Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
ladies and gentlemen,
now we're going to talk the
bigger end of town.
We're going to talk about eoi.
We're going to talk abouttender.
When you see this advertised byreal estate agents on
properties, what does it mean?
Stay tuned, I'm the ringleader,so let's go.
(00:31):
Michael Bergio.
Speaker 2 (00:37):
Welcome to Morning
Minutes Myself, Michael Bergio,
Mark Novak.
Episode 1460 Tender versusexpressions of interest.
What does it mean and what typeof properties typically use
this?
Because I find there arecertain properties this is great
(00:58):
for and then it's quite oftenjust thrown out there by agents
who just don't want to put aprice on it and don't know what
else to say in the box.
So I think it's very importantto go through when it should be
used, what is it and some keytips, Because I know over the
years, Mark, we've done manyexpression of interest and
tenders and there's definitelythings we do differently after
(01:22):
the 10th, 100th time than we didin the first time and we go
that's golden.
We need to always use that,always have that condition, have
that dialogue.
But I think maybe, first of all, maybe let's go through the
definitions.
What's the difference betweenan expression of interest or a
tender?
(01:42):
A lot of people think they'rethe same things, but there are
some big key differences.
Speaker 1 (01:48):
Yep, auction is
auction, private treaty is when
it's an advertised price.
But then you've got this EOItender process and it's rare.
You don't see it out there muchwith.
You don't see it out there atwith um.
You don't see it out there atall um, I guess for most people.
But then when you sort of startgetting over sort of three or
(02:12):
four million with um, commercialindustrial properties and
development sites, then youstart seeing it appear um, it's
very rare that you'll have anauction on a development site
where you get all the developersturning up in the one room.
They'll do tender.
Speaker 2 (02:32):
Yeah, or expression
of interest.
So just to run through foranyone watching, an expression
of interest is the method ofsale, typically when, instead of
just submitting a price likeyou would in a private treaty,
you're basically filling out aform and each sale is different.
But there's basically questionswithin that form prices
(02:54):
included, how long yoursettlement is.
Is it four weeks?
Is it 20 weeks?
A lot of time.
They're asking where yourfinance is coming from.
This is very important in adevelopment sale to know if you
have finance approval, if it'syour own money, because
sometimes an owner will choose abuyer who is either an all cash
(03:15):
buyer or they've got, say,funding from Commonwealth Bank
compared to a lower tier funderor overseas, and typically the
big difference.
Speaker 1 (03:26):
You don't ask that at
auction.
Speaker 2 (03:27):
No, you don't ask
that.
There's a big differencebetween the expression of
interest and the tender.
With the tender you'rebasically obligated to have the
check with your documents, havethe signed contract.
So it's very similar to anauction where if you're the
final highest bidder, you buythe property.
(03:48):
The money's there.
Expression of interest is alittle bit different because
there's a lot of times where anowner doesn't want to do auction
because they're looking forother terms within the sale.
They may be wanting a longsettlement.
So even if there's two buyersat the same price or one buyer
higher, they may pick the lowerbuyer for the terms within that
(04:11):
offer.
So an expression of interest isthe best method to be able to
identify other terms within theoffer and then the owner can
choose.
Speaker 1 (04:22):
So I remember we had
one out towards Worrywood where
we had 19 tenders submitted onthe property and it was the most
in 10 days.
So the owners came to us andsaid oh, we've got an offer of
10.365.
Do you think you can get more?
We've been dealing with thisperson for over a year.
(04:44):
We're happy to take that.
What do you reckon?
Here's the person that wants tobuy.
Can you just deal with them?
Happy to pay a commission?
We turned around and said look.
I turned around and said giveus 10 days, let us go crazy with
our marketing.
10 days later, 19 tenders.
(05:06):
We sat at the conference tablein the office with grandma they
are there and the grandchildrenand we laid all of these tenders
out on the table, 19 of them.
And the thing that the tenderallowed is it allowed us to get
into the undies of every buyerto understand the guts, the
(05:27):
stomach, the head, the shoulders, the whole whole structure of
that purchaser.
Where you don't get that in theauction, you sort of get this
part.
You know the top, you know what, you see the person With tender
.
You've got everything elsebelow as well as that.
You know asking.
You're entitled to ask thequestions.
(05:49):
The buyers don't have to givethe perspective, tenderers don't
have to give the answers, buthow they wish to fund it super
important.
I think you feel refreshed whenyou see a big bank on there, as
opposed to private lending.
When you're selling it tosomeone, you know they're going
to fund it easier.
(06:10):
I think question I love on thetender form is who they, who
they are going to use to resellthe stock.
Now, if you think about thepsychology there, you want to
make sure the agent's notpreferencing the offer maker or
the tender maker because they'regoing to get the listing.
(06:32):
So sometimes I see agents shapethe deal towards a specific
purchaser because they're gonnaget to sell all the ten units or
the hundred units in the block.
And I want to know that whenI'm selling, when I'm selling it
to someone and I'm the vendor,the seller, I want to know is
(06:53):
that agent going to be sellingthat stock?
I just want to know anotherthing that I love that that's in
, that's in our tenders that weput together is a deadline and a
non-commitment that we will saywhen will you be available If
you are the successful andhighest tenderer, when will you
execute that contract and paythat check?
(07:14):
And we're going to hold you toa deadline as well.
So we will hold you to that aswell.
So when we will hold you tothat and if you don't execute on
that desired date, we willqueue up a second buyer, because
there's so much energy in thattender that you don't want to
lose that energy yeah, andthat's very important and it's
often missed and I know wedidn't have it in our first ones
, which we've learned from, andit's never, no one, it's not a
(07:39):
google, it's never written.
Speaker 2 (07:40):
I've never seen
anyone else mention this.
Until you get to a scenariowhere you put so much energy in
those 10 days to get as manybuyers to that listing as you
can and people may, and that 10year, that 10 days, is like the
amalgamation of all your 10 or30 years in the industry of
(08:01):
calling because you've got preptime.
So people may think, well, it'sonly 10 days, but you've got
prep time for a few days thatyou're calling thousands of
people to introduce them, thatthis is going live.
Now you run the campaign, youget the highest offer maker, so
the other 18, a lot of theirmomentum is gone because they
(08:22):
know they haven't been thehighest and the big issue, the
person who's got the highest,like your normal rule of thumb
is to exchange within the fivedays.
But five days goes past, tendays go past and it's sort of
like when can you start talkingto the second underbidder to
exchange without losingcredibility and your integrity
(08:47):
as the agent and the vendor withthe sale?
Because it's a very smallcommunity, that development
world, and if word gets aroundthat you're running an EOI
tender campaign and you don'treally follow the campaign, then
they're not going to submittenders, they're not going to
bother and it doesn't work.
So it's very important touphold the integrity of the
(09:11):
method.
So once 10 days goes past fromwhen the end of the campaign was
, if you still haven't exchanged, the second highest bidder may
have bought something else, thethird may have bought something
else.
So it's very important to havethat.
If you have not exchanged forexample, if you have not
(09:32):
exchanged within five days, wewill pursue the second highest
offer maker to exchangeimmediately.
So one from the owner's pointof view, you really want that
pressure put on the buyer thatthey could basically lose it
without warning, without notice,even though they've had plenty
of warning because in thedocument and they're the ones
(09:52):
who have been screwing around.
So it's not like they'reblindsided and obviously you try
and make a call.
But the point of it is to havethat deadline in there that
gives you the authority toexchange with another um
purchaser and still uphold theintegrity of the sale method
moving forward, because we'reworking for the owner and it's
(10:15):
not in the owner's best interestif we just spend a month.
I've seen agents spend monthsafter an EOI trying to exchange
with that person.
And a real savvy.
What a real savvy?
Savvy is probably a polite wordto say.
Developer can and will, andsome do.
They drag it on as long as theycan until they know all the
(10:38):
other underbidders are gone andthen they'll reduce their offer.
And what are you going to do?
They'll?
Are you gonna do?
They'll thrash it.
You can't run the EOI againbecause you go back to those
under bidders and you can't say,oh, we got, we got slow rolls.
They go.
They don't believe it becausethey think, well, if you're an
agent representing this type ofasset, you shouldn't be getting
slow rolled.
(10:59):
So something's wrong with thesite.
We're not interested.
So it's very important to knowthis going into an EOI or a
tender process.
Speaker 1 (11:16):
And how many times
we've had that happen, michael,
where what we've done is we'vehad, when we've said, okay,
right, you wanted five days,you've got five days to exchange
.
We've gone back to the numbertwo tenderer, the second highest
tenderer, and we've said, look,if it's not exchanged in five
days, we're going to ask you fora signed contract and check how
many times they've actuallyprepared that signed contract
(11:39):
and check out of conviction thatsecond buyer and sometimes even
put a little bit more money ontop as a surprise.
The first buyer has had theright amount of time that they
asked for in their tender andthey didn't perform on executing
a signed contract.
The second one comes in, it'ssold, we have it happen.
(12:03):
An experienced agent will run ahard tender process like that
Very rare, but you've got to beexperienced to run that sort of
stuff.
And another thing is also anexperienced agent will run
sometimes around two or aroundthree in the tender process.
So once we you know, forinstance, that one I was talking
(12:24):
about with 19, we will sit withthe owner and say, here's our
top five or here's our top three, and the owner goes, yes, we
agree with that.
The seller goes, yes, we agreewith that.
And then they say but I reallylike these terms or I really
like this price.
(12:45):
And then we'll say okay, we'llinvite these three people into
round two and we'll see if wecan mold them into your terms,
conditions and prices yeah, andthat just, and then the vendors
got the best, um so muchconfident that they've got the
best price because they've goneback multiple times.
Speaker 2 (13:05):
It's just not.
It's not just like a one offerand set and forget.
It's as you said.
These are because with thetender, you get option, option
offers.
So it's a lot of the time yourule them out and then you get
some that want a two-yearsettlement.
Rule them out and then you, asyou said, you're left with your
best five and you can reallymassage that to.
And that's the great thingabout the eo tender your owner
(13:28):
can tell you what they reallywant as well.
Yes, best price, but a lot oftime it's settlement.
Sometimes it's they want aproperty back in the development
.
Sometimes they want a buyerwho's done a development locally
because they're going to liveacross the road and they want to
watch a beautiful buildingbeing built and they do care
about who buys it.
So it just allows extraquestions being asked and to
(13:50):
make sure, because, as much aspeople think the development
game is just like raining money,it's a tough business.
It's a tough business for thedevelopers, it's tough for the
owners selling developmentsbecause they get told so much
crap misled and it's just verytough all around Heartbroken.
Yeah, very heartbroken theamount of times where I've come
(14:13):
across where because a lot ofpeople put developers all in a
bucket, like if there's adevelopment company and they're
paying some fresh 18 year old toknock doors to find out people
who own homes, who doesn't knowwhat a unit is to, to a duplex,
to a townhome, that homeowner,if that, oh, maybe you could do
(14:33):
five stories here where itclearly says in the planning you
only can do two.
I've seen those owners livewith that for decades.
I can do five stories here.
A developer told me.
But it's like that's not adeveloper.
Within a company that dodevelopments sometimes there are
only one developer who is thedeveloper, the rest are workers
(14:58):
who don't?
have that experience.
But foot soldiers, the footsoldiers, and it's um, it's,
yeah.
It's a lot of heartbreak forowners that they take that by
face value and they just livewith it and it can be.
Speaker 1 (15:10):
I've seen people who
thought they were sitting on a
gold mine for retirement realizethey're not sitting on anything
and it's not it's sad, butthese properties that like to
give an idea the value thattender can add, with that
example I gave at the beginning,where the owner was happy to
trade it at ten, three, six,five gave us the buyer.
(15:32):
The actual buyer made a tender,was one of the nine ten tender,
as was probably of the 910tenderers, was probably in the
bottom five in terms of theiroffer.
We ended up selling at $12million.
So we got $1.7 million morethan the owner inspected within
two weeks, 10 days, and I know Ithink there was value there.
Yes, you do pay your agent, youknow 2%, but I think the value
(15:53):
is absolutely.
Yes, you do pay your agent, youknow you know 2%, but I think
the value is absolutely enormousthat we could run that process.
And something I've got to stressalso, with tender is the person
going to get to the finish line?
Yeah, so when you're, whenyou're selling to someone, I've
seen these development signsfall over because they want
maybe a long settlement or theywant um.
(16:14):
You know they're not funding itum, or you know through um, the
big four banks, you know theydon't really have the money, um,
and the owner goes greatcheering.
I sold it on an option uh, on atwo years and the buy-in never
fulfills and the property fallsback in their lap two years
later.
So that whole tender processallows you and a good agent
(16:37):
allows you to compress all ofthose terms, conditions and make
sure that it's actually themost ideal sale for the seller.
It's almost like auctioning onthe fly.
Imagine going into an auctionshowroom, auction room and then
actually stopping the auctionand sitting down with the vendor
and the buyer and then startingthe auction again and sitting
(17:00):
down with another buyer and thesame vendor.
It's quite unique.
It's an on-the-fly auction in away.
Speaker 2 (17:07):
Tender, I love it, I
love it and just almost closing
off because nearly everydevelopment.
Speaker 1 (17:15):
We have talked a lot.
We did get a bit excited today.
Speaker 2 (17:17):
I love the topic, I
love developments, I love it all
and especially when there'sjust a method that no real other
agents are implementing and ifthey are definitely not.
Like this, with the stages andknowing those questions at the
end just like a rule.
Like I've been doing what realestate 15 years it feels like
(17:39):
I'm getting old, yeah, but theamount of time someone's got a
development site and they alwayssay I've got this developer,
I've got this neighbor I havenever had in my long 15 years.
I've never had that person buythe property.
We've always gotten more moneywhen going to the open market
(18:02):
and it gave me a head spin formany years.
But I sort of came to theconclusion that your neighbour's
almost the worst buyer for theblock because they bought their
block so long ago at such alower price when, when they
start talking about the newmarket value, they always can't
(18:24):
comprehend paying for that whenthey know what they paid for
theirs.
I see all the time in commercialleasing the psychology of it,
where I remember selling abuilding where the tenants were
paying $50 a square metre inrent.
Cheap had been increased in 20years.
The market was $300 per squaremetre.
The new owner said we'll justdo it to $200.
(18:46):
And none of them would agree.
And they all hit the roof.
They all moved out sayingthat's crazy pricing and it's
because they had a price intheir mind that's so much lower.
They just can't come to it.
And that's like that worry runs.
A perfect example I rememberthe auction I did in west street
brookvale.
We have three neighbors andthey were all out very early.
(19:09):
So it's um, yeah, it's veryimportant to sort of do that
expression of interest, do thattender and put it to the
marketplace.
Speaker 1 (19:19):
It's always better to
sell retail than wholesale when
you're the seller.
Speaker 2 (19:23):
Can't sell a secret.
Speaker 1 (19:25):
No Good on you,
michael Berger.
Guys hope we helped you outtoday with the difference of
tender EOI and what they are inthe marketplace.
Love ya, see ya.