#149 - Tayler Tuttle Peavey

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The spark wasn’t love at first stride. Tayler Tuttle Peavey once hated running, chose softball, and struggled through PE miles—then found a coach who spoke the language of physiology and a path that led from Georgia to Colorado and, ultimately, to USATF national titles on the trails. We sit down to unpack how a hip labrum surgery, a health-first rebuild, and a sustainable coaching approach turned doubt into momentum and a breakout 2025.

Tayler takes us inside the pivotal transfer from Georgia to CU Boulder, the up-and-down college years, and the moment she realized roads weren’t the only way forward. She traces her first steps into trail racing—second at the Moab Trail Half after two years without a start—then the return to win Moab, a Twisted Fork statement, and a USATF 50K crown on runnable terrain that matched her strengths. We dig into Broken Arrow’s shortened VK, the chaos of mass starts, and the strategic lessons she can’t wait to apply when she lines up for the 23K.

Training with David and Megan Roche, Taylor’s blueprint centers on durability: weekly rest days, individualized intensity, and a mix of track, road, and trail sessions to keep speed sharp while building technical skill. She shares how she uses heart rate as a guide rather than a governor, why cross-training tools like Zwift, the elliptical, and stairs are staples, and how she keeps winter work efficient without unnecessary risk. Looking ahead, she’s targeting the two-to-three-hour sweet spot—30K mountain races, Broken Arrow 23K, and a potential Golden Trail schedule—while staying selective with travel and open to the right sponsorship fit as she moves full time into the sport.

We also talk bigger picture: how short trail can grow by inviting mass participation at accessible distances, why community and media coverage matter, and how the rising wave of D1 talent is raising the competitive bar. If you care about the future of mountain, trail, and sub-ultra racing—and the mindset it takes to thrive—this conversation delivers both inspiration and a practical playbook.

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Follow Tayler on IG - @taylerwithlime

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Episode Transcript

SPEAKER_00 (00:00):
Welcome back to this Deep Stuff Podcast.
I'm your host, James Loriello.
It's day, I'm so excited towelcome Taylor Toddle PV to the
show by way of Boulder,Colorado.
Taylor is the 2025 USATF 50K andhalf marathon national champion.
She came on the show to talkabout her running experience.

(00:21):
By way as well, growing up inGeorgia, running for the
University of Georgia and thenthe University of Colorado, UC
Boulder.
Taylor was kind enough to comeon the show and share her
experiences at the D1 level,what it was like.
We talked a lot about coaching.
We talked a lot about hertraining.
We got into plans for 2026 andbeyond, her goals for the sport,

(00:43):
what she thinks of the sport.
And uh yeah, it's just alwaysexciting to catch an athlete
just before they become ahousehold name.
And I feel like Taylor is one ofthese incredibly talented D1
athletes that has entered oursport and uh will be taking the
sport by storm over the courseof the next few years.
So it's always fun to kind ofhave these conversations before
they kind of uh take off.

(01:05):
So, guys, I hope you enjoyedthis one.
Definitely a favorite of mine,and uh the first big one of
2026.
We've got a bunch of good stuffuh coming down the line as well
as a bunch of goodannouncements.
So hope you enjoyed this one.
Taylor Tuttle Peavy.

(02:19):
Ladies and gentlemen, we'regonna be able to do that.
Taylor Tuttle PV, welcome to theSteep Stuff Podcast.
How's it going?

SPEAKER_01 (02:37):
Good.
Thanks for having me.
Yeah, good to be here.

SPEAKER_00 (02:40):
Yeah, excited to have this conversation.
I feel like you had such a justan amazing 2025 season and uh
lots to build off of that goinginto 2026.
So I felt like this was a greatopportunity to kind of reflect
back on the year and learn moreabout who you are as an athlete
and uh yeah, talk about yourplans for 2026.

SPEAKER_01 (02:57):
Yeah, thank you.
Yeah, I I don't even think I'vedone a ton of reflecting, so it
should be fun.

SPEAKER_00 (03:02):
Cool, cool.
Well, hey, I mean, dude, you'rethe 50k champion, you're the
half marathon champion.
There's a champion of a lot ofthings in 2025.
So uh before we get started,maybe maybe give me like the
five-minute elevator pitch.
Like who like what's yourbackground with sport?
I know you grew up in Georgia.
Um, I knew you're you went to UCBoulder, but help help paint

(03:22):
that picture for me on like yourbackground with sport.

SPEAKER_01 (03:26):
Yeah, okay.
Elevator pitch.
I'll try and keep it condensed.
Um okay.
I grew up hating running.
I'll start with that.
Um, I feel like a lot of runnershave either like the story that
they they loved running from thebeginning or they hated it.
And I was struggling to finishthe mile in PE, like not a
runner by any means.
Um, family wasn't either.

(03:48):
My sisters and I grew up playinga bunch of different sports.
Um so I got into running kind ofthrough softball, um, just for
like conditioning.
That was we had a coach who wasreally into running, um, made us
run a few miles before practice.
And I think at the time thatfelt kind of psychotic.
Um, so yeah, that's probablylike the first time I ever ran

(04:09):
continuous miles strungtogether.
Um, and then I just kind of fellinto it in high school.
Um, and it was one of thosethings where uh, you know, it
was getting time to startthinking about college
recruiting and like was prettyserious on the softball side,
tried to do both for a littlebit, decided to pursue running
instead.
Um, and I was lucky with justlike amazing teammates, amazing

(04:32):
community that I found soquickly with running that I
found a way to not hate it andthen ended up loving it.
Um, so that's how I got intorunning.
Um, so yeah, it was likesophomore junior of high school.
Um, yeah, then I actually did myfreshman year of college at the
University of Georgia in Athens.
Um, so closer to home, um, SEC.

(04:54):
I I had taken a visit to seeyou, but um, yeah, it just felt
so far and um yeah, it didn'tmake sense for me at the time.
So did my freshman year at theUniversity of Georgia.
Um, loved the team, lovedAthens.
Like I felt such a such a homethere immediately and and like
such a family on that team.

(05:15):
Um, but in terms of what I waslooking for, like on the running
side and like my development asan athlete and and really like
the team goals and team culturejust wasn't what I was looking
for.
Um, and so I kind of had to makethe difficult decision.
Um, really the end of my fallthere, my first fall there.
Um, I kind of had to me it waslike I'm either gonna keep

(05:38):
running and do it somewhereelse, or I'm gonna stop running
and enjoy my time here.
And I was nowhere near ready tobe done with running.
Um, and it's kind of funny, Ithink, like when you're going
into college, you're 16, 17years old making a decision
about where you think you wantto spend your career and what
you think you want.
Um, and then I think, yeah, youget into college and it doesn't

(06:00):
take much to make you realizelike maybe I wasn't looking at
the right things.
And you I think you learn a lotabout yourself pretty quickly,
and I know I did.
So um, yeah, it was pretty clearto me what I was missing, what
was important to me.
Um and and that kind of led tome looking at CU again.
Um, and and it really wasn't abig like I didn't end up looking

(06:20):
at a bunch of other schools, itjust became clear to me that's
where I wanted to be.
Um so yeah, that's how I endedup at CU did my so my second
through fifth years at CU.

SPEAKER_00 (06:31):
Were you at CU like crossover with McKenna Morley?
Because I think she graduatedwhat, like 19 or 20.
So you guys must have beenteaming.

SPEAKER_01 (06:37):
Yeah.
Yep.
I graduated in 19.
So I came in the same year shedid.
Um, but she was just a yearunder me.
So that's so crazy.

SPEAKER_00 (06:44):
And then I think was I um what was it, Taylor or
Tabor?
Sorry, Tabor uh Scholl.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Yeah.
So so many people in like thetrail world now, it's uh it's
kind of crazy.

SPEAKER_01 (06:54):
Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 (06:55):
Yeah, interesting.
Well, let's go back in time.
Maybe paint the picture for mebecause I'm just so curious,
especially coming out of highschool, you must have discovered
that you had like a knack atrunning.
Like you must have obviouslybeen very talented, talented at
it or worked very hard at itfrom the beginning.
At what point in time were youlike, okay, I want to pursue
this in college?
This is something I want to do,and the scholarships and the

(07:15):
recruiting started rolling infrom there.

SPEAKER_01 (07:18):
Yeah, I I remember having like such a crisis about
it.
Obviously, at the time it feltso big.
Like my sisters were both uhlike deciding to pursue
softball, and we had always kindof done the same sports growing
up.
Um, so at the time it was like akind of a big deal, but it was
like you either need to commityourself fully to go that track
or you need to decide to go, youknow, the running side if that's

(07:39):
what you want to do.
So my sophomore year of highschool, I did both cross-country
and softball in the fall.
Um, which I'm yeah, I feel likethat's usually something high
schools discouraged doing twovarsity sports, and I can see
why looking back on it, it wasjust really chaotic, but it
allowed me to like kind of haveto make a decision.
Um, so yeah, I I remember likeusing that season as kind of my

(08:03):
litmus test of like I'm gonnaneed to come out of this with a
decision.
And I I can like so clearlyremember like running some some
silly, like probably not thathard high school workout, but
seemed really hard at the time.
Um, and in the middle of it, Iwas like, why would I choose
this one?
Like this, this is so physicallypainful compared to the other
option on the table.

(08:25):
Um, and I and I like knew inthat moment I was like, but I'm
gonna choose this.
Like I don't know why.
Um so yeah, that's I I don't I Iknew there was talent there, and
I knew, yeah, like I was seeingsuccess in a different way than
I'd seen in other sports.
But I think it was a lot morelike I'm I'm suddenly seeing

(08:46):
this as this opportunity of likeI can put in this work and it
immediately is translating towhat seems like endless
potential.
Um, and I think a lot of younghigh school runners feel that,
but just yeah, like kind ofbeing able to seize that at a
young age and like especiallywhen you're kind of learning who
you are as a person and kind oflike developing your identity,

(09:08):
like that was a really strongpull for me.
Um so I think that was thebeginnings of of me like
becoming a lot more intrigued bythe sport.
Um, and then I ended up having areally, a really incredible high
school coach that I had barelystarted working with at the
time.
And um, he was a scientist andjust really scientific about um

(09:29):
training and physiology.
And I just ate that up.
Like that was so interesting tome.
Um, that that was the way thatyou could approach the sport.
Um, so I think that I kind ofgrasped onto that really heavily
early on, too.

SPEAKER_00 (09:43):
So interesting.
What what was the I guess therecruitment process for going to
like a D1 school like that?
Because especially because Imean, especially CU, that's the
the creme de la creme.
I mean, that's the tip of thespear when it comes to you know
the track and field andcross-country world.
Um was it very difficult,especially the transfer process
leaving from UGA, even though itis D1, but going from the SEC to

(10:05):
the Pac-12 at that time, whatwas that like?

SPEAKER_01 (10:09):
Well, it's it was a lot different than it is now,
because now there's a transferportal.
Um so yeah, I I will say backwhen I was going through it,
like the way it worked, um, youreally needed the support of
your like current coach becausethey had a lot of like options
to sort of block your potentialif they wanted to.

(10:29):
And I think that would depend onhow you left the program, how
that all went.
I, you know, thankfully had alot of support from my coach of
Georgia.
He was, you know, I came to him,had multiple conversations, and
by the time I was like allowedto contact other coaches, um, he
was like, I'm I'm on your teamhere, like I'll help you with
with this whole process.
He's like, I'll advocate foryou, I'm not gonna hold you

(10:51):
back.
And I had heard horror storiesof the opposite happening, um,
like people's eligibility beingblocked for a period of time.
Um, so yeah, for me it was likerelatively smooth logistically.
Um, it did feel like a huge liferisk.
Like I was going from a fullride scholarship in state to not
quite a full scholarship out ofstate.

(11:14):
Um, I was leaving, I was like anhour and a half from home in
Athens and I was flying acrossthe country.
I didn't know anyone.
Um, I was lucky to have metsomeone on my recruiting trip
who I was able to room with,someone on the team.
Um, but I wasn't living in thedorms.
I was just like, you know, comesummer moving across the
country.
So that piece of it was likefelt like such a risk.

(11:37):
And there was like a lot ofdoubt of like, is this yeah, is
this a great idea, or am I justlike feeling like I don't know,
like I think people have theidea with like the grass is
always greener somewhere else.
And I was like trying to makesure that's not why I was making
my decision and um kind of likerealizing and deciding like
these are the important factorsI've identified for myself.

(11:59):
And beyond that, you kind ofjust have to make it the right
decision.
Um, so that's kind of themindset I tried to have.
But it was it was, yeah, like Ifeel like the hugest shift and
risk I had ever taken at thatpoint.

SPEAKER_00 (12:11):
That's so interesting to me.
And the reason I ask in uh Idon't know, I think of like
college football.
I have a lot of friends thatplayed college football, and I I
just know from back in the day,like I graduated, I think it was
like 2013.
I I just remember coaches andthat whole process, they used
like if you were a Big Tenathlete and wanted to go within
the Big Ten, like a lot of timesthey had the power to block
that.
I didn't know it was that wayfor the same thing for uh cross

(12:33):
country and track and field.
That's interesting.
The portal has changed dynamicsso much.

SPEAKER_01 (12:38):
Oh my gosh, I know.
I could say a lot on yeah, justuh everything that's changed in
the NCAA since I've graduated,which is crazy.
Um, but yeah, I think I think ifI was transferring in
conference, it it makes it alittle bit stickier.
But I still think I I really didhave like really great support
from my coach.
So I think he would have helpedme um even with that.
But I think if you'retransferring out of conference,

(12:59):
that helps.

SPEAKER_00 (13:01):
Let let's talk about we'll shift gears.
I it like your time at CU anddid you have like goals to go
professional um on the on thetrack or the road after school?
Like how how was that workingfor you?
I'm just trying to bridge thatgap until you found the trails,
kind of.

SPEAKER_01 (13:16):
Yeah.
Um, yes.
So I to quickly touch on mycollege career, like it was
pretty up and down for me.
Um, like on paper, prettydisappointing.
But like I came out of schoolfeeling like I had had enough
sort of like glimpses of successand excitement still, um, that I
was like nowhere near ready tobe done with running.

(13:38):
Um but I hadn't I ran like halfan outdoor season my entire time
in college.
So I certainly didn't have anycredentials to be speaking to
any brands or anything likethat.
Um, but I I also felt like Istill had a lot of potential
with my college coaches and theyhad kind of a small
post-collegiate group um alreadygoing.
And then a few other women frommy year were were gonna continue

(13:58):
to train with them.
And um, so I jumped into thatand yeah, I kind of immediately
shifted to the roads.
Um just yeah, part partially,like that's where I felt like
the opportunity was for me umand the excitement.
Part of me still wants to go dosome stuff on the track someday.
I don't know if I will, but umthere's I don't know.

(14:18):
I feel it feels like there'sjust like some untapped, like
I've never even run a 10p on thetrack, which feels crazy.
Um but yeah, I also dealt withyeah, like quite a string of in
like up and down and likeinjuries post-collegially as
well.
So I really like I was trainingwith that group and um aspiring

(14:38):
to run on the roads for severalyears, and I really only had
like a small road season in2022.
Um and it was it was enough thatit like kept me excited about
the sport and and kept meexcited about my potential.
Um, but it it was I came out ofthat pretty quickly having to
deal with um some hip issuesthat I'd been dealing with

(15:00):
previously.
So um yeah, I would say mostlylike an up and down sort of
journey for me um thatultimately led me to the trails.
That being said, I do, I dostill have road ambitions.
Um, and I think yeah, we have alot of amazing athletes in our
sport who have proved you can doyou can do both.
You can do any mix that youwant.

(15:22):
Um, so for me right now, I thinkmy excitement mostly lies on the
trails, but certainly still someroad ambitions.

SPEAKER_00 (15:30):
If you don't mind me asking, like what made you stay
in Boulder?
Just because I feel like this islike an ongoing threat where
athletes graduate from boulder,like from CU.
And a lot of people just staybecause if you're an athlete,
it's like the place to be.

SPEAKER_01 (15:43):
Yeah, I mean, you said it, it's the place to be.
Um, yeah, and I it was kind offunny graduating.
Like I there were certainlypeople who could not wait to get
out.
Um, and then there are peoplewho I think I'm more aligned
with, which just like this feltlike my home.
And when I moved out hereinitially um and transferred, it
was partially because of becauseof the program at CU, the

(16:05):
coaches, the team, um, but alsojust like the environment here.
Like this, this has always feltlike so aligned with who I am as
a person and and like a placethat I feel so comfortable.
Um, so yeah, like it it justmade sense for me to stay.
Like, not only for like mytraining setup, um, yeah, like
the environment.
I don't think it gets muchbetter than this.

(16:26):
I think I I appreciate like Ithink I respond well to training
at altitude and like thisaltitude specifically.
I'm a C-level person.
So I think training much higherthan this consistently would be
hard for me.
Um so I think yeah, it's it's agood fit in many ways.

SPEAKER_00 (16:44):
Very cool.
Uh so we gotta, I gotta, I gottabring this up and we'll kind of
bridge the gap now to to thetrails.
It's funny, you came on my radarthis past year when you won
Twisted Fork, uh, the 15K.
I think if I'm not mistaken, Ithink it was David Roche, uh,
your coach that put something upon Instagram, uh, singing your
praises and just telling theworld to absolutely watch out.

(17:05):
And that obviously put you on myradar and of course a lot of
others, which was pretty cool.
Um, how did you find the trails?
Like, what made you say, like,all right, this this trail thing
looks kind of neat?
Was it a friend that said maybetry this out?
Or like, how did you find it?

SPEAKER_01 (17:21):
Yeah, I mean, obviously, I live in a great
place to like be on the trails.
Um, and actually, like goingback to high school, I wouldn't
say Georgia has like a crazyamount of trails, but I think
the most joy and excitement Iever found in running initially
was just like running throughthe woods.
Um, so like I I'd always beensomeone who would gravitate

(17:43):
towards training on the trailswhen I could.
Um so it wasn't anything likesuper out of the ordinary in
terms of getting curious aboutactually trail racing and like
understanding my potentialthere.
Um, my husband has been racingtrails kind of longer stuff um
since he moved out here in 2018.
So I think when I met him, likejust being a little bit closer

(18:06):
to that world initially wasreally exciting.
Um, obviously just doing alittle bit more on the trails,
like just running together withhim.
Um, but then going to my firsttrail races to support him, like
my mind was just blown,obviously, by just I don't know,
the community, the excitement.
It's just like such a fun facetof the the like of the running

(18:28):
world that I wasn't reallyfamiliar with.
Um, and I'm like such a runningnerd, such a fan of the sport in
general.
Like it's not, it's not hard forme to want to jump in and follow
another part of our sport.
So um that's probably where Iinitially got um just a lot more
exposure than I had previously.
And then um, yeah, I would say2023, I had pretty major hip

(18:53):
surgery.
And coming out of that, likeprior to that, I had said for a
while, like I kind of want tohave my road career and then
start dabbling on the trails,but maybe keep them separate.
Um, and coming out of that, Ikind of started to realize like
I don't need to do it in thatorder.
And I don't know, I think likewhen injuries start to eat away
at your time in the sport, likeyou start to think about what

(19:14):
matters to you more and likewhat you're more excited about.
Um, and so I was like, I kind ofwant to get more into trails
like sooner rather than later.
Um, and that's when David, mycoach, like came onto my radar
because I knew he had coached umplenty of athletes who had sort
of road trap trail ambitions.
Um, and like starting tounderstand that you could mix

(19:36):
them together.
Um, and kind of on top of thefact that I I had already kind
of been experimenting with liketraining a little bit more on
the trails um while competing onthe roads, just for like from a
health perspective, I thought itworked better for me.
Um, so yeah, around that time iswhen I started to think I I
think I want to like trysomething on the trails.

(19:56):
Um so yeah, going going into2024.
Um, like that's when I was like,when I'm healthy, I think I want
to put a trail race on mycalendar.
And it took me till um the endof that year to be able to do
that.
And it was still kind of astretch.
Like I was barely getting myfeet under me.
Um, but I that's the first trailrace I did was Moab, um, the

(20:17):
trail half 2024.
Um, and I had been there theyear before in 23 supporting my
husband running, and just beingthere, I was like, oh, like I
want to do this next year, likeI want to find a way to be here.
Um, so that was really cool.
Just like showing up.
I hadn't raced in like over twoyears.
Um, but it being a trail race,something I'd really never done

(20:41):
before, it kind of removed anyexpectation or like fear.
It was like, okay, like I don'teven know what to be afraid of.
So see what happens.

SPEAKER_00 (20:50):
Wanna backtrack a little bit?
Dude, hips are the worst.
I've had hip pain, hip hipissues in the past.
I feel like I I literally justhad a PT on to talk about hip
issues because I've had so manypodcasts that like have hip
problems that it's like aconstant conversation.
If you don't mind me asking,like would you would you mind
talking about like did you teara labrum?
Like, what did you do to your uhto the hip?

SPEAKER_01 (21:13):
Yes, I um yeah, I kind of like destroyed my labrum
and tried to run through it, runaround it, stave it off with
strength training for years.
Um and that's the crazy thingabout the hip labrum is you can
in many cases like work throughit until you can't.
Um yeah, that was my issue thatI finally got fixed in 2023.

(21:36):
Um, and then I've I followingthat dealt with for another
year, like unrelated, sort ofrelated pelvic issues.
So hip and pelvis, I've beenthrough it.
So I get it.

SPEAKER_00 (21:49):
But I mean, that's amazing that you're able that
you've been able to recover fromthat.
Because I mean, for a lot ofathletes, like sometimes that's
a career render.
Like if you can't get thatfigured out, like a lot of
people cannot come back fromthat.
So the fact that you've beenable to uh it kind of speaks
volumes.
That's amazing.

SPEAKER_01 (22:04):
Yeah, yeah.
I it's funny when yeah, I thinkback to like certain
conversations with doctors andthey're like, you know, running
just really hard on your hips.
Like, okay.
But yeah, I think I don't know.
I think if you're willing to dothe work, and I think there's so
many tools and and so much youcan do in the weight room and
with rehab and stuff, like Ithink I try to come back to the

(22:27):
fact that I really believe likeour bodies are so strong and
capable, and it's so exciting tolike see what you can do when
you're supporting your body likeproperly.
So yeah, lots of lots of rehab,lots of strength, but yeah,
durability, it's crazy.

SPEAKER_00 (22:43):
Like once I started like getting obsessed with like
I you know what I did, I stoppedpaying attention to like what
runners were doing, and Istarted paying attention to what
like kickboxers and like MuayThai, because they have so cool
flexion and they have so muchinternal and external rotation
in their hips.
And I just realized that likeother runners at a high level
they're so stiff in the hips,they don't have a lot of like
very side-to-side lateralmovement.

(23:05):
Um, and once I kind of figuredthat out, I was like, huh.
Like that's a that's a gamechanger because yeah, it's uh
it's the hip thing.
Yeah, I could do a whole podcaston it.
I have, I'll do another oneprobably.

SPEAKER_01 (23:16):
I like that.
I'll have to yeah, I'll have tolook into that.
That's interesting.

SPEAKER_00 (23:20):
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
It's hip strength is key.
Um moving on.
All right, so second place atthe Moab uh trail half in 2024.
You come back this year, youbecome the champion, you are
also the 50k champion.
Um you won Twisted Fork.
The only race that you I feellike you gotta get back
something on is Broken Arrow atthis point.

(23:41):
Like what uh what's the plan for2026?
I saw you signed up for the 23K.
What uh what else do you yeah,yeah.

SPEAKER_01 (23:50):
I actually really wanted to run the 23k last year
and I couldn't get in, um, whichis fair.
Like I didn't really have muchof a resume, so I'm really
excited to do that this year.
Um I don't have my calendarfully planned out, um, but I
think, yeah, I definitely havesome ideas about where I want to
start.
I'm looking at both Big Alta andGorge, like the 30-ish K

(24:13):
distance, which for me is likethat distance is kind of what
I'm most excited about.
And I really haven't raced thatdistance.
Like I've raced under that, andthen obviously the 50k.
Um, but I'm kind of mostintrigued by like two the two to
three hour like pocket ofracing.
Um, it just hasn't beensomething I've actually been
able to find yet.
So um yeah, I'm really I'mreally excited about doing more

(24:37):
of that.
And then I'm kind of standing byfor Golden Trail to release
their schedule.
Definitely interested in gettinginvolved with that series.
Um so yeah, I think that likeall of that should paint a
pretty good picture for theyear.
We'll see.
Um yeah, I'm getting excited.

SPEAKER_00 (24:56):
I like that.
Is there anyway?
I think the thing in Boulder toois there's so many athletes that
run the Golden Trail races thatthere's like endless people to,
if you want to train withpeople, there's endless people
to train with and talk to.
And I don't know, it's like areally cool community of the
folks that like Lauren Gregoryand all them that go over and
race those races.
So that's super cool.
Um yeah, I'm excited.

(25:16):
I like to hear, I love hearingthat Golden Trail is is possibly
on the calendar for this year.
I I want to know what's gonna beon their US calendar.
I think everybody does at thispoint.

SPEAKER_01 (25:25):
I know.
I would love if it was tworaces.
That would be great.

SPEAKER_00 (25:29):
I don't know.
I don't even know what's gonnabe one at this point.
It's uh from what I've heard.
We shall see.
We shall see.
Maybe uh Greg Vallea pull rapidout of his hat.
Um, but I don't want to glossover what you did in 2025.
I really want to go into that.
Like 50k national champion um orUSATF champ.
What inspired you to go to thatrace?
Like I think I think a lot ofathletes, especially coming from

(25:50):
the collegiate scene.
I know Adam Peterman was big onthis, another CU athlete.
Um, athletes go and they theywant to do the USATF stuff.
Um, what what inspired you tokind of do those races and kind
of mix it up there?

SPEAKER_01 (26:04):
Yeah, so kind of a couple things.
So 2025 for me was really likethe most important thing for me
was having a full year of healthand consistency, um, which then
allowed me to have like a fullseason.
But that being said, like I itwasn't like I was able to sit
down at really the beginning ofthe year and even build out a
full season because I wasn'tsure what that was gonna look

(26:24):
like.
And I was pretty sure I wasn'tgonna be able to travel
internationally to race.
Um, kind of just made thatdecision early with like
logistics, like not havingsupport from a sponsor or
anything and work and stuff.
So I was like, okay, like gonnakeep it domestic.
Um, and that kind of reallynarrows your opportunities, like
for highly competitive races,um, depending on like schedules

(26:47):
and stuff.
Like you can certainly puttogether a really high-level
calendar, but um just kind ofthe way things shook out, I
found myself like not having asmany opportunities as I wanted.
Um I I was originally planningon racing Sunope and I I missed
that just um coming off of likea super small thing that popped

(27:08):
up in the spring for me.
I like got back to running maybea week after I would have been
ready for that.
And so I said, let's not forceit.
Um so that's why I put twistedfork on my calendar was a great
way to open up.
Um pretty easy place to travelto for me.
Um, and then yeah, like didn'tquite get to do what I wanted to
at Broken Arrow.

(27:28):
Um, so then I was like, mycalendar was wide open for the
summer, and I was like, well,everyone's in Europe.
Like I don't know what myoptions are.
Um and so David put the 50K onmy on my radar.
Um, him and his wife Megan,obviously really familiar with
that race, um, with that courseand those trails.
And I was like, I do not want torun a 50k.

(27:49):
It's like I'm not, I know.
I was like, I'm not quiteinterested in that distance yet.
Like, I'm like, there's so muchmore I want to do before that.
Um, yeah.
So I was like, I I don't reallyknow if I'm like, I think I just
said no initially.
And he was like, he's like, Ithink you would like love these
trails.
I think you do really well onlike the profile of this course.

(28:10):
So like no pressure, but like ifyou're curious, like let's think
about it.
And so I thought about it and Iwas like, ah, okay, like maybe
I'll just do it.
And also just the fact that it'sI mean, there's pretty decent
verb, but it's so rentable thatit's you're looking at like a
four-ish hour 50k, not like asix, seven hour 50k.
So I was like, okay, I think Iam like down to see if I want to

(28:32):
do that.
Um, so yeah, I I went into itlike I don't know, like not like
I I was excited about where myfitness was at.
I was excited about how trainingwas got had gone, but I was
like, I don't know what thismeans over 50k because I don't
even know what a 50k is supposedto look like.
Um but yeah, I think it being aUSATF national race also like to

(28:55):
me, I'm like, that's gonnaguarantee there's at least like
some people there, right?
Especially that time in thesummer when other people are
traveling to Europe.
I'm like, at least we're gonnaget some people there, make it
worth the trip.
So um, yeah, I think that wasanother reason why I was like,
okay, like let's let's give it atry.
Um, and he was right about thetrails.
I loved them.
I was like, this is insane.

SPEAKER_00 (29:16):
So that area, that area is beautiful.
And I think it's it was, youknow, I don't know, I just like
looking back on your calendar, Ithink you made some really good
decisions as far as like forinstance, like Twisted Fork,
yes, it's a smaller race.
Yes, it was the first year forFinn running it, but there were
for winning that race, I think alot of people got to know who
you were because they put thaton on social media.
There was a lot of discussionaround it, and uh that's when

(29:38):
you know David started bringingstuff up in the media, which it
like I said, it just kind of putyour name on the map a little
bit more for uh not just brands,but just for folks in the sport
to learn who you were.
Um, and then obviously, youknow, the USATF 50K race,
winning that is you know big forname recognition as well.
So I think you you made somereally good decisions.
I gotta ask about Broken Arrow.

(29:59):
What did you think of theascent?
Because that's such a that was arough day for people.
First of all, it was cut short.
Yeah.
Uh it's already a strange racebecause I don't know, I feel
like of all the VK courses, notthat there are many in a in the
United States, that one is veryrunnable.
I mean, entirely runnable.
There's not a lot of hiking, ifanything.
But then when you cut it down toso short, it's it's a totally

(30:20):
different race.

SPEAKER_01 (30:22):
Yeah, I know.
I'm like, I still like don'tknow if I know what to think of
that.
I um yeah, I was pretty bummedwhen they cut it short, just
mainly because I think I don'tknow, for me, like I feel like
I've been training for longerefforts even than a full VK, but
like going down to like a30-minute race, I was like, ooh,
I'm I don't know that I'm likesuper VO2 fit necessarily at the

(30:43):
moment.
Um but I like it being runnablewas something I was more excited
about.
Um and and I was like superintrigued by just uphill racing
in general.
Um so yeah, I definitely likethe way I would describe it is I
feel like I got smacked in theface.
Like I was like, I don't know.
Like I I felt like I got outlike up that crazy ski hill,

(31:05):
like fine.
Like I was like, I think I didwhat I wanted to do up this
hill, like I didn't go crazy.
I I didn't have a very goodsense of where I was in the
women's field.
Like I didn't anticipate notbeing able to understand with
like just it being a mass start.
Like, because I think I thoughtI was further back than I
initially was.
I think I was like probablywhere I wanted to be, and then I
just had no idea what was goingon.
Um, and then I like by the timeit funneled at some point, I was

(31:29):
like stuck behind some guy withpoles, like trying to understand
if it made sense for me to,yeah, I'll like pass him, but
then just be behind like 20other people.
I was like, what's happening?
So I don't know, like it was itfelt like an out-of-body
experience is how I woulddescribe it.
Um, but then I finished and Iwas like, gosh, like my only

(31:49):
thought is that I want to likego figure out how to do that
better.
Like I just want to go down.
I feel like by the time you rundown, you're kind of recovered.
I'm like, I just want to do thatagain.
Like I just feel like I want tofigure out how to do that
better.
Um so yeah, I don't know.
And I was like, gosh, likehaving that experience with the
VK and like not being able tolike turn around and run the 23k
and like find a way to like havea better day there was like kind

(32:13):
of frustrating.
I I thought about stickingaround because I had heard there
were like last minute bibs theygive you if you show up the
morning of.
But I heard people showed up atlike 2 a.m.
And I was like, I don't, I don'tknow if I'm gonna be ready to
like rip up all night trying toget a bib.
Um, so yeah, I don't know.
Like I'm it was incredible to bethere.

(32:34):
I don't regret going.
And I like especially missingCenep, I was like, it's a world
year.
Like I want to give myself achance to like go be in this
race competing, um, even if it'snot the discipline I I felt the
strongest at the moment.
Um and like Broken Arrow wasamazing.
Like just being there, likebeing what like seeing so many
people and um being around it,it was like I'm glad I got to

(32:58):
experience that um before thisyear.
I got like going and getting torace what I actually want to
race this year.
Um so yeah, that being said, I'mnot signed up for the VK this
year.
Um, maybe I'm a littletraumatized, but I uh I want to
do it again, but I'm I'm kind ofmy mindset's more like I want to
flesh out the rest of my seasonbefore I decide if it makes

(33:18):
sense to try and double.
Um, and I think 23k is moreintriguing to me.
So we'll see.

SPEAKER_00 (33:25):
Well, it's the I mean, I feel like broken arrow
is probably for short trail atthis point.
It's the event in North Americanow, especially with like the
prize money and stuff floatingaround and like the support.
It's like really cementeditself.
So though, I mean, I thinkthere's there's always gonna be
options to jump into the VK.
I don't think that would be anissue.
The one thing I was gonna say islike that's one of the courses.
I don't know, like I've been onI've seen most of the VK courses

(33:47):
in North America now, and Ithink I don't know, like that
one, in my opinion, requires themost strategy just because of
the absolutely insane massstart.
And it's like you're on thatscheme that's got like plants on
it and shit, and it's like,well, what do I do with this?
And yeah, it's uh I feel likethe right don't check out the
Right VK too.
I think that's a in my opinion,that's a better VK course, but

(34:10):
you know, they're they all havetheir gems, they're all there's
all different ones, andhopefully we get more in North
America, which makes it, youknow, a little more fun.

SPEAKER_01 (34:17):
Yeah, yeah, I know.
I'm I think that was part of it.
Like I I maybe didn't expect,like I feel like David and I had
chatted through some strategy.
When you when you get out there,it's like I didn't even I don't
know, like it happened so fast,maybe because I hadn't raced
something that short in so long.
But I was like, wow, I want tofigure that out.
Like there's there's a lot tofigure out there.
So but I'm I'm also like I wantto race the full the full

(34:39):
distance, you know, and have alittle bit longer to figure it
out.

SPEAKER_00 (34:43):
So not to try and convince you or sell you or
anything, but you are a 50kchampion, a half marathon
champion for USATF.
The only thing you're not is thenot running champion.
So I feel like you is there achance Sunopee happens this
year?
I feel like that you might haveto put that one on the calendar.
That that could be, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 (35:01):
That's yeah.
I I am like I saw the photosfrom that race and I was like,
oh, it looks so sloppy and fun.
Um so yeah, I I did see thatthat's that's like the US champ.
So I am I am curious.
I think again, I want to liketake a look at my schedule as a
whole, especially just with likeI want to be cognizant of
travel, like because I I havenot raced internationally

(35:23):
before.
Um, so I even like just flyingacross the country like that, I
just want to be like selectiveabout travel, but it's on my
radar.
Like I'm I was bummed to miss itlast year.
It looks so fun.
So I'm curious.

SPEAKER_00 (35:37):
In the scope of the sport, like what gets you
excited?
Like, have you seen?
I know you mentioned uh GoldenTrail.
I'm sure you've seen like someof the YouTube videos on like
series and all and Zagama andraces abroad and stuff like
that, or even outside of uhGolden Trail, like OCC, it seems
to be that that people getfunnel that direction too.
Any of those things, like notfor this year necessarily, but

(35:57):
just in general to get youexcited?

SPEAKER_01 (36:00):
Yeah, all of the above.
All of the above.
I think um, yeah, I think I'mit's hard to like pace out like
when I want to do things.
I'm trying to be like measuredabout it.
I feel like my husband Bobby'slike been really um helpful,
like counsel just around is likeI've seen people get into the
sport and like try like kind ofgo too hard too soon and like

(36:22):
try to do it all too quickly.
And so I've tried to be, andDavid's been really good about
that too.
Like, you know, we have time,like we're playing the long
game, um trying to be likemeasured about what I feel like
I'm ready for, and but I'm likeexcited about it all.
I think something like obviouslylike UTMB week, it's like how
can you not want to be a part ofthat?
Um, I think, yeah, like for mein the next few years, I'm

(36:44):
excited about like 50k and underdistance.
Like I really I think it's suchan exciting pocket of our sport,
and I I love that it's startingto get more recognition.
Um, and I think I'm just likeunderstanding it myself.
So yeah, there's like a lot Iwant to do in that space.
Um and yeah, some of the bigger,like iconic rate like golden

(37:04):
trail races I'm I'm superintrigued by.
Um something like OCC, like Idon't see myself like I think
I'd maybe feel ready for that inthe next couple years, but even
this year I don't.
Like I I wanna wait till I'mlike really excited about trying
to race for five to six hours,you know.
Um, and I think I'm stillfinding my footing like in the

(37:25):
two to three, maybe four hourdistances.
So yeah, I don't know.
I think it's like I'm excitedabout all of it, but I'm also
I'm also just excited about likeracing internationally for the
first time, like puttingtogether a strategic season like
that, um, kind of coming off oflast year, just having a season
in general was new for me afterso many years of like up and

(37:47):
downs.
So trying to be patient.

SPEAKER_00 (37:50):
I respect that.
I actually really appreciatethat because your husband makes
a really good point.
I mean, when you get into thesport, especially for someone
like you having a meet almostimmediate success at pretty much
everything you touch, it's likeI want to do it all.
Like, how can I get my name onevery start list?
And I think it's reallyimportant to take a step back
and be like, all right, what'sgonna be the best thing, not
just for my health and for mysanity and my pocketbook,

(38:12):
because it I don't think peoplerealize it's like how I think a
lot of normal like athletes dolike realize just how expensive
it is to get from point A topoint B for all these different
races.
So I think it's a really uh Ithink it's a respectable thing
to kind of take a step back andbe like, all right, like what's
gonna be the best fit for me?
And the thing is too, like, Idon't know, like if like for
instance, like Golden Trail andstuff like that, you have one

(38:32):
successful race at Golden Trailthat goes pretty well, then I
know they're really good aboutfinding like necessarily not
necessarily new talent, butathletes that have that success,
then inviting you to the nextrace and then to the next race.
And it kind of helps open doorsand things like that.
So that's one thing that's goodas far as the opportunities go,
uh both internationally and anduh in the United States as well.

(38:55):
So yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Um all right, I want to pivot alittle bit.
I can ask you.
So you're coached by David.
Pretty much every person I haveon this podcast is coached by
David.
I feel like that he's a madgenius, and Megan as well.
They're just so good at whatthey do as far as coaches go.
Yeah.
Talk about that.
Talk about how um, you know,obviously that's a different

(39:18):
world than being on the trailscoming from the road and coming
from your backgroundcollegiately.
Talk about how that's kind oflike changed your training and
maybe talk about like yourapproach to training.
Like, are you more heartrate-based now?
Are you time-based?
Like, what does your traininglook like?

SPEAKER_01 (39:32):
Yeah.
Um, yeah, it's been a reallylike fun experiment transition
for me.
Like, I like I said, I workedwith my college coaches coming
out of school.
And like I I really I mean, Idecided to stay with them
because I really liked theirtraining.
And but it was like a very likesort of similar structure that

(39:53):
I've been in for at that point,like so many years.
So like pivoting to somethingnew was like very exciting, but
like Like I think you just likeit takes a little while to like
find confidence in that.
Um and and like some big thingsfor me, like taking a rest day
every week was like such a crazything for me at the time.
And I was like, I I don't knowabout that, or like but like I

(40:15):
can cross-train, right?
And it's like, no, let's reallylean into like a full rest day,
and that's been like sogame-changing for me.
Um, and I think like before Istarted working with David, like
as I was dealing with a lot ofinjuries, like I tried to really
like shift my mindset aroundtraining and like decision
making to like health above allelse.
Because if you're healthy,you're consistent.

(40:36):
If you're consistent, you'relike fitness is gonna come.
Like it's undeniable.
Um, and I think like having thatmindset and then seeing like the
way David approaches training islike just makes me like double
down on that.
Like it's I don't know, like itjust feels like we're we're like
very strategic with it.

(40:57):
Um but like it's always sort oflike let's let's be cautious,
let's be yeah, just justthinking about health first.
And that doesn't mean like thetraining's not like hard when
it's hard and fun andinteresting, but like I just
feel like the word I would giveit is like very sustainable.
And I just feel like I I thinklike I've probably been doing

(41:19):
this past like year or so, likein in a way, like more volume
than I've ever done in a shorterperiod of time, like taking rest
days, but like I've been feelinglike it's been more sustainable
than any training I've everdone.
Whereas in the past, I may havefelt like, okay, I'm doing good
training, but I'm like barelyable to string together how many
however many number of weeks.

(41:40):
Um so yeah, I think I don'tknow, I think David and Megan
are both like very likestrategic and individual about
how they kind of approachtraining, but I think we've
found um what works well for me.
And I think it's been reallyfun.
Like, this is my first timebeing like an athlete who's
primarily racing on the trails,but like I come from a track and

(42:02):
roads background and I lovebeing on the track still.
I love working out on the roadstill.
Um, but as someone new totrails, like I also needed to
spend some time learning how torun fast on the trails.
So like this summer felt like avery fun experiment of like when
it made sense to do my harderefforts on the track, on the
roads, on the trails.
Um, and that was like I feltlike it was kind of an

(42:26):
experiment that ended in likefinding a really good balance
and drawing some confidence fromyeah, like what we landed on.
So yeah, it's it's been like aninteresting kind of evolution, I
think, since we started workingtogether like two over two years
ago.
Um, but yeah, I I feel goodabout where we're at and it's
exciting.

SPEAKER_00 (42:47):
I love that.
It are is your training more onfeel, like perceived exertion?
Is it more heart rate based?
I've been a lot of people havebeen asking like me to ask these
questions, and it actually hasme intrigued uh as far as like
audience goes, because I'm a bigheart rate guy.
Like I do most of my trainingbased on heart rates and like
sticking with those in thosezones.
That's what my coach has me do.
Um, but I know David doesdifferent things with different

(43:08):
people sometimes.
So like what is it for youspecifically?

SPEAKER_01 (43:12):
Yeah, it's less like I would say I do use heart rate
more than I've ever used it, butI would say that's only because
I now have like a metric that Itrust.
I have like the corrosar band,which um I don't know, I never
really liked a heart rate strapprior to that.
And I think like wrist-basedheart rate can be pretty all
over the place.
So um having a tool that I nowbelieve is accurate, like I

(43:35):
probably use it more than I everhave, but I don't like I'm not
necessarily given generally likepaces or anything matched with
heart rate.
It's like I'm more looking at itafter the fact or kind of maybe
judging while I'm doingsomething more threshold just to
make sure I'm like in the zoneI'm trying to be in.
Um I do use it like a lot whenI'm cross-training.
I think heart rate is likepretty much filimetric.

(43:58):
I mean, besides perceivedeffort, pretty much filimetric
you have when you'recross-training.
And I think I mean, I like usedto cross-train a lot in college.
Um, and I feel like I've gottena lot more strategic with my
cross-training now.
And I think a lot of that isbecause I have a tool like heart
rate.
Um, so yeah, I use it some.
I think it's a really good tool,but it kind of depends on like,

(44:20):
yeah, probably anywhere betweenlike perceived effort or hitting
certain paces, depending on likethe terrain, time of year,
intensity of the workout.

SPEAKER_00 (44:29):
Um, for cross-training.
Are you grabbing more gravelcycling?
Like what are you skiing?
Like, what are you into?

SPEAKER_01 (44:38):
Uh I'm not a skier yet.
Um I've lived here for over 10years.
I'm not a skier yet, but um,it's uh it's on my radar.
I'm I think it'd be a really funoption to have, but it's kind of
I was talking to my friend aboutthis.
It's kind of a hard thing tolike break into uh when you
don't have the setup or theexperience.

SPEAKER_00 (44:55):
Boulder schemo, check out uh my buddy Davide.
He's got uh his whole BoulderSchemo set up.
So there's the infrastructure.
If there's any place where theinfrastructure's in place,
they've got to figure it out inBoulder.
So check out the boulder.
Okay, okay.
It's the thing to do.
Okay, and they're all they'reall like high-level athletes, so
it's fun.
Like they they know what they'redoing.

SPEAKER_01 (45:14):
Yeah, I I would love because I'm um gosh, I love the
snow, but I uh my body does notalways love the snow.
So I'm like very careful andselective about how much snow
running I do.
So it's it'd be really nice tolike not have to just hop on the
treadmill and have like anoption to ski in the winter.
Um, but yeah, cross training.
I'm I'm traditionally kind of anindoor cross training girly.

(45:37):
I kind of love to just, youknow, get it done indoors.
I do have a gravel bike, and Ithat was um a post-hip surgery
um endeavor for me.
And that like opened my eyes tothe fact that cycling is so fun
and crash training doesn't haveto be terrible all the time.
Um but I'm I'm I don't know,like I'm not someone who loves

(45:58):
to like descend very fast on thebike, I will say.
Like, I don't know, there'ssomething about like throwing
myself, yeah, like throwingmyself down a mountain on my own
two feet.
I'm like fine.
Like if I fall, I'm like notthat far from the ground.
But yeah, like here in Boulder,like there's there's like one
descent that is kind of like Ican get a good climb up to
Jamestown and I can descend backdown and like I feel comfortable

(46:21):
doing that.
But like there's so many otherlike bigger, more fun, epic
rides that I just like can't dobecause I just like can't do the
descent.
I just like won't do it.
So um I do I love to cycleoutside, but I also we have a
Zwift bike, which is really,really nice for indoor riding.
Um, and I also kind of thinklike depending on time, like
kind of like you get a littlemore bang for your buck inside.

(46:43):
Like if you're gonna go twohours inside, it's gonna be
maybe the equivalent to likethree plus hours outside,
depending on your effort levellevel.
Um I am a psycho who loves theelliptical.
Like I really can spend a couplehours on the elliptical and I
have a great time.

SPEAKER_00 (47:00):
Um amazing.
I just found I had one inFlorida and I would, yeah, I it
was amazing.
It's the greatest thing ever.
I think I might actually getone.
Yeah.
Stair step or two.
Those are sick.

SPEAKER_01 (47:10):
The stairs are also, and I feel like um, yeah, I
think there's like more trailspecificity to be gained on the
stairs too.
Like I love adding that in acouple times a week.
So yeah, I think if you have, Idon't know, some good music,
some good podcasts, like you youcan spend great time indoors
frustrating.

SPEAKER_00 (47:30):
So yeah, yeah.
I and I I yeah, and I feel likein Colorado, I mean, granted,
this year it's been kind ofunusually warm, but like, and we
have got like no snow.
Yeah, but still, uh, I mean, foras far as like year-round
running, it's been amazing, butuh as far as everything else,
not so good, but not good.

unknown (47:49):
Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 (47:49):
But uh yeah, especially you guys.
I feel like you guys have hadlike more fire skills like I'm
down in Colorado Springs andlike we haven't really had any
like okay, yeah.
But you guys have had a ton,it's been kind of crazy.
No bueno.

SPEAKER_01 (48:00):
I know.
Well, it's been yeah, if it'snot a hundred mile an hour
winds, it's fifty.
It's like I don't know, it'skind of nice, but I'm also like,
oh, I don't this is not good onyeah, it's not good.

SPEAKER_00 (48:11):
So weird.
Yeah, yeah.
I yeah, hopefully we get somesnow putting putting that out in
the universe.
Um want to shift gears a littlebit and talk to you about uh
free agency and I guess goalsfor like with your career and
stuff like that.
Like you've had so much successjust in one year giving this a
go.
Like the world is kind of atyour fingertips as far as what
you do going forward.
What do you want to do?

(48:31):
Like as far as like goals thatyou have in front of you, or is
it more so not necessarily goalsand just to have fun with it?
Like, how do you approach that?

SPEAKER_01 (48:40):
Yeah, I think this has been an interesting year in
a lot of ways.
I um up until the summer, I waslike since I graduated college,
like working full-time,balancing running goals with uh
work and life.
Um and yeah, like I think Imentioned this earlier, but I I
feel like I just have likeendless excitement about the

(49:04):
sport and my potential in thesport.
And I I kind of fear that I'msomeone who will be like 50
before I'm ready to say, maybeI'm not competitive anymore.
Like I just I don't I don'tthink I'm someone who will ever
get bored or run out of thingsto be excited about and like
belief in yeah, what where I cango in the sport.

(49:24):
So um, but for me this year hasbeen a shift towards like um
leave, like I left my full-timejob over the summer, um, and
kind of said like I want tospend some time like putting my
full focus on training andracing.
Um and kind of that going welland and like starting to see

(49:48):
like where I could go in thesport, like making me realize
like I I do want to pursue thisfull time if I can.
Um, or at least like I thinkjust the shift towards like this
being my first priority insteadof something that I'm juggling
or figuring out or not willingto give up, but maybe it not
being the thing that I can putmy full resources towards.

(50:08):
So yeah, I think it's been ayear of like kind of recognizing
and like I I think especially assomeone who's had a lot of like
setbacks and injuries, like itit starts to feel like you don't
have like you don't get to saythat, you don't get to want that
um when you've been so far fromthat potential before.
But I kind of feel like this hasbeen like a bit of a

(50:29):
resurrection of like that beliefin myself.
And um yeah, it's like why not?
Like I I that's what I want, youknow, and it's like why there
are so many reasons to tellyourself why you can't have it,
but it's like I'm in a place nowwhere I'm like I want to go for
it.
Um yeah, I want to like figureout how to make it the thing
that I'm able to focus on.

(50:50):
So um yeah, obviously, like I'mstarting to think about like
specific race goals for nextyear, but I think more than
that, it's like I want tocontinue to take steps to making
this like the kind of center ofmy career in like the best way
that I can.
So yeah, kind of kind of vague,but that's what I'm thinking.

SPEAKER_00 (51:09):
I was gonna maybe, and you don't have to answer
this or I can cut it out.
Um, have you started having anyconversations with any brands
yet?
I know we're gonna be doing anepisode on free agency soon.
So trying to jump the gun onthat and uh get some notes for
my free agency episode.

SPEAKER_01 (51:22):
Yeah.
Well, I I like the um I like theterm free agency.
It makes me feel like a footballplayer.
Um But yes, I am um I'm workingwith an agent and and having
some conversations.
Um yeah, so yeah, the door isopen there, which has been
great.
Um obviously, like, yeah, it'sit's obviously like a a process,

(51:42):
um, but trying to take somesteps in that direction and see
where it can go.

SPEAKER_00 (51:47):
So sweet, sweet.
Now keep it vague.
That's fine.
No big deal.
We'll exp we'll we'll we'll bewaiting for the announcement
soon.
No, I'm um that's super excitingand uh very excited to hear uh
what the next steps are and uhkind of what the plans are for
2026.
So um what do you think of thesport so far?
Are you uh like do you like thedirection it's going in?
I mean, it seems like these daysthere's a lot of people that

(52:09):
want it in the Olympics, whichit's all schemo, get in the
Olympics that'll be in theOlympics in the next month.
Um obviously we had worlds thisyear that seem to be on the
biggest stage that's ever been.
And then you've got the UTMBsituation.
Like, are you excited with thislike level of
professionalization?
It seems like, or do youobviously it's gonna transform
even more over the next fewyears and get kind of crazy,

(52:30):
even crazier than what we seenow?
Like, what do you think so far?

SPEAKER_01 (52:34):
Yeah, I mean, kind of going back to the fact that
like I I am a self-proclaimed,like huge fan of the sport, huge
running nerd.
Um, like I will consume any anycoverage.
Like I I love so like seeing allof it evolve on the trail side
is really exciting to me.
And like, yeah, discussions ofof trail running going towards

(52:54):
the Olympics, like coming from aroad and track background.
I'm like, hell yeah, that'sgreat.
Like, let's let's do it.
Um, so yeah, I think I'm stokedabout where it's at.
I like I mentioned I'm I'mexcited about I think kind of
the short trail sides gettingmore excitement behind it than
it's maybe had in the past,which is really cool.
I think my first impression oftrail running several years ago

(53:17):
was like, oh, that's like 100milers, like that's all it is.
Um, so yeah, like starting tolike see that more people are
excited about mountain runningand sub 50k stuff, and um seeing
the coverage for those eventslike kind of start to rival
stuff like UTMB or WesternStates, um that's nothing but

(53:37):
exciting to me.
So um yeah, I'm all for it.
I think obviously like asanything grows and there's like
more money coming into thesport, like obviously it's not
gonna be perfect.
Like there are gonna be somepotential issues, but um I think
I I think hopefully like theopportunities that come with it
outweigh the potential negativesides.

SPEAKER_00 (54:00):
Yeah.
Yeah, I think this is the timeto be in it too.
I mean, this is the time wherewe're kind of in that in-between
time where uh the growth isstarting to get exponential,
contracts are getting morevaluable than they've ever been,
so it's a good time to enter thesport.
Um and it's also getting morecompetitive.
Like the competition level fromjust this year going backwards
five years is insane how muchmore competitive it's gotten.

(54:22):
So that's what I'm reallylooking forward to is seeing the
competition continue to grow,more athletes like yourself from
these like high pedigree D1backgrounds coming in.
Um like it was really excitingto talk to McKenna Morley as
well, your former teammate.
And I've just had so many likeD1 athletes in the like in the
space kind of over the last fewmonths come on the pod to chat.
And it's like, wow, like shorttrail is going to be insane in

(54:46):
the next few years.
I mean, look at what ChristianAllen just did, like uh running
its CIM.
Like who would have thought amillion years that like a trail
runner is gonna go get on thepodium of CIM?
Sure shit.
Uh someone's able to do it.
And yeah, I just find it reallyinteresting.
So what do you um I don't know,just to like as a not just as a
fan, but like what do you thinkwe can do to grow the fan base?

(55:07):
Like uh just as uh as not justathletes in the sport, but as
just people in the sport, likewhat do you think needs to be
done for that fan base to torival ultra in a lot of ways?
Because I feel like we are soultra-centric, and that's not a
bad thing, that's awesome, but Ithink that we could just do a
better job in our little sportof like growing the fan base and
getting more and more peopleexcited about it.

SPEAKER_01 (55:29):
Yeah, maybe like maybe like more mass
participation.
I don't even want to sayopportunities, because it's like
I think I think the availabilityfor everyday runners to
participate in sub 50k liketrail races, like it's out
there, but I just don't feellike the mass popularity is
there.
I think when people think aboutI'm gonna do a trail race, they

(55:50):
like immediately think they haveto do an ultra.
Um so yeah, I think like I don'tknow, like I think about when I
was like first getting into thesport.
If I had like heard like, oh,you can go run a half marathon
on the trails, like what wouldthat have felt like, you know,
and like what how how would likeI don't know, like running a
half marathon on the trailsversus doing your like token
half marathon on the roads, likewhat would that be like?

(56:12):
Um, so yeah, I don't know.
I think that's maybe where likethe general population, like
understanding, like because thenI think then they're around like
the high-level athletes who arelike crushing those distances
and they're like, whoa, this islike mind blowing.
Like it's mind blowing forsomeone to run a fast hundred
miler, but it's also mindblowing for someone to like

(56:32):
destroy like a 30k trail racethat's like like in a quarter of
the time than they canunderstand, you know.
Like it's I don't know, I thinklike that's where I maybe see a
bit of a gap.
Um, and I'm not sure what thatwould look like, but yeah, like
if I if I had friends who werejust getting into sport, I would
be like, go run the Moab halfmarathon.

(56:53):
Like it's yeah, it's sick, likego see what it's about, you
know?

SPEAKER_00 (56:57):
Yeah, beautiful course too.
Yeah, I don't know.
I think the this the short trailis just presents such an easier
uh such an easier segue intointo the sport as opposed to
yeah, thinking that you have togo run a 50k and that's
automatically, you know, thatmakes you and it's great.
There's amazing 50ks out there,but I think as far as just
approachability, um the mass Iwas thinking about this today

(57:17):
because we had the the Rut uhthe Rut's a map like crazy mass
participation event.
It's like almost 5,000 people dothat race.
And I'm like thinking to myself,I'm like, all right, that's a
lot of people.
That's gotta be the secondbiggest trail race in North
America.
But I'm like, what is it aboutthat race?
Like, because they can't alljust be they're not all fans of
the sport.
They do it because you know, Ithink a lot of people get into

(57:38):
it just be from a communityperspective.
And I think that's what is Ithink as far as like just um
media in the space and a lot ofother things, like I think the
community is just such a slepton thing and just so important.
And uh yeah, I think that'swhere it starts, is in the
community and kind of trying togrow that.
It's interesting.
So it's gonna be fun to see likewhere that's I can't believe
they still had in 35 minutes.

(57:59):
5,000 people.
Did they really?
It's nuts.
Like, I'm like, wow, there'sthat many people in the sport,
like that excited about a racein the middle of nowhere in
Montana.
That is nuts.

SPEAKER_01 (58:09):
That's so sick.
That's so cool.

SPEAKER_00 (58:11):
So sports growing for sure.
Wow.
Yeah.
So well, I think this is a goodplace to stop.
I cannot wait to have moreconversations in the future uh
and chat more about uh 2026.
We'll obviously have a I'll bewe'll be talking about a
pre-broken arrow uh 23k uhinterview.
So that'll be fun.
We'll get to talk about then.
Um but yeah, wishing you thebest of luck and uh can't wait

(58:33):
to see where where things go,Taylor.
Appreciate it.

SPEAKER_01 (58:36):
Awesome.
Thanks for having me on.

SPEAKER_00 (58:37):
Yeah, thanks.
Cool.
All right, we're stopped.
Thank you so much.
I really appreciate it.
It was a great fun episode.
What'd you guys think?
Uh I really want to thank Taylorso much for coming on the show
and uh coming on for a chat.
It was a good discussion and uhexcited to learn.
I was super excited to get tolearn more about her and her
story.
Um, yeah, guys, I love like thisthese these are amazing

(58:59):
conversations.
It's always so fun.
Taylor's career is gonna takeher so many places, and uh, it's
just cool to get to have aconversation uh before um you
know her career starts to takeoff in the sport, and uh this
was a great one.
So many talented athletes comingto the sport from the D1 level.
It's absolutely bananas.
The sport is getting socompetitive.
Um guys, best way to supportTaylor is to give her a follow

(59:22):
on Instagram.
It's gonna be linked in the shownotes.
You can follow her at Taylorwith Lime.
Uh, you could just also type inat TaylorPV on Instagram and uh
you can give her a follow there.
I'm sure she'd love to hear whatyou guys think and uh would love
to hear more about the episode.
So uh guys, if you've beenenjoying this episode and uh if
you are invested in us for 2026,please give us a five star

(59:46):
rating and review if you haven'talready on Apple, Spotify,
YouTube, or wherever you consumeyour podcast.
We've got some fun sponsorannouncements coming down the
pipeline over the course of thenext couple of months, which I'm
super excited to share with youall.
Um I do want to Personally,thank Ultimate Direction so much
for sponsoring us in 2025.
Um they were it's kind of crazy.

(01:00:08):
They were my first runningsponsor and the first ones to
believe in me like three and ahalf years ago.
And so it's just very near anddear to my heart and uh super
want to appreciate, you know,super appreciate their support.
Um so definitely want to thankthem for all the support they'd
given us in 2025.
Uh looking forward to all thatwe're gonna accomplish this
year.
Supposed to be doing a state ofthe steep stuff episode, trying

(01:00:28):
to get my co-host, you know,figured out for that to have a
conversation about some of ourplans and what we're gonna be
doing for coverage.
We're gonna be in your face atraces in 2026, uh, Hint Hint
Broken Arrow, The Rut, andamongst many others, like the
Cirque series.
And we just got a lot of goodstuff coming down the pipeline
that I'm excited about.
We're gonna be we're gonna bebuilding a fan base in 2026, and

(01:00:50):
that's the goal.
So uh guys, thanks for believingin me, and thanks for believing
in the show, and uh more to comedown the pipeline.