Steel Sharpens Steel: Combat Veteran Shares Leadership Lessons with SFC Alexander Stewart

Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Warriors fall in.
It's time for formation.
I want to welcome you all backto the Morning Formation Podcast
, where we shine a spotlight onresilience, leadership and
survivability.
Today we're bringing back awonderful guest whose first
appearance left us with a verypowerful impact.
Sergeant First Class AlexanderStewart is not only a decorated
combat veteran and an activeduty leader.

(00:21):
He's a mental health advocate,motivational speaker and the
author of Unspoken Words.
In our last conversation,alexander actually shared his
journey through three combatdeployments and his evolution as
a leader and his unflinchinghonesty about the invisible
wounds of war.
But there's more to his storyand I wanted to make sure that
we got back into it again and wecovered it.

(00:43):
He went into great detail and alot of the things that he said
last time really hit home for meand really resonated with me.
Man, it got me a littleemotional.
So, Sergeant First ClassStewart, thank you so much for
joining me on the MorningFormation again.

Speaker 2 (00:59):
Absolutely.
Thank you for having me back.

Speaker 1 (01:02):
Dude, it's rare to meet someone like you because,
at the end of the day, like youare still in it, like you are
still in the military right now,but you're able to articulate a
lot and I can say that when Iwas in the military maybe it was
because I was younger, I don'tknow what it was, but like it
took years for me to process alot of the things that you

(01:26):
talked about last time.
It's almost like your brain isat a more mature level than I
think most of us that serve inthe military and get out.
It takes usually it takespeople years to process, but you
have this interesting, veryinteresting like perspective on
a lot of things that make sense.

(01:46):
So, um, it's great to have youback on the show man and, uh,
since our last conversation, um,have there been any new
developments in your advocacy oryour personal projects?
You got going on.

Speaker 2 (02:02):
Uh yeah.
So I just committed to do a22-mile ruck march for a
nonprofit called Hick Strong.
I'm going to be doing thatsometime here soon and the goal
is to try to raise a little bitof funds for them.
What they do, yes that's theone.

Speaker 1 (02:18):
That's right.
Yeah, yep, thank you, by theway.

Speaker 2 (02:21):
What they do is they provide free counseling that
does not report to the commandat all, for active duty and for
veterans.
So you know it's over the phone, it could be virtual, but the
fact of the or having to dealwith the stigma, all of that
isn't there and it just givesthem an entity outside of the

(02:53):
DOD to access.
So I think it's a great program.
I know the parents that runthat program very well, so I
figured I would do what I could,while also, you know, making
sure I stay in shape.
So we'll we'll see how thatgoes here soon.

Speaker 1 (03:09):
Yeah, I saw you, man.
I snook um on your social media.
You've been working hard, likemornings, nights, you've been
putting it in man.
So that's that's reallyimportant for just your mental
health as well, right.

Speaker 2 (03:22):
Absolutely that, and you know you to keep the dad bod
looking good always.

Speaker 1 (03:28):
What is the dad bod?
It's just like having abarreled chest and like no
definition.
I guess that describes me tothe T man.

Speaker 2 (03:37):
I always tell people you have your typical dad bod,
which is the one everyone talksabout with like the slight gut
and stuff, but then you have thedistinguished father figure.
So I'm trying to work on thatone.
I'm trying to graduate from dadbod to father figure.

Speaker 1 (03:53):
You're going to write the definition of that one man.
It's going to be a picture ofyou next to the father figure
versus the dad bod.
You're creating a whole newgenre of like older males that
work out.
New genre of like older malesthat uh, that work out.
Since the last time we talked,man, um, looking back on the

(04:14):
podcast and the conversationthat we had, was there anything
that you wish you had expandedin?
Uh, expanded on or explaineddifferently?

Speaker 2 (04:19):
No, you know, uh, I think we covered a lot of stuff
uh, decently Well, we got a lotof information, a lot of stuff
out there in the time frame thatwe had.
I would probably say that, youknow, we could focus a lot more
on just like mental mind stateand how to get after, you know,
becoming what you want to be anddeveloping yourself into that

(04:42):
end state goal and developingyourself into that end state
goal.
But outside of that, I'm prettysure we're fairly confident
that we covered a lot of stuffin that timeframe.

Speaker 1 (04:51):
Yeah, Sometimes people go back and they listen
to something that they said orsomething that they mentioned in
a topic, and then they wantedto kind of go back and, I guess,
make sure that they were clearon their message overall, and I
think one of the things that Isee over and over and over again
in today's world, in today'supbringing of leaders, is

(05:14):
digesting and processing theconcept of failure.
What are your thoughts on that?
As far as you know, in themilitary, it's always drive on,
drive on.
What are your thoughts on that?
As far as you know, in themilitary, it's always drive on,
drive on.
What are your thoughts on thatas a leader?

Speaker 2 (05:27):
So I think that a lot of people get into their heads
that you know failure is not anoption and if you fail at
something, then you know youshould just give up or walk away
, when in reality people need tostart going back to looking at
failure as a chance to grow.
I just recently spoke to aservice member who was going to

(05:48):
the promotion board and didn'tmake it and they were kind of,
you know, getting on themselvesabout it and I said, well,
what'd you do wrong?
And they told me the thingsthat you know they got wrong.
And I was like okay, so what'sthe plan moving forward, how are
you going to focus on thesethings, to improve yourself, to
like well, I don't know if Iwant to go back anytime soon.
I said, why not?
You have a whole month to fixthe small things that you didn't

(06:11):
do right.
Go right back and get rightback at it.
It's not that you failed orthat you weren't good enough.
It's that you weren't ready atthis point in time to become,
you know, that next level thatyou want to become.
Someone went out of their wayto tell you hey, you know, if
you fix these one, two, threethings, then you're ready.
So why would you now, you know,retreat and back out, instead

(06:35):
of just, you know, putting yourhead forward, leaning into it
and tackling those few thingsand then going right back out
there and, as a leader, thosefew things and then going right
back out there and, as a leader,you know, if people see you do
that, versus you know backingoff, they're going to respect
you more, because that is what aleader does.
Failure is not, you know, theabsence of success.

(06:57):
Failure is the opportunity tokind of readjust yourself and
then go right back at the sametask.
Maybe you could fail four orfive, six times, but as long as
every time you fail you takesomething away from that failure
and then you go right back atit and you grow and you learn.
You didn't really fail, youjust had an opportunity to learn

(07:23):
how to be better.
I love a quote that I used tohear all the time.
I'd rather I don't remember whosaid it, but someone said I'd
rather fail than succeed,because from success you don't
learn much, but from failure youcan learn everything.

Speaker 1 (07:39):
Yeah, yeah, I've learned a lot more from failure
than I have from success.
No-transcript.

(08:06):
I always thought there's twodifferent types of leaders.
There's the types of leadersthat have the battle scars from
making their own mistakes andlearning, and then there's a
type that just read from booksand imagine what that's like,
and I think that's huge forpeople Like, if you mess up,
it's okay, learn from it.

(08:26):
That's the most important part.
Just pick up and move on, um,and just share that experience
with others.
Don't be afraid to say, yeah, II fucked up as a leader.
Uh, this is what I did, um,because other people like to
know that they're not alone inin making these types of
decisions too.
Man and I just I feel likethat's a common theme lately in
my life is just a lot of youngpeople just feel like man, I'm a

(08:49):
failure, I failed, my life isover, and I'm like are you
kidding me?
You're still alive.

Speaker 2 (08:54):
There's people.
Yeah, no, absolutely.
You know, and you heard it whenyou were in the military.
And I tell people all the timenow, personally I've never been
counseled, I've never gotten introuble with anything.
But I tell them all the timeI'm like there's not a Sergeant
Major in the Army that hasn'tgotten an Article 15 or
something down the road oreverybody's gotten in trouble
for one thing.
Now I've been chewed out, butI'm weird.

(09:16):
I used to get made fun of,especially by my peers, because
they'd be like you've never beencounseled.
I was like, no, I got a couple,cause they'd be like you've
never been counseled.
I was like, nah, I got a couple, I got a couple like positive
performance counselings, butI've never had a written on
paper like counseling for doinganything.
If ever I did something, uh, itwas usually a talking to.
I did do one thing one timethat definitely deserved

(09:38):
something.
Um, but they, uh, they, they,they definitely let me off the
hook because it was ondeployment and it was just
something I said over the radio,not realizing that the radio
was being monitored by otherlike nations that were, that
were in the coalition force, andit was me commenting on on a

(10:00):
coalition force that didsomething to me that day.

Speaker 1 (10:04):
Oh, that sounds like it could have caused another war
.
I um dude, I I honestly man, I Isimply think that, um, when it
comes to, when it comes toscrewing up there, I mean the,
the the most important part ofall that is that you basically

(10:24):
share that with others and yougrow and you move on, you accept
it, you take the responsibility, you take the accountability,
and I think that's a hugemessage for a lot of people out
there.
Your book, unspoken Words,covers a lot of like your
thoughts, feelings, expressionsabout your time in the military

(10:48):
and just your life in general.
What feedback have you receivedfrom fellow service members or
veterans about your book?

Speaker 2 (10:57):
So you know, honestly , I didn't know what I was going
to receive when I first did it.
I put it out there and I'm likeI'm going to try to help
somebody.
You know, maybe it'll help oneperson, but I've actually never
met a service member up untilthis point who has given me any
negative feedback on that book.
The worst feedback I've gottenis a why the hell would you put

(11:22):
this on paper?
What are you trying to do to me, man?
Kind of thing, you know, notanger or not judging, but it was
, you know, just something thatthey weren't ready for.
And you know, when you tellsomebody, hey, I wrote a book,
you should check it out.
It just covers some of thestruggles that we go through,

(11:44):
you know they expect it to justbe like a book.
But nine times out of 10, whenI talk to somebody specifically,
I talked to a good friend ofmine who just did a show with me
not too long ago and he said hehad to you know, dog ear like
three or four pages in the bookand then come back to it later.

(12:04):
I've also had a friend that wasin the Marine Corps who was
shot in the chest and then got aPurple Heart and was discharged
and he had my book and you knowmy book's not long in any way.
It took him two and a halfmonths to make it from the
beginning to the end, because hesaid he would read one and then

(12:24):
he would have to like think onit for like four or five days
and he also just was I don'twant to say afraid, but kind of
reluctant to touch it againbecause he didn't want to go
back into that, into thatmindset.
He wasn't ready yet.
But after like two and a halfmonths he finally like messaged
me.
We talked about it but I thinkthe best feedback I've gotten

(12:48):
thus far.
I had a friend of mine who'scurrently overseas do a veteran
forum with me last month and Idid not know this, but he has
gone through a lot of stuff.
He went through infertilitythat he talked about on my show
with his previous spouse, adivorce, all of this stuff,

(13:08):
suicidal ideation, and then heremarried and he has this
amazing wife that is trying to,or was trying to, understand
what was going on with him whenit comes to post-traumatic
stress and just his time inservice.
And what he had told me was oneday he took my book and left it

(13:28):
on the coffee table for her andsaid I'm going to work.
If you want to know what'sreally going on, read this and
then maybe we can talk when Icome home.
And he told me the day he gothome after work.
That day he was met with tears,compassion and understanding for

(13:51):
the first time, like ever, andI was on my forum, you know, and
I'm trying to keep my composure, and he's got me tearing up
hearing this stuff, because notonly is he a friend of mine, but
we have been in two units andwe've been deployed together and
you know, and to hear yourfriend tell you hey, I, you know
, had this weapon to my headbefore and I was in this spot

(14:13):
and I was stuck, and to have aclose friend tell you that I
used your book to finally climbout was kind of it for me.
I think that's gotta be thehigh so far for me as far as,
like you know, the best feedbackand feelings I've had from that
book.

(14:33):
Cause you, you do this stuffand you know you do podcasts and
you go and talk to try to helppeople, but then when you find
out that, like you're startingto help people that are the
closest to you.
I mean, it's just a wholenother level.

Speaker 1 (14:46):
Yeah, I mean I was talking to someone yesterday and
they just kept asking me why,why, in a sense of like they're
asking me, why do you do thepodcast?
Why do you volunteer fornonprofits?
Why do you like why?
And they kept going into detailabout it and it got to a point

(15:06):
where like enough why's got meto be very emotional about it
and I got to the truth of why,why I care about community, why
I care about others.
I think a lot of veterans don'tthrive in the civilian sector
because we care too much aboutthe neighbors, we care too much
about the community.
We're not selfish enoughbecause we care too much about
the neighbors.
We care too much about thecommunity.

(15:26):
We're not selfish enough and umto to really thrive and make
the big bucks and all it's.
To some extent you got to kindof be a selfish asshole to make
a lot of money and that'sunfortunate that.
That's just how it is.
But I think a lot of veteransjust really care about community
.
Where do you think your careabout your fellow man, your
fellow woman?

(15:46):
Like?
Where do you think that startswith you?
Like, what?
Like?
When did you develop that?

Speaker 2 (15:50):
so I know, for me, I was raised by a soldier, so I
was always taught that if youcan defend somebody who can't
defend themselves, you do it.
If you have the ability to feedsomeone who's hungry, you feed
them.
You know, if you have theability to help someone who
needs help, you help them.
You don't ask them how they gotin this situation, you don't

(16:13):
ask them for anything in return,you just do it.
And you know, having a fatherthat was both military and a
professional fighter, you kindof get that instilled in you.
But I think when you say theveterans, I think that's
instilled like right in thatbasic training setting.
You know, when we're young kidsand you have this

(16:35):
battle-hardened drill sergeanttelling you that it doesn't
matter where you're from or howyou feel about the people to
your left and right, all thatmatters is that they did the
same thing you did put theirhand up, swore to join, said the
oath and put the uniform on.
From that moment on you willdie for the people next to you.

(16:58):
And you know we have that putinto us at such a young age, a
very impressionable age, becausemost of us are 17, 18, 19, 20.
And then you spend the nextcouple years with that in the
back of your mind and, like forme, I knew I didn't care how or
what somebody did or how theywere acting.

(17:21):
If you wore that uniform,similar to what just happened at
Fort Stewart, I mean, you havefive people that ran at a gunman
and tackled them, regardless ofthe situation you know, because
they saw that everyone else wasin danger.

Speaker 1 (17:40):
So they did what's been embedded in them and you
know what their at their core asa service member man, I tell
you how many times I've stoppedto help someone with something
and everyone else around me isquestioning why are you doing
that?
And I'm like, why aren't youdoing what the hell is wrong
with?
It's not what's wrong with me,what's wrong with you, and

(18:01):
that's just how it is.
That's how it's been out herefor me in the civilian world
anyways, and I wanted to mentionearlier and I forgot, I lost my
train of thought.
I, um, when you mentioned that,uh, you know, screwing up and
messing up and failing.
I think that's one of thegreatest things about the
military is you get put intopositions of responsibility that

(18:22):
challenge you and challenge andit helps polish you as a person
, because I know a lot of 24year olds, like in my case, for
example, when I became a platoonleader at 24, there wasn't a
whole lot of other 24 year oldsthat became platoon leaders in
our in a war zone at 24, like Icame back at 25 and I could look
around and I could.

(18:43):
I could very confidently saythat most of these people have
not dealt with what I dealt withfor the last year.
Um, and I think that's what'sgreat about the military is
especially like in the army andthe Marines, where you become a
squad leader and you're incharge of a small group.
Um, you know, I think for a lotof us too, we don't think about
it much, but when I was inbasic training, training man,
like they made me a squad leaderand I was a squad leader the

(19:07):
entire cycle and never got firedum, that's where I think it
started for me to care about myfellow soldier, because I always
carried around two ofeverything two canteens, two
smart books, two ponchos toeverything and so like.
Whenever I had a squad memberthat was missing something, I'm
like here, just hold this forinspection, just just hold on to

(19:28):
it, and you don't think muchabout it, man.
But it kind of starts like at avery infinite stage.
Um, you know, even in basictraining and you were a huge
part of that you were a drillsergeant for how many years?

Speaker 2 (19:42):
uh two, just two, because of the reclassing and
how they're reorganizing themilitary at least on the Army
side.
I came up on my finalre-enlistment and I was
basically told hey, you can stayin your job for the next eight,

(20:02):
seven years, whatever's left.
However, because the army'sdownsizing at any time, you
could be reassigned to adifferent MOS.
So, um, in order to have done athird year as a drill, I would
have had to have extended, andin order to extend, I would have
had to do one more umre-enlistment.

Speaker 1 (20:18):
So there was a huge barrier there, right, and it's
all about timing and what'sgoing on in the world and and
everything else.
I mean, yeah, that's huge.
So, um, I want to talk aboutsomething a lot of people kind
of a hot topic today, man, likewith this new generation coming
up.
A lot of people, um, you know,say the younger generation is

(20:41):
lazy, this or that there's.
I mean, I have my own thoughtstoo, but from your experience, I
mean, you've been a drillinstructor, a mentor, an NCO, a
leader, you've been to severalcombat deployments.
How do you think and not onlythat, but you kind of cross a

(21:07):
generational gap, because youcame in the 2000s, early 2000s,
and then now you're 2025.
How has this younger generationof soldiers, or just military
in general, surprised you, bothpositively and negatively?

Speaker 2 (21:16):
So I would say on the positive side, you know we get
all wrapped up in everythingthat's going on and all the
opinions of media and just thegeneral societal norms that they
push.
So I have been surprised a lot,especially as a drill, when I
come across somebody thatresembles that old fire, like in

(21:39):
a young enlistee, in a youngrecruit that you saw back in
like 01, 02, 03, 04, 05, during,during, like the height of the
war, we'd have these kids comein and like they were a hundred
percent all about it and itreally caught me off guard.
But at the same time that youknow that's where that fire gets

(22:01):
lit in you You're like, oh, Igot one.
All right, I'm going to givethis kid everything I've got
because I know that he deservesthat and he wants that.
And I was actually surprisedbecause there was a large number
of this new generation thateveryone thinks is such and such

(22:21):
, that actually was like that.
It's still there.
There are still these kids thatare joining and, you know, want
to serve that, have that fireeven in a time of quote, unquote
, peace, you know.
But on the flip side, like theextreme disappointment was just

(22:42):
all of these free riding.
I don't want to listen toauthority.
I have no respect for anything.
I can't tell you how many kidsjoined and didn't even make it
out of basic because they wouldjust throw their stuff, throw
everything away for either prideor an attitude issue or just
something dumb Like.

(23:02):
Imagine being told hey, here's$50,000 for a combat job which
you know.
It's like you and me back inthe day when we joined, you
weren't getting $50,000 for that.
But now, because it's apeacetime and we're away from it
, some of these kids are comingin with $50,000, $30,000 bonuses
.
Imagine being told at 18 yearsold, all you got to do is go

(23:27):
through six months of OSIT andthen you get $50,000 and then
just not doing it and, like I,had kids that would throw it all
away just to take like a hit ofa vape or sneak a vape in and
it's just the smallest things,and I think that was one of the
most shocking and disappointingthings, cause like my generation
and the way I grew up, Icouldn't fathom somebody making

(23:50):
a commitment and then just notsticking to the commitment.
I was always raised that if yougive your word for something,
you know that's it, and myfather used to always say you
know a man is only as good ashis word.
If if a man doesn't have hisword, he has nothing.

Speaker 1 (24:08):
You kind of glossed over it earlier, man, but I want
to go back again.

Speaker 2 (24:10):
Your father who is he ?
Oh, so my father is AlexanderArthur Stewart.
He fought in Desert Storm, hewas a tanker and he was also on
the Army boxing team.
Okay, he was a tanker and hewas also on the army boxing team
.
Okay, and he was trained byFloyd Patterson, who is a very,
very, very famous old boxer.

(24:32):
He fought Muhammad Ali.
He trained with the best.
So I grew up, kind of when I wasyoung, in in that shadow.
I got pictures of me sitting onJoe Frazier's lap at a barbecue
and you know, hanging out,hanging out with Floyd Patterson
, his son, tracy.
My dad's got pictures of RoyJones senior, roy Jones junior,

(24:55):
all of these big names Al Cole,charles Murray.
So I grew up in thisenvironment of one military
standard.
I still remember when I waslike four or five, watching my
dad shine and then bake hisboots, you know, and watch him
iron his stuff, and it was.

(25:16):
It was just like you saw thisstuff and you're like you know,
as a young kid, you're like thisthis is what a man is kind of,
you know, yeah, yeah.
And then to to every weekend ontop of that, to go to, I would
follow my dad to the gym all thetime.
So every Sunday he would go andteach boxing and I would go too
and he'd be training these,these like full grown men that

(25:39):
are paying him to train, and I'dbe in the background just
shadowing what they're doing.
And eventually I got to a pointwhere my dad shifted and
started training me and it was.
I think it was a goodexperience, you know to, to grow
up and watch all that like, tosee somebody dedicate all that
time to shining their boots, allthis other stuff staying in

(25:59):
shape, and then to also havethat discipline from a military
background mixed with thediscipline of a fighting
background.
As a young kid.
It really helped solidify one,that guardian mentality that we
were touching on earlier,certain mindset, and I think

(26:27):
that's one of the things thatthat's helped me throughout.
All my stuff is growing up andin having that mindset, yes, I'm
going to get into some darkplaces and I've struggled, but I
have also had that coreupbringing that's just deep
rooted in the memory.
So usually when I'm starting tostruggle or stuff, that's kind
of where I dig and I try to pullthat back out.

(26:49):
You know that, just thatmentality of, hey, you're a
fighter and not even military,just growing up as a kid, I was
always a fighter If somebody waspushing on someone that wasn't
you know big enough to dosomething back.
I built a name at a very youngage because I had a buddy and he

(27:10):
passed away, but we weren'tfriends at first.
He was a white guy and I wasmaybe like 10, 11 years old, and
so was he, and we were youngkids and I don't remember what
we were talking about something.
And then he just decided todrop the N word but like as like

(27:31):
, oh, what's up?
My, and I looked at him.
I was like don't ever say that,don't ever say that to me.
He's like oh, what's yourproblem?
You know, I'm just saying itwith it.
And he said it again.
I was like got, you, got onemore, one more and and we're
gonna have a problem.
And then he said it again andyou know, of course, he had this
crowd of of dudes around him.

(27:51):
He's one of those dude, one ofthose guys.
And, uh, my father always taughtme, you know, never start
something but you will finish it, or or you will deal with me
when, when you get home.
And I was like OK, so he, hesaid something, I shoved him.

(28:13):
And then you know this little11 year old dude who actually
secretly has been trainingboxing since he was like four
and a half five, like seriouslyfor every weekend, did some
really bad damage to another kidand from from that point that
was my first time ever actuallydefending myself.
From that point it was kind oflike a realization of one how

(28:36):
dangerous somebody who can doall those things to somebody is,
especially at that age whereother kids, especially back then
, things to somebody is,especially at that age where
other kids, especially back thenthis is.
You know, you got to rememberthis is before ufc mma, before
jiu-jitsu even really got bigbefore social media because you
want to, went viral yeah, soyeah, oh yeah, but definitely

(28:57):
before social media.
I mean we're talking like 2000and yeah but it was, it was a.
I'm blessed at that.
Now, yes, my childhood wasrough.
My parents ended up divorcingand stuff.
But that time period where Iwas able to see my father do all

(29:21):
of these things and then, youknow, get that one-on-one time
with him and all that dedicationand support into developing me,
I didn't realize you know whatit was when I was little, but it
helped kind of create thementality that I have now and
the strength that I have now,which is funny because even with

(29:43):
all that, with my dad being anNCO in the military and doing
all these things like where yousay you know you were the guy
that was helping everyone atbasic you'd probably be
surprised but I actually neverwanted to lead.
When I was in basic um, I wasgiven a spot as as a platoon
guide and like I was getting onthe bus five minutes after they

(30:03):
gave it to me and my drillsergeant looked at me.
He goes you don't want it, doyou?
And I went no, so then he gaveit back to the dude he just
fired.
But at the same time I wasn'tpopular because I took the oath
very serious.
If dudes were goofing off, Iwould get on them about it If

(30:24):
they weren't taking stuffseriously.
Like they all said, I was waytoo uptight.
But at the same time, even ifthey didn't like my personality
because I was just way too, theysaid I was way too.
Hooah, you know, not a badthing, I was that guy.
I was that guy Every time.
If I saw one of the dudes thatwas struggling with his rucksack

(30:45):
I would take it.
And my favorite memory iswalking through the woods in
Georgia with a dude's rucksackon my stomach and mine on my
back, and I was also the RTO, sothe RTO bag hooked onto my ruck
and I had this drill sergeantwho looked at me and he's like

(31:05):
what the hell are you doing?
And I said my battle buddy wasstruggling drill sergeant, so
I'm going to carry the load forhim.
And it was that kind of thing.
Battle Buddy was struggling,joel Sarnes, so I'm going to
carry the load for him.
And it was that kind of thing.
So it was funny because you know, kind of like dodgeball growing
up, we were getting ready to goto the field and the squad
leaders would be like, oh, whodo we want?
And I was right there andthey'd be like well, you know,

(31:31):
stewart is kind of uptight andstuff, but like hell he'll carry
some gear.
I'm uptight and stuff, but likehell he'll carry some gear.
And like he's got your back.
I don't like him, but like andthat's it.
That's how it would go andthey'd put me underneath them
just simply because of like, oh,if I need someone to carry the
radio, he'll carry the radio, ifsomebody can't carry their gear
or something, he'll carry them,kind of thing.
And I think that's that, um,guardian mentality.
But it wasn't until, like youyou said, where they kind of

(31:54):
push you into leadership rolesand force you, when I became a
corporal at like two years intoservice and after only two years
, you know, now I'm shoved intothese roles.
And that's kind of where Irealized, okay, well, when I
don't have a choice and I'mputting that spot, I guess I
guess there's a lot more therethat, like I said, I gained from

(32:17):
my childhood with my father andjust growing up being the
oldest of the brothers andwatching out for them, that I
didn't realize I had until thearmy pushed me into that spot
and said, hey, you don't have achoice right, we have a lot of
similarities, bro, like I mean,I'll be honest with you.

Speaker 1 (32:33):
Like I, I grew up a military brat.
My dad was drafted at the endof the vietnam war but by the
time he finished ranger schoolthey were sending everyone home,
um, and he retired e8.
Uh, very tough man with drillsergeant, volunteered for five
years, um, and, like you said,like I grew up, on one hand I

(32:55):
grew up watching him be thisprofessional like, always
looking very stacked, alwayslike uniform pressed.
You know his, his peers highlyrespected him, but he wasn't a
big guy, he was like a five footeight dude that was like skinny
but tough as as nails.
Grew up watching that.
But then I had this other sideto my life, where there was a
lot of domestic violence too.

(33:16):
And it's funny because a fewyears ago I knew someone that
was doing a military bratstorytelling thing and it was a
positive thing.
And they asked me to do it andI just kind of like I can't
really.
And they asked me to do it andI just kind of like I can't
really.
My time in the military as amilitary brat was not good,

(33:38):
moving around a lot, and thenthe domestic stuff was not good,
but what was good was I grew upwith a very strong dad, a very
strong man, so I saw what astrong man does as far as be
professional, look professional,talk professional, have the
command presence, and I think alot of dads today, strong

(34:00):
fathers, are very undervalued,like that whole notion is not
everyone talks moms, moms, moms,moms, moms.
I think that's one of theproblems in our society, man.
I think that's why you have alot of boys, a lot of boys that
never grow up to be men and theydon't know how to overcome
obstacles and adversity, becausethey're constantly falling back
on the safety net of their momsand the strong fathers are not

(34:25):
being as valued as they should.
Because that's what you reallyneed is like that guy that's
going to show you how to beresilient, strong, and I think
daughters too, like daughters,learn from dads to some extent.
And there's so funny how, likea lot of the things that you
mentioned just now, I couldactually resonate with man.
And going back to what you saidabout the money, like the

(34:45):
$50,000 stuff, bro, like backduring my time, people were
making a hundred thousanddollars to join Blackwater.
Back during my time, peoplewere making $100,000 to join
Blackwater, to be like afreaking what's that called A,
not a militia, a mercenary rightJust to go over there and like

(35:05):
$100,000.
In the 2000s $100,000 was$100,000.
So now it's like I don't know.
It just cracks me up, man, likethe money that they just throw
around today versus what it wasback 20 years ago.

Speaker 2 (35:18):
Yeah, you know how the military was.
They didn't really have to getus.
Everyone was angry, right, youknow everybody, everybody wanted
to get a piece of the action.
It's now that and I think thisis crazy I was just talking to
um, a marine the other day and asergeant from the army, and he

(35:39):
said something that I didn't itdidn't click in my head, yet he
goes, but he said it's crazy tome that 9-11 has been reduced to
a meme these days because somany kids don't know and weren't
even alive yet and like now,all you ever hear about it
besides, you know, on theanniversary is just memes and

(36:00):
all these other things.
And when he said that, you know, that was the first time I
actually sat back and thoughtabout that and I was like wow.
And then you know, you thinkabout how people, people are
joining and you know I'm not,I'm not dogging on anybody for
why they want to join.
You want to join forcitizenship, cool.
If you want to join for, youknow, uh, a college degree, good

(36:22):
, all of that Cause.
Honestly, I tell everybody, ifyou're not getting yourself
ready for life after themilitary, you're setting
yourself up for failure yourentire time in the military,
there should always be in thebackground stuff going on to get
you ready, because if you getout and then there is nothing
waiting for you, that's the mostdangerous thing ever, because

(36:43):
you went from having somethingevery single day and having a
plan and having a schedule tonothing.
As a service member, you willlose your mind, and I totally
agree with you when you say,like you know that transition
out is rough, and that's why Ialways tell people like, hey,
what are you doing right now toprepare yourself for when you

(37:03):
get out?
It's like, oh well, I'm notdoing anything yet.
I'm like no, no, no, you useyour TA because it doesn't touch
your GI bill.
I want you to invest some moneyin some stuff.
I want you to do this.
I want you to and I would liketake time out of their schedule
in the day and either sit downwith them myself or I'd be like
look, we don't have much goingon right now at Troop.
I want you to go over to thecommunity center and I want you

(37:25):
to book an appointment with thefinancial manager and I want you
to talk to them about one yourTSP, your 401k.
Then I also want you to talk tothem about how to properly
invest money for your future.
Because you're 19 years old, I'mlike go, go, go do what no one
ever did for me.
I didn't start doing any ofthat stuff till I was 27.
And it wasn't because someonetold me to, it's because I was

(37:48):
27 and I looked at the mirrorand went I haven't done anything
while I've been in Because Ispent.
You know, from 20 to 25 isdeployments, deployments,
deployments.
So when I was 26, I was justtired.
And then in 27 is where I kindof sat there I looked at my TSP

(38:09):
and I was like dude, I've onlybeen putting in like 2% for the
last seven years of my career.
What am I doing?
And then just look, it wassitting in the G fund and all
this stuff.
So it's, it's a whole notherball game.

Speaker 1 (38:24):
Yeah, yeah, man, um, a lot of a lot of what you're
saying is is exactly true.
No-transcript, the week to week, the month to month stuff.

(38:58):
So what's my role as a platoonleader?
Stand down there and get in theway of shit that I don't know
nothing about, right?
No, like, my job as a at thetime I was a first lieutenant
was to remove obstacles, was tosupport, was to also encourage

(39:21):
the young soldiers to go to theeducation center.
And I would have these strongconversations with them where
I'm like you know why did youjoin the military?
Oh, I want to take care of somecollege.
You know that's fine, you know,go to the education center, and
then I would follow up with.
You know that's fine, you know,go to the education center, and
then I would follow up withthem week to week.
Did you go to the educationcenter?
Like, I also walked the walkbecause after deployment I
started my master's degree, um,and I think that was really

(39:46):
important, as my role as aplatoon leader was to look at
the big picture and I wouldexplain to people like, look,
you think you're you're going tostay in 20 years, but you could
destroy your hip next month andthen you're going to get med
boarded out, then what?
The best place to be in life isa place where you have that
lateral mobility to go intoother jobs or other careers

(40:08):
without taking too much of a hiton your location, your salary
and your desired job.
And I think that is directlytied to the suicide that happens
to a lot of our veterans outthere because they get out
assuming that what they did inthe military is going to
translate, and a lot of times itdoes not translate.
You're going to sit across froma recruiter that doesn't know

(40:30):
anything about what a drillsergeant does, except for what
they watched on tv.
They're not going to understandwhat an nco is versus an e2.
They're not going to know.
So you're going to have to geton the floor and play blocks,
which is frustrating.
Um, so, working on thattransition early on, from the
minute that you get in themilitary and you start getting

(40:52):
those, those certifications, thedegrees, or I mean hell, I
would say even trade school likestart working on something
that's going to get you to whereyou have that letter mobility,
so, if life happens, so you meet, you meet your wife or whatever
, and then now she, you havekids.
Now you're like this militarylife isn't going to work.

(41:12):
I need to get out.
You have that, that, thatsafety where like, okay, I can
get out, I can transition, I canfind a job in the city that I
want to live in, get close tosalary like that I'm making now
and have the job that I canactually pallet going to every
single day.
And that's why I've beenvolunteering for act no
education for the last fouryears.
Um, I got up early this morningjust to get on a meeting with

(41:37):
the board to talk about thingsthat we're going to be doing
over the next year, and that'smy drive is to try to bring down
that suicide rate, try to makea softer landing than I had when
I got out.
You and I have an immense senseof community and and give a shit
about the man next to us.
Um, and I really appreciatethat about you, man, I really do

(42:00):
like you.
You don't have to be doing whatyou're doing, like you could
totally be just playing videogames right now, goofing off
like 90 of the crowd out there.
Um, but I, but I, I reallyrespect that about you.
I, I don't want to gloss overit, cause I have a immense um.
I have an immense respect forpeople that do mentoring and I

(42:23):
think there's no higher mentorin the military than a drill
sergeant.
You're the first introductionto the military for a lot of
these kids that come in.
You're the first introductionto the military for a lot of
these kids that come in.
What leadership lessons fromyour time as a drill sergeant?
Experience permanently changed,like how you mentor others.

Speaker 2 (42:40):
I think the big one and the key take away that
everyone that's ever a drillneeds to realize is at no point
in your entire career will youever have the influence and
power that comes with that hat.
You get these kids at such avulnerable and impressionable

(43:06):
time in their lives and everysingle decision, every move,
every step that you take isgoing to change how they
perceive things, how they behave, what they try to emulate for
the rest of their life.
Because most of the time forthese young kids, that drill

(43:35):
sergeant the one, the one, theone that sticks in their head,
because there's usually like oneyes, you'll remember a couple
of them, but there's always thatone we lean towards that one is
going to basically be thedriving force that influences
the majority of these kidsdecisions for the next couple of
years.
And I think the biggesttakeaway as a leader was that

(43:55):
it's you know you have aresponsibility to be everything
that you never got as a leaderand then stay away from
everything you wish you neverhad to deal with.
You know this is your chance tocreate that.
You know quote unquote perfectleader.

(44:18):
That doesn't exist.
And even if you're, you knowyou're not, that you can create
a persona which, you know,emulates that, and it's a unique
place and a unique opportunity.
Because even if you do, like Isaid, create that persona, who's

(44:40):
going to question it?
Right, you know, and you do itout of a necessity, not because
you know you have an ego thingor because you have, you know,
some kind of complex.
I used to tell the drillsbecause, as you know, we do get
non-combat drills that would getembedded with us, right, that's

(45:01):
interesting.
I would tell them, I don't wantyou to tell these yeah, they do
that, especially because theywant to integrate at least one
female, two, and we had three.
They want to integrate at leastone female, um two, and we had
three.
So I would tell them you willnot tell these kids that you're
not recon.
Like do not tell them that, donot tell them you're a

(45:22):
non-combat.
Just go with the flow, copywhat all the scouts are doing,
and then I would take thesedrills into like the office, or
like I'd wait for all the kidsto go to like chow, and then I
would take these drills intolike the office, or like I'd
wait for all the kids to go tolike chow, and then I would go
into the bay with them.
Be like what do you need me toshow you?
Like, pick one task so that way, when the next set of

(45:43):
instruction comes up, you can belike oh hey, come here,
trainees, let me, let me showyou something, and you know you.
You can have the opportunity toremove any doubt in their heads
that you didn't know what youwere talking about.
It might just be one one thing.
So like I had one that wasreally big on, like the mark 19.
So, okay, we brought the mark19 in the back and I ran them

(46:04):
through the mark 19 over andover again.
We brought the 240 for adifferent one, did that over and
over again.
Or I would email like 10 hoursof recon uh powerpoints that
I've developed over the years.
I'd be like just go throughthese in your spare time, so
that way you know some of thejargon, you, you know some of
the words and I think that, like, like I said, that persona is

(46:28):
just crucial and it's just suchan impressionable time and I
think that's where most leadersand that's why I have a lot of
respect for the ones who wearthe drill sergeant badge you
know that they finally, if theydidn't get it before, they get
it now.
It's more of an opportunity togrow as a leader, because

(46:59):
anybody who's got that patch anddidn't abuse it, you know that
they understand truly what itmeans to actually be a leader
and be a role model to youngsoldiers and young people.

Speaker 1 (47:10):
That's huge man.
Like what you just said, too,about the drill sergeant patch,
because I feel the same wayabout the uniform, I feel the
same way about rank.
I feel the same like, whetherit's law enforcement or it's
military, like that's not youridentity, like who you are is
who you are.
You're.
You're just doing that.
So like I never thought thatwhen I was wearing a captain

(47:33):
rank or any of that stuff, Inever looked at myself as a
captain necessarily.
I was just there, part of ateam, and you know as well as I
do that bullets don'tdiscriminate.
And when you're really in thefire and you're really getting
fucking shot at, like you needeveryone on that team, from the
e4 all the way up to the E7, e8and all the O's.

(47:53):
And to me, having gone to warat an early age, like I think
that humbled me the most and Ialways tell people that and I
always have a big problem and itirritates me whenever I see,
like law enforcement or I seemilitary people that they wear
their uniform or they wear theirbadge or they wear their rank

(48:14):
and that becomes their identity.
That's not who you are, that'swhat you do, like you don't
change who you are.
You are who you are likestarting first class steward,
growing up with a strong fatherwith the values and the
perspective that you did growingup.
You bring that into thatposition and you instill that
and you pass it on to others.

(48:34):
That's absolutely huge that youmentioned that and everybody
always hones in on the on theyoung soldiers right going to
bct.
Um, what about the older guys,man?
I mean they?
You have to laugh because whenyou hear about people being like
25 and up, I would say theyhave the worst time in basic

(48:56):
training because they're withall these kids, right?
So what advice do you have forthe folks that are joining late?

Speaker 2 (49:02):
So, first off, every guy I got and I did I had a 42
year old recruit and a 40 yearold recruit.
I'm like a 36 year old recruitthroughout the time.
First off, your nickname willbe pops.
There is no arguing you,arguing you are pops.
Don't, don't try to fight it.
Every drill sergeant will justcall you pops instead of your
roster number or whatever.
I was big on that.

(49:23):
I, I used to give all my kidsuh nicknames and I would never
use their roster number becauseI, I get the concept, but I hate
giving someone a number and belike.
That's all.
You are now right.
So no like and like I said lasttime and maybe, maybe that
would have been the one thingthat we could have dove into was
the um, the mentality of beingdifferent as a drill.

(49:45):
You know, I was my very firstday.
I got yelled at by my firstsergeant because I walked in and
they were at like black or goldphase so they're already all
the way at the end and thisbrand new drill sergeant.
First off, I yelled at them,but then, because they were
goofing off, then I was like youknow what, since you got
nothing to do and you got askills test coming up.

(50:08):
Let me show you something.
And I took my top off andrested my hat on the drill
sergeant desk in in the bay andI showed them how to do about
two or three things with a 240that they've never seen before.
But first, first sergeant walkedin and screamed you know who
the hell is in the kill zonewith no top on because I'm a

(50:33):
bald, bald and he's goes off andI turn around.
I'm like what's up for a second?
And he's like, oh, and then,like I put my stuff back on.
It's like I talked to you for aminute and then he brought me
out there.
He's like hey, yeah, don't dothat.
He's like you got to get rid ofthe um.
It's a platoon sergeantmentality and you know, realize,
you're a drill, right, youcan't treat these kids like

(50:54):
you're platoon.

Speaker 1 (50:56):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (50:56):
And that's.
I hated that.
No, no, no, because you want toshow people what a good leader
is, be a drill, be terrifying.
And we talked about this lasttime.
You know they were terrifiedand I'm sure you looked at all
the comments when we talkedabout this on that clip and
those were all.
Those were all my kids and,like you saw it, they're like
yeah, we didn't know if we weregoing to die or if he was going

(51:17):
to teach us something, but butwe knew, we knew it was going to
be exciting.
No, and and you saw it likethere isn't a single person that
commented on there and saidlike, oh, I hated him, it was,
it was.
Most of the comments were.
It was rough, like that.
This is the best leader I'veever had and some of those kids
have been for two, three yearsnow.
But with the older folks, whenyou join, you have to keep in

(51:41):
mind what you you know.
Yes, it's different, it's goingto be different and you've got
to keep in mind that end stategoal.
Most of the older guys that Ihad ended up being these huge
role models for these young kids, right, and that's why I always
gave them the nickname Pops andthey didn't realize it.
But then all of the traineeswould call them Pops and what I

(52:02):
just did was gave them this old,mature, you know, grown figure
amongst children that they couldlean on.
And usually with those guys Iwould make them the duty squad
leader.
You know, the squad that likesets up the tent, that feeds the
child, that does all the stuff.
One because he's older, so Iknow he's mature and he can

(52:24):
organize tasks and stuff.
And those duty squad leadersalways were the best and I just
would always do that.
I'd be like how old are you?
They'd be like I'm 36.
Cool, and I just would alwaysdo that.
I'd be like how old are you?
They'd be like I'm 36.
Cool, you're the duty squadleader first day.
I would have to say that thoseolder recruits also need to
realize, just like I was justsaying and just like how leaders
know and how you understand,that besides the drills and like

(52:46):
the NCOs, that oldest traineeis the role model for the group.
Everyone's going to look to youand I used to bring them to the
side and like talk to them andlet them know that I'm like you
didn't ask for it, buteverybody's going to be looking
at you.
So I don't.
I'm like I don't care if you'retired, I don't care if your

(53:07):
your body's aching becauseyou're older.
You will not quit, you will notshow pain and you will not show
them any sign of backing downbecause you need to establish
that the image that they gaveyou without you asking for it is
accurate, and I, you know Iused to say that to leaders too,
especially the new ones I gethey, you're coming in as a

(53:29):
sergeant.
Do not ever give any of mysoldiers the opportunity or
chance to think that you don'tdeserve their respect, that you
don't deserve to wear that rankand you kind of you know, like
you say, gloss uh, gloss over.
A little bit earlier is, andyou, you said something that we
hear all the time in themilitary but we don't say a lot.

(53:49):
There's a difference between ane-5 and a sergeant, right, and
I hate that there is, but I dolove the concept because it's
very true.
Did you do what you had to doto get the rank and the money,
or are you a leader?
Do you deserve to wear it?
Do people want to follow you?

(54:10):
And that's that mentality youneed to have, and that's that
the mentality that that oldersoldier needs to have too, even
though they're not in thatleadership position, if they can
do that.
Because think about it too whenyou were a PL, if you got a
private first class or aspecialist or you know what,
have you, whatever rank had?
This showed up and you look atthem you're how old are you?

(54:31):
What was your expectation?
You always expected them to bebetter than that 18, 19, 20 year
old person, because they'regrown, they're mature and it's
the same.
It's the same concept.
It's going to be a pain to tobe with these kids and it's
going to annoy you and you'regoing to have to put your boot
to their throat, sometimes asthat older trainee, but at the

(54:55):
same time, it is a major chancefor you to grow as a person, as
an older individual or as aleader, without having to be in
that position.
It's a really goodself-reflection and, you know, a
projection into the future 100%, man, and what you're talking
about, too, is manager versusleader.

Speaker 1 (55:18):
Yeah, absolutely.
And you'll see that in thecivilian side, you'll see
someone who's in charge of you,but are they a manager or are
they a leader?
And that's something you haveto contend with and you have to
understand, even when you getout of the military, to contend
with and you have to understandeven when you get out of the
military.
This is something that I thinkthat parents, teachers out there

(55:38):
, um, leaders in the military,deal with too, and I want to
understand, like yourperspective on this and what
you've, what you've learned andand uh, just through your
experiences, uh, how do you, howdid you typically approach, uh,
moments when you'd have asoldier that would push back
against your guidance or yourleadership?

Speaker 2 (55:57):
well I think I'd give the initial reaction, whereas
it's that stare into their eyeslike are you sure you want to go
down this road as a first.
And then it depends on you knowhow I was met with adversity by
that person.
Were they hostile?
At the end of the day, itdoesn't matter what kind of

(56:18):
leader I am.
I'm a grown man.
If you want to be hostile forno reason, you're going to catch
a little hostility back, andusually I would.
I used to call it spiciness.
You're going to get some spice.
I'm not going to be immature oranything.
I'm not going to do anything,but I will raise my voice, not

(56:40):
not yelling, but I will raise myvoice and deepen my tone.
So you know, like hey, I'm notthe one kind of thing.
Yep, and usually that usuallythat would work.
Um, when, when that didn't work, I would still keep that tone
the whole time and I, I wouldtake up more of an aggressive
posture If, like, if the personwas crossing their arms, uh, I

(57:03):
used to always say, uncross yourarms, you ain't in charge of
shit and and and and all thisstuff while we're, while we're
going, and but then I would belike, all right, so what is your
problem?
And I would try, as long as itwas reasonable, you know, to
hear out what they had to sayand usually what I would try to
do then, especially as like adrill or as a leader in the

(57:26):
military or just in anymanagerial position at that
point where someone's like Idon't want to do this, this is
stupid, right.
Any managerial position at thatpoint where someone's like I
don't want to do this, this isstupid, right.
Then do the definition ofleadership, provide task and
purpose right, and tell themwhat the result is supposed to
be.
That's all you got to do.
It's not hard.
The worst leaders I've everseen.
Just get into shouting matchesand don't explain it Nine times

(57:49):
out of 10, if you have somebodythat's giving you any kind of
pushback.
If you do the literaldefinition of leadership, which
is providing purpose andmotivation to complete a task,
then they'll do it.
A lot of people just want toknow why I'm doing this and they
won't ask why They'll, justbecause they think, oh, I can't

(58:10):
ask why I'll get in trouble.
But so instead they're justgoing to be rude or they're
going to be immature about it.
But what I used to always dobecause, you know, I learned
that as a young leader, probablyas a surgeon, that that would
happen.
So, as a staff surgeon and asergeant first class and a drill
sergeant what I did is, beforea task even started, I would

(58:30):
explain the purpose behind thetask.
Like I was, I was doing crazydrill during the first 72, where
everyone's screaming.
I would have no voice left andI'd sit there and I explained
we're going to do shower drills.
Right, you're going to get 30seconds or 45, whatever it was.
You know, if they, if theybehaved they, they got more
towards the minute.

(58:50):
If they didn't behave, it wentall the way back down.
But this is the very first timethey do it and I explained to
them.
You need to learn how to notwaste time get in the shower,
get out the shower and get backto it, because I can't tell you
how many times when I wasdeployed, because there's a
magical fairy on deployment thathates your soul and that alarm

(59:16):
will only go off when you're inthe shower, when you're eating
food or you just lay down and goto sleep.
It does not go off any othertime, especially if you're on
QRF.
So I told them that and insteadof you know people complaining
about the showers, they took itserious, like a training, and
then did the same thing with thed-fac, like oh, it's, it's bs,

(59:39):
we only get this much, this much.
Time d trainee, you need tolearn how to eat fast because
you don't have time in combat,nobody cares, no one cares.
So eat and get right back it.
And it was funny because youcould see the difference in the
platoon dynamics.
I didn't have this.
I didn't give so much advice tothe other platoons that I

(01:00:01):
wasn't in, because you know it'sthe military, it's a
competition.
The drill sergeant to look atthe other drill sergeants and be
like, hey, you see that what'sgoing on with your guys.
You know you got to poke alittle bit and make fun, but it
was great.

(01:00:22):
But the funny thing is whensomeone's like, oh why do you do
that?
I would just always turn and go.
In the regulation that coversleadership.
It literally says the processof providing purpose, direction
and motivation to complete theunit's tasks.
So if I'm going to lead and I'mgoing to make someone do
something, maybe I shouldprovide the three things that

(01:00:44):
are written into a book bysomeone smarter than me to get
them to do what I want them todo.
Yelling's not going to get itdone right.
Being disrespectful and cursingand doing all this stuff or
trying to flex A real leadernever has to flex strength.
A real leader never has toremind someone they're in charge
you don't.

(01:01:04):
They will do it because theyrespect you, because they know
it's in that presence.
Like I said, when I was young Iused to yell as a sergeant and
then, as I got I would probablysay when I got into the platoon
sergeant role, I realized thatyelling isn't going to get it
done and I would make sure Istarted teaching my sergeants
that I'd be like show them theright answer, show them the way,

(01:01:28):
don't scream at them, don't doany of that crap, because
yelling doesn't show that you'resmarter than anyone.
It actually shows a lack ofintelligence, right?
If you have to resort toyelling to get your point across
, just the loudest person in theroom is usually the dumbest, or
at least the least capable,right?
You know?
So I would, I would push thatand you know, I would tell

(01:01:50):
people hey, you want to lead,you want to do all these things?
It's not hard.
Literally, someone told youexactly what you need to do and
when you think about it, right,like for you or for me, when you
were doing tasks back, when youwere, you know, young and dumb
in the service.
Wouldn't it have been a lotbetter if someone had said this
is why we're doing it, this isthe direction we're taking this,

(01:02:13):
and this is why we're doing it,this is the direction we're
taking this and this is why youneed to do it.
Right, and this is going to bethe end result For every task.
You know, instead of going, hey, go to the motor pool and fix
your weapons and sweep the lineand do all this stuff, if
someone had just said we needour vehicles to train so we can

(01:02:33):
certify, to go on deployment, sowe can do our jobs, we need to
make sure that you guysunderstand, to maintain your
equipment properly.
So that way, when we're notlooking, you'll do it anyway,
because on deployment, sand isyour worst enemy and you will
clean your rifle every day tomake it work.
But unless we instill that inyou now, you know, with checking

(01:02:55):
your uniform, your bunk beingperfect, um, you know, making
sure everything is, you know,tip top shape, you're not going
to do that on your own and thenyour weapon is going to jam
overseas, all of those littlethings you know.
If someone had just done thatinstead, it, uh, it would really
make a difference.
And think about it.
You probably too.
I've had it where I've actuallyreached out to the leaders I

(01:03:17):
had when I was young and Iapologized to some of them
Because I was young and dumb.
I gave some pushback and I toldthem as I got into a leadership
position and they're retired,and I was like, hey, I just want
to say I'm sorry and I alsowant to thank you.
I didn't realize what you weredoing for me when you were doing

(01:03:38):
it, but as a leader now Iunderstand everything.

Speaker 1 (01:03:42):
I've done that with teachers.
I've reached back and said, hey, listen, I apologize, I was
immature, I'm much better now.
Thank you for putting up withmy shit.
Man.
You, some professor, you werelike a professor of leadership.
I mean true and true and true,man.
I'm not just saying that tokiss your ass or because you're

(01:04:03):
standing in front of me Like Ireally believe that you are a
professor of leadership.
And I guess one of the thingstoo is like, when you're with
someone for a long time, you'rewith these kids for like nine
plus weeks, you figure out whatmotivates them, what drives them
and what, what wags the tail onthe dog, as, as they say.
And you have that time toassess, like, how do I handle

(01:04:24):
this soldier?
How do I get them to understandthat what we're doing is
important?
And here's why.
And um, that's really importantbecause I joined initially.
I joined, I like I said, Ijoined national guard.
I wanted to pay for college.
I'm not gonna lie, I didn'tunderstand.
Back then, um 17, 18 years old,I didn't understand the

(01:04:45):
importance of serving.
I didn't understand, um, eventhough I grew up a military brat
, I didn't even know what I wasgetting into.
Man, I'd be honest, you, likemy dad, was a dress harm for
five years.
I wasn't expecting that.
Like I went to Fort LeonardWood and I don't know what I
thought.
I thought it was going to belike summer camp, like next
thing I know you've got thesebrown rounds walking in.
They're fucking yelling at me.

(01:05:05):
Get on the cattle truck.
I've got a bag in front backand I just thinking to myself
what the hell is this?
What am I getting into?
That's when it started for meLike I could have gotten out of
the military with myundergraduate degree and moved
on with my life.
But I wanted to take it to thenext level because I had so many
people in my life that thatwent to bat for me, that that

(01:05:26):
helped me, that believed in me,and I wanted all those people
throughout my childhood and myteen years and in my young adult
life.
I wanted them to understandthat you going to bat for me was
not in vain.
Like I'm going to make thisworth your time.
It's kind of like that part andlike that beginning of saving
private ryan, where you knowhe's standing by the grave and

(01:05:46):
he says you know, I hope I lived.
I lived a life worth living.
Yeah, you were a huge like gearin that giant machine of life.
That for a lot of these kids,that and I think that for a lot
of these kids that you helped itmay have been the first time

(01:06:08):
they've ever been disciplined intheir entire lives.
They've never had any authorityfigure.
They may not have grown up witha father and so you kind of
filled that role and helpedchange that direction.
And what you also mentioned toowhen things happen when you
least expect it to happen, thatis 1, 1000% true.
It was never when like we were.

(01:06:30):
We were, like you know, giventhe convoy brief and the Intel
is, it's freaking, you know,normandy beach out there and
it's never that.
It was always when you had yourhead up your ass and you're
looking at how pretty the sky iswhen all of a sudden, boom,
boom, boom, boom, and then it'slike holy shit, like then you

(01:06:51):
gotta.
You go back to your training,you go back to your battle
drills, you go back to you knowwhat you've done before.
Then, when things happen andhaving your shit tight, that's
when it's most important, man,and I I tell my family too I'm
like you know my my experiencein the military and just in
general, is when you leave thewire, you need to make sure you

(01:07:13):
have everything with you becauseyou don't have a chance to go
back and get it, yep, and that alot of civilians don't
understand that, like why, whyare you tripping?
Why are you tripping for likewhat?
And I was like, well, becausemy time and my experience as a
young adult was that when weleft the wire, we had to have
enough bullets, enough water.
We had to make sure we had allof our armor with us, everything

(01:07:34):
, um.
So, yeah, man, a lot of thethings that you mentioned about
um and even evolving as a leaderyou know talking about how
you're very authoritative,yelling when you were first
started and then you kind ofevolved from there.
That's important for people tounderstand too is, over the
years, I've heard so many peoplesay, oh, the guy sucks, he's
terrible, he's, he's the worstmanager, worst leader ever.

(01:07:56):
But then you see them gosomewhere new, take over a new
position, and they're not thesame person they were before,
absolutely, and that's okay.
Like they've evolved, theylearned.
Now they're somewhere else andthey're trying to get better
each and every single time, andthat's okay.
Like they've evolved, theylearned.
Now they're somewhere else andthey're trying to get better
each and every single time, andthat's important for leaders to
understand overall, that that'show it's supposed to work, man.

Speaker 2 (01:08:15):
Yeah, that's why the military lets you reenlist and
go to a new duty station andthat's why your counseling
packet, by regulation and by therules on the bottom of it, say
it's supposed to be destroyedwhen you leave, like all your
counseling.
So that way when you gosomewhere you get a clean slate,
you can reinvent yourself andI'll be honest, that's what I

(01:08:37):
did.
You know I had a lot ofpushback from my privates as a
sergeant and as, like, a youngstaff sergeant.
But then the guys who had meonce I became a senior staff
sergeant.
But then the guys who had meonce I became a senior staff
sergeant, you know I took aplatoon and a sergeant for his
class.
I've never had besides, like thekids that were just terrible,
like just not not bad, soterrible people.

(01:08:58):
Besides those guys, I never hadsomebody who complained ever
again about my leadership style.
The only people that wouldcomplain would be my peers,
which was annoying as hell and,like you know, don't want to go
off on a tangent but likeperfect example, I did Motor
Pool Monday.
I showed up as a new platoonsergeant, just slept out with

(01:09:20):
the old guy and I found out thatonly one of my six vehicles in
my platoon worked and we're at alight unit, so you know they
don't care about the vehicles.
Oh, we usually just go on footanyway.
Cool but, what if we need them,right?
So what I did was I made themgo to the motor pool every day,

(01:09:40):
every day, for at least threehours, and they had to go from
cover to back to back on the tmand write down everything that
was wrong.
Uh, my xo, I, at first, myfirst time was pissed.
My first I was like why thehell are five of your vehicles
deadline now?
And I told him I'm like,because five of them have class

(01:10:02):
two or class three leaks.
And no one was down.
I'm not taking my vehicles outif they're leaking transmission
and oil everywhere.
No, so I'm going to write downif they're not good so I can get
these fixed.
My XO, though, he loved it andthis is what I'm saying with the
peers they wouldn't even comeup and say it to me.
But two of the other platoonsergeants walked up to my PL and

(01:10:25):
said hey, can you tell your newplatoon sergeant to back off a
little bit, because now the XOis telling us he wants us to do
front to cover on the books.
And you know he's, he's, you're, you're, your dude's making us
do extra stuff.
And then there was other stuffI would do too.
Like there was no white spaceon my training calendar, like a
week ahead of schedule.

(01:10:46):
I would tell a sergeant, you'reteaching a class on this, you
have two days to put it togetherand pitch it to me and then
next week you're doing it.
And because I was always doingthat, or I had a rule that I
would never I had a board in myoffice that I put up the first
day I took over and I was likehere's the school's board.
At no point will one of mysoldiers not be in some kind of

(01:11:08):
school.
So like I was rotating dudes inand out of schools the entire
time, I had like three or fourdudes go through aerosol.
I had dudes go to all theseother things because that was a
priority for me, taking care ofthem.
But to have them go up to my PLand say like hey, can you tell
him to dial back I love my PLfor his answer he looked at him

(01:11:30):
and said first off, if you havea problem with my new platoon
sergeant, you can be a man andgo tell him yourself.
Second, if you're going to comein here and tell me to tell my
platoon sergeant to take it easybecause he's prioritizing his
soldiers and he's putting inwork and he's pushing his guys
to give a hundred percent getout.
And it was during lunch.

(01:11:52):
So I came back from lunch andmy PL was like close the door.
And I closed the door.
He's like you won't believewhat just happened and it's
funny because I'd only beenthere for like two and a half
weeks.
So I was like, oh well,no-transcript.

(01:12:27):
He thought that I was doing thestuff I was doing out of
maliciousness to try to likemake him look bad as a leader.
And he said I apologize nowBecause he's like I see you up
here still in the three shop andhe's like you haven't changed.
You push your three shopsoldiers, like my three shop

(01:12:48):
guys.
I was making them go to schoolsnow and I was doing all this
stuff and I was I was gettingused to stand in for the op
sergeant major.
So you know, as a young staffsergeant or, I'm sorry, an old
staff sergeant or a youngsergeant first class I was
stepping in to fill the opsergeant major shoes.
I was helping captains do stuff, I was writing op orders and
he's like you're the same personand he goes I'm sorry, and he's

(01:13:09):
like that's on me and uh, butit was.
It was a weird dynamic and itkind of just kind of goes to
what you're saying with theleadership and then styles and
then all this other stuff.

Speaker 1 (01:13:24):
Yeah, there's been times in my life my career,
civilian, military where I'vereceived my worst evaluation
ever and it was because ofeither.
I was too hard on my own bossand I learned that there are
times that, even though you havea supervisor or a boss, you may
have to manage them, you mayhave to sort of mentor up in a

(01:13:48):
sense.
Yeah, and it's a very, it's avery, it's a very like rocky
road a lot of tripwire becauseyou don't want to cross that
line of disrespect.
So I've, I've learned that manin my, in my life, that's,
that's huge.

Speaker 2 (01:14:03):
It is a big thing in the military.
There's a lot of people withegos that just won't put them
away.
Uh, sometimes it just takessome positive feedback or some
some critiques, because we'renot, we're not.
None of us are a hundredpercent.
You're lying to yourself.
If you are, we can always grow.
We can always get better.

Speaker 1 (01:14:21):
Amen to that, and that's that's huge man.
It's like that in the civilianworld too, it's.
It's a lot of the things thatyou talk about is very
translatable to the civilianside and and understanding those
leadership concepts and we'vecovered a lot about leadership,
man and, uh, I want to ask tosee if you want to come back on
the show, cause I want to talkto you about mental health,
family.

(01:14:41):
There's so many other topicsthat I want to cover with you.
Um, you know, if you're willingto, to jump back on I'm kind of
timing out for the day, uh,with everything going on.
But, um, yeah, you, just you.
I mean in, in, in a.
You really, how many yearsyou've been in or out?
16?
But no, brother, I'm at 12.

Speaker 2 (01:15:00):
You're at 12 years.
That's it, yep, 12.
And uh, I had my second look atMaster Sergeant coming up.
You've done a lot.

Speaker 1 (01:15:07):
12 years that's hard to believe.
How do you pack all that into12 years?
That's crazy.

Speaker 2 (01:15:13):
Volunteer for everything.
You can think of every school.
I won the NCO of the monthboard.
I won the Soldier of the monthboards.
Anytime you can compete, youcompete.
I tell everybody that it's like,hey, you got to remember.
Even if you don't want to,you're constantly competing with
everyone else in.
You have to, you know, makeyourself stand out.

(01:15:34):
I just won an award at theschoolhouse I'm at right now for
being like the best person inthe, in the in the unit for the
quarter, and it was simplybecause of like what I was doing
outside of work, on top ofworking.
So, but that's that's even now,like I was passively pushing
myself to stand out in the newplace I'm at, while I'm still

(01:15:57):
doing all these other things,and and it's that's, that's kind
of just how, how I was able todo it.
And a lot of people always askme that too.
You know, like, how, how didyou?
How did get sergeant in liketwo and change?
How did you make staff sergeantat five?
How did you?
You know, and and I just alwaystold them just don't, don't be
comfortable with mediocrity.

(01:16:17):
It's that simple.
You know, it's your career,it's your life.
Why, why the hell would you justput yourself on a back burner
and ride it out there.
There are so many motivations,you know, if you don't want the
rank, at least the money getsbetter, and just stuff like that
.
Like, if you're not going togive something 100% and this is
what I tell people all the timeas a motivational speaker if

(01:16:39):
you're not going to givesomething, you're doing 100%,
don't do it at all, don't wasteyour time.
What's the point?
If I'm not going to give it100%, I don't need to waste my
time with it.
Apparently, it wasn't importantenough for me to want to focus.
So and that's the kind of how Ilooked at it with rank and
service and all those otherthings, like everything I've

(01:17:00):
done in my career I've wanted todo, and if I volunteered for
something, I gave it a hundredpercent Cause why would I waste
my time?

Speaker 1 (01:17:08):
That's like are you in it for the right reasons?
I know when I, when I resigned,when I resigned my commission,
a lot of the other youngcaptains were like oh my God,
like what are you going to do?
Like what, like what?
Like what are you here?

(01:17:29):
Just for a paycheck?
Like, is that?
Is that it?
Because you don't know whatyou're gonna do?
You're still here.
Like that.
To me it just felt.
I never planned on staying inlonger than my first, you know,
stint as an officer.
I just wanted to serve mycountry at a greater capacity
than what I was doing.
I wanted to make my fatherproud of me, which I felt like I
fulfilled.
All that.
I went to war, which was morethan a lot of people can say,

(01:17:51):
and I just followed what I hadbeen planning the entire time.
I wanted to do my four years asan officer and get out, and
that was it.
But it really surprised me howmuch question I got with oh my
God, like you're going to, likeyou're going to just go, just go
unemployed.
Like what are you gonna do?
And I'm like well, why are youhere?
Like, are you just here becauseit's a paycheck?
Because, if so, then you'rehere for the wrong, the wrong

(01:18:11):
reasons all together.
Um, before we round out thisepisode, I just want to go over
um, what's next for you?
Uh, advocacy?
Um, are you gonna write more?
I mean talk about motivationalspeaking like what's on the
horizon.

Speaker 2 (01:18:31):
So right now I've been doing a lot of work with
colleges.
I actually just spoke atStenberg College about two and a
half weeks ago and my targetaudience is actually a very
small and unique group.
I've been working with studentsthat are becoming trauma
therapists, students that arebecoming trauma therapists, and
then I've also been doingvolunteer free speaking events

(01:18:52):
specifically just for notnonprofits but actual like
for-profit organizations thattreat service members with
post-traumatic stress disorder.
And what I've been doing isI've been going to these groups,
I've been getting in front ofthem and I just pour everything
out and say now I want you toask me the questions that you
can't ask your patient because Iwill answer.

(01:19:14):
And that's kind of been a bigfocus for me right now, because
my whole thing gets advocacy,all that, but like you can only
do so much advocacy, so how do Ifix the problem?
So what I decided to do is tryto target the people that can
affect it, those civilians thatare going into this field, and
teach them before they even getto the job a better way and help

(01:19:36):
them understand it.
So that way, as we say in themilitary, you know the tool belt
, our tool belt.
Now in their tool belt.
They have.
Hey, this veteran or thisservice member told me that if I
see this sign, this sign, thissign, this sign from physical
you know, physical reactions tosomething, there's something I
need to dig deeper into.

(01:19:56):
I just hit a nerve If, if,while we're talking, a veteran
you know, or the service memberis talking and then all of a
sudden just spaces out for asecond, this, this one dude
explained to me where theirmind's going.
So I just hit a nerve and theyjust had either a flashback or
they're focused on something andthey're not here right now.
So he's like so I know I'meither on the right topic or I

(01:20:18):
need to switch topics and findout what just happened, Like
those kinds of things.
So, I've been doing that andthen a lot of it is I'm trying
to get a lot of support for,like, the non-profits I'm in and
then also the other non-profitsout there that are just doing
good things.
And then, of course, you know,I want to get out there and do
more motivational speaking.
Um, because I personally thinkthat I have a decent ability to,

(01:20:41):
um, you know, project andconvey the proper mindset to
succeed, and I want people tosucceed and it's not for any
other reason besides the factthat, um, I'm a firm believer of
if you have the ability to dosomething that will help people,
then you need to go do it,otherwise you're selfish, you
know.
So I want to get out there, Iwant to share my knowledge.

(01:21:03):
I don't want to be selfish Likewhat if I?
If I don't share it, then Itake it with me to my grave.
Who benefits from that?
You know, nobody.
So get out there and help helpas much as I can.

Speaker 1 (01:21:12):
And that's why I love doing this podcast is because I
love capturing these.
Everything that you sacrificeblood, sweat and tears is not
ever in vain.
Like you, are sharing this inhopes that someone out there
would hear and maybe make abetter life for themselves or
make make better decisions.
Um, overall, I think that'shuge.
And the fact that you're helpingout, that there's so many

(01:21:32):
people that are in therapy andcounseling that should not be in
therapy and counseling and theyneed to have that conversation
with someone like you so theycan put themselves in the boots.

Speaker 2 (01:21:42):
Yes.

Speaker 1 (01:21:43):
And understand their own clients a little bit better.

Speaker 2 (01:21:45):
Absolutely.
And I tell these students and Itell these people, if the stuff
I'm talking about right nowbecause I went deep into stuff I
talked about sitting in thedark with a bottle of whiskey
with a Bowie knife in my handand thinking about just shoving
it through my chest and I wastalking to them about all this

(01:22:10):
and people were looking at melike I was crazy I go right now.
I'm telling you, the ones thatI see it in your face.
If that bothers you, you don'tneed to be here, because this is
what you're trying to get outof these people and if they see
that reaction on your face whilethey're opening up, you just
killed that for them.
They will never open up again.
They will never do this again,because the one time where they
finally felt comfortable enoughto tell somebody something, you

(01:22:31):
made them feel like they wereinsane.
So that's, that's you know, abig thing that I always harp on
when I talk to these groups.
That is so true.

Speaker 1 (01:22:43):
That is so true, man.
I mean, mean, I I love talkingto you because at the end of the
day, you cover, you're weird,but not in a bad way.
You're weird in a good waybecause you're able to process
and digest and and kind ofregurgitate this stuff out.
Um, it's almost like speakinganother language to certain and
you're help helping build thatbridge, because a lot of us guys

(01:23:05):
we went through what two20-year wars with Afghanistan
and Iraq and then we had Syriaand everything else going on.
I think just being in themilitary alone can be a huge
stress on the family, on theperson, depending on where they
came from.
Man.
So I very much appreciate yourwillingness to step forward and

(01:23:27):
help be that, be that umlighthouse for.

Speaker 2 (01:23:31):
I appreciate people like you giving me the
opportunity to man like none ofthis would work without good
people like you out there.

Speaker 1 (01:23:38):
Thank you, and I listen.
I appreciate you sporting thatbeautiful shirt.
Uh, thank you for putting it uponline too.
I I'm planning on, I'm planningon actually selling those to
help.
Um, I I have not reallymonetized off any of this stuff.
Um, everything that I've done,the subscriptions, the, the
equipment that I've purchased mytime, all that stuff I've never

(01:23:59):
done anything.
So I'm planning on launching,like to sell these shirts and I
appreciate you, you know,wearing it and sporting it and
helping spread the cause of theMorning Formation podcast man
and just being willing to comeon this show.
Was there anything that Ididn't cover that you want to
mention before we round off thisconversation?

Speaker 2 (01:24:20):
Not really, brother.
I mean, I love having theseconversations with you.
It feels like and I think wesaid this last time but it feels
like we've known each other forforever.
It's not one of these agendaconversations.
It's very open, it's very rawand I think that's why it
resonates so well with both ofus.
And also we're both at a levelin our lives where we can talk

(01:24:43):
and you can hit a point and I'llbe like oh, that's a new
perspective.
And then like, as you'retalking, I can develop um, you
know my standpoint on it, andthen you kind of just build off
of it, and I think that's whythe conversations flow and I
think it's hilarious and awesomeand, of course, I'll come back
again.

Speaker 1 (01:25:01):
Um, just cause.

Speaker 2 (01:25:02):
Why?
Why not, man?
It's like.
It's like talking to a longlost family member when I'm here
.

Speaker 1 (01:25:06):
There's a lot of things that you dealt with that
I also dealt with too, except,you're more mature than I was at
that age, and that's what Iappreciate more about your brain
, your thoughts, your soul isway more mature than I was back
when I was where you're at rightnow in your career and
everything.
Appreciate that.

(01:25:26):
Thank you for wearing the shirt, man.
I'm going to be offering theshirts online, if folks out
there just keep your eye out forit.
I'm in the process of doingthis.
I do this completely on my freetime.
It's just an extra thing I dobesides being a full-time dad,
full-time job, nonprofit stuff.
Just like you, man, I try tostay busy.

(01:25:48):
I try, to you know, give back asmuch as possible.
So thank you, sarum, firstClass Stewart, for the
conversation today.
I really appreciate it.

Speaker 2 (01:25:56):
Thank you for having me, brother.
It's always a pleasure.

Speaker 1 (01:25:59):
Formation Nation.
Today's conversation wasanother reminder that strength
isn't just about how much weightyou can carry.
It's about the courage to admitthat when that weight is too
heavy and to seek out the righttools to keep moving forward.
I want to have Sergeant FirstClass Stewart on again and we'll
dive more into mental healthside of it.
We covered a lot of leadershipstuff today which I think
there's a lot to be learned fromtoday's conversation.

(01:26:21):
Sergeant First Class Stewartcontinues to prove that
leadership is more about,there's more to leadership than
just rank.
It's more about impact.
It's about the lives you shape,the voices that you lift and
the people you refuse to give upon.
So if you haven't already, pickup a copy of his book unspoken
words.

Speaker 2 (01:26:39):
It's available on amazon, right amazon, barnes and
noble target walmart, basicallyanywhere online.

Speaker 1 (01:26:47):
You know, and that book is more about you know,
it's more than poetry, it's alifeline for those who are
struggling to put their ownbattles into words.
Sergeant First Class Stewart,again, thank you so much for
coming back and staying true toyour mission, both in and out of
uniform, and to our listeners.

(01:27:07):
Remember I want you to rememberthat it's okay not to be okay
and to go out there and findthat help.
Until next time, everyone, Iwant you to stay tuned, stay
focused and stay motivated.
Warriors fall out.

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