EP. 118 The Content Strategy That Changed Everything: London Lazerson's Final Boss Hour

London Lazerson, co-founder of Final Boss Sour, discusses the company's explosive growth, innovative marketing strategies, and the impact of influencer Keith Lee's review. He shares insights on product seeding, creating entertaining content for top-of-funnel marketing, and the importance of building relationships with influencers. The episode also explores the challenges and successes of launching a new CPG brand in the competitive food challenge market.

Please connect with Trevor on social media. You can find him anywhere @thetrevorcrump

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
Okay, we're gonna rip Green Apple.

Speaker 2 (00:01):
Oh, we're just going straight to level four.
The size of it makes it scarier.
We're doing it.

Speaker 1 (00:10):
He's seen death.
I can feel it, I can.

Speaker 2 (00:16):
Oh, I don't know, I guess maybe, I guess I'm immune.

Speaker 1 (00:21):
I've literally never seen somebody not give a
reaction to like level three andup.

Speaker 3 (00:26):
Yo, what's going on everybody?
Welcome to the unstoppablemarketer podcast.
With me, as always, is markgoldheart, my lovely co-host.
Mark, how are you?

Speaker 2 (00:34):
Oh great, doing well it um snowed today.

Speaker 3 (00:40):
Yeah, the groundhog saw its shadow and we're still
in the six weeks of winter.

Speaker 2 (00:45):
Which is great, because I bought, you know, one
of those icon passes, so now Iget to use it a little more.

Speaker 3 (00:50):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (00:51):
Probably not going to work tomorrow, probably going
to be at Alta.

Speaker 3 (00:57):
Just make sure you use your PTO.

Speaker 2 (00:58):
Yeah, submit my PTO.

Speaker 3 (01:01):
Exactly.
Yeah, well, we got a good guesttoday.
It's been a minute since we hada guest on and it's actually
our first repeat guest we'veever had on the unstoppable
marketer podcast that's rightyeah and honored and the honor
goes to london lazarson welldone london a local native utah.
What's that?

Speaker 2 (01:22):
we have a trophy for him after yes, we do.
Second plate so.

Speaker 3 (01:25):
London.
For those of you who don't knowwho London is, london started
out as a big.
Well, you still are a bigcontent creator on TikTok and on
Instagram, but recently, overthe last year- and a half
started a company called FinalBoss Hour.
That's absolutely exploding.
What was really cool?

(01:46):
We were just talking before.

Speaker 1 (01:47):
Are we going to do the challenge?
Yeah, I hope so.
I actually brought some secretstuff for you guys.
I hope that's how we start tobe honest with you.

Speaker 3 (01:52):
Yeah, we can do it.
We can make it be the hook orsomething.

Speaker 2 (01:58):
But anyways what?

Speaker 1 (01:59):
I was going to say is what day We'll find out.

Speaker 2 (02:01):
It'll be a long day.

Speaker 1 (02:02):
We'll find out.

Speaker 2 (02:03):
My face is going to make some faces.

Speaker 3 (02:05):
You'll make a good ad for it.

Speaker 2 (02:06):
This will be a good ad.
Yeah, exactly.

Speaker 3 (02:08):
But what I was just saying is London.
Actually, I don't believe onthe podcast some of you guys
might be able to correct me ifyou listen to it, but it's been
a minute since I've listened tothat, I think on the podcast he
said I have something cool inthe works.
He did, and then, separately,when the cameras and mics
weren't hot, he was like yeah,I'm doing this.
Yeah, you know, potentialchallenge thing that was May,

(02:31):
may of 2023.
May 16th yeah, that's crazy.

Speaker 1 (02:34):
No, that was right that was right when we were
really, really thinking about it, so I, yeah, epic so here we
like, I, we you know, when yousay we who was involved?
I've got two co-founders, yeah,um, we can get into the whole
story.
But I was shopping around forsome some funding for another
sour idea that I had.
They absolutely hated it.

(02:54):
And then they were kind offormulating this dried fruit
idea and we were like, let's dosour, let's do a sour challenge.
You know, one chip was having areally hot moment.

Speaker 3 (03:04):
Totally yeah, yeah.

Speaker 1 (03:05):
The one peanut challenge, just spicy, you know,
like spicy chip challenge.
Yeah, did you ever do it?
I've done it.
Yeah, I've done half a chip.
How was it Horrible?
Yeah, yeah.
But I love the economics of onechip challenge because they
ship you one chip, your cogs onthat are like incredible, so you

(03:25):
can buy one or three, I believe, at the time.

Speaker 2 (03:28):
I think they're out of it Five bucks or something
crazy.

Speaker 3 (03:29):
No, I think it's like 12.
Yeah, it's like $10, $12.

Speaker 1 (03:32):
For one chip, for one chip.

Speaker 3 (03:34):
But it's not that you're buying a chip.

Speaker 1 (03:36):
Does it have like a?

Speaker 2 (03:37):
ghost pepper on it.
What is it?

Speaker 1 (03:40):
No, it's like the would sell them at the grocery.

Speaker 3 (03:42):
It got so popular that you could buy them at
grocery stores too.

Speaker 2 (03:45):
Like they started getting distribution into like I
don't even remember thishappening Whole Foods and
Harman's and I was not payingattention.

Speaker 1 (03:51):
It was a big social, had a big moment on social media
.

Speaker 3 (03:55):
You still see the videos every now and then, not
as popular, but so we loved thatfrom an economic standpoint.

Speaker 1 (04:07):
So our original idea was like what if it was one sour
gummy worm?

Speaker 2 (04:09):
yeah, and then we were like oh, there's a bunch of
garbage ingredients and gummyworms.

Speaker 1 (04:11):
We don't really want to resell that as a challenge.
And then we were like, okay,what if it was one dried fruit,
you know, just thinking of theeconomics of one chip challenge.
And then it became, uh well, oh, we could actually do levels of
sour with all of our, our drieddried fruit, so we can offer
kind of a range and right, youcan work up the scale.
Cause I thought it would becool if, like, you got an array
of chips or one being salty, youknow, 10 being the hottest

(04:35):
thing you'll ever try, and youcan work your way up the skull
millimeter.
I thought that was.
I thought that would beinteresting.
The other thing we hated aboutthe one chip challenge is repeat
purchases interesting.
The other thing we hated aboutthe one chip challenge is repeat
purchases probably zero.

Speaker 3 (04:48):
Sure, I mean maybe for a gift gifting probably zero
.
But no, I'm probably close tozero because it had some gifting
and like, yeah, I mean that's a, that's a great uh like white
elephant gift sure how manyrepeat users is the question
it's a good, very low.

Speaker 1 (05:02):
Yeah, I think if you do it once, are you gonna do it
again.

Speaker 2 (05:04):
I'm guessing 15 returning customer rate on
shopify you think yeah which islow for really low, uh, cpg, you
can see that's skewed, becausethey're just trying to like get
people to suffer with them.
Totally, yeah, I doubt.

Speaker 3 (05:16):
I want to know how many people would do it again,
again I don't think you're doingit again, but you are repeat
purchases.

Speaker 1 (05:21):
I I agree like if, if I went, I mean I have, and I
never thought about buying itfor anybody else, but I'm sure
there are people out there.

Speaker 2 (05:28):
So we didn't like that about the way that If I was
in college, you'd probably, youknow, I would have thought
about buying it for other people.

Speaker 1 (05:33):
Exactly, or just buying 10, you know, doing a
party or something, and I'm surethat happened.
So we didn't like that, youcan't.
They did have flavors, but theflavor gets thrown right out the
window.
Yeah, what's something that isthat 20 seconds in.
Yeah, you don't even tasteflavor, you're just your mouth
so once we switch to the youknow our sour caps, put our sour

(05:56):
caps on.
We were like you know, sourlives a lot less, you know, on
your taste buds.
So you get that burst of sourand then you start chewing
through the dried fruit and wewere like we love that.
And then we were like but therearen't that many dried fruits,
or so we thought, you know, Iwas exposed to like dried
mangoes, dried strawberries, um,wasn't even thinking raisins,

(06:19):
wasn't even thinking cranberries, didn't know you could dry
blueberries, didn't know youcould dry cantaloupe.
And pretty soon we got onnutscom, which is like the
biggest distributor for driedfruit.
There are thousands of skews onthere dried fruit.
So we really thought we'd havea chance at delivering.
Uh, you know, an assortment ofsour and tons of thousands,

(06:39):
thousands of different fruits orlike varieties of yeah
varieties.
You know know variety packs withmixes of fruit or I.
I don't know the exact numberof individual fruits, but
there's a lot mark.

Speaker 3 (06:52):
Would like to know the exact number.

Speaker 1 (06:54):
Let's look it up.

Speaker 2 (06:54):
Yeah, I mean I'll, I'll look it up after and I'm
just wondering how weird, howweird does it get like dragon
fruit?
Yeah, dragon fruit, dragonfruit, papaya, ginger, obviously
.
Ginger.

Speaker 1 (07:05):
Yeah, we toyed around with a sour ginger.
It was weird.
It was really weird becausethey're kind of spicy.
You know it doesn't hurt likespice, but it's kind of spicy.

Speaker 2 (07:16):
Is ginger a fruit?

Speaker 1 (07:20):
Isn't it a root I?

Speaker 2 (07:21):
don't know.
I mean not to put you on thespot.
Final boss root.
But that's bizarre yeah.

Speaker 1 (07:26):
Yeah, so that was the inception of it?

Speaker 2 (07:28):
I had no idea.
One chip challenge.

Speaker 1 (07:29):
Yep, like, how do we make that sour and more
accessible?
Yeah, do more with it than inthe one chip challenge, yeah,
and so that was.
That was last May.
We were.
We are going through it.
We landed on sour cranberriesfor our first skew, yep, and
didn't do too hot.
Still isn't too hot, but that,I think, set the precedent of

(07:50):
like you can make dried fruitreally, really sour, totally.
We launched three levels ofthat.
The very next month we launchedthree levels of sour blueberry.
The next month after that, welaunched three levels of sour
strawberry.
So first, three months ofbusiness.
We already had three SKUs.
Then we piled those up intowhat's now our.
We've sold a hundred thousand ofthese on the TikTok shop.
This is our open dude.
This is our VIP pack.

(08:11):
Well, I filled this up withspecial stuff for you guys.
This isn't.
This isn't a goodrepresentation of the VIP pack.
Normally there's three rows ofsmaller pouches.
I've bought one.
Yeah, you've purchased, seen it.
So today I brought the boys themost sour thing we've ever done
.
We sold out of this in aweekend.
This is our latest drop.
Wow, sour green apple, levelfour.
This is the only second timewe've ever done level four.

Speaker 2 (08:33):
Okay, level we, we all just talking about level
three.

Speaker 1 (08:39):
Now there's a level four we all got on a call and
tried the first samples yeah,they're me and the co-founders
yeah, james and tommy are theirnames and we were like we did it
too sour and we had alreadyshipped.
So we were worried becausesometimes the timing because
we're so fast we do a drop everymonth sometimes the timing is
such that it's gonna we'retrying it, the real sample, for

(09:02):
the first time with ourcustomers unfortunately it
usually doesn't happen.
It happened there um lastchristmas, one of our most
successful drops, and we've weum did did two rounds of this.
This is christmas cantaloupe,just dried cantaloupe.

Speaker 3 (09:15):
I saw that I had no idea.
You can dry cantaloupe.

Speaker 1 (09:18):
This is level two.
Yeah, not too bad, I like that.
And this is.
And then this is our um, secondbest skew.
This is level three.
Level three mango dipper.
So it's a play on fun dip, yumso, um, dried mango strips here.
Our sour powder here you lickand dip.
Oh, super good, very fun, um.
So yeah, I think I think whywe're popping off now is because

(09:42):
and and I've just learned somuch from my two co-founders
they're just rock stars.
They've been in this worldforever.
One of them was really early onLiquid Death and Dollar Shave
Club, so he's kind of seen whatit takes to service customers at
a very high level.
I mean, you talk about LiquidDeath, how many SKUs do they

(10:03):
have now?
Level, I mean, you talk aboutliquid death, how many, how many
skews do they have now?
And actually I just found outthat their sparkling water has
now surpassed their still waterI believe that have you guys
tried their sparkling stuff.
They're sparking flavored waterjust sparkling.

Speaker 2 (10:16):
This is just sparkling.

Speaker 3 (10:17):
Sorry, I meant the flavors.
The flavor got it.

Speaker 2 (10:19):
The flavor is now and it's like, I mean it's I tried
their coca-cola flavor and it'ssurprisingly fine, is it have?

Speaker 3 (10:27):
you tried dr death, dr pepper flavor they just also
made them 12 and 12, which I'mpretty I haven't done the dr
death yet, but it's surprisinglyreally good when you taste it
you're like, oh, this is kind oflike a diet wait I want to try
soda

Speaker 1 (10:41):
are we ripping it?
Yeah, okay, we're gonna rip uhgreen apple right now.

Speaker 2 (10:45):
Yeah, we're just going to straight to level four.

Speaker 3 (10:47):
Level four let's raw dog it here.

Speaker 1 (10:50):
Yeah, because I don't want you building up tolerance
on the level twos.
That's what I was hoping for.

Speaker 2 (10:54):
You want to do that.
I was hoping for a little liketoday.
I'm bad.

Speaker 3 (10:57):
Let's get the reaction here We'll cut this.
This is gonna be the best adfinal boss hour has ever seen,
ever.

Speaker 1 (11:08):
Hey, one of those.
Your fingers are gonna a littlesticky.
Oh yeah, grab one of those oh.

Speaker 3 (11:15):
My gosh that the size .

Speaker 2 (11:21):
The size of it makes it scarier.
I'll do a big one too.

Speaker 3 (11:27):
And you just.

Speaker 1 (11:28):
So for anybody watching, we're doing it oh.
I like that.
He's seen death.
How I can feel it?

(11:50):
I can I forget how sour thatone is Nice.
He's a serial killer.
I've never seen that Adam.

Speaker 3 (12:05):
That taste was really delicious, so what do you think
?
Sorry, oh the aftershock.
I don't want another he didn'teven want to start on level four
and he just powered his waythrough that.
You said you don't like sourthings.
I gotta read, oh.
I like sour things who hurt youwhat scout trip?

Speaker 1 (12:22):
what camp?
Maybe I didn't have enough sour?
Who hurt you?
What scout trip?
What camp out?
Maybe it didn't have enoughsour on it?
I mean, no, I don't know.
Well, let's go through theflavors.
Dude, I want you to tryeverything.

Speaker 2 (12:33):
Oh my gosh.

Speaker 1 (12:34):
What do you think?

Speaker 3 (12:37):
I'm not a green apple person Like flavor-wise.
I actually love the flavor.
That was epic.
That is so funny, that was epic.

Speaker 1 (12:48):
My eyes watered.
You did not want to give me thead that was it.

Speaker 3 (12:50):
He did not want me he did not want me.
Yeah, I was trying to do thechallenge yeah, good oh my gosh,
what is not I didn't even thinkabout that with sour.
What's nice about sour?
Is it like doesn't stay withyou for a while?

Speaker 1 (13:02):
yeah, but like the heat which is nice, actually the
cantaloupe is gonna come out, Ithink, as the best flavor of
dried fruit.

Speaker 2 (13:14):
This one has a little more sour on it.

Speaker 3 (13:18):
That one's worse than that one Sour wise.

Speaker 1 (13:21):
that one's worse than that one think yeah, or did
your taste buds just get warmedup?

Speaker 3 (13:27):
not as long, but the initial dude.

Speaker 1 (13:31):
The after taste of the cantaloupe is crazy, right,
it doesn't taste like it's adried cantaloupe, it tastes like
a real cantaloupe.
Oh so, yummy, we're nevercoming back here.
I didn't have him test anything.

Speaker 3 (13:49):
No, he's not your model.
Do you like your teeth?
I?

Speaker 2 (13:54):
don't know, I guess maybe I guess I'm immune.

Speaker 1 (13:58):
I've literally never seen somebody not give a
reaction to level three and up.
Mark used to do a lot of drugsat a younger age.
He's seen some shit.

Speaker 3 (14:06):
He's been through.
He's been through.

Speaker 2 (14:09):
I've lived some lives , he's lived like 4 different
lives, the glasses on the head.
The bulletproof vest on.
That's true.

Speaker 3 (14:18):
When you're talking sour.

Speaker 2 (14:20):
The caramel is really good.

Speaker 3 (14:21):
The caramel is delicious.
So, yeah, I just like those.
I'll send you some.
It's great, it's really good,it's really good, it was
delicious, um.

Speaker 2 (14:26):
So yeah, I mean just doing a new flavor, I just like
those that was enjoyable.
Send you some.

Speaker 1 (14:29):
No, it's great he passed.
He passed the test.
What do I win?

Speaker 3 (14:36):
um a year supply for free.

Speaker 1 (14:37):
Yeah sorry, yeah, welcome with with club, with
proof of eating all of it.

Speaker 2 (14:43):
That was awesome.
Yeah, maybe I don't know, maybesour just isn't.

Speaker 1 (14:50):
No, it happens.
It happens, don't worry aboutit.
Those are great.
So this is what.

Speaker 2 (14:53):
I think I was so worried about it.

Speaker 3 (14:55):
Maybe we hyped it up too much, maybe it was kind of
like yeah, maybe we hyped it uptoo much.
Like somebody hypes up a movieLike, oh, like, oh,
oppenheimer's so good, and thenyou watch it and you're like it
wasn't that good.
Yeah, especially if you saw it.

Speaker 1 (15:05):
Maybe my face.

Speaker 2 (15:05):
Maybe my mind just reacts, my face doesn't.

Speaker 1 (15:09):
But it was sour.
Come on, it was sour, you justdidn't get it.
No, that was very sour.

Speaker 2 (15:13):
It was very sour, excellent Sometimes, mark will
be on a Zoom call.

Speaker 3 (15:17):
Yeah, and we'll be with clients and they'll be like
Mark, are you frozen?
Cause he won't move.
He won't move for, like, ifthey're talking or maybe I'm
talking, he won't blink or movefor like four minutes and so it
looks just like it's frozen.

Speaker 1 (15:33):
Okay, I'll be the first trilogy of the podcast and
I will bring our first levelfive for Mark oh who you'll be
the taste.
No.

Speaker 3 (15:43):
I think you need to have him on the call with the
investors.
When you guys do it together,we're gonna get you.

Speaker 1 (15:48):
I think that's my goal Is to make Mark just wince
a little bit.
We haven't done any.
Level 5, that's considered ourfinal boss.
Final boss, right?
Level 5.
Each box comes with kind of theroad map, right?
So you have your flavor, yourmini boss, and see, level four

(16:08):
hasn't come out in these flavorsyet and level five, the final
boss, coming soon.

Speaker 3 (16:13):
That's sick.

Speaker 1 (16:13):
You know, just kind of teasing, teasing the
landscape of the brand.
Those are tasty though, yeah,super good.

Speaker 2 (16:18):
I think, I think that's what's fun about this?

Speaker 3 (16:21):
That's something that I would like just to eat yeah
like I would buy that just tosnack on as like a candy you
know what next and you guys haveprobably already thought of
this like next, what would be avery interesting next step to
make final boss sour be go froma potential, because what do you
see?
Do you see people buying it thesame way they buy the chip,
which is.

(16:41):
I want to, um, like I want.
I wanted to try this for thefun of it, whether I'm looking
making a video, or whether I'mdoing it at a christmas party or
whatever it might be um, orhave you guys started to reach
the returning customer?
I imagine it's higher than yeah,much, much higher yeah but what

(17:02):
do you?
Can you share?
What is your return?

Speaker 1 (17:03):
yes, I mean we have.
You know, our average ordervalue is around like 55 bucks
and then lifetime value is, youknow, above 100 and I think we
get the repeat purchases becausewe're able to control the level
of sour.
So, for example, let's say,let's say green apple is a
banger drop and we sell, youknow, our, our, our, full

(17:25):
purchase order.

Speaker 2 (17:26):
And, by the way, the green apple tastes wonderful
yeah, so we have dry.

Speaker 3 (17:29):
I'm not a huge green apple guy like it, like the sour
.

Speaker 2 (17:32):
It's very sour, but it's it's very besides those
green apple caramel suckers.

Speaker 3 (17:35):
Remember those?

Speaker 2 (17:36):
yeah, from like those are really good.
Those are really good yeah yeah, those are amazing no, I was.

Speaker 1 (17:41):
I was just saying like if, if we see that this
drop sells out so verysuccessful dried fruit but we
get a lot of comments like waytoo sour.
At any given point we can justsay, okay, let's make a level
two, let's make a level one.
So, for example, ourstrawberries are by far our
customer favorite, but peoplebuy the level three to test the

(18:02):
sour, like you're saying.
You know, I want to try thiswith my friends.
We want to make phases, we wantthe level three to test the
sour, like you're saying.
You know, I want to try thiswith my friends.
We want to make phases, we wantto make videos, we want to
laugh, but then the repeat is onthe level one because now they
just want to snack, because itis good flavor, okay, and it is
good texture and it's good foryou and it's way better for you.
There's no talks.

Speaker 3 (18:15):
There's no uh colors in it?
There's no gelatin.

Speaker 1 (18:19):
My wife will be so excited.

Speaker 3 (18:21):
Yeah, I know a lot of people are really excited what
I was gonna say was like Iwonder if like a next step could
be, because how many were?
How many of the um in the uh,green apples?
How many were there?
Were there only three, or werethere four in the green apples,
yeah, or are there more?

Speaker 1 (18:36):
like uh, how many pieces?
How many pieces?
Yeah, there's, like you know,10 to 20.
Oh, oh, they're.
Yeah, like I mean, there's agood amount.

Speaker 3 (18:44):
Oh yeah, in my mind I was like there's three in there
, there's like three in there,no no, we try to.

Speaker 1 (18:51):
I mean, and the other thing about us is dried.
Dried fruit is not cheap.
No, these are yours.
I'm leaving this box with youguys and we can try that.

Speaker 2 (19:03):
We can try the mango dippers he is not passing Bad.

Speaker 1 (19:11):
So yeah, I think to your point.
Should I try a third one?
First touch point is I justwant the sour.
I want to see if these guys arereally more sour than Warheads,
toxic Waste, all those thingsout there.
Second touch point is now Iwant a snack on it and I'll get
level one strawberry, I'll getlevel one blueberry, I'll get
the mango dippers.
Yeah, let the, let theproducers try of the pod.

Speaker 3 (19:31):
I'm sweating, yeah.

Speaker 1 (19:34):
I'm sweating.
And then our third touch pointis our monthly drop.
So at any given point you'vetried, you've done the challenge
, you've done the snackableversion, but then a fruit that
you're interested comes out.
You're like, I got it, I gottatry that.
A little bit of crumble goingon there, you know like Supply,
supply them just new flavors,and then at the end of the year,

(19:55):
obviously we've only done thisonce.

Speaker 3 (20:00):
Grayson spent some time in Japan, so he's eaten
some weird shit before, so he'salright, not bad Caleb's.
Okay.
Caleb's some time in Japan, sohe's eating some weird shit
before, so he's alright, not badCaleb's.
Okay, caleb's struggling Causeyou're struggling.

Speaker 1 (20:11):
The guys behind the camera are acting tough.
This is your.

Speaker 2 (20:14):
Gamja Bar test.
See if you're Lisa Nagaib.

Speaker 3 (20:19):
Lisa Nagaib.
Alright, well, let's get into.
So what?
Okay, so you launch in.
Thank you, those are okay.
So you launch in.
Thank you, those are so good.
Yeah, thank you.

Speaker 2 (20:29):
It's like making my nose runny, what sour stuff
making my oh yeah, when it'ssour enough, man, it's like,
it's like a, it'll make youteeth, yeah yeah well, no man
it'll make you pop a molar well,it's the same thing as like
when it's super spicy, like whenit gets sour enough like your
body just is like yeah, yourtongue goes crazy, your sinuses

(20:51):
go crazy.

Speaker 1 (20:54):
You were saying that we launched some wasabi.

Speaker 3 (20:58):
So this is what I want to get into.
So let's, let's let's get intothe business and let's get into
like wasabi is an interestingspice, right.

Speaker 2 (21:05):
Yeah, I wonder how it do that was sour.

Speaker 1 (21:08):
I wonder how it would do that I didn't mention, but
we did it, we did a spicy, wedid chamoy.
Oh really, it was a huge hit,sweet, huge hit.
So it was a level two of souracids and that you think of a
mile long?
No, it's like random, likeSeptember.

Speaker 2 (21:24):
Oh come on.
Yeah, it was really cool, so itwas spicy and sour.

Speaker 1 (21:28):
Yeah, it was just, it wasn't too spicy, it was
nothing crazy, but it was thatsalty, sour and then sweet fruit
is really interesting, supergood, that's the only one I
really snacked on.
Will you try?

Speaker 2 (21:41):
some wasabi.
For me interesting spicebecause it doesn't last long
yeah, like it's just really hard.
And then it's like yeah, that'sinteresting um, I just brought
that up because I know you saidlike with sour it's better,
because it yeah, it doesn't lastas long.

Speaker 3 (21:54):
No, it's interesting um, okay, so launches the
business.
Uh, 18 months ago I rememberyou and me just texting back and
forth that it was like, hey,how's it going?
You're like, oh, it's goinglike it wasn't.
It was something you wereexcited about.
But maybe what felt like hey,it's not going the way I was
hoping it was going to goinitially, what has been the

(22:16):
catalyst that has taken you from?
I'm still excited about theidea, but I'm disappointed with
how it's maybe going to.
I'm so super stoked on the ideaand where it is right now.
Yeah, what's been the catalystfor you guys?

Speaker 1 (22:33):
Several, several factors played into it and I
don't know if I can redact thedisappointment, but I think I
was so pumped on the look of it,the vibe of it, the reactions I
got from people.
I've launched so manybusinesses in my career and I've
never scrolled on TikTok orInstagram reels and come across
somebody I didn't know postingabout my product and I think

(22:53):
that was the first inkling acouple months after we had
talked where I was like, oh,this random stranger purchased
something that we made.
I don't know them and they'reposting about it and it
organically hit my feed I waslike that's really cool.
And then it didn't happen foranother month yeah, I was like
okay, so maybe it's, you know,maybe it's just sprinkling out
in the ether somewhere.

(23:14):
But the biggest catalyst wasaffiliates on tiktok shop.
Yeah, and you know, our, ourbiggest.
We wanted to.
We wanted to kind of hit threetiers of product.
Right, how easy is it todemonstrate?
How many skews can you do andhow can you gamify it?
Yeah, and once we got all ofthose in place you know checks
and balances tiktok affiliateswere just begging us to to try

(23:38):
it.
They didn't.
They didn't believe it was assour as you know we were.
We were claiming it when theymade the video.
They, you know, had somethingfun to do, whereas, like, if you
think about a water, wereclaiming it when they made the
video, they, you know, hadsomething fun to do, whereas,
like, if you think about a waterbottle, yeah, it's like sure,
there's a ton of tiktokaffiliate making water bottle
videos, but it's like there'snot that edge.

Speaker 3 (23:55):
Yeah, um, well, there's, there's.
There's just such a like,whether it's the, whether it's
the chip challenge sorry tointerrupt you.
Very good, whether it's thechip challenge or not, like,
there are so many creators onTik TOK and YouTube and
Instagram whose entire likeethos is challenges, exactly.

Speaker 2 (24:10):
Right, like that's all, mr.

Speaker 3 (24:11):
There's a lot of salary whether it's eating
something, or just a challengeof like hey, can I live in this
coffin for 24 hours?
It's like the challenge worldis such an interesting thing
that we just like I find myselfwatching those videos my son
like we will turn on youtube onthe big tv because we don't let
him put it on the phone andhe'll just be watching mr beast
challenges, you know so thischallenge stuff is just that was

(24:34):
brilliant, like no, I, I agreethat.

Speaker 1 (24:37):
But the real catalyst that took us from like selling,
you know, 1500 to 3000 boxes amonth to 35 000, 40 000 boxes a
month was this keith lee review,you know, ke 1500 to 3000 boxes
a month to 35,000, 40,000 boxesa month.
Was this Keith Lee review?
You know who Keith Lee is.
You know Keith Lee I don't youknow, keith Lee?
You guys know Keith.

Speaker 3 (24:53):
Lee, I texted you who's.

Speaker 1 (24:55):
Keith Lee.

Speaker 3 (24:56):
I texted you the video.
I'm like this is just Keith.

Speaker 1 (24:58):
Yeah, I'm like dude, did you?
You were like the second personto text me it.

Speaker 3 (25:07):
So Keith me.
So so keith lee is keith, keithlee is.
I actually don't know hisentire origin, but he was
essentially a nobody in vegasand he would sit on his kids.
Uh, what was the chair?
Uh, puppy dog?
No, no, a paw patrol.
It was a paw patrol like a minichair and he'd just review
review food from uh vegas and hewas kind of gross about it.
Like not gross about it.
What would happen?
He'd like eat it and it wouldlike Fall from his mouth.

(25:29):
He'd be like Mmm, like it wasjust like the editing was like
odd yeah.

Speaker 1 (25:33):
And this Nobody.
The whole screen would be hismouth.

Speaker 3 (25:36):
Right in his mouth and he would essentially be like
Kind of like what Dave Portnoydoes with pizza.

Speaker 1 (25:40):
Okay, but he would do it raw reviews with the best
part about keith lee is from dayone.
He said I will never let acompany pay me to review their
product.
And to this day, or give them ayeah or give them a fake review
, fake for he just said from dayone this is my thing.
I'm going to review food, I'mgoing to review um products and

(26:01):
I'm never going to get paid andI'm always going to try to be as
honest as I can and he, he'ssaved businesses like thousands
of businesses and destroyedbusinesses.

Speaker 3 (26:08):
Yeah, so he'll he'll.
What he'll do is he'll be likeI'm going to.
I'm going to see if this is 20million on TikTok.

Speaker 2 (26:19):
Yeah, he'll, he'll, he'll say this He'll go.

Speaker 3 (26:21):
He pretty much says is it their product?
That is like why they're notsucceeding.
Is it their marketing or is ittheir customer service?
That's usually how he bases it,on those three things and
generally if a product isawesome, it's like it's usually
their marketing.
And then once he talks about it, it's like line for days to get
into this taco shop or thiswhatever, and it's crazy.

Speaker 1 (26:43):
I mean, yeah, he's kind of ditched the cringe
factor, like what we talkedabout from his beginning videos
and now he just reviews it he'llliterally go in disguise.
He'll put his bandana onglasses on.

Speaker 3 (26:54):
He'll go have his family or friends.

Speaker 1 (26:55):
Buy it, yeah, buy it they bring it out to the car and
he reviews it in his car sonobody can see it.
And so a week before he boughtour stuff, he reviewed this
really famous family run sushiparlor, whatever, and as he was
picking up he was chatting tocamera, holding a thing of sushi
in his I almost said toothpicks, chopsticks a literal bug

(27:20):
crawled out of the on camera.
But he's talking to camera.
He's not looking at jumps outof his sushi roll this episode
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Speaker 1 (28:42):
Eats the sushi roll, gives it a bug bug.

Speaker 3 (28:45):
Gives it kind of a mediocre review.
Listen to this, listen to this.

Speaker 1 (28:48):
Gives it kind of a mediocre review.
The comment section goes crazy.
There was a bug, there was abug, there was a bug, there was
a bug.
Business shut down in like aweek.

Speaker 3 (28:54):
Well, and somebody came out and said that's not
just any kind of bug Like that'sa centipede I can't.

Speaker 2 (29:06):
It was like, yeah, like a little little something,
a little something like abusiness under well, like when
you're talking about like eatingsomething, it's got to be like
a centipede sure, yeah, maybe.

Speaker 1 (29:12):
Anyway, whatever it was, yeah, that business took
like a week to for everybody toboycott it.
Yeah, and uh, I don't knowwhere, he didn't do anything.

Speaker 3 (29:19):
He didn't do anything , but I think it's under.
I think it's like they shuttheir doors.
At least they shut their doors.
Yeah, I remember watch, becauseI looked him up and they're
like we are shutting our doorsto do a compliance and you know
To like.

Speaker 1 (29:28):
I don't know how you reopen from that to have.
No, you're the bug guy now.

Speaker 2 (29:32):
Yeah, you had a bug crawl out of the sushi.
Yeah that is Gnarly dude.
Yeah, that is so gnarly.
My wife could have been amaggot.

Speaker 3 (29:40):
My why I think it was a maggot.
I I'm pretty sure it was amaggot.
My wife one time she got arumbi salad.
You remember rumbi?
Yeah, of course she got a rumbisalad and a praying mantis was
in her salad, like a full group.
A live praying mantis Prayingmantises are huge.

Speaker 1 (29:55):
It's chopping up her salad for her.

Speaker 3 (29:57):
And she was just like I was just really hungry.
I just tossed it out.
The is from Kung Fu Panda.
I was like we could have Rumbiefor life.

Speaker 1 (30:02):
Probably my wife has a famous story up at St Regis
their burgers are 100 bucks andthey're not even a good burger.
She bites into her burger.
First off, my dad's paying forour whole family, so it's going
to be $1,000, right.
My wife bites into her burger.
Full thing of plastic.

Speaker 3 (30:19):
They left the whole plastic top on the entire meal.

Speaker 1 (30:21):
They even invited us back.
We got two meals free that'slike her claim to fame.

Speaker 3 (30:25):
That's worth it.

Speaker 2 (30:25):
It's so good yeah and they gave her a burger and we
ate a little paper.
That's kind of an honestmistake.

Speaker 1 (30:30):
But it is yeah no, it totally is.

Speaker 2 (30:32):
Yeah, sorry, go on.

Speaker 3 (30:33):
Bug is not an honest mistake so yeah, week before he
shuts it down.
So how does keith did?
You didn't send it to him, hejust bought it so that's his
thing.

Speaker 1 (30:40):
Okay, he will.
He does not allow any prpackages to come.
I mean, I'm sure people getthem to him, but he doesn't?

Speaker 3 (30:45):
he's not filming, yeah.

Speaker 1 (30:47):
So this review goes up, keith Lee.

Speaker 3 (30:51):
Yeah, black guy with dreadlocks.
Yeah, you're going to, you'regoing to recognize him.
Yeah, you'll see.

Speaker 1 (30:54):
You have to.
Anyway, he's, he is literallythe the God of Tik god of tiktok
food reviews 100 by far.
Like there's tiktok food critic.
Tiktok food critic, you knowhe's been in mr beast videos.
He's done.
He's done clubs of the biggest,um gordon ramsay's cooked for
him, like that level.
So I get one text therecouldn't be any, just to let's

(31:18):
keep going couldn't be anybodybetter to find your product or.

Speaker 3 (31:25):
Yes, there's not a single person who could do
better for you, I think.

Speaker 1 (31:28):
Yeah, I love how we're the only ones in the room
who don't know we're reallytrying to get them.
If you did it through BeastGames or something like that,
but outside of Mr Beast, it'sprobably him yeah.
And Mr Beast isn't niche enoughto really move the needle.
Sure, because he doeseverything.
Sure is, keith is only food,yeah.
So anyway, I get a text,literally right, I want to say
like six hours before you textme, yeah, and I got the link and

(31:51):
I was on my computer so itpopped up here and I kind of was
like keith lee video and it'sfrom a buddy.
So I was like I, whatever, andI'm doing my thing when you text
me.
That was actually the only timeI watched it, because now I've
seen the thumbnail twice, yeah.
So, um, actually watch the fullthing.
And I'm like shit, shit, shit,shit.
You know, I, I gotta go.
I go into shopify, I go intoour tiktok shop and nothing's

(32:13):
moved yet and I'm like okay,okay, it was kind of a good
review and let me watch it again.
And so I'm watching it againand now I'm kind of the jitters
are off, because if he shits onour product, literally our
tick-tock shop is done,literally done.
No one's buying it and Gives usa great review.
Just the right amount of souron the lower levels, really sour

(32:37):
on the high levels.

Speaker 3 (32:39):
Really good flavor and what's nice is he's not like
a sweets guy.
He says it all the time.
I know way too much about thisguy.

Speaker 2 (32:45):
Get excited, Well do you know what the beauty of
talking about this guy is, andme not knowing who he is or our
producers not knowing is it justshows you how much success
there is to be had out there ohsure, anyone can do it, like
everyone thinks like oh,everyone already knows about
something, or yeah, true likethey're.
So the riches are in the nichesright Like you found an intent

(33:06):
based influencer.
Well, you didn't find them, hefound you right.
But an intent to base fininfluencer, who's only a food
critic that I have no idea about, apparently just like ransacks
or boost businesses based on anhonest, real review.
And you guys obviously made agreat product, so you pass, yeah
, so he passes.

Speaker 1 (33:24):
And yeah, so he passes.
And yeah, he posted at thebeginning of November we have
our biggest month in history by4 or 5X revenue-wise, and then
almost did 7X in December.
It's tapered off since the kindof Keith Lee effect has worn
off.
But we reached out to him.
We asked if we could split thecommission.
We asked if we could pay him.
His team said no, he would havemade hundreds of thousands of

(33:47):
dollars from one video that hedidn't put any time into um and
we, yeah, completely sold out ofevery single skew.
Um spent all of december.
My co-founder was flying backand forth between um, we, we
manufacture out of northcarolina.
He was packing orders, ordershimself.
I was running all the ads,doing all the marketing, what we

(34:08):
did too.
We said, hey, do you mind if we, you know, chop up your video.

Speaker 2 (34:11):
Or can I review your video?

Speaker 1 (34:13):
And use it as an ad.
They never responded.

Speaker 2 (34:15):
We did it anyway, yeah.

Speaker 1 (34:17):
And it ran a lot of.
It ran for a very long time.
One of the ads that we'vecreated Is still running, still
getting a lot of our spend yeahit's just keith lee going.
Apparently this is the mostsour candy in the world.
Let's rate it on one throughten.
Yeah, oh, that's it, you know,yeah and um.
So now we're.
The whole business model islike, wow, we could.
If we could just find two orthree keith lee moments a year.

(34:40):
Sure, that's just very organic,it would be great.

Speaker 3 (34:43):
So now we're two or three keith lee moments and then
you have a thousand of the like.

Speaker 1 (34:48):
Mini creator yeah, just the affiliates, yeah, yeah
and um you know what's awesomeabout the biggest catalyst?

Speaker 2 (34:54):
like you said, the gamifying aspect here.
I was just thinking about thisfrom a visual aspect a lot of
companies in marketing andadvertising.
Then I want to ask you a fewquestions about that.
Right, but in your perspective,it's hard to visually
demonstrate certain benefits andfeatures.

Speaker 1 (35:12):
Sure, sour is one of the flavors that you can
visually demonstrate and notfake it yeah, exactly, exactly
like you can't really fake aneye twitch, you know like some
people can if you're like Idon't know good at acting.

Speaker 2 (35:25):
I can't like I'm not gonna be able to, like some
people can.
If you're like I don't knowgood at acting, I can't like I'm
not going to be able to be likeright, like you're going to
know if someone's kind of itconvulses your body to give a
reaction.

Speaker 1 (35:31):
So it's like we get free content all the time, cause
, you know, our DMS are justfull of people who aren posting
it.

Speaker 2 (35:41):
here you go, yeah and it just I can't wait to film my
kids yeah, it's really fun mykids love trying new things too.

Speaker 3 (35:46):
Like they will, they'll go straight to the level
convinced that my kid, my 10year old kids, convinced that
there's nothing too sour for himand he won't make a face.
Okay, cool, so I'll have tobring this out.
Let me know and just give me aride as a ownership, all you
know but um, yeah, there's,there's been a, there's been a
lot of catalysts.

Speaker 1 (36:04):
The other, the other thing that I've I had an
experience in my professionalcareer dealing with products.
You know, I've been in, I'vebeen in the advertising space
for 10 years now and is the lovepeople have for it.
I've never like we.
We have crazy celebrities, likewe had um tyreek hill comment
on something oh cool, give mesomething.
Yeah, yeah, like tyreek hill,but just like it's so random,

(36:28):
like um the cheetah, yeah, nickcannon did a entire live stream
with it, really unprovoked.
That's incredible.
Yeah, yeah, I just put that onlinkedin a couple days ago
drumline great show yeah, it'sjust, it's just crazy and I, I
feel, I feel so happy to havesomething that strangers talk

(36:48):
positively about, becauseeverything I've ever done in my
career is like oh, I know london, I'm gonna, I'm gonna throw him
a bone and make this video forhis stupid little product that
nobody really wants, you know,that's how it's been for like 10
years, sure, and so it's beenreally.
It's been really fun that, umone, the ads are working, so a
lot of people, um, you know, alot of people are purchasing
that I don't know, and ads areprimarily reactions uh, yeah,

(37:13):
all reactions as far as theflavors, yeah, far as a hook.
Um, sour faces, new flavors, youknow, and then I'll.
I'll be scrolling youtube.
I'll just type in final bosshour on youtube.
I'll find I'll find like threeor four videos maybe a month
that are like two hours long, ofa person, some stranger,
talking about the box and tryingit, joe bartolozzi, one of the

(37:34):
biggest tiktokers in the world.
Um, has kind of transitioned tolong form streaming and youtube
videos and I've been a fan ofthis kid.
We, we kind of went back andforth when I was doing the Tesla
videos because he was I wouldrage, bait him because he wanted
a Tesla really bad, and I knewthat about him.
So that's when I did thespaghetti thing.

Speaker 3 (37:50):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (37:51):
And then he would dude.
It always worked.
He always reacted to my videos.
So we've kind of had this likeweird partnership.
We've never spoken and I'm likeI DM him like yo, that's my,
that's my, my thing, and he'slike what, like my arch nemesis?

(38:11):
And so we've we've done twovideos with him now.
Um, yeah, just very, veryreactionary based, and I feel
like, if you're thinking about aproduct, how do you make the
heavy lifting on the customer?
And the heavy lifting is justgetting people to react and to
use our product.
Right, it's all on the customer.
All we need to do is get intohands.
So we see a ton of productevery month and it has a pretty

(38:33):
good I mean untrackable ROI, butwe see as a big creator post
about it.
We do see bumps, do you?

Speaker 3 (38:41):
well, here's the beauty of seeding product.
I think that you, as aninfluencer, this is a we're
actually a really good liketopic to discuss.
Is, you know, back in like 2016, probably through what?
2020, 2021.
Yeah, it was so custom to sayhey post about this, I'll pay
you 2000.
I'll pay you $10,000.

(39:02):
And now we're starting to seethat that's not working at the
same ratio, not to say that itstill may not be worth it.
First, off.

Speaker 1 (39:10):
That's the entire reason I wanted to start a
company.
Yeah, cause I knew influencinginfluencer marketing just is
pivoting every year.
Sure, it's going to change.

Speaker 3 (39:25):
I can't.

Speaker 2 (39:25):
I mean consumer behavior is just changing.

Speaker 3 (39:27):
I can't tell you how many times I've paid.
Uh, you know, we paid back inthe day creators 20 grand to
post about us and we made 300intractable roi, and then and
then you pay somebody 300 andyou make 100 grand intractable
roi you know it's just like it'sso hit or miss.
So.
So what's what's veryinteresting is is seeding
product is meant for really twodifferent things.
Right, there is this world thatonce you seed enough product,

(39:52):
it doesn't matter if they have ahundred or a thousand followers
or 20 million followers.
Eventually, like a thousandpeople who have two thousand
followers and or gets a thousand, it doesn't mean followers a
thousand people that can get atleast a thousand to two thousand
views.
Right, that becomes adistribution.
We call it borroweddistribution, a borrowed

(40:14):
distribution channel.
You're borrowing all their,their data, their sorry, their
views.
But on the flip side, seedingproduct allows you to then run
those things as ads, right, andso that's kind of like when you
I think what brands need tounderstand is you have to see
product with the latter as thepriority number one.
Priority number one is I needbetter content from an ad

(40:37):
perspective, and priority numbertwo is hopefully I get the
distribution that follows it asI get enough now, if you just do
30 you're not gonna get thedistribution yeah, and I talked
with brands all the time.

Speaker 1 (40:47):
They're like yeah, we could probably see it 100 boxes
this year, and I'm like howmany boxes are you seeing?

Speaker 3 (40:53):
the how?
What do you see a month?

Speaker 1 (40:55):
oh, it goes up and down I give me an average.
I probably personally submitlike 100 to 300 influencers or
people.
I find friends and family whoare in the industry or who I
don't even.
And then but that that'sprobably multiplied by my two
co-founders too, you know.
And then we have a girl who'sjust dming people all day so

(41:16):
gotta be in the thousand.
Awesome um.
I love that.
I'd have to.
I'd have to get an exact number.

Speaker 3 (41:21):
I think the point I'm trying.
You made the point I was tryingto make, which is you have so
many people who are like I'mgoing to see 30 a month, which
is better than zero, sure, butif you want to get the
distribution, effect and,granted, sometimes depends on
your margins.
Yeah, these margins, I'mguessing not that dried fruit is
an expense or not.
Dried food is more expensive,sure, but in candy, but we're

(41:44):
not just stamping gelatin.
Yeah, versus, like these pantsright here are going to be a lot
more caught like cost a tonmore from like a weight in
shipping and from a COGSperspective versus yeah Like.

Speaker 2 (41:58):
I mean, if you look at it, if you look at it, you
see like you're saying, thoughlike not to go too off topic, 30
is better than none, but don'texpect to see the distribution
effect of seeding 1,000 productsby seeding 30.

Speaker 1 (42:11):
100%.
We're also just guessing thatour CAC will be relatively okay.
So, like speaking numbers here,let's say our CAC needs to be
under 25 bucks.
Uh, speaking numbers here,let's say, let's say our cac
needs to be under 25 bucks andour cost of goods is, you know,
ten dollars less than that ifthat person, which we, we can
almost guarantee buys a drop orbuys another one of our SKUs.

(42:35):
Now our cac went from 25 bucksto a free, just giving a free
product totally, and we've,we've seen that time and time
again.
Like I, I've gifted.
I really try hard to gift allthe Utah, all the Utah people.
If I'm scrolling and I seemountains in the background, I
always send them a DM,regardless of their following.
Don't even look, just say I'min Utah, we'd love to send you a
, we'd love to send you a box.

(42:56):
And every once in a while,going to know shopify or
whatever tiktok shop and look uptheir name or almost always
they've ordered, they've orderedsomething else do you?

Speaker 3 (43:05):
when you're seeding stuff to people, do you also let
them know?
Hey, we're on tiktok shops,like just to let them know.

Speaker 1 (43:10):
Yeah like my and I, because I come from both worlds.
Right, I'm like in the, I'm inthe, you know, business owner
world right now, day to day,yeah, but I come from the
influencer world where I wasgetting hit up daily, hey, can
we send you, can we send you aproduct?
And I noticed for me personally, when somebody asked me to do
something, yeah, huge turnoff,totally.

(43:32):
So, like our intern that isdming, I just say state your
name, say hey, I'm, you know,I'm uh kelsey, I work with final
boss sours seating team.
You know, make it official,sure, sure.
And we, we just, you know I'muh kelsey, I work with final
boss sours seating team.
You know, make it official sure,sure and we we just, you know
we vibe with your stuff could wesend you a box, nothing else?
Yeah, you send in the box.
Then and, and I, I had it theinverse right.
Hey, we want to send you a newwhatever, uh, new snowboard,

(43:57):
yeah, you know.
And and then them asking hey,later, a month later, two months
later, hey, did you ever filmanything?
We'd love to?
Yeah, we'd love to throw it inthe ad.
And and more often than not,they go yeah, I posted about it,
or here's, here's the post, orhere's the video I made.
But I think that where brandsget it wrong is just shooting

(44:17):
their shot a little tooaggressively.
Yeah, just make a relationshipwith these people.
And so I say, yeah, do not askanything of them, here's a free
gift.

Speaker 2 (44:26):
Do what you want Too aggressively in two ways I think
they go.
They think too big when theythink of influencer Like I need
to see the people that have Xamount of followers, or whatever
.
When follower counts, justdon't matter like they used to
it's just more about getting itout there to people that can
influence other people.
And its views, and it doesn'tmatter if that person is going

(44:47):
to influence a thousand in thebeginning or you know a hundred,
but I love.
What you also brought up is theother aspect here is when
you're advertising, sometimesyou need to think about your ad
costs the same way you thinkabout product seeding.

Speaker 1 (45:02):
Sure.

Speaker 2 (45:02):
Yeah, right, the more people that use your stuff, the
more people that will use yourstuff.
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (45:06):
If you have good stuff.

Speaker 2 (45:07):
Yes, If it's good To make it simple right.
If you have good stuff, themore people that have that good
stuff will want to share thatgood stuff, the more people you
sell to the more people sell.

Speaker 1 (45:25):
The and I just, I just love the generosity, like
there is the karma, you know thethe level of karma in, in my
opinion, of just like gifting,gifting, gifting, gifting and
receiving, receiving, receiving,and it is always paid off where
, where a hundred of theseinfluencers I've sent it to have
done nothing with the video,but then Keith Lee purchases it
because he went to a creatorthing and that could like you
know what I'm saying?

Speaker 3 (45:42):
A thousand other people doing it.

Speaker 1 (45:43):
Yeah, it's just yeah, my opinion is just give away,
give away, give away, andsomebody will give something
away back to you and and it'sjust, it's just paid off.
And not only that, but when youdo have a good product, people
just people just want in.
Like if Liquid Death DM'd you,hey, can I send you a box of
Liquid Death.
Who's saying no, yeah, yeah,for sure.
And then a couple of monthslater, yeah, you make any

(46:04):
content of that.

Speaker 2 (46:05):
Maybe most people aren't saying no to anything.

Speaker 1 (46:08):
True Right they might say no to.

Speaker 3 (46:11):
I'm not going to post about it or I'm not going to
say what you're asking me to saycan I send you something?
Oh, a hundred percent, unlessthey have a partnership with
somebody else no stringsattached, Like can I send you
something that's?
What we've learned Like.
That's our, that's our language.
Your line no strings attached.

Speaker 1 (46:27):
Love that Right.

Speaker 3 (46:28):
Hey, like no strings attached.
You just seem like the type ofperson who would love it.
Send me your address.
Yeah, and ads work the same way.
Or just just say marketing ingeneral, like marketing is all
about taking the next step, youknow, and like you're not trying

(46:49):
to get into the pants of thegirl you just met on the street,
exactly, and so don't do thatSome are but some are and they
are in prison sometimes.
Or they, or it works, I guess.
But at the end of the day it'slike yeah, it's like you're not
trying, yeah, you're not tryingto skip from like I just met you
.
I just met you to let's getmarried and have babies.

Speaker 1 (47:10):
You know, I think you've said, I think you've done
videos on that.

Speaker 3 (47:13):
Yeah, it's just such a it concept that most people
don't get.
We try like, especially in thedirect to consumer world.
We are so focused on immediateresults.
None of us have patience forthe if I sent this to somebody
or if I spent this amount ofmoney on an ad like.
We just don't have the patience.
We're expecting immediate.

(47:34):
All right, and it's it's whatlimits.
Most people and most brandscan't get past this $5 to $15
million mark because they're sofocused on direct return Direct
return no matter what I'm doing,in every aspect of what I'm
doing.

Speaker 2 (47:49):
And every company that grows and grows big gets
over that quick.

Speaker 3 (47:54):
Yes, I agree.
They understand their uniteconomics.
They understand their OPEX,they're very focused on it.
They're not in it to lose money.
Yes.

Speaker 2 (48:03):
But they understand this is an investing game and a
long term play, yep, andsometimes you can't expect a
return right away.

Speaker 1 (48:07):
Recently they've been just spending probably millions
of dollars on just getting theright faces to be drinking it
Totally Like Conor McGregor.
Yeah, five years ago when Iwent and met with them to work
out some influencer deal, theywere in the phase of like how
many clicks does your link inbio get?
Totally, they're not asking.
Conor McGregor that.

Speaker 3 (48:26):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (48:26):
They're like tell us your price.
Drink one of our cans in onevideo.
That's good enough for us.

Speaker 3 (48:33):
You fit our brand Fit our brand.
Yeah, we just have.

Speaker 2 (48:35):
He has a line with them now too.

Speaker 3 (48:37):
You know Alex MacArthur from Kizik.
Purple yeah he's become areally good friend of ours and
he was just in the office.

Speaker 1 (48:43):
I think I'm just LinkedIn buddies, but yeah, I
know who he is.

Speaker 3 (48:45):
Yeah, he was just in our office and he was saying the
exact same thing.
He's like okay, I have nowworked for like $3 billion
companies yeah, not just youknow or value, I assume Bucked
Up's valued at over a billion.

Speaker 1 (48:58):
oh easily.

Speaker 3 (49:00):
I have no idea, but I'm sure I would say easily
getting up there.

Speaker 1 (49:02):
Yeah I heard somewhere through the grapevine
they were doing like a hunt.
They were doing like 800k onlike one skew in retail.

Speaker 3 (49:07):
Yeah, a month, I would not be surprised yeah and
and that's what, exactly what hewas telling us.
He's like you just have to putmore into the top of funnel and
top of funnel 100 is not goingto oftentimes.
Today, give you a return it'sworking, but tomorrow it does.
Yeah, that's done right that'sour whole thing.

Speaker 1 (49:26):
So when me and me and james my co-founder, the guy
thought of the sour driedcranberry, when we were kind of
partnering up before, beforeanything was signed, before we
got our our first, um, you know,pile of cash just to inject in
the brand, we were just like,what do we do differently from a
marketing standpoint?
Because this is going to workgreat.
As UGC, we kind of already knowthat, like moms and their kids

(49:46):
and you know, people are goingto want to review the product
just to see if they make a face.
We already knew that.
So we're like we gotta, wegotta do something different.
So, um, and I so kind of whenwe're we think of ourselves

(50:07):
internally as an entertainmentbrand.
We just want, we just want toput funny stuff out there,
whether it has to do a lot withthe product or very little with
the product.
Um.
So this, the first video weever launched.
I can't remember what thescript is called.
It's called like battle at thearcade.
It was about a kid that gotbullied by the employee of the
arcade this this the employeethrows away all his kids tickets
and then gives them a challenge.

(50:27):
You know well, if you want yourtickets back, you got to go beat
the hardest arcade game.
The product, and this is ourfirst video.
Yeah, when our first videoshould be like hello and this is
the most sour candy.

(50:47):
You know, that's what our firstvideo should have been.
Yeah, we did this like shortfilm has like 60 million views
on youtube.
It really set a precedent fortop of funnel stuff.
Yeah, and that's when we?
yeah, that's when we decided,hey, let's focus on
entertainment and then let thethe audience make their own
videos for our bottom funnel,middle bottom yeah, what I've,
what I've noticed, is that, yeah, I think, I think the days of
just product centric ads are,are, are, there will always be a

(51:08):
place for them.
Yeah, but I think justcompanies just need to post good
, good content, whether it talksabout their product or not,
whether it shows all thefeatures, whether it tells you
the price point or not, andthat's, that's just the trend.
I'm on with final boss, ourother clients, we, we run ads.
We we film and run ads for a, acompany, a fairly new company,

(51:29):
called nightweave.

Speaker 3 (51:29):
They sell cloaks, literal cloaks and they're like
who you're talking about, likeweighted blankets brand yeah,
yeah, uh down in springville, Ibelieve yeah and that guy was a
huge tiktoker right and thenyeah, yeah yeah, chris, you're
coming a good good lady incloaks and they're crushing it.

Speaker 1 (51:46):
They sell so many cloaks a month and we don't ever
talk about cloaks.
We just make like lord of therings style content we just shot
, um, a really funny bit of.
We're trying to do this wholecampaign where people in modern
day are wearing cloaks but likeacting like the nerds in a
grocery store or at work ortrying to.

(52:07):
You know, cloaks are foreveryday people and we've just
we just made some funny stuff.
But yeah, I think to your point, top of funnel is the most
maybe untrackable place.
Obviously, obviously you cantrack clicks and views, but I
feel like that's if you're, ifyour brand is suffering on new

(52:30):
purchases.
Top of funnel is top of funnelis garbage.
You know new audience and we,we see it time, month over month
.
We can like, let's say,february was trash, revenue wise
and March is great.
We just look, okay, what'sgoing on top of the funnel?
Oh, the kidnapper video that I.
This is happening right now.
February, kind of mad month.

(52:50):
March is killing it right nowand we have this really famous
ad about a kidnapper that pullshis white van up to a kid it was
actually for the launch of ourmango dippers and he goes hey,
kid, you want some candy.
That you know that timelessjoke of.
Hey, don't talk to people inwhite vans.
They're going to ask for candy.

(53:10):
Don't get in Right.
And this kid's like scribblingchalk on the sidewalk.
And the kid's just like what doyou got Cause he's obviously
knows the joke.
And this guy goes oh, I've gotfun dip.
And he goes in the back and wehave this funny shot looking
into the back of this bus andthere's a tied up dead person
like kind of hidden, his toesare out, yeah.
And anyway it goes on to tellthis kid he's got fun dip.

(53:33):
Then the kid pitches him on whyhe doesn't eat fun dip.
He goes, oh, yellow five andall these other toxic
ingredients.

Speaker 3 (53:43):
I prefer final boss hour.

Speaker 1 (53:43):
So it switches from like short film to an ad.
Sure, anyway, I've run thatthing.
I run that thing probably everycouple months and sometimes it
hits again.
Sometimes it doesn't.
The first time we posted, itdid like 30 million views on
YouTube shorts and we were like,oh, why is?
Why is March crushing it?
So I'm going through and I haveall our, all of our videos
scheduled on tick tock instagramand youtube.
Sure enough, it's going viralin three places, just top of

(54:05):
funnel, organically, and so nowwe can kind of correlate.
okay, in february we didn't haveanything organically, yeah
ripping yeah and um, this samevideo that I shot a year ago.
It has like two and a halfmillion views over the last two
days on.
Yeah, and it's a shoppable,shoppable video on tiktok.
So, um, that's all.
That's all my day-to-day andfinal boss is scripting.

Speaker 3 (54:27):
Yeah, scripting, scripting, scripting dude, it's
so cool, entertaining, yeah,love it I had a bunch of like
good questions, but I'm likethis I actually don't really
want to answer, ask any of thequestions because I feel like it
will pivot.
The way the conversation's goneand this is is like the best
possible way this conversationcould have gone.
I think so.
That's awesome man.
Um.
I appreciate you guys.

(54:48):
Well, thanks for coming on.
Dude Like this has been greatUm what did we say?

Speaker 1 (54:51):
that the third one was going to be when, oh when,
we do level five.

Speaker 3 (54:57):
I want to just be you and Mark only yeah, in a dark
dark room staying hearing ateach other.
Yeah, the what's that like hotwings yeah you'll see if you
can't have a beanie on, so yousee if he has any beads of sweat
.
We thought about doing a spinoff of that show.

Speaker 1 (55:12):
But like we, and we tested it, we've, we've even
posted it.

Speaker 2 (55:16):
But that works, because the spicing that stays
with them stays with, whereas usit's like what'd you say?

Speaker 1 (55:23):
Oh, I'm fine, now Wait what was the challenge.

Speaker 2 (55:27):
There's like a hot wing challenge Is it when
they're talking.

Speaker 3 (55:31):
Yeah, it's an interview.

Speaker 1 (55:32):
The spice will stay the whole interview.

Speaker 3 (55:34):
Sour will stay for half the question.
Okay, yeah, that makes sense.

Speaker 2 (55:37):
We turn that off.

Speaker 1 (55:46):
They start sweating by the end of it for 80 million
or something like that.
Yeah, that guy's like way good.
He's like super famous forasking like the most unreal
questions, like call their highschool teacher.
Yes, dirt on them.
Yeah, have you heard?

Speaker 3 (55:51):
of that.
No, yeah, like you'll like saysomething to like he did selena
gomez that she forgot about 30or 20 years ago.

Speaker 1 (55:57):
Be like what happened when you cheated on your
biology test, and and she'll belike cheated on my.
Oh my gosh.
What did Mrs Clark say to you?
That's what he's asking likespicy questions.
Yeah, that's the whole pointwhat did Mrs Clark in second
grade say to you?
I've just seen the reactions ofpeople.
I guess the clips yeah, no the.
Yeah, they can't even rememberand he'll tell them the thing

(56:20):
that they lived and everyone'slike who's working for you.

Speaker 3 (56:23):
It's pretty cool yeah that's so good.
Well, dude, thank you so much.

Speaker 2 (56:27):
I tell everybody.

Speaker 3 (56:27):
Where you can, they can find final boss, our,
everywhere, our our website.

Speaker 1 (56:31):
You can actually get more pouches for cheaper on our
website, or tiktok shop or Onlyfans is our spicy, you know.

Speaker 3 (56:40):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (56:41):
Actually last thing, Would this be funny Because you
guys know marketing.

Speaker 3 (56:45):
Because we know OnlyFans.
Really well, yeah, you guysknow.

Speaker 1 (56:47):
OnlyFans Subscribers.

Speaker 3 (56:51):
No, actually creators , I'm just a subscriber, Not
subscribers we're creators.

Speaker 2 (56:54):
Just feet pics, though you know what if?

Speaker 1 (56:56):
like for a stunt.
Like I want people to writearticles about this.
Like I want people to writearticles about this is, if we do
another, if we do like anactually spicy flavor maybe
final boss spicy or somethingput it behind a, a, a paywall on
only fans, only fans, just as agimmick.

Speaker 3 (57:11):
I think it used to be super funny, cause you know,
how like it's all.

Speaker 1 (57:15):
You see the caption, like, click the spicy link.
It's like the pepper.
Yeah, I think that would be sofunny.
To launch a product behind onlyfans yeah, I think so too.
I think that could be reallycool.

Speaker 3 (57:25):
Let's actually think about it before we get canceled.
The only problem with that islike I bet your audience is moms
, right, like who are?

Speaker 1 (57:30):
like buying this for your kids, or, and you know, or
whatever that's the only, but Ilike maybe we get an article and
then yeah, yeah, it's a prstunt.

Speaker 2 (57:38):
Yeah, it's not.
You don't have to do it.
You could create a landing pageand mimic it.

Speaker 3 (57:42):
That'd make it look like.

Speaker 2 (57:43):
OnlyFans.

Speaker 1 (57:44):
There we go, way better.

Speaker 2 (57:45):
So you're not actually driving it to the
domain.

Speaker 3 (57:50):
And it's finalbosshour slash.

Speaker 1 (57:52):
OnlyFans or whatever.
That's funny Instead of.

Speaker 2 (57:55):
OnlyFans.
You could say like OnlySpicy oryou know, yeah, yeah.
You just change the word orit's only fans.

Speaker 1 (58:07):
that's what you do, yeah okay, well then, that's
super easy.

Speaker 2 (58:09):
We can do that, and then you just like like your
eight bit style, you just kindof pixelate the only fans logo
yeah, yeah you know, yeah, it'sgreat, and just have a character
with just like is that that way?
And then you can have like awarning when you get there,
which like mimics, like theparental warnings of like 18 and
older?

Speaker 1 (58:25):
Yeah, yeah, exactly.

Speaker 2 (58:27):
Like this.
Content is very spicy.

Speaker 1 (58:30):
Too spicy.

Speaker 2 (58:30):
Yeah, yeah, I like that.
Make sure you're of age Like.

Speaker 3 (58:34):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (58:34):
Put your birth date below.

Speaker 1 (58:35):
Dude, I had one more idea.
Can I get this one out, please?
Okay, a, um, a, uh, an adult,an adult app, you know, for
adult content.
But when?
So you down, right, you, youbasically place ads on other
apps.
Hey, uh, you know hot girlshere, whatever.
Then they go download that app,but then when you pull up the

(58:59):
app, it just loads infinitely.
So there's no, there's, there'sno sexual content but, this app
just loads.
And then you run all your adsfor your businesses on the top
and bottom while they, whilethey're waiting for this thing
to load and it just loads.
That's the whole app.
You just sell the ad space toto like, but think how many

(59:21):
downloads you'd get.
You'd get a lot, and it wouldget, you would get a lot of
downloads.

Speaker 3 (59:25):
It'd be, you'd get tons of downloads.

Speaker 1 (59:27):
It'd be short lived.
Yeah, it's almost like okay,it's almost like the first one
has to load all the way throughand give them like a little
something, and then it just anew bar, a new bar starts and
then, yeah, you just sell the adspace above it.

Speaker 3 (59:39):
Or like the loading is just like, slowly, a
pixelated image of just like,but it never, actually Never
form.

Speaker 2 (59:45):
I remember that page that kid was selling pixels for
yeah and he just sold a bunch oflike people just bought up
advertisements on.
It was just a page ofadvertisements and you could buy
a pixel right, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 3 (59:55):
You would buy one literal pixel yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:00:03):
One little pixel or multiple, like coca-cola, but it
got crazy.
I just want to prank people.
That's so funny.

Speaker 2 (01:00:07):
But that is.
That is a good ad, though, yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:00:09):
Yeah, oh, the only fans one.
Well, the only fans is funny,but also like you could do.

Speaker 2 (01:00:14):
Yeah, like that's such an easy ad, like, hey, what
are you looking, what are youdoing?
I'm just trying to find somespicy content.
Yeah, you know.

Speaker 3 (01:00:23):
Yeah, yeah, as an ad, I see what you're saying.

Speaker 1 (01:00:24):
Yeah, I feel like if I came into a large sum of money
, I'd probably get in trouble bytrying all these stupid ideas.
Well, dude, thank you so muchfor coming on.

Speaker 3 (01:00:32):
Also, if you want to follow, is it London Last Yep At
London Last Just?

Speaker 1 (01:00:36):
don't do it he needs some more.
He needs some numbers.
I think he gets to 1600.

Speaker 3 (01:00:41):
Yeah, all right, dude .
Okay, thank you everybody forjoining us.
We'll see you guys next week.

Speaker 1 (01:00:47):
Thank you, see you next week, same time.

Speaker 3 (01:00:50):
Thank you so much for listening to the Unstoppable
Marketer Podcast.
Please go rate and subscribethe podcast, whether it's good
or bad.
We want to hear from youbecause we always want to make
this podcast better.
If you want to get in touchwith me or give me any direct
feedback, please go follow meand get in touch with me.
I am at the Trevor Crump onboth Instagram and TikTok.

(01:01:12):
Thank you, and we will see younext week.