January 30, 2025 • 36 mins
This episode discusses the pervasive issue of burnout, especially in the nonprofit sector, focusing on its symptoms, impact, and practical strategies for recovery. Spring Richardson Perry and guest Shandelynn Hilliard, licensed professional counselor, share personal experiences and insights on recognizing burnout in oneself and others, emphasizing the importance of self-care and community support.
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Episode Transcript
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Spring Richardson Perry (00:03):
Hey, nonprofit friends, welcome to
the Spring Forward podcast,where we talk about all things
nonprofit, from board discord togrant writing and strategic
planning tips.
If you're an executive director, nonprofit board member or just
someone heavily involved in thenonprofit sector, then this is
the podcast for you.
Let's spring forward intoexcellence, and this is the
(00:28):
podcast for you.
Let's spring forward intoexcellence.
Welcome, welcome everyone tothe Spring Forward podcast.
I am your host, springRichardson Perry, and we are
back.
It's been a minute.
I was on a little hiatus tryingto figure out what is next with
the podcast, and so we are backand I am excited to share all
(00:51):
the new things that are going tobe happening with this podcast.
And so, for one, my focus hasbeen organizational development
in general, and these days I amnow fully focused on nonprofits
specifically.
So for those of you that don'tknow me, let me reintroduce
(01:14):
myself really quickly.
So I work with nonprofitorganizations, helping them with
grant writing, strategicplanning, fund development,
governance and compliance.
So what that means is grantwriting, of course, is
self-explanatory, but funddevelopment, I will help you
(01:35):
with fundraising strategies,help you identify different
streams of income for yournonprofit and, just overall,
help you to be a morefinancially sound organization,
because a lot of timesnonprofits forget that you are
still a business, so there is abusiness side to things that has
(01:58):
to be addressed.
So I help you guys with thosethings, as well as helping you
with board stuff in terms ofworkshops, leadership
development, understanding whatthe board's role is as opposed
to the actual staff of theorganization.
Compliance things nonprofitsrun into all kinds of issues
(02:19):
with compliance just becausemany of them are unaware there's
so many changing regulationseach and every year, especially
with tax compliance.
So my husband is actually a taxexpert he does, he's a
certified tax professional andso he helps me help nonprofits
(02:40):
with that.
And then, finally, withstrategic planning.
I actually just did a strategicplanning session this weekend
with a nonprofit board that Isit on.
I sit on two nonprofit boardshere locally.
One is called the Well Rockport.
They are a nonprofit thatfocuses on helping women who are
(03:00):
victims of domestic violenceand or sexual assault, and so we
are establishing sometransitional housing here in
Rockport, texas.
I also sit on the board of theChildren's Coalition of Aransas
County and they serve childrenand their families here in the
Rockport area.
So a little bit about me.
(03:23):
That's it About the podcast.
Together.
We went on our collegegraduation trip together.
(03:52):
I was at her graduation for hermaster's degree and when she
was getting licensed to be atherapist.
So when I say that's my girl tobe a therapist, so when I say
that's my girl, that's my girlfor real, I'm not just saying
that.
So we are super excited to betalking to you guys today about
(04:15):
burnout.
This 2024, when I tell you 2024turned me every which way but
loose.
And I find a lot of people feltthe same way.
They were burned out but didn'teven realize that they were in
burnout.
So we're going to be talkingabout that today.
We're going to talk about somestrategies to help you cope and
(04:37):
some things that she and I havebeen discussing and talking
about.
So, without further ado, let mebring on my girl, shandalyn
Hilliard.
Hey, hey, shay, what's up?
Shandelynn Hilliard (04:53):
girl, girl you can listen.
Spring Richardson Perry (05:00):
Only way.
Shandelynn Hilliard (05:00):
What time?
Only way, but it's been a goodday.
It's been a good day.
Let me catch my flyaways.
We almost threw on some gray.
Spring Richardson Perry (05:12):
Oh yeah , see, it's Monday.
Monday is a gray day, you know,because you don't know what to
expect.
You're just starting your weekout, so it's like I need some
gray, because there's some grayarea for me today.
Shandelynn Hilliard (05:28):
So I got to figure out what the rest of the
week is going to look like, soI may have some Well we're on,
oh my goodness.
Spring Richardson Perry (05:37):
Well, I'm excited to have you on today
to talk about burnout, becauseI'm sure this is something that
you see frequently in yourclients and just overall when we
think about mental health.
This is one of those thingsthat we don't talk about a lot.
We talk about psychologicalsafety, we talk about mental
(06:02):
illness in general, but we don'ttalk about just burnout,
exhaustion, just doing all thethings, feeling like you're not
getting anything done, and thenyou fall into this sort of black
hole, and so I want to reallyget into this.
First, talk to me about how youdefine burnout, like how does
(06:25):
it differ from just everydaystress?
What is burnout?
Shandelynn Hilliard (06:29):
Yeah, okay, it's the dragging of me by my
wig, that's what it is.
But burnout is going to be aprolonged exposure to chronic
stress, right so, and it's goingto intensify over time if we
don't do anything about it.
Okay, so it's imminent,essentially.
And then your everydaystressors.
(06:50):
These are typically temporary,so imagine like deadlines, or
imagine like the student who hasa test or something coming up,
right.
Once that challenge is met, ourstress goes down until the next
thing comes up, right, so it'sgoing to be different in the
intensity and then how long itis Okay, that makes sense,
(07:12):
because for a prolonged periodof time, I was feeling a certain
type of way, and so that makessense.
Spring Richardson Perry (07:20):
So that kind of leads into the next one
, though, because, because, like, what are those common symptoms
?
What do you normally?
What is it?
What does it look like?
What are some signs that peoplehave, whether they're a
caregiver, a nonprofit leader, aparent, a student, whoever?
Shandelynn Hilliard (07:37):
they are.
Spring Richardson Perry (07:38):
What are some signs that they're
experiencing burnout that theyshould be aware?
Shandelynn Hilliard (07:42):
of.
So one of the top ones is goingto be like feelings of
overwhelm, right.
Some of them could be just likethe idea of feeling stuck and
not being able to do anything.
With it.
It can be a lack of motivation,right, I just don't feel like
doing nothing.
I don't want to look at it, Idon't want to talk about it, I
just want to like take a nap,right.
Or it could be anxiety.
(08:04):
It could be going physical,where maybe it is headaches,
maybe it is like gastro issues,like my stomach been hurting,
but like what's up, why I gotthis migraine.
Those are all signs of it thatsometimes we don't take it into
account, right, because I don'tfeel like doing nothing To me.
I just don't feel like doinganything, but I will.
For instance, I will make you avision bingo card.
(08:27):
Okay, I'm going to avoid allthe adult things I have to do
and I'm going to make it pretty.
I've been coloring all weekBecause I ain't got it.
But also I'll say this I didtake a week off purposely.
It's like my kickstart of theyear.
From my birthday, I'll take theweek off, and so I don't want
to think about work, but maybe Ishould have put my gray sweater
(08:48):
on today.
Maybe it is one of those kindsof days, but those are going to
be the things.
Another one could be feelingincompetent, which is crazy, but
yeah, like I don't even knowhow to do that but yeah, like I
(09:09):
don't even know how to do that.
Spring Richardson Perry (09:09):
That's, that's crazy, because all of
the things that you'rementioning, it's like I have
experienced those things all atone time, right.
So the feeling of theseheadaches just coming on out of
nowhere, the feeling like I justdon't want to do anything, and
not just because it's like amoment in the day where the
feeling like I just don't wantto do anything, and not just
because it's like a moment inthe day where I'm like, okay,
I've done enough, I don't wantto do anything else.
(09:30):
Like I wake up, I don't want todo anything.
I go to sleep, I haven't doneanything.
I wake up again, I don't wantto do anything.
Almost like in a depression,but not necessarily feeling the
gloom and doom, but just likeI'm just exhausted, I'm just
tired, I feel heavy and I don'tknow what to do.
(09:52):
And every time I try to dosomething, my brain is just
cloudy and foggy and nothingmakes sense and I just don't
know.
Shandelynn Hilliard (10:01):
So oh girl, you get it, like all of those
things.
So the fogginess, like themental exhaustion, yeah, it's
real, but again, sometimes wedon't think about it until, like
, somebody make us think aboutit.
It's like, oh you right, that'swhat happened, that's exactly
it.
Spring Richardson Perry (10:18):
Right?
Because?
Because you're not, you're notputting all of these things
together as one consolidatedevent.
Everything in your head isindividual.
Oh, I have a headache, let metake an aspirin.
Oh, I'm tired, let me go laydown.
Shandelynn Hilliard (10:34):
Oh.
Spring Richardson Perry (10:34):
I don't feel like doing anything today,
I'll just get to it tomorrowand everything is just it's
isolated own thing.
Until you talk to someone likeyou and you're like, oh, is that
what's been going on?
Because it sounds like to meyou're a little burned out.
So, like I want to talk aboutthis, because what I find what's
(10:57):
been going on with me?
I've just been having so muchhappening lately in terms of the
business and then caring for mydad who's aging, who's
absolutely going nuts, and thenyou know, trying to put it all
together like what is thedifference?
(11:19):
Maybe how would burnoutmanifest in a caregiver versus
like a nonprofit leader orsomeone at work?
And I want y'all to know thatspecific chandelain has a really
, a really close relationship toburnout and caregivers too.
(11:42):
So this is something that'snear and dear to her heart as
well, because not only is sheseeing it in her clients, but
she's seeing it in her personallife as well.
Shandelynn Hilliard (11:56):
So talk to me about that okay, so I guess
I'm gonna start off with I don'tbelieve that there is a
difference, like there is noversus here and there, between,
like, caregivers or nonprofitleaders.
I think we feel it the same, itmanifests the same Like I legit
can't think of like a indicatorthat would say you're separate
from this person because of thisthing.
(12:18):
The feelings, they're the same.
So you're feeling overwhelmedthat we just talked about
Detachment, if you've ever feltthat.
So again, right, I'm not doingit today, I'm going to just
detach.
Spring Richardson Perry (12:30):
I just want to run away.
Shandelynn Hilliard (12:32):
How about that?
Seriously, like, can I pack abag?
I legit told him I was in asession one day and I was like I
mean I want to get on a planeright now.
And my client was like waitwhat?
I was in session one day and Iwas like I mean, I want to get
on a plane right now.
And my client was like waitwhat?
I was like, yes, I would liketo go Now, book me a flight
Again, the encompassing or howabout feeling inadequate?
Like again, I don't know, Ican't do when it's all false.
(12:56):
Feeling drained, that's a bigone.
So the same thing.
So the mental exhaustion is allthe same.
They manifest the same wayCaregivers and nonprofit leaders
, we are the same.
Spring Richardson Perry (13:07):
So I imagine that there's going to be
some long-term healthconsequences if this continues
to go unaddressed.
What does that look like?
Shandelynn Hilliard (13:17):
It looks like chronic stress.
It looks like it looks likechronic stress.
It looks like it let's just say, let's break it down so
long-term physically, mentallyand emotionally right.
So your physical impact couldbe the sleep that we keep
talking about.
So it's fatigue, it's thatexhaustion it can present as um
insomnia, hypersomnia, right?
(13:38):
So we all around here walkingaround talking about I get sleep
, well, I'm tired hypersomnia,right.
So we all around here walkingaround talking about I get sleep
while I'm tired, hypersomnia?
Um, you can have, like yourweakened immune system.
So, right, we're getting sick.
Like, why are we getting sick?
What's happening here?
And I'm carrying too much um,heart issues, um, hypertension,
(14:00):
heart disease.
Those are all parts of thingsthat can manifest if we're not
taking care of ourselves.
Right, there is um again goinginto like the emotional side and
the mental side that correlates.
So you have like the anxiety,the depression.
Those things are going tocorrelate, but they're going to
come from that mental side.
So I'm detached, um, I'm prettycynical now of the people.
Spring Richardson Perry (14:24):
Um, it gets a little self-work, or even
think about like your decisionmaking, like sometimes it starts
to deplete, you said earlier,it's real, your memory function
is real, and I think I don'tthink people realize that
decision fatigue is real too,like when you are like the
(14:47):
leader of an organization, like,for instance, my executive
directors for nonprofits.
Right, they get this compassionfatigue as well as this
decision fatigue right, becauseit's a constant putting out the
fire right the next crisis,dealing with the crisis of the
day or the crisis of the moment.
You have to make these hardmission.
(15:09):
You need A B, c, d, e, fresources, but I only have A B
and C and half an F and D and E.
(15:30):
We haven't had since 2001.
You know, so it's it's hard, soit's hard.
It really is hard on my leaders, especially that I see and I'm
(15:56):
always trying to help them sortof take a step back and really
just reflect, just take a momentand just think, just breathe,
just take a step back from itall, take yourself out of the
day to day and relax and do some.
I think another thing here thatthat may be helpful is some
self care.
But talk to me about what that,what that looks like, like how
(16:22):
can you, what can you do, maybesetting boundaries or what is it
that is helpful?
in managing this and preventingthis.
Shandelynn Hilliard (16:35):
Yeah.
So just before I go into that,I actually read something and it
says empathy is required butpersonal restoration is
neglected.
And I was just like, yeah, yeah, yeah, sign me up, because we
will, we will sign up to do allof the things.
So, again, when we put thenonprofit leaders and caregivers
same thing, right, you'reputting the company or the
(16:58):
community or, you know, theperson ahead of what you have
going on.
So you're underfunding.
That's real.
So now I have to do more withless, which is wild to me, right
, because I can't just make itlike a peer, but I have to
Because, yeah, because there'sright.
So part of this self-care idea.
(17:20):
So think about self-care likeyour security blanket, right, so
it is like the reassurance, itis a grounding of sorts.
Self-care is going to bring youback to you and, again, if you
don't, burnout is imminent, Likeit's coming for you, right, and
do the first thought is say no,okay.
Spring Richardson Perry (17:42):
That's my word of the year.
You know how everybody picks aword for the year.
I said this year, my word is no.
The answer is no, it is a fullsentence.
It doesn't require anexplanation.
No is no.
I say no.
That's it Because often timestoo, we find ourselves in this,
(18:05):
in this sort of like limbo,where it's like I know I'm tired
, I know I can't push myselfanymore, but this person needs
me to do this, or you know, mymission to serve is this and
this is what I'm supposed to bedoing.
But you can't do it all, andthat's something I had to learn
(18:28):
the hard way and I think youknow.
Besides the no, one of thethings that really helped me was
this journal, the invitationJournal.
So if y'all don't know thisjournal, journaling has always
(18:48):
been super helpful for me, butthis is Shanda Lynn's Journal.
This is what she created as amental health expert.
It has prompts in here thatreally give you some clarity.
It helps you to think about.
Okay, like I'm gonna give youan example.
Oh, my girl.
(19:09):
Question number one you'rereflecting on the past week.
It says what challenges did Idid I face this past week, if
any I did I face this past week,if any, so right then and there
you write down what happened,what challenges you faced, and
then it says what lessons did Ilearn from those challenges?
(19:30):
Which to me was like, as I wasgoing through this, I was like,
oh my gosh, like, yes, whatchallenge did I face?
What was it I learned from that?
Because every experience is alearning opportunity and whether
that experience is good or bad,you learn something from it.
(19:50):
But if you don't stop to thinkabout what it is that you learn
and value that particularexperience for what it was, that
experience, whatever it endedup being, and then move on from
it.
I think the burnout really comesin when we start holding on to
(20:11):
things too right, things thatweren't meant for us to hold, on
to burdens that weren't meantfor us to carry, burdens that
weren't meant for us to carry.
Darlene was laughing at me.
She said she was like when Iwrote the post on social media,
like I'm all of them.
I'm the parent, I'm thecaregiver, I'm the nonprofit
(20:32):
leader.
All of those three things areme.
All of those three things carrya very heavy weight, a heavy
burden, and but it doesn't haveto when you learn how to really
manage your time effectivelyAgain journaling when I tell
(20:53):
y'all.
This journal saved my life.
This is amazing, thank you.
We need to get you one, so Iwill put the link in the
comments for y'all so you canget one.
Journaling is so helpful it is.
Shandelynn Hilliard (21:08):
It is A little cheat sheet for that area
.
So what I will do is I won'twait to the end of the week when
I'm reflecting.
If something comes up, I'mgoing to notate it.
Because, again, if we're in aspace where we're foggy or
concentration, focus isn't there, I'm going to forget.
(21:28):
So I'm going to go ahead andnotate it.
I'm going to put it down whatmy challenge was and write it in
there.
If I've come up with somethinghelpful, I can put it there too.
But for me it's been helpfuljust kind of maneuvering around
the journal itself.
But also, don't forget to putyour wins there too.
One of my things when I alwaysbuy journals, I know this whole
idea of being happy and, like Imade it like a journal, it was
(21:52):
just so happy.
So that's why I said no.
But what was the challenges?
And then after that, what wasyour win?
So I can see, right, life isebbs and flows, like it's moving
, it's constantly moving.
And also, if I go back to July4th or something like that,
right, I can see, oh, on thatday I experienced this, because
(22:15):
maybe I'm experiencing thatagain, and so if I'm putting
down how did I overcome it, Ican use that again.
So the journal is just like atool that's going to bring you.
It's a wraparound.
I think that's a good word.
It's very transformational andit takes you on a journey where
you can really be like I feltcool that day.
I feel like trash today, andthat's OK.
Today I feel amazing.
Spring Richardson Perry (22:37):
It also .
It also allows you to reallysee your journey, your journey
right.
It's a visual of where youstarted and then where you're
going, because this, thisjournal, takes you on a 90-day
discovery, a 90-day journal ofself-discovery where you learn
about the things that thatplague you, the things that
challenge you, like what'schallenging to me may not be
(23:01):
challenging to Shandalyn, butyou learn more and more about
yourself and you start to learnhow to deal with these things
and sometimes mitigate thembefore it even comes up, because
you know, okay, this is atrigger, so I'm not even going
to deal with it.
And so it.
I mean it.
It's just y'all when I tell youtransformational is an
(23:25):
understatement, like it is so.
So transformational, it just it.
It helps you to see through neweyes.
That's the best way to explainthat it does.
Shandelynn Hilliard (23:38):
I would say the first time I did right,
because I'm always somebody whohas to try it out before I tell
somebody, oh, go do this thing.
When I finished my first 90days, I was like, oh, I am
cognizant of my mood, like I metherapist, right, yes, I can be
happy, I can be sad, I can doall of these things, the, the,
the example I always give myclients.
(23:59):
Um, so, going back to 2022,when my grandmother passed that
morning, I got up, I went tochurch, I had a facial plan.
Um, my best friend was movinggirl.
I went over there, we had shotsfor no reason, you know,
whatever.
Um, it's a Sunday, sunday, funday, and I got my facial and I'm
on high.
About 20 minutes later, I get aphone call from my mom.
(24:21):
Now she's calling back to backand I'm like, ah, because I used
to say don't call me back toback Cause I don't know if it's
an emergency, right, and so thistime she called it like
everything dropped, right.
But I remember going, like, tothe hospital that night.
You know, we, uh, we had to go.
You know, check out mygrandmother, all of these things
.
But I went home in a journaland for the next few days I just
(24:45):
kept journaling and what I sawwas my mood was like I'm here,
man, whatever.
Here we go again.
And then I remember the day Iwas happy.
I was like, oh wait, I'm happy.
And so we need that, becausewe'll think that it's a
continuous thing of like, um,pain or grief or not saying
grief stopped right.
But it's this continuation ofthings and if I look at it
(25:08):
without writing it down, I'mgonna think every day was trash
and every day isn't.
But yeah, so that's the story Ipassed like you gotta do it, no
matter what.
You have to push through it soyou can see what's happening.
And that's what the journal didfor me.
Spring Richardson Perry (25:23):
I love it, I love it.
Another thing y'all that isreally really helpful,
especially for me when I wasgoing through a really tough
time back in 2021, and I went on.
I guess you can call it like aretreat.
Shandelynn Hilliard (25:41):
It wasn't a structured retreat.
Spring Richardson Perry (25:43):
At the time it was just me just getting
away with one of my friends andwe went to this yoga resort out
in Costa Rica and I find that achange of scenery sometimes is
super, super helpful.
Machinery sometimes it's supersuper helpful.
And so, like when I was talkingabout running away, like
(26:05):
sometimes you do just want torun away, but if you have like a
scheduled event right orsomething planned that you know
like hey, I know in SeptemberI'm going to this place, it's
going to be great, like thatsort of gets you through it too.
Because as I was going throughall the things back then, at
(26:29):
that time I kept thinking in myhead, oh, but I have this trip
(26:55):
and that would just light me up.
So, just with journaling andthen that trip that I had
planned, it was so, so helpfulin terms of my mood, my emotions
and really helping me to liketo stay focused and to not see
everything as just doom andgloom.
Because if you it's a mindsetthing, right, you, it's a
mindset thing, right if you'reconstantly, if you're constantly
in this doom and gloom state ofmind, what is?
that gonna do for you, right?
Don't be writing on, my graceletter I don't put on grace
letters all day, every day,y'all shanley is getting on me
(27:19):
today.
Shandelynn Hilliard (27:19):
I see, you won't see Dior for a long time,
like that's where you're going,like it'll be different.
Maybe you'll see thebutterflies and the sunshine
versus the gray and all of thethings.
Yeah, you see the beauty in thethings.
Spring Richardson Perry (27:35):
Well, I'm excited because we are
planning something super special, yes, and I think it would be
very, very helpful to a lot ofpeople to just have a change of
scenery, some place that is justrelaxing.
Nice, you can go on the waterfor a little bit.
(27:57):
Nature is super helpful whenyou're like you're feeling down.
That's one of the things that Ilove um, to go take a walk or
to go.
I don't live far from the beach, so I'll go walk on the beach
or something like that put myfoot, put my feet in the water,
because when you were in houston, I was gonna say at home you
(28:17):
don't want to put your feet inthat dirty water anyway.
Shandelynn Hilliard (28:21):
I mean we used to, but we're not gonna.
We're not gonna do that now.
We know better we know better.
Spring Richardson Perry (28:27):
When we know better, we do better and
in case if y'all didn't pick upthe accent.
We are both from new orleansand so we love the water.
The water don't love us, but welove the water we do that.
Shandelynn Hilliard (28:40):
We love the good water, the blue water, the
blue water.
Spring Richardson Perry (28:45):
So so we are.
We, we want to plan a getawayso that those of you that are in
that moment, that areexperiencing this burnout, that
need to just get away for sometransformational healing, that
need to just get away for sometransformational healing, that
(29:05):
you can access that.
And so we don't have all thedetails planned yet, but we were
doing this for us and then werealized like, hey, like some
people like me this, and they'relike what are y'all doing?
Well, tell me about it and wheny'all gonna do this.
So we don't have all thedetails planned yet, but as soon
(29:27):
as we get some more information, we will start to put it out
there.
If you want to be on thewaiting list, you can message me
, you can message Shandalyn.
Just let us know and we willkeep you updated.
But we will certainly have moreinformation soon to come with
(29:48):
the details about when it'sgoing to be, where it's going to
be, what you can expect, thecost of it, all those good
things, because we know thatplays a factor in things too.
Shandelynn Hilliard (30:01):
So I'm excited.
I'm so excited.
I just want to be near thewater you talking about like
whatever because I ain't gettinganything.
I'm saying, okay, I'm not doingthat, um, but yeah, I'm excited
, um, because I definitely againright, I want to run, I want to
run away sometimes and whilethat that may sound bad, it's
okay.
You need a break sometimes andI think you know, come hang out
(30:25):
with us, let's see what we haveto offer, especially if you
enjoyed this little bit that wegave today.
Imagine like time with us, girl.
Spring Richardson Perry (30:36):
It's going to be fun.
It's going to be fun.
You will get a snippet of howShandalyn does her sessions, her
therapy sessions.
There will be some healing workin there, just some leadership,
personal development thingsthat I like to do with my
clients as well.
When it comes to my nonprofitleaders and really digging deep
(30:59):
into who you are, what is yourpersonal mission, your personal
values, what is it that you wantout of life?
Basically and I know it soundslike guru-ish and all that kind
of stuff, but I don't know,lately, maybe your 30s are for
figuring out who you are,because, first of all, I would
never tell y'all how old,exactly how old I am, just know
(31:22):
I'm somewhere in them thirties,okay.
But it just seems like thereare certain times in life where
it's all about having fun, it'sall about being with your
friends and doing all the things, and then you move into this
(31:42):
phase where it's like, okay,what is my purpose?
Why am I here?
What am I doing?
Yeah, like what?
What are my like?
I?
I feel like I want to do more,I'm called to do more.
So now, what does all of thismean?
How do we put all this together?
And so that's basically wherewe, where we are and what we're
(32:04):
going to help you do is toreally identify your personal
mission.
Give you some self-care, some,some good self-care yeah,
absolutely.
And then and then just justhelp you relax, because
sometimes all you need is acouple of days to get away and
(32:24):
you come back a brand new person.
I can attest to that.
Shandelynn Hilliard (32:30):
And the other part of it is coming with
other people, right?
Sometimes, again, we think thatwe're the only ones, you and I,
we talk.
And then one day I was like, ohwait, you know exactly what I'm
talking about.
You and I, we talked.
And then one day I was like, ohwait, you know exactly what I'm
talking about.
Like it's, it's real and it'swhile, it's indirect for me,
right, vicariously for me, butit's still direct in a sense,
(32:53):
which is weird.
I got a combination of bothgoing on.
But imagine going to a placewhere you have all of these
people with the same experiencesas you and maybe they know
something that you don't know,and that's okay, because I'm
always down to learn.
Maybe they have tips that wejust don't have.
I'm always down to learn, soI'm.
I'm so excited like I I'm.
I cannot wait.
I'm ready to go now.
(33:14):
We gotta play, but I'm ready togo.
Spring Richardson Perry (33:18):
we got some planning to do, guys, but
we will keep y'all updated.
I really honestly, this seasonon the podcast, I think what
we're going to do is we're goingto have our mental Health
moment Quite often withShandalyn, because she's great
At what she does.
She Is very helpful in givingyou Just tips and tools To
(33:42):
really be able to deal in a reallife kind of way, not like how
you have gurus telling you if wethink about entrepreneurship
right and they're like oh, I getup at four and I grind it out
for 12 hours, I go to bed, I getup and I do it all over again.
That don't work for everybody.
(34:03):
It don't work for me,especially because I got five
kids, I got a husband and I gota daddy who gets on my nerves.
So I mean, you know that don'twork?
Shandelynn Hilliard (34:16):
It's not.
And I will always say, like Iwas born at 1.41 PM, morning
time does not do anything for me.
I try my hardest, but you knowthe 5 am club.
I keep starting that book overbecause 5 am.
No, I'm gonna go to sleep.
Spring Richardson Perry (34:33):
I'm one of those.
I'm definitely a 5 am club girl.
See, I want to be.
Shandelynn Hilliard (34:39):
So maybe again I'm gonna come on this
trip and you might help me makemaybe sunrise yoga maybe, and
then I'm gonna come back homeand be like girl look y'all in
on some of this ground floorplanning.
Spring Richardson Perry (34:53):
We love it.
So if you have some tips for us, please message us.
Please let us know.
If you want to know more aboutwhat is to come with this
retreat, Message us, Let us know.
We'll get your name on thewaiting list.
I truly appreciate you alltoday for tuning in.
You know, if you have anyfeedback for me, get in touch
(35:15):
with me.
I'm on LinkedIn SpringRichardson Perry.
I'm on Facebook SpringRichardson Perry.
Instagram is at Springyunderscore springtime and then
Shandalyn.
How can they get in touch withyou?
Shandelynn Hilliard (35:29):
So Facebook .
You'll find me, shandalynHillard.
On Instagram it isteatimetherapy.
P-l-l-c.
Email shandalyn atteatimetherapyorg.
Or you can visit my website forall of that.
So it's teatimetherapyorg.
Or you can visit my website forall of that.
So it's Teatimetherapyorg.
Spring Richardson Perry (35:44):
And that's T-T-E-A, t-i-m-e,
therapyorg.
Thank you, baby.
Thank you Until next time Onthe Spring Forward Podcast.
Bye y'all, bye On the SpringForward Podcast.
Bye y'all, bye.
Hey, nonprofit friends, welcome to
the Spring Forward podcast,where we talk about all things
nonprofit, from board discord togrant writing and strategic
planning tips.
If you're an executive director, nonprofit board member or just
someone heavily involved in thenonprofit sector, then this is
the podcast for you.
Let's spring forward intoexcellence, and this is the
(00:28):
podcast for you.
Let's spring forward intoexcellence.
Welcome, welcome everyone tothe Spring Forward podcast.
I am your host, springRichardson Perry, and we are
back.
It's been a minute.
I was on a little hiatus tryingto figure out what is next with
the podcast, and so we are backand I am excited to share all
(00:51):
the new things that are going tobe happening with this podcast.
And so, for one, my focus hasbeen organizational development
in general, and these days I amnow fully focused on nonprofits
specifically.
So for those of you that don'tknow me, let me reintroduce
(01:14):
myself really quickly.
So I work with nonprofitorganizations, helping them with
grant writing, strategicplanning, fund development,
governance and compliance.
So what that means is grantwriting, of course, is
self-explanatory, but funddevelopment, I will help you
(01:35):
with fundraising strategies,help you identify different
streams of income for yournonprofit and, just overall,
help you to be a morefinancially sound organization,
because a lot of timesnonprofits forget that you are
still a business, so there is abusiness side to things that has
(01:58):
to be addressed.
So I help you guys with thosethings, as well as helping you
with board stuff in terms ofworkshops, leadership
development, understanding whatthe board's role is as opposed
to the actual staff of theorganization.
Compliance things nonprofitsrun into all kinds of issues
(02:19):
with compliance just becausemany of them are unaware there's
so many changing regulationseach and every year, especially
with tax compliance.
So my husband is actually a taxexpert he does, he's a
certified tax professional andso he helps me help nonprofits
(02:40):
with that.
And then, finally, withstrategic planning.
I actually just did a strategicplanning session this weekend
with a nonprofit board that Isit on.
I sit on two nonprofit boardshere locally.
One is called the Well Rockport.
They are a nonprofit thatfocuses on helping women who are
(03:00):
victims of domestic violenceand or sexual assault, and so we
are establishing sometransitional housing here in
Rockport, texas.
I also sit on the board of theChildren's Coalition of Aransas
County and they serve childrenand their families here in the
Rockport area.
So a little bit about me.
(03:23):
That's it About the podcast.
Together.
We went on our collegegraduation trip together.
(03:52):
I was at her graduation for hermaster's degree and when she
was getting licensed to be atherapist.
So when I say that's my girl tobe a therapist, so when I say
that's my girl, that's my girlfor real, I'm not just saying
that.
So we are super excited to betalking to you guys today about
(04:15):
burnout.
This 2024, when I tell you 2024turned me every which way but
loose.
And I find a lot of people feltthe same way.
They were burned out but didn'teven realize that they were in
burnout.
So we're going to be talkingabout that today.
We're going to talk about somestrategies to help you cope and
(04:37):
some things that she and I havebeen discussing and talking
about.
So, without further ado, let mebring on my girl, shandalyn
Hilliard.
Hey, hey, shay, what's up?
Shandelynn Hilliard (04:53):
girl, girl you can listen.
Spring Richardson Perry (05:00):
Only way.
Shandelynn Hilliard (05:00):
What time?
Only way, but it's been a goodday.
It's been a good day.
Let me catch my flyaways.
We almost threw on some gray.
Spring Richardson Perry (05:12):
Oh yeah , see, it's Monday.
Monday is a gray day, you know,because you don't know what to
expect.
You're just starting your weekout, so it's like I need some
gray, because there's some grayarea for me today.
Shandelynn Hilliard (05:28):
So I got to figure out what the rest of the
week is going to look like, soI may have some Well we're on,
oh my goodness.
Spring Richardson Perry (05:37):
Well, I'm excited to have you on today
to talk about burnout, becauseI'm sure this is something that
you see frequently in yourclients and just overall when we
think about mental health.
This is one of those thingsthat we don't talk about a lot.
We talk about psychologicalsafety, we talk about mental
(06:02):
illness in general, but we don'ttalk about just burnout,
exhaustion, just doing all thethings, feeling like you're not
getting anything done, and thenyou fall into this sort of black
hole, and so I want to reallyget into this.
First, talk to me about how youdefine burnout, like how does
(06:25):
it differ from just everydaystress?
What is burnout?
Shandelynn Hilliard (06:29):
Yeah, okay, it's the dragging of me by my
wig, that's what it is.
But burnout is going to be aprolonged exposure to chronic
stress, right so, and it's goingto intensify over time if we
don't do anything about it.
Okay, so it's imminent,essentially.
And then your everydaystressors.
(06:50):
These are typically temporary,so imagine like deadlines, or
imagine like the student who hasa test or something coming up,
right.
Once that challenge is met, ourstress goes down until the next
thing comes up, right, so it'sgoing to be different in the
intensity and then how long itis Okay, that makes sense,
(07:12):
because for a prolonged periodof time, I was feeling a certain
type of way, and so that makessense.
Spring Richardson Perry (07:20):
So that kind of leads into the next one
, though, because, because, like, what are those common symptoms
?
What do you normally?
What is it?
What does it look like?
What are some signs that peoplehave, whether they're a
caregiver, a nonprofit leader, aparent, a student, whoever?
Shandelynn Hilliard (07:37):
they are.
Spring Richardson Perry (07:38):
What are some signs that they're
experiencing burnout that theyshould be aware?
Shandelynn Hilliard (07:42):
of.
So one of the top ones is goingto be like feelings of
overwhelm, right.
Some of them could be just likethe idea of feeling stuck and
not being able to do anything.
With it.
It can be a lack of motivation,right, I just don't feel like
doing nothing.
I don't want to look at it, Idon't want to talk about it, I
just want to like take a nap,right.
Or it could be anxiety.
(08:04):
It could be going physical,where maybe it is headaches,
maybe it is like gastro issues,like my stomach been hurting,
but like what's up, why I gotthis migraine.
Those are all signs of it thatsometimes we don't take it into
account, right, because I don'tfeel like doing nothing To me.
I just don't feel like doinganything, but I will.
For instance, I will make you avision bingo card.
(08:27):
Okay, I'm going to avoid allthe adult things I have to do
and I'm going to make it pretty.
I've been coloring all weekBecause I ain't got it.
But also I'll say this I didtake a week off purposely.
It's like my kickstart of theyear.
From my birthday, I'll take theweek off, and so I don't want
to think about work, but maybe Ishould have put my gray sweater
(08:48):
on today.
Maybe it is one of those kindsof days, but those are going to
be the things.
Another one could be feelingincompetent, which is crazy, but
yeah, like I don't even knowhow to do that but yeah, like I
(09:09):
don't even know how to do that.
Spring Richardson Perry (09:09):
That's, that's crazy, because all of
the things that you'rementioning, it's like I have
experienced those things all atone time, right.
So the feeling of theseheadaches just coming on out of
nowhere, the feeling like I justdon't want to do anything, and
not just because it's like amoment in the day where the
feeling like I just don't wantto do anything, and not just
because it's like a moment inthe day where I'm like, okay,
I've done enough, I don't wantto do anything else.
(09:30):
Like I wake up, I don't want todo anything.
I go to sleep, I haven't doneanything.
I wake up again, I don't wantto do anything.
Almost like in a depression,but not necessarily feeling the
gloom and doom, but just likeI'm just exhausted, I'm just
tired, I feel heavy and I don'tknow what to do.
(09:52):
And every time I try to dosomething, my brain is just
cloudy and foggy and nothingmakes sense and I just don't
know.
Shandelynn Hilliard (10:01):
So oh girl, you get it, like all of those
things.
So the fogginess, like themental exhaustion, yeah, it's
real, but again, sometimes wedon't think about it until, like
, somebody make us think aboutit.
It's like, oh you right, that'swhat happened, that's exactly
it.
Spring Richardson Perry (10:18):
Right?
Because?
Because you're not, you're notputting all of these things
together as one consolidatedevent.
Everything in your head isindividual.
Oh, I have a headache, let metake an aspirin.
Oh, I'm tired, let me go laydown.
Shandelynn Hilliard (10:34):
Oh.
Spring Richardson Perry (10:34):
I don't feel like doing anything today,
I'll just get to it tomorrowand everything is just it's
isolated own thing.
Until you talk to someone likeyou and you're like, oh, is that
what's been going on?
Because it sounds like to meyou're a little burned out.
So, like I want to talk aboutthis, because what I find what's
(10:57):
been going on with me?
I've just been having so muchhappening lately in terms of the
business and then caring for mydad who's aging, who's
absolutely going nuts, and thenyou know, trying to put it all
together like what is thedifference?
(11:19):
Maybe how would burnoutmanifest in a caregiver versus
like a nonprofit leader orsomeone at work?
And I want y'all to know thatspecific chandelain has a really
, a really close relationship toburnout and caregivers too.
(11:42):
So this is something that'snear and dear to her heart as
well, because not only is sheseeing it in her clients, but
she's seeing it in her personallife as well.
Shandelynn Hilliard (11:56):
So talk to me about that okay, so I guess
I'm gonna start off with I don'tbelieve that there is a
difference, like there is noversus here and there, between,
like, caregivers or nonprofitleaders.
I think we feel it the same, itmanifests the same Like I legit
can't think of like a indicatorthat would say you're separate
from this person because of thisthing.
(12:18):
The feelings, they're the same.
So you're feeling overwhelmedthat we just talked about
Detachment, if you've ever feltthat.
So again, right, I'm not doingit today, I'm going to just
detach.
Spring Richardson Perry (12:30):
I just want to run away.
Shandelynn Hilliard (12:32):
How about that?
Seriously, like, can I pack abag?
I legit told him I was in asession one day and I was like I
mean I want to get on a planeright now.
And my client was like waitwhat?
I was in session one day and Iwas like I mean, I want to get
on a plane right now.
And my client was like waitwhat?
I was like, yes, I would liketo go Now, book me a flight
Again, the encompassing or howabout feeling inadequate?
Like again, I don't know, Ican't do when it's all false.
(12:56):
Feeling drained, that's a bigone.
So the same thing.
So the mental exhaustion is allthe same.
They manifest the same wayCaregivers and nonprofit leaders
, we are the same.
Spring Richardson Perry (13:07):
So I imagine that there's going to be
some long-term healthconsequences if this continues
to go unaddressed.
What does that look like?
Shandelynn Hilliard (13:17):
It looks like chronic stress.
It looks like it looks likechronic stress.
It looks like it let's just say, let's break it down so
long-term physically, mentallyand emotionally right.
So your physical impact couldbe the sleep that we keep
talking about.
So it's fatigue, it's thatexhaustion it can present as um
insomnia, hypersomnia, right?
(13:38):
So we all around here walkingaround talking about I get sleep
, well, I'm tired hypersomnia,right.
So we all around here walkingaround talking about I get sleep
while I'm tired, hypersomnia?
Um, you can have, like yourweakened immune system.
So, right, we're getting sick.
Like, why are we getting sick?
What's happening here?
And I'm carrying too much um,heart issues, um, hypertension,
(14:00):
heart disease.
Those are all parts of thingsthat can manifest if we're not
taking care of ourselves.
Right, there is um again goinginto like the emotional side and
the mental side that correlates.
So you have like the anxiety,the depression.
Those things are going tocorrelate, but they're going to
come from that mental side.
So I'm detached, um, I'm prettycynical now of the people.
Spring Richardson Perry (14:24):
Um, it gets a little self-work, or even
think about like your decisionmaking, like sometimes it starts
to deplete, you said earlier,it's real, your memory function
is real, and I think I don'tthink people realize that
decision fatigue is real too,like when you are like the
(14:47):
leader of an organization, like,for instance, my executive
directors for nonprofits.
Right, they get this compassionfatigue as well as this
decision fatigue right, becauseit's a constant putting out the
fire right the next crisis,dealing with the crisis of the
day or the crisis of the moment.
You have to make these hardmission.
(15:09):
You need A B, c, d, e, fresources, but I only have A B
and C and half an F and D and E.
(15:30):
We haven't had since 2001.
You know, so it's it's hard, soit's hard.
It really is hard on my leaders, especially that I see and I'm
(15:56):
always trying to help them sortof take a step back and really
just reflect, just take a momentand just think, just breathe,
just take a step back from itall, take yourself out of the
day to day and relax and do some.
I think another thing here thatthat may be helpful is some
self care.
But talk to me about what that,what that looks like, like how
(16:22):
can you, what can you do, maybesetting boundaries or what is it
that is helpful?
in managing this and preventingthis.
Shandelynn Hilliard (16:35):
Yeah.
So just before I go into that,I actually read something and it
says empathy is required butpersonal restoration is
neglected.
And I was just like, yeah, yeah, yeah, sign me up, because we
will, we will sign up to do allof the things.
So, again, when we put thenonprofit leaders and caregivers
same thing, right, you'reputting the company or the
(16:58):
community or, you know, theperson ahead of what you have
going on.
So you're underfunding.
That's real.
So now I have to do more withless, which is wild to me, right
, because I can't just make itlike a peer, but I have to
Because, yeah, because there'sright.
So part of this self-care idea.
(17:20):
So think about self-care likeyour security blanket, right, so
it is like the reassurance, itis a grounding of sorts.
Self-care is going to bring youback to you and, again, if you
don't, burnout is imminent, Likeit's coming for you, right, and
do the first thought is say no,okay.
Spring Richardson Perry (17:42):
That's my word of the year.
You know how everybody picks aword for the year.
I said this year, my word is no.
The answer is no, it is a fullsentence.
It doesn't require anexplanation.
No is no.
I say no.
That's it Because often timestoo, we find ourselves in this,
(18:05):
in this sort of like limbo,where it's like I know I'm tired
, I know I can't push myselfanymore, but this person needs
me to do this, or you know, mymission to serve is this and
this is what I'm supposed to bedoing.
But you can't do it all, andthat's something I had to learn
(18:28):
the hard way and I think youknow.
Besides the no, one of thethings that really helped me was
this journal, the invitationJournal.
So if y'all don't know thisjournal, journaling has always
(18:48):
been super helpful for me, butthis is Shanda Lynn's Journal.
This is what she created as amental health expert.
It has prompts in here thatreally give you some clarity.
It helps you to think about.
Okay, like I'm gonna give youan example.
Oh, my girl.
(19:09):
Question number one you'rereflecting on the past week.
It says what challenges did Idid I face this past week, if
any I did I face this past week,if any, so right then and there
you write down what happened,what challenges you faced, and
then it says what lessons did Ilearn from those challenges?
(19:30):
Which to me was like, as I wasgoing through this, I was like,
oh my gosh, like, yes, whatchallenge did I face?
What was it I learned from that?
Because every experience is alearning opportunity and whether
that experience is good or bad,you learn something from it.
(19:50):
But if you don't stop to thinkabout what it is that you learn
and value that particularexperience for what it was, that
experience, whatever it endedup being, and then move on from
it.
I think the burnout really comesin when we start holding on to
(20:11):
things too right, things thatweren't meant for us to hold, on
to burdens that weren't meantfor us to carry, burdens that
weren't meant for us to carry.
Darlene was laughing at me.
She said she was like when Iwrote the post on social media,
like I'm all of them.
I'm the parent, I'm thecaregiver, I'm the nonprofit
(20:32):
leader.
All of those three things areme.
All of those three things carrya very heavy weight, a heavy
burden, and but it doesn't haveto when you learn how to really
manage your time effectivelyAgain journaling when I tell
(20:53):
y'all.
This journal saved my life.
This is amazing, thank you.
We need to get you one, so Iwill put the link in the
comments for y'all so you canget one.
Journaling is so helpful it is.
Shandelynn Hilliard (21:08):
It is A little cheat sheet for that area
.
So what I will do is I won'twait to the end of the week when
I'm reflecting.
If something comes up, I'mgoing to notate it.
Because, again, if we're in aspace where we're foggy or
concentration, focus isn't there, I'm going to forget.
(21:28):
So I'm going to go ahead andnotate it.
I'm going to put it down whatmy challenge was and write it in
there.
If I've come up with somethinghelpful, I can put it there too.
But for me it's been helpfuljust kind of maneuvering around
the journal itself.
But also, don't forget to putyour wins there too.
One of my things when I alwaysbuy journals, I know this whole
idea of being happy and, like Imade it like a journal, it was
(21:52):
just so happy.
So that's why I said no.
But what was the challenges?
And then after that, what wasyour win?
So I can see, right, life isebbs and flows, like it's moving
, it's constantly moving.
And also, if I go back to July4th or something like that,
right, I can see, oh, on thatday I experienced this, because
(22:15):
maybe I'm experiencing thatagain, and so if I'm putting
down how did I overcome it, Ican use that again.
So the journal is just like atool that's going to bring you.
It's a wraparound.
I think that's a good word.
It's very transformational andit takes you on a journey where
you can really be like I feltcool that day.
I feel like trash today, andthat's OK.
Today I feel amazing.
Spring Richardson Perry (22:37):
It also .
It also allows you to reallysee your journey, your journey
right.
It's a visual of where youstarted and then where you're
going, because this, thisjournal, takes you on a 90-day
discovery, a 90-day journal ofself-discovery where you learn
about the things that thatplague you, the things that
challenge you, like what'schallenging to me may not be
(23:01):
challenging to Shandalyn, butyou learn more and more about
yourself and you start to learnhow to deal with these things
and sometimes mitigate thembefore it even comes up, because
you know, okay, this is atrigger, so I'm not even going
to deal with it.
And so it.
I mean it.
It's just y'all when I tell youtransformational is an
(23:25):
understatement, like it is so.
So transformational, it just it.
It helps you to see through neweyes.
That's the best way to explainthat it does.
Shandelynn Hilliard (23:38):
I would say the first time I did right,
because I'm always somebody whohas to try it out before I tell
somebody, oh, go do this thing.
When I finished my first 90days, I was like, oh, I am
cognizant of my mood, like I metherapist, right, yes, I can be
happy, I can be sad, I can doall of these things, the, the,
the example I always give myclients.
(23:59):
Um, so, going back to 2022,when my grandmother passed that
morning, I got up, I went tochurch, I had a facial plan.
Um, my best friend was movinggirl.
I went over there, we had shotsfor no reason, you know,
whatever.
Um, it's a Sunday, sunday, funday, and I got my facial and I'm
on high.
About 20 minutes later, I get aphone call from my mom.
(24:21):
Now she's calling back to backand I'm like, ah, because I used
to say don't call me back toback Cause I don't know if it's
an emergency, right, and so thistime she called it like
everything dropped, right.
But I remember going, like, tothe hospital that night.
You know, we, uh, we had to go.
You know, check out mygrandmother, all of these things
.
But I went home in a journaland for the next few days I just
(24:45):
kept journaling and what I sawwas my mood was like I'm here,
man, whatever.
Here we go again.
And then I remember the day Iwas happy.
I was like, oh wait, I'm happy.
And so we need that, becausewe'll think that it's a
continuous thing of like, um,pain or grief or not saying
grief stopped right.
But it's this continuation ofthings and if I look at it
(25:08):
without writing it down, I'mgonna think every day was trash
and every day isn't.
But yeah, so that's the story Ipassed like you gotta do it, no
matter what.
You have to push through it soyou can see what's happening.
And that's what the journal didfor me.
Spring Richardson Perry (25:23):
I love it, I love it.
Another thing y'all that isreally really helpful,
especially for me when I wasgoing through a really tough
time back in 2021, and I went on.
I guess you can call it like aretreat.
Shandelynn Hilliard (25:41):
It wasn't a structured retreat.
Spring Richardson Perry (25:43):
At the time it was just me just getting
away with one of my friends andwe went to this yoga resort out
in Costa Rica and I find that achange of scenery sometimes is
super, super helpful.
Machinery sometimes it's supersuper helpful.
And so, like when I was talkingabout running away, like
(26:05):
sometimes you do just want torun away, but if you have like a
scheduled event right orsomething planned that you know
like hey, I know in SeptemberI'm going to this place, it's
going to be great, like thatsort of gets you through it too.
Because as I was going throughall the things back then, at
(26:29):
that time I kept thinking in myhead, oh, but I have this trip
(26:55):
and that would just light me up.
So, just with journaling andthen that trip that I had
planned, it was so, so helpfulin terms of my mood, my emotions
and really helping me to liketo stay focused and to not see
everything as just doom andgloom.
Because if you it's a mindsetthing, right, you, it's a
mindset thing, right if you'reconstantly, if you're constantly
in this doom and gloom state ofmind, what is?
that gonna do for you, right?
Don't be writing on, my graceletter I don't put on grace
letters all day, every day,y'all shanley is getting on me
(27:19):
today.
Shandelynn Hilliard (27:19):
I see, you won't see Dior for a long time,
like that's where you're going,like it'll be different.
Maybe you'll see thebutterflies and the sunshine
versus the gray and all of thethings.
Yeah, you see the beauty in thethings.
Spring Richardson Perry (27:35):
Well, I'm excited because we are
planning something super special, yes, and I think it would be
very, very helpful to a lot ofpeople to just have a change of
scenery, some place that is justrelaxing.
Nice, you can go on the waterfor a little bit.
(27:57):
Nature is super helpful whenyou're like you're feeling down.
That's one of the things that Ilove um, to go take a walk or
to go.
I don't live far from the beach, so I'll go walk on the beach
or something like that put myfoot, put my feet in the water,
because when you were in houston, I was gonna say at home you
(28:17):
don't want to put your feet inthat dirty water anyway.
Shandelynn Hilliard (28:21):
I mean we used to, but we're not gonna.
We're not gonna do that now.
We know better we know better.
Spring Richardson Perry (28:27):
When we know better, we do better and
in case if y'all didn't pick upthe accent.
We are both from new orleansand so we love the water.
The water don't love us, but welove the water we do that.
Shandelynn Hilliard (28:40):
We love the good water, the blue water, the
blue water.
Spring Richardson Perry (28:45):
So so we are.
We, we want to plan a getawayso that those of you that are in
that moment, that areexperiencing this burnout, that
need to just get away for sometransformational healing, that
need to just get away for sometransformational healing, that
(29:05):
you can access that.
And so we don't have all thedetails planned yet, but we were
doing this for us and then werealized like, hey, like some
people like me this, and they'relike what are y'all doing?
Well, tell me about it and wheny'all gonna do this.
So we don't have all thedetails planned yet, but as soon
(29:27):
as we get some more information, we will start to put it out
there.
If you want to be on thewaiting list, you can message me
, you can message Shandalyn.
Just let us know and we willkeep you updated.
But we will certainly have moreinformation soon to come with
(29:48):
the details about when it'sgoing to be, where it's going to
be, what you can expect, thecost of it, all those good
things, because we know thatplays a factor in things too.
Shandelynn Hilliard (30:01):
So I'm excited.
I'm so excited.
I just want to be near thewater you talking about like
whatever because I ain't gettinganything.
I'm saying, okay, I'm not doingthat, um, but yeah, I'm excited
, um, because I definitely againright, I want to run, I want to
run away sometimes and whilethat that may sound bad, it's
okay.
You need a break sometimes andI think you know, come hang out
(30:25):
with us, let's see what we haveto offer, especially if you
enjoyed this little bit that wegave today.
Imagine like time with us, girl.
Spring Richardson Perry (30:36):
It's going to be fun.
It's going to be fun.
You will get a snippet of howShandalyn does her sessions, her
therapy sessions.
There will be some healing workin there, just some leadership,
personal development thingsthat I like to do with my
clients as well.
When it comes to my nonprofitleaders and really digging deep
(30:59):
into who you are, what is yourpersonal mission, your personal
values, what is it that you wantout of life?
Basically and I know it soundslike guru-ish and all that kind
of stuff, but I don't know,lately, maybe your 30s are for
figuring out who you are,because, first of all, I would
never tell y'all how old,exactly how old I am, just know
(31:22):
I'm somewhere in them thirties,okay.
But it just seems like thereare certain times in life where
it's all about having fun, it'sall about being with your
friends and doing all the things, and then you move into this
(31:42):
phase where it's like, okay,what is my purpose?
Why am I here?
What am I doing?
Yeah, like what?
What are my like?
I?
I feel like I want to do more,I'm called to do more.
So now, what does all of thismean?
How do we put all this together?
And so that's basically wherewe, where we are and what we're
(32:04):
going to help you do is toreally identify your personal
mission.
Give you some self-care, some,some good self-care yeah,
absolutely.
And then and then just justhelp you relax, because
sometimes all you need is acouple of days to get away and
(32:24):
you come back a brand new person.
I can attest to that.
Shandelynn Hilliard (32:30):
And the other part of it is coming with
other people, right?
Sometimes, again, we think thatwe're the only ones, you and I,
we talk.
And then one day I was like, ohwait, you know exactly what I'm
talking about.
You and I, we talked.
And then one day I was like, ohwait, you know exactly what I'm
talking about.
Like it's, it's real and it'swhile, it's indirect for me,
right, vicariously for me, butit's still direct in a sense,
(32:53):
which is weird.
I got a combination of bothgoing on.
But imagine going to a placewhere you have all of these
people with the same experiencesas you and maybe they know
something that you don't know,and that's okay, because I'm
always down to learn.
Maybe they have tips that wejust don't have.
I'm always down to learn, soI'm.
I'm so excited like I I'm.
I cannot wait.
I'm ready to go now.
(33:14):
We gotta play, but I'm ready togo.
Spring Richardson Perry (33:18):
we got some planning to do, guys, but
we will keep y'all updated.
I really honestly, this seasonon the podcast, I think what
we're going to do is we're goingto have our mental Health
moment Quite often withShandalyn, because she's great
At what she does.
She Is very helpful in givingyou Just tips and tools To
(33:42):
really be able to deal in a reallife kind of way, not like how
you have gurus telling you if wethink about entrepreneurship
right and they're like oh, I getup at four and I grind it out
for 12 hours, I go to bed, I getup and I do it all over again.
That don't work for everybody.
(34:03):
It don't work for me,especially because I got five
kids, I got a husband and I gota daddy who gets on my nerves.
So I mean, you know that don'twork?
Shandelynn Hilliard (34:16):
It's not.
And I will always say, like Iwas born at 1.41 PM, morning
time does not do anything for me.
I try my hardest, but you knowthe 5 am club.
I keep starting that book overbecause 5 am.
No, I'm gonna go to sleep.
Spring Richardson Perry (34:33):
I'm one of those.
I'm definitely a 5 am club girl.
See, I want to be.
Shandelynn Hilliard (34:39):
So maybe again I'm gonna come on this
trip and you might help me makemaybe sunrise yoga maybe, and
then I'm gonna come back homeand be like girl look y'all in
on some of this ground floorplanning.
Spring Richardson Perry (34:53):
We love it.
So if you have some tips for us, please message us.
Please let us know.
If you want to know more aboutwhat is to come with this
retreat, Message us, Let us know.
We'll get your name on thewaiting list.
I truly appreciate you alltoday for tuning in.
You know, if you have anyfeedback for me, get in touch
(35:15):
with me.
I'm on LinkedIn SpringRichardson Perry.
I'm on Facebook SpringRichardson Perry.
Instagram is at Springyunderscore springtime and then
Shandalyn.
How can they get in touch withyou?
Shandelynn Hilliard (35:29):
So Facebook .
You'll find me, shandalynHillard.
On Instagram it isteatimetherapy.
P-l-l-c.
Email shandalyn atteatimetherapyorg.
Or you can visit my website forall of that.
So it's teatimetherapyorg.
Or you can visit my website forall of that.
So it's Teatimetherapyorg.
Spring Richardson Perry (35:44):
And that's T-T-E-A, t-i-m-e,
therapyorg.
Thank you, baby.
Thank you Until next time Onthe Spring Forward Podcast.
Bye y'all, bye On the SpringForward Podcast.
Bye y'all, bye.
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