Can control and power dynamics silently creep into relationships, affecting even those you least expect? Join us for a compelling conversation with Sandhya Nagabhushan, a licensed professional counselor and owner of Enlightenment Therapy Services, as we shine a light on Domestic Violence Awareness Month. Sandhya shares her personal journey and the profound insights she has gained from her work at a family crisis resource center. Her experiences illuminate the often-hidden realities of dating and partner violence, and we explore how such violence transcends gender and sexual orientation, affecting individuals across all identities, including within LGBTQ communities. Sandhya's compassionate perspective offers hope and the possibility of healing and transformation for survivors.
Together, we navigate the harsh landscape of toxic relationships, emphasizing the resilience it takes to survive the cycle of abuse. Our conversation dives into the phases of control and isolation, such as the "honeymoon" and "walking on eggshells" stages, and the often-overlooked role of stalking, particularly cyberstalking, in modern relationships. We discuss how social media can intensify these threats and why raising awareness and finding support are essential steps toward empowerment. With Sandhya's expertise, this episode serves as a powerful reminder that each survivor's experience is unique, yet there is potential for healing and empowerment at every turn.
Connect with Sandhya today!
https://enlightenmenttherapy.services/#about
(Licensed in Texas and Missouri, and offers Telehealth in DC, Maryland, Virginia, and Texas)
We are happy and honored to be part of your life changing health and wellness journey:
https://telewellnesshub.com/explore-wellness-experts/
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Marta Hamilton, LPC (00:00):
Welcome, friends, to the Telewellness Hub
podcast, a space wherelistening is not just a simple
passive act, it's an act ofself-care.
I'm your therapist friend,marta Hamilton, your host, and
today we're speaking with alistener favorite, sandhya
Nagabhushan.
She's an LPC and owner ofEnlightenment Therapy Services
and is licensed in Texas andMissouri offering telehealth in
(00:22):
DC, maryland, virginia and Texas.
She's a specialist, if youheard in our previously recorded
episode.
She's a specialist in datingand partner violence and,
knowing that October is DomesticViolence Awareness Month, I
wanted to unite and amplify hervoice, as she advocates across
(00:42):
the nation through this podcastand very much in those states
that she is licensed in, in theeffort to end and heal from
domestic violence.
Welcome.
Sandhya Nagabhushan (00:53):
Thank you so much.
It's a pleasure to be hereagain today.
Yes, I love connecting.
Marta Hamilton, LPC (00:58):
You know, we, behind the scenes, we
connect on our own meetings,we're planning all kinds of I
mean, every time we connect,there's so much synergy in terms
of this alignment and wantingto help others and share
information, and we just believein the hope of having thriving
lives for others.
So it's always wonderful toconnect and this is a tough
(01:21):
topic.
Right, this is a heavy topic,but it's important to talk about
.
It's important and I personallyhaven't met many providers who
specialize in this area.
So when we recorded our firstepisode and it came up that you
have a background in this, Ireally talked about doing a
follow-up episode and I'm sograteful that you're sharing
your time.
(01:42):
I want to start with asking whydo you do the wellness work
that you do specifically withinthis realm of partner or
intimate partner violence?
Sandhya Nagabhushan (01:55):
Thank you so much for that introduction
and for kind of summarizing mypassion and my kind of fervor
for helping people in thissetting.
I'll get started with saying alittle bit about my own personal
journey and why I do thewellness work with intimate
partner violence and domesticviolence in general.
As an undergrad student inMaryland, I often did an
(02:18):
internship where I volunteeredat a family crisis resource
center and that really opened upmy eyes and gave me a very
jarring but humbling experienceto be an intern at this family
crisis resource center.
I worked with survivors ofintimate partner dating violence
, gender-based violence,stalking, and it was a very
(02:41):
humbling experience.
I realized there's so much morework we need to do in this realm
.
And having it be DomesticViolence Awareness Month, I
think it's so important for usto bring enlightenment,
education and advocacy to allpeople of all identities and
constructs to understand thatthis is a really big issue and
we really need to educate,promote and help survivors heal,
(03:05):
and that's really why Ispecifically wanted to talk
today with you about thisparticular topic, being that
it's Domestic Violence AwarenessMonth and bringing awareness
and education and advocacy allaround the US and in the world.
Marta Hamilton, LPC (03:20):
Yeah, no, it's a very important topic and,
knowing that background thatyou had, I'm sure it must have
been really eye opening.
I mean you had firsthandexperiences and in learning from
others experiences and seeingthe healing and I I think that's
something that's reallyimportant in this advocacy work
and education work that you'redoing too is because you being a
(03:43):
therapist is such a privilege.
I tell people it's such anhonor to walk through life with
other people and to support themand just be that safe space
Right, and you, I'm sure, haveseen just incredible
transformation and healing and Ithink that's important to
(04:03):
highlight in bringing awarenessthis month to that that there is
this other side of healing andhope and you've gotten to
witness this firsthand.
So that's why I mean I just gotchills just sharing that,
because I think that's importantfor someone listening who may
have experienced some form ofdating or partner violence or
(04:28):
know someone, that there's thathope that things can get better
and getting to hear from youfirsthand how that is an
experience that can happen, thatyou can grow, that you can
thrive, that you can heal.
I think that's a reallyimportant message to share and I
want to back up a little bit.
I wanted to ask a little bitabout what is dating or partner
(04:52):
violence.
Let's back up, because we heara lot of different terms
domestic violence, dating orpartner violence.
I really, from your perspectiveas a therapist and again for
those listeners, we always havethis disclaimer you know you're
not the listener's therapist,even though we're therapists
right, we're not giving specifictherapeutic advice, but just
(05:14):
really want to share and bringawareness.
What is dating or partnerviolence?
Sandhya Nagabhushan (05:21):
Excellent question.
So I will start off by sayingit can look very different in
different relationships.
In general, dating partnerviolence tends to be about
having control or power over theother partner.
The partner relationship couldbe a romantic relationship, it
could be a cohabitingrelationship.
(05:42):
It could be be a friendshipthat evolves into a romantic
relationship.
It does not have.
There's not one fits all kind ofthing, and so what I wanted to
really emphasize here is thatit's a matter of a person and
the intimate partner of datingviolence having control or power
over the other person.
And what does that look like?
(06:02):
That could look like umcoercive ways to manipulate that
other person, withholding umintimacy, emotional intimacy or
physical intimacy.
Um, that could look like uminsults in public in front of
their loved ones.
That could um be continuousberating or gaslighting of the
(06:24):
other partner.
And I want to emphasize I thinkit's really important, marta,
as you mentioned that it's notgender-based violence and
intimate partner dating violencedoes not just occur with women
or with men or with any identity.
It could be LGBTQ communities,it could be men, women against
(06:46):
men, men against women.
I want to make sure we'rereally mindful and inclusive
here that, according to thestatistics, men are also
survivors of intimate partnerdating violence.
Women are survivors and we haveto really be mindful of the
language that we use andunderstand that.
It can go both ways.
Marta Hamilton, LPC (07:03):
No, that's such an important thing to
bring up because I thinksometimes there are
misconceptions and that can beharmful in terms of people
seeking help or sharing.
From the research that I'veseen that people feel like, well
, is this do I?
I don't want to say.
(07:23):
In the research I've heardpeople disclose that maybe they
didn't share or disclose or seekhelp or report right when the
violence may have beenconsidered a crime, because they
almost felt like who's going tobelieve me if I don't fit this
picture of what it looks like,fit this picture of what it
(07:47):
looks like?
And so I'm really glad that youbring that awareness and
mention that, because when itcomes to who can be a victim of
dating and partner violence andwho commits the dating partner
violence, I think there is a lotthere and in terms of your
experience, your expertise, whatwould you share about that in
(08:08):
terms of that, maybemisconception and in reality,
and based on research and basedon the actual experiences, who
can be a victim and who commitsdating partner violence?
Sandhya Nagabhushan (08:21):
Absolutely so.
When I continued on this kindof personal mission or goal of
mine to become a therapist andhelp survivors, an intimate
partner of dating violence,stalking, as well as you know
the whole gamut of undergrad atthe Survivors for Shelton, I was
an intern for Survivors ofIntimate Partner Dating.
(08:53):
Violence.
And then I continued with mywork at George Mason where I did
my graduate school work tobecome a sexual assault services
advocate.
Now that role really opened upmy eyes.
It was a humbling experience.
Again, Part of that role was Iwas the first line in command
with other colleagues that weretrained by professionals to
(09:19):
treat survivors.
They were the first people thatthey would contact on campus.
Literally, someone could beleaving a party and had just
been assaulted.
Oh my gosh, wow, and imaginethe magnitude of just the
desperation for help at thatpoint Absolutely.
Marta Hamilton, LPC (09:33):
Who do we go?
Sandhya Nagabhushan (09:34):
to who do we talk to, what do we say, and
always being mindful that ittakes a lot of courage to speak
up.
Marta Hamilton, LPC (09:40):
Takes 100% .
Sandhya Nagabhushan (09:44):
And that they need to know that they're
not alone in any space, thatthere's somewhere that they can
go to for support.
Every college campus hasresources of their own, and I'll
speak to the role that I was inat George Mason.
Again, we would hear from alldifferent walks of life.
(10:04):
There's no assumptions to bemade here.
Anyone could be a survivor Iwant to emphasize that and
anyone could experience datingviolence, and it looks different
from one relationship to thenext.
And it was very eye-opening.
It was a very humblingexperience and it kind of forged
my way to really want to bringmore awareness and education to
this topic.
I did have to escort survivorsafter a sexual assault and bring
(10:31):
them to medical settings to beexamined.
That was really tough work, butto be an advocate for them, to
stand by their side, hold theirhand 100%.
Marta Hamilton, LPC (10:42):
To be an ally, to be a support, to walk
with them.
Yes.
Sandhya Nagabhushan (10:47):
It was actually really very
groundbreaking to haveexperienced that and have to be
honored to be in that humblerole to where I can assist
people.
I also was a court advocate, sowhat did that look like?
As you mentioned, marja, somepeople do not want to report it.
And that's fully up to theperson to decide whether they
want to report it or not, and wemust respect their position on
(11:10):
that.
Because, as we know, with datingviolence, in some situations
there could be retaliation.
There could be and not tominimize the survivor's impact
on their psychological health.
Right, that's so key there.
I want to emphasize that.
So I was also an advocate tohelp them with their court
(11:30):
hearings, assist them to medicalappointments and also be a
bridge between law enforcementand people that are seeking to
get to report others.
But bringing it back to thecampus role I was in, it was
really all walks of life andthat's what I want to really
(11:53):
just say is never make anyassumptions about who could be a
survivor or who could be aperpetrator for that matter.
Statistics show that datingviolence can occur by someone
that they knew in a datingcontext.
It could have been someone thatthey broke up with, someone
that they endured a relationshipwith or any kind of intimacy,
(12:17):
whether it's emotional orphysical intimacy.
It could have been any type ofrelationship and sometimes that
evolves into an unhealthy, toxicdynamic.
That's where it can get scaryright.
And you're talking aboutcollege-age students who are
just developing their prefrontalcortex and developing the area
of the brain.
(12:38):
Imagine the impact of thesesurvivors and how strong they
are and resilient and powerfultheir voices are to speak up in
that setting.
Marta Hamilton, LPC (12:46):
Yes, I love the way you frame that.
You said imagine how powerfuland how resilient.
I think that's so important tohighlight because it's confusing
.
I think people don't realizehow confusing the experience can
be and to be strong andpowerful to to walk through it,
(13:08):
to reach out to.
You know, I'm just imaginingthat experience and you know
I've never disclosed this beforebut I have had to go and try to
obtain a protective orderbefore.
So I'm.
You know, obviously, that everycase is unique and every
(13:30):
situation is individualized, butit's very it can be surreal
depending on you know theexperience.
To just go to someone and say Ineed protection, just that
identification of like I didn'tfeel safe or I want to feel safe
(13:50):
, I think that's really.
It's a really powerfulexperience in in the sense that
it alters you.
So I think, bringing up thatpoint that you know you're in,
if you're in a college campus,you're still your brain is
developing and and navigatingthrough that to come out of it
(14:12):
feeling empowered and resilient.
I love that you highlightedthat because, as you mentioned,
you gave some scenarios Datingor partner violence can look
very different, right?
So if you don't mind,describing just a little bit
about what does dating orpartner violence look like?
You gave a little bit of someinformation there, but I wonder
(14:33):
if you could talk a little bitmore about that and what it
might look like.
Sandhya Nagabhushan (14:38):
Yes, and thank you for being so
vulnerable and sharing that.
I really appreciate that,because that's the way we get
other people to speak up and nothave to feel any which way, any
shame or any.
It really means a lot that youshared that.
Yeah, well thanks.
It humanizes all of us.
Marta Hamilton, LPC (14:56):
Yeah it can happen to anyone at any
point.
And I remember a lot, so manyquestions like how did I let
this happen to me?
Like, how did right?
Like, how did this happen?
And so I can tell you thisyou're right, as a therapist you
know even therapists like it'sa human experience to walk
through life and face differentchallenges that can come up, but
(15:17):
I, with amazing helpers likeyou, I mean, I could imagine how
wonderful it would have beenlike if I could have had you in
my corner, right To like guideme through it, to support me
through it, to walk with me, andthe legal manners, right, like
no one ever imagined.
You don't get like a guidebookof like if you ever need to get
(15:37):
a protective order or you knowlike, this is how you go.
All of a sudden, you're likewhat do I do now?
What happens?
So I think it's amazing thatthere are lights in the world
like you to shine a light in adark, in a dark time, dark space
.
So it's easy to share with you,right?
So and I'm hoping somebody willwill hear this and, yeah, feel
(15:59):
empowered.
So, and in terms of that kindof what does it look like?
You brought up a really goodpoint that it can evolve and
that's something you mentioned.
So, if you don't mind, justsharing a little bit more about
what you've seen, absolutely.
Sandhya Nagabhushan (16:15):
So many people have heard of the walking
on eggshells stage, so what?
That kind of what I'm referringto is often in a dating
partnership.
That's where it's toxic orunhealthy or there's a power
dynamic involved there, whereone partner is exhibiting
(16:36):
control or power over the otheruh, partner, um, you know,
there's the honeymoon stage,there's the um I, I, really, you
, are my everything.
Maybe a little bit of lovebombing there, or um, a little
bit of uh, you know, you mean somuch to me.
Don't ever leave me likeisolating the person from their
friends, from their loved ones,from their um classes, you know,
(17:01):
just really isolating theperson to where they feel, um,
let their end, all be, all iswith their romantic partner.
And through that stage itevolves to um, a breakout, so a
an eruption in some kind ofviolence, whether it be
emotional violence,psychological violence, sexual
violence, and the survivor is inshock, is confused, is
(17:29):
disoriented, is often left withthis.
You know, I love, love thisperson, but what do I do?
This is not healthy and um,then it goes to the romance uh
phase again, where the otherpartner kind of uh, woos the
person back in.
You know, it was just a mistake.
(17:50):
I, I didn't mean to, it won'thappen again.
Um, behaviors like that areexhibited and that's the walking
on eggshells phase again.
So, looking at the cycle ofabuse is what I'm referring to
there, the cycle of that abuseand how it plays out in
relationships, partneredrelationships and you know, it
(18:13):
takes so much to even speak onthese topics.
It really does.
It takes so much Resilience isthe right word, I would say,
like you mentioned but it takesso much bravery, courage,
survivor, or another personthat's experiencing some form of
dating violence, and there's nocookie cutter way to treat it.
(18:38):
There's no cookie cutter way todefine it.
Um, each situation is differentin itself and recognizing that,
um, we all have the power toovercome it and we all have the
power to heal.
Marta Hamilton, LPC (18:51):
Um, it's so important you, you, you
mentioned stalking in yourprevious episode and, um, I'm
just curious to hear more aboutabout that specifically, because
you know we don't my minddidn't go to thinking about
stalking when it came todomestic violence awareness
(19:11):
month, but I think that's a veryimportant thing to just briefly
discuss in terms of anyinformation that you can give us
in terms of what that lookslike and the hope for people
experiencing it.
I know that you shared that themajority of women 81% you gave
(19:36):
me the statistic who experiencestalking also experience
physical violence.
So I'm just curious if youcould share a little bit more
about what it would look like tobring awareness to this
component.
Right, you said nothing iscookie cutter.
There's not one definition.
Every situation and every caseand every person's experience is
(19:59):
unique.
But anything you want to sharein terms of insight when it
comes to the stocking, copingwith the stocking, getting help
for the stocking and the couragewithin the stocking- Thank you.
Sandhya Nagabhushan (20:13):
Stocking is a huge component of what we're
talking about today and now, inthe world we live in, albeit
online, social media.
It is what it is.
You have to accept the fact thatpeople can stalk in the cyber
world you online social mediaplatforms and it creates so much
(20:37):
cognitive dissonance therebecause, uh, you have people
talk about um, well, Iunfollowed this person on my
instagram, or I unfollowed thisperson on my social media and he
won't leave me alone.
He won't stop looking at myfeeds, he won't stop looking at
my.
That's just one component andand this, this is this more time
I'm so glad you brought up thatpoint um, this is really,
(21:01):
really a huge part of whatdating violence and specifically
stalking can look like in cyberstalking.
Yeah, um, and everything thesedays is um in the social media
role and I and as a therapist,um I try to tell my clients or
not tell, but encourage myclients to maybe take a break
from social media here and there.
(21:22):
Um unplug, do a self, um like aself healing journey on social
media because, um, along withstalking, there's cyber bullying
, there's cyber stalking.
But to specifically answer yourquestion, what does it look
like and in what context arewomen experiencing stalking?
You know, I had a one, verysweet and very strong as we all
(21:49):
are young adult woman at GeorgeMason who was experiencing young
adult woman at George Mason whowas experiencing stalking to a
very, very serious degree, tothe point where she would be
looking behind her shoulders tosee if he's following her to her
classes, she would be checkingher car and he would be leaving
her messages on her car and shefelt so, I mean the amount of
(22:12):
fear this person, this personhad induced to her and had
scared her and she didn't knowwho to turn to.
She didn't know who to talk toabout it.
She thought people wouldn'tbelieve her.
This is someone that she wasinvolved with throughout her
whole college experiencehappened to be doing this to her
.
You know, going to, what yourpoint is those preconceived
notions, or those misnomers, orthose misunderstandings or myths
(22:35):
yes, about those myths thatarise there and um, it's rampant
.
It can happen in any context,in any place, um, in any setting
.
Uh, social media is just aspowerful as a tool as it can be,
um, uh, misplaced sometimes.
I think you'd be the right word.
(22:55):
I welcome your feedback on that.
Marta Hamilton, LPC (22:58):
Yeah, that's such a good way to say it
misplaced, because there's somuch amazing opportunity within
technology and the ability toconnect.
But I could absolutely see, andas a therapist, I myself would
also recommend a break fromsocial media.
I almost call it like a socialmedia cleanse, right, like how
can we detox from the socialmedia?
(23:21):
And it does give an opportunityto nurture yourself.
And there is a vulnerabilityright with social media, and
especially for someone who maybe needing to truly heal and
feel safe and feel empowered andcame from a very vulnerable
situation where they were avictim especially.
(23:44):
I think it's such an importantthing to highlight the social
media, the technological aspect.
I hadn't even considered thatwhen asking yes, but I could see
how that is huge, huge, huge onso many layers there.
So I'm so glad that you bringthat up.
And my last question for you,really for this, is you know
you've done such an amazing jobat kind of giving us an overview
(24:07):
and bringing an awareness andhumanizing it right, like this
is okay to talk about it.
Even you sharing this lets meknow.
You know you have clients thatyou welcome, you encourage.
Let's talk about this, let'sheal, and you're so easy to talk
to.
You know, I'm even disclosingthings I haven't shared with
other people, but I think it'simportant to talk about and
(24:27):
bring awareness to it, and whatwould you recommend in terms of
what insight, what encouragementwould you say to someone if
they know someone who is avictim, or if they themselves
are a victim of dating orpartner violence?
What can they do?
What kind of encouragementcould you provide them?
Sandhya Nagabhushan (24:51):
I love that you phrased it that way because
that elicits the fact thatthere's the bystander effect,
that often that can occur.
And what is the bystander effectis when you're in a setting and
you see something, clearly,that is coercive, manipulative,
dangerous to another person oranother identity or construct.
(25:14):
And what do we do?
Do we take a bystander effectand see it happen and not get
involved out of many reasons forfear of putting themselves in a
compromising place or gettingin trouble themselves.
So specifically, I would say ifyou know anyone, if you know a
(25:35):
friend of a friend, if you knowa person, an identity of any
type, that believes or thinksthey're in a relationship or an
intimate partner relationshipthat has toxic traits or just
not healthy and it can grow intoa domestic violence situation,
(25:55):
please reach out to them, tellthem there's support.
You can reach out to1-800-799-SAFE that's the
domestic violence hotline.
They have trained clinicians,trained providers that are there
to support you at any point intime, 24 hours a day, and it's
safe, it's anonymous, it's therefor everyone to take advantage
(26:20):
of, to develop a safety planwith them, because I want to
mention that Marta like,sometimes it's not easy to leave
these relationships.
You know, it's not easy to leavethese relationships you know,
it's not and we should neverquestion the survivor.
Never question them until youwalk into the shoes of someone
(26:40):
who's going through it, or havebeen a survivor yourself, or
have experienced it with yourfriends, family, loved ones.
There's never a place or room tojudge someone I want to make
that clear and to give them thespace to speak up about it and
raise awareness and advocacy,but definitely develop a safety
plan which would look a littlebit like working with a team of
(27:02):
clinicians or calling thehotline and asking for a way to
develop a safety plan so thatthey can have an exit strategy
when things are becoming violent.
And just if I could just thankyou so much again for allowing
us to bring this platform to thepublic, because it is domestic
violence awareness month.
(27:23):
It's not uncommon to say you orsomeone you know have been a
survivor of this issue and it'simportant to bring as much
awareness, advocacy and to shareresources and information and
awareness and ways that we canall be an ally right To really
(27:57):
support and advocate.
Marta Hamilton, LPC (27:58):
And I'll make sure to write the phone
number that you provided andyour contact information in the
show notes because if you don'tmind just sharing a little bit
about how people can best reachyou and in which states.
Sandhya Nagabhushan (28:14):
Thank you so much.
I always appreciate you.
I actually am working withclients in Texas.
I'm here in San Antonio, Ibelieve.
Right, oh yes, we're both inTexas.
That's how we get so connected,I think.
Uh, so I I work with clients intelemedicine, telehealth visits
(28:35):
in texas, maryland, virginiaand dc.
I'm a certified substance abusespecialist as well as a
trauma-informed therapist, so Ilove to do emdr.
Just trauma work is my breadand butter, um and, of course,
um.
I have a welcome client of alldifferent backgrounds, walks of
life, faiths and identities, andI thank you so much for having
(28:55):
this platform to speak on thesetopics.
You really are.
Marta Hamilton, LPC (28:58):
We as a team here are making, are trying
to make a huge difference, andI appreciate your time oh, I
appreciate yours as well andthank you so much for being a
part of our wellness journeytoday.
Sandhya Nagabhushan (29:08):
Thank you.
Welcome, friends, to the Telewellness Hub
podcast, a space wherelistening is not just a simple
passive act, it's an act ofself-care.
I'm your therapist friend,marta Hamilton, your host, and
today we're speaking with alistener favorite, sandhya
Nagabhushan.
She's an LPC and owner ofEnlightenment Therapy Services
and is licensed in Texas andMissouri offering telehealth in
(00:22):
DC, maryland, virginia and Texas.
She's a specialist, if youheard in our previously recorded
episode.
She's a specialist in datingand partner violence and,
knowing that October is DomesticViolence Awareness Month, I
wanted to unite and amplify hervoice, as she advocates across
(00:42):
the nation through this podcastand very much in those states
that she is licensed in, in theeffort to end and heal from
domestic violence.
Welcome.
Sandhya Nagabhushan (00:53):
Thank you so much.
It's a pleasure to be hereagain today.
Yes, I love connecting.
Marta Hamilton, LPC (00:58):
You know, we, behind the scenes, we
connect on our own meetings,we're planning all kinds of I
mean, every time we connect,there's so much synergy in terms
of this alignment and wantingto help others and share
information, and we just believein the hope of having thriving
lives for others.
So it's always wonderful toconnect and this is a tough
(01:21):
topic.
Right, this is a heavy topic,but it's important to talk about
.
It's important and I personallyhaven't met many providers who
specialize in this area.
So when we recorded our firstepisode and it came up that you
have a background in this, Ireally talked about doing a
follow-up episode and I'm sograteful that you're sharing
your time.
(01:42):
I want to start with asking whydo you do the wellness work
that you do specifically withinthis realm of partner or
intimate partner violence?
Sandhya Nagabhushan (01:55):
Thank you so much for that introduction
and for kind of summarizing mypassion and my kind of fervor
for helping people in thissetting.
I'll get started with saying alittle bit about my own personal
journey and why I do thewellness work with intimate
partner violence and domesticviolence in general.
As an undergrad student inMaryland, I often did an
(02:18):
internship where I volunteeredat a family crisis resource
center and that really opened upmy eyes and gave me a very
jarring but humbling experienceto be an intern at this family
crisis resource center.
I worked with survivors ofintimate partner dating violence
, gender-based violence,stalking, and it was a very
(02:41):
humbling experience.
I realized there's so much morework we need to do in this realm
.
And having it be DomesticViolence Awareness Month, I
think it's so important for usto bring enlightenment,
education and advocacy to allpeople of all identities and
constructs to understand thatthis is a really big issue and
we really need to educate,promote and help survivors heal,
(03:05):
and that's really why Ispecifically wanted to talk
today with you about thisparticular topic, being that
it's Domestic Violence AwarenessMonth and bringing awareness
and education and advocacy allaround the US and in the world.
Marta Hamilton, LPC (03:20):
Yeah, no, it's a very important topic and,
knowing that background thatyou had, I'm sure it must have
been really eye opening.
I mean you had firsthandexperiences and in learning from
others experiences and seeingthe healing and I I think that's
something that's reallyimportant in this advocacy work
and education work that you'redoing too is because you being a
(03:43):
therapist is such a privilege.
I tell people it's such anhonor to walk through life with
other people and to support themand just be that safe space
Right, and you, I'm sure, haveseen just incredible
transformation and healing and Ithink that's important to
(04:03):
highlight in bringing awarenessthis month to that that there is
this other side of healing andhope and you've gotten to
witness this firsthand.
So that's why I mean I just gotchills just sharing that,
because I think that's importantfor someone listening who may
have experienced some form ofdating or partner violence or
(04:28):
know someone, that there's thathope that things can get better
and getting to hear from youfirsthand how that is an
experience that can happen, thatyou can grow, that you can
thrive, that you can heal.
I think that's a reallyimportant message to share and I
want to back up a little bit.
I wanted to ask a little bitabout what is dating or partner
(04:52):
violence.
Let's back up, because we heara lot of different terms
domestic violence, dating orpartner violence.
I really, from your perspectiveas a therapist and again for
those listeners, we always havethis disclaimer you know you're
not the listener's therapist,even though we're therapists
right, we're not giving specifictherapeutic advice, but just
(05:14):
really want to share and bringawareness.
What is dating or partnerviolence?
Sandhya Nagabhushan (05:21):
Excellent question.
So I will start off by sayingit can look very different in
different relationships.
In general, dating partnerviolence tends to be about
having control or power over theother partner.
The partner relationship couldbe a romantic relationship, it
could be a cohabitingrelationship.
(05:42):
It could be be a friendshipthat evolves into a romantic
relationship.
It does not have.
There's not one fits all kind ofthing, and so what I wanted to
really emphasize here is thatit's a matter of a person and
the intimate partner of datingviolence having control or power
over the other person.
And what does that look like?
(06:02):
That could look like umcoercive ways to manipulate that
other person, withholding umintimacy, emotional intimacy or
physical intimacy.
Um, that could look like uminsults in public in front of
their loved ones.
That could um be continuousberating or gaslighting of the
(06:24):
other partner.
And I want to emphasize I thinkit's really important, marta,
as you mentioned that it's notgender-based violence and
intimate partner dating violencedoes not just occur with women
or with men or with any identity.
It could be LGBTQ communities,it could be men, women against
(06:46):
men, men against women.
I want to make sure we'rereally mindful and inclusive
here that, according to thestatistics, men are also
survivors of intimate partnerdating violence.
Women are survivors and we haveto really be mindful of the
language that we use andunderstand that.
It can go both ways.
Marta Hamilton, LPC (07:03):
No, that's such an important thing to
bring up because I thinksometimes there are
misconceptions and that can beharmful in terms of people
seeking help or sharing.
From the research that I'veseen that people feel like, well
, is this do I?
I don't want to say.
(07:23):
In the research I've heardpeople disclose that maybe they
didn't share or disclose or seekhelp or report right when the
violence may have beenconsidered a crime, because they
almost felt like who's going tobelieve me if I don't fit this
picture of what it looks like,fit this picture of what it
(07:47):
looks like?
And so I'm really glad that youbring that awareness and
mention that, because when itcomes to who can be a victim of
dating and partner violence andwho commits the dating partner
violence, I think there is a lotthere and in terms of your
experience, your expertise, whatwould you share about that in
(08:08):
terms of that, maybemisconception and in reality,
and based on research and basedon the actual experiences, who
can be a victim and who commitsdating partner violence?
Sandhya Nagabhushan (08:21):
Absolutely so.
When I continued on this kindof personal mission or goal of
mine to become a therapist andhelp survivors, an intimate
partner of dating violence,stalking, as well as you know
the whole gamut of undergrad atthe Survivors for Shelton, I was
an intern for Survivors ofIntimate Partner Dating.
(08:53):
Violence.
And then I continued with mywork at George Mason where I did
my graduate school work tobecome a sexual assault services
advocate.
Now that role really opened upmy eyes.
It was a humbling experience.
Again, Part of that role was Iwas the first line in command
with other colleagues that weretrained by professionals to
(09:19):
treat survivors.
They were the first people thatthey would contact on campus.
Literally, someone could beleaving a party and had just
been assaulted.
Oh my gosh, wow, and imaginethe magnitude of just the
desperation for help at thatpoint Absolutely.
Marta Hamilton, LPC (09:33):
Who do we go?
Sandhya Nagabhushan (09:34):
to who do we talk to, what do we say, and
always being mindful that ittakes a lot of courage to speak
up.
Marta Hamilton, LPC (09:40):
Takes 100% .
Sandhya Nagabhushan (09:44):
And that they need to know that they're
not alone in any space, thatthere's somewhere that they can
go to for support.
Every college campus hasresources of their own, and I'll
speak to the role that I was inat George Mason.
Again, we would hear from alldifferent walks of life.
(10:04):
There's no assumptions to bemade here.
Anyone could be a survivor Iwant to emphasize that and
anyone could experience datingviolence, and it looks different
from one relationship to thenext.
And it was very eye-opening.
It was a very humblingexperience and it kind of forged
my way to really want to bringmore awareness and education to
this topic.
I did have to escort survivorsafter a sexual assault and bring
(10:31):
them to medical settings to beexamined.
That was really tough work, butto be an advocate for them, to
stand by their side, hold theirhand 100%.
Marta Hamilton, LPC (10:42):
To be an ally, to be a support, to walk
with them.
Yes.
Sandhya Nagabhushan (10:47):
It was actually really very
groundbreaking to haveexperienced that and have to be
honored to be in that humblerole to where I can assist
people.
I also was a court advocate, sowhat did that look like?
As you mentioned, marja, somepeople do not want to report it.
And that's fully up to theperson to decide whether they
want to report it or not, and wemust respect their position on
(11:10):
that.
Because, as we know, with datingviolence, in some situations
there could be retaliation.
There could be and not tominimize the survivor's impact
on their psychological health.
Right, that's so key there.
I want to emphasize that.
So I was also an advocate tohelp them with their court
(11:30):
hearings, assist them to medicalappointments and also be a
bridge between law enforcementand people that are seeking to
get to report others.
But bringing it back to thecampus role I was in, it was
really all walks of life andthat's what I want to really
(11:53):
just say is never make anyassumptions about who could be a
survivor or who could be aperpetrator for that matter.
Statistics show that datingviolence can occur by someone
that they knew in a datingcontext.
It could have been someone thatthey broke up with, someone
that they endured a relationshipwith or any kind of intimacy,
(12:17):
whether it's emotional orphysical intimacy.
It could have been any type ofrelationship and sometimes that
evolves into an unhealthy, toxicdynamic.
That's where it can get scaryright.
And you're talking aboutcollege-age students who are
just developing their prefrontalcortex and developing the area
of the brain.
(12:38):
Imagine the impact of thesesurvivors and how strong they
are and resilient and powerfultheir voices are to speak up in
that setting.
Marta Hamilton, LPC (12:46):
Yes, I love the way you frame that.
You said imagine how powerfuland how resilient.
I think that's so important tohighlight because it's confusing
.
I think people don't realizehow confusing the experience can
be and to be strong andpowerful to to walk through it,
(13:08):
to reach out to.
You know, I'm just imaginingthat experience and you know
I've never disclosed this beforebut I have had to go and try to
obtain a protective orderbefore.
So I'm.
You know, obviously, that everycase is unique and every
(13:30):
situation is individualized, butit's very it can be surreal
depending on you know theexperience.
To just go to someone and say Ineed protection, just that
identification of like I didn'tfeel safe or I want to feel safe
(13:50):
, I think that's really.
It's a really powerfulexperience in in the sense that
it alters you.
So I think, bringing up thatpoint that you know you're in,
if you're in a college campus,you're still your brain is
developing and and navigatingthrough that to come out of it
(14:12):
feeling empowered and resilient.
I love that you highlightedthat because, as you mentioned,
you gave some scenarios Datingor partner violence can look
very different, right?
So if you don't mind,describing just a little bit
about what does dating orpartner violence look like?
You gave a little bit of someinformation there, but I wonder
(14:33):
if you could talk a little bitmore about that and what it
might look like.
Sandhya Nagabhushan (14:38):
Yes, and thank you for being so
vulnerable and sharing that.
I really appreciate that,because that's the way we get
other people to speak up and nothave to feel any which way, any
shame or any.
It really means a lot that youshared that.
Yeah, well thanks.
It humanizes all of us.
Marta Hamilton, LPC (14:56):
Yeah it can happen to anyone at any
point.
And I remember a lot, so manyquestions like how did I let
this happen to me?
Like, how did right?
Like, how did this happen?
And so I can tell you thisyou're right, as a therapist you
know even therapists like it'sa human experience to walk
through life and face differentchallenges that can come up, but
(15:17):
I, with amazing helpers likeyou, I mean, I could imagine how
wonderful it would have beenlike if I could have had you in
my corner, right To like guideme through it, to support me
through it, to walk with me, andthe legal manners, right, like
no one ever imagined.
You don't get like a guidebookof like if you ever need to get
(15:37):
a protective order or you knowlike, this is how you go.
All of a sudden, you're likewhat do I do now?
What happens?
So I think it's amazing thatthere are lights in the world
like you to shine a light in adark, in a dark time, dark space
.
So it's easy to share with you,right?
So and I'm hoping somebody willwill hear this and, yeah, feel
(15:59):
empowered.
So, and in terms of that kindof what does it look like?
You brought up a really goodpoint that it can evolve and
that's something you mentioned.
So, if you don't mind, justsharing a little bit more about
what you've seen, absolutely.
Sandhya Nagabhushan (16:15):
So many people have heard of the walking
on eggshells stage, so what?
That kind of what I'm referringto is often in a dating
partnership.
That's where it's toxic orunhealthy or there's a power
dynamic involved there, whereone partner is exhibiting
(16:36):
control or power over the otheruh, partner, um, you know,
there's the honeymoon stage,there's the um I, I, really, you
, are my everything.
Maybe a little bit of lovebombing there, or um, a little
bit of uh, you know, you mean somuch to me.
Don't ever leave me likeisolating the person from their
friends, from their loved ones,from their um classes, you know,
(17:01):
just really isolating theperson to where they feel, um,
let their end, all be, all iswith their romantic partner.
And through that stage itevolves to um, a breakout, so a
an eruption in some kind ofviolence, whether it be
emotional violence,psychological violence, sexual
violence, and the survivor is inshock, is confused, is
(17:29):
disoriented, is often left withthis.
You know, I love, love thisperson, but what do I do?
This is not healthy and um,then it goes to the romance uh
phase again, where the otherpartner kind of uh, woos the
person back in.
You know, it was just a mistake.
(17:50):
I, I didn't mean to, it won'thappen again.
Um, behaviors like that areexhibited and that's the walking
on eggshells phase again.
So, looking at the cycle ofabuse is what I'm referring to
there, the cycle of that abuseand how it plays out in
relationships, partneredrelationships and you know, it
(18:13):
takes so much to even speak onthese topics.
It really does.
It takes so much Resilience isthe right word, I would say,
like you mentioned but it takesso much bravery, courage,
survivor, or another personthat's experiencing some form of
dating violence, and there's nocookie cutter way to treat it.
(18:38):
There's no cookie cutter way todefine it.
Um, each situation is differentin itself and recognizing that,
um, we all have the power toovercome it and we all have the
power to heal.
Marta Hamilton, LPC (18:51):
Um, it's so important you, you, you
mentioned stalking in yourprevious episode and, um, I'm
just curious to hear more aboutabout that specifically, because
you know we don't my minddidn't go to thinking about
stalking when it came todomestic violence awareness
(19:11):
month, but I think that's a veryimportant thing to just briefly
discuss in terms of anyinformation that you can give us
in terms of what that lookslike and the hope for people
experiencing it.
I know that you shared that themajority of women 81% you gave
(19:36):
me the statistic who experiencestalking also experience
physical violence.
So I'm just curious if youcould share a little bit more
about what it would look like tobring awareness to this
component.
Right, you said nothing iscookie cutter.
There's not one definition.
Every situation and every caseand every person's experience is
(19:59):
unique.
But anything you want to sharein terms of insight when it
comes to the stocking, copingwith the stocking, getting help
for the stocking and the couragewithin the stocking- Thank you.
Sandhya Nagabhushan (20:13):
Stocking is a huge component of what we're
talking about today and now, inthe world we live in, albeit
online, social media.
It is what it is.
You have to accept the fact thatpeople can stalk in the cyber
world you online social mediaplatforms and it creates so much
(20:37):
cognitive dissonance therebecause, uh, you have people
talk about um, well, Iunfollowed this person on my
instagram, or I unfollowed thisperson on my social media and he
won't leave me alone.
He won't stop looking at myfeeds, he won't stop looking at
my.
That's just one component andand this, this is this more time
I'm so glad you brought up thatpoint um, this is really,
(21:01):
really a huge part of whatdating violence and specifically
stalking can look like in cyberstalking.
Yeah, um, and everything thesedays is um in the social media
role and I and as a therapist,um I try to tell my clients or
not tell, but encourage myclients to maybe take a break
from social media here and there.
(21:22):
Um unplug, do a self, um like aself healing journey on social
media because, um, along withstalking, there's cyber bullying
, there's cyber stalking.
But to specifically answer yourquestion, what does it look
like and in what context arewomen experiencing stalking?
You know, I had a one, verysweet and very strong as we all
(21:49):
are young adult woman at GeorgeMason who was experiencing young
adult woman at George Mason whowas experiencing stalking to a
very, very serious degree, tothe point where she would be
looking behind her shoulders tosee if he's following her to her
classes, she would be checkingher car and he would be leaving
her messages on her car and shefelt so, I mean the amount of
(22:12):
fear this person, this personhad induced to her and had
scared her and she didn't knowwho to turn to.
She didn't know who to talk toabout it.
She thought people wouldn'tbelieve her.
This is someone that she wasinvolved with throughout her
whole college experiencehappened to be doing this to her
.
You know, going to, what yourpoint is those preconceived
notions, or those misnomers, orthose misunderstandings or myths
(22:35):
yes, about those myths thatarise there and um, it's rampant
.
It can happen in any context,in any place, um, in any setting
.
Uh, social media is just aspowerful as a tool as it can be,
um, uh, misplaced sometimes.
I think you'd be the right word.
(22:55):
I welcome your feedback on that.
Marta Hamilton, LPC (22:58):
Yeah, that's such a good way to say it
misplaced, because there's somuch amazing opportunity within
technology and the ability toconnect.
But I could absolutely see, andas a therapist, I myself would
also recommend a break fromsocial media.
I almost call it like a socialmedia cleanse, right, like how
can we detox from the socialmedia?
(23:21):
And it does give an opportunityto nurture yourself.
And there is a vulnerabilityright with social media, and
especially for someone who maybe needing to truly heal and
feel safe and feel empowered andcame from a very vulnerable
situation where they were avictim especially.
(23:44):
I think it's such an importantthing to highlight the social
media, the technological aspect.
I hadn't even considered thatwhen asking yes, but I could see
how that is huge, huge, huge onso many layers there.
So I'm so glad that you bringthat up.
And my last question for you,really for this, is you know
you've done such an amazing jobat kind of giving us an overview
(24:07):
and bringing an awareness andhumanizing it right, like this
is okay to talk about it.
Even you sharing this lets meknow.
You know you have clients thatyou welcome, you encourage.
Let's talk about this, let'sheal, and you're so easy to talk
to.
You know, I'm even disclosingthings I haven't shared with
other people, but I think it'simportant to talk about and
(24:27):
bring awareness to it, and whatwould you recommend in terms of
what insight, what encouragementwould you say to someone if
they know someone who is avictim, or if they themselves
are a victim of dating orpartner violence?
What can they do?
What kind of encouragementcould you provide them?
Sandhya Nagabhushan (24:51):
I love that you phrased it that way because
that elicits the fact thatthere's the bystander effect,
that often that can occur.
And what is the bystander effectis when you're in a setting and
you see something, clearly,that is coercive, manipulative,
dangerous to another person oranother identity or construct.
(25:14):
And what do we do?
Do we take a bystander effectand see it happen and not get
involved out of many reasons forfear of putting themselves in a
compromising place or gettingin trouble themselves.
So specifically, I would say ifyou know anyone, if you know a
(25:35):
friend of a friend, if you knowa person, an identity of any
type, that believes or thinksthey're in a relationship or an
intimate partner relationshipthat has toxic traits or just
not healthy and it can grow intoa domestic violence situation,
(25:55):
please reach out to them, tellthem there's support.
You can reach out to1-800-799-SAFE that's the
domestic violence hotline.
They have trained clinicians,trained providers that are there
to support you at any point intime, 24 hours a day, and it's
safe, it's anonymous, it's therefor everyone to take advantage
(26:20):
of, to develop a safety planwith them, because I want to
mention that Marta like,sometimes it's not easy to leave
these relationships.
You know, it's not easy to leavethese relationships you know,
it's not and we should neverquestion the survivor.
Never question them until youwalk into the shoes of someone
(26:40):
who's going through it, or havebeen a survivor yourself, or
have experienced it with yourfriends, family, loved ones.
There's never a place or room tojudge someone I want to make
that clear and to give them thespace to speak up about it and
raise awareness and advocacy,but definitely develop a safety
plan which would look a littlebit like working with a team of
(27:02):
clinicians or calling thehotline and asking for a way to
develop a safety plan so thatthey can have an exit strategy
when things are becoming violent.
And just if I could just thankyou so much again for allowing
us to bring this platform to thepublic, because it is domestic
violence awareness month.
(27:23):
It's not uncommon to say you orsomeone you know have been a
survivor of this issue and it'simportant to bring as much
awareness, advocacy and to shareresources and information and
awareness and ways that we canall be an ally right To really
(27:57):
support and advocate.
Marta Hamilton, LPC (27:58):
And I'll make sure to write the phone
number that you provided andyour contact information in the
show notes because if you don'tmind just sharing a little bit
about how people can best reachyou and in which states.
Sandhya Nagabhushan (28:14):
Thank you so much.
I always appreciate you.
I actually am working withclients in Texas.
I'm here in San Antonio, Ibelieve.
Right, oh yes, we're both inTexas.
That's how we get so connected,I think.
Uh, so I I work with clients intelemedicine, telehealth visits
(28:35):
in texas, maryland, virginiaand dc.
I'm a certified substance abusespecialist as well as a
trauma-informed therapist, so Ilove to do emdr.
Just trauma work is my breadand butter, um and, of course,
um.
I have a welcome client of alldifferent backgrounds, walks of
life, faiths and identities, andI thank you so much for having
(28:55):
this platform to speak on thesetopics.
You really are.
Marta Hamilton, LPC (28:58):
We as a team here are making, are trying
to make a huge difference, andI appreciate your time oh, I
appreciate yours as well andthank you so much for being a
part of our wellness journeytoday.
Sandhya Nagabhushan (29:08):
Thank you.
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