you.
They have a program that alignswith exactly what it is that
you need Financially.
It is within your budget thatyou can afford and invest in.
I do not want anybody goinginto debt to hire me as their
coach because this is aninvestment.
(27:52):
Right.
If you're like, look, I'll putit on a credit card, I know I
can pay it off and fine, okay.
And yes, I do offer paymentplans, but you have to make sure
that the finance piece is rightfor you.
And, lastly, does the coach?
Is the coach capable of movingyou forward, given the work you
(28:15):
are willing to put in on it toget the transformation you
desire?
The transformation you desireIf you take those four Fs and
you build them in much like Icoach my clients on in terms of
finding that job they're goingto love, and you apply those
four Fs to picking the rightcoach for them.
I guarantee you it will notsteer you wrong.
(28:36):
And if you've enjoyed listeningto this episode or following me
for a while and you would liketo know how to work with me,
easiest thing you can do you cango to my website at
https://johnneral.
com.
There is a form on there tofill out for coaching.
That's one way you can get theconversation started.
You can connect with me onLinkedIn.
I'm the only John Neral.
(28:57):
That's well.
I shouldn't say that I thinkthere is one other John Neral,
but we are not related.
But you can certainly find myLinkedIn right off of my website
as well.
You can find me on Instagram orFacebook at John Neral Coaching
, or you can simply email me atjohn@johnneral.
But if you want 2025 to be theyear where you take greater
(29:18):
control of your career and youare ready to find the job you
love or love the job you have,or if you are a rising and
emerging leader who is lookingfor that kind of leadership
support to be more impactfulwith your team, increase your
visibility within theorganization, build a networking
strategy where you get to buildauthentic and genuine
(29:41):
relationships, where your brandis elevated and people are
talking about you in the mostpositive ways to be considered
for whatever that role might benext, you and I should
absolutely talk, and I lookforward to hearing from you.
So until next time, my friends,remember this you will build
your mid-career GPS one mile orone step at a time, and how you
(30:05):
show up matters.
Make it a great rest of yourday.
Thank you for listening to theMid-Career GPS Podcast.
Make sure to follow on yourfavorite listening platform and,
if you have a moment, I'd loveto hear your comments on Apple
Podcasts, and if you have amoment, I'd love to hear your
comments on Apple Podcasts.
(30:27):
Visit JohnNarrowcom for moreinformation about how I can help
you build your mid-career GPSor how I can help you and your
organization with your nextworkshop or public speaking
event.
Don't forget to connect with meon LinkedIn and follow me on
social at John Narrow Coaching.
I look forward to being backwith you next week.
Until then, take care andremember how we show up matters.
Thank you.
Hey there, if you've ever considered hiring a coach
for your career or yourleadership, how do you know
which one's the best?
How do you know which coach isthe right one for you?
It's a question I'veexperienced and one I get asked
a lot with people who areseeking to find a career coach
(00:21):
for them, and that's why, inthis episode, I'm going to peel
back the curtain on my processand my business to help you pick
the coach you believe will helpyou get the results you want.
So let's get started.
Hello, my friends, this is theMid-Career GPS Podcast and I'm
(00:49):
your host, John Neral.
I help mid-career professionalslike you find a job they love,
or love the job they have, usingmy proven four-step formula.
I've been thinking about doingthis episode for a while and I'm
glad I've got some time withyou this week to talk to you
about not just how you find acareer coach or leadership coach
(01:11):
, but also why having a coachmay be exactly what you need
right now to elevate or advanceyour career.
The new year without questionJanuary has been a lot okay and
if you have been following thenews, if you have been following
(01:32):
what this currentadministration is doing, it is
understandable that you might befeeling a little anxious, upset
, angry, frustrated over some ofthe executive orders and the
impacts that are directlyhitting the federal workforce,
but some fear that some of thatmay, or already has, trickled
(01:55):
down into the corporateworkforce, for example, the
executive order about everybodybeing back in the office five
days a week.
We're seeing other companiesfall in line with that as well,
and so, based on yourcircumstance or situation, that
may be something you're notliking.
(02:16):
There are other things that arehappening as well.
If you've been following me fora while, you know I typically
tend to not get into politics onthis podcast.
I will tell you this before weget started I am not surprised
by anything that has happened.
I followed both campaigns very,very closely leading up to the
(02:39):
election.
I am not surprised by anythingthat has happened.
That doesn't mean I am notsaddened or upset by it.
So you're sitting there andyou're thinking well, I'm not
really sure where my career isgoing.
I'm not really sure what mightbe next.
I've heard about this coachingthing and I'm kind of wondering
(03:03):
how do I navigate all of this tofigure out what's the best move
for me?
So here's the thing Coaching isnot therapy.
I know it's really important wemake that distinction because
there are times in a coachingrelationship personal things may
(03:25):
come up, especially if you'relooking, say, for a life coach.
Certainly, in career coachingthere are times when my clients
may bring something personalbecause it's impacting their
work a little bit.
Certainly okay, coaching themon it.
I am not a therapist.
I am not a trained, licensedtherapist in any way, shape or
form, nor do I claim to be right.
(03:46):
But by definition, a coach isgoing to take you from a
functioning state to an optimalstate.
A therapist typically works withpeople who are in a state of
dysfunction and moves them to afunctioning state all right, and
moves them to a functioningstate all right.
That dysfunction is notnecessarily quote-unquote bad,
(04:09):
but there is something thatmight be blocking them from
functioning at a better levelthan what they are.
Okay.
I've been in therapy severaltimes in my life, absolutely
what I needed.
I'm grateful for having mytherapist when I've had them,
and there are also times whenI've had coaches and I'm very
grateful for them as well, butit's a very clear and delineated
line between the two, right?
(04:33):
So, as a coach like one of thethings that I will, I will often
say to my clients, or even topeople who are inquiring about
coaching, is that my job as acoach is to hold your agenda.
We will often set a particulargoal at the beginning of the
session.
I'll ask them what success maylook like and then we will work
(04:55):
toward achieving that goal.
Let's say, for example, I'mworking with a client who is
mid-level, senior-level position.
They might be in finance,project management, consulting,
whatever it be.
I work with people across avariety of different industries
and they come to me and they sayJohn, I have had it with work
(05:20):
and I just wanna go greet peopleat Walmart.
Personally, I would not likethat job.
That job would bring up a lotof anxiety for me, not because I
don't like people, but becauseI just wouldn't like that job.
That's not something I'd reallywanna do.
That doesn't matter.
As a coach, my job is to getreally curious with them and say
(05:45):
what's attracting you to thatposition?
What makes that position moreintriguing to you than what
you're doing now?
Is that position going to beable to help you meet your goals
, your responsibilities?
How does that position betteryour work and your life in some
way, shape or form?
That's about keeping theclient's agenda front and center
(06:06):
and not my own desire, which isI would never want to do that
job.
I always make it a point to sayhi to those people, but I would
never want to do that job.
So what you also need to knowand you are probably very well
aware of this also is that thecoaching industry has blown up
(06:28):
over the last few years.
There are people out there,like myself, who are trained and
certified at being a coach.
There are people out there whosimply call themselves a coach.
Both could be good, both couldbe bad.
That's why you, as the client,the paying customer, needs to do
(06:52):
your work in terms of who isthe best coach for you.
Now.
I had a background ininstructional coaching before I
moved into corporate, career andexecutive coaching, and one of
the things that was really,really important for me was to
go get certified.
I found a program called IPEC,the Institute for Professional
(07:16):
Excellence in Coaching.
I started my training inNovember of 2016.
The following year, afteralmost about 10 months, 11
months, almost a year I obtainedmy coaching certification, and
that included over 300 hours ofin-person and virtual
(07:37):
instruction, along withpracticum hours as well.
There was a lot of work for meto get that certification.
I did my research.
The academic in me was allabout like this was the program
I want to go through and that'swhy this month I am very proud
to say I am celebrating eightyears in my business, and who I
(08:01):
have helped has certainlyevolved over the years.
But today my primary focus ishelping mid-career professionals
, who are typically mid-level,holding titles between manager
and senior director.
They're usually between theages of 35 and 50.
(08:22):
Their biggest pain point isthat they don't wanna be stuck
and when I ask them what stuckactually means, they will tell
me that they don't wanna bestuck in their organization
because there's no place forthem to move or to elevate or be
promoted within theirorganization.
But they also don't wanna bestuck if they're stepping
(08:44):
outside of their organization.
But they also don't want to bestuck if they're stepping
outside of their organizationand they get overwhelmed by all
of the things they think theyshould do to find a new job.
So when somebody comes to meand they share with me where
they're particularly stuck andif they meet a lot of the
(09:05):
criteria for what I consider tobe an ideal client, that becomes
a great opportunity for us towork together.
So when you're looking for acoach, there's lots of ways you
could find particular coaches,for example, referrals.
Talk to your friends, yourfamily members, your colleagues,
(09:30):
your peers.
Have they ever worked with acoach?
Who do they work with?
Did they like working with them?
Referrals are a huge part of mybusiness because when a client
has a tremendous experienceworking with me and they get the
results and achieve the goalsthat they wanted, they're going
to go tell people look, here'swho I worked with.
(09:50):
You need to go talk to this guy.
And then oftentimes, they comeand they hire me as well.
So I'm always grateful forreferrals.
Okay, you may also find a coachon social media.
You may find it through aGoogle search even, and see who
pops up.
But a podcast like this withover 280 episodes if you're
(10:11):
trying to navigate a careertransition, you can get a really
good idea of who I am and whatI'm like by listening to this
podcast, both either as a soloepisode or an episode where I
interview somebody.
Episode or an episode where Iinterview somebody.
Do your research.
Who do you want to work with?
Do you want to work with a manor a woman?
(10:37):
Do you want to work withsomebody who has a lot of
experience within your industryor not?
Do you care if they're marriedor single, gay, straight,
whatever that might be?
You have an idea in terms ofwho you believe you are going to
work best with, and if you aregoing to invest money in your
(10:57):
career and leadershipdevelopment, why would you not
pick someone that you believe isa great fit for you?
And that's the first thing.
You've got to make sure youknow what fit looks like.
Additionally, what's theirexperience?
What's their career path hasbeen?
(11:18):
How long have they been doingthis?
Do you want somebody whosepersonality is very strict and
regimented, or do you wantsomebody who is okay with a joke
, is okay, keeping things alittle lighthearted from time to
time?
I tell my clients all the timewe're going to do a lot of work,
we are going to have some funwhile we do it and we're going
(11:40):
to have some laughs along theway, and that's what's going to
make this work important.
So personality is important.
The other thing is how do youwant to be held accountable If
you're going to try to find anew job or elevate your career
in some way?
What do the accountabilitystructures look like and how
(12:06):
hard of a touch do you want?
I know that when I've hiredcoaches in the past especially
business coaches whom I'veworked with I do not want
someone who's going to beyelling at me in my face,
especially over Zoom.
Okay.
I also don't want somebodywho's going to be overly
aggressive in a way that I'mgoing to find to be a turnoff.
(12:28):
If I'm coming to you because Ineed support in, say, growing my
business, there's a veryspecific person who I know I am
successful with and someone whoI'm not.
Additionally, what are theresults the coach has gotten?
What are the testimonials?
(12:49):
Say about them on their website, on their LinkedIn profile, and
look.
Testimonials and results aregreat ways to see what people
have experienced.
You know what they'veexperienced by working with
somebody as their coach.
You don't need hundreds uponhundreds, upon hundreds of
(13:12):
recommendations and testimonialsto know that someone is
credible.
You're also not going to readall of them.
What you want is thatcredibility and social proof
that that person's legit, so fitis extremely important.
But then you have to look atthe function, and when we talk
(13:34):
about function, what I want youto think about is what's the
transformation you're seeking?
The transformation is gettingyou from point A to point B.
Is that coach the person to getyou there?
I have had people who havereached out and said, well, can
(13:55):
you guarantee me you're going tofind me a new job?
And my answer is always no.
First of all, as a coach, I'mnot a headhunter recruiter.
I'm not a job finder.
I can take you through mycoaching.
I can take you through myprogram.
I can coach you as best as Iwill one-on-one, but I am not
there with you in the room whenyou are interviewing for a job
(14:20):
and there are things outside ofmy control that I cannot promise
.
I cannot promise someonethey're going to get the job.
What I can promise is that theywill tell their story more
effectively and impactfully thanthey've ever done.
Based on our coaching, I canpromise them and guarantee that
(14:42):
they will tell their story froma place of value and service far
differently than they've everdone before.
I can promise them that theywill have the tools, the
strategies and the skills toknow how to network and find a
new job in this market.
But if you, as the client, arenot willing to do the work I'm
(15:02):
not your genie in a bottleclient are not willing to do the
work.
I'm not your genie in a bottle.
I can't make magic happen ifyou're not going to do the work.
So, when you think about thefunction, is it one-on-one
coaching?
Is it group coaching?
Is it an online course?
How is their program structured?
Essentially, what you areasking is what is their
(15:23):
container?
The container is how theydeliver their coaching.
So for me it is primarilyone-on-one, but I am getting
ready to launch a membershipcommunity and getting into this
membership community formid-career professionals is
going to be a different level ofmy business that I've never
(15:44):
launched before but have spentyears working on this idea.
The community is at a differentlevel where you will still get
support from me, but it'll bemore of a group-type setting
within the membership.
But it'll be Q&A, it'll be anopportunity for focus seat
(16:06):
coaching.
It will be information andeducation every month around
navigating either the careeraspect of your mid-career
journey, like finding a new job,for example, or it's focused on
your leadership and elevatingyour career within your current
organization.
It's that duality of.
(16:28):
There'll be people in the groupwho are trying to find a job
they love and there will also bepeople who are trying to love
the job they have even more.
If you are interested insomething like that, the place
to go is my website.
It's johnnerlcom.
It's my namej-o-h-n-n-e-r-a-lcom.
(16:50):
Right there on the homepage isa space for you to sign up and
get on the waitlist for themid-career GPS community that is
going to launch in quarter oneof 2025.
I'm so excited to get this outthere and getting on the wait
list.
You're going to be the firstones to hear about it.
But the function is thecontainer.
What's the container that coachis providing?
(17:13):
That's going to be best for you.
Additionally, we got to talkabout money.
Coaching is not a free service.
It's not.
If you're going to invest in acoach, just like you would
invest in a personal trainer oryou would invest in a financial
(17:37):
advisor, you are paying for aprofessional service.
There are coaches who charge alittle.
There are coaches who charge alot.
There are coaches who chargesomewhere in the middle.
I know, based on my marketresearch, that my one-on-one
coaching for three months rightnow, at the time of this
(17:58):
recording in January of 2025, is$3,500.
If that's in your budget, weshould talk.
If it's not in your budget, themembership community may be a
more viable option.
But what I will often say toclients is the amount of money
(18:22):
you invest is all about yourtransformation and you're
investing in me as your coachand you and yourself to get the
results you want.
So I've had people say to me ohmy gosh, that's really
expensive.
I had others go.
Oh, that's totally reasonable,it's all a thought.
It's all a thought based onwhat you're willing to invest.
(18:44):
But here's the thing If youbelieve that coaching is the
path to help you elevate yourcareer and you believe that I'm
the right coach for you, here'show the numbers break down.
Let's say you are making.
We're going to make the matheasy.
Let's say you make $100,000 ayear.
We're going to make the matheasy.
(19:07):
Let's say you make $100,000 ayear If you get an internal
promotion.
Typically what we see issomewhere between a 6% to 10%
raise.
If you are leveraging yourtalents and expertise outside of
the organization, we see thatpercentage increase somewhere
around the 8% to 15% mark.
So keep the math easy.
Let's say you get a 10% raise,and one of the things I help my
(19:31):
clients do as well is we talkabout negotiating their contract
or negotiating their job offer.
So if you're making $100,000,you get a 10% raise.
That's $10,000.
After taxes, you're probablylooking somewhere in the
ballpark of, say, $7,000.
Again, we'll keep the math easy.
So if three months of coachingright now is $3,500, that job
(19:54):
raise, that promotion,financially pays for itself
within the first year, not tomention the lifetime dollars you
will continually earn becauseyou've elevated yourself,
promoted yourself, you'regetting more money and the
lifetime dollars will compoundon top of that.
(20:15):
So the finance piece we have totalk about money.
This is what I do for afull-time job.
I am grateful that I get to dothis for eight years and
continuing to look to do thiseven more.
But you have to look at thefinance and see if that's
aligned with your budget andwhat you specifically want.
But here's the biggestconsideration and this is the
(20:38):
one that I will offer you.
Most people miss, and this iswhy I know, through my coaching,
when I help my clients, we talkabout this as well in terms of
their career path.
But how does this move youforward?
There is no point in lookingfor or hiring a coach if you
(21:05):
don't believe that coach isgoing to help move you forward.
Whatever your particular goalsare, they are yours, but moving
you forward is the biggesttransformation you could have.
I have had people whom I workedwith in the first couple years
(21:29):
of my business One.
Some still work with me.
Secondly, they will reach backout and say, oh my gosh, john, I
just got promoted.
Here's what we had talked aboutyears ago.
I never forgot that.
That was so powerful.
That warms my heart because myclients reaching their goals and
(21:52):
achieving the success they want.
That is why I do this.
That is why I get in front ofthe mic every single week with
you to help you build thatcomponent of your mid-career GPS
to whatever is going to be next.
And so you might be sittingthere saying, okay, john, well,
how do you work with people?
Well, there's free content.
Free content like this podcast.
(22:15):
Free content like my weeklynewsletter that goes out twice a
week.
You can get that on my websiteat johnnerrellcom.
Free content like my blog, whatI post on LinkedIn or what I
post on Instagram or Facebook.
I put a ton of free content outthere.
Free content is just that.
(22:36):
It's free.
Free content is valuable.
I repeatedly have people comeback and say this was really
helpful.
This was great.
You want to engage with me at afree level.
There's plenty of free contentfor that.
The other way I work with peopleis people who are customers.
That means they have bought aparticular service of mine, or
(22:59):
course.
So I have a couple of digitalcourses that are out there.
One is called From CareerCrossroads to Career Clarity a
step-by-step guide for findingyour sweet spot at mid-career.
I have an interview prep coursecalled A Simple Five-Step
Strategy for Crushing your NextInterview.
I do a LinkedIn profile audit.
You can find all of those on mywebsite at johnnarrellcom under
(23:22):
the courses section, butthey're typically an offer that
is less than $100 that allowsyou to come in and buy some paid
content that is going to helpyou more so than the free
content.
There is a reason why it's paid.
There is an additional level ofvalue in buying that particular
(23:44):
service.
The last piece is that youbecome a client.
Whether you're a client who'sgoing to come into my new
community or you're one of myprivate one-on-one coaching
clients, you now enter into afar different relationship with
me as a client because we arepersonally interacting.
(24:07):
When you buy one of my digitalcourses, you get me recorded.
You know you get lifetimeaccess to the course in that
regard, but that's just there.
Okay, you come into mycommunity or my private coaching
.
Now you get a different levelof support because you are
directly working with me.
(24:28):
Yes, that is a paid service.
So one of the things I did veryearly on in my business and I
would be remiss if I didn't talkabout this was I did what was
called a free session, or I dida consultation or a strategy
call, and I did them because Iwas new.
(24:51):
I did them because it was agreat opportunity for me to
build rapport with a potentialclient, and some of them became
clients and some of them didn't.
But here's what's happened,especially over the last year,
as this coaching industry hasevolved and changed.
There are people out there andI would be willing to bet some
(25:15):
of you might be listening tothis podcast as well and
thinking, oh, I could just get afree session from a coach and I
never have to pay.
There are coaches out therethat still do free sessions.
I do not.
I do not.
My work, my caseload, myexperience is such that I simply
(25:40):
do not do free sessions anymore.
If you want to work with me,you want to experience what's
working with me.
There is a way to book what Iam now calling a leadership or
career strategy session.
It's a 45-minute session.
At the time of this recording,in January of 2025, it's $197.
(26:01):
If you roll up into privatecoaching with me one-on-one, you
can take that and apply that tothe cost of the coaching
package.
Anybody that wants to work withme.
The first step is book aleadership or career strategy
session.
Get to know what a coachingsession is like.
Yes, you do have to pay for it.
If you don't want to hire meafter that, we've had a great
(26:22):
call.
If you do want to hire me afterthat, I do have to pay for it.
If you don't want to hire meafter that, we've had a great
call.
If you do want to hire me afterthat, I apply that to the cost
of the coaching package.
But I do not offer free sessionsanymore.
I just simply do not have thetime to do that and it is not
fair to those people who areinterested in hiring me as a
coach, who want to get that fullexperience.
(26:45):
That's why I offer that at areduced rate.
So if you are interested inbooking that particular strategy
session, go to my website,johnnarrellcom.
Click on the Work With Me tabor About Me section, and you
will be able to see that rightthere.
But in closing, here's what youneed to know.
If you are looking for a coach.
(27:07):
It is an investment.
You're gonna spend money onyour career development and
right now money isn't growing ontrees.
So if you're willing to makethat investment and this is
something you really really wantfor your transformation then by
all means do your research andmake sure you find the coach
(27:31):
that you connect with that is agreat fit for you.
They have a program that alignswith exactly what it is that
you need Financially.
It is within your budget thatyou can afford and invest in.
I do not want anybody goinginto debt to hire me as their
coach because this is aninvestment.
(27:52):
Right.
If you're like, look, I'll putit on a credit card, I know I
can pay it off and fine, okay.
And yes, I do offer paymentplans, but you have to make sure
that the finance piece is rightfor you.
And, lastly, does the coach?
Is the coach capable of movingyou forward, given the work you
(28:15):
are willing to put in on it toget the transformation you
desire?
The transformation you desireIf you take those four Fs and
you build them in much like Icoach my clients on in terms of
finding that job they're goingto love, and you apply those
four Fs to picking the rightcoach for them.
I guarantee you it will notsteer you wrong.
(28:36):
And if you've enjoyed listeningto this episode or following me
for a while and you would liketo know how to work with me,
easiest thing you can do you cango to my website at
https://johnneral.
com.
There is a form on there tofill out for coaching.
That's one way you can get theconversation started.
You can connect with me onLinkedIn.
I'm the only John Neral.
(28:57):
That's well.
I shouldn't say that I thinkthere is one other John Neral,
but we are not related.
But you can certainly find myLinkedIn right off of my website
as well.
You can find me on Instagram orFacebook at John Neral Coaching
, or you can simply email me atjohn@johnneral.
But if you want 2025 to be theyear where you take greater
(29:18):
control of your career and youare ready to find the job you
love or love the job you have,or if you are a rising and
emerging leader who is lookingfor that kind of leadership
support to be more impactfulwith your team, increase your
visibility within theorganization, build a networking
strategy where you get to buildauthentic and genuine
(29:41):
relationships, where your brandis elevated and people are
talking about you in the mostpositive ways to be considered
for whatever that role might benext, you and I should
absolutely talk, and I lookforward to hearing from you.
So until next time, my friends,remember this you will build
your mid-career GPS one mile orone step at a time, and how you
(30:05):
show up matters.
Make it a great rest of yourday.
Thank you for listening to theMid-Career GPS Podcast.
Make sure to follow on yourfavorite listening platform and,
if you have a moment, I'd loveto hear your comments on Apple
Podcasts, and if you have amoment, I'd love to hear your
comments on Apple Podcasts.
(30:27):
Visit JohnNarrowcom for moreinformation about how I can help
you build your mid-career GPSor how I can help you and your
organization with your nextworkshop or public speaking
event.
Don't forget to connect with meon LinkedIn and follow me on
social at John Narrow Coaching.
I look forward to being backwith you next week.
Until then, take care andremember how we show up matters.
Thank you.
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