January 17, 2022 • 32 mins
In episode 112, host Eric Dickmann interviews Lindsay Tjepkema. Lindsay is a business leader, speaker, podcaster, and CEO & Co-Founder of Casted- the first and only amplified marketing platform.
With more than 15 years of experience in B2B marketing, Lindsay is a dynamic leader who has had tremendous success building and growing marketing teams on a local and global level. After launching a branded podcast for a global marketing tech company, Lindsay realized her passion for authentic conversations. This passion led her to founding Casted.
Aside from brand marketing, Lindsay is passionate about women empowerment, strong workplace culture, and content marketing that prioritizes audiences over algorithms.
For more information and access to the resources mentioned in this episode, visit:
https://fiveechelon.com/harness-power-podcasting-business-s7ep12/
A fractional CMO can help build out a comprehensive marketing strategy and execute targeted campaigns designed to increase awareness and generate demand for your business...without the expense of a full-time hire.
The Five Echelon Group - Fractional CMO and strategic marketing advisory services designed for SMBs looking to grow. Learn more at:
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Eric Dickmann (00:02):
Welcome to The Virtual CMO podcast.
I'm your host, Eric Dickmann.
In this podcast, we haveconversations with marketing
professionals who share thestrategies, tactics, and mindset
you can use to improve theeffectiveness of your marketing
activities and grow yourbusiness.
Hey, Lindsay, welcome to TheVirtual CMO Podcast.
(00:22):
I'm so glad you could join ustoday.
Lindsay Tjepkema (00:24):
Hey.
And the pleasure is all mine.
This is going to be great.
Thanks for having me.
Eric Dickmann (00:27):
Yes, absolutely.
I've been looking forward tothis conversation because here
we are doing a live stream,recording a podcast, talking
about all things content, andyou're the founder of a company
called Casted, and we're goingto get into exactly what that
means and the services that youprovide.
But I would just love it.
If you could just kick us offhere and tell me a little bit
(00:48):
about your journey, aboutbecoming a founder and starting
a company.
Lindsay Tjepkema (00:52):
Yeah.
So I'm excited to be here too,because this conversation we're
gonna have today really is theessence of why Casted even
exists.
So my background, I spent 15years as a B2B marketer, and it
was always on the brand andcontent, customer experience
side of things.
And right before startingCasted, I was at a company
(01:13):
leading the brand and contentteam globally.
And we were doing podcasts andvideo series much like this, to
connect with our audiences in amuch more human way.
And I quickly found a couple ofthings after rolling out those
shows and the series is that itwas effective, but there was no
platform to serve me, mymarketing team, and what we were
(01:35):
trying to do or measure theimpact we're making on the
business.
And so I made the leap, I wentup to be the change I wanted to
see and go build the thing thatmy team and teams like mine
needed.
And that's how Casted was bornabout two and a half years ago.
Eric Dickmann (01:51):
That's exciting because you know, the best
companies I always think are theones that really address an
unserved need, as opposed tojust building something, a
better version of somethingthat's out there.
And it sounds like that youreally saw that.
When you founded it, what didyou really see as the basic need
that Casted was filling in themarketplace?
Lindsay Tjepkema (02:10):
Yeah.
So yeah I'm trying not to go toofar back or get too much on a
soap box just yet.
But in my career, I saw digitalmarketing kind of entered the
scene with content and moreconnection and more ability to
meet with your audience in realtime.
And that became something thatwas like, okay well, we have all
this stuff, how are we going tomeasure it?
(02:30):
Okay, well now we have data.
How are we going to measurethat?
Everything has to be measurable.
Okay.
Let's optimize for everythingand let's automate everything.
And we kind of got to this placewhere it was like- Okay, are we
actually serving audiencesanymore?
Like, are we actually goingafter that human connection
anymore?
And so that is starting to comearound with shows like this with
(02:51):
more human interaction, withmore connections, more
conversation and deliveringcontent that is not always
written word on page that's SEOoptimized, but like, how can we
provide content that's reallyrich and engaging, it starts
with conversation.
And so that's great and more andmore brands are coming around to
that.
However, again there was no waybefore Casted existed, no amount
(03:14):
of money could buy a platform tosay, how are we going to provide
access to that contentthroughout the marketing org and
to the sales org, and to thecustomer success org until
leadership and throughout theorganization so that you can get
more value out of it.
And how are we gonna measure it?
It's great that the companiesare starting to create more of
this content.
But the problem that we'resolving is saying- Okay, how do
(03:36):
you get as much value out of itas possible?
Because it takes work.
it takes effort to create reallyrich, engaging audio and video
content.
How can you get even more valueout of it?
And then how can you measure theimpact of that value is making?
And so that's what the platformdoes in a nutshell.
Eric Dickmann (03:50):
Well, that's interesting because you know,
we're at a time when there is somuch rich content out there.
You know, we're way past thestage where marketing just
produce brochures that the salesteam would take out on their
customer meetings, right?
Now, you've got this richcontent that's being created.
But I think oftentimes salesteams don't even realize that it
exists or how to use it withinthe sales cycle.
(04:12):
And so that's partially what youguys are trying to solve?
Lindsay Tjepkema (04:15):
Yeah, that's part of it.
So one thing that's kind of funis that one of my co-founders is
more on the sales side.
Like he is our Chief RevenueOfficer now, but his background
as much as mine is in marketing,his is in sales and solutions
consulting.
And so we've been on oppositeside of the table, even at the
same company.
Where it was like, not me and myteam were creating this content
that he and his team eitherdidn't know about it, didn't
(04:35):
feel like it was a fit.
It didn't feel like it wasaligned.
Um, and so that's been a greatpush pull of like, how are we
actually not just saying thatwe're bridging the gap between
sales and marketing, butactually doing it.
And it's not enough to justcreate great content.
How are you making it reallyuseful and accessible to the
people who actually need to useit?
In outside the business ofcourse, but also that internal
(04:57):
audience of sales and customersuccess super important.
Eric Dickmann (05:01):
Well, and I think we're in an era where certainly
webinars continue to beimportant, live streams, Zoom
calls, all of these things.
But as you mentioned, we'redoing a podcast here, we're
doing a live stream.
This is going to be able to formassets, whether they're short
clips or blog posts, but there'sa lot that can be created from
some of the initial sourcematerial.
(05:23):
And I think that's often wheresome of this gets lost because
it can be used in many differentways, it's not just that
original webinar, that originallive stream, or whatnot.
It's content that can berepurposed in many ways.
Lindsay Tjepkema (05:36):
Absolutely.
And so perfect segway into bigpart of what Casted does is say,
how do you take that content newand existing?
So that's another piece of thepuzzle, which is like you
mentioned earlier that there'sso much content.
Once upon a time, creating morewas the challenge.
Like, I don't have enoughcontent, we're not doing enough.
Everybody has enough contentnow.
(05:56):
That's rarely the problem.
Especially, I mean, we workmostly in mid marketing
enterprise.
It's not problem.
It's how do we use what wealready have in myriad ways, not
more for the sake of more, notmore channels from Sycamore
channels, but how do we continueto reach our audience with
meaningful messages both new andexisting.
And so what part of what theplatform does is say- Okay,
(06:16):
you're going to create thiscontent, that's great.
You do you, get creative, lookfor ways to really reach your
audience with conversations andcontent that matters, then you
upload it into this platformthat really exists to serve you
as a marketing team to say-Okay, now what I'm going to do
with it?
Yes,, we're going to publish it.
Yes, we're going to create anexperience on our website that
serves our audience when theycome here and it really gives
(06:37):
them a whole branded experience.
But what else?
How can we use a transcriptthat's created for every
webinar, every virtual event,every live event, every podcast,
every video of a customersuccess story?
How can we use that transcriptto create supplemental written
content, to boost SEO value andaccessibility by making
something that's audio and videoalso readable.
(06:58):
How can we create clips and keytakeaways to break it down into
smaller pieces that can beshared on social media and also
given into the hands of thesales team and the customer
success team to again continueto engage more people and expand
the reach of that content andmore and more, and more.
And then how can I also go backand search through all the
content that they already have?
So if I'm creating content nextquarter about apples, right?
(07:23):
Do I have anything on Apples?
It's a common question that Iwould get all the time from
sales about like, do we haveanything on?
Well, how do you know if you'vehad anything on that?
You know, that Apple content.
In audio or video because it'sall audio and video files until,
until very recently in atelecast.
And you couldn't search throughit all because there was no way
(07:44):
to index everything you haveunless you're going through and
tagging and titling so that itcan be found later.
So it's all about making it moreaccessible, more findable so
that you can do more with this.
It lets marketers be much morecreative with what they're
creating and think less abouthow to index what they have and
provide access to it much moremanually.
Eric Dickmann (08:03):
Well, I'd love to just take that a layer deeper
and let's just use today's showas an example.
So when we're done with today'sinterview, we will have a video
file, an audio file, and atranscript of our interview
today.
So if I was a Casted customer,what would I do with these three
things that then could solvesome of these problems that
(08:23):
you're talking about?
Lindsay Tjepkema (08:24):
Sure.
So if you're a Casted customer,all of those things would be
created from the one file.
So if you uploaded a video file,Casted would separate it into
audio and video so that you haveboth versions.
So you could publish the audioas a podcast, you can publish
the video onto YouTube, all fromCasted.
So that's one, you get it outthere.
Also in Casted, a transcript iscreated, which is human
(08:46):
transcription.
So within a couple of hours, youhave a transcription, it's an
actual human being, so they canactually spell check coma and
don't try to make it into, youknow, something that AI can
identify.
Um, so human level transcriptionthat goes live on that page,
that belongs on your website.
So again, you're invitingpeople, you're owning your
audience.
Yes, you're publishing andsyndicating out to the players
(09:08):
and the YouTube and Spotify, andeverything of the world.
Through Casted, you're alsocreating a page in Casted where
people can come to your site andexperience your brand and your
content related content.
And the transcript was livethere as well.
So now, you've published it,you've syndicated it.
How can you also provide relatedresources and break the content
down further?
So on the back end of Casted,you would go through and
(09:30):
highlight clips in thetranscript that you think are
really important.
So if you and I talk aboutsomething that is really
important for your audience thatyou really want to highlight,
you would literally highlight itin the transcript that creates a
clip and a key takeaway on thatshow page on your website so
people can click around, and ifthey don't have the full hour to
listen or consume that content,they can click just to the part
(09:51):
that matters most.
Um, those clips, that keytakeaways are also downloadable
and accessible on the backend,so you can later on use those
clips, create audiograms fromthem, right in the Casted
platform and videogram so youcan post them on social media,
so people can see our faces asyou're posting about the show,
get it in the hands of yoursales team to say- Hey, you
remember when Lindsay said thatas our customer, she saved all
(10:13):
this money by working with us,like, here's that clip, make
sure you share that and you usethat.
So you can start to see how it'sringing it out and from this one
conversation that we had.
It's atomizing that content.
So it can be used across myriadchannels and over a longer
period of time.
Then what good is all of it ifyou can't measure it.
So back in the dashboard andthrough integrations with CRM,
(10:35):
working foundation platforms andCMS, we make that content
accessible and also measurable.
So we can say not only how manypeople are engaging with this
content now and later inovertime and all the ways that
it's atomized, but who are they?
Who are those people?
Who are the accounts?
Who are the individuals that areengaging with our content?
What are they engaging with?
(10:56):
And then how can I follow up?
Eric Dickmann (10:58):
So it sounds like what you've done is you've
really taken a number of toolsthat you've taken a hosting
platform, you've taken anediting platform, you've taken
something like a headliner thatyou can use to create smaller
clips, you've kind of combinedall of those into one tool.
And then does it go as far asyou know, something like an Uber
Flip where you're creating sortof micro-sites around specific
(11:20):
content topics, that allowssales teams and others to access
this?
Lindsay Tjepkema (11:27):
Yeah.
And that's actually somethingthat we're trialing now
internally, because we obviouslyuse our own platform.
And our own sales team iscreating a kind of an account
based approach.
As you mentioned to say, here'sthis page that I created just
for you or here's a fun use casethat we're doing to do.
Let's say I'm giving you a demoright now of the platform and
(11:48):
I'm showing you all around.
I'm recording it, I put thatinto Casted, I highlight the
things that were most importantto you as key takeaways, I'm
attaching some of the relatedresources, if we're at that
point, even attached to contractright there in that custom built
page, just for you as myprospect to help make that
customized experience.
So, yeah, it's all right therein Casted.
Eric Dickmann (12:09):
No, that's interesting.
And so if I changed roles alittle bit and I'm a
salesperson, so maybe I'minteracting in my HubSpot CRM,
I'm trying to find this contentto be able to share with my
prospects, how does that lookfrom an internal facing user's
point of view?
Lindsay Tjepkema (12:27):
Yeah.
So that search function issomething that I really love for
this use case because again, Iwould get asked all the time and
still you know, do we haveanything on?
Do we have anything on Apples tocontinue that?
how we'll do anything on Apples,like I have customers ask me
about Apples and sure, I'm surethat there's all kinds of shows
and we focus a lot on Applesover time.
(12:49):
So I'm sure that there's tons.
What about that one conversationthat I had with Eric, where that
was totally.
The Virtual CMO, but there wasthis one 30-second clip where
you talked about Apples and itwas gold, but that would be lost
and gone forever, except thefact that everything that's put
into Casted is transcribed.
And so I can just type in Applesand that, and all of the related
(13:14):
keywords will come up andsurface to me, content that's
related to Apples, includingthat tiny little clip that would
have been lasting on forever ifI didn't remember it.
So that's a great place tostart.
And then sales can pull clips,marketing can pull clips for
them, whatever works for theteam and how that works
internally as far as workflows.
But they can then use that clip,download it as an audiogram, and
(13:37):
then that can be eitherembedded.
It can be shared as a socialcard.
It can be shared as like anactual, it's a video file or an
audio file.
So it gives you a lot of optionsas far as how sales wants to use
it, to make that interactionreally personal one really
relevant.
Eric Dickmann (13:55):
Well, I love that because I think one of the big
hindrances to adoption is if youhave a myriad of tools that you
need to go to, to be able to getinformation that can be a real
hindrance to people actuallyusing the tools, right?
If it's in the main tool thatthey're using, if it's in their
sales system, their CRM system,that makes it a whole lot easier
(14:15):
and the chances that they'llactually use it and take
advantage of it, go upsignificantly.
Lindsay Tjepkema (14:21):
Exactly.
Which is why integrations, let'ssee last summer written in the
heights.
I mean, I don't know what theheight was.
But in the early days ofpandemic life, we really leaned
into integrations.
It was okay, none of us knowwhat's coming, let's control
what we can.
Let's really start to lean intointegrations, which was really
strong for us and for ourcustomers, because that's when
we built out, you know, HubSpotintegration and Salesforce,
(14:42):
Marketo, Pardot, Eloqua,WordPress integration with the
Drifts integration, and so manymore to come, because exactly to
your point, for sales and formarketing and for CS, like if I
have to use one more tool, one,it's gonna be frustrating, two.
It's not going to happen becauseI have my workflows and I have
the places that I got and theplaces that I live, right?
(15:03):
And that's as simple as evenlike the difference between a
content marketer and a socialmedia marketer, right?
Social media person is workingin social media and you give
them something else that theyhave to get into that makes
their life easier, it's not,it's one more thing to you.
So why not integrate with wherethey already are, to provide
access to what that content teamis creating.
And so that's where ourintegrations really shine is to
(15:25):
provide that access and thenwhen it matters pulling the data
so that it's actionable likeCRM.
Again, what if I know who isinteracting with my content so
that my SDRs or the accountowner can respond accordingly
and can take action in a waythat's really relevant.
Like, Hey, you know, you haven'tbeen responding to my outreach
for six months but I'm seeingthat there's activity and you're
(15:47):
really consuming a lot ofcontent.
I know that now.
And I can take actionaccordingly.
Eric Dickmann (15:52):
I think that's such a smart strategy.
You know, we talk a lot on thispodcast about the plethora of
tools that are out there, thereare just so many.
But many of them are actuallyfeatures, they're not standalone
tools by themselves.
And I think that there are fartoo many companies who look at
their tool as a platform, andthat really hurts adoption
because if it's not integratedto the main tools that people
(16:14):
are using, the chances of itbecoming you know, one of their
primary tools I think goes way,way down.
And so I think their strategy issmart.
What a great time to do itduring this COVID craziness,
where you had to make somechoices, right?
Lindsay Tjepkema (16:26):
It's true.
And you know, it's alsointeresting because what I found
personally as a marketer, wasthat there's you're right,
there's thousands.
I mean, what's the landscape ofall of the insane tools that
exist and there's thousands andthousands and thousands.
Eric Dickmann (16:42):
Yes.
Lindsay Tjepkema (16:43):
But so many of them actually, they measure the
crumbs of the chaos, right?
They say, okay, here's thisthing, we know your life is
crazy, but what if you canmeasure it
Eric Dickmann (16:55):
Yeah.
Lindsay Tjepkema (16:56):
it's like that, it doesn't help me.
Okay, now I can measure thisinsane thing that's happening or
I can do this insane thingfaster as opposed to saying
like- What if we actuallyapproached this whole thing
differently?
And that's something that'sreally important to me that
we're doing.
We're providing real change, notfor the sake of different and
not because of a marketopportunity, but because it's
time, it's time.
Eric Dickmann (17:18):
Hey, it's Eric here and we'll be right back to
the podcast.
But first, are you ready togrow, scale, and take your
marketing to the next level?
If so, The Five Echelon Group'sVirtual CMO consulting service
may be a great fit for you.
We can help build a strategicmarketing plan for your business
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(17:39):
We'll focus on areas like how toattract more leads.
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How to increase lead conversion,improve your margins, and scale
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To find out more about ourconsulting offerings and
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(18:02):
Services.
Now back to the podcast.
Well, and I love the focus onmeasurement too because as
marketers, we all know this is achallenge, right?
People are constantly wanting tosee that ROI.
They're wanting to see that themoney is being well-spent, that
it's driving results.
But sometimes things take time.
I know if we're talking aboutpodcasts as an example, you
(18:25):
know, podcasts grow slowly.
Yeah.
You have your initial set ofdownloads when you release a new
episode.
But my whole back catalog goesup, you know, every month.
It's not just the latest episodethat goes up.
And so for a marketer, are youfinding that the clients that
you're engaging with that thatis really one of the primary
drivers to being on a platformlike this?
(18:46):
That they just don't have a wayof measuring it, and this
measurement can really help themprove the value of what they're
doing?
Lindsay Tjepkema (18:52):
Yeah, definitely.
That is one of the reasons we doget often is people that are
interested and obviouslyultimately come on board is I
need to know more.
And another thing that's tied tothat, that we see people getting
excited about is when a podcastfor example is seen as a
standalone channel and its ownthing.
(19:15):
It's reach is limited, itsmeasurement is limited.
Like what does it mean?
What do those downloads mean?
when it's seen as an integratedpart of a comprehensive strategy
and it can actually fueleverything else, and it's all in
one place, that changes thenarrative entirely, it's not
like, okay, we have our contentstrategy and a marketing
(19:35):
strategy over here and yourpodcast, you know?
And like, oh let's also tweetabout podcasts and then it kind
of pulls it in.
It's like, no, what if weactually use the podcast or the
webinars series or whatever itmight be, or all of the above to
actually fuel everything out.
You know, when we were talkingearlier, I was talking about the
workflow about this, then this,then this, then this, it's the
(19:56):
starting point.
The conversations that you'rehaving right now, that's the
starting point to everythingelse.
And why shouldn't it be, right?
And you talked aboutmeasurement.
Absolutely.
That needs to be measurable, notjust in quantity, but of who?
Not just how many, but who isactually engaging?
(20:17):
Are they loyal?
Are they really interested incoming back over time?
Even if your audience is reallysmall, small relatively
speaking.
If it's the right people andthey're super engaged, perhaps,
you know, depending on what yourneeds are and what you're doing,
that's the best way to go.
And you don't know, you justdon't know that when you're just
looking at number of downloadsor number of views,
Eric Dickmann (20:36):
Well, that's always a frustrating thing for
podcasters in particular isthat's the number you see.
You see downloads, you can tellwhat platform they're
downloading from, you can seewhat country they're coming
from.
But you don't really know.
If you're reaching your targetaudience or not, because you
just don't have that kind ofdemographic data where that
tends to come in is thesupplemental content when you
drive people back to yourwebsite, when they download, you
(20:59):
know, the tracking pixels takeeffect and you can sort of see
who's coming back and howthey're engaging, then you get a
little bit better sense of that.
But it's a real challenge forpeople like podcasters.
Lindsay Tjepkema (21:08):
Yeah.
And not to know anything aboutwho until they're on their
second engagement with you.
I mean, that's pretty risky,right?
And so some of the ways that wesolve for that is by one, being
a player, and so that gives us alot more capability to capture
information and pass it back toour customers.
(21:29):
By advocating that players aregreat.
Yes, Apple, Spotify, YouTube,those are great, those are
fantastic.
But what if you could also ownyour audience and bring people
to your website as much aspossible, then that unlocks a
ton of more data because you'renot at the mercy of whatever
those big players want toshare.Three, through that
(21:50):
integration with CRM, ifsomebody is in your data
database, You know then howthey're interacting with your
content because we're able toprovide that information.
And then we have some thingsthat we're actually rolling out
within the next early next year,that will go even further to
say, what if somebody shows upanonymously and then we can
still provide, you know, whataccount they're with and who
they are, and how they'reinteracting with your content,
(22:12):
which is very exciting.
Eric Dickmann (22:13):
Yeah, that is exciting because you know it is
a challenge for podcasters Ithink, where do you send people?
Do you send them to Apple, doyou send them to Spotify, do you
send them to your blog pagethat's got an embedded player.
And I think you know thedownloads, at least right now
show that people are mostly onApple and Spotify, you know,
that's kind of been split, 5050, if you will, just depending
(22:33):
on your niche.
I think Apple is far moreprevalent for business podcasts,
I think Spotify may be for someothers.
But you know, it does eliminatea lot of the tracking
capabilities if you're going tosomebody else's tool.
If you can get them to play iton your own website or your
through your own player, you'vegot a lot more capability of
understanding who that audienceis.
Lindsay Tjepkema (22:53):
Exactly.
And so what I always say is,look, yes, again, Apple,
Spotify, YouTube, anywhere else.
Yes, a hundred percent, it's afree, relatively speaking, free.
What are you actually gettingup?
But as far as my money isconcerned, it's free.
Why in the world wouldn't youuse it?
But when you have theopportunity to share a link and
say- Come, listen, consume mypodcast, watch my show, send
(23:16):
them to your own real estate,send them to your own website.
Otherwise, if you're sendingpeople away, you wouldn't do
that with any other content.
You wouldn't say, you know, Ihave this really great blog
post, it's over here.
I mean, we see it.
We see that once in a while,
Eric Dickmann (23:29):
Hmmm.
Lindsay Tjepkema (23:29):
In certain situations, but like generally
speaking, I have this reallygreat article, I have this
really great blog post come readit on my site.
Like that's the whole point isto get people to come to you so
that you can, yes, I meanthere's data and there's all
that stuff.
But when you're thinking aboutthe humans involved, so you can
provide a better experience,right?
You can really own thatexperience.
And you can say, this is whatwe're doing, this is what we
(23:50):
have for you, this is why wethink you're going to like it,
here's some other ways that youcan interact with this, by the
way, here's a way that you caninteract with us to do that.
Also with B2B podcasting, yes.
If you're into true crime or youwant to have a cooking podcast
or something that you reallylike, listening to it, watching
that content on a player like aYouTube or Apple, Spotify that
(24:13):
makes sense cause it's morediscoverable,
Eric Dickmann (24:16):
Yeah.
Lindsay Tjepkema (24:16):
But quite often when you are in a B2B
situation and you're looking foreducation on something, you're
trying to make a buyingdecision, your educating
yourself on how to do somethingbetter or best practice, you're
typically going to search forit.
And so if you can optimize froman SEO perspective that content
to be found and bring people toyour site, that's the ideal,
(24:39):
right?
So again, yes, use the playersto expand your reach, but
ultimately at the end of theday, set up a place where people
will want to consume yourcontent on your site and direct
people there.
Eric Dickmann (24:50):
I think that's such a great point because you
know, I encourage businesses allthe time to go into podcasting.
It's a very inexpensive mediumto get started, it can have
significant effects on yourbusiness, driving traffic to
your website, but don't go inunder the delusion, if you will,
that you are going to have a Top10 podcast.
Chances are it's not going tohappen.
Especially, Business to Businesspodcasts, they're too niche.
(25:13):
There's a very small audiencefor those, but that doesn't mean
that it's not a worthwhileendeavor.
But ultimately you have to thinkabout what the goal of it is.
The goal of it is to drivetraffic back to your own
website, not to show up anApple's Top 10 list.
Lindsay Tjepkema (25:27):
Right, yeah.
Unless that's your goal.
And then what?
Like, okay, you did it.
what's it doing for thebusiness, right?
Um, Yeah, a hundred percent.
Couldn't agree more.
Eric Dickmann (25:36):
So for many businesses, you know, we tend to
target small and mid-sizedbusinesses on this show, mostly
in the B2B space.
If they really haven't embraceda strategy around audio content,
around video content, when youlook out at the marketplace,
when you deal with yourcustomers, and I know you go
from that up to the enterprisecustomers, what do you see as
some of the trends?
(25:57):
Where is this going?
What do you see sort ofunfolding as we look forward to
2022 and beyond?
Lindsay Tjepkema (26:03):
Yeah.
One thing that I am excitedabout, and also I'm nervous
about, the marketer in me feelsthe pressure is that the
Netflixization, the Disneyplusization of the world is
liberal consumers, right?
The bar is higher than it's everbeen for what is great content,
(26:26):
and the bar isn't any differentfor B2B.
It's not any different for smallbusiness or the enterprise.
People want good, people wantgreat content.
And that doesn't mean expensivealways.
It doesn't mean high productionvalue, it doesn't even need
expensive as far as time, right?
It just means good.
It means if you're going to do apodcast, yeah, it can be a low
(26:48):
barrier to entry.
But make sure you're having goodconversations with people who
are relevant to your audience,right?
And make sure the quality is asgood as it can be for you and
for what you're doing.
The bar is higher than ever.
And so what I'm seeing happeningand I'm excited about is
marketers thinking a lot morecreatively again, I think we all
(27:10):
have this opportunity to getcreative, more creative again,
and our teams can.
And so it's like, what could wedo?
And how could we do this?
And I'm really inspired by thisand what if we went this
direction?
So let your team go there, letyourself go there, let your team
go there and get more creative,and then look for ways to
optimize it, right?
So if you're going to make moreof an investment in the creation
of content, creating really goodcontent, because you have to if
(27:33):
you're going to engage with youraudience.
How are you going to reap therewards?
How are you going to recoup thatinvestment by getting more value
out of every piece that you docreate?
So if you are thinking quantitywise instead of doing 50 pieces
of good content, you do sixpieces of really great content.
You've gotta be sure that youget a lot of value out of it.
(27:53):
So your podcast doesn't have tobe six episodes a week, you
know?
It doesn't even have to beweekly, just make sure it's
really good, and that you'regetting as much value out as
possible.
Eric Dickmann (28:02):
We are absolutely in a creator economy.
I look and see some of the stuffthat gets posted on Instagram,
TikTok, you know, thesechannels, and people do a
fantastic job.
You're absolutely right, the barhas been raised.
And it's not to say thateverybody is looking at those
channels, maybe with the sameway that sort of younger people
are, but that's going tocontinue to filter up, right?
And the bar is being raised andyou have to go for that quality.
(28:26):
A substandard stuff is just notgoing to get people's attention.
So I think that's an excellentpoint.
But the good thing is just inpower that you have on your
phone, you can create someamazing content without a big
investment.
Lindsay Tjepkema (28:39):
It's true.
It's absolutely true.
And people are you know, listento it,.
Whether you or your marketingteam or you have a marketing
team, people are creative, youknow?
And when we give ourselves thespace to think about- Hey, what
do we want to do?
Not, how are we gonna optimize?
How are we gonna do more?
How are we going to outbreak thecompetition?
How are we going to gain thealgorithms?
Like when we stop thinking thatway and say- what would be fun?
(29:02):
And what would our audiencethink is fun?
And what would really engage ouraudience?
Like go there and then thinkabout how you're going to get
more value out of it.
How are you going to use it?
Eric Dickmann (29:10):
Well, I think this circles back to where we
started really talking aboutpersonalization and talking to
your audience.
And I think if you can beauthentic, you can deliver a
real message about what you'rebringing to the marketplace,
have really interestingconversations that your audience
is going to embrace, that's wellworth your time.
Lindsay Tjepkema (29:30):
Exactly, exactly.
Authenticity will get you a longway.
Eric Dickmann (29:34):
Lindsey.
I think this is great.
This is one of my favoritetopics to talk about.
I'd love it if you could justshare with the audience a little
bit more where they can find outinformation about you and about
Casted as well.
Lindsay Tjepkema (29:44):
Sounds great.
casted.us is Casted's website.
And that's where you can findall kinds of great content from
us about who we are and what wedo, and also our podcast and
video series, multiple of thoseto dig deeper into this whole
concept that we're talkingabout.
I am also really active onLinkedIn.
If you can figure out how tospell my name, you can find me
(30:04):
there in Twitter and Instagram.
So yeah, I and we are easy tofind.
Eric Dickmann (30:09):
As the kids say, all the socials, right?
Lindsay Tjepkema (30:11):
In all the socials.
Eric Dickmann (30:13):
In all the socials.
Yeah, that's right.
I'll make sure that we have allthat linked up in the show notes
so that people can find it andspell your name correctly.
Lindsay, this has been a greatconversation, excited about what
you guys are doing over atCasted.
It sounds like a great solutionto a real problem and an
opportunity for many businessesas well.
So thank you so much for takingthe time to be on the show
today.
I really have enjoyed it.
Lindsay Tjepkema (30:33):
Thank you so much for the conversation.
This is great.
Eric Dickmann (30:38):
Thank you for joining us on this episode of
The Virtual CMO podcast.
For more episodes, go tofiveechelon.com/podcast to
subscribe through your podcastplayer of choice.
And if you'd like to developconsistent lead flow and a
highly effective marketingstrategy, visit fiveechelon.com
to learn more about our VirtualCMO consulting services.
Welcome to The Virtual CMO podcast.
I'm your host, Eric Dickmann.
In this podcast, we haveconversations with marketing
professionals who share thestrategies, tactics, and mindset
you can use to improve theeffectiveness of your marketing
activities and grow yourbusiness.
Hey, Lindsay, welcome to TheVirtual CMO Podcast.
(00:22):
I'm so glad you could join ustoday.
Lindsay Tjepkema (00:24):
Hey.
And the pleasure is all mine.
This is going to be great.
Thanks for having me.
Eric Dickmann (00:27):
Yes, absolutely.
I've been looking forward tothis conversation because here
we are doing a live stream,recording a podcast, talking
about all things content, andyou're the founder of a company
called Casted, and we're goingto get into exactly what that
means and the services that youprovide.
But I would just love it.
If you could just kick us offhere and tell me a little bit
(00:48):
about your journey, aboutbecoming a founder and starting
a company.
Lindsay Tjepkema (00:52):
Yeah.
So I'm excited to be here too,because this conversation we're
gonna have today really is theessence of why Casted even
exists.
So my background, I spent 15years as a B2B marketer, and it
was always on the brand andcontent, customer experience
side of things.
And right before startingCasted, I was at a company
(01:13):
leading the brand and contentteam globally.
And we were doing podcasts andvideo series much like this, to
connect with our audiences in amuch more human way.
And I quickly found a couple ofthings after rolling out those
shows and the series is that itwas effective, but there was no
platform to serve me, mymarketing team, and what we were
(01:35):
trying to do or measure theimpact we're making on the
business.
And so I made the leap, I wentup to be the change I wanted to
see and go build the thing thatmy team and teams like mine
needed.
And that's how Casted was bornabout two and a half years ago.
Eric Dickmann (01:51):
That's exciting because you know, the best
companies I always think are theones that really address an
unserved need, as opposed tojust building something, a
better version of somethingthat's out there.
And it sounds like that youreally saw that.
When you founded it, what didyou really see as the basic need
that Casted was filling in themarketplace?
Lindsay Tjepkema (02:10):
Yeah.
So yeah I'm trying not to go toofar back or get too much on a
soap box just yet.
But in my career, I saw digitalmarketing kind of entered the
scene with content and moreconnection and more ability to
meet with your audience in realtime.
And that became something thatwas like, okay well, we have all
this stuff, how are we going tomeasure it?
(02:30):
Okay, well now we have data.
How are we going to measurethat?
Everything has to be measurable.
Okay.
Let's optimize for everythingand let's automate everything.
And we kind of got to this placewhere it was like- Okay, are we
actually serving audiencesanymore?
Like, are we actually goingafter that human connection
anymore?
And so that is starting to comearound with shows like this with
(02:51):
more human interaction, withmore connections, more
conversation and deliveringcontent that is not always
written word on page that's SEOoptimized, but like, how can we
provide content that's reallyrich and engaging, it starts
with conversation.
And so that's great and more andmore brands are coming around to
that.
However, again there was no waybefore Casted existed, no amount
(03:14):
of money could buy a platform tosay, how are we going to provide
access to that contentthroughout the marketing org and
to the sales org, and to thecustomer success org until
leadership and throughout theorganization so that you can get
more value out of it.
And how are we gonna measure it?
It's great that the companiesare starting to create more of
this content.
But the problem that we'resolving is saying- Okay, how do
(03:36):
you get as much value out of itas possible?
Because it takes work.
it takes effort to create reallyrich, engaging audio and video
content.
How can you get even more valueout of it?
And then how can you measure theimpact of that value is making?
And so that's what the platformdoes in a nutshell.
Eric Dickmann (03:50):
Well, that's interesting because you know,
we're at a time when there is somuch rich content out there.
You know, we're way past thestage where marketing just
produce brochures that the salesteam would take out on their
customer meetings, right?
Now, you've got this richcontent that's being created.
But I think oftentimes salesteams don't even realize that it
exists or how to use it withinthe sales cycle.
(04:12):
And so that's partially what youguys are trying to solve?
Lindsay Tjepkema (04:15):
Yeah, that's part of it.
So one thing that's kind of funis that one of my co-founders is
more on the sales side.
Like he is our Chief RevenueOfficer now, but his background
as much as mine is in marketing,his is in sales and solutions
consulting.
And so we've been on oppositeside of the table, even at the
same company.
Where it was like, not me and myteam were creating this content
that he and his team eitherdidn't know about it, didn't
(04:35):
feel like it was a fit.
It didn't feel like it wasaligned.
Um, and so that's been a greatpush pull of like, how are we
actually not just saying thatwe're bridging the gap between
sales and marketing, butactually doing it.
And it's not enough to justcreate great content.
How are you making it reallyuseful and accessible to the
people who actually need to useit?
In outside the business ofcourse, but also that internal
(04:57):
audience of sales and customersuccess super important.
Eric Dickmann (05:01):
Well, and I think we're in an era where certainly
webinars continue to beimportant, live streams, Zoom
calls, all of these things.
But as you mentioned, we'redoing a podcast here, we're
doing a live stream.
This is going to be able to formassets, whether they're short
clips or blog posts, but there'sa lot that can be created from
some of the initial sourcematerial.
(05:23):
And I think that's often wheresome of this gets lost because
it can be used in many differentways, it's not just that
original webinar, that originallive stream, or whatnot.
It's content that can berepurposed in many ways.
Lindsay Tjepkema (05:36):
Absolutely.
And so perfect segway into bigpart of what Casted does is say,
how do you take that content newand existing?
So that's another piece of thepuzzle, which is like you
mentioned earlier that there'sso much content.
Once upon a time, creating morewas the challenge.
Like, I don't have enoughcontent, we're not doing enough.
Everybody has enough contentnow.
(05:56):
That's rarely the problem.
Especially, I mean, we workmostly in mid marketing
enterprise.
It's not problem.
It's how do we use what wealready have in myriad ways, not
more for the sake of more, notmore channels from Sycamore
channels, but how do we continueto reach our audience with
meaningful messages both new andexisting.
And so what part of what theplatform does is say- Okay,
(06:16):
you're going to create thiscontent, that's great.
You do you, get creative, lookfor ways to really reach your
audience with conversations andcontent that matters, then you
upload it into this platformthat really exists to serve you
as a marketing team to say-Okay, now what I'm going to do
with it?
Yes,, we're going to publish it.
Yes, we're going to create anexperience on our website that
serves our audience when theycome here and it really gives
(06:37):
them a whole branded experience.
But what else?
How can we use a transcriptthat's created for every
webinar, every virtual event,every live event, every podcast,
every video of a customersuccess story?
How can we use that transcriptto create supplemental written
content, to boost SEO value andaccessibility by making
something that's audio and videoalso readable.
(06:58):
How can we create clips and keytakeaways to break it down into
smaller pieces that can beshared on social media and also
given into the hands of thesales team and the customer
success team to again continueto engage more people and expand
the reach of that content andmore and more, and more.
And then how can I also go backand search through all the
content that they already have?
So if I'm creating content nextquarter about apples, right?
(07:23):
Do I have anything on Apples?
It's a common question that Iwould get all the time from
sales about like, do we haveanything on?
Well, how do you know if you'vehad anything on that?
You know, that Apple content.
In audio or video because it'sall audio and video files until,
until very recently in atelecast.
And you couldn't search throughit all because there was no way
(07:44):
to index everything you haveunless you're going through and
tagging and titling so that itcan be found later.
So it's all about making it moreaccessible, more findable so
that you can do more with this.
It lets marketers be much morecreative with what they're
creating and think less abouthow to index what they have and
provide access to it much moremanually.
Eric Dickmann (08:03):
Well, I'd love to just take that a layer deeper
and let's just use today's showas an example.
So when we're done with today'sinterview, we will have a video
file, an audio file, and atranscript of our interview
today.
So if I was a Casted customer,what would I do with these three
things that then could solvesome of these problems that
(08:23):
you're talking about?
Lindsay Tjepkema (08:24):
Sure.
So if you're a Casted customer,all of those things would be
created from the one file.
So if you uploaded a video file,Casted would separate it into
audio and video so that you haveboth versions.
So you could publish the audioas a podcast, you can publish
the video onto YouTube, all fromCasted.
So that's one, you get it outthere.
Also in Casted, a transcript iscreated, which is human
(08:46):
transcription.
So within a couple of hours, youhave a transcription, it's an
actual human being, so they canactually spell check coma and
don't try to make it into, youknow, something that AI can
identify.
Um, so human level transcriptionthat goes live on that page,
that belongs on your website.
So again, you're invitingpeople, you're owning your
audience.
Yes, you're publishing andsyndicating out to the players
(09:08):
and the YouTube and Spotify, andeverything of the world.
Through Casted, you're alsocreating a page in Casted where
people can come to your site andexperience your brand and your
content related content.
And the transcript was livethere as well.
So now, you've published it,you've syndicated it.
How can you also provide relatedresources and break the content
down further?
So on the back end of Casted,you would go through and
(09:30):
highlight clips in thetranscript that you think are
really important.
So if you and I talk aboutsomething that is really
important for your audience thatyou really want to highlight,
you would literally highlight itin the transcript that creates a
clip and a key takeaway on thatshow page on your website so
people can click around, and ifthey don't have the full hour to
listen or consume that content,they can click just to the part
(09:51):
that matters most.
Um, those clips, that keytakeaways are also downloadable
and accessible on the backend,so you can later on use those
clips, create audiograms fromthem, right in the Casted
platform and videogram so youcan post them on social media,
so people can see our faces asyou're posting about the show,
get it in the hands of yoursales team to say- Hey, you
remember when Lindsay said thatas our customer, she saved all
(10:13):
this money by working with us,like, here's that clip, make
sure you share that and you usethat.
So you can start to see how it'sringing it out and from this one
conversation that we had.
It's atomizing that content.
So it can be used across myriadchannels and over a longer
period of time.
Then what good is all of it ifyou can't measure it.
So back in the dashboard andthrough integrations with CRM,
(10:35):
working foundation platforms andCMS, we make that content
accessible and also measurable.
So we can say not only how manypeople are engaging with this
content now and later inovertime and all the ways that
it's atomized, but who are they?
Who are those people?
Who are the accounts?
Who are the individuals that areengaging with our content?
What are they engaging with?
(10:56):
And then how can I follow up?
Eric Dickmann (10:58):
So it sounds like what you've done is you've
really taken a number of toolsthat you've taken a hosting
platform, you've taken anediting platform, you've taken
something like a headliner thatyou can use to create smaller
clips, you've kind of combinedall of those into one tool.
And then does it go as far asyou know, something like an Uber
Flip where you're creating sortof micro-sites around specific
(11:20):
content topics, that allowssales teams and others to access
this?
Lindsay Tjepkema (11:27):
Yeah.
And that's actually somethingthat we're trialing now
internally, because we obviouslyuse our own platform.
And our own sales team iscreating a kind of an account
based approach.
As you mentioned to say, here'sthis page that I created just
for you or here's a fun use casethat we're doing to do.
Let's say I'm giving you a demoright now of the platform and
(11:48):
I'm showing you all around.
I'm recording it, I put thatinto Casted, I highlight the
things that were most importantto you as key takeaways, I'm
attaching some of the relatedresources, if we're at that
point, even attached to contractright there in that custom built
page, just for you as myprospect to help make that
customized experience.
So, yeah, it's all right therein Casted.
Eric Dickmann (12:09):
No, that's interesting.
And so if I changed roles alittle bit and I'm a
salesperson, so maybe I'minteracting in my HubSpot CRM,
I'm trying to find this contentto be able to share with my
prospects, how does that lookfrom an internal facing user's
point of view?
Lindsay Tjepkema (12:27):
Yeah.
So that search function issomething that I really love for
this use case because again, Iwould get asked all the time and
still you know, do we haveanything on?
Do we have anything on Apples tocontinue that?
how we'll do anything on Apples,like I have customers ask me
about Apples and sure, I'm surethat there's all kinds of shows
and we focus a lot on Applesover time.
(12:49):
So I'm sure that there's tons.
What about that one conversationthat I had with Eric, where that
was totally.
The Virtual CMO, but there wasthis one 30-second clip where
you talked about Apples and itwas gold, but that would be lost
and gone forever, except thefact that everything that's put
into Casted is transcribed.
And so I can just type in Applesand that, and all of the related
(13:14):
keywords will come up andsurface to me, content that's
related to Apples, includingthat tiny little clip that would
have been lasting on forever ifI didn't remember it.
So that's a great place tostart.
And then sales can pull clips,marketing can pull clips for
them, whatever works for theteam and how that works
internally as far as workflows.
But they can then use that clip,download it as an audiogram, and
(13:37):
then that can be eitherembedded.
It can be shared as a socialcard.
It can be shared as like anactual, it's a video file or an
audio file.
So it gives you a lot of optionsas far as how sales wants to use
it, to make that interactionreally personal one really
relevant.
Eric Dickmann (13:55):
Well, I love that because I think one of the big
hindrances to adoption is if youhave a myriad of tools that you
need to go to, to be able to getinformation that can be a real
hindrance to people actuallyusing the tools, right?
If it's in the main tool thatthey're using, if it's in their
sales system, their CRM system,that makes it a whole lot easier
(14:15):
and the chances that they'llactually use it and take
advantage of it, go upsignificantly.
Lindsay Tjepkema (14:21):
Exactly.
Which is why integrations, let'ssee last summer written in the
heights.
I mean, I don't know what theheight was.
But in the early days ofpandemic life, we really leaned
into integrations.
It was okay, none of us knowwhat's coming, let's control
what we can.
Let's really start to lean intointegrations, which was really
strong for us and for ourcustomers, because that's when
we built out, you know, HubSpotintegration and Salesforce,
(14:42):
Marketo, Pardot, Eloqua,WordPress integration with the
Drifts integration, and so manymore to come, because exactly to
your point, for sales and formarketing and for CS, like if I
have to use one more tool, one,it's gonna be frustrating, two.
It's not going to happen becauseI have my workflows and I have
the places that I got and theplaces that I live, right?
(15:03):
And that's as simple as evenlike the difference between a
content marketer and a socialmedia marketer, right?
Social media person is workingin social media and you give
them something else that theyhave to get into that makes
their life easier, it's not,it's one more thing to you.
So why not integrate with wherethey already are, to provide
access to what that content teamis creating.
And so that's where ourintegrations really shine is to
(15:25):
provide that access and thenwhen it matters pulling the data
so that it's actionable likeCRM.
Again, what if I know who isinteracting with my content so
that my SDRs or the accountowner can respond accordingly
and can take action in a waythat's really relevant.
Like, Hey, you know, you haven'tbeen responding to my outreach
for six months but I'm seeingthat there's activity and you're
(15:47):
really consuming a lot ofcontent.
I know that now.
And I can take actionaccordingly.
Eric Dickmann (15:52):
I think that's such a smart strategy.
You know, we talk a lot on thispodcast about the plethora of
tools that are out there, thereare just so many.
But many of them are actuallyfeatures, they're not standalone
tools by themselves.
And I think that there are fartoo many companies who look at
their tool as a platform, andthat really hurts adoption
because if it's not integratedto the main tools that people
(16:14):
are using, the chances of itbecoming you know, one of their
primary tools I think goes way,way down.
And so I think their strategy issmart.
What a great time to do itduring this COVID craziness,
where you had to make somechoices, right?
Lindsay Tjepkema (16:26):
It's true.
And you know, it's alsointeresting because what I found
personally as a marketer, wasthat there's you're right,
there's thousands.
I mean, what's the landscape ofall of the insane tools that
exist and there's thousands andthousands and thousands.
Eric Dickmann (16:42):
Yes.
Lindsay Tjepkema (16:43):
But so many of them actually, they measure the
crumbs of the chaos, right?
They say, okay, here's thisthing, we know your life is
crazy, but what if you canmeasure it
Eric Dickmann (16:55):
Yeah.
Lindsay Tjepkema (16:56):
it's like that, it doesn't help me.
Okay, now I can measure thisinsane thing that's happening or
I can do this insane thingfaster as opposed to saying
like- What if we actuallyapproached this whole thing
differently?
And that's something that'sreally important to me that
we're doing.
We're providing real change, notfor the sake of different and
not because of a marketopportunity, but because it's
time, it's time.
Eric Dickmann (17:18):
Hey, it's Eric here and we'll be right back to
the podcast.
But first, are you ready togrow, scale, and take your
marketing to the next level?
If so, The Five Echelon Group'sVirtual CMO consulting service
may be a great fit for you.
We can help build a strategicmarketing plan for your business
and manage its execution,step-by-step.
(17:39):
We'll focus on areas like how toattract more leads.
How to create compellingmessaging that resonates with
your ideal customers.
How to strategically package andposition your products and
services.
How to increase lead conversion,improve your margins, and scale
your business.
To find out more about ourconsulting offerings and
schedule a consultation, go tofiveechelon.com and click on
(18:02):
Services.
Now back to the podcast.
Well, and I love the focus onmeasurement too because as
marketers, we all know this is achallenge, right?
People are constantly wanting tosee that ROI.
They're wanting to see that themoney is being well-spent, that
it's driving results.
But sometimes things take time.
I know if we're talking aboutpodcasts as an example, you
(18:25):
know, podcasts grow slowly.
Yeah.
You have your initial set ofdownloads when you release a new
episode.
But my whole back catalog goesup, you know, every month.
It's not just the latest episodethat goes up.
And so for a marketer, are youfinding that the clients that
you're engaging with that thatis really one of the primary
drivers to being on a platformlike this?
(18:46):
That they just don't have a wayof measuring it, and this
measurement can really help themprove the value of what they're
doing?
Lindsay Tjepkema (18:52):
Yeah, definitely.
That is one of the reasons we doget often is people that are
interested and obviouslyultimately come on board is I
need to know more.
And another thing that's tied tothat, that we see people getting
excited about is when a podcastfor example is seen as a
standalone channel and its ownthing.
(19:15):
It's reach is limited, itsmeasurement is limited.
Like what does it mean?
What do those downloads mean?
when it's seen as an integratedpart of a comprehensive strategy
and it can actually fueleverything else, and it's all in
one place, that changes thenarrative entirely, it's not
like, okay, we have our contentstrategy and a marketing
(19:35):
strategy over here and yourpodcast, you know?
And like, oh let's also tweetabout podcasts and then it kind
of pulls it in.
It's like, no, what if weactually use the podcast or the
webinars series or whatever itmight be, or all of the above to
actually fuel everything out.
You know, when we were talkingearlier, I was talking about the
workflow about this, then this,then this, then this, it's the
(19:56):
starting point.
The conversations that you'rehaving right now, that's the
starting point to everythingelse.
And why shouldn't it be, right?
And you talked aboutmeasurement.
Absolutely.
That needs to be measurable, notjust in quantity, but of who?
Not just how many, but who isactually engaging?
(20:17):
Are they loyal?
Are they really interested incoming back over time?
Even if your audience is reallysmall, small relatively
speaking.
If it's the right people andthey're super engaged, perhaps,
you know, depending on what yourneeds are and what you're doing,
that's the best way to go.
And you don't know, you justdon't know that when you're just
looking at number of downloadsor number of views,
Eric Dickmann (20:36):
Well, that's always a frustrating thing for
podcasters in particular isthat's the number you see.
You see downloads, you can tellwhat platform they're
downloading from, you can seewhat country they're coming
from.
But you don't really know.
If you're reaching your targetaudience or not, because you
just don't have that kind ofdemographic data where that
tends to come in is thesupplemental content when you
drive people back to yourwebsite, when they download, you
(20:59):
know, the tracking pixels takeeffect and you can sort of see
who's coming back and howthey're engaging, then you get a
little bit better sense of that.
But it's a real challenge forpeople like podcasters.
Lindsay Tjepkema (21:08):
Yeah.
And not to know anything aboutwho until they're on their
second engagement with you.
I mean, that's pretty risky,right?
And so some of the ways that wesolve for that is by one, being
a player, and so that gives us alot more capability to capture
information and pass it back toour customers.
(21:29):
By advocating that players aregreat.
Yes, Apple, Spotify, YouTube,those are great, those are
fantastic.
But what if you could also ownyour audience and bring people
to your website as much aspossible, then that unlocks a
ton of more data because you'renot at the mercy of whatever
those big players want toshare.Three, through that
(21:50):
integration with CRM, ifsomebody is in your data
database, You know then howthey're interacting with your
content because we're able toprovide that information.
And then we have some thingsthat we're actually rolling out
within the next early next year,that will go even further to
say, what if somebody shows upanonymously and then we can
still provide, you know, whataccount they're with and who
they are, and how they'reinteracting with your content,
(22:12):
which is very exciting.
Eric Dickmann (22:13):
Yeah, that is exciting because you know it is
a challenge for podcasters Ithink, where do you send people?
Do you send them to Apple, doyou send them to Spotify, do you
send them to your blog pagethat's got an embedded player.
And I think you know thedownloads, at least right now
show that people are mostly onApple and Spotify, you know,
that's kind of been split, 5050, if you will, just depending
(22:33):
on your niche.
I think Apple is far moreprevalent for business podcasts,
I think Spotify may be for someothers.
But you know, it does eliminatea lot of the tracking
capabilities if you're going tosomebody else's tool.
If you can get them to play iton your own website or your
through your own player, you'vegot a lot more capability of
understanding who that audienceis.
Lindsay Tjepkema (22:53):
Exactly.
And so what I always say is,look, yes, again, Apple,
Spotify, YouTube, anywhere else.
Yes, a hundred percent, it's afree, relatively speaking, free.
What are you actually gettingup?
But as far as my money isconcerned, it's free.
Why in the world wouldn't youuse it?
But when you have theopportunity to share a link and
say- Come, listen, consume mypodcast, watch my show, send
(23:16):
them to your own real estate,send them to your own website.
Otherwise, if you're sendingpeople away, you wouldn't do
that with any other content.
You wouldn't say, you know, Ihave this really great blog
post, it's over here.
I mean, we see it.
We see that once in a while,
Eric Dickmann (23:29):
Hmmm.
Lindsay Tjepkema (23:29):
In certain situations, but like generally
speaking, I have this reallygreat article, I have this
really great blog post come readit on my site.
Like that's the whole point isto get people to come to you so
that you can, yes, I meanthere's data and there's all
that stuff.
But when you're thinking aboutthe humans involved, so you can
provide a better experience,right?
You can really own thatexperience.
And you can say, this is whatwe're doing, this is what we
(23:50):
have for you, this is why wethink you're going to like it,
here's some other ways that youcan interact with this, by the
way, here's a way that you caninteract with us to do that.
Also with B2B podcasting, yes.
If you're into true crime or youwant to have a cooking podcast
or something that you reallylike, listening to it, watching
that content on a player like aYouTube or Apple, Spotify that
(24:13):
makes sense cause it's morediscoverable,
Eric Dickmann (24:16):
Yeah.
Lindsay Tjepkema (24:16):
But quite often when you are in a B2B
situation and you're looking foreducation on something, you're
trying to make a buyingdecision, your educating
yourself on how to do somethingbetter or best practice, you're
typically going to search forit.
And so if you can optimize froman SEO perspective that content
to be found and bring people toyour site, that's the ideal,
(24:39):
right?
So again, yes, use the playersto expand your reach, but
ultimately at the end of theday, set up a place where people
will want to consume yourcontent on your site and direct
people there.
Eric Dickmann (24:50):
I think that's such a great point because you
know, I encourage businesses allthe time to go into podcasting.
It's a very inexpensive mediumto get started, it can have
significant effects on yourbusiness, driving traffic to
your website, but don't go inunder the delusion, if you will,
that you are going to have a Top10 podcast.
Chances are it's not going tohappen.
Especially, Business to Businesspodcasts, they're too niche.
(25:13):
There's a very small audiencefor those, but that doesn't mean
that it's not a worthwhileendeavor.
But ultimately you have to thinkabout what the goal of it is.
The goal of it is to drivetraffic back to your own
website, not to show up anApple's Top 10 list.
Lindsay Tjepkema (25:27):
Right, yeah.
Unless that's your goal.
And then what?
Like, okay, you did it.
what's it doing for thebusiness, right?
Um, Yeah, a hundred percent.
Couldn't agree more.
Eric Dickmann (25:36):
So for many businesses, you know, we tend to
target small and mid-sizedbusinesses on this show, mostly
in the B2B space.
If they really haven't embraceda strategy around audio content,
around video content, when youlook out at the marketplace,
when you deal with yourcustomers, and I know you go
from that up to the enterprisecustomers, what do you see as
some of the trends?
(25:57):
Where is this going?
What do you see sort ofunfolding as we look forward to
2022 and beyond?
Lindsay Tjepkema (26:03):
Yeah.
One thing that I am excitedabout, and also I'm nervous
about, the marketer in me feelsthe pressure is that the
Netflixization, the Disneyplusization of the world is
liberal consumers, right?
The bar is higher than it's everbeen for what is great content,
(26:26):
and the bar isn't any differentfor B2B.
It's not any different for smallbusiness or the enterprise.
People want good, people wantgreat content.
And that doesn't mean expensivealways.
It doesn't mean high productionvalue, it doesn't even need
expensive as far as time, right?
It just means good.
It means if you're going to do apodcast, yeah, it can be a low
(26:48):
barrier to entry.
But make sure you're having goodconversations with people who
are relevant to your audience,right?
And make sure the quality is asgood as it can be for you and
for what you're doing.
The bar is higher than ever.
And so what I'm seeing happeningand I'm excited about is
marketers thinking a lot morecreatively again, I think we all
(27:10):
have this opportunity to getcreative, more creative again,
and our teams can.
And so it's like, what could wedo?
And how could we do this?
And I'm really inspired by thisand what if we went this
direction?
So let your team go there, letyourself go there, let your team
go there and get more creative,and then look for ways to
optimize it, right?
So if you're going to make moreof an investment in the creation
of content, creating really goodcontent, because you have to if
(27:33):
you're going to engage with youraudience.
How are you going to reap therewards?
How are you going to recoup thatinvestment by getting more value
out of every piece that you docreate?
So if you are thinking quantitywise instead of doing 50 pieces
of good content, you do sixpieces of really great content.
You've gotta be sure that youget a lot of value out of it.
(27:53):
So your podcast doesn't have tobe six episodes a week, you
know?
It doesn't even have to beweekly, just make sure it's
really good, and that you'regetting as much value out as
possible.
Eric Dickmann (28:02):
We are absolutely in a creator economy.
I look and see some of the stuffthat gets posted on Instagram,
TikTok, you know, thesechannels, and people do a
fantastic job.
You're absolutely right, the barhas been raised.
And it's not to say thateverybody is looking at those
channels, maybe with the sameway that sort of younger people
are, but that's going tocontinue to filter up, right?
And the bar is being raised andyou have to go for that quality.
(28:26):
A substandard stuff is just notgoing to get people's attention.
So I think that's an excellentpoint.
But the good thing is just inpower that you have on your
phone, you can create someamazing content without a big
investment.
Lindsay Tjepkema (28:39):
It's true.
It's absolutely true.
And people are you know, listento it,.
Whether you or your marketingteam or you have a marketing
team, people are creative, youknow?
And when we give ourselves thespace to think about- Hey, what
do we want to do?
Not, how are we gonna optimize?
How are we gonna do more?
How are we going to outbreak thecompetition?
How are we going to gain thealgorithms?
Like when we stop thinking thatway and say- what would be fun?
(29:02):
And what would our audiencethink is fun?
And what would really engage ouraudience?
Like go there and then thinkabout how you're going to get
more value out of it.
How are you going to use it?
Eric Dickmann (29:10):
Well, I think this circles back to where we
started really talking aboutpersonalization and talking to
your audience.
And I think if you can beauthentic, you can deliver a
real message about what you'rebringing to the marketplace,
have really interestingconversations that your audience
is going to embrace, that's wellworth your time.
Lindsay Tjepkema (29:30):
Exactly, exactly.
Authenticity will get you a longway.
Eric Dickmann (29:34):
Lindsey.
I think this is great.
This is one of my favoritetopics to talk about.
I'd love it if you could justshare with the audience a little
bit more where they can find outinformation about you and about
Casted as well.
Lindsay Tjepkema (29:44):
Sounds great.
casted.us is Casted's website.
And that's where you can findall kinds of great content from
us about who we are and what wedo, and also our podcast and
video series, multiple of thoseto dig deeper into this whole
concept that we're talkingabout.
I am also really active onLinkedIn.
If you can figure out how tospell my name, you can find me
(30:04):
there in Twitter and Instagram.
So yeah, I and we are easy tofind.
Eric Dickmann (30:09):
As the kids say, all the socials, right?
Lindsay Tjepkema (30:11):
In all the socials.
Eric Dickmann (30:13):
In all the socials.
Yeah, that's right.
I'll make sure that we have allthat linked up in the show notes
so that people can find it andspell your name correctly.
Lindsay, this has been a greatconversation, excited about what
you guys are doing over atCasted.
It sounds like a great solutionto a real problem and an
opportunity for many businessesas well.
So thank you so much for takingthe time to be on the show
today.
I really have enjoyed it.
Lindsay Tjepkema (30:33):
Thank you so much for the conversation.
This is great.
Eric Dickmann (30:38):
Thank you for joining us on this episode of
The Virtual CMO podcast.
For more episodes, go tofiveechelon.com/podcast to
subscribe through your podcastplayer of choice.
And if you'd like to developconsistent lead flow and a
highly effective marketingstrategy, visit fiveechelon.com
to learn more about our VirtualCMO consulting services.
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