February 4, 2025 • 33 mins
Ever wondered how often you should eat foods like chicken, fish, eggs, or cheese? What about chocolate and wine—how much is too much? On this episode of The Nutrition Couch, Leanne Ward and Susie Burrell break down the most common foods we eat, revealing how often you should (or shouldn’t) include them in your diet for optimal health, weight management, and longevity.
Plus, we cover:
- The shocking truth about how many calories you think you eat versus how many you actually consume (based on real research!).
- A brand-new fish product in the freezer aisle—does it live up to its health claims?
- The truth about MCT oil for weight loss—does it actually work, or is it just another expensive fad?
If you want science-backed advice that helps you make smarter, more sustainable food choices, tune in now!
Don’t forget to subscribe and leave a review—it helps us keep bringing you the best in evidence-based nutrition!
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:01):
How often should you eat chicken, or fish or eggs?
Is eating chocolate every day too much? And how often
should you indulge in a glass of wine? On today's
episode of The Nutrition Couch, we take a closer look
at the most common foods we eat and the foods
that we crave and share how often you should or
should not be eating them. Hi, I'm Fussy Burrow and
(00:23):
I'm Liam Wood, and together we bring you The Nutrition Couch,
the weekly podcast that keeps you up to date on
everything you need to know in the world of nutrition,
as well as your own personal food counter. Today we
look at some research about how many calories we think
that we eat versus the actual number that we do.
We have a brand new fish option in the freezer
(00:44):
section to talk about, and our listener question is all
about MCT oil and whether it will help you to
lose weight. All Right, Leanne, I've got a quick fire
for you because this was an article that you sent
me and we liked the look of it. How often
do you eat.
Speaker 2 (01:00):
Cake on your birthday plus maybe once a month. I
wasn't expecting cake to come straight up put yourself with
bloody vegetables.
Speaker 1 (01:12):
Cake on your birthday. That's actually really funny.
Speaker 3 (01:14):
Okay, cheese, what about cheese once to day, once a day,
eggs a couple of times a week, red meat once
or twice a week.
Speaker 2 (01:27):
Hello, fish two three times a week, Chocolate a couple
of times a week, maybe once a day.
Speaker 1 (01:35):
Just think about.
Speaker 2 (01:37):
It's relative though, right, A couple of times a week, splash,
maybe a small portion every day if you really love it.
Speaker 1 (01:43):
Yeah, And I think what we're trying to talk about
here is I think sometimes it's good when you're looking
at overall diet quality to get an idea of how
to achieve the right balance. And I know something that
comes up all the time in nutrition circles is how
many eggs is okay to eat? And also things like
how often should you have red meat? And foods like that.
(02:03):
So I think the first thing that I wanted to
ask lean those questions because I would be surprised if
our answers as dieticians would be that different, because we
are looking at it from a calorie and macro nutrient
perspective and roughly know what the targets are, and then
when we work backwards what that looks like in food terms.
I have the cake on your birthday. I really like
(02:26):
that one, actually, but I would be answering very similar.
So we thought it was just a nice summary point,
particularly at the start of a year, for people to
do a little bit of a checklist, because sometimes we
sort of things slip in and you realize that you're
not having as much as you thought. So a classic
example is I'll have clients who'll be suddenly adding process
meat so turkey or ham to their sandwiches, and then
at some point I'll say it's not that high in protein,
(02:48):
and they're kind of shocked. So it's always good, I think,
just to have some rough references. So some of the
popular foods that come to mind from my perspective. With
the egg story, the old science we used to say
if you had high cholesterol, you should limit eggs. New
science shows us it's not about that. It's about overall
fat balance, and as such the recommendations are for people
without high cholesterol, a couple of eggs a day are fine.
(03:09):
If you do have high cholesterol, it's more a limited
about one per day is recommended. In the case of
red meat. Certainly, the Australian guidelines that have no more
than four hundred and fifty grams of lean red meat
a week. So again I would translate that into two
maybe three small serves of say one hundred hundred and
fifty grams cooks per week. And then when I work
(03:30):
backwards from their leanne if I'm looking at fish, well,
I absolutely want my clients to consume more fish. It's
low calorie, it's nutrient dents, or in the case of
the high fat Amega three rich fish like salmon, it's
incredibly nutrient dents. So I think the guidelines of twice
a week or a bit low. I prefer my clients
to have it three or four times, whether it's tinned,
cooked at night or in a salad at lunch. And
(03:51):
then chicken maybe once or twice, because red meat's offering
key nutrients versus chicken, which is a little bit lower.
And then I'm trying to get fish in there and
see our thinking. We're kind of going along and working
out what the numbers look like. I think a reference
of a serve of nuts or seeds a day is
also good. You know, nuts and seeds are very good
for us, but they are relatively high calorie, and I'll
(04:12):
have clients super loading their nuts and seeds, so they'll
have in a smoothie or a breakfast bowl chea plus
flax seed plus LSA plus some nuts, and then they
might repeat some nuts and seeds in the day and
it ends up being too much fat. So they're good
for you, but a serve of about thirty grams of
nuts and seeds per days more than enough. So that's
two small servings or one. You know, sprinkle, et cetera.
(04:33):
On cereal products with higher fat foods, things like cheese,
you know, it's nutrient dense, but it's just more a
calorie issue in terms of having too much. So I
usually say to client's cheese once a day. But there's
tricks with that, because of course we love cheese. You know,
you can use a really thin shaving or grating as
a seasoning without resorting to large slices, and then you
(04:54):
can sort of have it a couple of times. And
in the case of cheeses like cottage, well it's really
like cow you can sort of have as much as
you want. And then we get to our more indulgent foods.
The cake on your birthday, for example.
Speaker 2 (05:06):
I think I said like once a month as well,
didn't I?
Speaker 1 (05:09):
She thought about it. She doesn't love cake as much
as chocolate, so she's less.
Speaker 2 (05:12):
Now, yeah, I'm not a really cake person.
Speaker 1 (05:14):
I like cake, but I only like like a really
good cake, you know, And so rarely do you get
amazing cake. It's usually mass produced. So I'm like, if
you go to a beautiful bakery or like cafe and
they've got these amazing homemade cakes, go for it. But
in more cases than not, I find it's just mass
produced vegetable oil cake. It's not that great. But in
something like chocolate, you know, if you can control yourself
(05:36):
and have twenty grams a day, it's about one hundred
hundred and twenty cow you can probably fit that in
a balanced diet. But if you open the block of
cabrires and down the whole one seventy five grams remember
the good old days when they used to be two fifty,
you know, you probably better to have it once a
week in a larger serve, and then you know, rather
than know that you can't really control yourself. So it's
(05:56):
more about calorie balance and how often. And then with alcohol,
of course we do need to recommend that alcohol should
be consumed sparingly. We used to say two alcohol free
days each week. I think four is better. And you know,
if you can stick to that small one hundred meal
every day, sure, but in my experience most people do
not do that, so you're probably better to have it
just fewer times each week. If you do tend to
(06:18):
have a heavy pore with the wine, that alcohol is
a toxin. Really, we do need to say that the
less you have for your health long term, the better.
What are some other things we've missed?
Speaker 2 (06:27):
Oil?
Speaker 1 (06:28):
Yeah, oil oneil.
Speaker 2 (06:29):
And I should say or I should say mention that
when you're talking about the facts in particular, that's more
for somebody who's aiming to achieve a calorie deficit and
some fat loss, which is you know most of our
listeners as we've surveyed them, and you can definitely get
away with a bit more fats if your goal is
weight maintenance, like just maintaining or even trying to gain
some weight as well. But from a general health and
a gut health and even a hormone perspective, the big
(06:50):
one we haven't really mentioned is legumes or vegetarian meals.
Where you might not be vegetarian per se, but it
is super important to still be getting in some plant
based on options throughout the week. I Donocies is not
a huge fan of legumes, but I personally like my
clients eating them three to four times a week, and
even if that means that you're reducing the amount of
red meat. And I think that was why you were
a bit shocked with my red meat recommendation, because I
(07:12):
sort of don't do a lot of red meat for
my clients, but I do more legumes because they're still,
you know, not as high an iron, but you can
still get iron if you're smart about it, from other
sources through your diet as well. But I do like,
you know, a lot of legumes in my client's diet
from a gut health and a hormone perspective and just
a fiber perspective overall, because a lot of people do
struggle with just feeling really sluggish and constipated, particularly if
(07:34):
they're trying to achieve a calorie deficit because there's less
food and less volume going in over all. So me personally,
I like two to three vegetarian slash legume based meals
every single week. Greate, fiber, great protein, there's a bit
of iron there and you can even if you're not
a huge fan of legumes, you can reduce the amount
of red meat you're using, Like if you're making a
bowlin age, you can use half the red meat and
(07:55):
throw in a tin of you know, brown lentils, or
throw in a tin of red kiddi beans. You're making
like a chili dish shaw and some sort of mince
based dish as well, how do you have?
Speaker 1 (08:05):
That's a lot? Like I am not anti legume, can
I say? I love it? A marmae beans. I love
adding the crunchy faber beans to a salad like for
a crunch. I love the salt and vinega ones. And
I actually really quite like baked beans. But my tummy
is a bit sensitive, and I think that's why I
kind of too many, because it's a bit gassy. But
that's a lot of meals of legames. How do you
get that much in?
Speaker 2 (08:25):
Yeah? I use a lot of mince for my kids,
and maybe because they're a little like we don't eat
a lot of like, so I put it into the
mince yet or sometimes I'll just do say a like
a curry. Like a curry is a great option if
I'm using a bit of tofu plus some chickpeas or
plus some butter beans or something. Beans and legumes work
really well in those really flavorsome dishes like curries or
like a mince or something, because they don't have much
flavor themselves, right, And so if you're putting it with
(08:47):
a flavorsome meal like a curry or like a spaghetti bolonnaise,
you can absorb some of those you know, delicious flavors
around it.
Speaker 1 (08:54):
True, And I love the cannellini beans. They're probably one
of my favorite. And when it gets cooler, I always
do the beautiful beans to which I put on my Instagram.
But actually I've seen recipes where you can blitz those
up and make like a nice dip for them, you
know how. Sometimes we're seeing now in the dip section
they're blitzing kidney beans to make like the Mexican dips.
And if you're sensitive on the tummy, I find when
(09:14):
you blitz them they're much more gentle. And you can
do the same with a cannellini bean and some sort
of garlic olive oil and make a really nice dip
with them as well. So yeah, that's actually really good
ideas on how to incorporate those and just going back
to oil, I usually say one or two serves of
a good quality oil a day, whether it's as dressing
as cooking, because people sort of worry about that. I
(09:36):
think it's much more important to have more veggies, more
salad that taste good with a good quality oil than
be worried about a little bit of extra as long
as it's good quality. So yeah, I think they're the
main sort of foods like the other things. Like people
would say, what about lollies, Well I don't or soft
drink I don't think you should have it. Like they're
really occasional party foods. There's nothing nutrition sound in them.
I don't think there's a reference. I think it's the
(09:57):
less you kind of have them, the better in your
diet of processed sugar.
Speaker 2 (10:01):
Well, I've got one for you. What about coffee? Oh, coffee, Yes,
I said my second one.
Speaker 1 (10:06):
Yeah, the coffee if we're talking about barist of coffee
like shot. So that's about one hundred milligrams of caffeine.
The recommended upper intake I think is about three hundred
milligrams for caffeine, is that right, which is sort of
two or three coffees. But everyone's got different tolerance, you
know what I mean. I think if it doesn't negatively
affect you, you sleep well, it doesn't impact you.
Speaker 2 (10:27):
You know.
Speaker 1 (10:27):
I think two maybe three a day really, But if
someone was you know, had an extra piccolo and they
tolerated it, it's not the end of the world. My
issue with coffee is the milk because it just adds
a lot of extra calories and sugars if you're constantly
having lattes or flat white. So keep that in mind too.
You know, sometimes you better should do a three quarter
or piccolo and still have the taste of the coffee
(10:47):
rather than just getting all the extra milk. More to
the point, but if you just drink like coffee, I
would say three four per day, like not Shoe and
Shoe probably if it was an instant though, because it's.
Speaker 2 (10:56):
Not that cafe. Yeah, yeah, true, like those ans cafeas
a lot of people use them, yes, but.
Speaker 1 (11:02):
They've got quite lots of sugars in them though. Hey
they're so ultra processed.
Speaker 2 (11:05):
I think some of them yeah yeah, yeah, it again,
it depends on how many you have.
Speaker 1 (11:10):
Yeah, So I think with coffee, you know, it's more
as long as it's not negatively affecting you, and if
you just be mindful of how much milk that you're
having each day, because yeah, milk is important as a nutrient,
offering protein, calcium, magnesium, but certainly dairy milks and even
a lot of the plant based milks oat, so they
do have a calorie load you have to be careful
of and if you sort of sip on coffee over
(11:30):
several hours. So that's the story for another day. But
I think hopefully that gives you a little bit of
a ready reckoner about categorizing food. And I think for
me and it's well one, it's relevant for treats, isn't it,
because we all have too many, But in terms of
getting your protein balance right at night and really lightening
it up the portions of red meat and having more
fish and having more even one or two plant based
(11:51):
meals each week will go a long way and improving
your nutrition. We've got more and more evidence showing that.
So there's some positive steps to take in the start
of a brand new year. And cake on your birthday.
I love that, So come back to that if you're
in doubt. But I was just cruising through Instagram as
we do, and I read a really interesting rehash of
(12:14):
a very old study. Actually I think the study goes
back to nineteen ninety, but it just reminded me of
so many things that pop up with clients. So it
was from Lane Norton, who I think sef physiologists, very
well known on Instagram, puts a lot of really interesting
stuff about performance. And it was a study just reporting
some old data, a study of OBEs, people who claim
(12:35):
they ate twelve hundred calories per day and could not
lose weight. And what happened was the researchers then tracked
their food intake and activity very closely, and the data
found that the subjects underestimated calorie intake by fifty three
percent an overestimated activity by forty seven percent. And I
thought this was relevant because not any targeting people in
(12:59):
their way. This is the case with all human beings.
We underestimate how much we eat and we overestimate how
much we do and there's several reasons for that. So
one of the key reasons is that calorie intake monitoring
is extremely inaccurate. So if you're putting your food into
my fitness power and estimating portions, amounts, and even the
(13:20):
raw data itself there's a significant error margin. So not
only will you probably be getting wrong how much you
actually had, but even the original data will be a
little bit out because food changes, it's not overly accurate.
So straight away you've got to have always a buffer
of one hundred or two hundred calories from what you
think that you're eating. Some days it might be a thousand,
and you think it's twelve hundred, and some days it
(13:41):
might be fourteen hundred, and you think like there's a
real error margin. But the other thing I find even
more than that land. I find that we get really
inaccurate data and how much we do. And I think
the reason for that is psychologically, when we think we're
putting a lot of effort or we think something's hard, god,
we naturally equate it to say a lot of calories.
(14:03):
So classic example is that we'll have reports of I've
gone for a walk. Now most if you are walking
five kilometers an hour, Now, that is fast, Like if
you get on the treadmill and plug it at five
k an hour, I would argue very few people could
maintain that pace. Like I'm a walker, I'm a walker
(14:24):
from way back. I could barely do that without sort
of really having to put my back into it, you
know what I mean. Like that is a really quick pace. Now,
even if you're walking for an hour at five k's
an hour, you'd be lucky to burn four hundred calories. Lucky,
lucky because we grossly overestimate the effort. Because the human
(14:44):
body is very efficient when it comes to calorie burning.
And let's be honest, when things hurt and really push us,
we don't like it very much. So we always tend
to hold back a little bit, or go for a
walk one we say we go for a walk, but
we actually do it once a week. Or we will
go for a walk and we go with a friend
who's slower than us, or we go with the dog.
A dog walk is not exercise. I have a dog now,
I can talk on behalf of dog owners everywhere. Trust me,
(15:07):
it's not they stop and start all the time, you know,
like unless you've got like a full on dog who
runs for the hour. Like so all those things mean
that unfortunately we just don't burn as many as we think.
But then we put it into the calorie monitoring apps
and it adjusts for the calorie like, it's all those
things going on. So we're not talking about this today
to shame anyone. You know, the goal of the nutrition
(15:30):
Couch is to be a useful resource, but it's just
a bit of a funny reminder that as human beings,
we will always overestimate how much we've done and underestimate
how much we eat. And that may be way even
though you think you're doing a lot or think that
you're eating for fat loss, you're not quite getting there.
And that's okay, but just understanding that that is very common.
And as we could see from that data.
Speaker 2 (15:51):
Yeah, and that's really interesting because when you sent me
that study, I've seen this way back when, and it
actually takes me back to I think the first day
of my master is a dietetic somewhere. We're sitting in
the big to theater and the I can't remember what
teacher or what lecture it was, and they stood up
the front and they were like, welcome to your you know,
Masters of dietetics. The first thing I'm going to say,
and this will stick with you for your entire career,
and she goes, do not try to change your family
(16:14):
and friends. That is number one and she goes the
second most important point that will stay with you for
the rest of your career is that your clients will
always overestimate how much they move and underestimate how much
they eat. And she's like, everybody repeat it back to me,
and that stuck with me, you know, throughout my entire career,
which is, you know, over a decade plus. And it's true,
(16:35):
and we have the research to support it, and we've
certainly seen the clients in our clinic and they don't
People don't do it on purpose. We don't misreport on purpose.
We simply a lot of people simply don't understand or
appreciate the energy value of food. And I might say
to a client, well, you know, you went out to
dinner and you had a ball of pasta, like, you know,
how many calories do you think that is? And they'll
(16:55):
be like, oh, maybe six hundred, maybe seven hundred, And
that's a really good estimate from them, behalf. But they
just have no idea that that bowl of pass to
which they were thinking was maybe six seven hundred calories. Reality,
it was about one thousand to twelve hundred calories. So
that can be the difference of about four to five
hundred calories a day. That one meal is your calorie
(17:15):
deficit out the door for the day basically. And other
than that, like you've said, Susie, like we think we
move so much more than we do. And I have
a lot of clients that exercise every day. They might
go to some form of, you know, an exercise class
that's forty five minutes long, and I very much attended
gym that's like that as well. The classes are fifty minutes.
The first five to ten minutes of that is a
(17:36):
warm up, then we watch the instructors demonstrate all the
exercises front of the five minutes. Sometimes the classes are
only thirty two to thirty six minutes long, like the
actual workout itself. So that might be all well and good,
and you're doing a really intense work up for say
thirty six forty minutes, but if you then go to
work and sit on your butt for the next eight
nine hours of the day, you're simply not moving anywhere
(17:58):
near as much as what you need too. So I've
always when clients, you know, send me their food dios,
they send me the amount of activity. I tape it down,
you know what I think their requirements need to be
based on the fact that I know they're not moving
as much as what they think or people always give
the best case scenario. Like clients will say to me,
I exercise three maybe four times a week, and in
my head, I go, right, we're gonna budget too, because
(18:21):
three or four times a week now. And I don't
mean that disrespectfully. I mean that that's their best case scenario.
But often life happens and it doesn't come to fruition.
You know, they think in their head, I do three
to four times a week. The next week, they've come
down with the flu because their kids are sick, in
the whole household sick. The week after that, they've got
a bit of a niggly ankle or something, so they
like only went once this week. Then they had a
(18:41):
bit of a headache, they slept in and they only
went two or three times the next week. They're always
going to give us the best case scenario, and that's fine,
and as clinicians we know that and we'll always tape
it down for that. And same deal with their energy.
You know, they say, have had this and this. We
just forget what we take in through the day. We
forget the extra little bit of pinut butter we put
in our smoothie. We forget the couple of bytes of
the sandwich that our toddler leftover. We forget the extra few,
(19:05):
you know, spoonfuls of mashed potato that we went back for.
We forget the extra few bites of lasagna. As we
were wrapping up the leftovers, we had a few more
bites from the plate. We just forget about all of
these little things. We don't do it intentionally, but that's
the reality of what happens. And that's why so many
people struggle with losing weight, is because we're not as
active as what we think we are, and we take
(19:25):
in far more calories than we actually think we do
as well, and some of that is unintentional, and some
of that is just kind of forgotten about through a
busy work day as well. So I think it was
a good reminder. It certainly is a very very old study.
But you know, you and I have heard time and
time and time again, I don't eat anything. I only
eat twelve hundred calories, only a thousand calories. I've certainly
(19:46):
started clients on fourteen fifteen hundred calories, and they've dropped
two kilos that week, So we know that what most
people report that they're actually doing, despite feeling like they're
truly doing that, it isn't the reality in most cases.
And I think that's why working with really experienced clinicians.
If you're trying to get those results yourself and you
have been for well over six to twelve months and
(20:07):
you still can't get those results, something's not adding up.
You're not broken. It's generally not your metabolism. It's generally
not your genetics. Or I'm big boned, or I can't
lose weight, or you know, I'm going through menopause, whatever,
those You hear those excuses all the time. Ninety percent,
ninety five ninety nine percent of the time people can
lose weight. They're just not doing the right things, and
(20:28):
they're not doing the right things consistently over time to
actually get the results that they need.
Speaker 1 (20:34):
True. And you know, I think we really want to
stress we're not highlighting this to shame people or to
say that we're laughing at people. You know, we're human too.
We absolutely have plenty of extra calories that go in
and don't make it too many gym classes at times
as well, we're very aware of the pressures of our
listeners and are not judging. But what I wanted to
use it for was to say that is why sometimes
(20:55):
really checking in on the quality of your training can
be helpful, and just checking if your goal is lost,
just making sure you're doing that getting that higher intensity
heart rate workout and you may need to do a
shorter walk with the dog and then go and do
a fast walk yourself, for example, and mixing things up.
And the same with our food. I don't get clients
to do a food diet to shame them. I get
them to do a food direat to become more aware
(21:16):
of their behavior and where things don't go to plan.
You know, I had a client just today and she
is struggling with afternoon over eating. And here she is
beating herself up over you know, eating too much, when
really the issue was from my perspective, that she wasn't
eating enough in the first half of the day and
that was just a symptom of the problem. So it's
looking for ways to create a strong foundation for your
(21:36):
diet and one that's sustainable for you, rather than shaming
people that they ate, you know whatever, because we all
do it. It's just looking for ways to manage it
or change it if it's becoming an issue in terms
of the goals that you have for yourself. So yeah, unfortunately,
as humans, we all do less than we think and
eat more than we realize.
Speaker 2 (21:55):
Yeah, we like a check glass of wine and a
cheese plat that. So it's more about education.
Speaker 1 (22:00):
Oh, I'm just as guilty with the kids' food, and
you know, having strategies, you know, and that's why as scientists,
practitioners were actually live it and talk it every day.
So all right, well, I'll just do this segment, I think,
and then you can do the final one. Because I
found these fishes in the freezer section. Have you seen
them this week? The birds Eye air baked range.
Speaker 2 (22:19):
No, I haven't seen them? Are then you?
Speaker 1 (22:21):
Yeah, brand new? And I thought, oh, this is interesting
product because it comes up with fifty percent less oil
in big riding on the front, and it's got a
four star health rating, so we will give it our
health rating in a minute. I was quite interested because
I do use crumbfish with my own children. They love it,
and when it's half priced sale, I think the half
priced birds I feel its, which are fifty percent fish
not great, come in at like six dollars a box,
(22:43):
so really cost effective and much healthier than sort of takeaway.
And I'll give it to my boys at least once
a week with some of the air baked chips that
we like and some cut up tomatoes, and it's just
a really quick and easy meal that they like. And
they get a server fish, doesn't it sort of? You know,
it's easy to do when you get home late. I
usually do it after sport, but this was one that
I thought, oh, they're really highlighting the health benefits of
(23:04):
this product. Now it is more expensive. They usually retail
at twelve dollars sixty bucks, but they were on a
significant sale the week we've reviewed them at eight fifty,
so that would be the weekly oded I would stock
up because we like a budget friendly product. So there's
all different ones. There's Barra Mundy, there's flat Hair. There's
a few, but I've just picked flat Head today to
have a look at it. So you rightly and it
comes in and says it's fifty percent less oil, high
(23:25):
in protein, good source of amiga threes. So there's three
serves per pack, which is quite interesting because I think
usually it's four serves per pack, so the philets must
be reasonably small, about eighty grams they're coming in at each,
so I think really also land, you probably need two
packets to feed a family at least or even the children.
Per serve. It's just under one hundred and fifty calories
(23:48):
per piece. It says eighty three grams are two portions.
They're quite small pieces. Eleven grams of protein, which is
not overly high, to be honest, it is quite low
in fat, though it's not technically low fat. It's still
got four point three grams per hundred low fat is
less than three, but it's very low. Normally this kind
of product is at least twelve to fifteen percent fat,
I think, or maybe just on ten some of them.
(24:09):
But still this is about half as I've described fishing.
Grams of carbohydrate per serve, so about a slice of
bread perchuse slices two pieces. Two point seven grams of sugars.
I don't know where that's coming from. We'll have a look
at that in a sec. And then three seventy four
milligrams of sodium, so recently low actually for a processed
fish product. When we take a look at the ingredients.
(24:30):
It's fifty five percent fish, which is one of the highest.
The highest you'll get sixty five, I think sixty to
sixty five. So it's up there with a crumb coating,
wheat flour, wheat gluten, rice flour, salt, oat fiber, may starch, dextrose,
extra yeat, garlic powder. So that's the sugars, a little
bit of sugar, a little bit of onion powder. But
overall the ingredient list is pretty good. Three percent canola oil,
(24:52):
so all the seed oil purists will be up in arms,
But that's relatively low again for that product. You know,
I quite like it ly and I haven't tried them,
so to me, it is much lower in fat than
the typical crumbed or battered fish you can find. You know,
I think it's actually good. I'd give it a seven
out of ten. I thought that were quite nice. I
wouldn't pay full price for them. The issue is, I
(25:13):
think the servis look pretty small. I think for a
family you'd be looking at at least two boxes, maybe
even three, to be honest, But I guess in the
big scheme of things, that's still pretty cost effective for
a meal. Yeah, so it's middle ground. You don't get
that much more fish, but you do get a lot
more fat in that product compared to the normal bird's
eye crumbed and battered filets. What do you think I like.
Speaker 2 (25:33):
Them for smaller children. I would probably give them to
my kids. I wouldn't have them myself. The portion size
is too small and the protein is too low per serving.
It's eleven grams of protein that is not even going
to touch the sides of a hungry adult like that.
My husband probably three times that amount, which would just
blow out the calories. I could be way too way
too expensive. So I think that these are great for kids,
(25:55):
particularly kids that don't lack fish like I remember growing up,
like I wouldn't eat just fish, but I would always
eat crumbfish. So once or twice a week, we always
used to have crumbfish tacos growing up because Mum knew
that fish was really good for us. But you know,
we just wouldn't eat, say like grilled fish or something.
She'd always have to make it bad at or crumbed.
So I think for kids who you have a hard
time getting in some of those healthy fats like fish
and salmon, this can be a good idea, but I
(26:17):
don't think it's really a great option for adults. I
just think that I think most adults would need to
eat two portions of that, and then you know, we're
talking about what closer to three hundred calories for about
twenty grams of protein. There's therese far better ways to
get that in. Or if you did have something like that,
I'd be making that up with a salad with a
bit of feta and some chickpeas in there to really
boost the overall protein of that plate, because eleven grams
(26:38):
per meal is nowhere near enough protein for an adult,
particularly when your goal is weight loss. You want that
closer to thirty grams, and you know, for some males,
you know, forty grams. Even so, I just don't think
that's it's a great product for adults. I'd prefer my client,
if they didn't mind fish or salmon, to have an
actual fillet of fish or salmon not crumbed, or if
they wanted to actually just lightly crumb it themselves, rolled
(27:00):
in a bit egg wash, splits up some bread crumbs
and just dip it in and throlled into the air fryer.
You know, you can do that in less than, you know,
less than ten minutes, and it's just going to provide
you with a significantly higher amount of protein for probably
you know, slightly cheaper.
Speaker 1 (27:14):
Leanna couldn't have summarized it better myself. That's why they
pay you the megabucks these days. Because I agree, perfect
for children, not so great for adults. Yes, very good
cook that's.
Speaker 2 (27:24):
A question, interesting one, Susie. Mct oil Does it help
with weight loss? Gosh, I haven't heard about MCTA oil
for years now. Like it was also rage when that
bulletproof coffee, like people used to put it in black
coffee with butter.
Speaker 1 (27:39):
And oh god.
Speaker 2 (27:40):
Anyway, it is something that when I used to work
at the hospital, you know, up in the intensive care
you knowit, they did consider it and use it quite
a bit because it was really readily available and readily
absorbed by the body. And so it was something that
you know, in a clinical setting, particularly if you had
like a burns patient or somebody who was really critically unwell,
it could be used as a really good energy source.
(28:01):
But for the average you know, gen pop, the average
person like you and I and our listeners, would mct
oil be beneficial, and I was looking at some of
the research and it did surprise me a little bit
because mct oils are what we call medium chain fats.
Compared to other types of fats like olive oil, et cetera.
They're what we call long chain fats or long chain
(28:22):
triglystrites LCTs. So the mcts are shorter in length, and
that basically from a physiological perspective, is easier for the
body to digest and absorb, and so they're a quicker,
sort of better absorbed energy source, which is why they
can be good in a critically unwell person. But when
it comes to weight loss, I do know off the
top of my head that a lot of sort of
(28:43):
the research has been studied in terms of high fat,
low carved eyes or kithogenic dyes, that's where people use
mct oils a lot. But there have been some newer, smaller,
i will say, studies that do actually indicate that mcts
may contribute a mild to moderate weight loss improvement and
also body composition. So there was a meta analysis. There's
(29:05):
only a small one thirteen randomized control trials that found
that when you substituted a long chain treackless ride such
as olive oil with an MCT this did actually lead
to a total reduction in body weight, waste and hip
circumference and total body fat profile as well. So it
was about a sixteen week study. It involved overweight and
(29:25):
obese individuals and they basically, as part of a calorie
controlled diet, either consumed MCT oil or olive oil. And
the group that consumed MCT oil as part of that
weight loss program lost on average one point seven kilos
more than the group that consumed the olive oil, So
that I think was interesting, but it was a small study,
(29:45):
it was over a short period of time. I'm sure
that there were some factors that weren't sort of co
founded for as well. So there does appear to be
a little bit of research that it may be beneficial.
But hand on my heart, SUSI, I have never once
in my my entire career written MCT oil into a
client's meal plan. And you and I both worked with
clients who might want to lose anywhere between five kilos,
(30:08):
and we've had clients losing thirty plus kilos over a
year or two. So we work with clients who have
lost a significant amount of weight. And I don't know
about you, but I've never written MCT oil into a
meal plan. It's quite expensive, and I think that this
would be something that I would be doing far far,
far far down the track. It's never something that I
would really start off with because there is a huge
(30:30):
cost factor involved, and you also don't get the anti
inflammatory benefits, all the positive health benefits that you would
get from other types of heart healthy fats such as avocados,
such as salmons, such as extraversion olive oil. So the
body might be able to utilize it that little bit easier,
but we're not. Besides a basic energy source, we're not
getting any really like anti inflammatory benefits or antioxidant compounds
(30:53):
or anything like that like some of our other types
of healthy fats. Give us what's your take on this,
because I didn't really realize that there were some studies
out there but did show that it may assist with
weight loss. But again, I think there needs to be
a bit more research before I'd even really consider utilizing
it within clinical practice.
Speaker 1 (31:08):
One of your thoughts, Oh, I'm very much like you
because I was trained clinically at a tertiary pediatric hospital
and they only ever used it Piketo diets for the
kids ton ebilipsy. So I find it sort of comes
through the gym crowd sometimes, and as I say, yes,
there's a proportion of the fat that's metabolized through the
liver first, but it still has the other proportion of
fat that's not And I think, you know, when we're
(31:29):
modeling diets, I get the fat balance I'm looking for
from my nats and seas, from aity fish, from a
good quality oil like an extraversion olive oil or an
avocado oil. I don't need to use that. And I
actually haven't had a client who's keen on using it.
I find it's more that you know, prescriptive gym crowd
who gets their diet advice elsewhere. So you know, if
I had a client who wanted to use it, I'd
(31:49):
be like, okay, we just stick to a relative portion
of a servile to a day in general for fat balance.
But yeah, it hasn't really crossed my path. I certainly
don't think it's worth extra money. I don't think the
research strong enough when it comes to providing superior fat
loss results. You know, when it comes to fat loss,
it's about getting carbohydrate in the right proportion for activity
and achieving calorie deficit and just achieving the right fat balance.
(32:13):
So we had it come up as a question on Instagram,
and we do try and always answer those, so I
thought it was just an interesting thing to chat about.
But yeah, I wouldn't be spending money on it unless
you had a specific reason you wanted to, and then
I would say go back to that couple of servers
a day if you wanted it. But it functionally doesn't
have the nutrients that are a high antioxidant oil like
avocado or olive oil will have, and as such, it's
(32:35):
not something that's on my radar for adding positive nutrition
or positive nutrients into anyone's diet. All right, and well
that brings us to the end of the Nutrition Couch
for another week. Please tell your friends about us so
we can continue to grow and reach our five million
download target, and we have an upcoming retreat at the
end of March, which we still I think, have one
place to feel if anyone's keen, we can always squeeze
(32:58):
another person or two in. If you are keen to
really invigorate your health this year, it's in Lovely Kingscliff
and you'll have the weekend with Leanne and I to
talk all things health and nutrition and do all things
yoga and pilates and have a fabulous time away from
your family and have much needed break from cooking. So
think about that and we will see you, same time,
same place for our regular weekly episode.
Speaker 2 (33:19):
Drop and you get a one on one consult with
either Susie or myself as part of the weekend as well.
If that doesn't you know, entice you to come.
Speaker 1 (33:27):
If that's a big sales picture.
Speaker 2 (33:29):
If you want more information, admin at the nutritioncouch dot
com we can tell you some more retreat details and
we will catch you in next week's episode.
Speaker 1 (33:35):
Have a great week.
How often should you eat chicken, or fish or eggs?
Is eating chocolate every day too much? And how often
should you indulge in a glass of wine? On today's
episode of The Nutrition Couch, we take a closer look
at the most common foods we eat and the foods
that we crave and share how often you should or
should not be eating them. Hi, I'm Fussy Burrow and
(00:23):
I'm Liam Wood, and together we bring you The Nutrition Couch,
the weekly podcast that keeps you up to date on
everything you need to know in the world of nutrition,
as well as your own personal food counter. Today we
look at some research about how many calories we think
that we eat versus the actual number that we do.
We have a brand new fish option in the freezer
(00:44):
section to talk about, and our listener question is all
about MCT oil and whether it will help you to
lose weight. All Right, Leanne, I've got a quick fire
for you because this was an article that you sent
me and we liked the look of it. How often
do you eat.
Speaker 2 (01:00):
Cake on your birthday plus maybe once a month. I
wasn't expecting cake to come straight up put yourself with
bloody vegetables.
Speaker 1 (01:12):
Cake on your birthday. That's actually really funny.
Speaker 3 (01:14):
Okay, cheese, what about cheese once to day, once a day,
eggs a couple of times a week, red meat once
or twice a week.
Speaker 2 (01:27):
Hello, fish two three times a week, Chocolate a couple
of times a week, maybe once a day.
Speaker 1 (01:35):
Just think about.
Speaker 2 (01:37):
It's relative though, right, A couple of times a week, splash,
maybe a small portion every day if you really love it.
Speaker 1 (01:43):
Yeah, And I think what we're trying to talk about
here is I think sometimes it's good when you're looking
at overall diet quality to get an idea of how
to achieve the right balance. And I know something that
comes up all the time in nutrition circles is how
many eggs is okay to eat? And also things like
how often should you have red meat? And foods like that.
(02:03):
So I think the first thing that I wanted to
ask lean those questions because I would be surprised if
our answers as dieticians would be that different, because we
are looking at it from a calorie and macro nutrient
perspective and roughly know what the targets are, and then
when we work backwards what that looks like in food terms.
I have the cake on your birthday. I really like
(02:26):
that one, actually, but I would be answering very similar.
So we thought it was just a nice summary point,
particularly at the start of a year, for people to
do a little bit of a checklist, because sometimes we
sort of things slip in and you realize that you're
not having as much as you thought. So a classic
example is I'll have clients who'll be suddenly adding process
meat so turkey or ham to their sandwiches, and then
at some point I'll say it's not that high in protein,
(02:48):
and they're kind of shocked. So it's always good, I think,
just to have some rough references. So some of the
popular foods that come to mind from my perspective. With
the egg story, the old science we used to say
if you had high cholesterol, you should limit eggs. New
science shows us it's not about that. It's about overall
fat balance, and as such the recommendations are for people
without high cholesterol, a couple of eggs a day are fine.
(03:09):
If you do have high cholesterol, it's more a limited
about one per day is recommended. In the case of
red meat. Certainly, the Australian guidelines that have no more
than four hundred and fifty grams of lean red meat
a week. So again I would translate that into two
maybe three small serves of say one hundred hundred and
fifty grams cooks per week. And then when I work
(03:30):
backwards from their leanne if I'm looking at fish, well,
I absolutely want my clients to consume more fish. It's
low calorie, it's nutrient dents, or in the case of
the high fat Amega three rich fish like salmon, it's
incredibly nutrient dents. So I think the guidelines of twice
a week or a bit low. I prefer my clients
to have it three or four times, whether it's tinned,
cooked at night or in a salad at lunch. And
(03:51):
then chicken maybe once or twice, because red meat's offering
key nutrients versus chicken, which is a little bit lower.
And then I'm trying to get fish in there and
see our thinking. We're kind of going along and working
out what the numbers look like. I think a reference
of a serve of nuts or seeds a day is
also good. You know, nuts and seeds are very good
for us, but they are relatively high calorie, and I'll
(04:12):
have clients super loading their nuts and seeds, so they'll
have in a smoothie or a breakfast bowl chea plus
flax seed plus LSA plus some nuts, and then they
might repeat some nuts and seeds in the day and
it ends up being too much fat. So they're good
for you, but a serve of about thirty grams of
nuts and seeds per days more than enough. So that's
two small servings or one. You know, sprinkle, et cetera.
(04:33):
On cereal products with higher fat foods, things like cheese,
you know, it's nutrient dense, but it's just more a
calorie issue in terms of having too much. So I
usually say to client's cheese once a day. But there's
tricks with that, because of course we love cheese. You know,
you can use a really thin shaving or grating as
a seasoning without resorting to large slices, and then you
(04:54):
can sort of have it a couple of times. And
in the case of cheeses like cottage, well it's really
like cow you can sort of have as much as
you want. And then we get to our more indulgent foods.
The cake on your birthday, for example.
Speaker 2 (05:06):
I think I said like once a month as well,
didn't I?
Speaker 1 (05:09):
She thought about it. She doesn't love cake as much
as chocolate, so she's less.
Speaker 2 (05:12):
Now, yeah, I'm not a really cake person.
Speaker 1 (05:14):
I like cake, but I only like like a really
good cake, you know, And so rarely do you get
amazing cake. It's usually mass produced. So I'm like, if
you go to a beautiful bakery or like cafe and
they've got these amazing homemade cakes, go for it. But
in more cases than not, I find it's just mass
produced vegetable oil cake. It's not that great. But in
something like chocolate, you know, if you can control yourself
(05:36):
and have twenty grams a day, it's about one hundred
hundred and twenty cow you can probably fit that in
a balanced diet. But if you open the block of
cabrires and down the whole one seventy five grams remember
the good old days when they used to be two fifty,
you know, you probably better to have it once a
week in a larger serve, and then you know, rather
than know that you can't really control yourself. So it's
(05:56):
more about calorie balance and how often. And then with alcohol,
of course we do need to recommend that alcohol should
be consumed sparingly. We used to say two alcohol free
days each week. I think four is better. And you know,
if you can stick to that small one hundred meal
every day, sure, but in my experience most people do
not do that, so you're probably better to have it
just fewer times each week. If you do tend to
(06:18):
have a heavy pore with the wine, that alcohol is
a toxin. Really, we do need to say that the
less you have for your health long term, the better.
What are some other things we've missed?
Speaker 2 (06:27):
Oil?
Speaker 1 (06:28):
Yeah, oil oneil.
Speaker 2 (06:29):
And I should say or I should say mention that
when you're talking about the facts in particular, that's more
for somebody who's aiming to achieve a calorie deficit and
some fat loss, which is you know most of our
listeners as we've surveyed them, and you can definitely get
away with a bit more fats if your goal is
weight maintenance, like just maintaining or even trying to gain
some weight as well. But from a general health and
a gut health and even a hormone perspective, the big
(06:50):
one we haven't really mentioned is legumes or vegetarian meals.
Where you might not be vegetarian per se, but it
is super important to still be getting in some plant
based on options throughout the week. I Donocies is not
a huge fan of legumes, but I personally like my
clients eating them three to four times a week, and
even if that means that you're reducing the amount of
red meat. And I think that was why you were
a bit shocked with my red meat recommendation, because I
(07:12):
sort of don't do a lot of red meat for
my clients, but I do more legumes because they're still,
you know, not as high an iron, but you can
still get iron if you're smart about it, from other
sources through your diet as well. But I do like,
you know, a lot of legumes in my client's diet
from a gut health and a hormone perspective and just
a fiber perspective overall, because a lot of people do
struggle with just feeling really sluggish and constipated, particularly if
(07:34):
they're trying to achieve a calorie deficit because there's less
food and less volume going in over all. So me personally,
I like two to three vegetarian slash legume based meals
every single week. Greate, fiber, great protein, there's a bit
of iron there and you can even if you're not
a huge fan of legumes, you can reduce the amount
of red meat you're using, Like if you're making a
bowlin age, you can use half the red meat and
(07:55):
throw in a tin of you know, brown lentils, or
throw in a tin of red kiddi beans. You're making
like a chili dish shaw and some sort of mince
based dish as well, how do you have?
Speaker 1 (08:05):
That's a lot? Like I am not anti legume, can
I say? I love it? A marmae beans. I love
adding the crunchy faber beans to a salad like for
a crunch. I love the salt and vinega ones. And
I actually really quite like baked beans. But my tummy
is a bit sensitive, and I think that's why I
kind of too many, because it's a bit gassy. But
that's a lot of meals of legames. How do you
get that much in?
Speaker 2 (08:25):
Yeah? I use a lot of mince for my kids,
and maybe because they're a little like we don't eat
a lot of like, so I put it into the
mince yet or sometimes I'll just do say a like
a curry. Like a curry is a great option if
I'm using a bit of tofu plus some chickpeas or
plus some butter beans or something. Beans and legumes work
really well in those really flavorsome dishes like curries or
like a mince or something, because they don't have much
flavor themselves, right, And so if you're putting it with
(08:47):
a flavorsome meal like a curry or like a spaghetti bolonnaise,
you can absorb some of those you know, delicious flavors
around it.
Speaker 1 (08:54):
True, And I love the cannellini beans. They're probably one
of my favorite. And when it gets cooler, I always
do the beautiful beans to which I put on my Instagram.
But actually I've seen recipes where you can blitz those
up and make like a nice dip for them, you
know how. Sometimes we're seeing now in the dip section
they're blitzing kidney beans to make like the Mexican dips.
And if you're sensitive on the tummy, I find when
(09:14):
you blitz them they're much more gentle. And you can
do the same with a cannellini bean and some sort
of garlic olive oil and make a really nice dip
with them as well. So yeah, that's actually really good
ideas on how to incorporate those and just going back
to oil, I usually say one or two serves of
a good quality oil a day, whether it's as dressing
as cooking, because people sort of worry about that. I
(09:36):
think it's much more important to have more veggies, more
salad that taste good with a good quality oil than
be worried about a little bit of extra as long
as it's good quality. So yeah, I think they're the
main sort of foods like the other things. Like people
would say, what about lollies, Well I don't or soft
drink I don't think you should have it. Like they're
really occasional party foods. There's nothing nutrition sound in them.
I don't think there's a reference. I think it's the
(09:57):
less you kind of have them, the better in your
diet of processed sugar.
Speaker 2 (10:01):
Well, I've got one for you. What about coffee? Oh, coffee, Yes,
I said my second one.
Speaker 1 (10:06):
Yeah, the coffee if we're talking about barist of coffee
like shot. So that's about one hundred milligrams of caffeine.
The recommended upper intake I think is about three hundred
milligrams for caffeine, is that right, which is sort of
two or three coffees. But everyone's got different tolerance, you
know what I mean. I think if it doesn't negatively
affect you, you sleep well, it doesn't impact you.
Speaker 2 (10:27):
You know.
Speaker 1 (10:27):
I think two maybe three a day really, But if
someone was you know, had an extra piccolo and they
tolerated it, it's not the end of the world. My
issue with coffee is the milk because it just adds
a lot of extra calories and sugars if you're constantly
having lattes or flat white. So keep that in mind too.
You know, sometimes you better should do a three quarter
or piccolo and still have the taste of the coffee
(10:47):
rather than just getting all the extra milk. More to
the point, but if you just drink like coffee, I
would say three four per day, like not Shoe and
Shoe probably if it was an instant though, because it's.
Speaker 2 (10:56):
Not that cafe. Yeah, yeah, true, like those ans cafeas
a lot of people use them, yes, but.
Speaker 1 (11:02):
They've got quite lots of sugars in them though. Hey
they're so ultra processed.
Speaker 2 (11:05):
I think some of them yeah yeah, yeah, it again,
it depends on how many you have.
Speaker 1 (11:10):
Yeah, So I think with coffee, you know, it's more
as long as it's not negatively affecting you, and if
you just be mindful of how much milk that you're
having each day, because yeah, milk is important as a nutrient,
offering protein, calcium, magnesium, but certainly dairy milks and even
a lot of the plant based milks oat, so they
do have a calorie load you have to be careful
of and if you sort of sip on coffee over
(11:30):
several hours. So that's the story for another day. But
I think hopefully that gives you a little bit of
a ready reckoner about categorizing food. And I think for
me and it's well one, it's relevant for treats, isn't it,
because we all have too many, But in terms of
getting your protein balance right at night and really lightening
it up the portions of red meat and having more
fish and having more even one or two plant based
(11:51):
meals each week will go a long way and improving
your nutrition. We've got more and more evidence showing that.
So there's some positive steps to take in the start
of a brand new year. And cake on your birthday.
I love that, So come back to that if you're
in doubt. But I was just cruising through Instagram as
we do, and I read a really interesting rehash of
(12:14):
a very old study. Actually I think the study goes
back to nineteen ninety, but it just reminded me of
so many things that pop up with clients. So it
was from Lane Norton, who I think sef physiologists, very
well known on Instagram, puts a lot of really interesting
stuff about performance. And it was a study just reporting
some old data, a study of OBEs, people who claim
(12:35):
they ate twelve hundred calories per day and could not
lose weight. And what happened was the researchers then tracked
their food intake and activity very closely, and the data
found that the subjects underestimated calorie intake by fifty three
percent an overestimated activity by forty seven percent. And I
thought this was relevant because not any targeting people in
(12:59):
their way. This is the case with all human beings.
We underestimate how much we eat and we overestimate how
much we do and there's several reasons for that. So
one of the key reasons is that calorie intake monitoring
is extremely inaccurate. So if you're putting your food into
my fitness power and estimating portions, amounts, and even the
(13:20):
raw data itself there's a significant error margin. So not
only will you probably be getting wrong how much you
actually had, but even the original data will be a
little bit out because food changes, it's not overly accurate.
So straight away you've got to have always a buffer
of one hundred or two hundred calories from what you
think that you're eating. Some days it might be a thousand,
and you think it's twelve hundred, and some days it
(13:41):
might be fourteen hundred, and you think like there's a
real error margin. But the other thing I find even
more than that land. I find that we get really
inaccurate data and how much we do. And I think
the reason for that is psychologically, when we think we're
putting a lot of effort or we think something's hard, god,
we naturally equate it to say a lot of calories.
(14:03):
So classic example is that we'll have reports of I've
gone for a walk. Now most if you are walking
five kilometers an hour, Now, that is fast, Like if
you get on the treadmill and plug it at five
k an hour, I would argue very few people could
maintain that pace. Like I'm a walker, I'm a walker
(14:24):
from way back. I could barely do that without sort
of really having to put my back into it, you
know what I mean. Like that is a really quick pace. Now,
even if you're walking for an hour at five k's
an hour, you'd be lucky to burn four hundred calories. Lucky,
lucky because we grossly overestimate the effort. Because the human
(14:44):
body is very efficient when it comes to calorie burning.
And let's be honest, when things hurt and really push us,
we don't like it very much. So we always tend
to hold back a little bit, or go for a
walk one we say we go for a walk, but
we actually do it once a week. Or we will
go for a walk and we go with a friend
who's slower than us, or we go with the dog.
A dog walk is not exercise. I have a dog now,
I can talk on behalf of dog owners everywhere. Trust me,
(15:07):
it's not they stop and start all the time, you know,
like unless you've got like a full on dog who
runs for the hour. Like so all those things mean
that unfortunately we just don't burn as many as we think.
But then we put it into the calorie monitoring apps
and it adjusts for the calorie like, it's all those
things going on. So we're not talking about this today
to shame anyone. You know, the goal of the nutrition
(15:30):
Couch is to be a useful resource, but it's just
a bit of a funny reminder that as human beings,
we will always overestimate how much we've done and underestimate
how much we eat. And that may be way even
though you think you're doing a lot or think that
you're eating for fat loss, you're not quite getting there.
And that's okay, but just understanding that that is very common.
And as we could see from that data.
Speaker 2 (15:51):
Yeah, and that's really interesting because when you sent me
that study, I've seen this way back when, and it
actually takes me back to I think the first day
of my master is a dietetic somewhere. We're sitting in
the big to theater and the I can't remember what
teacher or what lecture it was, and they stood up
the front and they were like, welcome to your you know,
Masters of dietetics. The first thing I'm going to say,
and this will stick with you for your entire career,
and she goes, do not try to change your family
(16:14):
and friends. That is number one and she goes the
second most important point that will stay with you for
the rest of your career is that your clients will
always overestimate how much they move and underestimate how much
they eat. And she's like, everybody repeat it back to me,
and that stuck with me, you know, throughout my entire career,
which is, you know, over a decade plus. And it's true,
(16:35):
and we have the research to support it, and we've
certainly seen the clients in our clinic and they don't
People don't do it on purpose. We don't misreport on purpose.
We simply a lot of people simply don't understand or
appreciate the energy value of food. And I might say
to a client, well, you know, you went out to
dinner and you had a ball of pasta, like, you know,
how many calories do you think that is? And they'll
(16:55):
be like, oh, maybe six hundred, maybe seven hundred, And
that's a really good estimate from them, behalf. But they
just have no idea that that bowl of pass to
which they were thinking was maybe six seven hundred calories. Reality,
it was about one thousand to twelve hundred calories. So
that can be the difference of about four to five
hundred calories a day. That one meal is your calorie
(17:15):
deficit out the door for the day basically. And other
than that, like you've said, Susie, like we think we
move so much more than we do. And I have
a lot of clients that exercise every day. They might
go to some form of, you know, an exercise class
that's forty five minutes long, and I very much attended
gym that's like that as well. The classes are fifty minutes.
The first five to ten minutes of that is a
(17:36):
warm up, then we watch the instructors demonstrate all the
exercises front of the five minutes. Sometimes the classes are
only thirty two to thirty six minutes long, like the
actual workout itself. So that might be all well and good,
and you're doing a really intense work up for say
thirty six forty minutes, but if you then go to
work and sit on your butt for the next eight
nine hours of the day, you're simply not moving anywhere
(17:58):
near as much as what you need too. So I've
always when clients, you know, send me their food dios,
they send me the amount of activity. I tape it down,
you know what I think their requirements need to be
based on the fact that I know they're not moving
as much as what they think or people always give
the best case scenario. Like clients will say to me,
I exercise three maybe four times a week, and in
my head, I go, right, we're gonna budget too, because
(18:21):
three or four times a week now. And I don't
mean that disrespectfully. I mean that that's their best case scenario.
But often life happens and it doesn't come to fruition.
You know, they think in their head, I do three
to four times a week. The next week, they've come
down with the flu because their kids are sick, in
the whole household sick. The week after that, they've got
a bit of a niggly ankle or something, so they
like only went once this week. Then they had a
(18:41):
bit of a headache, they slept in and they only
went two or three times the next week. They're always
going to give us the best case scenario, and that's fine,
and as clinicians we know that and we'll always tape
it down for that. And same deal with their energy.
You know, they say, have had this and this. We
just forget what we take in through the day. We
forget the extra little bit of pinut butter we put
in our smoothie. We forget the couple of bytes of
the sandwich that our toddler leftover. We forget the extra few,
(19:05):
you know, spoonfuls of mashed potato that we went back for.
We forget the extra few bites of lasagna. As we
were wrapping up the leftovers, we had a few more
bites from the plate. We just forget about all of
these little things. We don't do it intentionally, but that's
the reality of what happens. And that's why so many
people struggle with losing weight, is because we're not as
active as what we think we are, and we take
(19:25):
in far more calories than we actually think we do
as well, and some of that is unintentional, and some
of that is just kind of forgotten about through a
busy work day as well. So I think it was
a good reminder. It certainly is a very very old study.
But you know, you and I have heard time and
time and time again, I don't eat anything. I only
eat twelve hundred calories, only a thousand calories. I've certainly
(19:46):
started clients on fourteen fifteen hundred calories, and they've dropped
two kilos that week, So we know that what most
people report that they're actually doing, despite feeling like they're
truly doing that, it isn't the reality in most cases.
And I think that's why working with really experienced clinicians.
If you're trying to get those results yourself and you
have been for well over six to twelve months and
(20:07):
you still can't get those results, something's not adding up.
You're not broken. It's generally not your metabolism. It's generally
not your genetics. Or I'm big boned, or I can't
lose weight, or you know, I'm going through menopause, whatever,
those You hear those excuses all the time. Ninety percent,
ninety five ninety nine percent of the time people can
lose weight. They're just not doing the right things, and
(20:28):
they're not doing the right things consistently over time to
actually get the results that they need.
Speaker 1 (20:34):
True. And you know, I think we really want to
stress we're not highlighting this to shame people or to
say that we're laughing at people. You know, we're human too.
We absolutely have plenty of extra calories that go in
and don't make it too many gym classes at times
as well, we're very aware of the pressures of our
listeners and are not judging. But what I wanted to
use it for was to say that is why sometimes
(20:55):
really checking in on the quality of your training can
be helpful, and just checking if your goal is lost,
just making sure you're doing that getting that higher intensity
heart rate workout and you may need to do a
shorter walk with the dog and then go and do
a fast walk yourself, for example, and mixing things up.
And the same with our food. I don't get clients
to do a food diet to shame them. I get
them to do a food direat to become more aware
(21:16):
of their behavior and where things don't go to plan.
You know, I had a client just today and she
is struggling with afternoon over eating. And here she is
beating herself up over you know, eating too much, when
really the issue was from my perspective, that she wasn't
eating enough in the first half of the day and
that was just a symptom of the problem. So it's
looking for ways to create a strong foundation for your
(21:36):
diet and one that's sustainable for you, rather than shaming
people that they ate, you know whatever, because we all
do it. It's just looking for ways to manage it
or change it if it's becoming an issue in terms
of the goals that you have for yourself. So yeah, unfortunately,
as humans, we all do less than we think and
eat more than we realize.
Speaker 2 (21:55):
Yeah, we like a check glass of wine and a
cheese plat that. So it's more about education.
Speaker 1 (22:00):
Oh, I'm just as guilty with the kids' food, and
you know, having strategies, you know, and that's why as scientists,
practitioners were actually live it and talk it every day.
So all right, well, I'll just do this segment, I think,
and then you can do the final one. Because I
found these fishes in the freezer section. Have you seen
them this week? The birds Eye air baked range.
Speaker 2 (22:19):
No, I haven't seen them? Are then you?
Speaker 1 (22:21):
Yeah, brand new? And I thought, oh, this is interesting
product because it comes up with fifty percent less oil
in big riding on the front, and it's got a
four star health rating, so we will give it our
health rating in a minute. I was quite interested because
I do use crumbfish with my own children. They love it,
and when it's half priced sale, I think the half
priced birds I feel its, which are fifty percent fish
not great, come in at like six dollars a box,
(22:43):
so really cost effective and much healthier than sort of takeaway.
And I'll give it to my boys at least once
a week with some of the air baked chips that
we like and some cut up tomatoes, and it's just
a really quick and easy meal that they like. And
they get a server fish, doesn't it sort of? You know,
it's easy to do when you get home late. I
usually do it after sport, but this was one that
I thought, oh, they're really highlighting the health benefits of
(23:04):
this product. Now it is more expensive. They usually retail
at twelve dollars sixty bucks, but they were on a
significant sale the week we've reviewed them at eight fifty,
so that would be the weekly oded I would stock
up because we like a budget friendly product. So there's
all different ones. There's Barra Mundy, there's flat Hair. There's
a few, but I've just picked flat Head today to
have a look at it. So you rightly and it
comes in and says it's fifty percent less oil, high
(23:25):
in protein, good source of amiga threes. So there's three
serves per pack, which is quite interesting because I think
usually it's four serves per pack, so the philets must
be reasonably small, about eighty grams they're coming in at each,
so I think really also land, you probably need two
packets to feed a family at least or even the children.
Per serve. It's just under one hundred and fifty calories
(23:48):
per piece. It says eighty three grams are two portions.
They're quite small pieces. Eleven grams of protein, which is
not overly high, to be honest, it is quite low
in fat, though it's not technically low fat. It's still
got four point three grams per hundred low fat is
less than three, but it's very low. Normally this kind
of product is at least twelve to fifteen percent fat,
I think, or maybe just on ten some of them.
(24:09):
But still this is about half as I've described fishing.
Grams of carbohydrate per serve, so about a slice of
bread perchuse slices two pieces. Two point seven grams of sugars.
I don't know where that's coming from. We'll have a look
at that in a sec. And then three seventy four
milligrams of sodium, so recently low actually for a processed
fish product. When we take a look at the ingredients.
(24:30):
It's fifty five percent fish, which is one of the highest.
The highest you'll get sixty five, I think sixty to
sixty five. So it's up there with a crumb coating,
wheat flour, wheat gluten, rice flour, salt, oat fiber, may starch, dextrose,
extra yeat, garlic powder. So that's the sugars, a little
bit of sugar, a little bit of onion powder. But
overall the ingredient list is pretty good. Three percent canola oil,
(24:52):
so all the seed oil purists will be up in arms,
But that's relatively low again for that product. You know,
I quite like it ly and I haven't tried them,
so to me, it is much lower in fat than
the typical crumbed or battered fish you can find. You know,
I think it's actually good. I'd give it a seven
out of ten. I thought that were quite nice. I
wouldn't pay full price for them. The issue is, I
(25:13):
think the servis look pretty small. I think for a
family you'd be looking at at least two boxes, maybe
even three, to be honest, But I guess in the
big scheme of things, that's still pretty cost effective for
a meal. Yeah, so it's middle ground. You don't get
that much more fish, but you do get a lot
more fat in that product compared to the normal bird's
eye crumbed and battered filets. What do you think I like.
Speaker 2 (25:33):
Them for smaller children. I would probably give them to
my kids. I wouldn't have them myself. The portion size
is too small and the protein is too low per serving.
It's eleven grams of protein that is not even going
to touch the sides of a hungry adult like that.
My husband probably three times that amount, which would just
blow out the calories. I could be way too way
too expensive. So I think that these are great for kids,
(25:55):
particularly kids that don't lack fish like I remember growing up,
like I wouldn't eat just fish, but I would always
eat crumbfish. So once or twice a week, we always
used to have crumbfish tacos growing up because Mum knew
that fish was really good for us. But you know,
we just wouldn't eat, say like grilled fish or something.
She'd always have to make it bad at or crumbed.
So I think for kids who you have a hard
time getting in some of those healthy fats like fish
and salmon, this can be a good idea, but I
(26:17):
don't think it's really a great option for adults. I
just think that I think most adults would need to
eat two portions of that, and then you know, we're
talking about what closer to three hundred calories for about
twenty grams of protein. There's therese far better ways to
get that in. Or if you did have something like that,
I'd be making that up with a salad with a
bit of feta and some chickpeas in there to really
boost the overall protein of that plate, because eleven grams
(26:38):
per meal is nowhere near enough protein for an adult,
particularly when your goal is weight loss. You want that
closer to thirty grams, and you know, for some males,
you know, forty grams. Even so, I just don't think
that's it's a great product for adults. I'd prefer my client,
if they didn't mind fish or salmon, to have an
actual fillet of fish or salmon not crumbed, or if
they wanted to actually just lightly crumb it themselves, rolled
(27:00):
in a bit egg wash, splits up some bread crumbs
and just dip it in and throlled into the air fryer.
You know, you can do that in less than, you know,
less than ten minutes, and it's just going to provide
you with a significantly higher amount of protein for probably
you know, slightly cheaper.
Speaker 1 (27:14):
Leanna couldn't have summarized it better myself. That's why they
pay you the megabucks these days. Because I agree, perfect
for children, not so great for adults. Yes, very good
cook that's.
Speaker 2 (27:24):
A question, interesting one, Susie. Mct oil Does it help
with weight loss? Gosh, I haven't heard about MCTA oil
for years now. Like it was also rage when that
bulletproof coffee, like people used to put it in black
coffee with butter.
Speaker 1 (27:39):
And oh god.
Speaker 2 (27:40):
Anyway, it is something that when I used to work
at the hospital, you know, up in the intensive care
you knowit, they did consider it and use it quite
a bit because it was really readily available and readily
absorbed by the body. And so it was something that
you know, in a clinical setting, particularly if you had
like a burns patient or somebody who was really critically unwell,
it could be used as a really good energy source.
(28:01):
But for the average you know, gen pop, the average
person like you and I and our listeners, would mct
oil be beneficial, and I was looking at some of
the research and it did surprise me a little bit
because mct oils are what we call medium chain fats.
Compared to other types of fats like olive oil, et cetera.
They're what we call long chain fats or long chain
(28:22):
triglystrites LCTs. So the mcts are shorter in length, and
that basically from a physiological perspective, is easier for the
body to digest and absorb, and so they're a quicker,
sort of better absorbed energy source, which is why they
can be good in a critically unwell person. But when
it comes to weight loss, I do know off the
top of my head that a lot of sort of
(28:43):
the research has been studied in terms of high fat,
low carved eyes or kithogenic dyes, that's where people use
mct oils a lot. But there have been some newer, smaller,
i will say, studies that do actually indicate that mcts
may contribute a mild to moderate weight loss improvement and
also body composition. So there was a meta analysis. There's
(29:05):
only a small one thirteen randomized control trials that found
that when you substituted a long chain treackless ride such
as olive oil with an MCT this did actually lead
to a total reduction in body weight, waste and hip
circumference and total body fat profile as well. So it
was about a sixteen week study. It involved overweight and
(29:25):
obese individuals and they basically, as part of a calorie
controlled diet, either consumed MCT oil or olive oil. And
the group that consumed MCT oil as part of that
weight loss program lost on average one point seven kilos
more than the group that consumed the olive oil, So
that I think was interesting, but it was a small study,
(29:45):
it was over a short period of time. I'm sure
that there were some factors that weren't sort of co
founded for as well. So there does appear to be
a little bit of research that it may be beneficial.
But hand on my heart, SUSI, I have never once
in my my entire career written MCT oil into a
client's meal plan. And you and I both worked with
clients who might want to lose anywhere between five kilos,
(30:08):
and we've had clients losing thirty plus kilos over a
year or two. So we work with clients who have
lost a significant amount of weight. And I don't know
about you, but I've never written MCT oil into a
meal plan. It's quite expensive, and I think that this
would be something that I would be doing far far,
far far down the track. It's never something that I
would really start off with because there is a huge
(30:30):
cost factor involved, and you also don't get the anti
inflammatory benefits, all the positive health benefits that you would
get from other types of heart healthy fats such as avocados,
such as salmons, such as extraversion olive oil. So the
body might be able to utilize it that little bit easier,
but we're not. Besides a basic energy source, we're not
getting any really like anti inflammatory benefits or antioxidant compounds
(30:53):
or anything like that like some of our other types
of healthy fats. Give us what's your take on this,
because I didn't really realize that there were some studies
out there but did show that it may assist with
weight loss. But again, I think there needs to be
a bit more research before I'd even really consider utilizing
it within clinical practice.
Speaker 1 (31:08):
One of your thoughts, Oh, I'm very much like you
because I was trained clinically at a tertiary pediatric hospital
and they only ever used it Piketo diets for the
kids ton ebilipsy. So I find it sort of comes
through the gym crowd sometimes, and as I say, yes,
there's a proportion of the fat that's metabolized through the
liver first, but it still has the other proportion of
fat that's not And I think, you know, when we're
(31:29):
modeling diets, I get the fat balance I'm looking for
from my nats and seas, from aity fish, from a
good quality oil like an extraversion olive oil or an
avocado oil. I don't need to use that. And I
actually haven't had a client who's keen on using it.
I find it's more that you know, prescriptive gym crowd
who gets their diet advice elsewhere. So you know, if
I had a client who wanted to use it, I'd
(31:49):
be like, okay, we just stick to a relative portion
of a servile to a day in general for fat balance.
But yeah, it hasn't really crossed my path. I certainly
don't think it's worth extra money. I don't think the
research strong enough when it comes to providing superior fat
loss results. You know, when it comes to fat loss,
it's about getting carbohydrate in the right proportion for activity
and achieving calorie deficit and just achieving the right fat balance.
(32:13):
So we had it come up as a question on Instagram,
and we do try and always answer those, so I
thought it was just an interesting thing to chat about.
But yeah, I wouldn't be spending money on it unless
you had a specific reason you wanted to, and then
I would say go back to that couple of servers
a day if you wanted it. But it functionally doesn't
have the nutrients that are a high antioxidant oil like
avocado or olive oil will have, and as such, it's
(32:35):
not something that's on my radar for adding positive nutrition
or positive nutrients into anyone's diet. All right, and well
that brings us to the end of the Nutrition Couch
for another week. Please tell your friends about us so
we can continue to grow and reach our five million
download target, and we have an upcoming retreat at the
end of March, which we still I think, have one
place to feel if anyone's keen, we can always squeeze
(32:58):
another person or two in. If you are keen to
really invigorate your health this year, it's in Lovely Kingscliff
and you'll have the weekend with Leanne and I to
talk all things health and nutrition and do all things
yoga and pilates and have a fabulous time away from
your family and have much needed break from cooking. So
think about that and we will see you, same time,
same place for our regular weekly episode.
Speaker 2 (33:19):
Drop and you get a one on one consult with
either Susie or myself as part of the weekend as well.
If that doesn't you know, entice you to come.
Speaker 1 (33:27):
If that's a big sales picture.
Speaker 2 (33:29):
If you want more information, admin at the nutritioncouch dot
com we can tell you some more retreat details and
we will catch you in next week's episode.
Speaker 1 (33:35):
Have a great week.
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