June 15, 2022 • 28 mins
Forget what you know about resilience! Neuroscientist, nutritionist and exercise physiologist, Paul Taylor is about to change the way you think about resilience forever, by redefining what it actually is, what we're doing wrong, and how we can build it in ourselves and the next generation. Then, if you're trying to stick to healthy eating habits, but your busy lifestyle just doesn't allow for the consistency you need, Sam gives his top tips to keep you on track! Have a question for Sam? Send it to him here.
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:03):
One thing that comes up time and time again on
the Wood Life is getting into good habits, whether it's
your exercise regime, or healthy eating or mindset. I always
bring it back, and so to so many of our
expert guests to developing those good habits. But what happens
if you have disruptions in your life that make it
difficult or challenging to even start a habit, let alone
(00:24):
keep it consistent. That is definitely an issue that Deb's
been facing.
Speaker 2 (00:28):
When I travel for work, I find the food is
really hard to stick to. I was wondering if you
could provide me a few tips on which I could
use so that I could stick to some kind of
more structured healthy eating while I travel for work.
Speaker 1 (00:41):
So you may not have travel necessarily traveling for work,
but we all have travel from time to time maintaining
a routine. So I'm sure, no matter what's going on in
your life, this will be able to help you in
some way. And we're going to answer that a little
later on the show. But first, I'm very excited to
introduce you to our guest today.
Speaker 3 (00:59):
He's been a good.
Speaker 1 (01:00):
Friend of mine for many many years, perhaps the most
qualified person that I've ever met and is an expert
in a number of fields. He could talk about a
huge range of topics, but today he's going to speak
about resilience in a way that perhaps you've never heard
it before. That's next on the Woodlife. Our next guest
(01:44):
is someone that, in my twenty two years experience in
the fitness industry, is the smartest person in fitness that
I have ever met. And I wouldn't make a statement
like that if I didn't absolutely believe it's true. He
is a neuroscientist, an exercise physiologist, and a nutritionists Paul Taylor,
Welcome to the Woodlife.
Speaker 3 (02:02):
It's a pleasure to be here.
Speaker 1 (02:04):
Our listeners don't know how brilliant you are just yet,
but they're going to in about twenty minutes time. Let's
start at the basis. What is resilience to you? I mean,
what's your definition of it? And as a genuine resilience expert,
you know you work with corporates all over the world,
and you know high performing athletes and everything in this
particular area, what is resilience? Take it anywhere?
Speaker 3 (02:25):
Your luck, mate. It's a good starting point, right because
most people would talk about resilience so they would define
resilience as the ability to bunch back right from getting
knocked down, or to go through a tough experience, a
period of stress, and not to have it impact you
psychologically too much. Right. But I actually like a broader
(02:48):
definition of resilience, and it comes back to why we
became the dominant species on Earth. It's largely because we
adapted better to stressors changing environments than any other species. Right.
And I think that the real thing that underpins resilience
is something called hormesis, which is a branch of science
(03:10):
that most people have never heard of, but it's basically
summed up by the words of Frederick Nietzsche, the German philosopher,
that which does not kill us makes us stronger. My
phday at the minute that I'm doing is in psychology,
focusing on resilience, on what I call You're doing a
book as well, and I'm writing a book called Death
by Comfort. Why. So there's a nice segue into this
(03:32):
why modern life is killing us and what we need
to do about it? Right, And so my whole premise
of this but linked back to what I said, we
became the dominant species largely because we adapted better to
stressors than other species. But since the Industrial Revolution, we've
entered what I call the comfort revolution, where we are
no longer moving very much and actually exercise. Physical exercise
(03:56):
is fundamental to our biology. And I now say with
complete certainty and without any judgment by the way, that
if you do not currently engage in regular physical activity,
at least some of which is vigorous, there's not a
snowballs chance in hell that either your brain is functioning
optimally or that you will have optimal resilience. It's absolutely impossible,
(04:17):
because it is so fundamental to our biology. But it's
not just exercise. We eat shit food that most of
which was never around for our species, And now more
than fifty percent of our data is made up of
ultra processed foods, right, which again affect our biology in
negative ways. We don't go hungry anymore. And hunger stress
(04:40):
is a hormetic stress that actually can strengthen your sALS,
that can strengthen your brain cells and actually protect you
against stress, just like exercise does. And you know, I
know you've got to degree in exercise science because I
taught you have money your subjects, right, But you know,
if we think about exercise, people get bigger, faster, stronger
(05:01):
because exercise is a stressor.
Speaker 1 (05:03):
Stress isn't always bad, no, we all have that psychology.
Speaker 3 (05:06):
That is the difference between d stress, which is stuff
that breaks you down physically sliced mentally, and you stress,
which is stuff that builds you up physically and or mentally. Right.
And my epiphany in this area came when I went
through combat Survival and Resistance to Interrogation training in the
Armed Forces. It was ten days, a pretty hard core shit,
(05:27):
and it was at the end of that course something
happened that normally I had have found a little bit stressful,
and I was like water off a duck's back. I
went and spoke to people on the course and they
all said the same thing. And that's when I because
I already had my master's in exercise science, and I thought,
maybe psychological and emotional stress follows the same pathway as
(05:48):
exercise stress. That you need to have exposure to some
of it, moderate intermittent exposure to it, followed by a
period of recovery that actually makes you stronger. And now
I actually, in the academic literature, for me, there's been
way too much focus on post traumatic stress and actually
postraumatic stress has changed from being about an event to
(06:09):
being about the individual now right, But now in the
literature they're starting to talk about post traumatic growth that
actually people who go through tough times, if it doesn't
break them, they actually grow. I say to my kids,
you're growing up in a bubble within a bubble within
a bubble. Right, Australia if you've never been overseas is
(06:29):
a bubble country. If you've never been to the Third World.
We live in a bubble. I live in Mountain Eliza
in the mornings and Peninsula. It's a frigging bubble. Right.
My kids go to awesome schools with awesome teachers, and
some of that is absent the stressors that we need
kids when they learn from school. So here's the interesting thing, right,
So I have this company years ago with Carly, had
(06:54):
this conversation and she vetoed my first suggestion, which was
taking our kids through a kiddie version of Come Survival
of Resistance to Interrogation. Get your friends prepared to sign up.
But you know what was on sport? Yeah, So we
said to our kids when they were young, here's the
house for is you need to do a team sport
and a martial art and actually saying to our kids,
(07:15):
I'm really proud that you got outside of your comfort zone.
And we talk to our kids all the time about
getting outside their comfort zone. I always say, lots of
people spend most of their lives in their comfort zone,
right and they dip their toe out and they go, oh,
that's a bit uncomfortable. I've got to come back here.
And you know, for me, it's like two am. No
(07:36):
good shit happens in your comfort zone. Think of something
that you're super, super proud of, and I guarantee you,
for the majority of your listeners it's going to involve
being out of your comfort zone and being stressed.
Speaker 1 (07:48):
For me, it was meeting Snage going on a reality
TV show, Get the Shit out of Me.
Speaker 3 (07:52):
Yeah, you never dreams that.
Speaker 1 (07:54):
I think I'd take that plunge and imagine if I hadn't.
So yeah, I share that one hundred.
Speaker 3 (08:00):
So that was a very long answer to for me.
Resilience it's psychophysiological and that's my PhD is on. There's
a large component of resilience that has to be earned,
that happens at a cellular level that affects both your
physiology in terms of your muscles, but also your biology
(08:21):
and your neurobiology and how you adapt to stress. So
one thing I'll give you here on this link. So
there was a research study done in the nineteen seventies
there's now been actually repeated that showed that fit women
versus unfit women, they had two s two cohorts, and
they exposed them all to this battery of stress tests,
so it was both psychological and physiological stress tests, and
(08:44):
they measured the cordisol responses right the major stress home
and the fit women had much dampened, much lower cortisol
responses to that battery of stress than the unfit women
right across both whether it was a psychology, whether it
was psychological or physio.
Speaker 1 (09:00):
Being physically fit to handle both.
Speaker 3 (09:03):
Yes, and you know why the mechanism and a lot
of people don't talk about it. And actually I looked
in the academic literature for this, and I thought, there's
going to be a whole heap of stuff. This is
what we call the cross stressor hypothesis has actually been
shown from cold exposure can help perform and exercise it
under hypoxic conditions. Other researchers come out and shown that
(09:24):
fitter people actually do better on a cold press or test, right,
And I know all around the country is going to
be people doing this.
Speaker 2 (09:33):
Right.
Speaker 3 (09:33):
You get a big jug of water, ice water, right,
put a whole heap of ice in it, and then
you stick your your hand in it up to your
just past your past your wrist, and see how long
you can and it's horrible. Right, that's a good score.
A good score is two minutes. But they fit in
the test at three minutes. Right. And when you look
at people who pass, it is a direct relationship to
(09:55):
their level of physical activity, and it's a dose response
in that sedentary people much fewer of them pass, and
people who are moderately active more of those past, people
who are highly active more even more of those pasts,
and people who do vigorous physical activity. That is the
most right. And for me, it's about because they're training
(10:17):
their stress response system, that ability to switch it on
and switch it off. And that's the biology that the
psychologists don't talk about.
Speaker 1 (10:25):
There must be a varying natural level of resilience. Absolutely so,
I mean this is you're doing environmental factors. We can
move the dial by actually proactively doing things, I mean
correct all I'm thinking is if I did that test,
which I will do by the way, I'll tell that
this is my score that right, Yeah, but Snares is
(10:48):
much tougher than I am.
Speaker 3 (10:49):
Mentally, she's not fitter than me. So you know there's
a psychologically often women are psychologically tougher that right. Okay,
So that's that's one thing. The other thing is there
is a component. We know that there are genes that
but as you will know, genes predisposed. It's the genes
interacting with the environment and particularly the early environment. Right,
(11:11):
So there is this learned resilience, and my kids have
a large amount of learned resilience.
Speaker 1 (11:16):
Is there a particular window of years? Look for all
the parents listening is is it has to be before?
I thought it's between.
Speaker 3 (11:23):
When you look at the brain. Right. The Jesuits have
a saying, give me a boy to leads of seven
and I'll give you back a man, right, And so
US neuroscientists talk about that great period of development of
the human brain and a lot of your characteristics are
laid down in those formative years. So starting early with
your kids and and really let's get practical about it,
(11:45):
it's it's praising your kids, not for outcomes, but for
effort right, and praising them that when they feel but
continue to pick themselves up and go at it, You've
got to praise those behaviors, right. And I'm very anti
this boosterism movement around that started in the nineteen yearies
(12:06):
in the United States that they saw that people who
had hire self esteem seemed to be more successful in
life and seem to have less crime and all of that.
So they thought, well, let's just boost people's self esteem,
and this whole movement swept throughout the United States with
no evidence behind it. If you look at all the
world class performers, athletes, successful people, it's effort that is
(12:30):
the thing that goes past it is the ability to
get comfortable with being uncomfortable. That is the one treate
that links all those people across different demands.
Speaker 1 (12:42):
Whenever you hear about world's most successful, but you know,
whether it's an actor that you love or entrepreneur, you know,
they've all got similar traits and similar routines. You know,
whether it's the four am workout, or it's the cold share,
or it's you know, there's some level of discipline, there's
some level of forcing themselves out of their comfort zone consistently.
Speaker 3 (13:04):
You mentioned cold shars our cold exposure. That is another
method by which you can enhance both your resilience and
improve your physiology. Right when you get into whether it's
a coal shar, or jump into a coldpol or get
into the ocean, there is a cold shock response that
happens within milliseconds that communicates with your brain, and there's
(13:26):
a whole heap of biology that is actually switched on. Right,
And we know that nora adrenaline, right, which is an
important mood enhancing chemical in the Brian can be increased
by hundreds of percent when you expose yourself to cold water.
But it also activates these things called stress response proteins.
So I mentioned Hermesis earlier on and stress response proteins
(13:47):
are the things that link exercise, particularly vigorous exercise, cold exposure,
hate exposure such as sauna, but also links into fasting
and how fasting can be really good for us. There
are now over six hundred identified hormetic stressors. Right. For instance,
you take broccoli keel, lots of people eat that and
(14:07):
they talk about the sulfuravian and it's a powerful antioxidant.
It's not an antioxidant, it's a poison. Lots of plants
are good for us because they have small doses of
poison that in an insect is enough to persuade them
not to eat it. But because we are much bigger,
induces a mild what we call hormetic stress. And because
(14:28):
our sales get this mild stress, they upregulate the activity
of protective genes. So you talked about genes earlier on.
Yes they're important, but it's whether or not your genes
are switched on or switched off. And it turns out
when we expose ourselves to a range of mild stressors
that we upreguliate protective genes such as antioxidant defence genes.
(14:51):
And these things are like the special forces of yourselves, right,
So rather than have them being guarded by Dad's army,
we want them to be guarded by our special forces.
And it's that repeated, intermittent exposure to a variety of
stressors that enhances our cellular resilience, and I believe spills
(15:11):
over into our emotional on our mental resilience as well.
Speaker 1 (15:15):
And I one hundred percent agree with you, and I
think for so many of us, we think getting out
of our comfort zone has.
Speaker 3 (15:21):
To be such a big.
Speaker 1 (15:24):
Significant event. Yes, I did a marathon, I've co got
my favorite public speaking or you know I only ate
broccoli for four nine days and nothing whatever?
Speaker 3 (15:34):
What you know?
Speaker 1 (15:35):
Like, you know, I'm up at four am jumping in
the ocean for a month. But it's actually success by
a million cuts by actually just continually. If you wrote down,
maybe you introduced.
Speaker 3 (15:47):
One a month. Yep.
Speaker 1 (15:48):
With the exercise you said, exercise regularly. Some of it
is high intensity. Do you have a formula?
Speaker 3 (15:55):
Yeah, yeah, look I do have a little bit of
a formula. A quick buckstory on this. The Hudsa are
the last hunter gatherer tribe on Earth. They live in
East Africa, so they are the best insight into what
our species is bred for and what your genome is
actually bred for. So our genome hasn't changed significantly in
forty five thousand years. You've got a hunter gatherer genome.
(16:16):
Sovi ice over every one of the listeners, and they
a bunch of scientists put GPS trackers on them, but
they also put heart rate monitors on them. Right, So
the recommendations in Australia are one hundred and fifty minutes
of moderate physical activity a week, or seventy five of
vigorous or a combination thereof. And thankfully they're also saying
(16:37):
two of those sessions at least should be strength training.
Speaker 2 (16:39):
Right.
Speaker 3 (16:39):
The hadza to one hundred and thirty five minutes of
moderate to vigorous physical activity a day, nine hundred and
forty five.
Speaker 1 (16:49):
A week, and already know the responsegathers.
Speaker 3 (16:52):
What's a realistic So for me, there's a trade off
between time and intensity. So the less you move, the
more intention you're going to be sure, right, And it's
all about where your starting point is. And this is
the beautiful thing for anybody's listening who's really out of shape.
You do anything, you're going to improve. This is the
awesome thing for people who are listening who are not
(17:13):
doing any of this stuff. Anything that you do, your
biology is going to improve. Right. So for me, it's
just about I love the idea of lamp pos right,
So just go out and you're going to go for
if you're not active at all, you're going to do
a ten minute walk, right, And if you're highly active,
you're still going to use the lamp pos right. And
the whole idea is between the first two lamp posts,
you go slow. Between the next two lamp posts, you
(17:35):
get out of breath. Make sure you are having planned
uncomfortable activity every day, ideally a minimum of ten minutes.
And most people go, you know what, I can do it?
And then it's about, as we know, if it's about
your goals. Do I want to just maintain or am
I looking to improve? So if you're looking to improve,
you need to progressively overload the system. So if you're
(17:57):
doing two ten minutes for the first week, then it
might be twelve, Then it might be fifteen. Right, it
might be a ten second col shower this week, it
might be fifteen next week, it might be twenty the
week after, right. So it's just making sure that you're
moving forward. And here's one of the big things I
think for all of your listeners from a psychological perspective,
but that plays into this, don't compare yourself to anybody else.
(18:20):
Got Jordan Peterson said this, compare yourself to who you
were yesterday, right, And I'd like to expand that, compare
yourself to who you were yesterday, last week, last month,
last year. As long as you are moving forward and progressing,
that's the key thing. Get off Instagram, stop looking at
that shit shopplingan at the awesome people that are making
you feel bad. Just look at where you were last week,
(18:42):
last month, last year, and even if you've gone backwards,
are you nyeing forwards motion? That's the key thing is
just taking forward steps every day.
Speaker 1 (18:52):
This is all about what is their comfort zone? Well,
our comfort zone might be sitting on a comfortable catch
in a warm trek suit, eating corn chips in a
warm house. So what's our what's our uncomfort zone? Well,
it's eating broccoli, getting outside, getting ourselves puffing and panting
(19:13):
or burning from a physical muscular perspective in the gym
or with some lightweights or kettlebells or whatever it might be.
At home, it's having a cold shower and we want
to be warm, and you know, like it's just the
opposite to that. In four or five or six areas
of our life, and start with one at a time.
I love as a precademic, you've given our listeners something
(19:33):
to do. I want them to go away and call
this their resilience program. And it's going to be high
intensity exercise. And you start with whatever you can do
and you build it up. Let's say two minutes a week.
Correct From a food perspective, do you have a.
Speaker 3 (19:47):
Try to eat mainly stuff and that is little hair
chai litl hair chai the ga I prefer the hit
chi and nobody near that shad up. I was going
to say, what CHI stands for? Human interference? It right?
You look at it and you go to I recognize
that this has been a right alive recently and minimally
interfered with by humans. If it's in a packet, put
(20:08):
it back. And if you're looking at it, you go,
mister Krispy Kreme donut. I don't remember seeing you running
around on four legs. I'm not saying always put it back.
Eighty twenty room, so eighty percent of the staff and
just run an experiment for the next week. See how
close you get. Roughly, don't calorie count, but roughly eighty
percent of the stuff that goes into your mouth should
have been alive recently minimally interfered with by humans. And
(20:31):
the other twenty percent is you treat for it. Now
you may be reducing your treat food significantly. Go for
the best. If it's ice cream and chocolate, buy the
best quality and eat it slowly and see for it.
But that's your twenty percent.
Speaker 1 (20:45):
Yeah, progress not perfection. We're all about that, yeah for sure.
So that's a good one. With food the cold showers,
you can.
Speaker 3 (20:51):
Just start with whatever you can. But here's the thing
for the colshar You've got to control your breathing. I
like to do box breathing. Box breathings. You breathe side
of a box, right, so you breathe in for I
like four seconds. You can do three, five, whatever, but
bree then for four hal for four breath Vigo. You
have special force of soldiers use it when they're on
patrol to control their level stress. Arisal. So you've got
(21:14):
to slow the breath down as the cold water hits you.
Speaker 1 (21:19):
And again, don't be disheartened if you can't do it
at first. Easier said, then that's right. Well, thank you
so much, mate. I can't wait to get you back.
The name of your book again. I know it's not
even out yet, but I'm sure our listeners will be.
We'll be keeping a close eye out.
Speaker 3 (21:31):
So the book is called Death by Comfort. It's going
to be had in a couple of months. And podcast
is mind Body Bringing Project beautiful mate. Thanks for coming
on the wood off. Absolute pleasure see you again.
Speaker 1 (21:45):
I don't know about you, but my brain is spinning
as it always does after I speak to Paul resilience,
and I genuinely believe this is one of the most
important subjects for us to address us, both individuals and parents,
even within the workplace. I'm going to take some of
that homework myself and make sure I put into action,
because it's all very well knowing, but it's all about doing.
(22:07):
And next up we're going to get into some healthy eating.
So many of you have probably heard me say that
the foundation for healthy lifestyle and getting ourselves in shape,
keeping ourselves in shape is to build good habits. And
we've spoken about when we build these habits, it's important
(22:28):
to not turn your life upside down on day one,
but to start small and build it up step by
step until things have become autonomous. But we also live
in the real world and not everyone. In fact, many
of us don't have a lifestyle or a really easy
structure where that advice is always going to work, which
(22:49):
brings me to this question.
Speaker 2 (22:51):
Hey, Sam, my name step I originally started your program
when I was traveling a lot for work because I
wanted someone to give some routines and workouse that I
could do well I was away from home. My problem
is when I travel for work, I find the food
is really hard to stick to or try and stick
to healthy eating. I was wondering if you could provide
(23:12):
me a few tips on which I could use so
that I could stick to some kind of more structured
healthy eating while I travel for work.
Speaker 3 (23:19):
Thank you so deb you beautiful twenty eight.
Speaker 1 (23:22):
It is such a great question, and I love that
you've asked it because I bet this question is something
that many people are wondering. So first of all, it's
great to have that flexible mindset because it really doesn't
matter how you move your body, and it really doesn't
matter what healthy food you put in your body as
long as you're moving and as long as you're eating well.
(23:42):
So we don't need to be so rigid that if
it's not the eating plan that we're meant to be following,
it's not the exact workout that we're meant to be doing.
Instead it's a five k walk before our day of meetings,
and instead it's a healthy choice at the hotel restaurant
that's okay, But when it comes to traveling for work,
you've got to become.
Speaker 3 (24:02):
A bit of a pro.
Speaker 1 (24:02):
You've got to know where to stay, you've got to
know what exercise you're going to do, and it might
be yep, I love staying in this area because it's
great for running, or I know that when I'm in
the hotel it's going to be fine because I've got
an online fitness program that i can do with my
phone in my hotel room, and that's all I need.
I don't need a gym, I don't need any other resources.
(24:23):
And then the food is the trickiest bit. The workout bit,
I think is much easier to get your head around
and have success than the food, because when we do travel,
it is a complete iye opner for how badly most
of this country and most of the world eat. You know,
Airports I think are a prime example. There are very
few healthy food choices around, and there are very few
(24:47):
people eating healthy foods. So it just means you've got
to be ahead of the curve and you've got to
take care of yourself. So taking some food to the airport,
that's okay. Having a little bit of food prepped from
the fridge to the air PA. That's okay knowing that
there's probably not going to be anything healthy served to
you on the plane, so you eat before your flight
so you don't have to make a poor choice while
(25:08):
you're starving. That's a good move too. I've spoken about
the plane example, but it's the same in the car,
and I know it.
Speaker 3 (25:14):
I'm as guilty as any of us at falling for it.
Speaker 1 (25:16):
You cannot be bothered to pull over, get out of
the car and look for something healthy. In fact, it's
really hard to do on long stretches of road. Guess what,
the only things that are open are drive through takeaway outlets.
So that's when being really organized for your long drive
can be an absolute game changer, because you've got the
healthy option in the car with you, and that's where
(25:39):
you do need to do a little bit of research.
Where is the nearest town where there's going to be
a healthier choice, And don't be too hard on yourself.
You're not trying to make a perfect choice. You're trying
to make a better choice. And then when you get
to your destination, it's really good to do some research.
What does the menu look like at this hotel that
I'm staying at and it's about just getting back to basics.
(26:02):
Is the meal that I'm choosing, whether it be breakfast, lunch,
or dinner, made up of predominantly good source of protein,
lots of edgies, and some healthy carbs. And if the
answer to that is yes, you are going to be
ticking the box. Often these work trips are associated with
meetings and drinking, and we get a little bit caught
up in that, feel like we have to do it
to fit in, or we have to do it to
(26:23):
close the deal. You need to be strong enough to
say it's okay, I can still do my job absolutely
well enough by drinking water. And that's going to mean
I'm probably more likely to bounce out of bed tomorrow
morning and get my exercides done too, because I'm not
going to be feeling slow and lethargic and hungover. You've
also got to be comfortable asking for things to be
changed from the menu, which is something that I know
(26:45):
many of us are uncomfortable with. But I feel like
the world is shifting a little bit. We're getting more
and more comfortable saying no, can I please have the
carbs on the side or the sauce on the side,
or the dressing on the side, or can I have
this cooked in a particular way rather than deep fried,
I'll have it grilled. Whatever it might be, just simple changes.
It's the same food, but you're making some simple, healthier adjustments.
(27:05):
And then there's just the discipline. So you just need
to think to yourself, what's realistic. I'm flexible but unpractical,
and I'm not going to worry too much around all
this stuff that's going on around me.
Speaker 3 (27:21):
I'm not gonna worry about what that.
Speaker 1 (27:22):
Person's eating, or if that person's drinking alcohol, or that
it's kind of the done thing to get on the
booze or whatever it might be. I'm going to still
stick to my platform, to my program, to my rules
even though the environment is changing, because that environment for
me is going to change often, and if I don't
have a level of structure and a level of discipline,
(27:42):
I'm really going to get frustrated myself and I'm going
to come unstuck. So it was a bit of a
longer answer the normal deb but I really thought that
needed some context around it, because there's a lot of
different facets to keeping yourself on track when you're traveling
for work or when you're traveling for holiday, So it.
Speaker 3 (27:58):
Was a really good question.
Speaker 1 (27:59):
Thanks so much for sending it through, and as always,
Woodlife listeners, if you've got any questions of that nature
or anything you'd like covered in the wellness space, please
send them through. There's a link in the show notes.
I'd absolutely love to hear from you. Thanks for listening.
I'll be back Monday for another motivational moment. I'll see
you then.
One thing that comes up time and time again on
the Wood Life is getting into good habits, whether it's
your exercise regime, or healthy eating or mindset. I always
bring it back, and so to so many of our
expert guests to developing those good habits. But what happens
if you have disruptions in your life that make it
difficult or challenging to even start a habit, let alone
(00:24):
keep it consistent. That is definitely an issue that Deb's
been facing.
Speaker 2 (00:28):
When I travel for work, I find the food is
really hard to stick to. I was wondering if you
could provide me a few tips on which I could
use so that I could stick to some kind of
more structured healthy eating while I travel for work.
Speaker 1 (00:41):
So you may not have travel necessarily traveling for work,
but we all have travel from time to time maintaining
a routine. So I'm sure, no matter what's going on in
your life, this will be able to help you in
some way. And we're going to answer that a little
later on the show. But first, I'm very excited to
introduce you to our guest today.
Speaker 3 (00:59):
He's been a good.
Speaker 1 (01:00):
Friend of mine for many many years, perhaps the most
qualified person that I've ever met and is an expert
in a number of fields. He could talk about a
huge range of topics, but today he's going to speak
about resilience in a way that perhaps you've never heard
it before. That's next on the Woodlife. Our next guest
(01:44):
is someone that, in my twenty two years experience in
the fitness industry, is the smartest person in fitness that
I have ever met. And I wouldn't make a statement
like that if I didn't absolutely believe it's true. He
is a neuroscientist, an exercise physiologist, and a nutritionists Paul Taylor,
Welcome to the Woodlife.
Speaker 3 (02:02):
It's a pleasure to be here.
Speaker 1 (02:04):
Our listeners don't know how brilliant you are just yet,
but they're going to in about twenty minutes time. Let's
start at the basis. What is resilience to you? I mean,
what's your definition of it? And as a genuine resilience expert,
you know you work with corporates all over the world,
and you know high performing athletes and everything in this
particular area, what is resilience? Take it anywhere?
Speaker 3 (02:25):
Your luck, mate. It's a good starting point, right because
most people would talk about resilience so they would define
resilience as the ability to bunch back right from getting
knocked down, or to go through a tough experience, a
period of stress, and not to have it impact you
psychologically too much. Right. But I actually like a broader
(02:48):
definition of resilience, and it comes back to why we
became the dominant species on Earth. It's largely because we
adapted better to stressors changing environments than any other species. Right.
And I think that the real thing that underpins resilience
is something called hormesis, which is a branch of science
(03:10):
that most people have never heard of, but it's basically
summed up by the words of Frederick Nietzsche, the German philosopher,
that which does not kill us makes us stronger. My
phday at the minute that I'm doing is in psychology,
focusing on resilience, on what I call You're doing a
book as well, and I'm writing a book called Death
by Comfort. Why. So there's a nice segue into this
(03:32):
why modern life is killing us and what we need
to do about it? Right, And so my whole premise
of this but linked back to what I said, we
became the dominant species largely because we adapted better to
stressors than other species. But since the Industrial Revolution, we've
entered what I call the comfort revolution, where we are
no longer moving very much and actually exercise. Physical exercise
(03:56):
is fundamental to our biology. And I now say with
complete certainty and without any judgment by the way, that
if you do not currently engage in regular physical activity,
at least some of which is vigorous, there's not a
snowballs chance in hell that either your brain is functioning
optimally or that you will have optimal resilience. It's absolutely impossible,
(04:17):
because it is so fundamental to our biology. But it's
not just exercise. We eat shit food that most of
which was never around for our species, And now more
than fifty percent of our data is made up of
ultra processed foods, right, which again affect our biology in
negative ways. We don't go hungry anymore. And hunger stress
(04:40):
is a hormetic stress that actually can strengthen your sALS,
that can strengthen your brain cells and actually protect you
against stress, just like exercise does. And you know, I
know you've got to degree in exercise science because I
taught you have money your subjects, right, But you know,
if we think about exercise, people get bigger, faster, stronger
(05:01):
because exercise is a stressor.
Speaker 1 (05:03):
Stress isn't always bad, no, we all have that psychology.
Speaker 3 (05:06):
That is the difference between d stress, which is stuff
that breaks you down physically sliced mentally, and you stress,
which is stuff that builds you up physically and or mentally. Right.
And my epiphany in this area came when I went
through combat Survival and Resistance to Interrogation training in the
Armed Forces. It was ten days, a pretty hard core shit,
(05:27):
and it was at the end of that course something
happened that normally I had have found a little bit stressful,
and I was like water off a duck's back. I
went and spoke to people on the course and they
all said the same thing. And that's when I because
I already had my master's in exercise science, and I thought,
maybe psychological and emotional stress follows the same pathway as
(05:48):
exercise stress. That you need to have exposure to some
of it, moderate intermittent exposure to it, followed by a
period of recovery that actually makes you stronger. And now
I actually, in the academic literature, for me, there's been
way too much focus on post traumatic stress and actually
postraumatic stress has changed from being about an event to
(06:09):
being about the individual now right, But now in the
literature they're starting to talk about post traumatic growth that
actually people who go through tough times, if it doesn't
break them, they actually grow. I say to my kids,
you're growing up in a bubble within a bubble within
a bubble. Right, Australia if you've never been overseas is
(06:29):
a bubble country. If you've never been to the Third World.
We live in a bubble. I live in Mountain Eliza
in the mornings and Peninsula. It's a frigging bubble. Right.
My kids go to awesome schools with awesome teachers, and
some of that is absent the stressors that we need
kids when they learn from school. So here's the interesting thing, right,
So I have this company years ago with Carly, had
(06:54):
this conversation and she vetoed my first suggestion, which was
taking our kids through a kiddie version of Come Survival
of Resistance to Interrogation. Get your friends prepared to sign up.
But you know what was on sport? Yeah, So we
said to our kids when they were young, here's the
house for is you need to do a team sport
and a martial art and actually saying to our kids,
(07:15):
I'm really proud that you got outside of your comfort zone.
And we talk to our kids all the time about
getting outside their comfort zone. I always say, lots of
people spend most of their lives in their comfort zone,
right and they dip their toe out and they go, oh,
that's a bit uncomfortable. I've got to come back here.
And you know, for me, it's like two am. No
(07:36):
good shit happens in your comfort zone. Think of something
that you're super, super proud of, and I guarantee you,
for the majority of your listeners it's going to involve
being out of your comfort zone and being stressed.
Speaker 1 (07:48):
For me, it was meeting Snage going on a reality
TV show, Get the Shit out of Me.
Speaker 3 (07:52):
Yeah, you never dreams that.
Speaker 1 (07:54):
I think I'd take that plunge and imagine if I hadn't.
So yeah, I share that one hundred.
Speaker 3 (08:00):
So that was a very long answer to for me.
Resilience it's psychophysiological and that's my PhD is on. There's
a large component of resilience that has to be earned,
that happens at a cellular level that affects both your
physiology in terms of your muscles, but also your biology
(08:21):
and your neurobiology and how you adapt to stress. So
one thing I'll give you here on this link. So
there was a research study done in the nineteen seventies
there's now been actually repeated that showed that fit women
versus unfit women, they had two s two cohorts, and
they exposed them all to this battery of stress tests,
so it was both psychological and physiological stress tests, and
(08:44):
they measured the cordisol responses right the major stress home
and the fit women had much dampened, much lower cortisol
responses to that battery of stress than the unfit women
right across both whether it was a psychology, whether it
was psychological or physio.
Speaker 1 (09:00):
Being physically fit to handle both.
Speaker 3 (09:03):
Yes, and you know why the mechanism and a lot
of people don't talk about it. And actually I looked
in the academic literature for this, and I thought, there's
going to be a whole heap of stuff. This is
what we call the cross stressor hypothesis has actually been
shown from cold exposure can help perform and exercise it
under hypoxic conditions. Other researchers come out and shown that
(09:24):
fitter people actually do better on a cold press or test, right,
And I know all around the country is going to
be people doing this.
Speaker 2 (09:33):
Right.
Speaker 3 (09:33):
You get a big jug of water, ice water, right,
put a whole heap of ice in it, and then
you stick your your hand in it up to your
just past your past your wrist, and see how long
you can and it's horrible. Right, that's a good score.
A good score is two minutes. But they fit in
the test at three minutes. Right. And when you look
at people who pass, it is a direct relationship to
(09:55):
their level of physical activity, and it's a dose response
in that sedentary people much fewer of them pass, and
people who are moderately active more of those past, people
who are highly active more even more of those pasts,
and people who do vigorous physical activity. That is the
most right. And for me, it's about because they're training
(10:17):
their stress response system, that ability to switch it on
and switch it off. And that's the biology that the
psychologists don't talk about.
Speaker 1 (10:25):
There must be a varying natural level of resilience. Absolutely so,
I mean this is you're doing environmental factors. We can
move the dial by actually proactively doing things, I mean
correct all I'm thinking is if I did that test,
which I will do by the way, I'll tell that
this is my score that right, Yeah, but Snares is
(10:48):
much tougher than I am.
Speaker 3 (10:49):
Mentally, she's not fitter than me. So you know there's
a psychologically often women are psychologically tougher that right. Okay,
So that's that's one thing. The other thing is there
is a component. We know that there are genes that
but as you will know, genes predisposed. It's the genes
interacting with the environment and particularly the early environment. Right,
(11:11):
So there is this learned resilience, and my kids have
a large amount of learned resilience.
Speaker 1 (11:16):
Is there a particular window of years? Look for all
the parents listening is is it has to be before?
I thought it's between.
Speaker 3 (11:23):
When you look at the brain. Right. The Jesuits have
a saying, give me a boy to leads of seven
and I'll give you back a man, right, And so
US neuroscientists talk about that great period of development of
the human brain and a lot of your characteristics are
laid down in those formative years. So starting early with
your kids and and really let's get practical about it,
(11:45):
it's it's praising your kids, not for outcomes, but for
effort right, and praising them that when they feel but
continue to pick themselves up and go at it, You've
got to praise those behaviors, right. And I'm very anti
this boosterism movement around that started in the nineteen yearies
(12:06):
in the United States that they saw that people who
had hire self esteem seemed to be more successful in
life and seem to have less crime and all of that.
So they thought, well, let's just boost people's self esteem,
and this whole movement swept throughout the United States with
no evidence behind it. If you look at all the
world class performers, athletes, successful people, it's effort that is
(12:30):
the thing that goes past it is the ability to
get comfortable with being uncomfortable. That is the one treate
that links all those people across different demands.
Speaker 1 (12:42):
Whenever you hear about world's most successful, but you know,
whether it's an actor that you love or entrepreneur, you know,
they've all got similar traits and similar routines. You know,
whether it's the four am workout, or it's the cold share,
or it's you know, there's some level of discipline, there's
some level of forcing themselves out of their comfort zone consistently.
Speaker 3 (13:04):
You mentioned cold shars our cold exposure. That is another
method by which you can enhance both your resilience and
improve your physiology. Right when you get into whether it's
a coal shar, or jump into a coldpol or get
into the ocean, there is a cold shock response that
happens within milliseconds that communicates with your brain, and there's
(13:26):
a whole heap of biology that is actually switched on. Right,
And we know that nora adrenaline, right, which is an
important mood enhancing chemical in the Brian can be increased
by hundreds of percent when you expose yourself to cold water.
But it also activates these things called stress response proteins.
So I mentioned Hermesis earlier on and stress response proteins
(13:47):
are the things that link exercise, particularly vigorous exercise, cold exposure,
hate exposure such as sauna, but also links into fasting
and how fasting can be really good for us. There
are now over six hundred identified hormetic stressors. Right. For instance,
you take broccoli keel, lots of people eat that and
(14:07):
they talk about the sulfuravian and it's a powerful antioxidant.
It's not an antioxidant, it's a poison. Lots of plants
are good for us because they have small doses of
poison that in an insect is enough to persuade them
not to eat it. But because we are much bigger,
induces a mild what we call hormetic stress. And because
(14:28):
our sales get this mild stress, they upregulate the activity
of protective genes. So you talked about genes earlier on.
Yes they're important, but it's whether or not your genes
are switched on or switched off. And it turns out
when we expose ourselves to a range of mild stressors
that we upreguliate protective genes such as antioxidant defence genes.
(14:51):
And these things are like the special forces of yourselves, right,
So rather than have them being guarded by Dad's army,
we want them to be guarded by our special forces.
And it's that repeated, intermittent exposure to a variety of
stressors that enhances our cellular resilience, and I believe spills
(15:11):
over into our emotional on our mental resilience as well.
Speaker 1 (15:15):
And I one hundred percent agree with you, and I
think for so many of us, we think getting out
of our comfort zone has.
Speaker 3 (15:21):
To be such a big.
Speaker 1 (15:24):
Significant event. Yes, I did a marathon, I've co got
my favorite public speaking or you know I only ate
broccoli for four nine days and nothing whatever?
Speaker 3 (15:34):
What you know?
Speaker 1 (15:35):
Like, you know, I'm up at four am jumping in
the ocean for a month. But it's actually success by
a million cuts by actually just continually. If you wrote down,
maybe you introduced.
Speaker 3 (15:47):
One a month. Yep.
Speaker 1 (15:48):
With the exercise you said, exercise regularly. Some of it
is high intensity. Do you have a formula?
Speaker 3 (15:55):
Yeah, yeah, look I do have a little bit of
a formula. A quick buckstory on this. The Hudsa are
the last hunter gatherer tribe on Earth. They live in
East Africa, so they are the best insight into what
our species is bred for and what your genome is
actually bred for. So our genome hasn't changed significantly in
forty five thousand years. You've got a hunter gatherer genome.
(16:16):
Sovi ice over every one of the listeners, and they
a bunch of scientists put GPS trackers on them, but
they also put heart rate monitors on them. Right, So
the recommendations in Australia are one hundred and fifty minutes
of moderate physical activity a week, or seventy five of
vigorous or a combination thereof. And thankfully they're also saying
(16:37):
two of those sessions at least should be strength training.
Speaker 2 (16:39):
Right.
Speaker 3 (16:39):
The hadza to one hundred and thirty five minutes of
moderate to vigorous physical activity a day, nine hundred and
forty five.
Speaker 1 (16:49):
A week, and already know the responsegathers.
Speaker 3 (16:52):
What's a realistic So for me, there's a trade off
between time and intensity. So the less you move, the
more intention you're going to be sure, right, And it's
all about where your starting point is. And this is
the beautiful thing for anybody's listening who's really out of shape.
You do anything, you're going to improve. This is the
awesome thing for people who are listening who are not
(17:13):
doing any of this stuff. Anything that you do, your
biology is going to improve. Right. So for me, it's
just about I love the idea of lamp pos right,
So just go out and you're going to go for
if you're not active at all, you're going to do
a ten minute walk, right, And if you're highly active,
you're still going to use the lamp pos right. And
the whole idea is between the first two lamp posts,
you go slow. Between the next two lamp posts, you
(17:35):
get out of breath. Make sure you are having planned
uncomfortable activity every day, ideally a minimum of ten minutes.
And most people go, you know what, I can do it?
And then it's about, as we know, if it's about
your goals. Do I want to just maintain or am
I looking to improve? So if you're looking to improve,
you need to progressively overload the system. So if you're
(17:57):
doing two ten minutes for the first week, then it
might be twelve, Then it might be fifteen. Right, it
might be a ten second col shower this week, it
might be fifteen next week, it might be twenty the
week after, right. So it's just making sure that you're
moving forward. And here's one of the big things I
think for all of your listeners from a psychological perspective,
but that plays into this, don't compare yourself to anybody else.
(18:20):
Got Jordan Peterson said this, compare yourself to who you
were yesterday, right, And I'd like to expand that, compare
yourself to who you were yesterday, last week, last month,
last year. As long as you are moving forward and progressing,
that's the key thing. Get off Instagram, stop looking at
that shit shopplingan at the awesome people that are making
you feel bad. Just look at where you were last week,
(18:42):
last month, last year, and even if you've gone backwards,
are you nyeing forwards motion? That's the key thing is
just taking forward steps every day.
Speaker 1 (18:52):
This is all about what is their comfort zone? Well,
our comfort zone might be sitting on a comfortable catch
in a warm trek suit, eating corn chips in a
warm house. So what's our what's our uncomfort zone? Well,
it's eating broccoli, getting outside, getting ourselves puffing and panting
(19:13):
or burning from a physical muscular perspective in the gym
or with some lightweights or kettlebells or whatever it might be.
At home, it's having a cold shower and we want
to be warm, and you know, like it's just the
opposite to that. In four or five or six areas
of our life, and start with one at a time.
I love as a precademic, you've given our listeners something
(19:33):
to do. I want them to go away and call
this their resilience program. And it's going to be high
intensity exercise. And you start with whatever you can do
and you build it up. Let's say two minutes a week.
Correct From a food perspective, do you have a.
Speaker 3 (19:47):
Try to eat mainly stuff and that is little hair
chai litl hair chai the ga I prefer the hit
chi and nobody near that shad up. I was going
to say, what CHI stands for? Human interference? It right?
You look at it and you go to I recognize
that this has been a right alive recently and minimally
interfered with by humans. If it's in a packet, put
(20:08):
it back. And if you're looking at it, you go,
mister Krispy Kreme donut. I don't remember seeing you running
around on four legs. I'm not saying always put it back.
Eighty twenty room, so eighty percent of the staff and
just run an experiment for the next week. See how
close you get. Roughly, don't calorie count, but roughly eighty
percent of the stuff that goes into your mouth should
have been alive recently minimally interfered with by humans. And
(20:31):
the other twenty percent is you treat for it. Now
you may be reducing your treat food significantly. Go for
the best. If it's ice cream and chocolate, buy the
best quality and eat it slowly and see for it.
But that's your twenty percent.
Speaker 1 (20:45):
Yeah, progress not perfection. We're all about that, yeah for sure.
So that's a good one. With food the cold showers,
you can.
Speaker 3 (20:51):
Just start with whatever you can. But here's the thing
for the colshar You've got to control your breathing. I
like to do box breathing. Box breathings. You breathe side
of a box, right, so you breathe in for I
like four seconds. You can do three, five, whatever, but
bree then for four hal for four breath Vigo. You
have special force of soldiers use it when they're on
patrol to control their level stress. Arisal. So you've got
(21:14):
to slow the breath down as the cold water hits you.
Speaker 1 (21:19):
And again, don't be disheartened if you can't do it
at first. Easier said, then that's right. Well, thank you
so much, mate. I can't wait to get you back.
The name of your book again. I know it's not
even out yet, but I'm sure our listeners will be.
We'll be keeping a close eye out.
Speaker 3 (21:31):
So the book is called Death by Comfort. It's going
to be had in a couple of months. And podcast
is mind Body Bringing Project beautiful mate. Thanks for coming
on the wood off. Absolute pleasure see you again.
Speaker 1 (21:45):
I don't know about you, but my brain is spinning
as it always does after I speak to Paul resilience,
and I genuinely believe this is one of the most
important subjects for us to address us, both individuals and parents,
even within the workplace. I'm going to take some of
that homework myself and make sure I put into action,
because it's all very well knowing, but it's all about doing.
(22:07):
And next up we're going to get into some healthy eating.
So many of you have probably heard me say that
the foundation for healthy lifestyle and getting ourselves in shape,
keeping ourselves in shape is to build good habits. And
we've spoken about when we build these habits, it's important
(22:28):
to not turn your life upside down on day one,
but to start small and build it up step by
step until things have become autonomous. But we also live
in the real world and not everyone. In fact, many
of us don't have a lifestyle or a really easy
structure where that advice is always going to work, which
(22:49):
brings me to this question.
Speaker 2 (22:51):
Hey, Sam, my name step I originally started your program
when I was traveling a lot for work because I
wanted someone to give some routines and workouse that I
could do well I was away from home. My problem
is when I travel for work, I find the food
is really hard to stick to or try and stick
to healthy eating. I was wondering if you could provide
(23:12):
me a few tips on which I could use so
that I could stick to some kind of more structured
healthy eating while I travel for work.
Speaker 3 (23:19):
Thank you so deb you beautiful twenty eight.
Speaker 1 (23:22):
It is such a great question, and I love that
you've asked it because I bet this question is something
that many people are wondering. So first of all, it's
great to have that flexible mindset because it really doesn't
matter how you move your body, and it really doesn't
matter what healthy food you put in your body as
long as you're moving and as long as you're eating well.
(23:42):
So we don't need to be so rigid that if
it's not the eating plan that we're meant to be following,
it's not the exact workout that we're meant to be doing.
Instead it's a five k walk before our day of meetings,
and instead it's a healthy choice at the hotel restaurant
that's okay, But when it comes to traveling for work,
you've got to become.
Speaker 3 (24:02):
A bit of a pro.
Speaker 1 (24:02):
You've got to know where to stay, you've got to
know what exercise you're going to do, and it might
be yep, I love staying in this area because it's
great for running, or I know that when I'm in
the hotel it's going to be fine because I've got
an online fitness program that i can do with my
phone in my hotel room, and that's all I need.
I don't need a gym, I don't need any other resources.
(24:23):
And then the food is the trickiest bit. The workout bit,
I think is much easier to get your head around
and have success than the food, because when we do travel,
it is a complete iye opner for how badly most
of this country and most of the world eat. You know,
Airports I think are a prime example. There are very
few healthy food choices around, and there are very few
(24:47):
people eating healthy foods. So it just means you've got
to be ahead of the curve and you've got to
take care of yourself. So taking some food to the airport,
that's okay. Having a little bit of food prepped from
the fridge to the air PA. That's okay knowing that
there's probably not going to be anything healthy served to
you on the plane, so you eat before your flight
so you don't have to make a poor choice while
(25:08):
you're starving. That's a good move too. I've spoken about
the plane example, but it's the same in the car,
and I know it.
Speaker 3 (25:14):
I'm as guilty as any of us at falling for it.
Speaker 1 (25:16):
You cannot be bothered to pull over, get out of
the car and look for something healthy. In fact, it's
really hard to do on long stretches of road. Guess what,
the only things that are open are drive through takeaway outlets.
So that's when being really organized for your long drive
can be an absolute game changer, because you've got the
healthy option in the car with you, and that's where
(25:39):
you do need to do a little bit of research.
Where is the nearest town where there's going to be
a healthier choice, And don't be too hard on yourself.
You're not trying to make a perfect choice. You're trying
to make a better choice. And then when you get
to your destination, it's really good to do some research.
What does the menu look like at this hotel that
I'm staying at and it's about just getting back to basics.
(26:02):
Is the meal that I'm choosing, whether it be breakfast, lunch,
or dinner, made up of predominantly good source of protein,
lots of edgies, and some healthy carbs. And if the
answer to that is yes, you are going to be
ticking the box. Often these work trips are associated with
meetings and drinking, and we get a little bit caught
up in that, feel like we have to do it
to fit in, or we have to do it to
(26:23):
close the deal. You need to be strong enough to
say it's okay, I can still do my job absolutely
well enough by drinking water. And that's going to mean
I'm probably more likely to bounce out of bed tomorrow
morning and get my exercides done too, because I'm not
going to be feeling slow and lethargic and hungover. You've
also got to be comfortable asking for things to be
changed from the menu, which is something that I know
(26:45):
many of us are uncomfortable with. But I feel like
the world is shifting a little bit. We're getting more
and more comfortable saying no, can I please have the
carbs on the side or the sauce on the side,
or the dressing on the side, or can I have
this cooked in a particular way rather than deep fried,
I'll have it grilled. Whatever it might be, just simple changes.
It's the same food, but you're making some simple, healthier adjustments.
(27:05):
And then there's just the discipline. So you just need
to think to yourself, what's realistic. I'm flexible but unpractical,
and I'm not going to worry too much around all
this stuff that's going on around me.
Speaker 3 (27:21):
I'm not gonna worry about what that.
Speaker 1 (27:22):
Person's eating, or if that person's drinking alcohol, or that
it's kind of the done thing to get on the
booze or whatever it might be. I'm going to still
stick to my platform, to my program, to my rules
even though the environment is changing, because that environment for
me is going to change often, and if I don't
have a level of structure and a level of discipline,
(27:42):
I'm really going to get frustrated myself and I'm going
to come unstuck. So it was a bit of a
longer answer the normal deb but I really thought that
needed some context around it, because there's a lot of
different facets to keeping yourself on track when you're traveling
for work or when you're traveling for holiday, So it.
Speaker 3 (27:58):
Was a really good question.
Speaker 1 (27:59):
Thanks so much for sending it through, and as always,
Woodlife listeners, if you've got any questions of that nature
or anything you'd like covered in the wellness space, please
send them through. There's a link in the show notes.
I'd absolutely love to hear from you. Thanks for listening.
I'll be back Monday for another motivational moment. I'll see
you then.
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