October 3, 2024 • 37 mins
Are you looking for a Third Growth Option ℠ ?
What does it take to build a soulful brand that resonates deeply with its community? In this episode of the Third Growth Officer podcast, we sit down with Nora Napientek, the creative force behind the celebrated company, and Janice Christensen, the first employee and president, to uncover the secrets behind their incredible journey. From Nora’s memorable marketing stunts, like balancing a platter on her head, to the support she received from her brother during challenging times, we explore the resilience and innovation that have become the hallmarks of their brand. Learn how their commitment to an authentic community within market booths and beyond has been integral to their success.
Discover the importance of deliberate and intentional growth as Nora and Janice share their philosophy of prioritizing long-term goals over immediate financial gains. They reveal how being selective about partnerships and maintaining a steady pace has allowed them to nurture genuine relationships with partners and customers. This thoughtful approach has not only fostered mutual growth and sustainability but also helped build a brand that truly connects with retailers. The significance of saying no to misaligned opportunities underscores their strategic vision and dedication to maintaining brand integrity.
We also discuss the dynamics of successful business partnerships and how diversity within a team can drive success. Nora and Janice emphasize the value of hiring for character and training for skill, showcasing how different personalities and skill sets can enhance a business unit. Their insights into unique sales strategies and thoughtful philanthropy offer valuable lessons for aspiring entrepreneurs. By extending their willingness to assist anyone in the industry, Nora and Janice highlight the importance of community support and collaboration. Tune in for a masterclass in sustainable growth and learn how to foster a supportive entrepreneurial environment.
Always growing.
Benno Duenkelsbuehler
CEO & Chief Sherpa of (re)ALIGN
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:02):
Hey, welcome to the Third Growth Officer podcast,
where we talk about all thingsgrowth, yes, even and especially
those hard parts where you shedsome skin and pick yourself up
by the bootstraps.
Hey, I'm Benno Dunkelspüler,growth sherpa and OG hashtag
growth nerd.
We're on a mission to redefinesuccess inside and outside the
(00:23):
business, one TGO episode at atime.
Speaker 2 (00:33):
Hi guys, I'm Nora with Nora Fleming.
I founded Nora Fleming 20 yearsago this year and I'm super
excited to share our story withyou guys today.
We are coming live from you.
I'm in Chicago.
Speaker 3 (00:48):
And I'm Janice Christensen, president of Nora
Fleming, first employee and beenwith the company for 16 years
and really proud and excited tobe part of our amazing team.
Looking forward to today.
Speaker 4 (01:05):
So thank you so much, both of you, nora and Janice,
for coming on this podcast.
Nora Fleming as a company issort of well-known I think I can
use the word legendary in thesense that it's unique.
People know what you do.
I'm just excited to learn moreabout the origin story and then
(01:29):
talk a little bit about yourphilosophy on growth and
business and branding and people, and we'll get into all kinds
of things.
But I'll leave it open to whowants to answer or just start us
on.
Actually, I'm going to ask aquestion around your.
I read this in this articlethat, janice, you had sent me
(01:53):
how Nora Fleming spent the first10 years in the temporary
booths at the Atlanta market and, nora, rumor has it so it was
written that you would walk upand down the aisles balancing a
plate on top of your head isthat what's up with that?
Speaker 2 (02:09):
yeah, unfortunately that is a true story.
Um, as any small business ownerknows, or new entrepreneur
knows, it's very hard to getyour concept out there.
So I was just finding peoplewalking by not really
understanding the concept ofwhat we were doing.
Um, so I came up with a littleploy to walk up and down the
(02:30):
aisle with platters on my head,and of course that stopped
people, because who's the crazylady with a ceramic platter on
her head.
And then it gave me theopportunity to explain what we
do.
When people would ask what areyou doing with the platter on
your head, I could explain howthey were all interchangeable
and how each piece is a basepiece that can work with many
different seasons orcelebrations.
(02:50):
So it kind of gave me anopening to talk to people, if
you will.
Speaker 4 (02:54):
I think some people I have referred I have heard that
being referred to, as you know,burning your cool card, losing
you know?
Oh, it was gone right away.
Pride's a renewable resource,right?
Speaker 2 (03:08):
Gone right away.
But you know you, you didn'tcare, you just wanted to to just
garnish five minutes ofsomebody's time, um, so that's
really all we were looking to do, and nine times out of 10, they
were like oh, never, neverthought of that.
I wish I had thought of that,so so that I never got any bad
reactions from it.
So that was good and, as far asthe temps go, yeah, that was
(03:29):
our home for 10 years.
Um, very purposefully, um, wekind of made our own little
family and our aisle andbuilding three.
um.
As the years went by and as wegrew, we would just kind of take
up more and more space and then, about 10 years in, we decided
that it was time for us to moveup to our own showroom.
(03:49):
It was really nice.
It's always been our company'sphilosophy to try and help the
newer companies.
So as we grew we knew we woulddraw some crowds in and we would
get really excited abouttelling our new neighbors who
hadn't been to market beforewhat our busy hours were, what
to expect at certain times ofthe day, and it also gave us an
opportunity to introduce ourclientele to our neighbors, you
(04:12):
know, on different sides of theof the hallway, which was, which
was just an amazing opportunityto be given.
Speaker 3 (04:21):
Yeah, I think that was really deliberate in the
sense that it was such acommunity, because everyone's
right by you and you can pointpeople.
That way you can still do it inthe showroom, but it's a lot
easier when the booth is reallytwo down and do you have a
staple gun, and all of thattaking place in those final
hours before we're ready to open.
(04:41):
It really is a different senseof community there.
And so it was 10 by 10 and then10 by 20.
(05:02):
Then we've got a 10 by 30.
And eventually we thought, okay, we're dragging so much stuff
down here, maybe it's time toopen up a showroom.
But it was really fun and agreat community it really was.
Speaker 4 (05:14):
And I think this sense of community is really
integral to the brand, to theproduct, to the way you behave
as a team and as individuals,Talk a little bit more about.
Well, I'm guessing that thesense of community is largely I
(05:37):
mean, it had to have originatedfrom the founder, Nora, and then
also Janice, your employeenumber one for 16 of this
20-year journey so far.
But it's just about kind ofbeing.
I mean, Nora, the person, andNora Fleming, the brand, are
(06:00):
kind of the same thing.
Is that how you see it, Nora?
Speaker 2 (06:08):
um, it is how I would like to see it.
Yes, um, both of my personaskind of play off each other.
Um, I?
I'd like to start by saying so.
I started the company with mybrother originally 20 years ago.
It was was just the two of us,Um, so it really does come from
like a true family um originstory.
(06:29):
And when it when it started, Iwas just making them myself in
the basement and I had had myfirst child, so I was kind of
doing it, kind of not doing it.
And then I had had my secondchild and she was born with some
medical difficulties and I hadsevere postpartum depression
with her Um, so I kind ofdropped out of the world
(06:50):
altogether.
At that point my brother cameto me and said people really
like your art.
I don't want to see this as asetback.
Let let's, you know, let metake over.
And I kind of handed over thereins to him while I focused on
her and getting myself back in ain a mentally healthy space.
Um, so that's like because itcomes from such a vulnerable
origin Um, I think that's reallythe personality of the brand.
(07:15):
Even 20 years later, you know,people are much more likely to
be vulnerable in our community.
Um, I'm sure we'll get intothis more later, but every time
I do a signing, there are peoplewho come up who tell the most
beautiful stories of what theselittle porcelain figures mean to
them.
I never would have guessed backin the day, but now, in
(07:39):
retrospect, I really see that itwas born of a need for
vulnerability and patience andkindness and understanding.
So, yes, 100% I agree with you,Benno, that me, the person I
hope to be, is the person I tryand be in that brand image as
(08:00):
well.
Speaker 4 (08:03):
And the other community aspect.
Right is the product itself,because it is tabletop
entertaining that people use.
I mean, the product is used,you know, usually not when one
person is having a TV dinner,right, right right.
Speaker 3 (08:20):
Right it is.
It's a gathering, and you knowobviously any kind of gathering
which could be a happy gathering, but not always.
You know, you, that communityhappens even at times that are
sad or when you're trying topull together and figure
something out.
And there is that sense ofcustomization to the gift too.
(08:42):
It's not just any gift.
I chose this mini for you.
I saw this and I purchased thismini for you, and I think that
community extends not only toour retailers but also to our
partners, obviously the team aswell.
That sense of community you knowobviously the team as well.
(09:03):
That sense of community, allthose kind of interlocking
circles, it's always that senseof we're in this together, we're
doing this thing for goodtogether, and I think that that
comes out just in the way.
We don't know how to operateany other way, we don't know how
to be anything, but that havethat sense of community.
(09:25):
We tease with our partners.
You know the other vendors thatwe work with.
On a call like this, we'll askare we your favorite?
Do you love working with us?
Is this your favorite call ofthe week?
Are we your favorite minutes?
We just want that sense ofcommunity all the time that
people are happy to work with usand solve problems with us, and
(09:46):
whatever it is, we'll figure itout, but we'll do it in a way
that's good and kind foreveryone, and there is a way to
do that.
Speaker 2 (09:53):
There's a way to do it.
Oftentimes we even findourselves hanging up with one of
our vendors or one of ourpartners and like we love you.
Speaker 4 (09:59):
And then you're like wow, I love you.
Speaker 2 (10:02):
I mean, I do love you , but I didn't mean to say it
out loud.
Speaker 3 (10:10):
Right, but it just, it just bubbles up in, we're
having fun, we're trying tosolve problems and figure things
out.
But can we do this in a waythat everybody, everybody
benefits and every you can.
There is a way to do that.
You just have to, like, workpatiently to find that way, but
it can happen.
It doesn't have to be alwayscutthroat.
It is a business, yes, but canwe do this in a good, kind,
thoughtful, intentional manner?
And we can, and that's what wetry for.
Speaker 4 (10:34):
And I think along with what you just said is that
comes the fact that you are veryintentional about who your
customers are and who yourcustomers are not Right, it's
sort of the magnet thing themagnet attracts half of the
(10:56):
universe and repels the otherhalf.
Right, and you, and I think youknow there's a lot of big
businesses that are trying toattract everybody, you know, try
to be everything to everybodyand are nothing to nobody, maybe
or in a soulless way, but Ithink you guys are being very
soulful in wanting to attractand being okay with saying no to
(11:25):
big box retailers, for example.
Right, talk a little bit abouthow you see.
How do you define growth?
How do you think about growth?
Speaker 2 (11:36):
I'll give you a little history on that.
You know, it takes a very, verylong time to build a successful
business and adhere to themodel with which we set forth in
the beginning.
And we knew that we were.
We knew we were going to haveto be patient.
Fortunately, over the 20 yearsthat I've been doing this, I
(11:56):
have seen or, unfortunately, um,I have seen a lot of people try
to do both try to be in big box, try to be on, you know, the
big home shopping networks,which there's nothing wrong with
, but it's very, very hard to doboth and then to be committed
to small mom and pop retailers.
Um, so, right out of the gate,john and I decided that we were
(12:16):
going to take the slow andsteady route and, um, and just
give it time.
Um, like I said, super hardbecause you have to be very
patient.
I mean, it was many, many, many, many, many years before we saw
any sort of return on ourinvestments.
Um, and it was very hard tolike when we were bouncing
checks all across, all acrossthe world or asking people you
(12:38):
know, can we pay you in a week?
We would get these big POs fromyou know, big, big, huge POs
from stores and and decide toturn it down, even though our
cash flow was really strugglingat the time.
But we knew it didn't.
It didn't align with our longterm goals and we wanted to be
(12:59):
in it for future generations and, god willing, our children's
children's children will be apart of this company someday.
So to us it was never a hitthis level and sell or hit this
goal and build.
It was just a very differentbusiness model.
(13:19):
We've also People.
We were so young.
When we started, I was 20,let's see how old am I 20.
I was 26, 25, 26.
When we started selling toretailers um, no idea what we
were doing my brother would havebeen 24, then 23, 24.
I mean, we people had to teachus how to write orders.
So, also, just giving credenceto that and honoring those
(13:41):
relationships with people whotook such patience with us, we
would, you know, the firstcouple of years we'd run out of
stock Right in November.
You know, really, really novicemistakes, because we were young
and just trying to learn thewhole industry.
Obvious mistakes because wewere young and just trying to
learn the whole industry and allof these partners that we still
(14:04):
have.
Many, many, many, many of themwere so patient with us that as
we grew it just even became moreapparent that we needed to
honor that relationship morethan ever.
So that's kind of how itstarted, how we ended up with
that business model, and thenJanice, as we've grown- Nora's
famous quote that I say a lot.
Speaker 3 (14:26):
But it struck me so much then, and probably strikes
me even more now, is that it'smore important what we've said
no to than what we've said yesto.
That slow and steady,deliberate, intentional, and it
might be no, not right now.
Know that you can be patientwith things.
(14:48):
It doesn't have to be yes toeverything right this minute
that you can say hold on, it'snot right now, but we'll get
there.
And when we get there, this isgoing to be awesome.
But it doesn't have to beeverything all at once as soon
as someone presents something toyou.
But that's part of that.
You know, deliberate,intentional growth.
I think, as far as you know, yousaid, benno, it's not for
(15:11):
everyone, but I think theretailers that do go all in with
us, then we'll go all in withthem, and so if you're willing
to do that, let's do this thingand you'll carry the line.
Then we'll partner with youreally 100%.
And that's not for everyone,and that's okay.
(15:33):
That's okay.
It doesn't have to be foreveryone.
We would kind of rather have itbe where you go into a shop and
you think, oh, my goodness,they carry North Fleming, that's
awesome.
Not, we don't have to be inevery door, it's OK, it's OK.
But then that becomes.
You know, explain that to yoursales team, right, and your
(15:53):
sales partners.
You know, this is OK with us,it's all right.
We'd rather have the rightstores than all the stores.
Speaker 4 (16:10):
And you also, you have a requirement for a new
account to come on board thatthey buy kind of an opening
package of some sort, kind of anopening package of some sort
which ends up, you know it's nota low minimum order, it's not a
, you know, $200 minimum order,it's probably one or $2,000
minimum order, because you wantto be, you want it to be
(16:35):
meaningful, and it's notmeaningful if they just put in
three items of yours.
Speaker 2 (16:37):
Well, and that's what we've really learned too over
the course of time.
That is one thing in ourphilosophy that's changed a
little bit.
You know, when you're starting,you're so grateful that
somebody wants to introduce itat all.
Any dollar is a good dollar yeahyou're like amazing and this is
(17:01):
100% from my heart and not asales tactic at all is that
people, if a store does not haveall of the seasons at one time
throughout the year, they're notgoing to be successful with it.
Nine out of 10 times a customerwill come in, they will be
buying Nora Fleming as a gift,say for a wedding shower, and
they will want a base piece ofplatter and then four different
seasons.
So we're selling Christmastrees in June, we're selling 4th
(17:23):
of July at Christmas.
I mean, as a rule of thumb.
This isn't like an off thing andthat's a hard sell to some
people.
They're like what are youtalking about?
It's spring, I want Easter.
And you're like oh, I get it, Iget what you're saying, but I
guess that's also where, like,the trust comes in.
And if you're willing to tounderstand how this program
(17:44):
works and how people buy it forother people, then people I mean
10 out of 10 have a greatsuccess with it.
So, yeah, that's kind of ouropening order is not so much
about like a monetary quantity,it's about having the right
products and to explain it sopeople understand the program
and people have enough of anoffering that their customers
(18:06):
can buy, you know, a breadth ofa gift.
Speaker 3 (18:10):
Right, and we have done things to try and help with
that.
You know each SKU, the casepack, is three.
So you know it isn't 12 minis,it's just three of them.
So you know, so that you canyeah, you can offer a good
percentage of the minis becausethere's only you know the
(18:31):
minimum is three.
So that helps as well.
So we've done things to try andhelp the retailers out.
Obviously, obviously too, butit is you have to have a decent
offering there so that peoplecan see oh look it, I'm good,
I'm going to get this.
She loves, you know, football,I'll grab this.
And so the more you have therethen, the more people can see.
Right then, and there to choosethose minis.
Speaker 4 (18:54):
And I think there's there's a lot to be said also
for having the guts especiallyas a young I mean this was
probably more gutsy in the earlyyears than on your 20th
anniversary to have the guts tosay to raise the bar, which not
(19:16):
everybody is going to be willing.
I mean it will turn someretailers off, but the retailers
that get it, that are into it,they become raving.
I mean you have raving fans,don't you?
As retailers, as end consumers?
Speaker 3 (19:34):
They are really there , good to us.
There are retailers andconsumers.
They really are there.
They're big fans of NoraFleming and we're big fans of
them at the same time.
That cycle of goodwill isreally.
They're excited about our newofferings.
We're excited to have them.
It really it's a good cycle.
(19:55):
I know it sounds like veryPollyanna, but the goodwill that
we put out and the things thatwe try to create.
And then the retailers I meanit really is, it's a good cycle,
it is.
And again, retailers I mean itreally is, it's a good cycle, it
is.
Speaker 2 (20:07):
And again like we know what works for people.
So it's back to that being ableto say no, you know, if
somebody says no, you know I'mjust a Halloween store, I just
want to carry the Halloween ones, that's fine.
We can have a privateconversation on the side if you
want to do some sort ofpromotional thing with a
Halloween mini and a platter.
But as far as being a zip code,zip code protected store of
(20:28):
ours, you know that's, that'snot going to work and, um, that
took a lot of just growing upand being more confident.
You know, as, as our companygrew, you know, in the beginning
we would have been like sure,bye, a hundred pumpkins, good
luck, exactly, Exactly, um, soyeah, that's been a growing
(20:49):
curve and a maturity curve.
You know, in a um, a classcurve too.
You know, I've I've learned howto phrase it correctly now
without sounding presumptuous orprecocious.
You know, just, it's, this, isthis won't work for you in that
way, but we can make somethingelse work.
You know, let's talk privatelyafter market or whatever.
Speaker 4 (21:08):
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(21:30):
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(21:52):
Let's talk a little bit aboutthat team.
So, janice, you're employeenumber one and you know, I think
(22:18):
, just the visual.
Looking at the two of you, onecan say that the two of you
complement each other and aremaybe two halves of a circle.
In terms of left brain, janice,because you are kind of the
integrator, maybe in EOSlanguage, for Nora Fleming, how
did you help build what is todaya good-sized team of folks?
Speaker 3 (22:43):
Well, still a tiny team.
I would say that it's probablynot as large as everyone thinks
it is, but we're still right at20,.
All in, that's a lot more thantwo.
It is a lot more than two.
You're right, and it'sinteresting that you say that
about me and Nora.
It's funny.
I was talking to Nora'sdaughter at market how much Nora
(23:06):
and I are alike and also howvery different we are and those
two things work so well togetherwe it's.
It's interesting really.
There are some things that werereally spot on lockstep and
then other things that were sodifferent, but but it all works.
It really has been a greatpartnership I think I'm speaking
(23:29):
for myself.
I'm assuming Nora would say thesame that it really has been.
It's been great for both of usAbsolutely, and that's another
thing.
Speaker 2 (23:38):
You know that maturity and time has taught me
as a business owner, and one ofmy favorite things to do is to
help young entrepreneurs andyoung business people start
their own dream and watch makeit happen.
And one of the things I sayoften is as soon as you can hire
somebody who's better atsomething than you are, do it.
(23:59):
I mean that's like number oneadvice.
I mean there's nothing moreimportant to me than putting
together a team with completelydifferent skill sets.
Um, I think that's really thecore at core reason for success
for any, for any business, anyteam, any band, any anything
(24:21):
really.
Um, I think oftentimes peopleget into too much trouble.
Get into trouble when they aretrying to do too much because
they're afraid to pay the money.
But I'm telling you, it's goingto be worth it in the long run
to really build your team up ofdiversity and differing thought
(24:44):
processes, different skill sets,different ways of communicating
.
We have some salespeople whoare super introverted.
We have some who are superextroverted.
We know who to send to whichstore at which time.
People are so different and wealso learn from each other a
tremendous amount, and that'sjust a blessing in and of itself
(25:07):
too.
So, yeah, those would be mypieces of advice, and I think
why Janice and I work so welltogether is that I don't pretend
like I'm organized.
I'm not.
I mean, if you, we travel a tonfor work and forgive me, Janice
, for telling your dirty secrets, but when we travel for work
and we open up our suitcases, Imean you open mine and literally
(25:27):
everything flies out.
Nothing is organized, Nothing'seven folded, it's just you know
, a big disaster.
All my makeup's from Walgreensand the Ziploc, and she opens
hers and she has her proper bagwith her.
You know, undergarments and herdresses and her shoes are each
in bags, and I mean justwatching.
That explains everything aboutour personalities.
(25:48):
We both get the stuff there.
We both end up pulling it off,but in totally different ways.
Speaker 3 (25:55):
It totally works and I think that for the team as
well.
I think one of the things iswhat are the things that you
aren't able to teach someone?
You know that culture fit youaren't able to teach someone.
You know that culture fit, thatdesire to continue to do the
good things that we're doing.
You probably can't teach that.
The other stuff if you canteach it, then we'll do that,
(26:16):
we'll figure it out together.
But you kind of have to decideis this the kind of thing?
Do they have everything thatand can we pull this team
together, the things that wecan't teach that?
They already have that, andthen the other stuff.
We'll figure that all outtogether.
You can take a course, you canbrush up on things, but there's
some of that that you can andthat culture fit that's tough to
(26:40):
teach someone.
Speaker 4 (26:41):
They say hire for character and train for skill.
Hire for character and trainfor skill.
Speaker 3 (26:46):
Right, right, right.
And since our position is alittle bit different, especially
on our sales team, our positionis a little bit different than
other companies might be youkind of have to look out for
that and make sure you'reaccounting for that, our kind of
Nora Fleming personality.
Speaker 2 (27:04):
Yeah, we almost have to set different matrix for our
sales team than a traditionalcompany would.
We have some amazing rep groupsthat work with us, and I'm sure
no one's ever said it to medirectly, but I can imagine it's
very challenging for some ofthem to be given such strict
parameters with whom they cansell, versus somebody who says
(27:25):
just go out there and get me 500new stores.
Just get me 500 new stores thismonth and I'll be thrilled.
You know, to us it's moreimportant to have, but you know
they're paid on commission, sohow do you?
So?
We have to come up withdifferent ways to incentivize
our sales staff um to work inthat business model, which is,
you know, a different, adifferent way of thinking, um,
(27:53):
and it can be just as lucrative.
It just we have to be cognizantof how to reward our, our
people.
That isn't in the traditionalsales model.
Speaker 4 (27:56):
And you know I mean what I love about your, the way
you sort of organically growing,thoughtfully growing on brand,
not, you know, sticking to yourknitting as as, as they say, um
in, in terms of like knowing whoyou are and what your brand
promise is.
And you know, not bigger.
(28:18):
Bigger is not better, better isbetter.
Speaker 3 (28:21):
Right.
Speaker 4 (28:21):
Right Um.
I mean bigger can be better,but better is always better.
Speaker 3 (28:26):
Talk a little bit.
Speaker 4 (28:28):
So you guys have made a decision a number of years
ago, I think, or maybe you havealways done give back and
donations, charity, and you'vedone.
You're doing this amazing workwith St Jude.
Talk about that.
Speaker 2 (28:49):
I'll start it off a little bit.
So this project came about twoyears before my brother passed
away, so 2017, my brother and Iwe were donating to everybody
very happily but anyone friendof a friend who was having a
something sending out plattersevery day, platters and minis,
(29:09):
um, or just financial donationsto different organizations and
it just got so diluted.
So my brother and I sat downand had a meeting and we didn't
have any preconceived umorganization that we were going
to go with, nothing like that Um.
But we uh sat down and we saidyou know, let's really try and
make a concerted effort, make acommitment to one organization
(29:30):
and see what we can do.
So we decided that point.
We'd been touched by my son'sbest friend passed away from a
brain tumor and one of ouremployees.
A few years later her son wasalso touched by cancer.
So it seemed very appropriatethat we would go to St Jude for
our first big commitment.
And we went to them and we saidwe'd like to partner with you,
(29:51):
We'd like to do nine minis overthe course of five to six years
and have all of the proceeds goto St Jude, Not having any idea
how it would go, and you cantake it from there, Janice, like
it was just beyond.
Speaker 3 (30:05):
So it was those nine minis and then kind of the
keepsake collector's box thathad the St Jude logo on it and
we focused the minis onchildren's themed minis.
You know, a bear in the littlered St Jude wagon, two hearts
that a young patient had drawn,sandcastles, so other things
(30:26):
that were kind of kid-focusedbut still obviously could be
used in any situation.
And all of the proceeds, youknow, went back to St Jude.
The retailers partnered with usand consumer knew that's what
each mini was for.
We limited the number to 10,000of each one, you know.
(30:50):
So we knew that's what thedonation is going to be and then
in the end we just finalizedthat this summer the total
donation and it was nine minisand one keepsake box and that
donation was just over $1.1million from Nora Fleming.
From those 10 pieces, $1.1million, wow, yeah, which just
(31:11):
shows that everyone kind ofgrouping together focusing on
that.
You know that's the differencethat you can make.
But if you think of our productoffering, it was one mini, it
was one mini.
Right, there are other minis.
We, you know we had theproceeds from all the other
minis.
It was one.
So we were sharing one of apart.
It wasn't, it was a commitment,but it you know we could still
(31:36):
carry on business wise.
It was, it was a good decision.
Speaker 4 (31:40):
Great.
Speaker 2 (31:42):
And people were just we.
We really found, too, thatpeople are just really excited
to be part of something biggerthan themselves.
This whole notion of purposefulbuying is it's true?
I mean, I, I, I can't believehow how many people want to.
When, given the choice betweenA and B, and they like them, you
know, equal, even if they likeB a little bit more.
(32:04):
But A is giving back, they'regoing to buy A.
Um, so it's been it's, it'sbeen very eyeopening and very?
Um inspiring to know that thathumanity still has that amazing
goodness in it and that wehaven't lost that as consumers.
You know, you always hear likewe just want to consume more
stuff, but what I see from whereI sit is that people want to
(32:27):
consume stuff that matters andstuff that makes them feel good
when they bring it out ordisplay it in their home them
feel good when they bring it outor display it in their home.
Speaker 3 (32:40):
And we've kind of, now that we're finished with St
Jude, we've carried that on withanother product line whose
entire intention is to continuethe give back, now to 10
different causes, and it'scolorful silicone rims that add
on to our round melamineplatters, it's called Band
Together and most recently weadded, as the 10th partner, hard
(33:03):
on Main Street.
So that's giving back to theretailers and again, that's just
another way for everyone topartner together and do this
thing together.
Speaker 2 (33:15):
Jay, since Hard on Main is so new, can you explain
that maybe to any listeners whodon't know much about it?
It's just such a neatorganization.
I'm so proud that we're part ofit, and Janice We've had
Patrick Kaiser on anotherpodcast.
Speaker 4 (33:28):
We've had Patrick Kaiser on another podcast also.
Do tell Janice.
Speaker 2 (33:32):
Janice, she really spearheaded this from the Nora
Fleming side and I just couldn'tbe more proud.
Speaker 3 (33:40):
Well, and it kind of came out of you know a mistake
actually that we made.
We started the Band Togetherprogram with nine colors and we
didn't forget purple.
But we didn't have room foreverything.
So we knew we have room foreverything.
So we knew we were missing acolor.
The Baltimore Ravens people werethe most upset by this.
(34:01):
The TCU people were upset.
You know, there was no purple,so we were going to have to make
a purple band and then I justthought why don't we just take
this band and why don't we do itto Heart on Main Street and so
that you know that's the causeto help those retailers?
You know, not only with thewebinars and you know that
(34:24):
programming, but also if there'sa natural disaster and a
retailer needs help, then withfinancial support and a great
story about that, ourmanufacturing partner was so
moved by this that even theyhelped on our pricing so that we
can make a bigger donation toHard On Main Street and if
(34:48):
that's not true partnership thateverybody's pitching in so that
we can all help the independentretailers.
I mean that really that has beena great and I think we're the
first vendor who has said we'regoing to take this product and
this product can be for Heart onMain Street, but just like the
St Jude minis, you know you cando this.
It's just take the, you know,make a candle or make a pair of
(35:10):
earrings and just say we'regoing to do this for Heart and
Main Street or whatever cause.
We're already doing this, we'realready doing the product
development.
You're just intentionallysetting aside this.
One product is for this cause.
Speaker 4 (35:24):
I love it.
You know.
I think this is a good place towrap it up.
I do have.
I'm going to just plug yourwebsite here so you don't have
to do it, because you keeptalking about minis and people
need to check outnoraflemmingcom and and
(35:45):
understand what that is it's.
You guys have a very coolproduct line, I think it's um.
I thank you so much for sharingjust your.
You know your story, yourthoughts on branding and growing
and better is better, notbigger is better, necessarily.
And you know what you're doingfor your various communities I
(36:11):
think is heartwarming and it'swonderful and congratulations.
Speaker 3 (36:16):
Thank you so much.
Thank you for letting us shareand and spending time with us
today.
Speaker 2 (36:22):
Thank you so much.
And just as a last note, ifanyone needs help out there in
the industry or or has anyfurther questions, you can reach
Janice and I very easily justthrough our emails.
I'm I'm Nora at Nora Flemingand Janice is Janice at Nora
Fleming, one M in the Fleming.
But it would truly be our honorto talk to any budding
entrepreneurs out there, or ifthere's anything that we could
(36:43):
help with, we would love to be apart of it.
So keep that in mind.
Speaker 4 (36:47):
Terrific.
Thank you so much, thank you.
Speaker 1 (36:54):
Thank you for listening to this episode of TGO
Podcast.
You can find all episodes onour podcast page at
wwwrealign4resultscom.
You can find me, benno, host ofTGO Podcast, there as well.
Just email Benno B-E-N-N-O atrealignforresultscom.
(37:16):
Let's keep growing.
Hey, welcome to the Third Growth Officer podcast,
where we talk about all thingsgrowth, yes, even and especially
those hard parts where you shedsome skin and pick yourself up
by the bootstraps.
Hey, I'm Benno Dunkelspüler,growth sherpa and OG hashtag
growth nerd.
We're on a mission to redefinesuccess inside and outside the
(00:23):
business, one TGO episode at atime.
Speaker 2 (00:33):
Hi guys, I'm Nora with Nora Fleming.
I founded Nora Fleming 20 yearsago this year and I'm super
excited to share our story withyou guys today.
We are coming live from you.
I'm in Chicago.
Speaker 3 (00:48):
And I'm Janice Christensen, president of Nora
Fleming, first employee and beenwith the company for 16 years
and really proud and excited tobe part of our amazing team.
Looking forward to today.
Speaker 4 (01:05):
So thank you so much, both of you, nora and Janice,
for coming on this podcast.
Nora Fleming as a company issort of well-known I think I can
use the word legendary in thesense that it's unique.
People know what you do.
I'm just excited to learn moreabout the origin story and then
(01:29):
talk a little bit about yourphilosophy on growth and
business and branding and people, and we'll get into all kinds
of things.
But I'll leave it open to whowants to answer or just start us
on.
Actually, I'm going to ask aquestion around your.
I read this in this articlethat, janice, you had sent me
(01:53):
how Nora Fleming spent the first10 years in the temporary
booths at the Atlanta market and, nora, rumor has it so it was
written that you would walk upand down the aisles balancing a
plate on top of your head isthat what's up with that?
Speaker 2 (02:09):
yeah, unfortunately that is a true story.
Um, as any small business ownerknows, or new entrepreneur
knows, it's very hard to getyour concept out there.
So I was just finding peoplewalking by not really
understanding the concept ofwhat we were doing.
Um, so I came up with a littleploy to walk up and down the
(02:30):
aisle with platters on my head,and of course that stopped
people, because who's the crazylady with a ceramic platter on
her head.
And then it gave me theopportunity to explain what we
do.
When people would ask what areyou doing with the platter on
your head, I could explain howthey were all interchangeable
and how each piece is a basepiece that can work with many
different seasons orcelebrations.
(02:50):
So it kind of gave me anopening to talk to people, if
you will.
Speaker 4 (02:54):
I think some people I have referred I have heard that
being referred to, as you know,burning your cool card, losing
you know?
Oh, it was gone right away.
Pride's a renewable resource,right?
Speaker 2 (03:08):
Gone right away.
But you know you, you didn'tcare, you just wanted to to just
garnish five minutes ofsomebody's time, um, so that's
really all we were looking to do, and nine times out of 10, they
were like oh, never, neverthought of that.
I wish I had thought of that,so so that I never got any bad
reactions from it.
So that was good and, as far asthe temps go, yeah, that was
(03:29):
our home for 10 years.
Um, very purposefully, um, wekind of made our own little
family and our aisle andbuilding three.
um.
As the years went by and as wegrew, we would just kind of take
up more and more space and then, about 10 years in, we decided
that it was time for us to moveup to our own showroom.
(03:49):
It was really nice.
It's always been our company'sphilosophy to try and help the
newer companies.
So as we grew we knew we woulddraw some crowds in and we would
get really excited abouttelling our new neighbors who
hadn't been to market beforewhat our busy hours were, what
to expect at certain times ofthe day, and it also gave us an
opportunity to introduce ourclientele to our neighbors, you
(04:12):
know, on different sides of theof the hallway, which was, which
was just an amazing opportunityto be given.
Speaker 3 (04:21):
Yeah, I think that was really deliberate in the
sense that it was such acommunity, because everyone's
right by you and you can pointpeople.
That way you can still do it inthe showroom, but it's a lot
easier when the booth is reallytwo down and do you have a
staple gun, and all of thattaking place in those final
hours before we're ready to open.
(04:41):
It really is a different senseof community there.
And so it was 10 by 10 and then10 by 20.
(05:02):
Then we've got a 10 by 30.
And eventually we thought, okay, we're dragging so much stuff
down here, maybe it's time toopen up a showroom.
But it was really fun and agreat community it really was.
Speaker 4 (05:14):
And I think this sense of community is really
integral to the brand, to theproduct, to the way you behave
as a team and as individuals,Talk a little bit more about.
Well, I'm guessing that thesense of community is largely I
(05:37):
mean, it had to have originatedfrom the founder, Nora, and then
also Janice, your employeenumber one for 16 of this
20-year journey so far.
But it's just about kind ofbeing.
I mean, Nora, the person, andNora Fleming, the brand, are
(06:00):
kind of the same thing.
Is that how you see it, Nora?
Speaker 2 (06:08):
um, it is how I would like to see it.
Yes, um, both of my personaskind of play off each other.
Um, I?
I'd like to start by saying so.
I started the company with mybrother originally 20 years ago.
It was was just the two of us,Um, so it really does come from
like a true family um originstory.
(06:29):
And when it when it started, Iwas just making them myself in
the basement and I had had myfirst child, so I was kind of
doing it, kind of not doing it.
And then I had had my secondchild and she was born with some
medical difficulties and I hadsevere postpartum depression
with her Um, so I kind ofdropped out of the world
(06:50):
altogether.
At that point my brother cameto me and said people really
like your art.
I don't want to see this as asetback.
Let let's, you know, let metake over.
And I kind of handed over thereins to him while I focused on
her and getting myself back in ain a mentally healthy space.
Um, so that's like because itcomes from such a vulnerable
origin Um, I think that's reallythe personality of the brand.
(07:15):
Even 20 years later, you know,people are much more likely to
be vulnerable in our community.
Um, I'm sure we'll get intothis more later, but every time
I do a signing, there are peoplewho come up who tell the most
beautiful stories of what theselittle porcelain figures mean to
them.
I never would have guessed backin the day, but now, in
(07:39):
retrospect, I really see that itwas born of a need for
vulnerability and patience andkindness and understanding.
So, yes, 100% I agree with you,Benno, that me, the person I
hope to be, is the person I tryand be in that brand image as
(08:00):
well.
Speaker 4 (08:03):
And the other community aspect.
Right is the product itself,because it is tabletop
entertaining that people use.
I mean, the product is used,you know, usually not when one
person is having a TV dinner,right, right right.
Speaker 3 (08:20):
Right it is.
It's a gathering, and you knowobviously any kind of gathering
which could be a happy gathering, but not always.
You know, you, that communityhappens even at times that are
sad or when you're trying topull together and figure
something out.
And there is that sense ofcustomization to the gift too.
(08:42):
It's not just any gift.
I chose this mini for you.
I saw this and I purchased thismini for you, and I think that
community extends not only toour retailers but also to our
partners, obviously the team aswell.
That sense of community you knowobviously the team as well.
(09:03):
That sense of community, allthose kind of interlocking
circles, it's always that senseof we're in this together, we're
doing this thing for goodtogether, and I think that that
comes out just in the way.
We don't know how to operateany other way, we don't know how
to be anything, but that havethat sense of community.
(09:25):
We tease with our partners.
You know the other vendors thatwe work with.
On a call like this, we'll askare we your favorite?
Do you love working with us?
Is this your favorite call ofthe week?
Are we your favorite minutes?
We just want that sense ofcommunity all the time that
people are happy to work with usand solve problems with us, and
(09:46):
whatever it is, we'll figure itout, but we'll do it in a way
that's good and kind foreveryone, and there is a way to
do that.
Speaker 2 (09:53):
There's a way to do it.
Oftentimes we even findourselves hanging up with one of
our vendors or one of ourpartners and like we love you.
Speaker 4 (09:59):
And then you're like wow, I love you.
Speaker 2 (10:02):
I mean, I do love you , but I didn't mean to say it
out loud.
Speaker 3 (10:10):
Right, but it just, it just bubbles up in, we're
having fun, we're trying tosolve problems and figure things
out.
But can we do this in a waythat everybody, everybody
benefits and every you can.
There is a way to do that.
You just have to, like, workpatiently to find that way, but
it can happen.
It doesn't have to be alwayscutthroat.
It is a business, yes, but canwe do this in a good, kind,
thoughtful, intentional manner?
And we can, and that's what wetry for.
Speaker 4 (10:34):
And I think along with what you just said is that
comes the fact that you are veryintentional about who your
customers are and who yourcustomers are not Right, it's
sort of the magnet thing themagnet attracts half of the
(10:56):
universe and repels the otherhalf.
Right, and you, and I think youknow there's a lot of big
businesses that are trying toattract everybody, you know, try
to be everything to everybodyand are nothing to nobody, maybe
or in a soulless way, but Ithink you guys are being very
soulful in wanting to attractand being okay with saying no to
(11:25):
big box retailers, for example.
Right, talk a little bit abouthow you see.
How do you define growth?
How do you think about growth?
Speaker 2 (11:36):
I'll give you a little history on that.
You know, it takes a very, verylong time to build a successful
business and adhere to themodel with which we set forth in
the beginning.
And we knew that we were.
We knew we were going to haveto be patient.
Fortunately, over the 20 yearsthat I've been doing this, I
(11:56):
have seen or, unfortunately, um,I have seen a lot of people try
to do both try to be in big box, try to be on, you know, the
big home shopping networks,which there's nothing wrong with
, but it's very, very hard to doboth and then to be committed
to small mom and pop retailers.
Um, so, right out of the gate,john and I decided that we were
(12:16):
going to take the slow andsteady route and, um, and just
give it time.
Um, like I said, super hardbecause you have to be very
patient.
I mean, it was many, many, many, many, many years before we saw
any sort of return on ourinvestments.
Um, and it was very hard tolike when we were bouncing
checks all across, all acrossthe world or asking people you
(12:38):
know, can we pay you in a week?
We would get these big POs fromyou know, big, big, huge POs
from stores and and decide toturn it down, even though our
cash flow was really strugglingat the time.
But we knew it didn't.
It didn't align with our longterm goals and we wanted to be
(12:59):
in it for future generations and, god willing, our children's
children's children will be apart of this company someday.
So to us it was never a hitthis level and sell or hit this
goal and build.
It was just a very differentbusiness model.
(13:19):
We've also People.
We were so young.
When we started, I was 20,let's see how old am I 20.
I was 26, 25, 26.
When we started selling toretailers um, no idea what we
were doing my brother would havebeen 24, then 23, 24.
I mean, we people had to teachus how to write orders.
So, also, just giving credenceto that and honoring those
(13:41):
relationships with people whotook such patience with us, we
would, you know, the firstcouple of years we'd run out of
stock Right in November.
You know, really, really novicemistakes, because we were young
and just trying to learn thewhole industry.
Obvious mistakes because wewere young and just trying to
learn the whole industry and allof these partners that we still
(14:04):
have.
Many, many, many, many of themwere so patient with us that as
we grew it just even became moreapparent that we needed to
honor that relationship morethan ever.
So that's kind of how itstarted, how we ended up with
that business model, and thenJanice, as we've grown- Nora's
famous quote that I say a lot.
Speaker 3 (14:26):
But it struck me so much then, and probably strikes
me even more now, is that it'smore important what we've said
no to than what we've said yesto.
That slow and steady,deliberate, intentional, and it
might be no, not right now.
Know that you can be patientwith things.
(14:48):
It doesn't have to be yes toeverything right this minute
that you can say hold on, it'snot right now, but we'll get
there.
And when we get there, this isgoing to be awesome.
But it doesn't have to beeverything all at once as soon
as someone presents something toyou.
But that's part of that.
You know, deliberate,intentional growth.
I think, as far as you know, yousaid, benno, it's not for
(15:11):
everyone, but I think theretailers that do go all in with
us, then we'll go all in withthem, and so if you're willing
to do that, let's do this thingand you'll carry the line.
Then we'll partner with youreally 100%.
And that's not for everyone,and that's okay.
(15:33):
That's okay.
It doesn't have to be foreveryone.
We would kind of rather have itbe where you go into a shop and
you think, oh, my goodness,they carry North Fleming, that's
awesome.
Not, we don't have to be inevery door, it's OK, it's OK.
But then that becomes.
You know, explain that to yoursales team, right, and your
(15:53):
sales partners.
You know, this is OK with us,it's all right.
We'd rather have the rightstores than all the stores.
Speaker 4 (16:10):
And you also, you have a requirement for a new
account to come on board thatthey buy kind of an opening
package of some sort, kind of anopening package of some sort
which ends up, you know it's nota low minimum order, it's not a
, you know, $200 minimum order,it's probably one or $2,000
minimum order, because you wantto be, you want it to be
(16:35):
meaningful, and it's notmeaningful if they just put in
three items of yours.
Speaker 2 (16:37):
Well, and that's what we've really learned too over
the course of time.
That is one thing in ourphilosophy that's changed a
little bit.
You know, when you're starting,you're so grateful that
somebody wants to introduce itat all.
Any dollar is a good dollar yeahyou're like amazing and this is
(17:01):
100% from my heart and not asales tactic at all is that
people, if a store does not haveall of the seasons at one time
throughout the year, they're notgoing to be successful with it.
Nine out of 10 times a customerwill come in, they will be
buying Nora Fleming as a gift,say for a wedding shower, and
they will want a base piece ofplatter and then four different
seasons.
So we're selling Christmastrees in June, we're selling 4th
(17:23):
of July at Christmas.
I mean, as a rule of thumb.
This isn't like an off thing andthat's a hard sell to some
people.
They're like what are youtalking about?
It's spring, I want Easter.
And you're like oh, I get it, Iget what you're saying, but I
guess that's also where, like,the trust comes in.
And if you're willing to tounderstand how this program
(17:44):
works and how people buy it forother people, then people I mean
10 out of 10 have a greatsuccess with it.
So, yeah, that's kind of ouropening order is not so much
about like a monetary quantity,it's about having the right
products and to explain it sopeople understand the program
and people have enough of anoffering that their customers
(18:06):
can buy, you know, a breadth ofa gift.
Speaker 3 (18:10):
Right, and we have done things to try and help with
that.
You know each SKU, the casepack, is three.
So you know it isn't 12 minis,it's just three of them.
So you know, so that you canyeah, you can offer a good
percentage of the minis becausethere's only you know the
(18:31):
minimum is three.
So that helps as well.
So we've done things to try andhelp the retailers out.
Obviously, obviously too, butit is you have to have a decent
offering there so that peoplecan see oh look it, I'm good,
I'm going to get this.
She loves, you know, football,I'll grab this.
And so the more you have therethen, the more people can see.
Right then, and there to choosethose minis.
Speaker 4 (18:54):
And I think there's there's a lot to be said also
for having the guts especiallyas a young I mean this was
probably more gutsy in the earlyyears than on your 20th
anniversary to have the guts tosay to raise the bar, which not
(19:16):
everybody is going to be willing.
I mean it will turn someretailers off, but the retailers
that get it, that are into it,they become raving.
I mean you have raving fans,don't you?
As retailers, as end consumers?
Speaker 3 (19:34):
They are really there , good to us.
There are retailers andconsumers.
They really are there.
They're big fans of NoraFleming and we're big fans of
them at the same time.
That cycle of goodwill isreally.
They're excited about our newofferings.
We're excited to have them.
It really it's a good cycle.
(19:55):
I know it sounds like veryPollyanna, but the goodwill that
we put out and the things thatwe try to create.
And then the retailers I meanit really is, it's a good cycle,
it is.
And again, retailers I mean itreally is, it's a good cycle, it
is.
Speaker 2 (20:07):
And again like we know what works for people.
So it's back to that being ableto say no, you know, if
somebody says no, you know I'mjust a Halloween store, I just
want to carry the Halloween ones, that's fine.
We can have a privateconversation on the side if you
want to do some sort ofpromotional thing with a
Halloween mini and a platter.
But as far as being a zip code,zip code protected store of
(20:28):
ours, you know that's, that'snot going to work and, um, that
took a lot of just growing upand being more confident.
You know, as, as our companygrew, you know, in the beginning
we would have been like sure,bye, a hundred pumpkins, good
luck, exactly, Exactly, um, soyeah, that's been a growing
(20:49):
curve and a maturity curve.
You know, in a um, a classcurve too.
You know, I've I've learned howto phrase it correctly now
without sounding presumptuous orprecocious.
You know, just, it's, this, isthis won't work for you in that
way, but we can make somethingelse work.
You know, let's talk privatelyafter market or whatever.
Speaker 4 (21:08):
So yeah, Are you ready to learn how to evaluate
like a Sherpa so you can buildnew revenues like a Sherpa?
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(21:52):
Let's talk a little bit aboutthat team.
So, janice, you're employeenumber one and you know, I think
(22:18):
, just the visual.
Looking at the two of you, onecan say that the two of you
complement each other and aremaybe two halves of a circle.
In terms of left brain, janice,because you are kind of the
integrator, maybe in EOSlanguage, for Nora Fleming, how
did you help build what is todaya good-sized team of folks?
Speaker 3 (22:43):
Well, still a tiny team.
I would say that it's probablynot as large as everyone thinks
it is, but we're still right at20,.
All in, that's a lot more thantwo.
It is a lot more than two.
You're right, and it'sinteresting that you say that
about me and Nora.
It's funny.
I was talking to Nora'sdaughter at market how much Nora
(23:06):
and I are alike and also howvery different we are and those
two things work so well togetherwe it's.
It's interesting really.
There are some things that werereally spot on lockstep and
then other things that were sodifferent, but but it all works.
It really has been a greatpartnership I think I'm speaking
(23:29):
for myself.
I'm assuming Nora would say thesame that it really has been.
It's been great for both of usAbsolutely, and that's another
thing.
Speaker 2 (23:38):
You know that maturity and time has taught me
as a business owner, and one ofmy favorite things to do is to
help young entrepreneurs andyoung business people start
their own dream and watch makeit happen.
And one of the things I sayoften is as soon as you can hire
somebody who's better atsomething than you are, do it.
(23:59):
I mean that's like number oneadvice.
I mean there's nothing moreimportant to me than putting
together a team with completelydifferent skill sets.
Um, I think that's really thecore at core reason for success
for any, for any business, anyteam, any band, any anything
(24:21):
really.
Um, I think oftentimes peopleget into too much trouble.
Get into trouble when they aretrying to do too much because
they're afraid to pay the money.
But I'm telling you, it's goingto be worth it in the long run
to really build your team up ofdiversity and differing thought
(24:44):
processes, different skill sets,different ways of communicating
.
We have some salespeople whoare super introverted.
We have some who are superextroverted.
We know who to send to whichstore at which time.
People are so different and wealso learn from each other a
tremendous amount, and that'sjust a blessing in and of itself
(25:07):
too.
So, yeah, those would be mypieces of advice, and I think
why Janice and I work so welltogether is that I don't pretend
like I'm organized.
I'm not.
I mean, if you, we travel a tonfor work and forgive me, Janice
, for telling your dirty secrets, but when we travel for work
and we open up our suitcases, Imean you open mine and literally
(25:27):
everything flies out.
Nothing is organized, Nothing'seven folded, it's just you know
, a big disaster.
All my makeup's from Walgreensand the Ziploc, and she opens
hers and she has her proper bagwith her.
You know, undergarments and herdresses and her shoes are each
in bags, and I mean justwatching.
That explains everything aboutour personalities.
(25:48):
We both get the stuff there.
We both end up pulling it off,but in totally different ways.
Speaker 3 (25:55):
It totally works and I think that for the team as
well.
I think one of the things iswhat are the things that you
aren't able to teach someone?
You know that culture fit youaren't able to teach someone.
You know that culture fit, thatdesire to continue to do the
good things that we're doing.
You probably can't teach that.
The other stuff if you canteach it, then we'll do that,
(26:16):
we'll figure it out together.
But you kind of have to decideis this the kind of thing?
Do they have everything thatand can we pull this team
together, the things that wecan't teach that?
They already have that, andthen the other stuff.
We'll figure that all outtogether.
You can take a course, you canbrush up on things, but there's
some of that that you can andthat culture fit that's tough to
(26:40):
teach someone.
Speaker 4 (26:41):
They say hire for character and train for skill.
Hire for character and trainfor skill.
Speaker 3 (26:46):
Right, right, right.
And since our position is alittle bit different, especially
on our sales team, our positionis a little bit different than
other companies might be youkind of have to look out for
that and make sure you'reaccounting for that, our kind of
Nora Fleming personality.
Speaker 2 (27:04):
Yeah, we almost have to set different matrix for our
sales team than a traditionalcompany would.
We have some amazing rep groupsthat work with us, and I'm sure
no one's ever said it to medirectly, but I can imagine it's
very challenging for some ofthem to be given such strict
parameters with whom they cansell, versus somebody who says
(27:25):
just go out there and get me 500new stores.
Just get me 500 new stores thismonth and I'll be thrilled.
You know, to us it's moreimportant to have, but you know
they're paid on commission, sohow do you?
So?
We have to come up withdifferent ways to incentivize
our sales staff um to work inthat business model, which is,
you know, a different, adifferent way of thinking, um,
(27:53):
and it can be just as lucrative.
It just we have to be cognizantof how to reward our, our
people.
That isn't in the traditionalsales model.
Speaker 4 (27:56):
And you know I mean what I love about your, the way
you sort of organically growing,thoughtfully growing on brand,
not, you know, sticking to yourknitting as as, as they say, um
in, in terms of like knowing whoyou are and what your brand
promise is.
And you know, not bigger.
(28:18):
Bigger is not better, better isbetter.
Speaker 3 (28:21):
Right.
Speaker 4 (28:21):
Right Um.
I mean bigger can be better,but better is always better.
Speaker 3 (28:26):
Talk a little bit.
Speaker 4 (28:28):
So you guys have made a decision a number of years
ago, I think, or maybe you havealways done give back and
donations, charity, and you'vedone.
You're doing this amazing workwith St Jude.
Talk about that.
Speaker 2 (28:49):
I'll start it off a little bit.
So this project came about twoyears before my brother passed
away, so 2017, my brother and Iwe were donating to everybody
very happily but anyone friendof a friend who was having a
something sending out plattersevery day, platters and minis,
(29:09):
um, or just financial donationsto different organizations and
it just got so diluted.
So my brother and I sat downand had a meeting and we didn't
have any preconceived umorganization that we were going
to go with, nothing like that Um.
But we uh sat down and we saidyou know, let's really try and
make a concerted effort, make acommitment to one organization
(29:30):
and see what we can do.
So we decided that point.
We'd been touched by my son'sbest friend passed away from a
brain tumor and one of ouremployees.
A few years later her son wasalso touched by cancer.
So it seemed very appropriatethat we would go to St Jude for
our first big commitment.
And we went to them and we saidwe'd like to partner with you,
(29:51):
We'd like to do nine minis overthe course of five to six years
and have all of the proceeds goto St Jude, Not having any idea
how it would go, and you cantake it from there, Janice, like
it was just beyond.
Speaker 3 (30:05):
So it was those nine minis and then kind of the
keepsake collector's box thathad the St Jude logo on it and
we focused the minis onchildren's themed minis.
You know, a bear in the littlered St Jude wagon, two hearts
that a young patient had drawn,sandcastles, so other things
(30:26):
that were kind of kid-focusedbut still obviously could be
used in any situation.
And all of the proceeds, youknow, went back to St Jude.
The retailers partnered with usand consumer knew that's what
each mini was for.
We limited the number to 10,000of each one, you know.
(30:50):
So we knew that's what thedonation is going to be and then
in the end we just finalizedthat this summer the total
donation and it was nine minisand one keepsake box and that
donation was just over $1.1million from Nora Fleming.
From those 10 pieces, $1.1million, wow, yeah, which just
(31:11):
shows that everyone kind ofgrouping together focusing on
that.
You know that's the differencethat you can make.
But if you think of our productoffering, it was one mini, it
was one mini.
Right, there are other minis.
We, you know we had theproceeds from all the other
minis.
It was one.
So we were sharing one of apart.
It wasn't, it was a commitment,but it you know we could still
(31:36):
carry on business wise.
It was, it was a good decision.
Speaker 4 (31:40):
Great.
Speaker 2 (31:42):
And people were just we.
We really found, too, thatpeople are just really excited
to be part of something biggerthan themselves.
This whole notion of purposefulbuying is it's true?
I mean, I, I, I can't believehow how many people want to.
When, given the choice betweenA and B, and they like them, you
know, equal, even if they likeB a little bit more.
(32:04):
But A is giving back, they'regoing to buy A.
Um, so it's been it's, it'sbeen very eyeopening and very?
Um inspiring to know that thathumanity still has that amazing
goodness in it and that wehaven't lost that as consumers.
You know, you always hear likewe just want to consume more
stuff, but what I see from whereI sit is that people want to
(32:27):
consume stuff that matters andstuff that makes them feel good
when they bring it out ordisplay it in their home them
feel good when they bring it outor display it in their home.
Speaker 3 (32:40):
And we've kind of, now that we're finished with St
Jude, we've carried that on withanother product line whose
entire intention is to continuethe give back, now to 10
different causes, and it'scolorful silicone rims that add
on to our round melamineplatters, it's called Band
Together and most recently weadded, as the 10th partner, hard
(33:03):
on Main Street.
So that's giving back to theretailers and again, that's just
another way for everyone topartner together and do this
thing together.
Speaker 2 (33:15):
Jay, since Hard on Main is so new, can you explain
that maybe to any listeners whodon't know much about it?
It's just such a neatorganization.
I'm so proud that we're part ofit, and Janice We've had
Patrick Kaiser on anotherpodcast.
Speaker 4 (33:28):
We've had Patrick Kaiser on another podcast also.
Do tell Janice.
Speaker 2 (33:32):
Janice, she really spearheaded this from the Nora
Fleming side and I just couldn'tbe more proud.
Speaker 3 (33:40):
Well, and it kind of came out of you know a mistake
actually that we made.
We started the Band Togetherprogram with nine colors and we
didn't forget purple.
But we didn't have room foreverything.
So we knew we have room foreverything.
So we knew we were missing acolor.
The Baltimore Ravens people werethe most upset by this.
(34:01):
The TCU people were upset.
You know, there was no purple,so we were going to have to make
a purple band and then I justthought why don't we just take
this band and why don't we do itto Heart on Main Street and so
that you know that's the causeto help those retailers?
You know, not only with thewebinars and you know that
(34:24):
programming, but also if there'sa natural disaster and a
retailer needs help, then withfinancial support and a great
story about that, ourmanufacturing partner was so
moved by this that even theyhelped on our pricing so that we
can make a bigger donation toHard On Main Street and if
(34:48):
that's not true partnership thateverybody's pitching in so that
we can all help the independentretailers.
I mean that really that has beena great and I think we're the
first vendor who has said we'regoing to take this product and
this product can be for Heart onMain Street, but just like the
St Jude minis, you know you cando this.
It's just take the, you know,make a candle or make a pair of
(35:10):
earrings and just say we'regoing to do this for Heart and
Main Street or whatever cause.
We're already doing this, we'realready doing the product
development.
You're just intentionallysetting aside this.
One product is for this cause.
Speaker 4 (35:24):
I love it.
You know.
I think this is a good place towrap it up.
I do have.
I'm going to just plug yourwebsite here so you don't have
to do it, because you keeptalking about minis and people
need to check outnoraflemmingcom and and
(35:45):
understand what that is it's.
You guys have a very coolproduct line, I think it's um.
I thank you so much for sharingjust your.
You know your story, yourthoughts on branding and growing
and better is better, notbigger is better, necessarily.
And you know what you're doingfor your various communities I
(36:11):
think is heartwarming and it'swonderful and congratulations.
Speaker 3 (36:16):
Thank you so much.
Thank you for letting us shareand and spending time with us
today.
Speaker 2 (36:22):
Thank you so much.
And just as a last note, ifanyone needs help out there in
the industry or or has anyfurther questions, you can reach
Janice and I very easily justthrough our emails.
I'm I'm Nora at Nora Flemingand Janice is Janice at Nora
Fleming, one M in the Fleming.
But it would truly be our honorto talk to any budding
entrepreneurs out there, or ifthere's anything that we could
(36:43):
help with, we would love to be apart of it.
So keep that in mind.
Speaker 4 (36:47):
Terrific.
Thank you so much, thank you.
Speaker 1 (36:54):
Thank you for listening to this episode of TGO
Podcast.
You can find all episodes onour podcast page at
wwwrealign4resultscom.
You can find me, benno, host ofTGO Podcast, there as well.
Just email Benno B-E-N-N-O atrealignforresultscom.
(37:16):
Let's keep growing.
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