Dr. Daved Rosensweet: Your 30s = Danger Zone | Why Hormone Decline Starts 20 Years Earlier Than You Think | #164 - The Sex Reimagined Podcast

Episode Transcript
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Dr. Willow (00:05):
I'm Dr.
Willow Brown, your Taoist expertat Sex Reimagined.

Leah (00:08):
And I'm Leah Piper, your Tantra expert at Sex Reimagined.

Dr. Willow (00:12):
And today we interviewed the one and only
Daved, Dr.
Rosensweet, Dr.
Daved Rosensweet.
He's the founder of theInstitute of Bioidentical
Medicine and the menopausemethod.
Um, really cool guy and, uh,incredible practitioner and just
actually a very beautiful human,very beautiful soul, I felt.

(00:35):
And just very extensiveeducation, loves helping women,
has helped hundreds of thousandsof women around the globe and
teaches and educates other, uh,practitioners to help women with
their hormones as well.
Um, he did write an incrediblebook, which he gave us for free.
So be sure to listen for thatbook.

(00:56):
Um, cause you're gonna learn somuch about your own body and
your own hormones and how theyall function.

Leah (01:02):
look, if you are in your thirties this is an important
episode for you to listen to.
If you are in your forties, thisis an important episode for you
to listen to.
If you're in your fifties orsixties or seventies, look, it's
never too late, you want to tunein and get involved in this
conversation because it'simportant to our vitality, to
our sexuality and to our feelingof strength and youthful.

(01:23):
Blah, blah, blah.
Youthfulness, youthfulness,youthfulness.
Alright, tune in and you knowwhat to do.

Dr. Willow (01:32):
Turn on and fall in love with Dr.
Daved Rosensweet.

SxR Announcer (01:36):
Welcome to the Sex Reimagined Podcast, where
sex is shame free and pleasureforward.
Let's get into the show.

Dr. Willow (01:44):
All right, welcome.
We're so excited to be here withDaved Rosensweet.
Dr.
Rosensweet, welcome to the SexReimagined podcast.
And I am curious how thisconversation is going to go
today because Dr.
Rosensweet is a bioidenticalhormone expert.
And I, as a functional medicineand Chinese medicine doctor,

(02:06):
tend to be on such a holisticside of the perspective on how
to handle hormones that Iactually don't even recommend
bioidenticals, unless it's aslike jumper cables to get things
going again, but not long term.
So I'm so excited to be herewith you, Dr.
Rosensweet, and just to learnmore about your method.

(02:26):
And learn more about how youhave helped so many hundreds of
thousands of women.
I mean, that really is the nameof the game.
That's the end goal, is thatwomen feel better in their
bodies and in their lives.
Um, and I know that you do itvery, very safely and ethically.
So I'm excited to have you here.
Welcome.

Dr. Rosensweet (02:43):
Thank you very much, Willow and Leah.
Nice to be here.

Leah (02:46):
Yeah, and I'm excited because this is going to be like
a spectator sport for me becauseI'm somewhere in the middle.
I mean, Willow knows me enoughthat it's like pulling teeth to
get me to take a supplement.
So, um, it'll be interesting tosee as we are both in our mid
40s and headed into our journeyinto being perimenopausal in the

(03:07):
near future.
And so this is such a timelytopic, as I was just spent
probably an hour and a half thismorning speaking with a
girlfriend who is postmenopausaland having some of her own
issues.
So I'd love to drop that in bothof your laps to see what kind
of, um, how you might help hersolve her problem.
And the other thing I'm kind ofcurious about is we've already

(03:29):
started talking about women, butdo you also treat men and their
hormones?

Yes, for sure.

Leah (03:36):
Okay.
Um, and would you say that yourpractice is like 50 50 or is it
dominant in one gender?

Well, the main thing that I do these days is
train and mentor physicians andnurse practitioners to treat
women and men in menopause andandropause with compound and
bioidentical hormones.

Leah (03:55):
Cool.

Dr. Willow (03:56):
So I'm curious, Dr.
Rosensweet, in your work withpeople, do you, do you look at
their nutrition?
Do you look at their diet?
Do you, do you look at herbs asan option for them in bringing
their hormones into balancebefore going to bioidenticals
or, um, or do you go straight tothe bioidenticals?

Well, a little background.
Um, I graduated in 1968 frommedical school.
I loved medical school.
But, even as a senior, yeah,even as a senior, I loved it.
It was like a temple.
It was a synagogue for me.

Dr. Willow (04:31):
Oh, that's so

And, uh, it was hard, but it was

Dr. Willow (04:33):
True physician then.
Love it.
Yes.

And yet as a senior, I started asking, well,
gee, how do you help peopleheal?
And I got very interested innutrition.
The very first thing I pulledout of the University of
Michigan library was the YellowEmperor's book

Dr. Willow (04:49):
Oh, okay.

Chinese medicine.

Dr. Willow (04:51):
Awesome.
Oh

great.
And so right out of the gate, Iwas exploring nutrition,
toxicity, exercise, emotions,life.
And, uh, it, the more I did, themore I thought that one's life
and living was very good forhealth.
And then all the obstacles thatwe have to that emotional,

(05:13):
mental, choosing.
All the, well, one way to put itis conditioning that we bring to
it leads to life habits, healthhabits that really dismantle
health.
And the elephant in the room ispoor nutrition.
So I was hired by the state ofNew Mexico to write on
nutrition, to try and do apractical manual that says way

(05:35):
into it.

Dr. Willow (05:35):
Okay, good.

And I, and then along comes the need for my own
healing.
And so, uh, I've, 45 years, I'vebeen deeply devoted to really
unraveling, bringing to thesurface, and healing emotional
impediments.
Mental.
Choice.
Perception.

(05:57):
Relational.

Dr. Willow (05:59):
Right.
Wonderful.
So you are coming from this veryholistic point of view.
I love that.

Absolutely, absolutely, and...

Leah (06:06):
Share a little bit about your healing journey?

Yes.
I love medicine.
But the main thing that I wantedto do in this lifetime, having
observed my parents, is I wantedto be married and be happily
married and have kids.
And I thought because as ateenager, uh, I loved life, I
grew up in a very, very preciousand special household.

(06:32):
But when I was about 13 and Idiscovered girls, I went, whoa,
whoa.
This is a much differentuniverse than anything.
This is what I want.

Leah (06:42):
Right on.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

To be in love and, uh, and be married like my
parents and have kids.

Leah (06:49):
That's so sweet.

Doctors nice.

Leah (06:51):
Mm hmm.

Dr. Willow (06:52):
But you want, that was the thing you

That's the, that was my dream and I did get
married at 28 and had a childand, you know, we were ill
equipped.
I was certainly ill equipped.
I was carrying way too muchemotional and mental hurdles,
detriments, conditioning.
I think you've been down thispathway.

(07:16):
And, uh, and by five years intoit our marriage dismantled and I
thought, well, okay, must be thewrong woman.
And then I went into a secondrelationship and within a couple
of years, I was repeating theexact same, um, and I saw it.
And, uh, when she walked and shemeant it, I, I really had a

(07:41):
major, major breakdown in

Leah (07:44):
Yeah.
A reckonin.

Yeah, I do not know how to love.

Dr. Willow (07:50):
Mmm.
So powerful and so deep to havethat moment in life.
So what did you do from that?

Well, just to add to the, um, intensity of it,
when I realized that I hadbroken the second relationship
and it was primarily me.

Leah (08:06):
Mm.
Yeah.

these were two wonderful women,

Leah (08:10):
Mm hmm.

and I, I, I broke down into a primal scream,
spontaneous.
This is, this is.
I was like 35.

Dr. Willow (08:20):
Wow.

And I had never heard of such a thing and I was
in a closet doing this, andabout three and a half hours
later I was in lying on thefloor in sweat and going, oh my
God, I know where this pain iscoming from.
I was, I was given love and Imyself dismantled it and I
realized that I was a man whodidn't know how to love.

Dr. Willow (08:44):
Mmm.

And I saw the depth of it.

Dr. Willow (08:46):
Wow.

I saw the depth of the beliefs, the emotions,
and, um, and I committed at thattime that I don't know if I was
ever going to be able to succeedat it because I saw that it was
severe, it wasn't mild.
Even though I was a, you know, Iwas a nice young man with a
great upbringing and a gooddoctor, uh, way too much

(09:07):
impediments.
As women, you've probably met upwith some,

Dr. Willow (09:11):
We've met some men like that.

Leah (09:13):
We've had our share.
Mm

Dr. Willow (09:14):
What do you attribute that not knowing how
to love to, was it not beingable to receive love, or was it
not being able to be vulnerableor open your heart?
What was at the root of it?

Well, there's three,

Dr. Willow (09:28):
All three of those

Leah (09:29):
Yeah, those are good ones, right?
Mm hmm.

It's a, I think the depth of diminished
consciousness, insufficientconsciousness goes way, way
back.
Not necessarily confined to thisparticular lifetime.
And I came to earth with a lotof gifts and I'm a human being
and, uh, it's such a blessing,but I came to earth with a lot

(09:52):
of old, old dysfunctionalthoughts and perceptions and
funneled interactions throughthat perception.
And, you know, what I'm sayingis it ran silent and it ran
deep.
And it was lifetimes old.
And the great fortune I had iswhen I did make that commitment

(10:15):
to heal, I started meeting upwith teachers and guides who
really were able to assist meand give me tools.
And so I set to work and I putfar, far more time and energy
and money into that process thanmedical school.
And, uh, and it really gave mea, uh, you know, decades into

(10:35):
it, it really gave me insightinto well what's causing
illness?
And what do you need to do?
What does commitment to healreally mean?

Leah (10:43):
Right.

And, uh, and yes, nutrition really matters,
but the nutritional choices arebased on these contorted
emotions.
and You know, I think, I think Iwon't exercise today because I'm
feeling a little down ratherthan, hey, I feel I'm, that's
getting me out there, you

Leah (10:59):
right?
Or I'm feeling a little down.
I should go exercise, right?

and I should do

Leah (11:05):
yeah, because that's the medicine, right?

Yeah.

Leah (11:08):
So curious, like, during that journey of, you know,
investing in this kind ofpersonal growth and this
emotional health, this learninghow to love, what, was there a
book or a course or a teacher ora mentor that really impacted
you?

Because I was so deeply committed, I had the
great fortune as the universeunfolded, so to speak, to the
right time, meet the rightteachers, and there was a series
of them.
And they've occurred over many,many years, and there's people
who know things, and you'veprobably encountered things
yourself, who know a lot aboutthe emotions, know a lot about

(11:50):
the mind, know a lot aboutconsciousness, and so there's a
long list of them.
And some of them were very, veryimportant to me and some of the
most important things thathappened was I received tools
that I could deploy in my lifeto work with my own emotions in
my own mind, etc.

(12:13):
And so it's been quite a journeythat that particular vector, but
I want to return to themedicine.

Dr. Willow (12:19):
Yeah.
I'm

I've always loved medicine.

Dr. Willow (12:21):
if it enhanced your medical, you know, training to
actually then open up to thiswhole emotional and spiritual,
it sounds like, side of life.

Absolutely.
And I met up with it everywhere.
I delivered babies at home for along time and I'm no longer
doing that.
I don't think it's a safe thingto do, but, uh, I saw it in the
marriages.
I saw, oh, what's the, what,which pregnancies and labors are
tough?

Leah (12:46):
Mm hmm.

um, they're not married.
They didn't plan the baby.
Uh, it's not universal, but I, Istarted seeing what I was
living.

Dr. Willow (12:56):
Yeah.

And experiencing and, you know, and then it comes
down to what constitutes health,what matters for health.
You know this, this is bread andbutter for you.
It matters what we eat andbreathe.
It matters that we detoxify fromThe um, many exposures that we
have.
It matters that we exercise,exercise, exercise.

(13:21):
And the elephant in the roomthat really dismantles the
biology is the dysfunctionalresponse to the stress of life.
And the biochemistry that getstriggered there, the fight or
flight biology, and it reallythrows off these most powerful
biochemicals in our body.

Dr. Willow (13:37):
Mm hmm.
yeah, I always like to say,like, hormones are like
sensitive little babies, and ifyou take really good care of
them, they're gonna, you know,respond well.
And if you give them just alittle bit of crap, they're
gonna respond to that as well.
They're very sensitive, thesebiochemicals.

And they're very powerful, too, they are, they're
the most powerful biochemicalsin our body.
And I never really guided mycareer around, as I was going
into midlife, one of my midlifewomen patients, uh, who I knew
was brilliant, and she hadactually retired in her 40s,

(14:14):
think about that, what it takesto do that.

Dr. Willow (14:17):
She was a smart cookie.

Leah (14:18):
Smart.

She came storming into my office one day
and, uh, this is before officehours and came up to my desk and
angry, you know.
Don't think you know me.
I'm telling you, I'm fallingapart and I'm going crazy.
And don't get, don't give methis or that.
I'm telling you this is serious.
And I knew her well enough tobelieve her but it was so out of
character.

(14:40):
And serendipitously, I don'tthink that's the way the world
works though.
But serendipitously, I'd beenspeaking to the world expert on
progesterone a couple of weeksearlier, and this is in the
early 1990s.
And I gave her some progesteronetopical cream and three weeks
later I got a letter from hersaying I can't believe this
stuff.

(15:01):
I'm totally myself again,

Dr. Willow (15:02):
mm.

And you know 86% of women Midlife, 14% no, 80%
yes, get mild, moderate, orseverely life stopping symptoms.

Dr. Willow (15:18):
Mm hmm.
Absolutely.

the hormone depletion.
These ovarian hormones are sostrong.
And they matter for the brain,and the arteries, and the bones.

Dr. Willow (15:26):
And your emotions.
Yeah.

Leah (15:30):
And sex! And sex! You know?

Dr. Willow (15:33):
Yeah, your desire, your

Leah (15:34):
Yes! Like, ah! Oh.
Okay.
Wow.

And, uh, I had never seen such a dramatic
response to anything I'd evergiven.
You in the health field, youknow that by the time someone
consults with you, there's a lotof water under the bridge.
It can be a slow moving train tohelp someone really restore from
a significant illness.
This was so dramatic, but Iwasn't guiding my career, but
she wound up referring to me.

(15:59):
And, uh, before I knew it, I hadan office full of menopause
women.

Dr. Willow (16:04):
Ah, so that's how the, that's how the menopause
train came

That's how it happened.

Dr. Willow (16:08):
It just swept you up.

And eventually, although I was, I was so deeply
into holistic medicine,functional medicine, I couldn't
wrap my arms around the wholefield anymore.
There was just, you know, therewas the experts in the brain and
dementia.
And there was experts in thegut, and you know, and these
things matter so much.
And the expert in thecardiovascular, and I tried to

(16:32):
keep containing it all, Icouldn't.
And I made a decision, okay, I'mgoing to specialize.
Instead of being an allinclusive doctor, which is an
illusion, I'm going to get goodat one thing.
I'm going to get good at onething.
And it was the best decision Iever made, and, you know,

Dr. Willow (16:50):
That's fantastic.

Commitment attracts wonders.

Dr. Willow (16:54):
Mm

Leah (16:55):
Did you make it?
Well, I guess you made a choicebecause of that friend needing
support and then, you knowRecommending people at first.
I was like, did you have to makea choice?
Like do you miss the brainstuff?
Do you miss the gut stuff, butit sounds like it chose you.
Hormones chose you

Well, I also responded to the call, and it's
not like I don't respect theseother important projects to do,
but I like to refer it to peoplewho are, that's their

Dr. Willow (17:25):
Who are the

You want to straighten out the intestinal
tract, you got a piece of workto

Leah (17:30):
Yeah.
Yeah,

Dr. Willow (17:31):
A big one for

Yeah, so it's not like we don't include that,
but part of it was so much was,um, there, there's such dramatic
results from replenishinghormones that I got attracted to
it because of its effectivenessand because of the leverage and

(17:53):
I'm, I've been very fortunate toattract quite a team and we were
deeply mission driven.
We, we think that this planetdesperately needs more feminine
energy.
And

Dr. Willow (18:04):
Well, cheers to that.
We couldn't agree more with youon that.
So, tell us about your method.
Like, let's say a woman comes toyou and, and she's like, okay,
yeah, I'm definitely inperimenopause.
My libido's in the toilet.
I have my, you know, labia arestarting to shrivel up.
I'm super irritable all thetime.
Everyone's driving me crazy andI can't seem

Leah (18:24):
have hot

Dr. Willow (18:25):
find piece inside of my mind.
Yeah.
Hot flashes, night sweats, thewhole nine yards, brain fog.
Um, what's your, what's yourprocess?
What do you take them through?
What's the journey?

Well, you're naming some very, uh, familiar
and, and, uh, uh, symptoms thatdisable women.
And the process is always thesame, uh, and we've developed
over the years, uh, a lot ofdifferent moving parts to the
process to streamline it and tobe able to leverage to get into
working with millions of womenand men.

(19:00):
So, so, but we have an initialquestionnaire that is extremely
thorough and has a heavyemphasis on, uh, on, on female
hormones.
And um, You know, I read throughthat questionnaire, and I'm
talking to my patient, and thenext steps become super clear
right away.

Leah (19:18):
Oh, is that right?

And, and you get an idea, okay, you got an idea
of what to do, and then youdeploy that idea, and you see
how well it pans out.
But in the world of hormones,it's pretty straightforward.
Um, and, and yet, each woman issuch an individual.
There's such a wide variation,woman to woman.

Dr. Willow (19:38):
It depends on what's happening in their lives too,
with work and partnership andkids and

It does.

Dr. Willow (19:44):
Yeah.

That's huge.
And you try and overcome, youtry and do better living through
biochemistry to help someoneovercome life's stressful
things, and nature will notallow that.
And you know that very well.
It's gonna, it's like whack amole.
Okay, well, I'll support youwith hormones, and then the
marriage is breaking down.
Yeah,

Dr. Willow (20:05):
Right.
One thing after another.

Before going into that, biology can achieve a
lot.
It's a lot easier, I see, forwomen to make the courageous
decisions, and men, too.
And to have the, uh, oomph toimprove their health and improve
their lives when the bottom isbeing supported because without

(20:27):
those biochemicals you don'tmove very well.
You're not very motivated.
You're not thinking veryclearly.
I mean, some of the most commonsymptoms of menopause is a
cognitive decline.
Women are just not functioningat the same level of, and the
mood, the moods can go.
Chronic anxiety, when there's noreal reason for the anxiety,

(20:49):
they're not used to anxiety.
And the drive from the loss ofthe androgens, loss of
testosterone, the motivationthat a woman can have to make 50
decisions in a day, importantones, it can just wither away
without someone really knowingit.
So, you asked about theprocedure.

Dr. Willow (21:07):
Yeah.
Process.

So we had that first consultation, and it's
very apparent to me, I knowwhat's happened.
These are, like a young woman at20 is at the absolute peak of
her hormone output of her ovary.
And she declines.
Same with men.
20, plus or minus a coupleyears.

(21:28):
Decline.
And in the 30s, that declinebecomes significant.
Not all women feel that decline,but it is significant.

Dr. Willow (21:37):
Yeah.

Leah (21:38):
they do feel it, what are they noticing?
Like, what's the symptoms of thedeclne?

Dr. Willow (21:42):
That we just kind of rattled off, like

Leah (21:44):
Oh, you still might have more mood swings.

There was some additional ones.
Um, mood, anxiety, depression.
These are, these are thebiochemicals of well being.
And without them, you startgetting into anxiety states.
Young women can have that ifdon't

Leah (22:03):
No one ever mentions this that in your that you are a
little ornery and anxious and,oh, it might be because your
estrogen levels have beenlowered.
Like, that never gets broughtup.
That never gets brought up witha therapist.
That never gets brought up inconversations with your
girlfriends.
Your doctor doesn't mentionthat.
I think that's reallyinteresting that,

Dr. Willow (22:24):
gets brought up if you're talking to Dr.
Rosensweet, he knows all

Leah (22:27):
yeah.
But how many 30 year olds do youtalk to?

Dr. Willow (22:31):
yeah, that's a good question.
Probably

Well, you know, it's such an important thing
because in my lifetime, I'veseen the explosion of
benzodiazepines, Xanax andstuff.
And I was talking to one of ourboard members, a woman who's
been working with hormones atthe PhD level for 40 years.
And we know that these women arenot ovulating properly or

(22:57):
they've had a progesteronedecline.
You give them progesterone,they're back on the horse,
feeling

Leah (23:02):
great.
Yeah, because you know, when wefeel depressed and anxious, what
we do is we self attack.
What's wrong with me?
What's wrong with my life?
What's wrong with my decisions?
And we go through this wholeordeal when we could just say,
Oh, my hormones need to bechecked out.
Like that could bring so muchunderstanding, relief, and also

(23:23):
minimize the drama of the ofwherever that, that feeling of
depression starts to talk backto us in a negative way.

Dr. Willow (23:31):
Yeah.
You know,

Leah (23:32):
So thanks for bringing that up.
I think that's,

It's so complex, um, we've grown up in an era
where these microscopic poisons,uh, and what do they do?

Leah (23:42):
Right, the plastics in the

What do the herbicides,

Dr. Willow (23:46):
in the air, in the plastic water bottles, in the
soap,

what does that do?
Well, wouldn't you know, itinterferes with the hormone
receptors.
That's what it binds

Leah (23:59):
That's the biggest danger, isn't it?
With the, with the toxins thatwe can't see.
It's, it's really of, it attacksthe hormones before anything
else?

The receptors, yeah, it binds to the receptor
sites.
And

Dr. Willow (24:10):
that's why I think it's so important to clean the
liver at least once a year.
You know, at least once a year,because that's a filter for all
of your blood.
It's gonna, it's gonna clean outall of those xenoestrogens that
we're constantly getting inputwith.
Hopefully, yeah, if it's a goodcleanse.

And, you know, really minimizing exposure.
You know that so, so much.
It's just the exposure is sohuge.
So that's a complexity that'sthrown in why in this day and
age there's more of that anxietyand depression than I think, and
it's there for differentreasons.
And then one could make the casethat nature is pushing, is

(24:48):
pressing on the human racethrough the leaders, which it's,
it's the feminine that's leadingin this regard, to, My God, I'm
anxious all the time.
I feel shame.
There's something wrong with me.
Gee, elephant in the room, maybeI should learn a lot about shame
and acquire some information andtools and support to deal with

(25:12):
shame.
So it's a little complex,because if you, I learned, uh,
somewhere along the line torespect who's sitting in front
of me, and if they're saying,I'm feeling really bad about
myself.
And it's, I feel shame, ifthey're really clear on it.
I don't immediately say, well,we'll give you some hormones and

(25:34):
that's going to take care of itfor you.
I go, oh, okay, someone'stalking to me.
They're telling me I feel shame.
That's what they chose to say.
So it's, you know, it's amultifaceted approach, as I'm
sure you use.
You want to, you don't want toquiet down the very signal that
someone's getting that it'sfinally time in life to deal

(25:54):
with the part of myself that is,feels shame.

Dr. Willow (25:58):
Right.
Right.
That's great that you're reallymeeting them where they're at.

But the bottom line is those hormone declines
are very significant.
They, and you asked earlier,Leah, um, sleep disturbance.
You start getting low inestrogen and you start waking up
in the middle of the night andthe mind is racing and you can't
go back to sleep or you can'tfall asleep because you got low
progesterone or you're gettingpain on intercourse and your

(26:23):
relationship's starting to getwobbly there.
Or, you know, there's amultitude of symptoms.
The hot flashes, women do, youknow, are strong, they do well
with hot flashes during the day,but not at night.
When it starts interfering withsleep, and you lose a few nights
sleep, or get interrupted sleep,it's life

Dr. Willow (26:41):
stopping.
fog ten

Leah (26:43):
Yes.

Dr. Willow (26:43):
worse.

and the brain fog's got its own origins,
because there's a zillionreceptor sites for estrogen in
the brain.
And for progesterone, And youstart losing your estrogen, and
it's one of the most commoncomplaints,

Dr. Willow (26:59):
Absolutely.
That's, it's such a challengingone.
I mean, anyone who's had COVIDknows that like the brain fog
part of that, that is so hard toovercome.
And so that's kind of the, it'skind of that constant feeling
when you're going throughperimenopause into menopause
that like, I can't, I just can'tthink I can't come up with
words.
Like, it's just.

Leah (27:18):
Yeah, recall is really challenged.

Dr. Willow (27:20):
My understanding is, um, you know, once the, once the
ovaries kind of take their finalbow and stop doing all the
producing of these incrediblehormones that the adrenal glands
take over and, no.
Okay.
Let's hear what you got to sayabout that.
Mm-hmm.

I mean, the adrenal glands are still
producing testosterone.
And testosterone can convert toestradiol, and you're getting a
tiny bit of progesterone, butit's almost like a drop in the
ocean.
And I, I know this for certainbecause we do 24 hour urine
hormone testing, and I have for25 years, so we see the adrenal

(27:56):
hormones, and we see the ovarianand testicular hormones.
And when a woman goes intomenopause her estrogen tanks.

Dr. Willow (28:06):
Absolutely.
But they're still bringing someof those hormones forward.
And if somebody is heading intoperimenopause with, with burnt
out adrenals with reallydeficient adrenal energy, then
they're really going to tanklike Those hormones in their
bloodstreams, they're really notgoing to be, um, swimming.

In, in my practice, and I'm just speaking
from my practice, um, theprimary thing I see is the, the
drastic things that happen fromthe loss of the ovaries or the
testicles.
We see adrenal varying degreesof an adrenal that is actually

(28:46):
increasing its production, butthat's pretty rare.
People usually don't have theumph anymore.
More what we see is probablywhat you see is a declined
adrenal.
It's been stressed, but thatadrenal, because we need
cortisone to live, cortisol tolive, it gets priority.
It will be preserved.
And so I'd say 10% of the womenthat I see, they have

(29:09):
significant diminishing of thecorticosteroids.
But I'm dealing also with themotivated, most motivated,
proactive, health consciouswomen on the planet.
I'm not dealing with thepopulations I've dealt with in
the past, clinic populations.
So it could be a whole differentstory.

(29:30):
Um, In dealing with thatpopulation, which is under, you
know, multiply stress time100,000 and much worse.
So you might see, uh, dependingon who you're seeing a severity
of adrenal loss inability to doit.
That's much more severe thanI've been seeing.

Dr. Willow (29:49):
Mm-hmm.
Okay, so, so at what point doyou do the testing?
So they've, they've filled outthe questionnaire, they've come
in, they're sitting in front ofyou, you meet with them, you
connect with them as a person,give them resources and tools
from there, and then, um, atthat point do you start to
prescribe different styles of,um, of hormone replacement

(30:10):
therapy?
Is it, you know, pellets,creams, or do you do testing
first, or how do, what's thenext step?

Leah (30:16):
Yeah, like, yeah, you, and could you say a little bit more
about, you're getting the testand you're reading it, and what
is it showing you, and how can apatient understand what's
happening with

their levels?
Excellent questions.
Um, for one thing, by the time awoman goes, makes an appointment
for a consultation.
Or a man.
It's usually, the duress ispiled up, so it's not
necessarily as early in theprocess as we would like.
My dream would be to, uh, seewomen in their early thirties

(30:48):
and prepare them and be able tointeract with them then, but
that doesn't happen.

Leah (30:52):
Okay.

And I'm dealing with it.

Dr. Willow (30:55):
No, that is the best time, ladies, to start preparing
is in your mid to late 30's.

You know, it's like all of us sometimes it
takes some strong medicine tomake us want to go after what we
need to do.
And so by the time I see womenand men there's been significant
decline.
So right out of the gate, well,it doesn't work to test that.

(31:23):
That's very important to know.
How did I learn it?
I tested women in theperimenopause.

Leah (31:30):
A

women is in perimenopause and her hormones
have been declining and her, herbeing realizes this and her
brain, her hypothalamus and herpituitary is going, this is a
little too low.
And it has stimulating hormonesthat can be excreted from the
pituitary gland to stimulatethose ovaries.

(31:50):
And they work.
You get a little burst of FSHand LH, the ovaries revive a
bit.
In fact.

Dr. Willow (31:58):
Okay.

They can be so stimulated that a woman can have
higher estrogen levels than shehad when she was younger.
But for a very short duration.

Leah (32:06):
Mmm.

Dr. Willow (32:08):
It's like a push, like a quick push.

Leah (32:10):
Does that make her

Well, always possible for a variety of
reasons.

Dr. Willow (32:14):
Can.

Leah (32:14):
Okay.
Alright.
Fingers crossed.

but it doesn't sustain.
So, in a young woman, when youfollow the estrogen level
throughout the course of hermenstrual month, you see these
nice smooth curves, and thenfinally she menstruates again
and starts over.
In the perimenopause, it'slower, you get a burst, you get
higher.
Can't sustain, goes lower,higher, burst, lower.

(32:41):
So it's very erratic.

Leah (32:43):
Kind of like her mood swings.

But overall, the sum total is not enough
estrogen, not enoughprogesterone.

Dr. Willow (32:49):
Hence the erratic emotions

The mistake you can make is testing a woman in
the perimenopause.
Like for example, I did thiswhen I first started out.
Woman's having hot flashes,waking up in the middle of the
night.
Mood, mood disturbance.
I know she's low in estrogen andprogesterone, just by her age.
So if you go to test a womanwho's in the perimenopause with

(33:12):
that erratic, you can getmisleading results.
So I remember sitting in frontof a patient who's having hot
flashes, night sweats, mooddisturbance.
I tested her and she's lookingat her test results and it shows
high estrogen.
And I say, well, I want to teachyou, I want to treat you with
estrogen because I know you'relow.
And she looked at me like I wasout of my mind.

Dr. Willow (33:34):
She's like, but it says hi.
Yeah.

So we do testing for various things, but we
always 100% test women thatwe're treating at about the
three or four or five monthmark.
My favorite time to test is whena woman says, Oh my God, I feel
myself again.

Dr. Willow (33:53):
Mmm, after she's been taking some bioidenticals
for a while.
Okay.

Leah (33:57):
Yeah, what do you mean by the third or fifth month?
What does that mean?
She hasn't had a period in threemonths or?

Dr. Willow (34:03):
Of seeing them.
Of seeing him.

Leah (34:05):
okay.

yeah, because, you know, by the time a woman
seeks hormone replenishment,she's 10, 20, 30 years into
hormone decline.
So we move slowly to help herget back up and overcome the
multiple internal adjustments.
So it takes about three to fourmonths.
to really dial it into

Leah (34:26):
so once she's already on a

And we gauge that by a simple statement, I
feel great.
And it happens almost all thetime.

Leah (34:35):
Now,

we test 100% of the women with 24 hour urine
hormone testing.
And it turns out that's veryimportant because a woman can
alleviate symptoms but not havesufficient estrogen to protect
her bones and her vagina.
And if she does not have that,she does not have sufficient to
protect her brain.

Leah (34:55):
Okay.

So, and, or she can be on too much.
She can have so much estrogenthat she's overstimulating
breast glandular tissue.
So we, we like the, uh, not toolittle and not too much, so we
eventually confirm that withtesting 100% of the women.

Leah (35:11):
And so, you understand that not too little, not too
much is based on how she'sfeeling.

No.

Leah (35:17):
Oh, okay.
That's based on that big testyou were just referring

it's guideline, the, the, how she's feeling
tells me she's really oscillatedback towards a good zone for
herself.
But we did a study.
Only 25% of women are actuallyin the optimal zone.
They can, a woman can say, Ifeel a lot better.
But she can still haveinsufficient estrogen that

(35:43):
ultimately is going to lead tobone loss and vaginal atrophy.
It's that big a deal.

Leah (35:49):
So, at what point are you starting a protocol of
bioidentical hormones in thebeginning?
Like, for me, I'm 44.
When do I start?
I mean, obviously if I'm, if Iknew in my late thirties, mid
thirties, I would have calledyou and said, give me a plan.

(36:10):
But now I'm 44.
I didn't do that.
And I called my doctor last yearand I said, look, I want to know
what my baseline is.
Can we test my hormones?
I'm worried about, you know, mymenopausal experience.
And she goes, it makes no senseto do that.
That's not going to do anythingbecause your hormones are
changing hour to hour, day today.
We can't get an honest resultfor you doing that.

(36:31):
Which left me feeling reallyimpotent.
Then it's like, okay, well thenwhat do I do?
But what do I do now?
Is it impossible to know what mybaseline is at this age?
How do I know if I wantbioidentical hormones, what the
best, where do we start with,uh, I'm guessing the amount of
hormones you use.
So help me, help me.

I love this perspective.
And one thing you could do, andyou all could offer this on your
website if you want, is a freecopy of my book, Happy Healthy
Hormones.

Leah (37:03):
Great.
We will, we will put that

Yeah, and, and that came about because when I
started out there was so littleknown.
This has been a very neglectedfield.
Every field of medicine has got,

Leah (37:16):
Men, you get all those, all that funding for your
penises.
We want funding for ours.
That's just my my

well, yes,

Leah (37:25):
my broadcast out to whoever makes those things
happen.
So back to what you were

and, uh, so one of the things that I, I knew a
certain amount, but I, I, Ifigured I'm gonna have to figure
this out woman by woman.
And so I would help a womanunderstand a certain amount of
it, give her the hormones, startlow, Gradually increase, and I
was so correct, and one of thethings I learned was about the,

Leah (37:51):
Well, at what point do you give her the

when she shows up in my office,

Dr. Willow (37:56):
Right

Leah (37:56):
you would give me hormones today.

well I would, I, the very first thing I would do,

Dr. Willow (38:00):
you take out the questionnaire.

exactly, I want details, but at 44, there may or
may not be details, but itsounds like there is.

Leah (38:12):
There's some brain fog happening.

you go.

Leah (38:15):
And there's really mostly just fear.
Like, am I going to be one ofthe wackadoos that just is like
a hot mess?
I don't want to be that.
I don't want to piss offeveryone because I'm so damn
moody.

Dr. Willow (38:28):
Liver cleanse, honey.
do a liver cleanse.

Leah (38:30):
definitely do a liver cleanse.
But

Dr. Willow (38:33):
I've been trying to get Leah to do a liver cleanse
since I've known her.

Leah (38:37):
I, you know, you hear horror stories.
She has.
I did a lot of

Dr. Willow (38:41):
It's not that

Leah (38:42):
in my 30s.
I

So one good thing is it's a wonderful time
to learn some things

Leah (38:47):
I'll stop being a

baby.
Because part of what'sdisconcerting is something's
going on or you're concernedsomething's going on and you
don't know what it is.
And so I wrote that book sowomen would know.
This is what's going on.
This is what's going on.
And then,

Dr. Willow (39:06):
Yeah, I'm

I want to assure you that you're starting at a
perfect age.
You know, I meet up with womenwho are 20 years into menopause,
never had hormones.
The losses are enormous.
Muscle, muscle loss.

Dr. Willow (39:22):
bone loss and brain loss.
and muscle loss.
That's why weight lifting is soimportant around age, in your
early 40s.

what gets women and men into assisted living
facilities?
Loss of muscle and loss of boneand loss of cognition.
80 90% of folks, as a physician,I see people of all ages.
So you'll wish that you couldstart with someone in their 40s.
50s is great.
60s is pretty good.

(39:51):
So, just know, Leah, you'regonna do fine.
And the first thing to do, andhere's your main job, and I
don't know what state you're in,but you go shopping for someone
who loves this field and knowswhat they're doing and has
taken, because when peopledon't, when providers are like

(40:13):
all of us, you know, they don'tnecessarily know what they don't
know.
So what was told to you abouttesting was incorrect.
What was incorrect was you werestarting to be concerned, so
what do you do as a health careprovider?
You listen.
And you pay attention.

(40:34):
And what we would learn aboutyou is there's probably reason
for concern, but so much isrevealed just by asking you a
lot of questions.
And what would I learn?

Leah (40:46):
Mm

I would learn that you were hormonal deficient
because you weren't at the levelyou were at 20.
And so, how early do we startthem?
Well, it's a woman by womandecision.
But I want to go back to yourmain job and the job of every
woman.
It's to follow that interest ofyours and go shopping and find

(41:07):
someone in your state who has aspecial interest in treating
women in menopause withhormones.
With compounded bioidenticalhormones.
'cause they're gonna be the,they're gonna be the smartest.
And you wanna find someone youreally like and you really
trust.
Who knows a lot.

(41:28):
That's your job.

Leah (41:30):
Okay, so interview and do your due diligence when looking
for, uh,

And if you, there's different ways to do
that.
There's two main ways to do it.
You can contact us.
'cause we've, I've, I spend mostof my time training folks.
So what state are you

Leah (41:45):
California.

Oh yeah.
Well we got Californiaproviders, naturopaths.
Medical doctors that areexcellent, they're in our
training program.
And that's your job, is to findone that you're specially
compatible with.
And go on the journey with them.
And they know how to go on thejourney.
And you check it out.
See if it feels right to you.

(42:06):
See if they feel right to

Leah (42:08):
How much should I bring to the forefront my family members
who've been through menopauseand their experience.
Is there any reason to believethat their experience might be
similar?
Something that I might expect?
For instance, my mom went intomenopause a little bit younger
than the average woman.

(42:28):
She had a pretty easygoingmenopause.
My aunt had a, really, juststruggled.
It was, she just was in hellforever, it seemed like.
So, is there any reason to thinkthat, um, the women in your
family may hold a clue to yourexperience?

I, I wanna, I wanna help you keep your eye on
the prize.

Leah (42:50):
Mm hmm.

You got one job.

Leah (42:53):
Redirect.

Read, read my book because you'll learn a lot.
And you'll decide whether youlike it or not.
Whether it's your cup of tea ornot.

Leah (43:02):
hmm.

But the second thing is to find that provider
because you're going to need apartnership.
For one thing, you're going toneed someone to prescribe the
hormones.
And we're talking about aphysician or a nurse
practitioner.
So you want to find that person.
It doesn't matter so much whatwent on in your family because
every woman and every man goesthrough it.

(43:24):
There's no exceptions.

Leah (43:26):
Now my understanding too is that it's really important if
you're going to go thebioidentical route that you
start taking hormones inperimenopause versus waiting
until menopause, that if youwait until after, in menopause,
it's kind of like you're missingthe boat a little bit and
there's a lot of catch up to do.
Is that true?

It's ideal, we say, whenever a woman comes
around to it.
I've had success with two women,one of them was my mother, the
other was my mother in law, whostarted taking hormones in their
late 80s.
Never had hormones.
My mother in law, when she gotout of rehab because she was

(44:07):
using a walker because she lostmost of her muscle, and fell and
fractured her hip and her, her,her humerus and her pelvis.

Leah (44:17):
mm.

She hadn't, and we gave her testosterone and
within three months, we have avideo of her sitting on a low
couch, arms upstretched,standing up without the use of
her hands.

Leah (44:30):
Wow.

And so this was after three months, so it's
never too late.
But it's ideal to start early.
It's like anything else inmedicine, or life.
You know, you start early,you're better off.

Leah (44:43):
Alright, that's encouraging.

Dr. Willow (44:45):
Yeah, it's so it's so interesting from from my
training and from where whereI've come from, which has, like
I said, been the most holisticside of things, right?
So I've learned, like hormonesare little messengers, they run
through your bloodstream,they're going to run up to the
pituitary and hypothalamus,those master glands in the
brain, and they're gonna say tothe brain, hey, I've already got

(45:07):
enough hormone, we've alreadygot enough estrogen or we've got
enough progesterone because it'scoming in exogenously.
It's coming in through the skinor through pellets or however
it's coming in, and so thenthose master glands in the brain
will tell the downstream glandslike, hey, we don't need to
produce that as much, we don'tneed to produce as much estrogen

(45:28):
or progesterone, so ovaries youcan take a nap.
Like, let's say at the age thatI'm at, 43, I'm still having
regular periods.
Sure, my, my, um, hormones havedeclined.
But, so I have been trained, andwhat I, what I also give my
patients to use is to reallylook at their, their diet, their

(45:49):
lifestyle, their sexualpractices.
Um, and to, to start by reallycleaning the blood, like clean
the liver, that's my kind offirst step, right?
And then getting those glandsactivated by taking
protomorphogens or glandulars toget those glands turned on so
that they're doing the work foras long as possible, which is

(46:12):
very much the opposite of whatyou're saying.

Leah (46:14):
And what are those, Willow?
What's glandulars, and what wasthe other thing you said?

Dr. Willow (46:18):
So protomorphogens and glandulars, it's like we
don't, in our culture, we don'teat a lot of liver, we don't eat
a lot of heart, we don't eat alot of pituitary glands.
You know, we don't eat thosethings anymore.
So, um, these are supplementsthat you can take that are
basically like eating thoseglands that feed and nourish
those glands.
And I have seen miracles happen.

(46:40):
I have seen women get pregnantwho medical doctors told them,
absolutely no way will you getpregnant naturally.
And they have through, throughdiet and through these
protomorphogens and glandularsand, and also meditation and all
the pieces that, that you're onboard with, Dr.
Rosensweet.
Now, what's interesting for meat this age and this time in my

(47:01):
life is I definitely know myprogesterone levels are
declining and I'm seeing thesymptoms of it.
And, um,

Leah (47:07):
What are the symptoms?

Dr. Willow (47:08):
Oh, I'm, I'm getting like, kind of warm at night, um,
you know, my

Leah (47:13):
Okay.
The usual.

Dr. Willow (47:15):
libido's fine, but you know, there's a couple
little things, I can tell.
And I also know when I take alot of chastree, which is an
herb that helps your naturalprogesterone in your body to, to
produce more, when I take a lotof it, I don't see those
symptoms as much.
So, in my mind, and in myeducation there's this, um,

(47:38):
there's this idea that I shouldcontinue to take, um, as long as
possible the herbs and the foodand the nutrition.
Only as of late have I evenentertained the idea of, of
doing progesterone exogenously,so that's, it's very timely that
we're having this conversation,so I'd love to just hear your

(48:00):
take on all of

Well, there's a fundamental concept that you
brought up there, and it's bestillustrated, um, with the
thyroid gland.
For example, hypothyroidism, athyroid gland not putting out
optimal levels of thyroidhormone, is epidemic in the
United States, and there's a lotof reasons for it all over the
world.
And if, a provider then treatssomeone with hypothyroidism,

(48:28):
With the right amount ofthyroid, that's one thing.
But if they use a little bit toomuch the mechanism you described
comes into play.
Their brain realizes, Whoa, toomuch thyroid around here.
What can I do?
I can have them throw up thepill so they're not taking it.
No, that doesn't work.

(48:49):
Or I can shut down the thyroidgland.
But it's all that's pilot error.
Anyone who's really highlyskilled with thyroid would never
do that.
Would never shut down thatthyroid gland.
They would take the thyroidglands capable of putting out a
certain amount and in this case,not enough.

(49:12):
So you replenish to augmentthat.
But you don't give someone toomuch or exactly what you
described will happen.
It's different with the ovaries.
They're going to go on out.

Dr. Willow (49:24):
Okay.

and how do we,

Dr. Willow (49:25):
Yeah, they're going out whether you

yeah, they, they just do.
And our, our approach to thingsisn't, okay they're going out a
little bit.
Well, let's just take them overand just flood the system and
shut down the pituitary drive ofthe ovary.
No way.

(49:47):
The, the art and it's not hardby the way, it's not hard at all
to make up that deficit.
To where you can sleep, to whereyou're not waking up with
feeling warm and having a racingmind.
And that's actually an estrogendeficiency.
Now, if you have an estrogendeficiency, you can be certain

(50:07):
you've got a progesteronedeficiency, so you're spot on
with that.
So, you're talking about a veryimportant concept.
We're not there to overwhelm thegland.
In fact, let's say, in general,that this is the range for
healthy young menstruatingwomen.
It's a range.
Some women, they just need acertain amount of estrogen.

(50:29):
It's pretty low.
They regularly menstruate.
They're fertile.
They can have babies, carrypregnancies to term.
Whereas other women need a lotmore estrogen.
They need three times thatamount, actually.
And that's the, that's howindividual women are.

Leah (50:45):
What about the testosterone levels in a woman
during this time?

They're extremely important.
They decline as well.
Testosterone is imperative toretain muscle mass.

Leah (50:59):
Okay.

Who would, who would ever want to not celebrate
exercise to the highest order?
And you, you, you gotta, youknow, it's, you don't use it,
you lose it.
And you lose it.
You're gonna lose it.
But, but what happens to oldpeople, and a gerontologist
taught us this in medicalschool, he said, um, you know,

(51:21):
you medical students, you know athousand diagnoses.
Let me tell you what's happeningto old people.
They lose their muscle.
They can't stand and walk withstability.
They fall on their osteoporotichips, and they die.
You want to do something forthem?
Help them with their muscle.
And like I was saying earlier,

Leah (51:38):
ding.

because I've seen people at all ages, And
I've, you know, I, I spent timewith my mother for eight years
as she went from assisted livingto a nursing home.
The majority of the folks whoare in there are from, they're
for sarcopenia and cognitivedecline.
And in order, so we always feellike the greatest service that
we do for women is replenishthat testosterone because you

(52:03):
have twice as much testosteroneas a young woman as you have
estradiol, the most potent ofthe estrogens.
It is not a male hormone.
It is a human hormone, and it'sinherited of women, and it
always declines.
Now, there's some rare instanceswhere, as the estrogens decline

(52:24):
in the perimenopause, thetestosterone, some of it coming
from the adrenal increases tocompensate.
Because testosterone isconverted into estradiol.
That's where a woman gets herestradiol.
But it doesn't last.
And though I used to see itoccasionally 30 years ago, I am

(52:45):
very, very rarely seeing a womanin the perimenopause who's got
adequate testosterone thesedays.
It really speaks to ademographic shift here in
health.
And how do I know?
If a woman's getting FLAB here,or her libido, or decision
making, Um, certainty is down,or she can't squat, like I

(53:06):
always say to a, you know, apatient, stand up for me without
using your hands.
And, you know, you will see somuch sarcopenia in the
perimenopause.
So, combination, combination isimperative.
Testosterone plus exercise, it'simperative.

Leah (53:26):
Okay.
I've got a question, but I wantto pause before I just start
raining more questions on you.
If there's willow, if there'sanything you want to jump in
there with.

Dr. Willow (53:34):
No, I'm just, um, yeah, go ahead.

Leah (53:36):
Okay.
Alright, so.
Let's talk about the, all thesexual consequences of this and
how, so, okay, I'm going tostart with one story.
Which is, I've got a friend whois, I know, I, I probably went
through menopause maybe, sixyears ago or more.

(53:58):
And she's took a time away frombeing very sexual but she's back
to being sexual again.
And it seems like for the lastcouple of years at least, she
can't have sex without getting aterrible UTI.
When there's a condom involved.
And it hurts, right?
So this is a common complaint.
Especially the tissues beingthin.

(54:20):
There can be bleeding.
It can just be painful.
It's not very orgasmic.
Penetration is very difficult.
And this chronic UTI, eventhough she does all the
preventative stuff up front, uh,Willow, you've mentioned a few
things that women can do to helpprevent UTIs.
She's on all of that protocol.
And it is still, she's nothaving any luck.

(54:41):
She's even started to do thebioidentical hormones.
I think they're still trying toget that figured out.
But they're, I mean, just theother night she was in tears
going, is it, do I just give up?
I'm starting to lose hope thatI'm going to be able to have
penetrative sex again in myfuture.
Like am I done with that part ofmy life?
You know, I'm never going tohave a hard one up the middle.

(55:02):
If I said, I don't think so.
So I'm really glad that you'reon today.
What's been your experience withwomen who really felt like, Man,
my, my yoni is shutting down.
It's shrinking.
And especially the UTI

Good news.

Leah (55:18):
Alright.

It's healable at the 100% level.
Because the cause is extremelywell understood.
Estrogen is, it's a powerfulhormone and it does so many
things.
And as a woman's hormonesdecline and her estrogen
declines, this is going onsimultaneously with the vagina.

(55:44):
She's losing vaginal health.
And when you look under amicroscope, you see a condition
called vaginal atrophy, whichused to be thick and moist.
It gets thin and the cell'snature changes.
It's a hundred percent.

Leah (55:59):
And is it because it's losing collagen or, I

losing its surface, epithelium.
it's it needs estrogen to have ahealthy vagina.
Let me put it that simply.
You must have adequate estrogen.
So, 100% of the women go intosome form of vaginal atrophy.
And the ones who are havingintercourse are the ones who
really know about it.
The first thing that happens isthey start using lubrication.

(56:26):
And they didn't need lubricationwhen they were in their 20s.
That moment of when they startedusing lubrication, they were
already experiencing significantlevels of estrogen decline.
And the great news is, it'stotally healable.
Maybe not to restore a youthfulnature of the vagina, but

(56:51):
totally without pain.
Some women continue to needlubrications, others don't.

Leah (56:56):
Well, lubrication aside...

Dr. Willow (56:57):
also some great, there's some great suppositories
and things on the market nowthat are non hormonal that can
really replenish and rebuildthat tissue as Well, as what
you're

Well, I'm going to disagree.

Dr. Willow (57:10):
yeah, go for it.

I'm going to offer a different opinion.
I say without the estrogen, I'dlike to know what those are and
how much experience you've hadin those.

Dr. Willow (57:19):
Yeah, and I'm not saying necessarily without the
estrogen, but the suppositoriesthemselves are without the
estrogen, which is not to saythat women aren't additionally
taking estrogen.
Although I was speaking to awoman the other day who has a
company, we're going to beinterviewing her, and I didn't
get the intel on whether or not,you know, they were additionally
using estrogen either through acream or through pellet or

(57:40):
something like that, but thesuppository itself was, to, was
really supportive ofreplenishing those tissues.
So

Leah (57:47):
Do you know what's in this repository?

Dr. Willow (57:49):
I can, um, I'll look it up for you.
We're going to have a wholeinterview with

But I want to give you a...
I want to give you a view.

Dr. Willow (57:55):
Okay.
Let's hear it

Leah (57:56):
us.

That vaginal atrophy is from low estrogen.

Dr. Willow (58:00):
Yeah.
Oh, I agree with you that that'swhat's happening.

And you can do all kinds of work around...
You're going to use all kinds ofwork around, but what the body
wants is the estrogen and theestrogen works.
And she's starting with bioidentical hormones to the degree
of vaginal atrophy that she has.
I think in terms of three tonine months recovery of that
vagina.

(58:23):
When she's applying the estrogento her skin, which I'm hoping
she's doing.
Now, what we do in instanceslike your friend is that we will
also, uh, suggest that a womantakes some of the estrogen
intravaginally.
For example, what we did many,many years ago is we invented

(58:44):
and patented, uh, certifiedorganic oil

Leah (58:48):
Massage oil?

The estrogen, testosterone, and progesterone.

Leah (58:51):
internally?

Well, it's jojoba.
It's pure jojoba.
And we've got, we have threepatents on it, so you can't put
hormones in it without violatingthe patent.
But what we suggest with thesetopicals is that a woman bring
her general body levels up.
And twice a day we have her takeestrogen.
We put a couple drops on theforearm and you rub the forearm
together.

(59:14):
But a woman who's having thesituation that your friend is
will say, yeah, take an extradrop or two at night.

Leah (59:20):
Uh huh.
Put it on the vulva?

Put it on your finger, insert it in your
vagina, rub it around your vulvaand do that.
She won't have to do that localapplication for more, at most,
three months.

Dr. Willow (59:33):
And then it will come back and she won't have to
keep going with it.
Maybe, maybe like several yearslater.
But if the estrogen internallyis doing the work, then she
shouldn't have to.

It will.
The estrogen internally will, asyou say, that will take over.
Now, you continue to take the

Dr. Willow (59:49):
estrogen.
That's like a little jumpercable trick.
Right.
Yeah.
Yeah.
yeah.

That's right.
Exactly.

Dr. Willow (59:53):
Mm

Exactly.

Leah (59:55):
yeah.
So like, yeah, the topical oilis just a, it's a starter.
It's a jump starter.

Dr. Rosensweet (01:00:01):
Exactly.

Leah (01:00:01):
Okay.
Interesting.
Interesting.
And so what about the UTIconnection?
Is there a correlation

connected.
It's 100% connected.

Leah (01:00:10):
there something going on with the urethra?
Is it thinning?
Is it

we'll see the, yes, exactly.
That's precisely what's goingon.
The urethra, which is a tube,just for your audience, that
drains the urine from thebladder out.
But the urethra ends in thevagina.
And the place where the urethrajoins the vagina is called the

(01:00:35):
urethral meatus.

Leah (01:00:35):
Mm hmm.

It's the opening, and that's part of the
vagina.
So recurrent UTIs are almost100% a function of the vaginal
atrophy that's also occurring tothe urethral meatus, and it gets
very tender and very easilyinjured by penetration.

Leah (01:01:00):
get UTI and you feel sick and it's just the pits.

But it will stop in almost every, you never say
always in medicine, you neversay, Oh, 100% of the time, you
never say that.
But in 98% of the women, allthey have to do is, is restore
the health of the vagina and theurethral meatus will be part of
that restoration.
Now, women who've had a lot ofUh, kids and large headed kids

(01:01:27):
often, they can do somestretching in there that also
can contribute to loss of urine,urinary incontinence, but what
you're describing is vaginalatrophy affecting the urethral
meatus, which is part of thevagina.

Leah (01:01:43):
you think that the use of condoms is creating an added
complication or a reason for theUTIs to be that much more
problematic?
Or is that not a coincidence?
Or is it just a coincidence?

Well, I'm, I'm, I'm trying to hold my breath
here because I'm such a fan ofcondoms.

Dr. Willow (01:02:01):
I would say it's contributing.
Yeah.

Going to say it.

Leah (01:02:05):
Tell the truth, even though we are also a fan of
condoms.

Yeah, but with, you know, lubrication and my
favorite is coconut, organiccoconut oil or our organic
johobo oil.
That's what we use with adequatelubrication and don't, don't
hesitate to slather it on.
Mm hmm.
And if the condom is

Leah (01:02:27):
she's a sex educator, so she's, um, very pro lubricant.
Um, and

Yeah, good.
Now, some of these lubricantsare irritating,

Dr. Willow (01:02:36):
lubricants on the condoms can be irritating, too.
So, I mean, it also depends onwhat kind of condoms.
You know, the sheepskin, theskin, the S K Y N might be
better for her.
But, yeah, ideally she would bewith a partner she didn't have
to use them with.

Leah (01:02:50):
Yes, she would, yeah.
thank you for, for

Dr. Willow (01:02:54):
Yeah, so I feel like we could talk to Dr.
Rosensweet for probably like 25more episodes because there's

Leah (01:03:01):
Yeah.

Dr. Willow (01:03:01):
to cover here.

Leah (01:03:03):
There is.
So, so as we sort of wrap up,I've got one question that we
probably should have asked inthe very beginning, which is,
what are bioidentical hormones?
Because some people may not evenknow what that means as compared
to

Yeah,

Leah (01:03:17):
or replenishment.

Replenishing hormones has been known to be
going on for about a thousandyears.
Yeah, the Chinese aristocratsset up these outhouses to
collect urine of young women.
And they also set up,

Dr. Willow (01:03:33):
And then they drank it.

no, not exactly, That was somebody, that was a
different

Leah (01:03:36):
ha.

Dr. Willow (01:03:38):
Chinese culture.

And they collected in a separate outhouse
the urine of young men.
And they dried it out and thearistocrats took it.
And that's why the 24 hour urinehormone test works, because
there's hormones in the urine.
And so that was the original.
And then in the 40s, thepharmaceutical industry had the
idea that women could useestrogen, so they chose the

(01:04:03):
horse, the pregnant mare.
They catheterized pregnantmares, collected the urine,
dried it out, and came out withthe most popular and profitable
drug in the history of, uh, uptill that time.
Premarin, pregnant mare urine.
So they're taking that.
Now, that's bioidentical for thehorse.

(01:04:24):
Same estrogens as the horse but50% of them the human female has
never seen.
In the process of doing thebirth control pill actually,
that the plant world had aprecursor.
Yams have it.
Soy has it.

Leah (01:04:41):
Was going to ask you about the

yam...
Soy has it.
That's called diastionin.
And if you take that diastioninand you carefully process it,
you can turn diastionin rightout of the plants.
In fact, the pharmaceuticalindustry owns soy fields.
Because they're getting theirown.
And you can process it and makepure estradiol, same molecule

(01:05:03):
that used to come out of yourovary.
Or is coming, excuse me, notused to, still coming out of
your ovary.
Pure testosterone, pure DHEA,pure estriol, pure progesterone,
same molecule.
So there's many, many ways thathormones have been replenished,

(01:05:23):
but bioidentical means you,you're using the same molecule
that came out of your ovary.
And it's derived from plants.

Leah (01:05:32):
Okay.

Dr. Willow (01:05:33):
I'm curious, okay, one more final question before
we wrap up.
It's a little different.
I know, God, it's always hard towrap these things up.
Um,

Leah (01:05:43):
I know.

Dr. Willow (01:05:43):
so this 24 hour urine test, what you're getting
with that, let's say, me, forexample, still having regular
cycle, yes, it's not, you know,it's not the hormone level it
used to be, but it's still doingthe up and down, and when I do a
saliva panel where I'm you know,spitting into a tube every two
or three days and then sendingthat in.

(01:06:05):
I'm, I'm looking at what's goingon with the levels and the
hormone throughout the entiremonth versus the 24 hour
snapshot of the urine.
So I want to understand a littlebit more why that works so well.

Well, so, none of these methods are perfect.
And, just like in the medicinethat you're practicing, there's
a multitude of factors that weaddress to understand what's
going on and to get ideas aboutwhat to do.
But testing is an important partof it.

(01:06:42):
The testing that was consideredthe gold standard in the 1960s,
when some of the original workwas done, was the 24 hour urine
hormone test by G.
C.
Mass Spec, it's called.
And, because all of the hormonesand what happens to the hormones
when they get processed, show upin the urine.

(01:07:02):
Saliva can be decent to measurehormone levels of cortisol and
DHEA.
in someone you are not treatingwith cortisol and DHEA.
But once you go to treat a womanor a man, to me, I'm going to

(01:07:22):
give you my best shot.
Saliva absolutely does not work.
Now, it's not just an opinion.
Our group ran tests.
We had individual women andindividual men send in split
specimens on the same day.
Send in a salivary hormone, 24hour urine hormone to two
different laboratories, bloodtest, and a five point urine

(01:07:44):
collection, and compare theresults.
And the salivas were just, theydon't work.
I'm going to give you my bestshot.
People might want to disagreewith me, but I'm going to give
you my best shot.
And I found it out in thetrenches.
I was treating these women and Istarted out with salivary tests
and the results I was gettingdidn't make any sense
whatsoever.

Dr. Willow (01:08:05):
Now, were these women already on hormone
replacement therapy?
Okay, so what you're saying isthey really need to be clean and
not on anything in order to geta good read with the salivary
test.

But, like I said, in the situation that
you're in, I would not recommendtesting you at all.
That doesn't mean we couldn'tlearn a lot about you And if you
choose to read my book, you willlearn a lot about you.
You will see, in livingtechnicolor.

(01:08:38):
Because the homos are sopowerful, the lack of them has
these effects

Dr. Willow (01:08:41):
Yeah, yeah.

all women.
Yeah,

Dr. Willow (01:08:44):
fascinating, I know.

Leah (01:08:46):
What an exciting industry.
And thank you so much for, um,doing the work that you do.
We will have, Dr.
Rosensweet's, links for hiswebsite.
Now you can go to his websiteand you will see his book and
there's a link to go to Amazonto go purchase it.
But doggone it He's giving usthe book for free.

(01:09:06):
So click on the link in the shownotes.

a PDF copy of it

Leah (01:09:11):
And if you want the hard copy, you can still get it on
Amazon.
But we are e readers, yes.

Dr. Willow (01:09:17):
Perfect.
Easy peasy.
Print it out, grab ahighlighter, get a pen, get old
school, study this stuff.
You know, I just want to say inclosing, like I just, I really
appreciate, um, getting to knowyou and your method and your
understanding and youreducation.
And it's very intriguing to me,you know, from, from the

(01:09:38):
education and training that I'vehad to just kind of dive into
your pool of training andeducation.
And, you know, I'm, I'm now my,my curiosity is peaked.
I mean, I love to understand allaspects and sides of, of
endocrinology.
So, um, I'm excited to read yourbook and also potentially come a

(01:09:58):
little bit, learn a little bitmore with you as the years go
by.
Yeah.

All right.
And we do have professionaltraining programs.
it's also a special gift for me.
For number one, to hang out withthe two of you.
You're not doing this byaccident.
And there's a richness to whoyou are.
And I can imagine the benefit towho you influence.
So I experienced that.
So it's very mutual.
I'd like you to know that.

Dr. Willow (01:10:21):
Thank you so much.
Such a pleasure to sit with youtoday.

Leah (01:10:24):
It's Such a pleasure And of course I got one more, which
is...
Do you have a prerequisite foryour professional courses for
people who are taking kind ofthe professional track?

no,

Leah (01:10:34):
Well, there you go out there.

Dr. Willow (01:10:36):
Oh, that's great.

Leah (01:10:36):
Yeah.

but I'd be honored if you, if you all wanna
have more questions at anothertime, just let Corina know.

Dr. Willow (01:10:42):
Okay.

I'd be

Leah (01:10:44):
do.

back.
Act,

Dr. Willow (01:10:45):
Yeah.

Leah (01:10:45):
Alright, y'all

Dr. Willow (01:10:47):
everyone.
Much love.
Thank you, Dr.

Leah (01:10:49):
love, love, love.
love,

SxR Announcer (01:10:51):
Now, our favorite part, the dish.

Leah (01:10:55):
Okay.
It's dish time.

Dr. Willow (01:10:59):
All right.
Let's dish on Dr.
Rosensweet.
You know, it was so interestingas we were coming into this
interview.
I was just checking his workoutand looking at his bio and I was
like, Oh, God, here we go.
It's like, I'm going to behaving the exact opposite
opinion of him in almost allregards.
But I was so happily surprisedwhen we got off on such a good

(01:11:22):
foot of like the holisticnessthat he brings to this.
Like, okay, I still may onlyhave, you know, may have the
training that I have of like, Ihave a very, very special
functional medicine teacher whoexplains things in a very, very
specific way.
And it's a little bit hard toreiterate, but when she explains
the function of the body, itmakes so much sense and it does

(01:11:45):
go um, in some controversialaspects to what a lot of medical
doctors see.
Um, that said, you know, he'sbeen in practice, he's been
running labs, he's been doingthese tests.
And so has my, you know,teacher.
But, um, it's not to negateanything.
You know, I think all of it isvaluable and I think it's also

(01:12:09):
following your own intuition,you know.
Like, but I still have aresistance.
Like, I don't want to startputting stuff in my body.
I don't want to get Botox.
You know, I don't want to, Idon't want to enhance myself.
I want to stay as natural aspossible, as long as possible.
As long

Leah (01:12:24):
why is that important to you?
I'm curious.
Like, why is that a strong valuefor you?

Dr. Willow (01:12:28):
I think, well, partially I think because of my
training, you know, being inthe, in the Eastern medical
field.
And then I've always justthought that we have all the
medicine we need inside of us.
You know, I think cultivatingorgasmic energy, I mean, that's
something he just doesn't knowabout.
Okay, maybe he does inside ofhis own, you know, sexual

(01:12:48):
practices in his own life.
But you and I have been studyingwhat it means to draw orgasmic
energy up into your pituitaryand your hypothalamus and your
pineal gland.
And we know the value of thatbecause we've been doing it for
ourselves for so long.
So, you know, there's, um, Idon't know.

Leah (01:13:07):
There's a dedication and there's a discipline of
utilizing the cultivation ofthese natural things with which
you can dedicate yourself toyouth and regeneration as you
get older.
So you're not aging as fast asyour contemporaries because
you're being mindful, present,and you've done your due
diligence to know, what are thethings that are going to
increase the aging process?

(01:13:28):
And what are the things that aregoing to decrease the aging
process, which is why the, theyouth and regeneration industry
is, you know, billions ofdollars.
And, and people pursue itbecause we want to be young and
healthy and we want to feelvital.
Um, and you know, for someonelike me who likes shortcuts,

(01:13:49):
discipline, discipline is justnot in my makeup.

Dr. Willow (01:13:55):
And I think that's such a big part of it too.
It's like, it depends on who youare.
And, and I would say, you know,the example that he gave was
like this high powered womanwho, uh, No, she, she retired at
43,

Leah (01:14:09):
right.

Dr. Willow (01:14:10):
42.
Right.
I'm like, okay, she's coming into perimenopause with burnt out
adrenals, like so many womenacross the globe, right?
Because we don't value the yin.
We don't value doing nothing.
We don't value just being.
It's not something that ourculture ingrains in us.
It's all about what did you getdone?
What did you produce and howmuch did you, you know,

Leah (01:14:33):
yeah, create and yeah, output.

Dr. Willow (01:14:35):
Exactly.
So there's, I think culturallywe're really heading into this
metamorphic time and our livesas women with a lot against us.
It's like we're pushing aboulder up a hill already.
And so that's why going to, um,shortcut, quick fixes and, you

(01:14:56):
know, like bioidenticals and,and other things.
And also saying that I want toalso say, I, of course, bone
density and muscle tone.
And absolutely that is thefunction of estrogen in your
body.
And so when it declines, youknow, if you've got incredible
adrenals, I see people, cause Ido see people sail through it.

(01:15:18):
I do know other Chinese medicinepractitioners who eat really
healthy and do eat liver and doeat those things, you know?
And so they do sail

Leah (01:15:27):
Yeah, that

Dr. Willow (01:15:27):
that time with no wrinkles, you know?
So I do know that it's possibleto do it as, um, absolutely
holistically as.
As possible, not adding thingsto your body, and we also live
in a world where if you're amom, and you've got a job, and
you've got a husband, and you'vegot bills, and you've got all
that stuff over you that you'vegot to take care of, you know,

(01:15:49):
you might, you might just wantto take some, take some

Leah (01:15:52):
Well, and it may not all be stress related, right?
I mean, it could be geneticrelated that you, you know, that
I don't know.
I do know that When he wastalking about like, okay,
needing lubricant in your 20s,because this is, this is kind of
a thing that comes up onoccasion.
Women feel bad if they thinkthey need lubricant.

(01:16:12):
And I've always thought that wasjust ridiculous.
Like, I used more, I used lubein my 20s

Dr. Willow (01:16:17):
Oh, yeah.

Leah (01:16:18):
about it.
I didn't realize that theremight be a connection to
estrogen levels declining as aresult.
And then I thought, well, I wasalso ejaculating quite a bit in
my twenties, and that is veryastringent and washes away a lot
of the mucosity of naturallubrication.
So I don't know which camefirst, my progesterone going
down or

Dr. Willow (01:16:38):
You're Amrita?

Leah (01:16:39):
My amrita stripping my natural, um, mucosity.
Isn't that a great word?
Mu

Dr. Willow (01:16:44):
Mucosity.

Leah (01:16:45):
ty.
Um,

Dr. Willow (01:16:47):
say it, honey.

Leah (01:16:48):
I thought, I thought his sort of take on the adrenals was
interesting.
That, um, he didn't agree thatthe adrenals are that
significant to the production ofestrogen.

Dr. Willow (01:17:00):
They definitely produce a lot less the ovaries
are going to be the opera singerat the front of the stage, and
once they take their final bow,you're going to have, like, you
know, a pretty good singer comeon stage.

Leah (01:17:14):
Now, I do know someone who sailed through menopause, didn't
really feel like she had anysymptoms, but she was also on
sports, uh, testosterone.

Dr. Willow (01:17:26):
Okay, so she was on exogenous hormones.
If she was on exogenous, any

Leah (01:17:31):
All bets are off, there's no, no comparison.

Dr. Willow (01:17:34):
So that's not fully

Leah (01:17:36):
I also thought bioidentical hormones were your
own hormones that they like takeout of your body and then they
do something to it and then theygive it back.

Dr. Willow (01:17:43):
No,

Leah (01:17:44):
been totally wrong about

Dr. Willow (01:17:45):
Yeah.
And, and what I've learned aboutbioidentical hormones, like what
he was saying, it comes fromwild yam.
Right.
And so it's got this alreadything inside of it.
That's, that's synonymous tothe, the chemicals that come out
of your body.
Um, but my, my education, myteacher taught me, you know, you
have to change the molecule of abioidentical 18 times.

(01:18:06):
It has the structure has tochange 18 times in order for it
to be bio identical to yourbody.
And I do love my teacher, youknow, but I, I'm, I'm
influenceable.
And I'm like, I'm curious aboutDr.
Rosensweet's and methods andstuff.
And especially as I'm headingtoward perimenopause, there's
all kinds of things that I knowto do that I do do like

(01:18:27):
weightlifting, super important.
Yes.
As you're heading in and noteating a bunch of sugar and
keeping your caffeine levelsdown.
And, you know, keeping your, allthe pizzas, right.
And,

Leah (01:18:37):
Sunblock.
Sunblock help?

Dr. Willow (01:18:40):
Actually, I'm more of the, the non-sunblock, you
know, that's just me.
So, but I, I also don't want to,um, miss the boat on keeping
myself healthy because of oneeducation, you know, one form of
education.
So that's why I'm excited toreally look into his stuff and
maybe I'll even do his training.

Leah (01:19:02):
Well, that's great.
You know, I kind of because Ihad a roommate who was a
compound pharmacist.
So, um, she was, she makesdifferent all sorts of stuff and
was telling me like whenbioidentical hormones, it seemed
like it got, they got reallypopular.
Um, and the use of them, maybethe technology, you know,
improved or something.
So I kind of always set myselfup in my mind.

(01:19:23):
I had a story going, um, Well,that's what I'll do.
And then being in these groups,right?
Where women come in, we're at,they're at my Tantra seminar and
they're telling their stories,they're sharing their stories of
woe.
And one of the stories of woe isalways a woman who's struggling
with her vaginal tissue, hercomfort, how painful sex is,

(01:19:44):
things atrophying.
And it seemed like the ongoinganswer in the class would,
someone would always saybioidentical

Dr. Willow (01:19:52):
on bioidenticals.
Yeah.
Mm hmm.
Yeah.
Yeah.
I mean it it is a it is a verymagical fix.

Leah (01:19:59):
Yeah, he did make it sound very magical, didn't it?

Dr. Willow (01:20:02):
Yeah, it is and it I mean when women start taking
testosterone when they're likegod I haven't wanted to have sex
in five years and they starttaking a little testosterone.
They're like a whoo hoo, honeyLet's go, you know.
It's it's a pretty big gamechanger because hormones are
powerful powerful drugs

Leah (01:20:18):
yeah, they're like altered.
Yeah, they

Dr. Willow (01:20:20):
are.
They alter.
I mean, think about if you'rehigh on dopamine or you're high
on oxytocin, like you're in analtered state.
And so, you know, when, whenwe're, when we're in our
fertility years and we've gotthese higher levels of estrogen,
progesterone, we're high on themall the time where sometimes
we're high.

Leah (01:20:38):
we don't have

Dr. Willow (01:20:38):
low.
Yeah.
But then, then they go away.
And we're like, Oh, you know,it's kind of like the lights go
out.
So it can, and it can be veryconfusing.
And, and like you said, therecan be so much self criticism
and blame, like that, I'm notthis enough or that enough.
So it's, um, I'm excited to readhis book and I would love to
just fill out his questionnairetoo.

(01:21:00):
Just

Leah (01:21:00):
Just to see what, what's on there.
Yeah, I, I had that thought too.
Okay, my last thing I want toget clarification from you is I
couldn't quite, I didn't feellike I was getting a clear
answer.
So maybe you picked up somethingI didn't, but it was like, Okay
i, now that he said all thethings I, I can say with pretty
good confidence.

(01:21:21):
Yeah, I can feel my levels nowgoing down.
I can see some of the symptoms.
Um, so when do I start takingthe medicine?
I mean, obviously you have tosee a doctor

Dr. Willow (01:21:30):
Right, right

Leah (01:21:31):
I thought it was, you got to wait until you stop having
periods or, or

Dr. Willow (01:21:36):
Oh, no.
Oh, no, no, no.
Yeah.
Yeah.

Leah (01:21:39):
can do them now.

Dr. Willow (01:21:40):
you could do them now.
Aren't you still taking birthcontrol?

Leah (01:21:43):
Yes.

Dr. Willow (01:21:44):
Okay, so you're still on exogenous hormones, so
that's, you know, so if youwanted to start taking
bioidenticals, which are stillexogenous hormones, you would
want to, um, in my opinion, youwould want to get off the birth
control first.
Because you're already addingestrogen to your body, so you'd
want to, you'd want to get offof that, then you'd do a liver

(01:22:05):
cleanse to clean the slate.
And then you would, um, and thenyou could add some
bioidenticals.
Or, probably, in his opinion,you would just, um, switch over.

Leah (01:22:18):
Okay.
So if you would, if you likethis episode, would you please
let us know?
I'm, I'm in talks with anothergynecologist who's specializing
in, um, endocrinology.
Yes.
And, uh, it would be interestingto have another perspective.
So if this is fascinating to

Dr. Willow (01:22:35):
We should really have my teacher on, too.

Leah (01:22:37):
Yes, a thousand

Dr. Willow (01:22:39):
have my teacher

Leah (01:22:40):
Yeah, because that's probably even what people don't
know even more.

Dr. Willow (01:22:43):
That's definitely, yeah.

Leah (01:22:45):
All right, y'all.
Have a beautiful day.

Dr. Willow (01:22:48):
Ciao, ciao.

SxR Announcer (01:22:50):
Thanks for tuning in.
Leah Piper is a tantric sexmaster coach and a positive
psychology facilitator.
Dr.
Willow Brown is both a Chineseand functional medicine doctor
and a Taoist sexology teacher.
Don't forget, your comments,likes, subscribes, and
suggestions matter.
Let's realize this new worldtogether.

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.css-14f5ked{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:2;overflow:hidden;}Dr. Daved Rosensweet: Your 30s = Danger Zone | Why Hormone Decline Starts 20 Years Earlier Than You Think | #164