The Truth About Anxiety: What it is Really Trying to Tell You

In this episode of the New Ashla podcast, hosts Michael and Justin delve into the complexities of anxiety, exploring its psycho-spiritual dimensions and the role it plays in our lives. They discuss how anxiety can be both a messenger and a teacher, guiding us towards self-awareness and healing. The conversation emphasizes the importance of understanding the nervous system's response to anxiety, grounding techniques to manage anxiety in the moment, and the significance of building self-trust and agency. Ultimately, the hosts encourage listeners to embrace anxiety as a natural part of life and to cultivate a compassionate relationship with it.

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Takeaways

You can't control everything that happens in your life, but you can control how much power anxiety has over you.

Anxiety can be a good emotion that alerts us to potential dangers.

Anxiety is a messenger that communicates our needs and fears.

The body stores memories and emotions, which can trigger anxiety.

Healthy doses of anxiety can lead to caution and self-awareness.

Grounding techniques can help manage anxiety in the moment.

Building self-trust is essential for managing anxiety effectively.

Anxiety often stems from a lack of agency and control over our lives.

Curiosity about our anxiety can lead to deeper understanding and healing.

We must learn to befriend our anxiety rather than fight it.

Keywords

anxiety, mental health, self-awareness, grounding techniques, psycho-spirituality, emotional intelligence, self-trust, nervous system, mindfulness, healing

Episode Transcript

(00:00):
You can't control everything that happens in your life.
You can't control how much poweranxiety has over your life.
And it starts with understandinghow it actually works.
My name is Michael Perry and I'mjoined today by Justin Gates and
this is the new Asheville Podcast.
Hello and welcome to the new Asheville Podcast.
Homo Shadow Work and Self Mastery where spirituality and

(00:20):
psychology come together to helpyou make a road map to take
charge of your life. Spiritual psychology.
What did you? What was the phrase you coined
today as psycho spirituality? There we go.

(00:42):
We're going to make that a new phrase.
It's going to be big. So today we're diving into
anxiety, which is something thatI think most people are impacted
by in some way, shape or form. And for many, it's crippling.
I've seen anxiety take people and just slowly take over their
lives. And I think in many ways for
each of us, it finds its own wayto Nestle in and cut us off from

(01:06):
certain things, whether that's going out, trying new things,
pushing out of our comfort zone and leaving that job.
There's there's so many areas anxiety has a hold of us.
It's when fear overloads our caution, right?
Because we're always constantly scanning for something to
happen, something bad to happen.I know it's coming.
I know it's coming. And I just, I just need to
protect myself. I need to hide.

(01:27):
I'm scared, I'm afraid. And you know, I'm not calling
you a coward. And this isn't a personal
failing. It is it is a physical malady in
some cases. And that's where it hits US the
most is right. I mean, dead center makes it
hard to breathe and we get theseweird pains.
And, you know, the first time I ever remember actually having a

(01:51):
panic attack from being anxious,right was not too long ago.
I went my whole life without really having any kind of
anxiety episode, which, you know, everybody would probably
say, well, how is that possible?I just don't remember it right.
But I do remember having to go to hospital because I thought I
was having a heart attack. I couldn't breathe and I was
having pressure and, and I told Heather I was like, hey, I, I,

(02:15):
I, I know you're probably not expecting me to ever say this to
you, but get me to the hospital.I think I'm having a heart
attack or something. But it was anxiety.
It was I, it was anxiety that I had to triggered a panic attack.
And let me tell you something, your perspective changes on
things. You know, I used to kind of, you
know, the way I was raised and the kind of way I grew up in the
way I was as a young man and even into my 30s, you know, it

(02:39):
was always, it was always like, you know, tough guys don't tough
guys don't deal with that. And if you're, if you are
showing that, then you're just being a little weak a little,
you know, you, you're just a little weak sauce or something,
man, you know what I mean? Like, you know, toughen up,
toughen up. But let me tell you something.
I became a believer that day because I went to the hospital

(03:03):
and they hooked me up to all themachines and did EKG's and even
put dye in my body and did a MRIthink is what they call it.
And they're like CT, Oh, ACT scan.
And they're like, there's nothing wrong with you
physically. They're like, this is just, you
just had a panic attack. And I'm like, what?
What the Hell's a panic attack? Because there was nothing like I

(03:25):
wasn't being chased by a lion oranything.
There was nothing to cause me tohave that.
And for a minute I felt like, I felt like do dot.
I just, I lost all my strength. I lost all I'm weak now, right?
And but I want you to understand.
And, and I came, I'm kind of hard headed if you guys haven't
figured that out. So sometimes I have to learn
lessons the really, really hard way.

(03:46):
And I learned a lesson that day.That anxiety is one of those
experiences that you feel like you're kind of losing it, man.
But it's not, it's anything but that.
And like we always say this, I realized it wasn't an enemy that
I needed to conquer. Again.
It's it's a what? It's a messenger.
So. Well, I mean, I would argue

(04:07):
anxiety is an emotion and anxiety is a good emotion.
You talked about caution earlier.
All right, Anxiety and healthy doses is caution.
It's something to alert us that we might not be doing something
right or that something might bea mess.
Anxiety can be healthy, but if we start shoving it down, the
one thing I've noticed is anxiety.
We'll talk to you, but if you don't listen, it's going to

(04:28):
start yelling. And the longer you wait, the
more it's going to yell and the more you're going to be feeling
overwhelmed by at any time it surfaces.
Right, Yeah. But you know, I, I just want to
set the tone here, even though, and there's a lot of people out
there, Michael, that'll still say I don't get anxious.
I don't get, I don't have panic attacks.
I don't, you know, this doesn't bother me because I'm tough.
I'm tough. Yeah, keep saying that.

(04:48):
Keep saying that to yourself. You will learn the hard way like
me. And it's has nothing to do with
with strength. It is, it is a messenger.
Like all things that we talk about, these are messengers
really in some sense a guardian,right?
It's doing the job that is designed to do.

(05:08):
It's lighting you up, man. It's like, you know, you got
these bells and whistles going off a little bit.
What we're talking about today, though, is when that goes to
extremes because your nervous system and your your active
guardian doesn't know the difference sometimes
misunderstands a lot of what we need, right?
Well, I think often, I mean you look at the brain and it's the

(05:30):
amygdala that just gets hyperactivated.
And often, I mean so many peopleoperate from their amygdala,
which is pretty much their emotions.
And when you're not self aware, whenever it gets triggered,
whenever the amygdala flares up,especially depending on your
stress response, whether that's flight or freeze, it will.
It can be incapacitated. And a lot of it is.

(05:53):
You haven't managed your anxietyfor so long that it now has
complete rain over your nervous system.
Yeah, there. There's an axiom for this one,
that one that really you and I and and many of my students have
had to have some pretty long conversations about because on
the surface it feels like something else.
And I'll read it to you. Axiom of light.

(06:14):
As danger draws near, ready yourself by deepening the
stillness within for eager anticipation will only push you
off balance. Now, a lot of a lot of folks
when they, when they hear that axiom, they think, OK, be
paranoid because danger is everywhere, right?
There's another, there's anotheraxiom that talks about dangers
around every corner type thing. But that's not the point of this

(06:35):
of this axiom. The point is, is that whether
danger is real or imagined, we must do our best and prepare
ourselves not to do everything with that anxious anticipation,
right? Because with that hyper sense
of, of awareness about potentialdangers, again, whether they're

(06:57):
real or imagined. And even if they are imagined, I
just want to point out, doesn't mean they're not real to you
because you are experiencing something, right?
It doesn't mean that that just because I can't see the danger
that you're experiencing doesn'tmean that it's not real for you.
It may not actually be real in asense, right?
But it could still be real for you.

(07:18):
Well, and it's like the body stores memories within the
nervous system, right? And when they have scientific
research that proves this, then when we go through something
stressful, we can easily, an imagination, create the same
reaction within our body of being in threat.
Yeah, that's a lot of what PTSD is.
It's it's the nervous system remembering those emotions and

(07:41):
reliving that event. And we part of managing anxiety
is processing these emotions andlearning to retrain the nervous
system to how to respond. Because that's exactly what
you're saying. I mean, it's the nervous system
remembers. Well, and here.
Doesn't know the difference. Here's the thing too, we have
to, we have to understand a simple law of the universe that

(08:03):
that we believe you create. You create with your thoughts.
Everything is energy. Energy becomes matter.
It's just the way things are, right?
And if, if you believe in something like the law of
attraction where you can create or manifest abundance or
manifest house or a car or whatever, why can't you imagine

(08:26):
or, or, or create danger or whatever, right?
You can. But this isn't just something
that affects the mind. This is not an affliction of our
minds. It starts there.
But when, when that anxiety reaches a, a, a boiling point,
it's a very real physical thing.Tons of tension.

(08:49):
I get it so bad in my neck, so bad in my neck that it can't
even turn my head. Mine shows up in my chest.
Hyper vigilance I get in my chest too.
I get these weird pains, right? Like now at this point I'm just
like, well, if it's a heart attack, then I'll find out in an
hour. I guess.
I can't run to the hospital every time I think I'm having a
heart attack, right? But yeah, you get this bad

(09:12):
tension, you get hyper vigilant,which creates what?
These racing thoughts, uncomfortableness, tightness in
your chest. So, and we often like like I
did, I thought these things weresomething physically wrong with
me, like I need to get help right now, man, this could kill
me. But, and this is where we kind

(09:32):
of get get screwed up because itcould be something wrong with
you. But if you have have a history
with anxiety, right, it's, it could be, could be simply, you
know, your nervous system not feeling safe about something.
And again, it could be real or imagined.
This is why we do a lot of mindfulness.
This is why we do a lot of breathing.

(09:52):
That's why we do a lot of meditation so that we start to
kind of know when these things are going to be triggered and
how to kind of ground ourselves.And I know we'll talk about
that. I'm here in a little bit.
But again, it's often misunderstood.
The anxiety is something that's just mental.
Go talk to somebody about it. They'll say, OK, I will, but can
I get my body back in, in, in balance?

(10:13):
Because it's freaking out right now, right.
And the physical part of this wetalked about a few times in some
other shows where we physically learn how to carry trauma and
it's not something we do on purpose.
But what do we always say? The body remembers, right?
Body remembers. When I think with anxiety too, I

(10:34):
mean again with the nervous system and how it does remember
past grievances, past offensives.
I mean, one thing that is interesting about anxiety is it
follows patterns. So you will notice that it's
certain things that trigger anxiety.
Is it social interaction? Is it going and talking to
strangers? Is it, I'm thinking very basic

(10:55):
ones right now. But there's certain things we do
that ingrain anxiety into us, and the repetition of letting
anxiety controls in those moments perpetuates it to higher
levels. So for instance, you go and ask
a girl out, you get rejected, you start developing anxiety.
You go to ask out another girl and you're already anxious about
it. She picks up on it, you get

(11:17):
rejected. And now all of a sudden, every
time you go to approach a girl, it's instant panic attack.
Yeah, yeah, yeah. There's a, there is a accident
for that too. Can you guess which one?
There's only 100. Can you guess?
Others will perceive, others will perceive trepidation.
Be mindful people pick up on what you're putting down.
And you may not even you may notbe trying to, but they pick it

(11:40):
up especially, especially the women, they're very, they're
very more naturally attuned to these things.
They, they pick them up way better than we do typically
speaking. Of course, there's exceptions to
every rule, But you know, sometimes she'll know when I'm
upset about something before I even realize I'm upset about it.
You know what I mean? It's but that's they're just
more naturally attuned to that. But people will pick up on it.

(12:02):
They just do. And yeah, it's.
And then you get locked in that pattern because it just gets
worse and worse and worse and worse doesn't.
It yeah, 100%. You see this, this dating
epidemic going on now where moreand more men are just avoiding
dating in general. And part of that's just the
chaos of the dating scene right now.
But a lot of it is people are avoiding stressful situations.

(12:24):
And unfortunately, getting in the dating scene is always
stressful, yeah. Well, Heather and I are so old,
I just went to a cave and just bumped her in the head and took
her back to my cave. That's how long ago it has been
since I've dated. I don't know if we do, we still
do that stuff. I don't know.
It sounds, it sounds really stressful.
I just can't. Like, I, I mean, it does.
I, I can't imagine having to be be completely vulnerable and

(12:49):
naked in front of someone. I I can't imagine that that
stresses me out a little bit just thinking about it because I
mean. Now, I watched so many dating
experts sort of dissecting what's going on in the dating
scene today, and it's just it's fascinating to hear how
corrosive it has become and how difficult it is to really
navigate from too many opportunities being out there to

(13:12):
just the insecurities that have become so rampant in society.
It's creating such a crazy divide.
Yeah, yeah. And from the Ashland
perspective, this is this is a form of disconnection, I would
say, and a kind of warping or distortion of our instinct to be
connected, but be connected harmoniously, not with fear.

(13:35):
So of course the antidote to that is trying to reconnect
first to ourselves and try to try to do that.
But yeah, but but when it rises,it's a tough Rd.
I mean, I've seen people, I've seen it paralyzed, but like
actually, not like actually paralyzed people, but make it to
where people can't literally just can't function with the

(13:56):
simplest things, which which is a big problem.
And, and, and I know anxiety is stress have become an epidemic,
You know, I mean, stress kills people.
We know this. It kills you well.
What really blows my mind the most about anxiety in society
nowadays is part of anxiety is learned helplessness, right?
And we live in a society where it's a lot harder to survive.

(14:18):
Get your own home, you know, payfor the minimal.
People are living with their parents till past the age 30.
This is becoming normal. And when they don't have the
struggles they would have otherwise, it slowly teaches
them helplessness. And it makes it more and more.
It exacerbates the struggle of going out there and confronting

(14:39):
life more and more. And again, like, the economy is
a big part of that, but there's also a level of just inferiority
that is instilled in people who feel defeated or helpless to
really get ahead. So I want to set the tone for
people today to look at anxiety as a messenger, as a form of

(15:00):
communication, right? And at this point, we're talking
about a disconnect of good communication with ourselves
because there's a part of us that still believes that we must
be hyper vigilant, prepared, guarded, or, or have the perfect
circumstances just to survive and listen.
If we can learn to listen to it as as in all things we talked

(15:20):
about, not be more afraid because of it, not not feel
shame because of it, and certainly not suppress it, This
this opens that doorway to healing.
So kind of the tone we set todayis that we should try not to
fight this, to defeat this, right?

(15:41):
Really, if we want to, if we want to reconnect and we want to
treat this as an opportunity forcommunication with our self, we
need to we need to not fight andwe need to start asking
questions. You know, what is this trying to
protect me from or what part of me needs to feel safe again or
whatever those kind of questions.

(16:02):
We just need to stop and ask questions at this point.
So yeah, I hope that sets the tone for today because, you
know, this doesn't have to be permanent.
You know, we can, we can work through this.
We can heal this. Especially if you're, if you're
amping yourself up to the point where you're having actual panic
attacks all the time. That's got to be, that's got to

(16:22):
be miserable. It's got to be a ton of
suffering. I've only had one, one or two
panic attacks my whole life and that's all I ever want to have.
They were bad, you know, so. No, it's a good tone, too.
I think one other thing is to really hone in on, and we're
going to talk about this later in the episode, is a lot of
anxieties based on outside expectations, or what we
perceive is the expectations of the outside.

(16:44):
When we start to learn to managethe inside to man, to validate
our own life and our own circumstances.
Yeah, and not seek externally for trying to reach a goal.
You can go miles. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
As I said, as I said in the in, because I was just editing
today, I was just editing the the show on dealing with family

(17:06):
conflict because of, you know, the big dinners, the big
gathers. We're going to be having most of
us throughout the rest of this year, you know, learning that we
can't control another person. We can't control their their
responses. We can't control their path.
We can't control anything. We can only control ourselves.
And you know, borrowing from what you just said, a lot of

(17:27):
that comes from us trying to control everything to there,
there is a part of us that must let go of something.
And that's why, you know, today we need to make sure that we're
communicating with ourselves when we're talking about this,
because really that's a conversation you have to have
with yourself because it's, it'sonly talking to you, right?
And so we have to, we have to make sure we ask those

(17:47):
questions. Hey, what is, what is your
problem, bro? What you know.
Right. What's going on here?
But you know, you can't keep living with with these bad panic
attacks and stuff because you know, over time the stress will
cause disease. It will, you know, once you're
damaged, once you actually physically, literally damage
your heart to a point where it can't be, it can't be fixed.

(18:10):
So let's, let's start now. Let's start having these
conversations with ourselves now.
A lot of what we do is is about talking to ourselves.
A lot of it is about the introspection.
That's the probably the most important thing we can do.
And yeah, we got to do it. We got to do it.
It sucks and it's hard, but we got to do it.

(18:32):
So let's dive into. We were talking earlier about
how the mind and the body interact together.
You know, often anxiety will start in the body, you'll get
that nervous flare up and your mind will start creating a story
around that sensation. And often you are going into a
situation that mirrors a past experience, which 9 out of 10
your anxiety lives in the past and it's trying to give you

(18:53):
messages, warning flags so you don't get hurt against, you
don't mess up or make a fool of yourself.
But as soon as it hits the body,that's when the self doubt
starts creeping in. That's when the shame kicks on.
That's when we start spiraling. Yeah, as you said, this, this,
it all always, it always begins in the body and then the mind
follows and your mind can, your mind can tell all kinds of

(19:15):
things, you know, like if you goto Google and try to type in
some symptoms, don't ever do that, but your mind does that
your mind will access every literal thing that you can think
of that you're dying right now, right?
You know, your mind will spin out of control and, and you are
100% correct. I believe that the body does

(19:36):
fire first and in the mind triesto make sense of what's
happening because this, a lot ofthis comes from our subconscious
thinking, you know, back in the head type stuff.
What I mean, 95% of our thoughtsare the unconscious mind, and
our unconscious mind is so deeply connected to our bodies.
Yeah. I mean dude, this stuff comes
from the oldest, most primal part of our biology, that

(19:59):
nervous system and everything that's connected to it.
I mean things you'll notice whenyou start to get ready to go
into that panic mode, you know, tightening a chest, nausea,
racing heart like. All.
Sorts of things go on within thebody.
You start feeling antsy, you start twitching or moving your
hands around. And I mean, there's all these
signs to keep an eye out for andthere's, and that's a great way

(20:20):
for you to sort of step into is there, is there something I
should be concerned about right now or is my body just
remembering? Yeah, and, and, and there is,
you know, the body's firing and the minds trying to make sense
of everything. And it comes rushing in, man,
like a, like a hero going, oh, hold on, hold on, calm down,
buddy, calm down. What's happening?
Tell me, speak to me, buddy, Tell me what's going on.

(20:41):
Right. And the body's just like
freaking out. And the minds like, oh, crap,
oh, crap. And our minds hate uncertainty.
We don't like that. We like knowing exactly.
You know it, it's like, it's like when your pet is sick and
you know they're sick, but they can't tell you what's wrong.
It's just so frustrating. It's so madding sometimes it's

(21:02):
like, and they're just sitting there and they're whining and
they're whimpering and, and you can't, you know and you can't,
you don't know what to do for them.
You know when your kid, when your kids can talk, they'd say,
mom, my head hurts or dad, my, my arm hurts.
Well, OK, now at least I can focus on something.
But when the body's freaking out, the mind, the mind can't

(21:23):
get a straight answer. It's just like, like, you know,
the control, the control, the console is going freaking out.
There's, there's like sirens andalarms and, and the minds just
like I can't, I can't handle this.
I don't know what to do. I think Inside Out painted such
a beautiful picture. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
That's what I was trying to, that's what I was trying to
describe. I couldn't remember where I
where I remember that from, but.Yeah, well, and it's like it's

(21:44):
so often will go to the worst case scenario.
We catastrophize so easily. I mean, it starts from I'm
nervous to ask this girl out to,Oh my God, she's going to think
I'm a complete loser. She's going to shame me in front
of everybody here. She's going to come at me,
degrade me, whatever. Like we're just going to root in
that example. But you know the again, The

(22:08):
thing is the body, the body generates the anxiety or at
least triggers it. Or, you know, it's triggered in
the body and the mind is trying to interpret it.
But so, So what does the mind do?
It goes to the worst thing it can think of the absolute worst,
the absolute worst, because it's, it's trying to protect you
too. And it's like, but, but it, it,
it'll throw the baby out with the bathwater, man, it will, it

(22:30):
will do crazy things to, to try and stop everything to calm
everything down. But for us, the actual
perspective on this, this this is where, you know, they
actually have confusion to sorts.
Reason really comes to play because the sensation, the
messengers, the message of it is, is pretty neutral.
It's just your energy moving through the body trying to alert

(22:52):
you to something. But then the story we attach to
it becomes the source of the suffering and we think of the
worst thing possible. And This is why that
self-awareness is so important. And This is why, because we can
catch those triggers, because something triggers it.
Now a lot of times as we said it, it triggers without our
without our knowledge, because then we start freaking out
consciously trying to figure it out.

(23:13):
But the more you do this work, the more you can start catching
those little triggers that happen.
It starts weaving a story and then you just end up following
along with it. And real key is just having that
self-awareness when you get intothose moments, realize what
those triggers are, stop yourself.
Like I'm spiraling right now. Right now my mind is taking me
for a ride 11 exercise I had a therapist give me that I

(23:36):
absolutely loved. Was this exercise called the
Wise Mind? And it's pretty much taking the
experience. And you go to that worst case,
experience, the worst case scenario, then you go, what's
the best case scenario? And 99% of the time it's going
to be somewhere in the middle ofthat, right?
And that can really help ground you out of that catastrophe mode

(23:58):
you go into. It can help sort of give you a
light of like, no, this is probably what's going to happen.
Right. Yeah, I mean, it's going to
suck, but at least it isn't the worst possible thing ever,
right? And I know it feels like it is
when you're going through it. I really do understand that.
I'm not trying to make light of it because again, whether it's
real or imagined, you're still experiencing it anyway.

(24:21):
But but that's a good point thatyou made, because when these
cessations start to turn into the story, that's where you can,
that's where you can regain power again.
That's where you can start saying, OK, pause.
Put a pause on the game real quick.
Do do some grounding. Do a grounding, a few grounding

(24:42):
breaths and again communicate with yourself.
Is this true? Is this thing true?
Is this story that is this worstcase scenario true?
Or is it some other imagined or some past memories speaking
through my body? I mean, the science has shown
that again, anxiety is an emotion.

(25:02):
Emotions only reside in the bodyfor up to 90 seconds as long as
we don't let it be perpetuated. Through thoughts, yeah.
Or else it'll last forever. You know, we were talking about
in the last show, we were talking about that, that
emotional bill. You know, the bill comes due and

(25:23):
you know, we may not experience that, that emotion that's
causing us harm for more than a few minutes at a time, but it
adds up. It adds up.
And it will just jump out of nowhere for no reason to if we
don't, if we don't pay the bill,so.
Just sort of look at it like weather, you know, it's
temporary and it's not reality. Reality still hasn't happened

(25:46):
yet, right? And the more I like how you
brought up control because that's what it's trying to do.
Anxiety is trying to control predictive outcomes to say to
save you from harm. The more you can release the
need for control, the more you can release the desire to know
what's going to happen, the moreyou can move with the ebb and
flow of how things can go to thebest case scenario when you

(26:07):
focus too much on what the worstoutcome could be.
When you're catastrophizing intoall these different outcomes,
you restrict the ability to bring your full self to the
situation you are involved in and allow yourself to act with
grace. Because often when you're
planning for 100 outcomes, you narrow your response because
you're ready to react depending on whatever is coming your way.

(26:30):
Yeah, that seem of like agonizing over situation to
resolution provides limited gainand comfort.
The price you pay long term for not letting go can be great,
right? It's exactly as you said, to
endlessly and obsessively ruminate over a situation
thinking that that's the path toresolution.
It may feel safe for a minute. You may feel like you're gaining

(26:52):
ground for just a minute, probably that 90 seconds that
you're talking about. That's it.
That's it. Because like when you're
relentlessly pursuing closure ofsomething that will exact a toll
and it outweighs any immediate benefits that you hope to gain
because you're trying to controlthe whole thing.

(27:12):
You know, that's a really good one.
That's that's yeah, you're righton the money for that.
That's a good one because I remember.
When you first gave me that axiom, it resonated so much with
me because I was going through asituation where it's just like I
was so honed in on what I wantedthe outcome to be that I refused
to look at the potential avenuesoutside of that.

(27:33):
And it was just constant anxietybecause I was trying so hard to
make it work and it was destructive.
Yeah, well, you know, I would say, hey, just let's pause for a
second. Breathe, breathe.
Take your shoes off. Touch the grass, man.
You know, this is this is just atemporary thing.

(27:55):
Can't rain all the time unless you live in Washington state,
then it rains literally every day.
But. That's why we're not there.
That's why I'm not there. Yeah.
But look, at the end of the day,this again.
We shouldn't fight these messengers.
These messengers are trying to protect us.
We need to start witnessing and we need to start seeing them and

(28:15):
hearing them for what they are. And when we do that, everything
can start to change. And treat them with love and
kindness. I'm going to You can think you
can conquer anxiety. That's not a realistic thing.
There are only two groups of people who don't have anxiety.
One group are dead people. That's how you know you're
alive, man. You know the second.
Group. Psychopaths.

(28:36):
Yeah, yeah. Everyone else deals with anxiety
to some degree. Yeah, that's OK.
It's natural. It is, it is, it is, it's about,
it's about, it's about not controlling everything that's
happening outside of you. It's about controlling the
narrative and making sure that it's true, that what you're
feeling is something that you need to deal with.

(29:00):
And oftentimes it may be, but ifwe don't know what's causing it,
what's triggering it, then we wecan't take steps to start to
heal it, integrate it to, to honor those witnesses or honor
those messengers within us. You know, we can't, we can't
look at this is where over the years we start to.

(29:21):
And I think most people now in in the circles that that our
path, our philosophy kind of travels in where, you know, many
years ago it was about suppression and all suppression
does suppression of emotions. All it does is 'cause you to get
sick. You know, we don't seek to make
enemies of ourselves. Our emotions are messengers.

(29:43):
Our shadows are parts of us thatare being dragged out into the
light. And they just want to be
connected to us too. They want to be part of the
whole. So we can't make enemies of
ourselves. And how do we do that?
By, by by pausing and having these conversations with
ourselves. Restore that that line of
communication. Build a bridge to yourself.

(30:06):
So let's talk about interruptingthe spiral before it begins
catching the anxiety as it starts to rise.
You know, what are some things we can do to help ground
ourselves when anxiety likes to spike up like it does?
Well, you can't. You can't out think.
You can't overthink or out think.
You can't solve this with logic really, right?

(30:26):
It's it. This isn't a logical problem
because you can't out think of dysregulated nervous system.
It is going to do what it does, It's going to do what it was
designed to do, what it was literally built to do.
You have to start where anxiety starts, and that's in the body.
By noticing, becoming aware of the little things, a sensation

(30:47):
or a twitch or you know, you start to get hot for no reason,
right? It doesn't matter.
However, anxiety effects you, and I think it probably affects
us all mostly the same because we all have pretty much the same
kind of nervous system, but you have to start in the body.
When, like you said, the pause is one of the most precious
weapons you have against yourself to be able to catch
yourself as it's starting to build up and just pause.

(31:08):
Take a deep breath, you know, box breathing.
Do the calming breath. Bring yourself to a point where
you can reflect internally. What's really going on here?
Now ask yourself the question, what is my body?
Remember. Yeah, you got to name these
things. We say this all the time.
You got to call it out and don'tdo it judgy, but do it.
Do it with, with love and, and concern for yourself and name

(31:32):
these things when you say that when your chest gets tight or
your hands get hot or whatever it is, or you're fluttering, you
know, you, you can't, you can't just say what is wrong with me
or something is definitely wrongwith me.
You got to call these things outas they're happening because
you're describing what's happening.
And that gives you a chance to communicate with yourself.
And the more you do that, the more likely you're start to

(31:54):
learn that, OK, I'm not having aheart attack.
Still I. Don't need to run to the
hospital. I don't have to do these things
because once you call it out, then it says, OK, thank God he
finally sees me. He's listening to me.
Now's my chance to tell him what's wrong.
Possibly, you know, and it may take you a bunch of times to do
that. It probably will.

(32:16):
It took me years, but you know, This is why it's important to,
to get help. And, and if it's not, if it's
not super bad, you know, find a trusted mentor, find a trusted
teacher. You know, if you're religious,
find a trusted minister or, or, you know, monk or whatever,
whatever you subscribe to. But if it does affect your life
in a way where you're not able to function very well, then you

(32:38):
have to get you have to get some, some real professional
help, right? I mean, a coach probably isn't
going to do it if you're if you're constantly paralyzed, you
have to get to get some some. And there's nothing wrong with
that. Again, none of this is judgy.
Don't ever feel we talked a lot about having to break stigmas.
You know, I would love to take ahammer to the stigma.

(33:00):
I would love to shatter it with a single blow.
You know, because people, it hurts people.
I would say it kills some peoplewhen they feel like they can't
get help because they're going to be ostracized or whatever, or
they're going to lose a job overit or lose their rights to
something or another. That's why that's why veterans a
lot of times don't get help because they're afraid that
they're going to be, you know, put in the system and then

(33:22):
treated badly. So it's a very bad stigma.
We talked about, we talked with Gabe about that, you know, a few
shows back. Yeah, you have to call it out,
dude. You know, that's a perfect,
perfect point. And of course, grounding,
grounding and breathing, like you said, because, because
really, when this is happening, it's happening in the moment.
It's not happening next week. It's happening right now.

(33:42):
We got it. We got to be as present as
possible. That's where our most powerful
awareness is. I guess some would argue that's
where our only awareness is a true one.
That's right, is now being present.
And the more you can do that, the more you can bring yourself
to back to the moment. You'll be able to come back to
the moment quicker the more you do it, but you'll also be able

(34:03):
to start noticing the other signs, the other signals that
you're getting that maybe you didn't notice before, and you
can start to head these things off.
You know, another important maneuver, this helped me a lot
when I was going through a lot of my chronic anxiety after I
went through everything I did isdoing cold exposure.
And you can do this anywhere, anywhere, as long as you're in a
building, right? I go to a faucet, turn on that

(34:24):
cold water, let it blast, splashmyself in the face a couple of
times, shock my nervous system back-to-back to baseline.
Cold showers. You know, that's one of the
reasons ice baths is so big, as it's great to help stimulate
that sensation in the nervous system and pull you back into
the present moment. Yeah, yeah, those little fidget
toys I see people use, those aregood.

(34:47):
Yeah, I. Keep one on my desk.
Yeah, yeah, there's a little fit.
There's those little fidget toys.
Let me see yours. You said you got one right
there. Yeah, just something I can play
around with. Yeah, little fidget toys, right?
I think that's what they call them, right?
Fidget toys, Yeah. Because they have like little,
little things you can do, but they have textures or you know.
If there's also, there's so manyvarieties of them, yeah, like
this one is just one. You move around and it does

(35:08):
different shapes and stuff and it's like, I'm never looking at
it, trying to make anything. But it's a great little fidget
item. Something that Heather does
something Heather does, she plays with her.
I see her playing with her bracelet, you know, or she'll
play with her hair. She does that a lot.
People do that. But whatever, whatever brings
you back to the present, give your, give your mind and your
and your nervous system something else to focus on.

(35:30):
You know, maybe don't jump in a frozen pond.
But I guess if that, that works,I do the, I've done the water
thing where it's just, you know,and, and, and really it's, it's
kind of kind of strange because sometimes when I, before I start
getting to that point where it'sgoing to be a problem, I'll get
really super hot all of a sudden, right?
So that cold water really, you know, my body's like, please

(35:54):
throw water on me, throw water on me because we're overheating.
And you know, there's nothing wrong with me physically.
Like I'm not sick or anything. But because as soon as I bring
myself, it's not the water that cools my whole body down.
Throw it on my face. It's it's the grounding, it's
the re centering. And then my body goes back into,
you know. When really just being able to
name it, you know, again, when it starts to come up, being able

(36:17):
to stop. That's what's helped me so much
is being able to just contain itinto my body.
Not letting my mind touch it. Our mind is dyed by the color of
the things going on inside in our bodies.
Being able to stop it. This is anxiety.
This is just I'm go, I'm gettingsome heart racing going on.
There's nothing going on around me.
I'm safe, I'm fine. Stop trying to create a story.

(36:40):
Something you something you introduced to the show many
moons ago, you know, this is this is going to be episode 81,
by the way, that's crazy. But something you introduced
many shows ago was the what if, how we get stuck in that, that
cycle of rumination. What if, what if, but what if,
what if we need to switch that to what is what is happening

(37:01):
right now. I don't care about what's
happening then, certainly don't have any clue what's going to
happen then. I need to be concerned with
what's happening right now. Why am I feeling this way?
Where am I feeling it? How can I help you Sir?
Type thing, right? Yeah.
Am I really in a threat? Is there really a threat going
on right now in my? Life.
Yeah. Because this thing, this thing

(37:22):
could spiral like a wildfire sometimes it feels like.
And when you're able to ground or come back to center or back
to your breath or whatever the case, whatever pulls you out of
that, that fire loses its fuel. It has no more fuel to burn it
just right. It comes back down South.
And you got to try to stay in that, in that center as long as

(37:43):
you can. Because, you know, although the
emotions only last a few seconds, you know, a minute and
1/2 or something, that's that sense of peace and that sense of
stillness and that sense of security and safety that you can
bring yourself back to that thathas much longer lasting effect.
You know, another big 1, and I was bringing this up earlier, is
the internal locus of control, which is where you take

(38:06):
ownership of the role of and of outcomes in your life, but of
the things you have control over.
I remember I went through this period of my life where I was
having panic attacks every otherday, and the thing that grounded
me was the serenity there. That is something that I
instilled into my very being. God grant me the serenity to
accept the things I cannot change, the courage to change

(38:26):
the things I can, and the wisdomto know the difference.
And the reason this was so powerful for me is I realized
almost everything I was stressedabout, I had absolutely no
control over. And often I feel like that's
what anxiety is. We want to manage the outcomes.
We want to manage people. We want to manage all these
situations in our life. Check engine lights, you know,

(38:49):
and when we can ground ourselvesin, what is it I do have control
over in this moment? Check engine light.
All right, I can't afford a repair right now.
That is just how the situation is.
So if I save up this much money for the next two paychecks, I'll
be able to address this issue, You know, when it comes to a bad
work situation, what can I do tomanage the stress better?

(39:11):
Can I change departments? Can I find a new job?
Like all things that are overwhelming us, if we look at
what part can we play in avoiding the suffering, what
part can we do to take ownershipof our lives can help direct
that mentality to a much more productive thought process than
one that is just drowning and suffering.

(39:32):
Yeah, no, you're right. Because the suffering and
anxiety really is strongest whenwe feel powerless.
The more powerless we feel, the worse it gets.
And that comes from where where things that we're trying to
control are really just unpredictable life things.
And we have to remember that we don't control, you know, 95% of

(39:53):
what, 95% of what happens outside of us.
I'm just making this number up, but it's probably close to that
of the things happening around us are out of our hands.
We have no control over these things.
But we have 100% control of whathappens inside, how we how we.
And I'll say that with a little asterisks.
Right as you are starting your healing journey, you will have

(40:14):
not a lot of control what happens inside of you either.
This is why you take these smallsteps, but you can, you can
regain 100% control through thisprocess, right?
And I know what it won't feel like that at first.
It'd be like, well, I'm still having anxiety, Justin.
Well, I'm still. It's even worse now.
I'm, I'm yeah, yeah, yeah. Because now that I know that I'm
responsible for this, I just gotworse, you know, and that's,

(40:36):
that's, that's also perfectly natural.
Do not judge yourself for that. That's natural because you have
to literally relearn and rebuildthings that that just went crazy
on you somewhere, probably more than likely when stuff went
crazy on you before you had any real power in the world, even
power over yourself, right? You know, it's like there's this

(40:57):
interview, I listened to it, Jordan Peterson, and he was
talking about how life is suffering.
It's a very pessimistic way to look at life, but life is
suffering. We will go through the crap, but
I love his stuff so much. But he talks about this and it's
true. Life will deal us some rough
cards at some very inconvenient times.

(41:17):
That is just that is how life works.
And we, if we don't want to be at the mercy of it, we got to
learn to manage what it is we can control.
Because in that moment, you allow yourself to step back, not
look at all the things outside of your control, which you can,
how can I respond to this situation?
How can I, can I show up in a way that's going to make an

(41:38):
impact and change my life for the better?
It's this is a detrimental shiftthat can happen.
You know, one thing you can do to start cultivating this is
just stopping. When you start getting into that
catastrophizing, when you start getting overwhelmed, stop and
ask yourself, what is it I can change in the neck?
What can I influence in the next5 minutes?
And just evaluating that again, if your job's horrible, start

(42:01):
looking for a new job. Start building that resume.
Take action, but don't make it be sporadic and anxiety induced
action. Yeah, because look, the, the,
the, the truth is, this is the bottom line anxiety.
This anxiety doesn't come from too much responsibility.
It comes from too little agency.Yes.
You're not taking enough responsibility for what you have

(42:24):
power over. And you know, this internal
locus of control is something that's very important to this
and very vital because it's one of the most powerful antidotes
to our anxiety. Because it doesn't mean
controlling everything is simplymeans remembering, right?
Remembering here, remembering here that you have influence,

(42:46):
you have choice. And what you're trying to regain
control over is your presence. But you have to remember that
that presence must be there eachmoment.
And you only got to take it moment to moment.
That's all you got to do. But you got to own that moment,
right? You have to own it with all of
your being. So when you, when you shift from
this, this ideal that everythingis happening to me and you

(43:09):
switch that to play a role in what happens next, starting with
this moment, that's where these things start to soften a little
bit and you stop feeling like a passenger in your own car.
You have to take the driver's seat.
Yeah. You know, ask yourself, what
outside of my control can I release?
And you start letting go of these burdens that's taking up

(43:31):
so much of your energy, of your mental bandwidth.
It gives you that capacity back to start channeling towards
things that you do have control over.
Yeah, what can I, what can I control in the next 5 minutes
even? Yeah.
Not tomorrow, not the whole problem, just right now.
Right now and for the next 5 minutes, wouldn't you say that

(43:52):
anxiety kind of operates in the future?
Yeah, it's weird because it's all the energy inside is stored
from past experiences. Anxiety 100% lives in the
future. It is always trying to be a
future seer and it's not really a good one.
So if trauma lives in the past and anxiety lives in the future,
where is all your power then? Not in the present.

(44:13):
All your power is here. This is the only place you can
make a difference. You can't change that.
Yeah, if you move out of them, yes.
Yes, you got to stay here with this kind of stuff because
that's where your only power is,is now, right?
Is now. And I don't want people to think
that accountability is taking blame for something.

(44:34):
But accountability here is also a source of empowerment when
we're talking about the locus ofcontrol.
Yeah, right. Because when we were able to
start taking responsibility for our inside, for our inner world,
our choices, our thoughts, our patterns, these things, we can
start to reclaim the ability to shift them, to integrate them

(44:54):
into something that's not suffering, into something that's
gives us power to control what'shappening to us.
Yeah. It allows us to PIF pivot.
It allows us to pivot from that helplessness into a place where
you can be responsible for your own life, right?

(45:14):
There are, look, there are things in the world that that we
are helpless to. That's just a fact of, of life,
right? We can't control economies and
we can't control governments andwe can't control our loved ones,
right? But that doesn't mean you have
to be completely helpless. You can respond differently.
You can choose differently as you start this work, but you
have to become someone who trusts themselves enough to meet

(45:38):
everything head on. And that takes time sometimes.
I know for me, I had spent a decade destroying myself trust.
And I remember I had one of my closest friends come to me and
he wanted to start a business venture.
And he's like, come on, how can we make money right now?
How can we do this? And it's like, bro, I need to
start with manageable steps so Ican reclaim that trust.

(45:59):
And it started with just going to the gym everyday.
That is one of the best place tobe in.
Or start smaller than that. I'm going to show up at the gym
twice this week. Do manageable bite sized things
to start rebuilding that trust within yourself so that when the
time comes, you know you're going to show up for yourself.
We talk about harmony all the time here.

(46:20):
So, so I, I, I want you to put anxiety once one scale right on
one tray of the scale. And then I want you to put self
trust and faith in yourself in another scale.
And the more you add to self trust, the more anxiety comes
down. That is the only way to balance
this as far as I'm concerned, right?

(46:41):
So, and you know, faith in a higher power, faith in people
that are in your circle of trust.
That helps too. They will good people will teach
you how to be good to yourself. Good people will teach you how
to trust yourself and have faithin yourself.
And that's what we seek to do asLuminari.
We we seek to be that example, to be that light, but also to

(47:05):
you know, as you guys hear all the time on the show, we call
ourselves out too. So it's it.
But it's important that that's how you start to balance the
scales of that though. That's where you start to find
harmony, self trust, faith in your ability to take good care
of yourself. So I think one thing that would
be really good to talk about with this is sort of doing some

(47:26):
nervous system hygiene. That's an interesting, that's an
interesting way to look at it. I think it's a good way to look
at it because we have to stop treating this kind of thing as
like just a momentary storm thatmay never come again.
But looking at it as a climate, maybe instead of a storm, well.
Again, that repression, if you don't listen to it, it starts

(47:46):
goes from talking to you to yelling at you to grab the
megaphone and just screaming at you.
Well, yeah, because what, what we're, what we're trying to
accomplish here is not managing the spikes, although we do have
to manage those. But it's it's about creating a
better baseline for our nervous system.
Yeah, right. Yeah, build resiliency in it.

(48:07):
Yes, yes. And hygiene.
I, I love the way you put that. That's, that's perfect.
Is that, is that a term that other people use?
I've never heard that before. I'm TM ING it right now.
Nice. Taking. 1/4 for any time anybody
says it. Be rich in a week.
Yeah. I mean, yeah, it's spot on.

(48:28):
Because just like with physical hygiene, it keeps us, keeps us
healthy and keeps us right. Yeah, I mean, when it comes down
to it, your habits matter more than the panic itself.
The habits you have in your lifeis what helps dictate yourself.
Trust your resiliency, your ability to cope with difficult

(48:48):
situations. Yeah, now again, we talked about
hitting the gym earlier. Hitting the gym is one of the
best ways to manage anxiety. Lifting weights, running on a
treadmill, getting that energy out of the system.
Yeah, yeah. Movement.
You know, you're talking about movement right now.
That's that's powerful. Your body, your body needs
consistent movement, not just tokeep, not just keep us in shape,

(49:10):
but to keep our mind healthy. The gym is great for that.
I know a lot of people that cured their depression just by
force themselves to go to the gym and working out right.
Well, it's like we store up cortisol and adrenaline in our
bodies and when we get these anxiety spikes, especially if
they're a lot, it's a build up of these these hormones in our
bodies that just constantly trying to flood us.

(49:32):
And exercise helps breakdown these chemicals in the body and
helps them release through us. That literally is something that
was plaguing me. My body tends to over produce
adrenaline and and I I, you know, cortisol is not my friend.
I get too much of that too and it does build up and it causes
weird, weird pains. So I really have to get up and

(49:54):
move around, even if it's just little things because if I don't
then then I'll literally be laying in bed all day so.
Well, it's like we're not meant to handle loads of adrenaline
and cortisol. You look at animals in the
Kingdom, in the animal Kingdom, and I love this example of like
a gazelle when it gets chased bya freaking lion, it runs.
It runs. It's life is an absolute danger,

(50:16):
more than any of us have probably experienced, right?
And once that once it evades thelion that that gazelle is going
to shake it out, it is going to convulse like it's having a
seizure. But as soon as it does, it goes
right back to grazing like nothing ever happened.
Yeah, it's just gone. Just gone.
Yeah. Yeah.
Our body doesn't just want to calm down, right?

(50:36):
It needs somewhere to send all that excess chemical energy.
Our bodies are fascinating. I mean, truly fascinating.
I learned facts about the body every day that just blow my
mind. And but not only do we have
electrical energy, spiritual energy, etheric energy,
universal energy, but we got to deal with chemical energy too.

(50:59):
And it's a lot. Yeah, another important thing is
making sure you get sleep. You know, I suffered from
chronic anxiety and one of the key factors I never considered
is, oh, I'm only getting three to five hours of sleep a night,
and that's been consistent for like 3 years.
Why am I dealing with so much stress and fatigue and just fog?

(51:21):
Because you're not healing, you're not giving your.
That's when our body heals. It's when we're sleeping, right?
That's why, that's why rest is the best medicine, right?
That's why they always telling you to rest, rest, rest.
That's why they knock you out inthe hospital so that you sleep.
That was the best sleep ever, dude.
When I had my when I had my surgery, that was literally the

(51:42):
greatest sleep I've ever had that I can remember, man.
I mean, seriously, it's like to me, only like 10 minutes went
by, but I woke up like renewed my leg, my leg was all banged up
and had a bunch of cuts on it and bunch of screws in it.
But otherwise, dude, I felt great.
I was ready. But that also ties hand in hand

(52:05):
with the movement. The more we move, the more we,
we physically exert ourselves, the easier it is for us to
sleep. And, and I love how these all
tie in together because then nutrition comes into play, you
know, and that plays a huge rolein our lives.
You know, most weight loss, it'smostly nutrition when you're
trying to lose weight, right? I mean, a good, a good chunk of

(52:27):
it is exercise too. But the bigger part of his
nutrition and when we take in a lot of caffeine, a lot of sugar
and those nasty processed foods,they amplify our cortisol.
This is something that Jenna taught me.
Jenna, we had her on the show a while back, right?
She talked to us when you guys went into the spikes and
cortisol and these things and how they, they cause us a lot of

(52:50):
problems. All these foods, you know,
nicotine, caffeine, too much sugar, too much processed foods,
those all increase our cortisol.And when you have too much
cortisol, again, like we're talking about, you get, you get
a lot of actual health problems.So and so, yeah, so, so
nutrition is really important because our brains need food.

(53:12):
Our brains need nutrition. And when we starve those of
food, then we have problems too.Joe, another important one is
making sure you have making sureyou have a is to make sure you
have a predictive routine. You know, you get habits are
best built in routine. We are creatures of habit.
And if you do not have a routineor structure to your life, you

(53:34):
will never be able to get ahead of yourself because you're going
to be constantly living, jumpingfrom one place to the other.
You know, they talk about 8080. And I truly believe, like when
we start processing these emotions, when we start being
able to hone into our passions and start being able to create
structure in our lives, we can avoid a huge percentage of what
ADHD does to us. Because with that structure,

(53:57):
your mind automatically knows, I'm going to this task.
I'm going to this task. Yeah, and one of your favorite
things? Digital hygiene.
Yeah, being careful how much time you're spending on those
screens, especially on social media.
But if you only got like 2 hoursa day, we love it that you spend
it with us. That's.
Yeah. That's the one exception.
I might be biased there, but. I think that's wise advice,

(54:20):
actually. Yeah, yeah, I tend to give a
little bit of wise advice every so often.
Sometimes you're pretty good at it.
I think you should do a podcast on that.
You know, I'll think about it. You know, and again, like,
anxiety isn't all bad. Anxiety is an emotion.
It's here to teach us things. It's here to show us things.
You know, it's a signal in our bodies and it's not meant to be

(54:41):
punished. Again.
I know so many people that struggle with anxiety and it's
just like, how do I conquer my anxiety?
How do I get rid of my anxiety? And it's like, you don't want to
do that. It's a guide.
It's a messenger that can help you figure out what you need to
do in a given situation, especially once you learn to
integrate it, you learn to work with it.
You treat it with love and kindness and acceptance.

(55:04):
And, and, and it's again, it's just a, it's just a messenger,
man. It could be over stimulation.
It could be you're carrying too much weight.
It, it could be, hey, you're notbeing very good to yourself,
right? It could be you're eating really
horrible food. It could be you're not
exercising enough. It could be so many things, but
listen to it when it talks to you.
It's a teacher. Everything we do here, right?

(55:25):
I always say, and I'll beat thishorse to death.
Everything can be a teacher if you let it be.
Stay curious, you know, Stay open.
Let yourself accept the mission,accept the message, accept the
lesson. Experience.
Yes, and it doesn't feel good. It doesn't feel good, I get it.
But it does illuminate those spaces where things from the

(55:49):
past are causing you future problems.
Still. Remember, the trauma comes from
the past, The anxiety is in the future.
Your power is now in that moment.
Use it wisely. So what ways can anxiety be a
teacher? Well, it helped.
It teaches us to learn to be aware of what's happening to us

(56:09):
and and then it allows us to, you know, learn, integrate, you
know, I mean, because if we justtrying to fight everything, if
we treat it, if we treat it withfear or frustration, you know,
it doesn't go away. It gets worse.
And that and that bill keeps piling up that emotional toll
that it's going to take. You're going to have to pay for
that some point, probably in your body somewhere.

(56:31):
And it could become a disease ifyou're not careful.
But what if we approach things with curiosity?
The student is the best teacher after all, And that's about
being curious. What if we approached it with
curiosity? What if our question, Michael
wasn't How do I get rid of this?How do I destroy this evil
scourge upon me? And what if we just ask it

(56:51):
instead? What is this?
What is this trying to tell me? What is this asking of me?
What can I learn from this? Right.
You know, often it carries really important messages.
It could be showing you where you're ignoring your own needs,
whether that's advocating for yourself or stepping out of your
comfort zone, you know, or if boundaries have been crossed,
You know, I know that was a big one for me.
One of the aha moments I've had in the last year is I had a

(57:14):
friend do something that I didn't appreciate.
And it just like I felt all thisanxiety and it hit me.
It's like I need to confront this dude and tell him that I
did not appreciate this and doing so gone.
Yeah, and it actually worked outof your favor for doing that?
Yeah, imagine that, right. Well, we talked about boundaries
in the last show, and that's exactly how you do it.

(57:35):
Yeah. You did it masterfully,
perfectly, because you were like, hey, and then and then you
actually felt it in your body, which is so important.
Well, it is, but the, but that'sthe great thing about this work,
about healing. You will know when you're
starting to come out of it. You'll know when you're starting
to rebuild, when you're startingto create those new connections

(57:57):
with yourself, because you will feel it.
You will actually feel it and itwon't feel bad.
It'll feel great. You'll feel peace.
If you've never felt stillness or peace, trust me, when you do,
it is like it is like being reborn.
It is such a powerful state of being.
So true, though I think one of my favorite things about anxiety
in recent years as I've been doing this work is it often

(58:20):
tells me where I still need to heal.
You know, someone says something, there's something I
don't like. I get that flare up in the body
and it's like, what is it tryingto show me about the past that
still has influence over my life?
Yeah, yeah. Now this is going to sound
counterproductive, but by by befriending this discomfort, you

(58:40):
build more self trust, you startto tip the scales again back in
your favor and you start to findthat balance in harmony.
I know that sounds counterproductive to what?
Do you want me to become friendswith this thing?
Yes, yes I do, because it's there to protect you.
It's there to help you, right? We're not here to destroy it.
We're not here to banish it to the Badlands forever, because

(59:04):
you can't. It will just keep coming up in
really horrible ways for you. Yes, I want you to befriended.
I want you to treat it like a teacher because it will teach
you how to be better for yourself.
In the end, it's not about mastering it, it's about
building a relationship with a relation.
Yeah, because you're building a relationship with yourself.
Yeah. And, and, and it can be.

(59:25):
It could be like a teacher calling you deeper into your
mastery of that relationship with yourself.
Anxiety is not the enemy, it is one of the greatest gifts we are
given. We just don't understand it when
we're first starting off. I know for me, I was diagnosed
with chronic anxiety as a child.At the age of five, I was
diagnosed with chronic anxiety and I was constantly told this

(59:48):
was a bad thing, that I needed medications for it.
It's treated as some kind of mental illness.
Yes. When in fact it's a part of
life. It's an important part of us.
It protects us. It protects us.
But when we but when we treat itlike a like the plague or treat,
treat it like a leper, of coursethere's going to be suffering

(01:00:08):
because what? Guess what?
There's disconnection there. And disconnection is what?
Disconnection is what? It's hell.
Disconnection is hell. It's suffering fire and
brimstone, man. It sucks, it hurts, it literally
hurts. So yeah, it's not a bad thing.
It just needs, just like the egoit needs to be brought into, it

(01:00:30):
needs to be integrated into yourbeing.
It's a part of you. It's trying to help you.
It's trying to save you, but it doesn't know the difference.
It doesn't know it doesn't know how to save you per SE.
It just knows how to light you up like a Christmas tree
sometimes. And it's unpleasant, but that's
only because you're ignoring it.Well, it's like we said, I mean
the more you repress it, the louder it becomes, the more

(01:00:52):
control it has over your life. Do you have any final thoughts
before we close this out? I do.
So as we come to the end of thisconversation, I again want to
remind and I want you to remember something important.
Anxiety is not a flaw in your design.
It is there by design. It's a part of your internal
guidance system, right? It's this messenger deep deep

(01:01:15):
down, and it's physically, literally connected to you.
It's that way on purpose. You were never meant to walk
through this life numb or just certainly not disconnected.
You were meant to feel and you're meant to respond and
you're and you're meant to learnfrom what comes up in you,
right? We are creatures that receive

(01:01:37):
signals both from outside and inside.
It's important that we treat them with the respect that they
deserve because they are not ourenemies.
And some of you may have heard adifferent perspective on
anxiety. Many of you have been told and
and and believe that it's an enemy to fight.
But it's a again, it's a signal,and it invites you to reconnect
you with yourself if you let it.And the more you listen to your

(01:02:00):
signals, the more you listen to your messengers, the more you'll
notice that anxiety isn't random.
It is almost intelligent in a way, wouldn't you say?
Yeah. It's purposeful.
It is pointing you towards the places that healing will happen
and wants to happen. So here's my call of action to
everyone today. For today, this week, choose one

(01:02:23):
moment of anxiety, just one. And make sure you practice the
pause. And instead of rearing from it
or reeling from it or bracing orpushing against it or trying to
control it, just breathe with itand just ask what's up bro?
What are you trying to show me? Clearly there's something wrong
here. And let your curiosity replace

(01:02:44):
your fear and be compassionate instead of judging.
Don't be judging it to yourself.Everybody outside of you is
already doing enough of that to last all of us a lifetime.
Don't do it to yourself too, right?
Because every single moment of presence, you start to retrain
and rebuild your nervous system in a way that it to trust you

(01:03:04):
again and for you to trust it. And as we always say, you know,
we talk about putting ourselves through the forge, where we are
the forge. We are the Smith, we are the raw
materials, right? Mastery doesn't come from
avoiding discomfort. It doesn't.
You have to. If you want to find wisdom, you
have to meet these things head on.
You have to call them out, as hard as that is.
Do not try to conquer your anxiety.

(01:03:25):
You know, you have to stop abandoning yourself.
Start trusting yourself when it shows up and you know, learn how
to ground yourself. It's really, really important.
So that's all I have for today. That was good stuff for
affirmations today. I can handle what I feel one
moment at a time. My sensations are temporary and
they do not define me. I trust myself to respond

(01:03:48):
instead of react. I choose what I give my power
and attention to. I am safe in my body and present
in this moment. Good ones for our journaling
prompts today. What sensations show up in my
body when I feel anxious, and what stories does my mind attach
to those sensations? Where in my life do I feel
powerless, and what parts of thesituation are actually within my

(01:04:08):
control? If my anxiety could speak
plainly, what would it be tryingto warn me about or protect me
from? Those are great little exercises
to go through anytime you're starting to feel anxiety to
really pick it apart and find meaning.
Thank you so much for joining ustoday.
Please check out our YouTube, our Instagram, TikTok, Facebook,
we're all over the place. Don't forget to check out the

(01:04:30):
best website, evernewashley.com.And thank you so much for making
it through to the end. We hope you got something from
this X episode and that you get that much closer to learning to
befriend your anxiety with love and gratitude ad luchum.
Ad Luchum, love you guys.