September 2, 2025 • 27 mins
Before you panic—we're not suggesting you fire your business partner!
But what if AI could handle many of the roles you've been desperately trying to fill with that elusive "perfect co-founder"?
In this provocative episode of Startup Different, hosts Dave and Chris tackle one of the most controversial questions in modern entrepreneurship: Can artificial intelligence actually replace key founding team members? The answer might surprise you.
We break down exactly how solo entrepreneurs are using AI to fill critical gaps traditionally handled by co-founders—from technical development to marketing strategy to financial planning. But we also dive into the nuanced reality of where human partnership still reigns supreme, especially in sales and customer relationships.
You'll discover:
- The 7 specific ways AI can step into co-founder-level responsibilities
- Why the traditional "hunt for a technical co-founder" might be outdated
- How AI-first startups are competing with fully-staffed companies (and winning)
- The surprising areas where human intuition and relationships still dominate
- Real strategies for building transparency around AI usage that actually builds trust
- Why business valuations are shifting for AI-powered ventures
Whether you're a solo founder struggling to find the right partner or part of a team wondering how AI fits into your strategy, this episode challenges conventional startup wisdom. The future isn't about replacing humans—it's about radically reimagining what founding teams can look like.
Warning: This episode might make you rethink everything you know about building a startup team.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
Everybody's always like, oh, I got a business idea for like an
app or some sort of piece of tech or whatever.
Yeah. And it's like, oh, now I don't
need a, a technical cofounder cause I can just use AI.
But I sit there and I think as like a technical person, maybe
now I don't need a, you know, a marketing.
True. Yeah.
Like that's the thing. It's actually easier.
(00:21):
If anything, those other things have been.
Replaced here the. Technical piece.
With you, I feel like you're coming for us.
We're coming for. You.
Hey love it for everyone. Yeah.
Let's get it rolling. Big ideas, money, hustle, smart
dream so. Wild.
During that grinding through a joy ride.
(00:50):
Do you remember how we were running our company and every
time I made even the smallest mistake, you would joke about
how I was fired and then I wouldgo yay?
Thank God, that guy. Yeah, yeah.
Everybody knew that bit actuallyby the end of.
That everybody, everybody like that would became the running
joke at anytime. I was like, uhhh, guys, I really
(01:11):
messed up. I, you know, did whatever and
everybody's like, you're fired. That I just.
Yeah, yeah, yeah. Hey, I mean, this is really what
this episode is about. That's what we're talking.
About is 7 ways to replace ChrisSinkinson with AI No, to replace
your cofounder with AI. I wanted to take on this topic
because I'm thinking a lot aboutthis.
(01:31):
I have something going on in stealth right now and I'm sort
of trying to think about, and it's not with Chris.
So that's true. Take that true.
And is it it's in stealth because it it doesn't, it
doesn't work. It doesn't work, it doesn't
exist, and isn't isn't a real thing yet.
So. But I and I think one of the
challenges that I'm thinking about is can I build and it's a
(01:54):
direct to consumer product, it'sa totally different thing.
So can I build a business with no employees?
OK. And I think this is like just
roughly speaking has sort of been answered that like, yes,
you can, if you go on, there's people on X, which I don't
really like X Twitter, whatever the hell we're calling it.
I, I don't really like it. I find it to be a bit of a
cesspool. But everyone saw this kind of
(02:15):
some interesting stuff. All, of course it's not really
backed, but there's people who are like I'm doing this thing
and I'm making like $1,000,000 ayear doing this.
Tons of stories like that, I never know.
It's believe the school services.
Person making $10 million a month.
No, it's just 1000 a month. That's the school thing.
So school like SKOL, the Alex Hormozi stuff that the the go to
thing, if you go out school, thefront page school is just like,
(02:38):
here's how I'm making 10,000 a month using school like every,
every I don't know, there's likea yard sale on 10,000.
Everybody has 10,000. Really somebody needs like
10,000 and one, you know, like price is right rules.
But anyway, So what I'm trying to figure out is like how like
how, if this is possible and then like the best way to go
about it and and what am I seeing out there sort of in this
(03:01):
concept of a single person like enterprise?
And what does that look like? And I think for the record, I
think a lot of this is probably,unless you're a software
developer, you know, kind of building on the, the skepticism
around like some of these AI coding tools, which are getting
better. But right, it's probably a lot
of these are more like consumer focused like physical products
(03:23):
as opposed to SAS companies and those sorts of things.
I feel like this is the thing that bugs me about this is that
like everybody's always like, oh, I got a business idea for
like an app or some sort of piece of tech or whatever.
And it's like, oh, now I don't need a, a technical cofounder
cause I can just use AI. But I sit there and I think as
(03:43):
like a technical person, maybe now I don't need a, you know, a
marketing. True.
Yeah. Like what's the?
I think it's actually easier at anything those other things have
been. Replaced here theatrical.
Piece. With you, I feel like you're
coming for us. We're coming for.
You, he's coming for everyone. Yeah.
You know, it is it really? It genuinely is coming for
(04:04):
everyone. And that's why I'm kind of
thinking about this differently because I, part of me thinks
this could also be the future ofsmall business.
Yeah. Is, is, is like a side hustle on
cocaine, You know what I mean? Like, you're really able to
scale, but with no one else. And all of a sudden, you know,
you could have a normal job or maybe that goes away anyway, and
then you're doing this side hustle that's a lot more
scalable than it used to be. So that's why it was really
(04:26):
thought this was an interesting topic to dive into.
So let me, I'm gonna read my phone here.
Like a couple of data pieces. So Harvard Business Review notes
that startups using AI can now compete head to head with
giants. OK, so this makes sense.
So, so, you know, so only lean team from an AI coding partner.
So cursor managed to rival toolsfrom even like GitHub or even
(04:46):
Open. I thought that was pretty
interesting. I was like, OK, so I mean,
there's like a skill element there too, and you know, all
these different things, but it'seffectively like a leveling tool
for the playing field, at least on a competitive basis.
Actually, I was listening to thedaily this morning at New York
Times daily. I like listening to that
occasionally. And they were talking about how
like it's weird that open AI obviously being the first mover
(05:10):
notwithstanding, it's weird thatthey're leading the race when
you consider like Meta is in in this race with unlimited
capital, Google with unlimited capital, like Microsoft,
Microsoft like, like, I mean, Microsoft sort of open AI.
But Elon, you know, who's normally, like, always ahead of
stuff, you know, kind of not really like.
Microsoft didn't like they, theyinvested in AI kind of late in
(05:30):
the game almost, you know, so like they, they weren't there.
I don't. Think in the everybody hates
Copilot and yeah, it keeps trying to like turn itself on my
computer. I'm like, I don't need this.
Like typical Microsoft. It's like, oh wow, we have these
amazing tools, let's force our users.
To do it like. Stop Microsoft like.
Anyway. Yeah.
OK. So a global BCG survey, Boston
(05:52):
Consulting Group found that organizations effectively
deploying. I see.
And I like this 45% cost savingsand 60% higher revenue growth on
average. Yeah.
So I think that's interesting. Supporting what you were kind of
saying at the start is like actually the behind this is this
like the actual marketing functions can also be vastly
(06:13):
automated. Yeah, honestly, I think the
technical cofounder is is not the low hanging fruit.
I think everything else is the low hanging.
Fruit definitely like and we talked about like a couple of
episodes back to the story of Jasper right and like and some
of these other ones were like writing and blog writing and
advertising copy like those things are evaporating if not
already Meanwhile founders adopting AI now this is really
(06:36):
interesting. So this is kind of
counterintuitive, but I, I want it think of this as a much more
smaller business. But these are existing
companies. So founders adopting AI aren't
actually necessarily cutting jobs.
Nearly 80% of AI heavy startups actually hired more people and
they use AI as a force multiplier rather than a
replacement. Yeah.
(06:56):
What do you think about that? Isn't that kind of surprising?
Like I remember. And then again, I love this
anthropic interview with friendsLenny, because he talked about
how they're hiring like crazy and you're like, that's kind of
weird. You're an AI company.
They're a startup company and they know that they can bring in
people and augment them with AI tools.
Cyborg. And they're like, yeah, they're,
(07:18):
they're on steroids, their employees on steroids and like,
doesn't. That give you bubble worries,
though, Like some people say, I kind of like a bubble, right?
They could be like a bubblelikethe.com and stuff.
There's so much money into this.So all these things and it's.
Yeah. And yet it's such a powerful
tool, and yet they're hiring thousands of people.
Do you remember maybe about a year or so ago the guy who's, I
(07:39):
don't know, the founder of the CEO of Spotify said like the
marginal cost of making music isgoing to be essentially 0.
And remember, all the artists got really upset about him
saying. Right.
Because like. You know, they're and there is a
lot of work that goes into it, but I think his point was kind
of like that, you know, these tools are making much easier to
create really good music. And so the the the like cost to
(08:01):
create music is going. He didn't mean like the
emotional cost or like the like the artistic cost.
I think he meant more like production.
Values so then some of the thinkabout a lot of things that
businesses do. So let's take software
development. The cost to build offer is gonna
like essentially go down. Your cost per like line of code
is gonna be almost nothing. OK, But you can kind of just
keep going with that because youknow, you can use AI to do
(08:23):
marketing, you can do a use AI to do sales, you can use a I do
finance, you can like. So is the cost of starting a
business or getting a business off the ground essentially going
to be like? Zero.
I don't think it'll be 0, but itdefinitely a lot lower than what
it was before. I think a lot lower than three
years. Ago.
So then, so then all of a sudden, how easy is it for
anybody to start a business? Right.
So and then are are we in an arms race where it's like holy
(08:46):
smokes, like starting a businessis really about like who had the
best AI tools you know, to I. Think there's still an execution
piece to it. I think it really depends on the
nature of product, right? There's an execution and
strategy component here too. So like again in this direct to
consumer would like thing that I'm working on in stealth that
doesn't exist that thing like you can see that the path of
(09:08):
this the the actual various entry are considerably lower.
You do need some capital, not a ton of money though.
Now you can get away like 1020 grand pretty easily.
And I think like, which is nothing in the business starting
business world that gets you pretty far.
Yeah. And you know, depending how far
you wanna go into it and how talented you are with marketing.
I think the real challenge is actually it's a much more
(09:28):
competitive landscape to this point.
Like a lot of people have started something because
they're like, I may as well throw my hat in the ring.
Yeah, see how it goes. The winners are the ones who
market the. Best.
So then I got a question for you.
Because you have this thing in stealth.
Maybe it's a thing, maybe it's not a thing, whatever.
OK, so let's say that you can essentially automate.
You don't need a cofounder. You don't need Chris.
(09:50):
Yeah, you've got, let's say you can you can automate like 70% of
of what needs to be done in thatbusiness.
OK, so the 70% gone, the 30, what is the 30%?
Yeah. That you feel like you can't use
AI for that. You have to do on your own.
Yeah, there's two thoughts therethat I have.
One is there are things I enjoy doing.
Right which? Part of having a business is not
(10:13):
just about making money, it's enjoying what you do with your
day. So that's the first thing I'm
gonna say. Something weird category.
Yeah, fair enough. Fair enough.
That maybe that's a Dave only thing.
Yeah. The things that I think require
a human or human interaction. You're not gonna close the deal
with an AI agent with another company, you know what I mean?
Like I wouldn't negotiate with an AI agent.
I would like if I'm going to sign a.
(10:33):
Would you use an AI agent to do like sales prospecting?
Maybe cold outreach SDR activity, but I'm not gonna.
Do it. So where's the point where it
switches over to? Demo real life and I think
customers respect a person, yeah, especially now.
And I think that will be increasingly true overtime.
Do you think customers will takeissue?
I'll say issue OK with being cold called on by AI.
(10:58):
Yeah, some, but I think. That will they know or is.
It possible they won't necessarily.
I think people like look a couple of years ago it was hard
for anyone to pick up whether animage was AI altered.
Now you have like an eye for it or even like text, if it's been
written by chat ET, you kind of know there's a way to see it,
right? If you, if you use these tools a
(11:18):
lot. So I think maybe like people
will increasingly know that that's happening and perhaps
they'll be like counterintuitively, a respect
for sort of the traditional methods, right?
It really again though, depends on the nature of your product.
Like if you're being, if, if youhave a mass market product being
like advertised to you, you don't really care if the ads or
(11:39):
if the content. I I think as long as it's
engaging and accurate and valuable and perhaps
entertaining, I would definitelyentertaining that.
Like, does it really bother you that much if it's AI or not?
Like I saw, I saw the craziest thing the other day and like I'm
laughing about it was so funny. OK, You know the scene in the
Matrix where Neo's in the subwaystation?
(11:59):
Yeah, and, and, and, and Agent Smith comes in like fights them,
right. And they have that really big
fight and and he said there's the big deal because he stands
his ground against the agents that right, OK.
And he's beginning to believe. And so the fight was instead of
me over Sages Smith, it was Sam Altman versus Mark Zuckerberg.
(12:19):
Mark Zuckerberg being being Neo actually, and Sam Altman being
Agent Smith. Like it was amazing.
Like it was so good. Like the the it's you know, when
that he gets punched in the faceand his classes break and it's
like, it's Sam Altman's like face like as if he got punched.
It's incredibly. Well, play Wow.
And I'm just like, that's awesome.
(12:40):
And like, that's obviously AI. Yeah, but that's cool.
Like I was entertained, right? So I don't know.
I think for consumer, probably there are different rules if
you're selling. I sold my business for $40
million and I want you to steal my ideas.
Check out my book Start Up Different on Amazon, Audible and
(13:00):
Kindle landscaping companies because I know you're working on
your cottage stuff that you're selling landscape companies in
your outbound calling with an AIagent.
I think really most of the time outbound calling is competing
with people from India calling us, which we get a lot right and
(13:20):
or from call centres in other countries.
So I think like maybe it actually will be better.
It's possible. Yeah, maybe not like I don't
know. I can't, I don't know.
I don't really know on that. But anyway, everybody hates cold
calls anyway. Yeah, Yeah, I know what you
mean. Can I put in a thought out
there? Yeah.
So just thinking about the 7030 split.
So 70%, what if it's not that you.
(13:41):
So let's say, you know, you've got 10 different roles in your
company, OK. And you're saying, well, no, I
can have 70% of those just like done by AI, OK, 30% of them will
be done by by people. OK.
What if that's, what if that's afallacy?
What if that's wrong? What if it's actually more like,
you know, I I can't actually eliminate a CTO role with with
(14:03):
AI, but I can eliminate like I can have 70% of what the CTO
does done by AI. The other 30% I still need a
founder for right. Is there is there some risk of
that? OK.
Is there some risk where you know, like when you and I were
running started our company. OK, so I kind of did like the
finance. I kind of did the.
Different hats like. A bit of the operations like and
(14:25):
then you did both. Were kind of in operations,
yeah. OK.
So like, so you know, if you're starting a business right now,
let's say there's two of us, OK,is it more like, you know, Dave,
you're gonna handle these roles,so marketing, sales, leadership,
strategy, and then Chris, you'regoing to handle tech and.
(14:46):
Escalation customer. Support, customer service,
customer success, yeah, whatever.
And so as those two rules, you have to do like 30% of it of
each one of those with AI doing the other 70% of those.
Yeah, like maybe it's not as clear cut as you're just
replacing like 1. Department, yeah, you know,
replacing it effectively like a department in a small.
Company, yeah, or you look at ita different way, you say hey
(15:07):
cool, I am gonna have a CTO, butthat's CTO is gonna.
Be like that. That's the that's the
amplification, the Cyborg thing we're just talking about at the
start where it's like you're, you're, you're you're enhancing
force multiplier for AI as opposed to which is probably
true. Maybe it depends really, again,
it's just specific on your, of your business.
(15:28):
I think what it might allow for is I don't, I think what I like.
So let's go back to me. Yeah, I could definitely see
there's a case, you know, if this thing actually works out,
whatever it is that I have a chief operating officer later,
but that I don't really have to give them an equity stake.
Yeah, you know what I mean? And I think that's valuable to
me even alone, right. The founder, right, Obviously
(15:49):
hugely valuable depending on thecircumstances.
Yeah. So it's kind of like, you know,
you're you're right. So maybe the and and the you
could argue with the rationally like, well, I'm gonna have AI
due at least half of all the terrible stuff.
I'm gonna pay you really well. I'm gonna bonus to you really
well, but you're not going to get any equity because whatever.
And if you don't like it, you know, go somewhere else.
(16:10):
Find. This is interesting.
I feel like, you know, we've talked if I had some guests on
who do things around fractionals.
Yeah, OK. Yeah, I think fractionals have a
real opportunity where they can say, hey, I'm gonna come in and
only gonna work for you 30% of the time, but I'm gonna provide
the equivalent of a full time marketing CMO or a full time,
(16:30):
you know, revenue operations. Personnel though, when you look
at when you look for an AI agentbefore you hired.
A. If if my argument around that
you can't one for one just replace a person.
OK, Yeah. OK, sure AI.
Then maybe the fractional is thepiece that you you need.
Could that be the real life person using a whole lot of AI
(16:52):
tools behind? So I mean, I don't know.
That's interesting. So, yeah, even even be able to.
I see. So you're trying to suggest that
avoiding hiring in that way you could, you could basically run a
company without any full time employees, but having a mix of
yourself, AI agents and fractionals.
Yeah, Yeah, I think that's probably.
I think that's definitely. True.
Right now I want to throw another question.
We go, OK, so you got me. You got your stealth thing.
(17:13):
That's maybe not a thing, but whatever, you're doing your
thing. OK.
So when you think down the road,you're probably at some point
considering like what is the exit look like on this?
So if you've started a company and you have it, it is
profitable. So no, no, no, just just bear
with you. I'll follow along with me.
OK, So what if you get what if you're successful and you're
(17:36):
down the road and you've got a business that is doing millions
in revenue, it's profitable, that sort of stuff, and you're
looking to make an exit and you've got investors looking to
buy that from you. Are you ever concerned you ever
heard the term of a zombie company?
I know I haven't heard the term.But it's essentially the company
that is like, remember when we built our business, we had to
(17:59):
make sure we had enough people who could actually keep running
it when we were. Not there.
Remember, Remember hearing aboutthe Solo Stove guys?
Yeah. And they tried to sell and they
were like, it can't just be you 2 dudes need to build like an
actual company with people. And then they built an actual
company with people and then they sold.
Yeah. Remember that so so this is a
risk so our I do. Think it's.
A risk? Do you think that if you do
build this, you are going to have to have some human
(18:20):
component to it so that it is not a hollow company, it is not
a zombie? I think is something that could
be continue on with that. You are making that you're
bringing up that fear by lookinginto the past.
You're saying that the way that companies are required was like
our company was acquired is the way they're going to be acquired
later, which you don't know, we,we, it may be acceptable.
(18:43):
We like, I don't know that a company could be run by one
person with 25 different AI agents that do a whole bunch of
things automatically that connect to your, your, you know,
your partnerships and your, yourif it's a product, so a physical
product you like a 3:00 PM right.
Third party logistics probably. Yeah, like connected to that.
Like all these things just talking to each other.
Like there's basically what the acquirer is then purchasing is
(19:06):
like the brand, the the probablylike the customer list
effectively like, you know, thatthat kind of like revenue
momentum and the growth rate. And likely they would have you,
they'd be buying into something that they believe they could
augment because of their reach or whatever it is, right.
So like, it's so like this thought just crossed my mind.
The other thing though, for me that I also think about for this
(19:27):
business is because my circumstance is a little bit
different. Get a little personal here.
I don't know, I feel about this,but is that like, I don't
necessarily feel like I need to sell, but I like for now, I'm
just like, let's see if I can make some money doing this.
That's that's really the approach I want to take.
I want to put a ton of pressure on myself, like, Oh, I need to
make a gazillion dollars. I kind of just be like, is this
even going to work? Because it could totally fail
And like I'm cool with. That, yeah.
(19:48):
Like I think of when we started App Armor, there was a bunch of
things that we tried before him that failed miserably, but we
learned a lot. Like or like Land of the Living
Dead. You know, we got to like couple.
Like I do feel like we're kind of at a a rebirth moment on how
businesses start. Yeah.
And I, I think I remember when we were doing our mobile apps
and the big term was mobile first.
Yeah. And I think right now the term
(20:11):
is AI first. Yeah.
You know, so you're building an AI first business and we really
don't know how that's gonna. That's cool.
I didn't even like put the that label to it but.
That's exactly that's exactly what you're trying to do.
So then I do have a question foryou.
Yeah, So let's assume that you aren't just doing this as like a
hobby and you do want to eventually exit from it.
Yeah, OK. Are you concerned that
(20:34):
businesses which are AI first because of this?
You know, thinking about the Spotify guy saying that the cost
of of music is going down to marginally like nothing if if
all these businesses are startedas AI first businesses, do you
worry that the valuations on an acquisition are incredibly
compressed? Because everybody knows, hey,
(20:55):
that guy, that the way that he does that thing is easily
copyable by a bunch of. AI but that's where your brand
equity comes in. Like remember this is gonna be
like a marketing play effectively.
OK, you have a thing you drive down costs on your distribution.
You're sorry your manufacturer side your like you, you add as
much margin as you get into thisproduct, you immediately take
every available penny you have otherwise and put it into
(21:17):
marketing this product, buildingbrand equity, building brand
trust. It is not easy to build a brand.
That's why it's so I remember when the Warby Parker guys did
it. The big thing that was
surprising Warby Parker is that those guys not only built an
amazing brand, they also built afactory.
Yeah. And people were like, that is
unheard of. And as honestly like peering
(21:37):
into this world now, I can't believe how little stuff is made
by the companies that sell it. Yeah.
That is very surprising. Sounds dumb but I'm like wow.
Factory in China, yeah. There's a lot of or wherever
somewhere in the world right now.
This is kind of awkward, but I haven't highlighted the seven
things, OK? So.
OK, so the seven things, seven ways to replace, it's more like
(21:59):
7 like understandings to for replacing.
And I think we covered actually a lot of them.
So this is actually so let's loop this in.
So one is for the AIS like pick its job.
OK, So what is the AI decide? Is it your code or your
marketing, your analyst? Or is it gonna like blend into
these roles? So that was good for you.
AI isn't magic. It's just like a super fast
intern that doesn't sleep. Yeah.
And I was like, that's a good. Way of seeing.
(22:20):
It starts small, test fast. So give it one task that you'd
normally lean on a cofounder for.
Like, I don't know, it depends what your co-founder does, but
one of those tasks, so for let'ssay it was a salesperson you
were replacing, see how it does with cold emails, See how it
does with some of that prospecting, some of the things
you'll see in like software platforms like Apollo and stuff
like that. Keep the human stuff human was
another point. So if the demo, the demo, the
(22:43):
deal, the handshake, the backslaps, conferences, like
those things have to be, you gotto take people over dinner, you
know, and for now we don't have robots doing that.
So anyway, we'll see how that works.
One thing that is definitely important, at least for the
start, is that checking its work, Yeah, You know, you think
about like it didn't grok, say, like it was some sort of.
Yeah, awful. Thing.
(23:05):
Some sort of Nazi thing on, on, on and stuff like that.
So like be really tight to the Ifor a while until like you would
like you would like you would anemployee though, like I don't
think that's outrageous. Yeah, we were like, oh, I gotta
watch this thing. Gonna watch an employee?
Like you're you're having a draft the e-mail, but you're the
one actually hitting send things.
Like, correct. Like I remember I had a boss one
time. It was like, just imagine
hitting send whenever you do that.
(23:26):
Like a bomb could explode, yeah,if you're not careful.
And I was like, that's a good way to think about it.
That's really, you can't really,you know, when you do what's
that called recall you do then that just alerts everyone.
e-mail. Yeah. 5 is measure the wind.
So did it actually save time? How much time did it close?
More deals that cut costs? It has to actually generate an
ROI and you have to be able to act on that benefit, like take
(23:49):
up that game time, game, money game, something like that.
I think that's obviously kind ofintuitive, but it's something to
remember because I think a lot of people are like using a lot
of tools, racking up monthly costs on these things without
actually being able to be like, this is the game I get from
this, right? Build a feedback loop.
So obviously, so don't accept just what AI spits out, like
(24:10):
work on it iteratively improve it like you would any lean
startup thing. And then lastly is be
transparent. So I thought this was an
interesting point, but tell, tell people in the market that
you're doing this, that you're using AI, that you're telling
your investors that this is the way you're structuring.
The people think you're 9% less competent.
Yeah, I think yeah, actually based on the old depends who
they are, they middle management.
(24:31):
So I think, I think what it is though is it's like if you're
hiding AI, it seems like you have you've something to be
worried about. Whereas I think if you're just
like transparently like yeah, ofcourse we use AI tools like
everybody uses, everybody shouldbe using it.
I think you. Just drive costs down first
company and it keeps our costs low and that's the synovate and.
(24:51):
You know, it's really funny. I, I genuinely wonder the way
I'm structuring this thing now. I, I really wonder when am I
going to be like, aside from me,when am I going to need a
person? And I'm really thinking about
this and I'm like, I don't know.Yeah.
And it'll happen. I think.
I think it will happen, Right. And then I'll deal with it then.
But it is kind of an interesting, interesting take.
(25:12):
So cool. So like weirdly, AI in the short
term might lead to more people, which is one thing.
One of the weird conclusions to start this, because this
enhancer makes people more effective long term is not
clear. But either way, there's lots of
different ways that you can makeup for the weaknesses that you
have that you would implicitly need a cofounder for.
But just keep those seven pointsin mind this year.
(25:33):
No, that's great. You know, like I one point on
the hiring all the AI companies hiring is that let's let's say
for instance, you had a secret way to go out and buy a hire
people and they were just like superhuman, right?
Yeah, then you would hire. More.
Yeah, right. So I don't think it's like that
surprising that AI companies arehiring I.
Just think it's, you know, the the weird thing about a lot of
(25:54):
these AI tools, like open AI like loses a lot of money,
right, Because it's so expensiveto have that this like the
infrastructure required for sure.
It just seems interesting to me that the costs are so low on
using these tools given their relative power.
Yeah. Like it almost became, I mean,
the consumer wins. This is capitalism.
(26:15):
There's so many AI tools trying to be dominant in the market.
At the same time, it's really driven costs down on incredible
functionality. That I remember when that
DeepSeek thing, yeah, like everybody freaked out.
They trained it on $5,000,000 and yeah, I think that was
actually not true. Like they, you know, there was
some fudging of those, sure. I don't know.
Yeah, but like anyway, a lot less than whatever opening I
(26:37):
was. Doing.
Yeah, exactly. Anyway, lots of opportunity.
I'll let you know how it goes. Good luck with your new venture,
Dave. Yeah, don't even need you
anymore bro. Anyway, I'll see you tonight.
Alright folks, see you later, hey?
Let's get it rolling. Big ideas, money folding hustle,
(27:00):
smart dream. So why turn that grinded through
a joy? Ride.
Everybody's always like, oh, I got a business idea for like an
app or some sort of piece of tech or whatever.
Yeah. And it's like, oh, now I don't
need a, a technical cofounder cause I can just use AI.
But I sit there and I think as like a technical person, maybe
now I don't need a, you know, a marketing.
True. Yeah.
Like that's the thing. It's actually easier.
(00:21):
If anything, those other things have been.
Replaced here the. Technical piece.
With you, I feel like you're coming for us.
We're coming for. You.
Hey love it for everyone. Yeah.
Let's get it rolling. Big ideas, money, hustle, smart
dream so. Wild.
During that grinding through a joy ride.
(00:50):
Do you remember how we were running our company and every
time I made even the smallest mistake, you would joke about
how I was fired and then I wouldgo yay?
Thank God, that guy. Yeah, yeah.
Everybody knew that bit actuallyby the end of.
That everybody, everybody like that would became the running
joke at anytime. I was like, uhhh, guys, I really
(01:11):
messed up. I, you know, did whatever and
everybody's like, you're fired. That I just.
Yeah, yeah, yeah. Hey, I mean, this is really what
this episode is about. That's what we're talking.
About is 7 ways to replace ChrisSinkinson with AI No, to replace
your cofounder with AI. I wanted to take on this topic
because I'm thinking a lot aboutthis.
(01:31):
I have something going on in stealth right now and I'm sort
of trying to think about, and it's not with Chris.
So that's true. Take that true.
And is it it's in stealth because it it doesn't, it
doesn't work. It doesn't work, it doesn't
exist, and isn't isn't a real thing yet.
So. But I and I think one of the
challenges that I'm thinking about is can I build and it's a
(01:54):
direct to consumer product, it'sa totally different thing.
So can I build a business with no employees?
OK. And I think this is like just
roughly speaking has sort of been answered that like, yes,
you can, if you go on, there's people on X, which I don't
really like X Twitter, whatever the hell we're calling it.
I, I don't really like it. I find it to be a bit of a
cesspool. But everyone saw this kind of
(02:15):
some interesting stuff. All, of course it's not really
backed, but there's people who are like I'm doing this thing
and I'm making like $1,000,000 ayear doing this.
Tons of stories like that, I never know.
It's believe the school services.
Person making $10 million a month.
No, it's just 1000 a month. That's the school thing.
So school like SKOL, the Alex Hormozi stuff that the the go to
thing, if you go out school, thefront page school is just like,
(02:38):
here's how I'm making 10,000 a month using school like every,
every I don't know, there's likea yard sale on 10,000.
Everybody has 10,000. Really somebody needs like
10,000 and one, you know, like price is right rules.
But anyway, So what I'm trying to figure out is like how like
how, if this is possible and then like the best way to go
about it and and what am I seeing out there sort of in this
(03:01):
concept of a single person like enterprise?
And what does that look like? And I think for the record, I
think a lot of this is probably,unless you're a software
developer, you know, kind of building on the, the skepticism
around like some of these AI coding tools, which are getting
better. But right, it's probably a lot
of these are more like consumer focused like physical products
(03:23):
as opposed to SAS companies and those sorts of things.
I feel like this is the thing that bugs me about this is that
like everybody's always like, oh, I got a business idea for
like an app or some sort of piece of tech or whatever.
And it's like, oh, now I don't need a, a technical cofounder
cause I can just use AI. But I sit there and I think as
(03:43):
like a technical person, maybe now I don't need a, you know, a
marketing. True.
Yeah. Like what's the?
I think it's actually easier at anything those other things have
been. Replaced here theatrical.
Piece. With you, I feel like you're
coming for us. We're coming for.
You, he's coming for everyone. Yeah.
You know, it is it really? It genuinely is coming for
(04:04):
everyone. And that's why I'm kind of
thinking about this differently because I, part of me thinks
this could also be the future ofsmall business.
Yeah. Is, is, is like a side hustle on
cocaine, You know what I mean? Like, you're really able to
scale, but with no one else. And all of a sudden, you know,
you could have a normal job or maybe that goes away anyway, and
then you're doing this side hustle that's a lot more
scalable than it used to be. So that's why it was really
(04:26):
thought this was an interesting topic to dive into.
So let me, I'm gonna read my phone here.
Like a couple of data pieces. So Harvard Business Review notes
that startups using AI can now compete head to head with
giants. OK, so this makes sense.
So, so, you know, so only lean team from an AI coding partner.
So cursor managed to rival toolsfrom even like GitHub or even
(04:46):
Open. I thought that was pretty
interesting. I was like, OK, so I mean,
there's like a skill element there too, and you know, all
these different things, but it'seffectively like a leveling tool
for the playing field, at least on a competitive basis.
Actually, I was listening to thedaily this morning at New York
Times daily. I like listening to that
occasionally. And they were talking about how
like it's weird that open AI obviously being the first mover
(05:10):
notwithstanding, it's weird thatthey're leading the race when
you consider like Meta is in in this race with unlimited
capital, Google with unlimited capital, like Microsoft,
Microsoft like, like, I mean, Microsoft sort of open AI.
But Elon, you know, who's normally, like, always ahead of
stuff, you know, kind of not really like.
Microsoft didn't like they, theyinvested in AI kind of late in
(05:30):
the game almost, you know, so like they, they weren't there.
I don't. Think in the everybody hates
Copilot and yeah, it keeps trying to like turn itself on my
computer. I'm like, I don't need this.
Like typical Microsoft. It's like, oh wow, we have these
amazing tools, let's force our users.
To do it like. Stop Microsoft like.
Anyway. Yeah.
OK. So a global BCG survey, Boston
(05:52):
Consulting Group found that organizations effectively
deploying. I see.
And I like this 45% cost savingsand 60% higher revenue growth on
average. Yeah.
So I think that's interesting. Supporting what you were kind of
saying at the start is like actually the behind this is this
like the actual marketing functions can also be vastly
(06:13):
automated. Yeah, honestly, I think the
technical cofounder is is not the low hanging fruit.
I think everything else is the low hanging.
Fruit definitely like and we talked about like a couple of
episodes back to the story of Jasper right and like and some
of these other ones were like writing and blog writing and
advertising copy like those things are evaporating if not
already Meanwhile founders adopting AI now this is really
(06:36):
interesting. So this is kind of
counterintuitive, but I, I want it think of this as a much more
smaller business. But these are existing
companies. So founders adopting AI aren't
actually necessarily cutting jobs.
Nearly 80% of AI heavy startups actually hired more people and
they use AI as a force multiplier rather than a
replacement. Yeah.
(06:56):
What do you think about that? Isn't that kind of surprising?
Like I remember. And then again, I love this
anthropic interview with friendsLenny, because he talked about
how they're hiring like crazy and you're like, that's kind of
weird. You're an AI company.
They're a startup company and they know that they can bring in
people and augment them with AI tools.
Cyborg. And they're like, yeah, they're,
(07:18):
they're on steroids, their employees on steroids and like,
doesn't. That give you bubble worries,
though, Like some people say, I kind of like a bubble, right?
They could be like a bubblelikethe.com and stuff.
There's so much money into this.So all these things and it's.
Yeah. And yet it's such a powerful
tool, and yet they're hiring thousands of people.
Do you remember maybe about a year or so ago the guy who's, I
(07:39):
don't know, the founder of the CEO of Spotify said like the
marginal cost of making music isgoing to be essentially 0.
And remember, all the artists got really upset about him
saying. Right.
Because like. You know, they're and there is a
lot of work that goes into it, but I think his point was kind
of like that, you know, these tools are making much easier to
create really good music. And so the the the like cost to
(08:01):
create music is going. He didn't mean like the
emotional cost or like the like the artistic cost.
I think he meant more like production.
Values so then some of the thinkabout a lot of things that
businesses do. So let's take software
development. The cost to build offer is gonna
like essentially go down. Your cost per like line of code
is gonna be almost nothing. OK, But you can kind of just
keep going with that because youknow, you can use AI to do
(08:23):
marketing, you can do a use AI to do sales, you can use a I do
finance, you can like. So is the cost of starting a
business or getting a business off the ground essentially going
to be like? Zero.
I don't think it'll be 0, but itdefinitely a lot lower than what
it was before. I think a lot lower than three
years. Ago.
So then, so then all of a sudden, how easy is it for
anybody to start a business? Right.
So and then are are we in an arms race where it's like holy
(08:46):
smokes, like starting a businessis really about like who had the
best AI tools you know, to I. Think there's still an execution
piece to it. I think it really depends on the
nature of product, right? There's an execution and
strategy component here too. So like again in this direct to
consumer would like thing that I'm working on in stealth that
doesn't exist that thing like you can see that the path of
(09:08):
this the the actual various entry are considerably lower.
You do need some capital, not a ton of money though.
Now you can get away like 1020 grand pretty easily.
And I think like, which is nothing in the business starting
business world that gets you pretty far.
Yeah. And you know, depending how far
you wanna go into it and how talented you are with marketing.
I think the real challenge is actually it's a much more
(09:28):
competitive landscape to this point.
Like a lot of people have started something because
they're like, I may as well throw my hat in the ring.
Yeah, see how it goes. The winners are the ones who
market the. Best.
So then I got a question for you.
Because you have this thing in stealth.
Maybe it's a thing, maybe it's not a thing, whatever.
OK, so let's say that you can essentially automate.
You don't need a cofounder. You don't need Chris.
(09:50):
Yeah, you've got, let's say you can you can automate like 70% of
of what needs to be done in thatbusiness.
OK, so the 70% gone, the 30, what is the 30%?
Yeah. That you feel like you can't use
AI for that. You have to do on your own.
Yeah, there's two thoughts therethat I have.
One is there are things I enjoy doing.
Right which? Part of having a business is not
(10:13):
just about making money, it's enjoying what you do with your
day. So that's the first thing I'm
gonna say. Something weird category.
Yeah, fair enough. Fair enough.
That maybe that's a Dave only thing.
Yeah. The things that I think require
a human or human interaction. You're not gonna close the deal
with an AI agent with another company, you know what I mean?
Like I wouldn't negotiate with an AI agent.
I would like if I'm going to sign a.
(10:33):
Would you use an AI agent to do like sales prospecting?
Maybe cold outreach SDR activity, but I'm not gonna.
Do it. So where's the point where it
switches over to? Demo real life and I think
customers respect a person, yeah, especially now.
And I think that will be increasingly true overtime.
Do you think customers will takeissue?
I'll say issue OK with being cold called on by AI.
(10:58):
Yeah, some, but I think. That will they know or is.
It possible they won't necessarily.
I think people like look a couple of years ago it was hard
for anyone to pick up whether animage was AI altered.
Now you have like an eye for it or even like text, if it's been
written by chat ET, you kind of know there's a way to see it,
right? If you, if you use these tools a
(11:18):
lot. So I think maybe like people
will increasingly know that that's happening and perhaps
they'll be like counterintuitively, a respect
for sort of the traditional methods, right?
It really again though, depends on the nature of your product.
Like if you're being, if, if youhave a mass market product being
like advertised to you, you don't really care if the ads or
(11:39):
if the content. I I think as long as it's
engaging and accurate and valuable and perhaps
entertaining, I would definitelyentertaining that.
Like, does it really bother you that much if it's AI or not?
Like I saw, I saw the craziest thing the other day and like I'm
laughing about it was so funny. OK, You know the scene in the
Matrix where Neo's in the subwaystation?
(11:59):
Yeah, and, and, and, and Agent Smith comes in like fights them,
right. And they have that really big
fight and and he said there's the big deal because he stands
his ground against the agents that right, OK.
And he's beginning to believe. And so the fight was instead of
me over Sages Smith, it was Sam Altman versus Mark Zuckerberg.
(12:19):
Mark Zuckerberg being being Neo actually, and Sam Altman being
Agent Smith. Like it was amazing.
Like it was so good. Like the the it's you know, when
that he gets punched in the faceand his classes break and it's
like, it's Sam Altman's like face like as if he got punched.
It's incredibly. Well, play Wow.
And I'm just like, that's awesome.
(12:40):
And like, that's obviously AI. Yeah, but that's cool.
Like I was entertained, right? So I don't know.
I think for consumer, probably there are different rules if
you're selling. I sold my business for $40
million and I want you to steal my ideas.
Check out my book Start Up Different on Amazon, Audible and
(13:00):
Kindle landscaping companies because I know you're working on
your cottage stuff that you're selling landscape companies in
your outbound calling with an AIagent.
I think really most of the time outbound calling is competing
with people from India calling us, which we get a lot right and
(13:20):
or from call centres in other countries.
So I think like maybe it actually will be better.
It's possible. Yeah, maybe not like I don't
know. I can't, I don't know.
I don't really know on that. But anyway, everybody hates cold
calls anyway. Yeah, Yeah, I know what you
mean. Can I put in a thought out
there? Yeah.
So just thinking about the 7030 split.
So 70%, what if it's not that you.
(13:41):
So let's say, you know, you've got 10 different roles in your
company, OK. And you're saying, well, no, I
can have 70% of those just like done by AI, OK, 30% of them will
be done by by people. OK.
What if that's, what if that's afallacy?
What if that's wrong? What if it's actually more like,
you know, I I can't actually eliminate a CTO role with with
(14:03):
AI, but I can eliminate like I can have 70% of what the CTO
does done by AI. The other 30% I still need a
founder for right. Is there is there some risk of
that? OK.
Is there some risk where you know, like when you and I were
running started our company. OK, so I kind of did like the
finance. I kind of did the.
Different hats like. A bit of the operations like and
(14:25):
then you did both. Were kind of in operations,
yeah. OK.
So like, so you know, if you're starting a business right now,
let's say there's two of us, OK,is it more like, you know, Dave,
you're gonna handle these roles,so marketing, sales, leadership,
strategy, and then Chris, you'regoing to handle tech and.
(14:46):
Escalation customer. Support, customer service,
customer success, yeah, whatever.
And so as those two rules, you have to do like 30% of it of
each one of those with AI doing the other 70% of those.
Yeah, like maybe it's not as clear cut as you're just
replacing like 1. Department, yeah, you know,
replacing it effectively like a department in a small.
Company, yeah, or you look at ita different way, you say hey
(15:07):
cool, I am gonna have a CTO, butthat's CTO is gonna.
Be like that. That's the that's the
amplification, the Cyborg thing we're just talking about at the
start where it's like you're, you're, you're you're enhancing
force multiplier for AI as opposed to which is probably
true. Maybe it depends really, again,
it's just specific on your, of your business.
(15:28):
I think what it might allow for is I don't, I think what I like.
So let's go back to me. Yeah, I could definitely see
there's a case, you know, if this thing actually works out,
whatever it is that I have a chief operating officer later,
but that I don't really have to give them an equity stake.
Yeah, you know what I mean? And I think that's valuable to
me even alone, right. The founder, right, Obviously
(15:49):
hugely valuable depending on thecircumstances.
Yeah. So it's kind of like, you know,
you're you're right. So maybe the and and the you
could argue with the rationally like, well, I'm gonna have AI
due at least half of all the terrible stuff.
I'm gonna pay you really well. I'm gonna bonus to you really
well, but you're not going to get any equity because whatever.
And if you don't like it, you know, go somewhere else.
(16:10):
Find. This is interesting.
I feel like, you know, we've talked if I had some guests on
who do things around fractionals.
Yeah, OK. Yeah, I think fractionals have a
real opportunity where they can say, hey, I'm gonna come in and
only gonna work for you 30% of the time, but I'm gonna provide
the equivalent of a full time marketing CMO or a full time,
(16:30):
you know, revenue operations. Personnel though, when you look
at when you look for an AI agentbefore you hired.
A. If if my argument around that
you can't one for one just replace a person.
OK, Yeah. OK, sure AI.
Then maybe the fractional is thepiece that you you need.
Could that be the real life person using a whole lot of AI
(16:52):
tools behind? So I mean, I don't know.
That's interesting. So, yeah, even even be able to.
I see. So you're trying to suggest that
avoiding hiring in that way you could, you could basically run a
company without any full time employees, but having a mix of
yourself, AI agents and fractionals.
Yeah, Yeah, I think that's probably.
I think that's definitely. True.
Right now I want to throw another question.
We go, OK, so you got me. You got your stealth thing.
(17:13):
That's maybe not a thing, but whatever, you're doing your
thing. OK.
So when you think down the road,you're probably at some point
considering like what is the exit look like on this?
So if you've started a company and you have it, it is
profitable. So no, no, no, just just bear
with you. I'll follow along with me.
OK, So what if you get what if you're successful and you're
(17:36):
down the road and you've got a business that is doing millions
in revenue, it's profitable, that sort of stuff, and you're
looking to make an exit and you've got investors looking to
buy that from you. Are you ever concerned you ever
heard the term of a zombie company?
I know I haven't heard the term.But it's essentially the company
that is like, remember when we built our business, we had to
(17:59):
make sure we had enough people who could actually keep running
it when we were. Not there.
Remember, Remember hearing aboutthe Solo Stove guys?
Yeah. And they tried to sell and they
were like, it can't just be you 2 dudes need to build like an
actual company with people. And then they built an actual
company with people and then they sold.
Yeah. Remember that so so this is a
risk so our I do. Think it's.
A risk? Do you think that if you do
build this, you are going to have to have some human
(18:20):
component to it so that it is not a hollow company, it is not
a zombie? I think is something that could
be continue on with that. You are making that you're
bringing up that fear by lookinginto the past.
You're saying that the way that companies are required was like
our company was acquired is the way they're going to be acquired
later, which you don't know, we,we, it may be acceptable.
(18:43):
We like, I don't know that a company could be run by one
person with 25 different AI agents that do a whole bunch of
things automatically that connect to your, your, you know,
your partnerships and your, yourif it's a product, so a physical
product you like a 3:00 PM right.
Third party logistics probably. Yeah, like connected to that.
Like all these things just talking to each other.
Like there's basically what the acquirer is then purchasing is
(19:06):
like the brand, the the probablylike the customer list
effectively like, you know, thatthat kind of like revenue
momentum and the growth rate. And likely they would have you,
they'd be buying into something that they believe they could
augment because of their reach or whatever it is, right.
So like, it's so like this thought just crossed my mind.
The other thing though, for me that I also think about for this
(19:27):
business is because my circumstance is a little bit
different. Get a little personal here.
I don't know, I feel about this,but is that like, I don't
necessarily feel like I need to sell, but I like for now, I'm
just like, let's see if I can make some money doing this.
That's that's really the approach I want to take.
I want to put a ton of pressure on myself, like, Oh, I need to
make a gazillion dollars. I kind of just be like, is this
even going to work? Because it could totally fail
And like I'm cool with. That, yeah.
(19:48):
Like I think of when we started App Armor, there was a bunch of
things that we tried before him that failed miserably, but we
learned a lot. Like or like Land of the Living
Dead. You know, we got to like couple.
Like I do feel like we're kind of at a a rebirth moment on how
businesses start. Yeah.
And I, I think I remember when we were doing our mobile apps
and the big term was mobile first.
Yeah. And I think right now the term
(20:11):
is AI first. Yeah.
You know, so you're building an AI first business and we really
don't know how that's gonna. That's cool.
I didn't even like put the that label to it but.
That's exactly that's exactly what you're trying to do.
So then I do have a question foryou.
Yeah, So let's assume that you aren't just doing this as like a
hobby and you do want to eventually exit from it.
Yeah, OK. Are you concerned that
(20:34):
businesses which are AI first because of this?
You know, thinking about the Spotify guy saying that the cost
of of music is going down to marginally like nothing if if
all these businesses are startedas AI first businesses, do you
worry that the valuations on an acquisition are incredibly
compressed? Because everybody knows, hey,
(20:55):
that guy, that the way that he does that thing is easily
copyable by a bunch of. AI but that's where your brand
equity comes in. Like remember this is gonna be
like a marketing play effectively.
OK, you have a thing you drive down costs on your distribution.
You're sorry your manufacturer side your like you, you add as
much margin as you get into thisproduct, you immediately take
every available penny you have otherwise and put it into
(21:17):
marketing this product, buildingbrand equity, building brand
trust. It is not easy to build a brand.
That's why it's so I remember when the Warby Parker guys did
it. The big thing that was
surprising Warby Parker is that those guys not only built an
amazing brand, they also built afactory.
Yeah. And people were like, that is
unheard of. And as honestly like peering
(21:37):
into this world now, I can't believe how little stuff is made
by the companies that sell it. Yeah.
That is very surprising. Sounds dumb but I'm like wow.
Factory in China, yeah. There's a lot of or wherever
somewhere in the world right now.
This is kind of awkward, but I haven't highlighted the seven
things, OK? So.
OK, so the seven things, seven ways to replace, it's more like
(21:59):
7 like understandings to for replacing.
And I think we covered actually a lot of them.
So this is actually so let's loop this in.
So one is for the AIS like pick its job.
OK, So what is the AI decide? Is it your code or your
marketing, your analyst? Or is it gonna like blend into
these roles? So that was good for you.
AI isn't magic. It's just like a super fast
intern that doesn't sleep. Yeah.
And I was like, that's a good. Way of seeing.
(22:20):
It starts small, test fast. So give it one task that you'd
normally lean on a cofounder for.
Like, I don't know, it depends what your co-founder does, but
one of those tasks, so for let'ssay it was a salesperson you
were replacing, see how it does with cold emails, See how it
does with some of that prospecting, some of the things
you'll see in like software platforms like Apollo and stuff
like that. Keep the human stuff human was
another point. So if the demo, the demo, the
(22:43):
deal, the handshake, the backslaps, conferences, like
those things have to be, you gotto take people over dinner, you
know, and for now we don't have robots doing that.
So anyway, we'll see how that works.
One thing that is definitely important, at least for the
start, is that checking its work, Yeah, You know, you think
about like it didn't grok, say, like it was some sort of.
Yeah, awful. Thing.
(23:05):
Some sort of Nazi thing on, on, on and stuff like that.
So like be really tight to the Ifor a while until like you would
like you would like you would anemployee though, like I don't
think that's outrageous. Yeah, we were like, oh, I gotta
watch this thing. Gonna watch an employee?
Like you're you're having a draft the e-mail, but you're the
one actually hitting send things.
Like, correct. Like I remember I had a boss one
time. It was like, just imagine
hitting send whenever you do that.
(23:26):
Like a bomb could explode, yeah,if you're not careful.
And I was like, that's a good way to think about it.
That's really, you can't really,you know, when you do what's
that called recall you do then that just alerts everyone.
e-mail. Yeah. 5 is measure the wind.
So did it actually save time? How much time did it close?
More deals that cut costs? It has to actually generate an
ROI and you have to be able to act on that benefit, like take
(23:49):
up that game time, game, money game, something like that.
I think that's obviously kind ofintuitive, but it's something to
remember because I think a lot of people are like using a lot
of tools, racking up monthly costs on these things without
actually being able to be like, this is the game I get from
this, right? Build a feedback loop.
So obviously, so don't accept just what AI spits out, like
(24:10):
work on it iteratively improve it like you would any lean
startup thing. And then lastly is be
transparent. So I thought this was an
interesting point, but tell, tell people in the market that
you're doing this, that you're using AI, that you're telling
your investors that this is the way you're structuring.
The people think you're 9% less competent.
Yeah, I think yeah, actually based on the old depends who
they are, they middle management.
(24:31):
So I think, I think what it is though is it's like if you're
hiding AI, it seems like you have you've something to be
worried about. Whereas I think if you're just
like transparently like yeah, ofcourse we use AI tools like
everybody uses, everybody shouldbe using it.
I think you. Just drive costs down first
company and it keeps our costs low and that's the synovate and.
(24:51):
You know, it's really funny. I, I genuinely wonder the way
I'm structuring this thing now. I, I really wonder when am I
going to be like, aside from me,when am I going to need a
person? And I'm really thinking about
this and I'm like, I don't know.Yeah.
And it'll happen. I think.
I think it will happen, Right. And then I'll deal with it then.
But it is kind of an interesting, interesting take.
(25:12):
So cool. So like weirdly, AI in the short
term might lead to more people, which is one thing.
One of the weird conclusions to start this, because this
enhancer makes people more effective long term is not
clear. But either way, there's lots of
different ways that you can makeup for the weaknesses that you
have that you would implicitly need a cofounder for.
But just keep those seven pointsin mind this year.
(25:33):
No, that's great. You know, like I one point on
the hiring all the AI companies hiring is that let's let's say
for instance, you had a secret way to go out and buy a hire
people and they were just like superhuman, right?
Yeah, then you would hire. More.
Yeah, right. So I don't think it's like that
surprising that AI companies arehiring I.
Just think it's, you know, the the weird thing about a lot of
(25:54):
these AI tools, like open AI like loses a lot of money,
right, Because it's so expensiveto have that this like the
infrastructure required for sure.
It just seems interesting to me that the costs are so low on
using these tools given their relative power.
Yeah. Like it almost became, I mean,
the consumer wins. This is capitalism.
(26:15):
There's so many AI tools trying to be dominant in the market.
At the same time, it's really driven costs down on incredible
functionality. That I remember when that
DeepSeek thing, yeah, like everybody freaked out.
They trained it on $5,000,000 and yeah, I think that was
actually not true. Like they, you know, there was
some fudging of those, sure. I don't know.
Yeah, but like anyway, a lot less than whatever opening I
(26:37):
was. Doing.
Yeah, exactly. Anyway, lots of opportunity.
I'll let you know how it goes. Good luck with your new venture,
Dave. Yeah, don't even need you
anymore bro. Anyway, I'll see you tonight.
Alright folks, see you later, hey?
Let's get it rolling. Big ideas, money folding hustle,
(27:00):
smart dream. So why turn that grinded through
a joy? Ride.
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