When Tragedy Transforms: Finding Purpose Through Family Challenges with Charles Manning

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What does it mean to be the quarterback of your family? Charles Manning, founder of Face the World and lacrosse enthusiast, takes us on a deeply personal journey through his experiences as a father, grandfather, and leader in business and sport.

Growing up in Australia as one of five siblings, Charles shares how a childhood tragedy transformed his family when his younger brother was hit by a car at age five. Rather than breaking his family apart, this challenge taught Charles profound lessons about empathy, service, and unconditional love that would shape his approach to fatherhood and leadership. "From tragedy quite often comes blessings," Charles reflects, explaining how this pivotal moment ultimately led him to meet his wife and create the life he now cherishes.

The conversation dives into the core values that guide Charles as a father – service, abundance, and patience. With remarkable candor, he explores his struggle to overcome what he calls the "Italian fire up" – a tendency toward emotional reactions that he's worked to temper throughout his life. "The higher the emotions get, the lower the level of intelligence is put on the table," he explains, offering a powerful insight for parents everywhere.

Perhaps most valuable is Charles's framework for understanding the "drama triangle" and why many parents fall into the trap of rescuing rather than teaching their children. "Our job as a parent is not to rescue, it's to teach," he emphasizes, challenging listeners to become facilitators who help their children develop problem-solving skills. He also introduces the concept of energy givers versus energy takers, providing a lens through which we can evaluate our impact on others.

Whether you're early in your parenting journey or reflecting on a lifetime of fatherhood, Charles's wisdom about cultivating curiosity, practicing patience, and leaving a meaningful legacy will inspire you to become not just a better parent, but a better human. Listen now and discover how to lead your family with both strength and heart.

Please don't forget to leave us a review wherever you consume your podcasts! Please help us get more dads to listen weekly and become the ultimate leader of their homes!

Episode Transcript

Speaker 2 (00:03):
Hi, I'm Riley and I'm Ryder and this is my dad show.
Hey, everybody, it's CaseyJaycox with the quarterback dad
cast.
Welcome to season six, and Icould not be more excited to
have you join me for anotheryear of fantastic episodes and
conversations really unscriptedand raw and authentic

(00:25):
conversations with dads.
If you're new to this podcast,really it's simple.
It's a podcast where weinterview dads, we learn about
how they were raised, we learnabout the life lessons that were
important to them, we learnabout the values that are
important to them and really welearn about how we can work hard
to become a better quarterbackor leader of our home.
So let's sit back, relax andlisten to today's episode on the
Quarterback Dadcast.

(00:45):
Well, hey, everybody, it'sCasey Jaycox with the
Quarterback Dadcast.
We're in season six and we'regoing to the opposite side of
the world, everybody.
It's spring coming to summerand we're going to go talk to a
gentleman.
It's crisp fall, saturdaymorning and we're recording on a
Friday which he's thereSaturday, which always trips me
out when this type of thingshappen.
But, thanks to the wide worldof the internet, we're going to

(01:08):
have a conversation today andour next guest is Charles
Manning.
He's the founder of Face theWorld.
We're going to learn all aboutthat.
More importantly, he's a dad,he's a grandpa, he's a fantastic
lacrosse player and I onlylearned that because of a friend
, a client, a former podcastguest.
The one and only MarkAgostinelli said I got a guy you

(01:28):
got to talk to and so we had aprep call.
But I'm saving majority of myquestions for now and we're
going to let curiosity drive afantastic conversation.
But I'm excited to welcome tothe quarterback podcast our next
guest, mr Charles Manning.

Speaker 1 (01:43):
Casey, thank you, it's great to be on the show.
I don't know the last time I'veheard myself called mr charles
manning, but sounds very formal.
But yeah, yeah, well it justcame to me just came to me.

Speaker 2 (01:56):
Um, all right.
Well, we always start out eachepisode gratitude, so tell me,
what are you most grateful foras a dad today or granddad today
?

Speaker 1 (02:03):
Well, what I'm grateful for is tomorrow morning
we get on a plane and fly up toIndonesia, to Bali, for 12 days
, but my grandson's coming, sowe're going up for a wedding in
Bali and my daughter and herhusband are coming up, so I get
to have like 10 days of justspending all that time in the

(02:24):
pool with my grandson.
So I'm really grateful for theopportunity to do that, and
Bali's beautiful too.
Just can't wait to get thereagain.
How long a flight is?

Speaker 2 (02:34):
that?
How long a flight fromAustralia is that?

Speaker 1 (02:37):
yeah, it's from Adelaide, it's just over four
and a bit hours.
Yeah, it's, indonesia's ourclosest neighbour, new Zealand's
our next closest neighbour, butIndonesia and part New Guinea
are the two closest ones.
Indonesia's an archipelago ofthousands of islands and Bali's
one of the Hindu ones, so it'sgot this beautiful, beautiful,

(02:59):
peaceful culture and, yeah, andyou go and hang out it's like
Americans going to Mexico, I'mguessing or down to and hang out
.
It's like americans going tomexico, I'm guessing, or down to
the caribbean, and it's verycheap, like um.
At the moment we can probablyfly return for about 300
american dollars for a returnflight to bali, and
accommodation and food's prettycheap up there too.

Speaker 2 (03:22):
Wow, I'm, I'm jealous .
That sounds amazing.

Speaker 1 (03:26):
Yeah, that sounds amazing, but I'll say it in an
American accent for you a bally.

Speaker 2 (03:30):
Okay, there we go.
Nice Well, what I'm mostgrateful for today I get to
watch my daughter playbasketball this weekend, and I
got my mom in town.
She's going to come watch mydaughter play hoop.
We'll spend Mother's Day withboth my mom in town.
She's going to come watch mydaughter play hoop.
We'll spend Mother's Day withboth my mom and my wife, which
will be great, so we'llcelebrate them together, and

(03:51):
then I travel all next week, butI'm going to just enjoy the
weekend, watch some hoop, playgolf with my mom and enjoy the
weekend ahead.

Speaker 1 (03:59):
Beautiful.
I will share with you that inAustralia, tomorrow is Mother's
Day.
I think we have it at adifferent time of the year.
It's not Mother's Day there isit.

Speaker 2 (04:09):
It's tomorrow.
Sorry, we're on Sunday.
We're on Sunday.

Speaker 1 (04:12):
Okay, so Father's Day is different, so for us
Father's Day is September.

Speaker 2 (04:16):
Okay we're.
June for Father's Day.

Speaker 1 (04:20):
So we've got a Father's Day dinner tonight and
our two local football teams inthe National League and our two
local football teams in theNational League have got their
game against each other tonight.
So I normally have tickets tothat game and we're staying home
for Mother's Day dinner becausewe've got to get up at four in
the morning to catch this plane.
But it'll be beautiful, thefamily will be here tonight and

(04:40):
we'll have a dinner and then goto bed and go to Bali.

Speaker 2 (04:43):
There we go.
God, it sounds fantastic.
Well, I can't wait to see pics.
So please share a few when youget back.
I'd love to see.
I think once my I think my wifeand I definitely have plans to
travel more of the world once weget to that next stage, once we
get kids into college or out ofcollege.
Well, bring me inside theManning huddle.

(05:04):
So for for the, the theme ofthis podcast is kind of like we
we we treat dads like thequarterback, and so sometimes
dad's going to be the one incharge, sometimes he's going to
take a step back and let mom bein charge, and so quarterback
isn't always the one.
It's the biggest voice, it'sthe one with the biggest like
influence and trying to bringpositivity.
So you have an opportunity toinfluence your kids, your

(05:25):
grandkids.
So I'd love to just learn alittle bit about who's inside
the Manning huddle right now.

Speaker 1 (05:31):
Yeah, beautiful question.
Well, I'm a father of two.
My son is the youngest, kurt,he's 27.
He's just got engaged.
He actually did that up in Balia couple of weeks ago, so we've
got a connection with Balithere.
And my daughter, eva, she's 30.

(05:51):
And both of them playedlacrosse as kids and spent a lot
of time with Mark Gastinelliwhen he was here and, yeah,
great connections there.
But my daughter actually worksin our business at the moment
and was looking at becoming aconsultant as well, doing the
work that we do.
But she's got in there andrealized, you know, just, it's

(06:14):
probably not the role for herbecause of a couple different
reasons.
But she is so skilled andgifted at it now clients love
her and she could definitelymake it a role.
But, um, she's trying tobalance the whole thing up of
how do you make it work whilstbeing a mum and a wife and all
those sort of things.
But she's still happy playingthe role she's playing for us in

(06:35):
the business.
My beautiful wife Janice, wemet when we were 17.
So I'm about to turn 60 nextmonth, so we've been together
for a very long time, but she'sdefinitely the glue in our whole
unit.
I'm not sure what positionshe'd be playing in American

(06:56):
football.

Speaker 2 (06:57):
We'll call the general manager.

Speaker 1 (06:59):
There you go, there you go.
That is definitely what she'scalled here too.
Yeah, and she's my best friendand we spend a lot of people go.
I don't know how you two spendso much time working together,
because we do a lot ofassignments together.
We both did the same master'sdegree at university, which was

(07:22):
pretty much in behavioralscience.
But she doesn't want to be aconsultant at the front of the
room, but she sits back and, asyou know, you pick up so much
data from listening toconversations, watching
behaviors, and she is just thisriver of information when we're
on assignments with clients.
But her role is quite oftenwhen we're running workshops in

(07:45):
the back of the room and, um,riding shotgun with the venue
and just making sureeverything's ready for the next
session, capturing all the stuffout of that session, watching
for participants well-beings andjust being, um, yeah, my, my
right-hand guy really, but inthe family you should know so

(08:07):
much more than that.
Yeah, so that's really the innercircle and I'm one of five kids
, I'm the middle of five, and myolder brother is one of my.
Really he's a really great mate.
He's got a couple of adultchildren the same age and we're
just really tight and, yeah, wedon't always see each other for
a couple of adult children thesame age and we're just really
tight.
And, yeah, we don't always seeeach other for a couple of

(08:28):
months and he only lives 40minutes up the road, but we've
just got a really beautifulconnection.
So I'd definitely put him inthat inner circle and my nephew
would be upset if I didn'tmention him.
I've got a nephew that'splaying in the same lacrosse
team with me today.
He's 40.
He's 20 years younger than me.
He's in his 40s.

(08:48):
I just gave him a couple ofcredit years.
He's actually probably about 42, 43.
Yeah, and he plays in theattack line and I play goalie.

Speaker 2 (09:00):
So yeah, that's the inner circle there and you have
some grandkids too.
Did I hear that?
Yeah, just the one circle thereand you have some grandkids too
.
Did I hear that?

Speaker 1 (09:05):
Yeah, just the one William.
We just call him Will.
He's three.
Okay, he's gone around with alacrosse stick now.
So yeah, a lot of fun.

Speaker 2 (09:18):
There you go.
Well, that's cool.
Well, we'll dig into somelacrosse here in a little bit,
but I want to go back in timeand I want to learn about what
was life like for Charlesgrowing up and talk about the
impact your mom and dad maybesiblings had on you now that
you're a father and granddad.

Speaker 1 (09:35):
I'll try and help people with the geography a bit.
I live in Adelaide, which iskind of where Texas is on the
map for you guys, so down thebottom in the middle and I'd
probably go, I think, corpusChristi or somewhere around that
on the map.
That's where Adelaide is inrelation to Australia.
But I was born in a city calledArmidale, which is in New South

(09:58):
Wales, a few hours from Sydney,so that's on the east coast.
But my older brother and sister, my sister's the oldest, and
they were born in Sydney.
So that's on the East Coast,but my older brother and sister,
my sister's the oldest and theywere born in Sydney.
My dad had served in the armyand met my mum, who lived in
Sydney, and then once he got outthey moved back to Armidale and

(10:19):
he went to the University ofNew England there, because we
have a New England region aswell, and the University of New
England there, because we have aNew England region as well, and
the University of New Englandis where he ended up studying
and working.
And I was born in Armidale,which is kind of where his
family were from and my twoyounger brothers were.
And then most people have heardof the Tassie Devil from the

(10:40):
old Disney series.
So we moved down to Hobart inTasmania when I was about four.
We actually, you know again, ifyou're thinking about the map
of the US, you think Floridaright down the bottom,
tasmania's down that bottomright-hand corner, but it's an
island and it's pretty cold.
Tasmania's, hobart's, rightdown the bottom, it's the

(11:03):
capital.
We lived there for seven yearsand Dad was working in the
University of Tasmania at thetime and yeah, we had, you know,
after my primary school years.
My elementary school years werethere.
But we had a tragedy in thefamily.
My youngest brother was fiveand he got hit by a car right in

(11:25):
front of me I'm out the frontof our house when I was eight
and he survived but he diedthree times that day and it was
a real trauma for the family, asyou can imagine, and as an
eight-year-old I've only justprocessed it really with a
counselor in the last couple ofyears carried a lot of guilt,
thinking I should have beenholding my brother's hand and we

(11:49):
weren't even crossing the road.
We were watching because ourfamily dog had run across the
road and my older brother hadgone to get it and for some
reason my younger brother justtook off to go help out and that
changed the whole family'sworld because he ended up in a
coma for months with braininjury and they said he wouldn't
be survived, he'd be avegetable.

(12:09):
But he actually, with lots oflove and care, ended up being
able to walk and talk.
But he was definitely headinjured and ended up in his
mid-30s when he passed away.
But he was a 12-year-old mindin a 35-year-old body at that
time.
But as a kid we had lots.
Of it brought so many blessingsto our lives, as tragedy quite

(12:33):
often does, and that, yeah,helped us understand about
living with, understandingdisability and people with
diversity and families bondingtogether.
And there wasn't as manysupport programs in Tasmania and
also the job prospects for theother kids weren't as strong.

(12:56):
So my dad made the choice totake a job at University of
Adelaide and we moved up herewhen I was in year six at school
and so, yeah, it moves up hereand that changed my life,
because that's when we're at theschool I was at, which lacrosse
is our clubs 110 years old, butI'd never heard of the game and

(13:21):
, yeah, they came out to ourprimary school and introduced
the sport.
But it was so if we hadn't hadthat tragedy, my parents
probably wouldn't have moved.
We would have grown up inTasmania, um, I wouldn't have
met the lady that is mybeautiful wife and friend.
I wouldn't have the life I havenow if we hadn't had that
tragedy.
On, a whole lot of philosophytalks about from good comes bad

(13:45):
and bad comes good, and and it'shard in that moment to hold
that space and I know my parentsit was my um, it really
strengthened my dad's faith.
We grew up as catholics and, um, yeah, I've moved away from
that now as an adult, butdefinitely at the time that was
a thing that really got ourfamily through.

(14:06):
Yeah, so probably talking toomuch, casey, no I appreciate you
sharing.

Speaker 2 (14:11):
That's the goal is.
I always kind of make the kindof sarcastic joke my job is to
take my guests on a leash to thebeach and then take the leash
off and let you run.
So thank you, I'm.
I'm here for you guys, not me,so I have questions already.
So tell me, what was dad's jobfor the university?

Speaker 1 (14:30):
He was in the finance department.
So in the military he was inthe intelligence corps and he
came back.
Actually, when he moved back toArmidale, we had had
generations of bakers in ourfamily.
My grandfather owned a bigbakery in that town and my dad
went back there to take over thefamily business because his dad

(14:51):
was ageing.
But one thing led to anotherand the family ended up selling
the business and my dad had todecide.
He was meant to be a bakerwhere he really only came back
to help the family out and hethought it wasn't the best use
of his intellect or providingfor his family.
So he went back to universityand did a finance degree.

(15:12):
So our education system works abit different.
In Australia people pretty muchgo from year 12 at high school.
When you graduate high school,the next year you can be doing
medicine, um.
So you go and you might andyou'll do six years to do a
medical degree.
But you can also be doingengineering or accounting or

(15:33):
whatever it might be and you'restraight into you know, um, the
schools that you guys havetalked about, where I watch
college in america, and to mecollege is about helping people
learn to be adults and preparefor life and if you're fortunate
enough to do college in theStates, it's part of your system

(15:53):
.
I know not everyone gets thatluxury, but you do college and
it teaches you to think and lookat the world and then say you
know what am I going to do?
And then you might go off tomedical school or business
school In Australia.
You're straight in, and so mydad.
But as an adult he went backand went to business school and

(16:17):
did accounting.
So he comes out as a.
He was qualified as anaccountant but basically he
ended up as the CFO of theequivalent of the university.

Speaker 2 (16:28):
Wow, did mom work or did she stay home?

Speaker 1 (16:32):
Yeah, no, she worked with five kids.
They really needed that and soas well as doing that, she did a
lot of time pretty much as anurse and she was working in the
hospitals down there and whenwe came to Adelaide she moved
into aged care nursing.
But she also had differentthings that she did all the time

(16:55):
.
She worked at a hotel on onestage doing housekeeping and she
just took whatever jobs sheneeded to support the family.
She ran a local corner storefor a while which she bought and
had interesting times runningthe store with the butcher next
door and the drugstore on theother side, and that was right

(17:16):
near our house where we grew upin Woodville in South Australia.
So yeah, she just took the jobsshe needed to support the
family and definitely never hada career.
She just did jobs to helpprovide for the family.
You know, really I know myyounger brother and my older
sister both struggled around myhandicapped brother because you

(17:41):
know, we didn't go away onfamily vacations.
I remember just that one timein Tasmania where our dad took
my brothers and I camping and hewas a real outdoors guy.
That's what drew me to themilitary and kayaking and
shooting and all that sort ofstuff, and so he wanted to take
us camping.
But that was a really rarething was to try and take five

(18:03):
kids on a family vacation,particularly with a handicapped
son.
Um was tough.
But so my younger brother andolder sister.
I think feel they they missedout in life because so much of
my parents energy had to go tolooking after that handicapped
brother and my older brother andI feel we got blessed because

(18:26):
I'm getting emotional.
Yeah, we loved him and he wasgreat fun and we learned to do
that stuff.
But it also meant, you know,you can fly under the radar a
bit because our parentsattention for me personally as a
middle child.
People talk about middle childsyndrome and I go me personally
as a middle child.
People talk about middle childsyndrome and I go, mate.
I loved being the middle childbecause my older brother and

(18:48):
sister had done all the hardwork.
You know, having parentsworrying about their kids.
By the time they get to thethird kid and there's another
two behind him, it's kind oflike, yeah, do what you want to
do.
So I got so much freedom andalso my parents having to give
that care to my brother.
You know that brought alldifferent people into our home

(19:12):
and our parents always, evenbefore his accident, you know,
we had Malaysian students thatwere at the university that my
parents would bring into ourhome.
And then after the Vietnam War,many Vietnamese families moved
to Australia, a lot of themcoming in as boat people.
They had to escape Vietnam andjust gave up everything and were

(19:35):
in leaky boats coming asillegal immigrants into our
country.
Australia, took them in.
My parents had Vietnamesefamilies coming in and they just
always opened the home up andmy dad coached rugby, and so
we'd have young rugby players atour house on a Sunday night
sitting by the fire.
I just have so many memoriesbecause of all the stuff my

(19:58):
parents did to open their houseup and care for others, and so
my older brother and I go.
You know, having that life, wewere so privileged and we never
went without for food orclothing or education or the
sports we wanted.
You know we didn't have brandnew bikes or you know the latest
, you know fashionable clothesor go on cool holidays to Fiji

(20:21):
or Bali and it was great yeah.

Speaker 2 (20:24):
What are mom and dad still with us?

Speaker 1 (20:27):
my dad.
Sadly we lost him a few yearsago.
That was hard and my mom'sstill with us.
She's in her early 80s butthat's a bit of a sad story too
because you know, really I thinkshe had lots of trauma in her
childhood which she neverprocessed and she's turned into
into a bit of a grumpy old ladyand really a lot of the family

(20:51):
are estranged from her andyou're probably familiar with
Cartman's drama triangles.
She's the queen of the dramatriangle and everything's a
drama and so people don't wantto invite her to family events
like weddings or engagements,because she turns them into a
drama.
And so she, yeah, a bit sadbecause she's a bit isolated.

(21:14):
But my older brother and Ialthough we see that and it's
hard to have a relationship withher today and I've spent a lot
of time managing her affairs andtrying to help her out over the
last decade but we just lookback and remember everything she
did for us as kids and the lifeshe gave us and she was a
strong, amazing woman.

(21:35):
But I actually put it down tomental health for where she is
right now and even though that'shard talking about.
But I know most families havestuff like that going on, and
how do you deal with mentalhealth?
if they were if she hadarthritis and couldn't walk,
everyone could go see that anddeal with that.

Speaker 2 (21:53):
But yeah, I don't.
I don't know if this is inaustralia, but like in on I I I
actually was made aware of thisthrough linkedin but mental
health awareness month in mayand I've seen people post on
linked and my, my dad passedaway December 29th 2021.
Um, he had mental illness.
He had a rap sheet of healthstuff, um, and my wife and I

(22:15):
really helped take care of himfor close to 20 years, um,
physically, mentally,emotionally, financially, um, so
, um, I can, I can probablyguess I know what you're going
through with your mom and I'vebeen there.
So I'll be thinking about youguys and wish you wish the best.
And I remember one time I gotso like I don't know what the
word is like just frustrated andsad and mad, and I literally

(22:39):
typed in caregiver burnout and Iwas just like, and I didn't
know, I for some reason, I justdid, and it was there's 10
symptoms and I had nine of them.

Speaker 1 (22:47):
Wow.

Speaker 2 (22:48):
Um, but the the blessing was like you kind of
talked really good.
The bad, like when he at theend of my dad's life, the last
like six weeks, was like rightin the middle of COVID, it was
awesome, I mean, we could spendtime with them.
And it was actually fromanother guest I had on the show
where his dad died of dementiaand Alzheimer's and he just said
he goes.
He asked how how much do yousee him?
I go, not, not that much.

(23:09):
And he did look at me, goes,he's still in there.
And I was like, oh no, I wasjust like this guilt I felt so I
was like all right and so Iliterally just changed my
mindset and my attitude and Iwent and tried my best to go see
him and you know the days weretough sometimes but at the end
it was almost like before hepassed away.
The dementia like went away.
It was really weird.
And we had some peaceful daysand I was with him when he took

(23:32):
his last breath.
I was holding his hand.
So I'll always help with that.
That's beautiful.

Speaker 1 (23:37):
That's a beautiful case and I know that my wife
went through that.
Her mother had dementia forover eight, nine years before it
took her.
But my father-in-law and mywife both spoke about how they
lost her.
Probably six or seven yearsbefore she died she was gone and
the shell of her body was there.

(23:57):
But Shirley was gone and youknow, I know your colleague said
they're still in there.
In fact we were lucky enough tobe in those last few hours with
my mother-in-law.
We saw moments where, you know,things just clicked and she'd
say stuff or whatever, but thenshe faded out again and such a

(24:18):
terrible disease and I think, um, sadly, we had to put down our
family pet at labrador lastsaturday and there was so much
grieving there and I just thinkit's so odd how labrador you
know he would labradors willkeep eating right up until their
last breath and wagging theirtail and giving love.

(24:39):
But he was in pain and he wasstruggling and he may have been
able to go on for another year,but he was in so much pain and
so we're allowed to go and givethem a peaceful exit from this
world.
Yet with humans we go.
No, you got to stick around andgo through some more shit.
I know I don't get that.

(25:01):
I don't think.

Speaker 2 (25:02):
I, I, we.
Unfortunately we have that incommon too, charles I.
We put our dog, stella, downabout two months ago and, uh,
brutal.
And so now we have, and we had,a puppy, harley.
So she's, she's almost two, butHarley, like she was when she
came into the world, she waslike oh, I got this friend, this
is awesome.
I got this big piece of land togo run around and hang out with

(25:23):
this dog and then all of asudden, one day, stella's gone,
harley's here.
Harley's like hey, where thehell did Harley go?
She's like I mean, where thehell did Stella go?
I was joking, it's almost likewe she's can't find her.

Speaker 1 (25:39):
I'm like you ain't gonna find her, but we're, we're
gonna.
We've got two dogs as well, andum gus is, uh, actually a
little bit older.
So he had ted come into hislife but and we had gus kind of
there when the vet was herehelping us um send him on his
way.
But then at that last moment wegot gus to go inside so he
didn't see what the vet wasdoing.
But then we let him come backout and we took him with us.

(26:01):
When we saw Ted lifeless infront of him and he went up and
sniffed him and looked at himand he came with us.
When we buried he saw usburying and we made sure we
buried him very deep just incase he didn't want to get his
mate back.
But he's buried just up thefront of the vineyard.
Here We've got a lovelysteel-crafted Labrador dog cut

(26:28):
out and we put that there tomark the spot.

Speaker 2 (26:32):
Well, I'm sorry for your loss, man.
Oh, thank you.
Losing a pet sucks.

Speaker 1 (26:39):
They bring so much joy too they do 100.

Speaker 2 (26:42):
Well, like harley.
Yeah, she usually sits rightback there and I take her for
now.
I mean she's I'm takingmultiple walks a day and she
sleeps on her bed.

Speaker 1 (26:49):
Now it's just like, uh, she's the best so I can see
the beautiful view out your doorbehind you and you said you got
some space and stuff that I'msure Harley's living a great
life.

Speaker 2 (27:01):
Oh, it's like, yeah, she's on vacation all the time.
She eats and sleeps and takeswalks and chases things and
bunnies.
She's living the jackpot life.
So I was asking my guests aboutvalues that you learned that
from your parents that wereimportant to you.

(27:23):
Just to the stories you told sofar, I'm hearing empathy, like
your mom taught you empathy.
Your parents taught you empathyby opening your home to others.
I don't know if I'm right orwrong, but tell me what other
values were really important toyou that you taught your kids.

Speaker 1 (27:34):
Yeah, my older brother and I both at our dad's
memorial, um, yeah, the value hegave us.
He gave us so many things, butbig one was service.
And you know you come into thisworld and you know we, we talk
a lot about seeking our purpose.
But even if you're lucky enoughto be able to articulate what

(27:59):
your life purpose is, um, muchof it is about leaving legacy.
But, um, you know, I didn'treally understand until you know
, my son introduced me toreadings around stoicism.
Um, that that's pretty muchwhere my dad was coming from.
He said everything you do is aservice for others.
He goes just most of yourwaking life will be about doing

(28:23):
a service for others.
And he said not 100%.
Obviously, we also do stuff toserve ourselves, but at work,
your outputs are someone else'sinputs and thinking about who is
it that I'm actually serving?
And even for your children, ourrole is to serve them as a

(28:44):
parent, by providing for themand guiding them with those
teachings as you alluded to.
Yeah, so Dad gave us a big oneof service, and the other one
was probably abundance andabundance is a huge one of
service.
And the other one was probablyabundance and abundance is a
huge one for me.
Um, I'm not sure if you feelfamiliar with buckminster fuller

(29:04):
, bucky, fuller's uh work backin the 70s and 80s.
Um, american guy and a lot ofbooks written by Buckminster
Fuller, but he treated his lifeas a bit of an experiment where
he said you know what and a lotof philosophers say this as well

(29:25):
, and new age coaches might saythis stuff but he said just
focus on what it is that you'repassionate and good at and do it
well, and the money will sortitself out.
But so much of our society isdriven by the accumulation of
wealth and people judging theirsuccess in life by their

(29:47):
accumulation of wealth, and formen, particularly with toxic
masculinity, their sexualconquests and their physical
conquests around sport orwhatever it might be.
And those three things quiteoften distract us from what
we're really meant to do withour life, which is to actually

(30:08):
be on purpose and leave legacy.
And the legacy isn't aboutbeing the richest man in the
cemetery, but the sort of thingspeople say at your memorial
that they're so grateful thatyou left that as part of your
legacy and what they're going tomiss you for.
And so that part of abundanceis going.

(30:30):
Don't worry about the moneyabout my wife Janice being, as
you call it, the general manager.
At times I feel a bit guiltybecause when we started our
business over 30 years ago andeven as young newlyweds, I
thought you know what I'm goingto let her do all the finances.
I hear all these guys talkingabout don't give your wife a

(30:52):
credit card and all this sort ofnonsense and the guys having to
cut their spending, and I'mthinking I'm gonna let her run
all the budget and she couldtell me how much I can spend.
I'm sure it's been.
That's worked out pretty well Igot.
I got the same strategy, brotheryeah, but she carries so much
stress managing invoicing,chasing up, telling us when

(31:16):
we've got to pick up the targetson the earnings and all that
stuff and I go, I just lovedoing my work.
Do we have to put an invoice in?
Okay, I'll let you do that.
And so that sense of abundanceit's also as I've worked with
other people over the years,sharing work, where you can win
an assignment with a client andyou could pretty much do all the

(31:38):
work yourself and happy dayswith the money.
but you know, you think aboutthe old consulting dilemma of
you know, that you can have thisover a supply and just you know
famine and feast, and so you'reall so busy feasting you
haven't set yourself up for downthe track and so then you find

(31:59):
yourself in time of famine whenall this stuff runs out.
And so that abundance part forme was so important to the
success of our business because,by actually sharing work with
other associates, it gave mespace to go and have more
clients seek other work and thenjust always have this pipeline.

(32:20):
And even as I'm moving to 60 andthinking about what that next
phase of work will be for me,you know, because of all that
now I have a space where I don'thave to go chase work, work
comes to me, and that's allbecause of all those
relationships you built which Imight not have had time if I

(32:41):
hadn't shared.
It wasn't actually anintentional strategy, it was
purely just wanting to gothere's enough for everyone.
We can make the pie bigger andthere's enough pie for everyone
versus people.
That and you know this is whenyou go back to values.
One of the values I found ithard to collaborate with was
people that operate fromscarcity and hide stuff and want

(33:03):
to earn more than you and doall the work themselves and not
share.
So you know, probably thesimplest word is sharing, so
that abundance is about sharingand knowing you'll find more.

Speaker 3 (33:17):
Hi, I'm Leslie Vickery, the CEO and founder of
ClearEdge, a company dedicatedto transforming the business of
talent.
Through our three lines ofbusiness ClearEdge, marketing,
recruiting and Rising that helporganizations across the
recruitment and HR tech sectorsgrow their brands and market
share while building their teamswith excellence and equity.

(33:40):
I believe we were one ofCasey's very first clients.
He helped our sales and accountteams really those people on
the front lines of building anddeveloping client relationships
in so many ways.
Here are a few.
He helped us unlock the powerof curiosity.
For me it was a game changer.
I was personally learning allabout TED-based that's, tell,

(34:02):
explain, describe, questioning,and that really resonated with
me.
We also learned about unlockingthe power of humility and
unlocking the power ofvulnerability.
Casey taught us to be a teamplayer, to embrace change, to
stay positive.
He is one of the most positivepeople I know.
He believes that optimism,resilience and a sense of humor

(34:24):
can go a long way in helpingpeople achieve their goals and
overcome obstacles.
And I agree Casey's book Win theRelationship, not the Deal.
It is a must read.
Listen.
Whether you're looking forcoaching and training or a
powerful speaker or keynote,casey is one of the people I
recommend when talking tocompanies.

(34:46):
The end result for us, at leastas one of Casey's clients our
own clients would literallycommend our approach over all
other companies, from the way wewere prepared in advance of a
call to how we drove meetings,to how we follow up.
It sounds really basic, I know,but let me tell you it is a
standout approach that led tostronger relationships.

(35:09):
I encourage you to learn moreby going to CaseyJCoxcom.
You have nothing to lose byhaving a conversation and a lot
to gain.
Now let's get back to Casey'spodcast, the Quarterback Dadcast
.

Speaker 2 (35:24):
How did your dad or mom teach you abundance?
Is there a story that you canthink of?

Speaker 1 (35:31):
Look, I think it's probably even when they were
doing it tough financially, evenwhen they were doing it tough
financially, that they wouldalways share meals with people
and bring people in that and wehad people come stay with us and
stuff and look back at it.
Sometimes we had some weirdcats come through our house, but
it was that.

(35:51):
And I look at other familiesthat would go, oh, we can't help
those people out because wedon't have enough.
I think, wow, you got more thanus, but our parents are still
helping.
So it was probably just thatyou know, and I'll share one
story with you that actually isreally a bit of a negative for

(36:13):
me, but it was just reallyshowed me so much about my dad.
My older sister struggles a bitwith mental health stuff too
and she had a series of partnersin her life and different
people.
But she had this one friend andhe wasn't a partner.
He was a really elderly manthat really befriended my sister

(36:34):
and her family.
She was a single mum mostly manthat really befriended my
sister and her family.
She was a single mum mostly andbut they lived.
She, she lived in back inadelaide and this guy lived in
another town and we were tryingto organize christmas and it was
going to be my home this yearand um, we were just going do we
even invite my sister?
Because she just uh, she likedmy mum very much like my mum

(36:58):
would A drama queen would makethe day awful.
There would always end up peopleyelling, doors being slammed,
people taken off, all that stuff, and you think, geez, it's a
day of loving and care, but it'salways a drama.
I'll tell you another storylinked to Harry Potter about a

(37:19):
good metaphor for that.
But my sister was going, couldshe ask this guy to come to
lunch?
And we go no, it was just aftermy handicapped brother had died
.
He died in September and it wasour first Christmas without him
.
And we said, no, can we justplease keep it to the family,

(37:40):
the inner family.
We just want to have a lovelyChristmas together.
I can remember my dad being soangry with me and he goes
Charles, haven't we taught youthat Christmas is a time of
loving and giving and openingyour homes up and sharing.
Why won't you let this guy joinour Christmas lunch?
But I also knew if I let thatguy in, we had to let all these

(38:03):
other people in.
A couple of us were grievingand going.
We just want to keep the doorsclosed and just huddle in as a
family, and dad was still goingopen the doors up and share, and
I didn't do it that year, whichcaused a drama, and my dad
forgave me, but he was, you know, just even in those times,

(38:25):
still wanted to go.
Yeah, we're all grieving, butthere's still plenty of food on
the table and more people cometo the table and it'll be even
better.

Speaker 2 (38:35):
Wow, wow, yeah, that's powerful.
Your dad was a.
I almost knocked my microphoneover buddy.
Your dad was a giving dude.
Any idea where that came fromfor him?

Speaker 1 (38:46):
I think it was his mother, yeah, his, with my dad's
.
A number of his siblings arestill alive and a few of them
are coming down next month tocelebrate my 60th and a lot of
them are in their 80s andthey're all just beautiful
people.
But they talk about my dad'smum being that matriarch of the

(39:09):
family.
Yeah, and even during World WarII, when my grandfather was
away doing military service, sheactually had this job of
looking after a family of sixand keeping things ticking over.
But she also had this job ofrunning the gates on the train

(39:30):
line and a lot of women gotthese roles and there was many
American troops on the eastcoast of Australia and to move
them up into the pacific theywould go from sydney or
melbourne and our military campson the east coast and take them
up train lines up the eastcoast.
But all the gates on thosetrain lines were operated

(39:50):
mentally and there would be mymother, my grandmother, out
there two in the morning openingthe gates so the troop trains
could go through and and stufflike that.
And you know she also had totrain the family how to be ready
to go and hide in these cavesin the hills because they're all
expecting japan to invadeaustralia because they got right

(40:11):
down into new guinea andaustralia and american troops
really um stopped them in NewGuinea from the invasion.
But Australia had already drawna line across the top of the
country about what they wereprepared to accept with the
invasion during then.
But so much of it was aboutwomen holding the because the

(40:33):
men were off fighting the warand she had to train to take
families and kids and old peopleup into the hills to hide in
these caves for when thejapanese invaded and just all
these stories and all that stuffabout service and generosity.
That was her and she was just.
My dad and his mom were reallycalm and you know

(40:55):
Irish-German-English ancestry.
Manning is an Irish name andI've been back to that part of
Ireland from where we came from.
But my mum's family wereItalian and they'd come from the
island of Salina, a mafiosocountry.
But my grandfather, who'dmigrated out to Australia after

(41:16):
the war, my mum's dad, he was apharmacist and he came out to
Australia after the war.
My mum's dad, he was apharmacist and he came out to
work for the Australian Navy andhe said to his kids you're not
going to speak Italian, you'regoing to learn to speak English
and you integrate into thecountry, and he just wanted his
kids to become Aussie kids.
So we didn't have a lot of thatcultural legacy of learning

(41:37):
Italian, and I guess that's oneof my connections with Mark as
well with our Italian-Irishancestry Catholic boys, all that
sort of stuff.

Speaker 2 (41:52):
So one question I like to ask dads is mainly for
younger dads if we can impartsome wisdom.
You got more wise years than me, but I got.
I've been married now 26 years.
I got a 19 year old and a 17year old, so I got a few years
under my belt, but I'm stilllearning every day, and
selflessly.
I get this podcast to get freetherapy from gentlemen like
yourself, which is great.

(42:12):
But um, well, if you had toreflect back on your dad when
you're raising your kids, um,what would be an area of your
dad game that maybe wasn'talways where you wanted it and
you had to learn to kind ofimprove?
Maybe you had to check your egoa few times.
That might help another dad athome that might be struggling,
that we can maybe speak to him,or speak to him through through
your experience, or and I'lleven maybe lead my witness, my

(42:34):
my gap that I always work on,still to this day, is patience,
not overreacting when I don'tneed to overreact, and so I've
actually improved quite a bit.
I think my wife's even said so.

Speaker 1 (42:44):
But tell me what comes to mind for you well, that
bit about the harsh versus theItalian ancestry.
I know it's a generalizationaround cultures, but it was more
around temperament.
My dad had this beautiful andso did my grandmother this

(43:04):
beautiful temperament ofcalmness.
And you know you talk aboutcuriosity and the biggest
learning for me as an adult andI loved you sharing in our
pre-meeting around thatcuriosity, because that's one of
the pieces I try to teach orshare with all my clients.

(43:24):
If you want to avoid ending upspiraling into a negative
conflict and have healthyconflicting ideas, you need that
curiosity.
Conflicting ideas, you needthat curiosity.
Um, but from my mum's side theywere what I call bulldozers and

(43:47):
you know, in the advocacy withinquiry model, they were very
high on advocate, advocating orcompeting and low on inquiry
about other people.
And that word curiosity isabout being curious about or
inquiring about what otherpeople think.
And my dad, even when he knewhe was right, he would still be
curious about why other peoplewere thinking the way they did.
Way before a whole lot of thisstuff was being taught and, yeah

(44:12):
, where I grew up very emotiveand even as a lacrosse player,
that was one of the biggestthings I had to get under
control was getting triggeredand firing up, and that firing
up would bring so much energyand aggression, which can be
great in a contact sport, but,um, when the emotions are raised

(44:33):
, the intellect lowers, you know, um, so the intelligence
disappears.
The higher the emotions get,the lower the level of
intelligence is put on the table.
And that was definitely the casefor me of.
You know that um italian fireup and everything in that was in
a family of five.
Any, any conflict that wasbeing resolved always was sorted

(44:58):
out very loudly and quite oftenaggressively, with four boys,
and that was never my dad, Ithink.
In my memory I can onlyremember probably two or three
times in my whole life where helost his cool.
Yeah, yeah, I can rememberabout 3,000 times where I've

(45:18):
lost mine.

Speaker 2 (45:20):
How did you improve and get better at that?

Speaker 1 (45:23):
It was when I was doing my master's.
I definitely was on a path ofwanting to grow and develop, but
I was still in a path ofarrogance.
So another beautiful thing yousaid to me me and that's been a
key lesson was around humilityand just and I'll still battle
with this all the time where youknow your brain just runs and

(45:45):
you think you've workedsomething out, you've got a
position on it and I've justbeen always grown up with okay.
You then go in and fight forthat position and it comes from
such a base of ego as well,being right.
And it was at uni when theywere taking us through this
program of you know, learningabout the jihari window and the

(46:09):
fact that we've got thesemassive blind spots, and and
then from your study group,getting feedback and opening up
to feedback and people give mefeedback about these things.
That were my strengths, butthey're also my weaknesses.
It was the first time people hadthe courage to tell me in my
face about you know, it kind ofpisses people off when you do

(46:30):
that and I remember coming homebecause I was going to uni in
Melbourne and for one weekblocks and coming back to
adelaide and I'd always be soexcited, heading off to a week
of university for my master'sdegree.
And then I'd get to universityand I'd have this wake up moment
that punches you in the face.
And then I'd ring home tojanice and go this is terrible,

(46:54):
I just want to come home.
I hate this shit.
And then, as you process it andsit with it, ringing up and
going this is amazing, this iswhat I needed to hear.
And so, just having that otherpeople around you, but
committing to wanting to grow,and that first commitment to
wanting to grow is, um, droppingthe guard and being ready to

(47:24):
hear stuff and not react to it.
But it was this process thatour professor took us through,
which you know I now do withclients and on leadership
programs, but, geez, I wish Igot that when I was 19.

Speaker 2 (47:32):
but now you're going to give it away.
And so it's amazing when youare really listening to learn
versus listening to persuade.
In life, and I've been verylucky with some great mentors,
like my college football coachhe remember told me, casey, if
you ever have to tell me howgood you are, you're not that
good when you're great, I'lltell you.
One of my first bosses out ofschool, he told me he asked me a

(47:53):
question.
He goes do you want to be rightor do you want to get what you
want?
Most powerful piece of advice Igot in my life, one of the most
powerful Late in my corporatecareer, before this
entrepreneurial journey found mea very, very successful
software sales guy, salesevangelist, leader, trainer,
extraordinaire.
He told me it's okay not toknow every answer.

(48:15):
It's just not okay not to doanything about it.
And so, when you can which thentriggered my like, okay, my,
these are my superpowers that Iwant to ignite for others is
being humble, being curious,being vulnerable, like when
those traits are present and Iteach my kids all the time like
you're never going to knoweverything, you can never learn
it, you can't learn enough, andif you have a question, probably
five of the people have thesame question.

(48:36):
So we're going to go first andbe the one to go and ask our
thing, and so I think weencourage people to like when
those three traits humility,vulnerability and curiosity, I
think, are present.
In my experience not saying I'mright, just my experience I
think it removes fear and weremove fear that it stops

(48:57):
eroding families, it stopseroding cultures, it stops and
and but.

Speaker 1 (48:58):
When fear is present, ego loves to be getting in the
way and block all the goodthings that are about to happen
so I want to hear about leavingthat with the children and you
know I'll look at both mychildren and um, my son has
closer to my wife's personalityand my daughter closer to mine.
But both the my kids havedefinitely picked up that and we
call it the LeCantro, which wasmy mum's maiden name.

(49:20):
The LeCantro arrogance, and wejust see.
So arrogance is almost thecompilation of all those three
things you just spoke aboutgoing missing.
And even my wife and I ran aleadership program during the
day yesterday.
And then we had to go to aboard meeting last night and my

(49:41):
wife and I are both on thisboard for this regional
community leadership program wewere running and one of the guys
in the meeting was saying somestuff and I'm so lucky because
my wife's sitting next to me andshe could pick, read the body
language and she just kicked meunder the table and said don't
say anything, because I sostruggle to not go into that

(50:04):
bulldozer arrogance mode becauseI just know the guy was so
wrong and you know the don't sayanything sometimes is a good
strategy, but actually beingcurious and asking a question is
quite often the right strategy,but in that moment, because
we're where we were.

(50:24):
It's also being strategic andseeing the long game, and you
know that question you want toask, or help the group ask,
because sometimes it's not rightnow.
You need to ask it.
You know it'll be in twomeetings time, and so that sense
of patience can be importanttoo, because I want to get
everything sorted out today.
I don't want to wait for twomeetings time, but I know over

(50:47):
those two, that time thosepeople will discover some of
those things themselves andthey'll bring it back to the
meeting and you won't be the onethat has provided that insider
lightning bolt moment for thegroup, which is about what your
coach was talking about as well.
You know.
Park the ego.
Why is it that you have todemonstrate your brilliance?

(51:07):
Isn't it more exciting to seepeople discover stuff that maybe
you wanted them to discover?
And they might even bring otherthings that you didn't even see
on the radar.
So would park that arrogance no, love it, ma'am.

Speaker 2 (51:24):
Um, so the beautiful game of lacrosse.
Um brought uh, my my new friend, who I get to meet actually.
So when this episode comes out,I will finally have met mark in
person.
Um, I'm gonna be back in bostonhere in a couple weeks.
Um, we're gonna play golf forthe first time.
Um, he doesn't know, he's gonnagive me five strokes aside and

(51:45):
uh, uh, joking buddy, but maybeyou'll give me six.

Speaker 1 (51:50):
You better ask for it too, because the guy every
sport he touches right, I'm surehe's a gun at golf.
He's a good player.

Speaker 2 (51:57):
Yeah, I can't wait.
Maybe he's going to.
I'm hoping he signs a glove orsigns a ball for me that I can
bring it home.
Just joking, okay, what he'salready signed it for you, I'm
sure.
There we go.
Tell me a good lacrosse story,because I think it's cool.
He good, uh, a good lacrossestory, um, because I think it's
cool.
He came over to playprofessional with you.

(52:17):
You guys played in the sameteam, were you like the coach
player, or, if I have that right, or?

Speaker 1 (52:20):
yeah, that's right.
Well, I wasn't coach, I was aclub chairman and player.
Yeah, so we had a very goodcoach that year, which is an
interesting story in itself okay, but he come.

Speaker 2 (52:32):
but I think it's a cool story.
He comes over and he wasintrigued by the work you were
doing, so he was probablylearning through osmosis,
watching you do what you doplayed lacrosse, but you guys
still stay in touch.
And then, next thing, you know,you guys are both guests on my
podcast.

Speaker 1 (52:46):
Crazy, living in our house as well.
So what would happen?
And I played this role for anumber of clubs going back to
the days when Jesus walked theearth.
I used to recruit.
So I'd gone to America to playlacrosse in Texas on a tour in

(53:10):
1986, and I was such a lacrosseum junkie and I used to get
lacrosse magazine delivered tome in australia and I realized,
you know, we'd had a couple ofcanadians play for our club, our
box players, and I thoughtthey'd made a difference.

(53:34):
That was when I was a kid andeveryone just loved watching
these box guys doaround-the-back stuff and all
that sort of thing.
And I thought, and a couple ofother clubs had had some really
top-level players come out fromCornell and a place like that to
play to their club and theirclubs just dominated everyone

(53:55):
because that player brought alevel of professionalism and
lifted everyone.
So I wrote a letter to lacrossemagazine saying any young men
that are graduating that areinterested in adventure in
australia for a season, um,here's the package right to me.
And so it was all done withsnail mail.
And this is when I was workingfor army and running the

(54:17):
Woodville lacrosse club from mydesk with the army engineers.
Um, I'd get letters from theseguys asking to come out and play
lacrosse and I'd read throughthem all and I'd try and do a
bit of due diligence was, whichwas not easy.
I'm trying to find out ifthey're legitimate players and
we'd pick two.
And so the first two I pickedwas those guys.

(54:40):
One of them was out here for mydaughter's wedding only two
years ago and we visit them bothand we played Masters together
in Denver and around the worldSan Diego.
And one guy was from WilliamMary, which I don't think has a
men's program anymore.
They dropped the men's program.

(55:01):
And the other guy was from UVAand Tom Garland and Jack
McDonald, and Jack was fromWilton, connecticut, and Tom was
from Charlottesville down inVirginia and they have become
like brothers to me.
And from that year, every yearI'd recruit two players.
Another club started asking meto get players for them.

(55:22):
They'd come out to Australia.
They'd get hosted or billetedwith a player or a family.
We'd try and find them somework during the daytime, because
we only had practice two orthree times a week and played on
Saturdays, so the rest of theweek they would work, get some
stuff on their resume for whenthey went home, money to pay to

(55:45):
have adventure in the countryand they'd coach our juniors.
So it was great for developingour young players because they
had other players getting thekids excited.
And this just went on for yearsand when Mark was coming, by
that time I was married, hadchildren, been doing this for 20
years and it was now startingto happen with emails.

(56:07):
And Mark wrote an email to meand it was now not me putting an
ad out in lacrosse magazine.
It was all word of mouth andMark had heard from someone who
had heard from someone and hewrote to me and said about
coming out.
And you know I went and checkedhis stats because now I could
go and look online and seeplayers' stats and see what
their last four years had lookedlike and now even their high

(56:30):
school career, and then maybetalk to people that could give
him a reference that I knew.
And Mark just looked amazing.
But he said I've got threeother guys that want to come and
I'm thinking we only want two.
And I said I can get the othertwo guys a spot with another
club in our city.
And he said, oh, we all want tostay at the one club and I said

(56:51):
well, we have divisions, wehave our state league league,
division one and division two.
Whoever doesn't get picked inthat first team on a Saturday,
then they pick a second 15 forthe next division and everyone
play up left over, plays in thethird division and all the clubs
kind of have players at thatlevel.
And he said I said they canplay in our first division team.

(57:13):
They don't make the stateleague.
And he goes yep, they're in andthey're.
All.
These four boys that had gonethrough St Mick's together all
came out to Australia and Imanaged to get families to host
them and it was just an amazingyear and they had so much fun.
But Mark had blown his.
Just before Mark came out he'dblown his knee back in the

(57:37):
States and he wrote to me and hewas to tell me and we spoke on
the phone.
He was just devastated anddidn't know whether he could
come and I said you know whatmate, you come out anyway and
you can live with me and you cancoach.
And so he came out in 2007 andhis three mates got to play

(58:02):
while he was still doing rehab.
He was doing his rehab here andhe coached juniors and got to do
lots of work in our businesswith me, and then he and his
girlfriend tina came out, who'snow his wife, and she lived with
us.
And then they got an apartmentand they extended their visa and
ended up staying for two years,and the next year he actually
played and got to play some goodlacrosse and have some fun.

(58:27):
So he didn't get to get achampionship game, though, so he
came out and watched us win theinaugural Australian Club
Championship and I was about 40at that time game, though, so he
came out and watched us win theinaugural Australian club
championship.
So and I was about 40 at thattime and um come out of
retirement to play goalkeeper inthe state league team and we
won the championship.

(58:48):
And because of that we got toplay in the club championships
and first one ever and we beat aclub from Victoria and I got to
play in those games, and so didthe other three boys from St
Mike's, and Mark just had towatch it and he was so gracious
about it.
And then the next year he playedhis heart out, but we didn't
win those games, but he left ahuge legacy here.

(59:10):
That's awesome, but he goesback, and even going back,
everything he does, he serves.
He had that same value ofserving and just and also about
our responsibility is one of hishuge values around.
Um, you know, being clear aboutwhat your responsibilities are
and meeting thoseresponsibilities.

(59:30):
He just doesn't want to letpeople down, but he expects the
same in return.
I'll stop watching.

Speaker 2 (59:37):
No, this is great man .
I appreciate the stories.
It's been fun learning aboutyou and your relationship with
Mark.
Okay, before we learn aboutFace the World, I want you to
summarize, if you can, to yourbest, in succinct fashion.
Try to think about three wordsor values that dads can take

(59:59):
from our conversation today.
They can kind of maybe do someself-reflection, say these are
three things that I can thinkabout, I can work on to become
that ultimate or quarterbackleader of my home.
Charles, tell me what wordscome to mind.

Speaker 1 (01:00:13):
Well, the biggest one we haven't mentioned to me is
about patience, and we all wantthe best for our children and we
think we know those paths thatthey should probably choose to
get their best.
And you asked me the questionearlier and I didn't get to it.
With my dad you know I lookback in early in my life I felt

(01:00:38):
he didn't do enough of kind ofpushing me or guiding me in the
directions I should have takensome of the choices that I made,
but he let me make my ownchoices and he never, ever
judged me for not choosing thepaths that I think he probably
thought I should have took andit's taken me a long, long time

(01:01:00):
he probably thought I shouldhave took and it's taken me a
long long time.
Even with my own kids, I triedsuper hard to put the paths in
front of them that would givethem really good doorways to
open and then just sit back and,if they didn't want to go
through that door, justaccepting that.
My job was to love them,regardless of which doors they
choose to go through, and whenyour kids are really not at

(01:01:24):
their best, that's when you haveto love them the most and
probably the worst value that Iinherited from my mother and my
daughter really grapples with itas well is the one of judgment,
and we so quickly judge otherpeople in situations and

(01:01:45):
actually just parking judgment,being conscious and aware of
your judgment and putting it offto the side and just giving
love.
So, as a dad, understanding theresponsibility to serve, be and
withhold judgment and give loveprobably the three biggest

(01:02:05):
things.
I still struggle with it attimes because with that
Cartman-Drauman Triangles andI'm not sure if you're familiar
with it, they talk about whenpeople play the victim in their
life that's one at the bottom ofthe triangle when they avoid
responsibility and they want toblame other people for what's

(01:02:28):
going on or how they're feeling.
They want to avoid or deny thatthey have any part in it.
You know what's your 50% ofthis?
Because, as always, you have apart to take that responsibility
.
So they blame, they justify,they deny, but ultimately
they're trying to avoidresponsibility.
And the way they do that isquite often by getting angry or

(01:02:52):
whinging and complaining.
But if they do enough whingingand complaining, they kick in
the third, second player in thetriangle, and this is the
mistake we make as parents sooften we rescue, we go in and we
want to sort things out for ourkids because we love them and
we care for them.
We want to resolve theirproblems, whereas sometimes we

(01:03:15):
need to realize our job as aparent is not to rescue, it's to
teach.
Need to realize our job asparent is not to rescue, it's to
teach.
But every time you rescue them,they don't learn the lesson
that they maybe need to learn.
But in your becoming a rescuer,sometimes they see you as the

(01:03:36):
third player, which is whenthey're playing the victim and
they want to blame people.
The third player is thepersecutor or the bully, and
that's the one that the child'sor in that relationship is
actually causing the pain forthat person perceived pain and
all of us have experienced asdads, when your kids are tired
and grumpy and angry and theylose their shit and they're

(01:03:57):
going.
I hate you, dad, you're theworst dad in the world.
All because you've told themthey can't have another bowl of
ice cream, it's time to go tobed, and they just lose their
head and just are yelling at youbecause they're tired and
grumpy.
But a parent then gives in andgoes okay, you can have another
bowl of ice cream.

(01:04:17):
It's not the best metaphor, butyou've just rescued them and
reinforced that if they actuallythrow a tantrum, then they'll
get what they want and you'rejust creating someone that plays
a victim.
And I call that all the redtriangle, because we need to
stop doing that and that redtriangle that was the harry
potter reference I meant.

(01:04:38):
You know, I call them thedementors because if you see
someone that's a red triangleperson that is either a bully or
a victim or something, and yousee them coming and they haven't
seen you in the workplace, alot of the time we go is it too
late to hide in the closetbecause if that person sees me,
they're going to corner me.
And in the harry potter genre,the dementor traps you and sucks

(01:04:59):
the life out of you in just twominutes.
Person sees me, they're goingto corner me.
And in the Harry Potter genre,the Dementor traps you and sucks
the life out of you in just twominutes.
And some people have got theability to do that.
And that's kind of what I wassaying before with my mum.
You know she's a classicDementor.
If you go and spend time withher you've got to make sure your
energy levels are high, becausethey just take the energy out
of you.
And that was one of the thingsMark said for me.

(01:05:21):
That he got from me was when hecame out.
I said to my kids there'senergy givers, there's energy
takers and there's people thatsit on the fence and you know
that if you go and spend timewith someone like Mark, he's
such an energy giver and youmight only have five minutes

(01:05:42):
with him but you walk awayfeeling pumped up and great, I
love that time with that guy.
And then there's other peoplethat they're okay, they just
hang there, they don't take yourenergy, they don't give you
energy, but they're neutral.
But then there's the energytakers, which are those victims,
particularly, or even thebullies, and you spend time with
them and it drains your batteryand it's hard when they're

(01:06:05):
people you, they're a family andyou kind of love them.
But even with work colleaguesor clients or friends, you go.
I just can't spend time withthat person at the moment
because I haven't got the energyfor it, because you know all
they do is take it and yeah,that's that red triangle.

Speaker 2 (01:06:23):
No, well said, I actually drew it myself and it
makes complete sense.
And you know, you're the victimof your own story, the hero,
and I would say there's threesides, Like your triangle
there's your side, my side, andthe truth there's somewhere in
the middle Sorry, can I just say.

Speaker 1 (01:06:38):
Say, because you use the language that a lot of
people use either the victim orthe hero.
And the hero has courage, theyaccept responsibility to problem
solve.
And teams can fall into thatspace too.
Dads can fall into that space,but definitely as individuals we
all can.
But if you see someone that'scaught in that red triangle that

(01:06:58):
you love and care about,there's only two roles.
You've got a choice to play.
And in the green triangle,which is where you go to to help
people be the hero in their ownstory, you go, is my job.
One of the other two roles,which is, rather than be rescuer
, you're the teacher.
Rather than being the bully,you become the facilitator to

(01:07:20):
try and help that person.
And again it's your questionsaround being curious.
So you see someone struggling,you think you know what the
answers are, so you want to goin and do it for them.
That's rescuer.
I need to help them learn this.
That's the teacher.
But sometimes you're not theright person to be the teacher
or you don't have the skill, sothat brings in the facilitator

(01:07:42):
and the facilitator willintroduce that person to the
teacher or they encourage thatbehavior by asking the right
questions, it could be sayingthings like I can see.
This is really upsetting andreally hard for you.
What can you do to fix it?
And just asking that onequestion and the person goes
what do you mean me fix it?

(01:08:03):
This person's causing the planeand they should nature and
they'll go into the victim spaceago yet, but they're probably
not going to.
So what can you do to make thesituation better for you?
And that's being thefacilitator, when you're not
actually telling the person,teaching them or rescuing them
and it's such a great parentingtool because so many parents

(01:08:26):
want to go in to rescue theirkids.
Dad, I love you for giving methat bowl of ice cream, but then
later in life, when they put onall this weight, they go.
It's your fault, dad, that I'veput on too much weight because
you gave me all that ice creamSorry.

Speaker 2 (01:08:48):
How can people learn more about you and Face the
World?

Speaker 1 (01:08:52):
Well, we've got a website, facetheworld, or one
word lowercase com, but forAustralia you have au at the end
of it.
So there's the story of Facethe World.
On there You'll see photos ofEva and Janice and some of our
associates.
It talks about the work we do.
We only do three things or twothings really.

(01:09:14):
We facilitate thinking aroundbusiness and strategy and we
help people and teams get ingood shape.
So that plays out of really usplaying the role as coach for
many teams running leadershiptraining and doing one-on-one
executive coaching.
So that's pretty much the threetypes of work we do and we've

(01:09:34):
been doing it for 30 years and Ilove it.
People ask me what are you goingto do when you retire?
I'm going to keep doing exactlywhat I'm doing now all the same
stuff.
I might just do a lot more forfree for people in the community
, community organisations andindividuals that can't afford it
, because that's my life purpose.
I don't want to stop workingwhen I retire.

(01:09:57):
I say retirement is when you nolonger need employment and we
have employment to give us themoney to finance our life.
So retirement should be a timewhen you no longer need to earn
money, but it's actually whenyou should get to choose the
work you do and you should bechoosing.
Whereas most people think it'stime to go play golf, and you

(01:10:19):
know, stop working, I think no.
It's time to go play golf andyou know, stop working.
I think no.
It's the time to start doingthe work you really couldn't do
before, or the work you weredoing that you loved the most.
You know, keep serving becauseit gives a sense of purpose and
autonomy and mastery.
So there's Dan Pink.

Speaker 2 (01:10:43):
You're speaking the best way, speaking to my heart,
brother.
You're, uh, I'm, I'm early onthis journey that you're on that
.

Speaker 1 (01:10:47):
You've already been on for years, but I didn't mean
to tell the difference in colorwith their beards out of beard.

Speaker 2 (01:10:52):
There we go well one's much wider than yours yeah
, exactly, um, but it, I, I,it's a calling man.
I enjoy it and so it's soimportant, this work.
And when you talk about earlyearly, about abundance and
sharing, I love sharingcustomers with people and love.
Actually, when I go out and seeMark he's a potential

(01:11:12):
competitor of mine, I don't care, but he's a friend of mine.
I had him on the podcast.
His name's Chris Mader.
He wrote a great book and he'sa friend of mine.
I had him on the podcast, hisname's Chris Mader, he wrote a
great book.
We do kind of the same work,but obviously we're two
different people, but he's goingto go with us.
It'll be great, and so I lovethat you have that same, because
a mindset of abundance is a lotbetter than a mindset of
scarcity.
So I love that you're teachingthis from across the world.

(01:11:35):
Okay, it's now time time, as wewrap up, to go into the
lightning round, where I ask youjust random questions.
I'm going to show you the hitshave taken too many bong, I'm
sorry, too many hits, not bonghits, but football hits in
college when I playedquarterback.
That's an uncle Rico momentfrom Napoleon dynamite.
Everybody, your job is toanswer these questions as
quickly as you can.
My job is to try to make youlaugh, tina come and eat some

(01:11:56):
ham.

Speaker 1 (01:11:56):
Eat your food, Tina, Tina.
Come and eat some ham.

Speaker 2 (01:11:59):
Eat your food, tina, okay, yeah.
All right, are you ready?
I'm ready.
Okay, you hold an Australianlacrosse record for most scored
by a goalie in a game.
Not true, okay, true or false.

Speaker 1 (01:12:23):
Mark Agassinelli owns the Australian lacrosse record
for most ejections in a gameProbably very true?

Speaker 2 (01:12:27):
It's not true at all.
Okay, what is?

Speaker 1 (01:12:32):
your favorite comedy movie of all time, the.

Speaker 2 (01:12:35):
Castle.
Okay, last book you read, it'san Australian movie you want to
understand Australian culture.

Speaker 1 (01:12:41):
It's an old movie, but the Castle, have a look.

Speaker 2 (01:12:45):
The Castle.
Where can I find it?

Speaker 1 (01:12:51):
If you can't find it, email me and I'll help you find
it.
It will help people reallyunderstand Australian culture.

Speaker 2 (01:12:59):
Perfect.
Last book you read was it wasYuval Harari's Sapiens.
Okay, If you were to go onvacation right now, just you and
Janice.
Where are you going?
Bali tomorrow morning, thereyou go.
What would be one genre ofmusic that might surprise your

(01:13:23):
customers?
That you work with, that youlisten to?

Speaker 1 (01:13:27):
Bluegrass A bit of cherry pickers with bluegrass,
yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:13:31):
Okay, if I was to come to your house to dinner.
I'm flying the next flight outof Seattle to Australia.
What would we have for dinnertonight?

Speaker 1 (01:13:39):
I'd cook you a lamb roast from some lambs from out
the back.

Speaker 2 (01:13:46):
Okay, love, it Sounds good.
If there was to be a bookwritten about your life, tell me
the title.
He Left a Legacy.
Okay, I love it.
Well said, and now theAustralian filmmakers and the
American filmmakers are notgoing to.
They're fighting over this,this manuscript, because because
this, this movie he left alegacy, is going to be just an

(01:14:08):
absolute thriller and killer,and, and and across the world.
You are now the castingdirector.
I need to know who's going tostar Charles Manning in this
great new film.

Speaker 1 (01:14:18):
Oh, you probably don't know the guy, but it'll be
funny for most Australians.
A guy called Mick Malloy.

Speaker 2 (01:14:25):
Okay, perfect.
Now I'm going to look him uptoo.

Speaker 1 (01:14:28):
He's a beer drinking bum.
He's just a.

Speaker 2 (01:14:31):
A beauty.
I love him.

Speaker 1 (01:14:32):
Yeah, quite inappropriate as well.

Speaker 2 (01:14:35):
Okay, that sounds like right up my alley of humor,
charles.
So I love that.
Okay, and then last questionTell me two words that would
describe your wife Calm andsmart.
Great answers, lightninground's complete, as usual.
I usually laugh more at my ownjokes, so I get the loss, you
get the win.
Charles, congratulations, I'mgrateful that you woke up early

(01:14:59):
on a Saturday morning inAustralia it's still Friday here
and spent some time with me andshared your story, shared a ton
of wisdom.
I have a page full of notes now.
I want to give huge gratitude toMr Mark Agostinelli for making
this introduction happen and forbeing a great customer and a
great friend and a great formerpodcast guest himself, and I

(01:15:20):
want to make sure that people gocheck out Face the World.
I think what Charles and hiswife and his team are doing is
well, so important, and it's whyhe's been in business for, or
they've been in business for,close to 30 years, because the
EQ is never going to get in mymind, never going to get
replaced by AI.
How we treat people, how weconnect with people, how we ask

(01:15:40):
questions, how we give that Mayaemblem on by, how do you make
people feel when they leave theroom is still a massive gift
that we can give today.
And I was joking with acustomer yesterday.
I said there's this dude namedVoltaire back in the 1500s and
he was teaching this thingcalled curiosity.
I think he might've been asexist, charles Cause he said a
man, so it brought him to thisday.
I said a man or a woman is notjudged by his or her answers but

(01:16:02):
by his or her questions.
So everybody, let's get alittle bit more curious tomorrow
.
Have some grace for people.
Listen to learn versus persuade, like we said, and I hope that
once you listen to this episode,everybody take time to leave us
a review or take time to sharethis episode with another dad
that you think our conversationcould could benefit them and
their mindset where they're at.
But, charles, I'm grateful foryour time.

Speaker 1 (01:16:23):
Man, I'm grateful I passed across and I hope to have
a chance to meet you in personsoon thank you, and I really do
want to honor you for the workyou're doing, but the great
learnings you gave me throughthis process too.
I love that.
The thing about advocacy withinquiry is mutual learning, and
that's what we always aspire tois be mutual learners, and thank

(01:16:45):
you for that gift.

Speaker 2 (01:16:46):
It's been a pleasure you bet, brother.
Well, have a great rest of yourweekend, enjoy Bali, and we'll
hope our paths will cross againsoon.

Speaker 1 (01:16:53):
Sampai jumpa lagi.
Let's see you later, mateBalinese.

Speaker 2 (01:16:59):
Love.
It All right, see you later.