Barr Trail Mountain Race Elite Panel

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The steep stuff podcast delivers a fascinating glimpse into the minds of elite mountain runners in this special episode featuring the Bar Trail Mountain Race Elite Night panel. Host James Loriello brings listeners directly into the pre-race conversation with six accomplished athletes preparing to tackle one of Colorado Springs' most iconic trail races.

The episode opens with crucial safety information from El Paso County Search and Rescue, highlighting the unique challenges of the course, including the infamous Big Boulder section where traffic jams are inevitable. Their practical advice serves as a sobering reminder that even elite athletes must respect the mountain.

What follows is an intimate discussion with panelists Melissa Rogers, Wendy Roberts, Amanda Kozlowski, Benjamin Townsend, John Aziz, and Dean Abel. Each athlete shares their distinct running journey – from those who competed in high school to others who discovered their talent decades later. Their stories prove that elite performance can emerge at any age when passion and dedication align.

Particularly moving is John Aziz's experience balancing new fatherhood with elite competition. Just three weeks after his daughter's birth, he's toeing the line against Colorado's best mountain runners. Meanwhile, Benjamin Townsend provides a global perspective as he recounts racing across multiple continents on the Skyrunner World Series circuit.

The conversation takes unexpected turns as athletes reveal their preferences between climbing and descending, their favorite races worldwide, and even their non-running hobbies – from hacky sack to dog parenting. When asked about motivation, their answers range from supportive partners to the simple joy of experiencing nature without a phone in hand.

Whether you're preparing to race Bar Trail yourself or simply curious about what drives elite mountain runners, this episode offers candid insights into the physical challenges, mental strategies, and personal connections that make trail running such a rewarding pursuit. The camaraderie among these competitors reminds us that even at the highest levels, the trail running community remains supportive, genuine, and grounded in shared passion.

Follow James on IG - @jameslauriello

Follow the Steep Stuff Podcast on IG - @steepstuff_pod

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
What's up, fam?
Welcome back to the steep stuffpodcast.
I'm your host, james Loriello,and I'm excited to bring you
guys a recording.
This is gonna be a liverecording of the bar trail
mountain race elite night thattook place this past Friday,
july was it the 18th?
The 18th time flies, with awhole panelist of elite athletes

(00:20):
that decided to show up andhave a conversation just ahead
of the bar trail mountain racethat took place today.
That would have been July the20th, 2025.
So I hope you guys enjoy thisone.
Thanks for tuning in, reallyappreciate your support and,
without further ado, the bartrail mountain race elite night.
Listen up, guys.
The steep stuff podcast isbrought to you by ultimate

(00:41):
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All right, guys, we're going toget started.
I'm going to introduce myself.

(01:45):
I'm James Lauriello, the hostof the steep stuff podcast, and
before we get started, I'm gonnaintroduce El Paso County search
and rescue.
I'm gonna call them up to comeand have a conversation with the
group all right, welcomeeverybody.

Speaker 3 (02:05):
So I am Ferg, short for Ferguson.
This is JT.
We're at the Boston CountySearch and Rescue.
Last year we basically justsaid big boulder weather and
kind of because you guys aren'there to listen to us, but last
weekend there was a death at theHard Rock 100, so we kind of
wanted to speak a little bitmore to safety and give a little

(02:27):
bit more due diligence to someof what you guys are going to
encounter on race day.
So, with that said, the otherchange is that last year JT
stood up here with me and didn'tspeak, so this year I'm making
him talk Got promoted.

Speaker 4 (02:42):
Hey guys, I'm going to go over two things here.
First is weather.
I think most of you have beenon the trail.
You know the weather's kind ofcrazy up there at times but it
looks pretty good for Sunday.
At the trailhead at the CobbRailway, 63 is the low.
When you're finishing up it'sgoing to be up in the lower 80s.
So be aware of that, it's goingto be pretty hot.
Up.

(03:05):
At Bark Camp, the high point,we're looking at 58 degrees for
the low and 70 for the high.
That sounds great.
As you know, if you run intoproblems and you start walking
other than running, that 58 canget cold pretty quick.
So just be prepared for thatsupposed to get heavy rain
moving in around noon.
Hopefully everyone's off themountain by then, so that should
be good.
And eight stations there's fiveof them.
Start, finish, they're gonnahave water and tailwind.
Top of the W's they're onlygoing to have water.

(03:25):
No Name Creek they'll havewater and tailwind.
Bob's Road water and tailwind,and then Bar Camp at the
turnaround.
We're just going to have waterup there.
Any questions?

Speaker 5 (03:39):
So which one of?

Speaker 3 (03:40):
those eight stations are you only going to pass once?
Which one of those aid stationsare you only going to pass once
?
There you go.
Very good, all right.
So we're Search and Rescue.
We are there for on-coursesafety and medical support.
So, just so you guys are aware,there are 20 to 30 people that
are going to be on that mountain.
Hopefully you don't see us andyou enjoy your race and you're

(04:02):
just like what that?
We're Search and Rescue on themountain, but you know we are
there, we are mobilized, likewhat there were search and
rescue on the mountain.
But you know we are there, weare mobilized.
We are ready for anything thatyou guys may encounter up there.
So the one thing that I wantedto speak to in particular with
us from a safety perspective isBig Boulder.
So last year we had a bouldermove down and really kind of
impede the traffic on Bar Trail.
It is going to get crowded,you're going to get delayed.
Unless you're maybe one ofthese people up here and you're

(04:25):
speeding, you get through reallyquick, but there's going to be
a traffic jam.
Please be patient, please be ingood spirits.
We will get you through thereas quickly and as safely as we
can.
So just wanted to mention thatas well.
And, in general, just from asafety perspective, one thing
that you know, when we're out onmissions and as we get more

(04:48):
people moved to the area, itjust strikes me that it's
incredible how many ultrarunners are just kind of out
there doing their thing, butthey just have a handheld and
they're wearing a singlet andshorts and they really don't
have much else with them.
So, again, when you're movingand you're generating body heat,
everything is good, but yousprain an ankle, something goes
wrong, um, all of a sudden itbecomes a really bad day, and

(05:09):
then you know myself and JT andthe rest of the team have to
come get you.
So a couple of things I justwanted to remind you guys of.
And the first thing it's supereasy Just tell someone where
you're going and when you'regoing to be back, and that in
and of itself will save you fromwhat otherwise is something
that they may make a movie outof 10 years from now.

(05:29):
Um phone just make sure youcharge up your phone, uh, before
you go out so that if somethingdoes happen, you can, you can
call, you can call for help, um,hydration, nutrition, um, I do
not come from the ultra or thetrail running world, I am more
of a track and road guy.
So you know, when I asked JTyou know you're going out for a
20-mile run, what do you takewith you?
He's like, I don't know, I justgrab, like some gummy worms and

(05:52):
I jam a ho-ho in my shorts andI got a handheld and I'm good to
go.
That's just not my world.
So just, you know, take intoconsideration that you're going
to be out there for a while.
Take, take the water, take thethe calories and the nutrition
that you need, um, and the otherthing that's super easy and
doesn't cost you anything isjust take a trash bag, a jacket,
something that you can juststuff in in case the weather
turns.

(06:12):
Which, for those of you thataren't local, hands up, how many
are not from Colorado?
How many of you are not local?
Okay, just one, okay.
So the rest of you I'm kind ofpreaching to the choir and you
guys already know this the localsaying wait 15 minutes if you
don't like the weather, and it'sgoing to change.
So anyway, yeah, that'sdefinitely a real thing.
So those are basically all thethings that we wanted to cover

(06:35):
from a safety perspective.
You guys have a great day outthere on Sunday.
Enjoy the race.
And sorry we were solong-winded, but wanted to make
sure we spoke to safety and gaveit its due.
So the race, and sorry we wereso long-winded, but wanted to
make sure we spoke to safety andgave it its due.

Speaker 1 (06:51):
So with that, we'll hand it over to the people that
you came here to listen to.
Thank you, guys, so much, allright guys before we get started
.
One of the things I love aboutthis race is there's some
history here.
So before we get started, we'regoing to do a little raffle
slash trivia that we're going toask the audience to get
involved with.
So, before we get started, we'regoing to do a little raffle
slash trivia that we're going toask the audience to get
involved with.
So the first question I havefor you is who founded this race

(07:12):
?
Who founded the BartrellMountain Race?
Matt Carpenter.

Speaker 2 (07:15):
All right, you win a prize.

Speaker 1 (07:17):
Where's Ron?
You're getting a prize.
All right.
Who else founded besides?
Matt Carpenter founded theBartrell Mountain Race.
I wish I had the Jeopardy musicin the background.
John Nancy, that's right.
Nancy Hobbs, All right.

(07:43):
In what year was BTMR founded?
You can find all thisinformation on Instagram, by the
way, 2000.
Correct.

Speaker 5 (07:56):
Over here, raise your hand up.

Speaker 1 (08:00):
All right, all right, just getting started.
How long?
Is the course.
How long is the BTMR?
12.6.
Correct, correct, Alright.
This one's a little ambiguous.
How much vertical is there?
I've seen on Strava anywherebetween 30.
What Sorry.
Sorry 36?

(08:26):
I'd say 36.
That's right.
Alright, now we're going to getinto the harder ones.
This one's a little easy.
Who holds the men's courserecord?
I don't want to hear it fromany of you, joe Gray.

Speaker 4 (08:42):
And we're done with prizes.

Speaker 1 (08:44):
There's an IOU and the last, and we're done with
prizes.
We're done with prizes, allright, there's an IOU, there's
an IOU, and the last one will bean IOU.
Who holds the women's courserecord?
It's not Tina.
Nope, oh, I'm sorry.
Who holds the women's courserecord?
Nope, brandi Erholz.

(09:07):
Yeah, so there you go.

Speaker 2 (09:12):
All right, let's get us started.

Speaker 1 (09:13):
Let's introduce our panelists here.
I guess we could start herewith Melissa.
How's it going, melissa?
Good, all right.
So I'm going to go in nameshere.
We'll start with Melissa Rogers, wendy Roberts, amanda
Kozlowski, benjamin Townsend,john, I always butcher your last
name, is it?

(09:34):
Aziz?
I had you on my podcast and Igot it wrong.
I'm so sorry.
And Dean Abel, I got it Allright.
Well, guys, let's give a biground of applause for these
athletes that are going to becompeting on Sunday.
All right, we'll start with you, melissa.
Are you still on mute or areyou good?
I think I'm good.

(09:54):
You're good All right Am I good,yeah, okay, all right, so let's
get into some questions.
I'm curious like talk to meabout your running journey.

Speaker 8 (10:04):
I started running in high school but before that I
was, I guess, discovered by thehigh school coaches doing just
the physical fitness test inmiddle school.
I didn't know I was a runner, Ijust, I guess my sister and I
were fast and they startedrecruiting us and then I ran
track and cross country in highschool and then took off like 15

(10:26):
years and then came back torunning when I was 47.

Speaker 1 (10:30):
Wow, that's impressive yeah.
So you're obviously in 40ies,early fifties.
What, um, can you tell, like,how it's gotta be?
You obviously train at a veryhigh level.
You're a very competitiveathlete.
Like, can you talk about that?
Like how how is difficult, asyou age, to be able to like,
maintain the mileage and dothings like that.

Speaker 8 (10:50):
I think that I don't have anything to compare it to
because I started so late.
So maybe, maybe, if I startedyounger I'd be like well, I'm
declining, but because I startedlater, it's kind of nice,
because I don't have to see thatas much.

Speaker 1 (11:03):
So I like it yeah I gotta ask you about btmr.
You've had some great finisheshere like what, what about this
race excites you?

Speaker 8 (11:11):
the up and then the down.
Okay, I like.
I like going the up and thenthe down, okay, I like going all
up and then all down.

Speaker 1 (11:16):
What do you prefer more?
The down, your down is yourstyle.

Speaker 8 (11:19):
Yeah, the down, definitely.
Okay, all right.

Speaker 1 (11:22):
That was my next question stylistically.
I could ask you this, becausethe funny thing about this race
is it ends on this weird uphillwhere you'll turn go up.
Do you guys like that?
Do you not like it?
You like it, wendy likes it all, right, yeah I think I like it
too you like it too, I mean it'sthe.

Speaker 8 (11:39):
It's not that far to run up and there's all the hype
around there, so, okay, it's agood place to push okay, very
cool now you've got a longerrace.

Speaker 1 (11:49):
That's all on your ultra sign up.
You're training for, gettingready for.
Is this a tune-up for that asyou start to go into some later?
Like longer mileage?
I know you've raised someultras before, but like what?
How does that rank as far aslike?
Are you kind of getting readyfor that, or?

Speaker 8 (12:02):
I'm definitely focused on that telluride
mountain run yeah, 40 mile or soum we'll talk about the 13 mile
I'm gonna get are you doing ittoo?
Yeah, oh, awesome.
Well, uh, I think I'm going togo back to focusing on ultra
again, after doing shorter runsthe last or races the last two
years.
There's just something aboutultra that, um, it pushes you in

(12:24):
a different way and thesuffering's different.

Speaker 1 (12:29):
Actually we can get into this a little bit, cause
we've got time.
Um, like I know you and Deanhave had like crazy good
finishes at like black canyon100k and years past and stuff
like that.
Like, is that like a race thatintrigues you to go back to?
Or kind of like, what distancelike, uh, ultra, are we talking?

Speaker 8 (12:44):
I think.
So I'm not very good at reallysteep ups and so because of that
, that's what I want to do.
I want to see if I can reallymaster the uphill and get
stronger at it, and I like theidea of building like good,
strong legs too.
It's just more exciting.
Black Canyon was fun.
It was very hard on the bodybecause you know it's you don't
walk at all and you, I don'treally like to walk anyways, but

(13:06):
that's something I need to workon because you're not going to
be running Telluride mountainrun the whole thing.
But anyway, black Canyon is afast downhill race, so you can't
walk for a week and a halfafterwards.

Speaker 1 (13:19):
Brutal, brutal.
Back to BTMR.
Last year you had a sixth placefinish.
This year, what is yourexpectation for race day?

Speaker 8 (13:27):
Hopefully better than last year.
I'm going to focus on myselfand beating myself.

Speaker 1 (13:32):
I love that.
Yeah Well, give it up formelissa everybody.
Thank you so much.
Thank you, best of luck on raceday, wendy.
How's it going good?
Yeah, well, if you wouldn'tmind introduce yourself.

Speaker 2 (13:45):
Well, we already introduced you, but tell the
audience like maybe your runningjourney um, I'm wendy roberts
and I have lived here since Iwas six months old, so local
mostly.
Um, my, I got into runningbecause of my mom.
Um, she was, uh, one of the Ishould say, the original ultra

(14:05):
women back in the.
Uh, she ran leadville twice in89, 1989 and so I was only a
little kid at the time and Ididn't really appreciate it at
the time, but looking back it'samazing and she kind of pushed
us.
I was not discovered in highschool my mom definitely pushed
all of us kids into running.

(14:27):
We did high schoolcross-country, we did track.
She coached us at some point Idid a little bit in college and
burned out and then just decidedI was going to do kind of run.
I've always ran since then, butit's been more kind of at my
own pace.
So yeah, my mom, she passedaway about 21 years ago of

(14:49):
cancer.
But like that is definitely thething behind my running journey
is always kind of thinking ofher now on the topic of btmr.

Speaker 1 (14:58):
You raced this race back in 2000, if I remember
correctly.

Speaker 2 (15:00):
Okay, wow, first time I was 17.
I was going into my senior yearof high school.
Um, I went to st mary's highschool and they were up on the
road.
I remember they were at bob'sroad at the uh doing the aid
station thing, as they still do,and so I hadn't run it for a
long time.
I came back three years ago in2022 and did it and they were.

(15:21):
It was amazing.
St Mary's was there at Bob'sRoad.
I was 40 years old and I justran through.
I was like, oh my God, you guys.
I was like St Mary's crosscountry, that was super cool.
They were probably like who'sthat crazy old lady, but uh,
yeah, that was just amazing.
Um, so I, I and I hadn't run.
That was my first time running,since I had like my uh like

(15:44):
running trail stuff again, sinceI had my son, um, and that the
bug really, I didn't do thatgreat that year.
I hadn't really trained muchfor that kind of distance and
intensity, and then every yearI've been coming back.

Speaker 1 (15:58):
I just love it so it's a special race for you.
That special race, yeah, um,maybe you kind of got into it,
but like, how has it changedsince like 2000?
Like it was just a small?
I mean not that it's, it's agrassroots vibe t-shirts are way
better now.

Speaker 2 (16:13):
I don't know if anyone remembers the very first
t-shirt they had.
It was this white cottont-shirt, you know, really baggy
one that like fits one size fitsall, and it had a picture of
hole in the rock, like a photolike right there, and you
couldn't really tell what it was, because it's just a picture of
the hole in the rock.
So people would be like whatthe heck, you just found your
shirt, the hole in the rock.
So people would be like whatthe heck, you just found your

(16:34):
shirt.
It was like the most hideousshirt ever.
But I really I went back.
I couldn't find it.
I must have donated it.
But I really regret donatingthat shirt though, because I
would totally wear it again.

Speaker 1 (16:45):
Oh, I love it.
I love it.
What are you more excited for?

Speaker 2 (16:53):
Are you more of a climber or more of a descender?
I'm definitely more of aclimber.
I think when I was 17, I thinkI was definitely more of a
descender.
I could really kill it on thedownhills.
I remember doing kind of likeparkour on the switchbacks back
in the day, like bouncing offthe little rocks that are like
sideways.
But I cannot do it anymore.
So now I'm like I try and be,I'll be.
My best placement will be atthe top at bar Camp, and then I

(17:13):
turn around and I'm just goingto get passed by all the young
ladies.
So they're just crazy fast.
And I fell two years ago aswell.
So now I'm just even more Justlike I'd rather get down and
survive than have an amazingtime but also wreck my knees and
everything.

Speaker 1 (17:29):
A lot of folks tap the knees, lots of blood and
gore out there.

Speaker 2 (17:33):
I'm probably going to wear my biking gloves for this.

Speaker 1 (17:35):
Okay, that's an Allie Mack thing, very cool.
What else, uh, what else do youhave on the schedule for 2025?

Speaker 2 (17:43):
Let's see.
Well, I'm just coming off of myfirst half Ironman.
I did that.
I did Cordelan 70.3.
Uh, I'm, I might havediscovered a new love about that
.
Yeah, uh, I have always kind oftried to be a runner.
I've never really thought ofmyself as a really good runner,
um, and I've always had more oflike that the taller the

(18:05):
shoulders and more of like the,the build, and I, I, but I was
never really a swimmer oranything.
I did a little bit of it, but Ipicked it up this year just for
fun, started swimming twice aweek, started biking and I'm
like I'm getting better at thesethings.
I can actually see improvementwith running.
For me it's like, eh, notreally getting better, getting a

(18:28):
little bit worse over time, butI'm like biking, I'm getting
better.
Swimming, I'm getting betterswimming, I'm getting better.
This is fun, uh.
And also like it doesn't wreckme, like I feel like when I
start putting on mileage, itjust stop running yeah, but I'm
supposed to do the 50 miler uhrun rabbit in September.

(18:49):
I'm not doing garden to peakthis year, so I signed up for
that.
It's a week before the ascent,but I'm I'm really nervous about
it.
I don't.
I don't know if I'm going doingGarden to Peak this year
because I signed up for that.
It's a week before the ascent,but I'm really nervous about it.
I don't know if I'm going toget the volume in that I need.

Speaker 1 (18:58):
Oh, I think train it for a marathon, like all that
aerobic work, I'm sure you'll besuper fit and ready for that.
I hope so.
Well, wendy, thank you so much,wishing you the best of luck on
race day.
Appreciate it.
Yeah, amanda, how's it going?

Speaker 9 (19:14):
Good.
How are you Good?

Speaker 1 (19:15):
good, good, yeah, why don't you introduce yourself?
Well, we kind of already did.
I keep doing that again.
Maybe talk about your runningjourney.

Speaker 9 (19:24):
So I'm Amanda Kozlowski.
I, kind of like you, have beenhere since I was five, so pretty
much a native, but really don'thave much running background
until maybe my beginning 30s tomid-30s.
Dad was a runner growing up andhe tried to get us out there,
but we didn't go.

(19:45):
We more liked the soccer andthings like that.
I did run cross country for thefun of it and to get a little
bit in better shape for soccermy junior and senior year of
high school, but that was prettymuch it.
Everything else wasanti-running.
Then COVID well, I think I kindof started doing a little bit
before COVID.
But when COVID hit and thingsstarted shutting down and I

(20:08):
didn't have any other options, Istarted picking up running a
little bit more and noticed kindof getting a little stronger, a
little better just doing thingson my own and had a pretty good
finish on the ascent a coupleyears ago and so kind of thought
might as well hire a coach andsee if they can help me out to
get a little bit faster.
And so I did and have had beenworking with him for about a

(20:30):
year and a half now and havejust been seeing a lot of
improvements.
Um, it's amazing, when you havesomeone telling you what to do,
how much you can do that youdidn't realize that you were
capable of.
So it's it's been hard, butit's been a lot of fun so.

Speaker 1 (20:44):
I love it.
The coaching definitely.
Yeah, it changes the.
It works a lot for some peoplefor sure.
So obviously you said BTMR likeit's's.

Speaker 9 (20:52):
You've had a lot of history at this race, like
actually last year was my first,just last year, I'm sorry, yeah
, yeah what, um, why this race?

Speaker 1 (20:58):
then like, why come back?

Speaker 9 (21:00):
um, it was a blast last year.
I it was rainy.
I think you guys probablyremember that it was so much fun
.
Um, I think that we got likesome of the best pictures out of
those that day.
I told someone the other day Iwas like man, I really hope that
it rains this year Because itwas just nice and cool and we
all just came down looking likewet rats.
But it was so fun and just Ireally Shoot.

(21:28):
Like Melissa said, I reallylove all the up and then all the
down.
Like Melissa said, I reallylove all the up and then all the
down and have been doing theascent since 2019-ish and so
finally had the opportunity lastyear to do the triple crown and
just fell in love with the BTMR.

Speaker 1 (21:47):
I love it.
Are you a better ascender ordescender?

Speaker 9 (21:51):
Probably ascender.
I would say um, for similarreasons, just kind of that
nervousness of falling of.
I mean, I fall all the time, soit's fine, I fall in the boston
marathon, so I'll probably fallon sunday.
Um, it's just what happens.
But um, yeah, I woulddefinitely say ascender.
They've done some really greatwork on that trail, though, so I

(22:14):
think it'll help coming down.
Um, but yeah, definitelyAscender.

Speaker 1 (22:19):
Very cool.
Now, one of the cool thingsabout you is you've got, you
know, you've had some like crazyfinishes, like last year at
12th place at Cirque series,snowbird, which was the U S
mountain running championship.
Um, if I were to have you onthe formal podcast this is a
question I would ask everybodyhow was that race for you?
I'm just so curious becausethat was one of the most
competitive races assembled onAmerican soil in the last few
years.

Speaker 9 (22:38):
Yeah, that one had Grayson Reen who is I think
she's in the short series forthe world or for the US, for a
world championship.

Speaker 1 (22:47):
Grayson Murphy, grayson Murphy.

Speaker 9 (22:48):
I said, grayson, no, you're good that was literally
one of my students like 12 yearsago.
Yeah, lord have mercy.
So yeah, grayson Murphy, andthen Rachel I always butcher her
last name, but tons of it's amind check.
Yeah, he knows them all, but Ikind of went in.
I did go in as like an elite onthat one, and I was like my

(23:14):
whole goal was just not to bethe last elite competitor coming
in.
Um, that one was so steep goingup, which was awesome, but the
steepness of the downhill justcaught me way off guard.
Um, it was super fun, though,to be out there and toe in the
line with some of the bestathletes.
Um, definitely one of the mostcompetitive races I've been in,
but it was beautiful day andjust yeah, super fun.
The reason I ask it is becausethere was've been in, but it was
beautiful day and just yeah,super fun.

Speaker 1 (23:34):
The reason I ask it is because there was a week
removed from, or it was a weekbefore BTMR for you, correct?

Speaker 9 (23:39):
Yeah, it was.

Speaker 1 (23:40):
You go and get on the podium of BTMR.
So this year you're a littlefresher, right.

Speaker 9 (23:44):
That's what I keep telling myself too.
I was like I was trying tothink back to last year.
I said you know what?
You?
Because my goal this year is tobreak two hours.
I don't know if it'll happen,um, but I'm like you can do it,
because you were off of Cirquelast year and your legs were
beat up.
So that's what I'm tellingmyself mentally to hopefully get
me up there a little faster.

Speaker 1 (24:03):
So we'll see very cool, very cool.

Speaker 9 (24:06):
Well, actually, you know what else is on your
schedule for this year um so twoweeks after BTMRmr, I'm going
up to jackson hole for therendezvous oh, it's a great race
yeah, it's 6.1 and like 4 000feet vertical um, so that one's
any excuse I can get to run injackson hole.
I'm taking it and then I'm doingtelluride mountain run, but

(24:27):
only the 13 um.
Some of their littledisclaimers about needing to be
like that you could fall scaredme a little bit, so I'm like
I'll go as short as possible andthen um the ascent.

Speaker 1 (24:39):
I'll do the ascent as well.
Very cool.
Well, that's a stack schedule.

Speaker 9 (24:42):
Wish you the best of luck and thank you so much.
Thank you.

Speaker 1 (24:44):
Thank you, dean.
How's it going?
Good, dean, I really it goingGood, dean, I really just
appreciate you, and actually forthe audience as well.
You've done a lot helping BTMRthis year and just putting all
this together.
You were one of the main peoplearound this.
So, guys, please give a roundof applause to Dean, thank you,

(25:06):
thank you.
You and I kind of know eachother adjacently, so what is
your running journey, man?

Speaker 11 (25:14):
I've been wanting to actually talk to you about this
for a while, so so I guess, ifwe go back to when it first
started, when I was in middleschool, in fifth grade we had a
good kind of track and fieldprogram.
Everybody did it for middleschool and I decided my mom's
5'3".
I'm super short if you guyscan't tell.

Speaker 1 (25:28):
Same.

Speaker 11 (25:29):
And I just said she was a hurdler.
She said when she was in highschool.
So I'm like, I'm a hurdler, Iwas terrible.
Like I was just wastingsomebody's time, you know, and
my brother was a year older thanme just killing it in the mile
and a half mile.
So the coaches finally, afterlike the fourth meet, they're
like you're not doing thisanymore, you're running the mile
.
You know, they made me run themile.
I did.
All right, you know, ran schoolkind of stopped after that.

(25:50):
Um, like kind of similar tomelissa, didn't run for easily
15 to 17 years and then I wasout here by then.
Um, I was actually training fornolans in my mind and I was
doing teller, county search andrescue and my friend mitch was a
runner on it and he's like well, you never run a race.
He's like why don't you comedown and run the tours in the
hair with me and we'll do that?
It was my first 5k in forever.

(26:11):
And before the race startedwith how it works, he's like oh,
let me see what your bib says.
And it said 0-0-0, which meansI start last in that race
because it's kind of ahandicapped race with timing.
So then I did better than I wasexpecting and then my
competitive edge just kicked inand I got right back into
running again and just havingthis great community to run with
, getting again and just havingthis great community to run with

(26:35):
, getting to know people uh, thebig competitors you get to race
against, it just was super funfor me so well.

Speaker 1 (26:38):
It's super cool.
What is your like?
Let's talk about your journeywith btmr.
Like, why, why, btmr, what?
Both of you from yourinvolvement at the race level as
well as as a competitor um,this will be my seventh year in
a row doing it.

Speaker 11 (26:51):
Uh, when I first wanted to get into it, it was
extremely competitive and thefield that ran in the year
before me was, I mean, amazing,and I just wanted to be able to
race against those people, seehow I stacked up, and so that
kind of got my involvement.
Then, after that first race, Ilearned how much they were
involved with the high schoolcross-country teams, which I
thought was amazing Growing up,we didn't have something like

(27:12):
that.
So getting teams which Ithought was amazing growing up
we didn't have something likethat.
So getting to see what theygive back to them was kind of
really cool.
And they, those kids, theyreally pump you up when you're
like feeling pretty miserable.
You know I don't ever eat thedonuts or whatever they got, you
know, but still they're pretty,they're inspirational is how I
put it.
It's nice to see them so ampedup.
So and then just wanted to keepgoing and seeing what I could
do to help and just keep thatcompetitive edge with the race

(27:34):
and, you know, and making sureour locals come and run it and,
you know, kind of represent isthe idea.

Speaker 1 (27:41):
No, I love it.
I mean such a great race.

Speaker 11 (27:44):
Oh, I love it.
I've ran this the most out ofany race.

Speaker 1 (27:48):
Very cool.
What do you like better, theAscent or the Descent?
Definitely the Descent.

Speaker 11 (27:52):
You're a better downhill runner.
Oh yeah, way back it's, and bartrail is probably up there in
my easily my top five of likefavorite downhills, especially
from bar camp down, or even likeright before no name when you
drop down to there.
After that it's like just acruise to me.

Speaker 1 (28:07):
So very cool.
What else do you have on theschedule for this year?

Speaker 11 (28:11):
um, I'm kind of a procrastinator, so I'm waiting
to get into Telluride MountainRun 40.
It sounds like I'm going to getin.
You just have to wait untilAugust when people start
dropping, so I'll have that.
And then I'm stillprocrastinating on, you know,
uray 50 I'm thinking about.
I've paced twice or three timesthere, twice the last 50 of the

(28:32):
100, and then her when she didthe 50, I paced the last 25.
So I just feel like I have thatcourse locked in.
It's tons of ups and downs.
You go over dinosaur tracks,it's really cool.

Speaker 1 (28:42):
It's so cool, yeah, that's a tough course I paced
the 100-mile.
My buddy did the 100-mile acouple years ago and it's just
like I think the hardest partabout that is like you have to
come back in and then go backout and then come back in You're
like, oh, that's my car rightthere, it's very easy to quit.
And I'm sure the 50 is like nodifferent, just equally as
painful, terrible.

Speaker 11 (29:02):
Yeah, I mean they're about like 50% each.
You know the 100, you spendhalf the race at Ironton and
then come down to Fennel andthen in the 50, you just spend
your whole time at the Fennel.

Speaker 1 (29:11):
I mean, dude, you're a formidable ultra runner in
your own right.
You've had one of the things Iremember a couple years ago,
when you ran Black Canyon, youhad a great finish there Is
there anything like that thatexcites you to go back, or is it
more some of these longermountain stuff that gets you
excited?

Speaker 11 (29:26):
I did Nolans in 2020 , and I want to go back and do
that actually.
Yeah, back and do that actually.
Yeah, I mean I love racing,don't get me wrong, but I feel
like I did great when I didaccomplish nolan's, but I felt
like I left a lot of time outthere.
I was eating footlong subs fromsubway on my breaks, you know,
having a beer here and there,you know, and I could probably
take it a little more serious,you know do you guys know what

(29:46):
nolan's is.

Speaker 1 (29:48):
No, can you.
Can you tell people what it is?

Speaker 11 (29:49):
so nolan's 14er is an unofficial kind of challenge
where you have to providetracking information.
You connect the 14ers behindBuena Vista in one go.
You have to break 60 hours andit's about over 100 miles with
the 14 peaks.
You can do it supported orunsupported, so you can have
people helping you, meeting youat places, going with you up the

(30:10):
peaks.
I mean it can go.
We just had a wrecker get setso the fastest guy now is under
36 hours, but you can easily beout there for two whole days no
sleep, no rest.

Speaker 1 (30:22):
It's so cool.
I was going to say rare air.
That's kind of a pun becauseit's in thin air.
Well, Dean, actually we talkedabout what's next, so thank you
so much for coming on appreciateit, appreciate it.
John's back on the hot seat.
This is your third time how'sit going?

Speaker 7 (30:43):
buddy doing well, yeah, excited to hear for a
third consecutive VTMR.

Speaker 1 (30:49):
Guys, let's give John a round of applause along with
his new wife or sorry, his wifeand new baby, john's.
A new dad.
How does it feel to be a newfather?

Speaker 7 (31:01):
My cookie-cutter answer is just our hearts are so
full right now.
We've wanted this for a whileand it's immediately
life-changing.
That's what everyone says, butit's so cute.
Love can just stare at her allday.
That's what everyone says.
So cute Love, to just stare ather all day.
We're taking it on, learning alot and it's already super
rewarding.

Speaker 1 (31:19):
I'm sure.
I'm sure Congratulations, btmr.
You're coming back this year.
I would imagine.
Kind of unfinished business foryou.
Last year you were so close towinning.
Joe was right there.
What do you think?
Are we on a course record watchfor this year for you.
What are we thinking?

Speaker 7 (31:35):
No, to course, record watch.
I think last year's time isstill a few minutes off.
And, yeah, we just talked aboutthe new variable.
We're learning how to live onfragmented sleep.
Yeah, so this is very much atest to how running goes in our
this next season of life.
I'm still gonna.

(31:56):
I mean everything.
I'm so grateful things havegone so smoothly.
You know, took some time offfor first week through delivery
and we're only three weeks innow, so haven't really learned,
figured everything out.
It's like expect some reallychallenging nights and days, um,
but yeah, gonna just see how wecan do um with the new balance

(32:18):
of priorities and I've beengetting out running and doing
workouts.
So, um, I think the biggestchallenge is can I, can I wake
myself up?
uh, to run hard I've always beenrunning super early, but now
you know time doesn't meananything at the moment.
So that day we'll just see howit goes at race time.

Speaker 1 (32:35):
It's that dad strength, dad energy.
You get a new variable therefor yourself.
You're not too far along,removed from Broken Arrow.
That was the most competitive50K race probably ever assembled
on American soil.
Maybe can you paint a picturefor the audience, not just about
your race, but just like thealtitude, like everything.
How was that race for you?

(32:56):
How did you enjoy it?

Speaker 7 (32:56):
Sure, yeah.
So Broken Arrow 46K was fourweeks ago now.
Yeah, that comes out 28something miles and has
somewhere around 9000 feet ofgain.
But, that was this year'squalifying race for Team USA for
the World Mountain RunningTrail Championships, so that had

(33:19):
been on my.
It had been a goal since Worldswere announced two years ago.
We had 2024 off and this is thelast World in 23.
So knowing that oh, worlds inSpain and 25 is on the counter.
I'm going to get myself in thequalifying race.
That was before baby was on theway.
Nonetheless still set it as atarget race and wanted to go

(33:43):
throw down against a reallyincredible, incredible field.
Had an okay buildup Lifedefinitely happened this year
beyond the baby.
So both with managing somenagging injuries and just family
things, an okay buildup Lifedefinitely happened this year
beyond the baby.
So both with managing somenagging injuries and just family
things, it was somewhat of achallenging buildup.
So, going from you know, Iactually won the last two

(34:03):
qualifiers, pikes Peak being oneof them, and from there it'll
go to 50K.
So going from winning thequalifier to 11th was, you know,
on paper that looks hard toswallow but just where things
were at.
I think it's a really honestassessment of where I'm at right
now, so happy to just getthrough it.
And that's a course where Ieasily could have.
It's a two-lapper, so that's areally mental game when you're

(34:24):
coming halfway through and haveto do all of that climbing again
.
So I'm really proud.
I know I positive split by like12 minutes, but you could easily
make that a 40-minute positivesplit if you're just reduced to
really stumbling in.
But I got hung on and there'sstill 10 places behind me are

(34:44):
all stout guys coming in, soreally pleased with the result,
despite it not being a qualifier.
I'm not even sure I would havebeen able to to go and leave
these two at home no, that makessense.

Speaker 1 (34:55):
That makes sense.
I mean, the baby was born.
What a couple days after youknow, that's another thing I
yeah.

Speaker 7 (35:00):
So, um, it's a high demand race everybody wanted to
get in, so you had to prettymuch commit back in december
that you're gonna go do it, andso if you know, start counting
weeks and things you can imagine.
We probably just found out thatwe were having a child and I
counted it up, it's like, okay,race weekend, tara, you're going
to be 34 and a half weekspregnant.

(35:21):
And that time it's like, okay,I think there's a pretty good
chance we can go and come back,get a little bit closer.
And we're only like two orthree weeks out and it's like
shoot, it's 35 and a half weeks.
And just that one week like inmy head, like should I go?
I don't know.
And then, um, yeah, so that wasfour weeks ago.
I don't know if we said on themic yet, but we talked before um

(35:42):
, baby rosalyn is three weeksold now, so came back on sunday
and she came almost a monthearly that friday wow, we were
doing a post analysis like okay,if you had called me when your
water broke, like, and I triedto get to the airport, like, I
would have ended up being twohours late.
So, uh, glad, glad, it allworked out.
But it was like, yeah, it'sjust interesting, exciting,

(36:05):
nerve-wracking, all, all theemotions you can imagine I love
it.

Speaker 1 (36:08):
I love it it is.
It's all the emotions this yearwith things up in the air.
Do you think you'll be goingback to pikes?

Speaker 7 (36:15):
Yeah, so I said to Dean um 20 minutes ago, if uh if
I'm not hurt on Monday, I'mgoing to go register for the
marathon.
I love it, I love it.

Speaker 1 (36:24):
All right, I would be our four time champion.
Three right now.
Um, john, thank you so much forcoming.
I really appreciate it andcongratulations again, thank you
yeah, thank you what's up,buddy?
Mr benjamin townsend, how's itgoing?

Speaker 10 (36:43):
doing good man, how are you doing?

Speaker 1 (36:44):
good, good, it's like your sixth time on the podcast.
Yeah, fifth or sixth, a localto the podcast?
Keep these going.
Yeah, yeah, how you feelingfeeling good.
Yeah, thanks for coming on.
For the audience that might notbe familiar with you, maybe
talk a little bit about yourrunning journey.

Speaker 10 (36:59):
Yeah, so I'm Benjamin Townsend.
I am born in Colorado Springs.
I started running in middleschool a little bit just kind of
doing stuff here and there.
I mean, I've been running mywhole life but started taking it
a little bit more seriously.
And then through high schooljust kind of always did trails
in the summer as sort of a prepfor cross country.

(37:22):
And then when it sort of camedown to it with COVID and all
these weird scholarship thingsgoing on college started to look
a little difficult to do and Ihad been talking with some
schools but it was kind of up inthe air and I'd really pushed
it off too late.
So I decided, instead ofrunning D1 College, to pursue
trail and mountain runninginstead, and then been in that

(37:46):
for about three.
I think this is my fourth yearnow, so it's been a fun ride and
you're starting to see theresults now, yeah, finally
finally you want to talk alittle bit about broken arrow
yeah, so broken arrow sky racethe one he was just talking
about I did the 23k, which isjust one loop around.
It's good enough for me.
Um, I had a 20 minute or 17minute improvement on my time

(38:10):
from the year before, um, from217 to two hours, and so I felt
really happy with that.
I took 18th or 19th overall ina golden trail world series race
, a world mountain running champor trail association race, all
these things so it was really agood breakthrough day for me and
I really felt like I finallysort of did what I knew I always

(38:33):
could, if that makes sense,yeah, yeah, no, definitely on a
on a good breakthrough day forme and I really felt like I
finally sort of did what I knewI always could, if that makes
sense yeah, yeah, no, definitelyon a on a good trajectory man,
so congratulations yeah, thankyou so much let's let's talk
btmr.

Speaker 1 (38:42):
Last year you raced this.
You got a fifth place finish.
How are you looking to improvegoing into this one?

Speaker 10 (38:48):
um, honestly, that was a pretty, a little bit of a
rough day for me.
So I think, um, if I can justfinish feeling good with myself,
it'll be a good day.
Um, I'd like to be able to hangwith this guy for a little
while.
So we'll see about that.
Um, but honestly, as long as Irun significantly faster than

(39:10):
last year, I'll be, I'll be good.
Why?
Btmr?
Run significantly faster thanlast year, I'll be, I'll be good
.
Why btmr?
Um, I love the local coloradosprings races.
I feel like they have so muchhistory and so much local
retention and I've been racing.
So I raced broken arrow fourweeks ago and then two weeks
later raced in peru and thenraced again last week.

(39:31):
So I've raced almost every weekand I was kind of unsure about
racing or not this weekend.
And then I work here in theshop and Colorado running
company and the other dayeveryone was coming in to buy
stuff for the race and all mycoworkers like, hey, we're doing
the race, are you doing it?
And it got me all stoked up sothat's why I beat you more.

Speaker 1 (39:50):
I love it.
I love it.
So you have a really cool story.
Like you're racing right now onjust with same with Rio.
Shout out to Rio on the U 23Skyrunner world series.
Can you talk about that alittle bit and like what, what
you know, what that's done foryour career and kind of the
progression?

Speaker 10 (40:05):
Yeah.
So this is my second year partof the series and essentially
what they did is created a.
So in cycling it's big under 23and then you kind of move into
elite as of now.
In trail there really wasn'tanything like for you 23.
It was like you really justhave to race the best in the
world until you are good enoughto race the best in the world.

(40:27):
So sky running world series, ifyou're not familiar, is the
most steep, most technical formof trail racing that exists, and
they came out and made an under23 series focused more towards
their shorter races to sort ofgive an outlet for younger
athletes to get some morehighlight and be able to race

(40:48):
each other and not just say,well, I was 18th against 18,
30-year-olds, you know what Imean and endurance training.
That's when you're your peak.
So it's been really fun to beable to be a part of that series
and be able to travel the worlda little bit and they help me
with money and travel places andI've been to, like I think,

(41:10):
five or six countries sincejoining it, so it's been a
fantastic opportunity.

Speaker 1 (41:16):
Can tell the audience , like some of the races you did
this year yeah, so earlier thisyear in April, I raced in Spain
.

Speaker 10 (41:23):
um then May I did back-to-back weeks in Malaysia
and then Japan, and then I justgot back from Peru last Monday,
so it's been fun all over theworld Is Peru the Cordelia
Blanca one.

Speaker 1 (41:37):
Yeah, that's like super high altitude, yeah.

Speaker 10 (41:38):
So we started at 11,000 feet and topped out just
about 15,000.
So my altitude is quite allright for this race, so I'm
feeling good.

Speaker 1 (41:50):
That's awesome.
That's awesome.
What do you prefer?
More, are you more of adescender or a climber?

Speaker 10 (41:55):
You know, it really depends on the day.
Sometimes I feel like I'm areally good climber and then
other days I feel like I'm areally good descender.
I run with this guy, ace, quitea bit and pretty good descender
.
He'll.
He'll really show you howyou're not very good at
descending.
Um, when I'm not running withhim, I usually feel like I'm
pretty good, so we'll see Verycool.

Speaker 1 (42:15):
What else is I mean?
I know you've got we talked alittle bit about this before but
what else is like left on yourcalendar for this year, so after
this race?

Speaker 10 (42:23):
thankfully I have a little bit of a break, which
will be nice, and then I'll gointo a couple Cirque series
races.
I'll be doing the Pikes PeakAscent again and then the U23
Skyrunner World Series Final inSpain in October.

Speaker 1 (42:38):
Ooh, Spain in October .
Yeah, that should be nice.
What part of.

Speaker 10 (42:41):
Spain.
Is it like In the Basque?
Oh, so north west, if you'renot familiar, but it'll be
really fun.

Speaker 1 (42:48):
They have their own dialect.
It's pretty cool, oh yeah.

Speaker 10 (42:52):
If you say, are you Spanish, they'd say I'm basque,
like it's almost kind of maybehawaii to us.
If that makes sense, they don'treally identify as being
spaniards.
They're basque people.

Speaker 1 (43:03):
So very cool very cool well, benjamin, wishing you
the best of luck on your race.
Thank you so much for coming on.
Thank you so much, sir.
All right guys, we're gonna goto audience questions now.
Who's got who's got the?
Thank you so much, sir.
All right guys, we're going togo to audience questions now.

Speaker 5 (43:22):
Who's got the first?

Speaker 1 (43:23):
one, I'll break the ice.
All right, all right.

Speaker 5 (43:29):
First of all, thank you all for taking this time.
It's amazing.
As a coach of U23 athletes, Iappreciate some of your
perspective in terms of yourgrowth in the sport.
My first question, I guess,would be to John if it's okay,

(43:49):
so you have a new daughter, dorespect everybody up there.
You've got to be the one tobeat, right?
I mean, on Sunday you've got tobe the one to beat.
So if I were the dad ofsomebody racing you on Sunday,
how would I coach him to beatyou on Sunday?

Speaker 7 (44:12):
Is this okay?
Um, I think it's very importanton these challenging climbs,
technical trails, to focus onrunning your own race and, um,
being very tuned in to what yourbody is telling you.
Being very tuned in to whatyour body is telling you.
I've done five races on bartrail now.

(44:33):
I mean I've run it hundreds oftimes.
But in those three, two and ahalf marathons, two bar trails,
like every time I'm at the topof the Ws, there's demons in my
head like, oh, I'm already dead,like this is over and it takes
time to chill, so it's hard andI still might mess up in my head
like, oh, I'm already dead.
Like this is over and takestakes time to chill, so, um,
it's hard and I still might messup.

(44:53):
Other competitors might mess up.
Um, so if you're just focusedon where you're at and trying on
that day to advance thatfarther than where you've been
before, um, it might that alonemight put you ahead of another
person, and then, plus, there'sjust so many variables that
someone could not be feelinggood on the day and they come
back to you.

(45:15):
So I just put the emphasis onrunning your own race.

Speaker 5 (45:19):
Awesome.
Thank you for that and hope youget amazing sleep right.
Hope you're first right thatmorning and congratulations,
thank you.
That's an amazing, amazing yearfor an unbelievable next 50, 60
years, so congratulations.

Speaker 7 (45:36):
Thanks.

Speaker 1 (45:37):
Thank you, sir, all right.
Next audience question.

Speaker 6 (45:46):
At least two of you said you started really running
later in life and I have asimilar story.
I played soccer, hated running.
There was nothing worse on theplanet than running until she
talked me into it when Icouldn't play soccer anymore
because I wasn't fit enough.
Now I run and I don't playsports.
How do you go starting runninglate in life to being so good?

(46:10):
You're sitting in this groupGenetics.
Is there some?

Speaker 2 (46:17):
training secret.

Speaker 8 (46:21):
Because I started running when I was younger.
I feel like the foundation waskind of built, even though I
took a lot of time off, was kindof built even though I took a
lot of time off, and also thementality you know, and not to
limit yourself like don't, don'tsay I'm older now, so you know
I need to keep it slow or haveto walk this portion, or just

(46:42):
believe in yourself and believethat you can do what younger
people can do.
I think it's all about the mindframe really, and get lots of
rest if you can do what youngerpeople can do.
I think it's all about the mindframe really, and get lots of
rest if you can.

Speaker 9 (46:58):
Yeah, I see I didn't run when I was younger, so I was
very much like you were.
I had soccer and running suckedand I think I kind of got into
the gym scene first and thenlike, started working on
strength stuff.
Um, I would definitelyencourage that, for runners is
just building that strength.

(47:18):
I'm I a lot of people don'tknow but TRX, um, it's a
suspension training program andI'm an instructor for that.
That builds a lot with yourcore and just different things.
So, um, I think all of that fedinto why running was becoming
more successful.
And then, like you said, onceyou start feeling like that

(47:38):
success, you then start thinking, oh, I can do this and I can
push myself harder.
It's nice to have someone whowill push you.
That's so close to you.
Um, I needed to find that coach.
That was my motivation.
But I think just findingwhatever motivates you to do it
and I mean you're already there.
You already have thatmotivation and that bug in you.
So you just keep pushingyourself to get better and I

(47:59):
think it's all relative like forme doing better.
Tomorrow or on Sunday we'll berunning two hours.
Um, versus some of us othersit's going to be um, without
falling.
So it just depends on what yourgoal is, right yeah.

Speaker 1 (48:13):
Dean, do you want to do it as well, because I know
you were a miler and then tookwhat?
15 years off?
Right?

Speaker 11 (48:20):
Yeah, I mean, I think just not like Melissa said
, I think earlier was not havingall those miles on your legs
for so long.
You know just some of thefriends I've made through
running.
They've been running straightsince college and I can't even
imagine what that feels like.
I mean, I'm still kind of young, I'm 43, and you know I'm
already noticing the differencein my knees.
You know, just from the fewyears I've been running.

(48:40):
I was never this successfulwhen I was young, like I was
always second to my brother, youknow, and I was always second
everywhere actually and like so.
So when I started doing it justwas the motivation, like once I
surprised myself.
It was the drive, thecompetition and just really
wanting to focus on that taking,taking it more seriously.

(49:02):
When I was a kid I never tookit seriously.
It was more of just fun andhanging out, you know.
So go on the back.
What's the most fun race you'veever run?
Oh, that's a good one.
Do I have to go first?
Yeah, you start, yeah.

Speaker 7 (49:28):
I don't have a particular one race, but college
cross-country races, highschool cross-country races, that
team element, and still I meana lot of those tend to turn
toward golf course type venuesbut it gets you that kind of
trail running aspect to somedegree.
So those are for sure for mesome of the most fun races I've

(49:49):
had um, funnest race.

Speaker 10 (50:00):
Uh, if I could do two.
Um broken arrows honestly ablast, just the.
The whole ambience of theentire weekend is just magic.
It's that true, like what youhear about in europe.
You know where you get justthis magical feel around, where
everybody is just in love withthe sport.

(50:21):
Um, and then secondly, the raceI did in japan earlier this
year was just perfect.
I loved, loved it.
It was super fun.
It was 16 miles with a littleover 10,000 feet of vertical
gain.
So that's the kind of stuff Ilike and it felt really good.
What about Sky Race de Matazan?
Oh, yeah, that one actually.

(50:42):
So Sky Race de Matazan, orhowever you say it in France,
they're switchbacks but youdon't have to take them, so you
go straight up and figure outyour way straight down, and that
was a lot of fun being able tojust know rules, just go as fast
as you can in the best-lookingway possible, which you fall a

(51:06):
lot.
Thankfully, there it's a lotmore grassy and not quite as
brutal as here, but that racewas a ton of fun as well.
It's a popular one.
Yeah, anybody else got a?
Say BTMR, that one's fun.

Speaker 2 (51:21):
That one's fun.
But we've already talked aboutBTMR.
I think my favorite race thatI've ever done the most fun and
it didn't start out that way wasthe Mount Lemmon Half Marathon
in Tucson.
I don't think they do itanymore, but they would bus you
halfway up the Mount LemmonHighway.
It's a famous biking hill and apretty famous area.

(51:44):
Down there you go all the wayto the top of this mountain.
You just run up the road andit's all kinds of crazy
switchbacks and you start wherethere's like cacti and by the
time you get to the top it feelslike you're in Colorado.
There's aspens and it's a lotcooler.
It could be 114 down in thevalley and it's 74 up there.
That was, I think, a littleoutclassed by the folks up here,

(52:09):
but that was I.
Uh, I think I'm a littleoutclassed by the folks up here,
but that was the one race Iever won, and it's only uphill.
So, um, that one was really fun.
I wish I still had it.

Speaker 9 (52:22):
I, so I tend to mix it up with road and trail.
So I'm not just straight trail,but, um, I would say favorite
road race is probably Chicagomarathon.
Um, it's just, that's home, andso, um, it's always just fun to
race to the streets of Chicago.
Um, it hurts the marathon,hurts afterwards, but um, and

(52:42):
then trail run you.
I was going to say the ascent,which is like one of my favorite
weekends because or days, mymom runs it as well and then my
dad volunteers at the top.
So it's just super fun to getup there and wait for mom to get
up at the top and hang out withdad while he's volunteering.
But then I also ran one in theCirque series in Jackson Hole.

(53:02):
It was 30K and, oh my gosh, itwas just.
There were wildflowerseverywhere and it was just such
a beautiful race.
Hence why I'm excited to goback in August.

Speaker 11 (53:19):
I love BTMR.
That's probably definitely upthere, but when I first got back
into running, I did the fallseries.
I think it was 2017.
And the race at Monument ValleyPark they actually make you run
up the creek.
For I don't know, mike, is it ahalf mile?
I don't know how long it is.
Yeah, and I just think that wasawesome.
I mean, it's really dirty torun up that creek, I think, and

(53:41):
luckily nobody stepped onneedles or anything, but it was
super fun.
Everybody was struggling in thewater.
It was super neat to see and itdefinitely brought a whole
different aspect to racing.
You know, very short race butstill super cool.
They don't let us do it anymore, unfortunately.

Speaker 8 (54:00):
All right, melissa, all right.
I think Javelina 100 wasprobably the funnest race, just
the aid stations they're everyfour miles and the hype and the
party.
It wasn't the most beautifulrace, it's desert and stuff.
So for trail races I reallyliked Crested Butte Ultra

(54:21):
because it was just beautifuland it was in the fall.
So lots of color.
And those are my top two.

Speaker 1 (54:28):
For Javelina did you wear?
Everybody wears a halloweencostume, did you?
Did you want?

Speaker 8 (54:32):
no, I just wore a regular running outfit.

Speaker 5 (54:33):
Yeah, it was too hot all right, anybody else audience
questions quite a quick one,favorite distance and why, or,
if you're like, prefer superelevation, gain course, downhill
, some ultra versus ultraFavorite distance.

Speaker 2 (54:59):
I like uphill races.
I was thinking about it, theonly races I ever won, which was
the Mount Lemmon, and then whenI was in high school, I won the
Salida Spiral Hill one and Ithink I did.
There's another one, I think,the Ultra last year, the Great
Divide Ultra, super hilly up inMueller.
So I'd say the Uphills,anything that's not too

(55:23):
technical for me, and I think Iprefer distances that are like
half marathon to about maybe the50K in that range, anything
more than that, and I startgetting injured and anything
faster than that and it's likeyou know, you're just killing
yourself for however long.

Speaker 9 (55:48):
I would say I got the sun.
Thanks, there we go.
Thanks guys.
For road I would say 10K,they're just super speedy and
fast.
I was in Chicago for a 10-milerace, so just coming from that

(56:08):
elevation going down, that wassuper fun to be fast.
And then for trail, I would sayanywhere between half marathon
to 18 milers, so that 30k rangeand then, like you said, like
the up is super fun, or if it'sup and down, but the up, down,
up, down, up, down, up, down isvery taxing.

Speaker 11 (56:27):
So yeah, I like technical.
That's what I really enjoy Formy distance.
It's not really a distance,it's just the time frame, like
an hour and a half to two and ahalf hours.
Then I'm not like completelydead for weeks on end and I can
like bounce back and somewhathobble the next week, you know.
So that's kind of my time frame.

Speaker 7 (56:52):
Let's see, probably not absolute, but just current
season.
Like marathon to 50k distance,um, on the on the road I just
found I mean I love running 10ksbut my competitiveness going
from 10k to marathon I just getso much better.
So even though you got tosuffer for longer, I enjoy that.
I can compete at a higher levelthere.
Um, and yeah, um, they'll getinto the trails.

(57:14):
Like starting to I don't know,I want to do it all.
So one season at a time,interested in going to doing
some vks.
Um, get out to east coast, doloon mountain, again mountain
washington, that'd be fun to do.
Um, eventually do some kind of100 or or other ultra.
But you know, current seasondefinitely half marathon, 50k
distance.
And to the element dean wasadding about terrain, I like to

(57:41):
be able to roll, get the pacegoing.
I don't want to be too sloweddown by the technicality of it,
so I want to open up the legsand get rolling.

Speaker 10 (57:52):
I don't know if you could tell already, but I like
it really steep and technical.
The gnarlier it is, the better,for the most part, um, I really
like it when you kind of gethands-on scramble kind of stuff
like that.
Um, for time, I'd probably say,or how long?
Maybe half marathon to 20 miles, somewhere two to three hours,

(58:16):
I think feels really good.
It is fun to jump in races likethis, though that are a little
faster, and just kind of seewhat you can do at an hour and a
half or or so.

Speaker 1 (58:25):
So what's the shoe choice on race day?
What do you guys?
What are you guys racing in?

Speaker 10 (58:36):
um I'm gonna plug the north face here.
I'll be racing in the NorthFace Vective Sky 2.
I am looking for a sponsor.

Speaker 7 (58:53):
I've got an Asics shoe I've been liking.
I couldn't even tell you whatit is.
It's an Asics, though runningin it today I actually had some
issues with the tongue, so Imight switch to an Adidas one.
It'll be a game day, butprobably Asics.
I wore that at Broken Arrow.
It worked pretty well.
Not super lightweight mediumweight.

(59:14):
It feels more rugged andprotective on my feet when I
really want to hammer thedownhills and feel comfortable
hitting rocks hard with my foot,and so I think that one will
play well uh, my shoe isdiscontinued.

Speaker 11 (59:29):
It's the las portiva , las portiva, captivas um.
I found a brand new pair onamazon.
They're probably the last onein the country so just breaking
them in now.
Now, no one likes them, andthat's why, they got
discontinued.
I'm the only one that seems tolike them, but I love them.

Speaker 9 (59:47):
I actually recently.
I'm like still up in the airabout my trail shoes right now.
I was running an Asic Strabucos.
They felt a little heavy andfat on my feet, so now I'm an
Asic Fugees.
They're a little heavy and faton my feet, so now I'm in Asic
Fugees.
They're a little less stable,so I'm still on the fence about
them, but that's what I'm goingwith first race in them, so
we'll see how it goes.

Speaker 2 (01:00:14):
I'm a wide square-toed over-pronator so I
pretty much run in BrooksAdrenaline all the time, but
unfortunately there's no longerreally a good trail shoe from
Brooks.
Last year I was running inCascadia.
I was getting horrible blistersand then I switched to the Topo
Mountain Racer and the widesquare-toed boxes are wonderful.

(01:00:37):
So I think I'll keep going withthose.
I might have to get slightlybigger ones, but they've been
treating me pretty well.

Speaker 8 (01:00:46):
And mine's the La Sportiva Prada GoPro Is that how
you say it?
Prodigio, that's it.
That's the one I'm running in.
I really love those.
You do have to break them in,though.

Speaker 1 (01:00:57):
It takes a little time.
Yeah, good shoot.
You should see the new Maxeswe're coming out with.
Anybody else?
There's another one floatingaround, there it is.

Speaker 9 (01:01:11):
Any hobbies outside of running or training For any
of you?
I would like to know.

Speaker 10 (01:01:19):
I'm an aspiring professional hacky-sacker.
I even did it in threecountries in one day, one time,
so that's my fun fact.

Speaker 7 (01:01:31):
Skiing is probably my biggest other time sink outside
of work and family and running.
I don't do it all year round,but I try to get as many days in
as I can in the winter.
Then food, baking, coffee, allthose things that complement
running.

Speaker 5 (01:01:51):
well, Is that Alpine, Nordic, Both yeah.

Speaker 7 (01:01:54):
All of it, yeah, yeah , so mostly Alpine.
Since childhood Started pickingup, some, like so many others,
got a backcountry and schemo setup in 2020.
What do you like to eat?
Cookies, cinnamon bread?

(01:02:15):
No, well, we might trysourdough, I don't know.
We picked up some good loavesat the farmer's market in Black
Forest last weekend.
We'll either go keep spendingour money there or try to pick
some.
So hobby not super intense.

Speaker 11 (01:02:35):
I'm a dog dad outside of running, so we have a
basset hound and a coon hound,so that takes up a lot of our
time afterwards.
So we have a basset hound and acoon hound, so that takes up a
lot of our time.
Afterwards.
We do ski and snowboard.
She skis and then I've got herto play tennis once.
Got to get her back out thereagain because tennis is, if you
haven't played, it's really fun.
It's a lot of running, so forrunners it's perfect and it's

(01:02:56):
just no pressure you know, Iwould definitely say traveling,
which is not a cheap hobby.

Speaker 9 (01:03:02):
But it's another reason why I kind of took on
this running a little bit to seeif I could go and run in some
really cool places, so kind ofusing running as an excuse to
travel.
Yeah, that would be my mainhobby outside of running.

Speaker 2 (01:03:17):
Actually my day job.
I'm a technical writer so nowthat it's my job it's not so fun
anymore.
I used to be more of a funwriter and I do actually edit
for our local Pikes PeakRoadrunner newsletter as well,
and I like to read books.
So I'm kind of an introverttype.

Speaker 8 (01:03:37):
And mine's, I guess, the same as Dean's the dogs I
ski.
And then, well, I used to be abodybuilder, so that was
something I'd like to get backin the gym more and get back to
that hobby.
So Very cool Maria.

Speaker 2 (01:03:56):
Who inspires you guys to keep running, whether it's
like family, friends,professionals who can inspire
you to start and who inspiresyou to keep going?

Speaker 8 (01:04:09):
my boyfriend dean inspires me to keep running.
He, yeah, he will do it and go,no matter what like if he
doesn't feel good, if we have,we're busy.
He keeps me accountable.

Speaker 2 (01:04:23):
I already mentioned my mom.
Uh, crazy, awesome runner,she's way better than I'll ever
be um, definitely inspired me tostart running and forced me to
run some of the times, like,wendy, like go do your afternoon
run.
You haven't run yet, but uh,somehow I'm still running.
Uh, I still want to run.
And then I also have to thankmy boyfriend, tyler.

(01:04:45):
He's not here, he's watching my, my son.
So without someone there to youknow like it's really hard to
get miles in when you have achild.
So I really, really appreciatehim for doing that.

Speaker 9 (01:04:58):
And uh, yeah, I don't know how I would be on the
trails at all without that um, Iwould say kind of watching like
local runners, like TinaMaceranus, allie Mack, like
they're very, very inspirational.
Um, but on a more personallevel definitely, my mom and dad
were both athletes growing upand so I think it was kind of

(01:05:20):
just driven into our blood justthat competitiveness and wanting
to be better.
And they're both still crushingit, both going up the incline,
and mom's still going to walkthe ascent with me on September
20th yeah, I think.
And then I've got to say to myhusband as as well he let me go

(01:05:41):
part-time as a teacher so that Icould put more focus into
training, um, with my coach.
So just all of the people thatlike to hear your stories and
are just there to support youare amazing.

Speaker 11 (01:05:53):
So uh, I guess I go with Melissa, as one Yesterday I
didn't want to run.
I was tired Our basset hound'sbeen a little sick keeping us up
at night and when I got offwork it was about to rain.
I was just like no, I'm notrunning.
And she made me get in the carand drove over to the fossil
beds and got a short run inbefore it rained.
We got rained on a little bitand then more motivation is.

(01:06:16):
I mean, I'm pretty much strictlytrail, unless I have to run on
the road in the winter orsomething, because we live up in
Teller County and it's justseeing all that wildlife,
finding those old, mysteriouscabins, sometimes finding some
cool rock or gem.
I mean you just never knowwhat's going to happen when
you're out there.
I actually purposely leave myphone in the car now.
I know Search and Rescuedoesn't like hearing that, but I

(01:06:40):
feel like it's bad luck, youknow, bringing it with me.
I feel like I'm always going tosee something cool if I don't
have it with me and just beingout in nature, and that's what
brought me to Colorado ingeneral.

Speaker 7 (01:06:51):
Yeah, I don't think I have a person or a few
individuals who drive me, butit's become part of my identity
and my community, and I stillenjoy it.
I just like the lifestyle rightnow.
So for that reason I want tokeep doing it and because of
that it's a time sink.

(01:07:12):
So doing it with so many otherpeople and engaging with the
community, that's an rewardingaspect too.
So it's how I socialize, it'show I have fun.
So I think those are the thingsthat keep me going versus a
particular person.

Speaker 10 (01:07:30):
I would say similar to John, not as much a person,
but to eventually reach the topof the sport and be the best, I
think is what drives me a lot.
I also absolutely just love torun.
So just getting out there forme is not necessarily like I
need to be inspired to do it,it's I have to do it just for me

(01:07:53):
.
I don't feel like they all say,instead of getting hangry, my
family all says I get wrongrybecause I didn't run.
So I think I really need it andabsolutely love doing it.
So that's what inspires me themost any other questions?

Speaker 1 (01:08:21):
No, nobody, all right .

Speaker 7 (01:08:24):
I think that concludes our night Guys.

Speaker 1 (01:08:26):
Thank you so much.
Oh, one last thing Is anybodyrunning tomorrow?
Show of hands.
Anybody going to be runningtomorrow?
Yeah, there's a shakeouttomorrow at 8 am Be here.

Speaker 7 (01:08:38):
Yeah, awesome, you're going in.

Speaker 5 (01:08:38):
Austin Bluffs.
It is in Austin.
Be here.

Speaker 1 (01:08:39):
Yeah, awesome.

Speaker 5 (01:08:40):
You're going in Austin Bluffs.

Speaker 1 (01:08:42):
It is in Austin Bluffs, yep If you're not
running Austin Bluffs open space.

Speaker 5 (01:08:47):
Make sure you come in the morning, because, well,
actually don't come.
It's a hidden gem.
It is an absolute hidden gem.

Speaker 4 (01:08:56):
We'll have some refreshments and coffee
afterwards that will show up andsome wrap lines.

Speaker 1 (01:09:03):
Awesome.
Well, guys, thank you so muchfor coming out, Thank you to our
panelists and thank you toColorado Running Company for
putting this on.
Thank you.

Speaker 2 (01:09:41):
I think I'm excited to see you.

Speaker 9 (01:09:43):
I'm excited to see you.

Speaker 1 (01:09:45):
I'm excited to see you.
I'm excited to see you.

Speaker 9 (01:09:48):
I'm excited to see you.
I'm excited to see you.

Speaker 7 (01:09:51):
I'm excited to see you.

Speaker 3 (01:09:54):
I'm excited to see you.
No, no, I was just going to saywe are not doing anything?

Speaker 5 (01:09:59):
Yeah, we're not doing anything.