Ever wondered how a spark of inspiration can ignite a booming business? Brenna Millville, the force behind Elly and Grace, shares her journey from a conference lightbulb moment to shipping over half a million faith-based apparel pieces worldwide.
With her husband's support and a timely bonus from her previous job, Brenna’s leap into entrepreneurship is a story of faith, creativity, and grit. She opens up about challenges like Facebook advertising changes, design theft, and social media fact-checking snafus.
Despite these hurdles, Brenna's strategic decisions and authenticity have built strong brand loyalty through social media, email marketing, and direct customer communication. Tune in for invaluable lessons on balancing creativity with business and the power of staying true to your convictions.
Connect with Brenna Millville:
https://ellyandgrace.com
Connect with Tona and Al Haywood:
Website
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Tona Haywood (00:02):
The we Pivot podcast is for you if you're a
woman who has recently pivotedinto entrepreneurship.
You'll find digital marketingtips, trends and strategies to
help grow your business intoday's digital world.
Join Tona and Al Haywood as wehave fun breaking down all
things digital marketing, so sitback, relax and enjoy the show.
(00:25):
Hello everyone and welcome backto the we Pivot podcast.
Have I got a treat for you?
Today, I will be interviewingBrenna Millville, and she is the
founder of Ellie and Grace,which is a Christian apparel
(00:48):
company.
Let me tell you a little bitmore about her.
Brenna is a wife of nine yearsand mother to her three-year-old
Grace.
After attending a Christianconference in 2016, she was
called to start a Christianapparel company and Ellie and
Grace was started.
Seven years later, brenna andher team have printed and
(01:12):
shipped over 500,000 pieces ofapparel around the world from
their Missouri-based office and,most recently, have launched
embroidery kits that help womenrelax and learn a new hobby
while spending time with Jesus.
When she's not creating newdesigns on her iPad, sending
voice memos or studyingscripture, you can find her
(01:35):
drinking iced chai tea lattesyear-round, hiding in the shade
while chasing her toddler aroundthe park and trying not to show
her extremely competitivenature at casual game nights
with her friends.
Welcome, brenna, to the wePivot podcast.
So excited that you're here.
Brenna Millville (01:55):
Thank you so much.
I'm so excited to be here.
This is going to be so much fun.
Tona Haywood (01:59):
Yes it is, and you know it's so funny.
You said you have a casualcompetitive nature at game
nights.
I feel like that's somethingthat I have too, but it goes
when we're playing Uno.
My family is avid Uno playersand we always play and I always
seem to get a little bitcompetitive.
So that's something we have incommon.
Brenna Millville (02:23):
I try not to be competitive.
But as I've gotten to know mygroup of friends over the last
four years, they just know how Iam now.
So now I just own it.
Tona Haywood (02:32):
Right, that's right, you have to.
I mean, what's your favoritegame?
Brenna Millville (02:36):
Oh gosh.
So I've really been likingcards, christians like I find it
to be so hilarious.
I guess it's not really a gameyou can win, but I also like
Catan, I like Risk, I like thosetype of games.
Dominance is like okay.
So lots of different games,lots of different ones.
Tona Haywood (02:54):
Okay, I've never gotten to Catan.
I've seen it before, neverplayed it Risk.
I feel like the last time weplayed that, my husband and I
played and just left the pieceson the board and I think we
never got back to it One day,though One day we will.
So one of the first questionsthat I've had I've been an
(03:17):
admirer of yours from afar for along time and I've always said,
man, you have really niceproducts and you seem to have
grown exponentially over time.
And I've always said, man, youhave really nice products and
you seem to have grownexponentially over time.
And I've always admired that,especially in the Christian
apparel space, because I also,as Tona, my husband and I have a
(03:38):
Christian apparel company too,called to Edify Boutique, which
started a long time ago, andstaying in the race and
continuing is really hard a lotof times and I've seen people
come and go and all of thesedifferent things.
But you have stood the test oftime and I thank God that you
(04:00):
have in your company.
And so one of the questionsthat I know myself and my
listeners want to know is whatdo you feel was the pivotal
moment or experience thatactually led you to realize the
need to start Ellie and Grace,and how did this concept evolve
(04:21):
over time?
Brenna Millville (04:29):
over time.
So in 2016, I was working at anonprofit and I just wasn't.
I felt like my mission and myvalues and their mission and
values were really starting todeviate from each other.
I don't think that I was reallychanging.
I think that they were morechanging.
And so I went to this Christianconference and I'm not really
I'm pretty introverted, so Idon't like to go to things by
myself.
So I told myself that I wouldinvite my busiest friend.
(04:50):
If she could go, then I wouldgo, but I knew she wouldn't be
able to go, so that was going tobe my out, so I wouldn't have
to go, but she could go.
So she went with me and whilewe were in, when we walked in
the door, they had it was achurch and they sold apparel.
And I looked at their appareland they only had ladies small.
That doesn't fit a lot ofpeople.
(05:11):
Like, basically, it fits almostno one, because ladies small is
even smaller than unisex.
So I was like, oh, that's abummer, I wish they had like
other sizes, and I didn't reallythink anything else about it.
Then we went into theconference and the speaker was
talking.
She was talking about beingfearless and in my mind.
I just felt, well, you couldstart a Christian t-shirt
company.
(05:31):
And I was like, well, that's aweird thought.
I've never thought about thismy like.
When I worked at the nonprofit Iwas working with numbers, I was
doing fundraising, I was doingmail, like I was doing.
I wasn't doing a lot ofcreative stuff really at all, so
it was very out of my realm.
So I thought, okay, I'll tellmy husband this idea.
(05:52):
I'm sure he's going to tell meit's a terrible idea, and then
that's going to be it.
But instead he was like, okay,I think we could do that.
And then, just like my, mybrother, and my brother was
getting married, so I was reallyhelping with the wedding.
So I'm like I'm going to wait,so after the wedding, then I'm
going to start this activity.
It was like a month later.
But then after that I got ayear end bonus the nonprofit.
(06:16):
Their year was fiscal year, soit was July one to June 30.
And I got a bonus and it wasfor like the exact amount I
would need for like a cricketmachine and a heat press.
So I was like, ok, I can dothis.
So I started doing it and I westarted on Etsy and my husband
was like you can just sell oneshirt a day.
Then I think that's fine and Iwas like, ok, so I did that and
(06:40):
that was great and we let's seethat was in June no-transcript,
(07:35):
wonderful.
And he was like, no, this isnot sustainable, we need to move
out into a new location.
So we moved the office out ofour house into a building and
then that was kind of thebeginning, okay.
Tona Haywood (07:49):
Wow, and so you basically, when you were working
at the nonprofit, you did thisalongside with the nonprofit and
Ellie and Grace, so you weredoing both at the same time for
a little while.
Brenna Millville (08:04):
I had an hour commute there and then an hour
commute back, which I absolutelyhated.
It was probably one of my leastfavorite things about going
there, because it was verytrafficy and it was just.
It was just like a bad.
It just put me in a badheadspace every day.
And then one day I was justlike I just need to take this
time and do something else withit.
So I started listening tobusiness podcasts and learning
(08:28):
about there were.
Their podcasts aren't reallyaround anymore, but there were a
few of them that were aroundthen that I would listen to
every single time and they wereabout like women who had started
Etsy shops.
I'm like, ok, so I could learnabout this.
So I just kind of treated it astwo hours of continuing
education and I worked four daysa week, so that was eight hours
a week that I could just learnthings instead of just sitting
(08:49):
in my car being like I can'tbelieve I have to go to this job
.
This is terrible.
This is just like making melike perpetuating that.
Tona Haywood (08:55):
I turned that time and made it into something
beneficial and that's great,because I believe that probably
gave you motivation to kind ofkeep going and not think so much
about the job you hated, butsomething else that you were
putting your time and energyinto.
I like that.
And at what stage did youdecide to expand Ellie and Grace
(09:18):
?
Or was that the stage when yourealized the basement was being
overtaken by clothes, productand all of these different
things?
Was that the stage when it justgot like, okay, this is not
sustainable at all?
Brenna Millville (09:34):
Logistically, it was pretty challenging to be
working all the time like that.
It was doable.
But we also had other things,like we had too many packages
and USPS didn't want to comepick them up from our house, and
so it would be beneficial tohave a space for, and have a
designated pickup where, like amore industrial truck came every
day.
It was the first thing we hadto outsource was customer
(09:57):
service, because you can't belike packing shirts and also
responding to emails at the sametime, unfortunately.
I wish that that was possible,because that would really help
us out.
But so there were just a lot oflittle things.
And then, especially once wehad grace in 2020, in January
2020, which was a crazy timethen I wasn't physically able to
(10:18):
do what I was like I did beforebefore.
We were in a busy time.
Then, if I remember this onetime, it was supposed to start
snowing at like 7am, and snow inlike this time of year is great
sometimes, but when you have acertain number of orders, you
need to get out every day.
Losing a whole day can reallyset you back.
So I was like it's fine, I'lljust go to the office before it
(10:40):
snows at like three and I'lljust wait until they clear the
roads in the evening and thenI'll just go home.
So I can't do that now becauseI have a toddler, but I was able
to do it then and I did, and Iwould just ramp up and ramp down
.
So having a great team rightnow that's able to do those
things is very helpful.
So I don't have to come in at3am before the snow come in at 3
(11:08):
am before the snow.
Tona Haywood (11:08):
Right, and that's good.
That's good.
And with your team, how are youable to decide who is going to
be on your team?
What qualities were you lookingfor in a good team?
Brenna Millville (11:16):
The most important thing I think about in
a great team aren't necessarilythat they can do the specific
job that you're hiring them for.
Like, can they cut fabric forembroidery kits?
Probably yes.
Can they pack and ship in order?
Probably yes.
All of our skills can be taught.
So then it's mainly on attitudeand work ethic.
(11:37):
So that's kind of what we make.
That's what we definitely putabove the other, like the skills
, just because of the nature ofwhat we do.
We're not like mechanics, soyou don't have to, you can't go
to school to do these specificthings.
So it's mainly just aboutattitude and work ethic for us.
Okay.
Tona Haywood (11:54):
That makes sense.
How big is your team now?
Brenna Millville (11:58):
I'm very lucky that I'm able to do most of the
creative things and my husbandhandles almost all the business
side of things.
So we have, we have a manager,we have, let's see, I'd say
around 10, 10 to 15.
It varies on the year, like itvaries when we're like like
(12:20):
right now is our very busy timeand the summer is usually our
slower time, so it just kind ofvaries based on the time of year
.
Tona Haywood (12:25):
Okay, that is really good to know.
Um, as an entrepreneur in thefaith-based apparel industry,
what has been your mostsignificant challenges?
Brenna Millville (12:39):
I had to laugh when I read this question,
honestly, because I would sayone of the biggest challenges to
us was kind of a I would in mylike positive attitude, I would
say an unintended consequence.
In my negative attitude, Iwould maybe say purposeful.
But after the 2020 election,facebook chose to remove a lot
(13:04):
of interest.
Facebook chose to remove a lotof interest for, um, the brain
of bad specific people, yes, anda lot of our people obviously
are christians.
If you're not a christian, youprobably don't want to wear a
christian shirt.
So when they chose to removeall that stuff, it was very
challenging because it was hard.
It's harder for us to find ourpeople because of the decision
(13:25):
they made to do that.
So I say that's been a prettybig challenge.
Um, I would say anotherchallenge and I don't know if
this is faith industry, specificthough that one really was is
just people taking our designsand steal like literally taking
our pictures and then sellingthem for like a fourth of the
(13:45):
price, which is frustrating, andthey're doing it.
Some of my friends to someonejust messaged me a picture
yesterday and she was like Canyou make this for me?
And I was like no, I can'tbecause that's not my design,
but also I know whose designthat is, and so I sent them a
picture and I was like, hey, youmight want to file something
(14:06):
with this like overseas companybecause they're selling your
design as their own and that'snot right and they should do
their own work.
But I wanted to let them know.
So that's definitely that'sbeen an ongoing challenge.
I'd say that's one of thebenefits of our new book and
doll collection is that that's alot harder to rip off it is
(14:27):
definitely like that and I thinkthe embroidery kits.
Tona Haywood (14:32):
It's kind of hard to do that.
Brenna Millville (14:33):
Well, this is funny.
So that picture I was tellingyou about it was actually.
Someone actually took a pictureof this woman's embroidery kit.
Put it on a shirt.
Tona Haywood (14:44):
Wow.
Brenna Millville (14:45):
Yeah, I know I was like they are really
getting bold with it.
That is kind of bold and peoplecommented on it.
They're like, how would thiswash?
And I'm just like, well, notwell, because it's an embroidery
kit.
Tona Haywood (14:59):
And they literally took the picture off her
website, removed the hoop andput it on a shirt.
Oh yeah, that is.
That's not good.
I do understand what you taughtwhat you're talking about with
the Facebook part.
I know that I would dabble inads every now and again and from
(15:20):
the time that I starteddabbling in ads to like, let's
say, today, when I went on mostrecently, I was like, wait, what
happened?
Like what happened with theinterest, what happened with all
of the things that I was I usedto be able to you to check?
Those things aren't thereanymore.
And it's like well, am I goingto be spending money to waste on
(15:40):
people who may or may not likethese specific things?
To come to my page, there areso many changes with Facebook, I
tell you.
Every time I would go back in,it was just like okay, this is
just too much, I can't, I justcan't even deal with it.
Now the part about peopletaking other individuals work
(16:05):
and trying to sell it as theirown.
I haven't yet seen mineanywhere, but I can't.
I can't confirm or deny thatit's not.
Brenna Millville (16:16):
There's so many of them.
I only find out when peoplemessage me about it.
Right, it's frustrating,because then I see it and I'm
like why?
Tona Haywood (16:25):
Why, exactly, especially.
And then the selling of it issuch lower prices where people
are going to be like, oh, thisprice is so in my, you know, in
my affordability, you know, Ican just go ahead and just get
it.
That can be very, veryfrustrating.
Brenna Millville (16:45):
And then another thing that happened I'd
say that was frustrating is thewhole fact checking and all of
that, which is I understand whythey did that.
Over the summer I had a reelthat I posted and it was about
the devil and trying to like usnot being concerned about the
devil because we're strong inthe word, but the Instagram
algorithm thought it was aboutthe border.
(17:07):
And then everyone that followsme gets a notification that's
like are you sure you want tofollow this account?
Because it's been like they'veposted misinformation and if
someone tries to tag me, they'llalso get the same warning.
So now I'm getting messagesevery day being like oh hey, did
you know this is happening?
And I'm like, yeah, I actuallyhave an auto thing that I just
(17:28):
like type in one word and itsends my thing Right.
It's exhausting to have toexplain it every single time,
and I tried to appeal it andthey were like no, wow, so
they'll have to throw up andlook for it.
Tona Haywood (17:44):
It had like the little misinformation like I
think I remember that, I feellike I remember seeing that and
they're still doing that now,like every time.
Oh, that's annoying.
Brenna Millville (17:54):
It's extremely annoying.
Tona Haywood (17:59):
Oh, and another question just about the apparel
Do you design it all yourself oris there a collaborative effort
with team of designers?
I think you might have saidthis already, that you design it
all yourself said this alreadythat you designed it all
yourself.
Brenna Millville (18:16):
But so previously, the past seven years
, yes, I've designed everythingmyself, with the exception of
our new men's line that justcame out last week, and my
husband worked with anotherdesigner on that because I just
didn't feel called tospecifically design men's wear
myself.
That's not my forte.
So, other than the spiritshield line, everything else is
designed by me, ok that's nice.
Tona Haywood (18:36):
I'm glad that you got your husband involved and
got a designer to design themen's part, because sometimes I
feel like when you're aChristian boutique owner
especially when you're doingmost of the things yourself,
like myself when it comes to thedesign space, we tend to just
be like you know what I can do,that I can get that done.
(19:01):
But knowing these are thethings that I'm good at versus
this is something that somebodyelse needs to take on so that we
can best use our time, energy,effort and resources.
So it can be good Makes sense.
And can you walk us throughyour design process?
(19:22):
How do you find inspiration anddevelop new ideas?
Brenna Millville (19:27):
So what I generally do now that we've been
doing this for so long.
We mainly design for seasonalcollections.
So I'll go back, I'll see whatdid well, what didn't do as well
as we'd hoped.
Then those items will beretired.
Then sometimes I'll use thosephrases or those verses for
future designs.
So I'm not necessarily having togenerate everything out of thin
(19:47):
air like I used to, because I'mkind of just redoing what I've
done in the past, with theexception of the embroidery kits
, because those are brand new.
So it's kind of fun to be ableto come up with something, cause
now I'm like a little limitedin my designing for shirts,
because it has to it can only beso many colors.
Well, I guess embroidery kitscan only be so many colors too,
(20:07):
but my it's larger and if Ireally want them to be more, I
can.
It's just you have to putanother thread in the bundle,
and sometimes you know thatcould be a lot.
I can do a lot, but it's niceto be able to have this creative
kind of mind expansion to whereI can do whatever I want.
So when I'm thinking I'mactually designing for Easter
(20:28):
right now, then we're inBuc-ee's.
So they do, they want theirstuff about six months in
advance.
So right now I'm doing 4th ofJuly and Mother's Day for
apparel and I'm doing Easter forembroidery.
So I'm thinking about Easter andI'm like what do I want to see
on the Easter design?
What do I like see in my mind?
And usually I can see itsomewhat clearly, at least for a
(20:51):
first draft, and then I usuallyhave to like rip it out and
restitch it a few times tochoose, like the exact right
colors, but that's kind of whatI do.
And then for the holidays it'sjust what has done.
Well, do I want to reiterate itLike?
I believe like Mary Design hasbeen a good seller for us since
we started it.
It's kind of similar to mywomen of the Bible design that I
(21:14):
created.
So I was like I liked thatdesign.
I want to try to do a Christmasdesign that's like my woman of
the Bible design, so that I kindof do it like that and just see
what hits me.
Tona Haywood (21:26):
Okay, I like that.
What made you decide to getinto the embroidery portion and
the book and dolls?
Brenna Millville (21:35):
like what made you decide to kind of lean into
that a little bit, um more inthis season so two Christmases
ago we were, I guess, betweenChristmas and New Year's I'd
just been feeling like there wassomething else I wanted to do
with.
I wanted to do something elseif there, I wanted to still do
apparel but been feeling likethere was something else I
wanted to do with.
I wanted to do something elseif there, I wanted to still do
(21:56):
apparel.
But I felt like there wassomething else I needed to do.
And I always loved AmericanGirl dolls.
I never had one, but I had allthe books I really love to read
and I'd also been going to ourlocal library with my daughter
and I'm like some of these books.
I just don't like them.
And if the world is not goingto be shy about putting out
(22:17):
their values for children, thenwe should also not be shy about
putting out our values forchildren, right?
So I wanted to create asomething that was kind of along
those lines where there was adoll that someone could see, a
child could see, and they couldassociate it with the characters
in the books.
And then I wanted to do threeand I wanted to have them.
(22:38):
I was envisioning like a marveluniverse type of situation,
because they, like each have amain character.
But then the other people makelike support.
They're supporting roles ineach right, okay.
Okay, even if they get one doll, they'll still see the other
three in the book and if theywant to get them in the future,
that's totally fine.
But I actually came out withthat idea even though they
(22:59):
released six months after theembroidery kits.
I came out with it two yearsago.
It just took a long time to getthe books.
Actually, it didn't take a longtime to get the books written.
I wrote the books in like aweek.
But all the rest of the processtook an extremely long time.
And then, with embroidery, I wasstitching every night because I
just enjoyed it.
It's relaxing, it's fun to havesomething to do that's not on a
(23:23):
screen.
And so I just I first startedjust making kits for my friends
that I would be like okay, Iknow that you really like this
certain verse, so I'm going tomake this for you.
And last year I made littlecross.
Stitch is slightly different,it's basically a bunch of little
X's but I made like familyportraits for all my friends.
(23:43):
And then I was working on theseembroidery kits and I was like,
well, maybe we can sell them.
We'll do like a little test andsee how it goes and people are
really loving them, I think.
With just technology being soin your face all the time, it's
nice to have something thatyou're just physically doing
with your hands, and one of myfavorite things to do with it is
like listen to a podcast whileI'm stitching, or listen to an
(24:06):
audio book or listen to worshipmusic, and I use that time to
really decompress.
I usually try to stitch atleast like an hour a night, you
know that's the funny thingabout that.
Tona Haywood (24:18):
I had a friend from church who did knitting.
She was, she was an avidknitter, and I kept saying you
know, I just I'm always on thescreen, I'm tired of being on
the screen, I'm going to learnhow to knit.
Can you show me?
It didn't go over well.
And it's the same with sewing,because my mom actually she sews
(24:43):
all the time and she taught mehow to sew, but I didn't pick it
up like she did, and so for meit was kind of one of those
things that I don't think I'mgoing to deal with this.
But with embroidery it seemslike you give the instructions
right, and so is it prettyself-explanatory and easy to
(25:07):
follow, Even for a person that,like me, doesn't like to sew.
Brenna Millville (25:14):
I would say yes, it comes with everything
you need except scissors.
There is a written PDF that'slike step one use this thread
and this stitch to complete thisarea.
We also have videos of everysingle stitch, because it's, of
course, very hard to explain astitch in written form and once
you know it, then you know it.
(25:34):
It might seem like it'sintimidating, but once you start
it and you're like okay, now Iknow, let's say, the French knot
.
Well, this French knot is onlydone one way.
So once you know it, you knowit, and then you can do those
parts of the project.
So I usually recommend topeople is they like, read the
PDF and like, okay, I'm doingthis part first with this stitch
.
Go watch the video, go do itand then go to the next one and
(25:58):
if you have any questions, justmessage me or DM me.
I just told someone this morningto send me a video because I
was like it might be easier foryou to explain via video what
your question is and then I canlet you know how to do it.
Because I just feel verystrongly that if people are
intent, if they let themselveslike, accept that it might be.
(26:19):
You know, it can be a littleintimidating, but if they go
ahead and do it, then they'll behappy that they did and it's a
great skill to have and it's afun way to make like a special
project for someone or just keepthem in your house.
I need to figure out how I canneed to display mine, cause I
obviously have quite a few ofthe hoops and they're all just
sitting in a stack, cause I usethem for content, of course, and
(26:41):
I'm like I need to put themsomewhere and, like make them
pretty, Display it in a bookcaseor something I think on a shelf
bookcase, something like thatyou should do.
Tona Haywood (26:52):
And I'm thinking about it.
I might have to just get oneand just dive in, because I
believe, like you say, we'realways on the screen and whether
you're designing or whetheryou're doing social media, email
, whatever, it's all on a screen.
And trying to get away fromthat is always good to use a
(27:14):
different part of your brain aswell.
Brenna Millville (27:18):
The other thing that's nice about it is if
you're doing something else,you're not on the computer and
say your phone's on, do notdisturb, or silent.
You're not getting interrupted,at least by any digital
interruptions.
Tona Haywood (27:32):
That's right.
Brenna Millville (27:33):
Then you're.
It's hard sometimes when you'reon your computer that you can
set it so you don't disturb.
You can X out of all yourmessaging notifications, but
they're still kind of there.
But if you've got your hands ona hoop and one hand's holding
it and the other one's stitching, you can't be like oh, I wonder
what is going on over there.
Oh, I wonder if anyone messagedme because your hands are busy.
Tona Haywood (27:51):
That's right, that's true, and you're right,
because if you are even on yourcomputer or your computers
nearby.
Brenna Millville (28:03):
There's still this innate desire to go to it,
Like calling to you.
Yeah, it does it speaks.
Tona Haywood (28:07):
I agree with you on that one.
So for those interested inentering the faith-based or
inspirational apparel market,what advice would you offer to
them?
Brenna Millville (28:20):
I would say the most important thing is to
be original and to try to comeup with your own things that
don't look like anyone else's,and to especially not see
someone's design and think, oh,I like that, I'm going to take
that exact design and sell itfor myself, because then you're
not really doing your own thingand so you're not.
(28:42):
You're not able to be a uniquebusiness and like differentiate
yourself, because you just looklike everyone else.
You want to be able to beyourself, kind of with.
Like the three essentialelements of starting a business
being able to be yourself,providing a quality product and
quality customer service are allvery, very important to
establish your brand.
I think in general with asuccessful business and I know
(29:05):
people have had success on Etsybut I think that also being able
to have once you're able tohave your own website, that's
very important.
Being able to have once you'reable to have your own website
that's very important becausewhenever people get something on
Etsy like I just bought aNutcracker sweatshirt for Grace
two days ago on Etsy I could nottell you the name of the
business at all.
I got it on Etsy but I don'tremember where.
Like they all looked the same.
So, but if you have your ownbrand and you're able to
(29:29):
establish that, then instead ofsomeone saying, oh, I got that
on Etsy, they can say, oh, I gotthat on Ellie and Grace.
And that's really what you want, because you want to be able to
get brand loyalty and bringthem back to you.
Instead of now, the next time Iwant a Nutcracker sweatshirt,
I'm just going to get on Etsy,right, I won't necessarily buy
it from the same person, becauseI won't even remember.
Tona Haywood (29:51):
That is so true.
Buy it from the same personbecause I won't even remember.
That is so true.
That is so true.
And I think most timesindividuals, they go to SD first
because it's like this is a wayto get free traffic, I don't
have to worry about my owntraffic.
But there's such a competitionout there with the same thing
that you're doing, so how do youget those eyeballs on you in a
concentrated space when somebodycan click on you and click off
(30:12):
really quick and they'resomewhere else?
Brenna Millville (30:15):
It'll say they'll be on your page Like
this happened to me when I waslooking at the Nutcracker
sweatshirts and it says youmight also like.
And there's like three moresweatshirts that look basically
the same and they're all fromdifferent businesses.
Tona Haywood (30:28):
So you can very easily go to another business
and then you're somewhere elseentirely businesses, so you can
very easily go to anotherbusiness and then you're
somewhere else entirely, that'strue, and then you don't even
know how to get back to the onethat you were at in the
beginning.
So that makes sense.
So were those your essentialelements for a successful
business as well?
The customer service.
Brenna Millville (30:47):
Yes, the quality product and the
originality yes.
Tona Haywood (30:50):
Okay, those are perfect Now.
I see you all the time onInstagram.
Brenna Millville (30:56):
Well, thank you, I don't feel like I'm on
there as much as I used to be.
I used to post every day andthen I was like I cannot do this
anymore.
It's too hard it is too hard.
Tona Haywood (31:05):
Well, I guess it seems to me that you are
consistent.
So, whatever your consistencyschedule looks like, it looks
consistent to me.
Okay, could you share some ofthe strategies for maintaining
an effective and consistentemail and social media marketing
(31:26):
strategy?
Brenna Millville (31:27):
Yes, we actually have a person on our
team that does the emailmarketing, primarily with my
husband, so that's extremelyhelpful.
That's right scheduled andlater, two weeks out, but right
(31:50):
now, because it's busy, it's alittle bit of an imperfect world
, so I'm kind of posting alittle bit more on the fly, but
I try to have, like I have, realdrafts.
I'm kind of committing thecardinal, I'm breaking the rule.
I don't have any of the draftssaved other than an instagram.
So if something happens toInstagram, I'm going to be
(32:11):
totally.
But you know, oh well, it isyeah, and just trying to take
pictures.
When I'm able to take pictures,remembering like okay, I'm at
the office today, I need to takesome.
If I ship orders today, which Iprobably will, I need to like
set up my phone and get some,like some video of that, I need
to take some pictures and justhaving that type of stuff.
(32:32):
So then when I'm ready to post,I don't have to think, oh no,
now I need to go take thatpicture because I already have
it.
So that's also very helpful.
I do like I prefer to havescheduled content.
I just because I've beenhelping a lot with production,
because we've been busy withBlack Friday it, I haven't been
able to do it as much as I wouldlike, so here's a question,
(32:54):
since you do dive into socialmedia a lot when you have time,
based on the season that you'rein.
Tona Haywood (33:01):
Okay, it can differ.
Do you feel that the majorityof your sales come from social
media like Instagram, facebookand things like this, and this
is without ads, without doingads, do you feel like the
majority comes from there, ordoes the majority really come
from people finding you onlineand your repeat customers?
Brenna Millville (33:26):
We do have a high return customer rate
because of our product and ourcustomer service, which I think
is why those are two of theessential elements, and our
email list is also veryimportant.
I think, in general, an emaillist is extremely important
because there have been timeswhere, you know, instagram has
gone down and Facebook has gonedown and we never.
We can't really rely on thosethings, but we have our email
(33:49):
lists and that's a way that wecan directly get into people's
mailboxes.
So I would say that email.
I've technically been in thisspace for a very long time,
(34:15):
probably since 2011.
Tona Haywood (34:18):
And it started out just my husband and I.
We were wanted to see picturesin every house with, like my
poetry and his photographygraphic design, so we would put
something together and we weredoing it by hand.
For first off, it was friendsand family were buying them, and
(34:39):
then we're trying to figure outhow to do this better, where we
could scale it and not be, youknow, doing all this stuff
ourselves.
And eventually there were thingsthat came about that enabled us
to do that, like print ondemand and things of that nature
, and that's primarily what weuse.
But the reason why is we have awhole our other businesses,
(34:59):
digital marketing, where we helpbusinesses with their websites
and things like that.
So we do both of these inconjunction, but we know that
this over here can be sustainedby the print on demand, and so
that's what we do on you know,pretty much on this side.
But when it comes to socialmedia, you can tell that I can
(35:22):
post, I can do stories, I can dothis, I can do that, but there
aren't really a whole lot ofsales that come from that.
Most times, it does come fromthe people who decided to be on
your list, who decided topurchase, who decide to
repurchase those committedcustomers that you've built a
bond with.
Brenna Millville (35:41):
So I heard someone say once I don't
remember who it was that socialmedia is almost like it's more
for nurturing your currentcustomers the people who already
know you to be like, to justkind of.
So that's kind of how I treat it.
We definitely get new people.
I just had a real and this isalso on content and you can have
super simple content my mostwatched video real ever by like
(36:04):
a significant amount.
I think.
It is at like 1.2 million.
Wow, which is crazy to me.
I've never not like I'm talkinglike by by a lot like.
The next one was maybe like20,000.
So a lot higher, and it wasjust about reading a chapter of
Luke every day, december 1st toDecember 24th, because there are
24 chapters, right, and so nowI wasn't planning on posting
(36:29):
about my reading every morning,but now, since that reel went
viral, I've created a highlightand I'm like Okay, I'm just
going to post a few things thatI thought of whenever I was
reading the reading of the day,and I'm just going to post it in
the morning.
I'll save it to the highlightsand if anyone wants that
information, it's available.
That was just a simple one.
You never know what.
Tona Haywood (36:48):
Instagram is you don't.
And I think that's the hardpart, because when you're doing
things on Instagram, you can gointo this looking to see what
everybody else is doing, lookingto see what gets the most views
, and then you try it and yousee if it works.
Sometimes it does, sometimes itdoesn't, but it doesn't really
(37:10):
increase anything per se.
It doesn't give you new emailsignups, it doesn't give you new
followers.
Like, I had a reel that my topreel had about close to 50,000
views, but it was just memimicking someone else singing
and that was it.
And it's like oh okay, that wasgreat, but it didn't really
(37:35):
change anything.
So I think for each person Ithink that's the takeaway Each
person you have to figure outwhat works for you and where
you're at in your season,because it may not look the same
as everyone else and you haveto be okay with that and be able
to be consistent.
However, it works for yourseason.
Brenna Millville (37:56):
Yes, and with posts, and sometimes posts not
doing as well and sometimesreels not doing as well.
If someone who's listening tothis is has had that problem and
I've had that problem it's notbecause you're bad and it's not
because you're not talented andyou're not using the skills God
gave you.
It's just because the algorithmis weird and it's not a
(38:20):
reflection on your business orwho you are as a person.
Tona Haywood (38:23):
I agree, because I know a lot of times there will
be people that will preach atyou your content is not right,
your content is not right.
Your content is not right, yourcontent is not right.
But you can put out somethingthat will resonate with a lot of
people, but those people willjust never see it because it
didn't take off in the way thatit was supposed to take off in
(38:43):
order for the algorithm tocontinue to push you out.
And so it doesn't mean thatwhatever you did wasn't good
enough.
It's just that how things workon the back end.
That may have prevented peoplefrom seeing it, but it doesn't
negate you still doing what youwere called to do and being
obedient.
Whoever was supposed to bereached, they would be reached.
(39:16):
On that note, since we arealways in the social media space
and looking and seeing and allof these other things, what
other people are doing, how doyou prevent comparison?
Because I tell you, with a lotof the big name Christian
apparel companies like yourself,every time I see like oh my
gosh, they have out their fallline already.
I'm still struggling over here.
Like, look, they're alreadyhere and I'm not there yet, like
(39:40):
what you know.
And then I'll go back into thisrat race of OK.
Well, I got to be out just likeeverybody else is out.
I got to hurry up and I got todo this and then I finally
figured I had to look at myselfand said Tona, you're one person
, you're not, it's just you.
You don't have the sameresources that everyone else has
(40:02):
and you can't keep puttingthese extra pressures on
yourself to be where others are.
That's not what I have for youright now.
So how do you speak to thatpiece?
The comparison that can come inat times.
Brenna Millville (40:20):
It is.
It's definitely challenging.
You're not alone in that.
Like when I was saying earlierthat I was working, I need to be
working on the Mother's Day and4th of July line.
I need to have it done by theend of the year, and I'm already
feeling like a slacker andwe're talking about, like that's
six months away, right so, butI need to have it done by the
end of the month.
So I'm already feeling thatlike, why can't I get this out
sooner?
What's wrong with me?
(40:40):
So you're definitely not alonein that.
I would say if there is aaccount, or more, more than one
account that is making you feelterrible about yourself, then I
would advise to unfollow or muteif you don't want to unfollow
them, because you're afraidyou're going to, like cause some
drama in the social media world.
And the other thing that Iwould say is to try to change
(41:04):
your attitude to cheering theother people on I can't say that
I've experienced this back.
The other people on I can't saythat I've experienced this back
.
But there are people that likeI, like I see online.
I'm like, oh, I wish I wouldhave thought of that.
Oh, I really like that, andthen I just try to be like that
looks great and like, try, likereally mean it because it does
(41:24):
look great.
Do I wish I would have thoughtof it?
Yes, but I'll think ofsomething else.
So that's okay, and we all havedifferent things.
If our stuff all look the same,it would be a bummer.
So just trying to remember thatcomparison is really can
destroy everything, not just ourjoy, but really all of our like
, everything we have.
(41:45):
And so trying to remember that.
But you can unfollow, you canmute, you can do those type of
things if it would make you feelbetter.
I also try not to do a lot ofscrolling, which is funny.
I'm like, on one hand, I'm likemy posts don't get very much
reach and, on the other hand,I'm like I don't even really
scroll the feed anymore.
I don't really watch stories, Iknow.
Tona Haywood (42:10):
Exactly and that I find that I'll go on.
I will search a couple ofthings.
I will probably look at mystories or whatever.
I have the most fun in mystories.
Actually, that's where I I tendto do.
I've just decided I I'll spendmy time in the stories, cause at
least I know that these fewpeople that are there, they're
(42:34):
there, they come to beencouraged, because I can't, on
the feed itself, you may notreach anybody these days, so.
So it's like I'll go there anddo that.
But you're right, there's beena lack of me really scrolling
and staying on there, becauseyou get all of these different
(42:55):
messages that I don't reallyneed to get right now.
That does it, you know.
Hey, you need to use this audioor this audio or this.
It's like, ok, I'm out again.
So that does make a lot ofsense.
And how can you, or how do you,balance the creative demands
with the business side ofrunning Ellie and Grace?
Brenna Millville (43:19):
So the wonderful thing is, now that
we've been around for so long,this is our seventh seventh year
yeah, seventh year and myhusband is very good at the
business side and all of that.
So luckily I don't have to do alot of that, which is very
convenient Because since Gracewas born I've had childcare one
(43:39):
or two days a week.
Now she's in school two days aweek.
Next year she'll be in schoolthree days a week.
Then she'll go to kindergarten,which is crazy to me.
But there isn't enough physicaltime for me to do all of those
things Like.
Even now I have about 14 hoursa week that I'm able to like
dedicatedly work, but becauseit's a busy time, half of those
(44:00):
hours are spent helpingproduction, so I have even less
time to do the things likeprepare for Easter and Mother's
Day and Fourth of July.
So I'm making sure to stitch atnight because I have all these
things that I want to get done.
There's only so much time inthe day.
So sometimes, even when you'vebeen established for a long time
(44:22):
and you have an amazing team,you still have to work at night
and in the morning, sometimesbased on the season, and that's
okay.
Tona Haywood (44:29):
That's true.
It's all based on the seasonthat you're in.
It's kind of like an ebb andflow and since this is a digital
marketing podcast, what is onecritical component of digital
marketing for your business thatmust not be overlooked under
(44:50):
any circumstance?
Brenna Millville (44:53):
that must not be overlooked under any
circumstance.
I would say the most importantthing is to be on things.
Whether you have an email list,you have to have something.
I think it's very challengingto do this and not have anything
.
I have two friends that arelike I'm just not gonna have
social media at all and theyhave businesses and they have
email lists.
But I'm just like, is thatreally working?
(45:15):
I'm not sure.
Maybe it is.
At least they have an emaillist.
It's better than nothing.
But you have to have something.
And also it's important to beyourself and bring that
personality to the brand.
Even if you don't want to showyour face on camera or you don't
want to have like your face andstories and you want it to be
more like less personal, youstill need to have some elements
(45:38):
to where people know you're notlike spam company.
I guess is a better word todescribe it, because a lot of
those type of companies the onesthat seal designs, the ones
that like those type of thingsthey don't have any information
about who has created them,because they can't, because it's
just like a bot that's createdthe whole thing.
(45:58):
So you want to be able to beyourself and have some sort of
personality, even if you're justshowing like your hands or the
back of your head and stuff likethat.
Grace was recognized in person afew years ago, which was a
little concerning to me as hermother.
So now I only show usually I'llshow like the side of her face,
(46:18):
or I haven't shown like herfull profile in a little while,
except for on our so lovedcollection, because like that's
kind of her, it's for her Right.
So there's it.
You're able to createboundaries and do things like
that.
My husband does not want to beon social media so whenever I
show pictures it's like usuallyand it's very rare, like for
small business Saturday it's theback of his head.
Tona Haywood (46:40):
Right.
Brenna Millville (46:41):
Or if I'm like doing a picture and stories,
I'll put like a block over, likea block of text right over his
face.
There you go, so just becreative with it.
There are ways that you canhold those boundaries and still
be personal and try not to betoo serious and try to have fun,
because if you're miserabledoing your digital marketing and
(47:01):
your business, then you'reprobably not doing.
You're probably not doing whatyou should be doing.
Maybe you're not, maybe you'renot.
That's not what you're supposedto do and you should do
something else.
Maybe it's not the right, maybethe business isn't the right
fit for you.
There are other things.
If you're not happy doing yourown business, then you probably
(47:22):
should think about what youshould pivot and change to make
yourself not feel unhappy.
Tona Haywood (47:28):
That makes sense, not feel unhappy that makes
sense, and so when you say be onsomething, do you mean like, be
on like?
Brenna Millville (47:44):
social media like pick one yes, you have to
exist to have digital marketing.
That's true.
And if you don't, then youcan't.
Tona Haywood (47:49):
That's true, very true.
Well, I appreciate youanswering all of these questions
in our time today.
Is there any last bit ofinformation that you would give
to our listeners today?
Brenna Millville (48:09):
I would say the most important thing to do
is to if you have, if you'rethinking about starting a
business, or if you're wonderingthe direction your business
should go in, or if you'refeeling frustrated or really if
you're feeling anything youshould always be praying and
reading the Bible and makingthose some of your top
priorities so that you can makesure that your priorities are
(48:32):
able to stay in line.
Sometimes, when we get verybusy as entrepreneurs and
maintaining our home and withour families, it's very easy to
say you know, I'm just going toread that tomorrow I don't need
to, I am too busy to spend timewith God today, but tomorrow and
he understands because I'mdoing something for him.
But that's not the attitudethat we should have.
(48:52):
So I would say that is one ofthe top priorities that we
should have, no matter theseason, whether we're busy or
slow, or it's chaotic orpeaceful, we should always be
turning to that first.
Tona Haywood (49:03):
That is so true that keeps us on the right path,
on the path that he has for us,Exactly, exactly right.
Well, Brenna, I want to thankyou for being our guest today on
the we Pivot podcast.
This whole interview was veryenlightening and I am sure that
(49:26):
people who listen to it will beeducated and inspired with their
own business, especially withthe digital marketing and things
that they have that the Lordhas given them to do.
So thank you so much for beinghere.
Brenna Millville (49:42):
Thank you so much for having me.
Tona Haywood (49:44):
You're so welcome.
Al Haywood (49:46):
We're so excited that you tuned in to the latest
episode of the we Pivot podcast.
Thank you for joining us.
Now, whether this is your firsttime or not, please make sure
to subscribe and share with afriend who can also use some
digital marketing guidance aswell.
Until next time.
The we Pivot podcast is for you if you're a
woman who has recently pivotedinto entrepreneurship.
You'll find digital marketingtips, trends and strategies to
help grow your business intoday's digital world.
Join Tona and Al Haywood as wehave fun breaking down all
things digital marketing, so sitback, relax and enjoy the show.
(00:25):
Hello everyone and welcome backto the we Pivot podcast.
Have I got a treat for you?
Today, I will be interviewingBrenna Millville, and she is the
founder of Ellie and Grace,which is a Christian apparel
(00:48):
company.
Let me tell you a little bitmore about her.
Brenna is a wife of nine yearsand mother to her three-year-old
Grace.
After attending a Christianconference in 2016, she was
called to start a Christianapparel company and Ellie and
Grace was started.
Seven years later, brenna andher team have printed and
(01:12):
shipped over 500,000 pieces ofapparel around the world from
their Missouri-based office and,most recently, have launched
embroidery kits that help womenrelax and learn a new hobby
while spending time with Jesus.
When she's not creating newdesigns on her iPad, sending
voice memos or studyingscripture, you can find her
(01:35):
drinking iced chai tea lattesyear-round, hiding in the shade
while chasing her toddler aroundthe park and trying not to show
her extremely competitivenature at casual game nights
with her friends.
Welcome, brenna, to the wePivot podcast.
So excited that you're here.
Brenna Millville (01:55):
Thank you so much.
I'm so excited to be here.
This is going to be so much fun.
Tona Haywood (01:59):
Yes it is, and you know it's so funny.
You said you have a casualcompetitive nature at game
nights.
I feel like that's somethingthat I have too, but it goes
when we're playing Uno.
My family is avid Uno playersand we always play and I always
seem to get a little bitcompetitive.
So that's something we have incommon.
Brenna Millville (02:23):
I try not to be competitive.
But as I've gotten to know mygroup of friends over the last
four years, they just know how Iam now.
So now I just own it.
Tona Haywood (02:32):
Right, that's right, you have to.
I mean, what's your favoritegame?
Brenna Millville (02:36):
Oh gosh.
So I've really been likingcards, christians like I find it
to be so hilarious.
I guess it's not really a gameyou can win, but I also like
Catan, I like Risk, I like thosetype of games.
Dominance is like okay.
So lots of different games,lots of different ones.
Tona Haywood (02:54):
Okay, I've never gotten to Catan.
I've seen it before, neverplayed it Risk.
I feel like the last time weplayed that, my husband and I
played and just left the pieceson the board and I think we
never got back to it One day,though One day we will.
So one of the first questionsthat I've had I've been an
(03:17):
admirer of yours from afar for along time and I've always said,
man, you have really niceproducts and you seem to have
grown exponentially over time.
And I've always said, man, youhave really nice products and
you seem to have grownexponentially over time.
And I've always admired that,especially in the Christian
apparel space, because I also,as Tona, my husband and I have a
(03:38):
Christian apparel company too,called to Edify Boutique, which
started a long time ago, andstaying in the race and
continuing is really hard a lotof times and I've seen people
come and go and all of thesedifferent things.
But you have stood the test oftime and I thank God that you
(04:00):
have in your company.
And so one of the questionsthat I know myself and my
listeners want to know is whatdo you feel was the pivotal
moment or experience thatactually led you to realize the
need to start Ellie and Grace,and how did this concept evolve
(04:21):
over time?
Brenna Millville (04:29):
over time.
So in 2016, I was working at anonprofit and I just wasn't.
I felt like my mission and myvalues and their mission and
values were really starting todeviate from each other.
I don't think that I was reallychanging.
I think that they were morechanging.
And so I went to this Christianconference and I'm not really
I'm pretty introverted, so Idon't like to go to things by
myself.
So I told myself that I wouldinvite my busiest friend.
(04:50):
If she could go, then I wouldgo, but I knew she wouldn't be
able to go, so that was going tobe my out, so I wouldn't have
to go, but she could go.
So she went with me and whilewe were in, when we walked in
the door, they had it was achurch and they sold apparel.
And I looked at their appareland they only had ladies small.
That doesn't fit a lot ofpeople.
(05:11):
Like, basically, it fits almostno one, because ladies small is
even smaller than unisex.
So I was like, oh, that's abummer, I wish they had like
other sizes, and I didn't reallythink anything else about it.
Then we went into theconference and the speaker was
talking.
She was talking about beingfearless and in my mind.
I just felt, well, you couldstart a Christian t-shirt
company.
(05:31):
And I was like, well, that's aweird thought.
I've never thought about thismy like.
When I worked at the nonprofit Iwas working with numbers, I was
doing fundraising, I was doingmail, like I was doing.
I wasn't doing a lot ofcreative stuff really at all, so
it was very out of my realm.
So I thought, okay, I'll tellmy husband this idea.
(05:52):
I'm sure he's going to tell meit's a terrible idea, and then
that's going to be it.
But instead he was like, okay,I think we could do that.
And then, just like my, mybrother, and my brother was
getting married, so I was reallyhelping with the wedding.
So I'm like I'm going to wait,so after the wedding, then I'm
going to start this activity.
It was like a month later.
But then after that I got ayear end bonus the nonprofit.
(06:16):
Their year was fiscal year, soit was July one to June 30.
And I got a bonus and it wasfor like the exact amount I
would need for like a cricketmachine and a heat press.
So I was like, ok, I can dothis.
So I started doing it and I westarted on Etsy and my husband
was like you can just sell oneshirt a day.
Then I think that's fine and Iwas like, ok, so I did that and
(06:40):
that was great and we let's seethat was in June no-transcript,
(07:35):
wonderful.
And he was like, no, this isnot sustainable, we need to move
out into a new location.
So we moved the office out ofour house into a building and
then that was kind of thebeginning, okay.
Tona Haywood (07:49):
Wow, and so you basically, when you were working
at the nonprofit, you did thisalongside with the nonprofit and
Ellie and Grace, so you weredoing both at the same time for
a little while.
Brenna Millville (08:04):
I had an hour commute there and then an hour
commute back, which I absolutelyhated.
It was probably one of my leastfavorite things about going
there, because it was verytrafficy and it was just.
It was just like a bad.
It just put me in a badheadspace every day.
And then one day I was justlike I just need to take this
time and do something else withit.
So I started listening tobusiness podcasts and learning
(08:28):
about there were.
Their podcasts aren't reallyaround anymore, but there were a
few of them that were aroundthen that I would listen to
every single time and they wereabout like women who had started
Etsy shops.
I'm like, ok, so I could learnabout this.
So I just kind of treated it astwo hours of continuing
education and I worked four daysa week, so that was eight hours
a week that I could just learnthings instead of just sitting
(08:49):
in my car being like I can'tbelieve I have to go to this job
.
This is terrible.
This is just like making melike perpetuating that.
Tona Haywood (08:55):
I turned that time and made it into something
beneficial and that's great,because I believe that probably
gave you motivation to kind ofkeep going and not think so much
about the job you hated, butsomething else that you were
putting your time and energyinto.
I like that.
And at what stage did youdecide to expand Ellie and Grace
(09:18):
?
Or was that the stage when yourealized the basement was being
overtaken by clothes, productand all of these different
things?
Was that the stage when it justgot like, okay, this is not
sustainable at all?
Brenna Millville (09:34):
Logistically, it was pretty challenging to be
working all the time like that.
It was doable.
But we also had other things,like we had too many packages
and USPS didn't want to comepick them up from our house, and
so it would be beneficial tohave a space for, and have a
designated pickup where, like amore industrial truck came every
day.
It was the first thing we hadto outsource was customer
(09:57):
service, because you can't belike packing shirts and also
responding to emails at the sametime, unfortunately.
I wish that that was possible,because that would really help
us out.
But so there were just a lot oflittle things.
And then, especially once wehad grace in 2020, in January
2020, which was a crazy timethen I wasn't physically able to
(10:18):
do what I was like I did beforebefore.
We were in a busy time.
Then, if I remember this onetime, it was supposed to start
snowing at like 7am, and snow inlike this time of year is great
sometimes, but when you have acertain number of orders, you
need to get out every day.
Losing a whole day can reallyset you back.
So I was like it's fine, I'lljust go to the office before it
(10:40):
snows at like three and I'lljust wait until they clear the
roads in the evening and thenI'll just go home.
So I can't do that now becauseI have a toddler, but I was able
to do it then and I did, and Iwould just ramp up and ramp down
.
So having a great team rightnow that's able to do those
things is very helpful.
So I don't have to come in at3am before the snow come in at 3
(11:08):
am before the snow.
Tona Haywood (11:08):
Right, and that's good.
That's good.
And with your team, how are youable to decide who is going to
be on your team?
What qualities were you lookingfor in a good team?
Brenna Millville (11:16):
The most important thing I think about in
a great team aren't necessarilythat they can do the specific
job that you're hiring them for.
Like, can they cut fabric forembroidery kits?
Probably yes.
Can they pack and ship in order?
Probably yes.
All of our skills can be taught.
So then it's mainly on attitudeand work ethic.
(11:37):
So that's kind of what we make.
That's what we definitely putabove the other, like the skills
, just because of the nature ofwhat we do.
We're not like mechanics, soyou don't have to, you can't go
to school to do these specificthings.
So it's mainly just aboutattitude and work ethic for us.
Okay.
Tona Haywood (11:54):
That makes sense.
How big is your team now?
Brenna Millville (11:58):
I'm very lucky that I'm able to do most of the
creative things and my husbandhandles almost all the business
side of things.
So we have, we have a manager,we have, let's see, I'd say
around 10, 10 to 15.
It varies on the year, like itvaries when we're like like
(12:20):
right now is our very busy timeand the summer is usually our
slower time, so it just kind ofvaries based on the time of year
.
Tona Haywood (12:25):
Okay, that is really good to know.
Um, as an entrepreneur in thefaith-based apparel industry,
what has been your mostsignificant challenges?
Brenna Millville (12:39):
I had to laugh when I read this question,
honestly, because I would sayone of the biggest challenges to
us was kind of a I would in mylike positive attitude, I would
say an unintended consequence.
In my negative attitude, Iwould maybe say purposeful.
But after the 2020 election,facebook chose to remove a lot
(13:04):
of interest.
Facebook chose to remove a lotof interest for, um, the brain
of bad specific people, yes, anda lot of our people obviously
are christians.
If you're not a christian, youprobably don't want to wear a
christian shirt.
So when they chose to removeall that stuff, it was very
challenging because it was hard.
It's harder for us to find ourpeople because of the decision
(13:25):
they made to do that.
So I say that's been a prettybig challenge.
Um, I would say anotherchallenge and I don't know if
this is faith industry, specificthough that one really was is
just people taking our designsand steal like literally taking
our pictures and then sellingthem for like a fourth of the
(13:45):
price, which is frustrating, andthey're doing it.
Some of my friends to someonejust messaged me a picture
yesterday and she was like Canyou make this for me?
And I was like no, I can'tbecause that's not my design,
but also I know whose designthat is, and so I sent them a
picture and I was like, hey, youmight want to file something
(14:06):
with this like overseas companybecause they're selling your
design as their own and that'snot right and they should do
their own work.
But I wanted to let them know.
So that's definitely that'sbeen an ongoing challenge.
I'd say that's one of thebenefits of our new book and
doll collection is that that's alot harder to rip off it is
(14:27):
definitely like that and I thinkthe embroidery kits.
Tona Haywood (14:32):
It's kind of hard to do that.
Brenna Millville (14:33):
Well, this is funny.
So that picture I was tellingyou about it was actually.
Someone actually took a pictureof this woman's embroidery kit.
Put it on a shirt.
Tona Haywood (14:44):
Wow.
Brenna Millville (14:45):
Yeah, I know I was like they are really
getting bold with it.
That is kind of bold and peoplecommented on it.
They're like, how would thiswash?
And I'm just like, well, notwell, because it's an embroidery
kit.
Tona Haywood (14:59):
And they literally took the picture off her
website, removed the hoop andput it on a shirt.
Oh yeah, that is.
That's not good.
I do understand what you taughtwhat you're talking about with
the Facebook part.
I know that I would dabble inads every now and again and from
(15:20):
the time that I starteddabbling in ads to like, let's
say, today, when I went on mostrecently, I was like, wait, what
happened?
Like what happened with theinterest, what happened with all
of the things that I was I usedto be able to you to check?
Those things aren't thereanymore.
And it's like well, am I goingto be spending money to waste on
(15:40):
people who may or may not likethese specific things?
To come to my page, there areso many changes with Facebook, I
tell you.
Every time I would go back in,it was just like okay, this is
just too much, I can't, I justcan't even deal with it.
Now the part about peopletaking other individuals work
(16:05):
and trying to sell it as theirown.
I haven't yet seen mineanywhere, but I can't.
I can't confirm or deny thatit's not.
Brenna Millville (16:16):
There's so many of them.
I only find out when peoplemessage me about it.
Right, it's frustrating,because then I see it and I'm
like why?
Tona Haywood (16:25):
Why, exactly, especially.
And then the selling of it issuch lower prices where people
are going to be like, oh, thisprice is so in my, you know, in
my affordability, you know, Ican just go ahead and just get
it.
That can be very, veryfrustrating.
Brenna Millville (16:45):
And then another thing that happened I'd
say that was frustrating is thewhole fact checking and all of
that, which is I understand whythey did that.
Over the summer I had a reelthat I posted and it was about
the devil and trying to like usnot being concerned about the
devil because we're strong inthe word, but the Instagram
algorithm thought it was aboutthe border.
(17:07):
And then everyone that followsme gets a notification that's
like are you sure you want tofollow this account?
Because it's been like they'veposted misinformation and if
someone tries to tag me, they'llalso get the same warning.
So now I'm getting messagesevery day being like oh hey, did
you know this is happening?
And I'm like, yeah, I actuallyhave an auto thing that I just
(17:28):
like type in one word and itsends my thing Right.
It's exhausting to have toexplain it every single time,
and I tried to appeal it andthey were like no, wow, so
they'll have to throw up andlook for it.
Tona Haywood (17:44):
It had like the little misinformation like I
think I remember that, I feellike I remember seeing that and
they're still doing that now,like every time.
Oh, that's annoying.
Brenna Millville (17:54):
It's extremely annoying.
Tona Haywood (17:59):
Oh, and another question just about the apparel
Do you design it all yourself oris there a collaborative effort
with team of designers?
I think you might have saidthis already, that you design it
all yourself said this alreadythat you designed it all
yourself.
Brenna Millville (18:16):
But so previously, the past seven years
, yes, I've designed everythingmyself, with the exception of
our new men's line that justcame out last week, and my
husband worked with anotherdesigner on that because I just
didn't feel called tospecifically design men's wear
myself.
That's not my forte.
So, other than the spiritshield line, everything else is
designed by me, ok that's nice.
Tona Haywood (18:36):
I'm glad that you got your husband involved and
got a designer to design themen's part, because sometimes I
feel like when you're aChristian boutique owner
especially when you're doingmost of the things yourself,
like myself when it comes to thedesign space, we tend to just
be like you know what I can do,that I can get that done.
(19:01):
But knowing these are thethings that I'm good at versus
this is something that somebodyelse needs to take on so that we
can best use our time, energy,effort and resources.
So it can be good Makes sense.
And can you walk us throughyour design process?
(19:22):
How do you find inspiration anddevelop new ideas?
Brenna Millville (19:27):
So what I generally do now that we've been
doing this for so long.
We mainly design for seasonalcollections.
So I'll go back, I'll see whatdid well, what didn't do as well
as we'd hoped.
Then those items will beretired.
Then sometimes I'll use thosephrases or those verses for
future designs.
So I'm not necessarily having togenerate everything out of thin
(19:47):
air like I used to, because I'mkind of just redoing what I've
done in the past, with theexception of the embroidery kits
, because those are brand new.
So it's kind of fun to be ableto come up with something, cause
now I'm like a little limitedin my designing for shirts,
because it has to it can only beso many colors.
Well, I guess embroidery kitscan only be so many colors too,
(20:07):
but my it's larger and if Ireally want them to be more, I
can.
It's just you have to putanother thread in the bundle,
and sometimes you know thatcould be a lot.
I can do a lot, but it's niceto be able to have this creative
kind of mind expansion to whereI can do whatever I want.
So when I'm thinking I'mactually designing for Easter
(20:28):
right now, then we're inBuc-ee's.
So they do, they want theirstuff about six months in
advance.
So right now I'm doing 4th ofJuly and Mother's Day for
apparel and I'm doing Easter forembroidery.
So I'm thinking about Easter andI'm like what do I want to see
on the Easter design?
What do I like see in my mind?
And usually I can see itsomewhat clearly, at least for a
(20:51):
first draft, and then I usuallyhave to like rip it out and
restitch it a few times tochoose, like the exact right
colors, but that's kind of whatI do.
And then for the holidays it'sjust what has done.
Well, do I want to reiterate itLike?
I believe like Mary Design hasbeen a good seller for us since
we started it.
It's kind of similar to mywomen of the Bible design that I
(21:14):
created.
So I was like I liked thatdesign.
I want to try to do a Christmasdesign that's like my woman of
the Bible design, so that I kindof do it like that and just see
what hits me.
Tona Haywood (21:26):
Okay, I like that.
What made you decide to getinto the embroidery portion and
the book and dolls?
Brenna Millville (21:35):
like what made you decide to kind of lean into
that a little bit, um more inthis season so two Christmases
ago we were, I guess, betweenChristmas and New Year's I'd
just been feeling like there wassomething else I wanted to do
with.
I wanted to do something elseif there, I wanted to still do
apparel but been feeling likethere was something else I
wanted to do with.
I wanted to do something elseif there, I wanted to still do
(21:56):
apparel.
But I felt like there wassomething else I needed to do.
And I always loved AmericanGirl dolls.
I never had one, but I had allthe books I really love to read
and I'd also been going to ourlocal library with my daughter
and I'm like some of these books.
I just don't like them.
And if the world is not goingto be shy about putting out
(22:17):
their values for children, thenwe should also not be shy about
putting out our values forchildren, right?
So I wanted to create asomething that was kind of along
those lines where there was adoll that someone could see, a
child could see, and they couldassociate it with the characters
in the books.
And then I wanted to do threeand I wanted to have them.
(22:38):
I was envisioning like a marveluniverse type of situation,
because they, like each have amain character.
But then the other people makelike support.
They're supporting roles ineach right, okay.
Okay, even if they get one doll, they'll still see the other
three in the book and if theywant to get them in the future,
that's totally fine.
But I actually came out withthat idea even though they
(22:59):
released six months after theembroidery kits.
I came out with it two yearsago.
It just took a long time to getthe books.
Actually, it didn't take a longtime to get the books written.
I wrote the books in like aweek.
But all the rest of the processtook an extremely long time.
And then, with embroidery, I wasstitching every night because I
just enjoyed it.
It's relaxing, it's fun to havesomething to do that's not on a
(23:23):
screen.
And so I just I first startedjust making kits for my friends
that I would be like okay, Iknow that you really like this
certain verse, so I'm going tomake this for you.
And last year I made littlecross.
Stitch is slightly different,it's basically a bunch of little
X's but I made like familyportraits for all my friends.
(23:43):
And then I was working on theseembroidery kits and I was like,
well, maybe we can sell them.
We'll do like a little test andsee how it goes and people are
really loving them, I think.
With just technology being soin your face all the time, it's
nice to have something thatyou're just physically doing
with your hands, and one of myfavorite things to do with it is
like listen to a podcast whileI'm stitching, or listen to an
(24:06):
audio book or listen to worshipmusic, and I use that time to
really decompress.
I usually try to stitch atleast like an hour a night, you
know that's the funny thingabout that.
Tona Haywood (24:18):
I had a friend from church who did knitting.
She was, she was an avidknitter, and I kept saying you
know, I just I'm always on thescreen, I'm tired of being on
the screen, I'm going to learnhow to knit.
Can you show me?
It didn't go over well.
And it's the same with sewing,because my mom actually she sews
(24:43):
all the time and she taught mehow to sew, but I didn't pick it
up like she did, and so for meit was kind of one of those
things that I don't think I'mgoing to deal with this.
But with embroidery it seemslike you give the instructions
right, and so is it prettyself-explanatory and easy to
(25:07):
follow, Even for a person that,like me, doesn't like to sew.
Brenna Millville (25:14):
I would say yes, it comes with everything
you need except scissors.
There is a written PDF that'slike step one use this thread
and this stitch to complete thisarea.
We also have videos of everysingle stitch, because it's, of
course, very hard to explain astitch in written form and once
you know it, then you know it.
(25:34):
It might seem like it'sintimidating, but once you start
it and you're like okay, now Iknow, let's say, the French knot
.
Well, this French knot is onlydone one way.
So once you know it, you knowit, and then you can do those
parts of the project.
So I usually recommend topeople is they like, read the
PDF and like, okay, I'm doingthis part first with this stitch
.
Go watch the video, go do itand then go to the next one and
(25:58):
if you have any questions, justmessage me or DM me.
I just told someone this morningto send me a video because I
was like it might be easier foryou to explain via video what
your question is and then I canlet you know how to do it.
Because I just feel verystrongly that if people are
intent, if they let themselveslike, accept that it might be.
(26:19):
You know, it can be a littleintimidating, but if they go
ahead and do it, then they'll behappy that they did and it's a
great skill to have and it's afun way to make like a special
project for someone or just keepthem in your house.
I need to figure out how I canneed to display mine, cause I
obviously have quite a few ofthe hoops and they're all just
sitting in a stack, cause I usethem for content, of course, and
(26:41):
I'm like I need to put themsomewhere and, like make them
pretty, Display it in a bookcaseor something I think on a shelf
bookcase, something like thatyou should do.
Tona Haywood (26:52):
And I'm thinking about it.
I might have to just get oneand just dive in, because I
believe, like you say, we'realways on the screen and whether
you're designing or whetheryou're doing social media, email
, whatever, it's all on a screen.
And trying to get away fromthat is always good to use a
(27:14):
different part of your brain aswell.
Brenna Millville (27:18):
The other thing that's nice about it is if
you're doing something else,you're not on the computer and
say your phone's on, do notdisturb, or silent.
You're not getting interrupted,at least by any digital
interruptions.
Tona Haywood (27:32):
That's right.
Brenna Millville (27:33):
Then you're.
It's hard sometimes when you'reon your computer that you can
set it so you don't disturb.
You can X out of all yourmessaging notifications, but
they're still kind of there.
But if you've got your hands ona hoop and one hand's holding
it and the other one's stitching, you can't be like oh, I wonder
what is going on over there.
Oh, I wonder if anyone messagedme because your hands are busy.
Tona Haywood (27:51):
That's right, that's true, and you're right,
because if you are even on yourcomputer or your computers
nearby.
Brenna Millville (28:03):
There's still this innate desire to go to it,
Like calling to you.
Yeah, it does it speaks.
Tona Haywood (28:07):
I agree with you on that one.
So for those interested inentering the faith-based or
inspirational apparel market,what advice would you offer to
them?
Brenna Millville (28:20):
I would say the most important thing is to
be original and to try to comeup with your own things that
don't look like anyone else's,and to especially not see
someone's design and think, oh,I like that, I'm going to take
that exact design and sell itfor myself, because then you're
not really doing your own thingand so you're not.
(28:42):
You're not able to be a uniquebusiness and like differentiate
yourself, because you just looklike everyone else.
You want to be able to beyourself, kind of with.
Like the three essentialelements of starting a business
being able to be yourself,providing a quality product and
quality customer service are allvery, very important to
establish your brand.
I think in general with asuccessful business and I know
(29:05):
people have had success on Etsybut I think that also being able
to have once you're able tohave your own website, that's
very important.
Being able to have once you'reable to have your own website
that's very important becausewhenever people get something on
Etsy like I just bought aNutcracker sweatshirt for Grace
two days ago on Etsy I could nottell you the name of the
business at all.
I got it on Etsy but I don'tremember where.
Like they all looked the same.
So, but if you have your ownbrand and you're able to
(29:29):
establish that, then instead ofsomeone saying, oh, I got that
on Etsy, they can say, oh, I gotthat on Ellie and Grace.
And that's really what you want, because you want to be able to
get brand loyalty and bringthem back to you.
Instead of now, the next time Iwant a Nutcracker sweatshirt,
I'm just going to get on Etsy,right, I won't necessarily buy
it from the same person, becauseI won't even remember.
Tona Haywood (29:51):
That is so true.
Buy it from the same personbecause I won't even remember.
That is so true.
That is so true.
And I think most timesindividuals, they go to SD first
because it's like this is a wayto get free traffic, I don't
have to worry about my owntraffic.
But there's such a competitionout there with the same thing
that you're doing, so how do youget those eyeballs on you in a
concentrated space when somebodycan click on you and click off
(30:12):
really quick and they'resomewhere else?
Brenna Millville (30:15):
It'll say they'll be on your page Like
this happened to me when I waslooking at the Nutcracker
sweatshirts and it says youmight also like.
And there's like three moresweatshirts that look basically
the same and they're all fromdifferent businesses.
Tona Haywood (30:28):
So you can very easily go to another business
and then you're somewhere elseentirely businesses, so you can
very easily go to anotherbusiness and then you're
somewhere else entirely, that'strue, and then you don't even
know how to get back to the onethat you were at in the
beginning.
So that makes sense.
So were those your essentialelements for a successful
business as well?
The customer service.
Brenna Millville (30:47):
Yes, the quality product and the
originality yes.
Tona Haywood (30:50):
Okay, those are perfect Now.
I see you all the time onInstagram.
Brenna Millville (30:56):
Well, thank you, I don't feel like I'm on
there as much as I used to be.
I used to post every day andthen I was like I cannot do this
anymore.
It's too hard it is too hard.
Tona Haywood (31:05):
Well, I guess it seems to me that you are
consistent.
So, whatever your consistencyschedule looks like, it looks
consistent to me.
Okay, could you share some ofthe strategies for maintaining
an effective and consistentemail and social media marketing
(31:26):
strategy?
Brenna Millville (31:27):
Yes, we actually have a person on our
team that does the emailmarketing, primarily with my
husband, so that's extremelyhelpful.
That's right scheduled andlater, two weeks out, but right
(31:50):
now, because it's busy, it's alittle bit of an imperfect world
, so I'm kind of posting alittle bit more on the fly, but
I try to have, like I have, realdrafts.
I'm kind of committing thecardinal, I'm breaking the rule.
I don't have any of the draftssaved other than an instagram.
So if something happens toInstagram, I'm going to be
(32:11):
totally.
But you know, oh well, it isyeah, and just trying to take
pictures.
When I'm able to take pictures,remembering like okay, I'm at
the office today, I need to takesome.
If I ship orders today, which Iprobably will, I need to like
set up my phone and get some,like some video of that, I need
to take some pictures and justhaving that type of stuff.
(32:32):
So then when I'm ready to post,I don't have to think, oh no,
now I need to go take thatpicture because I already have
it.
So that's also very helpful.
I do like I prefer to havescheduled content.
I just because I've beenhelping a lot with production,
because we've been busy withBlack Friday it, I haven't been
able to do it as much as I wouldlike, so here's a question,
(32:54):
since you do dive into socialmedia a lot when you have time,
based on the season that you'rein.
Tona Haywood (33:01):
Okay, it can differ.
Do you feel that the majorityof your sales come from social
media like Instagram, facebookand things like this, and this
is without ads, without doingads, do you feel like the
majority comes from there, ordoes the majority really come
from people finding you onlineand your repeat customers?
Brenna Millville (33:26):
We do have a high return customer rate
because of our product and ourcustomer service, which I think
is why those are two of theessential elements, and our
email list is also veryimportant.
I think, in general, an emaillist is extremely important
because there have been timeswhere, you know, instagram has
gone down and Facebook has gonedown and we never.
We can't really rely on thosethings, but we have our email
(33:49):
lists and that's a way that wecan directly get into people's
mailboxes.
So I would say that email.
I've technically been in thisspace for a very long time,
(34:15):
probably since 2011.
Tona Haywood (34:18):
And it started out just my husband and I.
We were wanted to see picturesin every house with, like my
poetry and his photographygraphic design, so we would put
something together and we weredoing it by hand.
For first off, it was friendsand family were buying them, and
(34:39):
then we're trying to figure outhow to do this better, where we
could scale it and not be, youknow, doing all this stuff
ourselves.
And eventually there were thingsthat came about that enabled us
to do that, like print ondemand and things of that nature
, and that's primarily what weuse.
But the reason why is we have awhole our other businesses,
(34:59):
digital marketing, where we helpbusinesses with their websites
and things like that.
So we do both of these inconjunction, but we know that
this over here can be sustainedby the print on demand, and so
that's what we do on you know,pretty much on this side.
But when it comes to socialmedia, you can tell that I can
(35:22):
post, I can do stories, I can dothis, I can do that, but there
aren't really a whole lot ofsales that come from that.
Most times, it does come fromthe people who decided to be on
your list, who decided topurchase, who decide to
repurchase those committedcustomers that you've built a
bond with.
Brenna Millville (35:41):
So I heard someone say once I don't
remember who it was that socialmedia is almost like it's more
for nurturing your currentcustomers the people who already
know you to be like, to justkind of.
So that's kind of how I treat it.
We definitely get new people.
I just had a real and this isalso on content and you can have
super simple content my mostwatched video real ever by like
(36:04):
a significant amount.
I think.
It is at like 1.2 million.
Wow, which is crazy to me.
I've never not like I'm talkinglike by by a lot like.
The next one was maybe like20,000.
So a lot higher, and it wasjust about reading a chapter of
Luke every day, december 1st toDecember 24th, because there are
24 chapters, right, and so nowI wasn't planning on posting
(36:29):
about my reading every morning,but now, since that reel went
viral, I've created a highlightand I'm like Okay, I'm just
going to post a few things thatI thought of whenever I was
reading the reading of the day,and I'm just going to post it in
the morning.
I'll save it to the highlightsand if anyone wants that
information, it's available.
That was just a simple one.
You never know what.
Tona Haywood (36:48):
Instagram is you don't.
And I think that's the hardpart, because when you're doing
things on Instagram, you can gointo this looking to see what
everybody else is doing, lookingto see what gets the most views
, and then you try it and yousee if it works.
Sometimes it does, sometimes itdoesn't, but it doesn't really
(37:10):
increase anything per se.
It doesn't give you new emailsignups, it doesn't give you new
followers.
Like, I had a reel that my topreel had about close to 50,000
views, but it was just memimicking someone else singing
and that was it.
And it's like oh okay, that wasgreat, but it didn't really
(37:35):
change anything.
So I think for each person Ithink that's the takeaway Each
person you have to figure outwhat works for you and where
you're at in your season,because it may not look the same
as everyone else and you haveto be okay with that and be able
to be consistent.
However, it works for yourseason.
Brenna Millville (37:56):
Yes, and with posts, and sometimes posts not
doing as well and sometimesreels not doing as well.
If someone who's listening tothis is has had that problem and
I've had that problem it's notbecause you're bad and it's not
because you're not talented andyou're not using the skills God
gave you.
It's just because the algorithmis weird and it's not a
(38:20):
reflection on your business orwho you are as a person.
Tona Haywood (38:23):
I agree, because I know a lot of times there will
be people that will preach atyou your content is not right,
your content is not right.
Your content is not right, yourcontent is not right.
But you can put out somethingthat will resonate with a lot of
people, but those people willjust never see it because it
didn't take off in the way thatit was supposed to take off in
(38:43):
order for the algorithm tocontinue to push you out.
And so it doesn't mean thatwhatever you did wasn't good
enough.
It's just that how things workon the back end.
That may have prevented peoplefrom seeing it, but it doesn't
negate you still doing what youwere called to do and being
obedient.
Whoever was supposed to bereached, they would be reached.
(39:16):
On that note, since we arealways in the social media space
and looking and seeing and allof these other things, what
other people are doing, how doyou prevent comparison?
Because I tell you, with a lotof the big name Christian
apparel companies like yourself,every time I see like oh my
gosh, they have out their fallline already.
I'm still struggling over here.
Like, look, they're alreadyhere and I'm not there yet, like
(39:40):
what you know.
And then I'll go back into thisrat race of OK.
Well, I got to be out just likeeverybody else is out.
I got to hurry up and I got todo this and then I finally
figured I had to look at myselfand said Tona, you're one person
, you're not, it's just you.
You don't have the sameresources that everyone else has
(40:02):
and you can't keep puttingthese extra pressures on
yourself to be where others are.
That's not what I have for youright now.
So how do you speak to thatpiece?
The comparison that can come inat times.
Brenna Millville (40:20):
It is.
It's definitely challenging.
You're not alone in that.
Like when I was saying earlierthat I was working, I need to be
working on the Mother's Day and4th of July line.
I need to have it done by theend of the year, and I'm already
feeling like a slacker andwe're talking about, like that's
six months away, right so, butI need to have it done by the
end of the month.
So I'm already feeling thatlike, why can't I get this out
sooner?
What's wrong with me?
(40:40):
So you're definitely not alonein that.
I would say if there is aaccount, or more, more than one
account that is making you feelterrible about yourself, then I
would advise to unfollow or muteif you don't want to unfollow
them, because you're afraidyou're going to, like cause some
drama in the social media world.
And the other thing that Iwould say is to try to change
(41:04):
your attitude to cheering theother people on I can't say that
I've experienced this back.
The other people on I can't saythat I've experienced this back
.
But there are people that likeI, like I see online.
I'm like, oh, I wish I wouldhave thought of that.
Oh, I really like that, andthen I just try to be like that
looks great and like, try, likereally mean it because it does
(41:24):
look great.
Do I wish I would have thoughtof it?
Yes, but I'll think ofsomething else.
So that's okay, and we all havedifferent things.
If our stuff all look the same,it would be a bummer.
So just trying to remember thatcomparison is really can
destroy everything, not just ourjoy, but really all of our like
, everything we have.
(41:45):
And so trying to remember that.
But you can unfollow, you canmute, you can do those type of
things if it would make you feelbetter.
I also try not to do a lot ofscrolling, which is funny.
I'm like, on one hand, I'm likemy posts don't get very much
reach and, on the other hand,I'm like I don't even really
scroll the feed anymore.
I don't really watch stories, Iknow.
Tona Haywood (42:10):
Exactly and that I find that I'll go on.
I will search a couple ofthings.
I will probably look at mystories or whatever.
I have the most fun in mystories.
Actually, that's where I I tendto do.
I've just decided I I'll spendmy time in the stories, cause at
least I know that these fewpeople that are there, they're
(42:34):
there, they come to beencouraged, because I can't, on
the feed itself, you may notreach anybody these days, so.
So it's like I'll go there anddo that.
But you're right, there's beena lack of me really scrolling
and staying on there, becauseyou get all of these different
(42:55):
messages that I don't reallyneed to get right now.
That does it, you know.
Hey, you need to use this audioor this audio or this.
It's like, ok, I'm out again.
So that does make a lot ofsense.
And how can you, or how do you,balance the creative demands
with the business side ofrunning Ellie and Grace?
Brenna Millville (43:19):
So the wonderful thing is, now that
we've been around for so long,this is our seventh seventh year
yeah, seventh year and myhusband is very good at the
business side and all of that.
So luckily I don't have to do alot of that, which is very
convenient Because since Gracewas born I've had childcare one
(43:39):
or two days a week.
Now she's in school two days aweek.
Next year she'll be in schoolthree days a week.
Then she'll go to kindergarten,which is crazy to me.
But there isn't enough physicaltime for me to do all of those
things Like.
Even now I have about 14 hoursa week that I'm able to like
dedicatedly work, but becauseit's a busy time, half of those
(44:00):
hours are spent helpingproduction, so I have even less
time to do the things likeprepare for Easter and Mother's
Day and Fourth of July.
So I'm making sure to stitch atnight because I have all these
things that I want to get done.
There's only so much time inthe day.
So sometimes, even when you'vebeen established for a long time
(44:22):
and you have an amazing team,you still have to work at night
and in the morning, sometimesbased on the season, and that's
okay.
Tona Haywood (44:29):
That's true.
It's all based on the seasonthat you're in.
It's kind of like an ebb andflow and since this is a digital
marketing podcast, what is onecritical component of digital
marketing for your business thatmust not be overlooked under
(44:50):
any circumstance?
Brenna Millville (44:53):
that must not be overlooked under any
circumstance.
I would say the most importantthing is to be on things.
Whether you have an email list,you have to have something.
I think it's very challengingto do this and not have anything
.
I have two friends that arelike I'm just not gonna have
social media at all and theyhave businesses and they have
email lists.
But I'm just like, is thatreally working?
(45:15):
I'm not sure.
Maybe it is.
At least they have an emaillist.
It's better than nothing.
But you have to have something.
And also it's important to beyourself and bring that
personality to the brand.
Even if you don't want to showyour face on camera or you don't
want to have like your face andstories and you want it to be
more like less personal, youstill need to have some elements
(45:38):
to where people know you're notlike spam company.
I guess is a better word todescribe it, because a lot of
those type of companies the onesthat seal designs, the ones
that like those type of thingsthey don't have any information
about who has created them,because they can't, because it's
just like a bot that's createdthe whole thing.
(45:58):
So you want to be able to beyourself and have some sort of
personality, even if you're justshowing like your hands or the
back of your head and stuff likethat.
Grace was recognized in person afew years ago, which was a
little concerning to me as hermother.
So now I only show usually I'llshow like the side of her face,
(46:18):
or I haven't shown like herfull profile in a little while,
except for on our so lovedcollection, because like that's
kind of her, it's for her Right.
So there's it.
You're able to createboundaries and do things like
that.
My husband does not want to beon social media so whenever I
show pictures it's like usuallyand it's very rare, like for
small business Saturday it's theback of his head.
Tona Haywood (46:40):
Right.
Brenna Millville (46:41):
Or if I'm like doing a picture and stories,
I'll put like a block over, likea block of text right over his
face.
There you go, so just becreative with it.
There are ways that you canhold those boundaries and still
be personal and try not to betoo serious and try to have fun,
because if you're miserabledoing your digital marketing and
(47:01):
your business, then you'reprobably not doing.
You're probably not doing whatyou should be doing.
Maybe you're not, maybe you'renot.
That's not what you're supposedto do and you should do
something else.
Maybe it's not the right, maybethe business isn't the right
fit for you.
There are other things.
If you're not happy doing yourown business, then you probably
(47:22):
should think about what youshould pivot and change to make
yourself not feel unhappy.
Tona Haywood (47:28):
That makes sense, not feel unhappy that makes
sense, and so when you say be onsomething, do you mean like, be
on like?
Brenna Millville (47:44):
social media like pick one yes, you have to
exist to have digital marketing.
That's true.
And if you don't, then youcan't.
Tona Haywood (47:49):
That's true, very true.
Well, I appreciate youanswering all of these questions
in our time today.
Is there any last bit ofinformation that you would give
to our listeners today?
Brenna Millville (48:09):
I would say the most important thing to do
is to if you have, if you'rethinking about starting a
business, or if you're wonderingthe direction your business
should go in, or if you'refeeling frustrated or really if
you're feeling anything youshould always be praying and
reading the Bible and makingthose some of your top
priorities so that you can makesure that your priorities are
(48:32):
able to stay in line.
Sometimes, when we get verybusy as entrepreneurs and
maintaining our home and withour families, it's very easy to
say you know, I'm just going toread that tomorrow I don't need
to, I am too busy to spend timewith God today, but tomorrow and
he understands because I'mdoing something for him.
But that's not the attitudethat we should have.
(48:52):
So I would say that is one ofthe top priorities that we
should have, no matter theseason, whether we're busy or
slow, or it's chaotic orpeaceful, we should always be
turning to that first.
Tona Haywood (49:03):
That is so true that keeps us on the right path,
on the path that he has for us,Exactly, exactly right.
Well, Brenna, I want to thankyou for being our guest today on
the we Pivot podcast.
This whole interview was veryenlightening and I am sure that
(49:26):
people who listen to it will beeducated and inspired with their
own business, especially withthe digital marketing and things
that they have that the Lordhas given them to do.
So thank you so much for beinghere.
Brenna Millville (49:42):
Thank you so much for having me.
Tona Haywood (49:44):
You're so welcome.
Al Haywood (49:46):
We're so excited that you tuned in to the latest
episode of the we Pivot podcast.
Thank you for joining us.
Now, whether this is your firsttime or not, please make sure
to subscribe and share with afriend who can also use some
digital marketing guidance aswell.
Until next time.
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