April 9, 2025 • 52 mins
In this week's episode of Witch Hunt podcast, Josh and Sarah translate to English when the guest speaks in Spanish. Please enjoy this new experience like we have.. We welcome Spanish documentary photographer and filmmaker Judith Prat. With a background in human rights law, Judith powerfully examines the persecution of women accused of witchcraft in the Pyrenees during the early modern period.
Judith discusses her documentary film "Decían Que Era Bruja" (They Said She Was a Witch), which pays tribute to the innocent women targeted during the witch hunts in Spain. She also shares insights about her photography exhibition "Brujas" and accompanying photobook featuring 67 striking images that document the landscapes of the Pyrenees and the women who inhabit them today.
Through her work, Judith challenges the stereotypical portrayal of "witches" as old hags, revealing instead the truth about ordinary women who were unjustly persecuted. Join us for this fascinating conversation about memory, justice, and reclaiming historical narratives through art.
Article:Dénia reflects on femicide with the documentary 'They said she was a witch' by Judith Prat
Purchase Judith Prat's Photo Book: Brujas
Listen to episode:Secrets of the Basque Witch Hunt with Jan Machielsen
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
Welcome and bianvenidos to WitchHunt Podcast.
I'm Josh Hutchinson. And I'm Sarah Jack, we're doing
something different today. You will hear our guest in
Spanish and then the English translation.
We hope you enjoy this new experience like we have.
Our guest is Judith Pratt, an artist from Spain.
(00:21):
Judith is here to talk about herfilm and her upcoming photo book
and exhibit. Decian Que era Bruja They Said
She Was a Witch is a documentaryfilm which pays tribute to those
accused of witchcraft in the Pyrenees.
This film explores the persecution of women during
witch hunts in the Pyrenees in the early modern period.
(00:42):
Brujas is an exhibit of photographs, which is also now
available as a photo book. With 67 photographs, Brujas
takes viewers through the history of the witch trials with
photographs of the Pyrenees and the women living there today.
Judith aims to show that the women accused of witchcraft were
not the stereotypical hags of popular imagination.
(01:04):
They were innocent women just trying to live.
Now enjoy our conversation with Judith Pratt.
Welcome to Witch Hunt Podcast. Please tell us your name and
about your work. Hi, Sarah Angels, and I would
like to say that I am very glad to participate in your podcast.
(01:26):
I really appreciate your invitation and I am Judith
Pratt. I'm a documentary photographer
and filmmaker from Spain, and mywork as a photographer and
documentary filmmaker is closelylinked to human rights.
I studied law and specialized inhuman rights before becoming
(01:49):
professional photographer and all my photography work are
focused on denouncing human rights violations and pointing
out the perpetrators. I am also very interested in the
relationship between people and territory, collective memory and
(02:12):
especially what happens to women.
All my work includes a gender perspective.
I am failing, sorry. My English is not so good and I
apologize for doing the interview in Spanish, but I feel
more comfortable speaking in Spanish, so sorry.
(02:33):
No problem. We're very happy that you're
here with us. Thank you.
And what is the name of your project that you're currently
showing? It's the trabajo que MI ultima
trabajo Dene dos partes next position photographica de Madame
Brujas which is Dioncordo metraje documental a documentary
(02:58):
short film called the Tianke da Bruja.
They said she was a witch. This work which is my latest
work has two parts. A photographic exposition called
Brujas which is in a documentaryshort film called Desean que era
Bruja. They said she was a witch.
(03:20):
What story are you telling? In.
(03:43):
This photographic work I talk about the witch hunt, which in
my opinion, is one of the cruelest episodes in the history
of humanity. Between the 15th and 18th
centuries, in the middle of the Renaissance, there was a social
consensus throughout Europe for which all women were potential
witches. Is a centador Las vas ESO tiales
ES Julie dicas para les ETI mar mil ES de Jos de la ovena en la
(04:06):
orcano. Yeah, one of the Los Echos mar
relevantes de la Casa de brujas opuridos en Europa to Vidan
lugar en en estania Y muyfo calisado en in Las in Las
Montanas and. They set the social and legal
(04:30):
foundations to legitimatize thousands of justifications in
the bonfire and at the Gallos right.
And some of the most relevant events of witch hunting that
occurred in Europe took place inSpain.
And we're very focused on the mountains called the Pyrenees,
right, where the crimes of witchcraft were persecuted by
the three types of justice that existed in Spain at the time.
(04:52):
La justicia de la sante quicition, la justicia
ecclesiastic Episcopal, ridiculous, incredulous entonces
(05:16):
Y aura como cerca papes de a ferdin fermar a la poblacion no
a Los animales. The ordinary or civil justice,
the justice of the Holy Inquisition and the
ecclesiastical or Episcopal justice.
The crime of witchcraft in Spainwas persecuted by those 3
justices, right? These women were sentenced to
(05:39):
death on the basis of such ridiculous and incredible
accusations. Ridiculous and incredible then
and now as being able to make the population sick or.
The animals with their spells, right?
(06:17):
Causing storms, droughts, big snowfalls, accused of keeping
packs with the devil, of flying over the mountains to meet with
other witches or with the devil,right?
Obviously this didn't happen. It was only in the mind of the
persecutor they confessed with the persecutors imputed to them
after days and days under torture.
(06:40):
Y album de la que Amin mas me Mia mabaraten fion de estoria ES
quesi Las mujeres en general emos de Las de la estoria en El
caso de Las mujeres. But obviously it wasn't true,
(07:04):
right? And something that caught my
attention the most about this story is that if women in
general have been relegated fromhistory, in the case of women
condemned by witchcraft, it has been much worse, in my opinion.
Right, because they are women who were victims of a femicide,
but it has not been told who they really were.
Not a condado que fuermo Peres que peniano ficios in
(07:27):
participant Italian presencia and trusofiera elastena
publicano like estoria que sobreYas allerados tan ustros Dias
durante siglos lo que siaco de El discurso de Los perseguidores
no ECA presentado estas mujeres como mujeres viajas feas E Mal
(07:48):
baras. It has not been told that they
were women who had traits, who participated and had a presence
in their society and in the public scene, right?
The story that has been told about them to this day, for
centuries, what has been told about them has been the
discourse of the persecutors, right?
And these women have been presented as old women, ugly.
(08:11):
And evil. From fuel amplificador del
discurso de Los perseguidores porreso ME parecia que tenia
(08:32):
todo sentido a yo de visa de la arte en este Casa la photorafia
para contar que NES fueronia centrelida para contrivoir
arista tarso memoria. But it is not told who was the
real woman victim of this feminicide.
(08:54):
The real woman condemned and murdered, is removed from
history or ridiculed. And also the art world was a
faithful amplifier of the speechof the persecutors.
That's why it seemed to me that it made perfect sense for me to
use art, in this case photography or cinema, to tell
who they were in reality, to contribute to rescuing their
memory and in some way to reconstruct that image, that
(09:16):
collective imagination. The costrido imaginario
connectivo que la re pare como victimite.
Rebuilding A collective imagination that redresses them
as victims and respects them, right?
That's what my work is about. Who are the women in this story?
(09:38):
Trabajo reales mucho documento de Los huicios de Las condenas
investigator Los artibos ES a conserva en espanol sobre so
restore sechos dove estenia Los echos porque enemos documentos
(10:02):
que La La or muchos de documentos and conservado.
Well, all my work, this work on the witch hunt is based on real
events. We have many documents from the
trials, the convictions, the accusations.
I investigated the files that are kept in Spain about these
facts, so I have the facts because we have the documents
that relate. To it or many of those documents
(10:38):
have been preserved. I had the facts.
I knew where these facts happened.
I had the names of these women, but I didn't have them right?
(10:59):
And I, as a photographer who hasalways focused my attention on
people and what happens to them,I didn't have the protagonist
this time, right? First, because I'm telling a
story that happened many centuries ago, and because in
addition, the protagonists were murdered, right?
(11:20):
Pasado El presente Y lo que alo ES buscar mujeres santuales que
(11:43):
vive en Los misos lagares do de Vivian Aquinas.
I could photograph a whole symbolism that has survived to
this day, right? And also traditions that have
survived to this day and that come from that time.
But they didn't have them. So I decided to provoke, to tell
their story, the story of these women.
I decided to provoke an encounter between the past and
(12:05):
the present. What I do is look for current
women who live in the same places.
Where those women lived. And through them we tell not
(12:32):
only the story of the current women who live in the Pyrenees
and all their complexity, but through them we tell the story
of those who were murdered for the crime of witchcraft, and we
pay tribute to them. Right.
The reality is that in the Middle Ages, women had all kinds
of traits. Perhaps when?
(13:10):
We think of a woman accused of witchcraft.
The first thing that comes to our mind is a midwife, A healer.
But the reality is that they hadall kinds of jobs.
They were midwives and healers, yes, but they were also
merchants, brick layers. They were outside the home
working. They had jobs.
Que la Casa de rujas eito fuen de bulbert a Las mujeres algar
(13:33):
al rol unico de tenerioso Europaavia vivido la peste la polacion
cisimo de mas benio capitalismo de obra parais E capitalis E Las
comadronas E Las parteras. Sylvia Federici says that what
(13:58):
the witch hunt did was return women to the home, to the sole
role of bearing children. Europe had experienced the
plague. The population was decimated.
And also capitalism was coming. And a labor force is going to be
necessary for that capitalism, right?
And the midwives not only helpedwomen to bring their children
into the world, they also practiced abortion and
(14:19):
prescribed contraceptive methods.
Is the tier caprares de Las parteras Las comadronas todas
Las bujeres de vienas muchas parteras muchas?
That is to say that through the midwives, all women had control
(14:41):
over their own bodies. That's why many midwives, many
healers, were the first to be murdered for the crime of
witchcraft. Right bueno.
They were. Removed from the public scene?
(15:05):
Well, through the current women who are the protagonists of my
photographs. As I say, we tell the story of
those who were murdered by the witchcraft crime, right?
And all of them, the previous ones and the current ones have
some things in common, right? The one hand, the variety of the
(15:44):
professional and personal profiles, but also that there
are women very attached to the land and the territory, and
women who in their personal lifeor in their professional life.
Question the status quo. They don't conform to the
(16:11):
socially established right and well.
Through the story of current women, we also dignify the
memory of those who were victimsof the witch hunt.
Where are they OK? En estania donde mas mujeresia
cesino por El de lito de brujeria cuen Catalunya en
Aragon en muyfo calisado como decia en Los pirinenos que sesa
corrigera montanosa que SE para Espana de Francia en Catalunya
(16:36):
SE registro de victimas en estania Y en Catalunya SE
promulgola Primera le local conocidanto de Europa que re
coje Y tercio de lito de Bulgaria.
In Spain, where more women were murdered by witch hunting, was
in Catalonia and Aragon and veryfocused, as I was saying, in the
(16:56):
Pyrenees, which is that mountainrange that separates Spain and
France in Catalonia. The largest number of victims
was registered in Spain and in Catalonia the first local law
was enacted, known throughout Europe, that collects and
pursues the crime of witch hunting.
En UN TE queno Pueblo de dos tiento sabitantes en estas
(17:17):
montanas SE cesino arendi cuatromujeres en Uno Niko professor
udivial por El de lito de projeria SE gregas Mai Las
majores matanzas en El Mundo en Uno Niko professor udivial en
francia a loto la de Los pirinosde estas montanas tambien nuora
ranca Tai brujas impulsada por El tribunal de bordeos no
(17:41):
convenfido de Las mujeres del bais Vasco prat destiny impactos
con El Diablo Y ER ambrujasno Y lanzo maran Casa de brujas tere
sultos befia mentes angri en El siglo de ticier.
In Eragon, which is where I live, it is my land.
In Eragon, in a small town of 200 inhabitants in these
mountains, 24 women were murdered in a single trial for
(18:03):
the crime of witchcraft. It is believed to be one of the
greatest killings in the world in a single judicial process.
In France, on the other side of the Pyrenees of those mountains,
there was also a great witch hunt promoted by the court of
Bordeaux, convinced that the women of the French Basque
Country had a pact with the devil and were witches, and
launched a great witch hunt thatwas especially bloody in the
(18:25):
17th century. Why my photographic and
(18:55):
documentary work on the witch hunt is located geographically
in this territory, in these mountains, in the Pyrenees,
right? All the female protagonists of
both the photographic exhibitionand the documentary short film
live in the Pyrenees, in the same places where these women
who were murdered by witchcraft lived.
Why did you do this project? Well, as I was.
(19:41):
Saying at the beginning, my entire career as a photographer
and as a documentary filmmaker is closely linked to human
rights, to issues related to women, also to the territory and
memory. And I think this was a great
topic that brought together all those topics that have
interested me as a photographer and as a visual artist, right.
It was a topic that I wanted. To address for a long time, I
(20:24):
always spend a lot of time researching before starting my
photographic work. The research process is a
process that I really like, right?
And I spent a lot of time researching before taking the
camera, and I start with the photographic fact.
Itself right when I started to.
(21:08):
Investigate about the witch hunt.
I had no idea that in Spain, where more women had been
murdered, it had been in the area where I am in Catalonia and
in Aragon, in the Pyrenees. I was born here.
I live here. Right.
When I discovered that, I was clear that it was a story that I
had to tell, that it was a storythat I was legitimate to tell
because somehow all those women were my ancestors.
(21:32):
They were my ancestors, right? So it seemed.
To me that it was more than pertinent that I approached the
story right. Who is this project for?
(21:59):
This is a story. I think that the subject of
witches, witch hunting is something that everyone has
(22:20):
heard about but no one knows in depth, precisely because it is a
very unknown story for the population.
It is a story that has been hidden, forgotten in history
books. As I was saying, the story that
has come to this day is the story of the persecutors, but
not the real story of. What happened?
(22:49):
So I thought it was. Essential to dignify the memory
of those women and tell everyonewho they were in reality, right?
(23:11):
It's been done for many years. But for centuries this hadn't
happened, right? We didn't know who these women
were in reality. So this story is directed to
everyone, to all the people who,like me, never were told who
these women. Had been right.
(23:48):
They haven't. Told us until now who these
women have been, right? This story in this photographic
work is aimed at all the people like me.
Since I was a child, I've been told that witches were old, ugly
and evil women of whom one had to be afraid, while the real
story of who they were was hidden.
(24:18):
I think it is very. Important for me as a
photographer to use the image tocontribute to the story, to tell
(24:38):
who these women really were right, and contribute to
creating a collective imagination that repairs them
and tells the truth about who they really were.
So it is a story that is addressed to everyone who has
heard of the witches but doesn'tknow very well what happened
because they haven't told us. Your project tells a collective
(24:59):
story through individual stories.
Can you tell us about how that works?
Asesinas por El de lito de bucarie ente Los Quinte entre
(25:30):
Los quinfidios tiocho 10%. Well, yes.
As I was saying, the resource that I use so that those women
murdered for the crime of witchcraft between the 15th and
18th centuries are present in mywork.
Let's say that the tool that I use is to look for current women
(25:52):
with similar profiles and who live in the same places where
those women lived. I established that visual
dialogue in my images between those women condemned to the
gallows or the bonfire for the crime of witchcraft and those
who currently live in the Pyrenees.
Pien ceriana or a Las brujasno pienes que mujeres oyen villa
(26:15):
poriens ER senaladas acusadas Y perseguidas por rujasno
pteroneste caso aricultoras artesanas esclidoras
investigadoras fientificas medicas O herreras O carpinteras
todas EE ya sonas protagonistas the historiano EE eston El
(26:38):
protagonistmo en estas position.I asked.
Myself, who would witches be now?
Who? What?
Women today could be pointed out, accused and persecuted as
witches, right? And maybe they aren't almost all
of them right? But in this case they are
farmers, artisans, writers, researchers, scientists,
(26:58):
doctors, blacksmiths, or carpenters.
They're all the protagonists of my story, aren't they?
They take center stage in this exhibition to recover their
memory E. Tambien, Parandre Todas and
(27:23):
Contacho, Historia E Defendernos.
(27:43):
And also for all of us to tell their story and defend
ourselves. I think this is also a work that
tries to establish a defense mechanism as a society against
ignorance and also against new forms of misogyny.
And the violence against women that keeps coming up, right?
Knowing what happened, knowing about the violence so many women
suffered, I think it should helpus identify current forms of
(28:04):
violence, learn to identify themand defend ourselves against
them, right? Tell us about the photos.
Well, ELE spectador tanto de Laspositio photographica como de la
pelicula documental E comprende estoria El paisade is
(28:39):
fundamental for. Me.
It was important that the viewer, both of the photographic
exhibition and the documentary film, could delve into and
understand a story that happenedso many centuries ago, right,
(29:00):
and in which so many things are mixed.
In this story and in my images, the landscape is fundamental.
We are talking about these events in Spain, happening in a
mountainous, inhospitable territory with a wild, hard and
beautiful nature at the same time.
And in the. Story.
(29:23):
The magical thought is also veryimportant the beliefs of the
population of that time. It's a.
Remastoria de misochinia Clara mente no portenta El decimo de
Las personas A cujas por El de lito de brujeria eran queres no
entor no no venta portente incluso mas pocos is the tier is
(29:43):
Clara mento me estoria sore la misochinia tambien de la Poca ET
odo ESO de nie que perfivirse enLas positioni en la peligula.
It is also story of misogyny, clearly, right.
A very high percentage of peopleaccused of witchcraft were
women, right? About 90%.
Even more were women. Although there were some men,
(30:05):
they were very few. That is, it is clearly a story
about misogyny too, right? From the time and all that time
had to be perceived in the exhibition and.
In the film De la Montana, then Territorio and the viewer.
(30:40):
Had to perceive all those thingswhen they saw by photographs,
right? It was important, therefore, to
get the atmosphere and the sensations of the mountain, of
the territory also in different times of the year right.
I was very interested in the fact that the photographs, well,
it took me two years to do this photographic work.
Into photography, as in Estas Montanas, in Toros Luares for.
(31:32):
Two years I was taking photographs in these mountains,
in all the places, because for me it was very important that I
hope that in the photographs thedifferent seasons of the year
will appear. Because territory and nature are
important in the story, right? Because the women could be
accused of causing a very hot and very dry summer that
affected the crops, but they could also be accused of causing
(31:52):
a very hard winter with a lot ofsnow, with a lot of cold that,
well, that put the population indanger, right?
(32:24):
These women. Could be accused of all those
things and that's why I wanted to see that change of seasons in
the images, that difference of the landscapes of the mountains
in winter or summer. Light is very important in
photography in general, right? Photography is light, but in
this case it was clear that light is a pretty important
factor that. Special light of the Mountains
(32:51):
in winter or. Summer at dusk or dawn, the
(33:12):
nights of summer in the mountains, all that was
important to the spectator to beable to enter the story right so
well. All that is reflected in the
images of the photographic exhibition.
The spectator finds all that when they see these images right
of this work. E Las.
Photographias EI retrados de mujeres E Las O Las Potamonistas
(33:34):
cambi EI mucho pisafe and we putante Porte la chiarafia El
territory El sisto it's important in estoria in.
The photographs, there are portraits of women.
They are the protagonists. There's also a lot of landscape
that geographically places us where we are.
It is very important because thegeography, the territory, I
(33:57):
insist, is important in this story.
In a photography encontrando en Los pueblos del pirineno no de
Los tirinenos, for example, Los estan tabrujas en Las gimeneas
de Las casas estas montanas no cesi en costrilleno Las casas
(34:21):
corona piedra en FEMA de Las gimeneas in the.
Photographs. We also find all that symbology
that comes from that time and that has been perpetuated to the
stay, a symbology that we continue to find in the towns of
(34:42):
the Pyrenees. For example, the witch scarers
on the chimneys of the houses inthese mountains, right houses
are still built with a stone on top of the chimney, because the
population at the time believed this protected the chimney from
the entrance of the witches. La floor del Carlo la puerta de
la Casa. They also placed the.
(35:19):
Thistle flower at the door of the house because they believed
that this flower protected the house, the home from the
entrance of the witches and all the evil beings, right?
All this we continue to find in the current houses of the
Pyrenees, right? And that appears in the
exhibition. It can be seen in the images all
that symbology that takes us to.That time, right?
(35:58):
The Portas conforma phallica What attempt well.
It's a compendium of everything,right?
There are a whole series of traditions in the Pyrenees in
which nature is exalted, but also everything that has to do
with the masculine, right? There's an exaltation of the
masculine. We find door knockers with a
phallic shape, for example. And it is not very well known.
(36:45):
What the origin is, but at that time it already existed.
There is a kind of exultation ofthe masculine, perhaps above the
feminine, in some of the traditions that are preserved
and that continues to exist in some carnivals in the area,
young boys are disguised with the skins and horns of the male
goat, the ram, the. The.
(37:26):
Ram the male goat was, accordingto the beliefs of the time, the
way the devil took to meet with these women.
Well, all that symbology that ismaintained in these areas, in
these towns, in this territory also appears in the images.
It can be seen in the exhibition.
(37:52):
LO que en ES al mujeres viviendoen SU propios pueblos esiendo en
aladas YA cujadas clearly my. Intention was for the spectator
to move to the geographical place, to the time to somehow be
able to feel what those women felt living in their own towns
and being pointed out and accused by their own neighbors
(38:14):
many times, right. Ecclesiasticals in Espanol
Iglesia like in Espanol Los tribunales.
(38:43):
Also. Persecuted by the authorities,
as I say, by all the authorities, by the civilians,
by the ecclesiastics. In Spain, it wasn't actually the
church that murdered the most women for the crime of
witchcraft. In Spain, the ones that murdered
the most women for the crime of witchcraft were the ordinary
courts, the civil courts, right?The Inquisition did too.
The ecclesiastical courts did too, but above all, the civil
(39:06):
courts. And can you tell us about the
documentary film? Photographic photography.
Photography, Photography. Well, I started doing
(39:42):
photography work purely with thephoto exhibition in mind, and
it's been a year since I've beentaking photographs and
photographing these women, photographing places, all these
symbols and rituals I'm talking about.
And as I said, I'd already met several of these women, I'd
photographed them, and I thoughtthat it was essential for the
story that everyone could listento it, right?
(40:09):
Yeah, you can see.
The photographs, right? But we couldn't listen to them.
And I thought their story was sovaluable that I thought it was
(40:31):
important that everyone could listen to them.
And that's when I decided to expand the project.
And in addition to a photographic exhibition, I began
to. Shoot the documentary sexy widow
(41:02):
and masted and torma trenta festivalis and masturbate pisces
differentes and lion rooting wine you know this is a short.
Documentary in which they tell their own story, their own life,
and at the same time they tell the life in the story of the
women murdered by the witch hunt.
It was a great decision, wasn't it?
Because the short film, the filmhas worked very well.
(41:23):
It has been shown in more than, I think, about 30 festivals in
more than 10 different countriesin one year in the last year,
right? Repercussion has had very good
(41:53):
reception and a great impact that I didn't expect, right?
With such a small, so modest film production and with such a
small budget, right? But really, the protagonists
have such a force that goes beyond the screen, right?
(42:21):
I wasn't wrong when I thought that we had to listen to them
and that everyone had to listen to them and that it was
necessary to make a documentary film with them.
I wasn't wrong because as I toldyou, the documentary short film
is working very well. It is working very well.
(42:52):
It's a wonders documentos que SEcon sermon Los archivos insistos
don't nobody legendas well the. Photographic exhibition consists
of 67 images, 67 photographs, some in large format and through
these 67 photographs I've followed the thread of the story
I told what happened according to the documents that are
(43:15):
preserved in the archives. I insist this is not about
legends, these are real facts. It happened in reality, right?
A. Sique a Travis estati cente ci
de machenes sigo El ILO de la Astoria Y con trujo mapa visual
evocador de Los echos Y Los lugares Clarence de la Casa de
(43:35):
brujas en espania en como de theafocalisado en en estas
montanas ques la cordillera de Los pirineros no so through
these. 67 images. I follow the threat of history
and I build a visual map evokingthe facts in the key places of
the witch on in Spain, as I was saying, focused on these
mountains, which is the mountainrange of the Pyrenees, right?
(43:57):
Well, identificat de la simbolosLas travicciones tambien Los
estigmas esta no Y loca de Las posifiones estas E machenes ES
estrir Los viejos estereo tipos pesados or estas mujeres via has
(44:19):
via SIM alvaras. You know san vicho, there's the
siempre quentos in factiles in the ninos.
You know San contao Las Peliculas, You know San Contado
Los artista Los pintores de Los Siglas.
Not I'm. Identifying the symbols, the
traditions, also the stigmas that have been perpetuated to
this day, right? And the goal of the exhibition
(44:40):
and these images is to destroy the old stereotypes, right?
It is to shout out to everyone, these women are not the old,
ugly, evil women we've always been told.
The stories we were read as children, the movies, the
artists and the painters have told us throughout the
centuries, Right Todos? Todos and representado a la
estas mujeres como mujeres viejas fias in malvanas no
(45:03):
minten fiones de fierle El Mundono El anasi estas mugenas no El
anasi El an mujeres intelligentes mujeres contre le
mafia Sofia Lina buno casos mujeres que caportava nasoso
fiera mujeres con con una sabi doria ecoros de mientos
anthestrales que pasaband de madres sairas Y quita Puerto do
(45:25):
ESO and tedas Y quitanas partanas de the de la circola
fion Buenos La La de locre divo de no all of them.
Have represented these women as old, ugly and evil women, right?
My intention is to tell the world that they weren't like
that. These women weren't like that.
(45:47):
They were intelligent women, women with jobs, women with
social relevance in some cases, women who contributed to their
society. Women with ancestral wisdom and
knowledge passed down from mothers to daughters.
And perhaps because of all that,they were feared and singled out
and removed, kept out of circulation, right?
Well, that's the goal of my images.
(46:09):
Isn't it?
(46:46):
The truth. Is that the images also navigate
through the magical thinking of a time in a population that had
to relate to a wild nature as the mountains were the mountains
of the Pyrenees, a wild and harsh geographical environment,
in many cases a nature that I did not always understand.
Actually, the photographic exposition in my images are
(47:07):
personal gaze that approaches history and territory, causing
an encounter between the past and the present.
I think that would be the summary of what the photographic
exposition shows. Fantastica por parte de El
(47:33):
publico no Las positio en elano dos mil venti tres en
photospania ques El vento photographico en ustro paiso
Gran evento photographico quedura tres meses
photographicas Las positio de espositio.
(48:00):
Yes, yes. The photography exhibition is
also doing very well, honestly, not even in my wildest dreams,
but I have imagined that this work would have such an impact
and be so fantastically receivedby the public right.
The exhibition was inaugurated in the year 2023 in Photo
Espana, which is the main photographic event in our
(48:20):
country. A great photographic event that
lasts 3 months, in which the whole country is filled with
photographic exhibitions. The exhibition was inaugurated
in Photospania in 2023 and sincethen it has not stopped being
exhibited in a multitude of cities and festivals inside and
outside of Spain. But for Puesto?
Francias exhibido ambiamente Camila in Andorra in tambien
(48:45):
mucho in Latinoamerica, functionado William in Latin
America. Estamos tereindo muchas ES
positianes in America, Latinas in Colombia, in Argentina.
Of. Course in France.
It has been exhibited extensively, also in Andorra and
(49:06):
also a lot in Latin America. It has worked very well in Latin
America. We are having many exhibitions
in Latin America. It has been exhibited in
Colombia, in Argentina. Recently we've been able to see
this work at the Havana Biennial.
And different spices the Latin America well and.
(49:42):
The reality is that it is scheduled all the year 2025 and
2026 is full of exhibitions in different countries in Europe
and Latin America, right? I hope that it can also be seen
in the United States at some point.
I really want to visit your area.
I think it's a relevant area. I've read a lot.
(50:21):
Too. And I've studied a lot about
witch hunting in your territory,and I think it's important to
establish those lakes, right? And this issue too, between
Europe and the United States, right?
Also with Latin America, of course, right?
So I hope that the exhibition and the documentary can be seen
at some point in the United States, right?
Yes, adelanto como como promethia OK nabrin salia la
(50:49):
venta El photo libro brujas and I'll tell.
You in advance. As a prelude, in April, the
photo book Brujas comes out. It's a third format where we'll
(51:11):
be able to see a book, a photo book that is also going to be
called Brujas Witches. It also includes some very
special literary collaborations of very special female writers.
Thank you. Thank you, esportado.
Which has raptias acido placer compartir este espacio compos
otros gracias portlandi pfioniosmando navrasso enorme ambos
(51:35):
otros. Yes, thank you very.
Much it has been a pleasure sharing the space with you Thank
you for the invitation and I send a huge hug to you and
everyone who follows your podcast.
A huge hug from Spain. Thank you.
Thank you for. Joining us for this special
bilingual episode. Join us again next week.
(51:58):
Have a great today and a beautiful tomorrow.
Welcome and bianvenidos to WitchHunt Podcast.
I'm Josh Hutchinson. And I'm Sarah Jack, we're doing
something different today. You will hear our guest in
Spanish and then the English translation.
We hope you enjoy this new experience like we have.
Our guest is Judith Pratt, an artist from Spain.
(00:21):
Judith is here to talk about herfilm and her upcoming photo book
and exhibit. Decian Que era Bruja They Said
She Was a Witch is a documentaryfilm which pays tribute to those
accused of witchcraft in the Pyrenees.
This film explores the persecution of women during
witch hunts in the Pyrenees in the early modern period.
(00:42):
Brujas is an exhibit of photographs, which is also now
available as a photo book. With 67 photographs, Brujas
takes viewers through the history of the witch trials with
photographs of the Pyrenees and the women living there today.
Judith aims to show that the women accused of witchcraft were
not the stereotypical hags of popular imagination.
(01:04):
They were innocent women just trying to live.
Now enjoy our conversation with Judith Pratt.
Welcome to Witch Hunt Podcast. Please tell us your name and
about your work. Hi, Sarah Angels, and I would
like to say that I am very glad to participate in your podcast.
(01:26):
I really appreciate your invitation and I am Judith
Pratt. I'm a documentary photographer
and filmmaker from Spain, and mywork as a photographer and
documentary filmmaker is closelylinked to human rights.
I studied law and specialized inhuman rights before becoming
(01:49):
professional photographer and all my photography work are
focused on denouncing human rights violations and pointing
out the perpetrators. I am also very interested in the
relationship between people and territory, collective memory and
(02:12):
especially what happens to women.
All my work includes a gender perspective.
I am failing, sorry. My English is not so good and I
apologize for doing the interview in Spanish, but I feel
more comfortable speaking in Spanish, so sorry.
(02:33):
No problem. We're very happy that you're
here with us. Thank you.
And what is the name of your project that you're currently
showing? It's the trabajo que MI ultima
trabajo Dene dos partes next position photographica de Madame
Brujas which is Dioncordo metraje documental a documentary
(02:58):
short film called the Tianke da Bruja.
They said she was a witch. This work which is my latest
work has two parts. A photographic exposition called
Brujas which is in a documentaryshort film called Desean que era
Bruja. They said she was a witch.
(03:20):
What story are you telling? In.
(03:43):
This photographic work I talk about the witch hunt, which in
my opinion, is one of the cruelest episodes in the history
of humanity. Between the 15th and 18th
centuries, in the middle of the Renaissance, there was a social
consensus throughout Europe for which all women were potential
witches. Is a centador Las vas ESO tiales
ES Julie dicas para les ETI mar mil ES de Jos de la ovena en la
(04:06):
orcano. Yeah, one of the Los Echos mar
relevantes de la Casa de brujas opuridos en Europa to Vidan
lugar en en estania Y muyfo calisado en in Las in Las
Montanas and. They set the social and legal
(04:30):
foundations to legitimatize thousands of justifications in
the bonfire and at the Gallos right.
And some of the most relevant events of witch hunting that
occurred in Europe took place inSpain.
And we're very focused on the mountains called the Pyrenees,
right, where the crimes of witchcraft were persecuted by
the three types of justice that existed in Spain at the time.
(04:52):
La justicia de la sante quicition, la justicia
ecclesiastic Episcopal, ridiculous, incredulous entonces
(05:16):
Y aura como cerca papes de a ferdin fermar a la poblacion no
a Los animales. The ordinary or civil justice,
the justice of the Holy Inquisition and the
ecclesiastical or Episcopal justice.
The crime of witchcraft in Spainwas persecuted by those 3
justices, right? These women were sentenced to
(05:39):
death on the basis of such ridiculous and incredible
accusations. Ridiculous and incredible then
and now as being able to make the population sick or.
The animals with their spells, right?
(06:17):
Causing storms, droughts, big snowfalls, accused of keeping
packs with the devil, of flying over the mountains to meet with
other witches or with the devil,right?
Obviously this didn't happen. It was only in the mind of the
persecutor they confessed with the persecutors imputed to them
after days and days under torture.
(06:40):
Y album de la que Amin mas me Mia mabaraten fion de estoria ES
quesi Las mujeres en general emos de Las de la estoria en El
caso de Las mujeres. But obviously it wasn't true,
(07:04):
right? And something that caught my
attention the most about this story is that if women in
general have been relegated fromhistory, in the case of women
condemned by witchcraft, it has been much worse, in my opinion.
Right, because they are women who were victims of a femicide,
but it has not been told who they really were.
Not a condado que fuermo Peres que peniano ficios in
(07:27):
participant Italian presencia and trusofiera elastena
publicano like estoria que sobreYas allerados tan ustros Dias
durante siglos lo que siaco de El discurso de Los perseguidores
no ECA presentado estas mujeres como mujeres viajas feas E Mal
(07:48):
baras. It has not been told that they
were women who had traits, who participated and had a presence
in their society and in the public scene, right?
The story that has been told about them to this day, for
centuries, what has been told about them has been the
discourse of the persecutors, right?
And these women have been presented as old women, ugly.
(08:11):
And evil. From fuel amplificador del
discurso de Los perseguidores porreso ME parecia que tenia
(08:32):
todo sentido a yo de visa de la arte en este Casa la photorafia
para contar que NES fueronia centrelida para contrivoir
arista tarso memoria. But it is not told who was the
real woman victim of this feminicide.
(08:54):
The real woman condemned and murdered, is removed from
history or ridiculed. And also the art world was a
faithful amplifier of the speechof the persecutors.
That's why it seemed to me that it made perfect sense for me to
use art, in this case photography or cinema, to tell
who they were in reality, to contribute to rescuing their
memory and in some way to reconstruct that image, that
(09:16):
collective imagination. The costrido imaginario
connectivo que la re pare como victimite.
Rebuilding A collective imagination that redresses them
as victims and respects them, right?
That's what my work is about. Who are the women in this story?
(09:38):
Trabajo reales mucho documento de Los huicios de Las condenas
investigator Los artibos ES a conserva en espanol sobre so
restore sechos dove estenia Los echos porque enemos documentos
(10:02):
que La La or muchos de documentos and conservado.
Well, all my work, this work on the witch hunt is based on real
events. We have many documents from the
trials, the convictions, the accusations.
I investigated the files that are kept in Spain about these
facts, so I have the facts because we have the documents
that relate. To it or many of those documents
(10:38):
have been preserved. I had the facts.
I knew where these facts happened.
I had the names of these women, but I didn't have them right?
(10:59):
And I, as a photographer who hasalways focused my attention on
people and what happens to them,I didn't have the protagonist
this time, right? First, because I'm telling a
story that happened many centuries ago, and because in
addition, the protagonists were murdered, right?
(11:20):
Pasado El presente Y lo que alo ES buscar mujeres santuales que
(11:43):
vive en Los misos lagares do de Vivian Aquinas.
I could photograph a whole symbolism that has survived to
this day, right? And also traditions that have
survived to this day and that come from that time.
But they didn't have them. So I decided to provoke, to tell
their story, the story of these women.
I decided to provoke an encounter between the past and
(12:05):
the present. What I do is look for current
women who live in the same places.
Where those women lived. And through them we tell not
(12:32):
only the story of the current women who live in the Pyrenees
and all their complexity, but through them we tell the story
of those who were murdered for the crime of witchcraft, and we
pay tribute to them. Right.
The reality is that in the Middle Ages, women had all kinds
of traits. Perhaps when?
(13:10):
We think of a woman accused of witchcraft.
The first thing that comes to our mind is a midwife, A healer.
But the reality is that they hadall kinds of jobs.
They were midwives and healers, yes, but they were also
merchants, brick layers. They were outside the home
working. They had jobs.
Que la Casa de rujas eito fuen de bulbert a Las mujeres algar
(13:33):
al rol unico de tenerioso Europaavia vivido la peste la polacion
cisimo de mas benio capitalismo de obra parais E capitalis E Las
comadronas E Las parteras. Sylvia Federici says that what
(13:58):
the witch hunt did was return women to the home, to the sole
role of bearing children. Europe had experienced the
plague. The population was decimated.
And also capitalism was coming. And a labor force is going to be
necessary for that capitalism, right?
And the midwives not only helpedwomen to bring their children
into the world, they also practiced abortion and
(14:19):
prescribed contraceptive methods.
Is the tier caprares de Las parteras Las comadronas todas
Las bujeres de vienas muchas parteras muchas?
That is to say that through the midwives, all women had control
(14:41):
over their own bodies. That's why many midwives, many
healers, were the first to be murdered for the crime of
witchcraft. Right bueno.
They were. Removed from the public scene?
(15:05):
Well, through the current women who are the protagonists of my
photographs. As I say, we tell the story of
those who were murdered by the witchcraft crime, right?
And all of them, the previous ones and the current ones have
some things in common, right? The one hand, the variety of the
(15:44):
professional and personal profiles, but also that there
are women very attached to the land and the territory, and
women who in their personal lifeor in their professional life.
Question the status quo. They don't conform to the
(16:11):
socially established right and well.
Through the story of current women, we also dignify the
memory of those who were victimsof the witch hunt.
Where are they OK? En estania donde mas mujeresia
cesino por El de lito de brujeria cuen Catalunya en
Aragon en muyfo calisado como decia en Los pirinenos que sesa
corrigera montanosa que SE para Espana de Francia en Catalunya
(16:36):
SE registro de victimas en estania Y en Catalunya SE
promulgola Primera le local conocidanto de Europa que re
coje Y tercio de lito de Bulgaria.
In Spain, where more women were murdered by witch hunting, was
in Catalonia and Aragon and veryfocused, as I was saying, in the
(16:56):
Pyrenees, which is that mountainrange that separates Spain and
France in Catalonia. The largest number of victims
was registered in Spain and in Catalonia the first local law
was enacted, known throughout Europe, that collects and
pursues the crime of witch hunting.
En UN TE queno Pueblo de dos tiento sabitantes en estas
(17:17):
montanas SE cesino arendi cuatromujeres en Uno Niko professor
udivial por El de lito de projeria SE gregas Mai Las
majores matanzas en El Mundo en Uno Niko professor udivial en
francia a loto la de Los pirinosde estas montanas tambien nuora
ranca Tai brujas impulsada por El tribunal de bordeos no
(17:41):
convenfido de Las mujeres del bais Vasco prat destiny impactos
con El Diablo Y ER ambrujasno Y lanzo maran Casa de brujas tere
sultos befia mentes angri en El siglo de ticier.
In Eragon, which is where I live, it is my land.
In Eragon, in a small town of 200 inhabitants in these
mountains, 24 women were murdered in a single trial for
(18:03):
the crime of witchcraft. It is believed to be one of the
greatest killings in the world in a single judicial process.
In France, on the other side of the Pyrenees of those mountains,
there was also a great witch hunt promoted by the court of
Bordeaux, convinced that the women of the French Basque
Country had a pact with the devil and were witches, and
launched a great witch hunt thatwas especially bloody in the
(18:25):
17th century. Why my photographic and
(18:55):
documentary work on the witch hunt is located geographically
in this territory, in these mountains, in the Pyrenees,
right? All the female protagonists of
both the photographic exhibitionand the documentary short film
live in the Pyrenees, in the same places where these women
who were murdered by witchcraft lived.
Why did you do this project? Well, as I was.
(19:41):
Saying at the beginning, my entire career as a photographer
and as a documentary filmmaker is closely linked to human
rights, to issues related to women, also to the territory and
memory. And I think this was a great
topic that brought together all those topics that have
interested me as a photographer and as a visual artist, right.
It was a topic that I wanted. To address for a long time, I
(20:24):
always spend a lot of time researching before starting my
photographic work. The research process is a
process that I really like, right?
And I spent a lot of time researching before taking the
camera, and I start with the photographic fact.
Itself right when I started to.
(21:08):
Investigate about the witch hunt.
I had no idea that in Spain, where more women had been
murdered, it had been in the area where I am in Catalonia and
in Aragon, in the Pyrenees. I was born here.
I live here. Right.
When I discovered that, I was clear that it was a story that I
had to tell, that it was a storythat I was legitimate to tell
because somehow all those women were my ancestors.
(21:32):
They were my ancestors, right? So it seemed.
To me that it was more than pertinent that I approached the
story right. Who is this project for?
(21:59):
This is a story. I think that the subject of
witches, witch hunting is something that everyone has
(22:20):
heard about but no one knows in depth, precisely because it is a
very unknown story for the population.
It is a story that has been hidden, forgotten in history
books. As I was saying, the story that
has come to this day is the story of the persecutors, but
not the real story of. What happened?
(22:49):
So I thought it was. Essential to dignify the memory
of those women and tell everyonewho they were in reality, right?
(23:11):
It's been done for many years. But for centuries this hadn't
happened, right? We didn't know who these women
were in reality. So this story is directed to
everyone, to all the people who,like me, never were told who
these women. Had been right.
(23:48):
They haven't. Told us until now who these
women have been, right? This story in this photographic
work is aimed at all the people like me.
Since I was a child, I've been told that witches were old, ugly
and evil women of whom one had to be afraid, while the real
story of who they were was hidden.
(24:18):
I think it is very. Important for me as a
photographer to use the image tocontribute to the story, to tell
(24:38):
who these women really were right, and contribute to
creating a collective imagination that repairs them
and tells the truth about who they really were.
So it is a story that is addressed to everyone who has
heard of the witches but doesn'tknow very well what happened
because they haven't told us. Your project tells a collective
(24:59):
story through individual stories.
Can you tell us about how that works?
Asesinas por El de lito de bucarie ente Los Quinte entre
(25:30):
Los quinfidios tiocho 10%. Well, yes.
As I was saying, the resource that I use so that those women
murdered for the crime of witchcraft between the 15th and
18th centuries are present in mywork.
Let's say that the tool that I use is to look for current women
(25:52):
with similar profiles and who live in the same places where
those women lived. I established that visual
dialogue in my images between those women condemned to the
gallows or the bonfire for the crime of witchcraft and those
who currently live in the Pyrenees.
Pien ceriana or a Las brujasno pienes que mujeres oyen villa
(26:15):
poriens ER senaladas acusadas Y perseguidas por rujasno
pteroneste caso aricultoras artesanas esclidoras
investigadoras fientificas medicas O herreras O carpinteras
todas EE ya sonas protagonistas the historiano EE eston El
(26:38):
protagonistmo en estas position.I asked.
Myself, who would witches be now?
Who? What?
Women today could be pointed out, accused and persecuted as
witches, right? And maybe they aren't almost all
of them right? But in this case they are
farmers, artisans, writers, researchers, scientists,
(26:58):
doctors, blacksmiths, or carpenters.
They're all the protagonists of my story, aren't they?
They take center stage in this exhibition to recover their
memory E. Tambien, Parandre Todas and
(27:23):
Contacho, Historia E Defendernos.
(27:43):
And also for all of us to tell their story and defend
ourselves. I think this is also a work that
tries to establish a defense mechanism as a society against
ignorance and also against new forms of misogyny.
And the violence against women that keeps coming up, right?
Knowing what happened, knowing about the violence so many women
suffered, I think it should helpus identify current forms of
(28:04):
violence, learn to identify themand defend ourselves against
them, right? Tell us about the photos.
Well, ELE spectador tanto de Laspositio photographica como de la
pelicula documental E comprende estoria El paisade is
(28:39):
fundamental for. Me.
It was important that the viewer, both of the photographic
exhibition and the documentary film, could delve into and
understand a story that happenedso many centuries ago, right,
(29:00):
and in which so many things are mixed.
In this story and in my images, the landscape is fundamental.
We are talking about these events in Spain, happening in a
mountainous, inhospitable territory with a wild, hard and
beautiful nature at the same time.
And in the. Story.
(29:23):
The magical thought is also veryimportant the beliefs of the
population of that time. It's a.
Remastoria de misochinia Clara mente no portenta El decimo de
Las personas A cujas por El de lito de brujeria eran queres no
entor no no venta portente incluso mas pocos is the tier is
(29:43):
Clara mento me estoria sore la misochinia tambien de la Poca ET
odo ESO de nie que perfivirse enLas positioni en la peligula.
It is also story of misogyny, clearly, right.
A very high percentage of peopleaccused of witchcraft were
women, right? About 90%.
Even more were women. Although there were some men,
(30:05):
they were very few. That is, it is clearly a story
about misogyny too, right? From the time and all that time
had to be perceived in the exhibition and.
In the film De la Montana, then Territorio and the viewer.
(30:40):
Had to perceive all those thingswhen they saw by photographs,
right? It was important, therefore, to
get the atmosphere and the sensations of the mountain, of
the territory also in different times of the year right.
I was very interested in the fact that the photographs, well,
it took me two years to do this photographic work.
Into photography, as in Estas Montanas, in Toros Luares for.
(31:32):
Two years I was taking photographs in these mountains,
in all the places, because for me it was very important that I
hope that in the photographs thedifferent seasons of the year
will appear. Because territory and nature are
important in the story, right? Because the women could be
accused of causing a very hot and very dry summer that
affected the crops, but they could also be accused of causing
(31:52):
a very hard winter with a lot ofsnow, with a lot of cold that,
well, that put the population indanger, right?
(32:24):
These women. Could be accused of all those
things and that's why I wanted to see that change of seasons in
the images, that difference of the landscapes of the mountains
in winter or summer. Light is very important in
photography in general, right? Photography is light, but in
this case it was clear that light is a pretty important
factor that. Special light of the Mountains
(32:51):
in winter or. Summer at dusk or dawn, the
(33:12):
nights of summer in the mountains, all that was
important to the spectator to beable to enter the story right so
well. All that is reflected in the
images of the photographic exhibition.
The spectator finds all that when they see these images right
of this work. E Las.
Photographias EI retrados de mujeres E Las O Las Potamonistas
(33:34):
cambi EI mucho pisafe and we putante Porte la chiarafia El
territory El sisto it's important in estoria in.
The photographs, there are portraits of women.
They are the protagonists. There's also a lot of landscape
that geographically places us where we are.
It is very important because thegeography, the territory, I
(33:57):
insist, is important in this story.
In a photography encontrando en Los pueblos del pirineno no de
Los tirinenos, for example, Los estan tabrujas en Las gimeneas
de Las casas estas montanas no cesi en costrilleno Las casas
(34:21):
corona piedra en FEMA de Las gimeneas in the.
Photographs. We also find all that symbology
that comes from that time and that has been perpetuated to the
stay, a symbology that we continue to find in the towns of
(34:42):
the Pyrenees. For example, the witch scarers
on the chimneys of the houses inthese mountains, right houses
are still built with a stone on top of the chimney, because the
population at the time believed this protected the chimney from
the entrance of the witches. La floor del Carlo la puerta de
la Casa. They also placed the.
(35:19):
Thistle flower at the door of the house because they believed
that this flower protected the house, the home from the
entrance of the witches and all the evil beings, right?
All this we continue to find in the current houses of the
Pyrenees, right? And that appears in the
exhibition. It can be seen in the images all
that symbology that takes us to.That time, right?
(35:58):
The Portas conforma phallica What attempt well.
It's a compendium of everything,right?
There are a whole series of traditions in the Pyrenees in
which nature is exalted, but also everything that has to do
with the masculine, right? There's an exaltation of the
masculine. We find door knockers with a
phallic shape, for example. And it is not very well known.
(36:45):
What the origin is, but at that time it already existed.
There is a kind of exultation ofthe masculine, perhaps above the
feminine, in some of the traditions that are preserved
and that continues to exist in some carnivals in the area,
young boys are disguised with the skins and horns of the male
goat, the ram, the. The.
(37:26):
Ram the male goat was, accordingto the beliefs of the time, the
way the devil took to meet with these women.
Well, all that symbology that ismaintained in these areas, in
these towns, in this territory also appears in the images.
It can be seen in the exhibition.
(37:52):
LO que en ES al mujeres viviendoen SU propios pueblos esiendo en
aladas YA cujadas clearly my. Intention was for the spectator
to move to the geographical place, to the time to somehow be
able to feel what those women felt living in their own towns
and being pointed out and accused by their own neighbors
(38:14):
many times, right. Ecclesiasticals in Espanol
Iglesia like in Espanol Los tribunales.
(38:43):
Also. Persecuted by the authorities,
as I say, by all the authorities, by the civilians,
by the ecclesiastics. In Spain, it wasn't actually the
church that murdered the most women for the crime of
witchcraft. In Spain, the ones that murdered
the most women for the crime of witchcraft were the ordinary
courts, the civil courts, right?The Inquisition did too.
The ecclesiastical courts did too, but above all, the civil
(39:06):
courts. And can you tell us about the
documentary film? Photographic photography.
Photography, Photography. Well, I started doing
(39:42):
photography work purely with thephoto exhibition in mind, and
it's been a year since I've beentaking photographs and
photographing these women, photographing places, all these
symbols and rituals I'm talking about.
And as I said, I'd already met several of these women, I'd
photographed them, and I thoughtthat it was essential for the
story that everyone could listento it, right?
(40:09):
Yeah, you can see.
The photographs, right? But we couldn't listen to them.
And I thought their story was sovaluable that I thought it was
(40:31):
important that everyone could listen to them.
And that's when I decided to expand the project.
And in addition to a photographic exhibition, I began
to. Shoot the documentary sexy widow
(41:02):
and masted and torma trenta festivalis and masturbate pisces
differentes and lion rooting wine you know this is a short.
Documentary in which they tell their own story, their own life,
and at the same time they tell the life in the story of the
women murdered by the witch hunt.
It was a great decision, wasn't it?
Because the short film, the filmhas worked very well.
(41:23):
It has been shown in more than, I think, about 30 festivals in
more than 10 different countriesin one year in the last year,
right? Repercussion has had very good
(41:53):
reception and a great impact that I didn't expect, right?
With such a small, so modest film production and with such a
small budget, right? But really, the protagonists
have such a force that goes beyond the screen, right?
(42:21):
I wasn't wrong when I thought that we had to listen to them
and that everyone had to listen to them and that it was
necessary to make a documentary film with them.
I wasn't wrong because as I toldyou, the documentary short film
is working very well. It is working very well.
(42:52):
It's a wonders documentos que SEcon sermon Los archivos insistos
don't nobody legendas well the. Photographic exhibition consists
of 67 images, 67 photographs, some in large format and through
these 67 photographs I've followed the thread of the story
I told what happened according to the documents that are
(43:15):
preserved in the archives. I insist this is not about
legends, these are real facts. It happened in reality, right?
A. Sique a Travis estati cente ci
de machenes sigo El ILO de la Astoria Y con trujo mapa visual
evocador de Los echos Y Los lugares Clarence de la Casa de
(43:35):
brujas en espania en como de theafocalisado en en estas
montanas ques la cordillera de Los pirineros no so through
these. 67 images. I follow the threat of history
and I build a visual map evokingthe facts in the key places of
the witch on in Spain, as I was saying, focused on these
mountains, which is the mountainrange of the Pyrenees, right?
(43:57):
Well, identificat de la simbolosLas travicciones tambien Los
estigmas esta no Y loca de Las posifiones estas E machenes ES
estrir Los viejos estereo tipos pesados or estas mujeres via has
(44:19):
via SIM alvaras. You know san vicho, there's the
siempre quentos in factiles in the ninos.
You know San contao Las Peliculas, You know San Contado
Los artista Los pintores de Los Siglas.
Not I'm. Identifying the symbols, the
traditions, also the stigmas that have been perpetuated to
this day, right? And the goal of the exhibition
(44:40):
and these images is to destroy the old stereotypes, right?
It is to shout out to everyone, these women are not the old,
ugly, evil women we've always been told.
The stories we were read as children, the movies, the
artists and the painters have told us throughout the
centuries, Right Todos? Todos and representado a la
estas mujeres como mujeres viejas fias in malvanas no
(45:03):
minten fiones de fierle El Mundono El anasi estas mugenas no El
anasi El an mujeres intelligentes mujeres contre le
mafia Sofia Lina buno casos mujeres que caportava nasoso
fiera mujeres con con una sabi doria ecoros de mientos
anthestrales que pasaband de madres sairas Y quita Puerto do
(45:25):
ESO and tedas Y quitanas partanas de the de la circola
fion Buenos La La de locre divo de no all of them.
Have represented these women as old, ugly and evil women, right?
My intention is to tell the world that they weren't like
that. These women weren't like that.
(45:47):
They were intelligent women, women with jobs, women with
social relevance in some cases, women who contributed to their
society. Women with ancestral wisdom and
knowledge passed down from mothers to daughters.
And perhaps because of all that,they were feared and singled out
and removed, kept out of circulation, right?
Well, that's the goal of my images.
(46:09):
Isn't it?
(46:46):
The truth. Is that the images also navigate
through the magical thinking of a time in a population that had
to relate to a wild nature as the mountains were the mountains
of the Pyrenees, a wild and harsh geographical environment,
in many cases a nature that I did not always understand.
Actually, the photographic exposition in my images are
(47:07):
personal gaze that approaches history and territory, causing
an encounter between the past and the present.
I think that would be the summary of what the photographic
exposition shows. Fantastica por parte de El
(47:33):
publico no Las positio en elano dos mil venti tres en
photospania ques El vento photographico en ustro paiso
Gran evento photographico quedura tres meses
photographicas Las positio de espositio.
(48:00):
Yes, yes. The photography exhibition is
also doing very well, honestly, not even in my wildest dreams,
but I have imagined that this work would have such an impact
and be so fantastically receivedby the public right.
The exhibition was inaugurated in the year 2023 in Photo
Espana, which is the main photographic event in our
(48:20):
country. A great photographic event that
lasts 3 months, in which the whole country is filled with
photographic exhibitions. The exhibition was inaugurated
in Photospania in 2023 and sincethen it has not stopped being
exhibited in a multitude of cities and festivals inside and
outside of Spain. But for Puesto?
Francias exhibido ambiamente Camila in Andorra in tambien
(48:45):
mucho in Latinoamerica, functionado William in Latin
America. Estamos tereindo muchas ES
positianes in America, Latinas in Colombia, in Argentina.
Of. Course in France.
It has been exhibited extensively, also in Andorra and
(49:06):
also a lot in Latin America. It has worked very well in Latin
America. We are having many exhibitions
in Latin America. It has been exhibited in
Colombia, in Argentina. Recently we've been able to see
this work at the Havana Biennial.
And different spices the Latin America well and.
(49:42):
The reality is that it is scheduled all the year 2025 and
2026 is full of exhibitions in different countries in Europe
and Latin America, right? I hope that it can also be seen
in the United States at some point.
I really want to visit your area.
I think it's a relevant area. I've read a lot.
(50:21):
Too. And I've studied a lot about
witch hunting in your territory,and I think it's important to
establish those lakes, right? And this issue too, between
Europe and the United States, right?
Also with Latin America, of course, right?
So I hope that the exhibition and the documentary can be seen
at some point in the United States, right?
Yes, adelanto como como promethia OK nabrin salia la
(50:49):
venta El photo libro brujas and I'll tell.
You in advance. As a prelude, in April, the
photo book Brujas comes out. It's a third format where we'll
(51:11):
be able to see a book, a photo book that is also going to be
called Brujas Witches. It also includes some very
special literary collaborations of very special female writers.
Thank you. Thank you, esportado.
Which has raptias acido placer compartir este espacio compos
otros gracias portlandi pfioniosmando navrasso enorme ambos
(51:35):
otros. Yes, thank you very.
Much it has been a pleasure sharing the space with you Thank
you for the invitation and I send a huge hug to you and
everyone who follows your podcast.
A huge hug from Spain. Thank you.
Thank you for. Joining us for this special
bilingual episode. Join us again next week.
(51:58):
Have a great today and a beautiful tomorrow.
Popular Podcasts
Stuff You Should Know
If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.
Cardiac Cowboys
The heart was always off-limits to surgeons. Cutting into it spelled instant death for the patient. That is, until a ragtag group of doctors scattered across the Midwest and Texas decided to throw out the rule book. Working in makeshift laboratories and home garages, using medical devices made from scavenged machine parts and beer tubes, these men and women invented the field of open heart surgery. Odds are, someone you know is alive because of them. So why has history left them behind? Presented by Chris Pine, CARDIAC COWBOYS tells the gripping true story behind the birth of heart surgery, and the young, Greatest Generation doctors who made it happen. For years, they competed and feuded, racing to be the first, the best, and the most prolific. Some appeared on the cover of Time Magazine, operated on kings and advised presidents. Others ended up disgraced, penniless, and convicted of felonies. Together, they ignited a revolution in medicine, and changed the world.
The Joe Rogan Experience
The official podcast of comedian Joe Rogan.