June 4, 2024 • 25 mins
What if standing against societal norms was the ultimate act of faith? Join us as we uncover the extraordinary journey of Mary Magdalene, who transitioned from personal shame to becoming the first witness of Jesus’ resurrection. We explore her profound transformation and the courage it took to share her testimony in a world dominated by societal labels and expectations. This episode sheds light on Mary’s bold defiance and strong faith, diving deep into the internal and external struggles she faced to deliver her powerful message.
We also reflect on how we can embody Christ through our everyday actions, taking inspiration from the stories of David, Moses, and the symbolism of marriage. Whether it's facing giants or recognizing our dependence on God in our daily lives, we emphasize the humility and unexpected ways in which divine strength manifests. Listen in as we discuss how the faith-filled actions of biblical figures serve as models for us today, encouraging us to view our lives through a spiritual lens and embrace the divine strength that guides us in all we do.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Welcome to the May coffee chat.
It's the middle of May, guys.
It's the middle of May, sotoday is our, it's billed as our
coffee chat, and so this is atime for you guys.
Okay, all right.
(00:20):
Well, let's bring Tara on,hello.
Speaker 2 (00:23):
So my question has to do and I don't have my study in
front of me but when I wasdoing the part with Mary
Magdalene and I didn't quiteunderstand the perspective of
how she was being interpretedI'm probably not getting the
right terms, but like strong andcourageous probably not getting
(00:46):
the right terms, but likestrong and courageous I didn't.
I guess I didn't look at itlike that, I just looked at it
as that she was a first witnessto things and then she told
people, but I don't understand,maybe, the perspective that I'm
supposed to have on it.
I guess I don't see it as likea courageous act.
I see it as important, but Iguess I don't see it for the
same lens and I just wanted tohear more from both of you on
(01:07):
that.
Speaker 1 (01:09):
Well, let me, let me go to that section in the study
and let's let's look at it.
For me, the courage comes inthe societal norms of the day,
right?
So if you look at herencounters with Christ that are
mentioned here, it talks abouther transformation, and her
(01:33):
transformation was more thanjust physical healing.
Her transformation was atransformation, obviously, of
the soul, and so she actuallybecame that first witness.
And when you think about, insociety at that time, a woman's
testimony was not consideredeven like a valid thing, so they
(01:59):
could easily be dismissed.
One of the things about her isthat she boldly stood for the
one who delivered her and savedher right, and she went against
what society may tell her to dothat.
Speaker 2 (02:21):
Jennifer, you know one thing about that which we do
not have the full context ofall the stuff that goes behind
this but the disciples believedher.
There is nothing that indicatesthat there was any like you
could interpret that as like shewas a peer.
You could interpret ormisinterpret anything.
Not you, particularly yourhetorical.
Interpret anything, not you,particularly you rhetorical.
(02:43):
I'm just like, it's just to me.
I'm not saying it was anon-event, but it just flowed
without issue.
So I didn't and I know womenwere different, perceived
differently, but in the contextof what happened there was no
hesitation of them believing her.
So you know what I mean.
(03:03):
So maybe outside of theirecosystem, sure, people would
not trust her, but she was partof the group, part of that group
of women that was with thedisciples.
So I mean, it was justinteresting to me and I bring it
up not, you know, to becontroversial, but it was just I
was trying to understandperspective on this because it
was like not an issue, becausethey were all on the same page,
(03:26):
you know all of them.
For some reason they believedher, without question.
Speaker 3 (03:32):
Well, tara, I totally see what you're saying and I
kind of have a slightlydifferent angle than Jen does.
But to me it was what happenedinternally and inside her,
because and Susan said they hadto see for themselves my answer
is she had to see herselfdifferently and identify as
(03:57):
somebody completely different.
And when we give witness tosomething or we share our
testimony or we, you know, talkto somebody else about something
that's happened to us, it'skind of the outward expression
of what's happened inside.
And to me that was a really bigdeal because, like she had a
(04:18):
reputation and there was, I'msure, a lot of shame that came
with that, a lot of shame thatcame with that, a lot of mental
baggage.
I mean, just think of us aswomen, when we have a reputation
or when we know someone sees usa certain way, whether we have
a label on us or we havechildhood baggage or whatever it
is that can hinder us, it putsus in a box and I think that
(04:42):
this act from her was like herseeing herself differently, her
taking herself outside of thatbox.
So that was kind of the answerand the thought that I had.
Oh, that helps a lot.
Speaker 2 (04:57):
That perspective helps a lot for me to understand
.
Yeah, thanks, yeah.
Speaker 1 (05:01):
And also if you, I mean if you read that part of
the story, she didn't recognizehim at first.
So it actually took, in myopinion, a lot of faith and
courage for her even torecognize that, because at first
she wasn't thinking that abouta resurrection, right, she was
(05:21):
thinking more that what he was agardener, I'm trying to to
remember, yeah, a gardener, um,and so it wasn't until, you know
, wasn't until he spoke to herthat she actually realized who
he was.
So and that to me, that was anact of courage and faith too.
Just, I mean that I believe,yeah, not just a matter of being
(05:43):
a woman and not just a matterof being transformed, not any,
but just the mere fact of likebelieving that there was such
that this resurrection waspossible.
Speaker 3 (05:57):
I mean, and kind of believing that she was equal to
the men in the group, you know,I mean, I think that's really
pretty stunning yeah yeah shedid take action, despite I mean,
even though she was part of thegroup she easily could have
been ridiculed for this beliefthat jesus is alive.
Speaker 2 (06:16):
I mean, you know that that that was I mean, I think
it was my perspective when I wasreading it.
But you know, once I shift alittle like, yeah, I, I see all
this and understand it and I'mglad I asked the question
because this will really cementthis into my consciousness, so,
yeah, so I'm I'm glad, I'm gladI brought it up.
Speaker 1 (06:34):
So yeah, thank you.
Speaker 3 (06:37):
Well, can I just add one little thing on that too,
and this is probably just myperspective.
But, like, men have alwaysintimidated me and that is
probably because I've had likesome poor experiences in the
past.
But I'm just thinking, likefrom a cultural perspective
there and and we don't know,this part of the story, like,
(07:00):
this is just my thoughts and I'mnot equating them with anything
scriptural or what equatingthem with anything scriptural or
what, but like just to thinkabout a woman who was kind of
substandard in that culturebecause of her background and
her history, the fact that shehad the boldness to do this and
(07:20):
that they accepted her word,like you pointed out, tara I
think that that is really justso significant to think about.
And and even the fact thatmaybe that act wasn't bold and
courageous in and of itself, butthe community and the
acceptance that she had from thecommunity gave her the boldness
(07:41):
to do that, that's significant,you know.
So, anyways, just lots oflittle different thoughts.
Speaker 5 (07:47):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (07:49):
So Susan has just a generalized thought.
That is just.
I mean not even related to thecultural aspects and for Anna
being a woman.
But how many of us tell othersof our encounter with Christ?
You know, even now I mean itjust, and I know it was
different because they were shewas walking with him and she
(08:10):
knew him.
But we today also, you know heis in us and we are in him, and
yet it still takes courage to beable to tell others of our
encounters with him.
All right, sarah's making somepoints.
Two things Recused from sevendemons, she may have been
considered crazy.
Even today, mental illness islooked down upon and people not
(08:32):
trusting her.
Christ healing her healed herreputation too.
So, yes, but she was.
She did get healed frommultiple evil spirits.
It says she had a past, aserious past.
And then, number two where wereall the men that morning?
They were hiding because theywere scared, and she had tons of
(08:53):
courage to go to the tomb inthe first place.
You know what?
That's a really good point too,sarah.
The women went to care for himbecause he was just killed.
He was just killed.
So just even having the courageto stand with him, even in
death was in and of itself acourageous thing.
(09:16):
That's a great point.
Okay, all right, madeline,hello.
Speaker 4 (09:22):
Hey, I thought about some of these people that we've
studied about, and it's not thatthey listened at that moment,
they've been listening all alongand they were ready for the
moment when it came to them.
I mean, that was kind of likethat's why we need to stay in
god's word yeah because, becauseyou don't know that moment
(09:47):
that's going to changeeverything for somebody else's
life or your own.
But anyway, I just liked havingthis study to have been a part
of, and to me that was the faithin action, when you've been
hearing all along what God issaying and you're ready for the
moment.
Speaker 5 (10:05):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (10:06):
Yeah, and just to add to that, I really like how you
said that that was.
That is the action A lot oftimes.
That is the action of faith forus is to listen, because it
takes expectation.
We expect that God's going tospeak or we expect that he's
going to have use of us, that wehave something yet to do.
(10:26):
So I think that is definitely ahuge act of faith is to always
be listening.
So really, really encouraged bythat comment.
Speaker 1 (10:34):
Madeline, you know I almost hesitated to put David in
the study to begin with,because I really don't like when
we focus on David facing hisgiant, because it's just really
not.
That's not what the story isabout.
I've said this so many times.
The story is about David beinga picture of Christ and it was
(10:57):
actually, you know, Christ'sfaithfulness.
But there is a component aswell to David having to stand up
in that moment, as Madeline wassaying, take that action in
that moment to face that giant,and in doing so he became that
(11:18):
picture of Christ.
So I don't think that wenecessarily the entire
application of that story is weneed to, you know, stand up
against our giant.
I think that the application ofthat study is that we have
Christ who does stand up againstour giants, but and in that
(11:38):
moment David had to be faithful,he had to be courageous, and
we're going to have thosemoments too.
So I think it's a two.
You can go off the ditch ineither way.
So I think having that balanceis good.
Speaker 3 (11:51):
So if you've done that part of the study, Well,
and I know we've talked abouttypology before and how all of
these stories in the OldTestament, they paint pictures
of Christ in the New Testamentand I think that's really
important.
If you don't know anythingabout that, I think we have some
archives in the academy, thatin the library, that you can go
(12:13):
look up.
But I think to your point, jen,in order for us to represent
Christ, because we are to be hisambassadors and his
representation here on earth, inorder for us to represent
Christ because we are to be hisambassadors and his
representation here on earth, inorder for us to do that well,
same as David, we do have totake action.
So my son got married about sixweeks ago maybe, and so my
(12:38):
husband and I have been meetingwith him and his new wife to go
through like new married couples, counseling, whatever.
So one of the things that wementioned that we talked about
was how marriage itself is arepresentation of Christ and the
church and how that you know,in order for us to do marriage
(13:01):
well, we have to understand thatit's a representation of Christ
and his bride, and we justtalked about how important it is
to see things through that lens.
So when you're encounteringissues and you're encountering
struggles to go back to that,like how is this supposed to
represent Christ?
And and I think it is the sameis true for us when it comes to
(13:25):
bold action like how are actionssupposed to represent Christ
and how, how am I being calledto represent him?
Um, even in something likecleaning the kitchen or you know
what it can be, anything I mean, we are supposed to do all to
the glory of God.
So, whatever it is that we do,whether it's a big, bold action
(13:47):
or a small, mundane one, it isto reflect the awesomeness of
God, which is what it means toglorify him.
We are to showcase hisawesomeness and all that we do.
So just kind of bringing inthat element of okay, whatever
my action is, it is to representChrist the same way David did,
(14:09):
coming back full circle.
The same way David did infacing the giant you know he was
.
He reflected a type of Christ,and we do, too, in our actions.
Speaker 1 (14:21):
Mm-hmm Ramona says, what I think of from that part
of David's life is how God chosehim, not by outward appearance,
which was man's way, but bywhat was inside of him, what was
in his heart, and we see thatover and over again in scripture
too, right, even in even theway Christ was born, I mean.
But putting it back down to thebasics of it is not man's way.
(14:42):
Man would never have allowedthe king of the universe to be
born the way Christ was, and sothat's a great point too, as
we're thinking about it, andthat also can help us, as we are
, you know, going through ourdaily lives and representing
Christ.
As AJ AJ is saying, it's notnecessarily going to be the way
(15:05):
we think it's going to be, orcertainly not the way the world
thinks it should be, becauseGod's ways are above our ways,
and we see that in Scriptureover and over again.
So that's another good, just agood takeaway from that story
from the life of David.
Yeah, all right, sarah.
(15:27):
The story of Moses and theburning bush a play on words.
Moses asked who am I to rescuethe Israelites?
God answers later that his nameis I am who I am.
Reminds me that I don't have tobe someone to obey God and let
him use me.
I am usable because of who heis.
Speaker 3 (15:46):
Yeah, you totally flipped that question around,
didn't he?
Instead of who am I, he'ssaying I am.
So yeah, I love that insighttoo.
Speaker 1 (15:58):
Yeah, I actually love that whole conversation.
If you haven't had a chance orif you didn't do the part about
Moses, just go and read thewhole conversation Moses has
with God at the burning bush.
I mean, it's almost funny.
It's like, no, I can't do this.
It's like literally a bush isburning and not burning up and
(16:22):
God is talking to you through itand you're arguing with him
about your skill level atspeaking.
You know, it's just, it's sohuman, it is so real that it
gives me so much encouragement.
Right, just that wholeinteraction gives me so much
encouragement when I say that toGod and God does turn it around
(16:47):
on us often, doesn't he?
We don't really have excuseswhen God calls us.
Speaker 3 (16:53):
And he's got such a sense of humor.
You know just the way he doesit.
Speaker 5 (16:59):
Yeah Again, it's not ever the world's, it's not ever
our way, it's always his waywhen I read David facing his
giants, I think when I look atthe things in my life, they feel
pretty small, they don't feellike giants.
(17:19):
Am I maybe not going deeperlike I?
Like I go to God witheverything, but they don't feel
like giants, they don't feelthat I can't handle them.
So can you kind of put somewords to that, ladies?
Speaker 3 (17:47):
Well, I mean, my first thought is is we don't
always have to be facing a giant.
You know, I don't think youhave to create one if it's not
there.
I think we all do have timesand seasons, though, when we do
feel feel like we are facingsomething insurmountable, and
(18:07):
that really is where we canreally draw encouragement from
David's example in and findcourage to face those things
that do seem insurmountable.
But, on the other hand, we needto live with a John 15
perspective.
We can do nothing without him,even the smallest of things.
(18:32):
So, even though it may not be agiant that we're facing, we
still live with the knowledgethat we can do nothing apart
from him and his power, and justliving in that weakness and
that level of dependency on him,you know, and knowing that
that's a safe place to be.
So I don't know if that waskind of where you're headed or
(18:55):
not, but but it's okay.
I don't think you have tocreate a giant if you're not
like in the middle of one.
Speaker 5 (19:01):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (19:02):
I also think.
Number one it's good to see you, debbie, by the way.
But also I agree with that.
As far as you know, there'salways like, if you think
circumstantially, think of thehorizontal plane there are
always going to be times in ourlives when we're on the mountain
, we're on the valley top orsomewhere in between Right we
were facing the giant or we'rekind of cruising along, we're
(19:24):
feeling pretty good about things.
You know, I think thattemporarily, that is always
going to be where we, where weare, we have those moments and I
mean it's by the grace of Godthat we're not looking into the
face of something that seemsinsurmountable, right, which is
(19:45):
also by the grace of God that wecan overcome that.
But I think another perspectiveon this if you're not feeling
that in a temporal kind of way,I don't know, the first thing
that comes to my mind is let'sthink of it a little bit more on
a little different, like ametaphorical kind of plane.
(20:06):
And if David, if David is thetype of Christ in this story,
then Goliath will represent oursin and the enemy and we can
always look at it at this momentof okay, I may not be in a
place in my life, where I'm, youknow, got financial issues,
(20:27):
health issues that areinsurmountable, relationship
issues that are insurmountable.
Many of us are, but maybeyou're not in that place, which
is awesome, but you can stillhave this perspective of yes,
but, but there is this giant,this sin that has to be
(20:47):
vanquished and has to beconquered, and that is what the
death of Christ on the cross didfor me.
And so you can look at thestory in that way and recognize,
come at it from a littledifferent perspective and remind
yourself every day that you'refacing your own sin.
I mean every day.
And now you've been forgiven ofsin, you've been saved, but we
(21:11):
still are fighting it.
That's sanctification, right.
So we still have to continue tofight that.
And that is in and of itself aquote unquote giant that,
through the grace of God again,through the strength of Christ
in us, we battle every day.
So I don't think it has to be.
I agree with AJ.
(21:31):
It doesn't have to be some big,testimony-worthy giant that
you're facing right this minute.
It's just the mere fact thatyou're fighting your sin.
I mean little sin, big sin, itdoesn't matter.
You're fighting your sin rightnow, and we all are, and we're
finding that sin.
(21:51):
We're slowly growing in Christlikeness.
We're becoming the light on thehill.
We are a light on the hill.
We're illuminating the beautyof Christ through our lives, and
that's big.
That's big and that's a battle.
Speaker 3 (22:08):
Yeah, that's a really , really good point.
I love that.
And Sarah says pray for thoseof us who have multiple giants
right now.
If you find yourself in aposition where things are kind
of smooth sailing, remember thatthere are others who are going
through a harder time, and takethat as an opportunity to pray
for others.
Speaker 1 (22:27):
Yeah, yeah, I mean we're either moses trying to
keep our hands up, but we'reerin helping support them.
Yeah, we're.
We're in some, in some capacity.
We are one or the other ofthose.
We're either we're we're eitherexhausted or we're the support
and we're needed in both ofthose roles.
(22:49):
Yeah, that's right, I enjoyedthese discussions.
We don't, aj, and I never knowwhat's going to come up in these
discussions, so it can make usa little bit nervous.
Speaker 3 (23:04):
Yeah, this was really good, though, and, tara, I
really appreciate you hopping inat the beginning with the
question, because that just wasperfect to get things started.
Speaker 1 (23:13):
Okay, all right.
If that is all, we will closein a quick word of prayer.
Dear Heavenly Father, thank youso much for this day.
Thank you for your blessing ofallowing us to gather from
around the world, around thecountry, and from all the
different locations to be ableto see each other face to face
and speak with one another andlearn from each other.
(23:34):
Thank you for a desire to knowyou and a desire to understand
who you are through your word.
Thank you for giving us yourword and for our ability to be
able to even read it.
We do not take that for granted.
I pray that, as we enter intothis next coming up week, that
you just allow us to focus onyou, remove any obstacles to
(24:00):
Bible study and to growth in you, and allow us to just be that
light on the hill, to know youmore, to glorify you in all
things and become more likeChrist.
In your name we pray Amen.
Speaker 3 (24:19):
Bye guys, see you next week.
Welcome to the May coffee chat.
It's the middle of May, guys.
It's the middle of May, sotoday is our, it's billed as our
coffee chat, and so this is atime for you guys.
Okay, all right.
(00:20):
Well, let's bring Tara on,hello.
Speaker 2 (00:23):
So my question has to do and I don't have my study in
front of me but when I wasdoing the part with Mary
Magdalene and I didn't quiteunderstand the perspective of
how she was being interpretedI'm probably not getting the
right terms, but like strong andcourageous probably not getting
(00:46):
the right terms, but likestrong and courageous I didn't.
I guess I didn't look at itlike that, I just looked at it
as that she was a first witnessto things and then she told
people, but I don't understand,maybe, the perspective that I'm
supposed to have on it.
I guess I don't see it as likea courageous act.
I see it as important, but Iguess I don't see it for the
same lens and I just wanted tohear more from both of you on
(01:07):
that.
Speaker 1 (01:09):
Well, let me, let me go to that section in the study
and let's let's look at it.
For me, the courage comes inthe societal norms of the day,
right?
So if you look at herencounters with Christ that are
mentioned here, it talks abouther transformation, and her
(01:33):
transformation was more thanjust physical healing.
Her transformation was atransformation, obviously, of
the soul, and so she actuallybecame that first witness.
And when you think about, insociety at that time, a woman's
testimony was not consideredeven like a valid thing, so they
(01:59):
could easily be dismissed.
One of the things about her isthat she boldly stood for the
one who delivered her and savedher right, and she went against
what society may tell her to dothat.
Speaker 2 (02:21):
Jennifer, you know one thing about that which we do
not have the full context ofall the stuff that goes behind
this but the disciples believedher.
There is nothing that indicatesthat there was any like you
could interpret that as like shewas a peer.
You could interpret ormisinterpret anything.
Not you, particularly yourhetorical.
Interpret anything, not you,particularly you rhetorical.
(02:43):
I'm just like, it's just to me.
I'm not saying it was anon-event, but it just flowed
without issue.
So I didn't and I know womenwere different, perceived
differently, but in the contextof what happened there was no
hesitation of them believing her.
So you know what I mean.
(03:03):
So maybe outside of theirecosystem, sure, people would
not trust her, but she was partof the group, part of that group
of women that was with thedisciples.
So I mean, it was justinteresting to me and I bring it
up not, you know, to becontroversial, but it was just I
was trying to understandperspective on this because it
was like not an issue, becausethey were all on the same page,
(03:26):
you know all of them.
For some reason they believedher, without question.
Speaker 3 (03:32):
Well, tara, I totally see what you're saying and I
kind of have a slightlydifferent angle than Jen does.
But to me it was what happenedinternally and inside her,
because and Susan said they hadto see for themselves my answer
is she had to see herselfdifferently and identify as
(03:57):
somebody completely different.
And when we give witness tosomething or we share our
testimony or we, you know, talkto somebody else about something
that's happened to us, it'skind of the outward expression
of what's happened inside.
And to me that was a really bigdeal because, like she had a
(04:18):
reputation and there was, I'msure, a lot of shame that came
with that, a lot of shame thatcame with that, a lot of mental
baggage.
I mean, just think of us aswomen, when we have a reputation
or when we know someone sees usa certain way, whether we have
a label on us or we havechildhood baggage or whatever it
is that can hinder us, it putsus in a box and I think that
(04:42):
this act from her was like herseeing herself differently, her
taking herself outside of thatbox.
So that was kind of the answerand the thought that I had.
Oh, that helps a lot.
Speaker 2 (04:57):
That perspective helps a lot for me to understand
.
Yeah, thanks, yeah.
Speaker 1 (05:01):
And also if you, I mean if you read that part of
the story, she didn't recognizehim at first.
So it actually took, in myopinion, a lot of faith and
courage for her even torecognize that, because at first
she wasn't thinking that abouta resurrection, right, she was
(05:21):
thinking more that what he was agardener, I'm trying to to
remember, yeah, a gardener, um,and so it wasn't until, you know
, wasn't until he spoke to herthat she actually realized who
he was.
So and that to me, that was anact of courage and faith too.
Just, I mean that I believe,yeah, not just a matter of being
(05:43):
a woman and not just a matterof being transformed, not any,
but just the mere fact of likebelieving that there was such
that this resurrection waspossible.
Speaker 3 (05:57):
I mean, and kind of believing that she was equal to
the men in the group, you know,I mean, I think that's really
pretty stunning yeah yeah shedid take action, despite I mean,
even though she was part of thegroup she easily could have
been ridiculed for this beliefthat jesus is alive.
Speaker 2 (06:16):
I mean, you know that that that was I mean, I think
it was my perspective when I wasreading it.
But you know, once I shift alittle like, yeah, I, I see all
this and understand it and I'mglad I asked the question
because this will really cementthis into my consciousness, so,
yeah, so I'm I'm glad, I'm gladI brought it up.
Speaker 1 (06:34):
So yeah, thank you.
Speaker 3 (06:37):
Well, can I just add one little thing on that too,
and this is probably just myperspective.
But, like, men have alwaysintimidated me and that is
probably because I've had likesome poor experiences in the
past.
But I'm just thinking, likefrom a cultural perspective
there and and we don't know,this part of the story, like,
(07:00):
this is just my thoughts and I'mnot equating them with anything
scriptural or what equatingthem with anything scriptural or
what, but like just to thinkabout a woman who was kind of
substandard in that culturebecause of her background and
her history, the fact that shehad the boldness to do this and
(07:20):
that they accepted her word,like you pointed out, tara I
think that that is really justso significant to think about.
And and even the fact thatmaybe that act wasn't bold and
courageous in and of itself, butthe community and the
acceptance that she had from thecommunity gave her the boldness
(07:41):
to do that, that's significant,you know.
So, anyways, just lots oflittle different thoughts.
Speaker 5 (07:47):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (07:49):
So Susan has just a generalized thought.
That is just.
I mean not even related to thecultural aspects and for Anna
being a woman.
But how many of us tell othersof our encounter with Christ?
You know, even now I mean itjust, and I know it was
different because they were shewas walking with him and she
(08:10):
knew him.
But we today also, you know heis in us and we are in him, and
yet it still takes courage to beable to tell others of our
encounters with him.
All right, sarah's making somepoints.
Two things Recused from sevendemons, she may have been
considered crazy.
Even today, mental illness islooked down upon and people not
(08:32):
trusting her.
Christ healing her healed herreputation too.
So, yes, but she was.
She did get healed frommultiple evil spirits.
It says she had a past, aserious past.
And then, number two where wereall the men that morning?
They were hiding because theywere scared, and she had tons of
(08:53):
courage to go to the tomb inthe first place.
You know what?
That's a really good point too,sarah.
The women went to care for himbecause he was just killed.
He was just killed.
So just even having the courageto stand with him, even in
death was in and of itself acourageous thing.
(09:16):
That's a great point.
Okay, all right, madeline,hello.
Speaker 4 (09:22):
Hey, I thought about some of these people that we've
studied about, and it's not thatthey listened at that moment,
they've been listening all alongand they were ready for the
moment when it came to them.
I mean, that was kind of likethat's why we need to stay in
god's word yeah because, becauseyou don't know that moment
(09:47):
that's going to changeeverything for somebody else's
life or your own.
But anyway, I just liked havingthis study to have been a part
of, and to me that was the faithin action, when you've been
hearing all along what God issaying and you're ready for the
moment.
Speaker 5 (10:05):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (10:06):
Yeah, and just to add to that, I really like how you
said that that was.
That is the action A lot oftimes.
That is the action of faith forus is to listen, because it
takes expectation.
We expect that God's going tospeak or we expect that he's
going to have use of us, that wehave something yet to do.
(10:26):
So I think that is definitely ahuge act of faith is to always
be listening.
So really, really encouraged bythat comment.
Speaker 1 (10:34):
Madeline, you know I almost hesitated to put David in
the study to begin with,because I really don't like when
we focus on David facing hisgiant, because it's just really
not.
That's not what the story isabout.
I've said this so many times.
The story is about David beinga picture of Christ and it was
(10:57):
actually, you know, Christ'sfaithfulness.
But there is a component aswell to David having to stand up
in that moment, as Madeline wassaying, take that action in
that moment to face that giant,and in doing so he became that
(11:18):
picture of Christ.
So I don't think that wenecessarily the entire
application of that story is weneed to, you know, stand up
against our giant.
I think that the application ofthat study is that we have
Christ who does stand up againstour giants, but and in that
(11:38):
moment David had to be faithful,he had to be courageous, and
we're going to have thosemoments too.
So I think it's a two.
You can go off the ditch ineither way.
So I think having that balanceis good.
Speaker 3 (11:51):
So if you've done that part of the study, Well,
and I know we've talked abouttypology before and how all of
these stories in the OldTestament, they paint pictures
of Christ in the New Testamentand I think that's really
important.
If you don't know anythingabout that, I think we have some
archives in the academy, thatin the library, that you can go
(12:13):
look up.
But I think to your point, jen,in order for us to represent
Christ, because we are to be hisambassadors and his
representation here on earth, inorder for us to represent
Christ because we are to be hisambassadors and his
representation here on earth, inorder for us to do that well,
same as David, we do have totake action.
So my son got married about sixweeks ago maybe, and so my
(12:38):
husband and I have been meetingwith him and his new wife to go
through like new married couples, counseling, whatever.
So one of the things that wementioned that we talked about
was how marriage itself is arepresentation of Christ and the
church and how that you know,in order for us to do marriage
(13:01):
well, we have to understand thatit's a representation of Christ
and his bride, and we justtalked about how important it is
to see things through that lens.
So when you're encounteringissues and you're encountering
struggles to go back to that,like how is this supposed to
represent Christ?
And and I think it is the sameis true for us when it comes to
(13:25):
bold action like how are actionssupposed to represent Christ
and how, how am I being calledto represent him?
Um, even in something likecleaning the kitchen or you know
what it can be, anything I mean, we are supposed to do all to
the glory of God.
So, whatever it is that we do,whether it's a big, bold action
(13:47):
or a small, mundane one, it isto reflect the awesomeness of
God, which is what it means toglorify him.
We are to showcase hisawesomeness and all that we do.
So just kind of bringing inthat element of okay, whatever
my action is, it is to representChrist the same way David did,
(14:09):
coming back full circle.
The same way David did infacing the giant you know he was
.
He reflected a type of Christ,and we do, too, in our actions.
Speaker 1 (14:21):
Mm-hmm Ramona says, what I think of from that part
of David's life is how God chosehim, not by outward appearance,
which was man's way, but bywhat was inside of him, what was
in his heart, and we see thatover and over again in scripture
too, right, even in even theway Christ was born, I mean.
But putting it back down to thebasics of it is not man's way.
(14:42):
Man would never have allowedthe king of the universe to be
born the way Christ was, and sothat's a great point too, as
we're thinking about it, andthat also can help us, as we are
, you know, going through ourdaily lives and representing
Christ.
As AJ AJ is saying, it's notnecessarily going to be the way
(15:05):
we think it's going to be, orcertainly not the way the world
thinks it should be, becauseGod's ways are above our ways,
and we see that in Scriptureover and over again.
So that's another good, just agood takeaway from that story
from the life of David.
Yeah, all right, sarah.
(15:27):
The story of Moses and theburning bush a play on words.
Moses asked who am I to rescuethe Israelites?
God answers later that his nameis I am who I am.
Reminds me that I don't have tobe someone to obey God and let
him use me.
I am usable because of who heis.
Speaker 3 (15:46):
Yeah, you totally flipped that question around,
didn't he?
Instead of who am I, he'ssaying I am.
So yeah, I love that insighttoo.
Speaker 1 (15:58):
Yeah, I actually love that whole conversation.
If you haven't had a chance orif you didn't do the part about
Moses, just go and read thewhole conversation Moses has
with God at the burning bush.
I mean, it's almost funny.
It's like, no, I can't do this.
It's like literally a bush isburning and not burning up and
(16:22):
God is talking to you through itand you're arguing with him
about your skill level atspeaking.
You know, it's just, it's sohuman, it is so real that it
gives me so much encouragement.
Right, just that wholeinteraction gives me so much
encouragement when I say that toGod and God does turn it around
(16:47):
on us often, doesn't he?
We don't really have excuseswhen God calls us.
Speaker 3 (16:53):
And he's got such a sense of humor.
You know just the way he doesit.
Speaker 5 (16:59):
Yeah Again, it's not ever the world's, it's not ever
our way, it's always his waywhen I read David facing his
giants, I think when I look atthe things in my life, they feel
pretty small, they don't feellike giants.
(17:19):
Am I maybe not going deeperlike I?
Like I go to God witheverything, but they don't feel
like giants, they don't feelthat I can't handle them.
So can you kind of put somewords to that, ladies?
Speaker 3 (17:47):
Well, I mean, my first thought is is we don't
always have to be facing a giant.
You know, I don't think youhave to create one if it's not
there.
I think we all do have timesand seasons, though, when we do
feel feel like we are facingsomething insurmountable, and
(18:07):
that really is where we canreally draw encouragement from
David's example in and findcourage to face those things
that do seem insurmountable.
But, on the other hand, we needto live with a John 15
perspective.
We can do nothing without him,even the smallest of things.
(18:32):
So, even though it may not be agiant that we're facing, we
still live with the knowledgethat we can do nothing apart
from him and his power, and justliving in that weakness and
that level of dependency on him,you know, and knowing that
that's a safe place to be.
So I don't know if that waskind of where you're headed or
(18:55):
not, but but it's okay.
I don't think you have tocreate a giant if you're not
like in the middle of one.
Speaker 5 (19:01):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (19:02):
I also think.
Number one it's good to see you, debbie, by the way.
But also I agree with that.
As far as you know, there'salways like, if you think
circumstantially, think of thehorizontal plane there are
always going to be times in ourlives when we're on the mountain
, we're on the valley top orsomewhere in between Right we
were facing the giant or we'rekind of cruising along, we're
(19:24):
feeling pretty good about things.
You know, I think thattemporarily, that is always
going to be where we, where weare, we have those moments and I
mean it's by the grace of Godthat we're not looking into the
face of something that seemsinsurmountable, right, which is
(19:45):
also by the grace of God that wecan overcome that.
But I think another perspectiveon this if you're not feeling
that in a temporal kind of way,I don't know, the first thing
that comes to my mind is let'sthink of it a little bit more on
a little different, like ametaphorical kind of plane.
(20:06):
And if David, if David is thetype of Christ in this story,
then Goliath will represent oursin and the enemy and we can
always look at it at this momentof okay, I may not be in a
place in my life, where I'm, youknow, got financial issues,
(20:27):
health issues that areinsurmountable, relationship
issues that are insurmountable.
Many of us are, but maybeyou're not in that place, which
is awesome, but you can stillhave this perspective of yes,
but, but there is this giant,this sin that has to be
(20:47):
vanquished and has to beconquered, and that is what the
death of Christ on the cross didfor me.
And so you can look at thestory in that way and recognize,
come at it from a littledifferent perspective and remind
yourself every day that you'refacing your own sin.
I mean every day.
And now you've been forgiven ofsin, you've been saved, but we
(21:11):
still are fighting it.
That's sanctification, right.
So we still have to continue tofight that.
And that is in and of itself aquote unquote giant that,
through the grace of God again,through the strength of Christ
in us, we battle every day.
So I don't think it has to be.
I agree with AJ.
(21:31):
It doesn't have to be some big,testimony-worthy giant that
you're facing right this minute.
It's just the mere fact thatyou're fighting your sin.
I mean little sin, big sin, itdoesn't matter.
You're fighting your sin rightnow, and we all are, and we're
finding that sin.
(21:51):
We're slowly growing in Christlikeness.
We're becoming the light on thehill.
We are a light on the hill.
We're illuminating the beautyof Christ through our lives, and
that's big.
That's big and that's a battle.
Speaker 3 (22:08):
Yeah, that's a really , really good point.
I love that.
And Sarah says pray for thoseof us who have multiple giants
right now.
If you find yourself in aposition where things are kind
of smooth sailing, remember thatthere are others who are going
through a harder time, and takethat as an opportunity to pray
for others.
Speaker 1 (22:27):
Yeah, yeah, I mean we're either moses trying to
keep our hands up, but we'reerin helping support them.
Yeah, we're.
We're in some, in some capacity.
We are one or the other ofthose.
We're either we're we're eitherexhausted or we're the support
and we're needed in both ofthose roles.
(22:49):
Yeah, that's right, I enjoyedthese discussions.
We don't, aj, and I never knowwhat's going to come up in these
discussions, so it can make usa little bit nervous.
Speaker 3 (23:04):
Yeah, this was really good, though, and, tara, I
really appreciate you hopping inat the beginning with the
question, because that just wasperfect to get things started.
Speaker 1 (23:13):
Okay, all right.
If that is all, we will closein a quick word of prayer.
Dear Heavenly Father, thank youso much for this day.
Thank you for your blessing ofallowing us to gather from
around the world, around thecountry, and from all the
different locations to be ableto see each other face to face
and speak with one another andlearn from each other.
(23:34):
Thank you for a desire to knowyou and a desire to understand
who you are through your word.
Thank you for giving us yourword and for our ability to be
able to even read it.
We do not take that for granted.
I pray that, as we enter intothis next coming up week, that
you just allow us to focus onyou, remove any obstacles to
(24:00):
Bible study and to growth in you, and allow us to just be that
light on the hill, to know youmore, to glorify you in all
things and become more likeChrist.
In your name we pray Amen.
Speaker 3 (24:19):
Bye guys, see you next week.
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