#99 Gabe Arnold's Wrestling Odyssey: Triumphs and Trials

Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (01:42):
Thank you, guitar solo.

Speaker 2 (01:56):
Thank you.
Boom, we're live.
It is another episode of thevision quest podcast and we are
lucky enough to be joined by aniowa hawkeye who we've watched
for a little while.
Um, I mean, it's not, it's notnew to the game, but we've

(02:19):
definitely been watching theshit that he's been doing.
But, uh, we're joined by gabearnold.
Uh, the iowa hawkeyes man, Ireally appreciate you taking the
time out to do this today, dudeI appreciate you having me brad
.
Thank you so much not a problem,not a problem.
We always try to get a mix ofwhoever, wherever, however right
, different stories.
I mean, we just had theassociate head coach for indiana

(02:39):
here talking to him about histhing and he's my age, so we
were talking about wrestling andthings that we can't even
comprehend what you guys aredoing.
So just kind of looking at thestuff that you guys go through
and talking with him about, Iwas like, oh, finally someone,
someone I can relate to, as faras we didn't have this, but
we're sitting down today withyou to talk about your story and

(03:01):
your story is is a littledifferent than most of the guys
that we've talked to.
Um, even even in your area, asfar as age group, um, you are.
Well, we'll start first offlike where, what was?
Like, kind of and I always askeverybody this what was the
first sport you remember playing?

Speaker 3 (03:18):
my first sport was actually wrestling.
Um, so I tried it out when Iwas super young, I think I was
like, maybe anywhere betweenfive and seven years old.
Um, I tried it out and um, atthe time it just was not the
thing for me.
Um, I was just too young tocomprehend things and just I
didn't really enjoy getting beatup or beating up other people

(03:40):
just yet.
So it just quite really wasn'tmy thing.
Um, just yet I was still amama's boy.
So, you know, wheneversomething bad would happen, I'd
have to, you know, go um, be onmy mom.
So that just wasn't, wasn't,wasn't what I enjoyed just yet,
but wrestling was definitely myfirst sport.
And then after that I quit,after I did my first tournament
and, um, I lost all my matchesand I got a silver little

(04:03):
participation medal and, um, therunning joke that me and my
brother have is that my medalwas.
He ended up getting bronze, butmy medal was silver.
So I was like, dude, like I gotsilver, you got bronze.
So, technically speaking, I'mbetter than you, exactly, you
know, polish it off a little bit, make sure it looks real clean.
So yeah, but that was my firstsport and then, like I said, I

(04:24):
stopped for a little bit, justlike I said, wasn't my thing,
didn't enjoy it that much, um,and then my fourth grade year
was when I got back intowrestling.
My dad opened up his own club,but before that I played soccer,
um so, and I was actually agoalie, and the only reason
because of that was because Iwas about as wide as the goal.
So you know, balls didn'treally get past me.

(04:46):
So, yeah, fourth grade year waswhen I hit the ground running.
Like I said, my dad opened hisown club and then I haven't
looked back since.

Speaker 2 (04:54):
So, man, so I already I already love the story
because I hear the word soccerthat's, that's my background,
like that's a was really hopingliam would take on to that sport
, but not so much because he wasmissing wrestling practice.
So it's, it's a good sport,like when I always talk about
this too, and my brother was incollege the goalie was a

(05:14):
wrestler also great guy to havein that spot because he's not
afraid to take anybody on.
He'll go after the ball becauseit's his ball.
Absolutely that's, it's, it's a, it's a unique sport and the
aspect of of having to run milesall the time the whole time.

Speaker 3 (05:29):
Yeah, but that's the thing about the goal.
The goal doesn't have to run sothat was my favorite.
That was my favorite part of it.

Speaker 2 (05:33):
You know, I watched my teammates run up and down the
field and I was just like, yeah, you guys can have that one,
because it's just not for me, souh, yeah, I always used to
laugh at the water bottle in thecorner of the goalie's nest,
goalie's net and just sit therelooking and be like what do you
need that for?
It's not doing anything Exactly, so it's a great start.
Already you started wrestling,didn't love it, but you kind of

(05:55):
mama's boy, you said a littlebit, but then you kind of grew
into sports more and youmentioned your dad started a
club.
What club is that?

Speaker 3 (06:05):
Alpha Omega Wrestling started a club.
What club is that?
Uh, alpha omega wrestling ofsouth georgia.
All right, like I said, I'moriginally from southwest
georgia, closer to florida, umsmall town called albany, okay,
um.
So um started there and my dadhad some buddies that he used to
uh train with and crossfit andum, they were like dude, like
why aren't you, why don't yourun the club?
And he was just like you know,dude, I a don't have the money,
uh b don't have the time, it'sjust, I don't have a place and

(06:27):
all these things.
And a guy by the name of jsharp, um.
J sharp told my dad he goes,well, let's go find your
building, um.
And so j sharp found my dad, we, they found the spot of where
they want to do it at and um hepaid for it to start it off with
and j had some partners thathelped him out and yeah, so the
club started from there and itwas going strong for a while and

(06:50):
then it was a little tough tokeep up with it while we had
because we actually moved fromSouth Georgia to North Georgia
another move mainly forwrestling, but my dad had to
actually just open.
He opened up a new um call techcenter which he works for a call
tech center.
Um, they opened up a new calltech center in North Georgia so

(07:11):
he went there and started to runthat Um.
So yeah, I've all kind of allthe moves that have been made
have been made for me and forwrestling, um so yeah, but after
a little bit it was hard tokeep the gym open and, um, it
closed down, unfortunate.
But um, the the, the memory ofhow I started and how I got back

(07:31):
into this will forever be there.

Speaker 2 (07:33):
So yeah, yeah.
So you mentioned these moves,right, these moves were made
because they saw something,right.
So obviously your dad kind ofsaw something.
Your mom is probably just like.
My wife too is like yeah, I seeit too, you know, let's do it
so as you're let's talk about,just before, you guys moved to
North Georgia, so I lived inCairo, georgia.

Speaker 3 (07:52):
OK, I know that that's that's close.
That's close to the south, yeah.

Speaker 2 (07:56):
Southeast corner, I think we're a half hour from
Tallahassee.
Always a great drive whenyou're just about to turn 21
always, so I kind of know thearea.
Man, it's hot as hell downthere oh, absolutely right.

Speaker 3 (08:09):
Human is pissed human , and I'll get out right that's
right, that's right.

Speaker 2 (08:13):
So when you were wrestling down there, when you
started back up, you dad hadstarted the club.
What were you guys stretchingbeyond, uh, the georgia, uh,
borders to wrestle at that timewas, was your dad taking you to?
You know, like I don't want tosay super 32, but at least like
a, you know, a grappler,grappler, fall, classic things
like that.
What were?

(08:33):
What were some of your memoriesof tournaments back then or
events that kind of blew yourmind?

Speaker 3 (08:38):
yeah, um, when I first started, um, we would
mainly just to.
At the beginning we would justgo all over the state, being in
southwest Georgia, everything,all the big tournaments you know
, to wrestle the good kids theywere all you know towards the
Atlanta area, you know.
So we're talking like from myhometown, that's three and a
half hours away from me.
Yeah, so we were making thosetrips every weekend and they

(09:00):
were, they were grueling anddefinitely took a hit on the uh,
the old bank there, yeah, butit was, it was, it was worth it.
You know, and it wasn't just memy dad was taking groups of
kids because, like I said, heran his own club, you know.
So we were taking guys everyweekend north georgia, you know,
further away in south georgia,valdosta, stuff like that, you
know.
So, yeah, starting off, Ididn't really get a lot of

(09:22):
opportunities to go out of state, but one that sticks with me I
went to.
I don't know if you remember,but it was called Kingsport
National Duels, aau NationalDuels.
Yeah, so they have them in adifferent spot now, but
originally they were inKingsport, tennessee.
And that was after my first yearof being back with wrestling.

(09:44):
You know, my fourth grade year.
That was my first time out ofstate and I wrestled with a team
out of Georgia, out of NorthGeorgia, called Morris Fitness,
a coach named Charlie Morris,one of my biggest supporters,
biggest motivators.
You know, he's part of my storyand the reason why I've been
able to gain so much success,because the things that he
taught me run more than justwrestling, you know, just belief

(10:08):
in myself, confidence, and heplayed a very pivotal role in my
, in my wrestling and that way.
But I went up there and,needless to say, I got my teeth
kicked in.
I didn't win a single match andthe only match that I did win
was an exhibition match that mydad and Charlie had set up,

(10:30):
because the kid wasn't thegreatest, I wasn't really the
greatest, I thought I was thegreatest because, you know, I
just came off of a pretty solidyear.
I didn't place at state Georgiastate that year, but I mean, I
wrestled pretty well, I went toand out of state but I had an
eight and two record at thestate tournament.
So you know, kids statetournament, of course.
So you know, at that point, youknow, I was kind of thinking I

(10:50):
was hot shit, for lack of abetter term.
Yeah, and I went there and man,I just got drugged.
I just got drugged all over themag, I got the piss beat out of
me.
It was, it was, it was tough.
But, like I said, that onematch that I won was an
exhibition match that was set upbetween Charlie and my dad and
you know, I think that match isjust so.

(11:13):
It was so minuscule at the timebut looking back at it it was
huge, it's tremendous man.
Yeah, absolutely, absolutely.
And I think it completelychanged the landscape of my
belief in myself, my wrestlingthroughout the years.
You know, I think that was a,that was a huge moment for me.
You know, that match Icompletely blew the doors off of

(11:35):
the kid.
You know he wasn't the greatest.
I guess you could say I wasn'teither.
But you know I didn't know thematch was set up, I didn't know
anything about it.
You know, I just figured thatthis kid was some out-of-state
kid and I just took it to him.
I think the team was IndianaOutlaws.

Speaker 2 (11:51):
I want to say oh, I know that team yeah.

Speaker 3 (11:53):
Yeah, yeah, I figured you would.
Indiana Outlaws has been aroundfor a while.
So, yeah, that was one of thosemoments and that was my first
time competing out-of-state ofthose moments, and that was my
first time competing um, out ofstate, um, okay, and just really
I think one of the few times Ihad been out of state at that
point in time, um, so yeah thefirst time I encountered a
little exhibition match,especially with liam we're.

Speaker 2 (12:14):
I can't remember what .
I think we were up in uh um,new york doing a uh journeyman
classic, I think it was, andthere was a he had.
He had had some tough matchesagainst a kid named Sam Almedina
and his partner his trainingpartner, was at the tournament
we were at.
Sam wasn't there.
We were actually looking forSam, like Liam wanted a match
back with him.
He's like there's no way I'mlosing him this time.

(12:35):
He wasn't there so he didn'tget the opportunity to wrestle,
but his training partner wasthere and he's like hey, is it
okay if we wrestle over the mat,like do a match over here, just
to kind of see?
Sam told me a little bit aboutliam I think it was his dad and
I was like, yeah, what?
Okay, not a problem, you know,whatever.
That literally just took himoff to the side.
There was a mat available andthey started wrestling and you
know the other kid did fairlywell but liam beat him, I think,

(12:56):
by like four points orsomething like that.
But the guy looked at me.
He's like damn liam's, liam'stough I.
This is weird.
I've never had this happenbefore.
But I appreciate you guysreaching out to do that.
So that opened Liam's eyes up alittle bit too.
As far as, like oh cow, thisclub I thought was like you know
, the, the club for me to be islike I can, I can keep with
these guys, I can definitely runwith these guys, so that's

(13:24):
that's important to me.
To kind of it was eight and two,whatever it was, but what was
that like?
How was your dad just yourparents in general, cause I kind
of mentioned how we talk aboutsupport systems yeah, when you
were going through those ranksand trying to kind of make your
way up, what, what was?
What was the kind of feedbackyou're getting from your parents
?
Was there a man you're notdoing good enough?
You know, sometimes you gotthose parents are just hard

(13:45):
riders, right?
Yeah, or your parents like, hey, we're just trying to, let's
work on this a little bit.
What was that like for youcoming up?

Speaker 3 (13:51):
I think my dad did a a great job with obviously with
raising me, of course, um but Ithink I think he did a great job
with, you know, um, making sureit was what I wanted.
Um, I think too often,especially in today's time and
world, that you know, parentsget so caught up in these kids
winning all these bigtournaments and everything, and

(14:12):
at the end of the day I'm goingto say this as brutally as
possible and it's going to soundwrong it means absolutely shit.
There's no Tulsa Eagle, there'sno belt, there's no nothing.
That shouldn't make you seeyour kid any differently.
Um, you know.
So I think my, my dad did a agreat job with that.
You know he would push me.
He definitely would push me inthe room, but it was never like,

(14:33):
all right, dude, we gotta wakeup and you gotta go do this
right now or else you're nevergonna win.
You know what I mean.
In the times that it was likethat, it was because I wanted to
.
You know I'd wake up early inthe morning to go wrestle, to
watch wrestling, to look at myphone late at night and watch
YouTube matches.
You know he'd come in my roomlate at night and he would think
I'd be on my phone doing someother stuff, you know, as a 10

(14:54):
year old kid would do.
And it turns out I was justsitting under the match watching
freaking Sergey Belogazovwrestle.
You know what I?
mean.
So it's stuff like that.
So it's, it's, it's stuff likethat.
You know it was just everythingwas was on my terms.
But you know, my dad, I had toshow my dad that it was what I
wanted.
You know, I wanted to besomething great and you know he

(15:14):
took that and he ran with it andhe did it.
I think he did it the best wayhe possibly could.
You know, I didn't get burntout.
I didn't hate the sport when Iwas growing up.
I mean, did I get injured alongthe way?
Yeah, I mean, it's a part of it.
You know, when you wrestle somany matches, you know, but but
yeah, like I said, my, my, mydad did a great job with, you
know, bringing me up in thesport.

(15:36):
And, like I said, as I've saidit a couple of times, I'm making
sure it was what I wanted.
You know, and it was what Iwanted.
You know, and I think so manykids now and I've ran into so
many of them, you know, betweendoing camps, seeing kids at
tournaments, you know, just,I've seen so many of these kids
just it's just not what theywant, you know, they don't enjoy
it.
You know, you got these littleseven, eight year old kids at

(15:58):
camps, you know, and they'rereally freaking good, but they
just like want to go home and beon their ipad.
They want to go be a kid.
You know what?
I mean and there's.
There's absolutely nothing wrongwith that um so, yeah, my dad
did a great job and my mom justyou know, my mom wasn't my mom.
I'm always, I've always been amama's boy.
I'm still a mama's boy.
I love my mom to death yeah,and you know she wasn't she.

(16:19):
She wasn't the the biggest fanof me wrestling.
She still isn't the hugest fanof me wrestling, but she knows I
love it and she sees how hard Iwork and she sees the yeah, and
she sees the, the, the amountof time I put into it to to be
great.
You know she, she notices it andwhatever makes her boy happy,
whatever dream that I'm going tochase, you know she's going to

(16:41):
support it.
My dad's going to support it.
You know, you know, and that'sthat's all they've always been.
You know they've always told me.
You know, if it's not wrestling, it's not wrestling.
If you don't love this anymore,you know there's no, there's no
reason to be doing it anymore.
You know if I don't love it andI'm not having fun, then I'm
doing it for the wrong reasons,you know, and so that was
something my dad planted in myhead when I first started this
sport, you know was?

Speaker 2 (17:01):
did your parents have the?

Speaker 3 (17:02):
your mom did the education side dad was the sport
side yeah, well, notnecessarily so my mom so well,
that is true, because my mom wasactually an educator.
Uh, my mom was a teacher.
Um, at the time and when I wasliving in albany, she worked in
the classroom and she wasactually the head of the science
department of the dohertycounty school system, which was
the school system.
Yeah, which is the schoolsystem that I was going to

(17:24):
school in, you know no runningfor you, man no, I was, I was, I
was stuck, I was definitelystuck.
But yeah, I guess you coulddefinitely say um, mom was
definitely the the educator sideof it and dad was definitely
the sports side of it I guessyou could say um, because for
after my um, yeah.
So I would definitely say we'llget into this, the second part,

(17:46):
more yeah.

Speaker 2 (17:48):
So, with that being said, did you find yourself and
I ask this all the time tooespecially before you even got
to high school, because I know,I know the focus definitely
shift once high school hit.
But what with, with the sportsand and you know you talked
about kind of having a hard timeWas there any point before you
got to high school that you werethinking about quitting at all?
It just was getting too hard.

Speaker 3 (18:08):
Oh yeah, absolutely, a couple of times, a couple of
times, I mean.
I just had to.
I had to step away and, um, Ihad to look at the bigger
picture and look at what Iwanted.
Um, and I had to, even at ayoung age, you know, as a 12, 13
year old kid, that's prettydamn tough to do, you know not a

(18:31):
lot of kids not a lot of kidscan do that honestly.
You know, that's the that's thebrutal truth about it.
But, like I said, I think my,my dad did a good job of making
sure it was what I wanted, youknow and when it got to shit in
time.
You know he made sure that.
You know when I had thoseinternal conversations with
myself of do I really want to dothis?

(18:52):
You know I I answered thequestion the right way and how I
wanted to answer it Not becausedad wanted me to do it, not
because mom wanted me to do it,not because my family is so
endowed and rich and wrestlingand the culture of it.
You know it was just what Iwanted to do it, not because my
family is so endowed and richand wrestling and the culture of
it.
You know it was just what Iwanted to do.
It was what gabe wanted to doand, um, they've always my dad's
always made that at theforefront.

(19:14):
You know, no matter what sport,what, what, whatever, you know
it didn't matter yeah, sothey're.

Speaker 2 (19:20):
They're trying to set you up for life.
I mean, they're reallyabsolutely especially giving you
the reign, so that was kind ofwhat we had to do to it.
You know, I played high-levelsoccer and my parents weren't
athletic right, so I didn't haveparents that were saying you
had to do this, you got to dothis.
I mean, I was literallygrabbing a soccer ball and just
kicking it against a curb.
I didn't have a ton of camps.
I wasn't sent though too likemy parents just didn't know what

(19:52):
it took to to make something,to to go that level, so I had to
.
I had to work with whatever Ihad, but I also had parents that
didn't weren't forcing it downmy throat you have to do this,
you have to do this.

Speaker 3 (19:58):
The only thing they were doing that about was school
yeah, you have to do this thatwas, that was the one thing that
was a non-negotiable and right,so no grades, no grades.
No wrestling, no sports.
You're done, you know if youdon't have that there.
You'll be doing absolutelynothing.

Speaker 2 (20:12):
You'll be sitting at home and getting your grades
yeah, so high five to mom anddad, already right there, that's
awesome, that's awesome.
So, as you, had those thoughtsof I don't want to do this, you
know things like that and andyou kind of got drawn back.
You step back a little bit.
Was that?
What was?
What was the?
What was the the kicker for you, once you decided I'm committed

(20:33):
, I'm into this, this is whatI'm going to do.
Where were you at when thatfinally clicked and you no
longer thought that you wantedto quit?
Was that not until college?

Speaker 3 (20:43):
um, I mean, honestly, I uh, this is just brutally
honest, but uh, yeah, it's anongoing battle every day, to be
honest with you yeah, that'shonest man, that's this this
sport is is as tough as it getsand, man, it'll beat the piss
out of you mentally if you don'tfight back and punch it right
back in the mouth.
You know, and that's that's as,that's as easy as you put it.

(21:06):
You know what I mean and it's,yeah, it's a challenge.
It's a challenge every day,especially at the level that I'm
at right now, in the positionthat I'm in, um, currently.
You know it's a, it's anabsolute freaking battle.
You know I I battle with it.
It's internal battles every day,you know, and it's it's, it's
tough, it's not easy, but youknow I remind myself that there

(21:26):
is nothing more in this worldthat I'd want to do.
You know there's, there'snothing more that I want to
become than to be the absolutebest version of myself, and I
think to do that it requires asport, you know, and at the end
of the day it's just wrestling.
You know it's never going todefine who I am or what I am or

(21:47):
what I'll become.
You know, but I have poured somuch time, so much blood, so
many tears into this sport andyou know it's like that
girlfriend that you're just soattached to.
You know I've got attachmentissues with this sport.
You know, I've left it beforeand I've walked away from it.
A man had killed me.

(22:12):
Evil, exactly, evil, mistress,exactly.
So you know there's there'snothing I would rather do, you
know, and, like I said, it is anongoing battle.
You know, when a tough practicehappens, a tough, a tough
tournament happens and and Idon't get the result I want, you
know it sucks because you, yousee the work that you put in,
you know and um, but sometimesyou have to look at the bigger
picture and you have to look atthe lessons you learned along
the way, throughout thesepractices, throughout these

(22:33):
turnouts, throughout everythingyou know.
And there's just no other sportthat can teach you that,
besides this sport that I chooseto do every day, you know.
So it's, like I said, it's anongoing battle, but it's a
battle that I will keep winningbecause I love what I do and I
have fun doing what I do.

Speaker 2 (22:50):
Persevering I love it .
Absolutely so.
As you're kind of, you know wetalked a little bit about your
middle school having to movearound or you know what age
group that was and going toNorthern Georgia.
There's a little.
There's a little uh event downthere called elite eight duels,
um, and you are photographed onon their page.

(23:11):
So obviously you were in it.
Was that one of the biggerevents that you had ever been in
as far as the, the magnitude ofwhat you were doing and who you
were in front of?

Speaker 3 (23:19):
yeah, so elite eight um.
Elite eight was was actuallytowards.
I was like more during.
That got started during COVIDaround COVID time.
Towards like my seventh andeighth grade year, I was going
to the big events, okay.
I went to a bunch of duels.
I went to Super 32.
I still didn't do Tulsa oranything, just because my dad

(23:41):
and I didn't believe in it andit was just the dumbest thing to
us.
But I went to Wildwood, newJersey, for duels VAC, mcdonough
duels.
I did that whole series of allthose big duels that go around
the country and by my eighthgrade year I was freaking,
performing in them and I wasshowing out.
I wrestled guys that I stillwrestle to this day Braden

(24:02):
Thompson, lorenzo, norman.
At one point in time me andKeeter wrestled at Wildwood, new
Jersey.
I have a win over Keeter.
If anyone asks I'm better thanKeeter, you're better.
We're putting that out there onlive because if you want to go
find the match, it's on YouTube.
I basically ran Keeter down fora solid six minutes of the

(24:23):
match.
He ran for me the whole time.
He should have gotten kickedout of the match.
He said how much he wasstalling.
Exactly.
But yeah, by my seventh andeighth grade year I was doing
all those huge events and that'sawesome.
Okay, it was, it was, it was one, and when it was time to put me

(24:49):
out there and throw me to thewolves, hell, he threw me out
there and put me to the wolves.
Um, so by like, so, like fifth,seventh, eighth grade year, I
was doing those bigger, biggertournaments.
But, um, even through like myfifth and sixth grade years, I
was still going to kingsport.
We went to vac a couple oftimes.
I did a lot of duels, did a lotof duels um, out of the state,
did a lot of tournaments out ofthe state, um, not necessarily

(25:10):
to the magnitude of like a super32 or tulsa, but they were
bigger events and they wereout-of-state events.
Yeah, um, there I wrestled indixie nationals, which was in
state, um, but you know, you gota lot of kids coming down for
it.
Everyone wants to be the triplecrown winner, you know.
So they go and wrestle Dixie,and at the time it was in North
Georgia.
Whatever the hell a triplecrown really is, I don't know.

(25:34):
I know I broke a couple ofkids' dreams from that, you know
, because every time they beatmy bracket they weren't getting
past me, so yeah, I did, I didall those things and yeah so,
yeah, I did all those things andyeah so.
But yeah, elite Eight wasduring COVID and I forgot that's
when it started.
Yeah, it was like 2020 was whenthe first one happened.

Speaker 2 (25:54):
And.

Speaker 3 (25:54):
I got to be in the first one, of course, and it was
super cool.
I got to wrestle on the MinionLegends team, you know which?
was awesome, absolutely awesome,and by that time, you know, I'd
kind of already made a name formyself.
You know I had a great freshmanyear.
I placed third at Ironman at160 as a freaking 14-year-old
kid wrestling grown freaking men.
The only match I lost was toPaddy Gallagher and he beat my

(26:17):
butt, Beat the living piss outof me actually, but wrestled
that tournament, got third.
Great showing for me, um, greattime out.
Wrestled national preps, wonnational preps, um.
Won the blair duel, beat mastergiovanni, um.
But I had a, yeah, I had agreat, I had a great freshman
year.

(26:37):
I guess you could say andthere's things, there's
obviously things I wanted to win.
I didn't, um, which suckslooking back at it, but you know
everything happens for a reason.
This, that's what it is.
But Elite Eight was a greatshowing for me, just because I
think I was just so hungry,because you know we weren't
competing, you know we were allshut down.
All we could really do wastrain and you would have these

(26:57):
little small tournaments hereand there.
But it wasn't for me, it wasn'tthe level that I needed to be
at, you know, it wasn't thelevel that I craved and itched
for.
You know what I mean ashigh-level wrestlers.
We just itch for that type ofwrestling, you know, because I
can't get away from it.
And so Elite Eight was one ofthose events.
It was a huge event and I gotto compete in it and wrestle

(27:18):
some high-level guys and man, Iwas just.
I remember it like it wasyesterday.
I think that was some of mybest wrestling to this day, you
know, just because of how hungryand ready I was to compete.
And the second that whistleblew, I was on guys and it was
just.
It was so much fun because itwas in my home state.
I was with all of my boys thatI grew up wrestling with.

(27:40):
It was just an awesomeexperience and it was a great
event.
Cliff Preble did wrestling withum.
It was just, it was just anawesome experience and it was a.
It was a great event.
Cliff travel did a freakingamazing job.
Still does an amazing job withthe dual tournament, um.

Speaker 2 (27:51):
So yeah, it was awesome it was awesome that you
talked about kind of it soundslike it was it was kind of a
coming of age moment for youwhere you were really starting
to realize the power you had andjust the, the amount of time
that you put into it and thetechnique that you had with,
especially with that C word,covid and it comes up every time
I talk to you guys.
I mean, obviously it was a bigimpact, right.
Yeah.

(28:11):
Guys who missed NCAAs, guys whomaybe missed a state tournament,
you know things like that.
So it kind of burns and kind ofthinking about that, even as a
high school kid, and knowingthat your dad was doing
everything he could to give youthe best opportunities and to
kind of put you out there andthen throw you to the wolves.
What were you guys doing?
You know you had these events,but were you kind of just
bringing buddies over, trainingin the garage, retraining out in

(28:32):
the yard, like how was thatgoing for you guys, especially
in that hot, hot state ofGeorgia, and you guys trying to
work out and things like that?
But what were you doing duringCOVID as a high school kid?
Trying to work things out.

Speaker 3 (28:44):
Yeah, For one it was Georgia, so COVID kind of didn't
exist to us, to us Georgians.
I guess you could say you know,we still had people going out
to the grocery store, no mask on, didn't give a crap.
Yeah, yeah, you know, and myparents weren't one of those
people.
They weren't very, you know,half-minded about it.

Speaker 1 (29:03):
You know they still, they had to you got it, you had
to be aware of it.
You know and I don't.

Speaker 3 (29:07):
I don't want to get political about it because I
could give a crap less, but atthe end of the day it's just
about they wanted to be safe,you know so I mean, whoever has
a problem with that?
I could really care less.
I don't care about the politicsside of it and I could, yeah,
no, not my guarantee, um, so I'mnot the person to argue with
when it comes to that.
Yeah, um, but yeah, so I mean,we completely, um, we

(29:32):
transformed my garageimmediately to you know, my
little, my little workout area.
You know, we, we, uh, my dad,one of his buddies that he works
with, they built me a um, uh, aum, a weight, a weight rack and
a weight bench out of wood.
Um, so I had, and then webought some weights off of
Facebook marketplace and boughtthis another weight machine off
of the marketplace.
Um, so we turned my garage intomy own workout area.

(29:53):
We put mats down in the corners.
I would have my buddies over Um,actually, one of the kids I
wrestled in um the trials finalslast year, matthew Singleton,
me and him were each other'smain workout partners.
We would work out at my placein the garage.
I would drive to his place andhis dad had this own kind of
like little warehouse that hehad mats in.

(30:14):
We'd work out there together,you know.
So I still got it in, whetherit be with a partner or by
myself.
You know, I made sure we were,we were rest.
I was still getting what I need, you know, and thankfully I had
such a great club level upwrestling back in in Marietta,
georgia coach, down in Pannone.
He always had the doors open,we knew where the keys were.
So we would meet and buddieslike Matthew and Michael Killick

(30:37):
and RJ Weston, who goes to youand I now literally right down
the street, yeah, we would allgo in and just freaking man,
it'd be murderers.
Row caleb, henson, jackson,smith, man like these guys.
I was training with a nationalchamp dude.
you know so these are guys thatyou know I freaking grew up
wrestling with.
You know what I mean and it'sjust, it's not.

(30:58):
It was never anything new to beaway from the level that I
wanted to be with, because theguys that I was surrounding
myself with are freaking hammers.
I mean, looking at them now.
I mean Caleb Henson's, anall-american international champ
, dude and correct, pretty, it'spretty damn good.
If I do say so myself, you knowwhat I mean.
Yeah, so that was like one of my, you know one of the guys I

(31:18):
grew up rolling around with.
So I, I had, I had what Ineeded, you know what I mean, as
long as I had a mat and I hadsome like minded friends that
wanted to get in there and, youknow, get working and become the
best people we could be.
You know I was, I was set andyou know, yeah, covid put a dent
in some tournaments and someopportunities that we all had,

(31:39):
you know.
But you know we had each otherand we made the.
We made the frickin most ofthat because, man, we would beat
the piss out of each other.
We would go, it would be acouple minutes of drilling and
we would be freaking, punchingeach other in the mouth.
That's just how it was.
That's awesome.
We would go hard.
There were some real tough dayssometimes, but it had to be

(32:00):
done and we had to get the workin.

Speaker 2 (32:03):
So at what point, when you were in the sport, at
what point were you tellingyourself I want to do this in
college, I want to continue thisin college.
Was that middle school?
Were you telling yourself thatalready?

Speaker 3 (32:14):
Yeah.
So I made my family and I madethe huge decision to send me to
boarding school coming my myeighth grade year of high school
, and for one that is justcompletely unheard of yeah um.
For a kid like me, from a smalltown, you know sending your kid
away however many miles, youknow yeah georgia to freaking

(32:37):
pennsylvania.
That's just unheard of in theplace where I was born and
raised, you know yeah, andalbany, georgia, exactly,
exactly things like that,opportunities like that don't
just they don't presentthemselves.
for the kids that were born andraised in my demographic yeah,
you know what I mean.
And just, it just did not makesense, it didn't fit the bill of
you know what.

(32:57):
What was going on?
Um, so by my eighth grade yearwe, we, um, we were looking at
some options.
We came down between WoodlandHigh School, which is a school
out in North Georgia, sameschool that Jackson Smith, caleb
Henson, cade McCreary, allthose guys went to Literally one
of the best schools.
It was one of the best schoolsin the nation because of those

(33:23):
guys at one point in time.
So we looked at there, whichwas literally right down the
street from me in Cartersville,georgia, looked at there.
Baylor High School in Tennessee, coach Rex and Daniel, all
those guys, great program, greatschool.
And then we looked at WyomingSeminary, of course, which ended
up being my option, and thenNorthfield, mount Hermon, all

(33:43):
the way in Massachusetts.

Speaker 2 (33:44):
Oh geez yeah.

Speaker 3 (33:45):
So we looked at an array of options, yeah, and um,
scott had actually reached outto my dad in my eighth grade
year, um, about going to schoolthere.
And so, um, we, we looked atthe school, we went there and we
actually, when we visited sim,it was in the middle of a
freaking snow blizzard, um, sono, classes were going on, no,

(34:08):
nothing.
We literally just went thereand we sat down and we talked
with green.
That was mainly all we did.
We looked at one building andyou know, just that was about
all we could do.
Everything else, exactlyeverything else.
We just sat down and talked tocoach green and, um, after
having that conversation withhim, you know, I knew that was
where I needed to be and thatwas the type of guy I needed to

(34:29):
surround myself with, because ofhow much he reminded me of my
father and how much the valuesthat he had were the same ones
that my father had instilled inme and instilled in what is
important and what is reallyimportant, besides just winning
these tournaments and being thebest wrestler you can be.
You know that I could.
You know I could lose my legtomorrow and you know I would

(34:52):
probably be done wrestling, butyou know it's more than just
wrestling.
It's, at the end of the day,it's just wrestling.
You know, it's just somethingmy dad instilled in me.
It's just the same thing thatcoach Green instilled into all
of his guys and all of hiswrestlers.
You know, it was just, it wasimportant.
So, yeah, so that was the bigdecision to go from being a

(35:13):
small little hometown boy youknow, we were living in North
Georgia at the time, but I wasthis hometown kid in Albany, you
know to making this big jumpall the way to Wyoming Seminary
and being a boarding school kid.
And I think that was when, Imean, I knew if I was going to
make that big of a decision.

Speaker 1 (35:30):
Then you know we were going to take this to the house
.

Speaker 3 (35:31):
You know, we're going to take this all the way.
We were going to take it allthe way, and there was no, there
was no slowing down you knowwhat.
I mean, I knew, if this is thedecision I was going to make,
then this was going to be whatwas gonna be with us for me, you
know so at 14 you're going.

Speaker 2 (35:44):
You're going a couple , maybe a couple thousand, maybe
a thousand or two miles awayand now you're in a community,
like you said, a small communitybut at the same time, where
you're at, maybe they wanted youto stay there, maybe they
wanted this big cat to behanging out and doing that thing
for their school and, andobviously a lot of people still
have places that they left, thatwere really supportive about

(36:05):
them leaving.
What?
What was that for you as a 14year old, number one going to
you know, just a such a distanceaway from mom and dad, also not
being able to kind of representin your area.
Now you have a goal, you havethings in mind, you guys see the
pathway to it, right, but wasthere any kind of bite back
about you going to wyomingseminary saying we should keep

(36:25):
him here?

Speaker 3 (36:26):
I still catch hate about it from this day um there
was people.
There was people nagging on me,my dad.
They were on these forumsrunning their mouths about, yeah
, how I my my parents justshipped their kid away and
doesn't want him to be a georgiaboy.
But um, opinions are likeassholes, everyone has them they
all stink and they all stinkabsolutely.

(36:48):
And you know, we just I mean,I'm not saying it it obviously
can be done, it can be done, itcan be done in georgia, you know
.
And that that wasn't what thething was, it was just what was
for gabe arnold for you um.
And I think at that point intime, that was what I needed.
I wanted that exposure.

(37:09):
I wanted to wrestle these highlevel guys.
Every freaking weekend, dude, Iwas going from Ironman, I
wrestled a small tournament backin Wyoming, back in Kingston,
and then the next weekend I waswrestling Powerade.
After that I had a couple ofweeks off and then before that,
the next couple of weekend afterthat, I was wrestling Blair and
I was wrestling St Ed's, andthen I had prep stage, which is

(37:30):
the qualifier for preps, andthen I was wrestling national
preps.
So this was the schedule that Iwas, this was the schedule I
wanted.
That I dreamed of.
You know, I, I, I craved thathigh level wrestling and, like I
said, it can be done in Georgia, it can be done in my home
state.
But it wasn't what I needed atthe time.
You know, I, I, I crave thathigh level wrestling and um, I

(37:50):
went to where I could find itand that was at Sim and um.
You know it was.
It was what, like I said, itwas what I needed and it was
what was for me and I neededthat, I needed that exposure, I
needed to be around those typeof people, types of people.
You know I needed to be aroundthose coaches, I needed all of
that, you know, and it just mademy wrestling go from here and

(38:12):
just skyrocketing, you know, andthat's, that's not to say you
can't, it can't be done at home.
Right, it can most definitely bedone at home, and my coaches
that I had at home I'm still incontact with about technique,
about life, about mindset, abouteverything you know, and
between Charlie Donovan, youknow, terry Allison, all those

(38:33):
guys you know, I'm still incontact on a, on a daily basis,
talking about you know about,about anything you know, because
they were in my corner for solong that it's more than just a
wrestling coach.
You know, these are, these werefather figures that were
implanted in my life that playedsuch a pivotal role in the man
and the wrestler that I'vebecome to this day.

Speaker 2 (38:55):
Couldn't have said it better, yeah.

Speaker 3 (38:57):
So it's, it's, it can be done at home, and those
relationships that I did createwhen I was at home, I still have
those.
Those guys have no hardfeelings against me.
It was never any.
No, it was no harm, no foul,you know and they knew why they
knew what I did, what I did, andthey knew that I would always
know where home is.
And hell, I always know wherehome is.
That's why I got a tattoobehind my ear.

Speaker 2 (39:17):
So so that's that, that's that that's I mean.
So not only do we have parents,you know, coming up as athletes
, but you build relationshipswith those people that also
become a support system.
No-transcript.

(39:51):
Were you at a, at a, ever at apoint when you were at Wyoming
seminary and we're going to talkabout?
You know some of the milestonesthat you had there, but were
you ever at a point when youfirst got through like holy man
this is I'm on my own, like I'myou had people there, don't get
me wrong.
I mean I'm sure that they'rewatching.
Yeah, no, that happened 20minutes after my parents left I

(40:11):
got you, got you as a 14 yearold, that's kind of what I
expect man, we were all a wreck.

Speaker 3 (40:18):
I, we were all a wreck, we were emotional wreck
and and it was tough, and it'sone of the toughest things that
I have done to this day, man,and it's hard, it's really hard,
being away from your mom andyour dad and I don't know.
They've just been, they stillare, they've been so pivotal

(40:42):
everything that I've done.
They've been my biggestcheerleaders, my, my, my dream.
They've chased this dream, thisgoal, with me.
You know, and being thousandsof miles away from them was
tough.
It was tough.
It was tough on a 14 year oldkid and you know, it was just.
It was hard and it's lookingback on it.
It's still hard.
It was still difficult.
It was a tough decision to make, yeah, but it had to be done.

(41:06):
You know it had to be done.

Speaker 2 (41:08):
Unfortunately, and so you're, you're, you actually
had to kind of get a grip ofsome things that most 14 year
olds don't have to.

Speaker 3 (41:16):
Yeah, I had to learn the responsibility.
I had to learn how to do mywork by myself, because previous
to that I was homeschooled, soI can wrestle and travel more.
So mama had her foot up my buttconstantly to get work done.
Um, so, yeah, I had to learn todo that.
Uh, I had to do my own laundry,clean my room um yeah I know

(41:37):
things that are just unheralded,unheralded, you know yeah, made
no sense.
I have a 16 year old that can'thandle that right now I'm 14 on
my own, I got a roommate and I'mlike living like a college kid
so it was it was a complete.
I had to grow up really quicklyum and there was no looking

(41:58):
back from it either.
I had to grow up real quick.
Whether I wanted to or not.
If I wanted to do what I said Iwanted to do, oh yeah.

Speaker 2 (42:06):
That's for sure.
So, as you're as you're you,you get there.
Let's say, you get your yourfeet underneath you, you're.
You hit the ground running alittle bit as you, as you kind
of get more comfortable withwith being on your own and with
having to focus not just onschool but, like now you're
focusing more.
It's.
This is gabe's path.
Right now you're kind of onyour own.
You really get to think of man,I'm doing this by myself, I'm

(42:29):
doing this on my own.
This is, this is did it seemlike at that point, once you
kind of were able to be a littlemore comfortable, did you feel
like that?
This was like the, thebeginning of something great,
even greater than what youalready had, because you're at a
school already now that isknown for that.
That's that that brings upthese kids that are, that are
just elite level, likeconstantly, and they even build.

(42:51):
They, you know they're, they'redevelopers there.
They're not just guys that arejust getting kids that are
automatically awesome.
They also develop.
So, but as you're kind ofdeveloping yourself, were you?
What were some of themilestones that you surprised
yourself with?
That You're like, oh man, I didit.
I'm here by myself and I justdid this.
What were some of thosemilestones for you?

Speaker 3 (43:12):
Um, I hell, I think, clearing my room for the first
time by myself as well.
That's big man, I think.
Doing, I think, doing homeworkwithout having a foot up.
My butt was one of them too.
Um, yeah um, but honestly, man,every single day was a
milestone all right and justyeah, living by myself was a

(43:34):
freaking milestone.
You know and just, obviously Ihad, I had people there, I had a
support system there and I hada community that supported me
and whatever I needed, um thatthat they were there.
I knew I had those people there.
But the thing that was just,you know, it was just, it was
different being on my own.
I was still on my own, you know.
I could still go walk offcampus if I really felt like it.

(43:57):
I still, yeah, I had roomchecks, but hell, the second
they left I could just pop rightout of my room there's no
invisible fence with like acollar on or like something
around your ankle.

Speaker 2 (44:05):
A little shock like that no, nothing like.

Speaker 3 (44:07):
There were alarms on the doors, but the cameras
didn't work half of the time.
So um, so yeah I figured.
I figured out the blind spotsreally quickly, um, but anyways.
So yeah, every day was a lot,milestone man.
Just living by myself for thefirst time was a a big thing and
doing things by myself, how Iwas doing life by myself for for

(44:29):
three years of my life.
And uh, yeah, my parents arethere.
I had my support system there,but they weren't there.
You know, they couldn't controlwhat I did and no one could.
You know, I I still did my ownthing and marched to the beat of
my own drum.
At the end of the day, um, butI would say, a big thing for me
was um, making the lineup, um,and that was.

(44:51):
That was a process in and ofitself.
Um, I had to wrestle off a kidnamed nico katsuyoshi.
Kid was pretty good at the timeand I don't really know what
he's doing now.
I think he's at some school, orhe may not be in school anymore
, but I know he's making a lotof money, so I think that's yeah

(45:15):
, he definitely ended up beingmore than successful at the end
of the day, so it's um, actually, no, I think he made his own um
, like bitcoin or whatever, likehis own coin, or whatever, oh
boy yeah yeah, so he was prettydang smart for one and uh yeah
apparently he went to harvardfor a little bit, so he
definitely uh had the brainsthere for sure yeah

(45:36):
absolutely, and then some.
But, um, yeah, I had to wrestleoff him and um won that wrestle
off and I, you know, I wrestledto the way that I wanted to
wrestle, yeah, and just the, thejump from the, that jump from
my eighth grade year to thatfirst wrestle off was just like
there was like so many levels inbetween it, you know the motion

(45:59):
, the leg attacks, the handfighting, the, everything.
Just there was so many littleminuscule levels to just even
get to that point of winningthat wrestle off.
Um, so it was huge, it was, itwas freaking, mind blowing and,
um, you know, that was, that wasa big moment for me and I think
an even bigger one from thatwhich was right at the beginning
was Ironman.

Speaker 2 (46:19):
Okay, okay.

Speaker 3 (46:20):
I was untested.
I was unranked as a freshman inhigh school and just being at
that level, being at thattournament, being with the
teammates that I had, dude likeI was on a team with freaking Bo
Bartlett, lachlan, mcneil, coolyeah, dude like absolute
killers.

(46:41):
Right, jacob Kaminsky at thetime was really freaking good.
He was a cadet world bronzemedalist in Greco, which, with
my Greco status right now, is apretty big freaking deal.
Like dude, I was on a team withkillers, absolute killers.
These are the guys that Isurrounded myself with on a

(47:02):
daily basis man, um, I had hell.
I was on a team with nickbazakis.
Nick bazakis on that team aswell.
Can't forget bazooka um, so Iwas that's what we used to call
it back on the team.
So, man, I had a.
I had a really high standard tolive up to.
Like it wasn't necessarilyplaced on me, but these guys
that I had on my team, you knowthey expected it of themselves,

(47:25):
but they expected it of theirteammates and the guys that they
were rolling with too.
So it was, it was a lot ofpressure.
It was a lot of pressure and,um, there was a lot of eyes on
me coming into that tournament.
No one had me placed in.
I wasn't seated.
I think I was seated, maybelike 17th or something like that
.
Like, like I had, like it was.

(47:45):
It was.
It was a tough tournament, man,it was a really tough tournament
and you know just it.
It took a lot.
It took a lot and it was a.
It was a battle to to get thirdplace.
I was beat the hell up afterthat tournament.
My, I have a pic my dad has apicture on his phone.
It's of me winning my bloodround.
It was after I won my bloodround match and I facetimed him

(48:07):
and my whole mouth is justdripping blood I don't know what
happened, but my teeth areliterally bright red.
My mouth is soaked, like I haveno clue what happened to this
day.
I don't know what I did all Iknew is that I was excited as
hell and I had just placed atthe freaking iron man tournament
as a 14 year old kid, as afreshman at the, at 160 pounds

(48:27):
unheard of the president likethis, isn't this?
Isn't.
This isn't 106, this isn't 113.

Speaker 2 (48:32):
Nothing against my little guys out there, no, no,
yeah, I'm wrestling, I'mactually grown men as an
undeveloped 14 year old kid Ihad no facial hair, I had a baby
face.

Speaker 3 (48:42):
Competing with these guys, man, like it was, it was
tough and looking back to thisman, it was a tough tournament.
Oh god, it was a toughtournament to put that into
perspective.

Speaker 2 (48:52):
So you, that was that was powering, so liam that was
iron man, iron man iron man.
Sorry, that was iron man.
So liam going into, I thinkgoing into his eighth grade year
just before he was a freshman,he was kind of at the 100-pound
range just before state came andI took him in for his health
check at the school and theytold me he was 125.
I said he's 100.

(49:12):
What I?
Just literally had him.
That was COVID and I had himregistered for that year before
they said it was kind ofcanceled, that I had him
registered at a hundred pounds.
So I took him and I put him ina 15 year.
He was 12, 13.
I think I put him in a 15 yeartournament at 125 pounds Cause I
told him I was like this iswhat you're headed towards.
So, unless you think you wantto keep doing this, that was

(49:35):
another come to Jesus moment forhim.
But for you to be going intoIronman and 160 pounds at 14,
yes, highly impressive.
That is that man you were.
Obviously.
What Wyoming Seminary wasputting into their food was
working all right and the workyou've been putting in too was
pretty impressive.
Were you at any point like wasthat the birth of the mouth

(49:57):
guard for you by chance?

Speaker 3 (50:02):
at any point like, uh , was that the birth of the
mouth guard for you by chance?
No, the birth of the mouthguard, um, was um rest of master
giovanni.
Um, yeah, because I freaking, Igot the takedown in overtime and
I came down on his hip with mymouth open, so I took a hip
right into my tooth and my mouthwas just completely bloody and,
um, I remember, like after thematch, my mouth was just an

(50:24):
excruciating pain.
Adrenaline was gone, um, and Iwas just like, oh my god, like
this is like, yeah, I just wonthis match, but holy piss, this,
yeah, like this is so painful.
I literally had my tooth, wasliterally lodged in my gum.
I was like I don't know whatI'm gonna do about this and I'm
like so that, uh, the next,those next couple of weeks, I
ended up getting the mouth guardfitted for a mouth guard and

(50:45):
now it's yeah.
Ever since then, I've beenwearing a mouth guard.
I I hate wrestling without one.
I can't do it.

Speaker 2 (50:51):
So let's, let's talk a little bit now, cause I on the
flow, wrestling or whatever tobe able to see some of those
matches, and you should.
I watched about four of themtoday and, dude, you're so,
you're it's watching, youwrestle and you're not, you're
not predictable, because youhave so much in your toolbox and
watching the pace that youwrestle at and that you're able

(51:12):
to go to is is impressive.
So obviously, all this stuff,going into everything you've put
into it, you can see it.
I mean, just watching all theseflow matches, where were you
starting to get, uh, like Iguess not contacted, but coaches
, like you're at a tournament,super 32 for example, anything
like that?
Where are you starting to havecollege coaches kind of walk up

(51:33):
to you?
Hey, we're watching you, buddy,you know that kind of thing.
When did that start to kind ofhappen for you?

Speaker 3 (51:37):
um, probably around Ironman, was it?
I mean?

Speaker 2 (51:39):
that tournament was just They'll put you on the map.

Speaker 3 (51:42):
I mean, it was so pivotal and I think a lot of
people knew who I was.
You know I was a freshmancoming in.
I was on the starting lineupfor Sim.
You know that's already unheardof Freshman starting lineup at
Sim doesn't make a lot of sense.
Not a lot of guys do that,unless your name's Bo Bartlett,
right, and that guy is a hammerin and of itself.

(52:03):
Um, you know he was.
He was then too, even when hewas a freshman in high school,
so it's just unheard of.
Um.
So that already raised someflags, I think, for people.
And I think my performancethere and I think these guys
watching me, you know, runthrough the tournament the way
that I did there, was like holy,holy, piss, dude, this kid
might be, might be the big deal.
Um, so yeah, and I think thatwas that was kind of when I saw

(52:25):
coaches and um.
So my dad went to mizzou.
I'm related to jayden cox yes,that's his alma yeah, my cousin.
That's his alma mater where hegraduated from on three national
titles there, so you know, Igrew up going to the tiger style
camps.
You know I I trained with mikeireman a few times, yeah, um,

(52:46):
like I, I that was.
That was like my school.
I guess you could say that waswhere, like, at the end of the
day, that's where I thought myhead was going and that's where
I thought I was gonna be like.
I ended up having to change myheadgear, like at the beginning
of the year my freshman yearbecause I would wear this mizzou
headgear with tigers on them,you know and I was like.
I just don't know if that'sreally what I want to keep

(53:07):
wearing I'm just gonna driftsome colleges away from me.
Um, so that was the headgear Iwas wearing at the time and um,
yeah, so I would wear it all thetime.
And, um, it was just, it was mything.
But yeah, so that was like mylike school that I thought I was
always going to end up at Likeno matter.
I was like no matter whathappens.
I didn't even know about therecruiting process at this time

(53:28):
I was like no matter whathappens, I'm going to be a Tiger
.
That's what I thought was goingto happen.
So yeah, but I think that matchwas when I got a lot of eyes
and you know, obviously got the,the, the mail that you guys
probably get, the filling outthe recruiting sheet oh yeah
school sent to everyone, ofcourse um but yeah, that's when

(53:49):
you know it first started topick up.

Speaker 2 (53:51):
Okay, sure, that's it .
That's kind of why I asked,because it again, you, your path
wasn't the typical path, likeyou know, the whole moving at 14
and things like that, and I Ithink it kind of goes with like
Carrie Cole I'd said the samething, like my dad did this with
me, it doesn't necessarily meanit's going to work with the
next kid.
No, they, they obviously yourparents were, you know, they
talked to you about things youhad.

(54:12):
You had some input and youdecided this is what you wanted
to do and obviously, if it paidoff, so we can see, yeah, for
sure.

Speaker 3 (54:21):
It was definitely what I needed.
You know what.
I mean, and at that point intime that was what I needed, and
that's the type of parents thatI needed, and the type of
parents I still have to this day.
That's how they operate with me, you know, because they know
that's how I thrive, that is howI do my absolute best, you know
.
And with them in my corner, theway that they are, the way that

(54:48):
they have been.
That's what I needed.
It is not for every kid.
It is not for every kid to goto boarding school at 14 years
old.
It's not, and it takes aspecial type of kid Hell, it
takes a special type of parentto ship their kid off like that.
You what I mean it takes, ittakes a lot, it takes a lot.
It takes a special type ofhousehold to be able to do that
and um I think we had a specialtype of relationship me and my

(55:08):
mom and my dad to be able to dothat.

Speaker 2 (55:11):
So yeah, so you, it was three years at wyoming sim,
right, yeah, so freshmansophomore junior year.
Yeah, yeah.
So where those three years atthe end let's talk about, maybe
kind of towards the end of it?
Was that because you moved toIowa City, right?
Was that a decision based offof already what college you

(55:31):
wanted to go to Like?
How did you guys kind of decidethat move?

Speaker 3 (55:37):
My junior year was a very, very, very challenging
year for me.
Okay, it started off great Likethe beginning of my junior year
was a very, very, verychallenging year for me.
Um, it started off great.
Like the beginning of my junioryear, I won who's number one?
Number one in the nation.
I completed.
I completed a milestone of minesince I started wrestling.
You know that was.
I always wanted to be numberone in the nation.
That was my thing.
Um, recruiting was tough.

(55:59):
Recruiting was was really tough, and it it's it doesn't get
tough.
It doesn't, yeah, it doesn't gettalked about a lot of enough.
I don't think, um, as a highlevel kid man, I was getting
hounded like I was.
I was like top five in myrecruiting class at the time,
like I was getting hounded byschools, like coach would text,

(56:19):
text me hey, what are you doing?
I don't know.
Probably the same thing I wasdoing 10 minutes ago when you
texted me and asked me the samething.
Still sitting in my room.
I'm actually currently lookingat my chem honors homework.
Right now that I have no cluewhat I'm looking at because I
haven't been able to payattention to classes because
I've been on the phone everysecond with 20 different college
coaches.
So, yeah, yeah, every secondwith 20 different college

(56:47):
coaches.
So, yeah, yeah.
So it is it, man, it's a lot,it's a lot and it the, the texts
, the calls, the visits, the,the questionnaires, the freaking
everything.
Man yeah it's a freaking lot andit takes a toll on you as a I
was what, maybe 16 years old, 16years.
At this time, it takes a tollon you because you're I was what
maybe 16 years old, yeah, 16years at this time it takes a
toll on you because you're notused to that.
You're not used to having thattype of like oh, we want you.
And like, I remember when, whenJuly 15th is the, is the

(57:11):
recruiting date?
Right?
I think that's what it is.

Speaker 2 (57:13):
I think it's July 15th or 16th, yeah, something
like that.

Speaker 3 (57:16):
Yeah, I think yeah, yeah, I don't want to.
Yeah, I think it's 15th, it'sdefinitely july.
It's definitely july 15th.
Yep, yep, because I remember soat the time I was still a cadet
, um, but july 14th I was goingto tulsa duels, or junior,
junior duels in tulsa, oklahoma,right and um, it was july 14th.

(57:38):
Was that night that we left?
I'm in the middle of cuttingweight.
I don't want to deal withpeople.
I'm kind of hating my liferight now, like I don't want to
talk to anyone.
Leave me the hell alone, right?
Um, unfortunately it justdidn't happen for me.
Um, so I remember getting onthe bus and um, my coach is one

(57:59):
of my coaches, coach TerryAllison.
He's like hey, dude, like Iknow you want to go to bed, but
you're going to have to be up.
I'm like, terry, I just gotdone working out.
I do not want to talk to anyone.
And sure enough, before we goton the bus, 12 o'clock hit.
I got a phone call.
I'm like, dude, you got to beshitting me, was it Terry man

(58:24):
phone call.

Speaker 2 (58:24):
I'm like dude.
You gotta be shitting me, wasit no?

Speaker 3 (58:25):
terry allison okay, I was.
I thought, oh, you're justcalling.
Who called me?
Oh no, no, it was it was alexclemson.
Oh really, yeah, okay he used tobe an assistant at mizzou, yeah
, and so we obviously had thatrelationship from him being
there.
So, yeah, um, yeah, that was.
He was one of my first phonecalls and I was like I answered
it, you know, I was like, oh,that's pretty cool and I was
like I just didn't really thinkpeople were gonna be calling at

(58:46):
12 o'clock.
Oh and um, dude, this was this,was.
This is funny, this is funnystuff yeah, I go to.
I go to bed.
I go to bed on the because wetook a bus there.
We drove from georgia tooklahoma.
We took a big old you knowparty from Georgia to Oklahoma.
We took a big old party busthere.
Cool, I went to sleep, knockedout.
I'm like, dude, I'm tired.
I got done working out.
We got a long bus ride.

(59:06):
I need to go to bed, go tosleep.
I wake up to Terry shaking me.
Dude, you need to answer yourfreaking phone.
I got coaches calling me likesaying you're not't.
I grab my phone, I look at itHoly piss, missed call.
Missed call.
Text text text Missed call.
Missed call, missed call.
I'm like, oh my God and dude, Iwas just like I was mind blown

(59:30):
and even when I woke up thesecond I woke up, I had another
phone call.
I'm like, hey, who's this?
I'm trying to worry aboutwrestling, but I got all these
freaking college coaches blowingup my phone like a crazy
girlfriend.
I'm like holy hell, dude.
So it was crazy, man, it wascrazy, but it was just it's a

(59:52):
lot, and I say that because thatkind of took a toll on me in my
junior year.
It was just a lot of.
Oh yeah, it was a lot of.
The visits were a lot too, man.
It's just, we set up my visitsfor after who's number one and I
was gone basically everyweekend.
Like one weekend, one weekend,this visit, next weekend, this

(01:00:13):
visit, next weekend, this visit.
I had five.
So I had like five weekends ofback to back to back to back to
back official visits.
And they go all out for yourofficial visits.
You eat a lot of food, you getreal heavy, you know, and that
end of the month I had to goback to Ironman.

Speaker 2 (01:00:31):
Yeah, nike's.

Speaker 3 (01:00:33):
Yeah, wow, and I was 170.
And at the time I was justnowhere near 170.
So that was um makes two of usum.
So I'll give you the whole loreof my junior year.
yeah and um, so, yeah, thathappened and I think the last

(01:00:55):
one I took was virginia tech Iwant to say it was my last one
that I ended up taking and, um,so I took that visit and, um,
you know, I came back and I hadto certify for, for um, I had to
certify for the year.
I hadn't certified yet.
All my teammates had certified,but I hadn't certified yet.
So I had to.
Yeah, I was like here here,here, here, here over here I'm

(01:01:16):
actually over there too um, so,yeah, I had to get, I had to
freaking certify weight and Ididn't certify for the weight
class until for my weight class,until like that week of ironman
, oh yeah, yeah, and I certifiedand that took a lot out of me,

(01:01:37):
as is I had to get down to acertain amount of weight.
So, because I had to basicallybe on weight, because I didn't
have enough time to get it off,you know, and the the weight
certification plan works youweigh in a certain way.
You can lose x amount of weighteach week I had to be on weight
because we were the week of thetournament just like that
exactly.
My descent program was half apound.

(01:01:59):
I couldn't do.
There was nothing.
There was nothing more, so wowwe got.
We got it in at the last momentand um, holy cow, yeah, dude, it
was.
It was challenging to get downand um, so we got there, we got
down and um got down to wait foriron man and uh wrestled the
first day and, you know, secondday rolled around and it was

(01:02:20):
challenging to get weight off.
Um, I had to put so much backin me because I had completely
fried my body that whole weekjust to get just to fricking,
make weight, make weight forcertifications, you know.
And um, just weight wasn't,weight was sticking on me, man,
I couldn't get it off and itsucked, it was awful and that

(01:02:41):
was like one of my worst weightcutting times, right there.

Speaker 2 (01:02:46):
And just, it took a lot.
It took a lot out of me.
Were you ever kind of taughtabout not weight cutting but
like nutrition?
Oh, definitely.

Speaker 3 (01:02:55):
I definitely had my fair share of nutrition meetings
and how to do it the right way.
Was I listening?
Absolutely not.
We had my fair share ofnutrition meetings and how to do
it.
The right way um was Ilistening absolutely not because
I talked about um marching tothe beat of my own drum.
Sometimes, yeah, I do that alittle too much, actually yeah,
the drum is your plate.
Yeah, exactly you know, I'mjust picking up food to food to
mouth, food to mouth with themouth sure yeah, but anyways.

(01:03:17):
So yeah, day one iron manhappened and uh couldn't get
that weight off, and second daycame around and I missed weight
by a pound and a half, somethinglike that.
I missed weight by a whole poundand it was, like I said, it was
tough and you know that wasjunior year, was hard and that
kind of started the descent alittle bit.
After that I took some time offand regathered myself and came

(01:03:42):
back home and had a couple morehouse visits and, um, by that
time I wrestled powerade andpowerade didn't go the way I
wanted.
After I I thought I, I or thiswas before, this was before
powerade, um, so I went backhome.
I went back home after atournament.
It's called I forget the nameof it, but we have our own

(01:04:04):
tournament, that Wyoming Simruns, and so I didn't wrestle in
that.
I skipped that.
After that I went back homebecause Ironman's in
December-ish time, so by thenit's time to go back home for
Christmas.
So I went back home.
I was home for a little bit, andthe time that I was home we had
made a decision on which schoolI was going to and so it was a.

(01:04:28):
It was a huge, huge weightlifted off my plate, but I still
had the, I still had the voicesand everything else going on
and having to deal with it.
So Ironman ended up not goingas planned, ended up getting.
I lost on the front side toDanny and then on the back side
I lost to Rocco.
Um, suck, butt, but you know itwas what it was.

(01:04:48):
Um and that was.
But it was to me like thattournament sucked because I
didn't win, but at the same timeit was such a sigh of relief
because I had already committed.
I had told Iowa that I wasgoing to be there and I told all
the other coaches no, like Iwas.
It was a huge weight lifted offmy shoulder, but I still had a

(01:05:08):
little bit of carry on anxietyfrom you know, from that a
little bit, because of you know,just telling coaches no and
making this big decision Likethis is a big, life-changing
decision, you know.
So, at Powerade South, nowwinning, winning it.
But at the same time I was likedude, like I am glad this is
over.
You know, I I am, I am morethan glad that this is over.

(01:05:28):
This is the greatest thing ever.
I just had it felt like a hugeweight lifted off my shoulders
and, um, I remember like I um,stayed at my girlfriend's place
my girlfriend at the time.
I stayed at her, her place afterPowerade and I was there.
I was just so happy becausethis recruiting process was done

(01:05:48):
and I made the right decisionand knew where I wanted to be at
and it was a great time, man, Ihad found my home and even with
Powerade not going the way Iwanted, I was happy, I was
content.
I got back to Sim and I workedout that day.
I felt great.
Then that next morning rolledaround and I was like I'm going

(01:06:10):
to go work out in the morning,it's time to get back on my
horse.
It's time to do the things thatI know I need to be doing to be
the best possible wrestler Ipossibly can.
This was a practice I didn'thave to go to.
I went and I you know I wasdoing well, I was wrestling well
, and I'm going live with one ofthe guys on the team and, um, I

(01:06:31):
put I'm wrestling them and putmy hands, I place my hands on
them and I turn my hands and mybody turns, but my leg stays in
the mat oh secondthat happens heard a and that
was all she wrote.
I was in instant pain.
I was just like I knewsomething was wrong.
Something was wrong and it wasmy meniscus.
It's not a huge thing, but youknow, at that point in time we

(01:06:54):
were at the end of the season,so I had maybe a couple more
events left until, or I had wehad like a couple duels left and
then we had a tournament, thenpreps.
I didn't have enough time toget my knee healed.
My meniscus was displaced andit sucks because that was the
week of the Blair duel.

Speaker 2 (01:07:14):
Oh yeah, good one for you guys, man.
Yeah, it's a huge one for us.

Speaker 3 (01:07:17):
You know, yeah, for you guys, yeah, it's a huge one
for us.
You know, um, and I, I, I leftout of it and, um, you know that
my junior year was just so highand low, high and low, and it
was more low than high, morethan anything, and I, I needed
my, I needed my parents with me,no matter we knew at the end of
the day, no matter if, becausewe were throwing around the idea
of because I didn't want toleave, I, I just, yeah, I I

(01:07:39):
didn't want to leave, but at thetime I didn't have.
Scott green wasn't there at thetime.
Scott was coaching at westpoint.
Um, the assistant coach thathad been with me since my
freshman year.
He wasn't there anymore.
He was coaching another school.
It was, um, what else is hisname?
Uh, cornell.
Cornell was the head coach atthe time and he wasn't.
He's not a.
Uh, I I won't say anything badabout him because he was.

(01:08:03):
He's not a bad coach whatsoever.
He has tons of success.
Yeah, but he wasn't what Ineeded.
Yeah, he wasn't what was for meat that point in time.
I needed someone to be up mybutt and I needed someone to,
because I'm still a kid man.
I'm still in my developmentyears.
I still needed someone to takeme out of the ring and really
push me to the level I needed tobe at, and I just didn't have

(01:08:26):
that.
So that took a toll on me.
It took a toll on my mental, ittook a toll on my wrestling, it
took a toll on everything myemotional, just everything.
And junior year was rough.
It was a rough year for me andafter that me and my parents
decided, like, wherever it'sgoing to be at, it's either
going to be at Sim or it's goingto be in Iowa City.

(01:08:46):
We're going to be with you.
And I was completely fine withthat because that's what I
wanted.
I knew I wanted my parents withme for my senior year of high
school.
I wanted them to be there forsenior night and to take
pictures and to walk out with mymom on the mat and her get
flowers.
You know, these are things thatyou, you want to do as a correct
, as a senior in high school man, and I wanted my parents to be

(01:09:07):
a part of it for my senior year,you know.
So we didn't know where it wasgoing to be at at the time, but,
um, me and my dad came and wesaw a duel.
Um, we watched um, I think itwas I think I was wrestling
wisconsin at the time a coupleyears ago um, and then we came
out for a duel and ben was likejokingly.

(01:09:27):
he was like, hey, dude, comecheck out my high school.
I'm like all right, dude, meand my dad think it's just gonna
be super informal, just gonnabe me and him, um, me, him and
me, ben and my dad, um, the headcoach ended up coming and
showing us around.
Wow, we got to walk around theschool.
We're like, wow, this is cool,not thinking anything of it, of

(01:09:47):
course, me and my dad had a fewconversations of maybe moving
here.
We're like, yeah, it probablyjust wouldn't happen.
What are we thinking?
dude, all right, whatever wecome here for training camp,
training camp, you guys haveactually been to a couple of
times uh training camp for theus open.
Um we go there, and um we gothere.
And so my mom, my mom, ended upcoming up um why, I don't

(01:10:12):
really know.
You know, I think we wanted tosee the coaches again, see the
school hang out with the coaches.
Whatever, it's cool I was thereexactly.
You know, I was there to trainfor the freaking open um.
At that time I was still u17, Iwas training for u17 trials.
Um, I was hanging out with allmy boys, colby ben, all those
guys you know, nice, yeah, sothat happened, they came out,

(01:10:34):
and so now my mom, my dad, wentto city high, got a tour from
the principal and the head coachand so, for lack of a better
term, shit started to get real.

Speaker 2 (01:10:45):
Yeah right.

Speaker 3 (01:10:51):
At this point we're like all right, dude, this ain't
no just casual walk around.
We had.
I remember we got.
I remember we had a talk and wewere just like, yeah, dude, I
think this is we got to makethat.
It wasn't until after trialsU-17 trials that we made the
decision to move to Iowa Citybecause trials didn't go the way

(01:11:12):
I wanted and I didn't have whatI needed still then and we
didn't think that I was going toget what I needed at sim again.
You know, okay, yeah, it was atough decision to make because
that was the place I called homefor three years, right, um
getting there was hard, leavingthere was even harder.
You know, I had made so manyfriends.
I had made so many justfriendships that I still have,

(01:11:36):
to this day, one of my roommatesthat I I room but I still talk
to this to this day.
I FaceTime all the time.
He lives in California.
We, I talked to him all thetime.
His name's Chris and he's oneof my best.
He was one of my best friendsThen, one of my best friends now
.
You know I had to.

Speaker 2 (01:11:54):
I had to leave all that behind you know what I mean
.

Speaker 3 (01:11:57):
It's a huge, was really tough.
Trials didn't go the way Iwanted to.
I was still not feeling thewell I'm feeling the greatest
emotionally and mentally, and,um, you know, my parents and I
decided it was it was time forfor a change and um, we made
that big leap from living ingeorgia to moving to iowa city
and, man, we haven't looked backsince but um, I will I talk

(01:12:18):
about after trials a little bit,because we talked about earlier
about, you know, um, just beingable to take a break, take a
walk away from a little bit.
And after trials, that was oneof the times I knew I needed to
take a break because if I wouldhave kept competing I would have
burnt out.
Okay and um, interesting, we,we took time off.
I took a lot of time off.

(01:12:38):
My next time competing aftercadet trials wasn't until lead
eight that August.

Speaker 2 (01:12:45):
Okay, that was a break, yeah, break, yeah, yeah,
I took a long time off.

Speaker 3 (01:12:50):
I took a long time off and it was just strictly
training, strictly being aroundfriends and the people that care
about me and that I care about,and, man, it was the best time
for me.

Speaker 2 (01:12:59):
It was so I can appreciate that because, looking
at what you know, just kind oflike with liam right now, with
the amount that, like when wetalk about covid man, I was
taking him to any dualtournament I could get him into
Cause he didn't know when thestuff was going to close up and
running him through the gauntletall the way up until you know
15 when we finally got him to aspot where I'm like I can let
him go, but you get to a certainpoint.

(01:13:22):
I mean it could be at 14 or itcould be your junior year where
you got to be able to sit backand be like I really love this
thing, but I need to get re.
It's almost recentering right.
Like you're, you're gettingback to what you thought you,
who, the person you were being akid, going camping or you know
doing whatever, just having funand just not having to think
about it.

Speaker 3 (01:13:41):
Do the things that make you happy, man.

Speaker 2 (01:13:43):
Yeah, yeah, that that make you you, you know right.
That's that make you you, youknow right, absolutely.
I mean, it could be either it'syou know, liam, or you or
Austin Asante, it doesn't matterwho it is.
You've got to figure out whoyou are and do the things that
are going to make you recenter,especially when you're in such a
grueling sport that this is.
You guys are taking that triparound the high school.
You guys made the move.

(01:14:10):
Obviously, I'd made yourdecision on where college is
going to be.
Yeah, um, at that point, wheredid you, did you, did you find
yourself?
Re, I guess, refocusing on whatyou actually want to do?
Obviously, everybody wants towin, you know, an ncaa title.
Who doesn't want that right?
That's why you go to a big 10school like iowa to be able to
to accomplish those things.
Did you ever think about?
And you said we know youcompete in it, but were your
eyes on a larger prize the wholetime when you were thinking
about a college Cause?
Even talking to Liam, his goalsare trying to get the world.

(01:14:31):
You know world trials and orworld teams, and in Olympic
trials and Olympic teams, wasyour focus a little further down
the road and not so in in frontof you, like next year's a.
I got to make sure I get to thebig tens or anything like that.
When you were thinking aboutcollege, was your?
Were you thinking about RTC?
How am like that, when you'rethinking about college, was your

(01:14:54):
were you thinking about rtc?

Speaker 3 (01:14:55):
how am I going to train to become the best guy
that I can make?
A world team, olympic team,aside from ncaas?
Was that your thought processas well?
My thought process was I needto be at the place that's going
to make me the best gay brotherthat I can possibly be.
And, um, all those milestones,all those minuscule things that
you talked about, in the grandscheme of being a better person,
iowa fit the bill for all of us.
So, national titles, worldtitles, olympic titles, all

(01:15:26):
these, my thing is I try tominimize these materialistic
things that people will forgetabout along down the road.
I minimize them because, in thegrand scheme of what I want to
become, they're small and theydo not matter and as much as
they may matter to me and I, youknow, I really want to be a

(01:15:48):
world champ, I really want to bean Olympic champ, I really want
to be a four time nationalchamp, like, I really want to do
those things.
But I got to look at the hugepicture of, you know, this crazy
thing that we call life.
You know what I mean and it'sit's important, you know, and
it's things that you have to doto stay centered.
You have to do to stay centeredand that's what you know.

(01:16:10):
That's what the time that I hadfrom, from trials a couple of
years ago to you know, eliteeight duels you know that was
what I did in that time.
You know I I recentered, andfor me to stay within myself, to
stay who I am, to keep mycomposure, I had to realize how
small these things were in thegrand scheme of things.

(01:16:31):
You know what I mean and itsounds crazy and I probably
sound like this guy who has thislike super, like weird makeup
on life, but you know it'simportant because it's how I
would cope, it's how I cope,it's how I, it's how I um, it's
how I am able to do the thingsthat I do and compete at a high

(01:16:52):
level and go to Iowa and do X, y, z, you know it just doesn't
matter.
You know what I mean and it'swhat I have to do, what I have
had to do to be at the levelthat I'm at.
But I knew that if that is whatI wanted, what I'm telling you
right now, if that is reallywhat I wanted, iowa was the
place, was the choice for me,and they fit the bill for being

(01:17:16):
the best version of Gabe Arnold,and they want that for me as
well.
And obviously they want thetitles, they want the
accomplishments, they want thedreams that I have.
They want all those things, butthey care about me being a
better person.
Tom and Terry instilled thatinto me, and Morningstar and
Telford and Dennis and all thoseguys in that room instilled

(01:17:36):
that into me on a daily basis.
It reminds me that I made theright decision a couple years
ago.

Speaker 2 (01:17:43):
That's awesome.
As you're edging towards theend of high school because you
moved to Iowa City, I watchedyour finals match Close match.
That was a barn burner man.
Absolutely, I'll tell you that.
But you gave those guys a showBoth you guys did.
I mean, it was an awesome match, right?
I'm watching, as now you'rewrestling 174 this year, I
believe.
Right, I don't know if you cangive whatever, but I think

(01:18:04):
you're wrestling 174.
What weight?
Whatever, but I think you'rewrestling 174.
What weight was that yoursenior year?
82, 182.
Let's talk about that for aminute.
So have you you're?
Yeah, I know you talk aboutcutting and having to make
weight for certain things andyou know, once you get to a
certain level, it's just part ofthe game.
When you started getting bigger, were you always wrestling up
and not cutting like, let's say,you're cutting.

(01:18:26):
I sounds like an iron man,you're cutting quite a bit
because it was hard right.
Were you ever at a point whereyou're like I'm done cutting,
I'm gonna wrestle up?

Speaker 3 (01:18:36):
yeah, that was, that was my senior year that was your
senior year, my senior year, Idid that because I was like I'm
gonna wrestle 74 next year,there's no reason for me to drop
lower than 74.
I'm not wrestling 170, I refuseto.
And so I was like, yep, nothappening, I'm going up.
And then connell was okay withit.
Hell, I was okay with it.
I was like, yeah, dude, this isawesome, let's do it yeah yeah

(01:18:57):
we needed it.
At the time we needed an 82 andI was like, hey, it turns out, I
happen to be 182 pounds worksout perfectly yeah that's
awesome.
Yeah, that was the decision and,um, I think the times in the
past it was never necessarilycutting per se.
Um, I just wanted to be alittle, uh, fat kid and, um, not
worry about my weight and notcare about nutrition.

(01:19:18):
Um, right now I'm in that sameposition.
You know, I wrestle 74 andright now this is me being
brutally honest I'm probablylike a buck 95 right now.
Nice, just how, just how itgoes.
Once preseason once preseasonhits, that weight will go down
and after the, after the lastrun of preseason, I'll be back
walking around around 85.
Just how my body works.

(01:19:40):
I lose weight like this.
I go, I go and practice rightnow Heck, I'm going to walk out
of the practice losing 10 pounds.

Speaker 2 (01:19:46):
Yeah, you guys do some pretty decent practices
yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:19:51):
My body just fires.
Once I get going, body getsfired, metabolism starts rolling
, sweat starts coming off,weight starts dropping Just how
it goes.
At this point in time, I got itdown to a science of where I
need to have my weight at to beefficient and not feel like
absolute dog piss.

Speaker 2 (01:20:10):
So yeah, that's important, yeah, it's huge man.

Speaker 3 (01:20:13):
It's huge at this level.
You know, even with thetwo-hour weigh-in man, you cut
your nuts off trying to get downto weight.
Oh dude, you're going to feelabsolutely terrible.
There's just, there's no wayaround it.
There's no way around it.
And everyone thinks it's twohour range.

(01:20:34):
It's, it's great, don't get mewrong.
It's way better than one hour,right, but it still sucks, yeah,
it doesn't make getting on theweight any more fun?
um, not at all.
It's still a struggle.
It's still a challenge.
And it's just.
But it's, it's definitely nice,it's definitely a change, but,
um, you know, if you don't do itthe right way, you're gonna
hate your life.
Um, so yeah, so you had a.

Speaker 2 (01:20:50):
You had a great season your senior year.
I think it's pretty evident.
I think a lot of people knowthat.
I think what I want to know,but I watched a couple
interviews with you.
It was, uh, I think one whenyou were still at iowa city, um,
and they kind of asked also onmedia day once you guys were at
at the university, what was yourwell, I guess, what was your
mind frame going from?

(01:21:11):
Now you're a senior and thenyou jump into the hawkeye
wrestling room.
I'm imagining just throwing itout there.
You probably had a couplepractices already in the hawkeye
wrestling room to kind of seewhat it was like and kind of get
the feel for it, because you'reright in town, right?
So was that transition for you?
Because you were right there,was that transition in just a
little easier?
Because you saw the things thatyou needed to do and probably

(01:21:33):
put into place by the time yougot there absolutely, yeah,
absolutely.

Speaker 3 (01:21:38):
My senior year I was.
I was there every day.
Don't know if I broke any rulesthere, but hell, why wouldn't
you be?
You can't.
You can't put me in trouble forthings that have already
happened, right yeah, right nono no, you can't get me in
trouble, you can't get me introuble, oh, but anyways, I was
in there by myself, on my ownaccord nice, okay, yeah, nice,

(01:22:00):
yeah, yeah, yeah, anyone anywaysso yeah, man, but it definitely
made the transition a loteasier.
I'm already here, I alreadyknow what to expect out of the
coaches.
I know who my teammates are.
I know everything about theseguys, you know, because I'm here

(01:22:20):
with them.
I see the work that they put in.
They see the work that I put in.
You know it's not.
It's for a multitude ofdifferent reasons it makes sense
to be there early.
You know, it's like taking agap year.
It's like you got kids whograduate high school and then
they go to the OTC.
You know it's the same thing.
It's basically the same thing.
Only difference is I'm stillwrestling in high school.

(01:22:43):
I basically just took a gapyear.
That's all I did.
I wrestled in Iowa City, Iwrestled in Iowa, the state of
Iowa, but you know, that wasn'tnecessarily what I was worried
about.
I was here so I could get usedto being here, you know, and
Iowa City is unique because it'sa college town, you know.
So, basically all the time.

(01:23:03):
You know I was downtown hangingout with friends or I was going
to eat downtown or doing stuffdowntown.
You know I was downtown hangingout with friends or I was going
to eat downtown or doing stuffdowntown, you know.
So I'm emerged in that culture.
I I know what to expect.
I know I knew how tough it wasgoing to be to park for classes
before I was even there.
So I knew the struggles thatwere going to be faced, you know
.
So it's yeah, it's definitelythat's.

(01:23:24):
I would say he's definitelyunique when it comes to that
because of how rich andimmersive of a college town it
is.
So it was definitely huge forme to be here early.
I know the traffic of downtownIowa City.
I know how to get from.
I know how quick it's going totake me to get from point A to
point B.
I know how quick it's going totake me to get from Pomerantz

(01:23:45):
all the way over to freaking,where we have to meet with Doug
and all that stuff that I forgetthe name of it because I
haven't been in school in solong.
Yeah, but you know, I knowthese things you know, and being
there, being here a year early,made that transition that much
easier.
So I would definitely say forkids that are, you know who are

(01:24:07):
going, who are you already haveyour school to set it.
You know where you're going tobe.
This is going to be the place Ithink it's.
I mean, hell, try to get yourparents to move with you if you
can.
If you can't figure out a way toget there early by yourself,
you know, find someone to staywith or something, because I
think I really think it made itmade my wrestling jump levels.
I was.
I was so much happier.

(01:24:29):
My, my, my mental was just likedude, I was glowing being here.
I love it.
I love it.
Man, I was fricking.
I love Iowa city.
I love everything about thisplace and the school that I was
at city high was amazing.
It was what I needed.
It was exactly what I neededand it was like that it was.
My senior year was just such abreath of fresh air.

(01:24:50):
Man, to be honest, like did it?
Suck that.
Making that pro team, yeah, butit was just dude like I.
I had no worries.
It was all I had to do wasfocus on school and wrestling.
I had my parents here, man.
It was great.
Good it was.
It was.
It was awesome, man, and I hada.
I had a great team at the time.
I love City High.
I will forever be indebted tothat place.

(01:25:12):
Coach Connell was probably thebest thing that could have
happened to me.
I needed another coach likethat, like the way he was with
me and he was awesome.
He still is awesome.
Another one of those guys Ibuilt a great relationship with
and I still keep in contact withto this day because he was.
He was just that amazing for me, man, and it was God.
It was what I needed and he didso much.

(01:25:33):
He probably doesn't even knowhow much he did for me, but he,
he did so much for me that hewill probably never know.
Maybe if he watches in there atthis interview he'll he'll,
he'll know.
But he did he a lot.
He didn't want this for me andyou know I just my senior year
was awesome, man.
It was, like I said, a breathof fresh air and that's the best

(01:25:54):
way to put it so you roll up.

Speaker 2 (01:25:57):
Now you're an iowa hawkeye, right, you?
You made the decision, you'rethere.
Uh, you know you're going toschool.
I remember in an interview youtalked about time management.
You kind of talking about italready as far as trying to
figure out where to, how to getto where and doing what.
So you're, you're starting tofigure this stuff out.
That a parent hopes that theirkid figures out, right, you know
, just because, holy crap, if hedoesn't figure out how to get
to class in time, we're screwedand we're gonna be paying more

(01:26:19):
money than we want to fromschool.
When you finally get to thatpoint where you've been training
and then all of a sudden,they're like, hey, we need you
to suit up tonight.
What was that like in carverhawkeye, putting that singlet on
and coming out with the flamesgoing and you know the the?
The whole selling point of ofiowa is just that environment.
Yeah, what was that like foryou growing into that?

(01:26:40):
I already saw what happened,obviously, with the state finals
that you had.
I mean, iowa loves wrestling, Ino one's dummy to that.
But now you're in.
Now you're in carver hawkeye.
What was that like for you thatfirst time you put that singlet
on a walkout?

Speaker 3 (01:26:52):
I've always been a fan of the big lights.
Um, I love wrestling and itjust being me and me.
You know what I mean and that'show I view it.
Um, I love the fans of car.
I love the fans of iowa.
I love, I love that.
It's just, it's just somethingabout it that just freaking puts
a big old shitting grin on myface.
I love it and I show up for itevery time.

(01:27:15):
I love the atmosphere, I lovebeing emerged in that.
It's what I love.
It's what I live for.
Man, I absolutely love it.
I love that feeling.
I was definitely nervous myfirst time coming out and this
it's a lot, you know, but thesecond I step on that mat and I
thank the lord for putting me inthe position that I'm in.

(01:27:36):
You know, I know it's gonnatime, you know, and I get out
there and I I do what I gotta doand you know, hopefully I come
away with the win almost everytime.
You know that's the plan,that's what we'd like to do,
obviously, but you know it'syeah, it was, it was, it was
amazing.
There's just no other way toput it.
It was just.
I never really had the, thefeeling of like, like ben, for

(01:27:57):
instance.
Ben had that, that feeling ofgrowing up being a hawk fan, you
know and all he could thinkabout when he started wrestling
was walking out in thosewarm-ups in that thing, like
being that guy.
You know I I never had that,you know.
But I can imagine what it waslike to have that dream and you
know I've, I've lived that, youknow.

(01:28:18):
So, yeah, that in and of itselfis a blessing to be able to do
that.
Not many people can say they'vedone that, not many people at
all.
There's a very small percentageof people that can say they ran
out of that tunnel with thatsinglet on and went to fricking
war and carve a hot iron.
You know, you know, and I I'mglad I get to be a part of that
small percentage.
Um, but it was, it was amazingman and I I loved it, I lived

(01:28:51):
for it and I cannot wait to seewhat the season brings, but I'm
excited, I'm excited I knowwe're excited to watch.

Speaker 2 (01:28:57):
I mean, no one's dumb enough to think that I'm not an
iowa fan.
I have been since I was fiveyears old wrestling so that's
just where I stand and when youmentioned.
It was funny when you mentioned, uh, wearing the headgear with
the miss Missouri stickers on itand stuff like that.
Like I think it was Liam'sfreshman year.
We're like, hey, maybe not wearso much Iowa stuff.
I mean we don't want to paint apicture quite yet about what

(01:29:20):
you know because he goes throughyour options open.
It was nice going down to thatcamp because you had guys like
DeSanto and you and Drake andall those guys telling me I'm
like hey, just still keep yourmind open.
You know you'd still, you stillgot to figure out you like it's
, you have your dreams, you haveyour aspirations, but you still
got to figure out you.
So it was good to hear thatfrom those guys down there,
because I could sit there and belike man.

(01:29:41):
I want my kid to be a hockeyman, but I wanted to go.

Speaker 3 (01:29:50):
I'm gonna be a fan of wherever he goes um, I'm still
gonna be turning on float orespn or whatever, to watch the
iowa hawk when they had seasontickets for like two years down
that.

Speaker 2 (01:29:54):
So we're always gonna be fans of that, but we're
gonna be a fan of no matterwhere he goes.
When you started, kind of yougot into the groove.
You started wrestling.
We saw you at some events, sawyou at some duels.
You're wrestling, uh, trying toget on world teams.
Things like that are you.
Are you finding yourself that,that decision, and you said it,
you love it there and it's theplace where you're you're

(01:30:15):
growing.
Have you decided that maybethis is someplace I stay to
coach?
Is that something that's onyour brain?
As far as uh, getting gettingtowards the and you still got
four years left, I don't wantyou to think of the end of your
career yet, but when?
When it comes down to it, whatare your aspirations once you're
done with college, once you'redone being in school?
What do you want to do?

Speaker 3 (01:30:38):
My plan is to play with venomous snakes for the
rest of my life.

Speaker 2 (01:30:41):
Damn you and Max Mirren huh.

Speaker 3 (01:30:45):
Well, max is coaching and I.
Ms Hiss was just a.
I think he just cared for herin the best way he could.
He loved having her yeah.
But I plan on taking thisreptile thing all the way.
I my my main goal is to have areptile zoo where I milk
venomous snakes.
And you know, that's my, that'smy dream.

Speaker 2 (01:31:04):
What the hell are you talking about?

Speaker 3 (01:31:07):
Okay, mean like so yeah, so like there's, like
obviously, when you get bit by avenomous snake, um, like
there's, there's anti-venom,right well anti-venom to be made
.
Same thing with antibiotics.
You got to have venom, right,yeah?
So you extract said snake venomand you ship it off to these
people and they inject.
Inject it in the cattle, whichcreates the antibodies.

(01:31:27):
They pull it out of said cattle, put it into a little capsule,
spin it around super fast andthen.
So by the time you get it,you'll get it in a powder form,
but it doesn't turn into aliquid until it's mixed in with
the IV fluid.

Speaker 2 (01:31:40):
You're a biomedical genius at this point, Holy cow
man.

Speaker 3 (01:31:45):
This has been my dream since I've been a kid man.
I love snakes.
I has been my dream since I'vebeen a kid man.
I love snakes.
I've loved reptiles since I wasyoung man.
I have six snakes.
I got one in my room right now.
My other five are at myparents' place right down the
street.
So I absolutely live for thisstuff.
I love it and that's what Iplan on doing.
I want to play with venomoussnakes and things that are
probably going to kill me.

(01:32:06):
Once this is all said and done,the coaches won't let me do it
now.

Speaker 2 (01:32:10):
Of course not.

Speaker 3 (01:32:13):
They need me for at least four more years.

Speaker 2 (01:32:15):
Well, you were surrounded by water moccasins
and stuff like that Me and mybrother.

Speaker 3 (01:32:20):
me and my brother grew up catching those things
all the time.
We grew up catchingrattlesnakes and copperheads and
water moccasins and freakinggarter snakes dude, you name it
I.
So I grew up around thosethings.
I know how to catch them.
I've headed venomous snakesplenty of times in my life.
I'll do it again.
It's it's, it's nothing.
It's nothing.
It's nothing new to me.
I I love it.

(01:32:41):
I love it so much.
And it's like a lot of peopleget their thrill and adrenaline
from being on heights.
I am honestly not a big fan ofheights and I know a lot of
people are their thrill andadrenaline from being on heights
.
I am honestly not a big fan ofheights and I know a lot of
people are afraid of snakes, somy poison is snakes.
I choose snakes and I loveplaying with them, and
particularly I love playing withvenomous ones.

Speaker 2 (01:32:57):
Nice.

Speaker 3 (01:32:58):
That's my thing and that's what I love.
Those things, man, they'reawesome.
Someone's got to do it, man,someone's got to do it, it and
unfortunately it just happens tobe me.

Speaker 2 (01:33:07):
so so we know, we know your, we know your plans.
So, okay, you, what you'regonna, you're gonna doesn't mean
I'm out of what I'm done.

Speaker 3 (01:33:13):
Yeah, it doesn't mean once I'm done competing, I'll
be away from it forever, butyeah, I've been thinking about
this since I was a kid man and Iwould be stupid not to live out
that dream that I've wanted todo you know what I mean I talk.

Speaker 2 (01:33:24):
You're talking about the gay path.
That's the Exactly.

Speaker 3 (01:33:27):
I told you I marched the beat of my own drum and my
drum ain't for everybody.
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:33:32):
Definitely not me, that's for sure.
You want to invite us to have alook at some snakes?
It's fine, but I'm going to dothat whole COVID thing, that's
for sure.

Speaker 3 (01:33:40):
Maybe a little bit more.

Speaker 2 (01:33:42):
Yeah, maybe, Depending on how long the snake
is for God's sake, let's talkabout a couple things here is
for god's sakes.
So let's talk about a couplethings here.
I had a.
I had a guy that said he wantedme to ask a couple questions.
I'll ask one of them.
So obviously we've gotten tosee you wrestle on some of the
the other levels as far astrying to make world teams,
things like that.
We watched a mat with you or amatch with you wrestling a guy,
uh, from nebraska, right, and itcame to the end you were

(01:34:05):
winning.
You won.
Uh, doing some doing some buttpatting.
Was that just a hey, good match, buddy, nice try, though kind
of thing was that?
What was that fun?
Was that just kind of rising aguy up a little bit?
Because?

Speaker 3 (01:34:17):
I get it one for one.
He did nothing the whole match.
That's for starters.
Um, I didn't.
I wasn't a hugest fan of that.
I never am um yeah, liam's noteither.

Speaker 2 (01:34:26):
He hates that yeah, for two.

Speaker 3 (01:34:28):
Um, he started to get a little chippy with me and you
know if you're going to give itback to me.
I wrestle in the Iowa roomevery day.
Dude, I'm not the guy to giveit to, because I promise you I
will give it right back to you.
Yeah, so he started with me alittle bit and you know I was
did I smack one of his balls inSolid work?

(01:34:50):
Was I smacked one of thosesolid work?
Yeah, no, I said.
I said solid work, a for effort.
And, um, you know, he got upwith me and he kind of shoved me
and he looked at me a littlebit oh dude, I'm not the one to
do that and he kind of gave me alittle little knife.
So I shoved him back down tothe mat and then he kept trying
to wrestle.
He grabbed my feet and I'm likeI mean, dude, at that point
I've smacked you on the butt,I've shoved you on your back.
Why are you grabbing my feetand playing trying to bite my
ankle right now, like you'remaking?
I've already made you lookreally dumb at this point.

(01:35:13):
So I mean, at this point weshould probably just leave it
alone before things really getout of hand.
But it's no hard feelings, it'sall in the, it's all in the
thing it's scrapping man yeah noand yeah no, and people have
their comments about it andwanting to call me a punk and
everything else.
But everyone has opinions abouteverything that I do, no matter
which side that I'm on.
It just doesn't make it.

(01:35:33):
Doesn't make it any easier thanI'm wearing an iowa singlet so
let's, let's talk about that.

Speaker 2 (01:35:38):
How do you, how do you, how do you block the noise
out, do you?
I mean, at the end of the dayI'm because you even told me
like hey, man, I'm not on here awhole lot, you know, kind of on
social media itself, right,like everybody says, oh you know
, nowadays kids should be onsocial media more, sell
themselves blah, blah.
Liam's not that much, you know,like even he's not, he doesn't
hear a lot of the noise thatgoes on.

(01:35:59):
You know that kind of thing.
So, as a as a high levelcollege athlete like that, how
are you able to block out thenoise and still be able to be
you?

Speaker 3 (01:36:07):
delete my socials.
Nice, that's and that's so I Ido it.
I've done deleting my socials.
Um, like since I was a freshmanin high school.
Like, leading up to bigcompetitions, instagram,
facebook, twitter goes bye-bye.
All of it goes bye-bye.
Um, I just okay, I don't, Ijust don't.
It's not what I need to immersemyself in before I get ready

(01:36:30):
for a big tournament.
And I still have TikTok.
You know, I look at TikTok, Iscroll through it.
I'm like, oh, dude, this isawesome.

Speaker 1 (01:36:36):
I like that, you know I gotta have something to
occupy me.

Speaker 3 (01:36:39):
I'm like a big iPad kid, you know I like looking at
YouTube and stuff watchingvideos all that stuff.
It's my thing, you know.
Know, I like doing that, butyou know I've good for you at
this point.
It's like, man, social media isso hit or miss nowadays.
It's like I I sometimes gets.
It's sometimes beneficial, mostof the time it's not.
Like after trials, I completelydeleted all my socials and I've

(01:37:00):
been off of them since um andI've stayed off of them just
because it's.
You know it's so like it's.
People say words don't hurt manas an athlete.
People will make sure wordswill hurt yeah um, yeah as they
will dig it into you, and eventhe people that say they love
you dude, you got your own, yougot your own.
Fan saying dude, screw this kid.

(01:37:21):
I'm like god ow yeah, right youa hawk fan?
I'm pretty sure I signed apicture for you and you hate me.
What the hell?
I'm like, dude come on youcan't win for losing out here.
But yeah, you know.
So it's a battle and just likeeverything in this sport, it's a

(01:37:42):
battle and finding the fineline for you is important.
I know my fine line.
Also.
A lot of the time, what peoplesay really does not bother me
that much, because I grew up ina household of just like I grew
up with an older brother, soI've taken just about everything
there is to take.
So, and at the end of the day,I know the type of person that I

(01:38:05):
am and I I know what I standfor and the things that these
people say and what they say tome about me, it it will never
phase me to the thing to thepoint that they think they phase
me because they say thesethings, because they think they
can arise out of you andeverything else and this, that
and the third.
And yeah, like I, like I saidearlier, opinions are like

(01:38:25):
assholes.

Speaker 2 (01:38:26):
We all have them, that's right, I know you're a
good kid man.
Obviously Liam was down there.
You kind of took him under yourwing a little bit and obviously
we were kind of doing things alittle crooked.
He was trying to lose weightfor the US Open when he should
have been trying to grab thatmuch weight.
We actually bumped him up aweight class then to wrestle
above, and that's genuinely whatwe've always done with him.
So you took him a little onyour wind cracks with him a

(01:38:48):
little bit and plus, I know hegot to kind of hang out with you
guys a little bit too.

Speaker 3 (01:38:50):
So yeah, that was.

Speaker 2 (01:38:52):
That was nice for him to be able to witness the, the
things that what you guysobviously show off the mat
having fun being kids, being theguys that you are in and
gelling as a team for the mostpart, and being able to do what
you guys want to do and beingable to keep that mind frames
tough and have all that noise.

Speaker 3 (01:39:09):
We are one big dysfunctional family.
We love each other.
Death but damn.

Speaker 2 (01:39:14):
We're dysfunctional and you know it's interesting
absolutely.

Speaker 3 (01:39:18):
We all have our own different personalities and
things we love to do.
We all march to the beat of ourown drum man and it's just
that's what makes.
I think that's what makes ourteam so unique, man, and I think
even with you know, we got guyswho weren't starters, who were
awesome to be around, and wehang out with them every day.
It's not, it's not okay.
This guy's here, so everyoneelse is down here, so we have to

(01:39:41):
worship this guy.
No, it's everyone together andit's just like I said it's.
We're one big dysfunctionalfamily.
We fight all the dang time.
We punch each other in themouth and practice we put each
other in the trash can, but thesecond, we, the second, we walk
into that locker room or we weget in that sauna or we were in
the shower together.
Man, it's just one bigdysfunctional family, man, and
we, we love each other to death.

(01:40:02):
We love each other likebrothers and we'll go to war for
each other every single day,every time out.
You know it doesn't matterwhere we are or who we're with.
It's just how it goes, you know.
So it's.
I'm glad that I'm here on thisteam because there's no one else
.
I would rather do that with.
There's after being here forI've been here for an actual

(01:40:23):
year now, you know, being aroundthe team constantly, and it's
instilled in me that I chose theright place, and there's no one
that I would rather do thiswith, besides the coaches that I
have, besides the teammatesthat I have.
You know what I mean?
It's just, it's refreshingknowing that I made the right
decision, even after a year.

Speaker 2 (01:40:42):
So tell you well, dude, we've been talking for a
while, man, and I reallyappreciate you, and what I
always like to do at the endI've talking for a while, man,
and I really appreciate you, andwhat I always like to do at the
end I've been doing thisrecently is you got shout outs,
things like that.
People you want to kind of, youknow, talk about, just like,
hey, I have much respect to thisperson, feel free to let them
fly.
I don't even care if it's acompany, I don't.
This stuff doesn't bother me.
So what you got shout outs youdon't know, I mean I've shouted

(01:41:03):
out everyone my parents, ofcourse mom and dad, of course.

Speaker 3 (01:41:07):
All my coaches back home, terry Donovan, coach
Charlie, all those guys CoachesI have here.
Of course they all know whothey are.
Tom Tade, morningstar, telford,all those guys.
Dennis Chad, beatty, the man,yeah All those guys.
Absolutely, Absolutely so yeah.
I'm in the best place to be thebest, best person, best version

(01:41:30):
I can possibly be, so I'mgrateful for that.
So thank you that's awesome.

Speaker 2 (01:41:33):
Well, we're gonna end it with that man and we're
gonna I'm gonna talk to you fora second after we're done, but
uh, hey, everybody, this hasbeen gabe arnold here on the
vision quest podcast.
Hope you enjoyed it because, uh, it was his story.
So, uh, all right, man, we'll.
Uh, we'll talk to you on theside here, but to everybody else
peace, thank you guys.

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