The Four Things Men Lack & Aligning Our Actions with Our Values | with Alain Dumonceaux

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Key Takeaways:

-  The importance of differentiating between our true values, versus borrowed values.

-  In order for us to develop to our full potential, a change of environment is necessary.

-  'Root Cause Analysis' and the *5 Why’s* technique, as an effective tool to guide us to the true source of our thoughts, feelings and actions.

When Alain Dumonceaux, a culinary Olympic silver medalist, encountered a storm of personal challenges—from the peaks of professional achievement to the valleys of new fatherhood and financial woes—his journey became a mirror for us all. His candid storytelling reveals the stark reality of how our self-perceptions are often misaligned with the truth, urging listeners to confront their fears and behaviors at the deepest levels. As we unpack Alain's decade-long voyage of self-discovery, we also offer you a guide to crafting your own personal purpose statement, and the life-changing effects of aligning your day-to-day actions with your innermost values.

Balancing the pillars of a successful life is no small feat. Men, in particular, will find solace in Alain's integrity challenge—24 probing questions designed to reflect upon and harmonize six critical areas of life. From managing the tightrope walk between professional commitments and family life to embracing vulnerability in relationships, Alain speaks on the art of communication and the power it holds in revolutionizing our personal interactions.

We close with a heartfelt conversation on the resonance of community support and the importance of introspection in personal growth. By sharing experiences from establishing a men's group in Winnipeg, Manitoba, to navigating the complexity of fatherhood and beyond, we underscore the significance of presence and wisdom in our lives. Whether you're seeking unity in a divided world or wisdom through reflection and experience, this episode is a clarion call to men and women alike to step into leadership roles within their communities, confront their deepest fears, and embrace the transformative journey toward self-realization.


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Episode Transcript

Kertia (00:00):
In this conversation with .
He had so many insightfulthings to say about our values
and why it is important toconduct an assessment of the
things we value and what ouractions signify in relation to
the things we say we value.
And to go a bit deeper, thisbranches off into the way we

(00:22):
think and the things we do andwhy we think and behave in
certain ways.
So Alain mentioned a veryuseful tool that is often
utilized by businesses and thatis called root cause analysis,
which is a method that helps touncover the fundamental or

(00:43):
deep-seated causes of a problemor an occurrence, and the
importance of this is that itgoes deeper than just putting a
band-aid solution on ourproblems.
So, instead of just treatingthe symptoms of a problem, the
purpose is to investigate andanalyze the underlying factors

(01:05):
that contributed to the problem,so that we can create solutions
to effectively address theproblem from the root in order
to prevent further reoccurrences.
Now, one other thing I'd liketo highlight about root cause
analysis is that there is neverany focus given to placing blame
on anyone, but the recognitionthat things are more than what

(01:30):
they seem on the surface.
There is a cause and effectrelationship that needs to be
explored.
But one more thing here is thatthere can be more than one root
causes to any given problem.
So one technique used to get tothe root cause or causes is

(01:53):
called the five why's approach.
And yes, there can be more thanfive why's.
So upon identifying and framingthe problem in essence creating
a full picture of the situationand all the components and
elements involved, you begin toask some why questions, and for

(02:15):
each answer you come up with,you ask another why question,
and this can go on for some time, but each time the questions
should get deeper untileventually you get to a root
cause.
So why is this important?
What is the relevance of this,you may ask?
And that is because root causeanalysis is not only exclusive

(02:41):
to businesses.
It is also a great tool to helpus in our personal lives, to
help us uncover the truth behindour thoughts and actions and
the reoccurring patterns in ourlives.
There are many root causes tothe issues we deal with on a
daily basis, and on this podcastwe address one major root cause

(03:05):
that can be problematic formost of us and that is fear.
Now the thing with humans, andI think it's safe to say that
most of us want the same thing,which is love to belong, to be
valued by our community, andsafety.

(03:26):
Now, oftentimes, the fears wehave around these things that we
want so badly is what,ironically, often motivates a
lot of our actions.
That leads to the creation of adivide among us, which leads to
us creating unloving, unsafeexperiences for others and,

(03:50):
equally, for ourselves.
Now, putting that intoperspective, I'd like you to
take a step back and think aboutthe reoccurring patterns in
your life.
Think about the unpleasantthoughts or feelings you may
have around certain people orsituations.
Think about the things that areuncomfortable or just too

(04:12):
difficult for you to face.
Think about the conflicts youhave with family members,
friends or co-workers.
Think about the things you areavoiding right now.
Do a root cause analysis andmaybe you might just uncover

(04:33):
some deep-seated fear you werepreviously unaware of, among
other root causes, of course.
Just a food for thought.
All right, let's get into thisconversation.
You mentioned that you are aculinary Olympic silver medalist

(04:54):
and you have been through somany challenges, coming from a
really high point in your lifeand experiencing a lot of lows
preceding that.
What was that like for you andhow did you manage it?

Alain (05:10):
Yeah, great question.
You know it was really, whileit was an exciting time of my
life, it was also a pretty darktime.
I came to realize that, whilewe can be successful in some
parts of our life, if we don'treally look at how we're living
holistically and in totality ofour lives, then we struggle, and
that's what happened with me.
I really struggled with beingable to manage a home.

(05:34):
I was a new father.
My first son was born fourmonths prior to me going to
Germany to compete, and so Ileft a mom, a brand new mom
trying to struggle to compete,and so I left a mom brand new
mom trying to struggle throughthat.
We were gone for a couple ofweeks, but still some of those
challenges were there.
And then, as our livesprogressed, another child came

(05:55):
along.
We bought a home and we justkept piling on things and we
weren't ready.
I for sure wasn't ready to be afather, although I thought I
could do that, and I wasn'tready to be a father although I
thought I could do that and Iwasn't ready with it.
And so what ended up happeningis I really started to focus my
energies on my work, because itwas something I knew I could
control and I could manage, butultimately what that ended up by

(06:18):
doing was costing me thatmarriage and really put me in a
tailspin.
We lost everything.
We lost a home, we lostvehicles.
I lost everything.
I ended up having to claimbankruptcy.
And it was at a time in my lifewhere I just felt that really
the imposter syndrome reallystarted to come through, as who

(06:40):
I thought I was and what wasactually happening around me
were two very different things.
And when I recognized that ittook a while for me to really
change my perspective about whoI am and by a while I mean like
10 years worth of true deepgrowth and some along that way.

(07:04):
Some of those challenges werealso on how I was being a father
.
I struggled with depression forthose first five years and
hardly saw my children.
It was really difficult forthem.
I'm paying a bit of that pricetoday.
I'm sure there's more I couldramble on, but that's a little
bit to get us started.

Kertia (07:17):
You mentioned something there about that concept about
who you thought you were versuswhat was happening around you,
what was happening with you.
Can you flesh that out a littlebit?

Alain (07:31):
Yeah for sure.
So I thought what I was?
I thought I was a successful,you know chef.
At the time, I thought I was ayou know, a successful father.
I had a you know, a vibrantmarriage, and the reality of it
was I was putting very littleenergy towards the latter two
and what ended up by causing wascausing.
That was because, as I saidearlier, I was struggling with

(07:55):
how to do that and how to bethat, and and unfortunately for
my, my wife at the time, shedidn't know how to respond
either.
And so we were trying to, wewere just treading water, just
trying to make things work, andultimately, when everything
started to, when everythingfinally fell apart, you know, it
gave me an opportunity toreally look, sit back and I

(08:16):
asked myself this question howcan somebody be so successful in
one pillar of their life, butin the other pillar in their
life they cannot.
They can be so so far removed.
And so I started to do somereally deep analysis, and so one
of the things I looked at wasreally diving into what I said
that I valued and what myactions said that I valued, and

(08:38):
so I went through a valueexercise to really assess and
say, okay.
Well, if I'm saying that mykids and my family are really
important, then why am Ichoosing to do something else?
And that's when I realized thatit was really fear-based.
I didn't have answers and atthe time, being a young man in
my mid-20s, I also didn't havethe mentors around to help me.

(09:01):
We moved from one province we'rein Canada here so we moved from
Saskatchewan to Manitoba and wewere trying to make it on our
own and ultimately, I think thatreally was challenging for us,
challenging for me for sure,with the pressures of career and
the pressures of family lifecoming on board and so doing the

(09:22):
values work really helped me toget a start, to get a handle on
what was actually happeningwith me.
And then I was also.
It also revealed a lot oflimiting beliefs that I had
about myself.
Really, it's the, the storiesthat I had wrapped those values
around, that that in order to beyou know, in order for me to be
successful, then I needed toput in all this extra time, and

(09:43):
all at the cost of my family,not really understanding that,
yes, I could still put in a lotof time, but when I was at home,
could I be more present?
How could I support what washappening at home?
How could I have betterconversations, even have a
conversation about what wasgoing on at home, instead of not
doing that and being a typical,you know father?

(10:06):
You would see on the old TVfather, come home, sit on the
couch, archie Bunker type stuff,not really engaged in my
personal life.

Kertia (10:15):
Yeah, I totally get that and as a mom myself, I totally
get when you're trying tobalance different aspects of
yourself.
When it relates to you as acareer person, as a parent, as a
husband.
There are so many roles thatyou need to balance.
What were some of the fearsthat came up for you as a career

(10:36):
man and a family man?

Alain (10:38):
Yeah, the biggest fear for me was not being able to
support my family, and so all Ithought of is how do I keep this
ship afloat?
We were struggling financiallyimmensely.
You've got to remember this wasin the mid-'90s.
This isn't being in theculinary field.
Back then you weren't makinggreat dollars, even as chefs.

(10:59):
You weren't making really bigdollars unless you were in a
prestigious hotel or a largeevent space, and I hadn't been
at that level just yet, and so Iwas really struggling with
balancing and managing that.
Yet still being able to providefor for the family and so taking
on other jobs to help, to helpsupport what the family needed,

(11:21):
was really important.
The other part was also tryingto figure out you know what,
what was, how do was also tryingto figure out you know what,
what was, how do we keep thekids in the activities?
You know, one of the things Ialways give kudos to and still
do to my to my ex-wife, is thatshe always made sure that the
kids, the boys, were doingsomething, involved in something
, and that's again more time.
Financially, it's a it'spressure as well, but, as you

(11:44):
know, after the divorce happened, separation it was something
that took a while for me toreally wrap my head around and
to become you know okay.
With what was that, what washappening?
And helping them, helping her,support them as best as I could,
as opposed to having them notbe participating in anything and
then giving them that so muchidle time, and so those were a

(12:06):
couple of things.
For sure, that were bigchallenges.

Kertia (12:09):
You mentioned something earlier about a value system.
What is that value system thatassisted you in getting through
all of that?

Alain (12:20):
Yeah, basically I came across this values exercise.
So I'm trained in NLP andtimelines therapy, and so one of
the exercises I learned throughmy NLP training was doing a
hierarchy of values exercise,and really what it is is you're
taking you can find any of theselists on the internet but the

(12:41):
list of words that describe whata potential value are, and you
write them down and so I putthem into a five column, five
different columns, and I startto group them.
There's no right or wrong wayto do this.
Just what resonates is that, asI start to put them through,
anywhere between five to sixwords per column, and then,
after doing that, then it was a,then it's a measurement between

(13:02):
each one.
So so, within each column, let'ssay, I said that I valued
success being financial, inbusiness and my personal life.
So what is more important inthose three?
So I would measure it againstwell, I wanted to be financially
successful is more importantthan having business success.

(13:23):
Okay, so now that would be thenext level.
Then I compare that to well,what's more important being
financially successful versushaving a successful family life?
And I'll slowly start todistill it down to one word that
would complete that column.
Ultimately, I came up with fivewords, five descriptions of
what I valued.
Then I write a purposestatement based on utilizing

(13:45):
those.
They may be in the actual wordsin that statement, or it's a
summary that brings it alltogether once I did that work
and I looked at what it said,then I could say that I could
challenge myself and say am Itruly living up to this, to that
?
what I say, this is how, what Ivalue yeah and then when I
recognize, well, I'm not reallyliving up to it in this aspect.

(14:06):
So, from a family perspective,I wasn't.
I needed to improve on this.
From a relationship perspective, I needed to do this.
From business, I needed to dothis.
So what that did now is it gaveme a framework to start to
incorporate.
Okay, this value statement wastrue for me.
Now it's about aligning myactions with it, and so it gave

(14:27):
me more intent, more purposeabout how to move forward, as
opposed to just stating that Iliked that.
This is what I say I value, butI'm not really putting any
intention behind it.
So it brings it into a sharperfocus for me and it lets me know
when I'm on track and when I'moff track.

Kertia (14:50):
That's a really good tool, because when you write
something down it helps to kindof bring clarity to what it is
that truly matters to you, towhat it is that you truly value.
And then when you can connectwith what you are writing or
what you've written down, thenthat kind of develops into a
certain level of alignment withwhat it is that you want, who
you are and what your purpose is.

(15:12):
So I like that.
That's a really good tool.

Alain (15:15):
Yeah, and in our work here with the Awakened man, our
motto is about living a life ofpurpose.
So we know what we want to doand on purpose meaning, we have
intention behind it.
It all starts with aligning ourvalues with with whom we say we
want to become, and it's theother piece that I really needed
to take, to really understandand take ownership for is I

(15:35):
really?
When everything was fallingapart around me, I recognized
that well, I'm here because ofthe decisions and the actions
that I've taken.
It has really nothing to dowith my partner or anything else
is going on.
I'm here because these are mydecisions, these are my actions,
and so as soon as I could ownthat, you know, then I could
stop the blame game right.

(15:56):
And so then, once I started toown where I was, then I could
also own who I was.
Well, I'm that guy.
Nobody forced me to make thesedecisions.
These are decisions that I madeon my own, consciously or
unconsciously, and ultimately,after doing the values exercise,
then I could takeresponsibility for who I aspired
to become, because now I have abit of a roadmap.

(16:18):
I have a statement that saysthis is who I want to become,
and because it's embedded withvalues.
And the interesting thing aboutthat exercise is it's not a one
and done thing.
It's something you do regularly, and so one of the things that
I encourage folks to do is to dothat exercise at least annually
.
It's a great time of year I'mnot sure when the episode will

(16:40):
air, but we're coming close tothe end of a calendar year here.
What a great tool andassessment for yourself to sit
to structure yourself and get itset up for the upcoming year,
and what are those things thatyou aspire to become and what
values do you need in order todevelop or to lean into in order
to achieve that.
And then you can measure.
You have something you can goback and measure on a regular

(17:02):
basis.
We we like to do it quarterly.
It gives us opportunity to growand change fine-tune, and then
you can reflect and do anassessment test on it.
So I think those are really keypieces and it's what really
helped me to pivot and change mylife.

Kertia (17:18):
That is really cool and I think what you said there is
really really important.
It's not a one and done thing.
This is something that you cankeep going back to.
You can keep changing it.
Certain things might change.
Maybe something that youthought was important is no
longer important to you Sixmonths from now.
You could re-clarify thosevalues and refocus on the things

(17:42):
that matters most.
So I like that.
This is a really good tool.
You are the host of theRevolutionary man podcast and
you talk about a lot ofchallenges that men face
aligning with their purpose,really just kind of get into
that stage of fulfillment andbeing the best that they can be

(18:05):
right.

Alain (18:06):
Absolutely.
You know, I started theRevolutionary man podcast
because I wanted an opportunityfor other men, other people, to
hear that we all are on our ownhero's journey, our hero's quest
and we call it a hero's questhere and I get this opportunity.
We start the show with somebodytelling about their transition,
that moment in time when theyknew things had to change, and

(18:27):
how that shaped them, becauseit's in those moments that we
really truly find out what we'remade of and who we are.
And we might not always likethat answer, but it's such a
great opportunity for us to leaninto understanding what that is
, to take responsibility andownership for it and to make a
change and to say enough isenough and to make that shift.

(18:48):
And so the podcast is aboutthat, and we like to get into
tools and strategies that myguests are using and how it's
shaping their lives forthemselves and people they work
with.
And I think people get a lot ofit because it's average,
ordinary people.
It's not some celebrity maybeone day that's the case but I
really like the idea of speakingwith average, everyday people

(19:11):
because that's that's who I seemyself as.

Kertia (19:13):
I'm just an ordinary guy working towards living an
extraordinary life yeah, andgoing back to what you said a
little bit earlier when you werespeaking about the different
areas of life and aligning thosevalues, you doing a podcast
like this, what do you find arethe biggest challenges for men

(19:35):
as it relates to aligning thosedifferent areas of their lives
the career, the wife, the kidsand everything else in between?

Alain (19:50):
What are the biggest challenges for men?
Aligning all of that?
Yeah, I'm finding the biggestchallenge that we have as men is
that we're very analytical andlinear in thinking, and so what
ends up happening is we focus onone or two aspects of our life.
For me it happened to be career, but I work with men whose
challenges is they're focusedmore so on their personal life,

(20:11):
yet there makes theirprofessional life, their career,
suffering.
So they come wondering whytheir career isn't flourishing.
They had figured at this timein their life they were going to
be 30 or 40.
Generally that's around the agefrom time that I'm working with
a little bit older than that aswell is that their careers
haven't developed but so muchenergy has been in one aspect of

(20:32):
it.
So we spend a lot of time.
I call it an integritychallenge.
It's an opportunity for them.
They go through 24 questionsevenly dispersed amongst our six
pillars.
We've got financial, we havespiritual pillars.
We've got financial, we havespiritual, we have physical, we
have professional.
You look at their relationshipsand obviously financial and
it's opportunity for them togauge themselves on where they

(20:54):
are sitting and they see quick,pretty quickly, that the area
that life is actually prettygood scores, extremely high,
because of the energy there andthe areas that they're
struggling in, things aren'tgoing as well, and so once they
have some clarity onto into thatand they have some insight, we
can start to work towardsbringing some time and some

(21:15):
energy into those aspects, andnot necessarily working on all
of them.
You know, I don't profess thatI think that you work.
You work on an air one area andwhat I find is that rising tide
lifts all ships and so otherareas start to come in because
there's commonality amongst thepieces that are missing in the
other, framed in the othercircle of uh circle of life.

Kertia (21:36):
So yeah, I totally get that.
Um.
I spoke to someone recently andthey um pointed out that
sometimes when we feel stressedand overwhelmed, it's not
because we don't have enoughtime, it's the energy right.
We're not pouring enough energyinto the things that matters,

(21:59):
in the things that are inalignment with who we are right,
in the things that are trulyimportant for us.
You know, your energy is kindof scattered everywhere else or
you put in too much energy onone aspect of your life, of
course.
So I know most of us feel like,oh, there's not enough time for
this, there's not enough time tospend with my wife, there's not

(22:19):
enough time to play with mykids, right.
But he was so great inexplaining this better than I am
and really structuring yourlife.
When it's work, this is work.
You prioritize those hours forwork and that is completely
different from family time.
One doesn't leak into the nextand vice versa, and that always

(22:44):
determines the outcome that youhave.
The outcome that you have forwork, the outcome you have for
making your wife feel loved andcared for, the outcome that you
have connecting with yourchildren, right, having that
really good structure where youhave everything prioritized and

(23:06):
in its place and not allowingthem to interfere with each
other.

Alain (23:11):
Yeah, I really love what the word you're using there.
You're using the word outcomeand that's really a great thing
for us to remember what is theoutcome that I'm wanting to
achieve with this piece.
You know, this part of thispillar in my life and one of the
things we talk also about isthis idea of work life balance.
People think of that as like ateeter totter and that it needs

(23:32):
to be always level, even, butthat's not really how life works
.
At different times in our lives, that teeter totter is going to
go up and down, just like itshould.
The difference is is that whenyou're consciously aware of
what's happening in your life,you can have the conversations
with your wife, with yourchildren, with your family, to
say that, hey, dad's really busyhere.

(23:52):
I have a major project thatneeds to get done.
I'm going to need to dedicateall of Saturday to work on it,
but I promise that come Saturdaynight we're going to go to a
movie, we're going to dosomething, and then you commit
to that.
You commit to that piece so thefamily understands.
You know you're communicatingabout where you're at, you're
not just assuming and that was achallenge in my first, with my

(24:14):
first marriage and, you know,with my ex-wife, then is that
lots of things.
We took a lot of things forgranted both of us, but this is
a story about me and Mike onlyown where I fell down, and where
I fell down is that took a lotof things for granted, and
instead of having acommunication and speaking like

(24:34):
we're doing today and havingeveryone understand.
It doesn't mean anybody ever ishappy all the time about hearing
that, but it goes a long way.
And as long as we own ourcommitments you know we get off
the when we say we're going tobe done then you'll find that
your, your, your family is muchmore supportive.
Your friends are moresupportive.

(24:54):
Even work will be moresupportive and understand where
you're coming from and you havethat, that truly that balance of
being able to go with the ebband flow of life and be able to
then to execute it at thehighest level possible.

Kertia (25:07):
Yes, exactly, and I love that you mentioned that
communication, effectivecommunication.
To be more precise, how doesall of this tie into what you
said about taking responsibilityand taking purposeful action?

Alain (25:25):
Yeah, great question.
No, it ties in because once weunderstand when there's
something, that there's achallenge or something not
working well in our lives, wecan go back and look at from an
assessment of an inside out.
What is it that I have?
What part did I play in thiscurrent scenario and how could I
have played my part differentlyNot necessarily better, but

(25:48):
differently in order to achievea different outcome?
and once we start from thatperspective and we continue to
own that, assuming that thatthis is things that all I'll
take care of, everything that Ican control, we start to see
things shift and change.
Maybe not immediately, and Ifind working with men sometimes
we're a bit impatient.
We want to see this changes.

(26:09):
Guys who struggle who haven'thad a crucial conversation that,
as I call them, with theirpartner, their spouse, and they
have things that are that arebothering them, and so instead
what they do is they stop it.
We're pretty good at stuffingthings down and then we blow up
and instead it's about havingthat taking the opportunity.
But well, listen, I listen.
I haven't really explained tomy wife the challenges that I'm

(26:32):
having, some of the things thatare going on, and it's going to
be scary because now I'm goingto make I have to allow myself
to be vulnerable enough that shemay not be ready to hear what I
have to say.
It doesn't mean that what you'resaying is being disrespectful.
I coach my men to always berespectful, reminding them that
this is the woman that you'vechose to spend your life with.

(26:55):
So how can you bring across themessage that you need to bring
across and keep her whole andthe relationship whole?
It's going to be messy, guys.
It's going to be messy becausewe're not used to doing this.
And then, as we practice and Ialso encourage them to say that
listen, I need to.
You know, if it was ourconversation, kershia, I'd say
you know, I really have to saysomething.

(27:17):
Kershia, I can't promise thatit's going to come over and come
across great, but please, youknow, do what you can to hear me
out and then go forth.
And I think you find that whenyou come in and you you frame it
in that in that way, you givean opportunity for your partner
to to be open to hearing as bestas she can be at the time, to
hear what you have to say, to beable to have a conversation,

(27:40):
and then that really helps.
It helps move the relationshipforward.
And, trust me, guys, when youstart to do that kind of work,
that kind of communicating,things change.
She didn't change much yet.
She saw you modeling a differentway of being, and that's what
is the attractive piece.
That's what the part is about.
Hey, I know there's a reasonwhy I picked that guy.

(28:02):
There's something there.
He's finally seeing it finallyseeing it.

Kertia (28:11):
You know, when you were speaking about the taking
responsibility part of that, Iwas thinking it is so hard to
take responsibility, especiallywhen that vulnerability aspect
comes in, because there are somany fears and limiting beliefs
involved in that right.
So sometimes I feel like maybeit's not that we do not want to
take the responsibility, butmore so that we avoid it because

(28:34):
it is so scary to kind of bareour souls.
You know, like speaking I'm awoman, but even for me it's the
same thing, right, I think thisgoes for anybody.
Right, you're speaking from aman's perspective, but I think
it applies to also females.
Right, speaking your truth,being vulnerable, being open,

(28:57):
communicating, saying how youfeel you know, admitting your
mistakes it doesn't come easyfor men or women a lot of the
times, because sometimes it'shard to show certain parts of
ourselves.
Sometimes we haven't evenreconciled with ourselves those

(29:17):
parts of ourselves, right, theparts that we are probably not
proud of, the parts that youknow we might perceive as being
shameful or not enough or notdeserving, even experiencing
emotions like, maybe guilt, andthere are just so many things

(29:41):
inside of that.
So how do we takeresponsibility when we are
dealing with all of those things, the fears, the limiting
beliefs.
How do we get from point A topoint B in order to be able to
fully express ourselves andcommunicate and ask for help, if

(30:04):
we need help and say that, hey,this is not working out for me
because of so, so and so, or youknow what I mean.
Like, how do we do that so thatwe can proper take
responsibility?
Because then, when we're ableto do that, we're able to get
more in alignment, right?

Alain (30:21):
Yeah, I completely agree.
And just to build on what yousaid, absolutely, because my
work focuses on men, obviously Icome from that perspective, but
women as well.
We all have challenges in beingvulnerable or allowing
ourselves to be vulnerableenough, and what I learned about
human beings is that, based onthe stories and the history that
we have, we've shaped ourselvesinto a certain way that we

(30:45):
think about something, andthat's where our limiting
beliefs come up play, play.
And so what I would say is Iwouldn't start with the biggest
topic on the table in yourrelationship.
That's probably not the wisestthing to do because, as I said,
it's going to be pretty messybut to take something that's
much smaller and and I wouldactually, and the smallest part

(31:06):
of that would be just sayingwhat we're talking about today.
No, actually, and the smallestpart of that would be just
saying what we're talking abouttoday.
You know, I would like to tryhaving a different, a different
way that we communicate and whensomething that that is
bothering us, a small thingthat's bothering us, that we
take this opportunity topractice speaking and
communicating.
And so one of the things that Iteach men as I teach them I'm

(31:27):
sure you've heard it, heardabout it, your travels, but this
idea of these five differentlevels of intimacy, and it's all
about communication.
And the first level is safecommunication.
That's where many of us stay,right, when we stay in this safe
communication, we don't have toworry about being, about
putting ourselves out there, andthe thing is that it keeps us.
We can guard ourselves, protectourselves, because we're not

(31:48):
really making a commitment.
So we stay in that place.
If we're brave enough, we'regoing to go to the next one and
what we'll do is we're going toutter and talk about other
people's opinions.
Hey, we're opening up the doora little bit here, but guess
what?
It's not my opinion.
Hey, it's what Kirsha said.
So this is what I.
I think is that you know, I'mjust passing it along, and so

(32:08):
we're still kind of safe.
We haven't allowed ourselves toreally express our heart.
And so then the third stage,getting even more open, and I
was talking about having ourpersonal opinion.
But guess what, when I expressmy personal opinion, I can
always change that, becauseguess what?
Life changes, something comesalong, and so I'm still, I'm
committing, but not really.

(32:30):
And what I really work withfolks is to really get into
these next two stages and asmuch as possibly in stage four.
And the stage four is myfeelings and my experiences.
So, just as we started thiswhole conversation here this
evening, talking about myexperiences and my feelings
being vulnerable enough to share, to know that potentially it

(32:51):
may not, my partner may notunderstand that, but it gives
them a glimpse into what's theinner workings of what's going
on, because all they've seen isthis reactionary piece of me and
ultimately we can get to thatpoint of the last level, highest
level, and that's really aboutexpressing my needs.
And so, starting with somethingsimple, it could be as simple

(33:18):
as who's making dinner thisevening and deciding on how that
and how that's happening, andmaybe somebody's home first more
often than the other person,but to be safe enough to say for
that person, who's first, who'shome first and maybe hasn't
been consistently preparing foodand that was an assumption that
was to happen that you can havethat conversation about.
Hey, when I get home from work,work is really draining for me

(33:40):
mentally, you know, maybe nowyou understand a little bit
about yourself.
I'm an introvert and so myenergy is recharged not by being
around other people.
I need some downtime.
I need about half an hour, Ineed 45 minutes.
It's not that I don't love youor care for you, I just need
this time.
When I get this time, then myenergies are or my batteries are
recharged and now I canparticipate.

(34:02):
See, I've been totallyexpressing my needs and wants
for this, for this particularthing, something as simple as
who's making dinner this evening, and because we understand that
about you, understand thatabout me.
Now it's a different mindsetwhen you walk in the door coming
in later, about an hour later,and things aren't ready or they
haven't started.
Because it's not that I don'tcare about you, it's about I'm

(34:25):
having some self-care and I'm abig believer in I'll take care
of me so I can take care of us.
Not that I'll take care of youso you'll take care of me.
There's lots of differentmindsets on that, but I'm a big
believer in I'll take care of meso I can take care of us.
Because, especially when wetalk about relationships, it's a

(34:46):
, especially when we talk aboutrelationships, it's a we
relationship, and so to getthere, we have to take care of
ourselves, our own stuff, so wecan show up.
You know as uh, as best that wecan exactly self-care.

Kertia (35:03):
It's definitely not a selfish act.
We can't pour into others if wehaven't first poured into
ourselves.
Right, we can't pour from anempty cup, as they say.
So that is definitely true.
Self-care is very important.
You mentioned that there arefour things that men lack.

(35:25):
What are those things?

Alain (35:28):
Absolutely.
One of the first things that Irecognize this is how I came
across in doing my work is thatthe first thing that we lack is
commitment Commitment to who weare as men, what we are here to
do.
It's really about understandingwhat is my why, why do I get up
every day?
Why am I going to do something?
So we lack a commitment to whowe are.

(35:48):
The second thing that we lackis we lack clarity on that.
Okay, maybe I understand whatmy why is, but I really haven't
dived into understanding thenuances of what makes that work,
and so one of the things that Iasked my guys to do is to
complete this sentence I'm thekind of man who you can change
that for women as well and thenwhatever you put after that is a

(36:10):
statement about who you arebecoming, and it puts us in
alignment with it, should put usin alignment with our why, and
so, once we're clear, we'reclear that we have, we've got
some commitment now, because I'mshowing up with with who I
describe myself as to be now.
Now I need a compass, I needsomewhere to focus that energy

(36:31):
on, and that's really about thethird step that I ask guys to do
is to prepare a compellingvision statement.
It's their true North Star.
It's who they ultimately aspireto become.
It may be something we neverget to, but it's our vision of
who we are as men.
And the last thing that we lackis we lack a community.

(36:53):
We all have friends, right, wehave a circle of friends, but
I'm not talking about that.
I'm talking about a communitywhere there's people that you
can pick up the phone, no matterwhat's going on in your life,
and you know that they will pickit up and they have your back.
It doesn't mean that theysupport you 100% in all your
decisions, but they're there tohave your back.

(37:13):
And men especially, we tend tohave this lone wolf idea that we
have to do it ourselves, and sowhen we don't have a community
to help lift us up, get us backon the right track, then we tend
to struggle in life, and sothose are the things that I
found that lacked in my life,and I'm finding more and more is
the same thing for other men.

Kertia (37:35):
You know, in this world, with the standards that we have
for men, both men and women,and especially right now we're
talking about men, the standardsthat we have, it is so
sometimes it is just sodebilitating to someone's
manhood right, how would youadvise someone to go about

(38:00):
seeking a community?
Because I can't assume that youknow everyone has that best
friend or that mentor or greatfamily members that are always
there for them.
How can someone seek acommunity, a supportive
community?

Alain (38:21):
Yeah, that's a great question.
There's lots of.
In today's environment, withsocial media and forums, there's
a forum for just about anything.
That's a forum for just aboutanything.
That's a great place to start.
I wouldn't necessarily say thatthat's going to be your final
spot to rest, but it's a greatplace to start.
And because I focus on the men'saspect of life and helping them

(38:42):
out, men's work is becomingmuch more popular and more and
more communities are popping uparound the world and you might
not have one right in your town.
We didn't have one here.
I'm in Winnipeg, manitoba.
There wasn't any men'scommunity.
There is today because I foundthat there was a lack of
community here for men to beable to come in and be

(39:04):
supportive.
So it's out there.
Would suggest you know, lookingat, I said, some forums and some
communities on through facebookand other social media to get
started.
But really reach out and youknow, if you're, if you have a
strong faith, ask your pastor.
There's lots of.
There's lots of churches thathave men's groups.

(39:25):
If that's not your jam,that's's fine.
Look at the wellness aspects.
There's lots of differentwellness communities.
They're going to have peoplethat will be able to point you
in the right direction, or folksthat are focusing on wellness
and, believe it or not, evenwithin hospice and hospital
sessions.
I actually because I advertisein a local wellness newspaper

(39:49):
here have been getting callsfrom hospitals believe it or not
who have clients there that aremen that are struggling with
things, and my heart was reallywarmed when that call came
because it was one of the thingsthat I was struggling just a
few years back when myfather-in-law passed and he was
like, uh, he was wasn't like adad to me, he was like a best

(40:12):
buddy, and we hung out, you know, pretty much every weekend, did
stuff together and and when Ifound him, um hadn't yet passed
away it really shook me and Ineeded to have that place to go,
and grief counseling didn'tquite make it for me.
I did a few of those sessions,but I really needed something
more.
And so there's lots ofdifferent ways that you can find

(40:34):
support for the work you feelyou need to do or need some
answers.
You just Google men's work.
You're going to find stuffpopping up all over the place.

Kertia (40:45):
Today, yeah, that's a really good tip, thank you.
You mentioned your relationshipwith your dad, you guys being
buddies, right, and it made methink back to this question as
to because, of course, thistopic and everything that, all

(41:07):
the work that you're doing, itgoes back to one foundation,
right?
And how can men nurture theirboys so that they can grow up to
have that connection tothemselves, so that they are

(41:30):
better able to identify thoseinternal things that is
happening within them, so thatthey are able to also not only
recognize it but acknowledge itand embrace the vulnerability
and the honesty and theaccountability that it takes to
address that, so that they candevelop?

Alain (41:55):
Yeah, great question.
I think that all starts withyou have to be doing your own
work first really to understandwhat's going on.
And what I mean by that is itdoesn't mean you have to run out
and, you know, do a bunch oftherapy sessions before you get
involved in your, in yourchildren's, lives.
What I'm suggesting is thinkback to how you grow up and what

(42:18):
are the things that weremissing in your life as a child
at that age, at that, at that atyour, at your son or your
daughter's age, what were thethings that were missing and
that you would have appreciatedand would have liked to have?
And when you start from thatperspective, then you can
implement plans to change howyou are.
And that means I'm asking youto be much more present than any

(42:40):
of our fathers could have been.
I'm the oldest of five.
My dad worked extremely hard tokeep a roof over our head.
You know, bills paid,everything.
We didn't have a lot growing up, but we always knew that we
would be like I said.
We had.
We were fed and we had a roofover our head, but we didn't

(43:00):
have a close relationship withmy father, my, my dad.
I didn't have a closerelationship because I didn't
know how to do that, and I thinktoday there's really no excuse
for us to not have closerrelationships and how to have a
conversation, and so what Iwould propose is that, you know,
one of the things I learnedwith my father-in-law who really

(43:23):
, like I said, became really abuddy with me we were buddies is
that you know, we'd go on roadtrips down to minneapolis to
watch the yankees because that'shis favorite baseball team and
that's an eight hour drive forus.
I'd have eight hours in the carto spend time talking to him
about whatever.
Maybe I'm listening to a bookon on there and you know he'd

(43:43):
say, ah, that's a bunch of bs.
And well, why do you think thatdad and we could have a
conversation about life and soget understanding about how did
he come to under to believe that?
and and it's those opportunitiesthat that really showed me that
I'm more present with mychildren, then I can get a
better understanding of of howthey're thinking, what they're

(44:06):
doing and then the other thing Iwould suggest is always be
mindful that you're not tryingto live your life through your
kids, especially here in canada,with lots of hockey and all
that, and sometimes we thinkthat you know the gory days.
I didn't quite make it to thebig show, so I'm pushing my kids
to go a little harder than theyneed to.
Let's face it today's day andage, these kids are playing

(44:28):
hockey 12 months of the year.
That's great if they love it,but if they don't love it, who
are you living this for?
Is it for you, is it for them?
And so, to really be presentand conscious about what's
happening and and ultimately,what that means is we touched on
this earlier is when work dayis over, it's over.
You know, don't go to thehockey game, the basketball game

(44:49):
, the whatever activity the kidsare doing, and your head's down
on the phone for the wholething.
Be present, be there.
They notice that.
They notice.
They will notice what we do farmore than they will do what we
say yeah so it's really aboutmodeling how we want to be, and
especially those of us that Idon't have daughters.

(45:09):
I have two sons, but you know,if I raised a daughter, my with,
with where, things and all thework that I'm doing today, it
would be really how am I?
What am I modeling?
My voice in showing them how Itreat their mom, because that's
how I want them to treat theirwives, their girlfriends.
They're the people that areimportant in their life and if

(45:31):
they see you showing care andcompassion and supportive, it's
a much different.
And don't kid yourself, even atthree and five years old, they
still see it, they sense it,they know what's going on and
that, how we show up in thosemoments, in those quiet moments,
it really speaks loudly abouthow they will ultimately grow up

(45:52):
and show themselves to theworld.

Kertia (45:57):
Absolutely.
You made so many great pointsthere and I think where a lot of
us kind of struggle with thatis so many of us we think that
we can copy and paste parenting.
You know, we do what ourparents did and we apply the
same rules and the sameexpectations and all that stuff,

(46:21):
and it's just like it doesn'twork that way.

Alain (46:25):
I wish it did, but it doesn't.

Kertia (46:29):
It doesn't work that way .
Our parents are, we're human.
They're human too, and theymade some mistakes as well.
And I said this before tosomeone not because they did it
that way, it doesn't mean thatthere isn't a better way to do
it, you know.
It doesn't mean that it wasright, and even if it was okay
enough, it doesn't mean thatthere isn't a better way to do

(46:49):
it.
You know, it doesn't mean thatit was right, and even if it was
okay enough, it doesn't meanthat there isn't a better way to
do it.
So I really love that.
You really touched on that.
You know not putting your owndreams and aspirations on your
children.
Completely being present,presence is such a huge thing
because it's so easy to getdistracted by everything, by all

(47:11):
the stresses andresponsibilities that we have
going on with us.
But, as I said earlier, youknow, having that structure and
when you know that you're unableto, then that is where
conversation and communicationcomes in, where it's just like I
really can't.
But if you're going to say likethis is the time that I'm going
to, you know, put towards thisthing, then you stick to that

(47:35):
and you commit to that.
Right and touches on one of thethings that you said.
Men have an issue withcommitment.

Alain (47:47):
I tell you we sure do.
I just think about how much youknow I.
I said I'm the oldest of fiveand I see how my parents raised
me and then, and then the babyof the family, like he's 12
years, I guess, younger than Iam, at least.
I just said I never got awaywith that stuff.
That's just because theyevolved and they grew and, truth

(48:07):
, truthfully, my brother and Iwore them out, so they retired
after that.
We do struggle with commitment.
We just don't like to do that,for whatever reason.
I still haven't quite figuredout why.
But let me tell you, once theydo commit though, you know we're
all in, and if I can get guysto get all in on their life, you

(48:30):
know, and in all aspects of it,you know this world be a much
better place yeah, definitely Ilove that.

Kertia (48:39):
I love it.
Um.
You mentioned um and what I'veread about you so far about
wisdom and connecting wisdom toyour purpose.
What do you mean by that?

Alain (48:57):
Well, I think the big thing for me with wisdom is
really the idea of unlearning.
You know, there's a Zen sayingit's not quite unlearning, but
it's about learning somethingnew every day, and I always look
at wisdom as that idea ofunlearning.
We talked about a cup beingfull, right, and so when we're

(49:20):
living our purpose, we can liveour purpose and gain wisdom
through three different ways.
Right, the first way we can dothat is through reflection, and
I'm a big fan of that.
To me, reflection is sopowerful.
It's because we get anopportunity to recenter
ourselves, realign ourselves towhat's happening, and I think
Buddha said that was the noblestof the three.

(49:43):
Right, because you're trulyspending time, buddha, or
Confucius, one of those guys outeast.
And then the second really isabout imitating.
Let's face it, that's how we getthrough life.
Right, we learn through doingand doing things that we learn
from other people, and so we'reimitating that work and then
we're refining it, and so that'sa pretty good way to do it, and

(50:06):
it's fairly easy.
You know, you're not reallyhaving to go from scratch
because you're going to imitateit.
But I'll tell you one of themost powerful ways to gain
wisdom, although it can be thebitterest.

(50:26):
Attach it to our vision and ourpurpose in life that the moment
that we decide to lean intosomething, we're going to make
mistakes, and it's through thoseexperiences, when we make
mistakes, that our wisdom grows.
We get an opportunity to learnsomething, get aha moments,
because if we're truly not goingthrough the quagmire of life

(50:48):
and failing for lack of a betterterm we never truly understand
what we can ultimately become.
And so, as we know, a diamondis formed under immense pressure
.
And so how can you become thatdiamond cutter and truly reform
and forge yourself into thebeing, the person that you

(51:11):
ultimately wish to become, ifyou're not willing to lean into
experience and wisdom and gainthat from our lives?

Kertia (51:18):
I like that you described that last one as the
bitterest, because when you'relearning life lessons, you know
reframing those failures aslessons.
It's challenging, right.
It is bitter, it doesn't feelgood, it doesn't look good, it

(51:39):
doesn't feel good, nothing aboutit seems good, but it is how we
learn, it is how we grow.

Alain (51:46):
So I like that you call it the bitterest well, you know,
you'll learn that, especiallyas I learned it anyways, doing
that value exercise I wastalking about earlier, because
what we, what I have discovered,many folks discover when they
do this is what we thought wevalued did serve us at some

(52:07):
point, and so the bitternesscomes from when we recognize
that this particular value nolonger serves me.
So the value of of beingsuccessful for me was being
successful in business, climbingthe proverbial corporate ladder
, and while that served me earlyin my in my career, it
ultimately it cost me so much,and so that lesson was then, you

(52:33):
know, was really loud and clearabout what do I truly value?
And is this one?
Does this serve me any longer?
Because I had competed in theOlympics, I won some medals and
that was great, but does thistruly serve me any longer?
And while I still have apassion to succeed in anything
that I do, I do it now with moreconsciousness and much more

(52:56):
intention, because there's otherthings that are important in my
life too.
It's not an all or nothingproposition any longer, like it
used to be, and so it can bevery bitter.
It's like sucking on that lemon.

Kertia (53:14):
It's a little bit tart, yeah.
And you know what?
The truth is, that sometimesour value system is out of whack
.
Sometimes it is out of whack,sometimes you kind of need to
throw it away and like redo thewhole thing.
And that is why the exerciseyou pointed out earlier is such
a good tool, because when youkind of can write things down

(53:39):
and pinpoint what makes senseand what doesn't make sense and
what truly represents what'sinside of you, because you know
a lot of the things that we aretaught to value, those are
things that someone else told usright, our parents told us, our
teachers told us, institutionstold us, society told us right.

(54:02):
So a lot of the things that weare told, a lot of things that
we value, we were told bysomeone else that these are the
things that we should value, andso at some point you kind of
have to learn how to cancel allof that.
Try to figure out what truly isimportant to you.
Does this make sense, whilethey say that this career is

(54:25):
good?
Is it really?
Is that really what I want?
Does this really interest me?
Does this really?
Is this really in my bestinterest?

Alain (54:35):
Exactly, and that's a great point that you bring up.
There is that a lot of times,what we find when we do a value
assessment, they are borrowed.
And what I mean by that is justwhat you said they're borrowed
from somebody else.
Do I value this?
Because that, just what yousaid they're borrowed from
somebody else, is this?
Do I value this because that'swhat I truly want, or that
because my parents wanted me tobe a doctor?
You know, whatever it is thatyou want to do, and so when we

(54:58):
assess ourselves and we look atthat exercise and we say that
this is truly what I want andthese are and these are the
steps I'm going to take towards,then you can own it.
But but the challenge and youasked earlier about, why do we
struggle the frame in and around, why we struggle to take
ownership and how do we do that?
It's because, more than justtaking ownership may mean you

(55:21):
need to change your circle offriends.
It may mean some people aregoing to leave your life because
you're in a different place.
It doesn't mean I'm not sayingin this interview here that you
know you're going to do thisexercise and go.
Well, that's it.
People are all gone, man.
That's not what I'm saying.
What I'm saying is you need toassess where you're at with
things, and you just may findthat there's other where you had

(55:44):
time, maybe, to go to the barwith your buddies every weekend.
That just isn't as importantanymore, and so maybe that's
every other weekend or it's oncea month, but you do it with
compassion and with care and youhave that conversation.
One of the virtues we have inour work is brotherhood, and one

(56:04):
of the exercises I ask the guysto go through is that.
One of the things that's reallybad for men is that when we end
a relationship with another guy, it just gets cut off.
There's no conversation,there's nothing.
They don't have a hot clue.
You don't have a hot clue why arelationship ended, and so what
I ask them to do is to reachout to somebody that they
haven't spoken to in at leastfive years and talk to them
about where you're at and whyyou haven't spoke with them,

(56:25):
because they and talk to themabout where you're at and why
you haven't spoke with them,because they don't know.
They have their own idea, andthe power behind that is that we
get an opportunity to see thatour values and our lives have
changed and so has theirs, andmaybe there's an opportunity to
reconnect and maybe there isn't,and that's okay, but it gives

(56:47):
an opportunity for us to reallyfind out who those people are
that can start to form ourcommunity.
It could be within a men'sgroup or a different group, but
that's another way to reallyfind that community those people
that you can pick up the phoneand know that they're going to
have your back and they're goingto be there.
That you can pick up the phoneand know that they're going to

(57:10):
have your back and they're goingto be there, and uh, and so I
think that's really really keyin how we grow and evolve as uh,
you know, as communities ingeneral.
Right, there's so muchdivisiveness today.
You know it's either, you know,depending whether it's a
political spectrum or what haveyou.
It seems like we're divided allthe time, and the reality of it
is is that we're not that muchdifferent.
You and I, we get up everymorning with the same desires to

(57:32):
live a happy, healthy life, youknow, to live as fulfilled as
we can if we have children, toraise happy and healthy children
as best that we can.
We all have the same commongoals.
But today's world is so easy toto be divisive and separate us
and let outside influencesdictate who we are as

(57:52):
individuals, as communities, andwe need to stop doing that.
We need to stop doing that.
Just men need to stop doingthat and start taking leadership
roles in their families and intheir communities, and just as
well as as women as well, to beable to be in that and lean into
their, to their power as well,and I think when we do that, we
can take control of our lives ina much more powerful state than

(58:15):
we're doing today.
Sorry, political rant there.

Kertia (58:20):
I love that.
Absolutely correct.
I agree with everything youjust said.
That was, yeah, so much truthin that.
And what stood out to me whenyou were speaking about the
friends and the people that weassociate with, I began to think
that may be a part of,sometimes, why it is so hard to

(58:44):
reassess our values, reassesswhat we truly do want.
Reassess our values, reassesswhat we truly do want.
Or maybe, if we truly know whatwe want, we are just afraid to
take those next steps to getthere.
Sometimes it's hard to let go.
Sometimes it's that fear ofletting go, the fear of losing

(59:06):
the familiarity, the fear oflosing the circle that you're
accustomed to, the friends oreven family members, right,
sometimes, in order to take thatnext step to where you want to
be, sometimes it is necessary todistance yourself from certain
habits, from certain people,whether they be relatives or not
.
That fear in what will thisrelationship look like if I go

(59:29):
left, right, when I know withinmy hearts of hearts that they're
not ready to go left with me?
Right?
What will that look like?
And it's just that fear ofletting go of the things and the
people that are so familiar tous that has offered us this
space of comfort, right?

(59:51):
So I think that goes hand inhand with what you just said
there, right?
Sometimes it is necessary todistance ourselves.
It doesn't mean that we nolonger love them, we no longer
care, but sometimes doing whatis necessary for our own
development means that we haveto let go of some things,

(01:00:12):
whether it be temporary orpermanent, right.
But it gets so personal, soit's so hard.

Alain (01:00:22):
Absolutely, and this you know.
Thank you so much for bringingthat forward, because you're
absolutely right, and that's whydoing this work alone is so
challenging and difficult andwhy it's so important to find
community, regardless of whereyou're at, because some of those
changes are going to be reallypainful.
Now let me just throw this atyou as well.

(01:00:42):
So one of the things that we doin business, we do this thing
called root cause analysis, andI've been incorporating it more
and more in our work.
And what a root cause analysisis is to take a look at a
challenge or a problem thatyou're facing in a process.
And so, you know, let's use theexample like go back to the
example of who's making dinnertonight and you're frustrated

(01:01:05):
about it, and so you'refrustrated about why somebody
isn't making dinner.
So what's the root cause ofthat?
Well, initially we might thinkwell, it's because they don't
care for me.
Okay.
Well, if that's true, why isthat important?
Well, it's important becauseI'm dedicating my life to this
person and they're not takingcare of me.
Why is that important?

(01:01:25):
Why is it important thatsomebody take care of me?
Well, if somebody takes care ofme, then that means that I'm
loved and I'm appreciated Great,so why is it important that
you're loved and appreciated?
Well, if I'm loved andappreciated, it means that I'm
supported Great, so why does itmean that?
So why is that important?
Why is being supportedimportant to you?
And ultimately, you get down toa point usually it takes about

(01:01:47):
five asking yourself why fivetimes.
And you, you get down to apoint usually it takes about
five asking yourself why fivetimes?
And you'll get to the point ofpretty much all the time is that
I'm going to be alone andnobody will take care of me.
And that, I'm telling you, is aroot issue for many of our
problems today in society isthat we are going to be kicked
off the proverbial island.
We're going to be left on ourown to fend for ourselves, and

(01:02:08):
we don't know if we can make it.
The truth of the matter is isthat, while you may feel alone,
a relationship ends, you knowand I've been through that
before where it felt like therewas just no way I was going to
recover.
And the truth of the matter isis that we recover and even if

(01:02:28):
you don't have a community, youdon't have people around right
now to support you.
Those people are there readywhen you're ready, and so I beg
people, I urge people, to trulylook at their lives and assess,
using a bit of a root causeanalysis to find out what's
really underlying, and that'swhat we're trying to uncover.

(01:02:48):
It's not the first piece.
It's much deeper than that andultimately it's going to come
around to some.
Fear is hiding something.
Sometimes it can be hidingshame from a past trauma, and so
you're protecting yourself fromthat, and other times it's this
fear of being alone andabandoned, which is pretty

(01:03:10):
prevalent in today's society aswell.
But when we recognize thatthere that today we've had,
there's no shortage ofinformation, there's no short of
space for people to be able toplug into that, what it all it
takes is for you to reach out.
There's somebody there tosupport you, and so it's really
important and key in my heart totry to do whatever I can do to

(01:03:35):
lower the statistics of suicidefor men.
You know, as you know, thestatistics today is that we're
five times more likely to commitsuicide than women, and the
reason for that is that becausewe'll take a very dramatic step
to make it happen, and it's allbecause there's fear, there's
anxiety, there's depression,because we're holding so much

(01:03:57):
inside and we just don't knowhow to process it.
We just don't know how to getthrough that through the woods.
And you get through it bysurrounding yourself with men
who have been on that path, whoare on that path.
As I always say, we need threedifferent mentors in our life.
We need somebody to mentor us,someone who's down the path just

(01:04:20):
a little bit further maybe alot further, but down the path
who can guide us towards wherewe're going.
Then we need to be a mentortowards where we're going.
Then we need to be a mentor.
We need to be a mentor tosomebody that is coming up and
we're the one further down thepath.
And then, thirdly, we needmentors to be together.

(01:04:41):
So we need brothers and sistersto go together on the journey,
because the journey goes.
If you want to go fast, go byyourself, as the saying says,
and if you want to go far, yougo with others.
And so I think it's soimportant that the work that
needs to be done in today'sworld and you know, I know

(01:05:02):
you're doing some great work aswell with this podcast and other
things just really importantthat we continue to lean into
that and we reshape the visionof a world that works for
everyone loved everything youjust said, and speaking about
that and suicide and um, allthose things that come along
with with that issue is justthat reminder that there's

(01:05:22):
always a community there is.

Kertia (01:05:25):
you're not alone.
There are others who have facedthe same things that you are
facing right now.
There is someone who have gonethrough the worst of it all and
have found a way to come out ofit, and you know you being able
to reach out, you know, and askfor help and or ask questions

(01:05:49):
and ask for support, can makesuch a huge difference.
So I love everything that youjust said.
Thanks, awesome.
So can you please tell myfollowers how they can find you,
how they can reach out to you?

Alain (01:06:08):
yeah, absolutely so.
You can find me on my websiteat theawakendemannet, and when
you go to the website right now,there's a pop-up, and as soon
as you show up there and it's onthe pop-up, there's an
opportunity to get a freeworkbook.
And the workbook is yourtransformational promise, and so
what this workbook does is anopportunity to reflect on how

(01:06:28):
this past year has gone.
Now you can do this exerciseanytime, but as we're closing
out the year, it's anopportunity to reflect, and if
you sign up for that, you'll getonto my newsletter.
You'll get a lot of other greatinformation On top of that.
When you sign up for thatworkbook, you're also going to
get another tool that I providefolks.
It's a goal assessment tool.
It gives an opportunity for youto truly do some of that value

(01:06:52):
exercise.
We look at a little bit ofteasing, a little bit with
limiting beliefs, and then it'san opportunity for you to make
some goals based on what yourtransformational promise will be
, and there's also a visioningmeditation in there.
It's an opportunity for you todo some regular visioning.
It's something different a lotof guys may not be familiar with
, but it's work that I was doingin my on my spiritual journey

(01:07:15):
that I found really helped me inhoning in, on understanding the
things I needed to let go of inmy life, the things I need I
should be embracing, I canembrace about my life and to
ultimately become the man that Iaspire to be, and so it's a
great tool, works for anybody.
Go to the member, totheawakenmannet, and grab that

(01:07:36):
tool.

Kertia (01:07:37):
Thank you so much for sticking it out this far.
Now, I'm currently doing a rootcause analysis on some of the
sticky areas in my life, so ifyou've decided to try this out,
I'd love to hear what you'vediscovered.
Again, thank you so much forlistening and thank you so much
for your support.
If you'd like to support usfurther, join our Patreon

(01:07:59):
community and share this podcastwith your friends and family.
Thank you,