June 5, 2025 • 39 mins
It all started with a wait in line for a pee.
That got fellow Bristol students Amber Probyn and co-founder Hazel McShane thinking; "There has be equality for women at events." The first urinals were introduced for men in 1866!
Amber and Hazel have successfully launched Peequal, the UK's first squat-and-go women's urinal. These are designed to be 2.7 times faster than traditional portable toilets, solving a problem that affects half the world's population.
Hear their story including:
- Raising £250K during COVID despite being an event-based business
- What they did when the suppliers let them down on the eve of the big launch at Glastonbury 2022
- How they manage as a team, and supplied toilets to the London Marathon 2025.
It's an amazing story told by an inspirational entrepreneur; one of many great stories coming out of the NatWest Accelerator in this mini series.
NatWest Accelerators: Connections, locations, and guidance to inspire you to grow your business.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Amber, thanks for joining me today on the NatWest
Unnoticed Entrepreneur PodcastSeries.
Speaker 2 (00:05):
Well, thank you for having me.
I'm really excited to have thisgreat conversation together.
Speaker 1 (00:10):
Well, you are solving a problem that affects half the
world, you know all women thatstruggle when it comes to large
events, and the first urinalmale urinal was invented in 1866
.
But you've got a solution nowfor women, so do you want to
tell us what business you'rebuilding, and then we'll talk a
(00:32):
little bit more about you andyour background.
Speaker 2 (00:33):
Love to.
Yeah, so myself and Hazel,we've created Piqua, and Piqua
is the UK's first squat-and-gowomen's urinal, and what we do
is we get women out of thequeues and back to the event so
they're not missing out on theirfavorite acts or delaying their
start times for marathons, orhaving to go further afield and
(00:54):
have a wild wee where it's a bitunsafe, you know, really
creating equal access tofacilities, and we consider
women's time as equal to men'stime.
So that's why we're reallypassionate about what we do.
Speaker 1 (01:06):
Yeah, what a wonderful, wonderful mission
that you've got.
And I said as a father of twodaughters, and I have three
sisters and five nieces.
Speaker 2 (01:13):
Yeah, you know the problem.
Speaker 1 (01:14):
I know the problem of waiting around for them
actually.
Speaker 2 (01:17):
That's right, so it's benefiting everybody.
Speaker 1 (01:20):
Piqul, tell us then the backstory.
How did you and your co-founder, hazel, start the business?
Speaker 2 (01:27):
then we'll talk about some of the challenges that you
faced along the way andsuccesses you've been having so
in our master's year at bristoluniversity, haze and I
collaborated in our fourth andfinal year and the project was
to solve a real world problem.
So in our summers we'd work atfestivals and in our breaks we'd
have to choose between going tothe loo or getting food just
(01:50):
because the toilet queues werethat long.
So you'd have to reallycompromise on what you needed,
and so we thought surely there'sa better way.
Let's just see what we can do,push some doors, be curious and
sort of see if there's any kindof solutions out there already.
So when we did the project andwe were going through the
secondary death research, wejust realized there was nothing
(02:11):
out there and we're like, oh mygoodness, this is a massive gap.
There's no innovation, there'sno investment assigned to this.
There's huge taboo aroundwomen's sanitation and it's
actually very unsexy and womenare very linked to being sexy.
So if you don't want to talkabout it, it's this huge taboo
around.
You know women's sanitation.
So we were like, gosh, someoneneeds to do something about this
.
So why not us?
So that's sort of where itkicked off it was.
(02:34):
That was very a big convictionpoint, and then, ever since then
, we've been speaking tomillions of women, hundreds and
millions of women, about gettingthis, getting this to be a
standard facility why do youthink that women's urinals have
taken this long?
Speaker 1 (02:49):
you said it's been um unsexy.
Yeah, has it also beensomething that's not been
interesting to you?
Know?
Speaker 2 (02:58):
inventors to vcs yeah , so the one point is that you
know we sexualize women, so wedon't want that associated.
We don't want any kind ofbodily liquid associated with
women.
So even in our language we'dsay I'm going to the powder room
, you know I'm going to powdermy nose instead of going to the
toilet.
Or you know, you see theseslight changes in our language
(03:18):
even to sort of disconnect womenfrom sanitation.
Um, so there's like tabooaround that.
But then there's also lack ofinvestment in this space,
because at the moment it's veryobvious that a lot of investors
out there are men and thisproblem doesn't impact them very
much, so the investment is lessfunneled towards women's
(03:39):
sanitation or women's healthtech.
Yeah, there's a big barrierthere for female founders to get
investment.
So, yeah, for a long time nowit hasn't been a priority.
Um, there's lots of otherbarriers as well, but those are
two main ones yeah, I mean.
Speaker 1 (03:55):
So you've got, I think, the statistically less
than one percent of all fundinggoes to women.
Yeah, when it comes to, youknow, investments, plus, you've
got the like, the unsexiness ofwomen's sanitation, yeah, being
not high on people's agenda.
And I guess you can't usetechnology perhaps in the same
way to get scales and so on.
Yeah, why did you and hazelthink that you could solve this
(04:21):
problem where, in 160 years, noone else has even come close?
Speaker 2 (04:27):
I mean, I think it was that conviction that we had,
like, when we realized therewas nothing out there and it was
like a bit baffling, you kindof surprised yourself and you
sort of realized that this is anormalized inequality that us
ourselves have been drawn into.
You know, it's something thatwe know the problem we feel the
pain waiting in the queues, butyet we've just stood about
(04:48):
thinking, oh, someone else willdo something about it.
But then you get thisconviction of, like gosh,
something needs to happen, solet's see if we can do it, let's
, why not us?
That kind of attitude of whynot us, if not us?
Who?
You know, that kind of thepowerful, convicting language
that you hear.
It was that kind of moment, andthen we just have been curious
(05:08):
and been running with it eversince.
Speaker 1 (05:10):
Well, I think it's amazing that you found such a
huge problem that no one hadaddressed, but also that the
scale of the problem didn'tintimidate you and Hazel.
Speaker 2 (05:20):
I think there was a bit of naivety at the beginning,
to be honest, which wasactually a protective thing,
because if you knew what we weregetting into, I don't know if
we'd even started.
But yeah, I think it is massiveand sometimes it is
intimidating to think about.
We're actually changingindustries, we're changing
language, you know we'rechanging expectations and budget
(05:40):
allocation and you know there'sso many important things that
people addresses and challenges,and so that's a big
responsibility.
So, yeah, I think the naivety Iwish we had a bit more of that
at the moment but yeah, it is ahuge opportunity.
Speaker 1 (05:57):
You had a huge opportunity and we'll talk about
how you got there in time.
But just for anyone watching orlistening, you have just served
the London marathon.
Yes, so you've had literallytens of thousands of people go
through PCOR.
So for anyone listening, thisis a true story of a couple of
women founders changing the waythat events and even society
(06:21):
operate.
So I do want to call that out.
So one listening goes wow,that's amazing.
Let's stick around and listento this story.
So you and Hazel universityfind a real world problem,
unlike just submitting yourthesis and then getting jobs and
say, well, we found the problem, but we decided not to tackle
it.
You have decided to tackle it.
(06:41):
You have decided to tackle it.
Can you just take us throughthe steps?
the stages that you've gone fromuniversity thesis to actually
delivering these P-Col urinalsto the London Marathon.
Speaker 2 (06:57):
Sure, I mean, there's so many stages and so many
things I could talk about, butto condense it down.
So after university, Hazel andI did get full-time jobs.
I got a job at an innovationconsultancy and Hazel got a job
with oh my goodness, I'veforgotten the company now.
Speaker 1 (07:16):
An important company, Very important company
sustainable company Sorry, hazel.
Speaker 2 (07:32):
And we did that in our days.
And then we worked on Pequil inour mornings and our evenings
to sort of keep going and keeppushing, getting more research,
talking to more people, morecustomers, and so that was how
we funded the sort of our workon Pequil.
Right at the start, we werealso applying for grants and
competitions where you'd win 500quid there, 200 quid here, so
that would sort of tie us over,um right at the start.
And then, um, we managed to geta grant from the University of
(07:53):
Bristol that enabled us to gofull-time, so we were able to
quit our jobs, which is anincredible feeling.
To you know, focus the besthours of your day on what you
really want to do.
Um.
And then we made lots and lotsof prototypes.
So we were already makingcardboard prototypes and 3d
prints, but then we made twoscale prototypes that we took to
covid safe events.
This was in 2021, um, and wetook our large scale prototypes
(08:16):
to get real feedback from womenat these events, because you can
talk about it all you want, butas soon as you go to an event,
get your feet on the ground.
That's when you get your realfeedback.
So it was fantastic.
So the first one we went to wason the Downs in Bristol.
Um, it was a comedy gardenfestival and, um, we had the BBC
feature us.
It was a fantastic opportunitybecause it meant that we won the
(08:39):
front page of the BBC with thisum made out of scrap material
prototype.
Basically because we had nomoney and that meant we had
customers internationallyreaching out to us saying how do
we get you to the US?
I want you in Malaysia,literally.
It was incredible the demandthat we were able to showcase
and that was a big point for usbecause it meant that when we
(09:00):
went for investment, we had allthis sort of that.
All these customers lined meantthat when we went for
investment, we had all this sortof that, all these customers
lined up that showed the demandfor our product like this.
So lots of prototyping.
And then the next step wasraise investment.
Um, and this was in covid.
So lots of zoom meetings, lotsof dodgy wi-fi, which was not
(09:21):
fun, very triggering, but we didmanage to raise 250K in COVID
for an event-based business.
So you know that's no smallthing and we often think about
that.
How do we do that?
But we had some incredibleinvestors and that still back us
today.
And, yeah, that allowed us tomanufacture the product in the
UK and then be able to launch atGlastonbury in 2022.
Speaker 1 (09:47):
I could keep going but that that's Well, what an
amazing story.
So it sounds as though youmanaged to really tap into a
zeitgeist where, although ithadn't been developed, everyone
saw the need.
Speaker 2 (09:58):
Yes, that's right, and COVID actually helped in
some ways, because it was achance for festivals and events
to rethink their sustainabilityand to look to switch up their
solutions, and so people were abit more open to change, a bit
more open to trying new thingsinstead of sort of the same old
rigmarole.
So, yeah, in that way it reallydid help us and also because
(10:20):
we're so much more hygienic thanportable toilets, it meant that
because covid had just happened, everyone was looking for
sanitary options, so it wasanother sort of arrow in our in
our boat yeah, like for thosepeople that aren't familiar with
how a woman's urinal works, I Idon't know whether it's
possible to say paint us apicture in words yes, I try my
(10:42):
best yeah, so that people canvisualize, of course yeah, so it
is a standalone facility so youdon't have to hold anything.
It's not a funnel.
You just step into thisfacility and pop a squat, you
pee into this thing called thepedestal, which is
anti-splashback, and it's reallycomfortable for all squat
heights.
We've tested this thoroughlyand there's a handle if you want
(11:05):
support and you just pop asquat and pee, squat and go.
It's that simple.
It's a designated safe spacefor women to go for a wee, just
like the equivalent of maleurinals.
Uh, it's.
What's the key thing about peakquiz is the efficiency.
So we've designed it to be 2.7times faster than a portable
(11:26):
toilet, which means women are inand out of those queues like no
.
Tomorrow means that you getback to the event without having
to miss out on anything.
Um and those, those, um.
That efficiency has been madereal because of things like the
pedestal being just squat and go.
You'd have to touch the thing,clean anything down.
It's overlapping doors insteadof like a lockable door and it's
(11:47):
semi-private.
This is the important thing.
It means that when you'restanding up, you can be seen
from the waist up, so it'sreally fun.
You can wave at your friends,um, but then when you're peeing,
you're popping up.
You can be seen from the waistup, so it's really fun.
You can wave at your friends.
But then when you're peeing,you're popping a squat.
You can't be seen by anyone andthat means you're fully private
.
It means that you'reincentivized to just pee and go.
You're not checking your phone,you're not doing anything else
in the toilet, you're justpeeing.
Speaker 1 (12:08):
You said something there which made me think of you
and Hazel as engineers, whichis about the micro moments and
makes me think about the idea ofthe frictionless customer
experience.
We remove anything that's abottleneck, and you've
identified time as being thegive back for the customer.
How did you light upon whatyou're calling micro moments as
(12:33):
being one of the keys to success?
Speaker 2 (12:36):
I think we just knew that we needed to make it more
efficient some way.
So we were trying to tacklewhat, what was it that was
slowing this process down andthen try to re-out, design it
basically, um, and that's shownthroughout our journey, because
we're actually launching aversion five next year.
So, you know, not just versionone, not two, not not three, not
four, but five.
(12:57):
And that's just microimprovements that we've made to
make the product a lot moreefficient, a lot more desirable
for the user to use.
So, yeah, it's just constantiteration and improvement to
make it even more efficient.
Speaker 1 (13:28):
So let's talk, then, about the move from raising
money and making these thingsyourself, these urinals yourself
, to commercialization, becauseit's one thing to have a great
idea and get people saying, hey,can you deliver it.
It's another game altogetherwhen there are two of you in
Bristol and you're deliveringurinals to Glastonbury, for
example, or to the marathon inLondon.
How did you and Hazel overcomethe really the transition from
(13:49):
idea and prototype intodelivered commercial product?
Speaker 2 (13:52):
um, I think a big moment was when we started
manufacturing from the UK.
So it went from building theprototypes ourselves to an
established rotational mouldingfactory producing the product
for us, and that was the productthat we had ready for
Glastonbury.
However, there is a story here.
You know, one of those barriersthat you, as founders, always
(14:15):
have to come up against.
Unfortunately, themanufacturers made half of the
product, so they made the tanksbut not the walls.
So if we had just gone ahead,we wouldn't have been able to do
Glastonbury that year.
So, as gritty founders that weare, we were like no, this has
to happen.
How do we get to Glastonbury?
How do we make sure that we dothis?
Launch Women access?
(14:37):
How do we get to Glastonbury?
How do we make sure that we dothis?
Launch women access, thisproduct?
So we got loads of our friendstogether.
We, we ordered some scaffold,loads of allen keys and some
foam boards and we basicallybuilt the walls ourselves I
think over 300 walls over aweekend or two, and our you know
, new employees they also gaveup their weekends to join us,
and it was just this big teameffort that enabled these walls
(14:59):
to be made.
And we got to Glastonbury andwe launched there and it was
significantly successful.
We were on Women's Hour, wesort of hit huge BBC outlets.
It was incredible and we got toprove that this is something
women love and really want tosee more of, and that those
walls we actually tookthroughout the whole of 2022.
(15:19):
It wasn't just Glastonbury, sothe manufacturers actually
couldn't have produced thosewalls for any of the other
events either.
So it just shows you just haveto really dig deep and think how
can we actually make thishappen?
As a founder, you're like sostubbornly passionate about what
needs to go next.
So, yeah, that was.
Speaker 1 (15:39):
That was a really big moment of going from just
prototyping to commercializationcan I ask what went wrong with
the procurement process that themanufacturer didn't deliver?
Speaker 2 (15:50):
because I wish I knew .
Okay, there's multiple reasons.
You know things that you can'thelp like.
You know, one of the toolmakers was sick for three weeks,
delaying production, you know,or some a big order took longer
than they anticipated before ourorder, pushing ours back.
You know, there's just so manythings that you can't control
(16:11):
with manufacturing and so, yeah,that buffer time was just eaten
up.
But you know, we've learned alot from it and you know we we
do enjoy, um, not having to makeourselves.
You know we do enjoy workingwith manufacturers that have
those skills to make sure we cancommercialize.
But, um, yeah, we're excited tobe producing version five in
(16:32):
poland year.
So we went out there last yearand we absolutely loved it and
it was a fantastic factory wherethey've got everything run to a
T.
We really enjoyed theirbusiness, their manufacturing.
Speaker 1 (16:47):
Okay, obviously it's a bit disappointing that in the
UK you won't be able to findsomeone to deliver, that you've
had to go to Europe.
But what I will ask you is acash flow question, because when
you commercialize you've gotthe quarter of a million but
you've got a team.
You've got you and Hazel.
How are you able to structurethe cash flow to carry you
(17:09):
through?
Because if you have amanufacturer that doesn't
deliver but you've probably gota commitment to glass debris,
for example, yes for me, anyway,the stress is when I'm trying
to arbitrage the relationshipsbetween a customer and a
supplier.
Right as an entrepreneur, youget stuck between what you
promise one person you'lldeliver and what someone else
promised yeah, you'll deliver,and you're expressing how you.
(17:32):
You bridge the gap by justsheer force of character and
appetite of risk, isn't it?
Exactly.
Yeah, can you just take usthrough how you solved, how you
dealt with that practically oremotionally, because I think
often people look atentrepreneurs oh well, they,
they were there and they got tothere, but there's there's a lot
(17:53):
of challenges, not just thephysical but the financial.
Speaker 2 (17:55):
Yeah, I mean from a cash flow perspective, what we
ask of our customers is 50 upfront, so as soon as they book,
and then 30 30 days before theevent and then 20 seven days
after.
So we get a large percentage ofthe cash up front before the
event actually happens, whichmeans that we have that cash
flow coming in significantlythroughout the year and that
(18:18):
really helps us sort of preparefor those events and tie us over
.
But we have raised a secondround of investment with from
since 2022 till now, and we arecurrently raising investment
around now.
So you know we are constantlylooking for new investors.
So if anyone's listening thatwants to back people, please
reach out to us, because wealways want to start new
(18:39):
relationships with new investors.
And, yeah, see how we can getPequil international.
Speaker 1 (18:44):
Okay, that's wonderful, amber.
So let's think about investors.
Will love the product, yes, andhalf the world.
Let's face it half or over halfthe world needs what you're
offering.
But investors also look at thefounders and the relationship
between the founders.
Can we just talk a little bitabout how you and Hazel operate,
(19:06):
because that can make or breaka business.
Speaker 2 (19:11):
Yeah, I think well for PQOL, our relationship has
made the business happen.
So, you know, both of us wouldsay we don't want to do this on
our own.
This is something that we'veentered into together, this is
something that we both reallybelieve in, really want to see
happen.
You know the off the back ofthe London Marathon.
You know we were collecting theurine to turn into fertilizer
(19:32):
and we were there on the groundactually collecting the urine
ourselves.
And you know you have thesemoments of, like, shared
experience.
You're like nobody elseunderstands me like you do.
No one else gets the grind likeyou do.
And it's this very rarerelationship where you challenge
each other, where you care foreach other, where you really
grind and see that strain witheach other and try and support
(19:56):
each other in the best way youcan.
Um, I don't know any otherrelationship in my life that's
like this one.
Um, but yeah, we, we shouldereach other, you know, and you
have to be constantlycommunicating to to let each
other know where you're at, eventoday.
You know, communicating whereour mood's at in the day, like,
oh, I think I need to just havea break, have a drink, get a cup
(20:17):
of tea.
Um, disclaiming.
You know, today I feel a bitrough.
You know that kind of thing.
It's the day-to-daycommunication that makes your
sort of relationship reliableand steady.
And, um, trust, trusting, and Ithink, yeah, both of us
treasure.
Treasure it, because I have gotfriends that are solo founders
(20:37):
and it is a big struggle, youknow.
It's isolating, it means thatyou don't feel as understood by
your peers.
There's there's a lot ofpositives as well, but I know
from experience that having aco-founder is significantly
better yeah, well, there's oldold saying, isn't there?
Speaker 1 (20:53):
if you want to go fast, go alone, but if you want
to go further, yeah, go withothers.
When you look now at people andyou know the role that you two
have been able to play and thecommunity that you found in the
accelerator, yeah you've comeboth as students yeah and I
(21:14):
think not it wasn't from abusiness studies background.
Speaker 2 (21:17):
No, no, I studied anthropology with innovation,
Hazel studied physics withinnovation.
So you know we both had sort ofcreativity in our blood.
Speaker 1 (21:26):
You know we've been creating dens and go-karts and
small business projects on theside all the time, but no, not
like a business backgroundnecessarily the side all the
time, but, um, no, not like abusiness background necessarily,
and so what are some of theways that you've got involved
with the accelerator and howthat's helped to to grow people
into the?
Speaker 2 (21:45):
kind of business that it's becoming I think a big
thing about the accelerator issharing in the challenges that
you're facing, um, because, likeI mentioned, nobody else quite
understands you like anotherfounder does.
Um, and sharing those strugglesis like quite a vulnerable
thing to do and if someone canhelp you in that, in that
(22:07):
position, you'll, you know, youfeel so grateful, you feel so
supported and and backed.
You know, I think there's thisreal feeling of fight.
If you're a founder, you'reconstantly like come on, I want
to create something, and it canbe really difficult to create
something.
So if someone's got your backand says, hey, I can connect you
with this person or hey, don'tworry about it, I've been there
(22:28):
and you'll get, you'll getthrough it.
That is massive and it's not tobe underestimated to have that
support system.
So.
So for us, it was that greatersupport system underneath Piquil
that allowed us to reach out topeople and be like what did you
do when you hit this wall?
How did you get over thathurdle?
And then us allowing us to dothe same for others.
If we could help others, wewould pass that on and do the
(22:49):
same.
Speaker 1 (22:50):
So would you say that , even if you have a founder,
like you and Hazel have?
Speaker 2 (22:59):
being part of a broader community brings some
benefits.
The perspective, I think, iskey.
We always talk aboutperspective.
If you're just working on yourbusiness and you're working from
home quite a lot, you can bequite insulated.
You can lose perspective.
So when you come into spaceslike this and you ask what's
your business, what are yougoing through at the moment?
Who are you talking to?
So when you come into spaceslike this and you ask what?
What's your business?
You know, what are you goingthrough at the moment, who are
you talking to, it kind of opensyou up to be a lot more um,
(23:22):
grateful.
In a way.
You sort of understand hey,let's celebrate these wins.
You know, the London Marathonjust happened, what like?
We were dreaming of this threeyears ago, you know.
Speaker 1 (23:31):
So I think perspective is one of the most
important things as a founderand, as you say, you've got the
perspective of everyone heresupporting you too, haven't you?
I think that, uh, even as beingon the podcast here, yeah,
people are celebrating and inyour corner it's wonderful to
have you and hazel and, I guess,family and friends.
What about the the mindsetshift that you two are having to
(23:55):
go through now?
Because, as the company growsand you've got pitches out to
investors and you're going to gofor more.
What are you having to thinkabout differently now as an
entrepreneur?
Because it's not been that long, in fairness.
I mean, you launched the firstproject in 2020, I think it was
2021.
We're in 2025, so you'veactually accomplished a huge
(24:23):
amount in a short amount of time.
Thank you, yeah, it'sincredible.
What mindset changes have youhad to make and how are you
making those?
Speaker 2 (24:29):
good question.
Um, I think I'll.
I want to rephrase it themindset things I want to keep
okay, um, because I think that'swhat has let, has meant the
business continues is to sort ofhold on to traits like the
passion, the grittiness, thesesort of like personal qualities
(24:52):
that have actually enabled thebusiness to keep going.
Um, that's, those are themindset qualities that have
actually enabled the business tokeep going.
Um, that's, those are themindset qualities that have
really enabled our business tothrive.
Because this grittiness youdon't find it in lots of people.
The grittiness that it takes tosort of do the really hard work
that no one else wants to do.
You know to be the last personat the end of the day, to to
(25:13):
clear up the cups.
You know to do the thingsnobody sees.
I think you need that grit andthat conviction, passion, and
those are the things I want tohave throughout my whole life,
not just running this businessbut in every aspect of life.
But, um, those are the things Iwant to keep.
Sorry, I rephrased yourquestion there.
Speaker 1 (25:30):
That's okay.
In a way, that's probably, uh,the hallmark of why you're such
a great entrepreneur, becauseyou're staying very true to your
core values.
Right, it needs to be done, andyou've got this higher sense of
purpose.
Speaker 2 (25:43):
That's right.
The purpose point is a reallyit's what drives us.
It's not just clickbait, it'ssomething that we really believe
in.
It really is what keeps usgoing and why, when it's so hard
, we do keep going.
And I think any businessfounder would agree that if you
have purpose at the center ofyour business, it is that thing
that keeps the engine going.
Speaker 1 (26:04):
Yeah, I think you're absolutely right, and the people
that fall by the wayside arethose who didn't really have a
mission, but maybe had a motive,maybe self-interest or
short-term interest, rather thanthe bigger picture which you've
got, really just equality forwomen, you know looking at your
website and watching the videos.
But looking at the website orwatching the videos, I can see
(26:25):
the enthusiasm that women havefor, frankly, the relief, right.
I mean, they've been waiting along time now.
They don't have to wait.
Speaker 2 (26:33):
The relief is the right word.
Speaker 1 (26:34):
The relief is the right word.
Speaker 2 (26:35):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (26:37):
How have you been marketing to those event
companies?
Because you've got some PR.
Can I say PR?
Speaker 2 (26:47):
You've got some public relations just to qualify
for that, see how many puns wecan get in.
Yeah, how many puns can we getin?
Speaker 1 (26:52):
one interview.
But what about the marketing tothose companies that are
looking at?
They've got an established portcabin provider.
They've got a piece of thefield that already comes to it.
They sell the tickets, whetherthe women get a better urinal or
not.
(27:12):
You know people aren't votingwith their wallets for that
service.
How are you getting theproposition for PQAL into the
market to get people coming tobuy?
Speaker 2 (27:24):
good question.
I think we started with eventsthat shared our values so
glastonbury, for example.
They're always looking to bemore innovative, they're always
looking to be more sustainable,they're always looking to bring
something new, something funinto their event and obviously
they set the bar.
So we wanted to start theinfluential events and then it
would just triple down into therest of the industry and that's
(27:46):
what we've seen happen.
So that that was definitely theright move.
But we do sort of angle ourpitch to customers sometimes
differently.
So we do.
We obviously create a betterexperience for the women, but we
can also generate a lot morerevenue for the events
themselves, because when womenaren't waiting in the queue,
they're getting a drink.
So you can see that we generatea lot more revenue for the
(28:09):
event themselves and actuallypeak will pays for itself once
it's there.
So if a event is struggling toget more money every year, this
is something that they can dotoo that's a good.
Speaker 1 (28:19):
yeah, that's good.
So if they're not peeing'reshopping, that's right.
Which?
With two daughters, and youknow three sisters I think
you're absolutely right.
So maybe I don't want to havepeople.
It costs me even more moneywhen I take my daughters to it.
But you said you got intoGlastonbury, but there's a
little bit missing that I dowant to talk about, because, as
(28:41):
an entrepreneur going, ok, yougot to Glastonbury, but how did
you get into Glastonbury?
Because it's a huge event.
They must have so many vendorspitching them, everything.
So I would just love forsomeone to hear that might be
listening to this.
Ok, that is the practical stepI would need to take to get the
dream client.
That would make the cascade ofcustomers full.
(29:01):
Yeah, the dream client.
Speaker 2 (29:02):
That would make the cascade of customers full.
Yeah, so the way we approachedGlastonbury was we were still
students at the time and wereached out to them as, like
research.
We were like, can we get youradvice, can we get your opinion
on this design?
We would love to provide thisfor you.
What sort of size tank capacitywould you like?
What kind of colorful wallswould you like?
And actually involving them inthe development process,
(29:23):
enlisted them on the journey,and so we weren't, we weren't
selling to them from the start.
We were constantly keeping intouch with them and and sort of
showing them the new design thatwe'd come up with what about
this?
What are your thoughts on this?
And we were talking to the headof sanitation at the time and
so, yeah, it was like a constantfeedback loop and they gained
more and more interest in Pequiland it meant that when we did
(29:45):
have something to sell, theyfelt a part of ownership.
They felt like, yeah, I want tosee this, how this goes?
I've fed into it.
You know I've said that thistank should be this size.
I've said that you know, womenwould want this kind of
dimension.
So that was definitely the wayof getting the our first
customer across the line.
Um, and yeah, we, we reallylove our relationship with
(30:08):
glastonbury.
They, they always get all ourstock every year and women
absolutely love it at theirevents.
So, yeah, that was how we sortof got that customer.
Speaker 1 (30:17):
It was just through relationship and through being
keen okay constantly knocking onthe door, and was that actually
physically going down to seethem, or we just found them on a
website?
Speaker 2 (30:26):
In COVID, so it was just over the channels that we
had, so it was email, phone,that kind of thing, great.
Speaker 1 (30:33):
So it's so important, I think, to go through the
detail of how these deals getdone, because for someone
starting a business.
It's often just that first step.
That's the hardest and no onewrites about.
Speaker 2 (30:46):
Yeah so true, I mean a lot of it is just calling
people up, it's just doing thesmall bits and you just never
know where it will go.
I've got so many stories oflike taxi drivers that knew an
investor that they made an intro, or someone at the pub knew a
manufacturer that linked me toanother manufacturer that we
went with.
There's just so many ways ofleads that you need to follow up
(31:06):
on you have no idea where theycan go.
Speaker 1 (31:08):
Exactly, and I think that's one of the joys of an
accelerator program that youhave mentors and people here.
Are there any examples of howpeople within the accelerator
community have supported you?
Speaker 2 (31:22):
Good question Definitely have had so many
founders share theirinvestor-like spreadsheets, A
lot of them sharing networks,being like oh, I think I know
this competition might besuitable for you or I know this
mentor that could help tacklethis problem.
The network is definitely thehuge advantage with this and
(31:43):
we've benefited significantlyfrom that.
I think it's the opennessfounders have towards each other
.
It's like, if I can help you, Iwill, and yeah, I really love
that.
Speaker 1 (31:53):
Okay, and I think also within NatWest, because
everyone's kind of joined thiscommunity of people under the
umbrella of NatWest.
There's a sort of a security.
People's guards are not upright.
They feel like they're all partof a community.
No one's trying to sell anybodyanything.
It's not a commercialarrangement.
It's really a supportivearrangement?
Speaker 2 (32:11):
Absolutely, there's a lot of respect towards each
other.
Everyone's very respectful.
Everyone knows people areworking towards something or
creating something that bringssomething good into the world,
and I think you know.
Can you ask for?
Speaker 1 (32:22):
yeah, to be surrounded by people that
inspire you, motivate you andsupport you.
Yeah, uh, that's a real dreamas an entrepreneur.
Speaking of dreams, amber,where in you?
Where have you and hazel got inyour mind for the next five
years?
For piqua?
Speaker 2 (32:39):
five years, um, so we've got lots of different
potential options.
Um, that will just be curiousand, like we've done so far,
just testing and seeing andseeing how it goes and if that's
what we want to do.
So there's no like hard planbut, um, we are hoping to go
international.
This is the next big thing.
Uh, we've got so much inboundrequests from the us, australia,
(33:02):
the eu, like there's just somuch possibility.
So once we've manufactured thev5, we will be going to events
in germany, in the netherlands,um, and so that will be where
we'd be scaling up in the eu.
So manufacturers in poland willbe very well suited to
international expansion and alsoworking with toilet
(33:23):
distributors to actually reachwomen much faster.
So we could scale up in-house,we could do all the logistics
ourselves and that's what we'vedone up till now.
So, hazel and I, we've gotforklift tickets.
You know we've been driving thestock around site in forklifts,
we've been doing the cleaning,we've been leading the teams.
But actually, if we want toreach women as quickly as we
(33:44):
want to reach them, we want thisfacility to be available for
all.
We need to start distributingwith other people.
Speaker 1 (33:49):
So that's how we're looking at scaling up I will ask
you the million dollar question, which is about ip protection.
And there I go.
I've got another p in there,sorry sorry, not sorry sorry ip
protection, because one mightthink that that there's no
software code, it's a design.
How are you going to protectPQOL from being copied?
Speaker 2 (34:13):
We have multiple patents granted and filed.
So from year one we filed apatent on our design, on the
functionality of how it fitstogether, and that's been
granted.
That was in 2021.
So that sort of you know, thatsort of held us over from from
the beginning and then, as ourdesign has been developed, we've
continuously filed more andmore patents that have sort of
(34:34):
broadened the umbrella of ip forpeakwell, um, and that spans
the uk, the EU, the US, chinaand Australia.
So we're in a good position forIP and it's an important
question because, you know, thatis the next obvious thing
copycats and what's the windowof time before other people
follow in our footsteps and yeah, that is very much on our
(34:56):
brains to be like there is thiswindow of time that we want to
actually leap into and land grabthere is this window of time
that we want to actually leapinto and land grab.
Speaker 1 (35:07):
That's great.
I want to ask that questionbecause there's been many an
entrepreneur that has a greatidea, commercialized it to some
degree and a larger company anArmitage Shanks or someone could
come along and, because they'vegot that heft, could steal it.
So this idea of IP protection,either locally, regionally or
internationally, is reallyimportant if you've got
something that could be copiedand actually it's remarkably low
(35:29):
cost for the protection itgives you, even if it just
creates a speed bump for anybodyelse, doesn't it?
Speaker 2 (35:34):
Yeah, that's right, that sort of barrier of
protection is there.
We're also building our brand.
So that is another way we'reprotecting people.
We're also building our brand.
So that is another way we'reprotecting PQOL.
We're becoming the go-towoman's urinal provider you know
, the trustworthy, establishedprovider out there and we're
building relationships, not justwith events but also the toilet
distributors that would havefleets of toilet blocks, things
(35:55):
like that.
We're building thoserelationships.
So, actually, when we do wantto go international, we have
these fully formed relationshipsthat we trust and that we want
to work together in an effectiveway.
Speaker 1 (36:07):
So, yeah, the brand, the IP and the relationships are
the key to that of the companynow growing and the sort of
environment that you're inshaping, how you and hazel think
of yourselves and where you seeyourselves in the next few
(36:29):
years um, I think we, we knowthat people has made an impact
in the event industry, which iscrazy to say and I, you know,
pat yourself on the back forthat.
That that is something tocelebrate.
Speaker 2 (36:42):
Yeah, so we 100% know that PQAL has made an impact
already.
I think in the future we areambitious and we want to see
policy change.
So we want to make PQAL makewomen's urinals a standard
facility for all events.
So when you go to an event, youneed to have X, Y and Z and
women's urinals needs to bethere everywhere.
(37:03):
Toilets are everywhere.
Male urinals are.
Women's urinals need to bethere too.
Speaker 1 (37:08):
Um, so, yeah, we're we're excited to be trying to
tackle that challenge and tryand change policy and guidelines
around that yeah, and you'redoing that, I think, with the
support of hazel, both of you,together with investors, new
investors and and, of course,this amazing community in the
Accelerator program.
Final question Amber, ifthere's an entrepreneur out
(37:29):
there thinking about how to growtheir business, thinking about
whether to join an Acceleratoror not, what would be your
experience that you'd share?
Speaker 2 (37:40):
I think one quality hazel and I both have is using,
being really resourceful andbeing really resourceful with
our networks.
So, like always thinking, whodo I know that might know
somebody else as a graphicdesigner, who you know?
I wonder if this person wouldbe able to do something for free
, I wonder, you know?
And and sort of utilizing thepeople in our network is the in
(38:02):
the best way possible.
You know, from the beginningour families have helped us out
big time.
You know we've got family,creative families that would
sort of help us model some sortof part of the product and be
able to, yeah, draw on theircontacts and just sort of think
creatively about the networksthat we have touch points within
.
And just sort of thinkcreatively about the networks
that we have touch points within.
So always think who do you know?
(38:24):
And look there first beforethinking I need to make a
stranger become my best friendbefore I can do anything.
Just think, oh no, I knowsomeone that knows someone else.
Speaker 1 (38:35):
And what about an entrepreneur that's looking at
the accelerator and going well,is that for me or not?
Maybe I can go alone.
What would be your advice tosomeone thinking about joining
an accelerator?
Speaker 2 (38:44):
I think there's no harm in it.
Hey, you know, like what?
What have you got to lose?
I think that's my attitude.
It's like what could you gain?
You know, there's either youcontinue doing what you're doing
or you could continue and havethis incredible support system.
So why not?
Speaker 1 (39:03):
Amber Probin.
Thank you so much.
It's such an inspirationalstory and you're changing the
lives of so many people.
From here in Bristol, you'rechanging the world.
Thank you so much for joiningme today.
Speaker 2 (39:13):
No, thank you for having me.
It's been really fun.
Cheers, it's my pleasure.
Amber, thanks for joining me today on the NatWest
Unnoticed Entrepreneur PodcastSeries.
Speaker 2 (00:05):
Well, thank you for having me.
I'm really excited to have thisgreat conversation together.
Speaker 1 (00:10):
Well, you are solving a problem that affects half the
world, you know all women thatstruggle when it comes to large
events, and the first urinalmale urinal was invented in 1866
.
But you've got a solution nowfor women, so do you want to
tell us what business you'rebuilding, and then we'll talk a
(00:32):
little bit more about you andyour background.
Speaker 2 (00:33):
Love to.
Yeah, so myself and Hazel,we've created Piqua, and Piqua
is the UK's first squat-and-gowomen's urinal, and what we do
is we get women out of thequeues and back to the event so
they're not missing out on theirfavorite acts or delaying their
start times for marathons, orhaving to go further afield and
(00:54):
have a wild wee where it's a bitunsafe, you know, really
creating equal access tofacilities, and we consider
women's time as equal to men'stime.
So that's why we're reallypassionate about what we do.
Speaker 1 (01:06):
Yeah, what a wonderful, wonderful mission
that you've got.
And I said as a father of twodaughters, and I have three
sisters and five nieces.
Speaker 2 (01:13):
Yeah, you know the problem.
Speaker 1 (01:14):
I know the problem of waiting around for them
actually.
Speaker 2 (01:17):
That's right, so it's benefiting everybody.
Speaker 1 (01:20):
Piqul, tell us then the backstory.
How did you and your co-founder, hazel, start the business?
Speaker 2 (01:27):
then we'll talk about some of the challenges that you
faced along the way andsuccesses you've been having so
in our master's year at bristoluniversity, haze and I
collaborated in our fourth andfinal year and the project was
to solve a real world problem.
So in our summers we'd work atfestivals and in our breaks we'd
have to choose between going tothe loo or getting food just
(01:50):
because the toilet queues werethat long.
So you'd have to reallycompromise on what you needed,
and so we thought surely there'sa better way.
Let's just see what we can do,push some doors, be curious and
sort of see if there's any kindof solutions out there already.
So when we did the project andwe were going through the
secondary death research, wejust realized there was nothing
(02:11):
out there and we're like, oh mygoodness, this is a massive gap.
There's no innovation, there'sno investment assigned to this.
There's huge taboo aroundwomen's sanitation and it's
actually very unsexy and womenare very linked to being sexy.
So if you don't want to talkabout it, it's this huge taboo
around.
You know women's sanitation.
So we were like, gosh, someoneneeds to do something about this
.
So why not us?
So that's sort of where itkicked off it was.
(02:34):
That was very a big convictionpoint, and then, ever since then
, we've been speaking tomillions of women, hundreds and
millions of women, about gettingthis, getting this to be a
standard facility why do youthink that women's urinals have
taken this long?
Speaker 1 (02:49):
you said it's been um unsexy.
Yeah, has it also beensomething that's not been
interesting to you?
Know?
Speaker 2 (02:58):
inventors to vcs yeah , so the one point is that you
know we sexualize women, so wedon't want that associated.
We don't want any kind ofbodily liquid associated with
women.
So even in our language we'dsay I'm going to the powder room
, you know I'm going to powdermy nose instead of going to the
toilet.
Or you know, you see theseslight changes in our language
(03:18):
even to sort of disconnect womenfrom sanitation.
Um, so there's like tabooaround that.
But then there's also lack ofinvestment in this space,
because at the moment it's veryobvious that a lot of investors
out there are men and thisproblem doesn't impact them very
much, so the investment is lessfunneled towards women's
(03:39):
sanitation or women's healthtech.
Yeah, there's a big barrierthere for female founders to get
investment.
So, yeah, for a long time nowit hasn't been a priority.
Um, there's lots of otherbarriers as well, but those are
two main ones yeah, I mean.
Speaker 1 (03:55):
So you've got, I think, the statistically less
than one percent of all fundinggoes to women.
Yeah, when it comes to, youknow, investments, plus, you've
got the like, the unsexiness ofwomen's sanitation, yeah, being
not high on people's agenda.
And I guess you can't usetechnology perhaps in the same
way to get scales and so on.
Yeah, why did you and hazelthink that you could solve this
(04:21):
problem where, in 160 years, noone else has even come close?
Speaker 2 (04:27):
I mean, I think it was that conviction that we had,
like, when we realized therewas nothing out there and it was
like a bit baffling, you kindof surprised yourself and you
sort of realized that this is anormalized inequality that us
ourselves have been drawn into.
You know, it's something thatwe know the problem we feel the
pain waiting in the queues, butyet we've just stood about
(04:48):
thinking, oh, someone else willdo something about it.
But then you get thisconviction of, like gosh,
something needs to happen, solet's see if we can do it, let's
, why not us?
That kind of attitude of whynot us, if not us?
Who?
You know, that kind of thepowerful, convicting language
that you hear.
It was that kind of moment, andthen we just have been curious
(05:08):
and been running with it eversince.
Speaker 1 (05:10):
Well, I think it's amazing that you found such a
huge problem that no one hadaddressed, but also that the
scale of the problem didn'tintimidate you and Hazel.
Speaker 2 (05:20):
I think there was a bit of naivety at the beginning,
to be honest, which wasactually a protective thing,
because if you knew what we weregetting into, I don't know if
we'd even started.
But yeah, I think it is massiveand sometimes it is
intimidating to think about.
We're actually changingindustries, we're changing
language, you know we'rechanging expectations and budget
(05:40):
allocation and you know there'sso many important things that
people addresses and challenges,and so that's a big
responsibility.
So, yeah, I think the naivety Iwish we had a bit more of that
at the moment but yeah, it is ahuge opportunity.
Speaker 1 (05:57):
You had a huge opportunity and we'll talk about
how you got there in time.
But just for anyone watching orlistening, you have just served
the London marathon.
Yes, so you've had literallytens of thousands of people go
through PCOR.
So for anyone listening, thisis a true story of a couple of
women founders changing the waythat events and even society
(06:21):
operate.
So I do want to call that out.
So one listening goes wow,that's amazing.
Let's stick around and listento this story.
So you and Hazel universityfind a real world problem,
unlike just submitting yourthesis and then getting jobs and
say, well, we found the problem, but we decided not to tackle
it.
You have decided to tackle it.
(06:41):
You have decided to tackle it.
Can you just take us throughthe steps?
the stages that you've gone fromuniversity thesis to actually
delivering these P-Col urinalsto the London Marathon.
Speaker 2 (06:57):
Sure, I mean, there's so many stages and so many
things I could talk about, butto condense it down.
So after university, Hazel andI did get full-time jobs.
I got a job at an innovationconsultancy and Hazel got a job
with oh my goodness, I'veforgotten the company now.
Speaker 1 (07:16):
An important company, Very important company
sustainable company Sorry, hazel.
Speaker 2 (07:32):
And we did that in our days.
And then we worked on Pequil inour mornings and our evenings
to sort of keep going and keeppushing, getting more research,
talking to more people, morecustomers, and so that was how
we funded the sort of our workon Pequil.
Right at the start, we werealso applying for grants and
competitions where you'd win 500quid there, 200 quid here, so
that would sort of tie us over,um right at the start.
And then, um, we managed to geta grant from the University of
(07:53):
Bristol that enabled us to gofull-time, so we were able to
quit our jobs, which is anincredible feeling.
To you know, focus the besthours of your day on what you
really want to do.
Um.
And then we made lots and lotsof prototypes.
So we were already makingcardboard prototypes and 3d
prints, but then we made twoscale prototypes that we took to
covid safe events.
This was in 2021, um, and wetook our large scale prototypes
(08:16):
to get real feedback from womenat these events, because you can
talk about it all you want, butas soon as you go to an event,
get your feet on the ground.
That's when you get your realfeedback.
So it was fantastic.
So the first one we went to wason the Downs in Bristol.
Um, it was a comedy gardenfestival and, um, we had the BBC
feature us.
It was a fantastic opportunitybecause it meant that we won the
(08:39):
front page of the BBC with thisum made out of scrap material
prototype.
Basically because we had nomoney and that meant we had
customers internationallyreaching out to us saying how do
we get you to the US?
I want you in Malaysia,literally.
It was incredible the demandthat we were able to showcase
and that was a big point for usbecause it meant that when we
(09:00):
went for investment, we had allthis sort of that.
All these customers lined meantthat when we went for
investment, we had all this sortof that, all these customers
lined up that showed the demandfor our product like this.
So lots of prototyping.
And then the next step wasraise investment.
Um, and this was in covid.
So lots of zoom meetings, lotsof dodgy wi-fi, which was not
(09:21):
fun, very triggering, but we didmanage to raise 250K in COVID
for an event-based business.
So you know that's no smallthing and we often think about
that.
How do we do that?
But we had some incredibleinvestors and that still back us
today.
And, yeah, that allowed us tomanufacture the product in the
UK and then be able to launch atGlastonbury in 2022.
Speaker 1 (09:47):
I could keep going but that that's Well, what an
amazing story.
So it sounds as though youmanaged to really tap into a
zeitgeist where, although ithadn't been developed, everyone
saw the need.
Speaker 2 (09:58):
Yes, that's right, and COVID actually helped in
some ways, because it was achance for festivals and events
to rethink their sustainabilityand to look to switch up their
solutions, and so people were abit more open to change, a bit
more open to trying new thingsinstead of sort of the same old
rigmarole.
So, yeah, in that way it reallydid help us and also because
(10:20):
we're so much more hygienic thanportable toilets, it meant that
because covid had just happened, everyone was looking for
sanitary options, so it wasanother sort of arrow in our in
our boat yeah, like for thosepeople that aren't familiar with
how a woman's urinal works, I Idon't know whether it's
possible to say paint us apicture in words yes, I try my
(10:42):
best yeah, so that people canvisualize, of course yeah, so it
is a standalone facility so youdon't have to hold anything.
It's not a funnel.
You just step into thisfacility and pop a squat, you
pee into this thing called thepedestal, which is
anti-splashback, and it's reallycomfortable for all squat
heights.
We've tested this thoroughlyand there's a handle if you want
(11:05):
support and you just pop asquat and pee, squat and go.
It's that simple.
It's a designated safe spacefor women to go for a wee, just
like the equivalent of maleurinals.
Uh, it's.
What's the key thing about peakquiz is the efficiency.
So we've designed it to be 2.7times faster than a portable
(11:26):
toilet, which means women are inand out of those queues like no
.
Tomorrow means that you getback to the event without having
to miss out on anything.
Um and those, those, um.
That efficiency has been madereal because of things like the
pedestal being just squat and go.
You'd have to touch the thing,clean anything down.
It's overlapping doors insteadof like a lockable door and it's
(11:47):
semi-private.
This is the important thing.
It means that when you'restanding up, you can be seen
from the waist up, so it'sreally fun.
You can wave at your friends,um, but then when you're peeing,
you're popping up.
You can be seen from the waistup, so it's really fun.
You can wave at your friends.
But then when you're peeing,you're popping a squat.
You can't be seen by anyone andthat means you're fully private
.
It means that you'reincentivized to just pee and go.
You're not checking your phone,you're not doing anything else
in the toilet, you're justpeeing.
Speaker 1 (12:08):
You said something there which made me think of you
and Hazel as engineers, whichis about the micro moments and
makes me think about the idea ofthe frictionless customer
experience.
We remove anything that's abottleneck, and you've
identified time as being thegive back for the customer.
How did you light upon whatyou're calling micro moments as
(12:33):
being one of the keys to success?
Speaker 2 (12:36):
I think we just knew that we needed to make it more
efficient some way.
So we were trying to tacklewhat, what was it that was
slowing this process down andthen try to re-out, design it
basically, um, and that's shownthroughout our journey, because
we're actually launching aversion five next year.
So, you know, not just versionone, not two, not not three, not
four, but five.
(12:57):
And that's just microimprovements that we've made to
make the product a lot moreefficient, a lot more desirable
for the user to use.
So, yeah, it's just constantiteration and improvement to
make it even more efficient.
Speaker 1 (13:28):
So let's talk, then, about the move from raising
money and making these thingsyourself, these urinals yourself
, to commercialization, becauseit's one thing to have a great
idea and get people saying, hey,can you deliver it.
It's another game altogetherwhen there are two of you in
Bristol and you're deliveringurinals to Glastonbury, for
example, or to the marathon inLondon.
How did you and Hazel overcomethe really the transition from
(13:49):
idea and prototype intodelivered commercial product?
Speaker 2 (13:52):
um, I think a big moment was when we started
manufacturing from the UK.
So it went from building theprototypes ourselves to an
established rotational mouldingfactory producing the product
for us, and that was the productthat we had ready for
Glastonbury.
However, there is a story here.
You know, one of those barriersthat you, as founders, always
(14:15):
have to come up against.
Unfortunately, themanufacturers made half of the
product, so they made the tanksbut not the walls.
So if we had just gone ahead,we wouldn't have been able to do
Glastonbury that year.
So, as gritty founders that weare, we were like no, this has
to happen.
How do we get to Glastonbury?
How do we make sure that we dothis?
Launch Women access?
(14:37):
How do we get to Glastonbury?
How do we make sure that we dothis?
Launch women access, thisproduct?
So we got loads of our friendstogether.
We, we ordered some scaffold,loads of allen keys and some
foam boards and we basicallybuilt the walls ourselves I
think over 300 walls over aweekend or two, and our you know
, new employees they also gaveup their weekends to join us,
and it was just this big teameffort that enabled these walls
(14:59):
to be made.
And we got to Glastonbury andwe launched there and it was
significantly successful.
We were on Women's Hour, wesort of hit huge BBC outlets.
It was incredible and we got toprove that this is something
women love and really want tosee more of, and that those
walls we actually tookthroughout the whole of 2022.
(15:19):
It wasn't just Glastonbury, sothe manufacturers actually
couldn't have produced thosewalls for any of the other
events either.
So it just shows you just haveto really dig deep and think how
can we actually make thishappen?
As a founder, you're like sostubbornly passionate about what
needs to go next.
So, yeah, that was.
Speaker 1 (15:39):
That was a really big moment of going from just
prototyping to commercializationcan I ask what went wrong with
the procurement process that themanufacturer didn't deliver?
Speaker 2 (15:50):
because I wish I knew .
Okay, there's multiple reasons.
You know things that you can'thelp like.
You know, one of the toolmakers was sick for three weeks,
delaying production, you know,or some a big order took longer
than they anticipated before ourorder, pushing ours back.
You know, there's just so manythings that you can't control
(16:11):
with manufacturing and so, yeah,that buffer time was just eaten
up.
But you know, we've learned alot from it and you know we we
do enjoy, um, not having to makeourselves.
You know we do enjoy workingwith manufacturers that have
those skills to make sure we cancommercialize.
But, um, yeah, we're excited tobe producing version five in
(16:32):
poland year.
So we went out there last yearand we absolutely loved it and
it was a fantastic factory wherethey've got everything run to a
T.
We really enjoyed theirbusiness, their manufacturing.
Speaker 1 (16:47):
Okay, obviously it's a bit disappointing that in the
UK you won't be able to findsomeone to deliver, that you've
had to go to Europe.
But what I will ask you is acash flow question, because when
you commercialize you've gotthe quarter of a million but
you've got a team.
You've got you and Hazel.
How are you able to structurethe cash flow to carry you
(17:09):
through?
Because if you have amanufacturer that doesn't
deliver but you've probably gota commitment to glass debris,
for example, yes for me, anyway,the stress is when I'm trying
to arbitrage the relationshipsbetween a customer and a
supplier.
Right as an entrepreneur, youget stuck between what you
promise one person you'lldeliver and what someone else
promised yeah, you'll deliver,and you're expressing how you.
(17:32):
You bridge the gap by justsheer force of character and
appetite of risk, isn't it?
Exactly.
Yeah, can you just take usthrough how you solved, how you
dealt with that practically oremotionally, because I think
often people look atentrepreneurs oh well, they,
they were there and they got tothere, but there's there's a lot
(17:53):
of challenges, not just thephysical but the financial.
Speaker 2 (17:55):
Yeah, I mean from a cash flow perspective, what we
ask of our customers is 50 upfront, so as soon as they book,
and then 30 30 days before theevent and then 20 seven days
after.
So we get a large percentage ofthe cash up front before the
event actually happens, whichmeans that we have that cash
flow coming in significantlythroughout the year and that
(18:18):
really helps us sort of preparefor those events and tie us over
.
But we have raised a secondround of investment with from
since 2022 till now, and we arecurrently raising investment
around now.
So you know we are constantlylooking for new investors.
So if anyone's listening thatwants to back people, please
reach out to us, because wealways want to start new
(18:39):
relationships with new investors.
And, yeah, see how we can getPequil international.
Speaker 1 (18:44):
Okay, that's wonderful, amber.
So let's think about investors.
Will love the product, yes, andhalf the world.
Let's face it half or over halfthe world needs what you're
offering.
But investors also look at thefounders and the relationship
between the founders.
Can we just talk a little bitabout how you and Hazel operate,
(19:06):
because that can make or breaka business.
Speaker 2 (19:11):
Yeah, I think well for PQOL, our relationship has
made the business happen.
So, you know, both of us wouldsay we don't want to do this on
our own.
This is something that we'veentered into together, this is
something that we both reallybelieve in, really want to see
happen.
You know the off the back ofthe London Marathon.
You know we were collecting theurine to turn into fertilizer
(19:32):
and we were there on the groundactually collecting the urine
ourselves.
And you know you have thesemoments of, like, shared
experience.
You're like nobody elseunderstands me like you do.
No one else gets the grind likeyou do.
And it's this very rarerelationship where you challenge
each other, where you care foreach other, where you really
grind and see that strain witheach other and try and support
(19:56):
each other in the best way youcan.
Um, I don't know any otherrelationship in my life that's
like this one.
Um, but yeah, we, we shouldereach other, you know, and you
have to be constantlycommunicating to to let each
other know where you're at, eventoday.
You know, communicating whereour mood's at in the day, like,
oh, I think I need to just havea break, have a drink, get a cup
(20:17):
of tea.
Um, disclaiming.
You know, today I feel a bitrough.
You know that kind of thing.
It's the day-to-daycommunication that makes your
sort of relationship reliableand steady.
And, um, trust, trusting, and Ithink, yeah, both of us
treasure.
Treasure it, because I have gotfriends that are solo founders
(20:37):
and it is a big struggle, youknow.
It's isolating, it means thatyou don't feel as understood by
your peers.
There's there's a lot ofpositives as well, but I know
from experience that having aco-founder is significantly
better yeah, well, there's oldold saying, isn't there?
Speaker 1 (20:53):
if you want to go fast, go alone, but if you want
to go further, yeah, go withothers.
When you look now at people andyou know the role that you two
have been able to play and thecommunity that you found in the
accelerator, yeah you've comeboth as students yeah and I
(21:14):
think not it wasn't from abusiness studies background.
Speaker 2 (21:17):
No, no, I studied anthropology with innovation,
Hazel studied physics withinnovation.
So you know we both had sort ofcreativity in our blood.
Speaker 1 (21:26):
You know we've been creating dens and go-karts and
small business projects on theside all the time, but no, not
like a business backgroundnecessarily the side all the
time, but, um, no, not like abusiness background necessarily,
and so what are some of theways that you've got involved
with the accelerator and howthat's helped to to grow people
into the?
Speaker 2 (21:45):
kind of business that it's becoming I think a big
thing about the accelerator issharing in the challenges that
you're facing, um, because, likeI mentioned, nobody else quite
understands you like anotherfounder does.
Um, and sharing those strugglesis like quite a vulnerable
thing to do and if someone canhelp you in that, in that
(22:07):
position, you'll, you know, youfeel so grateful, you feel so
supported and and backed.
You know, I think there's thisreal feeling of fight.
If you're a founder, you'reconstantly like come on, I want
to create something, and it canbe really difficult to create
something.
So if someone's got your backand says, hey, I can connect you
with this person or hey, don'tworry about it, I've been there
(22:28):
and you'll get, you'll getthrough it.
That is massive and it's not tobe underestimated to have that
support system.
So.
So for us, it was that greatersupport system underneath Piquil
that allowed us to reach out topeople and be like what did you
do when you hit this wall?
How did you get over thathurdle?
And then us allowing us to dothe same for others.
If we could help others, wewould pass that on and do the
(22:49):
same.
Speaker 1 (22:50):
So would you say that , even if you have a founder,
like you and Hazel have?
Speaker 2 (22:59):
being part of a broader community brings some
benefits.
The perspective, I think, iskey.
We always talk aboutperspective.
If you're just working on yourbusiness and you're working from
home quite a lot, you can bequite insulated.
You can lose perspective.
So when you come into spaceslike this and you ask what's
your business, what are yougoing through at the moment?
Who are you talking to?
So when you come into spaceslike this and you ask what?
What's your business?
You know, what are you goingthrough at the moment, who are
you talking to, it kind of opensyou up to be a lot more um,
(23:22):
grateful.
In a way.
You sort of understand hey,let's celebrate these wins.
You know, the London Marathonjust happened, what like?
We were dreaming of this threeyears ago, you know.
Speaker 1 (23:31):
So I think perspective is one of the most
important things as a founderand, as you say, you've got the
perspective of everyone heresupporting you too, haven't you?
I think that, uh, even as beingon the podcast here, yeah,
people are celebrating and inyour corner it's wonderful to
have you and hazel and, I guess,family and friends.
What about the the mindsetshift that you two are having to
(23:55):
go through now?
Because, as the company growsand you've got pitches out to
investors and you're going to gofor more.
What are you having to thinkabout differently now as an
entrepreneur?
Because it's not been that long, in fairness.
I mean, you launched the firstproject in 2020, I think it was
2021.
We're in 2025, so you'veactually accomplished a huge
(24:23):
amount in a short amount of time.
Thank you, yeah, it'sincredible.
What mindset changes have youhad to make and how are you
making those?
Speaker 2 (24:29):
good question.
Um, I think I'll.
I want to rephrase it themindset things I want to keep
okay, um, because I think that'swhat has let, has meant the
business continues is to sort ofhold on to traits like the
passion, the grittiness, thesesort of like personal qualities
(24:52):
that have actually enabled thebusiness to keep going.
Um, that's, those are themindset qualities that have
actually enabled the business tokeep going.
Um, that's, those are themindset qualities that have
really enabled our business tothrive.
Because this grittiness youdon't find it in lots of people.
The grittiness that it takes tosort of do the really hard work
that no one else wants to do.
You know to be the last personat the end of the day, to to
(25:13):
clear up the cups.
You know to do the thingsnobody sees.
I think you need that grit andthat conviction, passion, and
those are the things I want tohave throughout my whole life,
not just running this businessbut in every aspect of life.
But, um, those are the things Iwant to keep.
Sorry, I rephrased yourquestion there.
Speaker 1 (25:30):
That's okay.
In a way, that's probably, uh,the hallmark of why you're such
a great entrepreneur, becauseyou're staying very true to your
core values.
Right, it needs to be done, andyou've got this higher sense of
purpose.
Speaker 2 (25:43):
That's right.
The purpose point is a reallyit's what drives us.
It's not just clickbait, it'ssomething that we really believe
in.
It really is what keeps usgoing and why, when it's so hard
, we do keep going.
And I think any businessfounder would agree that if you
have purpose at the center ofyour business, it is that thing
that keeps the engine going.
Speaker 1 (26:04):
Yeah, I think you're absolutely right, and the people
that fall by the wayside arethose who didn't really have a
mission, but maybe had a motive,maybe self-interest or
short-term interest, rather thanthe bigger picture which you've
got, really just equality forwomen, you know looking at your
website and watching the videos.
But looking at the website orwatching the videos, I can see
(26:25):
the enthusiasm that women havefor, frankly, the relief, right.
I mean, they've been waiting along time now.
They don't have to wait.
Speaker 2 (26:33):
The relief is the right word.
Speaker 1 (26:34):
The relief is the right word.
Speaker 2 (26:35):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (26:37):
How have you been marketing to those event
companies?
Because you've got some PR.
Can I say PR?
Speaker 2 (26:47):
You've got some public relations just to qualify
for that, see how many puns wecan get in.
Yeah, how many puns can we getin?
Speaker 1 (26:52):
one interview.
But what about the marketing tothose companies that are
looking at?
They've got an established portcabin provider.
They've got a piece of thefield that already comes to it.
They sell the tickets, whetherthe women get a better urinal or
not.
(27:12):
You know people aren't votingwith their wallets for that
service.
How are you getting theproposition for PQAL into the
market to get people coming tobuy?
Speaker 2 (27:24):
good question.
I think we started with eventsthat shared our values so
glastonbury, for example.
They're always looking to bemore innovative, they're always
looking to be more sustainable,they're always looking to bring
something new, something funinto their event and obviously
they set the bar.
So we wanted to start theinfluential events and then it
would just triple down into therest of the industry and that's
(27:46):
what we've seen happen.
So that that was definitely theright move.
But we do sort of angle ourpitch to customers sometimes
differently.
So we do.
We obviously create a betterexperience for the women, but we
can also generate a lot morerevenue for the events
themselves, because when womenaren't waiting in the queue,
they're getting a drink.
So you can see that we generatea lot more revenue for the
(28:09):
event themselves and actuallypeak will pays for itself once
it's there.
So if a event is struggling toget more money every year, this
is something that they can dotoo that's a good.
Speaker 1 (28:19):
yeah, that's good.
So if they're not peeing'reshopping, that's right.
Which?
With two daughters, and youknow three sisters I think
you're absolutely right.
So maybe I don't want to havepeople.
It costs me even more moneywhen I take my daughters to it.
But you said you got intoGlastonbury, but there's a
little bit missing that I dowant to talk about, because, as
(28:41):
an entrepreneur going, ok, yougot to Glastonbury, but how did
you get into Glastonbury?
Because it's a huge event.
They must have so many vendorspitching them, everything.
So I would just love forsomeone to hear that might be
listening to this.
Ok, that is the practical stepI would need to take to get the
dream client.
That would make the cascade ofcustomers full.
(29:01):
Yeah, the dream client.
Speaker 2 (29:02):
That would make the cascade of customers full.
Yeah, so the way we approachedGlastonbury was we were still
students at the time and wereached out to them as, like
research.
We were like, can we get youradvice, can we get your opinion
on this design?
We would love to provide thisfor you.
What sort of size tank capacitywould you like?
What kind of colorful wallswould you like?
And actually involving them inthe development process,
(29:23):
enlisted them on the journey,and so we weren't, we weren't
selling to them from the start.
We were constantly keeping intouch with them and and sort of
showing them the new design thatwe'd come up with what about
this?
What are your thoughts on this?
And we were talking to the headof sanitation at the time and
so, yeah, it was like a constantfeedback loop and they gained
more and more interest in Pequiland it meant that when we did
(29:45):
have something to sell, theyfelt a part of ownership.
They felt like, yeah, I want tosee this, how this goes?
I've fed into it.
You know I've said that thistank should be this size.
I've said that you know, womenwould want this kind of
dimension.
So that was definitely the wayof getting the our first
customer across the line.
Um, and yeah, we, we reallylove our relationship with
(30:08):
glastonbury.
They, they always get all ourstock every year and women
absolutely love it at theirevents.
So, yeah, that was how we sortof got that customer.
Speaker 1 (30:17):
It was just through relationship and through being
keen okay constantly knocking onthe door, and was that actually
physically going down to seethem, or we just found them on a
website?
Speaker 2 (30:26):
In COVID, so it was just over the channels that we
had, so it was email, phone,that kind of thing, great.
Speaker 1 (30:33):
So it's so important, I think, to go through the
detail of how these deals getdone, because for someone
starting a business.
It's often just that first step.
That's the hardest and no onewrites about.
Speaker 2 (30:46):
Yeah so true, I mean a lot of it is just calling
people up, it's just doing thesmall bits and you just never
know where it will go.
I've got so many stories oflike taxi drivers that knew an
investor that they made an intro, or someone at the pub knew a
manufacturer that linked me toanother manufacturer that we
went with.
There's just so many ways ofleads that you need to follow up
(31:06):
on you have no idea where theycan go.
Speaker 1 (31:08):
Exactly, and I think that's one of the joys of an
accelerator program that youhave mentors and people here.
Are there any examples of howpeople within the accelerator
community have supported you?
Speaker 2 (31:22):
Good question Definitely have had so many
founders share theirinvestor-like spreadsheets, A
lot of them sharing networks,being like oh, I think I know
this competition might besuitable for you or I know this
mentor that could help tacklethis problem.
The network is definitely thehuge advantage with this and
(31:43):
we've benefited significantlyfrom that.
I think it's the opennessfounders have towards each other
.
It's like, if I can help you, Iwill, and yeah, I really love
that.
Speaker 1 (31:53):
Okay, and I think also within NatWest, because
everyone's kind of joined thiscommunity of people under the
umbrella of NatWest.
There's a sort of a security.
People's guards are not upright.
They feel like they're all partof a community.
No one's trying to sell anybodyanything.
It's not a commercialarrangement.
It's really a supportivearrangement?
Speaker 2 (32:11):
Absolutely, there's a lot of respect towards each
other.
Everyone's very respectful.
Everyone knows people areworking towards something or
creating something that bringssomething good into the world,
and I think you know.
Can you ask for?
Speaker 1 (32:22):
yeah, to be surrounded by people that
inspire you, motivate you andsupport you.
Yeah, uh, that's a real dreamas an entrepreneur.
Speaking of dreams, amber,where in you?
Where have you and hazel got inyour mind for the next five
years?
For piqua?
Speaker 2 (32:39):
five years, um, so we've got lots of different
potential options.
Um, that will just be curiousand, like we've done so far,
just testing and seeing andseeing how it goes and if that's
what we want to do.
So there's no like hard planbut, um, we are hoping to go
international.
This is the next big thing.
Uh, we've got so much inboundrequests from the us, australia,
(33:02):
the eu, like there's just somuch possibility.
So once we've manufactured thev5, we will be going to events
in germany, in the netherlands,um, and so that will be where
we'd be scaling up in the eu.
So manufacturers in poland willbe very well suited to
international expansion and alsoworking with toilet
(33:23):
distributors to actually reachwomen much faster.
So we could scale up in-house,we could do all the logistics
ourselves and that's what we'vedone up till now.
So, hazel and I, we've gotforklift tickets.
You know we've been driving thestock around site in forklifts,
we've been doing the cleaning,we've been leading the teams.
But actually, if we want toreach women as quickly as we
(33:44):
want to reach them, we want thisfacility to be available for
all.
We need to start distributingwith other people.
Speaker 1 (33:49):
So that's how we're looking at scaling up I will ask
you the million dollar question, which is about ip protection.
And there I go.
I've got another p in there,sorry sorry, not sorry sorry ip
protection, because one mightthink that that there's no
software code, it's a design.
How are you going to protectPQOL from being copied?
Speaker 2 (34:13):
We have multiple patents granted and filed.
So from year one we filed apatent on our design, on the
functionality of how it fitstogether, and that's been
granted.
That was in 2021.
So that sort of you know, thatsort of held us over from from
the beginning and then, as ourdesign has been developed, we've
continuously filed more andmore patents that have sort of
(34:34):
broadened the umbrella of ip forpeakwell, um, and that spans
the uk, the EU, the US, chinaand Australia.
So we're in a good position forIP and it's an important
question because, you know, thatis the next obvious thing
copycats and what's the windowof time before other people
follow in our footsteps and yeah, that is very much on our
(34:56):
brains to be like there is thiswindow of time that we want to
actually leap into and land grabthere is this window of time
that we want to actually leapinto and land grab.
Speaker 1 (35:07):
That's great.
I want to ask that questionbecause there's been many an
entrepreneur that has a greatidea, commercialized it to some
degree and a larger company anArmitage Shanks or someone could
come along and, because they'vegot that heft, could steal it.
So this idea of IP protection,either locally, regionally or
internationally, is reallyimportant if you've got
something that could be copiedand actually it's remarkably low
(35:29):
cost for the protection itgives you, even if it just
creates a speed bump for anybodyelse, doesn't it?
Speaker 2 (35:34):
Yeah, that's right, that sort of barrier of
protection is there.
We're also building our brand.
So that is another way we'reprotecting people.
We're also building our brand.
So that is another way we'reprotecting PQOL.
We're becoming the go-towoman's urinal provider you know
, the trustworthy, establishedprovider out there and we're
building relationships, not justwith events but also the toilet
distributors that would havefleets of toilet blocks, things
(35:55):
like that.
We're building thoserelationships.
So, actually, when we do wantto go international, we have
these fully formed relationshipsthat we trust and that we want
to work together in an effectiveway.
Speaker 1 (36:07):
So, yeah, the brand, the IP and the relationships are
the key to that of the companynow growing and the sort of
environment that you're inshaping, how you and hazel think
of yourselves and where you seeyourselves in the next few
(36:29):
years um, I think we, we knowthat people has made an impact
in the event industry, which iscrazy to say and I, you know,
pat yourself on the back forthat.
That that is something tocelebrate.
Speaker 2 (36:42):
Yeah, so we 100% know that PQAL has made an impact
already.
I think in the future we areambitious and we want to see
policy change.
So we want to make PQAL makewomen's urinals a standard
facility for all events.
So when you go to an event, youneed to have X, Y and Z and
women's urinals needs to bethere everywhere.
(37:03):
Toilets are everywhere.
Male urinals are.
Women's urinals need to bethere too.
Speaker 1 (37:08):
Um, so, yeah, we're we're excited to be trying to
tackle that challenge and tryand change policy and guidelines
around that yeah, and you'redoing that, I think, with the
support of hazel, both of you,together with investors, new
investors and and, of course,this amazing community in the
Accelerator program.
Final question Amber, ifthere's an entrepreneur out
(37:29):
there thinking about how to growtheir business, thinking about
whether to join an Acceleratoror not, what would be your
experience that you'd share?
Speaker 2 (37:40):
I think one quality hazel and I both have is using,
being really resourceful andbeing really resourceful with
our networks.
So, like always thinking, whodo I know that might know
somebody else as a graphicdesigner, who you know?
I wonder if this person wouldbe able to do something for free
, I wonder, you know?
And and sort of utilizing thepeople in our network is the in
(38:02):
the best way possible.
You know, from the beginningour families have helped us out
big time.
You know we've got family,creative families that would
sort of help us model some sortof part of the product and be
able to, yeah, draw on theircontacts and just sort of think
creatively about the networksthat we have touch points within
.
And just sort of thinkcreatively about the networks
that we have touch points within.
So always think who do you know?
(38:24):
And look there first beforethinking I need to make a
stranger become my best friendbefore I can do anything.
Just think, oh no, I knowsomeone that knows someone else.
Speaker 1 (38:35):
And what about an entrepreneur that's looking at
the accelerator and going well,is that for me or not?
Maybe I can go alone.
What would be your advice tosomeone thinking about joining
an accelerator?
Speaker 2 (38:44):
I think there's no harm in it.
Hey, you know, like what?
What have you got to lose?
I think that's my attitude.
It's like what could you gain?
You know, there's either youcontinue doing what you're doing
or you could continue and havethis incredible support system.
So why not?
Speaker 1 (39:03):
Amber Probin.
Thank you so much.
It's such an inspirationalstory and you're changing the
lives of so many people.
From here in Bristol, you'rechanging the world.
Thank you so much for joiningme today.
Speaker 2 (39:13):
No, thank you for having me.
It's been really fun.
Cheers, it's my pleasure.
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