October 24, 2025 • 23 mins
We explore burnout and boundaries in birth work with candor and care, from compassion fatigue to practical systems that protect energy and improve outcomes. We share tools for communication, caseload limits, backup plans, debriefing, rest, and reconnecting with joy.
• symptoms of burnout in doulas and caregivers
• compassion fatigue and emotional load
• on-call life, identity and fear of letting clients down
• culture of hustle versus balance
• communication windows and phone settings
• client caps and counting collateral time
• backup systems and shift handoffs
• planned recovery days and true time off
• not inheriting client challenges
• debriefing, mentorship and peer support
• continuing education as renewed purpose
• transition rituals and non-work hobbies
• choosing one boundary to start this week
• modeling self-care for clients and family
Reach out and make a human connection today—text or call a friend, meet for a walk, or lunch. Choose one boundary this week and honor it.
Visit our website, here: https://birthlearning.com/
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Show Credits
Host: Angie Rosier
Music: Michael Hicks
Photographer: Toni Walker
Episode Artwork: Nick Greenwood
Producer: Gillian Rosier Frampton
Voiceover: Ryan Parker
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
SPEAKER_01 (00:10):
Welcome to the Ordinary Doula Podcast with
Angie Roger, hosted by BirthLearning, where we help prepare
folks for labor and birth withexpertise coming from 20 years
of experience in a busy Doulapractice, helping thousands of
people prepare for labor,providing essential knowledge
and tools for positive andempowering birth experiences.
SPEAKER_00 (00:58):
That's kind of been my what my career has been
centered around for the last 20some odd years.
And I love it.
I love every aspect about thiswork.
And today's episode is kind oftimely because I do love this
work, but today's episode, we'retalking about burnout.
This is something that manybirth workers may experience.
(01:21):
I'm actually getting readytomorrow to teach a postpartum
doula training.
I've got an all day ahead of metomorrow doing that.
And as I've been preparing forthat, I honestly had a little
pep talk with myself.
I'm like, all right, Angie, yougot to pull it together and put
a positive spin on this work.
Um, because you're, you know, wewant to leave with enthusiasm
(01:43):
and a fire and passion to dothis work because I wasn't
feeling it sometimes this week.
Honestly.
So this episode is timely forme.
Um, so those of you who aredoulas, maybe you can relate.
Those of you who use doulas,maybe you can empathize and kind
of treat your doula withkindness and compassion because
this can be hard work sometimes.
I just finished um two crazywork weeks.
(02:07):
Everything came all at once withbirths and tons of lactation
visits and a good deal ofovernights.
I honestly did an 85-hour workweek and a 91-hour work week.
Um, some of that work wassleeping, you know, for sure.
But um, and miraculously Ididn't miss anything as far as I
had some big family events inthere as well, and was able to
(02:28):
um go to everything, butprobably wasn't my very best two
weeks of life for sure.
Um, sometimes the work gets likethat.
I sure hope not often.
Um, but sometimes doulas work 10hours a week, sometimes they
work five, sometimes they work95, um, just depending on what
the week looks like.
So this episode talking aboutboundaries and burnout.
(02:49):
Um uh I just want to likerecognize that that can be real.
Um, most doulas I knowabsolutely love this work.
You have to have a passion forthis work.
It's not for everyone, it's notfor the faint of heart or mind
or body.
It's uh it can be actuallyreally hard work, although it's
incredibly rewarding as well.
Um, and there's something calledcompassion fatigue when you are
(03:11):
showing compassion so much andgiving of yourself and um caring
for others.
Like doulas are caregivers,whether it's a postpartum doula,
birth doula, lactationconsultant, they listen
compassionately, they care, theykind of carry that with them.
But you have to have a full cupto be able to pour from that
cup.
(03:32):
So boundaries are incrediblyimportant, they're not barriers,
they're kind of a greatstructure that allows birth
workers to do this work and doit sustainably, do a high
quality of work.
So compassion fatigue is real.
Um, and and honestly, I can sayI really do love, love, love and
give my all to every singleclient, but it does wear on me.
(03:55):
And and doing that constantly umcan be pretty challenging when
you're a caregiver all of thetime.
There can be an emotionalexhaustion, um, and there can be
a physical exhaustion afterintense births or you know,
several overnights or something.
Um, sometimes you kind of feelkind of irritable.
And I would say that most of thetime, in my case, like um I get
(04:16):
pretty, what's the word?
Like tender.
If I've had a um a long birth ora hard birth or lost some sleep,
I'm pretty weepy actually.
Not like crying, but prettyweepy.
I actually met up with my kidsum this week.
We had some family in town, andI finished a birth I'd been at
most of the night, and I gotrelieved uh kind of midday in
just enough time to meet myfamily.
(04:39):
We went um downtown and had afun event.
So I met up with my kids andsome other relatives and joined
them for some activity.
So I was kind of tired, butdoing okay.
But everything just made meweep, and my kids were just kind
of making fun of me that I wascrying at everything, and I do
get pretty weepy, and that umand sometimes sometimes people
get irritable.
I might get pretty irritable,but I just slow down.
(05:01):
I kind of just do a real slowingof my thinking and my moving.
Um, and sometimes we don't havetime to slow down, which can be
can be challenging.
Sometimes that can wear on yourpassion of the work.
Um, and a lot of people feelcalled to do this work.
Like it's this is this is aninteresting role of work because
it's not just like, hey, I'm agood uh, you know, good project
(05:24):
manager, I'm a good engineer orsomething else, but we wrap this
up in our identity a lot becausepeople do this love it so
incredibly much.
Um and then sometimes there'sbody breakdown, right?
Like sleep disruption is a truething.
And that honestly, as I'mgetting older, makes me pretty
nervous.
I'm pretty um cautious about thesleep that I can get.
(05:45):
People get headaches or immunesystems are challenged.
Um, so doas need to take very,very good care of themselves
because sometimes they can't.
So all the other times when it'san option, they need to be
really good about their sleep,um, nutrition, hydration,
exercise, take care of yourselfso that you are there to take
care of others.
So having these challengesdoesn't mean you're not cut out
(06:06):
for this work.
It just means that you'renormal, that you're human, and
that you need to put someboundaries in place so that you
can continue to do this work.
A lot of birth workers, I think,struggle with boundaries because
your identity is so wrapped upin helping each other's and
being available.
Like this is a very strange lineof work in that you have to be
available 100% of the time,depending on how you structure
your um practice or yourpartnership or your um backup
(06:29):
system.
Um, sometimes you are available24.
I've basically been on call 24-7for 23 years.
Um, a couple breaks here andthere when I'm really truly like
gone and out of town, but reallylike have to be available.
Um, and there's a fear too ofletting people down.
Your professional reputationoftentimes is tied to your
(06:50):
services, of course.
And you want to keep that a goodprofessional reputation, so not
to let anybody down, but providehigh quality service for
everyone.
Um, and and sometimes too, Ithink we're afraid of taking
breaks because um, like yourincome is tied to this, right?
And so honestly, for somepeople, like, yeah, I want I
want all the clients I can get.
(07:10):
That's all the money I can get.
But does that you know add up toquality work?
So that might be a personalboundary that you set in place
for yourself.
And then in our in our culture,a lot of times, our broader
culture, there's not a lot ofrespect for downtime.
Like um, our culture aroundworking hard and and and going
(07:31):
100 miles an hour, like people,it's kind of messed up, but we
really respect that.
It's a little bit backwards, butbalance should be something that
we respect more and strivebetter for.
So uh don't be trying to be asuperhuman.
You're not just try to be a kindand honest human and a real
human and set yourself up tosucceed within those, within
(07:51):
those realms.
So practicing boundaries willprotect you.
They'll give you a higherquality product, which is you um
set certain hours or days um forcommunication that's not birth
related, right?
Like um, that's not like, hey,I'm in labor right now.
But if you need to, you know,redo interviews or consults or
(08:13):
something like you can setcertain times for that, set
boundaries for that.
Um, and have time expectationsfor you, for your client.
So, you know, I'll respond toemails or inquiries that aren't
urgent about imminent laborwithin 12 hours or 24 hours or
something.
And maybe you treat day andnighttime on call a little bit
differently.
(08:34):
Um, maybe your phone is at adifferent setting for for
clients and you can silence itfor other things during the
night.
I know a lot of times I'm justdrifting off to sleep when um I
get some weird, strange latenight text.
I am not, you know, unaccustomedto late night texts for sure.
And I have, you know, my phoneis set to wake me up during the
night.
But um, gosh, if it was one thatwoke me up and I didn't need to
(08:56):
be, then that can be kind offrustrating.
So set some some boundariesaround those kind of things.
And then as far as schedulinggoes, set a maximum number of
clients per month and bereasonable about it and realize
that each client comes with acertain number of appointments
as well, right?
It's not just a one birth you'regoing to.
It might be one birth, oneconsult, two postpartums, or two
(09:19):
prenatals and several phonecalls and texts as well.
Like it a client comes with awhole lot more um collateral
than just their birth, ofcourse.
And then creating a clear backupsystem for yourself is so vital.
Um, I realized that when I waspregnant with my last baby who's
almost 12, and I'd been doingsolo doula work pretty dang busy
(09:42):
for years, years, years.
And when I was pregnant, Ireached out for help and I said,
you know what, I could do 12hours.
Can you come in and back me upafter 12 hours?
And um I found a good doulacolleague that did that, and we
kind of morphed into apartnership after that, a really
great backup system where wenever are gone more than 12
hours now, and that's incrediblysustainable.
Sometimes we make it shorterthan that, depending on the
(10:05):
timing of things.
And then plan days of rest umafter births or plan weeks of
rest sometimes, as far as likeI'm gonna block out certain
weeks where I won't have clientsand don't do work.
Now I am terrible at this.
Terrible, terrible, terrible.
I am need to take my own advicehere, but um, because of the
nature of the work I do, I havelots of different types of jobs
(10:28):
and um I work so many days.
Like what I'm realizing in mywork is I need to take days off.
Like, honestly, take days off.
You it's kind of crazy how manydays in a month I work.
Um, and maybe it's just onelactation appointment or one
overnight or um one prenatal orsomething, but it's super
awesome to have a day or days.
Um, I get really envious ofpeople who work a nine to five
(10:50):
Monday through Friday.
I'm like, wow, you have twodays, you don't have to ever
work.
Um, and sometimes as with thisbirth work, it's it can be seven
days a week, pretty quick.
So plan days of rest, plan, plandays off.
And depending on the type ofbirth work you do, you can fit
that in there.
Um, and also this is a craft, Ithink, to be um acquired over
(11:14):
time, but learning not toinherit your clients' um
challenges and not morph theminto your own, not take them on
as your responsibility, that youare the only one, the only way
for them to get out of thischallenge or that challenge or
to address it as you.
You as a doula are a very keyemotional physical support
(11:35):
person, very key to theirexperience, but not the only
key.
There's a lot of other piecesinvolved, so don't look at
yourself as the only team memberor the most important team
member.
Um, we need our clients to beable to be independent without
us, emotionally, physically umbe responsible when we are not
there.
And so kind of leaving thosebirth stories at the birth.
When I was a newer doula, thatwas hard.
(11:56):
That was really, really hard.
I would internalize that.
If someone had a C-section, itkind of ruined me for a little
while.
Um, if somebody had a traumaticbirth or, you know, a really
disappointing outcome in in someregard, and that's different for
everyone, that really ate at mefor a long time.
And I realized that I needed toprocess that with someone.
(12:17):
And for me, the best person todo that was another birth
worker.
Having a doula partner helps alot with that.
Somebody who knows the situationpretty well is as someone good
to bounce things off of.
Um, and time, like just time andexperience help those to be uh
and perspective, help those tobe a little more, um, a little
softer for me to carry.
And and then protecting yourpersonal life, having a personal
(12:39):
life, right?
Like protect your partner,protect your kids if you have
them, like give unadulteratedtime to them, like where you're
not um glued to your phone oranswering emails.
I I remember when I became alactation consultant um and I
spoke to a doula who is a verybusy, fabulous doula in her
(12:59):
area, who had also become alactation consultant and become
a very busy lactationconsultant.
And I said, Oh, that's gotta benice that you're not like on
call in lactation like you arein birth.
And she laughed at me.
She said, actually, um, youstill get a ton of urgent texts
and phone calls and things.
And I found that to be true.
Um, where you know, like I cancompartmentalize my appointment
(13:21):
and I had this appointment, Icharted it, whatever with my
lactation clients, and then I'llstill get texts and calls about
this, that, and the other.
So it there's some blurryboundaries there, but um kind of
protect your personal life andblock out time where you are not
um not tied to your work becausethis work, by the nature of it,
we're tied to it quite a bit.
So create some time that you'renot um sometimes creating
(13:43):
rituals to transition afterwork, coming back into your
other life or family life orother roles that you may have.
Um, that can be helpful, whetherthat's um something you do on
the way home afterwards,something you listen to,
something you see, something youum smell sometimes, have kind of
a ritualistic, maybe it's abeing somewhere, you know, just
(14:04):
going stopping and getting adrink on your way home, or being
in your backyard for a littlebit, going for a walk, whatever
that might be, transition backinto being focused, fully
focused in your life.
Um so there is uh some thingsfor burnout recovery and
prevention.
Prevention's huge, right?
(14:25):
Um, getting sleep, like sleepwhen you can.
Like I used, I'm kind of anidol.
I'm getting to be less of aneye-dowl as I'm working on that.
Um, but when it's time to go tobed, go to bed.
Go to bed early.
Learn to go to bed a little bitearlier because there are the
nights that you can't.
Um, find support groups.
Um, I love to see groups ofdoula who, doulas who combine
(14:46):
together to support one another.
That makes this work so muchmore sustainable.
Um, for when you're givingemotional support and seeking
emotional support.
Um, and maybe mentorship.
Find a mentor, someone who youappreciate and admire the work
that they do.
Seek out some guidance from themor some advice.
Like you can skip a lot oflessons when you learn from
(15:08):
masters and not learn the hardway, but learn from someone who
knows, has the experience.
Um, so kind of watch, lookaround and see who you can learn
from.
And then debriefing, debriefingafter birth, whether it's a
great birth or a difficultbirth.
I have a lactation colleaguethat she and I cross paths every
single week.
She's also a birth dual and apostpartum duela.
We have very similar lives thatare which are kind of crazy
(15:29):
doing all the work.
Um, and she has become likesomeone, even in our quick
crossing of paths, we check inon each other.
Um, and if I this week,actually, I was called off from
the hospital and I'm like, oh mygosh, I wonder how she's doing.
I gotta check in.
Uh, I actually did go in and seeher for a little bit for other
reasons, but having someone whocan check in on you and you can
check in on them, and you cankind of debrief after things.
(15:52):
And then getting continuingeducation.
Sometimes I find that as I'mfeeling a little burnout for my
work, when I dive into theprofessionalism of it, um, the
latest research, the um cuttingedge, whatever's going on at the
time, it refuels my passion forthat.
So that can nourish um yourjourney as well.
(16:12):
And then taking time off, timeoff that you actually truly
honor.
I we have a home across thecountry that we go stay in
sometimes, and last year we wentfor a whole month and it was so
much fun um just to go besomewhere different.
But I have colleagues there andI worked there for that whole
month.
I worked a lot, um, helped outmy colleagues.
(16:33):
It happened to be the time whenthey needed a lot of help, so I
did a whole lot of work there,um, which was great, but I
didn't really get that time off.
I was just doing things in adifferent place.
This summer when we went backthere, we were only gone for a
couple of weeks, and I purposelydid not work while I was there.
And I came back to my real lifeand went to I went to the
hospital where I work and justsaw it with new eyes and was
(16:56):
refreshed in the things that I'ddone over and over and over
again.
Um, I was doing them in a freshway, in a more appreciative way.
So sometimes taking that timeoff really can boost your joy in
the work and your appreciationof the work.
Finding other joys and hobbies,this is also something I'm not
great at.
So it says, you know, we talkabout finding joys and hobbies
(17:18):
that are not your dual work,something outside your dual
identity, um, because we tend towrap up our identity in our work
sometimes as we do this work.
And this is something I alsostruggle with, like finding a
joy or a hobby.
Like honestly, I've have set agoal to watch a movie for the
last three weeks, and I havefailed miserably at this goal.
(17:38):
Um, I am kind of a workaholic,and if I have a minute, I'm
gonna work on something, developsomething, do something, chart
something, write something,whatever that might be.
Um, so I'm setting goals towatch movies, and I'm not doing
well yet.
Sometimes I'll set a goal to doa puzzle, like just something
that's that's different to um todo something a little bit
(18:00):
different, which helps preventburnout.
I need to be better at that.
And then realize what restoresyou.
That's gonna be different foreveryone.
Maybe it's going for a swim,maybe it's getting out in the
mountains for a hike or beingwith a friend, maybe it's um,
you know, listening to apodcast, whatever that is that
restores you might havesomething to do with your work,
it might have nothing at all todo with your work, and that's so
(18:21):
totally fine.
Um, and then realizing likewhere can I just loosen up a
little bit?
Where can I loosen my grip?
I think sometimes we get soburied.
And this goes for a lot ofworks, right?
Not just our our birth work, buta lot of people in our work,
like whether you're a teacher ora nurse or uh an attorney, like
um learning where we can loosenour grip, where do we not have
to hold on so tight?
(18:42):
It shouldn't be this hard.
Um, how are we making thingsharder?
Because realizing that you areimportant, you are valuable,
you're a resource, and you'renot a renewable resource without
rest.
And whatever work you do, youneed to rest.
And so I want to I want to justkind of wrap up here by by um
reiterating that boundariesprotect everyone's well-being.
(19:05):
When you set boundaries foryourself, and for me, I find I'm
the hardest person to keep myown boundaries.
Um, I surpass them more thanother people do, than my, like
say my clients do.
They don't stomp on myboundaries um very much at all,
but I stomp on my own.
But um reframing boundaries as aform of quality, quality
(19:29):
product, and love towardyourself and your clients.
When we have a healthy birthworker, a healthy doula, a
healthy lactation consultant,um, a healthy partner, whatever
that is, healthy in every way,right?
Because she's got good sleep,good nutrition, good exercise,
good balance in life, we havebetter client outcomes.
You can be more sustainablypresent.
(19:51):
Um, you can be a better resourcefor your clients.
And think of the people in yourlife you're also being an
example for.
Whether you're being a greatexample or not a good example, a
non-example, you are alsomodeling to those who watch your
life closely, whether that'schildren, family members, close
friends, parents, partners,whoever that is, model for them
(20:13):
what it looks like to take goodcare of yourself.
This will also help your clientsbe able to take care of
themselves, right?
We teach parents all the time,like ask for help, there's help
to be had.
Um, that message is the same fordoors as well.
Ask for help.
Sometimes this can be a lot canbe difficult work for sure.
Um, sometimes it's lonely work,it's often exhausting work.
(20:34):
Um, but it's so rewarding.
So this has been good for me asI'm gearing up again tomorrow to
teach uh postpartum doulatraining, that I can teach it
with fervor and with passionthat I very often feel, but the
last week or so have not felt.
I almost want to say to the theattendees, I like email like,
(20:55):
are you sure?
Are you sure you want to do thiswork?
Um, but of course, that's not mymy regular or my main message.
Um, but maybe I was feeling alittle bit of burnout with my
last crazy couple of weeks.
So burnouts, it can be common.
Um, do things to avoid it, um,set boundaries for yourself,
keep to your boundaries out ofrespect for yourself and quality
(21:16):
to your clients.
Um, and choose one boundary thisweek, one thing you can improve
upon.
That might be a boundary for,hey, I'm gonna go to bed a
little bit earlier, or oh, I'mgonna go for a walk every day.
Um, but be gentle to yourself asyou settle into taking care of
yourself because you deserve it.
You deserve support, you deserverest, you deserve to take care
(21:36):
of yourself because yourwell-being matters to you and
all those around you, not justfor the work you do, but the
life you live.
Like looking back, you want tobe able to look back and say,
you know what?
I did a good job for me and formy clients.
That's how that's how you'll doit.
So I want to end this podcast umby thanking you for listening.
Thanks for being with me today.
(21:57):
Um, hopefully you can takesomething that you've thought
about or some new concept umtoday and apply that into your
own life.
And as always, I want you toreach out and make a human
connection.
Another goal I have is to make asocial connection in person
every single, I mean, I'm makinga lot of connections in person,
but one that's just social, justfun.
(22:17):
Um, so I try to go for a walkwith a friend, meet up for lunch
with a friend, text or call afriend.
Um I have a pretty long list ofpeople I'm gonna be getting to
over the next few weeks, whichI'm excited about.
But I want you to reach out andmake a connection to someone,
some type of a connection toanother human that's important
for us.
Um, hopefully you'll find thejoy and the reward in doing so,
and others will as will as well.
(22:39):
Hope you have a great day.
Thanks for being with me, AngieRosier on the Ordinary Doula
Podcast, and hope to see youagain next time.
SPEAKER_01 (23:09):
Tune in next time as we continue to explore the many
aspects of giving birth.
Welcome to the Ordinary Doula Podcast with
Angie Roger, hosted by BirthLearning, where we help prepare
folks for labor and birth withexpertise coming from 20 years
of experience in a busy Doulapractice, helping thousands of
people prepare for labor,providing essential knowledge
and tools for positive andempowering birth experiences.
SPEAKER_00 (00:58):
That's kind of been my what my career has been
centered around for the last 20some odd years.
And I love it.
I love every aspect about thiswork.
And today's episode is kind oftimely because I do love this
work, but today's episode, we'retalking about burnout.
This is something that manybirth workers may experience.
(01:21):
I'm actually getting readytomorrow to teach a postpartum
doula training.
I've got an all day ahead of metomorrow doing that.
And as I've been preparing forthat, I honestly had a little
pep talk with myself.
I'm like, all right, Angie, yougot to pull it together and put
a positive spin on this work.
Um, because you're, you know, wewant to leave with enthusiasm
(01:43):
and a fire and passion to dothis work because I wasn't
feeling it sometimes this week.
Honestly.
So this episode is timely forme.
Um, so those of you who aredoulas, maybe you can relate.
Those of you who use doulas,maybe you can empathize and kind
of treat your doula withkindness and compassion because
this can be hard work sometimes.
I just finished um two crazywork weeks.
(02:07):
Everything came all at once withbirths and tons of lactation
visits and a good deal ofovernights.
I honestly did an 85-hour workweek and a 91-hour work week.
Um, some of that work wassleeping, you know, for sure.
But um, and miraculously Ididn't miss anything as far as I
had some big family events inthere as well, and was able to
(02:28):
um go to everything, butprobably wasn't my very best two
weeks of life for sure.
Um, sometimes the work gets likethat.
I sure hope not often.
Um, but sometimes doulas work 10hours a week, sometimes they
work five, sometimes they work95, um, just depending on what
the week looks like.
So this episode talking aboutboundaries and burnout.
(02:49):
Um uh I just want to likerecognize that that can be real.
Um, most doulas I knowabsolutely love this work.
You have to have a passion forthis work.
It's not for everyone, it's notfor the faint of heart or mind
or body.
It's uh it can be actuallyreally hard work, although it's
incredibly rewarding as well.
Um, and there's something calledcompassion fatigue when you are
(03:11):
showing compassion so much andgiving of yourself and um caring
for others.
Like doulas are caregivers,whether it's a postpartum doula,
birth doula, lactationconsultant, they listen
compassionately, they care, theykind of carry that with them.
But you have to have a full cupto be able to pour from that
cup.
(03:32):
So boundaries are incrediblyimportant, they're not barriers,
they're kind of a greatstructure that allows birth
workers to do this work and doit sustainably, do a high
quality of work.
So compassion fatigue is real.
Um, and and honestly, I can sayI really do love, love, love and
give my all to every singleclient, but it does wear on me.
(03:55):
And and doing that constantly umcan be pretty challenging when
you're a caregiver all of thetime.
There can be an emotionalexhaustion, um, and there can be
a physical exhaustion afterintense births or you know,
several overnights or something.
Um, sometimes you kind of feelkind of irritable.
And I would say that most of thetime, in my case, like um I get
(04:16):
pretty, what's the word?
Like tender.
If I've had a um a long birth ora hard birth or lost some sleep,
I'm pretty weepy actually.
Not like crying, but prettyweepy.
I actually met up with my kidsum this week.
We had some family in town, andI finished a birth I'd been at
most of the night, and I gotrelieved uh kind of midday in
just enough time to meet myfamily.
(04:39):
We went um downtown and had afun event.
So I met up with my kids andsome other relatives and joined
them for some activity.
So I was kind of tired, butdoing okay.
But everything just made meweep, and my kids were just kind
of making fun of me that I wascrying at everything, and I do
get pretty weepy, and that umand sometimes sometimes people
get irritable.
I might get pretty irritable,but I just slow down.
(05:01):
I kind of just do a real slowingof my thinking and my moving.
Um, and sometimes we don't havetime to slow down, which can be
can be challenging.
Sometimes that can wear on yourpassion of the work.
Um, and a lot of people feelcalled to do this work.
Like it's this is this is aninteresting role of work because
it's not just like, hey, I'm agood uh, you know, good project
(05:24):
manager, I'm a good engineer orsomething else, but we wrap this
up in our identity a lot becausepeople do this love it so
incredibly much.
Um and then sometimes there'sbody breakdown, right?
Like sleep disruption is a truething.
And that honestly, as I'mgetting older, makes me pretty
nervous.
I'm pretty um cautious about thesleep that I can get.
(05:45):
People get headaches or immunesystems are challenged.
Um, so doas need to take very,very good care of themselves
because sometimes they can't.
So all the other times when it'san option, they need to be
really good about their sleep,um, nutrition, hydration,
exercise, take care of yourselfso that you are there to take
care of others.
So having these challengesdoesn't mean you're not cut out
(06:06):
for this work.
It just means that you'renormal, that you're human, and
that you need to put someboundaries in place so that you
can continue to do this work.
A lot of birth workers, I think,struggle with boundaries because
your identity is so wrapped upin helping each other's and
being available.
Like this is a very strange lineof work in that you have to be
available 100% of the time,depending on how you structure
your um practice or yourpartnership or your um backup
(06:29):
system.
Um, sometimes you are available24.
I've basically been on call 24-7for 23 years.
Um, a couple breaks here andthere when I'm really truly like
gone and out of town, but reallylike have to be available.
Um, and there's a fear too ofletting people down.
Your professional reputationoftentimes is tied to your
(06:50):
services, of course.
And you want to keep that a goodprofessional reputation, so not
to let anybody down, but providehigh quality service for
everyone.
Um, and and sometimes too, Ithink we're afraid of taking
breaks because um, like yourincome is tied to this, right?
And so honestly, for somepeople, like, yeah, I want I
want all the clients I can get.
(07:10):
That's all the money I can get.
But does that you know add up toquality work?
So that might be a personalboundary that you set in place
for yourself.
And then in our in our culture,a lot of times, our broader
culture, there's not a lot ofrespect for downtime.
Like um, our culture aroundworking hard and and and going
(07:31):
100 miles an hour, like people,it's kind of messed up, but we
really respect that.
It's a little bit backwards, butbalance should be something that
we respect more and strivebetter for.
So uh don't be trying to be asuperhuman.
You're not just try to be a kindand honest human and a real
human and set yourself up tosucceed within those, within
(07:51):
those realms.
So practicing boundaries willprotect you.
They'll give you a higherquality product, which is you um
set certain hours or days um forcommunication that's not birth
related, right?
Like um, that's not like, hey,I'm in labor right now.
But if you need to, you know,redo interviews or consults or
(08:13):
something like you can setcertain times for that, set
boundaries for that.
Um, and have time expectationsfor you, for your client.
So, you know, I'll respond toemails or inquiries that aren't
urgent about imminent laborwithin 12 hours or 24 hours or
something.
And maybe you treat day andnighttime on call a little bit
differently.
(08:34):
Um, maybe your phone is at adifferent setting for for
clients and you can silence itfor other things during the
night.
I know a lot of times I'm justdrifting off to sleep when um I
get some weird, strange latenight text.
I am not, you know, unaccustomedto late night texts for sure.
And I have, you know, my phoneis set to wake me up during the
night.
But um, gosh, if it was one thatwoke me up and I didn't need to
(08:56):
be, then that can be kind offrustrating.
So set some some boundariesaround those kind of things.
And then as far as schedulinggoes, set a maximum number of
clients per month and bereasonable about it and realize
that each client comes with acertain number of appointments
as well, right?
It's not just a one birth you'regoing to.
It might be one birth, oneconsult, two postpartums, or two
(09:19):
prenatals and several phonecalls and texts as well.
Like it a client comes with awhole lot more um collateral
than just their birth, ofcourse.
And then creating a clear backupsystem for yourself is so vital.
Um, I realized that when I waspregnant with my last baby who's
almost 12, and I'd been doingsolo doula work pretty dang busy
(09:42):
for years, years, years.
And when I was pregnant, Ireached out for help and I said,
you know what, I could do 12hours.
Can you come in and back me upafter 12 hours?
And um I found a good doulacolleague that did that, and we
kind of morphed into apartnership after that, a really
great backup system where wenever are gone more than 12
hours now, and that's incrediblysustainable.
Sometimes we make it shorterthan that, depending on the
(10:05):
timing of things.
And then plan days of rest umafter births or plan weeks of
rest sometimes, as far as likeI'm gonna block out certain
weeks where I won't have clientsand don't do work.
Now I am terrible at this.
Terrible, terrible, terrible.
I am need to take my own advicehere, but um, because of the
nature of the work I do, I havelots of different types of jobs
(10:28):
and um I work so many days.
Like what I'm realizing in mywork is I need to take days off.
Like, honestly, take days off.
You it's kind of crazy how manydays in a month I work.
Um, and maybe it's just onelactation appointment or one
overnight or um one prenatal orsomething, but it's super
awesome to have a day or days.
Um, I get really envious ofpeople who work a nine to five
(10:50):
Monday through Friday.
I'm like, wow, you have twodays, you don't have to ever
work.
Um, and sometimes as with thisbirth work, it's it can be seven
days a week, pretty quick.
So plan days of rest, plan, plandays off.
And depending on the type ofbirth work you do, you can fit
that in there.
Um, and also this is a craft, Ithink, to be um acquired over
(11:14):
time, but learning not toinherit your clients' um
challenges and not morph theminto your own, not take them on
as your responsibility, that youare the only one, the only way
for them to get out of thischallenge or that challenge or
to address it as you.
You as a doula are a very keyemotional physical support
(11:35):
person, very key to theirexperience, but not the only
key.
There's a lot of other piecesinvolved, so don't look at
yourself as the only team memberor the most important team
member.
Um, we need our clients to beable to be independent without
us, emotionally, physically umbe responsible when we are not
there.
And so kind of leaving thosebirth stories at the birth.
When I was a newer doula, thatwas hard.
(11:56):
That was really, really hard.
I would internalize that.
If someone had a C-section, itkind of ruined me for a little
while.
Um, if somebody had a traumaticbirth or, you know, a really
disappointing outcome in in someregard, and that's different for
everyone, that really ate at mefor a long time.
And I realized that I needed toprocess that with someone.
(12:17):
And for me, the best person todo that was another birth
worker.
Having a doula partner helps alot with that.
Somebody who knows the situationpretty well is as someone good
to bounce things off of.
Um, and time, like just time andexperience help those to be uh
and perspective, help those tobe a little more, um, a little
softer for me to carry.
And and then protecting yourpersonal life, having a personal
(12:39):
life, right?
Like protect your partner,protect your kids if you have
them, like give unadulteratedtime to them, like where you're
not um glued to your phone oranswering emails.
I I remember when I became alactation consultant um and I
spoke to a doula who is a verybusy, fabulous doula in her
(12:59):
area, who had also become alactation consultant and become
a very busy lactationconsultant.
And I said, Oh, that's gotta benice that you're not like on
call in lactation like you arein birth.
And she laughed at me.
She said, actually, um, youstill get a ton of urgent texts
and phone calls and things.
And I found that to be true.
Um, where you know, like I cancompartmentalize my appointment
(13:21):
and I had this appointment, Icharted it, whatever with my
lactation clients, and then I'llstill get texts and calls about
this, that, and the other.
So it there's some blurryboundaries there, but um kind of
protect your personal life andblock out time where you are not
um not tied to your work becausethis work, by the nature of it,
we're tied to it quite a bit.
So create some time that you'renot um sometimes creating
(13:43):
rituals to transition afterwork, coming back into your
other life or family life orother roles that you may have.
Um, that can be helpful, whetherthat's um something you do on
the way home afterwards,something you listen to,
something you see, something youum smell sometimes, have kind of
a ritualistic, maybe it's abeing somewhere, you know, just
(14:04):
going stopping and getting adrink on your way home, or being
in your backyard for a littlebit, going for a walk, whatever
that might be, transition backinto being focused, fully
focused in your life.
Um so there is uh some thingsfor burnout recovery and
prevention.
Prevention's huge, right?
(14:25):
Um, getting sleep, like sleepwhen you can.
Like I used, I'm kind of anidol.
I'm getting to be less of aneye-dowl as I'm working on that.
Um, but when it's time to go tobed, go to bed.
Go to bed early.
Learn to go to bed a little bitearlier because there are the
nights that you can't.
Um, find support groups.
Um, I love to see groups ofdoula who, doulas who combine
(14:46):
together to support one another.
That makes this work so muchmore sustainable.
Um, for when you're givingemotional support and seeking
emotional support.
Um, and maybe mentorship.
Find a mentor, someone who youappreciate and admire the work
that they do.
Seek out some guidance from themor some advice.
Like you can skip a lot oflessons when you learn from
(15:08):
masters and not learn the hardway, but learn from someone who
knows, has the experience.
Um, so kind of watch, lookaround and see who you can learn
from.
And then debriefing, debriefingafter birth, whether it's a
great birth or a difficultbirth.
I have a lactation colleaguethat she and I cross paths every
single week.
She's also a birth dual and apostpartum duela.
We have very similar lives thatare which are kind of crazy
(15:29):
doing all the work.
Um, and she has become likesomeone, even in our quick
crossing of paths, we check inon each other.
Um, and if I this week,actually, I was called off from
the hospital and I'm like, oh mygosh, I wonder how she's doing.
I gotta check in.
Uh, I actually did go in and seeher for a little bit for other
reasons, but having someone whocan check in on you and you can
check in on them, and you cankind of debrief after things.
(15:52):
And then getting continuingeducation.
Sometimes I find that as I'mfeeling a little burnout for my
work, when I dive into theprofessionalism of it, um, the
latest research, the um cuttingedge, whatever's going on at the
time, it refuels my passion forthat.
So that can nourish um yourjourney as well.
(16:12):
And then taking time off, timeoff that you actually truly
honor.
I we have a home across thecountry that we go stay in
sometimes, and last year we wentfor a whole month and it was so
much fun um just to go besomewhere different.
But I have colleagues there andI worked there for that whole
month.
I worked a lot, um, helped outmy colleagues.
(16:33):
It happened to be the time whenthey needed a lot of help, so I
did a whole lot of work there,um, which was great, but I
didn't really get that time off.
I was just doing things in adifferent place.
This summer when we went backthere, we were only gone for a
couple of weeks, and I purposelydid not work while I was there.
And I came back to my real lifeand went to I went to the
hospital where I work and justsaw it with new eyes and was
(16:56):
refreshed in the things that I'ddone over and over and over
again.
Um, I was doing them in a freshway, in a more appreciative way.
So sometimes taking that timeoff really can boost your joy in
the work and your appreciationof the work.
Finding other joys and hobbies,this is also something I'm not
great at.
So it says, you know, we talkabout finding joys and hobbies
(17:18):
that are not your dual work,something outside your dual
identity, um, because we tend towrap up our identity in our work
sometimes as we do this work.
And this is something I alsostruggle with, like finding a
joy or a hobby.
Like honestly, I've have set agoal to watch a movie for the
last three weeks, and I havefailed miserably at this goal.
(17:38):
Um, I am kind of a workaholic,and if I have a minute, I'm
gonna work on something, developsomething, do something, chart
something, write something,whatever that might be.
Um, so I'm setting goals towatch movies, and I'm not doing
well yet.
Sometimes I'll set a goal to doa puzzle, like just something
that's that's different to um todo something a little bit
(18:00):
different, which helps preventburnout.
I need to be better at that.
And then realize what restoresyou.
That's gonna be different foreveryone.
Maybe it's going for a swim,maybe it's getting out in the
mountains for a hike or beingwith a friend, maybe it's um,
you know, listening to apodcast, whatever that is that
restores you might havesomething to do with your work,
it might have nothing at all todo with your work, and that's so
(18:21):
totally fine.
Um, and then realizing likewhere can I just loosen up a
little bit?
Where can I loosen my grip?
I think sometimes we get soburied.
And this goes for a lot ofworks, right?
Not just our our birth work, buta lot of people in our work,
like whether you're a teacher ora nurse or uh an attorney, like
um learning where we can loosenour grip, where do we not have
to hold on so tight?
(18:42):
It shouldn't be this hard.
Um, how are we making thingsharder?
Because realizing that you areimportant, you are valuable,
you're a resource, and you'renot a renewable resource without
rest.
And whatever work you do, youneed to rest.
And so I want to I want to justkind of wrap up here by by um
reiterating that boundariesprotect everyone's well-being.
(19:05):
When you set boundaries foryourself, and for me, I find I'm
the hardest person to keep myown boundaries.
Um, I surpass them more thanother people do, than my, like
say my clients do.
They don't stomp on myboundaries um very much at all,
but I stomp on my own.
But um reframing boundaries as aform of quality, quality
(19:29):
product, and love towardyourself and your clients.
When we have a healthy birthworker, a healthy doula, a
healthy lactation consultant,um, a healthy partner, whatever
that is, healthy in every way,right?
Because she's got good sleep,good nutrition, good exercise,
good balance in life, we havebetter client outcomes.
You can be more sustainablypresent.
(19:51):
Um, you can be a better resourcefor your clients.
And think of the people in yourlife you're also being an
example for.
Whether you're being a greatexample or not a good example, a
non-example, you are alsomodeling to those who watch your
life closely, whether that'schildren, family members, close
friends, parents, partners,whoever that is, model for them
(20:13):
what it looks like to take goodcare of yourself.
This will also help your clientsbe able to take care of
themselves, right?
We teach parents all the time,like ask for help, there's help
to be had.
Um, that message is the same fordoors as well.
Ask for help.
Sometimes this can be a lot canbe difficult work for sure.
Um, sometimes it's lonely work,it's often exhausting work.
(20:34):
Um, but it's so rewarding.
So this has been good for me asI'm gearing up again tomorrow to
teach uh postpartum doulatraining, that I can teach it
with fervor and with passionthat I very often feel, but the
last week or so have not felt.
I almost want to say to the theattendees, I like email like,
(20:55):
are you sure?
Are you sure you want to do thiswork?
Um, but of course, that's not mymy regular or my main message.
Um, but maybe I was feeling alittle bit of burnout with my
last crazy couple of weeks.
So burnouts, it can be common.
Um, do things to avoid it, um,set boundaries for yourself,
keep to your boundaries out ofrespect for yourself and quality
(21:16):
to your clients.
Um, and choose one boundary thisweek, one thing you can improve
upon.
That might be a boundary for,hey, I'm gonna go to bed a
little bit earlier, or oh, I'mgonna go for a walk every day.
Um, but be gentle to yourself asyou settle into taking care of
yourself because you deserve it.
You deserve support, you deserverest, you deserve to take care
(21:36):
of yourself because yourwell-being matters to you and
all those around you, not justfor the work you do, but the
life you live.
Like looking back, you want tobe able to look back and say,
you know what?
I did a good job for me and formy clients.
That's how that's how you'll doit.
So I want to end this podcast umby thanking you for listening.
Thanks for being with me today.
(21:57):
Um, hopefully you can takesomething that you've thought
about or some new concept umtoday and apply that into your
own life.
And as always, I want you toreach out and make a human
connection.
Another goal I have is to make asocial connection in person
every single, I mean, I'm makinga lot of connections in person,
but one that's just social, justfun.
(22:17):
Um, so I try to go for a walkwith a friend, meet up for lunch
with a friend, text or call afriend.
Um I have a pretty long list ofpeople I'm gonna be getting to
over the next few weeks, whichI'm excited about.
But I want you to reach out andmake a connection to someone,
some type of a connection toanother human that's important
for us.
Um, hopefully you'll find thejoy and the reward in doing so,
and others will as will as well.
(22:39):
Hope you have a great day.
Thanks for being with me, AngieRosier on the Ordinary Doula
Podcast, and hope to see youagain next time.
SPEAKER_01 (23:09):
Tune in next time as we continue to explore the many
aspects of giving birth.
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